Who will be considered the new Queen of Pop when Madonna retires or dies?

How will we be able to know? She looks like a corpse already.

No one is asking for a "Queen of Pop", hun. Did you learn to write at the Sheboygan Conservatory of cultural critique?

Madonna hasn’t been “Queen of Pop” in over 15 years.

OP, she hasn't been able to claim that title in decades. Her thrown was finally absconded in 2012 after several prior coups.

Stats?

[quote]Her thrown was finally absconded in 2012 after several prior coups.

Well, I sure was thrown by that sentence.

Madonna will be buried by the zillions of streams of present and future stars. Her achievements will seem quaint and historical.

I ascend

Beyonce

R8

“ The Evermore album, however, still sustained the No. 1 position on the Billboard 200 albums chart for it's second turn as well. The album beats Paul McCartney's McCartney III for the position. Her song Willow, unlike the album, couldn't retain the position. On December 29, Swift's Willow fell from No. 1 to No. 38. This 37 spot fall just isn't a step-down but is the biggest drop in the history of the Hot 100 charts.”

Madonna will always be the Queen of Pop. Hell, Michael Jackson is still the King of Pop and he's been dead for 11 years. No one will ever be able to touch Madonna's sales and concert grosses.

[quote]Her song Willow, unlike the album, couldn't retain the position. On December 29, Swift's Willow fell from No. 1 to No. 38. This 37 spot fall just isn't a step-down but is the biggest drop in the history of the Hot 100 charts.”

Honey, Madonna can’t even get a song ANYWHERE on the Hot 100 these days.

She can’t even sell out a theater tour without giving tickets away free. lol

And here comes Jabba spreading lies again.

Adele has already taken over from her. Years ago in fact.

Best selling artists of all time

chartmasters.org/2020/05/cspc-mass-update-streaming/

Read R16 and weep, Jabba.

R16, does that chart account for streaming?

It's going to be Billie Eyetrash.

I don’t think anyone will ever reach the level of fame she did in her peak. She may not be as popular now, but that doesn’t erase her overall career. She was all over the news during her peak. Her fame is worldwide. Her influence was/is vast. Many other stars have come and had a several year period of popularity, but they weren’t able to reach the heights she did. It’s a shame she has become such a joke.

Streams of her music are maybe not that high considering the amount of albums she sold. Her music isn't as popular compared to other acts as it once was. She is like the fifth most streamed female artist on Spotify from the 20th century and if you take out Britney and Christina, who are barely 20th century, she is behind Whitney and Mariah.

Honey, no one wants another Madonna. She was bad enough the first time.

I love her for what she once was and I hate her for what she has become. There were other avenues open to her. It didn't have to be this way.

Give it up, pal! Madonna relied heavily on shock value to maintain her NOTORIETY, and not celebrity. She scandalized rather than hypnotized with talent. She cheated!

R18, yes, it takes into account streaming. Madonna and Mariah actually get the same daily streams at 1.9 million each. Christmas is a totally different game though with Mariah obviously leading everyone else during that time. And on youtube, Madonna gets more daily views than Mariah or Whitney.

If we go by the stats at r5 then it's Celine. She has the 2nd place numbers to prove it.

Jabba must be feeling "pressed"--Janet doesn't even make the top 10 of most successful female artists accrdoing to chartmasters.com

"Who will be considered the new Queen of Pop when Madonna retires or dies?"

What about that old pink haired lady who does Madonna cosplay on Instagram?

Can't they just wheel her out now that Madonna's dead?

Like that Michael Jackson hologram?

[quote] I love her for what she once was and I hate her for what she has become. There were other avenues open to her. It didn't have to be this way.

Why do you hate her? What has she done for you to hate her? So you may not agree with her behavior, but it doesn't affect you in the least. It's not like she's out there giving money to Trump or doing anything to hurt anyone. You don't like it, then don't look.

[quote] Janet doesn't even make the top 10 of most successful female artists accrdoing to chartmasters.com

Janet is somewhere down at like 38. Below Alicia Keys.

Artists nowadays are too polished and too similar. No one is unique like Madonna once was. Uniqueness is extremely important when it comes to separating yourself from the herd

Madonna has many farewell tours left in her.

Gaga or Taylor Swift

When Madonna retires or dies?!? RETIRES???

Fuck me gently with a chainsaw, Veronica. M will never retire. NEVER RETIRE.

Kylie Minogue. She has been around and has been successful as a recording & touring pop singer for over three decades.

Kylie never came close to being Queen of anything and at her advanced age, if it hasn't happened yet, it ain't happening ever.

OP, why don't you post a selfie if you're gonna call Madonna "ugly" ? DL isn't judgy. The length of her career speaks for itself. If you don't like her current persona, dont watch. If you were a sentient being in the 80's you get her.

This may be the gayest post ever on DL

Dionne Warwick.

It’ll be Gaga. She stays relevant.

When’s the last time you heard a Beyoncé song that wasn’t a decade old?

Gaga revolutionized pop music. She is the one who brought up the crazy outfits. She was also very vocal about gay right before it was cool to do so.

The beef dress makes her an icon.

R29 I couldn't care less about her behavior. You asked why I hate her - I hate her for throwing away her talent. Her output for the past decade and a half has been awful.

