Valerie Harper Dead

Who?

Awwww, so sad.

thanks for the laughs

RIP

Loved her. Rhoda is an all time great character.

They are running her Hot in Cleveland episode on Get TV in nine minutes.

We're still here.

Predictions for the next two celebrity deaths

Robert Wagner and Alex Trebek

I never watched Hot In Cleveland, but I will today to see her episode.

I’m still here too!

RIP, wonderful lass.

Betty White is going to do the whole NFL Football opening day thing.

Maybe, God, just wanted another Mary and Rhoda reunion. Thanks for the years of laughter, Valerie! RIP!

RIP. So young 😢

Tweet from Ed Asner, "A beautiful woman, a wonderful actress, a great friend and with balls bigger than mine. Her brilliance burst through and shined its light upon all of us. Goodnight beautiful. I’ll see you soon."

I’m still here, too!

A sad moment for baby boomers.

Which channels, cable or even those non-cable channels via antenna, show Rhoda or Mary Tyler Moore? Any currently?

Can I binge watch either show on Hulu or Netflix or similar devices? Do they show these shoes for awhile, then discontinue before bringing them back a year later?

Will Broadway dim the lights? She had 8 Broadway credits including Lucile Ball's Wildcat.

I remember Lucille Ball in an interview saying that only the gypsies in the chorus of Wildcat were honest with her about how bad the show was. I can imagine Val coming into Lucy's dressing room, "Miss Ball, can we talk?"

I’m still here!

You’re supposed to title it: “is dead to me”.

But anyway, RIP.

How come none of you bitches every remember my contribution to the show? I gave off teenage lesbian vibes before there ever was a Nancy McKeon.

RIP. She was not doing well based on the reports—I think she was suffering significantly, so it's probably better that she's passed.

"I'M the Mary!"

I think Hulu has the Mary Tyler Moore show R16

Sad day. So many hours of outstanding entertainment. Thank you Valerie.

I'm surprised no one has bitched about how long it took from her first announcement back in the day.....I'm surprised by you bitches sometimes.....

RIP. what was on her ipod?

[quote]Tweet from Ed Asner, "A beautiful woman, a wonderful actress, a great friend and with balls bigger than mine. Her brilliance burst through and shined its light upon all of us. Goodnight beautiful. I’ll see you soon."

I can't believe HE's still alive. He seemed old to me when I watched MTM reruns as a kid.

I'll have to check the network morning shows tomorrow for some clips. Maybe the network shows tonight have already shown some?

Maybe Access Hollywood, Extra! and such will show something tonight or over the weekend?

People magazine next week may feature her on a small photo in the upper corner, plus a story?

Just read Ed Asner’s tweet and spontaneously burst into tears.

I’m still here!

—Georgia Eng- ah, fuck

Actually you are not. You died in April. Sorry to break this to you, Georgia.

This for one R26

R31, you need to sharpen the humor section of your mind.

And you need to sit down and STFU R33

Took her long enough! Jeeze Louise!

[quote]I’m still here too!—Julie Kavner

And, like everything else Julie, you phoned it in.

Rhoda - S01E01

Rhoda, the Beautiful.

I’m also having a MARY! moment after reading Ed Asner’s tweet.

She really made Rhoda work from the ground up. She was brash, witty, and vulnerable. We bought her as Mary’s best friend because she radiated everything anyone could want in a loyal friend.

Valerie Harper wins Best Actress Emmy Award for "Rhoda"

[quote]I'm surprised no one has bitched about how long it took from her first announcement back in the day.

We did. Some people thought she was lying about her illness, too.

RIP, Val—you were one of a kind

Here she is with Lucille Ball in Wildcat.

Decades channel usually does some kind of a tribute weekend when someone with a long running show dies. I expect they'll have a MTM/Rhoda weekend soon.

Has Jason Bateman commented yet? Susan Dey wants to know.

Valerie Harper, one of the best characters on television ever. Rhoda was so likable and one of the last of the good ol' broads. We will miss you. Mary and Rhoda together forever and always in our hearts.

RIP.

She is now in heaven with Mary.

Of course I remember Valerie on The Mary Tyler Moore show. I liked her character more than Mary's. Last I saw Valerie in was Dancing With The Stars. She seemed like a really nice person and someone you would want to know.

So young...

As Tallulah Bankhead

The big fight between Rhoda and Mary.

The last five minutes where they make up is one of my favorite moments in the series.

I remember this.

Damn. I’m old

Why is Sandy Duncan in the casket?

the Harper Valley PTA, Rose @ R26

I loved her style. Can't believe she's gone.

All the greats are passing and the millennials have produced nothing to replace them.

