Endeavour

I like Shaun Evans a lot.

I always enjoy it.

That and Metamucil.

R1, Then you must watch "The Take"! (Stars Tom Hardy)

Tom Hardy bugs me

But Shaun Evans is wonderful in "The Take," and his final scene is worth it.

Endeavor was the least loved of all the space shuttles.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH R6

Endeavour the space shuttle must try harder.

R3... I actually very much enjoyed Endeavour, though not Morse. Shaun Evans is terrific.

I know I am an eldergay or at least a premature eldergay as I watch pretty much nothing but PBS from conventional broadcast television.

I love Shaun Evans

I love it and watch it mainly for Shaun Evans and Roger Allam.

Yes, love the stories

Roger Allam is a gem.

Roger Allam is a hot daddy.

I went crawling back to "Endeavor" last night in spite of my mid-series boycott (WHET to the lovely nurse love-interest??!!); there's no resisting the allure of Shaun Evans's cheekbones.

^ The love story subplots always feel misplaced to me. They need to work on that.

Those Shaun Evans' groupies must watch The Last Weekend in which he and Rupert Penry-Jones present dongs.

Endeavour was good until season 4 or 5, then the stupid romantic subplots kinda ruined it.

Oh, they are with this new episode, r16! The ending might explain the otherwise inexplicable insistence of Ludo to have Morse as a best bud. I mean, attending Oxford can't be that big a connection.....in Oxford.

It was a slow burn for me, took me awhile to get into the series. I got PBS Passport this past year and caught up to the latest season. This season is set in 1970, that's not that far off from the mid 80's John Thaw Morse timeline. Will Endeavour make an effort to reconcile its Morse with that one?

^ The way that Ludo was all buddy-buddy with Morse after not having spoken to him in years made me wonder if he was going to hit on Morse

R20, I totally thought we were going to get a gay storyline!

Much better than the latest series of Grantchester.

R20, That was what I was intimating: a three-some, attempted by Ludo after his wife told him of her Little Death in Venice.

I wanted to like it because I love Inspector Morse. But I found it pretentious and extremely boring.

R24, Shaun Evans is certainly attractive, but to me John Thaw was more interesting to watch. And the original had better plots, and better writers (like Anthony Minghella) and directors (like Danny Boyle).

Checking Wiki, I found that Thaw was only 45 when Morse debut in 1987. And was only 60 when he died in 2002. He was like Wilford Brimley--they looked and acted much older than they were. I was shocked when Brimley died last month, I thought he had died in the early 2000's. I was surprised to learn he played 20 years older in Cocoon. I thought he was in his 70's in the 80's, how the hell did he live until 2020!

R16: You should use the thread number you are referring to instead of using up arrows. We typically use ^^ at the beginning of a post to indicate edits to our own preceding comment.

Thank you.

Fun fact: Roger Allam was the first ever Javert in Les Mis... created the role in 1985.

Allam looks like he was in Claudius but he's actually one of the few older venerable British actors who wasn't.

Love Allam and like Shane a lot. However, it could be called "Inspectors" or any other name, because other than being set in Oxford and the fact that Morse is a cop who loves classical music, I can't find that Shane is anything like Morse. I just don't get that vibe at all.

Roger Allam is in the later episodes of the satiric "The Thick of It" and he's sexy and funny and caustic. Very impressed.

I love Roger Allam as an actor, but I get very sick of Fred Thursday as a character. He's always dragging Morse down. I did like for once, though, that his wife Win was part of the actual story. I like the character and I like the woman who plays her.

The Italian woman Morse fell for seems like Cecily Strong playing a stereotype of an Italian woman on SNL.

From what I've read, the whistling serial killer will thread as a storyline through all three episodes.

As soon as these last two episodes air, I'm going back and bingewatching Endeavour. It's available on Amazon Prime and PBS Passport.

I absolutely love Endeavour and I never liked or watched Morse. There was so much foreshadowing in the early seasons that every finale I expected Thursday to be killed off but this time they’ve already announced an 8th series. Shaun Evans is fine but I watch it to see Roger Allam and lately for Anton Bright as well. His character has really grown. I’ve rewatched most of the seasons. It’s very dark though.

Re the current season, this Ludo guy...it’s a set up, right? He’s out for revenge because Morse slept with his wife or he’s an international crook or both.

Also in the PBS thread several months ago someone recommended watching the 2nd series of The Missing because I liked Baptiste so much. I am watching it now and it is fantastic. (Dropped out of the 1st season after ten minutes because it involved a kidnapped kid; can’t watch that, too realistic). Baptiste is a lovely character.

A younger Roger Allam is in "Midsomer Murders," Season 1, Episode 4: "Faithful Unto Death."

Holy shit R36 Joyce actually had some volume in her hair!

Rewatched it last night because I’d fallen asleep last week. I’d missed the whole confession scene by the head scientist guy but I’m still confused, did he confess to killing the bar maid too? Was she blackmailing him? That was kind of rushed.

Ludo No Last Name is def a bad ‘un. “Hello old chum...er...” “Morse” “Right, we were up together, I was in College X and you were in College...” “College Y” “That’s right. How have you been?”

R2 - if you accompany that with a douche and wash, marry me ;-)

[quote]Roger Allam is in the later episodes of the satiric "The Thick of It" and he's sexy and funny and caustic. Very impressed.

Allam played a pedophile in one of "The Missing" series on STARZ. Not sure if it was the 1st or 2nd season.

my fave show on pbs. along with vera .....the storys are complex and lots o fun seein them solve the crime. best actors around. shaun evaans is HOT

"I’d missed the whole confession scene by the head scientist guy but I’m still confused, did he confess to killing the bar maid too? Was she blackmailing him? That was kind of rushed."

No, it was implied that the real killer of the barmaid is still out there

I just finished watching that r40, season 2. He wasn’t a pedophile but he covered up for one due to some misguided army rah-rah buddy b.s. which was somehow the fault of the woman commanding officer.

[quote]I just finished watching that [R40], season 2. He wasn’t a pedophile but he covered up for one due to some misguided army rah-rah buddy b.s. which was somehow the fault of the woman commanding officer.

Are you sure about that? Wasn't there the scene where his character's collection of kiddie porn tapes was found on his boat? In fact, Allam's character lead the other person to the collection.

How did the quietly sexy Endeavour character morph into the desperate pathetic pussy chaser Morse? Old man Morse seemed to hit on every female he encountered, even wildly inappropriate ones like major suspects in active cases. I watched the Endeavour series first and loved it, but Inspector Morse was less enjoyable for that reason. I'm going to start Inspector Lewis, and see how he adapts to being the old-timer in a working relationship.

HOW EXCITING,,,new shows now, season openers, the plots so inscrutable......the delightful and said to be hung like a bull, shaun evans.

Sometimes i have to watch the same episode several times to get the plot......the one with the tiger was my fave, man eating tigers in UK !

[quote]said to be hung like a bull, shaun evans.

Said by whom, where? On display for all to view?

I don’t remember a boat r44. Allam’s character and the black friend (who was thought to have later committed suicide) covered up for the pedo soldier because they were all army buddies. In doing so they killed the girl’s father and (accidentally) the younger sister. So then the pedo soldier was able to blackmail them into helping him with the sick kidnapped girl. By then Allam was a brigadier general with more to lose.

They didn’t seem to spend much time trying to figure out who murdered the cook/towpath flasher. Thursday is still on about the pub waitress and her boyfriend. Morse is mooning over Ludo’s wife. Bright is worried about his wife. They’re all working on the Indian restaurant plot.

There was a clip afterwards discussing the changes this season and how the characters are “growing”. Ugh, I hate the petty sniping between Morse and Thursday. It’s beneath them. I never watched the original Morse except for two or three episodes, enough to know I didn’t care for it. Crabby guy yelling at his subordinate. The show runner feels compelled to steer Endeavour in that direction but it’s a shame. The relationship between young Morse and Thursday is much better written and to twist it to conform with the earlier series is going to be a predictable and regrettable mistake. Endeavour is a victim of its success.

it was on reddit, some guy saw on at an on set urinal. thick ten, figures, skinny vanilla guys like that have big weenies. ide go for his smooth pink fukhole and tear it up

Thank you so much, r51. It doesn't take much for me to consider Shaun Evans' dong numerous times during each episode. Now my imaginings shall be out of control.

A few shots on the show sometimes show it hanging down there like jon hamm's mancock.

[quote]I just finished watching that [[R40]], season 2. He wasn’t a pedophile but he covered up for one due to some misguided army rah-rah buddy b.s. which was somehow the fault of the woman commanding officer.

