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I saw "The Crown" Season 4, and have more questions than answers!

I will post them inside.

by Anonymousreply 40Last Sunday at 10:54 AM

1) When they show scenes of the whole royal family gathered at Balmoral or at Buckingham Palace, there are always lots of people with them I cannot place. Are these ladies-in-waiting, or courtiers and their wives, or cousins? or all of the above?

2) Why wouldn’t the Thatchers’ friends or colleagues have explained to them about what to wear at Balmoral since they would assuredly be asked to go hunting? Denis Thatcher’s friend warned him Balmoral would be a constant test, but he didn’t seem to tell him how to prepare.

3) Why would the Queen not take Diana’s phone calls during the early “Fairytale” episode? Didn’t she realize that after the marriage—even if it worked out—she would have to deal frequently with Diana for the rest of her life since Diana would be the Princess of Wales?

4) Who pays to keep Anne’s gigantic estate and stables running?

5) In the “Favourites” episode, the queen seems to barely know her grown children as individuals (except for Charles, whom she dislikes). Did she not have dinners with them when they were home from boarding school when they were growing up? Why does she not know Anne better when we see Anne frequently having dinner with her mother, the Queen Mother, and Princess Margaret throughout the season?

6) Would a courtier ever speak so rudely to a royal as Charles’s private secretary speaks to Diana on the plane to Australia? I would think, because of his snobbishness about respect for his title and office (which his wife shared with him), Charles he would have fired him on the spot, even if he himself wasn’t fond of Diana.

7) Why by 1988 did Diana not understand that Charles would hate her dance to Billy Joel’s “Uptown Girl” or her performance of a song from “Phantom of the Opera”? How didn’t she understand after seven years of marriage he was a horrible snob about culture?

8) Is Prince Edward really that bitter and vindictive, or were we being led to believe that was just a teenage phase? Since he and his wife Sophie were reportedly big friends of “The Crown” during the early seasons, they must really hate Peter Morgan now.

9) They explain pretty well why the Waleses took so long to separate, but why did Anne take so long to leave her cheating husband? After princess Margaret had divorced Lord Snowdon you would have thought the taboo against divorce would have been gone.

10) This is pure speculation: It seems in retrospect the biggest problems in Diana’s marriage (and also in Fergie’s marriage, which they didn’t show) was that their husbands didn’t want to be around them and so they became unbearably lonely and unhappy. Do you think it was explained after Diana’s death to Charles’s boys that they HAVE to be around their wives more and make them feel loved? Do you think William and Kate will teach that to their own children?

11) Bonus question: do you think Charles realizes now how badly he treated Diana and feels regret about it? He does seem like he became something of a better person after the divorce (and especially after her death).

by Anonymousreply 1Last Friday at 9:24 AM

All valid questions.

I'll add one more:

12) What was the purpose of making Margaret's discovery of the mentally ill cousins an entire episode? It didn't seem to really advance the overall story line at all other than to have great shots of Mustique and and explain that the Queen knew that gay people existed in the 1980s. And who were the couple that seemed to be the hosts in Mustique?

by Anonymousreply 2Last Friday at 9:32 AM

I can answer #12:

The purpose is that Peter Morgan has been clear since even before the show first aired that he wants the entirety of the series not just to spotlight the Queen but also the two people who have been closest to her her entire life, Prince Philip and Princess Margaret. (They have been her best friends and closest confidant(e)s.) Whichever actors play these three are always listed first in the credits because of this.

Prince Philip did not get a big spotlight episode this season, but he had enough big juicy scenes with Diana that he still had much to do. Bargaret would not have had any big scenes had they not done the "Hereditary Principle" episode. It gave us a chance to catch up on what she wa slike during the 80s (miserable because she was falling out of the public spotlight). Moreover, it gave Helena Bonham-Carter an opportunity to show what she can do, and it was the best performance all season, even thought he episode otherwise was not that well written.

In order to attract first-rate actors to those roles, Morgan had to give them spotlight episodes during their two seasons. Almost everyone I have seen agrees the "Moondust" episode was the dullest last season, although Morgan and the other staffers on the show speak proudly of it as if it were the best--but they had to give Tobias Menzies SOMETHING big to do at least one season if he were to accept the role.

