These Italian towns in Molise will pay you $27,000 to move there

What small businesses could DLers start in one of these small towns?

A male brothel.

non parlo italiano bene

Do these towns pass the Tasteful Friends test?

If it's a "rural [or agricultural] community", then it's likely VERY conservative and religious Catholic. They might need the money investment, but I'm not sure how welcoming they will be to outsiders, especially gays and bisexuals.

I imagine it's something like that French villagey town from the film "Chocolate", where Juliette Binoche was trying to start up a small business there, but the locals gave her a hard time for being too free-spirited (an unmarried hippie in a taboo sexual relationship with a travelling gypsy).

Italy has a youth problem, not too much unlike Japan really. A falling birthrate for awhile now and an aging population. Combine that with high unemployment making younger working adults seek out jobs in bigger cities and abroad and it's becoming a bit of a crisis for them.

Don't worry, we're on it!

Weed shops do well anywhere

Open up a kinky boots factory.

$27,000 per person seems generous.

How would they feel about a Chick-Fil-A franchise?

Life is [italic]slow[/italic] in these towns. You would have to be prepared for that. That's another reason youth, especially younger men, leave to cities like Rome and Naples.

I won how a Mexican food restaurant would do there 🤔🤔

Damn, Wonder how a Mexican food place would do there.

R13, a novelty and definitely better than Chik-Fil-A.

Chinese restaurants do well enough -- reading a Chinese restaurant menu in Italian, you'll probably do a double-take seeing noodle dishes described in terms of familiar pasta names (spaghetti for chow mein, ravioli for dumplings).

A “business”.

These towns look like a lovely backdrop for a Bel Ami corporate expansion.

^R17, at least that would provide jobs to the young in the south, where unemployment hovers around a shocking 30+%. It could be an incentive to stay put and forge a brave, new, lucrative path.😆

Mamma mia!

Italy must really be hard up for people if they're offering $1 homes and now this.

R20, their problem is not unique to Italy. Here in the US, we have a couple of states facing similar issues and they are trying to incentivize a more youthful migration to their region. Otherwise, some of these places are simply going to collapse and become defunct.

Land of mafia and squeaky clean holes.

Hmmm...time for me to buy a Tarot deck and books gemstones and Bach flowers.

If the native young people can't make a go of it there knowing the region, the people, the customs and the dialect what makes them think anybody else can do any better?

But immigration must be kept at bay!

R24, good question. Maybe they figure outsiders/immigrants would be 'hungrier' to make it work in their adopted small town? Sometimes you need an influx of different opinions from outside to help revitalize an area.

Open up a vape and weed shop.

Make Italian Twinks Vape Again

[quote]If the native young people can't make a go of it there knowing the region, the people, the customs and the dialect what makes them think anybody else can do any better?

The native people lack money for investment.

Foreign money will be invested in restoring the buildings, opening bed&breakfasts, small hotels, restaurants, spa retreats etc. People will mostly be opening businesses centered around tourism.

[quote]Italy must really be hard up for people if they're offering $1 homes and now this.

Here's an article that outlines the incentives offered by 11 different countries/states/cities. New Haven, CT has a pretty good offer - $10,000 tax free for downpayment on a house, $30,000 for renovations and $40,000 for college tuition.

"Here in the US, we have a couple of states facing similar issues and they are trying to incentivize a more youthful migration to their region. "

Which states? I see something from New Haven, Connecticut above, but that's a city with a bad reputation and not a state.

R30, Maine and Alaska. The article at R30 mentions some areas of Kansas and Nebraska, which I did not know about.

Article at R29, I meant.

Vermont, too.

Italian men moving away from mama? I don't believe it!

If outside people have money for investment what do they need the 27k for? As an incentive? Believe me in Italy that 27k will go very fast and they will start going through their own money very quickly as well. If you have a dream of living in a quaint Italian village be very rich.

R24, basically the program is to separate stupid rich people from their money.

How soon do they become Italian citizens and get the healthcare?

R25, I’m sure the people of these towns would prefer to see a natural increase in population from their own young people staying and having more children. But, since that’s not happening, they would rather have immigrants than die out completely. The hope (probably futile, unfortunately) is that newcomers will bring new businesses and vitality to the town, inducing the local young people to stay, while also adapting to the local culture and assimilating.

