Gay men in 'open' relationships

I don’t know. And I don’t get it either.

Everyone is in an open relationship in SF looking for a 3-way or side piece.

It's simple, if you don't like it then don't get in one. Stop whining about other people.

Me, neither, OP and R1. I genuinely looked for the better part of 25, 30 years for a partner / soulmate / husband before finally saying fuggit.

What's the point of being in a "committed" relationship if one or both parties either can't or won't truly commit? Just stay single and F your eyeballs out with anyone and everyone, instead.

Whores.

Meanwhile, I’m hotter than all of you cunts, and get even get one.

*can’t

We've been over this many times. My general conclusion has been:

1) One partner does most of the fucking around while the other puts up with it because they're too scared to lose them. 2) They are financially dependent on each other and can't afford to break up. They're just friends at this point but want to stay together because it's easier and they live a better life materially. 3) The small remaining couples are overly sexualized and agree equally to an open relationship as fucking around a lot is somehow part of their identity and self-worth.

The vast majority fall under #1 and #2.

R7 is correct, HOWEVER

#3 is the most common scenario nowadays, HOWEVER

What is "overly sexualized"? Monogamy wasn't working out too great for straight people decades and centuries ago, even though they got social acceptance and tax breaks. So why should gays be expected to strive toward monogamy in marriage—a model that wasn't working out for 50% of straight people, who comprised 90% of the population, all the way back in the '70s?

Why can't gay life be more polyamorous and pragmatic?

R8 - no, #3 is not the most common as most people's experiences have been.

It's not that it's strict monogamy - there are gay couples that will give each other a 'pass' here and there.

I'm talking about those whose identity is wrapped up in how many guys they can get and the constant hunt for someone new.

That's not really a healthy sexual life, purely from the STD stance alone.

There’s nothing more boring than having sex with someone you love

Ugh. This one married couple with Prep breath is always trying to get with me.

No different than het men. We’re just honest about it.

For the simple fact that I’m not hip to what PrEP breath smells like, I really miss WeHo.

It's not just us. Some people have them and don't even realise.

Speak for yourself, r10. Monogamy is easy if you're satisfied and unlikely to get better sex elsewhere.

R15 I was speaking for myself you cranky old queen. I’m glad that monogamy gets your rocks off, but as much as I love my husband, I need more than that. I can separate sex + love. Any holier than thou DL’er who gets up on his high horse to tell me the way I love doesn’t qualify to them can politely go fuck themselves ✌🏻💖

R16 - actually you weren't speaking for yourself otherwise you would have stated that.

To state 'there's nothing more boring than having sex with someone you love' means that your relationship is in very bad shape indeed.

Do you say this to your husband? Did you tell him that there's nothing more boring than having sex with him? How would you react to that?

If true, then you need to do your husband a favor and end the relationship. You can't just say inflammatory and derogatory statements and then snap back calling us holier than thou and judgmental.

Yes, I judge you and your relationship based on what you stated. I would be devastated to hear that comment from someone I'm in a relationship with and would end it right there.

I’m always completely amazed by how worked up GAY men get about this. It’s so frau-ish. R7 is wrong. In reality, I’d say most experienced gay men with self-confidence dont think monogamous sex is that important. Sex is getting your rocks off. Love is something different - as Is a lifelong emotional, financial and familial relationship.

I’ve decided it’s just that some men are wired differently - more like women who see sex as an emotional, psychological, spiritual bonding. For me, my husband having sex with someone else has no affect on me (cue the “you’re going to catch a horrible disease trolls”). Honestly at 55 after 30 years, if your husband having sex with a hot young kid makes you rage with jealousy about disrespect - you really don’t have enough self-esteem and are way too needy for a relationship.

R18 - so those not in open relationships are not experienced gay men and don't have self-confidence. They also don't have enough self-esteem and are needy. Got it.

Nobody is saying that you can't go out of the relationship from time to time. Nobody is saying strict monogamy only above everything else. Jeesh.

R18 - Serious question - what if your husband left you for said 30 y/o? It's a possibility that would give me anxiety. What if they had an emotional connection, would you feel differently?

