America Needs to Lock Down Again: The Only Way to Slow the Coronavirus

Stringent lockdowns, of course, would depend on the continued labor of essential workers, a category we estimate to be no more than 35 percent of the workforce and possibly less. What about other workers? As part of its broader anti-COVID-19 strategy, the federal and state governments should compensate both individual workers and small businesses that suffer substantial or irreparable economic loss as a result of lockdowns.

Such support negates the false choice between public and economic health. If carried out successfully, the near-complete shutdowns would be not open-ended but limited in time. And the government has the means to prop up adversely affected workers and businesses. As Minneapolis Federal Reserve Bank President Neel Kashkari outlined in an op-ed in The New York Times cowritten with one of us (Osterholm), this fiscal obligation could be covered by the money most Americans who have not lost income are saving by not spending as much during the pandemic—the personal savings rate of Americans has grown from eight percent in January to 20 percent in August. Domestic savings can fund investment in the national economy, a concept that should work equally well in other developed nations. Banks, whose holdings have been boosted by the additional savings, could loan the money necessary for protecting jobs and businesses; Americans would essentially be repaying themselves rather than taking the more traditional route of incurring foreign debt.

We believe many people would support a more robust lockdown if they understood that they would not suffer financially. Such a subsidy will actually save money in the long term by preserving jobs and small businesses.

OP that's not going to happen.

[quote]We believe many people would support a more robust lockdown if they understood that they would not suffer financially.

Many people, perhaps, but not a single Trump voter.

Not gonna happen in a million years, even in the bluest of blue states. That ship has sailed, thanks to Trump. Masks, masks, masks. And smart social distancing.

The only way this happens without large scale revolt is a legitimate stimulus bill from congress that would guarantee everyone $2000 a month, rent and mortgage forgiveness, and free covid related healthcare. Pelosi seems hell bent on not allowing that to happen, so it’s unlikely.

NO. We already did this. Enough already.

A lockdown again is last resort if it gets really bad. No way everything closes down again, the initial response shouldn't have been botched but Trump ruined any possible avenue for close control. So all we as American society due is mask, social distance, vaccine, and pray(for some this is literal)

R5, Pelosi is the problem? Really? You’re a trumpTARD.

It's not going to happen again. As someone else said, not even in the bluest states.

I am for another lock down, but I know I am in the minority.

Pelosi IS also a real part of this problem.

Both sides are carrying on like whiny little brats who aren't going to budge a single centimeter unless they get their way. No one seem to understand that the art of compromise is a key factor in politics.

And, in the meantime, those who need help the most are the ones who are suffering royally.

Health care is not being overwhelmed, cases in most states are declining, and people have already begun to adapt to the new normal. A new lockdown would be pointless.

House democrats are starting to get really pissed at Pelosi. She isn’t budging at all because of the state funding part of the bill. She’s asking for more than even the states asked for. She rejected a bipartisan bill that some house members came up with, outright. She’s being ridiculous at this point and people are going to start blaming her more than they already are. No one cares she passed a bill back in May.

Many people didn't follow guidelines this summer, and the numbers exploded.

Now, it's back to school, party time, and sports. And increasing numbers.

Just imagine what the numbers will be following Thanksgiving, Christmas, and New Year's celebrations.

We do need a lockdown. Suck it up, we've gotta do something. But it won't work unless everyone cooperates.

What are the chances .........

OP = Biden.

Pelosi is 80 years old, but she's acting like an eight year old.

Time to put the old made out to pasture.

Pelosi has the leverage she knows it and she should get more $$... the States need it

Not gonna happen, you Lockdown Troll. Time to lose your fucking weight instead of forcing the whole country to protect you from this benign virus, fat hoes.

You’re full of shit, OP.

The best thing to do with America would be to saw it off the globe and hurl it into outer space.

What r19 said.

CNN reports that Bill Barr said tonight that our lockdown was the greatest intrusion on civil liberties in America since slavery.

Can only hope you or someone you love dies from it, R17, you evil Trumptard shit.

No more lockdowns.

This would not happen. Both Democrats and Republicans made it clear that they weren't going to follow the COVID restrictions if they directly affected them. Americans are too selfish to do anything for the greater good, expecting them to sacrifice anything to end COVID is a pipe dream.

Get outta here, Commie!!!

Americans think giving up meat to stop climate change is a ridiculous thing to ask of them, you really expect for them to be so selfless and sacrificing that they'd go on total lockdown just to stop a disease?

They are a childish, petulant people who don't like being told the word "no" and can't handle being taken care of by someone else, despite how they fail at self-governing. They will never sacrifice for the greater good, and the rest of the world knows this, which is why instead of attempting to convince the US to lockdown have instead simply closed their borders to us.

They know we're a lost cause.

Europe isn’t going to lock down, either.

Did we REALLY have a first lock down?

R26 Nothing about what you say is unique to Americans. And asking the rest of us to Make sacrifices when the people in charge don’t and are the ones chiefly responsible is insane.

No .

Israel is locking down again starting Friday.

Parts of Europe are going through a second wave that is worse than the first one and a total lockdown isn't being considered in these places. In fact, a secnd total lockdown is off the table for most countries. Virus management going forward seems to be limited regional lockdowns with social distancing measures. If you don't like it then stay home.

We have had ENOUGH lockdown shit already! OP, you probably have no life, so being in lockdown is NO different than before!

LOOK at all the nasty denier cunts posting in this thread!

America didn't even have a first lockdown so there is literally no way there will be a second but it's what America needs to do. There wont be a vaccine for 12 - 18 months at the earliest. Apart from the 200,000 people who have already died - the long-term health effects of Covid-19 are unknown and are only starting to become apparent.

Let's put the current death numbers in perspective. In the 1918 flu pandemic, which started in Kansas and was exported to the rest of the world - around 675,000 Americans died.

[quote]Can only hope you or someone you love dies from it, [R17], you evil Trumptard shit.

And you have? NO ONE around me, my officemates, my relatives, my friends, my acquaintances ever catches this benign virus!!! But 5 people have fucking died from heart attack because they couldn't see their doctors.

So FUCK you, you stupid fat cunt R22. And please lock down your obese and odious self until all people around you die from economic ruins and lack of medical care. FUCK YOU!!!!! Stupid, ugly fattard.

Double-deniers just fucking take a look at Australia, Spain, etc... Did the complete lockdown help???? So fuck you, all near-blind, old fat cunts.

America won’t lockdown. I live in a college town and there have been 1800 cases of Covid since Labor Day and that’s the students and staff who’ve been tested. We can’t get past this until there’s a vaccine.

Going forward the model is Sweden.

And the picture is a beautiful blonde!

OP is going to start another toilet paper shortage.

[quote]And the picture is a beautiful blonde!

Of course, most 150-kg fattards wouldn't survive unscathed!!!!

Fauci smart. R17/35 rabid, brain-dead little bitch.

R34, before this is over, we could hit 675,000, maybe a million or more. And this is with much better masks and medications than 1918.

Think about it. By the time everyone gets vaccinated, it could be 2024. I know it’s impossible to believe, but in May, nobody thought it would be 200,000. They were predicting 66,000. Now they’re saying 400,000 well before the end of the year. With no end in sight. It’s a war of attrition.

[R26], you're not helping your credibility, referring to 'Americans' and painting us all with the same brush. Back to topic. I was talking to my dad yesterday. I told him here in Seattle, at least in my neighbourhood, everybody wears masks. The QFC super grocery store a block away has a sign telling anybody who enters that they must wear a mask. I watch travel channels on youtube. In Madrid's airport, and in England's airports, maybe half the people were wearing masks. It's unbelievable! Is it because it's been six or so months since lockdown that people believe it's OK to walk around exposing others to the particulates in their exhalation? I don't understand.

You're 100% correct with everything you say R42.

And just now on the news we saw Trump refuting CDC Director Robert Redfield’s comments on the timeline for vaccine availability to the general public and the effectiveness of masks! Trump basically saying that the vaccine will be released in October and Redfield was an incompetent fool who was too stupid to understand questions.

How much worse can you get than that?

China had a 8-week lock down, it worked for them. Italy had a 8-week lock down, and it worked for them too. But the US didn't even have a state wide 6 week lock down, let alone nation wide, so this proposal is not "again", it would be the first nation wide lock down for US, unfortunately it should be in March, not 6 months later.

R45, you obviously haven't been paying attention to what is currently happening in Italy.

I don't understand how even the blue states are handling this. What they are doing is so piecemeal that it isn't going to accomplish anything. You roll back to a higher level of restrictions when certain parts of a state get bad. Then, when their numbers drop a bit, they are allowed to again to right back to the same behavior that caused their bad numbers in the first place and, surprise, their numbers go back up again. Repeat on an endless fucking loop.

What they need to do is give the different areas one chance. Your numbers go up you get one chance to bring them down. If you do you get the restrictions lifted but if they go up again, permanent lockdown on restaurants, bars, social gatherings in that area. The idiot Americans who aren't acting responsibly only respond to toddler level punishment. So, they get sent to their rooms with no dinner and they can come out again when they can behave.

Nobody but the most sheltered and spoiled white collar workers wants more shutdowns.

If you haven't been exposed to Covid after 6 months, tough cookie. Take vitamin D and social distance.

R4 those practices clearly work though, as we’ve seen — so why lockdown yet again?

They just need to be strictly enforced in every state.

Let me add that fear of the virus far outweighs how infectious it actually is. Only a handful of people I work with ever caught it and we are face to face with the public day in and day out.

Oh, and the last confirmed case at my job was in July. Still locked down like it's the black plague out there, though.

I have said my piece.

