Who’s Watching FX’s “Mrs. America”?

Wait, Cate Blanchett did an FX show?!

Yep and she’s the executive producer. The show is critically acclaimed.

It's only on Hulu? Fuck Hulu.

Tracey Ullman and Amy Sedaris never working together will always be a crime. Those two were made to play sisters.

Why does Elizabeth Banks keep getting work. No one I know likes her.

Thanks! Something new to watch!

She gets trolled here a lot, but Cate Blanchett is one of my favorite Kates and one of my favorite actresses.

I like Cate Blanchett, but why is she doing a show called "Mrs. America"? I know her father is from Texas and she's half American, but she's mostly Australian and has an Australian accent.

So why would she be doing a show like this?

I'm probably still going to watch it though. And why is it on hulu when it's supposed to be on FX?

for the elderpervs: James Marsden also in it

I wanted to watch this, but got pissed when they said it was only on Hulu

I love Hulu, it's the service I watch most often.

This looks great but after the first three-episode drop they go back to one per week until the end of May. I'm going to hold off until then so I can watch the whole thing straight through.

Australians play Americans really well. That goes for Cate too. It's a great show, all the acting is great but the woman who plays Shirley Chisholm deserves an Emmy.

I love it. I’m savoring it. It’s perfect. I only know Schaflfy (she doesn’t deserve good spelling) from Milk. And this just so clearly shows how conservative women screw over everyone else to satiate their thirst for power and attention- really attention because that’s all they are taught to value.

And the costumes and sets are perfection. And I wish I was Rose Byrne.

[quote]the woman who plays Shirley Chisholm deserves an Emmy.

it's Uzo...Uzo Aduba!

Not interested. Especially if it's on Hulu. I don't pay to still be stuck having to watch commercials. And don't give me the no-commercials pricing tier bullshit. If you want money from me, fine, but then don't double dip and also get money from advertisers.

She’s playing a woman, not the statue of liberty, R7. Calm your patriotic panic down.

In case you didn’t know, the male lead on FX’s “The Americans” was played by Welsh actor Jonathan Rhys.

To answer your question of why an Australian actor would play an American...for a paycheck? Because the role is well written? Plenty of reasons.

Uzo Aduba already has too many undeserved Emmys.

But Uzo does really well on this. She's even better than Cate (who is excellent). I admit that I didn't know much about the history behind the second wave of feminism and I had no idea Friedan and Steinem clashed as much as they did.

What episode are thy up to?

I can’t think of a more boring topic. No, not going to watch it.

Does the show kinda feel like "Mad Men"? It seems to be from that time period in America.

Matthew Rhys, not Jonathan.

Tracey has her own episode, the fourth, I believe. They filmed the clash between her and Phyllis where she told her she should be burned at the stake. Friedan went nuts on stage and never lived it down. I loved how they brought up Betty’s anti-lesbian views in the very first episode. lol. Friedan was such a character.

Cate does such a great job in this so far and her accent is flawless, not a hint of a slip (Nicole Kidman please take note).

R23, she plays Phyllis without that "tick tick tick" thing Katherine Hepburn said that Streep always does.

This is terrific thus far. Cate Blanchett is absolutely ace! The rest of the casting is mostly great. Looking forward to the episodes to come.

Does it help erase her positively horrid performance as Kate Hepburn?

What is this FX on Hulu bullshit? I assume they will show it on regular FX eventually.

On FX in Canada. Really enjoying it. Cate is fantastic in it. Kudos to Tracey Ullman and Uzo Aduba also.

“So... who wants to nominate me?”

lmao.

On the topic of Phyllises (Phylli?) - does anyone else think the Republican bitch styling of Cate suggests she would work well as Phyllis in FOLLIES? Can Cate sing?

I almost watched MRS. AMERICA.

But then I remembered: I have a dick and balls.

Hulu is actually the best ( yeah yeah I know Disney owns it) it gets the cool stuff first like Portrait of a Lady On Fire, Parasite ,Golden Girls, first season of Handmade’s Tale, new episodes on The Simpson’s and Bob’s Burgers, a little known movie that should be a classic Border and many more. I hear the Fires series is good but I haven’t gotten around to watching it..

Breaking Bad is considered the best series ever. Some maybe consider Sons of Anarchy the second best. Both have been on FX.

R31 you remind me of pretentious friend I have. His husband and him have decided to stop watching TV because they want to get used to it Incase it doesn’t exist anymore. Two very dumb reasons.

THAT’s TRACEY ULLMAN?! I can’t believe it- she’s perfect. I’m a millennial but I watched her sketch show on hbo, I’m blown away.

Bella Abzug's "You wrote a book ten years ago" in response to Betty Friedan saying "I am the movement!" was hilarious

Martindale is brilliant in this. I'm looking forward to seeing Bette Midler in the same role when The Glorias is released

Growing up Catholic in St. Louis in the '60s-'70s, Schlafly was looked up to and lauded in the community as someone on the right side of things. No bra burner, she. Terrible fucking hypocrite, wanted all the power she could get while trying to keep other women down. Also a dedicated homophobe, but that didn't keep her self-hating gay son from working for her, nor did she ever change her views in response to her son's orientation.

I’ll wait. It will show up elsewhere eventually.

I already subscribe to Comcast cable, Amazon Prime, Netflix, HBO, Showtime, not to mention the NYT and Washington Post. This shit adds up to a lot, a lot, a lot of money. If anything, I’m going to start cutting back, not adding more subscriptions.

I stopped watching. Found it depressing. In these times I’m looking to watch more escapism than grim reality.

Who the hell is Phyllis Schlafly?

not me, love cate but not gonna watch any more of the right wing shit than i have to. the news is full of them already

This woman sounds like she was a damn Devil. I remember when she died, DL celebrated.

I had no idea who she was until she she died. Yeah, I'm young.

Jesse Helms and this cunt's are graves every gay man should dance on.

She will terrorize her.

I think it's great and reasonably historically accurate. Neither side is shown in their best light which is done purposely. Great casting, acting and sets if you like that kind of thing. Rose Byrne is doing a great Gloria.

What happened to John Slattery's face? Eek.

I remember when I was a child in the 70s noticing how Schlafly had a big effect on politics, and definitely on the ERA. Her opposition was kind of a Hail Mary considering how close the amendment came to being ratified.

Couldn’t they find an actress to look as fugly as the real Friedan? The other feminists weren’t bad looking, but Friedan...

Hulu has turned out to be more entertaining than Netflix or Amazon Prime.

I watched the first episode. By the third, I was bored.

I like Blanchett a lot, she's a great actress, but lately she's been "acting" her characters rather than "becoming" them. It's strange, not sure what's going on.

The show is a 6.5/10 so far.

I'm going to download the series and binge over a weekend.

So far I grabbed up to E3-Shirley.

It's not the most exciting of series but it's well-made, very well-acted and I'll admit I knew nothing about the story. I'm too young to have lived through it and I'm British so American political history isn't my strong point.

Has Character Actress Margo Martindale ever put a foot wrong ever?

I'm tired of America.

People will be watching this when a Democratic Congress removed the closure date on the ERA and sends it to President Biden for a signature.

It sounds like the kind of series Ryan Murphy would make. Tell me it’s better than one of his shows.

I was actually surprised Murphy didn't do it.

I'm into it, but it's a little too pro-Phyllis who was an awful awful human being.

I don't see it as being pro-Phyllis at all. It empathizes with her regarding her own struggles--look at how casually she is dismissed by many of the men around her--but it sides with the feminists.

Too long and drawn out. I felt the same way about Bette and Joan. Both concepts would have worked better as two hour movies, but a number of episodes is overkill. Not every little nook and cranny needs to be told.

Casting is pitch perfect for this, though.

[quote] What happened to John Slattery's face? Eek.

Oh, yes. Did he have himself pulled too tightly? What happened?

In honor of this show:

[quote] Why does Elizabeth Banks keep getting work. No one I know likes her.

That is a dirty LIE. I know her and like her very much.

[quote] People will be watching this when a Democratic Congress removed the closure date on the ERA and sends it to President Biden for a signature.

It needs a lot more than a friendly Congress and President. It’s an amendment to the constitution.

I was involved with the women's movement in my late teens and I met both Gloria Steinem and Bella Abzug at the NOW convention in Philadelphia in 1975. So I'm almost afraid to watch it. I'm reasonably sure I'll be disappointed.

I don't think any fictional adaptation can capture the energy that existed for feminists and lesbian/feminists back then. It was similar to the freedom that came with what we used to call "the gay liberation movement," with which I was also involved.

I don't care what you young'uns have to say -- we boomers knew how to start a political movement and make real changes happen in this country.

Those were the days.

R5 I guess casting for directors like her. She was spot on as the bitchy, Megyn Kelly esque Avery in 30 rock. Other than that I have never found her particularly compelling.

Margo Martindale needs to get a better agent. While Sarah Paulson gets an "And Sarah Paulson" for playing a composite character, Margo is just mixed in with the rest of the cast for playing a real person.

R60, Steinam, Azbug, Chisholm, Friedan, etc. were not Boomers. It wasn't Boomers starting these movements, Boomers just love to take all the credit.

I'm bothered by how much they are and will likely continue to sugarcoat just how awful Schlafly was/is, but there is an important lesson for leftists/progessives in this story: never underestimate how deep the racist/misogynistic opposition runs in this country. The minute these women wrote off Schlafly as just some nutter they sealed their fate.

Ten hours of screeching fraus.

I'll pass.

First episode was interesting.

Was Schafly vaguely this human early on or was she always a hideous cunt?

Another tiresome Tracey Ullman performance. More mannerisms and tics. Yes, dear, we know that you can do flat Midwestern American accents.

r66 Tracey struck comedy gold 20 years ago with Ruby Romaine, makeup artist to the stars. She has done nothing remotely as good since then.

I've gone through 2 episodes. It's a bit boring. There's not enough "there" there. Cate is playing an ice queen, Rose is playing a free spirit. The show needs less of that and more good looking men.

[quote] we boomers knew how to start a political movement and make real changes happen in this country.

Like not getting the ERA passed. Oops.

[quote] Tracey struck comedy gold 20 years ago with Ruby Romaine, makeup artist to the stars. She has done nothing remotely as good since then.

Uh, Dame Judi Dench and Angela Merkel would like a word.

r59 bootsie, It has already passed the states approval requirement. All it needs is a Congress to remove the closures date and send it to Biden if the Senate flips and Biden is elected.

I love Cate and love a good historical bio miniseries BUT I don't want to watch that cunt Phyllis Schlafly be celebrated.

And if she's not portrayed continuously as a cunt or doesn't get a horrific comeuppance at the end, not interested.

R70 I LOVED ALL of Tracey's characters on that first hbo show, but Angela and Judi really miss the mark for me.

[quote] [R59] bootsie, It has already passed the states approval requirement. All it needs is a Congress to remove the closures date and send it to Biden if the Senate flips and Biden is elected.

Not true, unless you a) accept the ratifications after the ratification deadline AND SIMULTANEOUSLY b) reject all the rescinded ratifications that occurred after the ratification deadline, which seems like having your cake and eating it too.

Allowing the congress to play games with the state ratification process like that subverts the clear purpose of the constitutional process. It’s not a process I like — as a teen I helped advocate for the ERA — but it is what it is.

And even if you get a friendly Congress that will interpret aall of this exactly as you want, well, good luck getting it past the Supreme Court, especially this one. It’s not happening.

^^^ “b) reject all the rescinded ratifications that occurred *before* the ratification deadline,”

God, Phyllis Schlafly was such a smug, condescending bitch. This was all before my time, and I'm enjoying it. Schlafly's whole thing was women staying home and being good little housewives. Flash-forward to the 21st century and most families can't afford to do that anymore. Schlafly's whole position/philosophy became completely irrelevant, due to simple economics.

You bitches don't know how to watch shit online for free? Where have you been for the last dozen or so years?

[quote]Has Character Actress Margo Martindale ever put a foot wrong ever?

Not that I've ever seen. She's a wonderful actress.

It's actually a very good show. They don't portray these women as arch anything but rather as real flawed people but I have to single out Tracey Ullman in a cast that is really excellent. She has the ability to completely transform herself and it is uncanny.

Schlafly was such a fucking hypocrite. She outsourced the raising of her own children and had household help. But argued that a 'woman's place was. in the home'.

I do love the subtle asides about having to get her husband's permission to get a credit card. And the way she threw her poor dear husbandless. sister in law under the bus when she was giving. her speech about woman's finest glory being to serve her man and bear children.

She is NOT being celebrated, R72.

Schlafly's position was not that a woman's place was in the home. Her position was that men and women are different and have different roles to fulfil. The issues are not as black and white as some of you make them. She was fighting against things like unisex bathrooms, a problem that we still have today. She wasn't the demon some of you make her out to be.

Are you kidding r81? She was a vile person.

You can’t get more good looking actors than James Marsden. Sadly he’s pushing 50 and hasn’t given humanity a good nude scene. I also like Neicy Nash and all Tracy had to play is her character of Kay and I would be fan for life.

I thought it was only 3 episodes long but IMDb says 9.

How are unisex bathrooms a problem, R81? And did you see the first 3 episodes?

"I thought it was only 3 episodes long but IMDb says 9."

Six more episodes of this deck?

"How are unisex bathrooms a problem, [R81]?"

The problem of men walking into women's bathrooms? Little girls not having to change clothes in front of boys? The problems of private space that the Trans community has caused.

The first scene has Cate in a bikini with some tricks used to make her look more attractive. Even though she is I never thought of it her that way. She should have played Phyllis how she looked like an old-fashioned religious nut.

I love the elevator scene in Episode 3 where Betty is complaining and Bella dismisses her by saying, "You wrote a book ten years ago. "

Episode 3 is the best as far as dramatic tension.

