The American Passport is worthless now

The travel embargo on Americans by the European Union was pretty air tight.

Trumps botched handling of the epidemic has ramifications.

Can we still go to Brazil and Russia?

He built that fucking wall all right

He walled us in backed us into a corner. This November, we come out swinging.

Mexico and Canada now have these walls and America paid for them

¡Ha llegado la hora de venganza! ¡Mwahahahaha!

R1, America has had an embargo on people travelling from the EU/EEA and UK for months now.

Americans are not banned from entering Europe, just from entering Europe directly from the US.

There's always Branson.

You mean even the shit hole countries don’t want us there?

The irony.

What, Kosovo and Tanzania aren't on your travel wish list?

Hey! Turkey's not bad!

Fat, stupid Americans- you are also dirty.

Puh, puh, we spit on you!

Tanzania isn’t on the list yet because they don’t have Internet yet

America vill elect Trump again. And after that, America end! You whore shut up! MAGA!

I heard you can go to Ireland, you just have to quarantine for two weeks when you arrive.

Tanzania has some insanely luxury resorts for those on Safari. Turkey's Cappodoccia is amazing as is dining overlooking the Bosphorus and visiting Topkapi palace. The food in Turkey is amazing.

As this New York Times article highlights, Americans still travel (with some conditions). I would encourage people to only do so if absolutely necessary though.

I hate Trump! I want the option of being able to go any place I damned well please. Damn him. Not only are we banned, we're laughed at.

My sister wants to come to the Romanian city I work in, Cluj-Napoca, and we wanna travel by rail to Bran Castle and then to Budapest. Alas, each place requires 2 weeks quarantine. Granted the quarantine here is in a nice hotel overlooking a lake and with food delivery.

R17 We were always laughed at, even under Obama.

Turkey is a Covid disaster as well. I don’t know about Tanzania but if it isn’t it seems like a beautiful place. It’s on my bucket list with Zanzibar.

And yet people still want to come here...

Anything to go on vacation. That sentiment is real. I don’t feel the same way, too risky. In normal circumstances Turkey is beautiful don’t get me wrong. Loads of (ancient)culture, lovely beaches, nice food.

Tanzania and Turkey are both gorgeous. Kosovo a little less so, but it's dirt cheap and the people are super friendly (and the men tend to have big cut peepees).

Hell, some friends took a road trip to Charleston and said it as awful. Most things are closed. Restaurants, etc. If you travel go by car and go to places with natural public things to do, because if your doing tourist things you will be sadly disappointed. Stay home. Sit in your driveway and get drunk.

R18, I have a trip to Cluj-Napoca planned for later in the year (it will be my 5th time). I have friends there and the pictures they post make it seem like life is returning to normal. Is that the case?

R19, yep, and Obama was bringing our groove back, worldwide. White racist fucks couldn't deal and so made corporations "people" so they could rig the system with endless amounts of corporate money. Lord knows that living, breathing REAL people can see through GOP machinations to suppress the fulfillment of promises made under our Constitution for POC, women, LGBGTQ, etc. , and anyone not fitting into their idealization of what an American should look and behave like.

Well some Americans have. For those of us who are proper, it's only a minor inconvenience to travel.

R26 I went to Europe under Bush and several times under Obama. Obama didn't make them treat us better, they just gave different reasons. Under Bush they were supposedly just upset at our government.

What I'm saying is Europeans are shallow assholes. I wish them the best, but their attitude toward Americans shouldn't be taken too seriously.

the US is a shit hole

[quote] R14: I heard you can go to Ireland, you just have to quarantine for two weeks when you arrive.

Likewise, my neighbor in Boston has a vacation home in Maine. He hasn’t been there, this season, because they have a two week quarantine, and he can’t be away that long.

R28, I don't believe that for one minute. Europeans have as much right to protect themselves from the fucked up politization of a pandemic as anyone else. I sure as hell wish I could.

And no, not ALL Europeans are shallow anymore than ALL Americans are assholes that don't wear masks and spread disease.

What IS shallow is a broad-brush declaration that reveals you know nothing about Europe, history, or why we are aligned with them as a culture.

[quote] I have a trip to Cluj-Napoca planned for later in the year (it will be my 5th time). I have friends there and the pictures they post make it seem like life is returning to normal. Is that the case?

Nope, the Balkans has become a new coronavirus European hot spot - most of the countries in the region have more infected people now that they had during the first wave back in spring and most of the new cases in other European countries are connected to "gastarbeiters" who've recently returned from those parts.

It’s not just the rest of the world; one third of US states have restrictions on people traveling from other States

R31 Unlike you I've been there many a time. It's a sweeping generalization that addresses the broader picture. Nothing cured me of caring about Europeans' opinions like living in Europe, various inidviduals and circumstances excepted.