They're probably hoping someone will start businesses and provide jobs for the young people, so they can stay in the small towns instead of hauling off to the cities.

And FYI if you move to Tulsa, Oklahoma, you can have a free apartment for a year. Someone I know is returning home to be near his aging parents, and found out that the city is so desperate to keep the population up there is free housing available.

This video touches on some of the problems facing young adults in Italy and why they choose to leave.

And exactly what market will those businesses have? Are they offering 27k for people to bring in 100s of thousands if not more of investment money? Doesn't sound like a good deal to me. Maybe a vanity business to keep somebody rich busy. But then again what is 27k to them?

[quote] Italian men moving away from mama? I don't believe it!

Surely a sign of the apocalypse.

I keep running into gorgeous European men that are apparently from norther Italy (more pale). If they can provide an all male staff of 20-25 year old I’d consider it.

I like the idea of Belami doing s sister location. If SeanCody hadn’t sold out, they could have started a Europe’s division.

I was the logistics director for an Italian fashion house here in the US. I hear the straight CFO here in the US saying to somebody that the Italian director of logistics in Italy whom I talked to several times every day(and who was a very nice guy) looked like a movie star. Of course when I went to visit the company there I was very curious to meet him. When a straight guy says another guy is handsome you listen.

Well when I met him I could have done a back flip. He was gorgeous. I couldn't help thinking why isn't this guy a model in Milan or an actor in Rome. I thought this guy is doing logistics? What a waste! He was probably very happy and lucky to have that job.

Enterprising young Italian men go into bareback porn, where the money's at!

R44 post his pic

R43, I think a southern European version of Bel Ami is a great idea, but a small town in southern Italy is probably not the best place. I think the scandal would make it difficult to start and maintain such a business in any small town.

Italy's larger southern cities, like Naples, are so corrupt that I wonder if any new business could thrive there, much less a foreign gay-porn business. Northern Italy would be the way to go, but northern Italian men as a rule don't have the dark, macho sexuality that would make the southern Euro Bel Ami such a successful contrast to its Eastern Euro counterpart.

Besides, while there are plenty of handsome Italian men, for my money, the handsomest young men in southern Europe are in Spain. Spanish men are gorgeous when they're in their 20s and 30s. They don't age terribly well, but while they've got it, they've really got it.

Maybe these towns need people to be caregivers for the elderly?

R48, being taken care of in old age is one thing older Italians don't have to worry about [yet]. Within the vast network of family, there is usually always somebody (a daughter, son, aunt, a cousin, a cousin's cousin, or at worst a neighbor) who will look after or at least check in regularly on a sickly or infim relative. The idea of shipping an elderly relative off to a nursing home or to leave them under the care of total strangers is kind of appalling there. That's also why adult children are allowed to live in parents' homes well into middle age and beyond. It's kind of a trade-off. A sort of unspoken quid pro quo.

So true r44! If straight guys compliment another man on his looks, then they are usually Grade-A prime beef, bc straight guys rarely share the beauty ranking of another male.

It sounds like Italy is having some of the same problems as the US.

R51, in some ways worse. The US hasn't reached that level of unemployment and population crisis.... yet.

Tourism is one of the country's largest economic industries, which is great if you're Venice or Cinque Terre. But if you're one of these small towns that tourists don't visit, you're not really benefiting from that. The government, though, at least seems to be trying to promote tourism to its lesser-known areas.

I'm black, though American, but I'm not comfortable visiting a small Italian town given the tension with African migrants. I don't want to be mistaken for one or face their Euro-racism because of that issue.

If anyone's been too small town Itlay, what's it like and do you think they'd have issues with black people, not to mention gay?

In addition to what R53 said, what's the level of anti-Americanism in these small towns?

Some of them might not be a place to be black, gay, AND American.

R53, I'm American but my mom is from Italy (Naples), I have family scattered in parts of rural southern Italy, and I used to spend almost every summer visiting as a kid. As far as I know, I never heard very overtly racist language about black people, although there was a streak of nationalism and when it was expressed, it was mainly against Romani (gypsies). The last time I was there was in 2016 so I can't say how much local attitudes have changed since the bulk of the migrant crisis.