The cast has brought up the fact that Phylis turned housewives into activists, basically shunning the idea that they should stay home and raise their families. That’s the irony. I’m glad the show isn’t showing one side in some wonderful light and the other completely evil. Everyone is a mess. There is a true villain in the story but the good guys also have their issues as well. It’s also interesting how so many people didn’t know Republican women were pro-ERA, and the issue was basically bipartisan before Schlafly flew in. They are also showing the start of the Christian Right being ushered into politics.

R85, you’re free to not watch.

Betty, the mother of the entire movement, was being cast aside for some bitch who was younger and prettier. Basically, we’re all bitter Betty. lol

I was watching a Donahue from the 70s and she seems less deranged there. Her cuntier, antigay BS came later.

I mean, there can be a reasonable conversation about how much families changed and how, just like motherhood isn't for everyone, singledom and/or the other side of the spectrum isn't, either. I remember as a kid in the mid 70s that almost everyone in our neighborhood had a mom at home and two parents who were married. 10, 15 years later that was not the case.

Life is just too short to watch a series focused on the Mother of All Deplorables, no matter how much talent is involved.

Life is complicated but Schafly was too damaging for a sympathetic portrayal. What is it with the media always being willing to give right wing women the benefit of a doubt or some degree of sympathy? Like that Bombshell movie released last year. Not every shiny haired rich blonde is a victim or misunderstood.

Bootsy, the Constitution does not recognize the rescinding of a state federal amendment approval. Why do you think that Nancy wears an ERA button. It IS possible. It will be done after PR and DC become states (4 more democratic senators) and after the Kavanaugh and Thomas investigations.

Be patient Gumdrop

Tracey started out as a dramatic actress before heading into comedy. She started out on a British soap opera called Mackenzie in the very early 80s. Then she was starred opposite Meryl in Plenty. In the last few years she's been doing more drama. She did "Howard's End" about two years ago for Starz and the BBC. I'm happy to see that she's dipping her toes into other genres and on both sides of the pond. She's absolutely brilliant. Let's face it, she also has the typical life of those who've gone into comedy: childhood trauma (father drops dead in front of her, family goes broke, physical abuse), husband of 30 years dies of cancer leaving her completely on her own, and one year later her mother tragically dies in a fire. It's amazing that she's as put together as she appears to be.

Episode 4 has her more or less aware of her gay son's proclivities. She doesn't look too happy about it.

Does anyone know how accurate the debate scene with Betty and Phyllis is?

Rose Byrne really has Gloria Steinem's voice down. Uncanny.

I never knew Steinem smoked. Of course since this was the 70s, I shouldn't be surprised.

Watching the first episode and it looks really good. Great acting, great costumes, historically accurate sets and cars, nice color timing and aspect ratio.

[quote] Bootsy, the Constitution does not recognize the rescinding of a state federal amendment approval.

You mean the Supreme Court hasn’t yet. Even Ginsburg has acknowledged the legitimacy of the question of rescinding and has stated the process should start over. The old ERA is never going to happen. The new ERA will be much lengthier and include exclusions.

r100 which is why the ERA will wait till the SCOTUS is "reorganized".

[quote]Does anyone know how accurate the debate scene with Betty and Phyllis is?

Completely. Betty lost a lot of support after that.

Episode 4 was the best so far. Definitely Emmy material.

It took four episodes before I recognized that was Elizabeth Banks. She looks so different in her 70s drag.

I didn’t recognize her at first either.

Wish they'd gone with someone hotter for the gay son.

Not from the US, so genuine question - without the ERA which sorts of inequalities are still going on that need legislated against?

Wasn’t it the other son that was gay?

Damn did they REALLY ugly up Tracey Ullman to play Betty Friedan! She looks absolutely frightful.

Did you ever see Friedan? They didn’t make Tracey ugly enough! However, DL is basically Betty Friedan inside and out.

I think the show officially hit its stride with this last episode. Excited for next week since it gives the spotlight to Ari Graynor, who really has needed a meaty role for years now.

Nice to see Lainie Kazan in the OP.

[quote]Not from the US, so genuine question - without the ERA which sorts of inequalities are still going on that need legislated against?

None. First of all, everything is covered by our Constitution.

The problem is not in legislation but enforcement. For example, woman complain that they don't get paid as much as men. Yet, we have the Equal Pay Act. What's not needed is more legislation, but enforcement of the legislation that is already in place.

Why does Tracey look like she's got dirt on her face and forehead as Betty?

Well, the entire abortion discussion wold be moot under the ERA as government would not be able to legislate against vaginas. Abortions would be just another medical procedure. This will happen once a Democratic president moves to investigate Kavanaugh and Thomas.

"Why does Tracey look like she's got dirt on her face and forehead as Betty?"

It looks to me like they are using a darker makeup on her. Was Betty that swarthy?

I loved how Betty and her neighbor got together to have cocktails and watch Mary Tyler Moore.

R115 Not at all, even when she was somewhat "tanned". It looks like Tracey has a handful of dirt on her forehead and cheeks. Bad makeup.

Here's the real debate between Phyllis Schlafly debates Betty Friedan on Good Morning America.

That same YouTube channel says this: (why am I surprised?)

FACT CHECK: Phyllis Schlafly's Background

The writers of Hulu's Mrs. America didn't bother to take a deep look at her background leading up to the fight over the Equal Rights Amendment. Thankfully, we have her personal archives available to tell the true story behind the real Mrs. America.

[quote] Here's the real debate between Phyllis Schlafly debates Betty Friedan on Good Morning America.

The debate featured in the show was not televised. There’s only a transcript. That’s what Tracey and Care used.

R119 It's still A debate, for people who want to see them together, was the point

Sorry, r120. Misunderstood.

[quote] Here's the real debate between Phyllis Schlafly debates Betty Friedan on Good Morning America.

There's like 1000 meme worthy facial expressions on Betty's face as she listens to Phyllis.

r112 is a lying propagandist. Women aren't even protected under the constitution. Go fling yourself off a bridge, freeper.

Okay, r123, not r112, but what does the ERA do that the constitution doesn't? Give us specifics.

Does it bother anyone that three very iconic American woman are being played by actresses from other countries? This is the whole thing again with the Brits playing Martin Luther King and Harriet Tubman? I get that Cate is a producer, but weren’t there any American actresses who had the power to get something like this made?

I didn’t know her son was gay, but I was getting the vibe in the show. Then in the wedding scene it looks like Phyllis catches something and has a suspicion, but it was so subtle that I didn’t see what tipped her off? Anyone catch it?

R76, the ultimate irony is that Phyllis supported the type of trickle down economics that Reagan championed that all but killed the ability of women to stay home and raise the kids unless you were upper middle class to wealthy. My mother wanted to be a stay-at-home mom, but without her working we were lower middle class. She got a job to get us solidly in the middle class. By the early 1980s, all the middle class families in my town had a working mother and father.

Schlafly found that trickle down economics rather bored people at her meetings. Abortion and anti-feminist movement talks made her more famous. Then she threw in anti-gay hysteria despite the fact that her own son is gay. She's a terrible hypocrite. As someone upthread noted, she outsourced her stay-at-home jobs to domestic help because her husband was a successful lawyer and she could afford to do so.

I like the show and I think it's fairly accurately portraying the gist of what happened. I don't think it's making Schlafly that sympathetic. If anything, it's showing her own struggles as a woman in the conservative movement, all the while fighting the feminist movement that was out to help remove those barriers.

Idiot, r125, everyone is American with the exception of Rose Byrne. You sound like a Trumper.

R126, her son was making goo-goo eyes at the groom. Are you blind?

[quote] My mother wanted to be a stay-at-home mom, but without her working we were lower middle class. She got a job to get us solidly in the middle class.

This is also a legitimate criticism against middle-class focused feminism. Many lower class women didn't WANT to work but HAD to, to avoid poverty. This was something that was over the heads of many white middle-class feminists.

Also, what seems to be muted is that Phyllis Schlafly was devout Catholic. She was reiterating what the Catholic Church believed.

Watching Tracey Ullman as Friedan, I keep waiting for her to turn into her Fern Rosenthal character any minute.

"I went into the city by myself to see Dreamgirls because Harry didn't want to see a show with a bunch of schvartzes in it. As soon as I got into Penn Station, I turned my rings around. Always turn your jewelry when you're in the city."

R128 Tracey is English, Cate is Australian. So....

Agreed, R130. My town was very blue collar, but it got to a point where the unions got busted up and wages for a single earner were not enough. My mother and her circle friends felt let down by the feminist movement of the 1970s. Schlafly was despicable but smart. She hit on all the points that more moderate women like my mother and her friends, who were Democrats, were worried about, like that the feminist movement was saying women couldn't stay home, they had to have a career, stay-at-home moms were "less than" career women. It's interesting watching the show and seeing Steinem worrying about that very issue and saying that's not what the feminists were saying; rather, they were saying women should have a choice. Schlafly and her horrible crew won that PR war, and down went the ERA. But what my mom and her friends didn't get was that Schlafly and the Conservatives supported economic policies that made stay-at-home moms impossible for the lower middle class. Now it's impossible for even middle class.

R133: Ullman and Blanchett both hold U.S. citizenship (Ullman was naturalized and is a dual citizen and Blanchett's father is American).

R133 You know that's not what the other poster meant by "American"...

Although I don't care what their nationality, as long as they act well.

136 was meant for r135

Fuck. I hate the archaic posting option here.

Do people who complain about Brits watch old movies? Have any idea of Hollywood history?

Rose Byrne has been fantastic as Gloria Steinem. I guess whoever playing Betty Friedan is doing a great job because she is annoying as fuck! Cate plays skinny stuck up white girls very well. Recommended!

Haven't we all known women like Phyllis Schlafly?

[quote] It's interesting watching the show and seeing Steinem worrying about that very issue and saying that's not what the feminists were saying; rather, they were saying women should have a choice. Schlafly and her horrible crew won that PR war, and down went the ERA.

My mom was/is a stay-at-home mom and I am thankful for that (but I was also really sheltered as a child so there's that). Anyways, I completely agree with you. From what it looks like, the second-wave feminist movement as spearheaded by Friedan looks like it was a big tent as far as political philosophy and race goes. That's a good thing. But there were two problems: 1) It wasn't inclusive of lower-class women and they weren't represented in the movement 2) The (relatively) inclusive nature of the second-wave feminist movement would, by it's nature, be more fractured and have more in-fighting than the more singular Anti-ERA reactionary women's group. Schlafly's movement was able to use these weaknesses to get people to reject the ERA. That should be a lesson to all those far-leftists today who think that they are too good to vote for Biden because he is "the same as Trump". This is exactly the kind of mentality that conservatives exploit to win elections. The sooner these far-leftists realize this, the better.

PS was The Mother of All Deplorable Karens.

The only way Mother Pence can get off is by pleasuring herself with a plastic statuette of PS while Mike recites The Contract With America.

I said I wasn’t going to watch it, but I have now watched the first three episodes. I was surprised that they made Schlafly the heroine of the series, and showed the feminists as schemers who were always in a foul mood and in a cat fight with each other. Regardless of your views, it’s inspiring to see how one woman, Schlafly, could have such a big impact when she set her mind to it.

Did anyone feel bad when Phyllis’ husband badgered her into having sex and she had to lay there and think of Australia with her contact hurting and all?

R143, you haven't been watching closely. Schlafly had to deal with Southern racists in her group and how that contingent could have left. I don't see her as a heroine.

[quote] I was surprised that they made Schlafly the heroine of the series, and showed the feminists as schemers who were always in a foul mood and in a cat fight with each other.

That's not what I am getting from the show. Schlafly isn't a heroine at all and the show doesn't present her that way. The feminist movement is shown as being bold but suffering from it's (relatively) more inclusive nature but also it's exclusion of working-class and less well-off women. The Schlafly movement wasn't nearly as bold but it had unity. It was exclusively made of white women who were afraid of the feminist movement and what it would bring. This is how the conservatives win to this day--by playing off the divided nature of the Democratic party. This is why it's important that the Democratic party remain a big, inclusive tent, even if we don't agree with one another.

"Did anyone feel bad when Phyllis’ husband badgered her into having sex and she had to lay there and think of Australia with her contact hurting and all?"

I think the show is good at portraying what the women had to put up with to get what they wanted. The only reason Ms. Magazine could get started was because Steinam was pretty. And the show demonstrates the trouble she had with Screw Magazine.

[quote] Schlafly isn't a heroine at all and the show doesn't present her that way.

I’ve only seen the first three episodes, so maybe it changes later on, but so far she’s been the underdog who triumphed over the all the top dogs of the feminist movement.

It's been mentioned on the show that Steinem was the star of the feminist movement and got a lot of media attention simply because of the fact that she was considered very attractive by the standards of the day. She held people's attention and got a lot of time on tv because so many of those feminists looked like dumptrucks and bulldykes. Steinem was very pleasing to look at for the masses.

R150, I think that's why Schlafly was so popular on the Conservative side. You looked at her and thought American mother. Don't underestimate the power of a sweater draped around the shoulders. She could easily beat Friedan in PR because Betty wasn't easy on the eyes.

I remember as a child only seeing Gloria Steinem as the face and leader of feminism. I didn’t know rough trade like Betty Friedan even existed until later.

I lived in NY State so Bella Abzug was well known. The local girl scout troop had her as a guest speaker. People used to comment about her hats. But I remember a lot of the women thought she was very abrasive. Not as nice as MM is playing her.

The show deserves a lot of credit for capturing the look of the 70s. Everything looks spot on, except for Marsden. I don’t remember anyone looking like him in the 70s.

The period detail is excellent. I'm reminded of the recent "70s interiors" thread we just had when I see all the various homes depicted on this show.