R20 - I was going to ask that, but decided to leave it alone. R18 would just say that you have low self esteem and you're too needy.

There have been multiple stories on DL about guys being left for the side piece.

Fucking once or twice is one thing. Sometimes they become more than that - and can threaten your relationship. I believe R18 is going to say that if they leave you, then it was meant to be and that the relationship wasn't very strong to begin with.

So if you don't have an open relationship, then your relationship isn't strong. And if you're left for someone else due to being in an open relationship, then your relationship isn't strong. I guess only these really special people in open relationships have the sturdiest rock-solid relationships and the rest of us are just weak.

Really?😯 r10

(Gay) men look for validation. And what greater ego boost is there than to get laid by someone who looks hotter (or has a higher social standing) than you? Marriage doesn't kill your desperation for validation. You take that baggage into your marriage.

A lot of gay men grew up (some in religious families still do) with the belief that being gay is wrong and will lead to living a sad, depraved, and lonely life. So many people self sabotage when they find themselves in a happy state (which feels totally scary and alien to them).

One of the biggest reasons why marriages and relationships end is losing trust in the one who cheated. Of course, if both partners are ok with an open relationship the next potential hurdle could be the nagging fear of one partner leaving the other for a trick or side piece.

Let people do what they want. For me, though, I know I would be way too jealous and insecure to be able to thrive in an open relationship. Paranoia would get the best of me.

My husband developing an emotional relationship with another person and having sex with another person are different things in my mind. Just like it is for me. Having sex with someone else does not affect my view of or love for my husband,

Sorry for being judgmental about self esteem. I get others want monogamy. I just feel that when I see someone having a complete meltdown over the fact that their husband/wife had sex with someone else, it makes me wonder why that is so affecting to them. Ongoing intimate texts and conversations would be more jealousy provoking. But I think jealousy or any sense of ownership of another is so....self-sacrificial or seeking validity from something outside of yourself.

Relationships are for weak people. Open relationships are for the pathetically weak.

R18 - thanks for clarifying. It's just when you said that someone is too needy or has low-self esteem when they may be upset about an outside relationship or hookup sounds just like the words someone is cheating would say to their concerned partner. I've seen that side a lot. The person hooking up all the time has the other person convinced they are just insecure and needy.

On the other hand, you say 'seeking validity from something outside of yourself' - that can easily apply to going around outside your relationship and hooking up with a lot of guys. That's a form of seeking validation as well.

It's not 'ownership' of someone else. I don't think people who give their spouses a pass now and again have complete meltdowns over it. It is those relationships where the fucking around was done behind their back and without their knowledge - or if it's long term.

I don't know and I don't particularly care- it really does not concern me and I am the last one to tell people how to manage a relationship.

Insecure people / people who suffer from low self-esteem issues are usually the ones who can't stand to be in relationships, because there is a component of uncertainty they can't control. To them it's not a matter of if their partner is leaving them but when, and they obsess about everything that's going on in the relationship and suffocate their partner and the relationship with him.

I've had hot three-way sex with couples in my single days. Glad to oblige. They always were very comfortable and it was fun for everyone. However, my ex-bf and I got together with this hot guy one time and it didn't end well. The guy went to fuck my boyfriend and I had to stop it right then and there. It was like my guts were being ripped out.

I’ve been with my partner for 17 years. For the longest time, I’d have the occasional random encounter while traveling for work or in the sauna at the gym. We never discussed it (we started dating when we were both very young, and neither of us had the life experience to breach those topics) and I always assumed he probably did the same thing I did. Ten years into our relationship I got caught and he was incredibly angry with me. But... it did force us to have the conversations we should have had years before.

Nowadays, we are content with each other, and don’t hunt for thirds or other couples... but we’ve been in situations where it happens and we’re both comfortable with it. If we have sex together with someone else or another couple, it happens maybe twice a year, and usually under serendipitous circumstances, like the time we were on vacation and another gay couple around our age happened to be in the room next to us. We started chatting while out on our balconies and a few hours later we were all naked and just having fun together. No big deal.

I think there needs to be a separation here about what 'open' relationships are. From what I've seen, there are 2 kinds:

1) A couple that allows the other to play around a couple times a year - or engages with other couples once in awhile 2) A couple where one or both are continuously having sex with other people. They're basically acting single but they're in a relationship.

