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These B-list stars surpassed their A-list rivals

It's always fascinating when a B-list star equals, or even surpasses, the fame of their A-list rival as they get older. They accomplish this through hard work and/or landing a prime role later in their careers. Here are some examples:

Barbra Streisand will always remain the superior star because of her legendary early career, but Bette Midler and Cher have surpassed her in success in the last 20 years. Both of them are prolific workhorses while Barbra has become lazy and increasingly neurotic with her work habits. If you don't keep your face in front of the public, they quickly forget about you no matter how big a star you are.

Joan Collins is a bigger star today than Elizabeth Taylor was at the time of her death. Even though Taylor's early career was vastly superior to Collins's C-list early career, that all changed when Joan landed the role of Alexis on Dynasty. She literally became Taylor's equal overnight. Collins's death will probably be a bigger deal than Taylor's was.

Joan Rivers became a bigger star than Johnny Carson. Carson was mostly forgotten when he died, but Joan was still beloved and famous. Her death was a much bigger deal than Carson's.

Bea Arthur and Angela Lansbury did Mame together on Broadway and were lifelong friends. Bea became a huge TV star when she starred in Maude and later on in Golden Girls. However, Lansbury became the bigger and more beloved star when she starred in Murder, She Wrote.

The most shocking example would be Betty White and Mary Tyler Moore. Who would have ever guessed that Betty would become a much bigger star than Mary? Betty is much, much bigger than MTM was at the time of her death. You can also add Valerie Harper into the equation.

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by Anonymousreply 23808/04/2020

This is insane. All of these stars are/were (still) huge. We remember them all.

by Anonymousreply 107/26/2020

While Joan Collins is and always has been fabulous, at no point has her fame even come close to that of Elizabeth Taylor.

I would also argue that Bea and Angela had similar levels of fame with Angela having a slight lead due to her Disney movies.

by Anonymousreply 207/26/2020

Johnny Carson had the number one nightly show in America for over 30 years. To compare his fame to Joan Rivers is insane. He was a private person. Joan owed everything to him, as she has stated in interviews.

by Anonymousreply 307/26/2020

Carson went out on top. Rivers became a laughingstock. She never became a bigger star and she was never beloved. Perhaps in her earlier Carson days she was a loved comedian, but her later days showed her to be a bitter, hateful woman. Not beloved.

by Anonymousreply 407/26/2020

Why do these stars have to "compete" with one another as to who is most remembered, most famous, most successful, etc.? You are so inane, OP.

by Anonymousreply 507/26/2020

Your hypothesis is deeply flawed, OP. But thanks for playing.

by Anonymousreply 607/26/2020

OP, what the hell are you talking about? ...one too many mimosas with brunch.

by Anonymousreply 707/26/2020

Kardasian/Hilton

by Anonymousreply 807/26/2020

[quote]Barbra Streisand will always remain the superior star because of her legendary early career, but Bette Midler and Cher have surpassed her in success in the last 20 years

That is because Streisand essentially dropped out after "Lentil." Sure she did lots of work but nothing high profile and since that was her apex, the thing she wanted to do most, she decided to pull back.

by Anonymousreply 907/26/2020

Carson is not known to any young people under 35, Rivers still is. Over all Johnny dropped out of sight and that is why he is unknown.

Just like Jo Stafford who was the biggest female singer of the first half of the 20th century and the biggest female singer up to 1955. Who knew Jo Stafford when she died in the 2010s? Almost no one, because she just faded away.

by Anonymousreply 1007/26/2020

Iron Man and The Incredible Hulk.

by Anonymousreply 1107/26/2020

No-one under 40 will have even seen an Elizabeth Taylor film but they’ll know who Joan Collins is.

by Anonymousreply 1207/26/2020

No one under 40 knows Joan Collins either. Dynasty was the 80s.

by Anonymousreply 1307/26/2020

Famous right now OP or in general? Famous for millennials? Your thread description is a mess.

by Anonymousreply 1407/26/2020

R12 Oh please, plenty of people under 40 know who Elizabeth Taylor. And they've probably seen at least ONE of her films: The Flintstones film.

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by Anonymousreply 1507/26/2020

"Joan Collins is a bigger star today than Elizabeth Taylor was at the time of her death. Even though Taylor's early career was vastly superior to Collins's C-list early career, that all changed when Joan landed the role of Alexis on Dynasty. She literally became Taylor's equal overnight. Collins's death will probably be a bigger deal than Taylor's was."

Bitch, you done lost yo mind.

by Anonymousreply 1607/26/2020

Barbra Streisand doesn’t have to prove shit to anyone.

by Anonymousreply 1707/26/2020

R13 I’m under 40 and watched Dynasty in the 80s. The only memory I have of Elizabeth Taylor was that she was grossly overweight and hung out with Michael Jackson.

by Anonymousreply 1807/26/2020

OP is confusing fame with familiarity. Television stars and performers of any kind who appeared on television a lot in the late 20th century became more familiar to the public because everyone watched the same few networks in those days. But that are not more famous. Anyone who thinks Joan Collins is or ever was more famous than Elizabeth Taylor has a pretty skewed view of fame.

I can't imagine what the person who thinks Jo Stafford was "the biggest female singer of the 20th century" is smoking. Jo was great, but she was one of many popular female singers of the era.

by Anonymousreply 1907/26/2020

R17 is Jason Gould looking for a raise in his allowance.

by Anonymousreply 2007/26/2020

OP, neither Bette nor Cher have surpassed Streisand in the last 20 years. The 3 films Streisand made all made a bundle (even if not so good) the Focker movies made her a small fortune- her CDs have charted #1 and her arena concerts sell outs, indeed setting individual arena records. Dunno what rock you’re under.

by Anonymousreply 2107/26/2020

Taylor's association with Jackson in the 80s was bigger than Collins Dynasty.

by Anonymousreply 2207/26/2020

Call me when Joan Collins has an equivalent iconic photo!

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by Anonymousreply 2307/26/2020

Two old down low gays and their hags. They should've done a Golden Girls type sitcom together.

by Anonymousreply 2407/26/2020

Who would have thought Kelsey Grammer and Woody Harrelson would be the two biggest names to come out of Cheers and have bigger and more lucrative careers than Shelley Long, Ted Danson and Kirstie Alley.

And I know Ted Danson still works a lot (and in some very good stuff) but he never had a Frasier. And more people know who Woody Harrelson is.

by Anonymousreply 2507/26/2020

[quote]While Joan Collins is and always has been fabulous, at no point has her fame even come close to that of Elizabeth Taylor.

You're totally wrong. If you asked 100 people on the street, more of them would know Joan Collins and Dynasty than Liz Taylor. I can guarantee you that. Taylor was only famous for her perfumes the last 30 years of her life. Joan was also prettier.

No one under 40 even knows who Johnny Carson is today, but most people still know Joan Rivers because of QVC and her red carpet appearances. She single-handedly made the Oscars and other awards shows must-watch TV for the current generations.

