Anne Boleyn was a black woman

Oh god, color-blind casting. I'm so triggered, OP.

Who gives a fuck, seriously? Don't watch something you think is garbage.

Anne Boleyn was a real person and a very important historical figure. This isn't the same as, say colour blind casting in a Dickens drama.

So you think we should have a white man play Mandela, do you, r1? By your logic that should be fine too.

I'd say in cases like this color blind casting in historical based television, and films tends takes you out of the story, and the character/person.

Also, what's the point? If, say the real Anne Boleyn was BAME it would cast an entirely different light in terms of dynamics in her story. For example it would turn the analysis into: The hatred of her by the public, the accusations of witchcraft, the execution: were they actually the result of racism?

To make her BAME and just tell her story as it was would be confusing to modern viewers in this regard, to say nothing of how it will take the viewer out of the experience of watching the story itself.

Why not do this instead with an historical figure who really was partly BAME, such as Catherine of Aragon, descended from the Iberian kings, who had previously intermarried with North African royalty.

Anne Boleyn was whiter than Catherine.

Boleyn, you in danger, gurl!

Catherine of Aragon was a redhead and does not look at all mixed-race.

Black, Asian and Minority Ethnic

The acronym BAME stands for Black, Asian and Minority Ethnic and is defined as all ethnic groups except White ethnic groups. It does not relate to country origin or affiliation. As far as possible, the GLA seeks to adhere to the Office for National Statistics' harmonized output categories for ethnic groups

This is just plain stupidity. Everybody knows exactly who Anne Boleyn was, what she looked like etc. She was the Queen of England and she was a white female - as were all royals and aristocracy at the time.

Rather than casting a fabulous black actress like Jodie Turner-Smith to play the part - which is then woefully miscast and unbelievable - why not make a fabulous new series about an African Queen or Egyptian Queen or Persian Queen where she is perfectly cast and can shine in something perfect which we haven't seen before.

This - "Diversity Casting" is to the detriment of the product being made. The recent desperate focus on casting for diversity ahead of anything else is creating substandard output. It's like the pendulum has swung too far in trying to correct the situation.

Solution? Create more diverse stories/topics and fill them with the applicable well-suited talent. I'd really like to see a series about a strong, ruthless African/Egyptian/Persian Queen in the same time period (1500s). That would be fascinating.

There are many fascinating actually black African queens in history. Why ignore them to retell Henry VIII *again*?

Anne Boleyn was NOT a black woman.

She was a transwoman of color!!!

Liked minds r9!

Indeed. If Anne can be black then why can't Anne be trans as well?

IT'S MA'AM!!!!

I loved that show Boleyn For Dollars.

I am black. I love Anne Boleyn and have loved her since I saw Anne of a Thousand Days back in 9th grade. While I usually don't have issues with colorblind casting in fiction, I am not thrilled when it is done on real life historical figures (and that includes Hamilton).

Here is a message to woke white producers who I know mean well and are trying to bring about honorable change. While we are all the same, (accept for that extra bone we black people have [I kid - I kid]) we are not interchangeable. Are you just casting a black woman to play white Anne Boleyn or are you giving Anne Boleyn the life and a family and the experiences of a black woman in Tudor England?

And ultimately, what message this truly sends is that there are no historical figures of color worth writing about and for current actresses of color to play.

I actually had someone say that the US isn't nearly as racist as people today say it is. The person said that the proof was that some of the Founding Fathers were people of color.

WTF?

After quizzing the person, it came out that she had seen Hamilton the musical.

As EST as this sounds, it actually happened. I mocked her mercilessly which ended in her crying and people calling me an asshole because I "didn't have to be so mean about it." But seriously, THAT is how stupid people are. No, as a matter of fact, I DID have to be so mean about it. This type of stupid needs to be corrected.

This is the problem with the "no shaming" philosophy. A person SHOULD be ashamed if they think that the Founding Fathers were a rainbow of diversity.

Anyone who has a problem with this casting is exposing their unconscious racial bias, or is a flat out racist. She's a fucking actress playing a part. Why keep hiring and paying very well, only white actresses for Anne Boleyn? Maybe in the future, a Japanese actress can play the role in another adaptation.

I suggest Julia Roberts play Anne from now on

[quote]Anyone who has a problem with this casting is exposing their unconscious racial bias, or is a flat out racist. She's a fucking actress playing a part. Why keep hiring and paying very well, only white actresses for Anne Boleyn? Maybe in the future, a Japanese actress can play the role in another adaptation.

LOL - she is a historical person whose life's details are predicated on the historical period, political and social context, and entire upbringing as part of the English nobility.

At least one of the six wives must be played by a tranny. Which one will be it? The ugly Anne of Cleves or the whore Catherine Howard?

It doesn’t sound like this is going to be realistic anyway, and newsflash: most of these “historical” pieces are filled with inaccuracies or important facts/events are removed.

A remake of The Autobiography of Miss Jane Pittman with Betty White as the elder Miss Jane Pittman. Emma Stone plays her adulthood!

Richard Madden is available to play one of the wives.

I think it's a fabulous idea.

Yes, she was a real-life historical person.