Regarding gay, Italy has a long ways to go, IMO -- especially since most of it's western neighbors are more accepting. Catholicism is not an excuse either since Spain and Portugal are much more gay-friendly. But as a tourist, you'll be fine. It's just that most gay men live closeted/discreet lives there, and are sort of second-class citizens and they are OK with this. There is no real push to bring the country into the 21st century to the level of gay rights we now enjoy here. Who knows, maybe that could change with this next Youtube generation?

I have never seen such PDAs as in Italy. Heterosexual only of course. The way they carry on in public they need to be hosed down.

R54, anti-Americanism (in the political sense) is not as virulent amongst Italians as it is with other Europeans -- the worst offenders of whom, from my personal experience, are the German, Dutch, and British, IMO. Italy is probably one of the lesser anti-American European countries, I think. Nevertheless, there were instances where I was in the position of having to explain Dubya during the Bush years, even though I never even voted for the guy.

That said, I have some 'sore' memories of being treated as an outsider as a kid -- of being seen as neither from here nor there, with some residual gay teasing -- but that's just a personal experience and kids being kids I guess.

[quote] that would provide jobs to the young in the south, where unemployment hovers around a shocking 30+%.

And that’s where the boat people immigrants are landing.

R55, I work with a woman whose parents are from a small town in the interior of southern Italy - Calabria, I think. She dreads going to visit family there. She says the small towns are poor and lack anything to do. The larger towns are also poor, along with being cramped. They do have restaurants, but the cuisine is local only. She says the food is good, but if you're used to American-style variety in your meals, it's gets tiresome. She also says the local people are extremely provincial and generally not well educated. (I guess everybody with a larger worldview or who wants an education and better life flees to big cities.)

I guess she and her family have mostly visited in the summer, when it's apparently hot and dusty, with A/C being unknown. Oh, and the roads are terrible, so it takes forever to get anywhere, making it hard for visitors to the interior towns to get to the attractive coastal areas for day trips. My colleague did say that, when you get to the coast, it's lovely and much more sophisticated because of the tourist trade.

Is my colleague being a sourpuss, or is this mostly true? She makes the interior of southern Italy sound like Mississippi or Alabama ca. 1950, minus the racial issues.

gid I think I will regret asking these 2 questions but, i am actually looking for answers,, not shitstirring:

why are so many 'white/ish' countries that are successful in so many ways peaking and declining now wrt population and expansion?

and on that note, why are those same countries not aggressively recruiting population from some of the lesser successful, more populated countries THAT DO NOT HAVE 'SCARY' religions? (i put caps because i am stipulating that i know tjat is one of the reasons not to) like, the... Philippines maybe?

Well why don't you ask your questions in English so we can decide if you are shitstirring or not.

"...why are those same countries not aggressively recruiting population from some of the lesser successful, more populated countries THAT DO NOT HAVE 'SCARY' religions?"

Well in Italy at least, it might be because unemployment is so high. If all the jobs go to recent immigrants from the less-scary countries, there are even fewer jobs for the native-born, and social issues result (to put it politely).

R59, your friend is mostly right. For a kid/teen, rural southern Italy is extremely slow and boring -- also another reason why youth are leaving in droves. I would take books and finish them within the first three weeks and then good luck getting any other reading material in English (with Kindle and WiFi, no longer an issue now thankfully). It gets very hot in the summer. I spent many sweaty summers there in front of an oscillating fan, marinading in my sweat.

The food and wine is absolutely amazing, but if you're used to a variety of different cuisines, you're mostly out of luck. Small town people there are like many small town people everywhere -- provincial and with a narrow scope of the outside world -- and old Italian women are freakishly intuitive and take gossip to the next level. Unless you have your own car, transportation is difficult.

As a middle aged adult, going back is actually more attractive in a vacation sense. I would enjoy renting a villa with friends, with a pool, eating around, wine tasting, and enjoying the idyllic peace and quiet. It could have its perks for retirees as somewhere quiet, safe, where people defer to elders, but I'm also not of retirement age, so I can't personally speak to that.

[quote]The food and wine is absolutely amazing, but if you're used to a variety of different cuisines, you're mostly out of luck.

And that's a great thing.

I say, let Italy be Italy. It doesn't have to be like every other place in the world.

Well the SJWs would strongly disagree.