Are you sure you're not confusing 'The Missing" with 'Baptiste'? Wasn't the Dutch woman commanding police officer, who Baptiste had the son with but didn't know he did, hiding something important about the case Baptiste was working on?

Guess I have to re-watch all these series.

[quote]A few shots on the show sometimes show it hanging down there like jon hamm's mancock.

There are nudes of Shaun Evans out there, his cock isn't that big.

You guys are hilarious.

The nudes i saw, it hung to his knees.

r55 r56 Pics?

I am not loving this season. Far too soap opera -y. I am not against knowing the main character's personal life per se, but this season seem really forced.

Bright and his wife seems like an after school special/very special episode. Anton Lesser is a fantastic actor, but the material is beneath him.

The Ludo/Violetta subplot is like a bad romance novel with all of the tatty trapping: mansions, fabulous parties, exotic locations/decor, chic clothing. I expect to see Pia Zadora any minute. Also far too clever in a sophomoric way. I get the references to The Talented Mr Ripley (Ludo does have a surname- "Talenti"), but it seems rather high school clever.

In fact, the name dropping (Fanny to his Johnny, etc.) is really annoying. It is as if the writers are saying, "See we did our research! We can name all of these people/things/ events from the period!"

R58, I watched the entire season, you're not wrong...The end is ripe, very, very ripe. I'm not saying it watchable but my eyeballs couldn't stop rolling.

I'm liking this season more than any other. I love it when he gets all opera-y, even soap opera-y. Of course, I am a contributor to the Midwestern Marvels threads.

R60, you'll be happy.

first 2 episodes have been let doown.....earlier ones were complex scripts and fun...bring in some new hot men

[quote]I expect to see Pia Zadora any minute.

Doable. Very, very doable.

His lips and eyes make me drop to my knees in desirous veneration, ide be his sugar mommy in a second, if he is good titty torturer. and piss giver.

There was a coup in Mali today. (I’m watching season 2 of Deep State so this is relevant to me)

Okay r54, The Missing Season 2: No, the only pedo was the Army public affairs officer who helped Keely Hawes and husband deal with the reappearance/death of their “daughter”. Twenty years previously, in Iraq he had been molesting a local girl, her father caught and tortured him, and Allam’s character and the black guy went AWOL, rescued him, killing the father and a younger sister in the process. Their reasoning was, they were just looking out for each other because their commanding officer (the blonde woman) was undisciplined, weak, yadda yadda, it was all her fault. (Yeah, not really a valid plot point)

Later on, when one of the kidnapped girls got sick, the pedo blackmailed Allam (now a general) and the black guy (the only one who actually had a conscience) into helping him by threatening to tell what happened in Iraq. The sick girl had seen their faces so she could identify them also. But they had no connection with the girls otherwise.

Good role for Roger Allam, take-charge brigadier general and then man losing his mind to dementia.

looooooove roger allam, ICON

My fantasia is allam sitting his fat hot ass on my face, and shaun sitting on my hard cock, and the fug daughter who ran away from home (she looks like she could be shauns momma) must stand by with that forelorn face: man she is a drag: weird casting huh

Shaun Evans looks just like my dad when he was that age. Makes it a weird experience.

Don't get the Shaun or Roger lust here, both men are average in the looks department.

I'm not talking about their acting, I'm talking about the posts here drooling over their looks. This is a very odd thread, neither man would be considered extremely good looking.

Shaun is too thin, maybe if he put on some weight, he'd be more attractive. Shaun looks like one of my goofy awkward young cousins.

takes all kinds mary, u should now dat by now

I knew there was something weird about the "friend" and his wife

Ugh, this romance between Morse and Violetta was too cliched and predictable. OTOH, the relationship between Bright and his wife was touching. (Not sure why the reporter would’ve learned of her accident before the police or her husband coming home to find her)

BUT THE BIGGEST ERROR IS HOW THEY ARE TWISTING ENDEAVOUR TO FIT INTO THE MORSE CHARACTER. Just stop it. Acknowledge that the student has surpassed the master and let Endeavour, Thursday, Bright and Strange get along and solve crimes together. It’s a mistake to break up a winning team because of what happened on a series that ran thirty fricking years ago.

Where are the Shaun Evans nudes?!

How did Bright ever get such a beautiful wife, even if she has been constantly dying for two seasons?

"Endeavour"'s season ended so ridiculously i cannot believe it.

What a fucking joke.

I just realized this afternoon that there was a seventh season, and I attempted to catch up starting with s 7 ep 01, but I quit it about 20 minutes in. I'm dreadfully tired of all the moping, from everyone, but especially from Morse.

I can see, though, how they're evolving his character into the older Inspector Morse of the earlier series. He's definitely gone from a melancholy and somewhat callow guy to the sour, pathetic skirt-chaser John Thaw portrayed. Not my cup of tea, though. It's sad to see the fairly attractive young character inexorably become what we know he's going to become.

One thing I've always wondered, though. What TF is his beef with Joan Thursday and, eventually, with Fred Thursday, too? The writing is so goddam elliptical that I can't see any real reason for all the animosity. On the other hand, I may have missed something, since all the seasons blur for me into a long, depressing mess.

Of course, I know that there was a brief possibility of romance between Morse and Joan, and he was more into it than she was, but, man, he really dwelled on that and was disproportionately bitter about it.

I keep harping on the subject I know, but it’s so ridiculous that the writers have their hands tied because of an ancient albeit beloved show. In the first season of Endeavour, practically the first episode featured the love story of “the one that got away” according to the 90s series Morse, which turned him into a bitter crank. It was a tiny blip in this series. Since neither Fred Thursday nor his daughter was mentioned on Morse although other current characters are, the writers have to conjure up ridiculous ways for them to be on the outs.

I’ve never met a man called Thursday.

Excellent show. Watched the Season & finale last night and loved it!

The show gets better with each season

There's going to be an eighth season, too, apparently. i do enjoy the mysteries but I am so sick of the constant problems between Morse and the Thursdays I've grown sick of that part of it.

The best character in the whole show has been Anton Lesser's complex Chief inspector Bright. Lesser is a superb actor (one of the very best in the UK) and he's brought so many layers to his part. He started out as a hardass, but as the show has gone through its seasons you see that bright is essentially a deeply kind man underneath his crustiness, and though he can be silly sometimes (and he's not as smart as Morse or thursday) and also can be hurt, he's surprisingly resilient. When he played Harold Macmillan in the first two seasons of The Crown he really amazed me because even though both Bright and Macmillan are quite similar in some ways (they are well-placed stuffed shirts), he put in enough shadings to both characterizations that they were really quite different: Lesser's Macmillan, despite being more highly placed and better educated and wealthier, was not as resilient as his Bright.

You loved that absurd plot? SMH.

R83, Smell My Hole??????

R83 - Yes I did. Sometimes it is not what it is about but how it goes about it.

Anton Lesser in Wolf Hall! He reminds me of Anton Walbrook a lot, the precision in speaking.

This series gave DS Strange more to do, foreshadowing his rise to DCS in Morse.

This season’s mystery was okay with the towpath murderer/ pub orphan storyline but the jogger /hit by car guy was a complete clanger (oh, he’s just a copycat because that’s what jogging will do to you) The love triangle story was predictable. Setting the denouement in Venice was ludicrous. Thursday jumping on a train to follow Endeavour because of a letter to Joan? And arriving just in time to stop Ludo from shooting him? And then the soap opera dying scene while Thursday is left to chase after Ludo and shoot him? Think next season will start with Thursday in an Italian jail? Or is Ludo going to become a Moriarity uber arch criminal character if there is no body?

Are we supposed to believe that the original affair in Venice was a fantastic coincidence or that it was somehow part of Ludo’s plot and the tension over his wife’s affair with Morse was all fake because . . .

Also, what good did having a “stupid police friend” really do for Ludo, and if one wanted a stupid policeman, was Morse the best choice?

R87 - I think there will be more to come in Season 8.

I'll tell you what, besides truck-sized plot holes, I didn't care for so basically skipped:

The epilogue of showing us the camera work. No!! Allow me (us) the suspension of disbelief!

[quote] Thursday jumping on a train to follow Endeavour because of a letter to Joan?

I wasn't watching as closely as I should have but didn't the letter have all the evidence that kinked Ludo to the crimes?

I agree, that back and forth with the opera was just pretentious to me. What was the point? We know Morse likes opera but his life is not an opera.

I don't mind some of the other issues. That's what happens in fiction - someone does show up to shoot the villain at the right moment. LOL!

I think Bright has turned into a fascinating character. Starting with us learning his history in India during the war and his shooting the tiger and saving Morse's life. The newer story revolving around his wife's illness further brought a humanity to him. So we know he is a man of principles in the most trying of circumstances (refusing to be corrupted with a bribe that could help save his wife's life) extremely competent in stressful situations and brave. Lesser does a stellar job of turning a stereotype on its head.