Her detractors did everything in their power to make her appear "other" in order to get rid of her. They declared her a witch and a whore.

Having her played by a woman of color automatically makes her interesting enough to captivate Henry and different enough to allow her enemies to villainize her to her death.

I guess if it is a full-scale reimagining of the House of Tudors, it could be interesting. However this is so pandering. Like R16 mentioned, why not focus on stories about (non-white) historical figures. Also, why yet another re-telling of Anne Boleyn?

I think some of these re-imaginings are pretty cool. Sometimes when I go jogging I cast “Pride & Prejudice” in my head with an all-black cast. Idris as Mr Darcy, Lupita as Elizabeth, etc

R27, now that I would be into! Though now that he is getting older, I think Idris would be a better Rochester (a la Jane Eyre).

r18 is wrong, and is example of everything that is wrong with the wokewashed.

She had it cut off but she remained a Queen.

A trans woman of color wasn't just behind the start of the Stonewall riots, but also the start of the Church of England.

She gave great head.

“Look around, look around at how lucky we are to be alive right now.” ...

Is it possible to have one thread without the anti Trans lobby. Gee fucking whiz.

If Anne Boleyn is black, then Henry VIII is a forward thinking, multiculturalist, not a raging monster, and Elizabeth I was mixed race.

It will be called "The Two Wives of Henry VIII" -- because, guuuuurl, a black woman ain't gonna let some white hussy steal her man!

This.never.happened.

Who are they gonna cast to play Henry VIII ?? ... Billy Porter?

Anne Boleyn's family was extremely important to both her rise and her fall. Her uncle was critical to both promoting her and then throwing her to the dogs. Her brother was her closest confidante at court and was who her enemies claimed she had primarily cheated with, making him a central figure in the story of her downfall.

Will they be black too?

Who's Ann Berlin?

Amber Lynn!

[quote]Will they be black too?

Black Anne-jacent.

It will be worth it if it gives Donald Trump and Stephen Miller heart attacks. Next to them being removed, everything is trivial.

Henry is the baby daddy.

Jodie would appear to have the neck for the role, at the least.

I suggest Trump as old fat Henry V111

Annx Boi-lyn was a trans sex worker of color.

so is princess diana....

I’m Chinese, y’all!

An'ne Boleyn.

What will her first name be? It can't be Anne.

Manne

It's very likely historical records exist calling Anne B. a "black woman".

Because an English-language usage that has fallen out of favor over the last two centuries. White people with black or very dark hair used to be called "a black man/woman", and if the idiom was around in Anne's time then I'm sure someone described her in writing as "a black woman". That didn't mean her skin was dark, or any of her ancestors came from Africa. That's just an old term for "brunette".

Sophie Okonedo *is* Queen Elizabeth in series 7 of The Crown.

This is an empowering step forward for racial equality

Yeah but no it isn't R56.

It's just preposterous.

Watch The Oprah Winfrey Story at 9pm EST/8pm CEN ONLY ON ABC! Sally Strothers IS Oprah Winfrey!

I watched this presentation on PBS of Julius Ceasar done, apparently by prison inmates, of all races and all female. It was great! I felt I understood Shakespeare better. Classics at any rate, which have a deeper message, well acted, do not depend on the race or gender of the actors.

Yeah, I don’t think old classics that were prejudice and kept POC and minorities and women out of the equation should be still restricted to white men only.

I think it’s weird that so many on this forum are aligning with the alt-right and white supremacists. It sucks that so many white gay people aren’t seeing the bigger picture.

I mean we’ve had gay plays and productions where people are re-imagined as gay and we gay people love it.

"Anne of a Thousand Micgroaggressions"

This isn't "colourblind" casting. A very specific and deliberate choice was made to cast a black woman as Anne Boleyn.

OP. Nah.

I hear Lupita Nyong’o will star in the upcoming Queen Victoria biopic.

This might have worked on stage but in a movie it is going to be vastly misleading and generation whatever will start referring to Anne as a person of color ... but hey, this is show business so don't let the truth get in the way of the story folks.

This is why I told Tootie nobody would believe her as Eleanor Roosevelt.

Some said at the time that Jenny, a Quebecoise Roman, couldn't play Anne in the Thousand Days. She did it, and did it well.

Why do Blacks come first in the BAME acronym?

Because black is king.

I am looking forward to the day when Brad Pitt can be cast as Dr Martin Luther King with Scarlett Johansson as Coretta Scott King.

Who invented Bame? It is totally stupid. Ethnic minority did fine and included Jews. Bame does not include Jews, please note that.

Anne wasn't Bame. She was a proto-Protestant, after spending so many years in the corrupt French royal court.

If Brad Pitt can be MLK, then I should get to play Malcolm X.

The pale. redheaded Elizabeth1, Henry and Annes daughter and future Queen of England, MUST be played by Jaden Smith

I couldn’t care less about her ethnicity. All the movies are re-enactments and speculative; one more wont hurt. My only concern is whether she can act. It doesn’t seem to be a priority anymore.

This actually makes more sense than most such casting. The audience knows the race of the historical Anne Boleyn so they will not confuse the race of the actress and the role she is playing.

