Club Promoter and Murderer Michael Alig is DEAD TO ME!!

I do not give a shit.

I didn’t realize he was still alive.

Well how about that, the world got a special Christmas present.

The only surprise is that this fucker made it to 54.

Good.

[quote] I didn’t realize he was still alive.

He ain’t.

I really expected this guy to be around forever like a cockroach, or a grease stain.

Who?

Guh fa her.

I admit this was a surprise.

How did he make a living after his prison release?

Thank the gods. The way he behaved around that child drag queen, and the fact that that kid's parents ALLOWED Alig anywhere near their child, is disturbing.

Probably for the best.

It's the Macauley Culkin curse!

Slightly disingenuous to refer to his victim as “his drug dealer.” While thats [italic]technically[italic] true, their relationship was more than just drug dealer/buyer. Angel promoted his clubs heavily, too.

Sorry for the formatting error.

Clearly, heaven needed another angel!

I mean, another one, in addition to the one he killed.

I’ll save the bitchery. RIP.

He had a boyfriend? Creepy.

I mean, this was inevitable, right?

Meh.

My regrets to the corpse handlers.

The ironic part is that the seedy world of the Club Kids was probably due for a revival soon, given how COVID has shaken New York to its foundations.

Garbage person died. Next.

It’s unfortunate he didn’t suffer.

Just 17 years for killing AND dismembering someone? Sounds like a short sentence to me.

Welcome to New York.

Yeah, NY is not exactly known for being tough on criminals.

He killed a drug dealer. He had his choice between a cash award or 8 years off his sentence. He opted for the time.

Aaaaaahhhhhh!!!

I could have sworn he OD'd and died years ago

In all seriousness, what a terrible, sad life to have led.

The family of the man he killed will get good news today!

Gay icon.

The creepy pedo father who let little Desmond into Aligg’s life should have child services drop by for an investigation.

[quote] He had his choice between a cash award or 8 years off his sentence.

What the hell are you talking about?

r4, I'm sure he made it to Studio 54 MANY times, back in the day.

He died doing what he loved..

[quote]In 1996 he killed a drug dealer named Andre "Angel" Melendez, dismembered his body and threw it in the waters off Staten Island. He was served 17 years in prison and was released in 2014.

He must have been released on good behavior.

He wasn’t on Musto’s 2000 Celebrities list which was the coup de grace.

In New York you only get 17 years for killing and dismembering a drug dealer? The Sacklers better steer clear of that state.

This is truly the end of Camelot.

[quote]How did he make a living after his prison release?

Generous donations from taxpayers like you. He was a welfare queen.

All that and still managed to get a boyfriend. Take note DLers.

I had always hoped that he would be like one of Andy Warhol's stars and show up as a cameo in John Waters' movies.

I think even Waters had limits

Merry Christmas!

John Waters has more class than that. Outragous is one thing; murdering and dismembering someone is something different.

John Waters has more class than that. Outragous is one thing; murdering and dismembering someone is something different.

R47/48 here, Oh-dearing myself for outragous.

R47/48 here, Oh-dearing myself for outragous.

It works for someone named Gus.

"Just 17 years for killing AND dismembering someone? Sounds like a short sentence to me."

He's white. His victim wasn't.

A whole heavenly host of angels just got their wings!

I'd known him for years. Thoughts and prayers to him and his family. The terrible beast of addiction has left quite a trail. The Lord may bless all those concerned.

James St. James posted he's logging off twitter for a few days and everyone is consoling him saying they are "sorry for his loss."

No comment yet from Mrs. Patsy Ramsey, formerly of Boulder, Colorado.

[quote] Thoughts and prayers to him and his family.

You're wasting them on him.

He didn't age well, did he?

They aren't quite her crowd, R56

Was he a big fan of George Michael? Dean Martin? W. C. Fields?

for those in the scene, it's just a horrible, horrible ending to a horrible, horrible story. Judgements be forgotten, addiction kills. Literally. God rest Michael's soul.

R58, he looks better in OP's photo than he did when he was young, imo. I always thought he was ugly as shit back in the day. But that whole crowd was. I lived downtown and went out a lot during the same time, but despite that they were supposed to be the cool people, they always acted like assholes.

R50 - what does this have to do with Lillian Gish?

At least he died doing what he loved.

R61 he should have died in prison

Rudy Giuliani can’t be far behind right?

Has Macaulay Culkin commented yet? He played Michael in Party Monster.

After prison, he went to the worst place possible for him, which was back to NYC. There was no way he was ever going to go back to the Midwest, I suppose. In interviews he said he was homeless sometimes, and would turn tricks for money, and you can only do that for so long.

A very tortured soul. I'm sorry for his sufferings.

R12, what child? Whats the story there?

R66, I hope Rudy lives long enough to be charged and convicted of multiple felonies in NY state and or city, even if Trump pardons him for federal crimes. Rudy shouldn't get off easy by dying and not have to answer in court for his misdeeds.

A pedophile who killed a non-white man. Good fucking riddance. He should have gotten the chair years ago.

[quote][R12], what child? Whats the story there?

Desmond is Amazing. He's a drag kid.

Isn't there a point in a normal adult life when you say "hmmm, maybe I should straighten up and start acting like an adult"? Maybe I don't get addiction or why someone would be attracted to heroin in the first place but as I've gotten older I've cut back way back on drinking and such.

He actually was quite handsome when he was released from prison to his death. He had lived a rough life, but he was in shape (thanks to prison) and has beautiful features.

He was hooking after prison..late 40s to 50s?

Bitch still owed me drink tickets.

Say nothing but good of the dead.

Michael Alig is dead. GOOD.

I'd love to hear from any DL's who knew him or spent time in that scene. What are your stories?

To make ends meet, he was selling old club promotion material on Ebay and had a video type of show on YouTube, I think. The fact that he OD'd seems somewhat fitting to his end. He had a second chance at life, and a boyfriend, and still couldn't beat his addictions and demons, obviously. Every day waking up knowing you're hated probably doesn't help. Not sure where he was living or how he could afford NYC rent. I think he was also still trying to promote events. What else is he gonna do?

Anyhow, I've followed him for a long time, always had a fascination with the club kids, NYC scene, watched the movie and etc. I'm about 10 years younger. I don't know how to say it, but he was someone I read about a lot and was curious how his life would play out. It's fucking awful what he did, and he took everything beyond too far in terms of the indulgence and drug scene. RIP.

Why is half of Twitter treating this like a tragedy? The guy was a murderer.

R64, are you also r37?

[quote] Clearly, heaven needed another angel! I mean, another one, in addition to the one he killed.

Oooh......

[quote] He actually was quite handsome when he was released from prison

uh, no.

[quote] he was in shape (thanks to prison) and has beautiful features.

uh, also no.

R68 what sane person with eyes would pay to touch and be touched by this human vat of vomit?

Wow. I'm not 100% certain, but...