Wouldn't the insurance company be suspicious of a guy cashing in policies for people he isn't related to?

hard to believe, but each episode is more boring thatn the previous, in tthe new season

Worst season of ENDEAVOR, ever.

I liked it more than most seasons. The last two episodes were better than most, and I think I've seen them all.

"Wouldn't the insurance company be suspicious of a guy cashing in policies for people he isn't related to?"

Buying people's insurance policies for a fraction of their worth is legitimate. You see ads on TV for this all the time.

If the insurance companies does not suspect murder by the beneficiary , because it is not on the death certificate as cause of death, then the payout is almost immediate like within 30 days in most states in the USA.

R90 - Bright has definitely become the most interesting character due entirely to Anton Lesser.

I was surprised at highly stylish his wife was as compared to the other WAGs on the show. It was clear that Bright and his wife were very much in love.

I am willing to bet we find out in future seasons she came from a lower-level aristocratic or moderately wealthy landed gentry background.

R90, yes the letter to Joan had all the evidence but it was such a clumsy plot device. What if Mrs Thursday hadn’t opened it when it arrived—it was addressed to Joan, she should have just forwarded it. Then Thursday would’ve arrived too late. Also, the apology about his behavior, I mean just send it directly to the man ffs.

The entire last act could’ve been set in England and been more believable.

R97 - Of course Mrs. Thursday open Joan's letter. Mrs. Thursday is a Nosy Nelly and a good plot device.

[quote]The entire last act could’ve been set in England and been more believable.

And yet, I liked looking at Venice. I found it entirely believable, what's more, that Morse would have gone there for New Year's. I liked it so much, I'm willing to forgive the plot structure that brought Thursday to Venice Just in the Nick of Time.

Oh don’t get me wrong, I love Endeavour, it’s one of my favorite shows. I just wish the writers spent a bit more time working out the plots. The acting and the art direction/production design is always fantastic.

I think we're supposed to believe that Morse and Violetta met by accident. Then Ludo and Morse met, and at their first meal together, Ludo started feeling Morse out, to see if he was corruptible. It makes sense that Ludo might want a useful idiot at the police, and the fact that Morse left evidence hanging around at his place, where Ludo could see it, at least makes it worth Ludo's time to cultivate this potential asset.

I don't think Ludo was supposed to know about the affair, because they went to the trouble of showing us how he called the house trying to reach Morse and instead reached Violetta.

R101 - Never understood why Morse "left" the phone number of his love shack with his department.

Because he needs to be reachable 24/7 and there are no cell phones.

R103 - I realize there are no cell phones. Was he living there with her or did they just use the place for rolls in the hay.

The true nature of the living arrangement was not quite clear to me from the episode.

He was not living there, but would be there long enough, probably at a regular time.

R105 - Thanks!

After all the wonderful and insightful posts on this thread, I plan to re-watch the episode tonight for the third time.

Endeavor meeting Violetta / Ludo kind of reminds me of Oedipus meeting a lovely woman, having an affair and then oops - he finds out she's his mother. It's all very heavy-handed Greek tragedy, down to the deus ex machina of Fred Thursday arriving at precisely the right moment to save the hero while the woman dies in the hero's arms. Ludo even talks about how he left his murders up to fate.

But maybe I'm overthinking it.

I thought it was way too much of a coincidence that she turned up in Oxford....so I assume they were planning the scam from the beginning

R103: I thought their love nest belonged to Violetta's dancer friend who was away on-tour. But didn't she turn up dead? Aye! So many characters and I am confused. Will take a third viewing by week's end: three is the charm.

My R109 is in response to R104. Oops.

R109, yes, the "friend" ended up a life insurance victim of Ludo and Violetta.

I think the friend, Petra, was intended to be a victim of Ludo/Violetta, but copycat towpath killer (the one the women caught) killed Petra first.

Was the mansion they were living in really theirs, or were they squatting in the home of one of their victims, just like with the dancer?

There was no discussion about the mansion Ludo and Violetta were living in, so I guess that's up to the viewer. They were living there quite visibly to the local community, so it's more likely they had the legal right to be there, as part of their facade.

The actress who played the Italian woman, Stephanie Leonidas, her younger sister is also an actress, a better actress and much prettier, Georgina Leonidas.

Georgina was very good in the short, "Baghdad Express", I think she was in a Harry Potter film but I've never seen one.

Was Ludo ever a student at Oxford? Must have been right? He can't have faked that in Oxford without anyone questioning it?

Ludo recognized Morse from their university days. He could have been lying about that, but if Ludo never attended Oxford at all, I think Morse would have seen through that. I vaguely remember an Inspector Morse story where Morse was able to spot someone who lied about attending the university - Morse was kind of smug about spotting the clues.

Also, at their first meal together, Ludo made a vague comment that made it seem like his wife had left him. That would have resonated with Morse, who was dumped by his fiancee during their university years. If Ludo was in Oxford at that time, he might have remembered the story.

Really interested to see what Morse does with the "crack shack" house he bought.

I hope it is done up decently as I am interested in seeing what the set designers do with the interiors of a newly renovated historic house in 1971.

That’s another big plot hole as far as I’m concerned. Morse would have been very skeptical of someone quite memorable, whom he did not recall claiming to remember him from Oxford, and would have wondered why this jet-setting, fabulously rich man was so intent on being his BFF. The ridiculous coincidence of the wife would only amplify his suspicions. Anyone would be curious about his new friend’s source of wealth, but Morse is not shown to have given it any thought.

R119 - Maybe Morse was just blinded by the wife's hole. Lust can do strange things to people.

Maybe.

R107, Oedipus didn't simply "meet a lovely woman...." He was married to (the recently-widowed by him unwittingly) Queen Jocasta for saving her realm from the Sphinx.

If the story extends to the next season—I hope so—because they didn’t show a body and Thursday as a British policeman carrying a gun and shooting someone in Italy has to be a complicated international incident at least, I think it will be proved that Ludo didn’t attend Oxford. C’mon, he was a conman. If future Morse is good at detecting fakes, then this is when he learned to do it. Remember at their initial meeting, Morse was the one who offered up his name and college name. It was right after he was chasing the guy who picked his pocket so he was distracted, later he would’ve been wary of leading questions like that.

One thing, opera in Venice, sure but wouldn’t a true buff go to La Scala?

R123, forgot about the pickpocket. It was a setup for Ludo to "meet" Morse.

R123 - Per an interview I read today online at PBS Masterpiece with Shaun Evans, Season 7 story line is over and done.

Season 8 will return to a stand-alone episode format. The interview is worth reading and shooting in Venice is much discussed.

Worth reading, but not worth linking?

Good thing for Morse that Thursday came to his aid, instead of investigating some stolen-auto incident. Heh.

R126 - Not sure I know how to post a link but I will try.

I was wondering why the opera was not at all familiar. They wrote it for Endeavor.

No kidding! I didn’t recognize it but I know very little about opera so I figured it was my ignorance.

man i love this show, the first 3 seasons damn fine. but this season is worst of the lot....simple simon...

yes anton lesser is fab! he a very well respected actor in england...done fab stage work

gettin weary of poor ole morse never findin love

may as well be a pitiful closet case..

R131, Best not watch the "Inspector Morse" series then.

i looove insp morse, awesome scripts, i love endeavor but this last season was amateurs ville hun

the new writers sucked

There will be a Season 8:

"Intrepid British detective Endeavour Morse may have just returned to our screens for the seventh season of beloved British crime drama Endeavour but for fans who are still hungry for more mystery, there's good news: the show, inspired by the novels of Colin Dexter—has been officially renewed for an eighth season."

........

after this season, my hunger is no mo

I found the Italian couple storyline to be very soap opera-ish. I also found it bizarre that such an intelligent man as Endeavour fell for that fake plastic Italian femme fatale. Sure, he was horny, but c'mon.

R137, The story line was intended to be opera. I get what they were trying to do, but the result was far too twee. Also, the operatic story line was jarringly inconsistent with the tone of the series.

R137 - It was not the best season of the Endeavour series but compared to other TV shows I think it was very much above average.

I liked this season more than most. The opera was silly, and very, very [italic]deus[/italic] , but I like looking at that part of Morse's character.

Plus Venice.

R140 - Did not mean to imply I did not like Season 7. I loved it. I was just comparing Season 7 to previous seasons.

I was just comparing it to other seasons, too, r141. I have mostly enjoyed Endeavour, though I do get bogged down sometimes in the mystery part of an episode. This did not happen as frequently this season.

r140

I thought the best "mystery" episode was last season when a young girl turned up dead and it ended up she was ran over by a car of an owner of a horse farm driven by his wife. That was a really good episode IMPO.