Oh bollocks r30, there’s no one checking at the border (which is the reason state by state shutdowns weren’t going to work.)

Trump had better hope that he can travel to a country with no extradition treaty when the time comes.

Gracie) Do I have to tell him my age?

George) You do if you want a passport?

Gracie) I'm 19

George) Gracie we've been married for fifteen years, if you're 19 that means we were married when you were four.

Gracie) I guess that doesn't make sense

George) It sure doesn't, now tell him your right age

Gracie) I'm 20

[quote] R19: [R17] We were always laughed at, even under Obama

Let’s not rewrite history. Dubya was disliked by the Europeans. He was thought to be militant and incompetent. He squandered the good we had after 9-11, by misleading all, about WMD.

Obama was a breath of fresh air. People admired the US for the strength of character in electing a President who doesn’t look like the majority of people. He represented a welcome change from Dubya’s Administration. And he never went on any kind of apology tour. He won a Nobel price, for God’s sake!

Donald is disliked and laughed at for the many reasons listed here. It’s not out of blind prejudice, he has earned their dislike and laughter. Trump refers To “never Trumpers” as a pejorative, but these people base their objection to Trump through actual experience. ,

Winning!

[quote]Likewise, my neighbor in Boston has a vacation home in Maine. He hasn’t been there, this season, because they have a two week quarantine, and he can’t be away that long.

I was to work in maine this summer, like usual, but they couldn't swing that I would have to quarantine on their dime for two weeks so I was let go

I have no plans for international travel anytime soon, but I imagine it wouldn’t be particularly fun. A lot of places of interest, museums, public parks, etc., would be closed. And what happens if you get sick? Will your medical insurance cover you? Would you feel safe being treated in a foreign hospital,, if you don’t know the language, using an interpreter?

[quote] R28: What I'm saying is Europeans are shallow assholes. I wish them the best, but their attitude toward Americans shouldn't be taken too seriously.

I usually don’t care for broad generalizations, but I’ve noticed a pattern when traveling in Europe. There is this reflexive anti-Americanism that is freely expressed in many cases. It’s like they are reacting to the “Ugly American” stereotype, even at an introduction with a random American, when such ugliness hasn’t had time to be be evidenced, I’ve defused the anti-Americanism by, for example, agreeing with them that the President is an abomination. I’m just struck by how often and how freely I’m judged by a foreign stranger, just based upon my citizenship.

Unfortunately, both sides have anecdotal evidence of past ugliness and I think that’s what people too often react to. For example, Europeans hate it if an American overstates his country’s role in WWII. Americans don’t like it when Europeans are ungrateful for the role the US has played in those wars and since.

R20 You may want to review how the country of Tanzania was formed before you go off gallivanting to Zanzibar by motorcar.

R42 I had that same experience. It's prejudice. They steep themselves in so many ugly stereotypes that they have to overcome them when they're talking to an actual American. They'll justify it by attaching it to the political zeitgeist, but the behavior itself rarely changes.

They fixate on our weight, our clothes, our personal flaws- assume we're stupid, assume we're ignorant, assume we can't be trusted with any responsibility. Then tell us it's our fault because some Americans really are that retarded and childish!

Have they ever known an American like that? Well, they hear about them.... and this one time they saw an American acting like an obese toddler somewhere...

R26, every time I think of the dead and suffering of Syria (which is actually quite often because they are a big deal in Europe, especially the country I'm currently in) I think of Obama and his laziness and inclination to do nothing and how, as a result, he has their blood dripping from his hands. As is the blood of all the many innocent Iraqi civilians bombed to death by him because his laziness meant that ISIS took over huge swathes of Syria and the only option that the US then had to stop ISIS - because Obama was too "sensible" and lazy to enter Syria - was to bomb Iraqi cities. I also think of how Obama vowed that if Assad used chemical weapons on the Syrian people then there would be consequences. Except their weren't, aside from some supposed international effort to dismantle Assad's chemical weapon, which Obama proclaimed a success because Assad supposedly no longer had chemical weapons - then Assad went and mass murdered Syrians with chemical weapons again.

Whenever I think of Trump's "victory" in the 2016 election, I think of Obama saying "cut it out!" to Putin over his interference in the election in favour of Trump. Putin must have pissed himself laughing at that one. Trump is president because thanks in large part to Obama.

The irony of Americans complaining that they can't enter Europe - for extremely valid reasons - when the US first banned Europeans and that without informing European governments first before it was announced on TV, as is normal diplomatic protocol.

[quote]Bonus points for spelling Tanganyika correctly

Extra bonus points for know that it was called German East Africa before Tanganyika.