Did they shoot, at least partially, in the HGTV Brady Bunch house?

They are capturing the period quite well, but there have been exceptions. For the opening party of Ms. Magazine at the Guggenheim, the more recently added wing was glaringly apparent. They made no attempt to CGI it out or shoot at an angle to exclude the view. Since it was an early episode it made me worried about how detailed they were going to be with such an obvious gaffe.

I'm so sick of people complaining that Brits are playing Americans!!!! Jeez, Scarlett O'Hara was played by a Brit but no one brings that up.

[quote][R128] Tracey is English, Cate is Australian. So....

They're Americans, nitwit. Both were naturalized. Tracey has lived in the US for 40 years. She's 60 years old.

What happened to Phyllis' gay son? I remember when he was outed and all that she would say is that he was gay but agreed with his mother's views. He was in his 40s in the early 90s. Is he in his 70s now?

I do know that the family had a feud in recent years over money after Schlafly's death.

[quote]But Uzo does really well on this. She's even better than Cate (who is excellent).

I agree. I didn't care for Uzo on Orange is New The Black. But, here she's a lot better and my favorite cast member.

R161, I'm embarrassed that I had no idea who Chisholm was before I watched the show. She's a woman who broke down a shit ton of barriers. Uzo's performance sparked my interest in her.

[quote]I'm so sick of people complaining that Brits are playing Americans!!!! Jeez, Scarlett O'Hara was played by a Brit but no one brings that up.

The Walking Dead and True Blood message boards on IMDB often had tons of posts of people complaining about Brits or Aussies playing Americans on those shows. Sometimes people do complain when Americans fake accents for parts and there was also that controversy when J.K. Rowling opposed an American actor playing Harry Potter and then the part was later recast with Daniel Radcliffe.

Whining helplessly about non-Americans playing Americans seems super MAGA.

Uzo is alright in this but the role is pretty thin. She doesn’t have to do much.

Amen R164! You deserve a blow job for that comment!

[quote]Whining helplessly about non-Americans playing Americans seems super MAGA.

lol I agree. I remember many years ago some TV or movie critic complained about American southerners in movies and shows being played by foreigners. His argument was that those roles should be offered more to Americans. I was talking with a friend last Christmas and he mentioned how his MAGA Evangelical relatives are into watching Hallmark Channel Christmas movies. He said from a business viewpoint his MAGA relatives should ditch Hallmark since most of their programming is filmed in Canada. But, at the end of the day they won't ditch that channel just like some people keep wearing MAGA made in China hats.

Uzo Aduba is a terrible actress. She's just terrible. I don't care if she looks like Shirley or not. She can't act. There had to have been, at least, fifty actresses with decent representation of a similar type who could have a made single moment of her scenes believable. I wish Aduba had given up acting and become a lawyer, as she said she almost did before booking Orange. How many one note, same song performances does she have to give before people realize: she can't act. This is just 'Crazy Eyes Plays Politician'.

Along the same lines, SAARPaulson is very much playing her own stock character, as well.

I agree with the comment above that, since about 'I'm Not There', Blanchett has been performing rather than embodying. However, many of her roles, since then, including this one, have been characters who are suffocating under their own artifice and I can't help but hope that the prevalence of gloss over cracks is the result of editing choices rather than the full spectrum of what she actually delivered.

Byrne, Martindale, Ullmann are all great, so far, and are all stretching, easily, beyond how they're usually typecast and their own tricks and whistles.

The writing is pretty heavy handed and I can't really say it's artful or particularly interesting beyond the historical significance, but I'm only three episodes in.

I've seen Blanchett in the US passport line at LAX. She's part American even if she's probably embarrassed by it.

R169 She’s just embarrassed of Republicans. We all are!

Who was the black guy that Steinem was dating? Is this character based on a real person, or is it a composite?

[quote] The writing is pretty heavy handed and I can't really say it's artful or particularly interesting beyond the historical significance

agree.

The first episode was interesting enough but I can't imagine wanting to spend 8 more hours with any of them.

It's interesting to someone, let them enjoy it, it's just not for me.

R172, Episode 2 is where it took off for me! I feel you though

Yes, I would say it picks up from episode 3 or even 4 (where Friedan and Schlafly face off).

I'm glad it was made. It just could have been made better and I wish it had been. The writing and production elements are subpar, of the sort one sees in projects aimed at teens and tweens and maybe that was the intent with this, simply to educate a younger generation who are very close to returning to a world where "women are butchered on kitchen tables" (to repeat a phrase used like a bumper sticker, I think, at least, five times in the Gloria episode.

Jim Brown, r171

Thank you, R176. The actor sure doesn't look anything like Jim Brown. He's built, but not... husky.

Okay, I know she dated Jim Brown, but I don't know that he was the only black guy she dated. When I watched, I assumed that was supposed to be Jim Brown.

No, it's not Jim Brown, although Steinem did date him (lucky bitch). The character is Franklin Thomas, who was president of the Ford Foundation. Steinem dated him as well. She must have liked black cock. She's had a pretty interesting dating history.

[quote] She must have liked black cock.

She seemed upset about the pin the cock on the feminist image in Screw, so there was some inconsistency.

C’mon, who didn’t want to set set Phyllis on fire?

Phyllis owned the hag Betty. It’s funny, I thought early on that the series was making Schlafly look like Glynda and Friedan like the WWOTW, and then they actually mentioned the comparison in the show. Betty was such a bitter, unhappy person.

Lordy, Miss Blanchett's fillers!!

I’m embarrassed I didn’t recognize Tracy Ullman!

I wished they would have found a more attractive and younger actress to play Gloria Steinem, I’m not buying Rose Byrne in the role. And I know she’s wearing a wig as an actress, but and it looks like one, Is it that Gloria did wear a wig in real life?

Well the Tom Snyder was a better casting then the Phil Donahue.

I think Rose Byrne is great as Steinem, she looks a lot like her and really did her homework on Steinem's voice, she got it down pat.

BTW, Rose Byrne is 40, Gloria Steinem was 38-ish at the time of the series. She's the appropriate age.

R187, I had no idea Steinem was that age at the time, I thought she was in her mid to late twenties.

Gloria Steinem was born in 1934, she's now 86 years old. I believe she's the only woman profiled on Mrs. America who is still living.

I fucking wrote this exact show in 2016/17 after Hillary lost. We had an all star producing team. Just as we we were pitching it, this fucking show came and stole our thunder and paychecks.

I am not bitter. I swear. Scout's honor.

R189 Brenda Feigen and Jill Ruckelshaus are still alive

Rose looks like her 50s and I too thought Gloria was to be in her 20s. But she is not attractive, what Bobby saw in her over Sutton I’ll never know.

R190 is a 60 year old woman in section 8 housing Idaho

When Phyllis said “Thank you, Daddy” I considered Suicide

Did all these people think Steinem was a teen when she wrote about being a Playboy bunny?

There is something weirdly sexist about this making Steinem younger. I think it was a trend in the 70s as well. Because a 40ish woman was not acceptable as a heroine.

They're not making Steinem younger in this, if that's what you're saying.

It’s just bitchy queens who want everyone to look like a 20 year old Barbie r195. Just as bad as republicans!

R193, I'm (a now) 40 year old gay man living in LA. But my mother was actually duped by the Phyllis Schlaffly in the 70s (she later renounced her, thankfully) so I was aware of Phyllis because of my mom and I wanted to write something about the old hag for a long, long time.

Rose Byrne always has a gassy look on her face

R196, the people here on DL are making her younger, saying they expected a journalist who was the first editor of a major magazine and got clout in a political movement was in her twenties.

(I thought Rose Byrne looks kind of young for Steinem.)

When the fuck is coming to Netflix?

R201 It’s only Hulu, bitch!

Someone mentioned Cannavale. I presume they want to fuck him, hence the shade about his gf's (wife's?) looks.

R195, it's the Boomers fault. For years they've been falsely claiming to have led all these progressive movements when in fact that work was largely done by the generation preceding them. Now we're all conditioned to assume all our heroes were Boomers.

R204 = YourMilennialPowerBottom

Episode 4 with Betty was good, despite the fact I'm not a fan of Tracey.

Oh my God, I've tried to watch episode 4 since midnight and I've fallen asleep twice. Canavale is briefly in it, he's not bad at all.

The wig on Byrne could be it's own character; too fake!

I still find the show is slow and Cate is "acting" too....something. 6/10

R198 Can you share more about what happened with your mom and Schlafly?

does Steinem have a deformed head or is that just the hairdo?

R205, not a Millennial, but that made me laugh.

Maybe Gloria just came off as younger and more attractive looking because she surrounded herself with all these older haggish women? She was much younger than Betty, Bella and Shirley right? Margo is much to pretty to be playing Bella, Harvey Feirstein would have been a better choice.

R206, she was a young mother of two (I came later) when the ERA was proposed in 1971. At first, she was all for it. As were most Americans.

But when Phyllis began her campaign by striking fear into housewives the country over by lying to them, my mother took the bait. Phyllis told them that if ERA passed, they'd be forced into getting a job, their husbands would divorce them, their entire way of life would be destroyed. My mom regrets buying into that silly rhetoric.

Betty Friedan was hot! Enough to turn a gay man straight!

R210 Thanks for sharing. Misinformation is so dangerous, as we see in today's pandemic days.

Glad your mother snapped out of it.

Cate should have demanded better hair people. Her wig looks terrible. In close-ups the seam is very obvious.

Straight guys all over the USA would jerk off to Betty Freidan in the 70s. She was THAT hot!

Five episodes and I have yet to hear "I Am Woman Hear Me Roar".

For those who have seen Episode 5: are we to assume that Phyllis' son is hanging around with rough trade when the guy returns the wallet?

R215 my series was called ROAR!

r217, who would you have cast to play Phyllis and Gloria?

Betty Friedan’s mind is sexy!

Gosh, I can't remember who was on the cast list. I do recall my producer wanted Gaga to play RGB (who was one of our protagonists) - years before A Star is Born.

[quote]I’m embarrassed I didn’t recognize Tracy Ullman!

She would probably be happy to hear you say that.

[quote]Cate should have demanded better hair people. Her wig looks terrible. In close-ups the seam is very obvious.

Looks perfect to me. If you knew Schlafly, you'd know her hair is on point. She had that ridiculous doo til the day she died.

Seriously r221. They made Ullman look like absolute shit for this, so no doubt she'd be pleased you didn't recognize her.

By the end of the series you'll understand how Trump got into power. Phyllis even championed him before she died and he spoke at her funeral.

The lesson is, never discount your opponent thinking no one will buy their bullshit. The ERA had support from both sides and then this quack comes along and does the unthinkable. It's literally Trump. No one took him seriously. Even the Clintons wanted him as the nominee. Look what happened. People are easily duped. Never become complacent.

Friedan was the only one who knew that Phyllis was a threat. She knew her type, where she came from, and all the housewives she could get on board. The New York liberals in the show couldn't foresee it.

[quote]They made Ullman look like absolute shit for this

I like the subtleness to the makeup they used on her. Betty was not an attractive woman. She was homely. No doubt she was threatened by Gloria due to her looks... and she was actually right. Which person do people equate with second wave feminism - the mother of the movement, Betty, or the bitch that jumped on board at the last minute and took all the credit, Gloria? There's your answer. Looks matter at the end of the day no matter how smart you are or how much legwork you put into something.

As for Tracey, she still looks amazing at 60. The fact that she even still has a face after decades of wearing prosthetics is amazing. Good genetics. She seems to be doing well, if the interview I just saw is any indication. She was with Rita Wilson at the Grammys right around the time Rita and Tom Hanks came down with covid-19.

Will Tracey ever cut a record again? And will Rita Wilson ever stop making records?

[quote] Looks perfect to me. If you knew Schlafly, you'd know her hair is on point. She had that ridiculous doo til the day she died.

I'm not talking about the style of the hair. In close ups of her, you can see the gap between the wig and Cate's head. They don't do a good job of making it look like natural hair.

R227 Which is the same thing I was referring to with Gloria’s, it’s so obviously a wig I was wondering if it was supposed to look that way because Gloria had one in real life? It like doing a Warhol movie and making the wig look like a wig.

They definitely went overboard with Byrne's wig. Gloria may have worn a fall on occasion, as they were all the rage in the 70's. But never did she look like Cousin It.

John Slattery looks.....different. Did he have something done to his face?

R230 I just assumed age caught up with him.

Here’s an article about the hairstylist from the series who did everyone, but Cate, who had her own personal stylist of course. Focuses mainly on Gloria’s hair, but only points out that Chisholm was known for her wigs and made to look like one and she used it to project height because she was small and surrounded by all the men.

Steinem could have been played by Dyan Cannon back in the 1970s.

Gloria was not pretty. In fact, she had a style that was way too young for her. She was pushing 40 and was dressing like a 20-something. Rose Byrne is drop dead gorgeous. The hairstyles look ridiculous because, well, the era had ridiculous hairstyles.

In episode 5, Gloria talks about her 40th birthday party.

I objectify the body of Gloria's black dude.

Hot.

Cate sounds exactly like Julia Sugarbaker. I wonder if that was her guide for American accent.

R194, I agree with you. Something about her “Thanks Daddy” disturbed me more than anything I have seen in years. Seriously, the reaction was visceral.

Did women really say that to their husbands back then? Ick.

R239 I think it might be a midwestern or Missouri thing. I have a cousin who is married to a guy from a small Missouri town and she has mentioned her mother-in-law calling the father-in-law "Daddy". She said that when she asked her husband about it, he replied that it was a Missouri thing.

Didn't Shirley Booth call her husband "Daddy" in Come Back, Little Sheba?

Agree that Rose’s wig looks ridiculous. She looks like a conehead.