A bit OT, but anyone watching 'DELICIOUS' on PBS? The series is with Iain Glen, Dawn French and Emelia Fox. One night, it was listed OnDemand at the PBS channel, then, when I went to watch the episode I missed before the last one, the entire OnDemand listing was gone. Where I live this show is aired Fridays on PBS. ENDEAVOUR is still listed in the OnDemand line-up, but not DELICIOUS.

I haven’t heard of that r144 but my local station has been very weird this summer. It randomly started airing the finales of the Great British Baking Show. Not full seasons, just the finales. It’s also been showing European police detectives series—Swedish, Belgian, Italian— but it ended the Italian one at the beginning of a new season.

R145, DELICIOUS is pretty good, a comedy/drama, with lots of twists. BBCAmerica has also been airing some AMC and PBS series, so I have no idea what's going on with that.

Yes, I also noticed the foreign police shows, I tried to get into them, but you cannot turn away for a second because you need to read the subtitles. That's why I stopped watching the Italian series on HBO, the show about the two Italian friends. I speak and understand some Italian, but I'm not completely fluent. It just became a major chore trying to watch it.

I did enjoy The Tunnel, despite so much of the dialog being in French.

they put no energy into this season

scripts were mickey mouse compared to previous seasons

Watched season one episode one, again....alwys have to masturbate to the hot son of the shopkeeper, he in white shirt with ciggy in mouth: hot lad...i dream of suckin out his ass lips

In season 2, loving it. Stands on its own. Hard connecting this Morse to the later Morse except for the brooding, alcohol consumption and problems with women. The solutions of the crimes are convoluted. Like Agatha Christey parodies but I take that is intentional and a bit camp and enjoy them for that reason. Hathaway in Lewis is meant to be the Morse type and young Morse is much like Hathaway. While Thursday is much like Lewis. Thursday says, in an aside, that his grandmother was from the north of England. Lewis is a Geordie. The crestors of Endeavor might be saying that's one reason Morse is so fond of Lewis as he reminds him of his mentor.

[quote]hot son of the shopkeeper,

Who? Link please. There was not one remotely "hot' person in this series. Even the Italian femme fatale was not much to look at. Shaun Evans would be much more attractive if he wasn't so thin, he's not ugly, but he's sickly looking.

These days, the bar for what passes as "hot" is always so damn low.

yea, young morse such a tee totaling bore, older morse was big drinker and skirt lover...

R151 He drinks quite a bit in the pilot, then goes dry for a few seasons, then drinks again throughout the rest of the series.

NEVER seen young morse remotely drunk, he needs 2 be, liven him up a bit

He got drunk in the pilot. Thursday pinned a note on his suit (while passed out on his bed) saying he had to report in at 8 a.m. in the morning.

The main skill evidenced by Shaun Evans is his adopting an Oxford accent. In interviews he speaks with his natural Liverpool one!

only 3 episodes in this season 7??? the third was announced as the finale.....odd....other seasons had twice as tht many or more.

nice to see him smoke a cig for a sec in this one, butches the lad up a bit..

That 3rd episode is ridiculous writing.....but ah venice....the smell of it

R155 - Shaun Evans may have been raised in Liverpool but his immediate family is from Ireland.

R158, You know, I actually thought his accent is Irish, but then figured I was wrong because of Google!

[quote] A bit OT, but anyone watching 'DELICIOUS' on PBS?

Tried, but it was just too awful. Very much like the lottery winners series. Short term soaps as opposed to East Enders-length soaps. Can’t sit through ‘em. Characters & plots are too predictable.

is this 3rd episode the final one of the season?

Yes, r161. That was it.

So the flat in Venice turned out to be the flat of Violetta’s friend who happened to be in England and was murdered on the towpath by a sadistic psychopath, but Morse managed to link her to Violetta & Ludo and a life insurance murder ring?

Was there an homage to Silence of the Lambs in this episode? Strange happened to be investigating a different case & unexpectedly found a sadistic psychopathic killer living in the house of a recently deceased person and heard something while looking at a business card in the kitchen.

In SoL, Clarice is investigating Fredericka Bimmel’s murder & finds a psychopathic killer living in the house of a recently deceased person and sees something when the killer is in the kitchen going though business cards.

[quote] He started out as a hardass, but as the show has gone through its seasons you see that bright is essentially a deeply kind man underneath his crustiness, and though he can be silly sometimes (and he's not as smart as Morse or thursday) and also can be hurt, he's surprisingly resilient.

I think his role/character was expanded in this series because he was in Game of Thrones. He is a reliably well known actor in the UK but wasn’t known much in the US until he played Maester Qyburn in GoT. I think that got the attention of channel surfers in the US (“hey...that’s evil old Qyburn playing a cop! What show is this?”) and regular Masterpiece Mystery watchers, so they expanded his character & made him more noble in order to sho what a versatile actor he is.

Anyone else catch the reference to Cousin Kevin? From The Who’s “Tommy”?

We’re on our own, cousin.

All alone, cousin.

Let’s think of a game to play

Now the grownups have all gone away

You won’t be much fun being blind, deaf & dumb but I’ve no one to play with today.

Do you know how to play hide & seek? To find me it will take you a week.

But tied to that chair you won’t go anywhere

There’s a lot I can do with a freak

How would you feel if I turned on the bath

Ducked your head under and started to laugh?

What would you do if I shut you outside

To stand in the rain and catch cold til you died? .

No. What was the episode's allusion? Because if it was simply the word "cousin".....

Fucked up season, went off the rails, in a boring way......earlier seasons had such delightful thick plots, not this one, . weak

[quote]Tried, but it was just too awful. Very much like the lottery winners series. Short term soaps as opposed to East Enders-length soaps. Can’t sit through ‘em. Characters & plots are too predictable.

I like the main performers, so I'm sticking with it. I agree, it's been predictable, especially the plot with Emila Fox's new BF ending up in bed with some guest at the old woman's party. I saw that coming a mile away. Emila Fox was good in "Slient Witiness", that series was on for one season on BBC America, it never returned. Think Emila is the only remaining original character on that show, the others are gone.

BBC America was so good when it first came on, now its endless repeats of Star Trek and nature shows. Which are fine, if you missed them, but they are endlessly repeated.

"Line of Duty", which has been on AMC, is an excellent cop/detective series. You don't know who the good or bad guys are, it really keeps you guessing, there are so many twists and turns. Keeley Hawes was excellent in it. This series featured some of her best dramatic acting. Currently, I think there are three or four seasons of the series OnDemand on AMC.

[quote] Because if it was simply the word "cousin".....

Umm, no it’s not. Johnny was the bad boy who tormented animals & his sister. But almost as an afterthought Endeavor adds “But there was a nasty Cousin Kevin who was even worse...”

No reason to add Cousin Kevin to the mix except as a shout out. The show often references 60s & 70s pop music. She’s Leaving Home (Joan Thursday), Good News candies (Creme Tangerine, Ginger Sling, Pineapple Tart, Coffee Dessert, Savoy Truffle).

They also reference 60s UK & sometimes US movies, tv & literature/events as well. David Nixon, Dont Look Now, Talented Mr Ripley. an idyllic village called "Chigton Green". This name runs together the titles of three animated TV programs for children which were popular on British television in the 1960s: Chigley (1969), Trumpton (1967), and Camberwick Green. We see a Thunderbirds-type kiddy show.

The names of famous science fiction writers are used liberally throughout the series

a few seasons had 6 episodes, many had 5....a few had 4

this had 3....wtf???? lazy acors?

R170, Um, I was only asking.

BTW, we did the whole "Chigton Green and Wikipedia" thing a while ago.

Not every TV show set in Venice references every movie set in Venice. (OTOH, there was "Death in Venice".....)

And SOR-REE if American viewers in 2020 don't catch all the 1960s British entertainment allusions! Personally, I'm waiting for Endeavour to say "Gear!" And "Fab!" And for Joan to sport some Mary Quant! *sarcasm*

"I think there are three or four seasons of the series OnDemand on AMC"

R169 - Line of Duty is also available on AcornTV.

[quote]Line of Duty is also available on AcornTV.

I guess Acorn has all the Brit series mentioned here, on one channel? I don't get the point of subscribing to Acorn when you can find most of these Brit series airing on basic cable channels. I have Spectrum, Acorn is considered a premium channel.

There are a lot of similarities between series 7 endeavor & Don’t Look Now, R172 & I’m not the only one who thinks so.

“Cinematic references to Don’t Look Now abound, and not just in the use of Venice as a location. The supernatural element is conveyed with a frisson of genuine horror worthy of M. R. James”

There’s a female clairvoyant warning people of danger & murder.