^^^ for knowing ^^^

Trump’s travel bans have largely been ineffective, Over 430,000 people travelled from China to the US after the Chinese travel ban went into effect. Likewise, IIRC, he banned direct flights from certain African countries, but I understand that the most common route between African and the US was through Europe.

R46, yeah, that was impulsive Trump at his finest.

What a bunch of crybabies above: so big bad snobby Europeans didn't like you...Boo hoo! I'm European too and if there's one thing I like about Americans is that most of them don't gave a shit about what others think about them. It's not exactly an admirable trait but it's one that I'd sure like to have. But reading the comments above made me realize that 'mericans are a bit more touchy these days (or at least those posting in this thread are).

Well here's a newsflash for you: Europeans tend to look down on everyone who don't speak their language and worship the exact same God, so it's not like Americans are the only ones who provoke their wrath.

R32, I’ve heard that gastarbeiters are masturbators. What are your thoughts?

R25 - it is for now. Terraces are open and summer events. So are cafes, artistic events and food festivals (with social distancing). If you come go for dinner in Piata Muzeului and you will love it. Also enjoy the surrounding nature. It is very relaxed and nobody really cares if you are gay. At least, I personally feel comfortable here. The mall in Gheorgheni is also next to a gorgeous lake and very relaxed with events, music, food and scenery. Just hope infection doesn't go up any higher.

I’ve met very nice Americans across the Europe. Most of them like to talk how their trip has gone so far. When I have met some Trump supporters it is very difficult to respect them. I can’t ask why they voted him and support him because in my mind supporting him makes no sense. I usually change the place and leave them alone. Luckily majority of Americans I’ve met have been open minded liberal people.

R41 Correct, your U.S. insurance will probably not cover you in Europe. You are not correct regarding the medical care that you'd receive, unless you're in a small village somewhere. Most hospitals are as advanced as you'd find in the U.S. I've been in Europe for nearly four years.

Thank you, R53. I will make it a point to dine in Piata Muzeului next time I'm in Cluj. Apparently, I've been to a place near there (Via), but it always seemed to crowded the times I walked around looking for places to eat. Out of curiosity, are there any recommended places for gay men to hang out? There don't seem to be gay bars or clubs, so I have relied on Tinder....with mixed success.

R55, I meant to reference a potential language barrier.

We can still go to Croatia and Serbia!

[Quote] We were always laughed at, even under Obama

Um, how many hundreds of thousands of people showed up to Obama’s Berlin speech?

R57 plenty of apps for that

A very interesting thread to read, but certainly not for the quality of the comments.

First, how can Americans blame Europeans for a ban on entering their territory when they were the first to banish Europe from theirs? I have repeatedly hallucinated on certain comments. Second, how can we praise Turkey at a time when it is established that this country is currently reproducing an Ottoman empire which is going on a crusade. Cyprus, Greece, Yemen, Syria, Libya, everywhere Erdogan goes there is a genocide. When it is not against the Kurds it is against other populations. Erdogan repeatly blackmailing Europe in order to obtain millions if not he threatening of sending terrorist refugees in Europe? It's like praising Hitler, literally. Seriously, either I came across a thread made by a Turk, either by a Russian or by a Trump supporter since it is Trump who allows and authorizes Turkey to do so.

Several hateful comments on Europeans, completely unjustified, and several lies of alleged people who visited Europe giving a description completely cliché, absurd and unrealistic. To say that Europeans treat Americans badly when they are in Europe is ridiculous and pitiful. The average American tourist, when he comes in Europe behaves well, but there are things that we cannot accept. Like yelling at our waiters because they don't speak English. I mean, they are in THEIR country not yours. Across Europe, people are learning 4/5 languages, even the Australians are doing much more than the Americans on it. If Europeans behaved the same way in the USA, you would take out your guns.

About the WWII, it's not that Europeans are ungrateful, it's just that y'all have the nerve to take credit for the victory when it's historically untrue. It is as if you educate yourself with the hollywood movies which always make America the superheroes of History. Europe waited 4 years before America came to help while Hitler sent everyone to concentration camps. Meanwhile, the British and the Russians in particular do everything to liberate Europe. So we know you have a hard time accepting not to be the superheroes portrayed in your movies, but you can't cheat with undeniable historical facts.

It's been 4 years that America has behaved like a whore with its historic allies and you would like that Europeans welcome you with open arms and accept all this without flinching? How many times has your president insulted Europeans? How many times has he humiliated them, just like this, without any reason? How many treaties has he broken with the Western Alliance? Who do you think you are and then cry because you are banished? I have never read a single democrat politician apologize to Europeans for the appalling attitude of your Russian Agent at the white House. Never. Do you think that Europe, which has felt betrayed for years, should just accept all this?