R234 "Gloria was not pretty."

Bullshit.

From what I see, Steinem did not favor a dark lip. Quite the opposite. I guess Byrne's own taste came into play. Her look is very costumey, whereas pictures of Steinem back then don't. Costume or no costume, Steinem was very savvy about branding/media image. The look no doubt made her relatable to the young/teen/college age women.

"The man you call your daddy ain't your pa."

Steinem was a dog. She looks like a middle aged woman trying to be young.

She worked up perhaps 2 variations on her look and wears them to this day. As she is not a French woman, this has not worked out well.

I was an extra in this when it filmed here in Toronto last year. Cate Blanchett was so exciting to watch

Why is Miss Cate Blanchett is exciting? I find her overblown verging on ham in many roles, and phony on talk shows. I hate worked up regalness.

I disagree Steinem back then was much better looking than Rose Byrne is today.

Steinem was considered good looking enough to get a job as a Playboy bunny.

R250 I agree completely, I wish they would have found a more attractive and younger actress to play her.

Rose Byrne is almost the same age Steinem was back then.

I think Rose looks better as Gloria than Gloria herself.

Gloria looks like she has a big bush.

Everybody had a big bush in the 70s. Haven't you ever seen porn from back then?

Why did FX decide to put the show on Hulu?

Why did FX decide to put the show on Hulu?

Casting wise, both Rose and Cate are perfectly age appropriate for these roles. Rose is nearly 41 (b.1979) and Cate is nearly 51 (b.1969), the same age difference between the real Gloria (b.1934) and Phyllis (b.1924).

I really wish the show went into how much Gloria Steinem was a spook for the CIA. Instead she just fucked a guy from the DOJ with some pillow talk about "working."

[quote]I really wish the show went into how much Gloria Steinem was a spook for the CIA.

Was she really? I never knew that.

Cate is very hammy in this role. I can't get over it. She's usually very on the nose in her roles but she's sneering her way through every scene and I'm over it. There's one scene in this latest episode where she excels (in the church) and that's it.

If you haven't watched the most recent episode ("Jill"), don't read on. I was pleasantly surprised how well Elizabeth Banks played her part. Very natural. Watch her in that scene opposite Blanchett, then tell me Cate isn't "acting".

Now they're getting into such specific political details, even I don't know what they're referring to. I wasn't around for the Regan era, but they talk about it like the audience would know the back story. Don't they want people outside the US to watch the show and engage? I'm in the US but even I watched the last 15 minutes of the episode like what's going on??

The episode has some good moments but it's so slow. And Uzo is just not experienced enough to be in the role. You can see Crazy Eyes (Orange Is the New Black) underneath her terrible wig.

Rose Byrne, who's missing from this episode, is a strong talent here. I've seen photos of Gloria in her glory days and she wished she looked like Rose. Everyone saying "Gloria is so good looking"...the standards of beauty were different then, sure, but she's still an average looking chick, no matter what era you're from.

[quote]Now they're getting into such specific political details, even I don't know what they're referring to. I wasn't around for the Regan era, but they talk about it like the audience would know the back story.

It was foreshadowing for the rise of Reagan and the Moral Majority, and all the religious nutcases who were given a seat at the table during his administration. Schlafly played a part in that. Reagan's election was a rejection of all the social progress that was made in the 60s and 70s and a return to conservative values.

R264 Thanks for that insight. But shouldn't this be explained a bit to the audience? Otherwise, they're just appealing to a niche audience who would know the history because they were around or have interest in that era.

Take The Crown, as an example. I don't think people need to look up the history as much to be engaged in the story. But I didn't even know where they're going with the religious stuff and Reagan until you said.

Eerily enough though, it's like watching something happening now, except this is what...50 years ago? It's as if the fashion has changed but the political plot is still the same.

r265 are you American? I'm not being snarky, but what I posted is pretty much common knowledge to Americans, even people who weren't around back then (I wasn't).

r266 Yes but I wasn't raised in the US and moved here as an adult. I honestly don't know that many people know the Reagan history to the extent the show counts on that fact. What I remember later from the Reagan era is...the Genesis song, "Land of Confusion" and Nancy's clothes. And that he was an actor. The rest, and to this detail, no. I imagine that's true for most people of a certain age. Perhaps you're just into history or a genius? :p

[quote]Now they're getting into such specific political details, even I don't know what they're referring to.

I was raised in an Evangelical church in the 1970s and I had no idea who Lottie Beth Hobbs was. I think that B plot was thrown in just to fatten Cate's material for this episode. I get Schlafly's struggle between the Evangelicals and her son being gay, but the Hobbs scenes could have been spent covering something more interesting.

R268 See, I didn't even catch that woman's name. I just looked her up after your post and she was from Texas. Of COURSE she was.

And yes, I was lost by the time they went to her house, like who is she and why? All I got from it was she's a religious nut who hunts defenseless animals and steals other people's text (such Christian values), has 15,000 women on her mailing list and that's worth something in politics, and she brought out Schlafly's homophobia to the surface. But why this was significant to the story or the ERA, I wasn't getting.

I'm all about "thinking" shows but if the show is too lazy to educate me and others who don't know this amount of detail, why should I keep bothering with it? (I'll still watch, though, because quarantine)

The other thing that they are not bringing out (and I don't really expect them to) is that all Evangelicals didn't vote in lock step Republican. Many supported Jimmy Carter because he said he was a born again Christian. And then many Evangelicals got pissed at him because he gave an interview to Playboy Magazine.

And many Evangelicals were not happy with Reagan because he had been divorced. Liberals always blame Evangelicals for the rise of Reagan, but there were a lot that didn't vote for him despite what Jerry Falwell tried to make everyone believe.

It was not all black and white back then.

Blanchett is fucking brilliant in this. Emmy’s comin’ a callin’.

This is coming to the BBC later this year but I wanted to download it, but my usually reliable torrent site doesn't have the first 3 episodes but does have these titles.

Mrs Creampie (Naughty America) Naughty America Mrs Starr Mrs Creampie 2 (Naughty America) Naughty America presents My First Sex Teacher Naughty America - My Friend's Hot Mom Naughty America - Mrs Vanessa Cage Fucks Her Son's Friend Mrs Creampie 3 (Naughty America) with SPLIT SCREEN Naughty America - My Friend's Hot Mom with Mrs Selena Steele

Guess I'll just have to wait

After she hears those awful quips about woman made by the Congressmen (excluding Shirley of course) I’m kind of hoping this pulls a Hollywood and is speculative history and Phyllis and her warriors switch corses and help get the ERA ratified and all is made well in the world.

[quote]I honestly don't know that many people know the Reagan history to the extent the show counts on that fact.

Again, it's basically common knowledge, you don't have to be a student of history to know what the show was touching on in regards to Reagan being a return to conservative values and opening the floodgates for all the religious evangelical nuts.

R270, maybe you do not know this but Carter was a Democratic candidate. He would not be in the mix for action at a Republican convention and among Republicans.

My guess is that Carter's relationship to evangelicals is coming up later.

I am fascinated by John Schlafly, Phyllis' son. Has he ever had an LTR? Someone must know something about him.

Apparently scheming with his brother to cut a sister out of his mother’s will.

[quote]This is coming to the BBC later this year but I wanted to download it, but my usually reliable torrent site doesn't have the first 3 episodes but does have these titles.

Why don't you try other sites? The episodes are out there.

Do the streaming sites instead of torrents. No downloading, much easier.

Another reason for Reagan's winning over of evangelicals was the fact that Carter didn't care to completely align himself with them. He didn't go against the Dem's pro-choice stance and that pissed them off.

The reason Reagan won was that Carter was a complete fuck up. The economy was in the toilet, lines at the gas station, there were hostages in Iran. Carter was a terrible president.

I don't think Carter was terrible. He definitely had screw ups but a lot of his accomplishments go unnoticed. I think his aloofness meant he would never completely connect with the public the way Reagan did. The economy wasn't Carter's fault. In fact, Carter was responsible for a large portion for the economic boom of the 80s. He hired Paul Volcker and it was he who killed the 70s stagflation. Regan wanted to fire him! Carter was also the one who began deregulation of industries (and it was necessary). Reagan merely took credit for this even though he had nothing to do with it.

Reagan won 49 out of 50 states.

Rose Byrne is phenomenal in the role.

Gloria dated all types of men. I hate how old some of you are, that because she dated some black men (as well as white) she liked “black cock”. Maybe she just liked men. Race meant nothing.

R180 how was that inconsistent? Because she enjoys penis means she wants to be disrespected???

Gloria was down with the swirl. She couldn't get enough black cock!

She dated white men also. She couldn’t get enough Cock. Period.

I like black cock, too.

Or maybe she pegged them all.

Or maybe she liked men.

I know it’s hard for racists to grasp, but some of us are attracted to all types of men and color means nothing

[quote]I really wish the show went into how much Gloria Steinem was a spook for the CIA. Instead she just fucked a guy from the DOJ with some pillow talk about "working."

I think that would work better as a two hour movie.

R290 Well hope they get someone attractive and young to play Gloria in the movie.

GLORIA WAS 40. Rose is age appropriate.

Why do you want a 20 year old playing a 40 year old?

R291 How old was Gloria when she was a spook for the CIA?

R291 How old was Gloria when she was a spook for the CIA?

R294 It was in the 50s and 60s after she graduated from Smith, so they would need a considerably younger, more attractive, talented actress to play her.

I think HULU has a free one month trial. If you sign up now you will probably be able to see all the episodes by the series conclusion. You just have to remember to cancel before it renews (same for HBO). This show is presented without commercials, not sure about other HULU stuff.

Gloria's wig is too pointy in the back and distracts me. The handsome BF she drops the phone for is played by lovely Jay Ellis. John Slattery looks terrible because they have Grecian Formula-ed his hair and left it a bit shaggy to keep him from looking too much like Silver Fox Roger Sterling. I can't stand Sarah Paulson's hair! We have seen her in huge sets of curlers in more than one scene but then when she's out and about her hair is just lank strands that look like the cat sucked on the ends. I think the clothes, hair and sets are pretty spot on. I love the authentic '70s street scenes that are spliced in, the soundtrack has been some great jams, not totally cliché. This show's timeline is about 10-12 years after the start of Mad Men's timeline.

Shirley Chisholm had an amazing lateral lisp that is not imitated by the actress. A great documentary to look up is "Chisholm '72 Unbought and Unbossed". Everything Shirley Chisholm talked about running in '72 is still true today. She is a real hero.

PS is not portrayed nicely, or as a heroine, and if it seems like the she is portrayed as the winner, it's because that is how this story ended. PS and her housewives swayed the vote and prevented the ratification of the ERA.

The series portrays PS in all her hypocrisy. She's wealthy enough to have been college educated before marriage, and she has run for political office twice. Along with a wealthy and indulgent enough husband to support her efforts, she has a staff made of hired servants and her spinster sister in law that allow her to pursue her goals. So since she's already partially relieved of the household drudgery and stunted ambitions that Friedan called 'the problem with no name,' Phyllis can't relate. PS seeks influence and power under the guise of just being an average housewife, and when she tries to engage in the public sphere, she is subjected to all the dismissive, belittling behaviors that women everywhere suffered in the workplace. But PS has committed to the homemaker nice lady image, so in situations that drove other women to embrace the principles of feminism, she doesn't speak up, she rarely defends herself or demands to be taken seriously.

These scenes aren't meant for us to feel sorry for PS for suffering rudeness and discrimination, it's to show what a steely bitch she was to swallow down the affronts, fuck her husband in her bra and half-slip, and become the Queen Bee she always wanted to be. The scenes with the plagiarizing newsletter ladies were to show how ready to form coalitions she was. PS came after those ladies to make them stop using her text and images but she ended up wanting to bring them and their 15,000 anti-abortion lady mailing list into her group.

Eventually she amassed the anti-ERA, anti-abortion/reproductive rights, anti-gay church ladies of America and funneled them right into that Moral Majority type voting bloc that brought us where we are today. I wonder what PS would think of the current Repugnantcan in office. I suspect she'd use all her powers to elect and keep in whatever GOP candidate is put forth, regardless of his crude ignorance, pussy grabbing and attention-seeking. She really was single-minded and had a terrible, far-reaching affect on this country.

Great summary of Schlafly, r296. She truly was a rotten person.

I don’t get why DL wants Schlafly depicted as some evil 100% villain. Like everyone, she had good qualities as well as bad.

Same for the liberal feminists.

Everyone has flaws.

For people born in the 80s and onwards, it is really hard to imagine there was once a time when the MAJORITY of the Republican party rejected and/or laughed at the so-called Moral Majority idiots. It's impossible for me to imagine someone like Jill Ruckelshaus being part of the Republican party today.

R298, she was disastrous for our country. She and her supporters were responsible for putting the moral majority at the center of the Republican party. This has been disastrous for our country. I've voted blue as long as I have been able to vote but even I yearn for the days when Republicans were more like Jill Ruckelshaus than Mitch McConnell.

Good interview with Jill.

[quote] she was disastrous for our country.

She was a reaction to something, just like Trump was. You have to look past her to find the root causes.

Do you ever really *stop* working for the CIA?

I never ever like Elizabeth Banks in anything, but I loved her as Jill. The “Jill” episode was great and she was very natural.

R296 "I wonder what PS would think of the current Repugnantcan in office."

Of course she supported him. It was literally her last message to her followers.

Schlafly was a stooge for the Republicans.

She was evil.

[quote]I never ever like Elizabeth Banks in anything, but I loved her as Jill. The “Jill” episode was great and she was very natural.

Same with me. I've never been a huge fan of hers. But, before this show the only thing I liked her in was Seabiscuit. She was terrific on this show.

