New Justin Trudeau Corruption SCANDAL

This isn't good in any respect. I think it reflects Justin's arrogance and cluelessness, rather than corruption. But it will be hard to put this one away.

I don't know what they were thinking, but it's silly to say this paves the way for the Conservatives. It doesn't. It probably means he will go sooner rather than later, a new PM will take over (probably Freeland or Morneau) and the Liberals will keep on governing as usual. Even if they did pave the way for the Conservatives, the Conservatives will fuck it up. They can't contain their freak flank and the centre of the country, actually most of it except for the middle west, just isn't into their bullshit.

But this is genuinely bad for Trudeau even if you do think he has a cute ass. His family made about $300 grand off it, he didn't recuse himself from a cabinet vote and the process was sloppy if you're being generous. He's kinda fucked.

R1 but should the Conservatives start shopping for new drapes for their government offices?

Pfft. You think THIS is scandalous?

Have you seen what's been going on in the White House for the last 3 1/2 years?

Pffft!

Jinx!

LOL you keep fucking that chicken OP.

First, the charity never paid them anything. Trudeau's brother and mother spoke at WE events and were paid by event sponsors, not the charity.

Second, the budget for that student volunteer program is $900M but the charity would be paid about $20M, not "awarded a contract at almost 1 Billion Dollars". The $20M would cover the cost of administering the program.

Trudeau and the PMO should have seen the potential for the opposition to exploit the optics of this, and it's an unforced error, but there's nothing wrong with his brother and mother - prior to now - being paid to speak at these events.

Meanwhile....what were you talking about?:

FF OP Russian troll

R2... no. Trudeau may go but the Liberals won't. Anyone pulling an election now would be crucified. That said, the NDP may make his head the price the government pays.

He's now in his third ethics investigation. And this is one the whole family can play. It's not a good look for re-election. Canadians will punish your party when the news is too much about shenanigans and not enough about policy. Harper, Mulroney, Martin... they all went down over drama.

Could be good news for the NDP. Not the Conservatives. Trudeau only delivered a minority and was rumoured to be out in 18 months of his own accord, but then COVID happened. That may be back on now. I think he's tired of governing and the scrutiny anyway.

[quote] Pfft. You think THIS is scandalous? Have you seen what's been going on in the White House for the last 3 1/2 years?

And that is what pisses me off as a Canadian - every politicians gets into "ethics" troubles. But the Conservatives and the media seem to come down on Trudeau & 10 TIMES harder than a Conservative PM or even Trump - stuff is child's play compared to the stuff Trump has gotten away with,

And the irony? The BIGGEST Trudeau haters and the STRONGEST Trump supporters in Canada - These Canadian Trump Supporters will defend Trump to the ends of the earth. Then they turn around and call Trudeau a crook and corrupt.

Seriously the guy who tried to kill Trudeau the other day (which NO ONE in Canada spent time talking about, including the media) wrote a lengthy manifesto where he wrote that Trudeau was destroying Canada, is a crook, should be in jail. But it wouldn't surprise me if he was also a Trump supporter.

R8 R9 if Trudeau decides to contest the next election, will be lose to the Conservatives. That is my question to you

I smell a troll, and a typically stupid one. Non news.

[quote] I smell a troll, and a typically stupid one. Non news.

Uhm every Canadian newscast is leading with this story

I do not believe the Liberals will lose to the Conservatives in the next election, no. I don't believe Trudeau wants to or will be leading the party during it, either. He wants out. This is the kind of problem that sticks, whatever the facts. The guy is not as beloved in the country as he is on DL. Obama was groovy, Trudeau increasingly comes across as smug, IMO.

Separately, the irrational over reactions to actual news about this guy are typical for DL. He's not perfect. He's not God. He should - as they all should - be best, to turn a phrase, and where he and the rest of them aren't, they should be called to account for it. There is nothing wrong with that. You embarrass yourselves calling people Russian trolls over basic scrutiny.

If the bar for scrutiny is 'was the sin as bad as something Trump has done?' then you're allowing a hell of a lot of people to get away with a hell of a lot of bad shit.

okay thanks R14 BUT IF Trudeau decides to seek re-election. Do you think he will lose to the Conservatives?

So the non news story is front page of the Toronto Star, historic friend of the Liberals.

The two headline are upper left and upper right on the web site:

FEDERAL POLITICS Trudeau’s family members received $283,400 to speak at events hosted by WE Charity

After each ethics violation, Justin Trudeau says he learned his lesson. Then there’s another such incident

By Susan DelacourtNational Columnist

Some of you have interesting definitions of non news.

[quote] If the bar for scrutiny is 'was the sin as bad as something Trump has done?' then you're allowing a hell of a lot of people to get away with a hell of a lot of bad shit.

What I'm pointing to is the Hypocrisy of Trudeau Haters/Trump Supporters (yes they are one in the same) - they will defend Trump to the ends of the earth - then turn around and ask why Justin Trudeau is not in jail! They can't have it both ways.

[quote] So the non news story is front page of the Toronto Star, historic friend of the Liberals.

The Toronto Star will probably NOT be the historic friend of the Liberals much longer as they have been bought by two businessmen who have donated to Conservative politicians, Doug Ford and Maxime Bernier

Look into the Clinton and Obama foundations. And I voted for them! Choose your enemies, you dumb cucks.

[quote]What I'm pointing to is the Hypocrisy of Trudeau Haters/Trump Supporters (yes they are one in the same) - they will defend Trump to the ends of the earth - then turn around and ask why Justin Trudeau is not in jail! They can't have it both ways.

Yes, I'm sure they were so upset when it came out that Conservative leader Andrew Scheer was using taxpayer subsidized political donations to pay for his children's private school education. Or flying his family around on a private jet.