Problem with y'all is that you were always unable to question yourself on your own behaviors. American imperialism all around Europe is also something you turn a blind eyes on, NOT US.

I agree with R61 and R62 esp the part about Turkey and WW2.

with this whole pandemic going on I understand the disappointment of not being able to travel to most of Europe. I believe we could all use a holiday by now..... In general American tourists are very friendly and polite(in my experience) also I have enjoyed my holidays in the US and again people were helpful and friendly.

Around here, the Americans and the Brit are known as the shitstainers as they don't spray their shitholes after they crap. Fat, filthy, deplorable people.

Where’s “here”? R64

I was supposed to visit China in October 2019 but it fell through. had a falling out with the guy I was supposed to go with and he didn't want to go by himself. I had to shell out $300 for a Chinese visa!

Now I think I dodged a bullet with Corona/Covid-19.

But it is good till 2029.

R45. Your first paragraph is a fair assessment of what happened during the Obama administration. Surely, not one of his great accomplishments or judgement. This is a great policy discussion which we need in a democracy.

Your second paragraph is the right wing set of lies. Obama called in congressional leaders in August before the election and presented them with the facts as to what the Russians were doing. He wanted bipartisan support to an aggressive response. McConnell said NO and threatened him with making public comments that Obama would be interfering with the election. He even threatened the usual Republican approach of House and Senate investigation. Obama weighed the consequences of McConnell's threat and OBSTRUCTION. He decided that it was likely Hillary would win (wrong assumption) and did not want to be face the BS Fox News and other right wing media would disseminate. So he became buried in paralysis by analysis. Top Obama administration officials issued repeated warnings to Russia to stop their interference in the US election. Obama said he himself told Russian President Vladimir Putin in September 2016 "to cut it out," vowing "serious consequences" if he did not. These were findings from the bipartisan Senate Committee investigation.

In the past, our two political parties disagreed mostly about policies, not facts. Yes, both of our political parties would occasionally lie, but mostly about scandals. However, since Newt Gingrich's gang of the 1990's the party of Honest Abe began increasingly lie far more systematically about candidates and issues. “Voodoo economics,” “yellowcake uranium,” “weapons of mass destruction” (as opposed to the U.S.’s far deadlier arms), birtherism, “death panels,” widespread “voter fraud” and “rampant” immigrant crime have been just a few of the Republican's false memories. Meanwhile, the falsifiers have denounced anyone standing by the facts, such as scientists, social scientists, and journalists. In fact, a 2013 George Mason University (remember...they have major financial and influence by the Kochs) study to found that Republicans were three times likelier than Democrats to make their claims, which subsequently the Poynter Institute’s PolitiFact called “false” or “pants on fire.” It has only gotten worse with Trump in that he has also spread myths ranging from inaugural downpours to oral disinfectants to murder by broadcaster. In the 17 months through May 29, he averaged 22 false or misleading claims per day, according to The Washington Post’s Fact Checker.

Our democracy is in danger if we continue on this pathway of denying facts rather than discussing policy differences.

Ok, Svetlana.

[quote]Unfortunately, both sides have anecdotal evidence of past ugliness and I think that’s what people too often react to. For example, Europeans hate it if an American overstates his country’s role in WWII. Americans don’t like it when Europeans are ungrateful for the role the US has played in those wars and since.

Why would an American in Europe even bring up the U.S. role in WWII—except to brag and beg for praise for a much exaggerated hero's role in "Saving Europe"?

Why would Europeans fall over themselves to give thanks to American tourists for their parents' or grandparents' role in WWII?

Very few Americans know more than a scant few old tropes and myths of their own history. They have been conditioned to think that the rest of the world is primitive: quaint languages, folkloric costumes, everything living in wee thatched cottages, chickens running wild in the metros, swarms of begging children their limbs cruelly bent by rickettsia, countrysides filled with cows and lumpen babushkas in wooden shoes and their aprons filled with a few misshapen potatoes, stinky because the water from the village well is so cold and heavy to carry on bent over shoulders, all chowing down with toothless mouths on gabagool and sauerkraut and baguettes, the poor things robbed and held back by their socialist health care systems. If it doesn't look like the inside of a boxcar headed to one of the camps, they're a little bit disappointed. Why do Americans think people should be so damned happy to see them just because they American?

I hope this is over simplified R69. It partly comes down to the American educational system.

Let’s not bash everyone, we’re all people and I believe Europeans and Americans can appreciate each other when on a holiday.

First, it isn't just international travel. At least DHL has major restrictions on packages going to or coming from the USA. It is very difficult for a private individual to send a package to the USA.