It’s reminding me of how well Schlafly played the feminists. The women’s movement of the time could never quite come up with an effective defense of the need for the ERA beyond it being a “symbol.” Schlafly et al struck gold with the claim that the amendment would extend the draft to women. Because it very well could have and nobody, feminists included, really wanted that.

As has been mentioned, Schlafly's whole argument of women staying home and being good little housewives became irrelevant due to simple economics. A two-income household is the norm now because women can't afford to stay home unless they're well-off. They have no choice but to go to work.

[quote]The women’s movement of the time could never quite come up with an effective defense of the need for the ERA beyond it being a “symbol.”

That's a good point. Then and now, no one can state what actual law or policy would change if the amendment existed. Schlafly was able to speculate about a very specific list of possible effects. The Supreme Court has found that gender equality already exists in the current Constitution without the amendment.

"Equality of rights under the law shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or any state on account of SEX."

[quote]As has been mentioned, Schlafly's whole argument of women staying home and being good little housewives became irrelevant due to simple economics. A two-income household is the norm now because women can't afford to stay home unless they're well-off. They have no choice but to go to work.

There's a woman named Lori Alexander who lives in California and runs a blog called The Transformed Wife. She's a very conservative Christian and she keeps claiming that all families can live on one income. Lori was only able to be stay at home mom because her husband has a successful orthodontic business consultation company. Many people on message board, blog sites, and youtube channels have argued that her beliefs are dangerous and that not every family can comfortably live on one income. Her main defense is that many families have two incomes because they don't want to give up luxuries and that all the working moms are money hungry women. She's really bizarre and she has other wacko beliefs. She reminds me quite a bit of Phyllis Schlafly.

I am really enjoying this series but I get disheartened when I do fact checking and see what did and didn't really happen. This story and the characters are fascinating to me but I wish the story presented was more factual, For example there is the debate scene in episode 5 where they Schlafly is called out for being a liar for making up the name of a legal case when in fact it was the liberal opponent that made up the case in real life. When you make shit up like that it's more fuel for the right wingers to dismiss things as "fake". She was a harmful enough person in the overall scheme of things; no need to make up shit.

R313, everything I've read says that Phyllis Schlafly did indeed make up a case in the on-air debate. At the beginning of the show, it says some events and dialogue are made up for dramatic purposes, and it is a retelling of the ERA fight, not a completely accurate chronological account. But many things did happen, and Schlafly making up the case on air was one of them.

[quote]Her main defense is that many families have two incomes because they don't want to give up luxuries and that all the working moms are money hungry women.

That is so ignorant. Many families are two-income just to pay the bills and buy groceries, they're not spending money on any luxuries.

R315 Yes, it's very ignorant. But, Lori just doesn't get it. I grew up in a two income household and there were a few years that we didn't have any luxuries to my dad losing a job and then getting a temporary job that didn't offer health benefits. We had some medical bill debt that my parents eventually paid off after my dad got a better paying job.

I know others who have the belief that many families have two incomes for luxury reasons. In my family, I have a conservative Christian cousin whose wife doesn't work and they say that others in my family have two incomes for luxuries. However, they have constant money struggles and have asked most people in the family for money so they could pay bills or have money for groceries.

If couples didn't have kids they wouldn't have financial problems. It's such a luxury to have kids and so unneccessary. It's honestly the #1 thing you can do to ensure financial security. I don't understand how our society blames smokers for lung cancer ("its your fault"), obesity on overweight people ("it's your fault!") but not having enough money to support your kids is seen as some victim status. If you didn't have kids, you'd have money. Thus, it's your fault.

What I don't understand are parents who have more than 2 kids these days. WHY!? Why would anyone do that? Unless they are adopting less fortunate kids, that I get.

" If couples didn't have kids they wouldn't have financial problems. It's such a luxury to have kids and so unnecessary. It's honestly the #1 thing you can do to ensure financial security. I don't understand how our society blames smokers for lung cancer ("its your fault"), obesity on overweight people ("it's your fault!") but not having enough money to support your kids is seen as some victim status. If you didn't have kids, you'd have money. Thus, it's your fault."

^^^THIS^^^ is why rights to reproductive autonomy is KEY to women's rights. Women who have the option to prevent and/or terminate unwanted pregnancies have MORE control over their independent lives, including education and finances.

Thwarting women's independent lives and finances is KEY to misogynists, god bags and other people who who insist on maintaining privileges, an underpaid working class, unpaid domestic laborers and sex providers.

Freedom from this oppression is the entire point of the women's movement and the "Mrs America" program. The far right's conglomerate of forced breeding evangelicals, Catholics, orthodox Jews and other wingnuts have made it their life's work to legislate their reductive, archaic views of women's stunted places in society and the home for EVERYONE. The network was established by PS and it continues its influence today. It's horrifying.

If R317 really believes the comment quoted above, R317 (and other crotch droppings detesters) should be supporting reproductive choice both locally and world wide. It's not people's "fault" if their lives are hindered by uncontrolled reproduction if their access to birth control is curtailed or denied.

This is R317 and I 1000% support reproductive rights and access to birth control. A woman's body is her own and should do with it whatever she pleases.

They overdid trying to make tha actor look like the real person.

The "Jill" episode was great. But, Bella Abzug is constantly the most interesting character given her desire to work the cards she's been dealt to make progress through incremental change. Sad that she loses her bid for the senate by one point. I wish someone like here was in the Senate now, because perhaps Al Franken could still be in his seat gearing up for the convention as out party's nominee. Instead, people like Gillibran had to run our strongest candidate out of DC so we are forced to make Biden work. Biden's team is doing a fine job, but we could have a stronger position going into November. At least Gillibran's hopes and dreams of becoming President are destroyed as the good old boys club that makes up the Democratic major donor list publicly turned their backs on her and refused to help fund her campaign. Karma!

This week's ep is Bella - can't wait!

Really? Fuck yeah, I’m excited!

I’m early into the series but I think they overdid making the characters look like the real Person.

How do you overdo making someone look like someone? All of the actors can act and they are close representations. Where is the problem?

When I see the actress playing the part I can tell they put a lot of effort to make her look like the character especially Gloria Stenium.

Femcel fraus hate pretty actresses.

Second to last episode and I still have not heard "I Am Woman Hear Me Roar!"

That was a good episode, but clearly a transition point to prepare us for the Houston showdown.

I just finished the Bella Abzug one from today and enjoyed it. I hate the way Cate acts in this. It just feels off somehow. I want to see how it all ends.

Cate is pretty spot-on in her portrayal of Phyllis, who really was a smug, condescending bitch IRL.

I think the problem is in the storyline. It really shouldn't be about Phyllis Schlafly. It should be about the women's rights movement of which Schlafly was one of many players. But I guess with "CATE" signed on, they had to make it more about Schlafly against the world.

R332 Cate's face looks strange. Something is off. Maybe too much fillers or I'm not sure. Her accent and intonations sounds different than the real Phyllis, ,too.

[quote]Her accent and intonations sounds different than the real Phyllis, ,too.

That's because Cate listened to a few of Schlafly's recorded speeches and based her entire speech pattern on that, not thinking that maybe Schlafly didn't speak like that in normal conversation but put on a different speech pattern for public speaking.

Cate's not attractive to begin with, so why worry how her face now looks? I've never understood why she's always promoted as if she's some important fashionista type and why so many high end brands court her. Cate is very plain, she' s certainly no great beauty.

I think she is pretty. I like that she doesn't have a normal ski slop nose. But she is very pretty. The tone of this episode just sort of felt slow and low impact, but they are really building up Houston. I love that I don't know how this will be shown. I know there is no ERA so the conservatives win.

I felt a for Phyllis during this episode because she displayed the dismay I'm feeling now with Congress, the courts and the Executive Branch under the control of Republicans. She just felt like this but in the reverse. So many of the arguments and items from the show are still relevant today.

[quote]The tone of this episode just sort of felt slow and low impact,

The episode is titled "Bella" yet they completely gloss over her loss of her Congressional seat. They spend more time on Phyllis' daughter throwing a tantrum (who cares about that?). And for a bit of Emmy bait, they give Margo the monologue about Mississippi, which was also poorly written. Margo isn't given the emotional material to complete that scene. If it's not a scene where Phyllis is twirling her mustache and saying, "Mwhahaha" then it feels like they didn't spend anytime thinking about those other scenes.

Tracey Ulman is wonderful in this... Emmy worthy

R334, what Cate does not capture is the "just plain folks" part of Schlafly's delivery. She may have dresses like an upperclass matron, but her zingers were not delivered in a supercilious way. Cate plays her like Fanny Cradock.

Blanchett is the upmarket Aniston in terms of beauty. If either looked like a model, they wouldn't have the same stature.

I hope there is some more focus on her gay son.

R334, Cate's face really does look different. I think it's a more recent nose job and the lack of fillers for this show. In Ocean's 8, her face looked like a balloon.

R340 You're right

R343 What kind of nose job would make her have a bigger nose?

Cate isn't pretty, but she's attractive and charming, when she's not trying too hard to be "funny" on talk shows. She photographs well, despite her unusual features. Her eyes pop and her smile is contagious. When she speaks about her craft in a serious manner, she's eloquent.

Of course, seeing her without her beauty team's efforts on Zoom also proves the miracles of professional hair/makeup and she looks very ordinary. But she's talented, so kudos to her.

I just find her theater-y and hammy in the Schlafly role.

Today is her birthday, incidentally.

[quote]I hope there is some more focus on her gay son.

Which is part of the problem with this show. Is it a biography about Phyllis Schlafly or is it a story about the ERA movement? It would be great to see how a conservative icon deals with a gay son, but we don't get that story.

We do get both a gay kiss and a lesbian kiss in the 7th episode.

Great sound track! Ramones last episode and The Runaways this week! CH-CH-CH-CHERRY BOMB!

Imagine having Phyllis Schlafly for a mother. Those poor kids!

Her daughter even shared her name!

Did her brother suggest the name "Liza?"

This is easily one of the strongest shows on television. After surviving “Hollywood,” it’s great to see a show focused on exploring complexities and characters. The pace might feel slow if you don’t enjoy detailed, sensitive acting or don’t understand what is going on. The power dynamics (especially with Schlafly’s allies) are fascinating. I thought Martindale gave a masterclass in this last episode.

Margo Martindale should get an Emmy for this. She is a fantastic actress.

[quote]Margo Martindale should get an Emmy for this. She is a fantastic actress.

If only she had been given better writing. Bella Abzug was a more interesting character than what they are writing. Her monologue about going down to Mississippi could have been better written.

Agreed 100%, r352. Abzug's story is quite interesting. It's barely touched on here. This series is a great idea, but the writing is all over the place. That's too bad; they have the perfect cast, Tracy Ulman as Betty Friedan is just outstanding. But the cadence of the series is all wrong.

If you aren't familiar with the story of these women, the writing gives you no tools to paint the picture. Still, it's a thousand times better than anything else right now.

[quote]Blanchett is the upmarket Aniston in terms of beauty. If either looked like a model, they wouldn't have the same stature.

There's no comparison whatsoever. Blanchett always looks mean and angry, with squinty eyes. Overall, she has an unpleasant face. Aniston, while not a great beauty, looks approachable. I'm talking about in terms of their looks, not in terms of them as actresses, fashion icons or whatever. I'm talking about if they were average women you noticed sitting in a doctor's waiting room, Blanchett seems haughty and pretentious. She basically has resting bitch face. The actress from Homeland, Clare Danes, has the same type of face.

I think R345 is missing the point. It's a show about women who are fundamentally alike despite their vast ideological differences. Phyllis, Bella, Betty (and to a lesser extent Gloria) were all driven by the idea that they were morally right despite any flaws in their arguments/approaches.

The writing of the Bella Episode was far below the other episodes. Thank you, Micah!

I wanted to see some reflection on the failed senate deadline. So many missed opportunities and Abzug. She was the most interesting character in the show, yet she was used to basically enhance everyone else story during her episode. Very odd.

Those are his friends and it’s a Pandemic, people lottery have the time to go on multiple shows since they are chilling at home. His team preps for his CNN show and Anderson is a work horse so this is nothing.

I like the idea of spreading the awareness of gay parents. Beats watching guys like Matt Boomer hold back tears while he pretended that his children didn’t exist on live TV. Yeah, I’d rather these press interviews over the lies.

Wrong thread lol

[quote]I wanted to see some reflection on the failed senate deadline. So many missed opportunities and Abzug.

That was one of the flaws in the writing. Just as Bella is about to make her speech in Schlafly's home state, she "schools" Schlafly's followers backstage. All one of them had to do was say, "Bella, the people of NY didn't want you, why do you think we do?"

I like when this show calls out some of the hypocrisy from both camps.

1. Working girls statement from the STOP ERA group. They were so proud to be something they claim to object.

2. Phyllis felling Jill that she doesn’t drink, then has a glass of white wine. At then end of the episode when she’s made it into the smoked filled Republican back room, she accepts and drinks a Scotch.

3. During the Jill episode some of the woman make a big deal out of the sexual harassment by members of their party, but don’t seem to have an issue with the physical harassment inflicted on the staff by Abzug. They rolled their eyes when the one male at the Ms meeting told them to calm down, but laughed off the throwing of cole slaw at a coworker.

That actress playing the old lady evangelist is awesome. Truly a scary hateful woman. I like how she gets straight to business and sees though Phyllis’ bullshit niceties.

R360, just because you didn’t write the script doesn’t mean it’s bad. That scene in particular showed Abzug’s intelligence and humanity, there was no reason they had to have a gotcha. The fact that Abzug lost was clear throughout - you could see it in Martindale‘a performance. They just didn’t spell things out in bold for viewers who need that.

That old lady evangelist was Loddie Beth Hobbs, and she was a hateful scary bitch. She only died a few years ago. Horrible woman.