With lesser known figures there might be a confusion, but that will not be an issue here.

If a black actress played a lesser known figure of the period, such Elizabeth Wyckes, the audience might think that the real person was also black.

Then why even cast white performers as anything?

R16

[quote] While we are all the same, (accept for that extra bone we black people have [I kid - I kid])

Dear me. I am verklempt. 🎭

[quote]I am looking forward to the day when Brad Pitt can be cast as Dr Martin Luther King with Scarlett Johansson as Coretta Scott King.

Can Patti LuPone play the mother? She could bring such conviction to Mrs. King's assassination at the church organ.

PC gone stone fucking crazy.

It’s l984 coming to life.

I'm going to produce "A Raisin In The Sun", with a blonde, blue-eyed cast.

Oh, fuck this shit.

Members of all groups experiencing the abuses of hate and bigotry inevitably display the same nasty habits.

Channel 5? Oh dear. Must be limited budget. This will end badly (no pun intended) and not because the leading actress is black but because C5 isn’t known for its quality.

Give it to Margot Robbie. She'll be free once she finishes Cleopatra.

Let's stop wasting time and cast Margot for everything. Including male roles.

No I want the Oscar-winning midget lesbian with the disability to play her . The Hunt person.

What is new about this Anne Boleyn production? Apart from a black actress, which is not enough?

[quote]I'm going to produce "A Raisin In The Sun", with a blonde, blue-eyed cast.

They actually did that on an episode of Strangers With Candy.

Colorblind casting in fictional stories is fine. Even though you rarely see multiracial street gangs in real life and suburban white people with one black friend, one Asian friend, and one Latina friend as part their main friend circle it's okay to do that in fiction. When you do that with historical characters it essentially white washes the real history of minorities into something that it wasn't.

This is getting ridiculous.

Jeez! All these years I thought she was a post-op Trans black woman. I stand corrected. Thanks for the clarification OP.

It's fine, do it. Have fun with it. How about Luke Wilson as MLK? Ruth Buzzi as Angela Davis? Let's do this.

just seems like dull witted stunt casting. There's probably no reason to make yet another Anne Boleyn movie anyway, so I guess this will be the reason, and nothing else.

Seriously though, there’s a good argument that this is true.

And it would be something, if at least was a statement about a "foreign" presence at Court, but even that doesn't fit. Anne Boleyn's father was kind of an upstart, but her mother was a Howard, and her uncle was the Duke of Norfolk, probably second only to the King in terms of prestige and importance. This was her world. She had been lady in waiting to the Queen of France, and she wasn't some nobody who just wandered in. If anything, she was more refined and graceful than many other ladies at court.

White actors have more employment opportunities, so there is no reason to cast them in roles written for black actors. Minority actors have fewer opportunities, hence the move toward employment equity.

Not to mention that white has long been the default--so when ethnicity did not matter, you just made the character white.

This is the sort of thing that only bothers people on the internet. I have seen HenryVIII, Eleanor of Aquitane, Henry V played by black performers. Audiences were perfectly okay with it.

^ I was not okay with it.

If she doesn’t have to be white, then why does she still have to be a woman?

lets face it, the 13% have taken over entertainment.....

People in entertainment who hate whites are really trying to erase their existence not only in fiction, but from history itself. Why? If a white person was cast for nonwhite role, all hell would break lose. There are lots of roles for POC in POC roles, but that's not the point. The point is that if POC can play any white role, why should there be white actors? Equal outcomes for all would dictate that POC would be favored over whites, who would disappear from entertainment in response, eventually. The people who would tell me that I'm a racist who's overreacting would also be quite happy about this state of affairs in media. I'm certain of that.

So Brave

R68 Anne Boleyn and her older sister, Mary, as teenagers, lived 7 years in France.

They belonged to the French Court as Ladies-in-waiting to Queen Claude wife of François 1er.

They became very acquainted with French ways.

[quote] People in entertainment who hate whites are really trying to erase their existence

Only the untalented ones.

R95, "White actors have more employment opportunities, so there is no reason to cast them in roles written for black actors. Minority actors have fewer opportunities, hence the move toward employment equity."

Perhaps because in majority white societies, the majority of people are white hence the majority of stories are about white people, the majority of actors are white and the majority of the audience is white. Sure, create good opportunities for black actors and create even more black and other minority roles, but don't cast black actors in white roles playing historical figures on screen, it's ridiculous.

In majority black societies most actors are black, in majority Asian societies most actors are Asian, in majority Arab societies most actors are Arab.

Remember this, which overlooks the fact that Mariane Pearl was very happy with Angelina Jolie playing her and Cleopatra was Greek.

Black Twitter blasts Angelina Jolie for portraying Egypt’s Queen Cleopatra in upcoming film By A.R. Shaw | June 3, 2014 | 127 cleo1

For the second time in her career, Angelina Jolie is set to portray a black woman (the first time was her role as Mariane Pearl in A Mighty Heart).

According to an interview conducted by the BBC, Jolie revealed that she will retire from acting after portraying the Egyptian queen Cleopatra in an upcoming film.