#1 is very common although they may not describe themselves as 'open'. #2 is what I think most people think about or describe an 'open' relationship.

FILTHY WHORES

Children, they're just children playing house.

The highs and lows of open relationships

straight couples are all in open relationships too--usually one of the couple don't know about it

Most gay men fuck around and most just hide it from each other. It's just easier to say you're monogamous and live the lie. And no not every open relationship is full of sex but it's there if the parties agree. Tell yourself he is not fucking around if it makes you feel better, it's a free country. I just may have fucked him myself.

My question is, if what you really want is variety and adventure, why do you need a partner?

We've been in an open relationship for 30 yrs and still going strong. We only know one couple who are still together since 1970 and they are open too , so there goes all your theories. I think we're still together BECAUSE we're open and not getting our panties in a wad over sex like so many of you. Straights screw around all the time and pretend they dont, gays are no different, better to be honest from the get go. Then there is that you all are looking for the best looking and richest man and the most perfect guy you can find. That perfect man doesn't exist.

I'd you're looking for monogamy in a gay relationship then just stay single and lonely because that's what you are going to get. Most gay men over 45 are single because they have to have that one perfect relationship that never will exist.

Men who put up with this kind of treatment are doormats, plain and simple.

Gosh r36 that is a very cynical take on human nature and relationships.😯

Men are whores, darlin. Women are too, but men are 10x that. Mother Nature always finds a way.

Mystery solved!

Let's go have some cake.

Human beings in general are restrained by logic and reasoning at best, and the overvaluation of sex in the 60s has really put the brakes on a lot of marriages since then. Just look at the stats. Gen X were the children of broken homes, they were latch key kids. Sex can become an addiction if over emphasized like it has been for the last few decades, much to the detriment of society. The straights associate being oversexed with being gay, and the gays play into it when there is so much more to gay relationships, like intimacy and companionship. We need some stops somewhere.

Speaking as young-ish gay of 27, the problem I see is that sex is way too accessible. You can download an app and be balls deep in some Twink 20 minutes later. It’s hard for monogamy to compete with that.

Yeah, exactly.

R12 nails it. I don't know a single hetero male friend or family member that has not at some point either admitted to screwing around or been caught red-handed. An acquaintance swears that her brother has never cheated on his wife, but he is massively and morbidly obese and also has a terrible personality. Even still....give him time. Some men pay for it. As for open relationships - some guys get excited watching and/or hearing about their lover getting fucked. This really isn't as rare as you might think.

We're nearing 10 years together, unmarried but the discussion very slowly develops each year, we started open and it was more due to a mix of my adventurism and his wariness that his relationship based OCD could handle being closed. He was unsure he could do it closed, and I actively promoted being open. Over time this turned to me doing almost nothing but liking that I have the freedom to do smaller things (gropes, kisses, whatever, still rarely happen and there's always a few guys waiting for my go-ahead) when the opportunity does arise, but he now gets laid once every one to few weeks with others.

I can say that it might have, over time, stunted aspects of our relationship but otherwise we have a very positive connection and adore each other. Our sex has slowed down a lot, he has sex with others more than he does with me, but we still do it and 4/5 of the time its an awesome experience. He's opened up to certain acts (ones I like but he didn't and ones that get introduced to me by him) and it spices up some things. He's fallen in love with at least two other guys over the years, but again besides the OCD, has stayed with me anyway and we held hands literally and figuratively throughout this. I've fallen in love with one bi guy who eventually married a woman, and our actions were barely anything but the connection was intense, but my partner also held my hands through it. And I have to note the other hand - though I'm much less active nowadays, much of that is because I'm more anxiety/depression affected from other mostly unrelated matters; I can easily see myself flat-out whoring when things improve (and if anything, that would be a relief to his OCD about all this).