Unpopular opinion: I don’t think she is a good actress. Her accents are garbage and she is corny as fuck.

There are a lot of females on this show r364, who are you taking about?

Pia Zadora.

Cate Blanchette

Upthread someone didn't know that Steinem was a CIA spook until I mentioned how it was very briefly mentioned in the show. I believe her intentions were pure-hearted (a World Youth Congress between Soviet and Western states), but she was still a stooge. Here's some more context:

In other words, all heroes are flawed. Mrs. America's most prescient point.

R290 a good writer needs to make some kind of thriller out of late 50s Cold War soft-power.

R370, you may find this podcast of interest:

[quote] I know her father is from Texas and she's half American, but she's mostly Australian and has an Australian accent.

If only actors could somehow imitate other accents than their own!

Hey, Meryl. Your accent in Dancing At Lughnasa was shit!

Tracey Ullman may not be as ugly as Betty Friedan (which is pretty much impossible), but all the same, she is absolutely no oil painting

[quote] Hey, Meryl. Your accent in Dancing At Lughnasa was shit!

Maybe it was, cunt, but Cate Blanchett's Missouri accent is impeccable.

Tracey Ullman is a perfectly pleasant-looking woman. She's not unattractive.

Betty Freidan was downright ugly.

Cate does not have a Missouri accent in this. She sounds very old-school East Coast.

Betty was a Jew

[quote] Betty Freidan was downright ugly.

At least she didn't have Harvey Fierstein playing her.

[quote]Betty was a Jew

Even fucking Helen Keller could see that.

Harvey Fierstein as Bella Abzug is inspired casting.

[quote] Tracey Ullman may not be as ugly as Betty Friedan (which is pretty much impossible), but all the same, she is absolutely no oil painting

Tracey has always said that she didn’t have looks to lose. She was always cute, imo, and her body has always been a knockout thanks to her years as a dancer and still being an exercise junky. She said her face is so easy to manipulate and transform because it’s so large. She’s never had any plastic surgery.

I will say it again:

[bold] Tracey Ullman may not be as ugly as Betty Friedan (which is pretty much impossible), but all the same, she is absolutely no oil painting [/bold]

[quote] She’s never had any plastic surgery.

And water is wet, honey.

Friedan had that old world babushka look. It didn't keep her from an accomplished life.

And I’ll say it again - Tracey is cute.

Love, love Tracey Ullman.

R383 = repetitive twat

Two episodes left. Judging by IMDB, the writers shot their wad with the episode “Betty”.

[quote]Two episodes left. Judging by IMDB, the writers shot their wad with the episode “Betty”.

Agreed. 9 episodes were too many for these writers to handle.

I just watched the whole thing thus far by binge-watching--I got Hulu this week.

I'm glad there's a bit of a camp sensibility flickering in it--if it were over the top it would be too much, but it was fun to watch Cate Blanchett listening in horror to the Runaways sing "Cherry Bomb" on her daughter's tape recorder.

It's a very good series, and it's pretty well written, although they've not done as good of a job impressing the urgency of the ERA passing as I would like. It's been interesting to me how there are many opportunities for them to have brought in actors playing big entertainment and political celebrities, but we've only seen a very few just in passing (Jerry and Betty Ford, Shirley Maclaine) and some big ones who are mentioned but not seen at all (Rosalynn Carter, Marlo Thomas, Warren Beatty). Probably that makes sense because it's such a gigantic cast of characters as it is.

Blanchett is terrific--I don't understand the DL dislike for her at all. She's very strong and powerful, very cool, and very vindictive. So far the most moving parts of the series have been to me the casual cruelty she exhibits towards her unmarried sister-in-law (Jeanne Tripplehorn) whenever she's feeling bitchy or needs to do it out of political expediency. Tripplehorn's part is small, but she's been wonderful (as usual). The supporting women have all been first rate too: Uzo Adabe (as Chisholm) and Margo Martindale (as Abzug) have been the standouts so far.

The complaints about the lack of an exact physical resemblance between Betty Friedan and Tracy Ullman are typical of Dataloungers, who ALWAYS bitch whenever an actor does not look 100% exactly like the famous historical personage they portray. Where the hell are you going to get an actress who looks just like Betty Friedan with that hideous nose? And if Ullman had worn a putty nose it would have been distracting. I thought she did a great job as Friedan, even though Friedan was such an abrasive person who was so hard to like.

John Slattery did have distracting makeup to play Fred Schlafly--they clearly added age spots and dyed his white hair, which paradoxically makes him look older. I had no idea the Schlaflys lived in such an enormous house outside St. Louis--practically a mansion.

R391 they had $$$

R391, I thought Blanchett was terrific at the beginning but as the series goes on, it's clear she's just using the same mannerism over and over again. Like she's a robot. I'm sure Phyllis was extremely calculated but in interviews, she doesn't come off as robotic as Blanchett does in the role. It's that "tick tick tick" thing that Hepburn said about Streep.

R393 disagree. Phyllis comes off the same in almost every interview

Blanchett’s performance has a lot of humanity, if you are willing and able to see it. She can be cruel, she gets hurt, and she also gets inspired “(but you can also make a mixtape for someone who is NOT your sweetheart”). If you know or understand women from that period and class, her performance nails something very true about their inability to ever expose what is behind the facade.

That Hepburn quote has been bandied around so much at actors who showed more far humanity than Kate could ever allow. Coming from an actress who defined mechanical virtuousity, it was a classic psychological projection.

[quote] Schlafly et al struck gold with the claim that the amendment would extend the draft to women. Because it very well could have and nobody, feminists included, really wanted that.

Although as the show points out, the draft was discontinued in 1973, so it became a pretty hollow argument. And if the draft were reinstated today (which would never happen), i think we would expect women to be included in it now. We're pretty used to women in the military at this point.,

One of Schlafly's other huge talking points was that the ERA would mean requiring mixed-sex restrooms, which was unthinkable at the time--but again, we're becoming more and more used to that.

R391, those aren’t DLers who hate Blanchett. Those are invading bigoted, conspirafraus from LSA, the kind of people who have, here, referred to Claire Danes as “that woman from Homeland”, and the UK Women First psychotic anti-Markle-ites. What they have in common is that they’re an even mix of Russian Troll and morons who parrot Russian propaganda talking points and they’re consistent misogynists, taking rageful aim at every attractive, successful woman. They’re also both groups of Straight women (and Trolls in Digital Frauface), willfully invading a board created exclusively for gays and lesbians to converge.

^^^What a marvelous description of the envious cunts.

[quote]Although as the show points out, the draft was discontinued in 1973

They did not discontinue the draft in 1973, they just renamed it. I turned 18 in 1982 and I had to go down to the local post office and register for "Selective Service". Luckily for me, there have been enough men to go and fight in military operations, but in 1982, if Iran had been more aggressive and Reagan decided to go to war, I have no doubt I would have been drafted.

[quote]One of Schlafly's other huge talking points was that the ERA would mean requiring mixed-sex restrooms, which was unthinkable at the time

And that's still an issue today. We have men saying they are trans and walking into women's locker rooms at the gym and women are not pleased about it.

One of the weirdest things was seeing Phyllis in a swimsuit twice and realizing Cate Blanchett actually has quite a nicely toned body.

I understand that it would be too difficult a concept to explain adequately in the series, but understanding the fear of adding additional text to the Constitution, which began in the mid-1970s, is essential for understanding opposition to ERA and every other amendment that has been suggested since then. The 23rd through 26th amendments breezed through in the 60s and early 70s. It was after many SC rulings in the 1960s and 1970s that reinterpreted or added new meanings to existing text that people became wary of providing the SC with more clauses to interpret in ways that could not be controlled or predicted. If it weren’t for that, the ERA would have been a slam dunk.

Thanks, R401. I was in elementary, middle and first years of high school when this was going on, so I was not tuned in enough at the time to understand what the big fucking deal was.

I wasn't around during the time period covered in this series, so it's been educational for me. I was only vaguely aware of who Schlafly and all the other players were, except for Gloria Steinem. It's been educational.

Another current limited series I recommend the the documentary "Slow Burn" about the Watergate scandal. It's six parts that covers everything and is very good. Again, it's an excellent resource for people who were not alive at the time.

If a new ERA is ever submitted, it will be longer than the original. It will be more precise on what is covered and what is not.

Wouldn't passage of the ERA have legalized same sex marriage way back then? Or at least been the justification for it passing as soon as securing gay marriage became a rallying point?

It is not about the amendment but the litigation that follows.

We could have a country where abortion was treated as simply another medical procedure rather than religious baby killing.

Iwas in high school, but this really fascinates me. Not so much about the ERA, but about how Phyllis Schafley and the Evangelical lunatic woman began organizing the Right and shaping it into the monster it has become today. The seeds were all there, the Klan support , etc. anything to oppose the liberals . Gotta say. They have been consistent in cobbling together their plans.

I love how Schlafley th9o9ught the Republican PArty was in grave danger because of the Liberal wing, and how they were talking about Reagan and rightly assessed that he'd never leave the Republican Party even at CPAC's urging to form a third party, the Conservative Party. Damn. I wish they had. A 3rd party on the Right would have guaranteed Democratic victories for decades.

[quote]A 3rd party on the Right would have guaranteed Democratic victories for decades.

Except Reagan won 49 out of 50 states. People would have voted for him no matter what party he was in.

Not if there was a traditional Republican. If there was a third Party it would have been somewhat like the 1992 election.

It's crazy to think how much the Republican party changed from the early 70s the early 80s. Both parties had the ERA as part of their platform. In the 1980 election, the Republican party withdrew their support for it.

My grandparents were the old Republicans, I guess what you would call "Eisenhower Republicans" or maybe "Country Club Republicans," i.e. they were fiscally conservative but they weren't religious nuts and believed certain things like abortion and some other social wedge issues were completely private matters. They didn't care much for Reagan and hated how the Reagan era brought all the evangelicals out of the woodwork and gave them a national spotlight. My grandparents thought that those people were really trashy and embarrassing for the Republican party, and were ruining it.

There were a LOT of people like my grandparents back in the day who felt that way, but the tide turned and there was nothing they could do about it. Reagan changed everything, for the worse and not the better.

My parents called Kennedy Airport *Idlewild* until the day they died.

The newest episode was the best one yet. Sarah Paulson was actually good, though I'm not generally a fan. Cate was barely in it.

Loved this episode but there's no escaping that Paulson's character is fictional. She's wish fulfilment in many ways - used to soften Phyllis in other episodes, and here she's an extreme example of someone starting to have an awakening

Does anyone have any info about Schlaffly's neighbor who did have an awakening?

You mean the sister in law r416? She just stopped showing up to her meetings and became the home’s second maid. She was only offended by Phyllis calling out single women.

No, I mean the neighbor who supported Schlaffly and then started supporting the ERA.

She has been referenced so frequently when Paulson's character is discussed in media, that I wanted to know more about her.

A little google told me all.

Her name was Dorothy Haegele. She opened a pro-ERA office right accross from Fred Schlaffly's.

Gloria and Jill are the only two who are still alive, and they're both well into their 80s.

My mother adored Bella! Adored her. She cried when Bella died.

Some Canadian trivia. I was watching the credits on episode 8 and I noticed that the first assistant director was Siluck Saysanasy, aka Yick from Degrassi Junior High and Degrassi High.

What was the "Christian tranquilizer"? A Quaalude? I loved her wandering around to all the. various breakout sessions in a. hazy state of wonder and revulsion.

It was an interesting way to showcase. Houston for sure.

Slattery is doing a great job as Phyllis's husband. A mean, small-dicked pig.

Why the fuck did Disney put this on Hulu and not on FX???

HULU is coming up, R424. Does anyone know who owns HULU? I'm too lazy to check. Also wonder if HULU is growing strong enough to either buy someone else out or to be eaten alive by one of the bigger boys. So many networks a re emerging. EPIX, HITZ, Peacock, it makes me dizzy and all of them are subscription.

Episode 8 is the worst. What a waste. I get that they needed a way to show all the different sects of women that were involved, but a conservative woman's drug trip seems a poor way to do that.

[quote] HULU is coming up, [R424]. Does anyone know who owns HULU?

Huh?

Disney owns Hulu.

I sort of liked the episode. It was like sitting in a room and asking Trump fans to defend his actions. At a certain point some views are indefensible. Those women saw that. You can be conservative without being hateful. I liked that this called that out. I liked the episode and wasn’t ready for it to end. I’m also a sucker for 70s clothing and this had it in spades.

Was this the last ep.?

Why was the other woman such a bitch?

I believe there is one more, r429.

[quote]Was this the last ep.?

There's one more episode.

And they better sing the goddamn "I Am Woman Hear Me Roar"

It’s a 9 part series. I believe it was intended to be 6 but they decided to do more.

Dusty Springfield had the best "I Am Woman."

Paulson was such a bitch to her friend.

[quote]Paulson was such a bitch to her friend.

Junkies often are.

Haha that was great r436. I mean that short hairs bitch leading the IL division and cozying up to the wives of Klan members.

Hearing the Cris Williamson song at the end made me smell patchouli.

We’re hotels like that with reservations back in the day? Just overbook and tell guests to fuck off?

R439 yes. In many places. It wasn’t like today where they have computers to keep track.

"I'll just call my husband, Buck, to straighten this out."

"Pay. phone's over there."

The overbooking still happens sometimes at hotels or on flights.

[quote]We’re hotels like that with reservations back in the day? Just overbook and tell guests to fuck off?

Not necessarily. I think that was just artistic license to set up the story of putting extra pressure on Paulson's character and forcing her to share a room with someone else. Better writing would have had Paulson's husband forget to make the reservation or delegate it to his secretary who didn't secure the reservation.