R15... I don't know.

He only seeks re-election is his riding. I don't know what his riding will make of it. In and of itself this isn't a criminal scandal but it could contribute to a general weariness with the guy that could see him defeated, especially if another party runs a star candidate.

Nationally, he becomes PM as leader of the party if the party gets the most seats and can form a government. Again, I don't think this in and of itself is fatal but cumulatively it might be.

The next election isn't until October 2023. That's a long time, even without everything going on.

The real scandal is the cringey name of the charity - "WE".

Canada is so quaint that this is considered a scandal.

This thread has too much partisan stupid on it to bother any more. Trudeau supporters are being as stubbornly irrational as his haters. It's meant to be conversation, not a temper tantrum.

[quote] Yes, I'm sure they were so upset when it came out that Conservative leader Andrew Scheer was using taxpayer subsidized political donations to pay for his children's private school education. Or flying his family around on a private jet.

Conservative Supporters DEFENDED that vigorously

Party supporters are partisan. They defend to the last ditch. That's what they do. What matters is what voters think. Party loyalty isn't what it used to be. When I was a kid you were a Liberal family or a Conservative family, historically. That's long dead.

R21 you do realize that the opposition might gang up on his and decide vote down the government to trigger an election at any time? They could even do it when the House resumes in September

Of course I realize that. It would be political suicide in the middle of COVID. This isn't bad enough to justify that. It's more of a slow boil thing if it's a thing at all to most voters. They'll all watch the polls.

R28 if I was Justin Trudeau I'd do a massive document dump, release all the documents to this now, have everyone go through everything during the summer

and hope everyone forgets about by September - no more of this drip-drip-drip of news stories like SNC that almost derailed him in the last election.

I wondered how Margaret could afford that co op.

[quote] I wondered how Margaret could afford that co op.

She sold her house and used that money to but the co-op

Now it is break that Finance Minister Bill Morneau's daughter Clare spoke at a WE Day, & WE co-founder blurbed her book.

His other daughter, Grace Acan, currently works for WE.

In 2019, Morneau announced $3M in federal funding to WE.

BTW these stories are being broken by Jesse Brown of Canadaland - and he is NOT a Justin Trudeau fan - far from it, he probably HATE Trudeau and is allegedly aligned with the NDP - so consider the barrage of stories coming from Jesse Brown to bring down Justin Trudeau

Which will just result in a Conservative win, but the NDP would rather oppose mean Conservatives than a party they align with, the Liberals. Cause the NDP need the Liberals out of the way, to get any type of traction. So the NDP is putting their own party over public policy.

Yup... and he didn't recuse or declare conflict when Cabinet discussed it.

R33 he admitted that BEFORE these stories came out

From another thread about this someone wrote (and I agree)

If something as blatantly stupid as this costs Trudeau the next election, then I don't know what to say. You all know the Cons and the NDP will screech about this for months to come. It's the new SNC.

I'd GLADLY trade...

R34, I'm not sure I agree it's [italic]blatantly[/italic] stupid. People deserve governments that conduct themselves properly. It's called the public trust. When they violate it, they often get punished at the ballot box if the public deems the violation bad enough to do so. I'm personally not comfortable rewarding fuck ups with my vote just because they're less objectionable than the other fuck ups. (Recognizing you gotta vote for somebody.) That kinda doesn't encourage them not to fuck up, which is actually the preferred outcome.

It's not tricky to get these things right. Trudeau has always lived in a bubble of self delight.... I'm sure it was a reflex, not a conspiracy. Reward your friends who think like you.

If you want to settle for bad but not worst, go ahead. I don't want to reward the usual take care of your friends bullshit. Yes, they all do it, but ideally they should think twice first and practically speaking at least have a few years governing properly before the sense of arrogant entitlement takes over. (And I'm probably voting Liberal next time. I don't know who else I'd vote for. I just hope Freeland is leader and Justin is not because it will be easier to vote for them.) At a minimum he doesn't have very good judgment. After SNC he said he took responsibility for his mistakes... yet here we are again.

R36 why not vote NDP ?

He's cute, but his treatment of indigenous people and their land rights continues to be a huge black mark against him.

How cute, meanwhile our corrupt Chump government doles out billions to his fellow conservative politicians and mega churches and the media doesn't even notice. I have a question about canadian politics, do the parties just sit around waiting for a "scandal" in the current government, seems like that's all i hear coming out of canada is about such and such "scandal", fucking candians get a life already.

If he can get away with multiple instances of blackface and hitting a female MP, why will this be different?

R37, I lived through the Rae government. I don't think the NDP are competent to run a government. There's always a few smart people but for the most part more heart than sense. Hell, even Bob Rae became a Liberal.

Thanks R41

The Bloc leader Yves-François Blanchet and Conservative leadership candidate Peter MacKay is calling on Justin Trudeau to resign over this

Well that's like saying hello when you pick up the phone.

What does Fat Scheer's crusty ass taste like, OP?

Given that OP contributed more than a third of all the posts on this thread, it seems he is VERY concerned. Is OP Susan Collins by any chance?

[quote] he is VERY concerned.

You have never heard of the "Justin Trudeau Concern Troll"?

Duff Conacher of Democracy watch says from what he has seen Justin Trudeau committed a crime, "Breach of Trust" he will be asking the RCMP to open a criminal investigation.

I for one, am ready for PM Freeland, and OP, that may very well happen since all three opposition parties are calling for an election. I don't think she'd ever be stupid enough to get caught up in such a stupid thing.