So, you're at work at your job, R50, where people have gotten infected but you have simultaneously been locked down like it's the black plague the entire time? Uh huh.

No more lockdowns.

R51 I am a heroic essential worker. Bow down. Learn to read.

States' rights!

[quote] China had a 8-week lock down, it worked for them. Italy had a 8-week lock down, and it worked for them too.

You trust China??!! Most of Italy’s infected patients are dead. Of course it went down.

There will be a vaccine in 6 months..but the question is when will we get it? PS Covid outbreaks in Europe are not rivaling the initial outbreak. That’s BS.

R56 Cases are rising throughout most of Europe. The number of new daily cases in France, Spain, and Norway are higher now than the initial out break. In France exceedingly so. However, deaths are low. Interesting how a few months ago all the talk was about flattening the curve. No more.

And about Italy: new daily cases are where they were at the beginning of May. Not good.

Why waste all the effort on a lockdown? Why try to force people to do something they have no interest in doing (even if it's for their own protection)?

Just let it become an Orwellian survival of the fittest: the weak will be killed off and the strong will survive.

[quote]NO ONE around me ever catches this benign virus!!!

1. If it were actually benign, you wouldn't know if anyone around you caught it.

2. You don't know what benign means.

Be like Sweden.

Yes, R56. Spain and France have reached number of new daily cases higher than the initial peak, but deaths and hospitalizations? Those figures are nowhere near what they were before—and that was the principal reasoning for "flattening the curve."

Not to imply that all is well and good, but the frozen meat trucks are not lined up to back into the loading docks and the hospitals are not chaos.

America is fucked. Our power in this world is diminishing. We have made way too many fuck ups and it’s all caught up to us.

At least this whole thing ripped off the facade. But we have to move forward and take action. We have to take these experiences and learn from them and do better. But I don’t believe Americans are able to do that. Sorry. I don’t believe Americans will learn and grow from this.

This coronavirus is only the beginning of national disasters that are to come.

[quote] Time to put the old made out to pasture.

Oh fucking dear.

[quote] Spain and France have reached number of new daily cases higher than the initial peak, but deaths and hospitalizations? Those figures are nowhere near what they were before—and that was the principal reasoning for "flattening the curve."

And that could be due to more testing.

A week or so ago New York tested 102,000 in one day. Back in the spring I’m sure there were more cases than we knew about because of lack of testing. Same probably goes for the EU.

America is not fucked. What are you talking about?! There are not dead people lying all over the place and even in more conservative areas people wear masks and are doing online classes and working from home if they can. The dystopian picture that some like to paint is not true. I have known only a handful of people to contact the virus and they didn’t have symptoms. Yes, maybe we’ll have a surge and be punished for our sinful ways in the winter. Hopefully so, so you all can be happy and rejoice in being fucked.

A lockdown would get a hold of this pandemic but, with a significant portion of Americans believing the whole thing is a hoax (aided by conservative states hiding their data), many people will just refuse.

That said, if numbers go up like crazy during the winter in the red states, they may change their minds but there would have to be mass deaths in the red states first...which I'm fine with .

Everybody has to get it. You can't stop it. Just hope you don't die.

R4

Our piece of shit phony baloney Governor Newsom, is allowing schools in counties to apply for waivers for K-6! Even where the virus is raging. Work around the rules. That’s the American way. He also approved fracking permits during all this hell. No lockdown will happen

R66

Yes we are fucked. Obviously not just from the pandemic. But the pandemic has proven that we don’t have our shit together. We can’t even come together to fight the pandemic and save the lives of Americans, how the fuck are we going to handle future, worse national emergencies? With the way this world is headed there is much more to come. And the coronavirus has exposed how ill prepared and incompetent we are.

As I said, the coronavirus is just the beginning. You are proving my point and have the blinders on.

[quote]China had a 8-week lock down, it worked for them.

It did R45. But the difference is that when China said [bold]lockdown[/bold] - they fucking meant it and if you didn't like it then they welded your door closed. There was none of this protesting your freedom dressed in fatigues and carrying machine guns or not wearing masks when you are supposed to be to protect your fellow countryman. They picked you up off the street, threw you in your house and then welded the door shut.

I have to admit I respect that commitment. It's a very no nonsense approach and a lot of Americans could do with the same treatment.

[quote]There was none of this protesting your freedom dressed in fatigues and carrying machine guns or not wearing masks when you are supposed to be to protect your fellow countryman.

Indeed. [italic]This[/italic] was the moment America needed to go out protesting / rioting?

Spain is reportedly set to announce targeted lockdowns in places where the virus is spreading rapidly, and renewed restrictions of movement on Friday.

The U.K. has started to reintroduce measures to restrict social gatherings, with the number of people allowed to meet now limited to six in England. Stricter measures targeting north-east England could be announced Thursday, the BBC reported.

In America COVID was the moment where public health slammed headfirst into white privilege.

I mean, seriously. The motherfucking ATTORNEY GENERAL tells us that requesting people (not a true lockdown, a request) to stay home so they don't die was worse than slavery.

Which I guess from their brain-damaged perspective makes sense. We're seeing people that , for the first time in their lives, they were asked to make a sacrifice for the public good, to forgo getting their nails done, forgo drinking in a bar, forgo working out in a gym.

And they lost what was left of their tiny little minds.

And this winter is going to get considerably worse, and these people are going to completely lose their shit.

But Halloween!

But Thanksgiving!

But Christmas!

But New Year’s

But Valentine’s Day

But Easter!

But Mother’s Day!

But Father’s Day!

But Memorial Day!

But 4th of July!

But Labor Day!

[quote] Spain and France have reached number of new daily cases higher than the initial peak, but deaths and hospitalizations?

I specifically wrote: "However, deaths are low. "

[quote]Those figures are nowhere near what they were before—and that was the principal reasoning for "flattening the curve."

No, the reasoning behind flattening the curve was to reduce the transmission of the virus.

The WHO expects mortality rates in Europe to rise in October, November.

Shut up..., I'm rich. I've got a million dollars. I own three blocks downtown. I've got oil in Bakersfield and its pumping, pumping, pumping....

[quote]We're seeing people that , for the first time in their lives, they were asked to make a sacrifice for the public good... And they lost what was left of their tiny little minds.

You forgot going to a cinderblock building and mumbling to a non-existent man-in-sky... who wanted them to take off the masks, shout, sing, clap, and spread virus around to everyone! Praise!

"The number of French people treated in intensive care units for COVID-19 rose for the twentieth straight day on Wednesday to a three-month high of 803, while the number of new daily cases was the third highest on record."

R67 The hysterical dogma on the left that Covid is an apocalypse destroying America and only more shutdowns can fix it... is every bit as politically motivated and divorced from reality as Trump supporters thinking the virus isn't real.

Science is not on your side.

R74 LMAO the white privileged are team shutdown. LMAO. White people and asians are the only groups reliably sticking to any pandemic regulations. Black people don't social distance or wear masks except at work.

Racist above.

Even if there were continued lockdowns it will not go away.

R81, you are kind of right. I'm black and live in Jersey City, which is pretty ethnically diverse. The whites, hispanics, and asians usually have on masks. Young black men and women (under 40 say) are foregoing masks altogether. I'm a 32 year old male and wear a mask when I go in public, but most young black people are not wearing masks AND not social distancing. In fact, most people aren't practicing social distance as well as they should. People apparently don't know what 6 feet looks like spatially.

R75 If you want to sit home then do so. The rest of us will be out enjoying ourselves.

So what are you saying, that the vast majority the population should stay locked down because a small minority of people might, might get sick.? And of those who get sick very very very small percentage of them may die, maybe? So what do we do stay locked inside and allow our economy to continue to flounder?

Do you have any idea how many thousands and thousands of people have lost everything in the shut down? How many have lost their businesses, homes, not to mention their sanity and their lives due to suicide? Open your eyes for god sake‘s, yes it’s bad for some, especially for those who are highly susceptible, but there comes a point in time when decisions have to be made for the betterment of all.

Lock down zealots need help.

It doesn't need to be a binary. Lockdown anal-retentive OCD doomsday scenario - or balls to the wall party of the century.

America locking down again is not as extreme is imprisoning people for being super spreaders, something we're already seeing happen in Germany. What needs happen is that those with underlying conditions must stay home, while the rest of us assume the necessary risks.

A colleague of mine (university) said he reported a student "to the authorities" for attending school for a week despite knowing she was COVID+. Mary!

[quote]Do you have any idea how many thousands and thousands of people have lost everything in the shut down? How many have lost their businesses, homes, not to mention their sanity and their lives due to suicide?

No, do you? Because I've heard the president and Fox News raise these points since March, but I've yet to see stats on the number of Americans who've actually 1) folded businesses, 2) lot homes 3) gone insane 4) committed suicide.

R85 is probably a troll but just a reminder to us all, the US FEDERAL GOVERNMENT is supposed to help it's citizens financially through a mandatory lock down, take a look at what Canada has been doing. Stop acting like we have to all fend for ourselves, that's trump and the rethuglicans doing. Cut defense spending and reallocate funds for real support to small business owners and workers. TRUMP HAD NO PLAN BECAUSE HE DOESN'T CARE.

The people should get financial support not Trump & the GOP's cronies.

R15 you might want to look up a book of synonyms.... ask your supervisor in the troll farm for one.

Make sure R15's 7 sock puppets who gave him a W&W also get a Thesaurus, R91.

How dare R15 say that about totally uncorrupt Nancy Pelosi!