There’s a serial killer on the loose

Accidental deaths & murders takes place near canals (in Venice and Oxford).

A man is murdered by having his throat cut

The color red is associated with female characters & death in both dramas. In Dont Look Now, it’s the red cape of a female child/dwarf. The child dies in her red cape, the dwarf murders in her red cape. In Endeavor, red the color of Violetta’s bedding, curtains, doorway of her apartment, much of her wardrobe & of the opera house.

Also, there are echoes of Dario Argento’s Deep Red in the series.

Kind of a mishmash, like this 7th series itself.

That Ludo sure was a genius to pick out all those people to murder in towns that spelled out his name ...managing to get all of them to sell their insurance policies to him .... joining a fundamentalist brotherhood of prayer warriors in order to convince Mrs Bright to sell him her policy so she could go to America for treatment .... How could he know she would survive long enough so he could electrocute her at Christmas?

Why did he need two idiot policemen? That was a bit chancey, don’t you think? He already had Mrs Bright in his power. Bright was a better idiot policeman. He never suspected. Morse, on the other hand, was smart enough to figure out the insurance scheme while Bright refused to believe it when presented with evidence.

Lots of cats, rats & birds....

R169 I watched seasons 1-5 of "Line of Duty" on Amazon. The current season is only available on Acorn.

Endeavor isn’t on Britbox

R178 - See link for Britbox US

R178 - Tried to post the Link for Endeavor on Britbox US and was not successful. I guess Muriel does not like Btitbox US.

I HAVE Britbox USA. Endeavor is not on it.

R181 - Sorry I just went to Britbox US online and found it.

I know I have it at home some it be on Amazon Prime. I know it is NOT on AcornTV or Netflix.

I have Britbox. "Endeavour" is not on it. It is on PBS Masterpiece and Amazon.

[quote]Personally, I'm waiting for Endeavour to say "Gear!" And "Fab!" And for Joan to sport some Mary Quant! *sarcasm*

I just finished watching s5/ep3 and thought you might be tickled to know there actually was a Mary Quant reference!

R184, I just re-watched, and right you are! Haha!

It's about an hour in, when the boutique owner is being questioned at the police station. He's asked where he's worked and mentions "Mary Quant"!

Good catch of a quick moment!

[quote] Sorry I just went to Britbox US online and found it

No you didn’t

I wish there were more episodes. I can’t deal with the subtitled Masterpiece Mysteries. I can’t sit for that long & read. I have things to do - make dinner, clean up, pee, immediately flush solid bits from cat litter, let dog out, let dog in, get texts, get weather alerts, catch spider & put it outside, negotiate with cat how long until next treat/feeding, break up cat/dog disagreement, get distracted by neighbors making too much noise near my property while I’m trying to watch tv, pee again. These shows are too long with no intermission.

Stephanie Leonidas is in one episode of the new Masterpiece mystery series 'Van Der Valk". I recognized her immediately. Thankfully, she's using her real accent, no fake Italian femme fatale voice.

R186 - I went to Britbox website and selected "shows". Endeavour was listed. I am sorry if I caused anyone any trouble.

R188, How stupid ARE you?!

Any favourite episodes? Mine is from season 5, episode 3 Passenger. I knew from the beginning something was amiss. A very satisfying episode.

The first episode I ever watched was from season 2, episode 3 Sway. "Le minou noir" (that was fun!)... I thought the actress playing Luisa, Thursday's former "comrade" in Italy, was excellent. The actress is French, incidentally, Cécile Paoli - although she plays Italian very convingly. She's not well-known in France. And she does Julianne Moore's voice! In the French dubbed versions: Big Lebowski, The Hours... Seriously.

I thought the pilot was excellent.

My favourite season is season five, by a mile.

My favorite episode, not for the “mystery” part because the explanation was very bad, but for the ambience was the Gatsby-esque one, the mysterious wealthy guy with the mansion and the parties. It was the season opener after a very traumatic previous season finale and Morse was living in a kind of semi derelict cottage in the woods. All the acting was fantastic.

R191 I loved that episode too! The atmosphere, and even the character "Bixby"... Opener for season 3. Might be my second favourite.

Most stories are extremely convoluted though. I love the art direction and the music.

I have just finished season 6, where Morse went undercover, was dumped by his girllfriend, Thursday lost his life savings, George died, and the station closed. I love stories like this and couldn't love anybody more than Mr. Evans at the moment.

^^I am bingeing on Prime.

The whole arc with the station closing (starting in season 5?) is very good.

Thursday being placed in that untenable position with his brother, and ending up losing his and his wife's lifesavings... I thought that was a particularly poignant situation, and very relatable.

No doubt about it, season 5 is my favourite.

I can't watch season 6 because Morse sports a moustache.

Very different, but I've been watching the 4-episode miniseries Fleming, with Dominic Cooper. Very enjoyable. With Anna Chancellor!

R194, very dark in that episode. A real turn toward darkness and loss.

My issue with George Fancy is that his death drove a lot of motivation for the next two seasons and he had barely been on the show before he was killed off. I could never remember what he looked like or anything he did that was noteworthy. DS Jakes, now I remember him. He was openly antagonistic to Morse and I couldn’t tell if he was bent. Then he had that bizarre send off where he became engaged to the daughter of a wealthy rancher and moved to Canada? the US? to be a cowboy. Him, I remember.

Both Jakes and Fancy were hawt skinny boys. Hawter than Morse.

I remember both, actually. I thought Fancy was pretty well-made as a character, always putting his foot in his mouth and being told off by Morse, who then ended up himself berated by Thursday for not giving "the young chap a chance" (not a direct quote). I enjoyed Fancy's pretty looks, and his youthful enthusiasm (coupled with real inefficiency/incompetence, typical of inexperience). He was starting to get there, precisely when he was killed. Starting to do things right.

I didn't like Jakes. Leave my boy Morse alone!

The actor playing George Fancy had a very pretty face. Lewis Peek, if he ever shows up in anything else.

We are given the backstory about Jakes to make him more sympathetic, childhood physical and sexual abuse. He grows more friendly toward Morse as time goes on.

He does, but still. I never knew that backstory, must have missed that episode.

Was Jakes one of the orphans in that town councilor pedo plot that ended up with Thursday getting shot? That was the most tense episode. I really was afraid they were killing Thursday off.

Any episode featuring the Sheldonian is fine by me.

On the trail of Endeavour's Oxford:

Yes, Jake was one of the orphans, the youngest. "Little Pete."

Right, thanks r208.

I’m a lunger

We're City Men.

I have no idea why Morse is obsessed with my bug-eyed self.

Is there any more explanation into the circumstances of Thursday's brother losing the life savings? I'd like to see sweet Thursday get a little retribution and recompense.

That was a real left-field story arc, Thursday’s brother. One look at him told you he was a spiv, yet Thursday knew him his whole life but never noticed?

I've not watched every episode with rapt attention--so forgive if I missed the obvious. I thought Thursday had some terminal disease and he was resigned to it?

R213 Isn't it something like the brother bet money on a scheme, or "invested" as the word goes? Something like that.

Thursday had shrapnel in his lung. There's a scene where he coughs it up.

It was a bullet. Don’t know why Thursday didn’t have an X-ray showing the metal in his lung.

Thanks...definitely missed the scene where he coughed up a bullet...

He coughed it into the sink in the washroom at work

R220 - It was a great episode ending scene.

I just watched an episode about an aristocratic fascist, who danced with Hitler at her wedding, somewhat subtly called “Charity Mudford”, heheh.

Also there is a photographer called “Farridge” who was murdered by a racist.

Gotta love Endeavour.

R222 - “Charity Mudford” was based on the real life sisters Diane & Unity Mitford. Both Diane & Unity were disgusting fascists.

"It was a bullet. Don’t know why Thursday didn’t have an X-ray showing the metal in his lung."

R218 - Thursday did medical treatment but the way the bullet was lodged made it inoperable.

I don't want to read through the entire thread because I've just started watching and don't want to get spoiled. (I just finished all of "Inspector Morse."

Is there some reason the pilot episode is not available (except for purchase) on either Britbox or Amazon Prime/PBS? I started watching what they showed as Season 1/Episode 1, but it's actually the SECOND episode ("Girl.")

Another "Morse"-related question -- Britbox shows that Season 1 of "Inspector Lewis" (aka "Lewis") is available, but they only have the first episode. It appears the only other way to watch is to subscribe to yet another service (PBS/Masterpiece.)

R225 - I watched the pilot of Endeavour on the PBS app purchased through Amazon Prime about four months ago.