I don't think Trudeau committed a crime, but it sure was stupid as fuck to let this happen and throw the Cons the bone they've needed. How fucking stupid is it to award a third party a 900 m. contract that your own family has ties to without recusing yourself?? It's not that WE got the contract, it's the lack of transparency and utter stupidity on behalf of the PMO, Trudeau himself, and Morneau.

I know all governments have scandals, but scandals are always the weakness of the Libs, and though I hate the Cons, they are right in the fact that the Libs lean towards being arrogant. It's sheer arrogance that this went down the way it did. I made a thread here a while back saying that as long as Trudeau could remain scandal free, that he'd win a overwhelming majority in the next federal election. Well, folks, he blew it.

I don't blame Trudeau totally, more of the blame is on the PMO. Is there no one there with a fucking brain? Who let this go? Where the hell were the advisors on this - especially after the whole SNC debacle? Stupid, stupid, stupid, and yes, I'm very pissed off at the moment.

Why do the Libs hand the Cons (and the NDP) shit like this? It's infuriating. Did no one in the PMO recognize the poor optics and how the Cons would attack and how the general public would view something like this? It doesn't matter what people actively engaged in following politics in Canada think, or what Liberal partisans thing, most voters are not out to analyze this or that - they read the headlines and see "scandal." How could this get by the PMO without someone opening their mouth and saying, "hey, Justin, hey, Bill, maybe you two should sit this one out?"

I like JT, but, he's dumb for letting this happen, and I never cared for Morneau, he's slimy.

[quote] Duff Conacher of Democracy watch says from what he has seen Justin Trudeau committed a crime, "Breach of Trust" he will be asking the RCMP to open a criminal investigation.

Well if “Duff” says so, I’m sure the RCMP will hut right to it!

Oh, and for all the Liberals out there, please realize that the conflict of interest issue DOES include his mother and his brother. There's some desperate people out there thinking it only applies to his wife and/or children. Read it and you'll see. It's been posted on Twitter a number of times and it's pretty clear.

Justin's prettiness absolves all his sins.

But the new salt-&-pepper beard now makes me think he's got a big nose.

Every politician is corrupt. You don’t get elected without bribes and owing and back-scratching.

ALL OF THEM.

Sigh....people on Twitter keep posting pics of various Cons' families at WE Day events and Scheer with the founders of WE. Unless they too ised their power and awarded contracts to WE, those pics are irrelevant. We have to be smarter about this, and besides, no one aside from people on Twitter will ever see them or care.

rich smug dumbass, but what an ASS! Can you imagine topping that? You know he keeps it pristine.

he should be fucked at both ends as punishment!

[quote] since all three opposition parties are calling for an election.

They are NOT calling for an election - In fact the Conservatives said they are NOT calling for the government to fall. Only the Conservative leadership contenders are calling for an election.

Parliament gave special powers to Justin Trudeau to make quick decisions during this pandemic

I'm just wondering if there is a loophole in these special powers that would allow him to green-light this project, because the gist is that he should've recused himself from voting at the cabinet table on this.

It doesn't excuse him from violating an ethics issue, (if that proves to be the case), R57.

Bump eh.

[quote] It doesn't excuse him from violating an ethics issue, (if that proves to be the case)

which is why Conservatives say they will use their majority at the Finance committee to FORCE Justin Trudeau to testify UNDER OATH at the Finance committee

and afterwards the Conservatives say they are going to go shopping for new drapes for their new government office when they win the next election, as they will destroy Trudeau when he has to testify

one more nail in Trudeau coffin

It's actually very unusual for Canadians to care about corruption. It's generally Alabama North as far as that goes.

R61 they why the SNC scandal reduce Justin Trudeau to a minority?

Nobody cares and the Conservative party is a mess right now. So they even have a leader?

Trudeau is just as corrupt as his dad (no, not the Canadian dad).

CTV News typically leans conservative, and today you’d be hard pressed to find this story on their web site.

GlobalTV News is even more right leaning and it’s the same there.

People have more important things to worry about at the moment, OP.

I really wish people on Twitter would stop with digging up pictures/stories of other politicians volunteering their time with WE, it's not helping the matter. No one is questioning Sophie or Maggie, or Morneau's daughter volunteering for WE, or even them getting paid, it's the fact that the PM and Morneau didn't recuse themselves from awarding a contract to WE, knowing their familes had connections to the organization that's the problem.

Many Ottawa reporters are dropping all pretense and calling Justin Trudeau a LIAR - Robert Fife going as far as saying Trudeau is a serial liar

Just like Trump I guess.

[quote] CTV News typically leans conservative, and today you’d be hard pressed to find this story on their web site.

CTV news lead with this story yesterday and today

[quote] GlobalTV News is even more right leaning and it’s the same there.

Its Ottawa reporter David Akin called Justin Trudeau a LIAR on its political show this AM

I don't believe he's a serial liar, R67, or even corrupt, but I do believe he's arrogant.

I agree a lot with what Scott Gilmore had to say.

Again can anyone tell why Conservative MPs shouldn't be looking at new office space in the Government buildings at this moment?

They don't have time to waste consulting with interior designers to set up their new offices in the government buildings.

Gilmore nailed it.

R70 - this is about Trudeau. It's all about Trudeau. The Liberals are known in Canada as the 'Natural Governing Party.' It probably isn't as true as it was but it is still more true than not. Trudeau just needs to go, ideally sooner rather than later. There's no coming back from it now. He's just so self entitled and smug.

The party can retain government with a new leader, probably Freeland, and that will put a new face on it - woman PM, all that. She will probably win them a majority next election. The price might be more concessions to the NDP or even cabinet seats. The Conservatives aren't organized to take over and their lump heads anyway.