R60:

(a) Because as women become more educated and populations become more affluent, they have fewer children. This has been seen in country after country. When women have other options, they marry later and have fewer children. When adults can afford lots of toys, they have fewer children even when they finally marry.

(b) Well, the US has quite a few people from the Philippines already. But, anyway, the answer to your question, putting it bluntly, is that people like their own culture. I like my own culture, after all; why shouldn't other people feel the same way about theirs? When you import a large numbers of newcomers, you change your culture. It's a tough choice for some. The Japanese, for example, have chosen to avoid large-scale immigration and let their population decline. They'd rather die out slowly than not be Japanese anymore. Other countries, like Italy, are not quite wealthy enough to attract the most educated and skilled immigrants. Why go to economically divided and politically chaotic Italy if you can go to Germany or Canada?

Also, many "less successful" countries are heavily populated with very poorly educated people with few skills. What would they do in a modern, post-industrial economy? The countries that have big populations of educated people are generally doing OK and, if they have a surplus (like India), they're already exporting them.

Thanks, R63. What about the health care in these areas? To thrive as a retirement destination, a region has to be able to provide solid health care services. It would be a shame to retire to a small but beautiful town in Italy and then die of a heart attack because it took an hour to get an ambulance that, once it arrived, took you to a facility lacking the level of emergency care you'd get in a US hospital.

thank you, those were educational responses to the questions I was uncomfortable asking. I am a first generation American and some of these things aren't as obvious to me.

'Because as women become more educated and populations become more affluent, they have fewer children. This has been seen in country after country. When women have other options, they marry later and have fewer children. When adults can afford lots of toys, they have fewer children even when they finally marry.'

In other words oppression and marginalization of women and gays was necessary in order to sustain societies. Life always bites you in the ass.

R67 The Italian health care system is one of the best in the world.

R70, thank you. But how is accessibility in rural southern towns? I'm sure you can get state-of-the-art care in Milan.

The US has one of the best (actually, probably THE best, but that's a topic for another thread) health care systems in the world if you have good insurance and live in a big city. If you lack insurance and live in an Appalachian holler, maybe not so much. In Italy, insurance may not be an issue, but road conditions and quality of small-town hospitals might be.

R69, what do gays have to do with it? Gay men have always enjoyed the same economic opportunity (or lack thereof) as straight men from the same backgrounds, and gay relationships do not, for obvious biological reasons, produce natural offspring. On this issue, we are [italic] hors de combat[/italic].

Pressure for gay men to marry and have children was and is incredibly important in Italy. Be gay but don't let anybody know and give us grandchildren. Of course there were always rogues who became artists and became priests but on the whole it is a horribly shameful if you can't come up with a good excuse. Why isn't your son married? No Italian mother wants to hear that question when she has a son well into his 30s.

An Italian women in Italy warned me when I was in my mid thirties that I had to get married otherwise I'd soon be old and nobody would want me. I kid you not.

'an Italian woman'

R68, Italy's healthcare services are good and have improved a lot since I was a child. There was a local duty doctor in or near the small towns my relatives lived in who dealt with people's day-to-day ailments.

Emergency medical services are provided to anyone, regardless of citizenship status. Dialing 118 used to be their 911 and I think that is still true? If you're really out in the boonies, wait times for an ambulance varies and can be longer than here in the States, and when they do arrive, you'll be transported to the nearest available hospital. In the south, the facilities may not be Cedars Sinai, but they are clean and attentive. If it's not a life-threatening emergency, wait times can be less efficient than up north (but that is true of everything in Italy).

Not speaking Italian is probably one of the biggest barriers for foreigners, but Google Translate can help fix that language divide somewhat.

What R73 said. The pressure to breed has been alleviated somewhat by the fact that even straights are not having many kids these days because of the bad economy.

[quote] An Italian women in Italy warned me when I was in my mid thirties that I had to get married otherwise I'd soon be old and nobody would want me.

This! Once you hit near or around 30s, there is marriage panic amongst older Italians. I can't tell you how many times I've been asked by nosy strangers about girlfriends and starting a family -- and they casually mention a single daughter or relative -- especially since I've been of prime breeding age for awhile (I'm 35). I imagine it's 10 x worse if you're a single woman.

[quote]Pressure for gay men to marry and have children was and is incredibly important in Italy.

Bullshit.