In the first 3+ months of the pandemic, only the sickest got tested. Now the numbers are rising exponentially partly because more people are getting tested and many of them don't feel particularly sick, but it turns out they are positive and still capable of spreading virus to the more vulnerable. I think we are past the point of lockdowns, but there should be a NATIONWIDE MANDATORY mask policy - from now until there is an effective vaccine. None of this bullshit "medical exemption" crap either. It turns out that masking plus reasonable social distancing measures are very effective in slowing the spread of the virus. But there are certain American pastimes that can't work this way. Indoor sports, concerts, movie theaters, restaurants, bars. All of these either need people packed together tightly to make sufficient profit for the enterprise, or people need to lift their masks to partake of food or drink. Which means a large segment of Americans will be out of work for a couple of years. Public transportation is also dicey. Mandatory masking would help, but it's very difficult to enforce social distancing on them.

R94 also very difficult to enforce social distancing at the riots you vociferously support.

Disingenuous cunt.

We all know it's a moot point because a. we never did a real lockdown the first time around, b. Americans lost their damn minds on the first "lockdown".

A national mask policy would, however, make a significant dent in potential new infections. Too bad we're governed by internet trolls rn.

For those of you still on the fence about things... Much of the world is currently locked down for a virus with a 99. 5% survival rate. Quarantine is when you restrict the movement of sick people. Tyranny is when you restrict the movement of healthy people. That is all.

R94 absolutely should be a mandatory masking policy. That plus enforced social distancing (yeah, there are always going to be a couple of stragglers who don’t comply, but by and large) is an “acceptable risk” to me and most healthy and sane people to move on with our lives already.

But when there Are such simple precautions to take, that are proven extremely effective, it’s absurd how people object and won’t comply. And going back to lockdown would be equally absurd, too.

You can't enforce masking and social distancing on black and brown people without forming the same fascist racist police state you claim already exists.

America will never lock down again. That's not happening. Too may people think they were duped by scientists who kept changing their mind and contradicting themselves. The citizens will not go to the lengths that they did before.

[quote]Much of the world is currently locked down for a virus with a 99. 5% survival rate. Quarantine is when you restrict the movement of sick people. Tyranny is when you restrict the movement of healthy people. That is all.

1. Americans are free to leave their homes at any time, as are most global residents. So your first statement is objectively false.

2. It's impossible to determine a true survival rate at this point, but if your stat is correct, hospitals would be overwhelmed with cases in the absence of mask-wearing and social distancing.

3. Per the CDC, people are put into quarantine when they are not sick, but have been or may been exposed to a communicable disease.

4. I'm healthy and I'm free to go anywhere I want.

People need to stop screeching about the low death rate -- there's evidence pointing to long term problems in people that were exposed, even if their symptoms weren't severe. Children that had the virus are being diagnosed with Diabetes type 1 at an alarming rate, when they were healthy prior to that.

There's an alarming amount of people post virus that haven't felt normal yet. They're fatigued, depressed, and some have permanent damage to lungs and body. That's without talking about mutations of we allow it to keep jumping around.

How is that acceptable? We should be demanding 24 hr test results, which should've been a main priority. We should be testing every person and isolating the positives.

But sure, let's live these half assed lives that will suck for years, so the entitled pricks can get in their lackluster vacations, go window shopping, and have their fat ass fed at a restaurant. 🙄 God forbid you can't do that to prevent permanent disability in a late portion of the population. I'm guessing the sane people will bitch when the post ill have to apply for social security decades earlier than they should've had to.

*large portion

When Dr. Fauci said people should not be wearing masks. This video is from a 60 Minutes interview in late march. It is extremely hard to find this clip. CBS has completely scrubbed it, even from their own On Demand service.

R104 Yes Fauci is the evil doer! Dumb ass.

We're watching the collective mental breakdown of upper middle class white people. Internationally.

[quote] People need to stop screeching about the low death rate -- there's evidence pointing to long term problems in people that were exposed, even if their symptoms weren't severe

The evidence isn't substantial. It's true that some people are at a higher risk of developing health complications due to Covid, however the evidence is still anecdotal. We're not going to know the long term effects in terms of years or decades for a long time, and you can't just keep people locked up until then. There will probably be other pandemics. What do we do at that point? All live in a bunker?

Similarly, no one knows for sure how long the immune response lasts, however it appears that individuals who got reinfected only months later are not the norm. There are just as many cases of people who didn't know they had Covid and have tested positive for immunity several months later.

There are people that have had heart damage, which may be irreversible, we don’t know. And there are a lot of asymptomatic kids that have heart damage and had no idea until they were tested. It’s up to adults to protect kids. Kids should not be running their own lives during a pandemic. They are not responsible.

I knew a guy who was a cardiologist. One of his patients was a poor young man who played basketball. The cardiologist found out this guy had a fairly common heart defect. He had had no idea and tried out for basketball. He was an excellent player and about to try out for a team that would have made his future. I guess the coach or somebody had his heart checked after some incident.

The cardiologist told him he couldn’t do it. He put him on beta blockers. He couldn’t play on them so he wouldn’t take them. He was looking forward to supporting his very poor family. The cardiologist kept telling him, it’s dangerous. He was so dumb, he thought he could just wish away the defect because he needed the money. He had a heart attack and died. So then his mother who wanted to be supported by him lost her golden goose anyway.

You can’t expect young people to behave rationally about how to act with heart defects. My sister had a heart defect. She ended up in the hospital several times trying to do too much. You’re talking about crippling very young people for a lifetime. Every thing they do is constrained by their heart issues. My sister is now 70 and she’s never been able to do a lot of things normal people can do. Every aspect of her youth was curtailed. Couldn’t be a cheerleader, couldn’t run, couldn’t be in the marching band because she couldn’t walk that far. Nearly died having her one kid, and they were prepared ahead of time. Spent school summers on bed rest or in a nursing home at one point. Is still sporting a tracheotomy scar from when she almost died and a has huge chest scar from heart surgery.

I can’t believe how selfish and heartless people are. How many parents or adults would willingly sentence their child or niece or nephew to that curtailed life? But talk to them about staying home and wearing a mask and that’s exactly what they want to do. Go out, breathe on everyone unmasked, scream about how they can’t live unless they’re spoiling themselves and totally disregarding anyone else. And these are the same people who would be whining their heads off about how unfair it is if it happened to someone they cared about. Or themselves.

R108 Sorry to break it to you, but the reality is none of us give a shit about your anecdotal stories. All of us are susceptible to all sorts of maladies. Schools must reopen in the US, just as they are in Europe.

Dr. Quack: CDC's Redfield claims masks ‘guaranteed to protect against COVID’

In February, Redfield said healthy people should *not* wear masks.

[quote] Testifying before the Senate Appropriations Committee Wednesday morning, CDC Director Robert Redfield entered further into quack doctor territory, claiming that wearing a mask protects the wearer against the novel coronavirus, even more so than a high-efficacy vaccine. “These facemasks are the important, powerful public health tool we have,” Redfield said, while touching both sides of his mask and unconsciously contaminating it with his hands. “I might even go so far as to say that this facemask is more guaranteed to protect me against COVID than when I take a COVID vaccine,” he added.

R104 Thanks for posting that video. And that is only a small part of Fauci’s advice during February and March when he was telling us we should be more concerned about the flu rather than covid. And then there is his praise for the response of the Trump administration. People desperately want to rewrite history. Because it is ALL about politics.

If we stipulate that experts changed their advice as circumstances and knowledge of the pandemic evolved, R110, would you quit beating the same tiresome drum?

Mary, r108!

We need another lockdown. People should not be dying just to safe the economy. Nothing is more valuable than human life. Safe the elderly. Protect the children. Elect Biden.

Wow, I simply cannot believe the volume of utter stupidity in this thread. You fucking assholes who still don't understand the severity of this virus and the way that Trump has completely botched the stoppage of it are truly fucking brain damaged. Anyone wanting to disprove the theory that gays are somehow smarter need only come spend a few minutes in here.

[quote]Schools must reopen in the US, just as they are in Europe.

Not until the U.S. achieves the same infection rate and case rate as Europe and not until the U.S. implements basic safety measures to keep faculty, staff, children, and their respective families safe.

It's just a few persistent sociopaths, R115. They've been here for months and have been regurgitating this same bullshit the entire time.

[quote]America will never lock down again. That's not happening.

On a state by state level, it's happened multiple times. Given enough cases and deaths, America absolutely will lock down again.

R116 Adjusted for population, case rates are now higher in France and Spain than in the US. And they've done less testing than the US too.

[quote] It's just a few persistent sociopaths, [R115]. They've been here for months and have been regurgitating this same bullshit the entire time.

I'm not sure. I've not seen it at this volume before. I hope you're correct.

I think that if Biden wins, once he's sworn in (and during the surge that the winter will surely bring) he may be able to "wipe the slate clean" and start fresh with a mandatory lock down and actually distribute funds the way they should have been in the first place, not feathering the nests of all the CEOs and 1%ers.

The Chicken Littles are obviously elder gheys with medical conditions. Understandable. Keep your ass inside! But you may have had it already and not have known. What does a lockdown achieve when it's not going away? It is still out there. Are you taking some rushed vaccine?

Uh-huh, R119. Come back when you've looked at the rest of Europe. And have looked at what is happening in those U.S. states with high positivity rates that have opened their schools.

[quote]I'm not sure. I've not seen it at this volume before. I hope you're correct.

Use Trolldar. There aren't that many in this thread and at least two of them have been seen over and over and over and over again in similar threads.

R122 believes absolutely nothing can be done and we must all die. Everyone stop wearing masks and go get Covid. If you die, you don’t deserve to live anyway because your continued life inconveniences R122. Let’s all sacrifice our lives to him.

[quote]I've not seen it at this volume before

Because the troll has figured out how to do sock puppets.

I never said don't wear a mask. And you know what? We all do die.