I'm amazed this is turning into a thing. It should be a thing, I'm just surprised it is. Maybe he will go. I thought he'd brazen it out, which would hurt the party.

R71 so you want Trudeau to resign

People have to ask themselves, are they Liberals or fans of Trudeau? Which is more important? I'm a Liberal, and yes, I like Trudeau, but it's one stupid thing after another with him, and I"m a Liberal first.

Even him going off to Harrington Lake was stupid. Sure it was no big deal, but it was terrible optics. You can't have the PM telling people day after day to stay home, then run off to another official residence, and THEN have his wife put pics all over instagram. That was fucking stupid, even if it wasn't really breaking Covid rules. It proves his arrogance and his cluelessness.

R73, I'm not R71, but yes, he needs to go. Freeland would never let things like this happen. Guaranteed.

R74 if he doesn't go would you vote Peter MacKay or Jagmeet Singh?

[quote]you keep fucking that chicken OP

Pics please.

It's just so cute when Canadians talk to each other like this. Before you know it, one of you might accuse anther of being a bad person. And suspect that maybe politicians aren't always perfect. And on top of that, one of you might actually decide to say something nasty.

Before anyone accuses me of being a Conservative troll, I volunteered for my Lib MP and campaigned for him twice and so did my mother.

No, R75, I would not, but I would not help with the campaign. I have voted NDP before, but that was when I lived in a different area and it was a race between the NDP and the Cons.

R73, I vote Liberal. Since Covid, my politics have shifted solidly left, from centre centre to centre left. I said upthread I don't think I could ever vote NDP because I don't think the party is able to produce enough competence to govern. I now envision voting Liberal for the rest of my voting days, as infuriating and arrogant and prone to low level corruption as they are. It's part of their nature, but they are basically centre and well intended.

So all that said, yes, I think Trudeau should go. He is ill suited to anything but preening. His judgement is poor. It is time for the grown ups to step in.

I feel very strongly about public cynicism about politics. It is as dangerous as anything in society. It produced Trump. So when it's just cut and dried like this mess, yes, Trudeau should do the honourable thing and step down. And I think he might, either in a rare flash of insight or pushed. Then he and that granola yoga wife of his can swan off and be fabulous and appear or actually do good.

Hey, R77, as a Canadian, let me just say fuck off, eh, asshole?

Happy?

Okay thanks for being honest R79 - sounds to me like you (and R80) would just hold you nose and vote Liberal

The problem is Trudeau is still better than the other two alternatives (MacKay & Singh) and Trudeau knows it - and I would bet the rest of Canada know its, because both MacKay and Singh are not suited to be PM - despite MacKay years in government

After the nursing home debacle during Covid and given the wrongness of income inequity, yes, I feel an obligation to vote Liberal that combines morality with pragmatism. The NDP are a nice idea but so are a lot of things that won't work out well.

And R82, I think you mean the Liberals are better than the alternatives. It's a strong party again. There are lots of options. Though Freeland stands to the fore, she's not the only option.

And don't underestimate the capacity of the Canadian voter to send a punishment message. They can decimate a party. They were so sick of the Conservatives after Brian Mulroney they reduced them to two - 2 - seats in the House of Commons. From government to two seats. It takes a lot to really piss of Canadian voters, but once you have, watch the fuck out, eh.

R83 I don't think we are at that stage yet where is Canada is rushing to vote Conservatives to get rid of Trudeau

and you forget the reason for the Conservatives to be reduced to 2 seats was the rise of the Bloc & Reform Party - I don't see that here - yet

The only way Trudeau would resign is if somehow the Conservatives are polling at 40% and the Liberals were behind the NDP - I don't see that happened - yet

Though anything is possible.

No, no, I am certainly not saying we're at that stage. But if he hangs on, we could get there. ]

Those parties were made viable in part by the two seats. It was a wipeout across the country. Even Ontario and Maritimes. Elsie Wayne and Jean Charest. It wasn't just an accident of alternatives rising. People were furious with the Conservatives.

Exactly my sentiments, R80.

I am sick and tired of defending Trudeau to the point when people at work bitch about him, I don't bother opening my mouth. What's to defend in this case? Nothing. Liberals on Twitter are very active in whataboutisim...it's stupid. Trudeau has to go, and I have a feeling even the party knows that. There was a Liberal MP on one of the news networks the other day and even he said that Trudeau and Morneau were "too close" to the issue.

Singh is irrelevant, MacKay is more of a threat. However, if the NDP become too popular, they can easily split the left vote and that's a problem. If that were to happen, then the Liberals deserve it. Maybe that's what needs to happen in order to get rid of Trudeau and someone less prone to these idiotic scandals can take over.

I don't see how anyone, even the most diehard Liberals are defending him on this one. I've met the man twice, went to functions, and donated, I was a supporter and a believer. No longer until he's gone.

[quote]Liberals on Twitter are very active in whataboutisim...it's stupid.

Party politics need idiots who take it seriously. Look at the Bernie Bros. Somebody's got to hammer in the lawn signs. That's what the faithful do. You couldn't pay me to actually belong to a political party and I admit, as a yute, I voted for Mulroney the first time he led. I know I have voted Conservative provincially (though not for Ford.). I don't do it often. But Covid has convinced me we need smart public spending to increase. I can live with taxes going up, whether it's income or a higher HST. There are things that matter more than money and Covid has exposed that. So it's Liberals for me. Like I said upthread, I lived through the Rae government (which wasn't as bad as everyone remembers) but was bad largely because half the cabinet hadn't finished high school. It is a not a party that attracts strength.

And please Canadians, for the love of god, PLEASE stop comparing what Trudeau does to what Trump and Canadian Conservatives do. They are not some metric for us to hold our PM up against. It's pathetic and desperate and is exactly what Conservatives do.