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by Anonymousreply 2607/26/2020

[quote]Barbra Streisand will always remain the superior star because of her legendary early career, but Bette Midler

Hmm. Disagree.

[quote]Joan Collins is a bigger star today than Elizabeth Taylor was at the time of her death. Even though Taylor's early career was vastly superior to Collins's C-list early career, that all changed when Joan landed the role of Alexis on Dynasty. She literally became Taylor's equal overnight. Collins's death will probably be a bigger deal than Taylor's was.

Yes, this is true.

by Anonymousreply 2707/26/2020

R26 oh and I agree totally about Joan Rivers but honestly I don’t think young people know who Joan Collins or Eliz Taylor are.

But freaking 10 year olds know who Betty White is, so that one is definitely true.

by Anonymousreply 2807/26/2020

Johnny Galecki showed his castmates from Roseanne a thing or two, didn't he?

by Anonymousreply 2907/26/2020

Elizabeth Taylor and AIDS go together like milk and cereal. People are still aware of her. Joan Collins more famous than Elizabeth Taylor? OP, you're just silly.

by Anonymousreply 3007/26/2020

I rarely hear of AIDS these days, let alone Taylor's charitable contributions to it.

by Anonymousreply 3107/26/2020

Kathy Griffin passed Joan Rivers near the end of her life. And Joan was livid about it.

by Anonymousreply 3207/26/2020

People will always remember who Liz Taylor is due to Lindsay Lohan's iconic portrayal of her in Liz & Dick.

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by Anonymousreply 3307/26/2020

too much math in this thread

by Anonymousreply 3407/26/2020

Joan Rivers is already forgotten. Her red carpet hosting were memorable only because she continually messed everything up and she became a joke. The idea that she's remembered is funnier than anything she said in the last ten years of her career..

by Anonymousreply 3507/26/2020

It's an interesting premise, but one predicated primarily on life span, going by many of the examples.

If not "outlived," I might say that the surpassers more "worked steadily."

by Anonymousreply 3607/26/2020

Taylor’s legitimate career was over by the end of the ‘60s. She didn’t work much from the eighties on.

How big a star she is to you might depend on when you were born.

by Anonymousreply 3707/26/2020

life is not a competition. there are no rankings. Lists of "top ten" anything are bullshit created for clicks or views. Stop trying to judge who was bigger, more important, famous, or successful. If you're having the debate or thinking of including them on a list, they've already succeeded 1000x more than most.

by Anonymousreply 3807/26/2020

This is a very stupid thread. It seems OP's point is that some people outlived others? Something like that.

by Anonymousreply 3907/26/2020

Who would have thought that Patti LaBelle would become more famous and beloved by the public than her rivals Diana Ross and Dionne Warwick? Young people today don't even know who Dionne and Diana are anymore, but everybody knows and loves Patti. I think Patti even has more money than both of them.

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by Anonymousreply 4007/26/2020

R40, everybody knows Patti’s macaroni and cheese.

by Anonymousreply 4107/26/2020

R40 is that Gladys on the left? It's not Diana.

Anyway I love Patti but comparing her to Diana or Dionne is dumb.

by Anonymousreply 4207/26/2020

OP is clearly an idiot.

by Anonymousreply 4307/26/2020

Young people do NOT know or care about Patti.

by Anonymousreply 4407/26/2020

Diana Ross is a good one. I doubt most people in their 20s would know who she is.

by Anonymousreply 4507/26/2020

Some stars peak in their twenties then go on to live for another six decades.

Some peak in their forties and live another two.

That context matters when it comes to how big they are at the time of their deaths.

by Anonymousreply 4607/26/2020

Patti LuPone overtook Bernie Peters in the last decade.

by Anonymousreply 4707/26/2020

Olivia and Joan were of roughly equal stature on DL a decade ago, but Olivia became a meme since then and so her death seems like a bigger deal now that Joan’s did.

by Anonymousreply 4807/26/2020

Most people under 30 have no idea who any of the people we are talking about might be.

by Anonymousreply 4907/26/2020

Streisand is unlikely to ever do anything of note again. Bitch is almost 80

by Anonymousreply 5007/26/2020

Do people under thirty even know who Paris Hilton is? Or do they only know Kim?

by Anonymousreply 5107/26/2020

I can't remember the last relevant thing Britney, Christina, or Jessica Simpson have done, whereas Mandy Moore is now a recent Emmy and Golden Globe nominee and has 2 Screen Actor's Guild Awards.

by Anonymousreply 5207/26/2020

Sandy bullock leap frogged over Julia Roberts in the late naughts

by Anonymousreply 5307/26/2020

B*tch, Bette Midler is A-list!

by Anonymousreply 5407/26/2020

R28, how are you defining “young people”? 12-year-olds probably don’t know who Elizabeth Taylor was, but I’m sure there are quite a few 25-year-olds who have at least heard the name and know she was a movie star. I don’t think you can generalize that the vast majority of people in their 20s know nothing of 20th century popular culture.

by Anonymousreply 5507/26/2020

[quote] Who would have ever guessed that Betty would become a much bigger star than Mary? Betty is much, much bigger than MTM was at the time of her death.

At the time of her death, yes. But Betty White has NEVER been as big as MTM was in the 70s. Very few people have been.

by Anonymousreply 5607/26/2020

George Clooney and Roseanne.

by Anonymousreply 5707/26/2020

Betty White is much more well-known today than MTM.

by Anonymousreply 5807/26/2020

"I’m under 40 and watched Dynasty in the 80s"

You watched Dynasty when you were 6?!

by Anonymousreply 5907/26/2020

Buck never would have known who Betty White is.

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by Anonymousreply 6007/26/2020

I had to look up r60's quote, which I've seen a lot of DL. You'd have to be in your 50s to get it.

by Anonymousreply 6107/26/2020

Buck would have never married DL icon Deb Winger.

by Anonymousreply 6207/26/2020

Buck would have never married DL icon Deb Winger.

by Anonymousreply 6307/26/2020

Mary Tyler Moore is in a league of her own starring in two of the most popular and critically successful television shows of all time: The Dick van Dyke Show and The Mary Tyler Moore Show.

Just because Mary has died and Betty White is still alive (and I love Betty), but it doesn’t mean that Betty has surpassed Mary in stature. And just because a 20-year old may know of Betty but doesn’t really know Mary today doesn’t mean Betty’s star is larger. It just means that Betty is still alive. But trust me, as soon as Betty dies, her star power will fade quickly. It won’t mean she wasn’t a star; it just means she’s not in the public eye any longer and people will slowly forget unless you were a fan of Betty’s two biggest shows in which she starred, The Mary Tyler Moore Show and Golden Girls.