Doesn’t mean we want to do it this month, R126. You just go ahead without the rest of us.

R120, see R37, for example, and his 9 posts on this thread. He's also posted literally dozens of times, if not hundreds of times, in the various Coronavirus Freakout threads. He has also claimed that Trump is favored to win because of Democrats "rioting, looting and ridiculous demands."

He is a sociopathic Magadroid who has no idea what he's talking about and who just wants people to die. In the six months he's posted here, he has learned absolutely nothing about pandemics, about history, about vaccines, about herd immunity, about "test, trace, and isolate," about what works and what doesn't.

Just a reminder that the people who were adamantly telling you to stay inside, or else grandma dies, just months ago, are now the same ones adamantly telling you it's racist to not protest in groups of thousands, because the media decides how they feel that day and what to think.

The problem is the sheeple will not see this. They have moved on from Covid. That was months ago. They worked themselves up into a frenzy attacking anyone that ventured outside telling them that they were going to kill millions. Its onto the next media sponsored outrage in order to divide humanity even further.

And yet the cattle will still wear their masks.

The end game is totalitarianism through left-wing radicalism, media manipulation, urban terrorism and complicity between corrupt politicians and elements of the intel/special ops community.

If you follow geopolitics and history long enough, you understand that nefarious actors behind the scene have always instigated events to promote their agenda.

R123 It is back to school in Spain and France. If you refuse to send your kid back to school in Spain you will get sanctioned. Cases are rising all over Europe, but kids are going back to school.

If numbers surge, you can bet we will be hunkering down (in the words of Fauci) once again. If that's what it takes, then that's what it takes. Anyone who doesn't like it will have to man up and STFU.

R131 Not gonna happen, Although we know you hope it does.

You are really just worried that the thread kvetching about finding Lysol Wipes will be over.

Admitting you were deceived is hard. Very hard for most people. People believe what they want to believe, and for some they don’t want to seek the reality. The most dangerous virus is stupidity.

And then there's R47 and his dozen posts. Want to know what he's said on other threads?

[quote]You all are causing so much suffering and heartache clinging to your doomsday scenarios. Pretending to have empathy while doing it, too. Ghouls.

[quote]Delusional, hysterical frau thread. You're all very out of touch.

[quote]Republican states will reopen schools and reap the benefits of that decision for years to come. People are leaving the overly restrictive states already and the reality of missing 6 months to a year of school for their kids with nothing to replace it but homeschooling or endless worksheets will drive people away. No one gives a fuck about Covid when things that actually matter get involved.

[quote]Yes, obese Mommyfraus of the suburbs, I literally meant you are trying to infect my beloved God and saviour, Trump, with the coronavirus. That is what I meant.

[quote]It doesn't work that way, and the stupid and crazy decisions being made in Democratic-controlled areas are going to cause much more suffering than the pandemic!

[quote]Logic says "The Democratic Party is slowly comitting suicide in an effort to use the pandemic as a 2020 wedge issue against Trump."

[quote]Unlike you dribbling dipshits, I have concrete values that don't shift with the wind.

[quote]As has been pointed out over and over again, it is very rare for children to contract Covid-19. As in, there have only been a couple hundred worldwide.

He never has been able to bring himself to acknowledge just how hilariously stupid that remark is.

[quote]I'm not the one wallowing and slopping around in all that sweet, sweet hate and death like some people. You seem be having a great time. Frothing at the mouth.

[quote]Apologies, you're all n-a-r-c-i-s-s-i-s-t-i-c pigs flopping around snorting with joy in other people's suffering. Oops!

He's also posted over 100 times in the various threads about the protests, where he's been unable to get his facts straight and has been basically making up shit.

[quote]Admitting you were deceived is hard.

Oh, you mean like the person who wrote this stupid shit, R134?

[quote]a small minority of people might, might get sick.?

[quote]Tyranny is when you restrict the movement of healthy people.

[quote]When Dr. Fauci said people should not be wearing masks.

[quote]Just a reminder that the people who were adamantly telling you to stay inside, or else grandma dies, just months ago, are now the same ones adamantly telling you it's racist to not protest in groups of thousands, because the media decides how they feel that day and what to think.

R135 Is the Gladys Kravits of Datalounge. Mucks up every thread dragging in posts from other threads as if anyone cares.

[quote]Not gonna happen.

Really, R134? And you know this, how, exactly? Have you looked at the positivity rate in the Midwestern and Southern states?

LOL.... You just don't like your own foolishness exposed, R137. Trust me, I could have posted a lot more. You have quite a track record here, almost all of it bad.

[quote]In America, COVID was the moment where public health slammed headfirst into white privilege.

[bold]THIS.[/bold]

In fact everything R74 said.

r135 is a textbook example of severe cognitive dissonance as are many on this thread. Objectively research both sides of this issue and apply critical reasoning and then form your opinion.

I try to have empathy for those that are still very much under the influence of the corporate media and see that their conditioning is not who they ultimately are, but merely an unconscious aspect of them.

R138 The people in the Midwestern and Southern states are not going to accept a lockdown. Not gonna happen.

[quote]R135 is a textbook example of severe cognitive dissonance as are many on this thread.

And yet, somehow, you aren't able to come up with anything I've posted that is incorrect. Why is that, exactly?

[quote]Objectively research both sides of this issue and apply critical reasoning and then form your opinion.

I have, thanks.

[quote]The people in the Midwestern and Southern states are not going to accept a lockdown. Not gonna happen.

Uh-huh, I'll take that claim just as seriously as all of your other predictions over the past six months. You have said shit like this over and over again, as cities, states, and countries have come in and out of lockdown repeatedly, all while you bleat that it can't possibly happen.

Fauci says more widespread lockdowns probably won't be needed in virus fight

Shut up, Fauci.

Opinion piece, TheGuardian: "The past three months have proved it: the costs of lockdown are too high"

Hey 4143 what have you posted that's correct??

Chew on this article of 500 (now over 1000+) German doctors that have put their careers on the line by exposing this plandemic. Are they insane? Of course not as credible as your AC360.

ROFL.... That's the best you could come up with, R148? Seriously? That's fucking hilarious. I don't even have to debunk something so ridiculous on its face.

Did you notice that little caveat, by the way? It's not "500 German doctors." It's "500 German doctors [bold]and scientists[/bold]." It's the same shit that the climate change deniers pull.

As for the doctors, being a doctor doesn't mean you understand epidemiology or that you're immune from bullshit. Just ask Trump's favorite doctor about her belief that alien DNA is used in medicine and that gynecological problems are the result of people having sex in their dreams with demons.

I’m more interested in all the UFO, astrology, Satanism and pedophelia articles at your link, R148. Those are always a good sign of a legit news organization.

Stay home, safe lives!

Plus the fact that the group referenced there, R150, which has apparently been "giving multiple conferences," hasn't been able to come up with a single actual study, peer reviewed or not.

Given the conspiracy theories and the reference to "objectively research both sides of this issue," I suspect we have a QAnon devotee in our midst. We should all genuflect.

It is interesting how the Guardian has softened its stance concerning the virus. Previously everything was a hit piece. No more. "Sweden spared European surge as coronavirus infections stay low" "Chief epidemiologist puts low number of cases down to light-touch ‘sustainable’ approach"

Should read: "It is interesting how the Guardian has softened its stance concerning the virus and Sweden’s approach.."

Oh, and it gets better: the claim about the "500 German doctors & scientists" links not to any list of those supposed "doctors & scientists" but to a YouTube video that's been removed. From the website of the group in question, there is no link that I can find to any such list of "500 German doctors & scientists."

r155 hmm... why would YouTube remove this free speech? Here ya go...

How many people on this thread have the courage to watch this?

Go away, Qanon

How can America successfully deal with COVID when we couldn't even get the individual counties in individual states to agree on a policy?

A lockdown isn't happening, people.

r157 LOL I'm definitely not a Qtard (never read any of this Q psyop bullshit) nor a Trumper. And I'm not a Russian bot either. I'm a critical thinker that's researched both sides of this issue extensively and formed my own opinion. You're obviously threatened by that.

R158 It is not going to happen because people won't accept it. Period. What OP is suggesting is ridiculous.

[quote]I'm a critical thinker that's researched both sides of this issue extensively and formed my own

You may not be a Q but you sure sound like one.

r61 I wouldn't know as I've never followed Q as it's an obvious psyop for the low IQ Trump people. I trust that you've researched both sides of this issue? Including Koch's postulates? Right??? Or Nobel Prize winner and inventor of the PCR test, Kary Mullis, who stated that this test should never be used to diagnose viruses?

Browsing social media is not “researching both sides of the issue.”

Reuters: Social media users have been sharing a quote attributed to the inventor of the Polymerase Chain Reaction (PCR) test, currently being used to detect COVID-19, which says “PCR tests cannot detect free infectious viruses at all”. This quote has been falsely attributed to the inventor, Kary Mullis, and has been taken out of context to falsify its original meaning.

Fortunately I've blocked most of the Covidiots, but it sounds like we're conflating arguments here about whether America *should* do lockdowns vs. whether they *would*.

Should officials consider lockdowns in areas with dangerous outbreaks? Absolutely. They're doing them all over the world as we speak - Spain, England, Australia, NZ. They work. China locked down Beijing for 2 weeks after 60 new cases.

Would Americans put up with it? Of course not. Not sure if New Yorkers would do it again with another outbreak.

Would the US government have the balls to do a Chinese style lockdown? (reporting your temperature to the government every morning, tracking your movements and body temperature through the day, literally welding people into their apartments) Seriously doubt it.

Lockdowns and mask mandates work. Unfortunately Americans are 3-year-olds who throw a fucking fit when somebody tells them "no".