DL isn't judgy?

Vadgebot is so transparent. It starts these threads in order to claim that everyone who disagrees (which is everyone) must be a Janet Jackson fan... give it up, your schtick is tired.

First of all, who or what is a Janet? Secondly Gaga is already a has been and she’s not 35 yet.

Nobody. No one could give a fuck anymore about some dumb autotuned slut pretending to sing. Pop music is dead.

She may not be queen of pop for a decade or two, but no one has taken her place. Not even close. If we're talking about sales, radio dominance, culturally, controversy, musical (Madonna single handedly brought dance music back to the pop charts. No one else ) and just plain star power. And for any singer, OP stated that she's 62 and will die soon. WTF? How old are you? Add ageism and sexism to the things DL needs to fix in 2021.

[quote] First of all, who or what is a Janet?

The undisputed Queen of Pop and creator of your faves, bitch. That’s who.

I don't think anyone will ever be able to ever match Madonna because she isn't as much a musician as stone cold narcissist who knew which trends to jump on in order to keep herself relevant way past here due date. She's basically the Trump of music.

R49: that is the very definition of a pop star. Take what you wrote and replace Madonna's name with Elvis and it's the same.

[quote]She was also very vocal about gay right before it was cool to do so.

Madonna was there before Gaga - in 1991.

[quote]The beef dress makes her an icon.

Everyone has a special outfit.

[quote] Madonna was there before Gaga - in 1991.

Well duh. She’s older and has been in the business longer.

R53 - well, duh, then why say "She [meaning Gaga] was also very vocal about gay right before it was cool to do so"?

so for all of you madonna fans and madonna haters, what SHOULD she do career and music wise to make you love her again, for her to be a success on the charts and in concerts again?...

i do wonder why though her dancing and movement have fallen off so much? i mean she IS ONLY 62, she's not 92... yeah, alot of wear and tear on her body from all those years, but wasn't she always in great shape, ate right and had personal trainers and masseuses and gosh knows what else to keep her strong and fit and resilient? but still there are women 62 and older who can dance for hours non stop! i wonder if that horseback riding accident from years ago in long term delayed her issues that are appearing now?

Cher

Umm, Lady Gaga just jumped on the gay rights train when it was already acceptable to do so. I mean, she debuted in 2008, not fucking 1952! Madonna was defending gays when Reagan was secretly laughing at the thought of gays dying from AIDS.

No one. That sort of designation belongs in the MTV era.

One thing I love about Madonna, Janet, MJ, George Michael, Bowie and Prince is they all experimented with different genres of music and put a lot of effort into their records. They all seemed like they enjoyed making music and were very hands on in the process. Of course, there was always manufactured pop tarts but had their place and faded away very soon. The 90s in general was such an excellent period of music with artists like Bjork, Fiona Apple, Alanis, Lauryn Hill, D'Angelo, A Tribe Called Quest, Jodeci, Nirvana, Smashing Pumpkins, No Doubt, Imani Coppola, Massive Attack, Jonny Lang, Mariah Carey, Toni Braxton, Alice in Chains, Tupac, Biggie, etc.

But starting in the 90s, a lot of telecommunication companies (television channels, radio stations, magazines/newspapers, websites) got bought out and consolidated under the ownership of five major (now four) companies. This allowed for the push of very clearly manufactured and commercial artists in the late 90s and throughout 2000s and many of the more experimental and talented artists faded away from mainstream or began to cater to more niche audiences. A lot of these manufactured acts like Timberlake, Bieber, Britney, Xtina, Rihanna, J Lo, Beyonce etc all became icons to the young generation but never will have any musical impact or great legacy that will live on for generations after. I think once Madonna dies, her legacy will be legitimized when people actually listen to her music and appreciate her body of work and the amount of diversity and sonic innovation.

While there are still really talented and unique artists out there today. Many of them do things DIY and get followings through social media. They won't become huge or mainstream like Madonna or Michael Jackson because TV, radio and print aren't the dominant forms of communication anymore. We have more options than ever, so people will just go into their echo chambers and listen and watch what they want rather than having to depend on TV/radio for music.

TL;DR: There will be no new Queen of Pop as the concept of pop royalty has become outdated and has become unobtainable too.

Janet never experimented, unless you call singing about her pussy an experiment. She just did what Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis told her to, when they could get her fat ass away from the craft services table.

Adele and/or Taylor

Of course, the Janet-hating faggot at R60 had to come showing her ugly face. Bitch, GET. A. LIFE.

It was so expected that the lunatic at R60 would pick Janet out of the bunch. R59’s post and the artists he named in it are very accurate. And yes, Janet’s sound was very experimental. Her music has encompassed many genres, from pop and R&B to rock, house and electronica.

Madonna didn't do any of the things she did for shock value. It just happened that when she did the same things male artist had and were doing that the world found it shocking. She broke the rules that dictated what female artists were supposed to be.

[quote] Of course, the Janet-hating faggot at [R60] had to come showing her ugly face. Bitch, GET. A. LIFE.

Of course Jabba the homophobe had to come showing its bigoted self.

[quote] Madonna didn't do any of the things she did for shock value.

I mean, the Sex book and her walking down that one fashion show with her breasts exposed definitely were for shock value...but I do think a lot of the "shocking" things she did in the 80s were just overblown and ulimtately, it was her music that kept her a star.