"Oh, look, Trudeau wore a mask since April, Trump only put one on the other day!! Isn't Trudeau the best??"

"Andrew Scheer went on a plane!!" - said in response to the Harrington Lake stupidity. Who the fuck cares what Scheer did, and whatever Scheer did does not excuse Trudeau from being an idiot.

Well after everything American's have been through with Donald Trump, they would look at this Trudeau scandal and say "This is something he should resign over?" I mean we have Trump own relatives working in the White House and using the paycheck protection program for their own business!

and the irony is the ones that DESPISE Trudeau the most are Canadian Trump Supporters - so while on the one hand they are calling Trudeau Corrupt and a crook, they turn around and defend Trump for pardoning Roger Stone!

That's kind of my point re. R80. Yes, this is something he should resigned over. It is at the very best terribly sloppy but it is also his third strike. He is unsuited to government, if a well intentioned person. He is damaged goods and he threatens the party. The party is more important than him,

He is compromised. The honourable thing is to go.

We cannot let Trump in his corruption and the Republicans in their indifference raised the bar on unethical behaviour so high that it rarely occurs. It just paves the way for the worst to seek and exploit office.

[quote] I am sick and tired of defending Trudeau to the point when people at work bitch about him, I don't bother opening my mouth. What's to defend in this case?

Then don't defend him - but if you are seeking a perfect President or a perfect Prime Minister, I have news for you. Nobody is perfect.

But oh he has to have high standards, be above reproach, have high ethics - Sorry, ever since we have Trump, Doug Ford and Jason Kenney that has all gone out the window. We are in a new world now, thanks to at the start the late Rob Ford to Trump to now Doug Ford. They changed the rules.

You can't put the toothpaste back in the tube - that ship has sailed and politics is a new world now.

It's irrelevant, R90. They are Americans and we are not. They can't vote for Trudeau, MacKay or whoever. It's insane to keep comparing the two since they are not running against each other. If Trump were leader of the CPC, then you'd have an argument. I'm not trying to be rude, but really, it doesn't matter what Americans think of our politics. The extreme Trudeau haters are idiots, and not a good representation of the majority of Canadians either, R90.

I'm not expecting Trudeau to be perfect, R92, but this is too much, he has to go for the good of the party. If the Libs lose it will be because of him, and that won't benefit anyone.

Then the toothpaste has to be put back in the tube.

I do not believe Canadians will stand for it. Our divisions, to the extent they are, are not American divisions. Our divisions can be largely surmounted.

And even if it's a campaign strategy, don't think for a minute the other parties won't be campaigning on restoring trust to government.

Trudeau's problem isn't an incident, it's a pattern and the problem with that is political. It is the Liberal party, not the Trudeau party. Take his ass out the equation and it makes more sense.

R93 R94 then don't vote for Trudeau if you feel that strongly about it - don't defend him, don't donate to him, Just stay home on election day and don't vote if you are so anti-Trudeau.

Now you're being silly, R95. I'm not a member of the Trudeau party, I'm a Liberal, and I want what's best for the party, and he's no longer it. You're right on one thing, unless he's gone, I won't put any effort or money into the next campaign.

Hey OP, go fuck yourself.

That isn't how the system works. You can't not vote for Trudeau if you don't live in his riding. If he is leader of he party, he becomes Prime Minister. If he hangs on when he's damaged he has the potential to damage the entire party and hand government to the Conservatives. The problem is there is not much party loyalty in the country... because parties don't command big membership.

The last number I could find was 300,000 card carrying, due paying Liberals. So that's about 8 or 9% of the population. That's a lot of unaffiliated voters to gamble on.

So R96 you want Trudeau to resign, but he doesn't you would still vote Liberal? I'd have more respect for you if you stuck by your guns and stayed home and NOT vote because Trudeau was leading the party

R97 read [R93] [R94]

R98 Liberal members don't pay for a membership - it is free. So no dues need to be paid.

OK but you follow... 300,000 isn't a lot of faithful.

R99, get the presidential model out of your head. That's not how it works.

R102 then don't vote Liberal if you feel this strongly about it

R103 I know that, but Trudeau is still the leader of the party.

R99, I was a Liberal member before Trudeau was an MP. I can tell you one thing, if he leaves, my riding may swing back to the Liberals.

It is likely many people won't vote Liberal, or won't vote at all, if he is in place and unpopular. Two things damage Canadian parties in the main: scandals or unpopular leaders. Well, three, leaders who become unpopular because of scandals. For me the option is refusing to vote. I may if I can't vote Liberal. Though in my riding I would vote Liberal if I thought the Conservatives would win. Although in my riding they would like shift to the NDP.

It is very strange - during the SNC scandal DLers here were vilifying Trudeau supporters wringing their hands worried about Trudeau losing - saying "Trudeau is not going to lose"

Now DLers are saying the OPPOSE saying Trudeau has to go because he will lose.

Simples, R107: one too many. The pattern. Three strikes you're out. Follow?

R108 I would think Blackface was the third strike, or elbowgate or him groping a woman

We are BEYOND three strikes

It is weird some posters here put ethics a HIGHER reason to resign than wearing blackface so many times, Trudeau can't remember

Honestly, R107, I think this is worse than SNC. I never believed that SNC was that huge of a deal, it seemed like back-room Ottawa politics to me, and this is the third ethics issue Trudeau's had. I don't hate him, and I don't even think he's corrupt, Gilmore is right - he's arrogant.

R111 what if the documentation comes back and it is proven that the public service did indeed recommend WE to run this program

Then what?

He still should have recused himself from a vote on a charity where his wife, mother and brother were engaged. For appearance's sake. It doesn't take a lot of brains to figure that out.