Personally, when I think of Betty White, I think of her character of Sue Ann Nivens on The Mary Tyler Moore Show because I loved that show, and I was not really much of a fan of Golden Girls. As a result in my mind, Mary was and always will be the bigger star. It was Mary’s show, she was the central character, and everything revolved around her. I love Betty White; she was hilarious, but she was always a supporting character on MTM. I never even think of the Golden Girls where Betty’s character was just dumb and unappealing to me. For me, Betty lessened her star power with that dumb Rose character on GG. Mary Tyler Moore will forever remain the bigger star.

by Anonymousreply 6407/26/2020

The concept of this thread doesn't make sense to me. Are we to argue that Mamie Van Doren surpassed Marilyn Monroe because she's still alive?

by Anonymousreply 6507/26/2020

This thread weakly but loosely is like “So and so is the poor man’s _______ fill in the blank.” But yet it isn’t really the same thing.

by Anonymousreply 6607/26/2020

The Golden Girls is one of the most popular tv shows of all time, it's still on tv daily and teenagers watch it. It's a big part of pop culture. It's far more popular than the MTM show, which most people under 50 have never seen.

by Anonymousreply 6707/26/2020

Nobody under 3 knows who Olivia de Havilland was, so what's fame? What's A-list? What's B? All in the mind.

by Anonymousreply 6807/26/2020

Just because someone young knows who a particular star is, doesn’t mean that star is bigger than someone else.

Elizabeth Taylor was an enormous star. Joan Collins is an enormous star. It’s just one hit it big very early on, and the other hit it big a bit later. If you were movie buff, then you will surely know Elizabeth. If you came of age and were a fan of nighttime TV serial stories of the 1980s, the you are probably a fan of Joan. The bottom line is that Elizabeth is probably the bigger star, but there’s not really a competition between she and Joan. They have similarities, but they’re also different. And one outlived the other, but what does that prove?

by Anonymousreply 6907/26/2020

R67. The Mary Tyler Moore Show was huge...just as big if not bigger than the Golden Girls. In the ‘80s, MTM used to be on in reruns and played back-to-back episodes every night 6:30-7:30pm for the longest time. Mary was part of pop culture as was the entire cast and all the spinoff shows that happened as a result of MTM.

Then the Golden Girls came along, another very popular show, not my favorite, but very popular nonetheless. Then television expanded and there were more networks that started airing reruns. So GG reruns aired frequently. Just because the two shows came along in different eras doesn’t mean one had more of an impact. Someone under 40 watches what’s available for the time in which they were consuming television. Is one a bigger hit? Perhaps. Did one have a bigger cultural impact? Yes. So you often view the show based on when you grew up or cane of age. In another five years , the GG will too be passé and people under 40 won’t know them either. But you’ll still be defending GG because It means something to you, which is fine. But it won’t mean much to tomorrow’s 30 year old.

by Anonymousreply 7007/26/2020

There is no world in which Cher or Bette Midler are B-list stars.

Actually, Barbra, Bette and Cher all started off within a few years of each other. Barbra had a bit of a head start since she is slightly older than Bette and Cher. They were almost all stars from the very beginning of their careers. They had a few off years now and then, but they all remained pretty big even if one works less than another now. Each had their impact, and you can say who you think is the bigger star, but I never compared them to each other particularly since each one is so different than the other.

Liza is another one. In her heyday, no one surpassed Liza on stage. She was an electrifying performer for many, many years. Now she doesn’t work on stage, but her star power and talent were enormous even if a 30-year old doesn’t know her these days. Is Lady Gaga bigger than Liza? No. She’s just more current with a younger generation, and even Gaga’s star is fading.

by Anonymousreply 7107/26/2020

R61, or have seen a movie that was made before your movie-watching life began. From some of these posts, you'd think no one ever watched an old (to them) movie or television show. Do you also have to look up "frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn" or "my father made him an offer he couldn't refuse"?

by Anonymousreply 7207/27/2020

r71, good post. But Gaga is currently one of the biggest female stars in the world. Her star was fading, but it’s back in full shine.

by Anonymousreply 7307/27/2020

[quote] Each had their impact, and you can say who you think is the bigger star, but I never compared them to each other particularly since each one is so different than the other.

Barbra and Cher are different.

But Barbra and Bette aren’t. Bette always modelled her career on Barbra’s. They followed similar trajectories, But Bette’s never reached the same heights.

by Anonymousreply 7407/27/2020

The MTM show is really in the dustbin of history now. Golden Girls is probably even more popular than it was 30 years ago. Hell, when was the last time you saw Buzzfeed stories about MTM?

by Anonymousreply 7507/27/2020

R75 Well, if Buzzfeed wrote about it, it must be famous!

OP, this was a stupid, stupid thread. You are comparing actors who are sort of connected and then claiming one’s star grew at the expense of another one.

And like many have stated, you are confusing current visibility with fame and impact. Fame is fleeting; not everyone is the same level of important their whole career or after death. That does not mean they at one time were not huge and just because someone is no longer in the public eye does not mean they are washed up.

More Zoomers now can identify Belle Elish and Black Pink than they can Arethra Franklin. Does that mean they are more impactful? More famous?

Joan Collins has camp value. She was never anywhere Liz Taylor. Liz Taylor will go down in history. Joan Collins as a foot note.

by Anonymousreply 7607/27/2020

R75 Well, if Buzzfeed wrote about it, it must be famous!

OP, this was a stupid, stupid thread. You are comparing actors who are sort of connected and then claiming one’s star grew at the expense of another one.

And like many have stated, you are confusing current visibility with fame and impact. Fame is fleeting; not everyone is the same level of important their whole career or after death. That does not mean they at one time were not huge and just because someone is no longer in the public eye does not mean they are washed up.

More Zoomers now can identify Belle Elish and Black Pink than they can Arethra Franklin. Does that mean they are more impactful? More famous?

Joan Collins has camp value. She was never anywhere Liz Taylor. Liz Taylor will go down in history. Joan Collins as a foot note.

by Anonymousreply 7707/27/2020

R75, MTM wasn't even really a hit in its first syndication run. It never had the sort of syndication power of GG or ILL. But that's true of most of those 70s sitcoms like AITF and Maude. There is a certain venerable quality about the series but I believe it's more manufactured by writers who were influenced by it and do stories about it rather than plain old TV watchers.

by Anonymousreply 7807/27/2020

[quote]Well, if Buzzfeed wrote about it, it must be famous!

What a very popular publishes is totally relevant.

[quote]Joan Collins has camp value. She was never anywhere Liz Taylor. Liz Taylor will go down in history. Joan Collins as a foot note.

Anyone who knows who is one is these days will know who the other is. And Taylor could be just as camp as Collins.

by Anonymousreply 7907/27/2020

[quote][R75], MTM wasn't even really a hit in its first syndication run. It never had the sort of syndication power of GG or ILL. But that's true of most of those 70s sitcoms like AITF and Maude. There is a certain venerable quality about the series but I believe it's more manufactured by writers who were influenced by it and do stories about it rather than plain old TV watchers.