John Light was in it playing a British spy and it was great

r226 Yes, but as I said, you had to BUY it. I'm looking for a way to see it for free, since I already subscribe to Amazon Prime AND Britbox. (And Netflix, Disney+, and HBOMax.)

"Britbox shows that Season 1 of "Inspector Lewis" (aka "Lewis") is available, but they only have the first episode. It appears the only other way to watch is to subscribe to yet another service (PBS/Masterpiece.)"

R225 - The same thing is true for "Vera" as only half of the seasons are available on BritBox and the other half of the Seasons are available only on AcornTV.

I found the pilot on DailyMotion. Not the best quality, and probably no captions, but better than nothing.

I guess I'll give up on "Lewis" for now.

R229 - I always have "Closed Caption" on when I watch British shows as I cannot always understand what the actors are saying. This is especially true with "Vera", "Marcella" , "Line of Duty" and sometimes Morse-Lewis-Endeavor.

I love the way the Brits pronounce "St. John"!!!

R227 - Sorry! I did not read your full comment.

I really hope we meet Morse’s post-Thursday mentor McNutt, as per The Masonic Mysteries. Also I hope we see the Mary Lapsley case as per Second Time Around which featured a Baby Christopher Eccleston, Oliver Ford Davies and an excellent Kenneth Colley.

[quote]I love the way the Brits pronounce "St. John"!!!

I don't.

[quote]Fun Fact: Some evidence exists that #Unity_Mitford & #Diana_Mitford arranged orgies for Third Reich's high command.

An orgy, maybe. The Third Reich's high command, NO!

I've got a question about Inspector Morse's John Shaw - what was wrong with his right leg? He's got a strange prancing gait where he places his foot down oddly on the ball of the foot, as if tiptoeing. Quite distracting once you notice it.

John Thaw’s limp is why Endeavour was shot in the first episode of the first season and Max said he may develop a limp in middle age.

Ah, I missed that since I watched Endeavour before Inspector Morse. Thanks, R237.

I had an intense sex dream about Shaun Evans last night. He had a thick cock and a sensitive pink hole and fucked for hours. Roger Allam watched us go at it through a window.

[QUOTE]Roger Allam watched us go at it through a window.

I've been hot for Allam since he did that Radio 4 aviation sitcom with Benedict Cumberbatch. Mr Golden Tonsils.

Refresh my memory - who in Endeavour apart from Jim Strange is a Mason? Specifically, is Game Of Thrones' Own Reginald Bright a Mason? I want to figure out who is stealing the evidence.

^can’t help you r241 but I just watched an episode with David Oakes as a rich guy called Joss Bixby, who calls everyone “old man”, hangs with gamblers and bought a massive country pile next door to his unhappily married ex whose best friend is a professional female golfer.

It’s almost as shameless as the aforementioned Charity Mudford. Gotta love Endeavour.

I am also told it has references to The Prestige.

I love that they use Oxford locations so well. It makes me nostalgic for visiting there.

I hate how the producers are trying to make Endeavour and Joan Thursday a thing. Shaun Evans pushed for it. She was a really unlikeable and “come and get me boys!” in the first 4 seasons but more to the point they have no chemistry. I preferred him with Monica or any other the women he’s been with, TBH.

my fave tv series. the new season on yet??? hope it goes on for yrs....very well done. altho joan his bosses daughter and the young mans gf, looks like his older aunt.

Best Scripts ive seen in a long time, expertly and lovingly done.

I'm almost all caught up! In the past two months, I've finished all of Morse, all of Lewis, and I have only two episodes of Endeavour to go! Then what do I watch?

Van Der Valk!

luv to see the stars cock and manhole. yumsssss

Who has sucked or rimmed the young star?

[quote]I'm almost all caught up! In the past two months, I've finished all of Morse, all of Lewis, and I have only two episodes of Endeavour to go! Then what do I watch?

Updating my previous post: I finished Endeavour, and now am now starting on the last season of "Line of Duty" (I finished the first four.) I have also started on "Pie in the Sky," but it seems awfully dated --more so than "A Touch of Frost," which is from roughly the same time.

I've seen all of Midsomer, George Gently, Criminal-UK, all the Agatha Christies, Agatha Raisin, Fr. Brown, DCI Banks, Hetty Wainthropp, Miss Fisher (but not the reboot), Death in Paradise. What next?

Forgotten Vera New Tricks The Sweeney (John Thaw's 1st cop show)

I enjoyed Thaw in Kavanaugh Q.C. quite a bit.

R251 - Shetland! It is on BritBox/Amazon Prime.

The Miss Fisher reboot "Ms. Fisher" is not bad. I have watched many of the same shows you watched and enjoyed them. Like you, I found "Pie in the Sky" dated. I really enjoy Murdoch Mysteries which is still in production.

I finished all of "Shetland" and the two new episodes of "Vera." Now I'm watching "The Coroner" (only has two seasons) and "New Tricks," which is fun.

I do have a question for my UK friends: why do so many episodes of these British detective/procedural/mystery shows feature a BASEBALL BAT as a weapon? Is it common for British homes to have one at the ready? I'm surprised they are even sold in the UK--does anyone actually use them for baseball? Wouldn't a cricket bat be more common?

Ms. Fisher had to grow on me. It hit his groove in Season 2. I am disappointed that Frankie Drake was cancelled.

Joan Thursday was annoying as hell. I preferred the fun nurse.

Has anyone in the UK seen the first episode of the new Endeavour season (series in the UK)? I think it is titled "Striker"

I like and have watched most of the shows mentioned here. Ashamed to admit that I have seen ALL of Midsomer Murders' 22 seasons (mostly during my covid shutdown). Have to specifically note "Shetland" because ... Doug Henshaw. Unbelievably sexy and not just because of the voice/accent. He was on a Midsomer Murders episode and blew me away (sadly only figuratively) with his performance - sad and intelligent and snarky and emotional, all at once.

"Ashamed to admit that I have seen ALL of Midsomer Murders' 22 seasons"

So have I!!!! You need to check out Murdock Mysteries on AcornTV.

Mj88i

^ lol

I’ve started the new season of Grantchester. It’s funny how they keep trying to butch up the new guy. Trying to make him into a James Dean/Marlon Brando type. He has a bit of sex appeal but the face just doesn’t scream “Hot!”

r260 I saw on another thread that Midsomer Season "22B" is coming out on Acorn on 9/27 (see link.)

No one wants to chime in on my baseball bat question?

R264 - Cannot wait to see Midsomer Murders Season 22B!

Since Barrington Pheloung died, the music doesn’t have that same, classic Morse feel

I didn't know Barrington Pheloung died. Sad. His beautiful and haunting music for Morse and Lewis is what he's known for, but there is much more out there to listen to and enjoy.

While searching Barrington Pheloung I found these tidbits:

(Barrington Pheloung ) "He became known for hiding clues and red herrings in the score for the TV show, occasionally revealing the killer's identity in morse code. The hypnotic title song also included a motif based on the letters M.O.R.S.E."

"John Thaw has the limp which was caused in a car accident when he was a boy and it damaged a nerve causing his foot to drag."

Thought I'd share those.

They're setting us up for Fred Thursday's demise. He does not appear in Morse, and Strange is the CS on Morse.

One last opinion - Anton Lesser is never less than brilliant in any role he is in, but as Chief Superintendent Reginald Bright, he deserves an award.

I like Anton Lesser, too

I just saw an episode of Morse featuring Simon Callow cast as a lady killer. It should be laughable but he just about pulls it off.

Weird how his growing a beard makes him look very different in Vigil.

I’ve dreaded the finale of every season of Endeavour because it’s always hinting at killing off Thursday. I don’t think the producers anticipated how popular the show would be or how long the actors would want to continue. It helps that the seasons are very short, almost a miniseries. But they are approaching the time period of the original Morse series. 😬

At first, viewers were thinking Morse never mentioned Thursday due to some scandal. I hope they are past that now and it’s just ‘Morse never mentioned Thursday (shrug)’.

GOD I HOPE IT GOES ON FOR MORE SEASONS.....BEST THING ON TEE VEE

The joking references to past and current events are fun. Apart from the aforementioned Charity Mudford and Farridge there is a sleazy school employee with a “Make Britain Greater” badge.

R273 - Love it when "they" complain about not being admitted to the European Common Market.

ANTON RIMS THE STAR?

whts the bootleg channel on u tube to watch new episodes of it???

Season/Series 8 has not yet aired in the US.

UK DLers who have seen Season/Series 8, is it any good?

R277 I thought it was great, as always. It was only three episodes, though.

It was shown here in September so I'm sure you'll get it soon.

R278 - PBS begins airing Season 8 March 2022, I think.

twas on u tube for a bit, got taken down.

where now?