In and of itself, it probably isn't resignation worthy.

But in an increasingly long line.... people lose confidence. How many chances should one guy get? He's never going to be among the greats. His father was. He's not. So how many chances does one of the average ones deserve?

He's not that special. He just has a good ass for a politician.

Drop dead, Trumpette, op.

[quote] How many chances should one guy get? He's never going to be among the greats. His father was. He's not. So how many chances does one of the average ones deserve?

That is up to the voting public - so far I don't see any evidence this is making an impact - yet

R114 read [R93] [R94]

R113 btw the ethics commissioner CLEARED Trudeau wife PRIOR to all this to work with WE

So that is one down.

So what, R117? He and Morneau should have recused themselves.

When people say "This is the third ethics violation..."

Well we have never had a Prime Minister that has had this type of HATE from Conservatives - really, think has there ever been a Prime Minister that have had this many media platforms, websites, twitter & Facebook accounts 100% devoted to taking someone down?

So when people say "This is the third ethics violation..." Trudeau could cross the street and the Conservatives would file a complaint with the ethics commissioner. I'm surprised it hasn't been more than this, with the amount of scrutiny they monitor his every move

When Hillary Clinton said there is a vast right-wing network trying to take Bill Clinton down, well it has been reconstructed here in Canada.

DLers used to laugh when it was said so many people that DESPISE Trudeau and are hell bent on bringing Trudeau down as PM, saying it was ABSURD. Well they are still trying and DLers are starting to believe it

What a bunch of nothing this is. Trudeau haters like OP are really silly little mean gurls, aren't they?

R120 read R93 R94

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz, R121.

R121 read R6.

R122

R93 & R94 are wringing their hands saying for the good of the country and the Liberal Party, Trudeau has to go

You have nothing to say to them?

OMG, R119, can you seriously not see the problem with what happened? He should have recused himself, it's that simple, but he didn't. Don't you see the optics?

You accusing people of being "Trudeau haters" is ridiculous. He made an error again, and like someone else mentioned, it's one of many. Some of us care more for the party than for him. He'll be fine no matter what happens, but will the party and the country? Ask yourself that. Will you be this blindly loyal to the next leader? What if he does step down and Freeland takes over, will you be loyal to her or are you just a Trudeau fan? Are you really a Liberal?

LOL... Justin Trudeau has seen nothing like the hate directed at Trudeau the elder when he was alive and governing. Alberta, Quebec... they were the Barbara Bush of Canadian politics... they knew how to hate.

[quote] Justin Trudeau has seen nothing like the hate directed at Trudeau the elder

Justin Trudeau is on DOUBLE DIGITS of death threats against him in 5 years

how many did Trudeau elder get?

R125 read R120

R126, Justin Trudeau has received a lot of hate, most of it invalid. People like R119 are hyper Trudeau fans and can't distinguish between valid criticism and the far right and far left loons we have in this country.

Answer the question, R128.

R129 read R120

R130 it is for R120 to answer

No, R132, I posed a question to you, in R125. Would you be this loyal to Freeland or whoever takes over the party or are you only loyal to Trudeau?

R133 I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt until see the documentation

Because this came from the Public Service and NOT Trudeau himself - he could say he voted on this because

(1) His wife was cleared by the ethics commissioner for her work she does at WE

(2) Trudeau was UNAWARE his mother & brother got paid by WE. He could have taken it at face value they didn't get anything. He is the PM of Canada - he has ALOT on his plate and it is possible he turned the responsibility of his mothers finances to his brother

So on those points, if he thought NO ONE was getting paid, he probably didn't see a conflict.

I will wait to see what the public service says (as Trudeau said it was THEIR decision to do this) - remember innocent until proven guilty.

R134, I know you're trying, but I'm pretty sure he'd know if his mother was making money by speaking at WE events. Again, I don't think he's as much corrupt as he is arrogant.

He apologized today for not recusing himself.

Even if he didn't, he's a politician with political rivals.

When the Cabinet makes a decision about a big amount of money involving an organization with working relationships with your wife, your mother and your brother, you stand aside for the decision. It's just optics. Which is a big part of politics. But that's the apparent problem with Justin... he thinks he's above it all. It's time to let the grown ups run the country. He's had his glory.

Like someone said, even people involved at low level politics, like school board trustees and municipal councilors, would know to recuse themselves in a similar situation. I stand by my beliefs that he's not corrupt, but this reeks of pure stupidity and arrogance on his and the Liberals part.

The Trudeau family is a plague on Canada.

Oh fuck off, R139.

No I won't "fuck off". I will call out this criminal corrupt piece of shiy PM, the worst Canada has ever had, until the fucker is gone for good.

This isn't Q anon, R141,

[quote] I'm pretty sure he'd know if his mother was making money by speaking at WE events.

R135 do you know how much money your mother has in her bank account. Do you ask her how much money she made last year? According to your logic all adult children should know everything about their parents finances

So please share with us your parents finances here.

[quote] It's time to let the grown ups run the country. He's had his glory.

Then don't vote for him.

[quote] Then don't vote for him.

Sorry, my mistake I meant to say

"If you feel that way, DON'T vote for the Liberal Party, whoever the Liberal candidate might be running in your riding"

Fuck off, R143, I'm sick of you. Of course he knew his mother was being paid, he virtually admitted that today. You don't care about the country or the party, you're just a Trudeau fanboy. I doubt you were even a Liberal before he came along.

He admitted he was in the wrong, he knew his mother spoke at WE events, how dumb do you think he is? I'm pretty sure I'd know if my mother was flying around the country on public speaking engagements. And to answer your question, yes, I know my mother's income. She's retired and collects a private pension, CPP, OAS, and a small amount from her RRIF.