Valerie Kathryn Harper

Born: August 22, 1939; Suffern, New York, U.S.

Died: August 30, 2019 (aged 80); Residence: Ashland, Oregon, U.S.

RIP Rhoda Forever

R54. Ain't that the truth?!

I kid you not. Vivian Vance at @1:53.

Has Cloris Leachman commented? Phyllis is still going strong at 93. Wow.

Has Susan Dey sent her condolences yet? You know, from one '70s star to Rhoda, one of the most iconic characters in television history?

When I was in the 4th grade my Rona Barrett magazine with Valerie on the cover was confiscated by my teacher and torn apart in front of the class. It was heartbreaking, but I kept quiet while it was happening to save myself from the embarrassment of owning the magazine. I had it hidden in my notebook but a bully saw it, took it away from me and gave it to the teacher knowing that she was destructive of other people's property. Hearing the news of her passing brings back the feelings of loss I had back then. It's as if she died twice.

I didn't think she'd make age 80 but she just eked it out by 8 days. She was a talent and a force and deserved her success. Her cancer treatments were successful beyond expectations which gave her more years, which was great. RIP Valerie, and thanks for everything.

Has Danny Ponce commented, yet?

Is Danny Ponce still alive?

Her first job in NYC which she quickly got was as a member of Radio City's corps de ballet.

Rhoda Morgenstern and her boho chic signature style was everything back in the day.

[Quote] Her first job in NYC which she quickly got was as a member of Radio City's corps de ballet.

I wonder if she worked with Helen Wood.

May she rest ❤️

She was terrific!

It's about fucking time!

I loved her film work too. Even in mediocre films like Last Married Couple and Blame It On Rio, Valerie always had that spark. I knew it was coming with the go fund me. But damn I’m still saddened.

Did Val's pussy stink?

etc.

Rhoda eating chocolate: "I don't know why I'm eating this. I should just apply it to my hips."

Rhoda: "I'd like you to meet my date, Mr. Mrs Armand Linton."

I was just taking a nap and woke up to all of these push notifications on my phone. I'm so sad to hear this. I knew it was coming but it still hurts because I always just adored her. May she rest in peace.

[quote]Decades channel usually does some kind of a tribute weekend when someone with a long running show dies. I expect they'll have a MTM/Rhoda weekend soon.

I also expect that MeTV will likely be airing some MTM/Rhoda episodes, too, probably this Sunday. They usually move pretty fast on things like this.

Rhoda and Phyllis

Mary and Valerie

Betty, Mary and Valeria

NYT obit:

The whole MTM gang except for Ted

The late, great, Valerie Harper

Love them.

Will miss Valerie. Great actress. I wasn't born when Rhoda aired but I loved watching Valerie. I was too young to understand what happened behind the scenes but thought it was poor taste even as a ten year old that killing her character off and then renaming the show Valerie's Family was in incredibly poor taste. I missed her on Valerie/The Hogan Family, although did like Sandy Duncan.

I'm glad she stood up for herself, although it seems it cost her some work.

Valerie and Betty

The early days of MTM

Finally that ole cunt died! Jesus, the flailing US empire took less time to go tits up.

THE HOGAN FAMILY (aka VALERIE): Season 1 Opening

So pretty

Valerie Hogan and Family

Hopefully she didn't work with Dolly Sharp, r66.

Rhoda forever

We will miss you. RIP.

Rhoda, Phyllis and Mary

Rhoda and Joe

She was great from the start.

"Get out of my apartment."

Valerie Harper and real-life husband, Tony Cacciotti

The real golden girls

He looks like current Matt LeBlanc there.

Valerie, Julie Kavner (Brenda) and the late, great Nancy Walker (Ida Morgenstern).

So much talent on stage...

TV's Funny Girls

October 28, 1974

From the WaPo obit:

“You’re having a lousy streak,” Rhoda says to Mary in one episode, coaching her friend through a rare rough spot. “I happen to be having a terrific streak. Soon the world will be back to normal. Tomorrow you will meet a crown head of Europe and marry. I will have a fat attack, eat 3,000 peanut butter cups and die.”

Just an FYI, MTM is on the Decades OTA channel every day at 2PM Eastern. They show two episodes back-to-back.

My third-grade teacher was a dead ringer for Valerie/Rhoda, complete with the thick New Yawk accent and attitude: "Billy, I'm gonna hoit you!!" (back then, teachers could threaten kids like that and get away with it).

But....

What happened to all of the money? Where did it go? A GoFundMe?

WHAT HAPPENED TO ALL OF THE MONEY!

I just read that she and Mary both died at age 80.

I went to her book signing; her book is called 'I, Rhoda."

She said at the signing she had considered calling it: "I Rhoda Book."