Second, the anti-American stuff is bollocks. We have gone to Germany every year for the past 15 years. We have never had anti-American comments directed to us. When we have heard anti-American comments it is because the Americans did something wrong and the comments were deserved.

[quote]Meanwhile, the British and the Russians in particular do everything to liberate Europe.

Oh yes, Ruskies behaved like total angels. They were allies with Nazi Germany and made a deal with Hitler where they divided Europe between themselves. Ruskies invaded various European countries and annexed parts of some of them. Is that what you call liberation?

Had Hitler not invaded the Soviet Union it's very well possible Stalin would've just let Hitler do his thing. Obviously these days Russians seem to only know what the Soviets did to defeat Hitler but conveniently forget all the shit they themselves did.

Americans, what more is it going to take for you to acknowledge you live in a shithole country?

I’ve read upthread that Americans are criticized for “imperialism”, and also criticized for not interjecting themselves into European conflicts. R44 is right, that seems like prejudice to me.

There are very few Americans on this site who feel anything but revulsion with President Trump. I think that’s something most of us agree with.

Isn't Ireland in the EU? How come US citizens can go if there is a ban?

But can they, R76? Northern Ireland is not in the EU since Brexit, FWIW.

An American can no longer visit Europe but an asylum seeker from the Middle East can just show up and get free housing, food, and permanent residence there.

R77, someone upthread said US citizens can visit Ireland but need to quarantine for 2 weeks. I wasn't talking about N. Ireland.

But I thought US is banned from entering EU?

"Holiday in Tanzania!" (... with thanks to the Dead Kennedys)

[quote]I have repeatedly hallucinated on certain comments.

Pics please.

R61, I haven’t read anything here, about Americans blaming Europeans for an unjust travel ban. The ban seems perfectly understandable. It’s just unfortunate, that it was necessary at all.

And I haven’t read anything here praising Turkey or Erdogan. Did I miss it?

(Just a technical point, George Bush once made the mistake of using the word “crusade” to describe the US mission after 9-11. This was a terrible mistake because we, in the west, often use the word as a synonym for “mission”, but Muslims interpret the word to mean “a military attack to convert Muslim territory and people to Christianity”. So, Erdogan may be on a mission and commit genocide, but he wouldn’t be on a “crusade”.)

R76/R79, there is a ban on Americans traveling to EU in the Schengen zone-France, Germany, Italy, etc. Ireland isn’t in thr Schengen zone and therefore will accept Americans but they’ll have to quarantine. The UK (England, Wales, Northern Ireland and Scotland) are no longer in the EU and are also accepting Americans but a quarantine is required. However it looks in the next few weeks in England passengers will just have to be tested at the airport and won’t have to quarantine.

[quote]An American can no longer visit Europe but an asylum seeker from the Middle East can just show up and get free housing, food, and permanent residence there.Reap what you sow.

The current U.S. president has made scapegoats of Mexicans, Chinese, Canadians, those fancy fuckers from Europe, anyone from anywhere but Russia and the U.S. of Russia. He has no problem restricting education and work visa programs that were put in place for good reason and to the good of the U.S. He blames everything on offshoring when it accounts for only about 1/6 of jobs that disappeared, even as he feathers the nest of the very richest Americans who eliminated those and many other jobs. He makes a great show of closing the borders to everyone in his program to wrest MAGA greatness from the wasteland he was left by his predecessor.

And you get your panties in a bunch because your Freedom to fly to Europe is restricted not for political reasons, not because of an upcoming European election, but only until the rate of the new infections in the U.S. has slowed to the same contained level as asked of other nations.

Not every American is an Ugly American, but there are enough in this place to give a clue that the phenomenon is not one of rarest exception.

I don’t think the upthread criticism of President Obama for not doing more in Syria is appropriate. He inherited two unpopular wars in the Mideast. Three, if you include the “War on Terror”. The American people wanted out of these wars. Yes, George Bush made a mess of things, and he left Obama with no good options, only bad ones. Obama couldn’t undo what had been done up until that point, but he was elected on promises to get out of these wars, not get involved in a new one in Syria.

In the US system, the President doesn’t even have the power to declare war. That’s up to Congress, and there was no support in Congress for an expanded war. I was proud of Obama for going to Congress on at least one occasion, to ask for war powers.

We were really just looking for an excuse, OP.

R84, most all Americans on this site agree that Trump is an abomination. You don’t need to argue that point. We already agree, for the most part,

I also don’t know that the Americans here are saying that the European ban is “unfair”, As an American, I think it’s perfectly understandable. I don’t know the nationality of R78, but if he is American, he is one person, not all Americans.

