Is it legal for individual chain pharmacy locations to invent their own refill schedules

Your question is technical, and when dealing with technicalities, it's rule-specific. We need to know where you live, and the specific nature of the guidelines, and what the pharmacy is doing with your fills. Anything else is speculation.

Walgreens and CVS basically own all retail pharm in the USA now so I’d say yeah, they can do whatever they want and no one can stop them.

RIP mom n pop pharmacies

I was notified by the app that two of my scripts were Ready To Refill on the 28th. So I submitted those refills. I got a confirmation email that they would be ready yesterday, at 1pm. Other than that confirmation email, every trace of that transaction was erased from my account. I went to the pharmacy today. Sat in line for the drive-thru for 50 minutes, only to be told that this particular store has made it their "policy" to only refill scripts 24hrs before the 30, 60, 90-day, etc. script timeline. Thus, my refill submissions were trashed. Zero notification of this "policy" nor that they do not adhere to state pharmacy board guidelines nor will they fill requests prompted by and submitted through their own corporate app, if those are made more than 24hrs before the absolutely last minute.

I agree that it’s bullshit, OP.

its ugly out there in Pharma world, but if i had to do it all over again, i would have become a pharmacologist..

we can thank drug addicts for a lot of this red tape, they would game the system to get their oxy and whatever else.

[quote] I was notified by the app that two of my scripts were Ready To Refill on the 28th. So I submitted those refills. I got a confirmation email that they would be ready yesterday, at 1pm. Other than that confirmation email, every trace of that transaction was erased from my account. I went to the pharmacy today. Sat in line for the drive-thru for 50 minutes, only to be told that this particular store has made it their "policy" to only refill scripts 24hrs before the 30, 60, 90-day, etc. script timeline

This has been CVS policy for controlled medication for some time.. If I try to refill my sleeping pill or muscle relaxant more than 24 hours before the renewal date, CVS says “Thank you. Goodbye” and hangs up.

If I’m putting in a renewal for a non-controlled medication, I can put the order in for it but when they ask when would I like to pick it up, I must choose a date more than 24 hours away.

For example, if I want to renew my Lunesta on the 24th & it’s not due until the 26th, CVS won’t let me request a refill.

But if I want to renew my blood pressure medicine on the 24th so I can make sure it’s available in the 26th, I can put in the request for renewal on the 24th & when they ask me the date & time whenI want it ready I say “1pm Monday the 26th” they’ll accept the refill request.

I’ve never had CVS text me a time & date to pick up my medication unless it was refilled & is there waiting for me. They may text me asking if I want them to call my dr to renew my medication because the renewal date is a week away and there aren’t any refills.

But they only text that I have a medication ready to pick up if it’s the renewal date & it’s there.

R3 - did you have anything remotely close to a narcotic? Sounds to me like the Pharmacist did not set out to be one.

Rite Aide does that too and since April 1st they will not deliver controlled drugs including Ambien. It really sucks. I have to go to the store and am high risk, can't wear a mask

My CVS has never allowed delivery of controlled substances. Not Ambien, notTylenol #3 - nothing that’s a scheduled drug. Because assholes would claim the delivery person substituted Tylenol for their sleeping pills & make a big stink demanding another bottle.

If it’s legal for stores to make their own whimsical refill schedules, why does the app/site only follow the legal state guidelines? Why would they design a fucking app with the intent of customer refill requests being deleted after confirmation? Also, what kind of idiot runs a business that makes it more difficult for customers to give you money? I do not believe it is legal for pharmacies to make up their own refill schedules, maybe it hasn’t been challenged, but there is a legal board that sets those dates.

[quote] If it’s legal for stores to make their own whimsical refill schedules, why does the app/site only follow the legal state guidelines?

They don’t make their own refill schedules. Your doctor writes an the rx for a 30 day supply of Aldactone, and gives you 2 refills.

It is filled. The next refill is 30 days from the day it is filled.

They don’t make the refill date. 30 days.

But they can give you a time period during which you can *request a refill* of the RX.

They might say you can only request a refill *on the date it is scheduled* to be refilled, meaning you can request a refill at12M of the day it is due for renewal.

Or you might be able to request a refill only *24 hours before the date* it will be renewed, so you can order it at 12M the day before renewal date, eg at 12M on the 20th for a drug that will be refilled the 21st.