For centuries, there have been debates over the race of Queen Cleopatra. She ruled in Egypt starting in 51 B.C. Although she spent time in Rome, Cleopatra’s family lived in Egypt for 300 years, according to Egyptologist Sally Ann Ashton. As a result, it was highly likely that Cleopatra was black and of African descent.

But Hollywood has whitewashed Cleopatra for years. Elizabeth Taylor starred as Cleopatra in 1961 and Jolie will follow with an inaccurate portrayal of the Egyptian ruler.

Moments after it was revealed that Jolie will star as Cleopatra, black Twitter displayed disapproval.

I really hope they call it "Anne From The Block."

WHAT WERE HER PRONOUNS

[quote]For centuries, there have been debates over the race of Queen Cleopatra.

No there haven't Cleopatra being of Macedonian Greek descent is a well-known fact all over the world except for the US apparently.

I think it’s fine and potentially interesting, but I have to laugh at the Variety article linked at OP, in which nobody even MENTIONS the fact that a blacktress is playing a white historical person. Not even a quote from the director about “not seeing color.”

And that Macedonian Dynasty remained very inbred, generally just marrying each other, including brothers and sisters getting married. There seems to have been very little native Egyptian blood in the mix.

and this weird idea that everyone is going to change things by "claiming" this or that historical figure is just stupid. Everyone should abandon that shit. Stunt casting never accomplishes anything but making everyone involved lie about their motives and look like fools.

At least they didn't cast Meryl.

I think R110 is dead on right in saying why this should work.

1. Its famously white Anne Boleyn--so no one is "claiming" she was actually black. 2. The actress is not well known, so it is not stunt casting.

When people try to justify non-traditional casting by claiming a heritage that the real person did not have, it is annoying and when it just becomes an excuse for a famous person to take the role, it is hard not to be cynical.

But this feels like the right way to do it.

Henry VIII: Anne, you are to be beheaded.

Anne Boleyn (black): OH NO YOU DI’NNT!

I don’t think Anne of Cleves was so bad looking compared to other queens married to Henry or any other king.

at least Cleves had a head

Zzzzzzzzzz.

Funfact:

Anne beheaded body ended in a big box for arrows.

R95

No, they don't. Black actors in Hollywood get 20 percent of roles when they make up 13 percent of the population. Latinos are the most underrepresented, and no one's trying to fix that.

Theater audiences are more accepting of raceblind casting largely because of the inherent constraints of theater, such as proximity (most theaters can't afford to import actors from elsewhere) and theater, in itself, being less realistic. Sets and costumes often can't reflect anything close to reality.

What bothers me about this push toward raceblind casting in film/TV is the fact that the primary audience of any period piece of this nature is overwhelmingly white. The message is: What's ours is ours, and what's yours is ours. I guarantee no one is telling Tyler Perry to diversify his movies. Other race/ethnic groups get to keep their own entertainment, made by and for them, while white audiences are being told to go fuck ourselves.

Once the novelty of this kind of move wears off, audiences simply won't tune in. Black audiences overwhelmingly aren't interested in period pieces, regardless of diversity, and white audiences aren't interested in a period piece that isn't trying to be true to life.

What these people could do is reimagine period pieces and set them in a different time and place, in which case they can cast just about anyone they want. But I guess that's too much work and isn't a sufficient "fuck you" to white people.

R28

Idris is too handsome to be Rochester.

Also another wrinkle in a black version of Jane Eyre is trying to figure out black equivalents of the ugly Rochester and the plain Jane that won't come across as racist. It's probably better to just let it be.

I thought the obvious casting choice would be Mason Reese, but I guess the times really are a-changin.

R117, where are you getting those figures?

SAG/AFTRA disagrees.

And why does it matter to you so much that minority actor be kept out of roles?

And how can you be so unaware that films are not real?

And why lie claiming that no one is working for inclusion of Latinx actors?

R120

Do let us know when a Latino actor is cast in an Anglo role in film or on TV.

R121, it happens a lot, but at the cost of actors downplaying or concealing their Latinx heritage. And of course, light skinned, fair haired Latinx actors are cast MUCH more than darker complected actors.

Which is why people are pushing for more Latinx visibility in casting. Unlike most black actors, you can see a Latinx actor in a role and not realize he or she is not white.

“Once you go black, you never go back”

Says who?

"Accusing me of witchcraft? I don't have time for that shit!"

raci$t le$bian troll alert!!

Color-blind casting is the most offensive thing. Famed black playwright August Wilson thought it was a very dumb idea. Remember all the brouhaha about Julia Roberts being mentioned to play Harriet Tubman? This is the exact same thing, but for some reason the progressives cheer!

How do the filmmakers think anyone will take them seriously? They won't!

[quote]Rather than casting a fabulous black actress like Jodie Turner-Smith to play the part - which is then woefully miscast and unbelievable - why not make a fabulous new series about an African Queen or Egyptian Queen or Persian Queen where she is perfectly cast

I guess they're admitting nobody wants to see these BAME, BIPOC, TRANS, and other such stories to begin with! I certainly am not interested in seeing the Underemployed Black Actors Jobs Program version of Anne Boleyn.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

Don't use that ridiculous "Latinx" word R122.