R121 Biden needs to stop promising more lockdowns immediately. I can't think of a less popular political position.

R165, I have to disagree. Most people are genuinely concerned about the virus. They see their loved ones getting sick and would put human life above anything else. We can sacrifice economy, prosperity and personal comfort on short run to safe lives. This why we are voting for Biden.

R166 I think you have a bad read on public opinion. Lockdowns appeal to clueless white-collar office workers and nobody else. Maybe, max, 25% of the national pop.

Article quoted by r163.

I’m in no mood to accept that this virus shouldn’t be taken seriously. I know two people who died from it. Both were in their early 60s and not physically frail.

R89, I don't have any stats, and we may not see any for a while, but all I need to do is watch or read the local Pittsburgh news and there's usually a story or two on how Covid forced a local business to shut down permanently. So there is merit to the economic fear.

R108 Obviously those with serious medical conditions or who are predisposed to genetic conditions should take their health even more seriously. But you're proposing a false analogy.

Most people don't play competitive sports. What could is living longer if you can't form connections, spend time with your friends or family, or even provide yourself a living? People were fine with lockdowns at first, but being told that you must stay locked down indefinitely even though you have no known health risks sounds silly to most people.

Those who have legitimate health concerns should seek medical attention and perhaps receive some compensation, however this shouldn't apply to everyone.

We are going to see an explosion of flu and coronavirus in about 30 days. By Election day, all hell will have broken loose.

Fuck that.

If anyone thinks that Florida will lock down, you are an idiot.

r101

[quote]4. I'm healthy and I'm free to go anywhere I want.

Hope you stay that way.

R174 =Jealous, shaming, passive-aggressive CUNT

R168 I don't really care what you're in the mood for. I also know two people who have passed with covid-19(84) in their system. Both of them were not physically frail either, i e had a lot of weight on them plus other health challenges.

R168 I don't really care what you're in the mood for. I also know two people who have passed with covid-19(84) in their system. Both of them were not physically frail either, i e had a lot of weight on them plus other health challenges.

Sweden

[quote]China had a 8-week lock down, it worked for them

If you believed any figures/data coming out of CCP-China, which gifted us with this Corona Virus in the first place, I have a real nice ocean-front Mansion in Siberia that you can’t say ‘No’ to!

2021 headline:

China's Population Numbers Mysteriously Dip, Dragons Blamed (No Covid Here!)

[quote]Should officials consider lockdowns in areas with dangerous outbreaks? Absolutely. They're doing them all over the world as we speak - Spain, England, Australia, NZ. They work"

There are NO stay at home orders in Spain or England. Are you writing from the month of May?

More lockdowns so I can work from home longer please!!!

[quote]There are NO stay at home orders in Spain or England. Are you writing from the month of May?

European countries are employing "targeted lockdowns." CNN today:

The British government has announced further restrictions for certain parts of England, including the North West, West Yorkshire and Midlands to tackle rising Covid-19 infection rates. Residents from these areas will be banned from socialising with people outside of their household and support bubble.

Authorities in the Spanish capital of Madrid are to announce new coronavirus restrictions on Friday.

Local authorities in Nice have banned public gatherings of more than 10 people on beaches and in parks, as part of new measures to fight the spread of coronavirus. All bars and restaurants will have to close their doors at 12.30 a.m. local time and all visits in Nice’s public care homes have been suspended.

The test is 100 times too sensitive. It gives positive ratings for people who only have nanobits of virus that are not infectious.

The only thing that matters is the death rate that is plummeting. Cases are not important. 397 people under age 24 have died from Covid19 and that is INCLUDING all coinfections. So basically if you had SARS2 when you died you were counted.

The second nationwide lockdown in Israel took effect Friday, tethering residents mostly to their homes in an effort to slow the spread of new infections, Reuters reports.

The second lockdown comes just ahead of the Jewish High Holidays and is set to last three weeks. The restrictions allow for worship activities but impose social distancing guidelines and capacity limits.

All the shut ins want it to happen since most of you have no friends or social life. A virus pandemic seems to do wonders for the anti-socials among us. It is not our fault that you guys suffer from social anxiety. I am all for wearing a face mask but a second lock down ain't going to happen. Sorry introverts.

F off R186, no one cares about your soooo important social life. Go and enjoy your COVID parties. Bye Gurl~

Sorry it's from the Sun, but there are local lockdowns all over the UK right now:

Miss R186 seems very confused. She seems to equate crawling around on the floor of her local ABS, ass bared and up in the air, pre-lubed and ready for any and all takers, as being an extrovert.

If everyone would fucking wear masks like they’re supposed to we would’ve been past this virus by now this is bullshit.

R190 For the umpteenth time, the masks are a social gesture. They have medical benefit, unless they are N95 rated or higher. Make sure you're taking Vitamin D and getting some sun.

Stay home, safe lives. Where mask to sleep. You never know. The virus is here. You can’t see it but it will get you. Spooky. In your sleep.

To the very overweight DL'rs that constantly perpetrate their fear and shame re the covid

You really should try to lose some weight.

It's been proven the Rona like the fats.

PS typing on a keyboard is not exercise!

Lots of idiots out there

R183 Face mask mandates and rules about crowding are not lockdowns.

They just said on CNN today that 43% of Americans have some type of pre-existing condition.

The idea that the only people at risk are ninety years old and in a wheelchair is false. What would America look like in a year if 43% of Americans are either dead or crippled by Covid side effects and can’t work to support themselves any more? And what about the people who have no known pre-existing conditions but for some reason, they get sick or die anyway?

People keep talking about the mortality rates as of December, January or whatever. They were doing that months ago when they were projecting the July figures. Like that was the end. It wasn’t. What are the mortality rates going to be in March, July, December 2021? We’re probably looking at half a million. Maybe more.

Even if we do get a vaccine, the majority of everyday people will not be getting it for months. It will be either rich people, medical personnel, cops, firefighters and maybe some high risk people who are already seriously ill with something else. When it finally trickles down to commoners, maybe teachers or people that work high risk essential jobs. Prison guards, food workers. People that work the assembly line at food plants. If you work in an office or can work from home, you may be looking at the end of 2021. Biden said children will probably be last, because when they get Covid they usually survive. Which means they can pass it.

It’s kind of pointless to say “400,000 by the end of the year” when the end of the year signifies nothing for most people.

Go fuck yourself R191. I fucking hope you die a slow painful death.

You know why we're in this mess, 2015 Thread Bumper? Because Trump is a loser.

On Friday, Boris Johnson admitted in a speech that Britain was entering a second wave of coronavirus. It is understood that he is preparing to impose sweeping nationwide measures to curb the spread of Covid-19.

London Mayor Sadiq Khan said Friday it is "increasingly likely" that lockdown restrictions will soon be needed to slow the spread of coronavirus in London.

I don’t know why anyone would continue to oppose lockdown when it’s already been proven worldwide how affective it is.

r200 Tell that to the Swedes.

Here, in my county, school districts have been banned from having any athletic competitions.

Now, all the athletic directors, coaches, players are pissed off they can't play in this county, so they are going to schedule all games in the next county, which has no restrictions. The county health department has been getting major flak from all sides.

If I was head of the health department, I'd say to all involved: go fuck yourselves, go play your stupid games, but when the shit hits the fan, and your kids start coming down sick, don't bother to contact me as you've been fully warned.

R202

Good point.

I’d also like to add, athletes are at huge risk because of the wear and tear on their bodies. The damage COVID-19 does to the body for many - the heart, the lungs, the brain, the muscles - is severe and that impacts athletes in many ways. This is extremely dangerous.

What are the current restrictions in the UK/London? Are you fully open and the "lockdown" will just be moving back to limiting capacities and shutting down bars and theaters, etc.? Or, are those things still shut down and you're all going back to locking yourselves in your houses? People seem to have different definitions of "lockdown".

Keep an open mind.

Fuck that.

Amazing that this article is from the BBC. Not how the tone is finally changing...we're now getting around to "living with the virus".

"Covid: Is it time we learnt to live with the virus?"

And do see the third chart "Age standardized mortality rates"

The Nanny state must end. No more forced lock downs. Let people go about their business, including schools at all levels and learn to live with it, as the article at R207 suggests.

Brits I think another lockdown is heading your way to coincide with the Oct/Nov School break. Seems to me the gov't may want to nip a new wave from flourishing before Xmas.

The Guardian: Ontario announced new restrictions and steep fines amid a surge of Covid-19 infections that prompted concerns that the country is losing control of the virus. Canada’s most populous province announced plans to limit the size of gatherings, reversing course on previous steps to reopen the province’s economy. The new rules reduce the size of indoor gatherings to 10, down from 50, and outdoor gatherings to 25, down from 100. A C$10,000 fine is also being implemented for organisers of “illegal” gatherings.

Reuters reports that Jordan has announced jail sentences of up to a year for anyone organizing weddings, parties, funerals or social gatherings where more than 20 people attend, in the latest measures aimed at heading off a resurgence in coronavirus cases.

I'll follow the lead of Canada and Jordan before the idiots in charge of America and the UK.

Spain: The mayor of Madrid, which has become a virus hotspot, has put parts of the capital in lockdown. The Spanish Prime Minister signaled more stringent measures could be introduced.

France: Lyon, Marseille and Bordeaux have introduced restrictions such as limiting public gatherings and prohibiting the sale of alcohol after 8 pm.

UK: Yesterday, the govt. announced that bars and restaurants much close at 10 pm. Groups of more than six people are not allowed to meet. Boris Johnson will announce further measures today -- which may include a "mini" lockdown of two weeks.