[quote]As Tallulah Bankhead

She was very sweet. I got to tell her how that Tony Award should have been hers. She was nominated with Viola Davis for Lead Actress in a Play, with Viola winning for "Fences". However when the show originally opened on Broadway James Earl Jones Best Actor but Mary Alice won Best Featured Actress in a Play. So Viola because she was a movie star the Tony committee upped her to lead YET when she made the movie and won the Oscar it was for Best Supporting Actress. If she had been in the right category Valerie would have won. But she was very gracious heaping praise on Viola.

Valerie Harper Had a Net Worth Of $1 Million. Valerie Harper had a net worth of $1 million.

THAT'S IT???

3-4 television series? Countless guest appearances? A long marriage? Santa Monica house? ONE CHILD? AND....

Valerie Harper Had a Net Worth Of $1 Million. Valerie Harper had a net worth of $1 million.

WHERE"S ALL OF THE MONEY????

I outlived another one!

MeTV will be airing episodes of MTM and Rhoda on Sunday, September 8:

2,131-square-foot home

WHAT??? It was a hovel!

This $4.2 million casa would be the perfect hangout for Mary and Rhoda. Valerie Harper, who skyrocketed to fame as beloved BFF Rhoda Morgenstern on The Mary Tyler Moore Show, just listed her three-bed, two-bath hacienda-style home for sale in Santa Monica, CA, for $4.2 million. Harper has owned the home for nearly 20 years — she bought it back in 1996 for $765,000. Oh, how times (and price tags) have changed!

The 2,131-square-foot home, which was built in 1920, is just two blocks from the stunning Palisades Bluffs, which overlook the Pacific Ocean. And with high ceilings and a large fireplace in the living room, this is the perfect mountain retreat to cozy up by the fire and settle in for some girl talk.

A separate dining room opens to an interior courtyard, while the kitchen/family room combo opens out to the rear yard. The master bedroom features a pitched ceiling, and two additional bedrooms are adjoined by a jack-and-jill bath. Additional amenities include a dining patio, spacious backyard, and a sports court with a basketball hoop.

Tweet from Ed Asner, "...a great friend and with balls bigger than mine.”

Great Lou, so now Rhoda has the spunk.

Related thread

Is it true Sandy Duncan will be marrying her husband this fall in time for sweeps?

Ed Asner's Balls have funk.

But.... But....

Was she lesbian? And... her husband...

A gay?

[quote]From the WaPo obit: “You’re having a lousy streak,” Rhoda says to Mary in one episode, coaching her friend through a rare rough spot.

That was a great scene. which also included Rhoda's "have some candy" advice:

RHODA: Here, have some candy.

MARY: Rhoda, chocolate solves nothing.

RHODA: No, Mary, cottage cheese solves nothing. Chocolate can do it all.

What a great series that was, and it largely due to Valerie Harper. BTW, I loved Ed Asner's tweet.

R119, though it was often said (rightly) about Beatrice Arthur, I thought Valerie Harper was every bit her equal at selling a comic line.

Valerie Harper’s Family Turns To Crowdfunding To Pay For Her Cancer Treatments

A crowdfunding page has been started to help TV legend Valerie Harper with the costs of her cancer treatments.

Harper, 79, was diagnosed with lung cancer in 2009. Then in 2013, doctors discovered she’d developed a rare brain cancer.

Harper’s husband, Tony Cacciotti, started a GoFundMe campaign titled The Valerie Harper Cancer Support Fund on July 8.

“Valerie is currently taking a multitude of medications and chemotherapy drugs as well as going through extreme physical and painful challenges now with around the clock, 24/7 care immediately needed, which is not covered by insurance,” the page says. “This is just part of the daily cost that is without a doubt a financial burden that could never be met alone. This GoFundMe initiative from Tony, is to ensure she receives the best care possible.”

When contacted by Deadline tonight, a rep confirmed that the page is real and said Cacciotti would offer additional comments at a later date. Asked if Harper’s friends in the acting community were aware of the situation, the rep said the crowdfunding page had been shared with “a small group” of SAG members.

Harper, a veteran TV and stage actress is best known for playing Rhoda Morgenstern in the 1970s on The Mary Tyler Moore Show and her own spinoff Rhoda. She also starred in the 1980s sitcom Valerie and Valerie’s Family later retitled The Hogan Family after Harper exited the show. More recently, she had recurring roles on The Office and The Simpsons. Her film credits include Freebie and the Bean (1974) and Chapter Two (1979).

Over the years, she won multiple Emmy Awards for her work on Rhoda and The Mary Tyler Moore Show, and was nominated for a Tony in 2010 for her role as Tallulah Bankhead in Looped

No health insurance?