Then you declare that there are “enough ugly Americans in this place to give a clue that the phenomenon is not one of rarest exception“. That is a terrible generalization. It’s quite a bigoted statement. I don’t even know what, in particular, you’re referring to. There are certainly awful people everywhere, but to criticize the population of an entire country based on 83 posts is, well, just rude.

[quote]I think of Obama and his laziness ... his laziness meant ... because Obama was too "sensible" and lazy to enter Syria...

And I'm sure you had absolutely no idea that "lazy" and all its derivatives have code-word significance when writing about America's first African-American president.

The funny part of your diatribe is that people like you just love to have it both ways: we're imperialists and swine when we engage in geopolitics in ways you don't like, and we're ignorant and "lazy" when we don't engage in ways you'd like.

Meanwhile, Putin and Russia are engaged in a broad-based effort to undermine Western power and influence, aided and abetted by rightwing politicians worldwide, even inside the highest reaches of US government. Sadly, Syria was just a minor blip in that effort; and we can all see how Putin is willing and happy to sacrifice those in his purview for what he deems his greater good. So while you're so happy with yourself that you managed to work an American epithet into your critique, perhaps you should ask yourself why a man like Putin has been able to achieve such influence and power over what is supposed to be a superior system.

R82 Who the hell are you kidding? You do not know how to read ? Don't you see all these posts which glorify Turkey ???? Do you lever learned the definition of the word HONESTY in Ankara, in Russia or in Trumpland or in Berniebrosland ???

R72 Another complete IGNORANT American. During WWII after Hitler betrayed Staline, he made an alliance with Europe and the British. These are the two countries that did the dirtiest work before America deigned to arrive in Europe. Four years of intense fighting of which the USA was not a part. Incredible to show such a lack of culture and you dare to cry when European call you ignorant ??? Really ??? When will you buy some History books you Trump/ Berniebros ???

As for Syria, the Republican-led Congress demanded that Obama ask Congress give approval for any Syrian action.

So, Obama followed the law and presented a resolution to Congress.

The GOP Congress voted it down.

So any issues you have with Obama and Syria fall squarely on the head of the GOP

[quote] An American can no longer visit Europe but an asylum seeker from the Middle East can just show up and get free housing, food, and permanent residence there.

Um, no they can't

Even if they could, they won't bring in covid like Americans would

[quote] “Cash and carry” was a policy by US President Franklin Delano Roosevelt announced at a joint session of the United States Congress on September 21, 1939, subsequent to the outbreak of war in Europe. It replaced the Neutrality Acts of 1937, by which belligerents could purchase only nonmilitary goods from the United States as long as the recipients paid immediately in cash and assumed all risk in transportation using their own ships. The "Cash and Carry" revision allowed the sale of military arms to belligerents on the same cash-and-carry basis. The purpose of this policy was to allow the Allied nations at war with Germany to purchase war materials while maintaining a semblance of neutrality for the United States.

[quote] The Lend-Lease policy, formally titled An Act to Promote the Defense of the United States, enacted March 11, 1941, was a program under which the United States supplied the United Kingdom (and British Commonwealth), Free France, the Republic of China, and later the Soviet Union and other Allied nations with food, oil, and materiel between 1941 and August 1945. This included warships and warplanes, along with other weaponry. It was signed into law on March 11, 1941, and ended in September 1945. In general the aid was free, although some hardware (such as ships) were returned after the war. In return, the U.S. was given leases on army and naval bases in Allied territory during the war. Canada operated a similar smaller program called Mutual Aid.

I hate to say this because I generally like the man, but it was Obama who fucked up the banks in Switzerland for Americans living and working there. An overreaching nightmare

The above show that the US was acting to aid the allies from 1939, forward. It could be argued that the allies could not have held out without this American aid.

The reason that Germany and Italy declared war on the US immediately following the attack on Pearl Harbor is because they believed that they were already effectively at war with the US, and that the US would then be particularly vulnerable after the Japanese attack.

As for complaints that the US was late to send our military men and women into the war, the feeling in the US at the time for many was that it wasn’t our fight. People felt that Europe bungled the peace, and they were responsible for straightening it out. Despite officially being neutral, though, we clearly favored the Allies. But what is the argument that the US should have joined the fight earlier? Does the same argument go for Sweden and Switzerland?

[Quote] hate to say this because I generally like the man, but it was Obama who fucked up the banks in Switzerland for Americans living and working there. An overreaching nightmare

Um, Obama made Swiss banks reveal their American clients so Americans could no longer get away with hiding money there without paying taxes.

Hardly overreach

Right, R97, as banks everywhere else have been required to do.

Umm we paid our double taxation.