R40,

Drunk In Love, Formation, Savage remix, Mi Gente

You tried it.

The only ones who are close to Madonna in terms of sales, hits and influence are Taylor Swift, Mariah Carey, Janet Jackson and Rihanna. I think Rihanna and Taylor are still young, attractive and modern enough to last another 10 years on the charts.

But still Madonna will always be the Queen of Pop.

There is no Queen of Pop. The only reason that MJ was called the King of Pop is because he gave himself that name. Just because he did that does not mean that there has to be (or that there is) a female counterpart.

Michael Jackson is the biggest solo artist of all time. Madonna is the biggest female solo artist of all time. The Beatles are the biggest act of all time, period.

Madonna was the queen of pop in the 80s, then it was Mariah's turn. Gaga had a turn and so did Katy Perry. Taylor Swift ruled from 2014-2016 and then it was Ariana Grande's turn. This year it's Dua Lipa's.

The fabulous Frankie Grande, of course!

Michael Jackson can be called the "King of Pop" objectively speaking because no one else had matched his success in his prime. Elvis is also dubbed "King of Rock" and even though in my opinion that should be given to Chuck Berry or Bo Diddley, Elvis was so hugely influential and such a world-famous performer that the name stuck.

There's certainly no Princess or Prince of Pop. They are pop princes (Timberlake, Chris Brown, Usher, Bieber) and pop princesses (Britney, Christina, Beyonce, Rihanna, Katy, Taylor) but none of them come close to Madonna, Michael Jackson or even The Beatles, Prince, Janet or Mariah in any cultural impact.

MJ was king of pop in the 80s only, after that he became king of pedophiles.

The newer acts will never match the sales pre Spotify even though they have shifted millions of units. Does not mean they are less successful.

Madonna and Michael Jackson are the king/queen of pop because they sold more than any other male/female artist. It's that simple. If Taylor Swift outsellls Madonna--not likely at all but crazier things have happened--she would be the new Queen of Pop.

I don't buy the Ariana or Dua argument. For one, they way are too derivative of older genres of pop music and aren't doing anything unique or new at all. They may be popular with their fans and at parties and clubs but they have no cultural impact or are not influencing or inspiring anyone.

Ariana Grande is the fastest-selling female artist in history, so she'll overtake Madonna eventually if she wants to keep going. She's already the most streamed female artist of all-time.

Ariana may outstream Madonna but she likely won't outsell Madonna and she certainly will certainly not have the same impact on the music industry nor on culture and society that Madonna had.

Ariana Grande has sold about 43 million in EAS (equivalent album sales) so far. That is nowhere near where Madonna was when she was 8 years into her career.

Who cares about sales? What has Ariana done musically or culturally to distinguish herself? And don't even ask......

I'm not even old but I have a deep knowledge and appreciation of music and listened to every genre and era. And I laugh when I hear people say Britney, Ariana, Dua, Camila are the "Queens of Pop" and I also laugh when people say Chris Brown, Bieber or Timberlake or Harry are these new "Kings of Pop".

You have to have no knowledge of any music history or just willfully ignorant to even make that assertion. Anyone with common sense and working ears should know that none of these people are close to the level of Elvis, Michael, Madonna, Aretha, Stevie Wonder, Whitney, Mariah and many others.

R80/R81, thank you. Ariana is just a Jersey Shore/Bratz dall wannabee version of the female pop stars who came before her.

R81 I totally appreciated your post until you inserted Whitney and Mariah names. Please don’t put their names in the same sentence with Michael, Madonna and Elvis. That’s insulting

Whitney and Mariah WERE massively influential, unlike Ariana.

I'm not a big fan of Mariah's over-the-top singing and whistle/whisper/rasp tone but she wrote a bulk of her material and had a big impact on the music scene. Whitney is massively influential and doesn't actually get enough credit for breaking the color barrier (her huge stardom on MTV, her gospel-style singing, The Bodyguard and National Anthem). It would just dishonest not to put them there regardless of personal taste

Either Britney Spears, Taylor Swift, or Beyoncé. Ariana Grande will be in a special category reserved for Divas such as Mariah, Whitney, Barbara, Celine, Arethra, and the like.

Please r85 Christina Aguilera is FAR worse in this regard.

Please r85 Christina Aguilera is FAR worse in this regard.

Britney is struggling to keep herself together though. She is a good case for why the manufacturing pop star factory is damaging. Plus she hasn't been musically relevant since 2008 with Circus. So over 10 years.

Beyoncé is a pop icon but she has not had huge musical sales in a while nor a big impact on music in any way. She is literally mostly famous nowadays for her looks, fashion and music videos. People stream her music but they aren't buying it. Plus nothing about her singing or music is influential at all.

Only Taylor is a good contender and Rihanna..

I forgot about Rihanna r89 and while she is the queen of #1 hits, she still hasn't released an album in over four years. Sis needs to get cracking

Britney and Beyoncé are the closet things to become the new Madonna when it comes the the look, sexuality and entertainment values. not good enough but still better than other female artists.