The couple at Mustique were Anne's best friends, Colin Tennant (the Baron Glenconner) and his wife Anne. Anne was the one who set Margaret up with Roddy Lllewellyn last season. The Glenconners own the entire island of Mustique and gave Margaret the Jolies Eaux estate as a wedding gift on the occasion of her marriage to Lord Snowdon. They lived right next door, and adored her. Anne recently wrote her memoirs, which were critically praised.

by Anonymousreply 3Last Friday at 9:50 AM

Oh, and two more questions:

#13: At the end of the "Fairytale" episode, Princess Margaret is bemoaning that Charles and Diana will marry the next day and that Charles is in love with another woman, and the Queen mother erupts angrily, "BUT THAT'S THE WAY IT'S ALWAYS WORKED!" But I understood her husband, George VI, was always faithful to her.

#14: The Queen and Margaret were extremely close with their own parents, so they must have valued it greatly. Why then was the Queen so distant from her own children since she had such good models in her own parents? George VI was king yet we saw the first season he always made time for his children.

by Anonymousreply 4Last Friday at 9:53 AM

Thank you R3, that was a great response.

Much appreciated.

by Anonymousreply 5Last Friday at 10:24 AM

BUMP FOR ANSWERS

by Anonymousreply 6Last Friday at 10:48 AM

Re. #10: William and Harry were old enough to see what was going on in the final years of their parents' marriage; I don't think "The Firm" could tell them ANYTHING after Diana's death. W&H told *them* if, when, and to whom they would marry. They didn't need to make their wives feel loved because (1) they would already love the women they married, and (2) they were brought up by their mother to be openly loving and caring.

Re. #11: I think he regrets marrying her in the first place.

by Anonymousreply 7Last Friday at 11:02 AM

It’s partly fiction, OP - not a documentary.

by Anonymousreply 8Last Friday at 11:30 AM

Thrilling when Josh o'connor is in the scenes, he so cute and winning as charles....if only he and diana could have come to some agreement and held on.... the screen comes alive when josh does his thing....in most all the films he is in..

by Anonymousreply 9Last Saturday at 8:14 AM

[quote]This is pure speculation: It seems in retrospect the biggest problems in Diana’s marriage (and also in Fergie’s marriage, which they didn’t show) was that their husbands didn’t want to be around them and so they became unbearably lonely and unhappy. Do you think it was explained after Diana’s death to Charles’s boys that they HAVE to be around their wives more and make them feel loved? Do you think William and Kate will teach that to their own children?

William doesn't appear to be around Kate much or like her all that much, either. He's very much his father's son. It wasn't that long ago that a documentary revealed he'd shunned his mother when she did that television interview, because he felt it was so inappropriate for a royal to do such a thing. I believe William was all of 12 at that point, and he'd already been brought up to scold the "outsider" women in the family for not behaving properly.

No one in the BRF would have explained any such thing to Diana's sons.

by Anonymousreply 10Last Saturday at 8:25 AM

I dont get it. Diana could not have been that naive, She must have known a bit of what she was getting into. Maybe she was unbalanced, she could have had her bf on the side and enjoyed life...she seemed to be inclined to be 'wretchedly unhappy'.... Was she even happy after the divorce??

by Anonymousreply 11Last Saturday at 8:31 AM

She was a teenager, r11.

by Anonymousreply 12Last Saturday at 8:48 AM

I also have question and it's for you OP: how did you make it through four seasons of that insipid middlebrow garbage show without killing yourself? And as a followup, do you have any plans to kill yourself now?

by Anonymousreply 13Last Saturday at 8:50 AM

R11 I read sources close to her described the doctor she dated post divorce as the love of her life. So she had some happiness it seems.

by Anonymousreply 14Last Saturday at 8:50 AM

Question::: the the lad with the hare lip have more than that one brief scene with Margaret where he says he goin to be a priest? I presume he had been her bf of some sort....he got a rave in the New Yorker for his role, but was there just that one brief scene?

by Anonymousreply 15Last Saturday at 9:00 AM

R15 he has a scene at the end of the episode after becoming a priest.

by Anonymousreply 16Last Saturday at 9:05 AM

OP, you're a doll. Thanks for the thread!

by Anonymousreply 17Last Saturday at 9:08 AM

OP, the most important thing to remember is that The Crown is fiction. It's based on real events and real people but it's the product of imagination, not what really happened on how these people really are.

by Anonymousreply 18Last Saturday at 9:08 AM

Indeed, fun thread, much thx OP...we appreciate ur effort in this Crown...