Germany: Munich has tightened rules on face masks, which must now be worn in public, and contact restrictions,

Italy: People arriving in Italy “from Paris or other parts of France with significant circulation” of the coronavirus must be tested.

The Telegraph - UK Prime Minister Boris Johnson has introduced the following measures to help restrict the spread of the coronavirus:

Office workers who can work from home should do so.

Pubs, bars and restaurants in England will be ordered to close by 10pm each night.

The hospitality sector will be restricted to table service only.

Face coverings must be worn in taxis and private hire vehicles, and by retail staff while at work.

Customers in indoor hospitality will also have to wear face coverings - except while seated at a table to eat or drink.

The exemptions to the rule of six will be reduced, banning indoor team sport - such as indoor five-a-side football matches.

The planned return of spectators to sports venues will now not go ahead from October 1.

Wedding ceremonies and receptions will be capped at 15 people from Monday.

Sounds like us

It’s about time Boris, still no broad mask mandate though

No broad mask mandates in Northern Europe either. Expect new restrictions to result in plenty of protests.

"Sweden's coronavirus pandemic 'may be finished': Danish researcher"

So much for the lockdown folly.

EXACTLY R218. I despise Trump, but this is clearly been politicized. How are people so goddamn gullible.

Israel now surpassed the US of covid infection per capita despite having one of the strictest lockdowns in the world.

[quote]"Sweden's coronavirus pandemic 'may be finished': Danish researcher"

It's a little early to declare victory. A number of European countries drove down their case rates substantially only to see them come roaring back.

It would be nice if immunity could be acquired with far less than 60% immunity.

Sweden has some strict travel restrictions that are probably helping more than anything else in keeping out a second wave. What's hitting Europe now is travel related.

[quote]Sweden has some strict travel restrictions that are probably helping more than anything else in keeping out a second wave.

Sweden has no travel restrictions for EU members.

Sweden has banned non-essential travel to the EU until October 31. It's borders are open in the other direction, however.

All America would have had to do is sacrifice 500,000 people over 50 and we, too, could have been just like Sweden.

R225 So far there have been 2,791 deaths of people over the age of 50 in Sweden due to the virus. It would be interesting to see how that compares per capita to the US, Spain, Italy, the UK, France etc. I doubt it would be so much higher.

[quote]Keep an open mind.

Keep an open mind about a hyper-orthodox magazine calling the global response to COVID a "hoax"?

Fuck off.

Belarusian President Aleksandr Lukashenko said last month via Belarusian Telegraph Agency, BelTA., that World Bank and IMF offered him a bribe of $940 million USD in the form of “Covid Relief Aid.” In exchange for $940 million USD, the World Bank and IMF demanded that the President of Belarus: • imposed “extreme lockdown on his people” • force them to wear face masks • impose very strict curfews • impose a police state • crash the economy Belarus President Aleksandr Lukashenko refused the offer and stated that he could not accept such an offer and would put his people above the needs of the IMF and World Bank. This fact can be verified using most search engines. Now IMF and World Bank are bailing out failing airlines with billions of dollars, and in exchange, they are forcing airline CEOs to implement very strict policies such as forced face mask covers on everyone, including small children, whose health will suffer as a result of these policies.

Trump will sell you a mask, but he won't ask you to wear one because he only wants your money and your vote, not you.

Melbourne has some of strictest and most dystopian COVID1984 restrictions in the world:

"For Melbourne, new restrictions will take effect from 6pm today (Sunday 2 August). A curfew will be in place from 8pm this evening. Curfews will be in operation from 8pm to 5am every evening. People are only allowed to leave their house for work and essential health, care or safety reasons.

Outside of these hours, you are only allowed to leave your house for 1 of the following four reasons:

1. To purchase food and necessary supplies. This must be done within a 5km radius from where you live. Only 1 person per household can leave for essential goods, and only once per day. For some people the nearest goods and services will be more than 5km away. In this situation you may travel beyond 5km to the nearest provider. If you are unable to leave home because it would mean leaving a young child or at-risk person at home unattended, then they may accompany you.

2. Exercise once a day for up to 1 hour within a 5km radius of your home. Gathering sizes will be limited to 2. If you are unable to leave home because it would mean leaving a young child or at-risk person at home unattended, then they may accompany you.

3. For care and health care including accompanying someone for essential medical care if you are a carer, guardian or necessary support person. The 5km limit does not apply to care or caregiving.

4. Work. Study at TAFE and university must be done remotely. The 5km limit does not apply to work."

Locking down again is not going to happen. It doesn't seem to help and people ignore it anyway. Also, the virus has proven to not be as deadly as they thought. It seems silly that we locked down to begin with over it. And I'm speaking as someone who knows a few people who had it and one who died from it. I think it was good we locked down at first since we didn't really know what was going to happen. But now that we know, locking down again is pointless.

watch this. nothing new under the sun.

"locking down again is pointless."

Exactly.

Thread closed.

[quote]the virus has proven to not be as deadly as they thought ... And I'm speaking as someone who knows a few people who had it and one who died from it.

Uh-huh.

R106, we LOVE to see it 🤣🤣

Let whitey seethe because they can't go to yoga or the bar 🤣🤣

I saw a lady this morning at Walmart. Not wearing a mask. She already looked half dead and like a Trumpster. There's that.

But I do think we will all have to get it. That's the only way thru it. It will not vanish. Watch the plague video.

People who intentionally spread COVID disinformation should be buried alive in mass graves.

Russian trolls would be exempt, because living in Russia is punishment enough.

Lol gaping hole

[quote] Also, the virus has proven to not be as deadly as they thought. It seems silly that we locked down to begin with over it.

Also we have had more deaths than anywhere else in the world and we’re not done yet! Also winter is coming and the flu season will kick into high gear when it’s expected that things will spike again! Also people are getting lazy and not social distancing and not wear masks again because they are SO SICK of them!

Do I think we’ll have another lockdown? Unlikely.

Do I think it will be a simple as wear a mask and social distance? No.

I think we will end up somewhere in between.

2,900 people died on September 11th mourned. Over 200,000 people have died of COVID and it didn’t have to be that way nor is it done and some of you are firmly in the, “So what? Who cares!” lane and it is sad.

* I really wish I hadn’t of typed R239 on my cell. Ugh.

Trump asked today about America passing 200,000 dead:

"I think if we didn't do it properly and didn't do it right we'd have two and a half million dead ... but this should have never happened, China should have never let it out."

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

There are at least five conjectures/ lies/ exaggerations, and false accusations just in that one comment.

Did I mention, a complete lack of responsibility?

Lockdowns are the new secular religious bullshit.

Trannies, carbon offsets, and lockdowns.

CDC posts survival rates for C19: 99.98% ... So what are the REAL reasons for the lockdowns and masks?

The "REAL" reasons for the lockdowns were that nobody knew what the fuck they were dealing with. They still don't know how to stop it and it spreads very, very easily. The long term affects on the bodies of people who have been infected is unknown.

We locked down to buy time. That's what we are still doing.

We know now and R244 makes an excellent point.

The virus is real but it is being used politically.

Coming from someone who wrote about Trump, "Without question, yes he will be re-elected," R246, I would say that your judgment is, at best, questionable.

No, it's not "being used politically." And the "REAL reasons for the lockdowns and masks" is that they work and that without them we were on track in the U.S. for an outcome ten times worse than we have right now.

"New Covid Cases Soar in Denmark, Surpassing No-Lockdown Sweden"

It’s a biological weapon. Until we address this issue I fear people will continue to be all over the place wrt to what to do.

The emotional/psychological/financial impacts of locking down is creating so much pain as well. I don’t know what the answer is, except to try and put more love and compassion out there

I find the most entertaining aspect the fact that so many need this Pandemic to be true. Their minds cannot accept the alternative and the people in power know this with such confidence that they can conjure up any ridiculous claim and people will believe it. Honestly they must be falling off their chairs in fits of laughter when they say "ok, ok, what are we gonna tell them next" "How about COVID Foot" or "COVID rash" or "Singing Happy Birthday can spread COVID"..There appears to be no end to the madness and no proof can be presented that will convince these people that the Pandemic is a sham.

[quote]The virus is real but it is being used politically.

It sure is.

[quote]Until we address this issue

There's nothing to "address," r249, since it is not, in fact, a "biological weapon."

[quote]I find the most entertaining aspect the fact that so many need this Pandemic to be true.

I find the most entertaining aspect the fact that our trolls here are so ridiculously clumsy, not to mention more than a little stupid.

Europe isn't locking down again. The French PM said people need to learn to live with it.

If you mean total lockdown, R253, you're correct. However, you're ignoring that multiple countries and cities are indeed either reimposing restrictions or imposing new ones. Multiple limited lockdowns are happening all over Europe, and with good reason.

I won't be surprised if we have a major lockdown in early 2021.

With Thanksgiving and Christmas approaching, people are going to ignore guidelines regarding crowd size, holiday shopping, parties, and large family gatherings.

We also have the approaching flu season peaking just in time for the holiday season. And no one can say with absolutely certain how the combination of Corona and the flu will affect us. We won't know until winter passes.

[italic] God Bless Us Everyone !

[quote]The emotional/psychological/financ - ial impacts of locking down is creating so much pain as well. I don’t know what the answer is, except to try and put more love and compassion out there

My sentiments exactly. I do think these numbers and fears of a second wave warrants another lockdown, but just looking at the implications that the first one and just the overall pandemic has had on people's lives, makes me wary of the notion. Thankfully, I can work from home, but so many have been laid off and there is no safety net for them - the enhanced unemployment went away, many places have ended their eviction freeze, no further stimulus in sight - people just can't afford another true lockdown.