They however don’t have the intelligence, the rawness, the cultural impact & influence, the creativity and the reinventions that Madonna has. Madonna has it all and until now is still irreplaceable

Taylor Swift is just BLAND and unimpressive, uninteresting and uninspiring. A total boring singer. She can always fuck off

Rihanna was a very “interesting” artist until recently. Her face now looks old and she’s getting fat. The main reason she has not released an album because I think she’s afraid of failures. It’s Ariana, Justin Biers time. She’s kinda a has been now

I always considered Madonna trash.

Barbra and Cher = my Queens!

Nothing personally but Ariana and Bieber are not interesting in any way, shape or form. They are both druggies who release low-effort autotuned music that nobody will remember in 20 years. Ariana can sing but like Beyonce keeps wasting her talent on subpar material. Our standards have really just lowered. We are living in an Idiocracy where mediocrity is being praised.

chartmasters.org/2020/05/cspc-mass-update-streaming/

Nobody. Madonna's place in history is set in stone. She peaked during a specific era which included the rise of MTV. She will forever be the Queen of Pop.

Britney and Beyoncé only had serious chances to become the new Madonna in the early 2000s. Baby...One More Time and Dangerously in Love where insanely huge debuts probably on par with Mariah and Whitney's debuts. However, Britney's knee injury, failed marriage, mental breakdown and regression into a childlike state delayed all of her creative growth which she showed with In The Zone and Blackout. So that killed her chances. Beyoncé was huge from 2003 to 2009 and was in blockbusters like Dream Girls, Pink Panther, Austin Powers and Obsessed. When she released 4 which was a more experimental and adult album, she lost a lot of her mainstream audience and she then began focusing on her black and gay fanbase and using social media marketing. She was smart because it secured her longevity because her niche fanbase is very passionate but she lost a lot of her mainstream appeal in the process.

Her face is fucked forever. What a stupid cunt

I was like 12 when Madonna first hit with "Holiday.". I was there. She pulled one shocking stunt after another, and it was never about a double standard. No male celebrity ever did that shit. Notorious for bad behavior done purposely to attract attention. Stunt Queen!

Madonna and Michael Jackson were attention-starved narcissists with type A personalities. They worked hard, trained hard, surrounded themselves with other talented producers, writers and musicians and fought tough-and-nail to reach their positions and even sabotaged others in the process.

Madonna's legacy is fading and she's causing it herself. Once her older fan base dies out, she could easily be forgotten.

Youngsters today don't care about her. They think she's a joke. They have their own version of a musical entertainer/desperate stunt queen/narcissistic fairground stripper. Her name is Miley Cyrus. At least Madonna was never photographed pissing in public. I'll give her that.

Madonna actually has a really excellent catalog of pop music and experimented with so many different genres. Ray of Light, Bedtime Stories and True Blue and her debut shit on anything most pop stars have released. Madge should have kept the Ray of Light image of a mature and introspective singer or the Music/Confessions image of an older wise but fun-loving disco queen and just kept making pop music for adults. But she had to try to keep appealing to teenagers or trying to be this weird "artiste". She doesn't even have anything to say like she did with "Like A Prayer", "Papa Don't Preach" and "Material Girl". Hell, Madonna could have just been like Prince or George Michael and became extremely reclusive. And unlike GM, Whitney and MJ who's legacies were revived after their deaths due to them not releasing any significantly terrible music. Madonna kept releasing garbage music after garbage music. She dug her own grave really.

R102 MadameX is not garbage.

[quote] And on youtube, Madonna gets more daily views than Mariah or Whitney.

I just checked kworb and Madonna actually is behind both Mariah and Whitney in their average daily views.

R100; once again, this is a definition of a pop star. Everything described about Michael and Madonna, insert pop stars from the 40s until now.

R104 it’s holiday seasons. They always have higher viewerships during holiday seasons due to whir Xmas songs and album

R105 Yes but that's competitive streak is why they were so good at what they did. Also Madonna and Michael were stubborn perfectionists and not easy to work with. They had visions and plans for their career and albums and did not settle for what they perceived as mediocrity and got rid of anyone in their circle they felt held them back. They purposely went after their competition too. Even though Madonna's been declining musically, she is still in charge of her work and her final product and probably needs an editor if anything but she's been so successful she wouldn't listen.

A lot of current pop stars are very low-effort and do whatever their handlers tell them to do. There is no vision or meaning behind their work and they know they lack the talent and intelligence to assert any control over their product. They are often too drugged out too to know what they are doing.

Beyoncé and Taylor Swift are probably the ones with the crazy work ethic and perfectionism of Madge and MJ.

Taylor writes her material and knows how to get hits herself and tap into a broad audience, so that's why she is more successful.

Beyoncé is mostly an entertainer and focuses heavily on the entertainment aspect. Bey puts a ton of effort in her live performances and visual albums. She is currently unmatched in that regard. However she now just releases uninspired party/stripper music and doesn't seem to want to make the charts anymore and her last hit was that duet with Ed Sheeran.

Rihanna is lazy and only puts effort in when she feels like it. She's just lucky she's hot and got so many hitmakers to work with her. ANTI was a defining moment for her career and her first cohesive album that got seriously acclaim. So she's probably too scared of not living up to it and procrastinating because of it.

Katy is also a lazy artist and again benefitted from the hitmakers but she's aged out and boring now, so that ended her career.

