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No country for face masks: Nordics brush off mouth covers

Stockholm (AFP) - As most of the world either orders or recommends the use of face masks, with even US president Donald Trump seen wearing one, Nordic nations are the remaining holdouts.

In supermarkets, on buses, and along the streets of capitals -- such as Stockholm, Copenhagen, Oslo, Helsinki and Reykjavik -- face masks are a rare sight, worn only by a small minority, many of who are tourists.

According to a recent survey by YouGov, only five to 10 percent of respondents in the Nordic countries said they used a mask in public settings, a figure that has remained stable since the start of the crisis in March.

At the same time, the corresponding figures have risen to between 70 and 80 percent for most of the other 20 countries polled, including India and the United States.

"I have the impression that if the government doesn't say clearly 'we advise you to wear a mask', nobody will," 21-year-old French student Camille Fornaroli told AFP, adding she was shocked to see how rare masks were in Stockholm.

- Following recommendations -

Birgitta Wedel, a 63-year-old pensioner, told AFP she would have preferred if Sweden's authorities recommended masks, at least on public transport.

But she added that she would keep going without one unless there was a shift in official policy.

"If they don't... I will not wear it because nobody else does," Wedel said.

Marten Sporrong, a 50-year-old businessman, also said he would follow government recommendations: "If they tell us we don't need masks, we won't wear them".

Sweden has received global attention for its softer approach to curbing the spread of the virus which, coupled with a relatively higher death toll, has led to the region's largest country being shunned by its neighbours.

But when it comes to masks, the Nordic nations look staunchly united.

"Except for Sweden, there are very few cases in those countries," KK Cheng, an epidemiologist at the University of Birmingham's Institute of Applied Health Research told AFP.

"So I don't blame them for not doing it, as long as they have reasonable social distancing and contact tracing is done properly," Cheng added.

Asked Tuesday what might change his mind on recommending the use of face masks, Sweden's chief epidemiologist Anders Tegnell said he was still waiting for "some form of proof that they are effective".

- 'Stubborn' -

For Cheng, such logic is questionable.

"I think it's wrong, it's irresponsible and it's stubborn," the epidemiologist said.

"If he's wrong, it costs life. If I'm wrong, what harm does it do?"

After the World Health Organization (WHO) changed its guidance, Danish health officials began cautiously recommending using masks in early July -- such as when going to the hospital for a test or when you are coming back from a risk area.

"Face covers don't make sense in the current situation, where we have a consistently very low level of infection," Soren Brostrom, director of the Danish Health Authority, told broadcaster DR on Tuesday.

"But could it make sense in the long-term, when we bump into each other on public transport and other situations? That is of course something that we will evaluate," Brostrom added.

Similarly, in Norway and Finland, although there is "no opposition in principle," masks are deemed an unnecessary precaution while the spread is low.

"It may be something that will have to be considered in the near future if the contamination increases," Are Stuwitz Berg, a doctor with the Norwegian Institute of Public Health, told AFP.

Mika Salminen, director of Health Security at the Finnish Institute for Health and Welfare, told broadcaster YLE the issue would likely resurface "when people begin to return from holidays to a greater extent, and of course if the epidemic situation changes radically."

On Thursday however, one Nordic country broke slightly from the mold.

Iceland -- which like its neighbours have so far sworn off masks -- announced that it would start requiring their use on public transport, domestic flights, ferries and in hairdressing salons.

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by Anonymousreply 60November 13, 2020 1:47 PM

I wish I lived there.

Masks fucking suck.

by Anonymousreply 1July 31, 2020 6:37 PM

""Face covers don't make sense in the current situation, where we have a consistently very low level of infection."

Maybe they can weather the storm; if so, good for them.

But, what in the fuck is this statement? They only make sense when infection levels are high? They're supposed to prevent high infection levels, not be a cure once they're already high.

by Anonymousreply 2July 31, 2020 6:39 PM

I read Nordic bush and got excited for a moment.

by Anonymousreply 3July 31, 2020 6:41 PM

Masks are for orientals.

by Anonymousreply 4July 31, 2020 6:43 PM

They'll be in for a rude awakening in the North, especially in Sweden. Winter starts earlier there and they'll be all cramped up inside.

Right now, the Swiss and the Swedish are the people I dislike the most in Europe.

by Anonymousreply 5July 31, 2020 6:48 PM

Swedes are arrogant and unlikeable. K ok they run their country well but so do Holland and Denmark. Get over it.

by Anonymousreply 6July 31, 2020 6:52 PM

[quote]right now, the Swiss and the Swedish are the people I dislike the most in Europe.