THR obit:

She died in Ashland, Oregon. Why did she move there and when did she do it? Was it related to her cancer treatment, or for economic reasons.

Remember when Val and Melissa Gilbert had a throwdown over who would be President of SAG?

She really fought, RIP.

In 1975, she reportedly refused to return to work on the second season of “Rhoda” until CBS bumped up her salary from $10,000 to $17,500 a week. In the case of “Valerie,” a jury eventually found that she was wrongfully fired, and awarded her $1.4 million and 12.5 percent of the show's profits.

In 1975, she reportedly refused to return to work on the second season of “Rhoda” until CBS bumped up her salary from $10,000 to $17,500 a week. In the case of “Valerie,” a jury eventually found that she was wrongfully fired, and awarded her $1.4 million and 12.5 percent of the show's profits.

She was such a lovely person and gave me lots of joy - big fan!!! RIP special one!

She didn't whine about how unfairly she was treated unlike some people I know.

R123 Or did she move there for the euthanasia?

🎶“Life is such a sweet insanity - the more you learn the less you know”🎶

Her husband used to be hot..

[quote]She died in Ashland, Oregon. Why did she move there and when did she do it? Was it related to her cancer treatment, or for economic reasons.

She writes about Ashland in her memoir: her family moved there when she was 11 and she loved it, and treasured her memories of that time in her life. They only stayed a few years, then moved to Jersey City, where she finished high school. She and her husband seem to have moved from Santa Monica to Ashland a couple of years ago; her brother and his family also lived in the area (he died in 2015).

[quote]Did Val's pussy stink?

Give it a few days.

[quote]In 1975, she reportedly refused to return to work on the second season of “Rhoda” until CBS bumped up her salary from $10,000 to $17,500 a week.

CBS did not produce "Rhoda;" they just broadcast it.

No, but you’re gone, R71.

Heaven, this is your last chance!

I for one am happy it is finally all over, I could not take another year of that poor woman hovering over the top of the annual death watch list yet again, now we can really concentrate on Betty without distraction.

were there any tributes shows on CBS or other networks?

R138 bitch

Good article about how Valerie helped to make Rhoda's Boho look stand out from the rest.

Lovely woman.

R140 Trust me I thought of naming you, but bitterness never dies, I’ve seen how the Heiress ends.

DLers want to know, will she be front page NYTs above the fold or not?

We're thay abel 2 save tha babie ?

She was so great as Justin Theraux's mother in Sex and the City.

I really liked her. RIP

[quote]Valerie Harper Had a Net Worth Of $1 Million. Valerie Harper had a net worth of $1 million...THAT'S IT???...3-4 television series? Countless guest appearances? A long marriage? Santa Monica house? ONE CHILD? AND....Valerie Harper Had a Net Worth Of $1 Million. Valerie Harper had a net worth of $1 million...WHERE"S ALL OF THE MONEY????

It's probable she had it put in a trust. Since she knew she was terminal and quite a long time ago, she could've set up numerous trust to protect her estate from going into probate, turning over what she wanted to her child and husband and whomever else she wanted to leave things to, rather than tie it up in probate.

[quote]You’re supposed to title it: “is dead to me”.

I'm usually one to defend long-standing DL memes but it's been nice having threads that don't use "dead to me." That one has really worn out its welcome, for some reason.

Did Jason Bateman comment on his TV mother’s passing?

[quote]WHERE"S ALL OF THE MONEY????

Do you have any idea how much it costs to have a long-term illness? Come on, you know exactly where the money is.

r149

Again, she probably shielded all that money so if worst came to worse she could go on medicare/medicaid. She had a long time to gift that away so her "worth," was almost certainly a lot more but officially it was a million.

Met her at The Broadway Cares Equity Fights AIDS Flea Market. She was loved.

The typical time to live with the cancer she had was 4 weeks without treatment and three months with treatment. She was diagnosed in 2013 so lived six years longer than she should have.

I wonder if she died from cancer?

[quote]Do you have any idea how much it costs to have a long-term illness? Come on, you know exactly where the money is.

No. I don't! One article above said her treatment was 3 million dollars. YES! That is ABSOLUTELY a lot of money and everyone should be OUTRAGED at the costs of her medical treatment! If someone of her means had to pay THAT much it really doesn't bode well for the rest of us!