[quote]White actors have more employment opportunities, so there is no reason to cast them in roles written for black actors. Minority actors have fewer opportunities, hence the move toward employment equity.

Movies and tv are not primarily jobs programs for underserved actors believe it or not. It's actually the task of performing artists to serve the writing first. I understand that Actors Equity exists only as a woke/progressive Black (BIPOC!) Actor employment arm instead of actually advocating for higher equitable wages for stage actors- a task at which they have failed miserably- so they've decided to just be a Social Justice PR firm, but don't get sucked in by that. This is all still pure bullshit!

I always wonder about people like R126.

How do they not notice that white people, black people, and latinx people occupy very different places in our class system, culture, and labor system?

Do they really believe that we are all separate but equal?

R130, so there is something inherent in whiteness that gives actors the skills to serve writing better than black actors?

The idea of equity in job opportunity is not a "job program" but rather a standard feature in labor law.

R132 - when they are playing actual historical figures, YES.

Look, for modern television and film, there's no reason that people can't be of different ethnicities for any role. We've made quite a bit of progress in that area and it's a good thing.

What next - an Asian Marilyn Monroe? A woman playing John Wayne? Stop with this bullshit - it's a one-way phenomenon, which should tell you it's wrong. You don't see white people playing black roles or asians (not that they didn't use to at one time).

Actually, in the past few years Scarlett Johansson, Tilda Swinton, Rooney Mara, Emma Stone, and Johnny Depp all played non-white characters. And that is just off the top of my head.

And I actually have seen a black actress play Marilyn Monroe and a woman play Abraham Lincoln very well. I guess I really do not see the problem--why not just cast the best actor for the role rather than focus on appearance?

You can tell the story of black people in Tudor England without having have a black actress play a white historical character.

But a white voice actor can no longer give non-white cartoon characters their voices, but black actors are wildly cheered to play white historical figures and are not harassed and shamed. Got it.

R134 So you have seen an actual black actress play Marilyn Monroe?

That sounds like blackface.

OMG This woman has been procreating with that tubby guy from 'Dawson's Creek'.

At least she has one of those painfully-long necks that will make it very easy for the executioner to cut off her head.

Anne. Daughter to Thomas Boleyn, the first Earl of Wiltshire; Maid of honour to the Queen of France. Engaged to the ninth Earl of Ormond. Maid of honour to Queen Catherine of Aragon. Engaged to the son of the fifth Earl of Northumberland. Catalyst for the break up of the Holy Roman Church in England. The Marquess of Pembroke. Queen of England. Mother to Elizabeth, the Queen of England.

History. Is just that. History. No need to rewrite. Just accept and move on.

R117 and R118, Weird logic considering the casting since the likes of William Hurt, Ciaran Hinds, Timothy Dalton, Orson Wells and Michael Fassbender have all played the role of Rochester. None of the above I would consider ugly or unattractive. To me, Idris has become a bit craggy, er “dusty” as he has aged, which is why I could see him in the role. Another option, the actor who played Tic in Lovecraft Country.

As for potential casting being deemed as racist, why? Off the top of my head, I could see Letitia Wright (Shuri from Black Panther) or Susan Wokoma as Jane, neither of which I would see as controversial choices.

That photograph at R139 looks as though it was suggested by Aubrey Beardsley's censored illustration of Salome fingering her pudenda.

R122, in Spanish-speaking countries do they refer to themselves as "Latinx"?

Black girl magic! Especially if it’s Beyoncé or Kamala Harris.

It is a gimmick to attract more attention. Nothing more. Is her sister Mary, who Henry VIII had as a mistress also black?

Henry had the jungle fever

R137, I saw the play about 15 years ago. The whole thing was really well done and I thought it would go further--but I also figured other productions would probably hire a white actress instead.

But the actress was terrific. Maybe because she was black she played the character rather than focusing on doing a Marilyn imitation.

R134, in many cases the best actor for a role is one who resembles the appearance of the role.

[quote]in Spanish-speaking countries do they refer to themselves as "Latinx"?

No, Latinx is only used in the US.

I'm surprised that Meghan Markle-Windsor hasn't filed an injunction against this production. After all, she was the first, and only, black royal.

R150, please leave your Meghan racist crazy out of this thread.

This is annoying AF. Woke cultists have gone from screeching about cultural appropriation to blackwashing European, North African, Persian and Asian culture. Anne Boleyn was a real person, she has her own identity, making her black is a sign these female writers are lazy attention seeking leftist simpletons who don't understand the first thing about history or culture but feel entitled to meddle with it.

They ought to have tried this on THE TUDORS, back when it might have been a bold move.

At least Jonathan Rhys Meyers would have appreciated and enjoyed it, he goes for coloured girls.

So, a black Anne Boleyn is too ahistorial, but the costumes and slender JRM on The Tudors are not?

[quote] is too . . . are not?

R154 The earlier casting was stupid but the proposed casting is insane.

Okay, after commenting a lot here, I'm going to say, if this is interesting it will be interesting. If it is just stunt casting, that will come through. If they want to do this thing (and honestly, I seriously wish they would pick other Queens besides all the Typicals), but if they want to do Anne Boleyn black, be at least interesting.