R5, warum?

by Anonymousreply 7July 31, 2020 6:53 PM

Why are you people so hostile to the Nordic countries, just because they don't want to fucking wear those stupid masks?

They're no worse off than any other European country with Covid, so why are you idiots making such a big fucking deal about it.

They can do whatever the hell they want to do.

by Anonymousreply 8July 31, 2020 6:55 PM

Don't the Nordic countries also have the highest suicide rates? Just saying.

by Anonymousreply 9July 31, 2020 6:55 PM

"Why are you people so hostile to the Nordic countries?"

The cuisine.

by Anonymousreply 10July 31, 2020 6:57 PM

Great. über-white people not wearing masks. Just what the freedom assholes in the US need for models. Thanks again, Sweden.

by Anonymousreply 11July 31, 2020 6:58 PM

[quote] "Why are you people so hostile to the Nordic countries?"

[quote] The cuisine.

No. That's the BRITISH, dear.

Their food sucks.

by Anonymousreply 12July 31, 2020 6:58 PM

Nordic countries have always been known for being smarter, and more progressive.

They're clearly also more rational than the rest of the world.

by Anonymousreply 13July 31, 2020 7:03 PM

They're not at increased risk of infection. They get enough Vitamin D from fish, they're white and in northern climate, they have a lower percentage of obese junk-food eaters and thus have less adipose tissue with ACE2 receptors for the virus to latch onto. They also don't have huge populations, and don't have the individual-over-society fuck-you-I-got-mine cultural attitude the US has.

Those are five positive attributes. The less a nation is like the US, the better (lower, like confirmed cases per million) COVID-19 position rank it has.

by Anonymousreply 14July 31, 2020 7:04 PM

Only the ugly, non-sexy brown poors in their shitty tower blocks in the outer reaches of Copenhagen, Malmo and Gothenburg are viral.

The rich, pretty blonde Scandis are happily and healthily residing at their summer houses on the islands and shores. Where the wind just blows all that stuff away. They don't need masks.

by Anonymousreply 15July 31, 2020 7:04 PM

You sound really jealous, R15.

by Anonymousreply 16July 31, 2020 7:07 PM

Swiss people - I am probably talking exclusively about the German speaking part - all have sticks rammed up their arses. They are uptight and unpleasant and the 'language' they speak is the most horrible thing you will hear in your life. They are also hostile towards Germans and think small. Very insular and arrogant.

And Swedish people because Bergman movies fucking suck. People who end up in hell are probably forced to watch those dreary Bergman movies Clockwork Orange style.

by Anonymousreply 17July 31, 2020 7:13 PM

They're all so attractive that it would be a shame to hide it. Every time I've returned from Sweden, Noway and Denmark, I've been exhausted by the constant erection I had to maintain whilst there.

by Anonymousreply 18July 31, 2020 7:20 PM

R17 thank you for clarifying. But can you hold an entire nation hostage because of one filmmaker? 😉😉

by Anonymousreply 19July 31, 2020 7:21 PM

[quote] They're all so attractive that it would be a shame to hide it.

That's what makes them so smart.

by Anonymousreply 20July 31, 2020 7:24 PM

R8, we're allowed to criticize people, so fuck off, Freeper

by Anonymousreply 21July 31, 2020 7:28 PM

R21 is just seething with jealousy because Nordic countries are still living a normal life.

by Anonymousreply 22July 31, 2020 7:31 PM

[quote] "Why are you people so hostile to the Nordic countries?"

You must be new here, haven't you noticed the way we treat everyone, including ourselves?

by Anonymousreply 23July 31, 2020 7:38 PM

[quote]Masks fucking suck.

Ventilators are worse, whiner.

And the Swedish herd mentality of 'we don't do things unless the government tells us to' is a little bit creepy, but whatever.

by Anonymousreply 24July 31, 2020 7:43 PM

How can I emigrate to Sweden?

They are clearly smarter people.

I'm tired of DUMP and tired of stupid Americans. Fucking losers.

by Anonymousreply 25July 31, 2020 7:45 PM

R11 sounds like the bigoted version of whiny Vinton on “Mama’s Family.”

by Anonymousreply 26July 31, 2020 8:17 PM

This is true. We don't wear face masks here in Norway. FHI is saying it has almost no effect so there's no point. We have a low infection rate and few deaths so it hasn't been necessary. We have managed fine without.

by Anonymousreply 27July 31, 2020 8:20 PM

if we had the other attributes, then we might be better off.

sounds like they might actually be doing "track/trace/quarantine" and thus don't have to assume that every other person one encounters has it.

if we had managed it earlier with other measures, we might have the "freedom" to go maskless too. but we allowed it to pretty much run loose and spread for a few months, and even now don't seem to be able to do the lower-tech methods that would get it in check.

