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The Lion in Winter (1968) Casting

We watched this last night on TCM. The script, the actors, the direction -- it all came together to make a wonderful film. But... what if other casting choices were made? What if it was Bette Davis as Eleanor? Or what if it was Richard Burton as Henry II?

I'm somewhat serious here -- what other actors could have done the film? (I think my two examples were totally wrong, btw).

by Anonymousreply 42December 25, 2020 2:36 AM

Burton could have made a decent Henry, but Bette as Eleanor is unthinkable.

Eleanor was a great beauty, even when she was older - it's almost always the first thing her contemporaries noted about her - despite the fact that she was also the richest woman in Europe.

She was one of the greatest marital catches of all time from the moment she was born, and she knew it.

Bette is too much of a jolie laide to pass as Eleanor.

by Anonymousreply 1December 24, 2020 12:53 AM

Can you imagine if Ross Hunter produced the film and it starred Lana Turner or Susan Hayward as Eleanor? Possibly John Gavin as Prince Philip of France? Who would he have cast as Henry?? Jewels by Cartier.

by Anonymousreply 2December 24, 2020 12:58 AM

What family (puff-puff) doesn't have their (puff-puff) little (puff-puff) problems...

by Anonymousreply 3December 24, 2020 12:59 AM

Richard!!! Bring me the axe!!!

by Anonymousreply 4December 24, 2020 1:14 AM

Reteam Camelot's Richard Harris and Vanessa Redgrave!

by Anonymousreply 5December 24, 2020 1:31 AM

Helen Lawson was originally cast as Eleanor of Aquitaine, but they fired her when she actually tried to hang that necklace from her nipples.

by Anonymousreply 6December 24, 2020 1:41 AM

Robert Preston (from the Broadway show) or Rex Harrison.

by Anonymousreply 7December 24, 2020 1:47 AM

[quote] Robert Preston (from the Broadway show) or Rex Harrison.

As who? Eleanor of Acquitane? Alison?

by Anonymousreply 8December 24, 2020 2:06 AM

*Sorry: Alais, not Alison

by Anonymousreply 9December 24, 2020 2:11 AM

What the film really gets right is the production and costume design. You really feel the barbarity of the times, the lack of any comfort beyond fire and a warm body. Dirt floors, stone walls, mattresses of straw. The woolen clothes look as itchy as they no doubt were. A length of animal skin or fur for the nobility. This was before even eating utensils and tea existed in England. No doubt Eleanor's wimples were ahead of their time.

by Anonymousreply 10December 24, 2020 2:15 AM

Annette Funicello, Frankie Avalon, Deborah Walley, Nancy Sinatra, Boris Karloff, The Dave Clark Five, Chad and Jeremy, Peter Lupus, Dom Deluise, Paul Lynde, Don Rickles, Elsa Lanchester

by Anonymousreply 11December 24, 2020 2:24 AM

Tura Satana

Max Baer, Jr.

Jim Nabors

by Anonymousreply 12December 24, 2020 2:29 AM

Lucy youknowho.

by Anonymousreply 13December 24, 2020 2:38 AM

I can see Jonathan Rhys Meyers as King Philip of France

by Anonymousreply 14December 24, 2020 2:40 AM

Of course, there was a 2003 TV movie with Glenn Close and Patrick Stewart and Jonathan played Philip in it. The 3 sons were Andrew Howard (Richard), John Light (Geoffrey) and Rafe Spall (John).

by Anonymousreply 15December 24, 2020 2:43 AM

Here’s my 6 degrees of separation post. When I was a young man I was at a Santa Monica gay beach one fine sunny day and this guy comes up to me calling me by someone else’s name. I said I’m not that guy, but I said you can sit and talk to me while you wait for him to show up. We’re talking about stuff and I ask him what he was doing in Santa Monica because he had a definite English accent. He said he was in the movie business doing some work locally. His friend doesn’t show and he asks me if I want to get some lunch. I said sure, but if this guy thought he was going to get me into bed, not gonna happen. Anyway, had a nice lunch and since I was driving he asks me if I’ll drop him by his hotel. I’m thinking I’m not driving this guy to Hollywood but then he says he’s staying in Santa Monica. I’m thinking this guy Is full of shit about being in the movie business. I say I’ll drop him by his hotel and he then says that he hates staying in Hollywood and Beverly Hills so he stays in Santa Monica. We get to his hotel and he says come on up to my room I want to show you something. He said it’s not sexual. Okay, we know the ground rules. I go up to his room and he pulls out some photos of him with various actors and actresses. He had told that his name was Tony, when we met. He asked me if I watched many movies and I said a few. He then asked me if I’d seen A Lion In Winter, which I had. He said that he had directed it. His name was Anthony Harvey. He was a really nice guy, but there was zero attraction for me, but we did have a nice afternoon visiting. While I was in his hotel room Glenda Jackson called to talk about a role. He told me that they were really good friends. Small world. Hadn’t thought about him in years.