YES OMG WE KNOW ITS FICTION...YE GADS

by Anonymousreply 19Last Saturday at 9:09 AM

Thrilling when Margaret cusses out Queen Mum etc for putting their cousins in the nuthouse, Not a fan of H B Carter, but bully good scene.

by Anonymousreply 20Last Saturday at 9:15 AM

According to books I've read, a great deal of the show is gently massaged or wholly created for more dramatic affect. I wouldn't get too caught up in questions as most were generated by scenes that may not have actually happened. As someone said earlier, it's a drama not a documentary.

If I were a Royal, it would really piss me off to see an event in my life dramatized where I'm made to look like an ass when the event didn't happen or no one was there to witness it.

by Anonymousreply 21Last Saturday at 9:15 AM

R4, the QM was not in love with Bertie. She rose up and made the compromise. She had aimed at David but, as dumb as he was, he knew wanted nothing to do with her.

So in the full context of what she said there is not a true analogy to apply to her, because there is no record of Elizabeth Bowes-Lyon ever loving anyone, except from duty and proximity to the cachet of the throne, but herself.

by Anonymousreply 22Last Saturday at 9:18 AM

The answers to all the questions is that all these people are/were magnificent cunts.

by Anonymousreply 23Last Saturday at 9:18 AM

curiouosly, the actress who plays Margaret's shrink, plays Josh O'connor's step mom in Gods own Country, on that farm...

seen her often in Midsummer Murders

by Anonymousreply 24Last Saturday at 9:19 AM

The entire season was an exercise in sycophancy for this entitled rich woman. I realize that Thatcher was not beloved, but they went miles out of their way to portray her as a dotard. Maggie Thatcher was a brilliant woman, academically speaking. A horrible PM maybe, but she was nowhere near as stupid as they portray her. They made her some campy drag queen version while smearing on a completely fictional picture that the queen of England is somehow "woke" and frets over all the poors and unemployed people.

That was evident throughout but nowhere was it more absurd than with the Michael Fagan episode where Liz is apparently "touched" by the poor guy who broke into her bedroom, she then proceeds to show her distaste for Thatcher as Thatcher, again in high ridiculous camp, keeps likening her job as a 'hard medicine for the people', as the queen suggests the medicine may be too potent, like deadly chemotherapy. Such utter bullshit. Thatcher did not come from wealth, she was a working-class girl. She was a total conservative and traditionalist and if anything, was blind in her worship of the monarchy.

Sorry for the tangent, it's just so silly and has become as campy and unrealistic as Downton Abbey ever was. I would love to watch an entire season where they're all at Balmoral. I've never actually seen or looked-up photos of it but if it's anything like what they showed this season, it's truly like a fairytale. So beautiful, even with the 24/7 miserable weather.

by Anonymousreply 25Last Saturday at 9:31 AM

I dont want this show to ever end, its so damn good...cant it just keep goint to up to today? many more seasons planned ? at least 2 i presume...

by Anonymousreply 26Last Saturday at 9:36 AM

Who will play Epstein and Maxwell in the future episode with jolly Prince Andrew? Clooney and Kidman?

by Anonymousreply 27Last Saturday at 9:41 AM

You say that, R19, but if you scroll up you’ll see that there are people posting about characters in “The Crown” and people posting about royal family members’ lives, with the line between the two getting blurred.

by Anonymousreply 28Last Saturday at 9:44 AM

Charles comes off worst of anyone by a lot.

He doesn't seem to get why Diana might not be happy being a breeding mare and the things that set him off--he doesn't like her taste in music--are the sorts of things a 15 year old decides he doesn't like about a girl he might have a crush on.

He's petulant to everyone and even his family can't stand him, except occasionally Anne.