Last night on Instagram, celebrity makeup artist and former club kid Kristofer Buckle was doing a live stream and it was a fundraiser for St. Jude children's hospital. I could have swore that at one point Kris thanked a donor that had a similar name to Michael Alig and Kris said something like he hadn't heard from him in a long time. This was around 1 am ET. Kris hasn't posted today, but I'm sure he will mention it if that was him.

[quote] I could have swore

Don’t cuss, honey. It’s unbecoming.

Ahhhhhhh

Not on Christmas!

That someone would pay to have sex with him post-prison is almost as dark as what he served time for.

I knew Michael and was briefly on the periphery of those crazy motherfuckers in the 90s. None of that crowd ended up doing particularly well, save one or two people. But still - this is the final nail in the coffin of dark underground NYC. I’m not sad - just melancholy that once upon a time, NYC was such a fabulous, out of control wonderland for freaks and misfits like me.

Michael was always scary and the drug thing just wasn’t for me. They REALLY devoured all that shit like it was candy. My first exposure to him was at a renegade party at McDonalds in 1989 (you can see videos of it on YouTube). I was still a teenager and a busboy at the club Mars and he came on to me all wasted. I politely declined but I still would get invites to his parties when he saw me working. The best was probably Keoki’s birthday on the disco truck. They literally rented a huge semi in the meat packing district and the back of the truck was packed with all of us dancing, beneath this massive disco ball, Keoki DJ’ng and dropping something of the sickest beats. It was just off its tits awesome.

Now I’m an old man (49) and gaze back at that time ambivalently. It was definitely like a Fellini movie meets Dario Argento.

"A pedophile who killed a non-white man. Good fucking riddance. He should have gotten the chair years ago. "

But, it's all SO sad and tragic because he was an addict, apparently.

What was on his Walkman?

[quote] None of that crowd ended up doing particularly well,

Quelle surprise.

Ooh, R91, we probably have a lot of (possibly dead) friends in common. Yes, the infamous McDonald's and other outlaw parties.

Wednesday nights at (S)Limelight was a fave. I was on Marc Berkley's permanent guest list. I'm even in one of Lou Maletta's inane cable show clips shot there. Got caught smooching with a dude on one of the washing machines in the back room.

You worked at Mars? When Vin Diesel was a doorman/bouncer? Chip Duckett used to give away beers to get (then) twinks like me and my pals drunk so we'd take off our shirts and dance.

Alig was totally nutty. He actually did whirl through the club like a human blender, forcing people to move and stop S&Ming (standing and modeling).

Interviews with various club kids by Geraldo Rivera.

[quote]None of that crowd ended up doing particularly well,

Wasn’t Lisa Edelstein past of that crowd?

[quote]Wasn’t Lisa Edelstein past of that crowd?

I attended a Q&A where Edelstein was on panel and she mentioned that she was in the club scene - which was news to me - but when the moderator asked her more, she deferred him to that article at r97. She did say that it got her alot of negative attention and stalkers, so she left the scene, but was able to get an agent because she used her popularity to market herself. She's a very smart and savvy woman and you can tell she has a lot of stories.

I was living in Manhattan at that time and was so bored by the Club Kids--they just had nothing to say except for constantly announcing, "We're SO decadent, and we crave attention!" I didn't find them creative or glamorous--just tedious.

He’ll never get out of this K-hole.

God needed another angel this Christmas

Too bad he died before Trump could pardon him

[quote] Got caught smooching with a dude on one of the washing machines in the back room.

HARLOT!!

Original, r101.

Very original. Good on ya!

R103 Were the machines on at that time?

He always talked about original he was, but as far as I could see he was just doing for his parties what Leigh Bowery had done much better on stage, with none of the originality or genuine shock value.

r105 = Betty Draper

Has Susanne Bartsch issued a statement?

Yes, r95 I knew Vin and his brother too. But before Mars. My best friend grew up in the Westbeth building and was friends with them. I met Vin when I was like 15. He’s a great guy. We didn’t hang much at Mars because we were both working. Just chatted here and there.

And I’m sure our “toes touched” via that time and place. I was just another willowy androgynous homo boy though - didn’t really stand out. Too many of those characters either died or moved away. I got out early, finished college, settled down, found a career. Though I’m still in NYC, I’m now the kind of person a young me would’ve snickered at....but I’m so much happier. Ha. Crazy to think how absolutely nuts NYC used to be though. I hope you every once in awhile revel in the memories of that time. Not many people can.

No, R105. I didn't have any quarters.

R103, yes, and damn proud of it!

Thanks, R109. I'm still amazed we lived through it! Should have taken more photos of all the hotties I dated.

R91 and R95 More tales of that era please?

It sounds an amazing place to have passed through.

SHE'S FUCKING EXHAUSTING !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!

More later; I'm off to a very socially distant West Village Xmas party for four. We're each going to sit in different rooms and Facetime.

His hair...

SO BAD!!!

“Should have taken more photos of all the hotties I dated.”

R91 here one last time. Same here. Its haunting actually. I dated a guy who was one of the big Armani models at the time. When I moved out to LA for a few years, we lost touch.

I was stalking Facebook recently and found his sister - turns out the guy had just died. Suicide while Living in his mother’s condo in Jersey somewhere. It was like a gut punch. This guy was chiseled from marble and best friends with people like Rupert Everett and Marc Jacobs once upon a time.

And he died in some senior condo complex. Ugh.

You see a lot of guys in their 40s/50s dressed like him, still wearing their ironic 90s t-shirts

[quote] I’m now the kind of person a young me would’ve snickered at....but I’m so much happier.

It’s a shame the young don’t get that. Well, they do say “youth is wasted on the young.”

A murderer O.D-ing, God bless us everyone!

Thank you r67

r109 did Vin hook up with guys?

good

tidbits from another story

[quote]Michael Alig, 54, was found dead inside his Washington Heights apartment on W. 159th St. by his ex-boyfriend about 3 a.m. and called police, officials said. The ex-boyfriend said Alig had been doing drugs and some heroin was found in the apartment, police sources said.

[quote]“We did pour Drano in the bathtub along with baking soda, but we did not inject him with any Drano – nothing like that,” he told 1010 Wins in a 2014 interview. “You know, it makes a huge difference. There are people that I know that would not speak to me for the whole time I was in (prison) because they thought that was true.”

[quote]“Have I paid my debt to society? Legally, I have,” he said. “But morally and ethically, I mean, nothing short of, you know, them killing me, I don’t think anything is going to ever really balance out the scales of karma.”

[quote] There are people that I know that would not speak to me for the whole time I was in (prison) because they thought that was true.

Awww. Now I feel ba...OK, I’m over it.

He was always ugly.

I came here once I heard. MARY!