A lot of '70s sitcoms seem very of their era. That's when sitcoms were at their most 'topical' and politically interested. That's also partly why something like DESIGNING WOMEN hasn't translated to today like the THE GOLDEN GIRLS.

by Anonymousreply 8007/27/2020

Designing Women and Murphy Brown were both too topical to translate to modern audiences. Hell, I was around back then and I've caught a few reruns of both in the last few years and even I couldn't remember some of the references.

by Anonymousreply 8107/27/2020

R50 She had sold out tour last year, including more than 65,000 tickets sold for Hyde Park event

by Anonymousreply 8207/27/2020

Old Boomers are Streisand's audience. She's never been a big deal to younger generations.

by Anonymousreply 8307/27/2020

R83 You should have seen how many young people there were in Hyde Park. Yes, it was a special concert and many wanted to see her one more time or just once. Young people might not listen to her music but many know her name and wanted to pay a lot to see her. She is a legend.

by Anonymousreply 8407/27/2020

It's obvious that Streisand can't get that many younger people because she hasn't had a mainstream hit in decades. She made specific attempts to do that during the 70s, 80s and even 90s. A woman of her age can't do a song like Arianna Grande or Halsey and her style of singing wouldn't translate. A great star who will endure but she's damn old.

by Anonymousreply 8507/27/2020

Barbra's always been a little less interested in being relevant than Cher; and is more secure in her stature than Midler.

It helps that she's much richer than both.

by Anonymousreply 8607/27/2020

Oh. I quoted the wrong part of OP's post earlier and made the opposite of the point I wanted to make.

Grr.

Anyway: Barbra > Bette

by Anonymousreply 8707/27/2020

R86, not necessarily. She's tried rock (Butterfly and ASIB) and disco (Main Event No More Tears) and when she went to the Gibbs, she got her last real mainstream pop success. She's a smart businesswoman and understood to try what was successful at the time. I can't think of the last time a 70 yo woman had a big hit on the charts.

by Anonymousreply 8807/27/2020

It's crazy how both Bea Arthur and Angela Lansbury didn't become stars until later in life. I think Bea was in her 40s when she got Maude, and Angela was unknown until Murder, She Wrote.

I can't decide whether Bea or Angela is the bigger star today?

by Anonymousreply 8907/27/2020

Lucille Ball surpassed a lot of the actresses she was competing for roles with as a 40s starlet

by Anonymousreply 9007/27/2020

Yes, R88, but she had mostly abandoned trying to be current by the mid-eighties.

That's when she was doing Yentl and The Broadway Album.

All of Cher's work from the same time on has been done with more an eye of what's relevant.

by Anonymousreply 9107/27/2020

Tina Turner was not a big deal when she was younger and never made much money. Then in her 40s she became far bigger than her peers, like Diana Ross, Aretha, Dionne, Gladys, etc.

Tina was always a hard-worker through the years(because she had to be) and it eventually paid off.

by Anonymousreply 9207/27/2020

Well, TCM is on 7/28 " showing "Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf."

So there goes that argument, OP.

by Anonymousreply 9307/27/2020

Yes, TCM.

So there goes your 'argument', R93.

by Anonymousreply 9407/27/2020

In my opinion, the original cast of Designing Women was far and away a better, more entertaining, well-written and acted show than Golden Girls. I loved Designing Women. Golden Girls never had the impact with me. It was a good show with a talented cast, but Designing Women was far superior. Designing Women was must-see TV; Golden Girls was hit or miss. If I watched, it was fine, but if I missed it, I never gave it another thought.

I know I’m going to get dragged for this post, but Golden Girls just doesn’t have a prominent place in my head or heart the way Designing Women does and lasts to this day.

by Anonymousreply 9507/27/2020

^^and yes, I’m a gay male.

by Anonymousreply 9607/27/2020

The biggest difference between Elizabeth Taylor and Joan Collins is that Taylor was immensely wealthy.

Most of Joan Collins assets are tied up in property so she has to keep doing theatre tours and selling QVC shite at 87 to keep the wolf from the door.

by Anonymousreply 9707/27/2020

Yes, Taylor was lucky to have things her marriage to Richard Todd and Cleopatra (for which she actually made closer to seven million dollars than her official one million dollar salary -- all in real terms).

Joan was only making forty thousand dollars an episode when Dynasty was at its peak. TV actors were much more lowly paid back then. I don't blame her for going on strike the following year for a raise.

by Anonymousreply 9807/27/2020

Joan was the highest paid actress on television in the '80s. Once Dynasty went off air I believe Angela Lansbury overtook her, and she held that position until MSW was cancelled.

by Anonymousreply 9907/27/2020

Angela was more famous before Mame but maybe Bea was more famous die to "Maude".

by Anonymousreply 10007/27/2020

By the time Mame was being filmed Broadway has ceased to be relevant to the average American in the way television was.

That's why it was so stupid of Angie to bemoan how it was made with Lucille Ball.

It could never have been made with anyone other than Lucille Ball.

by Anonymousreply 10107/27/2020

Scientologist Elisabeth Moss that passed the entire Mad Men cast.

by Anonymousreply 10207/27/2020

Chrissy Metz has overtaken Christina Hendricks.

by Anonymousreply 10307/27/2020

R101 fuck off, any number of stars could have made "Mame" work much better than that croaking frog Lucy.

And on no planet is Joan Collins anywhere approaching Liz Taylor's fame and legacy. Collins' last role of note was a cameo in a Miss Marple episode.

by Anonymousreply 10407/27/2020

Barbra Streisand was considered grandma music 30 years ago. Gen X gays have never been into her, except for Jewish guys in the NYC metro area. We were all about Madonna. Nobody else even came close to her popularity with Gen X gays.

by Anonymousreply 10507/27/2020

The point was, R104, that none of them could have gotten a film greenlit.

And Joan Collins still stays busy in the public eye, which Taylor had mostly stopped doing for the two decades before her death.

by Anonymousreply 10607/27/2020

R106 I'm sure lots of other actresses could have got it greenlit and Ball only got the part because she snapped up the musucal's rights.

by Anonymousreply 10707/27/2020

[quote]I'm sure lots of other actresses could have got it greenlit

Really? Which ones?

by Anonymousreply 10807/27/2020

None of this is true or even makes sense. It's like saying Jerry Van Dyke was on the Judy Garland Show, but her show flopped, while he ended up on Coach and got 4 Emmy nominations. Because who remembers her now?

by Anonymousreply 10907/27/2020

Don't forget that I am big. It's the pictures that have gotten small.

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by Anonymousreply 11007/27/2020

The Judy Garland Show might've only had one season, but Judy's place is modern pop culture is from TWOO not her show.

So, no, R109.

by Anonymousreply 11107/27/2020

R109. Who remembers Judy Garland? Is that what you’re foolishly asking?