And Edward, I am sure, set DL hearts aflutter when he referred to Charles as "cunty"

by Anonymousreply 29Last Saturday at 9:45 AM

I think Josh plays cunty Charles with a good more sympatica than the real dude actually posesses, alas.

by Anonymousreply 30Last Saturday at 9:58 AM

There is no indication to counter, and plenty of rumor behind the scrupulous propriety of the queen to support, the conclusion that the Royals as a group were appalled by the brazen black-and-white cruelty behind Thatcher's Thatcherism. Whatever the enforced callowness of their positions and the entitled naïveté behind the usual "something must be done by someone" ineffectiveness of their convictions, they support the British people and the people of the Commonwealth. Thatcher did not.

She despised those who were similar in their backgrounds who did not rise up like a granite Rock from sheer ambition and cunning. At the same time, the Royals always have been exquisitely sensitive to arrivistes, and to them that means more than Markle's clueless grab for the jewels and the usual social climbing-closeness to anything concerning the family. Thatcher was self-made and as haughty in her own way as the QM, and they recognized in her a formidability they associated with the various autocrats of the century preceding her.

So she was dismissive of the underclass, who the Royals reflexively supported out of noblesse oblige and the pity of the well-placed, an attacker of the welfare system that maintained a kind of underclass quietude (They never have forgotten the French and Russian revolutions), a Voice that spoke directly to Somewhat Our People (the powers of industry and corporate position), and a pissy, proper, thoroughly bourgeois woman - unfamiliar with the determined "down-home and simple" pretensions of the upper classes where you fart and keep silent and don't turn on the faucet to hide the sound of your tinkle - who came across like a pretender to them.

Don't play the "she was abused and misunderstood" game here. Thatcher was vile. That she was other things does not change that fact. Her and Reagan's propaganda that they spoke for the true center of nationalistic pride and tradition led directly to the ineptitudes and offenses of Johnson and Trump, and it is a mere sidestep to see how their mode of power also permitted later strongman rule as the collapsed Soviet sphere refined their methods and adopted much of the same language, if not policies.

by Anonymousreply 31Last Saturday at 10:05 AM

Much agree, Thatcher is looked back on as super vile, cut so many programs, etc that they still recovering from all the shit she did. Her asskissing of Reagan was pathetic but showed her colors... I do however enjoy the way Gillian is playing her, bit of dotty humor in her, she comes across as rather eccentric/ nuts....

by Anonymousreply 32Last Saturday at 10:10 AM

The series comes to a grinding halt when they focus too much on politics and not personalitys of the family. Some is ok, but more than ten minutes of it and im fast forwarding.. Loving Edward, more of him plz! the cunty remark was like fresh air.

by Anonymousreply 33Last Saturday at 10:18 AM

R33, I disagree—I find the politics and history aspects fascinating.

by Anonymousreply 34Last Saturday at 10:19 AM

Anyone think its possible the royals had a thing to do with her death? they/charles were very pissed that she seemd happy and strong after she left him, and still garnered so much press.....i dont know. charles was evidently real jealous of the massive crowds/love she got before and after the marriage... plus the queen is....crazy, who knows what she capable of. FOR THE CROWN.....

by Anonymousreply 35Last Saturday at 11:08 AM

They are The Firm... they rule with a steel fist. . Frightening people.., they saw Diana as a menace and threat to THE CROWN.. Theyr said to be ruthless, and anyone is expendable to them. Its said there was a sigh of relief in the Family when she was gone...no longer a threat to their power.

by Anonymousreply 36Last Saturday at 11:21 AM

Heartbreaking when one sees footage on youtube of his kids at the funeral....maybe they know what really happend at the crash.

by Anonymousreply 37Last Saturday at 2:37 PM

Diana's spirit will alwys live ....she alwys be with us.

by Anonymousreply 38Last Saturday at 5:21 PM

Watching documentarys bout Prince Charles....what a unfeeling old skag.

by Anonymousreply 39Last Sunday at 6:19 AM

What if josh oconner and prince charles swappedd places for a year....and we had a hot king to be scampering round the palace with his fat cock out....

by Anonymousreply 40Last Sunday at 10:54 AM
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