Umm the USA obliged Swiss banks to provide quarterly reports re American and even dual nationals (Swiss/USA). accounts

The Swiss said fuck it We're not doing all this work for you. So we won't bother with Americans at all

It was and is overreaching.

Why wouldn’t the EU ban non essential travel from the USA? We still have an outbreak going, and they obviously don’t want tourists coming and bring it back over again. When the situation was the reverse, as it was earlier in the pandemic, the US banned EU travelers. It’s not really personal, it’s attempting to contain a virus. Vacations can wait.

The year was 1941

The war had just begun

R99, well yes, it is overreaching, but not specifically to Switzerland, it's just that Switzerland resists the rather extreme reporting requirements where other countries relented and complied.

And R99, it was a.pain in the ass or worse for an American to open a bank account in Europe when Bush was in office, so these difficulties were by no means spun of whole cloth by Obama.

Agree with R100 In most EU countries Americans are banned.

[quote][R72] Another complete IGNORANT American. During WWII after Hitler betrayed Staline, he made an alliance with Europe and the British. These are the two countries that did the dirtiest work before America deigned to arrive in Europe. Four years of intense fighting of which the USA was not a part. Incredible to show such a lack of culture and you dare to cry when European call you ignorant ??? Really ??? When will you buy some History books you Trump/ Berniebros ???

R90, besides sounding like a lunatic you obviously have problems with the reading apprehension. No one besides Russians themselves view their actions during the WWII outside of fighting with the Nazis in a positive light. Stalin was a monster but obviously Putin's regime has been trying to make him a hero.

R101, I am not sure what post you’re replying to, but R93 shows that the US was selling military supplies to the allies in 1939 and forward. In 1941, before the US was formally at war, they changed the law to allow the US to provide military support to cash-strapped allies in exchange for military bases on allied territory during the war. Essentially, military aid for free.

One cannot know what the outcome would have been without this aid. But I’ve read that the USSR could not have survived and would have settled for a separate peace as it did in WWI, leaving Britain alone, in the fight. Britain was suffering mightily as it was, who knows the outcome if the full might if the NAZI war machine was turned against that nation. Britain extended some war rationing on some items until 1954!

R105, that is not true. The fact that Stalin was a monster and the war was won on the Eastern front are not mutually exclusive. In fact, it is largely because Stalin was a monster that the Soviet forces were so ruthless. Stalin actually starved to death the civilian population of the Soviet Union and blamed it on the Nazis. His reasoning was that the rank and file soldiers would fight harder if they believed the Nazis had killed their families.

PS, remember that Stalin was an ally from about 1941 on. The Soviet Union was not operating in a vacuum or independently. To describe the Soviet efforts in WWII as if they were separate from the efforts of the rest of the allies is not accurate.

There’s a story I like about LBJ and Charles De Gaulle. During the war, De Gaulle has a mixed relationship with the Anglos because Churchill and Roosevelt weren’t sure how to deal with him, as he wasn’t a democratically elected leader. He had assumed leadership of the free French forces, and De Gaulle didn’t think he got the respect he deserved as that leader.

After the war, De Gaulle did become the elected French leader, and there came a time in 1966 when he wanted to assert French independence. He stayed in the NATO political alliance, but withdrew from the NATO military alliance, and he ordered all US military forces off of French territory. LBJ was miffed and he ordered the Secretary of State, Dean Rusk, to ask De Gaulle if that included the Americans from WWI and WWII who had died and were buried in France. Rusk replied, “you can’t be serious.” And LBJ said, “Ask him, Dean”. At a subsequent meeting, Rusk put the question to De Gaulle, who didn’t answer, but stood up, and left the room.

Oh please, r45 and r67. If Obama had intervened in Syria, he'd be branded a warmonger like Dubya and trashed for causing the inevitable mess. Unfortunately, Americans and Europeans are quick to stick simplistic 'good & bad' labels on conflicts when the reality is usually more complex than that, and in the case of the so-called "Arab Spring" (ridiculous to call it "spring" now) there were barely any good sides at all (perhaps only the then Tunisian opposition and no other). The rest, from Egypt to Yemen have been catastrophic.

Intervening in Syria would have created an Iraq-style quagmire which would have only benefited the military-industrial complex and been exceedingly difficult to extricate the US from. Obama did the right thing. We also see what happened in Libya, where he caved to British and French pressure to support the removal of Gaddafi who, while no angel, had nothing on the warlords fighting over Libya now. A wealthy, stable country was ruined in turn unleashing the Mediterranean refugee crisis that Italy and Spain had to deal with without E.U. help, indirectly contributing to Brexit. American intervention in Syria would have meant Greece and Germany having to process and absorb triple the refugees. Given how they could barely cope at the height of the crisis, I legit think it would have led to a real fracture of the E.U.