I have lived decades in Italy. OK not in the South, in Tuscany. Most of my friends, guys in their 30s and 40s, aren't married and don't seem to have any rush. Others are divorced or separated. Couples aren't having kids and it's a reality that's part of modern Italy.

The Italians are very much live and let live.

If in a small Italian town in the deep South things are different....so be it. It doesn't speak for most of the country.

Well I'm speaking from experience in Bari so yes in the south but not a small town.

And I have to say I envy you being able to live for decades in Italy. And comfortably as a gay man(I assume.)

Also: the Italian peoples opinion of gay relationships is not what you are describing.

A 2017 NBC poll showed 60 % of Americans "say they support same-sex marriage".

A 2017 Italian polled showed 59% support for gay marriage.

"A 2013 Pew Research Center opinion survey of various countries throughout the world showed that 74% of the Italian population believed that homosexuality should be accepted by society (the 8th highest of all the countries polled),"

"Young people were generally more accepting: 86% of people between 18 and 29 were accepting of gay people, while 80% of people between 30 and 49 and 67% of people over 50 held the same belief. In a 2007 version of this survey, 65% of Italians were accepting of gay people, meaning that there was a net gain of 9% from 2007 to 2013 (the 4th highest gain in acceptance of gay people of the countries surveyed)."

"In December 2016, a survey was conducted by the Williams Institute in collaboration with IPSOS, in 23 countries (including Italy) on their attitudes towards transgender people.[79][80] The study showed a relatively liberal attitude from Italians towards transgender people. According to the study, 78% of Italians supported allowing transgender people to change their gender on their legal documents (the 4th highest percentage of the countries surveyed), with 29% supporting the idea of allowing them to do so without any surgery or doctor's/government approval (the 6th highest percentage of the countries surveyed). In addition to that, 78.5% of Italians believed that transgender people should be legally protected from discrimination, 57.7% believed that transgender people should be allowed to use the restroom corresponding to their gender identity rather than their birth sex, and only 14.9% believed that transgender people have a mental illness (the 6th lowest of the countries surveyed)."

R77, well, I don't think the pressure is what it was decades ago to marry/breed (I can't even imagine), but from my own experiences people do tend to be curious if you're a single man with no girlfriend. I don't think they're being malicious though -- more like a natural curiosity and a way to make conversation.

2013 Pew Poll:

Should society accept homosexuality?

USA: 60% yes - 33% no

Italy 74% - 18% no.

*Italy 74% yes - 18% no.

R79, hmmm, unfortunately that poll doesn't ring true to anything I've ever experienced. Italy still comparatively lags behind other countries in western Europe in terms of protections for gay rights. The nuclear family is king, and out gay men are a rarity. Regarding gay life, I've actually had some pretty negative experiences, but that's another topic for another thread and I won't hijack this one.

I certainly do hope things are improving there! I would love to be wrong.

R82 those statistics seem to be terribly misleading. I mean is there any real movement there for gay rights or gay marriage? I've come across so little it's practically non existent. I would think if there were any real fight for gay rights the Italian homophobes would make the French look like pikers.

The poll is about the Italian peoples attitudes. They are ahead of the government.

Although the majority of Italians support gay marriage, Italy at this point will have to do with civil unions. The sticking point is the adoption of children. The pact between the Vatican and the government....right or left.... is not going to change anytime soon.

But on a one to one basis, as a gay man I have no problem and never have had any problem in Italy. Actually I feel more comfortable there that I do here in the US. I have lived and worked there for years as an out gay man: not even a hint of a problem. Most of my friends are straight by the way. I'm just one of the guys. No one gives a shit.

Does Rome have a good gay scene?

R86, for a city of its size, just OK. The Ancient Romans probably had a more colorful gay scene than Rome currently does. Rome has a million other things to offer though, but I wouldn't make gay life one of the reasons to visit.

Italy is like much of the US: there is little "gay scene". My gosh, look at NYC. There are hook-up apps (which I'm not interested in) and so forth.

It's different during the summer: LOTS of gay beaches in Italy.

This thread has lots of genuine Fredos!

Gay beaches in Italy?! Where?! I can't imagine there is anything like Gunnison or Haulover.

Where, R88?

You couldn't pay me to live there.

r90 There definitely was one at Ostia (near Rome) when I lived there several decades ago. Quite an active scene in the bushes.