If they say you can’t request a refill more than 24 hours before its renewal date, there’s nothing wrong with that. They’re not messing with your Rx. You can still get it renewed on the 30th day from the last time it was filled. You just *can’t request* a refill of a controlled substance, for example, more than 24 hours before the renewal date,

So don’t put in a request on the 23rd to please renew your Ambien & have it for you on the 25th.

But you might be able to put in a request for a refill of your blood pressure medication on the 23rd for the 25th, just to be sure it’s ready, because it’s not a controlled substance.

r12, clearly you either did not read or did not comprehend the previous posts I've made in this thread.

Dispensing guidelines always give pharmacists a degree of discretion in dispensing drugs. This is probably enough to permit the creation of store-specific rules.

OP hasn't mentioned if the prescription is/isn't for a controlled substance yet.

Obviously it was a glitch in the system. It happens. It is a major annoyance but such is the stuff of life.

OP, I mostly get my Rxs from Caremark by mail, and they do check how frequently you get a refill. I once made a note to myself, that Caremark would refill a 90-day supply of whatever Rx after 68 days, and not one day sooner.

My doctor once accidentally sent a new script to the local pharmacy, instead of to Caremark. CVS is less fussy than Caremark, even if they are the same company. My sense is that my CVS would be willing to fill any script prematurely as long as they don’t have to deal with the insurance company. I’m on a Vitamin D Prescription, and it’s not covered by insurance, so I get it from CVS. So, “yes”, OP, they can make their own schedule.

I get my mom's drugs from CVS. One of her meds is an opioid. That one, we can't get filled more than 24 hours in advance of the prior prescription running out. Plus, we have to pick it up in person and show ID. The recurring problem we have is getting the doctor's office to send the prescription over, and CVS to not lose it in their system. I've had to leave and phone the doctor's office more than once to get the logjam broken (and both parties pointing the finger at the other). However, the last time there was a screwup AFTER I'd been notified it was ready for pickup. And my mom really needed that pain medication. I let them know I was very distressed that my elderly mom would have to go without at least till the next day, but I didn't get loud or dramatic. The pharmacist hesitated, then said, "Okay." And he filled the prescription on the spot, telling me he'd just watch for the new prescription to show up in their system the next day.

Her regular meds have a 7-day refill window. I tried getting an early refill on a couple to minimize the number of trips I'd need to pick up her meds, but they told me if we wanted the medication more than one week before the scheduled refill, her insurance wouldn't cover it at all, meaning I'd have to pay for it all. I decided it could wait.

A tangent that I think is funny:

When I moved to Boston in the late 1980s, there were still a lot of Blue Laws. There were a lot of dry-towns. No alcohol sales on Sunday, etc. There happened to be a mom & pop pharmacy close by where I lived. It had a Prohibition-Era allowance to sell beer anytime, because alcohol was considered a medical necessity.

In Connecticut as late as 1970, nightclubs had to close on Saturday/Sunday at midnight, because the weren’t allowed to sell alcohol on Sunday.

CVS will not refill my Xanax one day early. I had to plan my trips around their schedule. Sucks.

CVS has been on a power trip lately.

Yes, Yes, we get it. The pharmacy is under no obligation to do anything prior to the date.

OP got waxed on the app. He made a trip to store for no reason. I am surprised that the company allowed the order. Forget the money, who wants to deal with upset customers. An Asurion rep was talking about changing departments. She commented on the fact that once you get past the "upset", most people can follow instructions. I was struck how difficult customers were the default. No wonder some of them bite back..

I was surprised that you could buy codeine over the counter in France. Sorry about that happening to you OP. If you raise too much hell, they will probably accuse you of "drug seeking". By the way, what were those prescriptions?

r16, it's happened two months in a row, but last month I was told someone had "put a hold on it". This month, they tell me "it's store policy". The pharmacy emails me when the scripts are 'Ready For Refill'. I respond to that, refill via app, am sent confirmation texts/emails of my refill submission. And now this store is saying they set their own refill dates that don't correspond at all with the state guidelines or their own site/app, which uses those state guidelines to notify customers that it's 'Time To Refill Your Prescription'.

It’s obvious we’re talking CVS and a Benzo/Opioid/Amphetimine type Rx. Walgreens is strict, but not that strict, even on controlled, schedule 3’s, so it’s the CVS policy he’s so well versed in.

He’s not trying to pick up his fenofibrate or lisinopril or a motion sickness patch.

I took opioids for ten years and over that time the regulations 1) became stricter and 2) changed constantly. It is the price you pay for taking those drugs. You will not win any dispute over refill policy when it comes to controlled substances. It's just the way it is. It's not even worth complaining about.