Notice how r45 blames Obama for deaths in both Syria (no intervention) and Iraq (drone bombings).

[quote]Had Hitler not invaded the Soviet Union it's very well possible Stalin would've just let Hitler do his thing.

r72. Europe (this time Hitler's Germany and all their willing little allies, including the Ukrainians) invaded Russia and then whined at the scale of the strike back. Why poke the bear? Everybody knows Mother Russia is paranoid that the entire world has it in for them yet they keep repeating the same mistakes. Russia had zero interest in Europe and was content as long as there was a buffer between them and what they saw as the continuing menacing threat of the anachronistic cold-war alliance NATO. But NO! You just had to unnecessarily expand to the Russian border which, not only caused conflict in the Ukraine, but lost them Crimea forever. Why?!?

R111 Hi Vladimir. How's it hanging?

Truth too harsh, r112?

R113 Your revisionist history is too absurd. Go sell crazy someplace else.

[Quote]well yes, it is overreaching, but not specifically to Switzerland, it's just that Switzerland resists the rather extreme reporting requirements where other countries relented and complied.

Switzerland was the first to say you're insane if you think our staff is going to work for you with zero compensation. Quarterly reporting on each individual is estimated to cost approx $3000.00 annually per account.

[Quote]Unlike other advanced nations, the United States enforces a tax system based on citizenship rather than residency.

Which means USA citizens working abroad are subject to double taxation. Its bullshit. And many Euro banks now will not open accounts for American citizens even if they are dual nationals.. Its insane Its fascist

USA citizenship is a burden.

As a traveler, this has been a hard year and will likely continue to be.

We're in California, so we are fortunate that we have many car-accessible attractions. We are still limiting our travel options to outdoor locations as anything that is remotely open is just super-spreader central.

As for Americans and how they are viewed abroad, generalizing from anecdotal evidence only --- Americans are often frowned upon because 1) they are arrogant 2) for no reason 3) because they have a limited worldview focused on the US-alone. Just look at the Trumptards, they are the epitome of "this is how I want to handle this global pandemic and ain't no telling me differently."

OP, I know you're trolling, but here's the bottom line:

Americans neither need to, nor want to travel abroad.

We have everything we want in this country.

That's why everyone wants to come to the U.S., and not vice-versa.

We are the dominant culture. We are the alpha.

Everyone else wants to be us.

In fact, I think that we should close OUR borders to THEM. That would really make those asshole foreigners go nuts.

^^ crazy American fool.

R118 knows that R117 is speaking the truth.

R117 who’s trolling😉 We have a much higher living standard here but yes your nature is stunning

Yes, yes, U.S.A., number 1 in all things

Tell that to Tom Hanks and Rita Wilson who just traveled to Greece for his birthday celebration...under the guise of having dual citizenship. One would think that after both contracting Covid-19 in a foreign country and being quarantined there, they would have learned a lesson. Still, how was he able to travel when nobody else is ? Talk about entitled and elite.

^ Greece is open to Americans.

This is why the world laughs at us. Before Rona we were clueless, during Rona we're clueless, after Rona...

You called...?

America has been on a long decline, accelerated by the election of Trump. Self-inflicted wound.

Can you even get a passport issued or renewed right now?

I wouldn't worry. The world depends on American tourist dollars. As soon as they start to get a bit hungry, they'll be cutting their prices to entice us into their flea-bitten countries. And then we'll really fuck them over.

R127 types roadtrip to the indian casino and Ozarks type-traveler with no passport

All this winning.

Looks like a vacation to the US Virgin Islands for Christmas.

We deserve it.

r127, except we are the flea riddened diseased country no one wants to come to.

You sound amazingly well-traveled, R127! Maybe one day you’ll make it into one of the adjoining square states.

[quote]That's why everyone wants to come to the U.S., and not vice-versa.

Ummmm.... Not anymore R117. You're 20 years out of date. In case you hadn't noticed, America turned into a shithole country best avoided for so many reasons.

Trump got his wall, and like everything else these days it is virtual.

I wish they could just ban the states that are surging. It’s always the red states fucking up and the rest of us have to pay for it.

The Caribbean was starting to open up , and by now was supposed to be pretty much back to normal, until those shitholes started surging and so they rolled everything back.

So their “freedom” cost us ours, how ironic.

The wall isn't built R135 and Mexico hasn't paid one cent towards the parts of the wall which have been built.

[quote]I wish they could just ban the states that are surging. It’s always the red states fucking up and the rest of us have to pay for it.

It's not the red states that are surging.

Where can you even get passport photos right now?