The linked article from TMZ says:

[quote] He had a troubled life. In 1996 he killed a drug dealer named Andre "Angel" Melendez, dismembered his body and threw it in the waters off Staten Island. He was served 17 years in prison and was released in 2014. Michael was 54. RIP

*HE* had a troubled life — he killed someone, you see. RIP?! Truly, what the fuck?

Words, sentences, writing — apparently nothing means anything anymore.

When I think of natural look makeup artistry, I think Kristofer Buckle

Gorgeous. Will the funeral bring out ALL the aging stars of la Demi-mondaine?

Couldn't find any good pics of him even when he was younger. His fashion sense did him no favors.

Sad news, but not unexpected.

Knew late Michael Alig back in the day and like everyone else was shocked when stuff hit the fan about Angel's death. But then again when you knew what was going on (drugs both selling and taking), along with everything else, as that phrase goes "murder was bound to happen".

As many ex-convicts find out being paroled does not mean one can go back "home" again. Yes, he did a horrible thing, and MA paid his debt to society, but the demons that drove him to that act (and everything else) never went away.

Michael Alig did try to turn things around after being released on parole with various levels of success; but again those demons are what likely did him in. Conditions of his parole meant MA was supposed to keep himself clean and away from drugs; obviously that didn't happen.

"socialite"???

What a loss to the world.

Leigh Bowery left several art legacies. Paintings of him by Lucien Freud, books of his fashion, art performances, costume designer for ballet performances.

I don't think Alig and Bowery had much in common.

What R36? Do you think Michael Alig had season tickets with The Roundabout?

Thanks [R131] he WAS cute and really knew how to kiss (not just ass, either). The drugs didn't turn him into scum, he brought that with him from the midwest, but they did make him even more callous than he was by nature. Agree with [R91] how looking back on that period is more bitter than sweet.

🎶 On the first day of Christmas my true love gave to me,

A Club Kid dead from OD. 🎶

Just to be clear, Angel's body parts were dumped in *Hudson River*, not waters off Staten Island.

If any of you old queens knew where Michael Alig lived at the time, along with knowledge of Manhattan you'd realize at once moving a decomposing body to banks of Hudson River was one thing, out to Staten Island would be a whole different matter.

It was Michael Musto who first aluded to Alig's involvement in the murder with a blind item!

[quote] Just to be clear, Angel's body parts were dumped in *Hudson River*, not waters off Staten Island.

The Hudson is also “waters off Staten Island.” The body may have been thrown in further north, but the current took it to near Staten Island when it was found.

As for the "light" sentence, Michael Alig pleaded guilty to first degree manslaughter, not murder.

In NYS as nearly everywhere else criminal charges are most always pleaded down one or maybe two levels. If defendant won't accept plea deal, then DA has to go to court and prove their case. Usually however they will in turn ask for maximum sentence be handed down (if state prevails at trail) as reward for all their efforts.

Murder either in first or second degree is difficult to prove because state needs solid motive and intent.

Back to Angel's body parts, some of it washed up on shores of Staten Island, which is a natural occurence of currents both of Hudson (or North) River and East River which both flow into NYC harbor then out to sea.

Atta girl.

J'adore Seth Green as James St. James in PARTY MONSTER.

I still use that 'circle the room twice looking for your friend' trick at social events.

Good riddance.

I would kill myself too, if I lived in Washington Heights. There's only so much indignity a man can take.

Always like watching Seth Green as Mitch Miller on That 70's Show.

R146

You don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

Will give you things may vary depending upon east or west of Broadway, but Washington Heights/Inwood area while seemingly far from all some hold near and dear is a great place to live. It still is one of the new areas left in Manhattan where one can find relatively affordable housing. Tons of gays live and long have lived up there including actors/those involved in performing arts.

Well, we know what section of Manhattan r148 lives!

[quote] Michael Alig pleaded guilty to first degree manslaughter, not murder.

He was sentenced to 10-20 years, so 17 years is about 85% of his sentence, which, in New York anyway, is rare. Must’ve not had a good record behind bars.

Did he off himself or was it accidental?

R149

Actually one does not live in Washington Heights nor Inwood, so there you are Miss. Cyril Clatworthy.

R150

People have been convicted of worse and spent less time in NYS prison.

Yes, r153, which is why I said it’s rare to do 85% of your sentence and also speculated he probably had a bad record behind bars.

Are you confused?

I used to see Angel Melendez walking around the West Village. Not a connection and I'm not a glamorous gay. But whenever I read of Alig I think "Angel Melendez" was a person, a human being, and he didn't deserve to die like that.

[quote] Did he off himself or was it accidental?

Was he seeing Rusty?

Word on the street:

A mafia hit.

He got caught with drugs a bunch in prison and fighting.

No "demons" affected Michael Alig. All his problems were his own and were caused by himself--his addictions, his murder of Angel, his subsequent jail term, his prostitution.

There is no such thing as "demons" in the real world, and to speak of them metaphorically to describe people's problems is only to enable and excuse very bad behavior that is the person's own fault.

And no, I do not "have a little sympathy" for murderers. Those of you who do should have your heads examined.

[quote] and fighting.

Vicious face-slapping?

What about Bella Bolski? She must be prostrate with grief.

What happened to Alig's co-killer?

R154

No, am not just pointing out some salient facts, in particular for those not from NYS.

Now please come down off that cross, it's getting chilly out and we need the wood to make a fire.

[quote]I still use that 'circle the room twice looking for your friend' trick at social events.

Well, are you the precocious one.

I apologize, r163. I really do.

I shouldn’t have sniped and for that I’m sorry.

R162 He behaved himself in prison and got out long before Michael. I believe he is higher education now with a focus on prison reform.

R162

This should answer some of your questions.

And this answers a few "WHET" queries in general

Who cares?

Bit of how things went down...

I am not going to lie, I am sad. I was an LA raver boy in the late 90's/early 2000's. When I saw the Party Monster documentary with the outlaw parties, taking over a McDonalds and having a party there, the creativity of the club kids, I was totally obsessed. Michael was a creative, interesting person before the drugs and a lot of the club kids have done things, Chloe Sevigny and RuPaul being some. It's definitely the end of an era.

Truth to tell days of "Club Kids" and that whole NYC nightlife scene of late 1980's through good part of 1990's was going to implode anyway. Antics of Michael Alig were simply the rash that broke out from a long festering disease.

It wasn't just the "Club Kids", but drugs were everywhere, any party gay, straight, mixed or whatever you had young people passed out and or overdosing on any given night at Limelight, Tunnel, etc... Young men and women (often bridge and tunnel crowd) still experienced bad or horrible things much of it in some way with drugs in background. Kids who just wanted to be part of the scene becoming stoned out on various drugs, abused, etc...

Peter Gatien's empire of clubs had long been in the cross hairs of NYPD and Manhattan DA's office as parents of those harmed (or died), local community groups and others were fed up.