Britney was initially very hardworking but never recovered from her breakdown and knee injury and she doesn't get any hitmakers to work with her. If she actually learned how to properly sing too, she could have lasted longer.

[quote] And unlike GM, Whitney and MJ who's legacies were revived after their deaths due to them not releasing any significantly terrible music. Madonna kept releasing garbage music after garbage music.

Michael Jackson released Invincible (very shitty) and Whitney did release stuff after My Love is Your Love that is pretty much forgotten. Someone needs to Madonn to death or run her over, she needs a tragic death to cause a revival.

[quote] Madonna's legacy is fading and she's causing it herself. Once her older fan base dies out, she could easily be forgotten.

Wrong, wrong, wrong. Madonna, like it or not, is a legend. And that's not fan worship, it's not hyperbole, it's just fact. Madonna has carved a place for herself in history forever and will be remembered and talked about and discovered by new generations long after she's gone. Look at women like Judy Garland, Marilyn Monroe, Bette Davis, Marlene Dietrich... all have been gone for decades, and all are still remembered, revered, talked about and part of the pop culture lexicon. Maybe in another hundred years that won't be so, but I doubt it. As long as there are still examples of their work for new generations to discover, they will be remembered and celebrated. Because they all did something worthwhile and earned that legendary status. And you cannot say that about just anyone who had a string of hit songs or movies. Hell, pedophilia couldn't stop Michael Jackson's popularity, before or after death. He's still an icon, his music is still revered and people have been creating shows about him for Broadway and Vegas.

Maybe it would happen with someone like, say, Robert De Niro, who has been watering down his reputation for the past twenty years (starting with Meet the Fockers) with one shitty movie after another, to the point that those are ALL a new generation knows him from because they're (somehow) hits. But most icons can survive a flop here and there or a quieting down of a career, especially when they've had such a lengthy and storied career.

Rihanna is scared of nothing, she is simply resting on the empire of her billion dollar FENTY make-up and fashion fortune. She will make a new album when she makes a new album.

[quote]Britney and Beyoncé are the closet things to become the new Madonna when it comes the the look, sexuality and entertainment values.

Are you kidding me? Both of those girls, particularly Britney Spears, were clearly more influenced by Janet. Britney was damn near Janet 2.0, the white version when she came out, and Beyonce has bitten off of Janet's imagery and choreography several times. All of then have, including Rihanna, Ciara, J-Lo...

[quote]Ray of Light, Bedtime Stories and True Blue and her debut shit on anything most pop stars have released

i'm currently obsessed with the unreleased madonna song "SHAME" that was left off the erotica album.... love it!..

she really should release all the cuts that never made the albums over the years!

You know what’s a better question? Madonna takes care of herself and is likely to live to an advanced age. Will she still get the posthumous career boost that her peers got if she dies at 85+?

Let's drown Janet in a bathtub and see what happens.

I think it's clear MJ will always be the King of Pop, Madonna will always be Queen of Pop, Elvis is King of Rock, James Brown is King of Funk, Selena is Queen of Tejano, Prince is his Royal Badness, Bowie is the Thin White Duke, Jim Morrison is the Lizard King.

Now the princes and princesses only rule in periods and there was so much overlap of successes and reigns due to the fact they are products of the music industry. None of them have rose to the highest ranks to be called King/Queen/Duke of anything.

For Prince of Pop: Bobby Brown was an early contender and reigned from 1988 to 1992, Usher had a reign of 1997 to 2005, Timberlake had a reign of 2002 to 2013, Chris Brown had 2006 to 2009, Bieber had a reign of 2009 to 2016, Bruno Mars had an understated reign from 2008 to 2018, Mendes had 2016 to 2019, Harry is currently reigning 2020.

The candidates for princesses are more numerous and had shorter life spans but these are the ones who managed to reach impressive numbers. For Princess of Pop: Britney, 1999 to 2009, Beyoncé, 2003 to 2009, Rihanna, 2005 to 2017(on hiatus?), Katy Perry, 2008 to 2014, Lady Gaga, 2008 to 2011, Taylor Swift, 2005 and still going strong.

Still I rise.

The poor thing at R117 forgot the one who begat most of the artists she named

R55: I’d say Madonna needs to do a hits tour and make sure it’s 80s/90s heavy. Then come out with a decent pop album again with songs with a tune and decent choruses. That’s all if she wants some chart success or to have more than her loyal fans at her shows who go to every tour. She’s never going to win over teenagers or even people in their 20s now but she might get old fans buying her music/going to see her shows again.

Madonna should have done a Greatest Hits tour the same year she did the Superbowl and then retired.

Shawn Mendes

[quote] Selena is Queen of Tejano

Like there were many competitors?

[quote] The poor thing at [R117] forgot the one who begat most of the artists she named

Michael Jackson was mentioned.

I don't know if Queen of Pop exists like it did during Madonna's heydey, given the fracturing of the market and the fact that everybody has everything at their fingertips all the time.

That said, when she retires or dies? I think a several queens of pop of varying degrees have been anointed at various times - Bey, Taylor Swift, Katy Perry, others? - who ever it is and no matter how long it lasts, it doesn't necessitate Madonna dying or retiring.

[quote]Michael Jackson was mentioned.

You tried it.

Just like you tried to walk up three steps, Jabba.