By the way, I have no issue with Maggie speaking at WE or even being paid for her work. This mess is all on her son, it's not fair she's being dragged into this.

Dear R145, by voting for the Liberal candidate in my riding I can assure the grown ups are running things. Not only is Freeland my MP, but Justin won't be running by next time. Damaged goods.

[quote] but Justin won't be running by next time. Damaged goods.

How do you know?

[quote] yes, I know my mother's income. She's retired and collects a private pension, CPP, OAS, and a small amount from her RRIF.

I bet you she has a secret bank account she is hiding from you

R147, R145 is just a Trudeau fan, nothing more. If he were a true Liberal, he'd show some concern about the damage to the party.

I don't know who'll take over the party, I hope it's Freeland though.

R148, you don't think the party wants him out?

Because I know the Liberals passion for power, R148. He's a liability. He will be pushed out if he doesn't flounce under the steam of his own outrage.

I guess even Canada has to have the equivalent of Kamalastans and Hillbots. DL makes me so dismayed over gay intelligence.

Are you going to fawn all over Freeland when/if she takes over, R148, or is your passion only reserved for Trudeau? Please answer instead of directing me to read other posts.

[quote] If he were a true Liberal, he'd show some concern about the damage to the party.

Then why aren't "True" Liberals calling for him to resign. You know as well as I do, they are good at knifing people in back.

[quote] He will be pushed out if he doesn't flounce under the steam of his own outrage.

Where are the calls? Where are the whispers? where are the anonymous items in the paper?

Given the COVID-19 response in the US, I doubt anyone is looking to put the Cond back in power

[quote] Given the COVID-19 response in the US, I doubt anyone is looking to put the Cond back in power

and Justin know that - he might be impulsive, he might believe his own press, but he is NOT an idiot. If you look around, there is no one in the opposition who could defeat him. He knows that and Liberals know that.

Presumably it's all going on behind the scenes. If someone sees an advantage to going public, they will.

I think that's a bit optimistic, R156.... he only delivered a minority last time.

They'll all be looking at the polling and there hasn't been sufficient time to identify a trend.

[quote] They'll all be looking at the polling and there hasn't been sufficient time to identify a trend.

Angus Reid poll had come out taken during this controversy and it has shown the numbers haven't budged - Trudeau still commands high approvals

And Angus Reid is firm that leans Conservative

[quote] he only delivered a minority last time.

After Blackface that was as good as a majority.

You are dense if you don't see that MacKay as a potential threat. He could easily take back the so called red tories who couldn't stomach the idiot Scheer.

Do you think Morneau didn't realize that his daughter working for WE wouldn't be a conflict of interest as well? Or do you not see the arrogance on his behalf as well?? It's all so ridiculous and is rooted in arrogance, which is and always has been the weakness of the Liberals.

[quote] You are dense if you don't see that MacKay as a potential threat. He could easily take back the so called red tories who couldn't stomach the idiot Scheer.

There is significant part of the Conservative base who have said they will never vote MacKay in ten million years. So whatever red tories MacKay would win, he will lose twice as many true blue Conservatives that will move to the Wexit Party of the PPC

This last election the Conservative lost 7 seats due to vote splits with the PPC as some in the Conservative base felt Scheer wasn't Conservative enough!

Justin just needs to be more transparent about things. I suggest he dropped his pants and present hole. That way we can really have a full discussion on the issues we care about with him.

Seriously, three hours ago the charity published an explanation and pulled back from the program that they would have been operating so there was no perceivable conflict.

And what do you say about the people who would vote for MacKay, but not for Scheer, R160? I'm talking about urban dwelling old-school fiscal conservatives?

It begins....One of Trudeau's cabinet ministers, MP Chagger, is saying that she did not know that the PM's family had been paid by WE and states that she should have known and been informed.

In the US, we have impeachment. Is there something similar in Canada tjat's used to get rid a president who has committed serious offenses loke public corruption?

R158, is there anything you can't rationalize? Good as a majority... reach much further and you'll fall into the barrel of shit you've filled.

R158 would be screaming about corruption if the Cons had done something like this. Stop the whataboutism, R158, don't be a Con. Trudeau fucked up, just admit it. I'm not saying not to support the Liberals, but don't make lame excuses for his behaviour.

[quote] And what do you say about the people who would vote for MacKay, but not for Scheer

MacKay has no environmental plan, and if he does have one it will be very similar to Scheer

and many of those Red Tories say they can't vote Conservative if they don't have a credible environmental plan

R165 R166 if this is such and issue for you, then don't vote for the Liberal candidate in your riding.

Leave the rest of us alone.

Can you not grasp, R168, that I have more respect for the party than the self aggrandizing, self satisfied, smug, stupid dilettante who leads them? I will vote Liberal next time and if that moron is still helming the thing I guess he's the fart that spoiled a nice dinner. You're high functioning for what ails you, I'll grant that.

[quote] I will vote Liberal next time and if that moron is still helming the thing

I would have more respect for you if you said you were going to stay home and NOT vote - because at least you would be taking a stand on a point of principle.

R168, stop behaving like a Trump supporter.

If you're too sensitive to handle some much earned criticism of Trudeau, then stop reading this thread. I, along with other posters have every right to criticism him over this one. I'm not a hater, just so you know. I was on his side on the SNC issue, accepted his apology on the blackface scandal, even defended him when he went to Harrington during the lockdown, but this one is too much. He was in the wrong, and now he's damaged goods.

R171 the best way for you to pass your judgement on Trudeau is at the ballot box in the next election.