This person is the replacement King Henry.

Defender of the faith, founder of the Royal Navy.

R138

Anne Boleyn had a long thin neck that she was very proud of.

In fact, her executioner used a sword and not an axe to perform his duty.

A French Executioner, r158, skilled in the arts of cutting off heads. So I guess he should be played by an Algerian?

This WOKE decision will go down in history as being equally as crazy as Marion Robert Morrison of Iowa playing Genghis Khan of Mongolia.

lord have mercy,,,,butterfly mcqueen mus be rollin ovr in her grave.

I agree with everyone who says they could have gone with a different historical figure. But i'm not mad at this casting and i hope it turns out decent.

R160, I must protest!

I saw a production of Romeo and Juliet, in which Juliet was Black and Romeo was Hispanic and the parents were whatever--I don't remember. I thought it was awful but I sat in back of a row of Black teens who had studied the play in school. They recited lines along with the players. That was annoying, too, but I doubt if a conventional production could have reached them. I'll live to see other productions and had seen productions before but this one was life-changing for them. We should never forget the importance of representation to people who don't have very much of it.

[quote]I saw a production of Romeo and Juliet, in which Juliet was Black and Romeo was Hispanic and the parents were whatever

The difference was that Anne Boleyn was a real person and we know what she looked like, as well as her husband and daughter. Romeo & Juliet were fictional characters, and while the story is set in Italy, could technically be any color at all.

I don't care if it interferes with my willing suspension of disbelief if it makes others feel a sense of inclusion.

it aint bout historiical accuracy, its about....hey be WOKE....we is HERE....k????

ugh

[quote]The difference was that Anne Boleyn was a real person and we know what she looked like

We also know that she lived 500 years ago so the reality of what she looked like is about as important as what you had for breakfast this morning.

It's gonna be a teevee show. A teevee show.

Watch it. Don't watch it. Doesn't much matter.

The pearl clutching is so clearly bullshit. Hairstyles, makeup, costume, decor are always inaccurate but get given a pass, but skintone is the deal breaker?

Hmmm....why might that be......?

You could create a drama about one of the actual black people in Tudor England, R169, and investigate the role of race in the period. If you make a prominent historical person black and then NO-ONE AROUND HER MENTIONS IT, what are you actually saying about the 16th century? That it was a wondrous haven of diversity?

R170, I doubt they are making the character "black." There is no indication that they are.

All we know it that a black actress is playing the role. Not everything a black person does has to be about race.

[quote] Romeo & Juliet were fictional characters, and while the story is set in Italy, could technically be any color at all.

Keeping them as white Italians reinforces just how stupid they really are.

That's transparently disingenuous, R171. In this sort of context, that is exactly what it has to be about.

Whites should only get to play whites but Black people should be allowed to play any race they want. Fair is fair.

Yes, Snowflake. It really is not fair that black people have all the advantages and white people are being held down by uppity minorities.

Same thing with women. Men have to wear pants but women can wear pants or dresses--or skirts!

White people and men should have the same freedom as blacks and women.

So r171 you'd be happy with a white actor playing a historical black figure?

[quote] White people and men should have the same freedom as blacks and women.

Whyte “men” can’t even take being told that they are wrong, never mind 400 years of oppression. You would not last one day being forced to pick cotton in the hot Alabama sun in the middle of July. You deserve it, though.

Don’t talk to me about freedom until your “people” are dragged kicking and screaming from your homeland, whipped and beaten, forced to grow plants for rich Black men, and killed if they try to escape. Even then I won’t feel sorry for you because unlike Black people, you actually deserve to be slaves.

White men deserve every single bit of the exact same oppression they have subjected blacks, women, gays, and Jews to and still do to this day.

Until I see Black men owning vast plantations in the south where they force white people to grow cash crops day in and day out without rest or pay, you can shut the fuck up about “muh auntie whyte raycizzum hurr durr derp.”

Until Ricky Schroder is forced to pick cotton on a plantation, shut the fuck up about “muh auntie whyte raycissum.” There is no such thing and even if there was you would fucking deserve it. History is a record of everything you did to deserve to be hated by everybody you systemically oppressed.

Until Christians, Muslims, and heterosexuals are targeted for genocide as payback for doing it to gays and Jews, you can shut up about “muh auntie whyte raycizzum.”

r18 who do you think pays for all of your benefits?

Creators of this are just tryubg to get woke points.

If you have a need to see people like you in historical shows where there was a less than 1 percent chance people like you would even be around (much less on royal court), you need psychological help asap!

Eddie Redmayne *is* US President Barack Obama.

I don't like colorblind casting when it comes to historical or period pieces. I don't like when they whitewash ancient Egyptians (they were tawny, not white or black), ancient Israelites, or Asians (The King and I). I equally despise the farce that Anne Boleyn could be played by a black woman. As for fantasy, or historical fantasy, I don't care. All of the hobbits in Lord of the Rings could be Japanese for all I care.

The blacker the berry, the sweeter the JUICE!

[Quote] I'd say in cases like this color blind casting in historical based television, and films tends takes you out of the story, and the character/person.

Whereas Hollywood movies set in Ancient Greece with plummy voiced English actors trips no switch.