But, let's look at stuff from a top line view; She owned a house (a hovel/a shack) that she had forever and paid less than $800K for. She's a GREAT example of "buy and hold" because she owned it for 20 years, and so.... what mortgage? If she did have one the payments had to be next to nothing! Then she HAD to sell it for her medical treatments, she sold it for a bit over $4 million. She had a LONG time marriage--over 20 years. There are no reports of her having to pay any alimony and at the time that she divorced her first husband, women didn't really pay alimony. She was the breadwinner--okay. So, her gay husband was the house husband--okay. They only had ONE child that they adopted. There is no evidence of profligate spending on jewelry, cars, clothing etc

The woman worked pretty consistently. She may not have been paid appropriately, but given her reported expenses, she was paid more than enough to cover it all. Okay... she had lawyer bills. But, still??? The family had to resort to crowdfunding? What did she do with her money? Did she support her whole family? And.... the gay husband's too???

[quote]In 1975, she reportedly refused to return to work on the second season of “Rhoda” until CBS bumped up her salary from $10,000 to $17,500 a week. In the case of “Valerie,” a jury eventually found that she was wrongfully fired, and awarded her $1.4 million and 12.5 percent of the show's profits.

Do you realize the BUYING POWER of $17,500/week in the 70's? How long did "Rhoda" run? Then you had the other series. What was she paid on the MTM show? Scale?

We don't really know who started that crowdfunding. When is the last time anyone even saw Valerie Harper?

When families are faced with a lot of medical debt, often they hide money so they don't have to pay. After all if Valerie runs up a big hospital bill then dies, you can't enforce payment can you? Perhaps her husband started it without any knowledge of Valerie. Valerie's cancer was in her brain so she probably wasn't even too "with it," anyway.

This is why people, especially anyone with money use various thing, like trusts, to divert money. And it's not just the rich that do it. Many working class people do this when faced with family members with long term disabilities.

[quote]We don't really know who started that crowdfunding.

Yes, we do! The gay husband did!

How is a complete stranger's finances any of your concern? Don't like the Go Fund, don't contribute otherwise mind your own fucking business

Inside Brave Valerie Harper’s $3 Million Fight With Death--The ailing actress has lived six years longer than cancer doctors expected.

Valerie Harper Opens a New Window. ’s health and bank account were pushed to the breaking point as she sunk $3 million into miracle cancer cures to try and stay alive, insiders have told RadarOnline.com Opens a New Window. .

As the beloved Rhoda star’s condition worsened, sources said Harper began to lose the ability to speak. Her husband Tony Cacciotti rejected doctors’ recommendations to put her into hospice care as she faced her final days.

The actress and her hubby were left strapped for cash by her long and desperate battle with death Opens a New Window. — and even asked for fan donations to pay the star’s medical bills.

“Tony has found ways to cover all the bills that insurance or Medicare couldn’t,” a source said. “He’s been a miracle worker, but he’s reached the end Opens a New Window. of their finances.”

In 2009, Harper underwent surgery to remove a cancerous tumor from her lungs. She thought she had beaten the deadly disease until four years later, when she was told the cancer had spread to the linings of her brain and spinal cord — and she was given three months to live.

Incredibly, for years she beat the odds with alternative treatments and an experimental drug.

According to a source, one pill alone cost $1,000 and the 79-year-old needed to take at least ten a week, totaling a whopping $3 million spent since she was diagnosed in 2013.

In order to continue fighting for her life Opens a New Window. , the Golden Globe winner sold her Los Angeles home years ago and her prized possessions.

I think the gay husband swindled our poor Valerie....

The cut & pasters are going to have to start removing all those "opens a new window" tags in their articles.

[quote]How is a complete stranger's finances any of your concern? Don't like the Go Fund, don't contribute otherwise mind your own fucking business

Hi Tony....

She's a celebrity. Part of my money and my fandom of her made her a star that gave her the opportunity, (that many of us will NEVER have) to reach an income level that most of us will never have. This is a learning /teaching experience where people can learn something.

[quote] Part of my money and my fandom of her made her a star

Well THAT is fucking creepy.

You watching "Rhoda" when you were in junior high school doesn't mean she had a moral obligation to provide you personally with an itemized detail of every penny she spent during her life and as she fought cancer for several years.

R160 Mary

^Step aside, Helen. Grown people are in the room.

Look... mourn for Val, if you wish. I do too. But, it is a fair question to ask about the money, especially when the gay husband comes begging to the pubic for more money to make her comfortable while she was in her final days.

This woman, (God, rest her soul), was BLESSED, (because there is A LOT of talent out here that won't be as lucky), to achieve a fame and fortune that many can't even dream about. And yet, her gay husband needed money to care for her in her final days? Even with a $3 million dollar healthcare bill--which is ABSOLUTELY OUTRAGEOUS, there should have been money to handle it. What happened to it? Were they that irresponsible re their finances? This is a teaching moment.

[quote][R160] Mary

Helen!

I checked all her costars Twitters, no one but Ed cared.

R158 What are all those open window metaphors about, is that some new agey thing?