Madonna hasn't been the Queen of Pop for over a decade. Nielsen just released their list of artists with the most on-demand streams in the past decade and Madonna is nowhere to be found.

Artists with the most on-demand streams in the 2010's (via Nielsen's 2010's Year-End Report):

#1. Drake

#2. Post Malone

#3. Eminem

#4. Ariana Grande

#5. Future

#6. The Weeknd

#7. Taylor Swift

#8. Xxxtentacion

#9. Ed Sheeran

#10. Rihanna

So what? Madonna sold hundreds of millions of records. None of these people have.

Why are people lionizing gross pedo Jackson here? His name is a blight on pop history. Madonna is one of the few of her generation to survive. Pedo Jackson and Prince dead of overdoses. George Michael similar.

R128

Madonna is old and hasn't been musically important in over 15 years. So of course she isn't big on streaming services which are mostly used by young people. Also Madonna still makes music and it's not buying bought by anyone under the age of 50.

R130

Just because they had personal problems does not mean they were not hugely influential and popular. That's a completely irrelevant argument. Also MJ, George Michael and Prince were all much more talented than Madonna objectively speaking. Madonna is still alive but hasn't been relevant in over 15 years, so again that doesn't make a difference.

[QUOTE] So what? Madonna sold hundreds of millions of records. None of these people have.

And nobody will, in the streaming era. But Madonna's last decent era was in 1990. She hasn't been relevant since the 20th century. Adele and Ed Sheeran have had more longevity and success than Madonna and her mid 80s hits.

R128 is an idiot

[quote] But Madonna's last decent era was in 1990. She hasn't been relevant since the 20th century. Adele and Ed Sheeran have had more longevity and success than Madonna and her mid 80s hits.

You're a fucking moron and a shit stirrer. Madonna had success well beyond 1990. But you knew that.

[QUOTE] Just because they had personal problems, does not mean they were not hugely influential and popular.

Personal problems? MJ was a criminal. The most prolific pedophile in modern history. King of NOTHING but still worshipped by craven trolls like you.

Harry Styles?

I'm pretty sure it takes more than just physical sales to be dubbed "King" or "Queen" of anything. There has to some kind of impact or influence on society and pop culture that will last for generations. I really doubt Ed Sheeran, Drake, Taylor Swift and Beyoncé have changed anything about music.

Oh dear, the rabid Madonna Troll at R134 is pressed. Vogue was her last hit. She fell apart in the 90s and you can forget the 21st century.

R136

Harry Styles is the Prince of Pop for the 2020s!

R135 Stop thinking with emotion and use your logic. I do not worship him nor any human being or deity. I'm speaking facts. He was the biggest entertainer of the 20th century and still heavily influential. No need to be all overly hostile. You can choose to not listen to Michael Jackson's music and that's your choice. But it doesn't change his impact or legacy.

R137, what did Madonna's spazzy songs change? She didn't create a new genre of music. Just throwaway bubblegum pop.

[QUOTE] But it doesn't change his impact or legacy.

His legacy is that he abused 7 year old boys, pedo supporter.

R142 OK. I'm sorry I use logic and support facts and I can separate the artist from their personal life. Be happy letting emotions cloud judgments.

R141

How is Erotica, Bedtime Stories, Ray of Light, Music and everything after exactly "bubblegum pop"? Even her debut album was post-disco synthpop with a bit of a punk edge to it. The only time she was close to "bubblegum" was probably Like A Prayer and True Blue when she was appealing to mainstream suburbia but she never targeted teenage girls exclusively like Britney Spears and Debbie Gibson did initially.

[quote] Oh dear, the rabid Madonna Troll at [R134] is pressed. Vogue was her last hit. She fell apart in the 90s and you can forget the 21st century.

Oh dear, Jabba is back and liking its own posts.

I've been around for awhile and I've seen 3 musical Super Novas in my time: Elvis Presley in the 1950's, The Beatles in the 1960's, and Madonna in the 1980's. Never seen anything like them before and they simply can't be topped. They are immortalized, as the great musical icons that they are, forever.

I think there have been more than just those three artists as musical icons, R146, but those three acts did more than just make indelible music, they changed the face of culture. That's why they should be singled out over and above someone like Michael Jackson (though one could argue successfully that Michael broke barriers for black artists in music videos, which is something, but not quite the same thing).

Elvis pretty much broke a new form of music (Rock & Roll, even though he wasn't the first to perform it), The Beatles influenced nearly everything about art, music and culture (and continue to do so) and Madonna made it okay for women and gay men to explore their sexuality and to be seen and strong, powerful people.

I can’t imagine being such a vapid, shallow sissy with such basic, shit taste in music that I’d actually CARE enough to ponder the question, “who will be considered the ‘Queen of Pop’ once Madonna dies?”

Fucking MARY

[quote] Elvis pretty much broke a new form of music (Rock & Roll, even though he wasn't the first to perform it), The Beatles influenced nearly everything about art, music and culture (and continue to do so) and Madonna made it okay for women and gay men to explore their sexuality and to be seen and strong, powerful people.

Noteworthy here after the name “Madonna” is the lack of attribution for anything having to do with actual music.

[quote] Noteworthy here after the name “Madonna” is the lack of attribution for anything having to do with actual music.