Someone here is sure interested in changing the subject.

What is the subject? Your question was answered in r1. You haven't provided any details that would clarify your situation or location. Of course we're going to assume it involves a controlled substance.

must be different in flyovertown, here in NY we can’t get refills on benzos. If you need more your prescriber needs to send a new script. I get a 60 supply, there’s no refills ever. My blood pressure medicine has like 3 refills.

We also don't know where OP lives. But I was going to say something similar to what R14 said. Pharmacy regs and medical regs in general allow some weaseling by the staff depending on circumstances, and whether they are sick of you whining for your Adderall, you junky whore.

I think the opiod crisis was a perfect opening for the Tsk Tsk crowd to finally be able to judge you out loud.

The “opioid situation” as R30 put it has been a total nightmare for legitimate chronic pain patients with untreatable illnesses and intractable pain.

Elderly people who have irreversible spinal damage that cannot by fixed by multiple surgeries (like my dear great uncle) are treated like crap by pharmacists, doctors, etc. and are constantly under threat of any one of those entities or some random government agency taking away the only thing that gives him a brief respite from 24/7 pain.

And then you have politicians and agencies like the CDC that want to make *any* pain medication essential illegal—regardless of circumstances—and are putting pressure *hard* on any doctor that dares “prescribe” anything other than yet another surgery (even if the patient in question has already endured multiple painful surgeries that did *nothing* to fix the fucked up spine) or aleve, Advil, Tylenol or some other OTC medication that does nothing.

They just think crippled people in chronic pain with long histories and a pile of MRIs to prove it should suffer in silence and die early deaths or even kill them selves because they can do nothing in their lives without being in physical pain—pain that *never* goes away.

It’s evil. The CDC, media, and other “anti-drug/public safety!advocates” purposely conflated the statistics of heroin and other drug and alcohol (mixed together) overdoses and injuries with statistics regarding the few deaths that resulted from genuine druggies somehow getting ahold of prescriptions (often on the street by the way, not always even through doctors) and the occasional pain patient who misused their medications and presented these merged statistics (unknown to the public) as “the opioid epidemic” allegedly caused 100% by chronic pain patients with legitimate medical issues who allegedly became heroin junkies on the street or killed entire cities by making everyone heroin addicts.

This claim by special interest groups using purposely misleading statistics and outright lies over the past few years has led to a bunch of chronically physically ill patients with legitimate needs being treated like criminals with their medication always on the verge of being banned or their doctor being too scared of various government agencies to even try to treat their suffering patients with anything besides aspirin Tylenol or recommendations for acupuncture(!)

Continued....

R31, Continued:

My great uncle is a law abiding veteran (and always has been) with a fucked up spine and an incurable degenerative illness (meaning it will get progressively worse) and his life has been made hell over the past few years by all of these new (seemingly never ending) insane, draconian “consumer protection laws” aimed at street heroin addicts.

His doctor said to expect no relief very soon because he just can’t deal with the harassment from various government agencies to stop prescribing “any opioids” (regardless of individual patient condition or medical history) and just prescribed “alternatives” like aleve and acupuncture.

My great uncle feels so screwed by the government and media hysteria about “opioid epidemics” and doesn’t know how long he can last if he’s confined to a body filled with unrelenting pain 24/7 because some bureaucrats decided to get in the way of the doctor/patient relationship with people experiencing pain that they themselves could never dream about or handle for 24 hours.

He says he may just kill himself if he is sentenced to pain with no chance of legal relief ever because of government meddling. He is out of surgeries and options and I feel so bad for him.

His life is already hard enough (he’s never totally pain free even *with* the little bit of pain relief he is currently able to get) and I can’t imagine that he’ll do if he is confined to bed 24/7 with nothing but pain.

The CDC, anti-pain patient doctors, “well meaning” anti-prescription drug activists, and “opioid hysteria” media types and similar pharmacists should have to experience 24/7 incurable pain with no relief since they have no problem sentencing others to this life and think “it’s no big deal...just do some yoga!”

These people are soulless and deserve no mercy as they give none to the most vulnerable and desperate in our society.

And guess what? Even with all of these insane regulations on medical patients, *real* heroin (opiates) addicts are *still* doing real heroin. Ever been to the subways in San Francisco? Ever seen the needles all over the streets in that city?