R254 you're ignoring that most places in the US still have restrictions and limits. Florida, Nebraska are the exceptions.

At the same time Sweden is fully open, same for the Netherlands and Romania etc.

I love the new language: "limited lockdowns". We will not be going back to anything resembling a lockdown, that is schools, businesses, offices and factories closed, people confined to their homes. There may be curfews, restrictions on gatherings but nothing that can be classified as a lockdown as we saw in the Spring. The closest Europe is to that is some neighborhoods of Spain where travel is restricted. But even that is being met with protests,

[quote]At the same time Sweden is fully open

Not for long. Reuters: Sweden, which so far has decided against lockdowns as a means to contain COVID-19, is seeing early signs that the number of coronavirus cases are rising again and could impose new measures in the capital, its chief health officials said on Tuesday.

R252 - you know this how? Ralph Baric: We can engineer a virus without leaving any trace. In 2015 with Zheng-li Shi of Wuhan we left a signature in Chimera, otherwise is impossible to distinguish from a natural virus. The answers are in disappeared archives of the Wuhan laboratory

R259 "could impose new measures" won't mean a lockdown. Not in Sweden.

🕵️ Trust No One.

All of our interventions have focused on cutting lines of viral transmission, thereby controlling the spread of the pathogen. The “science” that has guided governments has been driven mostly by epidemic modellers and infectious disease specialists, who understandably frame the present health emergency in centuries-old terms of plague. But what we have learned so far tells us that the story of COVID-19 is not so simple. Two categories of disease are interacting within specific populations—infection with severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) and an array of non-communicable diseases (NCDs). These conditions are clustering within social groups according to patterns of inequality deeply embedded in our societies. The aggregation of these diseases on a background of social and economic disparity exacerbates the adverse effects of each separate disease. COVID-19 is not a pandemic. It is a syndemic. The syndemic nature of the threat we face means that a more nuanced approach is needed if we are to protect the health of our communities.

R259 was in response to a post that said Sweden was "fully open." If they institute restriction measures, they are not "fully open."

Well I’m in Melbourne, Australia and just about ready to kill the entire 60+ population with my bare hands to speed things up

That sounds like a good plan, r265!

[quote]If they institute restriction measures, they are not "fully open."

They've always had some restrictions; just not as many as some other countries.

[quote]you know this how?

Because it's been thoroughly investigated.

[quote]you're ignoring that most places in the US still have restrictions and limits.

That has absolutely nothing to do with my post at R254.

“Today, all of the European countries are more or less following the Swedish model..."

Nobody is following the Swedish model

What needed to happen in March is what needs to happen now: Comandeer the Koch brothers' paper factories to make billions of N-95 masks which will be distributed to everyone free of charge. And screw any social distancing or other rules except one: wearing a mask with draconian punishments.

R269 From the NYTimes article at R268:

"In response to the recent outbreaks, many European countries are imposing new restrictions. But political leaders, anxious to avoid unpopular and economically disastrous lockdowns, are relying mostly on social-distancing measures, while trying to preserve a degree of normalcy, with schools, shops, restaurants and even bars open."

"In essence, some experts say, they are quietly adopting the Swedish approach."

One thing I don't get is if people don't have a job and can barely pay rent/mortgage, then how the hell are they constantly out, buying, partying, and vacationing? Either people are throwing themselves further into debt (which at this stage of uncertainty is incredibly stupid) or ...

A month after U.S. series began to resume production in Vancouver with COVID-19 protocols amid the pandemic, most of them have suspended filming. Like was the case when restart of production was delayed in August, the issue has to do with testing.

A slew of series from multiple studios, including Riverdale, A Million Little Things, Charmed, Big Sky, Batwoman, The Mighty Ducks, Nancy Drew and Maid, have been idle for several days now or are in the process of shutting down because of delays of as much as 72+ hours in receiving COVID-19 test results for their casts and crew. Shows that had been scheduled to start this week, including The Flash, Supergirl and DC’s Legends Of Tomorrow, have been pushed.

[quote]“Today, all of the European countries are more or less following the Swedish model..."

Nobody is following the Swedish model and yes, I read the article. He doesn't provide the data to back up that statement and he's ignoring that cases are increasing in Sweden, and that most European countries are imposing new restrictions, including restrictions on "schools, shops, restaurants and even bars."

Republicans need to be locked up permanently. Every single one.

R274 The point is that those "schools, shops, restaurants and even bars" are OPEN. Economies can't afford otherwise. Yes, of course there may be restrictions. There were restrictions in Sweden as well.

Actually, R276, the point you're ignoring is that no, they aren't all OPEN and where they are open, they're under severe restrictions, far more so than Sweden.

Economies cannot afford the coronavirus. Fix that and everything else is fixed. Fail to fix it and your economy isn't fixed, either. Just ask Sweden, which is being just as badly hit as its neighbors.

Again, *nobody* is following Sweden's lead. And that will become even more clear if the outbreaks continue in France, Spain, the U.K., etc.

You've been on this same shtick for months, R276. You claimed that everyone was following Sweden's model in April; you claimed it in May; you claimed it in June; you claimed it in July; you claimed it in August; you claimed it in September; and you will doubtless be here in October, November, December, January, February, etc., as the rest of the world stubbornly refuses to accept your "reality."

R278 The world was in lockdown in the spring. No one said everyone was following the Swedish model then. Quit making things up. But after the lockdowns I did claim the Swedish model was and will be the way forward and as we see now, it is.

"the point you're ignoring is that no, they aren't all OPEN " R277 What EU countries have schools, shops, restaurants and bars closed?

I'm not "making things up," R279. Your track record here is available for all to see. And as we see now, your claims about the "Swedish model" are just as false today as they were when you first began spewing that bullshit. I repeat: *no* country in the world today is "following the Swedish model," which is why you have not been able to identify a single one, just as you were not able to identify any in April, May, June, July, August, or September.

[bold]NOBODY

IS

FOLLOWING

THE

HORSESHIT

SWEDISH

MODEL[/bold].

R279's problem is that he sees anything short of "total lockdown" as "the Swedish model" which is, of course, laughably ignorant.

He tried that stunt several months ago, when Germany began reopening along a prescribed plan. He was here insisting that Germany was adopting "the Swedish model," ignoring that Germany was doing exactly what it said it was going to do, following a plan that they had developed early in the pandemic, well before there even was a "Swedish model."

That's what pretty much every country is doing: opening and closing, increasing or relaxing restrictions, using guidelines that each country has developed. And, of course, test, trace, and isolate, which our rather ignorant friend still doesn't understand or accept.

Considering that the "Swedish model" was supposed to develop "herd immunity," which it has manifestly failed to do, and considering that Sweden is being hit hard economically, which "opening up" was supposed to prevent, that model is a failure by its own criteria.

As the NYTimes article states, they indeed are now following the Swedish model. That is the way forward.

R281 You wrote: "the point you're ignoring is that no, they aren't all OPEN " So what EU countries have schools, shops, restaurants and bars closed?

[quote]And, of course, test, trace, and isolate, which our rather ignorant friend still doesn't understand or accept.

Contact tracing has been a huge failure in Europe. As the incredible spike in cases show us.

[quote]As the NYTimes article states, they indeed are now following the Swedish model.

As noted above, the New York Times article, just like you, failed to provide a shred of evidence to support that assertion. Again, *nobody is following the Swedish model," which is why you have never been able to identify a single country that is.

As for "contact tracing," you have repeatedly demonstrated that you don't have the foggiest idea what "contact tracing" is nor how it's done. You continue to display your ignorance here, as what is happening in Europe has absolutely nothing to do with contact tracing, which is why you can't defend this bit of bullshit anymore than you can the rest of your nonsense.

I was lectured to about how Italy was so succesfully carrying out contact tracing by someone who knows nothing about the country or what is happening there. LOL. Test, trace, and isolate, oh really?

R286 You wrote: "the point you're ignoring is that no, they aren't all OPEN " So what EU countries have schools, shops, restaurants and bars closed?

[quote]I was lectured to about how Italy was so succesfully carrying out contact tracing

No, I simply told you that Italy was, in fact, doing contact tracing when you rather ignorantly insisted it wasn't. You were wrong then; you remain wrong today. And you remain completely ignorant of what contact tracing actually is and how and when it is applied. Six months and you've learned absolutely nothing.

[quote]Test, trace, and isolate, oh really?

Yup. Happening all over the world. Your utter ignorance of these issues is not my problem.

R288, since a Google search would quickly provide the answer to your question, and since you won't accept the answer even when I provide it, I'm simply going to laugh at your continuing ignorance.

As I wrote: "Contact tracing has been a huge failure in Europe. As the incredible spike in cases show us."

R290 LOL nice try.

It should be illegal to go outside for any reason until the virus is gone.

Unlike you, R292, I can actually back up what I write. I'll even give you a free clue: one of the country's names begins with an "F".

Oh, and your link in R291 specifically talks about cross-border tracing, not tracing within a country. And all it proves is just how important contact tracing is, so you're making my point for me. Thank you.

At least you're finally acknowledging that everyone is doing contact tracing, unlike all of your earlier denials. I especially liked it when you insisted that Italy wasn't doing any contact tracing, thereby demonstrating that you were both clueless and a moron.

What's even funnier about this is that every country in the world today, without exception, is doing some form of test, trace, and isolate. And the countries with the best records against the virus are, not surprisingly, the countries with the best records of "test, trace, and isolate."

It's the gold standard for infectious disease treatment and it has been so for over a century, regardless of whether it's a measles outbreak, an STD outbreak, an Ebola outbreak, or a COVID-19 outbreak. And the fact that you don't even know that, have multiple times tried to pretend that isn't what countries are doing or that it doesn't work, simply demonstrates just how ridiculously ignorant you are.