Liberals today are acting just like Trumpters on Twitter. Attacking journalists (David Cochrane for one) and anyone who says anything negative about Trudeau and WE. So fucking dissapointing.

R170, there is no measure in man or machine that can capture how little your respect matters to me.

I will remember to use that on twitter. Thanks R174

Now it turns out that the government awarded Trudeau's half brother a contract last year.

Link.

R177 it paywalled so no one can read it

Here it is, R178 -

[quote] The federal government awarded Prime Minister Justin Trudeau’s half-brother a $12,430 contract last year to speak and take part in a cryptocurrency conference in Switzerland.

[quote] Kyle Kemper says he was asked to be the “champion speaker” at the Crypto Valley Blockchain Conference in Zug, Switzerland, because of his expertise, and that the contract had nothing to do with his family. Mr. Kemper was previously the executive director of the Blockchain Association of Canada and he wrote a book called The Unified Wallet: Unlocking the Digital Golden Age.

[quote] Mr. Kemper is the son of Margaret Trudeau, the Prime Minister’s mother, from her marriage with Fried Kemper.

[quote] The Prime Minister’s Office said the contract was approved by the public service at Global Affairs Canada and the Prime Minister “had no involvement.” However, opposition MPs said the Liberal government should explain how the contract was awarded. Mr. Trudeau has been under fire for his involvement in awarding management of a $900-million program to WE Charity, which has close ties to the Liberals and Trudeau family members.

[quote] Mr. Kemper said he was invited after Canadian officials heard him speak about blockchain technology at a conference in Dubai. He said they recommended to their colleagues in Switzerland that he speak at a blockchain conference in that country, and so he was invited. The conference took place in June, 2019.

[quote] Blockchain is the technology that underpins cryptocurrencies such as bitcoin. Bitcoin was invented a decade ago and the companies in the sector have only been public for a few years.

[quote] Mr. Kemper spoke at the conference and also ran a booth, he said, where he talked to attendees about the Canadian blockchain industry. He said the $12,430 figure included flights and accommodations.

[quote] “It had nothing to do with family … this is all the work that I do,” Mr. Kemper said. “I literally, because of my family, I can’t do things. Doors are closed. You might think it would be the opposite.”

[quote] Krystyna Dodds, a spokesperson for Global Affairs Canada, said “champions” of the Private Sector Investment Champion Speakers Program (PSICSP) are selected by departmental officials from Global Affairs Canada.

[quote] “The selection criteria for these speakers include their recognition/visibility in the business community, sectoral/subject expertise, and speaking capacity,” Ms. Dodds said.

[quote] NDP MP Charlie Angus said he sees two issues with Mr. Kemper’s speaking gig in Switzerland – one is his connection to the Prime Minister, and the other is that the government hasn’t taken a position on the technology.

[quote] “Once again it’s an example of the Prime Minister’s close family benefiting from their relationship to Justin Trudeau,” Mr. Angus said.

[quote] “It becomes even more questionable when he’s speaking on behalf of a technology he’s promoting that Canada has not formally taken a position on,” Mr. Angus added.

[quote] Michael Barrett, the ethics critic for the Conservative party, said the Liberal government “must fully disclose” how the contract was awarded.

[quote] “As Justin Trudeau’s current $900-million scandal shows, the Prime Minister has a tendency to reward his friends and those close to him. When it comes to taxpayers’ dollars, full accountability and transparency is essential,” Mr. Barrett said, referring to the cancelled WE Charity contract.

[quote] Mr. Kemper maintains his extensive work in the field is what led to the opportunity in Switzerland. In addition to writing a book and his past work for the Blockchain Association of Canada, his LinkedIn page is spattered with experience in that area. In his About section, he wrote that he had his “bitcoin awakening” in 2013.

[quote] “That’s my expertise and I’d love to talk to you all about how blockchain can radically transform Canada and bring about a golden age, I would love somebody’s ear on that because I know I don’t have the ear of the man you’re looking to write about,” he told The Globe.

One of Trudeau's MPs, Nathaniel Erskine-Smith was just on Power and Politics saying that Trudeau should have been more careful regarding the WE scandal. That's the second MP in as many days coming out and speaking against Trudeau's actions surrounding WE. I wonder what's going on behind closed doors?

Here's an outline of the scandal.

The opposition now wants a record Margaret Trudeau's finances/paid speaking gigs going back to 2008!

Liberals MPs filibuster committee motion to review WE Charity payments to Trudeau family

LOL, it went on for hours.

Liberal took a knock in the polls today - they're down five points all because of the WE scandal.

OMFG, Canadian politics? Totally boring!!!

He can't even pick a representative for the Queen. Now the Governor General's gone Meghan Marklie.

Now Bill Morneau, the finance minister "forgot" to pay WE 42 thousand dollars for a family vacation he took with them? Good lord.

Golly and he's in charge of the books!

I can't believe that people on Twitter are defending Morneau and thinking he's a millionaire "who cares." He's a sleazeball.

Hey, OP, Trudeau is down even further in the polls. The Cons and the NDP are going to squeeze the life out of the story so it's not going away any time soon.

Apparently the Keilberger brothers were their usual smarmy selves during their appearance yesterday.

Are they usually smarmy, R191? I know nothing about them, but they kind of struck me as a bit smug and their charity sounds a bit scammy, especially since it came out that they laid off several employees and their board of directors resigned under suspect circumstances.

They’ve been feted as altruistic child prodigies since they first emerged with their first good deed. Like Just stand there self righteousness has gone to their heads. Don’t question us. We can do no wrong. All we do is right. You can’t sit with us unless you’re exactly like minded. And that’s how you end up in mess like this. It’s not that serious, it’s just the judgment. And that suffers from fat heads.