by Anonymousreply 16December 24, 2020 3:52 AM

If the casting of the 1968 version had been changed to c grade actors in would still be better than that abortion G. appear in.

by Anonymousreply 17December 24, 2020 4:01 AM

R16 Whatever happened to Anthony Harvey?

by Anonymousreply 18December 24, 2020 10:29 AM

Obviously O'Toole was granted a royal warrant on Henry II.

by Anonymousreply 19December 24, 2020 10:34 AM

I don't know the facts but why did King Henry marry a foreign queen who was a full 25 years older than him.

Henry was played by an Irish drunk who ranted continuously and monotonously for two hours. And Hepburn with her utterly-foreign, inimitably American crow-like voice were such an ill-matched pair.

And did they really spawn those 4 children who had NO physical resemblance at all? ?

by Anonymousreply 20December 24, 2020 10:39 AM

Royal marriages back then and really until only the last century were all about political alliances and had nothing to do with love or physical attraction.

by Anonymousreply 21December 24, 2020 2:29 PM

Henry and Eleanor were an exception to the rule that royal marriages were contracted without love. They had an intense affair while she was still married to the Louis, the King of France and it was an immense scandal at the time. She got an annulment from Louis, despite having 4(?) girls with him and no hoped- for son. Then she fled his court, went directly to Henry in secret, and they were married with what was considered tasteless haste. They were famously passionate about each other for years, and had their many sons (which enraged son-less Louis).

Their former passion is why the story of their falling out, Henry taking their young ward as his mistress, Eleanor using their sons to wage rebellions against her husband, and Henry throwing Eleanor in a convent for well over a decade is so much more poignant than would first appear. By the time we get to the Christmas court portrayed in the film, their relationship was still passionate, but now with passionate hate for each other instead of their former, famously passionate love for each other.

by Anonymousreply 22December 24, 2020 2:49 PM

Son Richard, of course, eventually went off to The Crusades to become known as Richard the Lionheart and then King Richard I. And son John became King John about whom Shakespeare wrote and named one of his lesser-known plays. Both sons figure in the Robin Hood legend. Son Geoffrey went nowhere and amounted to nothing.

by Anonymousreply 23December 24, 2020 3:05 PM

R23, Geoffrey became Duke of Brittany, through his marriage to Constance of Brittany. He allied himself with Philip of France against his own father in several rebellions, thus acquiring a reputation for treachery. He died at age 27 in 1186, three years after TLIW takes place, and three years before Henry II's death.

by Anonymousreply 24December 24, 2020 3:28 PM

R20, in reality, Eleanor was eleven years older than Henry, and they had eight children, but that would have really complicated the play.

by Anonymousreply 25December 24, 2020 3:48 PM

The fact that Eleanor could survive 8 births and god knows how many stillbirths and miscarriages at that time in history is truly a testament to her strength. She deserved any jewelry she was gifted.

by Anonymousreply 26December 24, 2020 6:04 PM

Truly, r26. AND she then survived 16 years in jail, and THEN went on to effectively become the ruler of Britain (and much of France) for something like a decade once Henry was dead and Richard the Lionheart was king. He went on semi-permanent crusade ( I think he only ever spent a few months in Britain) and she ruled in his stead. I think she was in her 60's and 70's at that point. She survived into her 80's, which is almost unheard of at that time. She was one incredibly tough woman.

by Anonymousreply 27December 24, 2020 6:14 PM

One things that brightens the 1968 film a lot is the chemistry and sparkling wit of Hepburn and O'Toole with their playful sparring. Kate and O'Toole actually really liked each other offscreen and they look like they are having fun together. It lightens up a very long historical film with a fairly dark story.

The 2003 TV remake has different casting and is from a revised script by James Goldman, the original author. Glenn Close and Patrick Stewart are very different and their chemistry is different. Neither of them are that gifted in light comedy and repartee unlike Hepburn and O'Toole - no Beatrice and Benedick vibe there. So that aspect falls flat. O'Toole was actually a fairly young man in 1968 -slender and fair-haired. O'Toole had to work against his lean physical appearance, suave tenor speaking voice and youth to play the fiftyish, stout and bellowing Henry II. Major lowering of the speaking voice and lots of makeup and padding. Patrick Stewart has a roaring baritone voice, barrel chest and maturity in spades - he is not as creative or interesting an actor as O'Toole. But he is very well cast as to type and fully equipped for the part.