[quote]At least you're finally acknowledging that everyone is doing contact tracing, unlike all of your earlier denials. I especially liked it when you insisted that Italy wasn't doing any contact tracing, thereby demonstrating that you were both clueless and a moron.

God you are dumb.

Yep, Italy is "doing contact tracing," at airports and train stations. True.

But because you do not read the Italian press, because you don't speak Italian, because you are unaware of the finer details, you are ignorant to the fact that the testing is "facoltativo".

No one is required or forced to cooperate.

You *still* have absolutely no idea what contact tracing is, who does it, or how it's done, even after all of these months. "At airports and train stations?!" Seriously? The mind boggles at how absolutely clueless you are.

And yes, of course, nobody is forced to cooperate, which is probably why I never said they were. This conversation would go ever so much better if you responded to what I wrote instead of to those voices in your head.

But hey, at least you're no longer ignorantly claiming that Italy doesn't do contact tracing, even if you still don't know what the hell contact tracing nor how it is done.

[quote] It should be illegal to go outside for any reason until the virus is gone.

No.... just no!

Shutting down the country over a virus is the same thing as shutting down the country over mosquitoes, it doesn't actually fix anything.

Sure it is going to save some people if they almost never go outside and risk being bitten by a mosquito or encountering the virus, but there is nothing anyone can really do to change that, you can hide indoors for 10 years and then come outside and you might be bitten by a mosquito within 10 minutes of being outside.

DL's resident lockdown queen at R296, the one with the South Korea fetish, continues to just not get it. So sadly misinformed.

[quote]Contact Tracing, Key to Reining In the Virus, Falls Flat in the West

[quote]Tracing is seen as a vital tool to avoid lockdowns and open economies, but that requires a robust system, widespread rapid testing and public trust. All are lacking in the West.

[quote]As the coronavirus stampeded across Europe and the United States this spring, governments made their depleted citizens a tantalizing promise: Soon, legions of disease detectives would hunt down anyone exposed to the virus, confining them to their homes and letting everyone else get on with their lives.

[quote]Nearly eight months on, as a web of new infections spreads across Europe and the United States, that promise has nearly evaporated.

LOL.... You continue to make my point for me, R299. It's hilarious that you think those stories disprove anything I wrote. And it's right there in the headline and in the lead blurb!

[quote]but that requires a robust system, widespread rapid testing and public trust. All are lacking in the West.

We don't have a "robust system" in every country, even though we need one; we don't have "widespread rapid testing," even though we need it; and we don't have "public trust." Those countries that have all of those things have controlled the outbreak. Those that have not, have failed.

So the article makes the point that contact tracing is "key to reining in the virus" and the reason we haven't reined in the virus is because the Trump administration, along with some other European governments, has so badly fucked this up. In short, all you've done is prove that what I've been writing over and over again is true!

You *still* have no idea what contact tracing is, why every country practices it (albeit some much better than others), and why it's so critical for control of the pandemic, do you? Tell us again about "airports and train stations," won't you? We can use a good laugh.

Nice try.

You have been telling us for months about how contact tracing was successfully happening throughout Europe, even after being told repeatedly that no, it has been a failure.

What countries announce they are doing and what they actually wind up doing, are two different things.

We are not South Koreans. There are things things they are able to do that we will simply not stand for. And the US and Europe are not New Zealand either.

But hey, tell us again about Italy's successful Immune app, won't you? We can use a good laugh.

R301, I'm quite careful with my words and you are simply lying. No, I have never, not once, said that "contact tracing was successfully happening throughout Europe." I simply said, repeatedly, that every European nation, including Italy, is doing contact tracing, despite your insistence that Italy was not doing anything of the kind. You were wrong.

In fact, every nation struggling with the pandemic today is doing contact tracing: some very successfully; some less so. And every nation that has succeeded in controlling this pandemic is doing so because they are following the standard best practices for infectious diseases: test, trace, and isolate. You have no answer for this, so you have to make up shit.

You have also insisted that nobody would ever lock down again, even though many cities and even some countries have done precisely that. You have also insisted that every nation is following Sweden's lead, even though literally none of them are.

But hey, tell us again about how Italy is never going to launch their contact tracing app and that Italy doesn't do contact tracing at all, won't you? We can use a good laugh.

[quote]Shutting down the country over a virus is the same thing as shutting down the country over mosquitoes, it doesn't actually fix anything.

If done properly, yes, it does. Shutting down, when it's necessary, when it's done properly, and when it's done with proper follow-up, can serve multiple purposes:

1. It ensures that the pandemic does not get ahead of health care capacity. Many people seem to have forgotten just how overloaded the health care system was in several European countries, as well as in New York City, Miami, Houston and Southern Texas, and Los Angeles here in the U.S. Those countries and states that "flattened the curve" avoided that catastrophe and the unnecessary deaths that happened as a result.

2. It brings the case count down such that managing the pandemic becomes a matter of controlling local outbreaks as they occur, as we've seen in countries like Vietnam, China, Australia, South Korea, and New Zealand, as well as (to a lesser extent) some of the European countries. It allows that "robust system" that [italic]The New York Times[/italic] talks about to work. That robust system cannot work in a scenario where the virus is out of control.

3. It allows for a much more robust reopening of the economy. As long as the pandemic is raging, it doesn't matter that much whether your restaurants, hotels, bars, and theaters are open. Business travel will still be down; a significant number of people will be taking local vacations and "staycations" rather than traveling; they will not go out nearly as much, they won't hire an Uber or rent an AirBnB home, etc. Bring the pandemic down to the level where it really is just a few local outbreaks and your economy will fully recover. Fail to do that and your economy will suffer, regardless of lockdowns, restrictions, or the lack thereof.

4. And, of course, it saves lives until a vaccine can be developed.

R303 No, that's not how public health works especially if you're talking about a nation the size of the US. I agree that containment methods including lockdown should be implemented if criteria are met, but it shouldn't be done unilaterally across all regions. Here in SF Bay Area we've had success throughout the pandemic with regards to containment, surveillance, and treatment. We're now at a downtrend even as restrictions are easing for the past few weeks. Our hospitals are not impacted by COVID-19 patients, and the ones who are hospitalized are not taking up beds by protracted stays; they are monitored, treated, then sent home. I had a patient whose family members tested positive, only she and her dad were briefly hospitalized. She lives in a home with her immediate and extended family, a total of 11 people in a small rented house. There was a delay in seeking medical testing and treatment because the family is here illegally. But I think here in SF and California in general the public health authorities have been very proactive in getting out the message that those who seek treatment would not be targeted by immigration.

The world will fight hard lockdowns...happening all over, not just the US

Approximately 16,000 doctors have come together opposing lockdown measures in various countries, as well as the possibility of a second lockdown that multiple governments are currently considering.

16000 whole doctors, huh?

Nobel Laureate Michael Levitt has slammed the epidemiological reaction to the pandemic as a “disgraceful situation for science”.

Levitt, who received the 2013 Nobel Prize in Chemistry, said: “As a group, scientists have failed the younger generation.”

The professor of structural biology at Stanford University added: “I’m not against lockdown; I’m against stupid lockdown without considering the full picture.

“It’s not just combating a virus that is exactly as dangerous as flu, but also avoiding the economic damage that every country has caused itself except Sweden.

“Epidemiologists have caused hundreds of billions of dollars’ worth of suffering and damage, mainly on the younger generation.”

^^^ Sigh.

Christ once said, "The poor will be with you always."

I guess that goes triple for the money-grubbers.

R308, you have to realize that scientists have crazies amongst their ranks as well. You have to listen to the overall concensus, not the lone voice in the wilderness. Do you know what a structural biologist is? A hint...it's not an epidemiologist.

BREAKING: New numbers from the San Francisco Medical Examiner's office show 468 people -- about two every day -- died of a drug overdose in the first eight months of this year. That's four times as many people as have died from #COVID19 in San Francisco. ^^^^^ We are on track for over 700 deaths in 2020 due to overdose just in SF. The harm reduction, look the other way and do whatever you want, with zero consequences for dealers and a huge homeless industrial complex to keep people turned out. Also an attractant for the rest of the country to come live in SF on the street no worries. Where is the out cry? Where is that stupid bitch Chessa Boudin ?

Records Show Bill Gates Funded Discredited “Professor Lockdown” Neil Ferguson in March, Whose Model Prompted “New Normal” Lockdowns

Sometimes it seems there are folks who want to drag out this situation as masochistically as possible. Gloomier the forecast the better they like it.

There seems to be a global growing movement against lockdowns and masks ..

For the first time in two decades millions are at risk for extreme poverty ..

Global agenda 2030.. very strange times. Govt against the people? Big pharma.. Moderna is sketchy it’s all very Orwellian and it’s not just bothering Trumpers, racists or proud boys

Interesting take a look doctors against government response

Speech of Robert F. Kennedy Jr. in Berlin 29.08.20.

Very interesting R316. Thank you for sharing. :/

So, the idiot contingent is now taking over the discussion here? That's what I get from the last few posts. Anti-vaxxer Kennedy? Really? Is that what you idiots have on your side? Maybe you dumb as shit trolls need to learn a new adjective other than 'interesting'. It would make your posts, especially the ones just used to bump your previously ignored blabber, more "real".

r132, please don't ever link us to a Qanon site again.

R318 You are uninformed. The media describes Kennedy as an anti-vaxxer (of course), but he does not describe himself that way. He advocates for quality vaccines. Kennedy is a smart man, no dummy.

The Great Barrington Declaration. A must read,

The US must never lockdown again.

Yeah, a "must read" for how literally insane it is, R321.