Answer: The entire fucking world!

by Anonymousreply 11207/27/2020

Has Markle (truly D-list) surpassed Middleton?

by Anonymousreply 11307/27/2020

R111, R112 I guess my meaning, and sarcasm, which I thought was clear, was not clear. I was making an analogy to say this thread is ridiculous. As in, saying Joan Collins surpassed Elizabeth Taylor is as silly as it would be to say Jerry Van Dyke surpassed Judy Garland.

by Anonymousreply 11407/27/2020

[quote]As in, saying Joan Collins surpassed Elizabeth Taylor is as silly as it would be to say Jerry Van Dyke surpassed Judy Garland.

No, that's not comparable.

by Anonymousreply 11507/27/2020

R115 Who gives a shit? I wasn't saying no one remembers Judy Garland, that was the point.

by Anonymousreply 11607/27/2020

You absolutely could make an argument that Collins surpassed Taylor. You could never say that about Jerry Van Dyke and Judy.

Your comparison is lousy.

by Anonymousreply 11707/27/2020

[quote]That's why it was so stupid of Angie to bemoan how it was made with Lucille Ball.

Bedknobs & Broomsticks was a big flop, so there's no way they would have given Mame to Lansbury.

by Anonymousreply 11807/27/2020

I doubt very much that the Joan Collins collection would realize the fortune that the Elizabeth Taylor auction did for Christie's and her children after she died. Even a 14-carat gold safety pin fetched over $5k. Not because it was gold. But because it once belonged to Elizabeth Taylor.

by Anonymousreply 11907/27/2020

Joan Collins jewels are largely paste, the most solvent husband she ever had was Anthony Newley (and he wasn't rich), they divorced 50 years ago.

by Anonymousreply 12007/27/2020

[quote] Not because it was gold. But because it once belonged to Elizabeth Taylor.

Hmm. I’m skeptical.

by Anonymousreply 12107/27/2020

Warren Beatty was very wealthy. Much more so than Anthony Newley.

by Anonymousreply 12207/27/2020

MTM is one of the great shows but it never did all that well in reruns and their DVD sales were terrible. Very few shows live on generation after generation after generation and very few shows from before say 20 years ago have retained that kind of staying power with all age groups. And it’s not necessarily a reflection of how good a show is. ILL (which I could never stand) , The Golden Girls, and Three’s Company live on forever and ever. Friends will be like that too.

by Anonymousreply 12307/27/2020

R122 Joan never married him though and aborted their child, with his consent.

by Anonymousreply 12407/27/2020

OP; you are in backwards land.

by Anonymousreply 12507/27/2020

R123, MTM show was perhaps too cerebral for most audiences?

Most people don't want to think too much when they watch a sitcom. They want a warmth and familiarity with some laughs thrown in. I wouldn't describe the MTM show as warm.

by Anonymousreply 12607/27/2020

MTM would be classed as a Comedy/Drama now as we all live in an 'Idiocracy'.

by Anonymousreply 12707/27/2020

R126, MTM was very warm. It’s the ones since that were cold, such as Seinfeld and 30 Rock.

by Anonymousreply 12807/27/2020

[quote]MTM is one of the great shows but it never did all that well in reruns and their DVD sales were terrible.

I don't know what you watched, but MTM was on in reruns for years, back-to-back two episodes every night 6:30-7:30pm. MTM was my all-time favorite, but it depicted the '70s, and I think after a while, people just move on. One of the few sitcoms that was older but one that has lasted is I Love Lucy, but nothing else that old is still around with any mass popularity. The shows from the '80s and '90s still seem relevant, but even those will fade in another five years or so.

There are plenty of MTM full shows on YouTube. Every once in a while i get hooked watching an episode, and then a couple of hours later, I'm still sitting here watching good ol' Mary and the gang again and again. The writing and acting is still great.

by Anonymousreply 12907/27/2020

Keep in mind that when many reruns of 70s and 80s shows, there wasn't the proliferation of networks that we have now. I think MTM reruns aired on local channels, and they were very popular. However, unless you were a diehard fan, most people had seen them--and they were from another era. Then years later, Nick at Night, TV Land started popping up. Shows like MTM were brought back in reruns, but by then, more current shows in reruns from the 80s and 90s took their place, and the 70s shows largely faded. I would watch MTM forever, but I'm a unique diehard fan.

by Anonymousreply 13007/27/2020

I Love Lucy's enduring popularity is pretty amazing. As the other poster said, no other show from that era is really known today, except perhaps the Honeymooners. But the Honeymooners has never been as popular. I Love Lucy was something special.

How many people today even know who Jack Benny, Sid Ceasar or even Milton Berle were?

by Anonymousreply 13107/27/2020

Bewitched reruns always get way more viewers than any of the 'Lucy' shows here in the UK.

Though so do 'Happy Days' and 'I Dream of Jeanie'. Laverne and Shirley is also a bit cult hit here (with people of a certain age).

by Anonymousreply 13207/27/2020

^^big not 'bit'^^

by Anonymousreply 13307/27/2020

r132, what other US shows are big over there?

by Anonymousreply 13407/27/2020

R134 Apart from Friends and Frasier almost nothing beyond the early 90's on terrestrial TV. The Golden Girls has just had a repeat run though. Everyone loves 'The Beverly Hillbillies'. A lot of US shows like 'Everybody Loves Raymond' are used as early morning filler.

We also pretty much hate all of the remakes of classic British shows like 'Sanford and Son (Steptoe and Son), Three's Company (Man about The House) and 'All in The Family' (Till'Death Do Us Part).

I personally quite like US procedural drama like CSI, Law and Order type shows.

On Cable/Satellite it's just the usual Game of Thrones etc, which was essentially a British production.

by Anonymousreply 13507/27/2020

[quote]How many people today even know who Jack Benny, Sid Ceasar or even Milton Berle were?

KInd of a shame, because when I was in high school some of us used to watch Jack Benny reruns and a lot of them were hilarious. The radio shows were super funny as well.

[quote]MTM show was perhaps too cerebral for most audiences? Most people don't want to think too much when they watch a sitcom.

Um, what? Cerebral? Were we such intellectuals in the 70s when this show was a huge hit?

by Anonymousreply 13607/27/2020

[quote] MTM show was perhaps too cerebral for most audiences?

Nah. I wouldn't say that about MTM. I'd say Lou Grant was ahead of its time and probably too cerebral even for TV viewers in the 70s.

by Anonymousreply 13707/27/2020

Gayle King and Oprah

by Anonymousreply 13807/27/2020

Gayle did not surpass Oprah

by Anonymousreply 13907/27/2020

John Lewis and Martin Luther king

by Anonymousreply 14007/27/2020

I think that Jessica Simpson and Britney Spears kind of fall into this dynamic. Though Britney is more beloved and iconic, her life is also more tragic with her guardianships and #FreeBritney and nonstop work schedule and whatnot. Meanwhile Jessica has made pretty much the same money by selling clothes in Kmart or wherever plus she got to have plenty of kids and get fat and enjoy her life.