Zzzzzzzzzz

[quote]The blacker the berry, the sweeter the JUICE!

Yeah, but nobody wants diabetes.

[quote]Whereas Hollywood movies set in Ancient Greece with plummy voiced English actors trips no switch.

Ancient Greek actually looked more like the English than modern Greeks.

So it's just looks that matter?

White people couldn't give a fuck if Brits play Romans or what have you. It's not an issue.

What about Italians playing Frenchmen?

I'm glad they're finally getting to telling the story of Anne Boleyn! I've never heard it told before in books or film or on TV.

I've seen Boleyn's story told 50 different times with 50 different actresses. One more doesn't make any difference. You racial-purity-in-acting people are fucking stupid.

I've forgotten more about English history than you will ever know and one Black Boleyn is not an issue.

Agreed. And I bet none of these people were complaining about Angelina Jolie playing a real life, biracial woman.

Well I know I wasn't r195. Never heard of it, don't give a shit.

[Quote] don't give a shit.

But of course.

Which kind of raises the question, why now, why her, why this r194? Or is stunt casting the entire point of this whole movie?

If not now, when?

I dunno r199, maybe never. Why do the same stories about the same people need to be told over and over and over again? Maybe Hollywood should focus on that rather than mixing it up with stunt casting and nothing else.

The Tudors are always good fodder for tv and movies. The stunt casting probably is the point, a la "Hamilton" and they're hoping to bring in younger, more diverse viewers.

I don't know. Whatever she does, she can't be worse than that dreadful Black Swan girl. She was laughably bad. It was a bad acting competition between Black Swan (what is her name?) and the Johanssen girl, who was a large vanilla pudding stuffed into a dress.

White actors played Othello for hundreds of years. *shrug* Men played womens parts for hundreds of years. *shrug* Tall people play short people, thin people play fat people, old people play young people and so on.

A white actor playing Othello today would be problematic.

Of course, the Moors were not black Africans, but that's another story.

Can anyone imagine a movie being made about a tribe in Africa in the 1500's time period and they cast a white or Asian woman as the Queen of the tribe?

This pathetic headline-chasing gimmick sounds ridiculous.

But on the other hand, we don't know if they're attempting pseudo-realism as in that pathetic colour-blind version of 'Miserables' (with adulterer Dominic West) or whether they're doing something self-consciously arty.

The title "Queen & Slim" makes me think perhaps they're attempting something self-consciously arty.

Sure, Jan.

Mabel's father was kinda cute.

Who's Mabel?

She's a British singer.

Her brother ain't so bad either.

[quote] Her brother

Is he black?

I don't know how he identifies. I believe his mother is pictured below.

^ That woman MIGHT pass as Anne Boleyn.

Colorblind casting with historical biopics is fine, as long as those movies call themselves "fiction" and not biopics or historical films. Rewriting history is fine as long as you don't expect for it to still be called history after you rewrite it. Once you tamper with facts they become fiction.

But isn't history written by the victors? Surely facts are tampered with to favor the victors?

I can play her. I have that in my repertoire.

If Miss Boleyn had been black she would have been called La Shonda Boleyn not Ann.

If Miss Boleyn had been black she would have slapped Henry into submission.

As long as they let Tyler Perry play her, I'm fine with Anne Boleyn being a black woman.

Henry loved big breasts not big booty so she must have been white!

I'm fine with Anne Boleyn being rewritten as a black woman as long as all her dialogue sounds like Prissy's in Gone With The Wind.

When I first started watching, "The Great", the colorblind casting was irking me, but then I got over it, because it was so fun.

In the article, they mention 3 other black actors (around the same age as she) and 2 older white actors, so it may be more skewed to more of a "all blackish" version.

She ain't had no tits neither, r219

[quote]And I actually have seen a black actress play Marilyn Monroe and a woman play Abraham Lincoln very well. I guess I really do not see the problem...

Then you sound like a total moron. Those projects that nobody has ever heard of were right up your alley!

r131 and r132 are bringing their straw man arguments big time. A couple of lulus.

If Connie Stevens can play Marilyn Monroe, so can a black actress.

[quote]What next - an Asian Marilyn Monroe? A woman playing John Wayne? Stop with this bullshit - it's a one-way phenomenon, which should tell you it's wrong. You don't see white people playing black roles or asians (not that they didn't use to at one time).

In 2015 Kent State University cast a white actor and a black actor to play Martin Luther King Jr. during the run of a play. Joseph Fiennes played Michael Jackson in an episode of "Urban Myths". And people can argue that Jackson's skin tone makes it so that a white actor could play him but he was a Black man and no amount of bleaching changes that.

The film "21" primarily cast white actors when they were depicting a true story about a group Asian Americans. "The Impossible" has Ewan McGregor, Naomi Watts and Tom Holland as the real life Spaniard family the film is based on. In "Argo" Ben Affleck stars as Mexican American Tony Mendez. Producers use the argument that they need "name actors" to get financing, but how will actors of other ethnicity and nationalities become bankable when they are being passed over for roles?

[quote] "The Impossible" has Ewan McGregor, Naomi Watts and Tom Holland as the real life Spaniard family the film is based on.