Probably because the point of my post was further mentioning how those three artists, over and above music, were cultural icons. Rock and Roll is about far more than just music, and Elvis was responsible for everything that came with it.

But you're so fucking stupid, you don't even know that Jamiroquai is a band, so why should anyone listen to you?

Sam Smith.

I AM A THEY!

Okay, I'll admit I haven't read all 151 replies and someone's probably already covered this, but, OP, the answer is "no one." Not because Madonna is (was) more talented than every living soul under the sun and not because there aren't very talented pop artists around today. It's simply because Madonna had such a confluence of factors in her favor that were unique to her time in the world. She had such perfect timing, understanding how to leverage the power of music video age like no one else. No one single pop singer is going to have that kind of influence because everything is so much more fragmented now in music.

R153 Thank you for the logical answer! I xouldnr have said it better myself! 💯

*couldn't

Michael Jackson was a pedophile yes, but he wasn't as prolific as Jeffrey Epstein or Jimmy Saville.

[quote] Vogue was her last hit.

Hung Up topped the chart in a record number of countries as did Confessions on a Dance Floor--both released in 2005.

Don't bother with Jabba, R157. It is allergic to facts.

Madonna has been left in the dust. No longer relevant

Madonna hasn't been the Queen of Pop since the turn of the century. Beyonce was never really the Queen of Pop. Ariana Grande probably has the greatest claim at the moment.

I thought Madonna was bigger in the UK, but Rihanna has double the amount of certified sales in the UK than she does. She's also going to get passed by Adele and Ariana soon. I also thought that Kylie Minogue, Tina Turner, Whitney, Mariah and Celine would be bigger in the UK, but they aren't even in the TOP 10.

Highest certified female artists in United Kingdom:

#1. Rihanna — 41.2M

#2. Madonna — 28.06M

#3. Adele — 26.3M

#4. Beyoncé — 20.7M

#5. Ariana — 20.3M

#6. Pink — 18.6M

#7. Lady Gaga — 17.5M

#8. Nicki Minaj — 17M

#9. Little Mix — 16.8M

#10. Katy Perry — 16.7M

Rhianna's big "sales" are from streaming, no? Tina Turner retired in the late 1990s. And Kylie's career has been a bust for the last decade, she's only recently recovered in the UK.

Yes, most of that sales are streaming and digital singles. If you use an EAS (equivalent album sales) method, Madonna is number one by far.

R158, I'm waiting for Janbot to post some random, cherry-picked Janet stats.

My bad, Janbot was probably at the failed coup attempt earlier this week. Oh well.

Janet's last Hot 100 #1 was in 2001

Madonna's last Hot 100 #1 was in 200

Janet has the most recent #1 hit

Janet wins

*Madonna's #1 was in 2000

HAGdonna defending Janet

Janet's last hit song was Someone to Call My Lover in 2003. Madonna's was Give Me All Your Lovin' in 2012. Madonna wins. And It's amazing Janbot calls Madonna "HAGdonna" in a clip where she is defending Janet.

[quote]Janet's last hit song was Someone to Call My Lover in 2003. Madonna's was Give Me All Your Lovin' in 2012. Madonna wins.

Ahem...

ALL FOR YOU (2001) - Janet's last Hot 100 #1

The longest running #1 single of 2001

Grammy winner for Best Dance Recording

ASCAP award for Song Of The Year

Janet was titled the "Queen of Radio" by MTV as the song made radio history by becoming the first single to be added to every pop, rhythmic, and urban radio format within its first week of release.

MUSIC (2000) - Madonna's last Hot 100 #1

Nominated for a Grammy

Janet has the most recent #1

Janet wins.

Bestselling artists of all time, streaming included

Madonna #5

Celine #11

Mariah #16

Whitney #21

Britney #40

Rihanna #43

Taylor Swift #46

Adele #50

Beyoncé #56

Janet Jackson #61

Rub Jabba's face in that, R171. Just like you would a dog in its own shit. Or Jabba in its own shit, I'm sure.

No one under the age of 55 considers this talentless old whore queen of anything. Least of all pop. Most of the young people today don't even know who she is or are familiar with her songs.

Barbra #22

Lady Gag #71

Cher #67

Ariana Grande #104

[quote] No one under the age of 55 considers this talentless old whore queen of anything. Least of all pop. Most of the young people today don't even know who she is or are familiar with her songs.

I'm well under 55 and I consider Madonna the all time queen of music. Sorry, you fail.

Ariana is an excellent example of how a female artist nowadays is considered “successful”. She’s #104 on all time best selling list with 42.6 millions album equivalence (streams included)

Let’s look at the streaming. She’s the top female with most streaming at 22.3 billion streams which equal to 14.9 million albums (1500 song streams = 1 album www.riaa.com/gold-platinum/about-awards/

R173 this fag is not very bright I think

[quote] this fag is not very bright I think

Jabba finally admitted it's gay. But you should not use that word about yourself, even if you're not very bright.

Britney and Beyonce had the best chance. But Britney just didn't have the chops to last and Beyonce stalled.

Gaga has the most raw talent, and even the most composed talent, for sure. But she's too inconsistent. When she's good? She's better than anyone. But she dips. I will say, even her dips are damn interesting.