Chronic pain patients need advocates and support inside and outside the medical community, and right now *nobody*—including the medical community as a whole, pharmacists and corporate pharmacies, the media (especially the hyperventilating media), the lovely compassionate and corruption-free CDC, and all of these recent *hysterical* “pain pill and legal medication for the truly wounded = heroin addicts on the street!” panic activists—has seemed to give a fuck about them and seemingly just wants them to curl up in a ball in pain and go die somewhere....but quietly please, as they don’t want to be disturbed by the inconvenient fact of their real pain or even their existence....

P.S. There has been such a persecution of injured and chronic pain patients by pharmacies and rogue pharmacists in particular, that there is now an actual law firm that does nothing but sue pharmacies that *refuse* to fill legitimate pain prescriptions given to chronic pain patients by their own doctors. That’s how crazy this insane “opioid hysteria” has become!

R31. I agree wholeheartedly with your assessment. Ever since 2012ish there has been an unrelenting crackdown (no pun intended) on re-scheduling entire classes of meds that were freely prescribed for anxiety and insomnia. ALL benzodiazepines are now controlled substances. These are NOT opioids. All sleeping pills are now controlled substances. These medications have absolutely nothing to do with opioids. The FDA can override any MD who is trained and actually sees th pt in person.

I believe this has happened completely as a cost-saving measure. Ever since Obamacare, the powerful medical insurance lobby has found ways to shave down costs. Humane, modern treatment procedures be damned. They are going to make a profit! It's also a matter of liability predominately as well.

Not trying to link this to Covid-19, but PPE is considered lost leaders. Hence, they are now in short supply. I can only pray and hope this changes with our new incoming Dem administration. But, I doubt it

All very interesting and I have many thoughts on the subject and how it correlates with this country's Puritanical founders; the ingrained notion in many, if not most Americans, that any pleasure is 'sinful'; the hypocrisy of treating chronic pain conditions any differently than diabetes or cancers; "well meaning" and thoroughly misguided 'addiction specialists' who are still locked into theological treatments for scientific problems; the state of medical education in the country, etc. This would all be an interesting topic to start a thread about.

But I started this thread to ask if a private business can override established state law on whim. The implication given to me by the pharmacist was that they had done this for their own convenience and no other reason. For months prior to CV19, no matter how far ahead one submitted routine refills at this specific pharmacy, nothing ever got filled. Further, no one answers the phone there, no matter the time of day and everyone behind the pharmacy desk bitches and moans about being understaffed, which they most likely are -- again as a corporate cost cutting measures. But none of those things would seem to me to override established law. So, that's my question. Are poorly run businesses allowed to break laws because they're too incompetent to follow them? Is that now the status quo in America?

R35. My answer to your question is Yes. At this time with the lockdown, the answer is Yes, because workers are not required to work. I don't think it's whimsical, but businesses are able to flex some rules/laws due to these extreme circumstances.

Corporations are this country's highest life form, and their rights supersede those of human beings, R35. I'm surprised that you are even asking this question.

r36, the pharmacist claimed *this has always been their policy*, which it simply hasn't been, but that's what he was sticking to.

r37, we're not talking about Big Pharma buying off Supreme Court judges so they decide permanently disabling side effects, including death, caused by generic drugs cannot be sued over. And we're not talking about Big Frack buying off the EPA to allow poison be dumped in the drinking water. These are fucking state pharmacy board decisions that an individual pharmacy manager at one of thousands of pharmacies in the state is deciding simply aren't convenient for him or his staff, so they're going to ignore them.

This thread is an EST and you can tell because the OP doesn't tell us the most important parts of the story:

The pharmacy in question

The state where this is happening

And what she is prescribed.

R39, I’m not telling you details because this board is infested with lunatic stalkers. No one should be giving away details about themselves on this board. You’d have to be an absolute idiot to do so.

Making matters worse:

1. Walgreens and CVS now control 99%+ of the pharmacies in the US

2. Most health insurance plans only have one of the two "in network", so for all intents and purposes, it's a nominal duopoly that's a de-facto monopoly. If you're unhappy with the customer service of your insurer's chosen PBM, fuck you... you can't take your business elsewhere. And even if you have an Obamacare policy instead of an employer policy & go out of your way to sign up for one that has the desired chain "in network", they can unilaterally change it at will with 30 days' notice and a form letter, and it's NOT considered grounds to let you re-enroll with a different insurer.