I thought it was the name of a book R165.

Crying this morning.

I'd like to think that somewhere yesterday Mary and Rhoda were together again. It was the greatest portrayal of a friendship ever on television.

I'm another one who burst into tears when I read the last line of Asner's post. Lovely tribute.

So I looked online at the NYT pdf of today’s front page and VH is there below the fold with a head scarf picture and the title “Mary’s Pal Rhoda” with the obit listed in section B. It would have been fun if they had gone with “Hogan Family Missing Mom” and a shot of Sandy and company instead.

You queens need to get a life. The woman lived to be 80, EIGHTY, 8-0. 8 x 10. old! Unfortunately, the last 6 years of her lifer was filled with pain and tribulation. But, none the less, the gal lived a long, productive, and fulfilling life. Let us all celebrate that rather than the morose and funk that many of you are in. There are many who never, or will never, reach her age or the many experiences that she had. Her life should be celebrated rather than mourned. And, part of that means finding out....

WHAT HAPPENED TO THE MONEY????

You don't think that our beloved Valerie wouldn't have wanted some type of charity gifted and/or some grant established that would/could encourage those coming after her to keep the faith, remain passionate, and to remain focused that they will succeed in show business in spite of the odds? Or, do you think that she would have preferred to be remembered as the forgotten star whose gay husband had to resort to her adoring fans to help pay for her funeral and the austerity-laden repast?

I'm mad that only Ed Asner said anything publicly, even her own husband couldn't be bothered.

Her daughter posted this on her Twitter:

[quote]“My dad has asked me to pass on this message: ‘My beautiful caring wife of nearly 40 years has passed away at 10:06 a.m., after years of fighting cancer,'”

Did her own daughter not know?

[quote]Crying this morning. I'd like to think that somewhere yesterday Mary and Rhoda were together again. It was the greatest portrayal of a friendship ever on television.

[quote]I'm another one who burst into tears when I read the last line of Asner's post. Lovely tribute.

OH GOODNESS! Why don't you both do yourselves some good and work on picking out your musical inspirational selections and arrangements, that will bring solace and comfort to those invited guests, attending your funeral?

Will Oprah do a special on Valerie like she did on Mary? And make it all about her??

[quote]Did her own daughter not know?

For just a million dollar estate I could only be so concerned myself...

I loved her and can't believe she wasn't Jewish!

Most of Valerie's former co-stars are OLD. Why should they - or anybody, for that matter - have to tweet condolences?? Ed Asner is on Twitter at 90-something; good for him. But he's an outlier.

R172 what are you on about? Go away.

Desi was a loser.

She never smoked. Sad that she started out with lung cancer.

My favorite episode of Sex And the City was the one with Valerie. She brightened any show she did a guest appearance on.

RIP

HAS WENDY SCHAAL ISSUED A STATEMENT??!?

Oh and Mary was a Republican in her last years. If there is a heaven I doubt she'll be meeting up with Valerie there.

Still no reaction from Cloris or Betty?

She was Jewish before Rhoda, r175!

GavinMacLeod: “My life has been so enriched by having the experience of working with Valerie and calling her a friend,” MacLeod wrote in a statement to the Associated Press. “In 1970, when a group of actors, producers and writers gathered together to read the Mary Tyler Moore show pilot. Val although she was unknown at that time, we all realized a talented, gifted actress had appeared.”

[quote]I loved her and can't believe she wasn't Jewish!

I can't believe she won Emmy Awards for an act of cultural appropriation.

Hello.

This is Mary...Your Doorman

I still look to Rhoda for scarf ideas. I have always loved her boho accessorizing and like to channel that spirit. Caftan + headscarf = Living the Life.

You tell ‘em R185!

I always though Rhoda’s husband Joe was hot as fuck. David Groh died over a decade ago.

Julie Kavner (Brenda) is the last regular cast member still living.

Ray Buktenica, added later in the series as Julie’s boyfriend, is also still alive.

R185 makes a valid point. I shall return my Academy Awards.

Who better to play my Bernie than Robert De Niro, R185?

I’m confused about this Emmy stuff, she was in a sitcom playing a character who happened to be Jewish not Anne Frank in a concentration camp. And Darren is half Phillipino and at least down with the gays if not one of them.

You're taking tongue-in-cheek posts way too seriously, R192. Lighten up. This is DL.

[quote]Hi Tony....

Not Tony, not related in anyway. Tell us, how much does your treatments cost you for your acute assholeism?

Has Lucie Arnaz sent passive-aggressive condolences yet?

Is Betty White still well enough to even comprehend that someone she knew died, nevertheless post on Twitter?

R181 Valerie might have been a religious right liberal/Reagan democrat.