Andre "Angel" Menendez had ties to Peter Gatien (Drug Dealer In Ordinary to Mr. Gatien's clubs) which came to light after feds raided and shuttered Limelight. The rest as they say is history... Angel's death not only helped federal case against Peter Gatien, but gave Rudy G and others the ammunition to launch an attack on nightlife pretty much across the board under guise of "quality of life" issues.

R115 What was the model’s name?

r148 If you can't afford to live in Manhattan proper, just go the fuck back to Iowa.

Humanity is better off without the Michael Aligs. They look great, but destroy themselves, and if they get into a position of influence, they destroy others.

I knew friends of Angel that were affected, and for years it was taboo to wear angel wings out in a club because it had been Angel’s signature look, people would hiss at you. If not the very end of club culture, everything definitely shifted after Angel’s murder. Suddenly, covers doubled at clubs because they needed to hire security, install cameras, or keep the lower rung druggy crowds out- and you were frisked or searched. I went to one of Michael’s parties at Limelight as a teenager and was absolutely hooked on NYC. Years later I moved from Boston.

I had spoken to Michael a few years ago (after prison) to commission a series of shampoo bottle labels that emulated his art work for a luxury brand I was promoting, but he came across as too flaky, distracted and unreliable, and didn’t seem very interested.

If you ask me, NYC nightlife died several year later when they closed Twilo the summer of 2000 because a medical student overdosed and the family went after the club publicly. At the time, Twilo was world renowned, had it’s own recording label, famous DJ residencies and was probably worth $10 million. Investing or reinvesting in mega clubs became risky once it was shut down. Clubs like Roxy, Earth/Exit and a reopened Limelight hobbled a bit after that but it wasn’t just Michael that killed the scene. Bottle service, wealthy neighbors complaining and one other curious thing- The iPod killed nightlife-

because suddenly you could capture everything you had heard on the dance floor the weekend before using Napster. The crowds waned because if you were kind of on the fence about going out, you didn’t because you had an IPod or office job to get to in the morning. This proved to be a very large margin of easygoing partygoers that would come early in the night- and left early.

Then all club promoters were left with was the hardcore party boys and their hard drugs like meth and GHB. Not an easy crowd to sell alcohol to or curtail from illegal behavior and quickly became messy.

I’m also going to say that Michael was a textbook addict, and didn’t come across as apologetic or genuinely regret his decisions. He seemed indifferent, and that because he was high, hadn’t slept or was delirious on drugs- he shirked responsibility. I would’ve liked to see him do volunteer work to help gay youths, change his life and go back to school, or put his nose to the grindstone and get a real job. He had the support, a roof over his head, and the friends that could help him but was internet on going eight back into the club scene. I don’t think he prepared well enough coming out of insular prison, wasn’t prepared for how much NYC has changed, didn’t realize he aged himself, and gave in to the temptations of drugs like meth.

I’m someone who always gives second chances but I’m surprised the people that helped Michael out of prison didn’t see this kind of hardheaded behavior or willful ignorance. I did.

He was INTENT on going RIGHT BACK to the club scene, where he could’ve applied his cunning marketing skills and street smarts a completely different way while sober, for youth, restaurants, small businesses, etc.

R146

"I would kill myself too, if I lived in Washington Heights"...

By what method?

I think we are seeing what really spelled the doom of club life. Clubs described as "world renowned" and DJ's described as being "famous" and having "residencies", as if they were an artistic expression rather than a commercial enterprises. This was an attitude that became current in the 90s and it could not hold. The club owners/promoters started to believe that their product had more cultural influence than it did. With this came an entitlement and flauting of the law.

Had clubs actually had the importance that the owner's thought, law enforcement and city codes would have eventually accommodated them. But the audience for clubgoing was actually very small and the decor, DJ's etc that they felt were so influential only influenced other clubs decor and DJs. So the clubs demanded a consideration that no one saw the benefit in giving.

I worked in that world and the collapse was easy to predict. We all knew that there just had to be only one or two scandals to destroy the whole house of cards.

^^^as one co-worker said, "No one ever gave a grant to develop a club." Yet, the true believers really thought of clubs as some high creative endeavor. Artists worked there---but it was our day job (so to speak).

Michael is voguing with Gitsie up in Heaven.

I wonder what his reunion with Angel was like, R182.

[quote] flauting of the law.

Oh, dear!

[quote] DJ's etc that they felt were so influential only influenced other clubs decor and DJs.

For the past few years DJ's have been the biggest they've ever been, pulling in crowds of even tens of thousands. EDM made them superstars, even more so than the likes of Paul Oakenfold ever were, and they moved beyond smaller clubs to larger venues. The clubs with DJs and big crowds are still a big thing in places like Ibiza, but sure, it's vacation time in paradise for most people going there.

An old Army buddy of mine Robert Scott used to hang out with some of the club kids. He killed himself in 1994 after way too much drugs.

When did djs go from being people who were interesting and knowledgeable about music to annoying people with no skills?

R70

here you go.

[quote] When did djs go from being people who were interesting and knowledgeable about music to annoying people with no skills?

With Spotify every one's an expert. But this started probably around the time people started DJing CDs.

Thanks for the dish, r176.

I can't believe Alig was actually offered money in exchange for his artistry but passed. Sounds like a drug addict in a bad place. That would be a dream come true for most artists. And talk about beggars being choosers!

I think I've heard you claim the iPod killed NYC nightlife before. Thank you for the explanation. But I also think the internet and social networking were the biggest force that killed gay nightlife because it happened everywhere else, too!

Whoever advanced the theory that the iPod killed the NYC club scene is an idiot. Because you could suddenly get the music you heard at the club on Napster and play it at home, this moron claims? The vast majority of people were not going out because of the specific music they just had to find some way to hear, nor would suddenly having more access to or personally owning that music stop them from doing so. No one went to Limelight to hear the mostly crappy homemade techno they played there (though it did provide the perfect soundtrack for the dark drug fueled debauchery which took place). It was a group social experience, dummy.

Many of the reasons the scene died are offered in other posts. One of them not mentioned much is the increasing amount of gentrification which replaced and/or priced out many of the creative artistic types that attended and fueled the energy of the scene and attracted others to the clubs. The simultaneous Manhattan real estate boom lost many big venues, Palladium, Roxy, Limelight, USA, Area, Tunnel, Sound Factory/Twilo, Roseland etc. Nothing has or can replace them now. Also as gays assimilated more, gay clubs and that whole gay aesthetic which drove much of the underground energy (like the Club Kids) became scarce and irrelevant. It was this and many other reasons, but definitely not the iPod .

r180 sounds like a judgmental prisspot who hates art in general.

You say the club scene in NYC had no clout or influence and it was "easy to predict its downfall," but NYC always had a thriving, multi-billion $ club scenes that sold music and style to the entire world before the internet, Giuliani, Bloomberg and the plutocratic takeover / gentrification of Manhattan.