Holy crap — didn’t recognize Strange. Bit of a weight loss there. And maybe a face tightening? You have to click the link to see Strange’s photo and his new face.

I thought Jim Strange looked great!

lady who plays joan looks like their older aunt. ..... weird casting

Morse's transformation into a bitter alcoholic is complete.

Series 8, Episode 2 ("Scherzo") features a gay subplot with two handsome actors, Nicholas Shaw and Joe Gallina.

Joan Thursday is kind of creepy. She looks like a puppet…could’ve been a character in the Neighborhood of Make Believe

Anton Lesser's daughter Lily is in Endeavour as Ravenna Mackenzie

[quote]Morse's transformation into a bitter alcoholic is complete.

Oh, it's just getting started.

The murder house mystery in the last episode was quite enjoyable. Why is Mrs. Thursday such a hag?

Love this show.

I've just finished series 3 on Amazon. I started watching it a few weeks ago when my husband was isolating with COVID and I had nothing to do. Now I'm addicted and even alternating with old episodes of "Inspector Morse" on YouTube! I'm very curious to see how (of if) they will achieve the transformation from bright-eyed young Morse to old grump Morse.

Shaun Evans is a dollface!

R271 I thought Morse DID mention Thursday. As in how he learned the ropes from him and always believed Thursday's shoes too big to fill. Thursday responsible for Morse's exacting standards. Maybe I backfilled.

[quote]Why Joan Thursday Has To Choose Strange Over Morse

Because Strange has a big, thick one.

Strange has become hot all of a sudden, thanks to unexplained weight loss.

"Why is Mrs. Thursday such a hag?"

R289 - Because her solider son, who is stationed in Ireland with the British Army during the beginning if the "Time of Troubles", is missing?

"Why Joan Thursday Has To Choose Strange Over Morse"

Because Strange is more stable and going up the latter in his career?

"Terminus" (S8, Ep 3) was just ridiculous in every way. The series, once excellent, is now in its Sad Last Days.

I can't wait for season 9 although 8 was pretty shitty.

R292, I only saw a couple episodes of Morse, enough to know that I didn’t like his hectoring character, but when Endeavour’s pilot did well and became a series, I read a lot of comments re Thursday not being “canon”, that Morse had mentioned his previous boss but it wasn’t Thursday. Which led to the rumors every season (before renewal) of Thursday’s imminent demise in some unmentionable way. I sincerely hope not. That would be a miscalculation of GoT proportions.

Fred has to pay the piper for his violence and corruption.

They will need a Roger Allam-level actor to play McNutt.

Strange is a Mason, for career reasons. Are Fred Thursday and Bright?

I’m wondering if in the final episode we’ll be told that names were changed for confidential reasons or if they’ll pass off the entire series as a dream.

Thursday, Strange, Bright, Trewlove, Fancy, Box are all stylized names. I’m hoping the creators weren’t just jerking us around and the names have a reason for being stylized.

Strange and Dr Max DeBryn were major supporting characters in the original Morse series. The author of the novels, Colin Dexter, was a cryptic crossword fanatic and stuffed his work with literary references.

Numerous minor m characters from Morse cases have appeared as their younger selves in Endeavour. And from the show Lewis, the sidekick’s sidekick, Hathaway’s father, turned up in the tiger episode as a teenager.

Dr DeBryn is my absolute favorite. He seems like a DLer.

Thursday is a tough cop as was the tradition but he is NOT corrupt.

Yes, he did succumb to some backhanders when the team was split up and those really corrupt cops came in. He’d lost all his savings loaning money to his no good brother and Mrs Thursday left him and Joan was gone, he hit bottom but it was only temporary.

“ Thursday, Strange, Bright, Trewlove, Fancy, Box are all stylized names. I’m hoping the creators weren’t just jerking us around and the names have a reason for being stylized.”

Don’t forget Jakes. Not typically British, are they. I don’t think we’ll get an explanation though.

I’ll be sad when it’s finished. This has been my favorite show for ten years.

Wasn’t Bright a braying asshole when the series started? Then GoT became famous and people were all “It’s Qyburn! Now he’s a foppy jerk! Oh no!” So they changed Bright into a hero figure after he shot the tiger.

Bright was an ass when he came on and distrusted Morse. It was interesting to watch him change his opinion over the series. (Was he in GoT? Don't remember that role. I think more people saw him in Wolf Hall where he played Thomas More. )

Anton Lesser plays Chief Superintendent Bright and was Qyburn in Game of Thrones. He wasn’t in Wolf Hall. That wasMark Rylance.

I find it boring. People just weren't all that naughty in the early 60s

R309 *sigh* There was more than one character in "Wolf Hall," you know.

R311 - Thank you for the link.

Anton lesser was also in two episodes of Midsomer Murders playing a bad guy: Birds of Prey (2003) and Talking to the Dead (2008).

Yes, he's one of those character actors who finds increasing popularity with age. He's going to be in one of the upcoming Star Wars shows as an Imperial.

Endeavor Season 8 was just three episodes and not very good either. “The foods terrible and such small portions!”

R314 - You make an excellent point that many will agree with.

Appropos of nothing, I stumbled upon this picture of Inspector Morse actor John Thaw from 1962. Real Endeavour!

The crooked cop Box is Rex Harrison's grandson.

the plot twist of joan crushing on the formerly fat detective cohort of morse is ridic !!

Don't worry, he'll be fat again in the future.

Bumping this as filming has just finished on the last ever series. Anyone seen pics of Shaun Evan's cock? Wasn't there supposed to be nudes out there? Rumours are he is hung like a horse.

R320 Alas, I have not.

I have seen some set pictures from the final season, and I'm surprised they they took no efforts at all to try to age up Evans a bit. Start giving him premature grey at least. I suppose we'll just have to imagine that somewhere between 1975 and 1985, ol' Morse really hits a wall.

I've watched it from the beginning and loved it. I never liked "Inspector Morse," but I've enjoyed "Endeavour" and "Inspector Lewis."

" Colin Dexter put a clause in his will barring anyone but Shaun Evans from playing the role of the detective. Dexter's estate is expected to enforce the clause for as long as they retain the rights – 70 years after his death, so Evans will be the last Morse of our lifetime."

Not a car lover per se, but those beautiful British cars with their rich paint colors have kept me watching from the beginning series. And the actors of course…

Have any of our UK DLers watched the final series? (Or have any of our other DLers pirated it?) Should we discuss, or wait until more people have seen it?

Have you seen it Sylv? I didn't get into Endeavour although I loved John Thaw's Inspector Morse and have read all the Dexter novels, where he's characterised a bit differently.

I liked some early episodes of Lewis but felt it went off the boil a bit in the later seasons, quite formulaic and going through the motions.

Reflecting on it, Morse sorta falls into the same category as Tom Barnaby in that there's usually multiple bodies before he figures out the killer! Not sure if that's the case with Endeavour too. Anyway, all three series had a respectably long run.

The last Endevour episodes were terrible. I don’t understand why it was so bad,

R326 I've seen the entire run of "Endeavour," and pirated the new/final season. Seasons 7 & 8 were bad, but 9 redeems the series somewhat and makes an effort to tie up loose ends and unresolved issues from past seasons. I enjoyed it. My major disappointment with "Endeavour," as always but especially in the final season, is that they don't do enough to show the transformation from young Morse to old Morse. They still seem like two completely different men who both happen to like opera to me.

I didn’t like the final season. The final 10 minutes of the last episode were the worst. It was like they didn’t know how to end it so they just threw in a bunch of montages that made no sense.

Spoiler alert: What was the gunshot about? Are we supposed to think that he tried to shoot himself?

Season 9 is on PBS! Anyone watching?

I'm watching

I pirated it and watched it a few months ago.

Thanks for the reminder.

I'll watch it at 10:00. Right now, Exploring Music is exploring the music of Ned Rorem. It's gay month all over PBS.

Hello, matey!

R330 - I am watching! The first episode "Prelude" was good. Not great but good. However, I did not have the problems with Season 7 and Season 8 that many viewers did.

I am a sucker for anything (film, TV, podcast...etc..) featuring Roger Allam and/or Anton Lesser.

Me too, r335! I love the scenes where they’re just sitting at the table having a conversation. Both are so perfect in their roles.

Sean Rigby lost weight making him no longer suitable to play the ample Strange.

I wonder if they are going to make any attempt to explain why the original Morse never mentioned Thursday.

Especially as Joan Thursday is now engaged to Strange. I never watched Inspector Morse, was Strange’s wife ever mentioned?

R338 All the time, but never her first name.

American have to be careful in this thread as the whole season has aired in the UK. I don’t want any spoilers so I’ll be staying away.

3rd episode tonight…how many episodes this season?