I think it works for us, but I also think that it contributes to the overall issue we have of commitment. We passively commit, instead of standing up and taking more substantial action. But I think even if we end up doing everything else joint (finance, living, contract, inheritance, social), we still most likely won't be entirely sexually closed, and we will be understanding of each other if love for others arises. There's always a helpful discussion we have about anything. At one point there was a prospect of polyamory and I shut it down, but this didn't make my partner bitter but he was relieved as it clarified things for him - again, his OCD. And I've admitted that my one love was the only man that might have actually convinced me to leave my partner. Nothing was thrown at me and we were just fine.

R47 I get excited by it, as long as I feel I have the control, so I guess it isn't exactly 'cucking'. And I don't think he gets to excited, but I think he loves to know I'm enjoying myself out there.

R38 because we have been preached to and conditioned to believe that being alone/single is bad, unfulfilling, lonely and just plain sad and it makes you a loser in society’s eyes. Don’t get into a relationship just because you are too scared to go it alone. If you can’t handle being single, get a roommate or a solid small group of close friends that you can hangout with.

A man, gay or straight, will be as faithful as his options allow.

I volunteered at a gay community center and we once did a survey about monogamy. The vast majority of gay couples had open relationships because "monogamy is a heterosexual construct."

I espoused monogamy in a relationship once because I wanted all of our romantic energies focused on each other and then found myself cheating because a hot guy who I thought was out of my league wanted to fuck. Didn't give it a thought, just did it. Realized then that I wasn't cut out for monogamy.

Lol, that's how I got my partner. You have to be careful. We have a monogamous relationship. Fuck that; who has time to build a healthy relationship, if one party is always trolling. Happy with what we have and we are both committed. Only one rule; if you want out, just tell me. We can part as friends; cheat and you're dead to me. We can work on everything else.

R50 yes, where the hell did this notion come from that monogamy is the ideal, the gold standard to which we all aspire. From straight people who got it shoved down on them by organized religion back in the dark ages. If you want to make the conscious decision to go that route, great. But the idea that this is the norm, that this is what everyone should follow and want to follow and this is the ideal, just seems incredibly misguided.

All these"experts" and posters who seem to be so sure or how it "should" all play out. 1- what business is it of yours and 2- what qualifies you as a judge of other people's relationships?

I've never been in an "open" relationship, but then I was never 100% faithful. My approach has always been "don't ask, don't tell". The occasional occurrences had nothing to do with either of my long-term relationships (one 10 and the other 11 years) breaking up. I don't think I'd be good at an "open" relationship- but then what do I know- never done it. And frankly, I don't really care if others are doing it. I tend to stay clear of partnered guys- but not always. But really, whatever works for a couple- works. And I get a kick out of people who insist that one partner in a couple should bail because the other was "unfaithful". Whether hetero or homo- on what planet do those people live on?

I want the perfect man 'for me'. If I don't find him I'm absolutely fine with hooking up now and then and being single. I love my life, the only way I'm making a commitment is if he is perfect 'for me'. Sorry to here so many of you suggesting that you settled. I guess that's a component to arrive at an open relationship. If it works for you then go for it.

An occasional arrangement or threesome is one thing but it seems like every middle-aged gay couple with even a little bit of money now has a much younger live-in boyfriend.

R54, do you suppose that this perfect man will never change- if you ever find him? One thing I know about long-term relationships is that, everything changes. It's about the only thing you can count on. The change is not nearly as important as how you react to it.

Bill Maher came up with the line years ago. "Men are only as loyal as their options".

Man-woman relationships carry a lot of cultural baggage that just doesn't apply to gay partnerships and marriage. If a man cheats on his wife--especially if he gives financial support to the other women or worse, has children with them--that's a tangible threat to her and her children's well-being, in terms of financial, social and psychological stability. Divorce may be popular but it's not harmless. Also, men are known to kill their women (and sometimes children) if the wife tries to leave them. Adultery is still considered justifiable grounds for killing a wife--not so much a husband. Gay men have the chance to completely redefine love and marriage in a much more positive, healthy and egalitarian way.

[quote]A man, gay or straight, will be as faithful as his options allow.

Ridiculous. A man, gay or straight, will be as faithful as he decides to be.

Here's a simple answer: It's fun.

And you know what? It is.

And it's all fine. You're all pearl clutching on this one. Life is to be lived, so live it.

Gay men want to suck very dick they encounter until they can finally get the validation they never got from daddy.