Britney will be remembered for longer but I think Jessica will have the better life.

by Anonymousreply 14107/27/2020

R40, Classic. Ppl like you make DL great.

by Anonymousreply 14207/27/2020

R141_ That's not what the OP said at all. Stick to the fkin post you cunt.

by Anonymousreply 14307/27/2020

This thread is dying and deserves a quick death! Kill it already!

by Anonymousreply 14407/27/2020

R8 had the only true example listed in this thread: Kim Kardashian and Paris Hilton

by Anonymousreply 14507/27/2020

[quote]Friends will be like that too.

No, it won't. It's already headed into "what were we thinking" territory.

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by Anonymousreply 14607/27/2020

[quote] MTM is one of the great shows but it never did all that well in reruns and their DVD sales were terrible.

Don't blame me, I bought them. It's not my fault if you can lead a horse to water, or in this case ambrosia, but can't make him drink it.

by Anonymousreply 14707/27/2020

What's weird is that ILL has a lot of references younger kids won't get and the Hollywood episodes are loaded with "celebrities" that are forgotten. Yet, it remains an evergreen comedy.

by Anonymousreply 14807/27/2020

This thread is all over the place because it depends on what you mean by surpass. Popularity? Material wealth? Volume of work? Personal happiness and stability?

by Anonymousreply 14907/27/2020

[quote] What's weird is that ILL has a lot of references younger kids won't get and the Hollywood episodes are loaded with "celebrities" that are forgotten. Yet, it remains an evergreen comedy.

I have a lot of old shows in my collection, and that's one of the ones that gets the most and best responses from all generations, races, sexualities. I'm sure most of them couldn't tell you what show came on after it originally.

by Anonymousreply 15007/27/2020

R148. I Love Lucy works because basically it's about love, family, friends...things and situations to which everyone can relate. If a show gets too "inside or about current events," then it gets dated easily.

by Anonymousreply 15107/27/2020

[quote] You're totally wrong. If you asked 100 people on the street, more of them would know Joan Collins and Dynasty than Liz Taylor. I can guarantee you that.

Are you ok, dearheart? Can we call someone for you?

by Anonymousreply 15207/27/2020

There were a few years after Rhoda premiered when Valerie Harper was bigger than Mary Tyler Moore. It didn't last, but it was a real thing for awhile.

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by Anonymousreply 15307/27/2020

It's easier than ever to look up references you don't get with a quick internet search. Even some of the jokes on [italic]I Love Lucy[/italic] were references to then-current things like [italic]South Pacific[/italic] when it was on Broadway before it was a movie, and even to things that were already dated but still recognizable, such as the silent Ramon Novarro version of [italic]Ben-Hur[/italic].

by Anonymousreply 15407/27/2020

[quote] There were a few years after Rhoda premiered when Valerie Harper was bigger than Mary Tyler Moore. It didn't last, but it was a real thing for awhile.

There hadn't really been a Jewish family on TV since [italic]The Goldbergs[/italic].

by Anonymousreply 15507/27/2020

1995 Marcia and Jan Brady > more well-known than the original '70s Marcia and Jan.

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by Anonymousreply 15607/27/2020

Google:

“Elizabeth Taylor” gets 24,800,000 results.

“Joan Collins” gets 3,710,000 results.

But yes Joan Collins is MUCH MORE FAMOUS!

by Anonymousreply 15707/27/2020

Younger audiences don't know who William Holden or Van Johnson were but know their appearances on ILL. The fact that an appearance on a TV sitcom is a greater legacy for some is a real testament to the show.

We're coming up on Lucy's birthday and last year, theaters showed several of the colorized versions of the show. The one I went to in Marina Del Rey was sold out and there were people from kids to seniors there and all had a great time. Too bad something like that can't be done this year.

by Anonymousreply 15807/27/2020

More google:

Johnny Carson” 11,600,000 results.

“Joan Rivers” 7,930,000 results.

That despite Johnny retiring decades ago, and Joan continuing to work until her death a few years ago.

by Anonymousreply 15907/27/2020

R146 yeah not true, and one dumb article doesn’t prove it either. Your opinion and DL’s opinion (we love to shit on Friends here) has nothing to do with it.

There are just a few shows that happen to take off with each succeeding generation. There’s probably some kind of “comfort television “ factor involved and it’s usually pretty easy to predict going into the first cycle of reruns. GG despite being about 4 old broads — some of its biggest fans were always young kids. It’s not in the least surprising that it would become as ubiquitous as it has become. Friends (like it or not) is heading on that same path.

by Anonymousreply 16007/27/2020

Pretty much the entire cast of Mean Girls surpassed Lindsay Lohans career, even though Lohan was considered the star of the film at the time. Even Lizzy Kaplan who played the weird outcast wound up starring in a well regarded showtime series.

by Anonymousreply 16107/27/2020

R161 oh wow that’s a really good one!

by Anonymousreply 16207/27/2020

R162 Thanks!

by Anonymousreply 16307/27/2020

Every single one of OP's comparisons is laughably, howlingly wrong.

by Anonymousreply 16407/27/2020

I think the one OP is right about is Betty White over MTM.

by Anonymousreply 16507/27/2020

Oh I’ve actually got a pretty good one you guys:

AMC: Kelly Ripa >>> Susan Lucci.

by Anonymousreply 16607/27/2020

R98, What? And do you mean Mike Todd or Richard Burton?

by Anonymousreply 16707/27/2020

OP is confusing "lived longer" with "surpassed."

That Joan Collins is working at age 87 means nothing vis-a-vis the legend that is Elizabeth Taylor.

by Anonymousreply 16807/27/2020

Joan needs to get her azz on (new) Dynasty. She could be that (bad) show's THIRD Alexis.

by Anonymousreply 16907/27/2020

Neely O'Hara surpassed Helen Lawson.

by Anonymousreply 17007/28/2020

Joan Collins was bigger than Taylor in the ‘80s.

by Anonymousreply 17107/28/2020

Is Christine Baranski considered bigger than Cybil Shepherd?

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by Anonymousreply 17207/28/2020

R172, nope.

by Anonymousreply 17307/28/2020

Okay how about this... for silent film stars TODAY (and for people who are into film ONLY), I think Buster Keaton has definitely "surpassed" Chaplin and Harold Lloyd for "popularity" in modern times. However, I think Harold Lloyd was the biggest money maker at the time of the three, no? Eldergays, help me out.

by Anonymousreply 17407/28/2020

No, Chaplin is by far the biggest silent movie star. Harold Lloyd had a bit of a resurgence in the 1980's, but it's still Charlie Chaplin. Buster Keaton is a barely remembered footnote.

Chaplin was worth the equivalent of $400million by the time he died in 1977.