I like that they’re leaning heavily into Blenheim Vale but I don’t remember much of the story. Jakes is back!

Finis

I've only just started watching it this week, the first five episodes and quite like it.

In the past I've stumbled on bits of Inspector Morse episodes, but whether for the random fragments or other reasons it didn't capture my attention despite some interest in the setting and subject. I'll go it a go again, and a fairer one once I've finished Endeavor.

What was ending at Blenheim Palace supposed to symbolize? Did it ever figure in a case?

R344, Not the Marlborough /Churchill Blenheim Palace.

"Blenheim Vale."

No. The end was at the Palace.

R343, Same here with "Morse," and I love Oxford and have visited several times!

But John Thaw simply doesn't appeal to me, and I'm darned if I can conjure up a scintilla of Endeavour in him, no matter the two times "Endeavour" did the "see each in a car" bit (the first was young Morse looking into his rear-view mirror and seeing old Morse looking back. The second was the Finale's final scene, with the characters driving past each other in their distinctive Rolls-Royces ).

I liked this Finale very much. Loose ends were tied up (Fred's money; Danny Webb's character; Morse's kiss, though imaginary, of Joan; the various departures from Oxford and farewells; etc.). .

But I hated it, too, because it is the final episode. I wonder why, given the incredible run for "Morse."

The ending was "fine." Since so many no longer watch when the episode airs, I can't say much more... all of the sudden there will be whining posts about "spoilers!".

I found trying to remember/follow Blenheim Vale very difficult... even with the explanations; so many names to remember from episodes that took place years ago.

Thursday, son Sam, the biker gang who appear in the final episode, and that stabbing - well, it's Thursday's life and if he can sleep at night, who am I to judge.

The gun shot in the church yard... what was the point?

Endeavour and Joan... the show's writers gave the fraus what they fantasized about for years, didn't they?

But overall, I don't see how this program and the original Morse are in any way similar.

Right you are, r346; Mea culpa from r345, as I was looking only at the red Rolls!

Agree about that final gunshot. No point at all. And the Joan “fake out” at the wedding was rather lame.

R348, Well THIS Frau appreciated the "alternate reality" with Morse and Joan! Pbbbbbt! 💋

I asked the same question about Morse, the Russian Roulette loading of the gun (which I really think Thursday would NOT have given to Morse, that the scene fit neither character), and the gunshot. Are we to believe that a heartbroken Morse (Joan's marriage; Fred's murdering; everyone leaving) contemplated suicide but turned the gun in time not to die?

Jaguars, my dear. Not Rolls Royces.

It was all rather confusing. I myself confused Box and Jakes into one character.

A Morse Wiki

I just finished season 8. The "Scream"-like conclusion to that finale set in the abandoned hotel must be the franchise nadir--it made no sense, and is completely out of keeping with the tone of the rest of the three series.

And that place would have been looted or cleared out, not left intact for 8 years.

Here’s the (rather inside) connection to the Palace:

“That’s also not the first time Blenheim Palace has been used as a location in Inspector Morse. 1995 episode ‘The Way Through The Woods’ featured the discovery of a body in the palace grounds. What made that one special? It was written by Endeavour creator Russell Lewis (and script edited by Mammoth Screen’s Damien Timmer), making Blenheim Palace both the start and the end of Lewis’ journey with the character.”

More:

“ Speaking to The Times, Lewis said that he wanted to end Endeavour at Blenheim Palace as a special tribute to Morse creator Colin Dexter as that was the last place he and actor-director Shaun Evans had seen Dexter at a Q&A event, before Dexter passed away in 2017.”

I think having a man named Lewis as the creator of Endeavour only adds to my confusion.

R352, What?! All this time I didn't know the car was a JAG, ME, who craves only one material possession and it's an XK-E?!

I should stop now while I'm behind!

A theory about the gunshot:

“The one character we knew had to live past the finale’s credits was, in a cryptic way that befits this playful series, perhaps its sole victim. This whole time, we’ve been clocking up the many and frequent portents of Fred’s death, forgetting that this ending was always destined to symbolically kill off somebody else – Endeavour, to leave behind Morse. Just Morse. That was perhaps the significance of the gunshot in the churchyard, the choral requiem, and the two Jags crossing on the bridge. There were always two men: Endeavour, and Morse. One had to exit the stage so the other could enter. “

I didn’t think it was possible to wrap of the series but they did a fantastic job. I got a bit teary seeing cameos of all the actors, the rear view mirror glances as the cars passed. Blenheim Vale was the best, most intense mystery and Little Petey’s sad solution/ending was tragic in that Morse can’t even tell Jakes who is so haunted by it.

And the writer accomplished the most difficult task of the entire series: why Inspector Morse never mentioned his old Gov in that series. That great character Thursday is demolished, it was so sad to see and Morse just shuts him down.

I also never watched the original series, just a couple episodes and I never saw the connection between Thaw’s interpretation and Evans’. I didn’t really care because I wasn’t a fan of the first one.

Also question the gun shot…maybe it was an attempt, because he destroyed his father figure and was feeling guilty?

When he left choir practice, he handed his music to someone, was that the show’s composer who took over when Phelong died?

Re the abandoned hotel episode. I loved it because it was a callback to classic Agatha Christie and “train schedule” type mysteries. It was also really scary. No one is who they seem to be, complicated codes, isolated hotel in a storm…classic! Okay some of the details needed to be finessed, still it was completely engrossing.

I love that explanation r361

They don’t reveal who played the choirmaster except Lewis says it was not him.

I don’t see Morse shutting Thursday down. The Thursdays have to go into hiding, and Morse has been shown to be a man who keeps secrets. Doesn’t really explain why Thursday is never mentioned in Insoector Morse while another mentor (his new Gov at Crowley) is.

Shaun Evans is hot.

Maybe I got the wrong impression, to me it seemed like Morse was angry? upset? disillusioned? that “upholder of the law” Thursday murdered someone. But Thursday was all about family and Morse has none and doesn’t “get” it. Thursday thinks of Morse like a son and seeing that Morse thinks less of him was heartbreaking.

But the Den of Greek explanation was quite different and also made sense. Thursday is grateful for the return of the money but now realizes he and his family have to disappear and he also knows Morse will never tell anyone.

I dunno, I think the story Morse thought up for the biker gang, that Tomahawk was a police informer and Lott had him killed for some reason, would hold since Lott is dead. Send Sam off to America with Jakes, I didn’t believe his sudden turnabout and I want to be a policeman.

[quote] When he left choir practice, he handed his music to someone, was that the show’s composer who took over when Phelong died?

My theory is that they tried to find a Colin Dexter (author of the Morse novels, who had cameos in every episode of Inspector Morse and Endeavour until his death in 2017) lookalike for that brief scene.

I’m going to miss this show.

Absolutely, r368! The stories but moreso the incredible cast!

What is next for Roger and Shaun??

A perfect ending to a wonderful show.

The ending with the choir singing did take place at Blenheim Palace. Blenheim Vale is a different place, much smaller building.

Since they mentioned that it was Blenheim Palace a couple of times, that was obvious r371.

But the article you linked is lovely, so I WWed you anyway.

Thanks R372. Apologies, when I opened this thread the last response was R345, the newer posts weren’t loading. I had to refresh the page to see them.

I was a big fan of Morse (started watching in the 90s). Although I also loved Lewis I was reluctant to watch Endeavour but I ended up loving it as well.

Morse is very much of its time and probably wouldn’t appeal to modern viewers. I can appreciate both and try not to compare. It is difficult to see how Shaun Evans could morph into John Thaw but I prefer not to dwell on that and let each program stand on its own.

I started episode one of Morse right after the finale of Endeavour.

Endeavour ends with Morse singing in a choir, the first episode of Morse also has him in a choir. I think it’s the same piece being sung in both episodes.

R374 I like that episode "The Dead Of Jericho". Quite a clever mystery but I always thought Anne Stavely was an annoying woman, I had no sympathy for her and didn't get what Morse saw in her.

Endeavour was still pulling in pretty decent viewer figures in it's last year. Am I right in thinking Lewis is the show that went on too long? Didn't Kevin semi-retired?

I love how they suddenly have him sn extra 30 IQ points after Morse died. Maybe Morse left them to him along with 1/3 of his bachelor home.

Having Thursday suddenly collapse in the college courtyard was a callback to Inspector Morse doing the same (at the same location I think) but it didn’t really fit in with the rest of the episode except I always thought Thursday would be killed or die in the show. Instead they wrote him off by having him go into hiding.

Yes, yes, r371 and r372---As I noted and LINKED TO with the SAME article in r349!

Your christian martyrdom is duly noted.

Thank you.

The red letters in the Masterpiece credits for the final episode spelled out "BLENHEIM PALACE."