A hotel would give away your reservation if it got late and you didn't show up or didn't call and tell them you were arriving late. But they didn't just give away reserved rooms in the middle of the day like that.

You'll also notice that they didn't attempt to sleep in the car.

The problem that I had with this episode is that Paulson's character comes across as a total dope. I've known women who completely depended on their husband (my grandmother was that type) but they didn't act like total imbeciles. After all, it takes some level of sense to raise children. I get that they wanted to demonstrate that Paulson's character was completely dependent on Schlafly, but she was made too helpless.

R443 that happened many times in the past. Don’t be dumb.

Melanie Lynskey is so underrated. Love her in this.

Can some woman explain why and when women stopped wearing pantyhose?

^^^what a perfect bitch! She wouldn't even let Pam and Alice change in her room. They had to go to the public restroom where sisters were smoking the ganja!

Yeah why wouldn’t her friend let her at least use her room to freshen up? Kind of fucked up. I would.

I like Paulson. I like Cate and I like Rose Byrnne. Rose is married to Bobby Canavale and he played Tom Snyder in this episode.

Rose is doing such a brilliant job.

My favorite episode was the Betty episode though. It really pulled me in like no other episode, and I feel that had to do with Ullman’s performance.

Also loved the episode focused on Jill a lot, and I usually hate Elizabeth Banks. She was terrific.

The short and sweet original footage interspersed is a nice touch in this episode as well as throughout the series.

I wish Niecy Nash had more screen time. They should've done a "Flo" episode.

"And if that doesn't work... I take a Christian pill."

Best line all season.

In the late Sixties, "liberated" young women had stopped wearing pantyhose, and by the eighties most women had except at very conservative businesses (some women still wear them there).

Pantyhose are impractical. They develop runs, they are expensive, and after women started going bare-legged in the Sixties, people became very aware they did not create the illusion of nudity very well.

Pantyhose still are worn and a top seller in retailers. Women wear them still because they look better with many skirts etc. than going bare legged.

[quote]In the late Sixties, "liberated" young women had stopped wearing pantyhose, and by the eighties most women had except at very conservative businesses

It was actually a style for awhile in the 80s(?). Women would wear dark hose with a heavy material dress like tweed.

[quote]Women wear them still because they look better with many skirts etc. than going bare legged.

And women in colder climates wear them for warmth. In NYC, if a woman is going to wear a black cocktail dress to a Christmas Party, she's not going out barelegged.

Yup. And some women wear them under pants during winter r457, my mother being one.

Some skirts can’t be pulled off well bare legged. I don’t know any woman who doesn’t own At least one pare of pantyhose.

My mother's legs are unsightly. She has red blotches all over them. Had the blotches f or years she's 68. She needs to wear panty hose.

I will add that she has taken to wearing pants most of the time and in the winter she wears knee high hosiery.

It was a weird episode. It was a compelling story in many ways but even if you didn't know already Sarah Poulson's character was a composite created for writerly purposes, you should have known from this episode--the dramatic arc of her being more-or-less converted to the feminists' point of view was much too tidy. The stories of all the real women depicted have been very messy and so much true-to-life.

But I did like the setting: the horrible concrete hotel building (the interior of which reminds me a lot of the awful Bonaventure Hotel in LA, built in the same decade). And I also liked how much Phyllis's image changed in the course of the episode from the Poulson's character's perspective: she speaks of her at the bar as an angelic ideal friend, then dreams of her as a rejecting monster, and sees her at the end as what she's become, in her creepy Nancy Reagan-like bright red designer suit and helmet hair (Phyllis's physical transformation from the 1st episode to now has been something to see.)

[quote] Reagan won 49 out of 50 states.

Actually, Reagan won 49 out of 50 states later, in 1984, when he ran against Walter Mondale (who carried only Minnesota).

In the 1980 election, Reagan won 44 states. Carter won Georgia, Hawaii, Maryland, Minnesota, Rhode Island, and West Virginia.

[quote] Melanie Lynskey is so underrated. Love her in this.

She apparently bonded with Tracey Ullman during filming. Tracey bought her tons of baby furniture for her trailer. Tracey’s grandson was having play dates with Melanie’s.

[quote] Women wear them still because they look better with many skirts etc. than going bare legged.

Older women are the only ones who still wear pantyhose. People under 40 don’t even know they exist.

When I first started watching, I didn't realize that Melanie Lynskey was the woman from Two And A Half Men.

Just got caught up. Love what Blanchett is doing with this evil cunt. Shocked at how good Elizabeth Banks was in her episode (which was also the best written IMO). Like Aduba but don't understand the awards talk for her; Margo Martindale is better with less material just in Episode 3, let alone the Bella episode (which I agree with many others was the thinnest writing of the lot).

What the show most accomplishes in showing how Schafly truly fucked us all--not just the ERA, but the way she linked all kinds of vile people into one smug confederation that continues to terrorize us today. I hope she's rotting somewhere now, and her son who still supports her should never see another dick.

You have to admire Schlafly's brilliance. The star wattage of Bella Abzug, Gloria Steinam and Betty Friedan were no match for our Phyl.

R463 I don’t know who Melanie Lynskey is, but it sounds sad that she lives in a trailer park and is so poor that she needs British American comedian Tracey Ullman to buy her furniture for her baby. But I guess Tracey still gets a cut of that Simpson’s money so she must be rolling in the dough.

R447, IIRC, Rosemary was staying at Mitchell Inn which was similarly overbooked. I assume there wasn’t enough time to go there and come back.

Recent interview with Blanchett in which she discusses the show and Schlafly:

Women under 40 know what pantyhose are 🙄🙄

What is it with men on here always speaking for women?

I’m not what you would call a fan of Paulson, but playing an unsympathetic character has let her talent shine through. Ryan should pull back from always having her be the hero of the story. The phone scene listing the ingredients was masterful, but I get what you’re saying having the composite character be the one with the most growth and how that can be problematic.

I am interested in the episode count. It’s strange how they are all over the place now days, you never know how many episodes you are going to get for a series. I could have used one or two more for the Plot Against America and two less for the Sinner. When a series is being pitched and finalized in production, is each episode budgeted for individually or is everything just pulled out of the big pot of money for the production? If so how could they have just added two here? If budgeted per episode is it a flat rate for all, or is each one itemized individually? Can money left over for one be carried over to another or would they just loose it back to the studio? And it seems like productions have a completely different budget for PR and promotion. You would think that would be part of the original package to assure the creator that the funds will be available for the full launch.

Many parents make their little girls wear pantyhose while in a dress or skirt. How they wouldn’t know what those are as adults is stupid.

THE SCENE with Alice in the hallway, her makeup a realistic wreck and then GLORIA APPEARING in her slacks and scarf...

I FEEEEEEEEL LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE! I FEEEEEEEEL LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE!

Oh my lard I laughed with real happiness. It made my day!

It's so good, It's so good, It's so good, It's so good,

I though Melanie Lynsky gave one of the best performances of the 90s in Heavenly Creatures. It is great to see her now so many years later.

Is she good on Two and a Half Men? Is it worth watching for her?

R474, I had the same reaction. I did not know what to make of the music choice. Gloria’s a sexpot? In her altered state, Alice realizes she admires her? I find it a little on the nose that a character Alice drinks something, eats something, and then explores wonderland—a place with characters and circumstances beyond her imagination.

R472, I actually love Paulson, and am struck by how beautiful her features are to In seventies costumes. Of all of her American Horror Story appearances, the costume I feel best showcased her was Lana Winters defending her son on the playground against a bully. IIRC, that scene was also seventies set.

They lowkey are star struck and admire Gloria

I have a feeling that when the idea was originally conceived it was thought of as a 6 episode miniseries. Let's do a series about the ERA and focus on the major players: Schlafly, Abzug, Steinem, Friedan. We have to throw in a diversity episode about Chisolm.

I wonder if when Cate Blanchett agreed to the project, it was bumped up to 9 episodes to make it "event" tv. But there's a lot of material that doesn't need to be covered. We didn't need an entire episode with Elizabeth Banks' character. We didn't need an entire episode with Sarah Paulson's character. The point the show is trying to make about their characters could have been made in one episode or economized into other episodes.

I don't think the show really knows what it wants to be. It's titled "Mrs. America" so we're to assume that it's a look about how Phyllis Schlafly influenced the ERA vote. But there's not enough material there for six episodes. I think it was the right idea to include the other women, but as Steinem says in her episode when she's called Mrs. Steinem, "It's Ms."

So my take is that it started out as a good idea, but the material was thinned out too much and the general idea was watered down to focus on Schlafly.

R478 go jump off a bridge. Chisolm was a wonderful, hard working, intelligent woman who did a lot for the women’s rights movement as well as women of color movement. Go fuck yourself.

I thought it was funny how Alice and her lackey were both like “God! She smells good!”

C’mon, Rose Byrne is hot enough to turn most church ladies.

[quote] Is she good on Two and a Half Men? Is it worth watching for her?

She plays a neighbor that is semi-stalking Charlie Sheen's character. She's excellent in the role, but it's the stereotypical second banana role. Her character is pretty much the same throughout all appearances.

[quote]Chisolm was a wonderful, hard working, intelligent woman who did a lot for the women’s rights movement as well as women of color movement.

I didn't say she wasn't. But the only reason she is in the show is to reflect how the white women were ignoring others and to push the false narrative that Schlafly associated with racists while Steinem/Abzug/Friedan saw the error of their ways and became inclusive (which is false because we see the black woman writer not feeling included at Ms. magazine). Once that is accomplished, Chisolm is dropped from the storyline.

R482 GO. FUCK. YOURSELF.

Yes, r476 her hair out outfit was snatched in that one little scene on the playground in AHS.

[quote] Why does Elizabeth Banks keep getting work. No one I know likes her.

Even if you dislike her, she's quite good. She caught a lot of people's eyes with "W" years ago--she not only actually looks like Laura Bush, but she brought a lot to what was otherwise a small role in the film and stood out quite a bit. before then she had mostly done comic roles. She did much better with her role that Richard Dreyfus and Thandie Newton did with theirs, even though they had bigger parts.

She was quite good in the "Jill" episode as a very different type of feminist than Chisholm or Abzug or Friedan--she was a mother of multiple children, and she was very flirtatious with men in the Ford White House in order to "play the game." The other major feminist women on the show would never do what she did, but she showed it was the most practical way to move forward with the agenda at the time.

I don't like the projects she often helms (like the terrible "Charlie's Angels" reboot), but she's a fine actress.

Jill is still alive. She was not a fan of Reagan and she isn't a fan of Trump either. She was actually fired from the Reagan Whitehouse because she wasn't conservative enough. She felt that Reagan didn't do enough to address things like racism and Reagan didn't like that. She was very much a Rockefeller Republican and I wish there were more of them.

[quote]She was very much a Rockefeller Republican and I wish there were more of them.

I'm glad there's fewer people trying to ride the fence. Be one thing or the other and don't pretend to be something you're not.

Rockefeller Republicans weren't pretending to be something they weren't. Rockefeller Republican types were a significant portion of the party until the 80s. The ERA was part of both parties' platforms until Reagan happened.

Oh, the final episode is called Reagan!

Imagine bitching because the show decided to include one of the few black faces of the ERA movement in the show.

Some of you need help.

Is the Nicey Nash character based on a real person or composite?

[quote] Imagine bitching because the show decided to include one of the few black faces of the ERA movement in the show.

Her character was there to point out the faults of liberal white women. They didn't include her in any continuing storyline like they did Betty Friedan who has outlived her usefulness on the series but remains part of the story. They've certainly fictionalized many circumstances in this story, they could have thrown in a few for Shirley if they were really that interested in her as a character.

R492 because Shirley was not with those others many times because she was off giving speeches in mostly black areas to get them on the movements side.

I agree that Banks is a good actress. Charismatic, even. But I rarely get the sense that she's enjoying herself, as an actor, in her scenes. And I almost always feel as though I'm watching someone who doesn't want to be looked at. Not sure if I've ever seen anything she directed or not.

Friedan hasn't outlived her usefulness to the show - she was actually at Houston, and her change to support the lesbians was major, even if the show trims her speech to make it seem more positive than it was.

I just can't get over what a cunt Phyllis Schlafly was.

I grew up hearing what a cunt Phyllis Schlafly was, but never having it explained beyond her opposition to the ERA. This series is really bringing home how much more far-reaching her banal brand of evil is.

R491 She is playing Flo Kennedy. They do not say her full name much so it is easy to miss who she is supposed to be.

I never heard of Elizabeth Banks before, but she is the actress I want to see in more roles after the series is over.

R498 Thanks!

Jill ought to be grateful Elizabeth Banks played her. My God have you ever seen a photo of her?

R501, yeah, not a looker by any means. She's able to mock herself though. I saw an interview she did and she said "Banks is much prettier than I was".

I don't think Ms Chisholm was an organizer of the women's movement the way Gloria, Bella, Betty and the others were. However, she was the first black woman to run for and become a US Congressperson and then was first to run for President. She spoke for the poor, underprivileged and for education and poverty reforms that are also the concerns of most women. (Not to mention every issue SC campaigned for is still relevant and unresolved to this day.) The circles of the Venn Diagram intersected here and the women's movement and Ms C worked together to some extent. That was reflected in the Shirley episode. (Shirley was also in a previous and following episode, so it wasn't just the one off.)

Shirley Chisholm was a real hero and she was tragically fucked over by the assholes in her own party. I loved seeing her as a character in this show.

R503 Well she is finally getting her due in Brooklyn.

[quote] I just can't get over what a cunt Phyllis Schlafly was.

I think the show tried to show with the bread baking tactic and the Friedan debate that Schlafly tried to position herself as the anti-cunt. She wanted to look more appealing than the feminists.