Spaniards are European and Caucasian.

You MUST be American.

[quote]Spaniards are European and Caucasian.

Yes, but do they have the same customs and heritages as Brits? Are the Finnish interchangeable with Spaniards?

I have to laugh when Americans act as if Spanish nationality automatically means the people aren't white.

A few years back the American press called Antonio Banderas a "person of color" and Spaniards went apeshit. They were highly offended.

[quote] Are the Finnish interchangeable with Spaniards?

They're close enough.

I know many Americans don't believe this, but all Europeans have variations in skin tone, hair and eye color. Not all Spaniards and Italians are dark and swarthy, for example. Many, many many of them can be fair and blue-eyed.

Conversely, there are many Scandinavians with dark hair and brown eyes.

Americans are SO weird about shit like this.

R223 You made me cackle with delight.

[quote]A few years back the American press called Antonio Banderas a "person of color" and Spaniards went apeshit. They were highly offended.

A few years back Harvard called Elizabeth Warren a "person of color" and barely anyone went apeshit. Very few "progressives" were highly offended.

Are you angry about Hamilton?

If Elizabeth Warren is a "person of color" then I'm the fucking King of Romania.

R137 That picture on the right somehow reminds me of—

R211, the woman in the photograph is not Neneh Cherry (Mabel's mother).

AND MY MOMMA WAS POLKA DOT.

I had to laugh when, during a production of A Doll's House, Part 2, where Condola Rashād played the daughter of very white Laurie Metcalf and Chris Cooper, a woman exclaimed way too loudly, "She must have been adopted"

When I saw the most recent version of Carousel, Joshua Henry played Billy Bigelow. I kept thinking that having a black actor in that particular role changed the dynamic of the character. During the intermission I overheard two black women talking and one of them said that it was the most racist thing she had ever seen on Broadway. Of all the roles that could have gone to a person of color, that was the last one that should have gone to a black.

Given that there is literally *zero* photographic evidence that Anne Boleyn wasn’t black, we should assume that she was.

see link

The BBC Mantra Handbook says.—

Everybody is the same above the neck.

Everybody is equal and race and gender and much else besides are mere social constructs

Everybody can be whatever they want to be.

Life is entirely about environment, opportunity and privilege.

She’s stunning, whoever she is in OPs photo.

It's true Anne Boleyn was a black woman. So was Eleanor Roosevelt. There are still people who don't believe that Prime Minister Winston Churchill was East Asian.

No it was Eleanor Roosevelt who was East Asian. That's why she asked Frank to intern them all for their PROTECTION from all those angry American mothers who went insane demanding payback after the Japanese killed their handsome young sons.

Mamie Eisenhower was black by injection.

Do you mean to tell me in our exhaustive and now infamous Mamie Eisenhower threads not one of you fuckers thought it worthy to mention that she was BLACK!

I'm very disappointed!

Only black by injection r246.

"A black person," R239, not "a black." This isn't 1962.

Hi R244, I am R243. I think you are correct and humorous. WW for you. Thank you for the correction. Apologies for my goof.

Anne Boleyn was a black woman and the King of France is also black.

(Ethiopian in the latest BBC version of England's King Lear)

I guess Queen Anne Boleyn's story will be remade in the years to come.

And I'm sure the new versions will need to updated with new angles to excite the increasingly ignorant audiences. And I'm guessing we'll see a new Anne Boleyn who looks like this--

She looks beautiful! I wish black women would wear full Tudor dress more often, they look so regal.

I read in an upcoming film, Napoleon Bonaparte will be portrayed as Hawaiian.

Her daughter did have suspiciously kinky hair...

R240, I guess that Tweeter never heard of "paintings."

Why is it that (non-PC comment coming) the change in race portrayal goes in only one direction: from White to Non-White?

Can you IMAGINE the outrage if someone re-made, say, "Amistad" or "Ray" with all White actors?

r255 or let them know that most of their beloved sitcoms about african americans in the 70s and on were american versions of shows that often started with a full white irish cast. that this entire identity they've built based upon that isn't black but just universally poor trash.

though, honestly at this point maybe we really do need every historical character to be bame, so people will stop tearing down statues and changing the name of everything if they're led to believe in whatever popular historical revision is of the day. even many universities full on support revisionism, berkeley has a professor that believes america was founded by jews and therefore has to be destroyed, nyu has one that believes any and all refugees from cuba were slave owners because no liberal would have ever left the utopia that cuba was and has always been and let's not even get into all those at the new school

White people have spent generations revising history and whitewashing people.

Turnabout is fair play.

R258

We just can't touch Dr King, Malcom X, Muhammed Ali or Lena Horne... They are sacred and above this all.

Why not just cast a 78 year old Asian man as Anne and a 12 year old black girl as Henry VIII?

Turnabout is only fair play if the same actual people are involved. Otherwise its just repeating unfairness.

R6, thanks for the laugh. A good hearty laugh, too.

BUMP

She’s...dark.

[quote] We just can't touch Dr King, Malcom X, Muhammed Ali or Lena Horne... They are sacred and above this all.

Malcom Jew-hater X. Oh, no!