Just the disco era alone had tremendously good and important musical scenes making tastes for the entire world, such as Studio 54, Paradise Garage, Limelight (which started in the '70s, BTW), etc. The Splash Bar may not have been cool, but it was a money maker that lasted later than Limelight and even a club in my podunk town ripped off the entire name and concept for a "Splash Bar" of its own.

So most people love music and have enjoyed and paid for music from NYC discos. Hip hop was invented there! Your predictions and criticisms don't apply to most of these clubs and musicians most of the time they were around.

The trouble is, nightlife is always competitive and morphing, with different scenes peaking and ebbing. Nothing can stay the "coolest scene" forever -- especially as generations change.

The reasons for Limelight's demise are unique and pre-internet. The Club Kids chose the raver outlaw scene — where part of the fun was/is breaking the law and throwing surprise parties in illegal places. That's an unsustainable niche that's uniquely prone to bust-ups.

Watching the documentary about the murder was interesting but really chilling too. I have no sympathy for Alig, but neither do I have any for most of the others in that world either. The way none of them really seemed to care about the guy who was murdered left a really horrible taste in my mouth.

It must have been a shock to go from the anything goes NYC of the 80's and late 90's. to the sensitized Pottery Barn/Duane Reade, instagram friendly world it is today.

[quote] Just 17 years for killing AND dismembering someone? Sounds like a short sentence to me.

I don’t get how murderers get such short sentences but cult leaders who’ve never killed anyone like Keith Raniere get 120 years.

[quote] Many of the reasons the scene died are offered in other posts.

Seems like why the scene died and why DJs got lame are separate concerns

I forgot that my cat, Gitsie, was named after the ClubKid. I didn't think the kitten was going to make it, but she did- a fat 15 year old in the next room.

[quote]Just the disco era alone had tremendously good and important musical scenes making tastes for the entire world, such as Studio 54,

I made it past the velvet rope several times during the Rubell era.

Not all that.

It's difficult to find sympathy for someone who murdered and dismembered somebody over drug debt; it is, however, a sort of poetic justice that he ended up dying from a heroin overdose.

Good!

How’s that drag kid he was grooming?

I've been reading about this much of the night. By many accounts he was an all around asshole. Besides the whole murder thing.

Interview with Peter Gatien (April 2020)

Heroin. You know, horse, black tar, brown sugar, diesel, dirt, Golden Girl, smack, hero...

On the one hand, he was a murderer who dismembered his victim's corpse. On the other hand, he wore fugly costumes and make-up when he was young. So, it's difficult to arrive at a verdict on him.

Thanks for sharing that ElderSage.. loved reading.

R195, perhaps the sentence is due to the fact that people thought the victim "deserved it" - it might have been a different story if he had killed a little old lady or some saintly person

[quote] for years it was taboo to wear angel wings out in a club because it had been Angel’s signature look, people would hiss at you.

Those were just Dataloungers saying hello, dear.

r195 = obviously a member of the NXIVM cult

[quote] On June 19, 2019, the jury found Raniere guilty on all charges after five hours of deliberation.[87] Raniere was found guilty of: *Sexual exploitation of a child and possession of child pornography with regard to minor victim "Camila"; *Sex trafficking of "Nicole", attempted sex trafficking of "Jay"; * Identity theft against Edgar Bronfman, James Loperfido, Ashana Chenoa, "Marianna", and Pam Cafritz; * Trafficking for labor and services of "Daniela"; forced labor of "Nicole"; *Conspiracy to alter records for use in an official proceeding; and *Sex trafficking conspiracy, forced labor conspiracy, racketeering conspiracy, and wire fraud conspiracy. Raniere was sentenced to 120 years in prison on October 27, 2020.

[quote] A number of Raniere's alleged lovers suffered untimely deaths. Gina Hutchinson was found dead of a gunshot wound to the head. Kristin Snyder disappeared and was last seen at a NXIVM event. Live-in girlfriends Barbara Jeske and Pam Cafritz both died from what was diagnosed as cancer at the time, but is alleged to have actually been subtle poisoning. Raniere's partner Kristin Keeffe survived cervical cancer. In 2009, Raniere was filmed claiming "I’ve had people killed because of my beliefs." In 2019, Investigation Discovery aired a documentary titled "The Lost Women of NXIVM", speculating that Raniere committed homicide. According to that program, a woman who lived with Raniere and developed bladder cancer submitted a hair sample – that sample reportedly revealed the evidence of dangerous levels of bismuth and barium

[quote] made it to 54.

He didn’t, it was Danceteria and the Limelight for him.

Well you can't rescind the record sales of disco acts from Studio 54, r198, or all of the powerful celebrities and government figures who hob-knobbed there. You're in total denial of the wealth generated by NYC clubs and musicians, which means you're just a crude hater.

Crime of murder is the unlawful killing a person especially with malice aforethought. Thus a murderer is someone convicted of committing the crime of murder. Michael Alig plead guilty to manslaughter, making him a convicted killer if you will, but never a murderer.

Uh-huh, R212. Tell that to Angel's butchered corpse.

Precisely r206. I'm not sure why we should feel much sympathy for a drug dealer who made money from destroying people's lives. Both he and Alig sound like shits.

I've really enjoyed the contributors, who were there, partying, in the 80s 90s and 00s.

Lots of factors contributed to the demise of these clubs. Drugs, gentrification, clubbers growing lack of disposable income, the attitude of authorities, changes in tastes of clubbers, the internet, etc.

One thing is sure, that these places left their mark culturally.

r153 That looks like Elton John.

Wasn't Michael's mom a prostitute?

r171 I remember hearing that Michael didn't like Chloe Sevigny.

I’m going to have to dig out my copy of Disco Bloodbath/Party Monster by James St. James and reread it.

As usual for DL there are multiple threads on same subject.

Trust Michael Musto (who was there from the start and thus should know), to write what one has seen to date as one of the best summing up of things.

Mr. Musto's article also fills in some of the blanks in terms of questions posted in this thread about what MA as up to since being released from prison.

R220 That article is behind a paywall.

I hate when people post paywalled articles.

Me too, because they're usually the ones you want to read.

Actually Musto's is the only take on this event I care to read.

r39 He was. It was on the bottom, not the main alphabetized section of the list.

Actually you two old paywall queens article worked fine for me, as stated link came from another DL thread. So I guess it's you that have to be worried.

Call your young nephews or nieces, get the grade school kid next door or down the block, someone to show you how to adjust your browser settings to get around paywalls.

See R57

R266 Is that what you had to do?

I recently learnt a trick about how to read articles behind a paywall - quickly click on the X loading/refreshing thingy (usually on the left of the URL bar) to stop the page from loading fully, before the "subscribe to read this article" pop up appears. It doesn't work on all sites but it does on many - the Musto article, for example.

How did these kids pay for their outfits, drugs etc? We're they working 9-5 or were they hustling?

I guess if that scene was existent today, they'd probably have a full range of social media and be called influencers now.

R214, even if Angel was a shit, he didn't deserve to be murdered and have his body chopped up and thrown in the river.