[quote] Italy is like much of the US: there is little "gay scene". My gosh, look at NYC.

Comparing the gay scene in Rome to NYC or LA is not accurate. The gay scene in Rome is more comparable to what one might expect in Cincinnati.

I suppose here may be a "Plan B" for Gio Giudice! A little bit of a nest egg for him to start with.

I think you are living in some sort of bubble As soon as you walk out of a room you're a finocchio.

[quote] the worst offenders of whom, from my personal experience, are the German, Dutch, and British, IMO

I have not experienced this from Germans?

[quote]Comparing the gay scene in Rome to NYC or LA is not accurate.

I'm not comparing Rome to NYC, just pointing out that there is little gay scene left anywhere in the US. NYC was once filled with gay locales. Most are gone now.

[quote]Gay beaches in Italy?! Where?!

Spiagge Gay Italia (Gay beaches in Italy)

* 100 Spiagge Gay Italia (100 Gay beaches in Italy)

There don't seem to be nude beaches in Italy like there are in France and Spain. Germany I understand has nudity in spas and in parks.

Would you say that Italians are anti nudity? Or are they uncomfortable with it or are simply more modest?

R100, I would say familial nudity is definitely less of a thing than, say, Germans. Attitudes can be more modest. There are nude beaches though.

Regarding Italian gays and the priesthood... Okay, some time ago a friend spent a couple of years in Italy doing research at various places around the country. She's Catholic, and went to church every Sunday, and one Sunday she looked up at the guy performing services and found herself thinking "Hey, wait a minute, this guy is STRAIGHT". She hadn't realized until then that every single priest had set off her gaydar, not until a straight one came along. And she found out later that he wasn't a proper sworn-to-celibacy priest, but some kind of "lay brother" who was authorized to perform certain priestly offices.

So, my question is: Is every priest in Italy gay? Is, or was, joining the priesthood the only socially acceptable way for a gay man to avoid marriage and life in the closet?

R102 So you believe "every priest in Italy is Gay" because your friend (a woman) and her finely tuned "gaydar" thinks so.

Do you realize how stupid you sound?

Certainly plenty of priests are gay men, and that's true everywhere.

And BTW: this is 2019, not 1949. It's hard to find young Italian priests in Italy. They're either old men or young men from countries like the Philippines or South America, lots of African priests in Italy too.

Really some of you write like WWII ended a couple of years ago.

R97, we've probably had different experiences with them then.

Germans know everything and they're always right and they're not shy to explain why your opinion is wrong. They are vocal experts on American politics and culture.

[quote] There is no real push to bring the country into the 21st century to the level of gay rights we now enjoy here. Who knows, maybe that could change with this next Youtube generation?

They legalized gay unions is 2016. Same rights as marriage except for adoption. You can even take on a foreign spouse like we do here in America and become citizens if you get legally married. So hook up what a hot out Italian dude over there, get married and you can become a citizen in less than 6 months.

[quote]well, I don't think the pressure is what it was decades ago to marry/breed (I can't even imagine), but from my own experiences people do tend to be curious if you're a single man with no girlfriend. I don't think they're being malicious though -- more like a natural curiosity and a way to make conversation.

Oh please, I get that shit here in America. They see a ring on my finger and more often then not the next phrase is "who's the lucky girl?" Usually nosy Fraus and office moms.

Their healthcare system is excellent, its ranked 2nd or 3rd best in the world depending on which stats you read. By compassion, America ranks about 11. They live longer and get more personalized care. But what outsiders often don't understand is they don't have big shiny hospitals referring you to get an MRI every time you have a stomach pain. You might have to wait your turn if it not serious, and oddly, bring your own cloths instead of those shitty paper gowns they make you wear in the US. Which to be honest, I wish I could if I had to stay in a US hospital. But at the end of the day the care is better, everyone is covered like its a right not a privilege.

[quote]Regarding gay life, I've actually had some pretty negative experiences, but that's another topic for another thread and I won't hijack this one.

I'm interested to know, r83 and I think this is the thread. I'm moving to Italy later this year and I'm on an Italian culture and customs crash course. I've trolled their gossip sites and found out there is next to zero gossip about their stars being gay/bi. Italians assume everyone is straight by default.