so now, our "low tech" method is the mask by default.

by Anonymousreply 28July 31, 2020 8:25 PM

I live in Stockholm and basically no one wears a face mask. We're already good at social distancing since it's considered rude to enter someone's personal space. That's about it, it's pretty much business as usual. I don't know anyone who's contracted the virus.

by Anonymousreply 29July 31, 2020 8:32 PM
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by Anonymousreply 30July 31, 2020 8:34 PM

Scandinavia wins.

by Anonymousreply 31July 31, 2020 8:35 PM

I live in Finland and haven’t used mask once. The case rate here is 0.1 when in US it’s around 22. I would say I see a person wearing a mask maybe once or twice a day. Very rare. But this is a country with very few people, less than NYC. I totally understand people in big US cities wear masks.

by Anonymousreply 32July 31, 2020 8:39 PM

r29, just because you don't know anyone with the virus doesn't mean it's not out there. Your infection rates are pretty high compared to other places in Europe

You don't sound bright. I don't know anyone who died in a car crash,but I wouldn't deny that thousands of people die in car crashes every year

by Anonymousreply 33July 31, 2020 8:40 PM

Sweden is betting that strict coronavirus rules like those imposed in virtually every other European country can work only in the short term. Treating citizens as children lacking the judgment to make wise decisions is not a sustainable approach. Addressing a prolonged crisis, or one that comes in repeated waves, will require citizens to be active and responsible participants in their security — not mere recipients of government instructions.

“The long-term sustainability of strict rules isn’t that big,” Anders Tegnell, the epidemiologist in charge of the Swedish coronavirus response, recently told a Danish interviewer. “You can only impose such restrictions for a limited time. So, you need to find a different way, and our model may prove more sustainable.”

He may very well be right. Swedes are demonstrating that collective responsibility is possible: Even though the government has only issued behavioral guidelines and individuals don’t face fines for noncompliance, 93 percent of the population say they are following social distancing recommendations.

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by Anonymousreply 34July 31, 2020 8:40 PM

R32 I need to continue, people have traveled to south of Europe for holidays and it might bring more cases. Our government is ready to tight the regulations if and when it happens. This March schools were closed in a day. One day government told schools will be closed after a day, so teachers had a day to build e-learning and it happened and everything worked fine for two months until schools were opened again. Finns follow regulations and rules very well and that’s why cases haven’t been nearly as high as elsewhere. Naturally one case is too much.

by Anonymousreply 35July 31, 2020 8:45 PM

[quote] Sweden is betting that strict coronavirus rules like those imposed in virtually every other European country can work only in the short term. Treating citizens as children lacking the judgment to make wise decisions is not a sustainable approach. Addressing a prolonged crisis, or one that comes in repeated waves, will require citizens to be active and responsible participants in their security — not mere recipients of government instructions.

THANK YOU, R34!

Judgmental assholes like R33 are so quick to scold and shame, just like most Karens in the US.

They have no clue what PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY means.

And the more you coddle your population by creating a nanny state, the worse they will act.

Scandinavia treats its people like intelligent adults, which is why they are so successful.

by Anonymousreply 36July 31, 2020 8:46 PM

R33 Maybe that was poorly worded on my end, my point was that everyday life hasn't changed much for me or the people around me. There are daily updates about the virus but people are going about their lives as usual.

[quote]Ekström noted that the reproduction number of the epidemic – or R number, which measures the average number of people that one infected person will pass the virus on to – has now fallen in Sweden to around 0.6, meaning transmission is declining. The number of people with antibodies against the new coronavirus, meanwhile, is increasing. Data published by Sweden’s public health agency in June showed that about 10 per cent of people in Stockholm – the nation's worst affected area – had developed antibodies to COVID-19, more than anywhere else in the country.

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by Anonymousreply 37July 31, 2020 8:51 PM

R36, what world are you living in if you think irresponsible people don't exist?

by Anonymousreply 38July 31, 2020 9:01 PM

[quote] They have no clue what PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY means.

It means covering your germy facial orifices with a mask.

And what's up with all the lauding of Sweden, which ranks even higher than the US in number of Covid deaths per 100,00 people.

by Anonymousreply 39July 31, 2020 9:18 PM

[quote]They have no clue what PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY means.

Neither does a significant portion of the American public. If they did, we wouldn't have to mandate masks and social distancing, people would take upon themselves the responsibility to protect other people and themselves.

[quote]the more you coddle your population by creating a nanny state, the worse they will act.