In the case of Glenn Close - there is a ruthlessness to her Eleanor that Kate Hepburn doesn't capture. Kate Hepburn is always working from her own likable, sensible, decent Yankee persona. There is a scene where Eleanor bribes some soldiers with jewels to effect an escape in order to foster rebellion against Henry. One of her mercenaries murders one of her guards in her presence and Eleanor/Kate looks on coolly as this happens. Well it is shocking in the 1968 film because it is "Our Kate" as a ruthless instigator of murder. With Glenn Close that Lady Macbeth side of the character is very natural and unsurprising - she seems a natural leader and ruthless power player.

Both films are worth watching but while Patrick and Glenn are very watchable and commendable, it is Hepburn and O'Toole who have the magic. BTW: both Geoffreys are hot - John Castle in the 60's and 70's had a sexy snarl and dark, brooding intensity and a smoking hot bod (not to be confused with straight porn star Johnny Castle). John Light is another dark sexy Brit in the remake.

by Anonymousreply 28December 24, 2020 7:07 PM

The great Rosemary Harris played Eleanor in the original Broadway production, and she's a far better actress than Hepburn could hope to be.

The piece itself is really just a bitchy family dramedy with pretensions, the latter of which are emphasized in the film, especially in the latter half when Hepburn carries on like she's back in Long Day's Journey.

The only first class performance in the film is sexy Timothy Dalton.

Haven't seen the version with Stewart and Close.

by Anonymousreply 29December 24, 2020 7:33 PM

John Barrymore was way too old in the Helen Lawson version but he had that roguish charm with more than a hint of ruthlessness that got him through.

by Anonymousreply 30December 24, 2020 7:54 PM

I think O'Toole turned in an absolutely first-class performance, r29, but you're right, so did Dalton.

by Anonymousreply 31December 24, 2020 8:00 PM

Also, weirdly, O'Toole played Henry II in not one major movie but two - 4 years before TLIW he played a young Henry in the 1964 film Becket, about Henry's "murder" of his best friend and Archbishop of Canterbury, Thomas a Becket. Another fantastic film. Both O'Toole and Burton are on top form and it got 12 Oscar nominations, with both Burton and O'Toole being nominated for Best Actor.

It's on Amazon Prime in the US right now, fyi.

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 32December 24, 2020 8:14 PM

[quote] Royal marriages back then and really until only the last century were all about political alliances and had nothing to do with love or physical attraction.

Wanna bet?

by Anonymousreply 33December 24, 2020 8:21 PM

The real Eleanor birthed ten children, two daughters to the King of France, whom she divorced, and then eight Plantagenet sprats. Two sons survived to claim the throne, there were also a bunch of daughters were were married off and who don't appear in the film.

O'Toole is the one possible miscast in the film, as he was much too young for the role. Well, they aged him up and gave him a monologue about how men die so young that at fifty, he's the oldest man I know. I forgive because he's Peter O'Toole, and because you've gotta love an actor who wants to play an obscure English king at various life stages.

by Anonymousreply 34December 24, 2020 11:23 PM

Should have been Liz Taylor and Richard Burton.

Hepburn is such a ham.

by Anonymousreply 35December 24, 2020 11:28 PM

Oh no, Hepburn was perfect! She was a famous beauty who was still something to see in her sixties, she was regal enough to look down on everyone on Earth, and she could play a venomous bitch who knew how to stick the knife in where it'd hurt the most.

Sure, there were a ton of British actresses who would have done a great job... but none in the right age group had Hepburn's striking looks. So kudos to the filmmakers who hired an American to play a British-French queen, she was

by Anonymousreply 36December 24, 2020 11:44 PM

R34, Henry II really isn't "an obscure English King."

by Anonymousreply 37December 24, 2020 11:51 PM

R37, he is to Hollywood!

by Anonymousreply 38December 25, 2020 12:03 AM

He's had multiple major films and plays written about him. He's not King Egbert.

by Anonymousreply 39December 25, 2020 12:21 AM

R18 He died.

by Anonymousreply 40December 25, 2020 12:45 AM

Hepburn and O'Toole have great chemistry which keeps this from being a typical costume epic, which was exactly what this needed. Costume epics had been over for ages and it needed some real charisma to make this work.

by Anonymousreply 41December 25, 2020 12:47 AM

John Castle (Geoffrey) was a very sexy British actor though it doesn't really come through in ALIW, nor should it. I first discovered him in a couple of the old Joan Hickson Miss Marples in the mid-1980s where he played a police inspector. Around the same time he was in a brilliant and quite hot in a Masterpiece Theatre series called Lost Empires opposite the young Colin Firth about a touring theatrical company in Edwardian England. I wonder if anyone remembers it? It wasn't until I then rewatched ALIW that I realized I'd seen them years before.

I don't think he worked much in American films though he starred in a very short-lived Broadway flop called Georgy, based on the film Georgy Girl. Castle played the Alan Bates role.

by Anonymousreply 42December 25, 2020 2:36 AM
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