[quote]What is it with all these couples and even married men in open relationships??

Ufhh, you should take a look at straight relationships. 90% of them are cheating on each other.

I’d wanna be present AND I’d wanna top the twink with a strap on. I know myself all too well, and this would eventually have to be a consensual scenario, or the “open” shit would not work for me.

What’s the point, if you’re ALL not having fun and participating?

Am I a whore? P r e t t y much. But a damn good one.

r44 A very good thoughtful post but could you please elaborate a little please what you mean by the overvaluation of sex has really put the brakes on a lot of marriages ? I am not disagreeing with you but rather would be interested to see you expand more on your viewpoint.

r51 What does validation from Daddy look like?

Sorry my above post was meant for r61.

I'm so confused and conflicted. This thread made me schedule a bonus session with my shrink.

So r45 thinks gay men only started having sex when hookup apps became available. R52 - the cultural expectation of monogamy arose from the evolutionary need to care for human children, who are dependant on parental care for much longer than most mammals.

No R68 it just became easier than it ever has before in the history of mankind to cheat your partner with apps

Another paid-for thread.

These relationships are known as "normal male relationships" among those of us not disgustingly attempting to fit ourselves into failed social norms.

r70 What do you mean?

I don't mind having sex with a guy in an open relationship. But I have to admit, it deprives me of the fun of being the side piece.

Sex fiends should never commit to one person in any way. And that's what these guys in open relationships are. Sex addicts.

Do what works best for you, but why do people carry on as if their own approach to relationships makes them any more advanced, evolved, or together than those who approach them differently? It's tedious and not at all convincing.

All the married gay guys I know I see on grindr.

And if you start shrieking about "heteronormative" this or that, just fuck yourself and your dumb queer theory classes.

Just admit you're a whore.

When I started dating my BF, I wasn't planning/expecting to be faithful. But he made it very clear he wasn't going to treat me seriously unless I committed. So I did, and I discovered I really liked the security and trust. After a number of years, and a series of rough patches, he told me he couldn't continue, and gave me a heads up that he was considering seeing other guys. That's all I could ask of him. We're both men, so there's no reason to be surprised. Just be honest with me, the way I always was.

R17 You can’t be in a relationship. You ᗰᑌᔕT be single. If not, my condolences to your very patient and hopefully in-a-vegetative-coma partner because you are one of the most insufferable, pompous, close minded, self-righteous bags of hot air I’ve encountered on DL - and that says a lot.

Go kiss your partners feet and thank him for putting up with such a miserable and judgmental queen as yourself.

Or if you’re single and alone, which is much more likely, go take a dirt nap

r25 = William O'Connor

R52, monogamy was not “shoved on” heterosexual couples by religion. It’s a logical requirement in relationships that result in children. If the wife is unfaithful, how does the husband know whether the children she bears are his? And if the husband is unfaithful, how can the wife be sure he won’t run off with some other woman, abandoning her and their children? (In reality, both things happen, but social opprobrium keeps the numbers down.)

If you don't want a monogamous relationship, why get married? I mean, what's the point? No kids, no monogamy ... why not just be an unmarried couple and screw around as you wish?

^^^That's not meant as a criticism. It's natural for men to want to fuck around. If a couple is happy together in other ways but needs or wants to add sex with others, it's nobody's business but theirs. I don't see the point in marriage in that situation, though.

We're whores darling

[quote]I don't see the point in marriage in that situation, though.

Because there are other societal advantages.

I'm sure the mincing prisspot brigade will queue up to tell me how disgusting I am, but my husband and I have been together for almost fifteen years. A few years ago, we realized that we have a huge libido mismatch (me>him) and he's told me numerous times that he doesn't feel like it's fair to force me to live like a monk just because he's not interested. I do emotional check-ins with him a lot, try and get him involved with threesomes (usually unsuccessfully), and have made it clear that I'll stop if it gets to be too much for him.

I know that if some of you could pry your fingers from your pearls long enough to respond, you'd tell me that my only options would be either to get divorced and throw away all of the other good things in our relationship, or to take my vows and reserve intimacy for my right hand and pornhub. Both of those choices sound miserable to me, and I reject them.