That's how two-year-olds behave -- and two-year-olds can never be relied upon to do the right thing. The soaring infection rates in America prove that.

by Anonymousreply 40July 31, 2020 9:27 PM

I mean, they basically are Confederate Deplorables according to many dumb Americans.

Science deniers!!!

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by Anonymousreply 41July 31, 2020 9:29 PM

The freepers who whine about the nanny state are so funny. These are the same people who wanted to ban gay marriage

by Anonymousreply 42July 31, 2020 9:34 PM

[quote]These are the same people who wanted to ban gay marriage

And tell women what they can and can't do with their bodies.

by Anonymousreply 43July 31, 2020 9:35 PM

In Norway or Denmark, they probably think they're too badass to wear masks. If it's Sweden, they're probably too depressed and secretly longing for death.

by Anonymousreply 44July 31, 2020 10:14 PM

Denmark is now also recommending masks on public transport, but only recommending. The number of daily cases has risen a little recently.

by Anonymousreply 45July 31, 2020 10:22 PM

taking the one single data point to extrapolate is specious in the extreme.

we don't have their society, their safety nets, their level of education. we don't live in the same housing in the same kind of developmental pattern, nor eat the same kinds of foods. we don't engage in their same social or work habits.

most of all, we don't have their health care system.

we probably did not take similar public health measures.

but yeah, we can emulate them on this and it will turn out just fine.

by Anonymousreply 46July 31, 2020 10:35 PM

I hope the fat, kaftan wearing "personal responsibility" queen isn't wearing a mask and never does. It's beyond funny the right wingnutz are now trumpeting Sweden as an example to follow! They don't want MAericans wearing masks--then give us the free health care, the subsidized housing and powerful unions they enjoy in Sweden-assholes! The OP's article shares a front page titled "Denmark registers highest number of new corona virus cases in two months." At the moment Sweden has 568 deaths/million while the US has 473, Denmark 106, Norway 47; Finland 59. Although it's obviously safer in most of these countries not to wear masks, Denmark's infection rate after reopening of the border with Sweden should be interesting to monitor.

by Anonymousreply 47July 31, 2020 10:55 PM

R44 A dangerous game, indeed.

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by Anonymousreply 48August 1, 2020 12:55 AM

[Quote] No. That's the BRITISH, dear. Their food sucks.

The British suck. And very well.

by Anonymousreply 49August 1, 2020 2:12 AM

Not anymore. The second wave started and now the government is encouraging people to wear masks.

by Anonymousreply 50November 13, 2020 11:01 AM

They don't seem to be helping much. They're a con to make people feel more secure.

by Anonymousreply 51November 13, 2020 11:22 AM

R51 That is why my government is saying you still have to wash your hands and keep your distance. Face masks don't do much, it's the combination of it all that makes a difference.

by Anonymousreply 52November 13, 2020 11:29 AM

Nordic men should not be masked, ever.

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by Anonymousreply 53November 13, 2020 12:31 PM

More and more people are using masks here in Finland because numbers are rising. The latest number of those who got covid is 316.

by Anonymousreply 54November 13, 2020 12:34 PM

Immunity to COVID-19 in Sweden is likely lower than previously estimated, the country's top epidemiologist and architect of its unorthodox pandemic strategy said on Thursday, as daily deaths in the disease rose to their highest level in months.

Chief Epidemiologist Anders Tegnell, whose rejection of lockdowns and widespread use of face masks made Sweden a European outlier, also acknowledged the country was battling a second wave of the pandemic after suggesting in August such a scenario was unlikely.

Tegnell played down hopes that Sweden's severe spring outbreak of the virus might offer sizable protection through widespread immunity, saying the number of undetected infections had likely been lower than previously believed.

D'oh!

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by Anonymousreply 55November 13, 2020 12:37 PM

And masks couldn't save California. hahahahahahaha 1 million "confirmed" infections already.

[quote]Don't the Nordic countries also have the highest suicide rates? Just saying.

No, that's bloody Russia where people are being suicided by Putin every day.

by Anonymousreply 56November 13, 2020 12:43 PM

I thought Swedes were smart, guess I was wrong.

by Anonymousreply 57November 13, 2020 12:46 PM

R57 Norwegians can't even travel to Sweden anymore. The border is closed. Many Norwegians, at least those living close to the border, travel to Sweden almost every month since groceries are half the price there.

by Anonymousreply 58November 13, 2020 1:13 PM

Can someone get a ladder and put a mask on Greta?

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by Anonymousreply 59November 13, 2020 1:17 PM

Good luck, Nordics! Take a look at US numbers and trajectory if you want to see how inconstantly used masks turns out!

by Anonymousreply 60November 13, 2020 1:47 PM
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