R230, we shared apartments 3-4 people and had more dispensable income, you could get a job waiting tables or working at a dept. store and still make decent money. I remember rent being only $600 for a 1 bedroom. I traveled to the city every single weekend. Also, many of these kids didn’t live right in the city but out in Jersey/Queens/Bronx where it was much cheaper and stayed with friends in the city on the weekend. There was a lot of grifting and whoring old men as well- I remember several well kept young men that had a few older gentlemen payroll them.

Then there was dealing drugs. Most of it was innocent enough but inner city kids didn’t have much of a choice if they weren’t in college. NYC was cheap but all of us worked 2-3 jobs and working in a club meant free drinks, a bit of prestige and cutting the lines but very little real money. The smart kids stayed in school and pulled back when things got a bit messy, many of us didn’t have that support.

Quite simply put, the over the top looks masked insecurity and a wanton release from the looming threat of AIDS. A lot of these kids (and myself) came from broken homes or parents that didn’t support them. In a way we supported each other, I had a bunch of friends that would loan outfits and makeup they kept on hand, and it was a lot more of a community then. Drugs lubricated everything and kept us gong into the early morning and from club to club. They were also A LOT more diluted than today and you didn’t really have to worry about overdosing. E came imported from Amsterdam labs and K came from a vet’s office with the label. There were no synthetic Chinese drugs or mega potent pot.

Saying “the iPod killed NYC nightlife” is abbreviating the truth- this was pre Google and smartphone, but at the very brink of the World Wide Web which dawned a year later in 97 and wasn’t widely embraced until 2002. But you still had to sit behind a clunky computer and dial up to connect using the internet- it took forever and you had to wait for pages to load! In a way, I think things will never be the same because that kind of ambition, ebullience and urgency doesn’t exist anymore because the wild youth of today can connect and express to others like themselves from the lap of their own home now. I know I sound like an old geezer, but it’s just not the same.

We had to do it in person to get the “likes”.

No one said he deserved it r231, but he chose a reprehensible life of high risk in which he didn't care what damage he did to others. This is in response to some of the people on this thread who are morally outraged at his killing. They're not much different from those who are trying to make excuses for Alig because he had "demons".

As someone I knew at the time said to me, post 9-11 club life in NYC was just a miniscule group of people trying to hold onto a moment that had passed a long time ago. As r18 said, while Ibiza truly is a party goer's paradise. Manhattan the emphasis is on your career and work-work-work. Leaving clubs like Twilo not as the sun came up but after the sun had been out for a while, passing those faithful old geezers handing out flyers for next week's party, was a harsh reminder that they were no longer in paradise. South Beach is the US' answer to Ibizia, not Manhattan. where funky retail one off stores and diners were quickly being replaced by nail salons, IHOPs and banks that were actually glorified ATM machines, and it'slargely about 9 - 5 and corporate and career. Or as Andrew Holleran so rightly put it in Dancer from the Dance, you'd be walking home by yourself heading east in the east village at 7am,, whole everyone around you was walk walking west to catch the subways that took them to their jobs.

Then Junior took up "residency" at the aptly named Exit, located in a bland, bum-fuck nosebleed part of Hell's Kitchen, where as soon as you left you never saw your communal co-horts anywhere in the city, ever. As if it were all a dream, and crashing from your drugs, until next weekend. Security was so tight, I knew a drug dealer who would give his entourage uninflated balloons and condoms filled with X that they would put up the butts suppository-style to get past security. Talk about taking all the fun out of it! Junior's music got so bad you couldn't dance to it. One morning someone threw a glow stick aimed at him in his custom-made DJ booth and he stopped the music. He had succumbed to the insidious nature of crystal and later admitted as much—"Thee's only room for one bitch in the DJ booth, not two!" That was the end of the end.

R232 ElderSage I could listen to your stories of yore all night long. I figured that guys made the best of what they could.

We had a similar lifestyle in London. The club's were rocking, the rents affordable. Weekend party guests were a plenty. I remember walking over bodies crashed out on Sunday afternoon on the floor of my flatmate and my flat. Drugs were good, E was plentiful and cheap. They have you a lift, but didn't zonk you out. Those were good days.

Anymore stories? Honestly, could listen to you forever!

R235, there was a week I dated a Russian billionaire that looked just like a young Dolph Lundren. He met me bartending and after the 3rd $50 tip, his cuter friend introduced me to him. He fell head over heels over me and invited me to New York to the front row Prada at fashion week and promised to buy me the whole season.

At the time, barbed wire and dogs couldn’t keep me out of Twilo every weekend- I wanted nothing to do with him and was fond of the angelic Puerto Ricans throughout the club and roaming free and unencumbered...

I dated the guy so I could go out to some of the finest restaurants, and was really intrigued- only to discover he wanted to “own” me. I met the girlfriend he broke off with and hung out at a dinner where he and 40 of his closest friends cordoned off half the restaurant. This was slumming for him. He’d wear $60K of clothing on his back and made a point to tell me.

Once he showed up to our date with scratches all over his hands, when I ask him what happened, I found out he had a private zoo and a silver fox that attacked him when he tried to feed him. He also kept hummingbirds and had to force feed them using a plastic syringe in the morning.

I didn’t want to be that fox or hummingbird. He called me a whore and I gladly took it as a compliment, lol.

Lol Oh that's a great story R236. You were well shot of him if that was his intention. I do think objectifying people is so wrong.

Did he not want to visit your world and experience the sights and sounds of Twilo?

RIP

They always annoyed me. Clubs died because of people like them - even before the internet. They morphed into the bottle service people who just wanted to be seen.

Clubs existed for people to DANCE. Dancing was what kept clubs alive. Many of us had real jobs and worked hard even back then. But we went out 3-4 nights a week to clubs to dance and meet hot men while dancing. And we paid full price for drinks and cover (which is what kept those clubs open - not the free drink ticket “club kids”). We had zero interest in those attention-starved annoying “club kids”. In fave we fact avoided the Limelight because it was filled with them and stupid cheesy gimmicks like the foam room. It wasn’t about dancing

Sound Factory, Sound Factory Bar, Twilo, Roxy were about DANCING. They were filled with paying customers every weekend - everyday gay men who held real jobs and lived normal lives (and yes did the drugs that were sold openly in the bathrooms). But people just stopped dancing. I honestly don’t know why.

What killed gay clubs for me in the early 00s was the gentrification of gay areas, clubs being shoved to new locations to make space for expensive stores and the infiltration of young straights. Yes, I know they wanted to come because their own clubs were so dreary. We were pushed out but I guess that’s what comes with being “accepted” by society.

[quote]Well you can't rescind the record sales of disco acts from Studio 54, [R198], or all of the powerful celebrities and government figures who hob-knobbed there. You're in total denial of the wealth generated by NYC clubs and musicians, which means you're just a crude hater.