Rihanna is bad ass. She could have taken over, but I think she just got bored.

Taylor will have the numbers, but unlike Gaga, Bey, Britney or RiRi (or Madonna!), no one wants to be her. She doesn't inspire love or hate the way the others do.

Adele is her own pop beast.

Katy was always manufactured in the worst possible way.

Not sure about the new girls? Billie, Dua, Lizzo, et al. Too early to tell who's the next Gaga or Bey or the next Lorde or Megan Trailor.

[quote] Janbot finally admitted it's gay.

Faggot says what?

I'm so sick of these Madonna vs Janet feuds on here. Both are hasbeens now but their music is influential and they had long and impressive careers. Madge and Miss Jackson are cool with each other in real life too.

Now Madonna needs to eat humble pie. Return to her roots and maybe do some apologies. She needs to regain the public favor. Despite her age I think she could comeback and enjoy moderate success.

And Madonna is just unlikable too. She burned bridges and was nasty and rude about others in the press. When she was a young and hot she got away with it. But now her looks faded and she comes across as a mean old lady who yells at kids on her front yard.

Mariah is bitchy but has a sense of humor about herself that endears the public. Whitney despite her crack addiction was still polite and caring though she could throw shade like no other.

Madonna has no class. But it's not too late to learn

R170/Janbot, you're an idiot. 2003 is LATER than 2001, is it not? Stupid.

[quote] Rub Jabba's face in that

They should have included Shania and Enya too--they have both outsold Janet as well. Shania released like three albums her entire career.

[quote] Whitney despite her crack addiction was still polite

Uh, no she was not. She and Bobby Brown were constantly rude to people and disrespectful, especially as their drug addiction got worse.

[quote][R170]/Janbot, you're an idiot. 2003 is LATER than 2001, is it not? Stupid.

Stupid is you. I do believe that a #1 hit bests a #3 hit, or whatever position that tripe "Give Me All Your Lovin'" happened to squeak up to.

But you tried it.

[quote][R170]/Janbot, you're an idiot. 2003 is LATER than 2001, is it not? Stupid.

Stupid is you. I do believe that a #1 hit bests a #3 hit, or whatever position that tripe "Give Me All Your Lovin'" happened to squeak up to.

But you tried it.

[quote][R170]/Janbot, you're an idiot. 2003 is LATER than 2001, is it not? Stupid.

Stupid is you. I do believe that a #1 hit bests a #3 hit, or whatever position that tripe "Give Me All Your Lovin'" happened to squeak up to.

But you tried it.

That wasn't the point of that post. 2003 was Janet's LAST big hit. 2011 or so was Madonna's last big hit. That's more impressive than having your last hit 10 years before that. It's that simple. A number one doesn't mean nearly as much as you think it does. Think of all the number one hits that are now long forgotten.

Janet's last era of mainstream success as All For You in 2001. After AFY, she became more focused on the black community and got more play on R&B stations and she was starring in Tyler Perry movies. Jermaine Dupri's production style was more heavily R&B than Jam & Lewis who had more pop and rock elements. So Janet lost her crossover appeal after AFY. But trust me the black community did not forget about her. "All Nite", "I Want You", "Feedback", "Nothing" and "Call on Me" were hits on R&B stations and the music videos were on BET.

Janet's mainstream mojo waned post AFY because of the Super Bowl blacklisting, period. And even though that happened, she was still able to go on to release four more top 2 albums (2 #2s and 2 #1s) and score more dance #1s.

Honestly, Janet wasn't "cancelled" per se the mainstream media. She was still playing on R&B stations, starring in Tyler Perry films like "For Colored Girls" and BET and MTV both still aired her videos. Being blacklisted by the radio didn't stop Britney and Madonna from still being popular in the early 2000s. Britney was blacklisted by ClearChannel for a bit for very childish and petty reasons and Madonna pissed off many people during This American Life too.

Janet could have worked the Super Bowl controversy to her advantage and called out the racism and double standard. Most of the black community had Janet's back and many rappers and singers supported her. Hell, Madonna even defended her! I think Janet just didn't care that much and she was already rich and successful, so why bother? But she is still an influence especially in the dance-pop, hip-hop and R&B world where she is regularly sampled and imitated.

*by the mainstream media

Bestselling artists of all time, streaming included

Madonna #5

Celine #11

Mariah #16

Whitney #21

Britney #40

Rihanna #43

Taylor Swift #46

Adele #50

Beyoncé #56

Janet Jackson #61

Barbra #22

Lady Gag #71

Cher #67

Ariana Grande #104

[quote] Janet's last era of mainstream success as All For You in 2001. After AFY, she became more focused on the black community and got more play on R&B stations and she was starring in Tyler Perry movies. Jermaine Dupri's production style was more heavily R&B than Jam & Lewis who had more pop and rock elements. So Janet lost her crossover appeal after AFY. But trust me the black community did not forget about her. "All Nite", "I Want You", "Feedback", "Nothing" and "Call on Me" were hits on R&B stations and the music videos were on BET.

All of this is Jabba's longwinded way of saying Janet has been a flop for 19 years.

Maluma?

[quote] MTV both still aired her videos

MTV did not. They played All Nite briefly, but that was it. They didn’t really start coming around until four years later with “Feedback.”