[quote] She wanted to look more appealing than the feminists.

A tactic that still seems to be working today.

Isn’t that all in the human psyche, though? In her mind she was the anti cunt, while the feminists are the cunts. In the feminists minds they are the anti-cunts, and the other side the cunts.

That is how it is. Always has been.

Dems see Republicans as cunts, while Republicans see Dems as cunts. It’s an ongoing cycle.

R443 is wrong. Hotels regularly over book because they want a full house and people often cancel - they probably overbook by 20% every day. Things always happen. If they get in a bind other hotels help them out with vacant rooms. In major cities they all have each other’s backs.

I always wonder about actors like Melanie Lynskey or Jake Lacy how they deal with being typecast all the time. I mean I’m sure they’re glad to be working but she’s always cast as ignorant, dim one with offensive views and he’s always the one night stand a woman always regrets before it even starts. He’s always the guy the woman doesn’t want, Mr. Second Best.

I had a reservation in Chicago once where the hotel wasn’t able to honor the reservation because of conventioneers extending their stay. The hotel sent me to a better hotel and my stay there was no charge. I’d like to be bumped like that again.

Completely disagree with R478. This series has been absolutely riveting. I could’ve had 10 episodes and another series of this. I loved the Ari Graynor episode and could’ve had a lot more of that.

Episode 8 was amazing. It’s too bad some people here are so dull in the head they can’t recognise good writing - Dahvi Waller did a great job of distilling the profound implications for the future of the country through one character. And in a series featuring a bunch of heavy hitters, Paulson’s performance was a tour de force - the moral dislocation, the trippiness of it, conveying the entire shifting narrative through her singular performance. You can write something like that but it takes an actress of extraordinary skill and power to pull all of that off. People talk about how they could listen to some actors read the phone book - Paulson created drama from reading a cornbread stuffing recipe. Case closed.

My friend reserved a Hotel months before her stay in LA, and when she went they were overbooked.

It still happens.

[quote] People talk about how they could listen to some actors read the phone book - Paulson created drama from reading a cornbread stuffing recipe.

It wasn’t very interesting without the second head on her shoulder.

I would one night stand Jake Lacy so hard!

Gloria Steinem says TV drama of 1970s feminist history ‘ridiculous'

In interview for Hay festival feminist writer says Mrs America misrepresents equal rights movement

It’s clear from that interview that Steinem hasn’t even watched the series. The insurance issue is brought up early on. The series covers the perception of the public issue and it isn’t over yet.

I listened to a right wing podcast about it by Schlafly’s niece and they’re just as blinkered as Steinem is. I think there’s a lot of nuance in this series but these figures are too entrenched in their point of view to give any way.

r511 what you say is true. Sarah Paulson gave an excellent performance. However, Paulson's character is made up.

The point is that this series is mixing fact with fiction. Some people are looking at this series and taking the fictionalized pieces as truth.

Take the character of Lottie Jean Hobbs. She is given more prominent place as Schlafly's right hand, but little is known about the woman. I grew up in a heavy Evangelical environment and I ran the name past my mother and she had no idea who she was. Lottie Jean was not a Tammy Faye Baker or Billy Graham or Oral Roberts level person (people who were extremely well known in Evangelical circles in the 1970s). If Lottie Jean were as important as this series makes her out to be, then hardcore Evangelicals (like my parents) would know who she was.

So the point is that there is a lot of made up stuff stretching as truth.

The show does not present Lottie Jean Hobbs as anyone prominent. Her power is her mailing list, but it is clear in the show that even the people on her list probably do not know her name.

But she was real and she was a force.

[quote]The show does not present Lottie Jean Hobbs as anyone prominent.

It shows Phyllis Schlafly having to appease Hobbs by allowing KKK members to be included.

R520, the show portrays Hobbs as powerful, not prominent. She has a powerful political machine, but is not herself a well-known public figure.

Her power came from her publishing company and mailing list. But she was not a well-known public figure on the order of Schlafly.

The show dramatizes that Hobbs needs Schlafly to be the public face and Schlafly needs Hobbs to shore up the grass roots support. As portrayed in the series, the two women find each other distasteful but recognize their mutual self-interest.

Next episode is going to be a huge downer when everyone gets totally fucked over except for Schlafly via Reaganism.

In addition to the Christian pill Alice took, she also ended up eating pot brownies in the room with some kind of art film screening. Girl was lit. No wonder she was so hungry.

The writing was phenomenal in showing how whenever Alice raged at anyone like Pamela for being a battered wife, or the Christian pill lady, even hanging up on her mother --she was truly externalizing her own self-hatred. But then, while high as fuck, she hung out with the lesbians (thank goddess for lesbians), apologetic not only to the people she realized she was hurting but also to herself. Standing up for the platform to "support women unconditionally" (or something along those lines, I need rewatch with subtitles), was awesome.

Julie White was the woman at the bar. She is such a wonderful actress, she never disappoints. She should've been much bigger.

[quote]Next episode is going to be a huge downer

Let's wait and see.

Maybe the series will pull a Tarentino and instead of an ERA bloodbath it will end with triumphant passing of the amendment and someone will throw a bucket of water on Schlafly and she will melt.

This final episode was a bit of a down or untold story. But everyone gets their just deserts so I was somewhat pleased. Overall this series was just good. I learned something, but I wouldn't really go out of my way to watch it again.

True story. Many years ago, one of my cousins was friends with Ms Schlafly and brought her to his moms home. My aunt told me she was so nervous to meet her, she farted during the into

This was nearly perfect television. It didn’t flatten the characters to fit the narrative, it pinpointed a lot of the roots of our widening political and cultural rifts, and it was meticulously researched and filmed to both represent and analyze the historical period. When acting is this detailed and on point, it is no mistake. Dahvi Waller knows her shit.

I was disappointed by the last two episodes--they were anticlimactic, and depended only on one of the made-up characters (Sarah Poulson's Alice) to have any kind of dramatic arc to them.

In real life, the failure of the ERA to pass was itself anticlimactic; but that did not mean in the end this made for a strong miniseries, despite the strong acting.

The last episode is a bit anticlimatic. None of the women get what they want. And they completely ditch Sarah Paulson's character in the last minute. She is the only character with growth in the show and we don't get to see the result.

I watched and enjoyed it, but it all seemed a bit... much ado about nothing.

[quote] it all seemed a bit... much ado about nothing.

That's the point, and why not having the ERA hasn't made any difference.

I did like the final scene with Schlafly in the kitchen. She wanted power but in the end she built her own tomb.

I wonder what would make a person like that snap out of it? She saw how men treated her, her husband hating being 'Mr. Phyllis Schlafly', and not getting a reward for hard work; so why wouldn't she just admit she was being treated unfairly because she was a woman? Was it really worth dumping herself and all women in a smaller pond just so she could be a bigger fish?

I also liked that Reagan was the only person to ever thank her. Even her own husband just whined about not having dinner ready without acknowledging her worth to life she's provided for him.

It felt a little bit like a didactic Afterschool Special-type history lesson at times, but I thought it was great overall. I gasped with the last thing that flashed on the screen before the credits: Schlafly’s last book was “The Conservative Case for Trump.” Before then, the series could have been accused by some of having humanized her too much, but that certainly makes her irredeemable.

BUMP

So will Hulu spin this off into a series about those wacky women libbers? One of my favorite one season hit wonder TV shows was basically about this and it was such great TV. It was called Swingtown and starred Melrose Place’s Grant Show and the wonderful Miriam Shor as a repressed housewife like Sarah’s character. Quite frankly I would rather see Sarah do something like this than another RM project, I enjoyed her here more than anywhere else in the last few years.

Would the ERA have accomplished things that were not in the end accomplished through the Civil Rights Act of 1965?

Yes, R537. it would have provided Constitutional protections. My mother likes to tell us about how she had to get my father's permission and his signature to get a bank loan or open a credit card account at Lord & Taylor. A woman couldn't buy a house or a car without a co-signer. Even if she had a job. That's important. Even if she had a job. She said that if a man beat his wife it was considered a private matter and police rarely ever did anything about it. A man could never be arrested unless the wife agreed to press charges and testify against them in court. Of course this would also deprive a woman of income. So if a guy had a job, but he went out, got drunk and came home and beat his wife up no one did anything. Women never were paid what men were for the exact same job. And if a company had to lay people off, they got rid of the women first because men were considered heads of family/breadwinners. All of these things were true up until the mid to late 70's when federal legislation was passed, but even then it wasn't enough.

It would have reduced abortion to a medical decision.

R538 My mother’s mother always worked, and she eventually became a bank manager. My grandfather was a functional alcoholic who worked in a hotel six days a week, and he spent his day off fasting from solid food and drinking alcohol. He wasn’t a “bad guy” under normal circumstances but he did have a conflict with my grandmother one time and he banged her head into the wall. My grandmother took my mom and her sister and left the state. He eventually tracked them down and went to beg my grandmother to come back. She said only on the condition that he would go to a doctor about his drinking. He agreed.

This is how that went:

Doctor: What can I help you with?

Grandmother: My husband has a drinking problem.

Doctor: Do you have a job?

Grandfather: Yes, I work in a hotel six days a week.

Doctor: Do you miss a lot of days?

Grandfather: No, never.

Doctor: Have you been reprimanded for poor performance?

Grandfather: No.

Doctor: I don’t see what the problem is. He provides for the family, doesn’t he?

Grandmother: Yes—well, we both do. But he attacked me while he was drunk.

Doctor: Oh, you have a job? Maybe that’s the problem.

—

Her first husband was gay and he left her for a man after WWII. She then married my grandfather, and she continued working because she enjoyed the independence and felt insecure relying on someone else financially. She got into banking because of her interest in financial freedom. She was very accomplished for her time. She told my sister and me that her boss once forced her to go to a banking conference with her (or else she’d lose her job) and then in the hotel he told her to come to his room for sex or else she’s lose her job. She said she went home and then expected to be fired, because there would be no recourse at that time, but she went to work as usual the next Monday and he never said anything to her about it. She wasn’t even quite five feet tall. I can’t imagine how much resilience women of that time had to have.

Thanks, R540 for that post. Your grandmother was a very strong woman indeed.

Binged this yesterday and today. Was Ullman nominated for an Emmy? She deserves one for her performance.

Great cast except it was obvious this was shot in Canada because many of the day players (like the guy who played Phil Donahue) were hopelessly bland. Canadian actors, generally, are just fucking indistinctive and uninteresting.

Ullman was incredible

[quote]Great cast except it was obvious this was shot in Canada because many of the day players (like the guy who played Phil Donahue) were hopelessly bland. Canadian actors, generally, are just fucking indistinctive and uninteresting.

Canadians are some of the worst actors out there.

Ryan Gosling is Canadian.

From Sexiest Man Alive to forgotten in a few short years!

I honestly forgot all about Ryan Gosling.

Well, there ARE a few exceptions ie Gosling. But Canadian actors, in general, are bland as fuck. They may look like they could be from the US but they have zero charisma and no sense of a vivid persona. Australian actors look like they could be from the US but do have charisma and a vivid persona. Go figure.

The beautiful ex-Canadian Luke Macfarlane is officially Amurrikan!

[quote]Well, there ARE a few exceptions ie Gosling. But Canadian actors, in general, are bland as fuck. They may look like they could be from the US but they have zero charisma and no sense of a vivid persona. Australian actors look like they could be from the US but do have charisma and a vivid persona. Go figure.

This is my view on Canadian actors. There are always exceptions and some Canadians are terrific comedy actors like Catherine O'Hara.But, if you tune into made for tv movies on Hallmark, Lifetime, or SyFy that film in Canada you really see bland most Canadian actors are.

Mike Meyers, Seth Rogen, Ryan Reynolds, Jim Carrey, Martin Short, Donald Sutherland, William Shatner...no charisma to be found among the Canucks!

How are things in Manitoba, R550?

[quote]It was called Swingtown and starred Melrose Place’s Grant Show and the wonderful Miriam Shor as a repressed housewife like Sarah’s character.

Miriam Shor was in the "Betty" episode of Mrs. America. She played Betty's friend/neighbor, Natalie.

[quote]Not if there was a traditional Republican. If there was a third Party it would have been somewhat like the 1992 election.

Please look up "John Anderson."

I thought the episode where Phyllis goes to Lottie Beth Hobbs' house was showing Schlafly at her worst.

She's very condescending to the lower class woman/hick and doesn't like her tacky, expressed bigotry, but as soon as she realizes she can use this woman and her mailing list, all her scruples go out the window.

It really showed that Schlafly had no morals, just ambition.

R554 That was the whole point of the Schlafly characterization. If anyone were too dense to get the message throughout the series, they pretty much hit you with a sledgehammer in the finale, when she is reduced to a servant-wife.

I grew up HATING anti-gay Schlafly.

So I did think the series was too sympathetic to her at the beginning. But It got its point across at what a manipulative opportunist -- even with her husband -- she was.

Cate Blanchett is an ideal actor to depict someone this vile, as she did in Blue Jasmine and Notes on a Scandal. She is great at this because she is charismatic and magnetic, as sociopaths and narcissists are, and so even when she’s playing someone horrible you remain engaged in her story and her motivations are so clearly communicated that you can relate in a way and even kind of admire their ambitions and wish they’d be better people as they go about realizing them. She proved in Elizabeth that she can be earnestly ambitious and noble, and has proved since that you can strip away the nobility and integrity from the character and are left with the same charismatic drive in a person who is not respectable. A lot of actors would play it as a cartoonishly evil villain, and that’s just a lot less interesting to watch most of the time. Or at least it leaves you feeling less unsettled. With this depiction of Schlafly, you probably imagine at times while you watch her that you might not have *hated* her had you met her, and that makes her much more nefarious than a typical bad guy.