No, Sweet Pea, I'm just not impressed by money, fame or position. The big thing about 54 was gaining access, nothing more. It was an old partially renovated building with sweaty people dancing, drinking and doing drugs.

With that attitude, I'm guessing you never made it in?

Studio 54's heyday was long before the club kids era. It was still open by the time they came along, but had none of the cachet of the Steve Rubell years before 1980, when Liza and Halston rubbed elbows with Betty Ford and Valentino. Rubell went to prison and that scene became basically a tourist attraction for out-of-towners who wanted to go home and say they'd been there, even though Bianca Jagger and Jackie O were long gone.

I’ll never forget working at Pat’s that summer and Michael coming in to have Danna do his hair upstairs at the salon. We all knew what had happened. Michael Musto’s article hadn’t been published yet. We were all on edge. It was like the elephant that wasn’t in the room. We didn’t know what to do or how to act. He came in and personally gave me a small jar of Honey. The invite to his last party. The Honey Trap.

[quote] We were all on edge. It was like the elephant that wasn’t in the room.

Wait. What?

[quote] Michael Alig plead guilty

Oh, DEAR!

Great post r232! Things were much better and more fun when you actually had to go out to meet people, and have real conversations face-to-face. Sitting in front of your phone or iPad or whatever in a room by yourself 24/7 isn't healthy, imho. You're not really participating in life and in the larger world.

We've had a similar experience of clubs closing down over here in London. Many of the club's have gone due to them being held in buildings now long since demolished for new shops or apartments.

It's so sad that they've gone in such numbers.

Unfortunately, r241, "money, fame and position" IS what we were talking about from r180 and Studio 54 was "all that," contrary to your judgment @ r198.

r180 was arguing that NYC clubs were never "commercial enterprises" with no significant cultural influence and that's simply not true —‚ not even of the Club Kids.

Their scene died because of too much criminality and r180 belittles the entire music and club industries.

I read in one of the articles, can’t remember which one, that a club kid gave an idea for a party theme to one of the club owners. He promptly got paid $500 cash.

If true, that would be a tidy income.

[quote]Unfortunately, [R241], "money, fame and position" IS what we were talking about from [R180] and Studio 54 was "all that," contrary to your judgment @ [R198].

Honey, it was just a nightclub.

Cellphones killed dancing. Who the hell wants to become a meme?

Most of the themes went to staff to figure out. Another bartender and I would throw candy, light up toys and Furbys on the bar, one time we bought kid laser tag rigs that were on sale. We had a Titanic theme with cute sailor hats and camped it up. The lounge I worked in had plenty of dark spots and the dealers would tip me in coke to be able to work the room unimpeded.

As a bartender the goal wasn’t to sleep with anybody, but to quickly separate drunks from their money and go have fun after hours.

R252 Sage words. We used to have Lovemuscle in London at the Fridge in Brixton, where Lee Bowery used to go too, which was our most hedonistic night, I guess.

The drug dealers used to be on the top floor sitting at tables selling their ecstasy pills.

I bet I used to know you, ElderSage, or someone just like you. I was one of the boys who'd do your make up and make you an outfit, provided you amused me, or had really good coke.

I parlayed it all into a career as a costumer, and the old me would think I was so boring!

It was so much fun, and then it wasn't. Got out with my life, which many aren't here to say. I feel old tonight, but lucky.

R254 Tell us more. How did you get your costume ideas? Who did you dress. Where did you go? etc.

I love how "club promoter" is not only included in this man's description in OP's title, but comes BEFORE "murderer."

Priorities.

If anyone feels like summarizing the 256 previously replies in this thread so I don't have to, I'll buy you a $25 Olive Garden gift card.

You should have come back to SouthBend Indiana

I can't imagine Pete being a Party Monster!

r226 r229 It works fine now. I don't know why it didn't previously.

So these Club Kids, how did they choose their styling, week on week?

Was there a theme that they went with, or were they just outrageous random consuming each week?

Gay.com launched their chat lines in 1997 invading AOL's territory who already had sizable lock on chat rooms, and things only went down hill far as bars and maybe even clubs ever since.

True everyone was largely still on dial-up connections using personal computers with huge monitors, but still the die was cast.

Not everyone had cell phones back then; you'd call someone hour after hour to see if they wanted to go out and got a busy signal. Maybe next day or whatever you finally ran into them or got them on phone and asked about the other night and got same story every time; " I was on "X" chat and met this man/boy......"

Year 1997 is also when club Life opened in former Village Gate jazz club space, thus began the era of bottle bars in NYC.

Rudy G. was busy shutting down every large club he could, and NY wasn't issuing new cabaret licenses (which you need to have a dancing in a bar or club that serves booze), so these small spaces that already had such licenses found it easy to move into bottle bar type things.

Some of the same promoters still had parties at Life or wherever, but because these bottle bars were smaller and more intimate spaces, nature of the parties changed. There was just as much drugs, sex and so forth going on at Life as say Limelight or Tunnel, but because space was smaller obviously less people were involved.

Thank you R262 for that appraisal.

Looks like the gang was all there at Steve Lewis's b'day party last February....

Spies spotted Lewis getting spanked by a dominatrix while chained to a cross, as two women performed a sex act across the room, a source said.

So we're these event polysexual affairs in the 90s?

So this is finally the end of the end of the end of the end of the end of an era that has endededed?

R256, if you look at the title of the linked article, murderer wasn’t even in it.

I would have been the king of New York club nightlife if my parents had bought me a co-op and paid for cabs too and from the clubs.

R267 = William Barr: “no collusion” between the Trump campaign and Russia, ... all allegations of collusion have been “proven false.”

Just because a lawyer says a murderer didn't murder someone, it's not necessarily true.

That wasn’t my point at all, r269.

Someone said in OP Club Promoter was put before murderer and joked, “priorities.” I pointed out that the article that was linked didn’t even deign to call him a murderer, whereas the OP did.

[quote] paid for cabs too and from the clubs.

Oh, dear!

OK, I'm sorry for the offense, R270. Mea culpa.

Not an issue, r272. No offense taken.

He wasn’t convicted of murder, you twat!

Well manslaughterer doesn’t have the same ring to it.

🙄

I haven't seen teve Lewis in years, I wish I had known about his birthday party.

Steve lived on the roof of the Hotel Chelsea. You took the elevator to the top floor, got out, walked up a long flight of stairs out onto the roof, and his funky one bedroom (with a loft) with its own entrance was hidden behind the cornice. He would invite club employees over after the club closed to hang out, which usually meant making a few drinks and sitting outdoors and just gabbing and socializing. Totally innocent fun as the sun came up. He is a very nice man.

*Steve

Has Diana Scarwid commented?

But did he have a big cock?

Top or bottom?

These threads burn out after 300 posts now? What has this site come to?

To be fair, R280, most of "these" threads aren't about a loser most DLers either never heard of or don't give a shit about.