She did multiple interviews for Pat Robertson's 700 Club (& others) while they were spreading both gay & AIDS lies (like you can get AIDS from a toilet seat, door knob or that AIDS activists were going to put contaminated blood in small town water towers to get more AIDS funding with new victims like Benny Hinn said). Also the "gays & lesbians can't reproduce so they need to recruit" line.

On none of these shows did she display "balls bigger than Ed's" by confronting these televangelists with the AIDS lies & homophobia when they were going at us 200% from 1981-1996 (their big heydays). She was never our friend. Just a user & abuser like many other "stars". Fuck her with Jerry Falwell's rotting oversized arm.

Loved David Groh's hairy chest!

[Quote] On none of these shows did she display "balls bigger than Ed's" by confronting these televangelists with the AIDS lies & homophobia when they were going at us 200% from 1981-1996 (their big heydays).

She challenged them on their lies but because she appeared on their show at all, she wasn't "our friend." Is that your argument?

So no comment from Julie? What a bitch!!

Julie is a clam.

This thread has gone stupid. Ancient gays start drinking early on Saturdays.

EST Killed Valerie!!!

"She did multiple interviews for Pat Robertson's 700 Club (& others) while they were spreading both gay & AIDS lies"

Links, please.

[quote]On none of these shows did she display "balls bigger than Ed's" by confronting these televangelists with the AIDS lies & homophobia when they were going at us 200% from 1981-1996 (their big heydays)

He was referring to her courage for fighting cancer and facing death. I loved her statement, "we're all going to die, but you don't go to the funeral before the funeral."

R205 Tell me about it.

Valerie Harper created one of the most iconic characters in the history of television. Loved her. RIP, Rhoda.

Has Arlene Golonka commented? Valerie and Arlene were roommates before Valerie got the MTM show.

Arlene Golonka, Ed Asner and Valerie Harper

No one cares about Arlene Golonka. Or Candy Azzara. Or Barbara Sharma for that matter.

The cast didn't even like Mary that much. It's Cloris, Val and Ed who love each other.

[quote]I'm mad that only Ed Asner said anything publicly, even her own husband couldn't be bothered.

How dare a grieving widower who just lost his wife hours ago not run to social media to inform you. Shame! Shame!

Valerie never smoked but developed lung cancer, her Mother never smoked but died of lung cancer.

Arlene and Val actually did Last Married Couple, but never shared scenes.

Antenna TV running a marathon of "Hogan Family" episodes tomorrow starting at 1 p.m. EST.

Somewhere in New York, Sandy Duncan is smiling ...

[quote]No one cares about Arlene Golonka. Or Candy Azzara. Or Barbara Sharma for that matter.

Not every actress is as beloved as I am.

I'd give my right eye to go to her funeral.

[quote]Somewhere in New York, Sandy Duncan is smiling ...

Only because she just passed gas. Sandy has dementia.

"Ray Buktenica, added later in the series as Julie’s boyfriend, is also still alive."

Richard Masur also played one of Brenda's boyfriends. And of course he played Ann Romano's lover David on "One Day at a Time." He's a character actor who's been in God knows how many tv shows. He's still alive, too. He's 70 years old.

[quote]When I was in the 4th grade my Rona Barrett magazine with Valerie on the cover was confiscated by my teacher and torn apart in front of the class. It was heartbreaking, but I kept quiet while it was happening to save myself from the embarrassment of owning the magazine. I had it hidden in my notebook but a bully saw it, took it away from me and gave it to the teacher knowing that she was destructive of other people's property. Hearing the news of her passing brings back the feelings of loss I had back then. It's as if she died twice.

MARY!

I thought Richard Masur was older than that, maybe in his 80s. 70 isn't that old. I remember him from what I think was an early All in the Family.

Her movie "Night Terror" is one of the most suspenseful TV movies I ever remember.

Richard Masur is 70. He'll be 71 in November.

^ That's Seth Rogan.

Don't Go to Sleep is good.....

How old is that pic of Richard Masur ^ ?

R227, that pic was taken in 1990 according to Wikipedia.

Valerie was a very liberal Democrat.

Ray Buktenica is still around doing VO. His longtime girlfriend is Karen Salkin who was the basis for the Tina character on Rhoda and was something of a mini celebrity for her public access show.

This is a pic of Masur from 2018:

^ That's Seth Rogan.

This is a nice remembrance.

I didn't realize Rhoda was one of the first people to say "gay" on TV.

The great things about the gay brother episode, is that it was not a very special episode that would be common later in the 80's. The character was treated respectfully, but part of a very funny pay-off.

That's a wonderful. well written tribute are R232. Thanks.

*at*

No it wasn't. It was full of several poorly researched inaccuracies.