The estate has earned vastly more than that since his death by licensing his image.

by Anonymousreply 17507/28/2020

Lloyd and Keaton are known to film buffs....but I'd say Chaplin is by the best known to the general public

by Anonymousreply 17607/28/2020

I was A bigger star than Will. He surpassed me and now is caught up in entanglements.

by Anonymousreply 17707/28/2020

Joan Collins is Fab... but NEVER surpassed the biggest movie star of all time.. Elizabeth Taylor

by Anonymousreply 17807/28/2020

Are you surprised that Dolly Parton has surpassed both Lily Tomlin and Jane Fonda's careers since starring in 9 to 5?

It was her first movie and she ended up stealing every scene from those two Oscar-nominated actresses. She became much more famous and successful than both of them combined.

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by Anonymousreply 17907/28/2020

Miss Kay Lenz is more iconic and legendary than her brief husband, David Cassidy.

by Anonymousreply 18007/28/2020

Kay who?

by Anonymousreply 18107/28/2020

Don't joke about that R181. Kay Lenz.

by Anonymousreply 18207/28/2020

Not completely what you're getting at but...

Faith Prince won the Tony. Nathan became the star. Nikki James won the Tony. Rannells and Gad became the stars.

by Anonymousreply 18307/28/2020

Also- when I was in high school, I went to a summer arts camp and lost out on all the roles to this one guy! He was extremely talented but it was upsetting. Ten years later, I made my Broadway debut and that "one guy" was a cater waiter at the opening night party. So never give up guys!

by Anonymousreply 18407/28/2020

People of my generation just saw Elizabeth Taylor as some strange woman that was friends with Michael Jackson. I can see how it would benefit some of these people to retire at their peak so they keep a good image of themselves in the public eye

by Anonymousreply 18507/28/2020

[quote]r10 Jo Stafford was the biggest female singer of the first half of the 20th century and the biggest female singer up to 1955.

I’ll take Darlene Edwards over Jo Stafford any day. Her musical stylings have brought me so much joy!

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by Anonymousreply 18607/28/2020

[quote]R185 People of my generation just saw Elizabeth Taylor as some fat woman

FTFY

by Anonymousreply 18707/28/2020

R160: No, it is not becoming a hit with younger generations, but a liability. And it was more than just one article. Someone edited a whole compilation of homophobic “jokes” and it was nearly an hour long. That show is one police shooting away from being canceled altogether. It is more than just that one article, and no it is not a fucking stupid article. And comparing it to a beloved classic such as [italic]The Golden Girls[/italic] is not just delusional, it’s downright sexist as well.

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by Anonymousreply 18807/28/2020

No, Collins did surpass Liz in the ‘80s.

by Anonymousreply 18907/29/2020

R185 there was a LOT more to Taylor than a friendship with MJ and being fat. Why don’t you educate yourself by looking up the history of AMFAR or watching Suddenly, Last Summer?

by Anonymousreply 19007/29/2020

Yes, she was a star in the ‘50s and ‘60s, but for those who came of age in the ‘80s, she was their mother’s star.

by Anonymousreply 19107/29/2020

Taylor was the embodiment of all that Hollywood aspired to re its creation of the ultimate, premiere, apex movie Queen. It was all realized in Elizabeth Taylor. Go ahead - throw whomever you like in my face for comparison. It makes no difference. Taylor was the "golden one." This is why she will always be remembered.

by Anonymousreply 19207/29/2020

Taylor was only the biggest female movie star during the 1950s. She quickly faded after that. The only thing that kept her in the public eye in the 60s-70s was her tumultuous relationship with Richard Burton. She had been replaced in Hollywood by Streisand, Fonda and Dunaway.

Joan Collins was absolutely bigger than Taylor during the 80s. She was on the cover of every magazine and the #1 actress on TV. She was a cultural phenomenon during her Dynasty years. Taylor was invisible during that time.

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by Anonymousreply 19307/29/2020

[quote]Taylor was the embodiment of all that Hollywood aspired to re its creation of the ultimate, premiere, apex movie Queen. It was all realized in Elizabeth Taylor. Go ahead - throw whomever you like in my face for comparison. It makes no difference. Taylor was the "golden one." This is why she will always be remembered.

MARY!

by Anonymousreply 19407/29/2020

[quote]Taylor was the embodiment of all that Hollywood aspired to re its creation of the ultimate, premiere, apex movie Queen. It was all realized in Elizabeth Taylor. Go ahead - throw whomever you like in my face for comparison. It makes no difference. Taylor was the "golden one." This is why she will always be remembered.

Elizabeth was one of the most talented actresses ever. She also had a lot of pain and struggle throughout her life. Despite that, she had a good heart, which is hard to encounter in Hollywood. At a time when gay men were oppressed beyond belief, they identified with her struggles, and she theirs.

by Anonymousreply 19507/29/2020

I like to think that Jonathan Taylor Thomas was the embodiment of all that Hollywood aspired to.

by Anonymousreply 19607/29/2020

Antonio Sabato Jr was the embodiment of all that Hollywood aspired to re its creation of the ultimate, premiere, apex movie Queen. It was all realized in Antonio Sabato Jr. Go ahead - throw whomever you like in my face for comparison. It makes no difference. Sabato was the "golden one." This is why he will always be remembered.

by Anonymousreply 19707/29/2020

No one has surpassed the incomparable and legendary songstress Lana Cantrell.

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by Anonymousreply 19807/29/2020

r195 LMAO. WW

by Anonymousreply 19907/29/2020

R195, I heard eldergays say exactly the same thing about Judy Garland.

by Anonymousreply 20007/29/2020

Have we yet determined if any B-List stars ACTUALLY surpassed their A-List rivals?

by Anonymousreply 20107/29/2020

Joan Collins has never even been nominated for an Oscar, though somehow won a Golden Globe in 1983 and has an Emmy nomination from 1984. Also a Peoples Choice award from 1985.

To say that she is mediocre would be a compliment.

Liz Taylor was a Star, not on one trick pony on a badly written soap.

by Anonymousreply 20207/29/2020

I think we can all agree that Cleopatra would have been much better with Joan Collins.

by Anonymousreply 20307/29/2020

Elizabeth Taylor was a vulgar coarse looking woman with no neck or calves. The hair was too dark, her brows too heavy, the voice too shrieking and her beauty was gone before she turned 30. She was very famous - though she is not remembered today. Her beauty was heavy and round and inelegant. A youthful moment of lush coloring and fine features were soon swallowed in bloat and tacky excess. She was short on everything but greed and calories. Oh, yes - the AIDS charity. She did what she considered "work." A drunk dilettante in tacky jewels and too much perfume. Showed up for five minutes a year. My grandma says that Liz Taylor was the most famous woman in the world. I guess. But there is nothing classic or classy about her looks or talent. Her voice alone is enough to make me change the channel.

by Anonymousreply 20407/29/2020

R204 is Zombie Debbie Reynolds.

by Anonymousreply 20507/29/2020

R204 And Joan Collins was the 1950's equivalent to a Yacht Girl. She's a bit deranged any over-sharing these days.

by Anonymousreply 20607/29/2020

^^and not any^^

by Anonymousreply 20707/29/2020

R204 Just a thought but try ploughing back through Joan Collins body of work since the early 1950's. Almost every character is identical, by the time you get to 'The Stud' and 'The Bitch' in the late 1970's I'd defy you not to be considering suicide.

by Anonymousreply 20807/29/2020

R204 = Cunt Chocula

by Anonymousreply 20907/29/2020

R204 = Cecil Beaton from the grave

by Anonymousreply 21007/29/2020

All it takes is 1 Liz fan to kill a party.