It's always fun trying to fill my last & first Adderall prescription (or two) of the year, because they almost ALWAYS have shortages... and when it happens, filling it can turn into a multi-day minefield. They won't tell you they don't have it until after you've gone in person, waited in line, and they've done 5 minutes of verification, identity-checking, and consultations with the one very busy Pharmacist. Then, if you go to "too many" stores unsuccessfully trying to fill it, they'll flag you in the system as "drug-seeking", and start telling you "they don't have it" EVEN IF they do.

It's like playing a game where you not only can't "win", they won't even tell you the game's actual rules, or even be honest and confirm that you ARE hopelessly losing. They ding you for going to a store besides the one closest to your house, even when they KNOW that one is out & have it documented that you went there first. They ding you for trying "too hard" to fill a prescription, but won't even allow you to try filling it until you're down to your last dose. It's insane.

It's the "lied-to after being flagged" part that's the worst, because THEN you're just wasting your time AND getting your punishment-time extended every further time you try... with no acknowledgment that you're BEING punished, for how long, or even why (unless a pharmacist finally take pity on you & quietly informs you, against company policy).

And keep in mind... these policies automatically kick in, without regard to REASON, even when all the humans involved KNOW you've gone store to store & been "refused" because the drug was SOLD OUT. The software doesn't care.

Oh... and some CVS pharmacies will take your prescription, say they'll order it for you, then... get more, and give it to someone else who showed up with a prescription before you came back to get it... assuming they even bothered to let you know it arrived, and didn't "lose" your prescription

R41, Yeah I can’t imagine why they would flag you as ‘drug seeking’ at all! That’s just weird.

My Harris Teeter always has adderall in stock.

And now I just found out that lying scumbag pharmacist from yesterday did not schedule the scripts for delivery as he claimed he would. So, now they aren’t going to show up until a day after I run out.

Even if it were illegal, the OP wouldn't do anything about it. He'd sit and complain and bitch and do nothing.

There are two types of people in the world, those who whine and bitch about something and those who actually DO something about thing.s.

Long story short, med-seeker OP, if the pharmacy is giving you a hard time and screwing around with you, make a complaint to the state board of pharmacy.

You’re so disappointed I won’t give you details to harass me with.

R47, You've given us plenty OP!

Yes, once you are flagged for a legitimate reason or NOT, the pharmacy has an ability to contact the prescribing physician and flag him/her too. Nowadays, with all prescriptions entered in a nationally-based computer tracking network, you are SOL! Plain and simple. Mind you, this sanctioned breach of privacy of a very sacred relationship (doctor/patient) was passed in about 2012 on behalf of YOUR best interest. That's right, they/whoever knows what's best for you. This is so that if you are taken by ambulance, the EMTs have your drugs pop up on their screen.

More pointedly: Pain or discomfort cannot be allowed to get in the way of making a profit.

This is why I buy online. My personal doctor knows that this is just another way to squeeze more blood from a rock.

How about this? My daughter takes an injectable once a week. I purchase insulin syringes at the same time that I pick up the prescription, but sometimes I stop by the pharmacy counter and get them a la carte. Never been a problem. ONE DAY, the pharmacist refuses to sell me any syringes without a prescription. New York State law, she says.

I said “I need the syringes to inject the drug you’re about to hand me.” NOPE. “How do I administer this drug to my daughter without them?” Tell your doctor he needs to write a prescription for syringes.

I had to go to another CVS twelve blocks away, where they sold me syringes without issue.

The doctor’s office had never heard of that being a problem and gave me a hard time about writing the prescription.

If it is Adderall you need, just find some Meth. It's not that hard to find and while it is very dangerous some of the negative hype is on reefer madness levels of exaggeration.

Guidelines are usually arbitrary. Look at the bullshit opening criteria that Trump put out. The states can open when THEY are ready. We recommend that you are at this level of safety first. But you do you, Georgia. The only legal dictate in your case is actually dispensing the medication as prescribed. There is nothing on the script that says when refills will be filled. If you make the argument about the state board guidelines not being followed you will be labeled a seeker. LOL at R42.

It really is the many over the few. And sadly, it is easy to point a finger at the addicts and their doctors that created this problem. And the drug companies and the list goes on. It is out of hand. But if it was my decision between watching whole towns destroyed by truckloads of opiates being trucked into their communities and strictly following the instructions on a script, I know which one I would pick.

[QUOTE] how it correlates with this country's Puritanical founders; the ingrained notion in many, if not most Americans, that any pleasure is 'sinful'

that’s why I hate US Protestants

[QUOTE] This is why I buy online.

and you’re paying full out of pocket? and you’re trusting the medicine is real? and the packages never get apprehended? and you don’t need a physician supervising this?