Could your local business be something really basic like making jam?

[quote]I've trolled their gossip sites and found out there is next to zero gossip about their stars being gay/bi. Italians assume everyone is straight by default.

Tiziano Ferro is probably the top Italian pop star, he's an out gay man.

One of the Italy's greatest rockers and biggest stars is an out lesbian, Gianna Nannini.

[quote]Italians assume everyone is straight by default.

What? No one ever assumed that about Lucio Dalla or Renato Zero or Ron....

[quote]I've trolled their gossip sites and found out there is next to zero gossip about their stars being gay/bi.

Then you obviously don't speak a word of Italian.

r110/r111 All of those stars are out of their own volition. No one gossips about stars who are closeted or bearding. e communque parlo italiano benissimo ... check out Ron, years after Lucio Dalla's funeral, trying to dismiss Dalla's long-time companion as merely his secretary.

[quote]"Era una figura molto importante per lui perché gli risolveva dei problemi enormi - spiega - Era il suo segretario ed era il suo produttore. Non so perché alla morte di Lucio abbiano tirato fuori questa cosa. Non si può alla morte di una persona così importante per l’Italia andare a toccare una sfera così privata e intoccabile".

Why would a presumably gay man say this? I love Ron's music more than most Italians, but this is shameful.

^ Point being, questioning someone's sexuality is perceived as a smear.

[quote]No one gossips about stars who are closeted or bearding.

Laughably wrong. You know absolutely nothing about Italy.

Dalla, Ron, Renato Zero ecc ecc have always been gossiped about. Just as plenty of closeted American (or European) pop stars have been. And plenty of them still remain in the closet. Italy is no different than any other country in that regard.

It has huge stars who are out...and others who will never be.

Also: Italy has always had important celebrities who the public knew were gay even without a public declaration.

You never saw Giorgio Armani, or Valentino or Gianni Versace bearding with anyone. They are Gods in Italy. Franco Zeffirelli....Luciano Visconti.... Pasolini ... the list goes on. These men did not pretend to be straight.

You don't even notice that everyone you've mentioned is from the 60s and 70s

[quote]You don't even notice that everyone you've mentioned is from the 60s and 70s

Exactly...long before being "out" was a thing. But despite that, no one in Italy was pretending those men where straight.

As for current out celebrities...Italy has it's share. See R111.

[quote] You never saw Giorgio Armani, or Valentino or Gianni Versace

How telling that these few out gay men have/had self-loathing qualities!

Nevertheless, gay men represent the very best of historical Italian arts culture.

[quote]How telling that these few out gay men have/had self-loathing qualities!

Unlike their American peer Calvin Klien, they never had to marry or pretend to be straight. Self loathing? Hardly.

R119, touche about CK. But I honestly believe if, say, 50% of gay men in the US are out, maybe 10% are in Italy. As someone who can compare both, that's my honest assessment.

R120 Are you the one trying to tell us what Italy is like from Puglia?

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Stefano Gabbana: "Don't call me gay"

[quote] Italians assume everyone is straight by default.

Since more than 90% of people ARE straight, wouldn't that be a logical position for everyone to take?

There are a dozen American actors R124 that say the same thing. You must be blind.

Who?

Slightly off-topic, but I'm wondering if there are Americans commenting here...I'd like to know how and why you ended up living in Italy? Do you work and what do you do? Are you retired? Where do you live?

Curious about whatever you'd like to share. I'm a first generation Italian-American. My mother was born there (south of Salerno) but as far as I can tell she gave up her Italian citizenship when she became an American citizen. I don't have any living relatives that would know. I wonder - if I was able to claim citizenship - if I would have the balls and the wherewithal to move to Italy.

Grazie a tutti.

R128, I am American -- my mom is from Naples and immigrated to the US in the '70s; dad is Italian-American. I spent most of my childhood and teenage summers in Naples and small towns visiting relatives. I did learn to speak Italian through my mom from a young age and full immersion in rural life there. I can read it too.

If you don't read or speak the language, beware that locals will probably not consider you Italian and, in fact, might treat you with disdain if you try to identify as such. If you simply identify as an American moving to Italy, you will be treated better...

It sounds like a steal to me.

r130 Believe me, it isn't. You'll end up broke, miserable and lonely. Your quality of life will make you suicidal.