He had opportunities and the requisite skills to have launched a brilliant career -- opportunities most people never get close to -- and unlike most felons, when he got out of prison, he had MORE opportunities to launch a brilliant career.

There's only so much gossip about this low-life killer that most people can stomach.

R281, to be fair Alig is one of the most notorious gay killers. I assume it's mostly the younger crowd who's never heard of him.

R276

Days of passing out paper invites are (obviously) long gone for most part. These people all are on FB if you want to reconnect and or be kept in the loop.

[quote] Well how about that, the world got a special Christmas present.

I guess there really is a Santa Claus after all, and that list thing he keeps with everyone’s names, really is true

That Musto piece is light as fuck.

At least he went doing what he loved.

Reprint of 2006 New York Magazine article......

I think his contribution to the New York nightlife scene cannot be understated.

I think his contribution to macrame cannot be understated.

I think his contribution to car cleaning cannot be understated.

I think his contribution to stacking chairs cannot be understated.

(Is the game to attribute pointless accomplishments?)

R289 But his cultural accomplishment on the NYC night scene wasn't pointless.

It's documented and will be in the history books long after you and I are gone and forgotten.

R282 I would not be surprised if younger LGBT people in their 20s had not heard of him or have never seen party monster, read the book, or do not know who any of the club kids are, except for Ru Paul who would go out clubbing but was not a club kid. I wonder if they know who Lady Bunny is?

R291, these are strictly NYC phenomena. Outside of the tristate area, no one was invested in Alig or Lady Bunny.

Maybe Lady Bunny will appear in the same history books as Michael Alig.

R292 I am in New Zealand and knew all about it. At the time.

Speak only for yourself.

I'm in London too and we were trying to emulate that edgy NY party culture in the 90s and 00s.

There were DJs, club promoters etc, moving between the UK and US, trying to pick up the latest trends. We'd had the emergence of the Berlin party scene too. Was a very exciting time to be partying.

[quote] I would not be surprised if younger LGBT people in their 20s had not heard of him or have never seen party monster, read the book, or do not know who any of the club kids are, except for Ru Paul who would go out clubbing but was not a club kid. I wonder if they know who Lady Bunny is?

I'm a gay guy who was of that era and even at the time I couldn't have given a fuck about the club kids. There were a lot of us back then who thought the whole scene was a bunch of fucked-up druggies with toxic personalities and we had better places to go at night.

I was a kid then and knew all about it

I thought the club kids were all spoiled rich kids like Lisa E, who's parents bought her a coop when she couldn't hack living with a roommate in the dorm.

That's why I asked about how they financed their costumes, drugs etc.

I suspected that some came from financially stable families.

Others obviously got by as best they could.

[quote] like Lisa E, who's parents bought her a coop

Oh, dear!

He wasn't all bad then.

"That's why I asked about how they financed their costumes, drugs etc."

I suspect that some 2nd tier Club Kids like Angel got into drug dealing to finance the Club Kid lifestyle, because in order to be part of the in crowd you had to be able to afford costumes and drugs. Like I said, when people like Alig become influential, they destroy others as well as themselves.

R302 So it all implodes on itself?

*Update*

GFM fundraiser has begun to pay funeral expenses for late Michael Alig. His mother is disabled (he died on her birthday), and from what am hearing any surplus funds remaining will go to Mrs. Alig.

wow that fund is building quickly!

Despite what some posting on DL and elsewhere would have world believe Michael Alig was loved, had friends and others who cared. From what one is hearing from various sources no one wants to see his remains end up on Hart Island (pauper's grave).

Then there is matter of Michael Alig's estate. Read something in local NYC media (cannot find it online) that MA had artwork and perhaps other possession in a storage locker but didn't pay the bills. So storage place has things locked up and won't turn them over until tab is paid in full, that or suppose like other "unclaimed" things in storage they will be sold off at auction. There is an effort underway (IIRC from media piece) to pay off the outstanding bill so MA's legal heir (his mother) can get the artwork and whatever else was in that storage locker.

[quote] From what one is hearing from various sources no one wants to see his remains end up on Hart Island (pauper's grave).

Oh, please, no one gives a shit where he ends up. I’d say dump him in the East River like he did to the kid he killed, but it’s polluted enough already.

Should we have a whip-round for him on here and then contribute to the Gofundme?

R307

No dear, that's just you and rest of bitter old queens on DL. As the fundraiser on GFM proves plenty do care and are giving what they can.

r289 is just a hater troll who disrespects any and all night life, clubs or NYC music because it's not getting laid.

You can see it @ r180 claiming that Club Kids had no cultural influence and the NYC club scene was "doomed" because it was never a "commercial enterprise," when, in fact, NYC night life and music was a multi-billion-dollar, worldwide commercial enterprise.

It hates music, it hates clubs, it hates sex and it hates gays. It's just looking to brand anything in the entertainment industry a "cess pit" as it does on every, other showbiz thread. It knows nothing of the 20th century. It has as much chance of having "worked in that industry" as the "Life-long Biden voter who just thinks Biden should stop Hunter's pedophile ring in the Ukraine."

In what universe can r299 not conceive that the average person could afford the cheap costumes the Club Kids made from tin foil and vending machine candy necklaces?

Haven't you seen everyone dig up a costume for Halloween? Haven't you ever been to a rave?

In the 90s, raves occurred at least every month in the Western World. Half of the people made costumes from cheap, dime-store and thrift-store crap.

Is r299 the Darfur Orphan?

I would have thought that there was a full range of courture costumes and some that kids made at home from what little they had or could afford. Although they were important, I think that the music, the attempt to identify and acceptance within that crowd were more important. I sense an egalitarian elitism were at its heart.

To the poster asking who the model was that committed suicide I think his name was Ambrose something. Yes, Ambrose Olsen.

That's a shame.

[quote] [R307] No dear, that's just you and rest of bitter old queens on DL. As the fundraiser on GFM proves plenty do care and are giving what they can.

Well, goody for them, but i don't think I'd brag about giving money for the funeral/burial of a druggie murderer, especially at a time when plenty of decent people are in legitimate need.

If people want to spend their stimulus money on a celebrity murderer's funeral and other associated costs, isn't it their choice?

At least they will be spending on local businesses, rather than on Chinese goods.

[quote] If people want to spend their stimulus money on a celebrity murderer's funeral and other associated costs, isn't it their choice?

Who says it's their stimulus money they're spending? But. yes, of course it's always one's choice how to spend one's own disposable income. Spending it on a celebrity murderer's funeral just strikes me as a bizarre and stupid choice. And, hey, how do you they won't buy a casket/urn made in China?

Has Kevin Sessums commented? According to Datalounge, Alig was living with him for a time.

As of late January drama surrounding Michael Alig's death and final arrangements still has not settled down.

What you've basically got is close friends of late MA battling with his legal next of kin (the mother, Mrs. Alig) over final resting place, who will pay....