She was a fat whore., best forgotten.

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by Anonymousreply 21107/29/2020

As stated above, she would have been better gracefully exiting during her peak. The later years were often an embarrassment and ruined her image.

by Anonymousreply 21207/30/2020

Larry Fortensky and the gray hair with black wings. Tacky.

by Anonymousreply 21307/30/2020

Girls, girls, GIRLS!

You both embarrassed yourselves and disappointed gay men everywhere in [italic]These Old Broads[/italic].

by Anonymousreply 21407/30/2020

Sc.. like r212 likes to pretend that there wasn't a lot of child abuse happening in the Golden Age, much more than later on; and that there weren't many clinically perverted back then in showbiz.

by Anonymousreply 21507/30/2020

Hmm...Taylor received two competitive Oscar's plus this one for her humanitarian work. Compare Collins' Oscar wins and...whoops!

Forgotten? Fucking idiots...

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by Anonymousreply 21607/30/2020

Liz’s acting was usually quite mediocre, and her voice shrill. She was good in a couple things (which were well written parts), but I think if any of us made 50 movies, we’d hopefully be decent in a handful of them, too.

It’s not like she was any innate performer. Her fame just let her luck into a few roles she could naturally identify with, and expanded on her own personality/persona.

by Anonymousreply 21707/30/2020

There’s a deluded Liz fan on this thread.

Like Judy and Marilyn, she attracts them.

For some reason.

by Anonymousreply 21807/30/2020

Marilyn Monroe was at least an interesting person, though, with a more soulful quality.

Liz was just fuckin’ BLANK most of the time. (Beautiful face, of course...) Her line readings were so flat they sometimes had to completely redo them on a second pass with additional looping (like in “Ivanhoe”)

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by Anonymousreply 21907/30/2020

Elizabeth Taylor had two vocal settings. Breathy whisper vocal fry voice or shrill SHRIEKING grand emotion!! ACTING!! What a fucking cow she was. Even when she was young.

by Anonymousreply 22007/30/2020

I always saw Joan Collins as the epitome of tacky.

by Anonymousreply 22107/31/2020

Liz too.

by Anonymousreply 22207/31/2020

Pat.Is.A.Fucking.Nut.Case. That will be all....

by Anonymousreply 22307/31/2020

Pat who?

by Anonymousreply 22407/31/2020

Joan was a better actress than Liz. Taylor played herself in almost everything she did. Collins had the ability to transform herself into different characters.

by Anonymousreply 22507/31/2020

Yes.

Reminds me of how Monroe found Jayne Mansfield’s performance in Will Success Spoil Rock Hunter? ‘not funny’.

by Anonymousreply 22607/31/2020

The fact that there are several queens in this thread arguing about Joan Collins being in the same realm as Elizabeth-Fucking-Taylor!

Oh, my sides!

by Anonymousreply 22707/31/2020

Joan was a real trooper.

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by Anonymousreply 22807/31/2020

R188 How does comparing FRIENDS to GG make it sexist? You sound absolutely insane! Then again so does any political extremist, be they far-right or far-left. However, it is the far-left who is currently condoning censorship in the arts, restrictions on freedom of expression, cancel culture, and militant actions.

FRIENDS is an easy target for far-leftists, because it is still very popular, has an all-white, all-hetero cast. Anything that doesn't promote their multicultural utopia where everyone has multiracial, gay, and trans family/friends/neighbors/colleagues is considered bad or evil. Extremists are terrible for the arts, because all they care about is promoting a political agenda, everything and everyone else be damned!

Incidentally, FRIENDS is very popular in Asia and in other parts of the world. Just because some SJWs/snowflakes in the US, Canada, and the UK take offense doesn't matter in the end.

by Anonymousreply 22908/03/2020

The far-left also has no sense nor respect for history; they prefer to reimagine the past as they wish it had been, not as it really was. IMO, that's dangerous territory. You know that old saying, "Those who don't learn from history..."

by Anonymousreply 23008/03/2020

Who is the bigger star today: Angela Lansbury or Julie Andrews?

I would have to give the slight edge to Lansbury. Julie hasn't done anything of note in decades.

Do you think Julie is resentful of Angela's meteoric fame and popularity in the last 20 years?

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by Anonymousreply 23108/03/2020

Julie Andrews should thank her boring old raspy ass that she was inexplicably popular for a few years, 60 years ago. She's not an appealing talent or attractive. Way too phony and not even a great singer of her type.

Have you seen Bedknobs and Broomsticks? Now that's a great film.

by Anonymousreply 23208/03/2020

Is there a feud between Julie and Angela?

by Anonymousreply 23308/03/2020

Angela died in 2017, so I don't think so R233. Julie Andrews can barely speak. She promoted her "book" on James Corden with a naughty story about once having swatted a fly. She was on Colbert too - just my luck. He was much more worshipful because he's 70 years old. Julie had the audience in stitches telling about how Paul Newman once mistook her for the script girl. Can you blame him? Someone on Datalounge is going to cry now that Julie Andrews sang for the Nazis. I know. She did good. But some of us were born in the late eighties. Julie is not fascinating or talented or attractive. At least Angela could sing. RIP.

by Anonymousreply 23408/03/2020

The fuck R234 is talking about? I'm still alive, cunt!

by Anonymousreply 23508/03/2020

After having won a Golden Globe (the male equivalent of the one Helen Reddy lost for [italic]Airport 1975[/italic]) for his first film [italic]The Champ[/italic], it must gall Ricky Schroder not only to see Jason Bateman, star of [italic]Teen Wolf Too[/italic], win an Emmy but to also see Scott Baio, star of [italic]Zapped[/italic], to steal his precious GOP convention podium out from under him even before he went to jail.

by Anonymousreply 23608/03/2020

Is Ricky Schroeder a Trumptard? Rethug, yes, but a Trumptard like Chachi? And was Ricky in jail? For what?

by Anonymousreply 23708/04/2020

If Ricky went to jail for allegedly hitting his girlfriend, then Faye Dunaway should get the death penalty for attacking that gay assistant.

by Anonymousreply 23808/04/2020
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