Not everyone is eighty years old R236. Some of use here aren't even 40. Naturally you are an expert on everything by your time of life. RIP.

Believe it or not, I just watched that MTM "gay brother" episode yesterday on the Decades channel. It was funny and very tastefully done.

Maybe it's the time of year with summer ending but this hit me hard reading through this thread. I got kind of teary looking at the old clips with MTM, Valerie and Nancy Walker etc. I knew she was sick and we were all prepared but damn....*sob*

(Also, I would be happy to find out that Valerie and her husband socked some money away to avoid paying out their life savings to the medical/end of life industrial complex. Fuck yeah! Single payer healthcare now! No one has to give to a gofundme you misérable cunt upthread)

MTM was a classy show with extraordinarily talented actors, writers and producers. So rare nowadays.

I was in 4th grade when Rhoda was at its peak. I remember ordering a paperback from Scholastic Book Club called All About Rhoda. Loved her - sad that she had go through the NBC thing and cancer.

[quote] Not everyone is eighty years old [R236]. Some of use here aren't even 40. Naturally you are an expert on everything by your time of life. RIP.

I wouldn't be so proud of myself if I were you. Laziness and stupidity is nothing to brag about.

I thought the piece at R232 was good. It discusses Valerie/Rhoda's significance in gay history, which I haven't really seen elsewhere beyond "She was loud and brash and wore scarves on her head!"

Except it's not true. The word gay had been said on a sitcom prior to that. In fact, the first gay character to be a regular in a sitcom had happened the season before on the ABC show The Corner Bar.

I can't find anything about Harper being on The 700 Club and am wondering if that was a troll, or someone who got confused?

In fact, there isn't a single appearance listed on the IMDb for her on any religious show at all.

The piece said Rhoda was "one of the first, perhaps the first" to say gay on a sitcom.

The Corner Bar ran for 16 episodes in 1972-73. It bombed in the ratings and was never rerun, so we don't know if the gay character was described as gay or his identity was just alluded to.

What about when Luke Spencer (GH) and Asa Buchanan (OLTL) were on All in the Family and Archie thought Mike's friend TG was gay but it turned out Archie's friend, AB, the ex-football player, was the gay guy. Trying really hard to recall if they used the word "gay" or just "light in the loafers" kinds of comments. Anyone remember better than I?

R247, that AITF episode, "Judging Books by Covers," first aired in 1971 about two years before the MTM episode talked about at R232. Like you, though, I can't remember if they actually used the word "gay" to describe the Philip Carey character, though I will go out on a limb and say they probably did.

I thought the MTM gay episode was sort of condescending. Of course a guy who was interested in Rhoda over Mary had to be gay.

^^You're looking at an episode filmed in 1973 through the lens of 2019.

I'm not so sure, R249. I think it makes sense that, in the presence of those two characters, any gay man would naturally gravitate more towards Rhoda. In fact, I kind of think that's also why the question of whether or not she was the first to say "gay" on a network sitcom (she likely wasn't) doesn't really matter anyway. What made gays like Rhoda was just the character herself -- how brash she was, how cool she was, the self-deprecating humor, etc. That's many of us through and through.

Phyllis's gay brother was played by Robert Moore, who was a successful, Tony-nominated stage director. He directed the original production (off-Broadway) of "The Boys in the Band." His Broadway directorial credits include "Promises, Promises," "Deathtrap, "They're Playing Our Song" and "Woman of the Year." As an actor, he also co-starred with Liza Minnelli in "Tell Me That You Love Me, Junie Moon." He died of AIDS-related pneumonia in 1984.

I remember watching MTM reruns as a kid (born in '74) and loving Rhoda, in part because I thought she was so pretty, much prettier than Mary, and being surprised that according to the show's reality, the opposite was true. I even asked my mom about it, who said that originally Rhoda was supposed to be heavier and not as attractive but she lost a lot of weight. Even today, while I can see that MTM would be considered cute and had a great body, Harper was just empirically, a more attractive woman.

MTM's nosejob would make her more attractive to WASPs..

Loved Valerie. RIP.

I just saw that All in the Family episode. The word gay isn't used. But the words fag, queer, Tinkerbell, and that side to side hand gesture Fred Sanford used to use to indicate gays.

R239, WHO are you calling a miserable cunt, ya miserable cunt? I know that no one is forced or obligated to give to any GoFundMe. That isn't the issue. The issue is that her family felt a need to establish one in the very first place! Betty White's net worth is reportedly $75 million dollars. Julie Kavner's net worth is reportedly $85 million dollars. Ed Asner's net worth is reportedly $10 million dollars. Georgia Engel's net worth is reportedly $8 million dollars. The latter two didn't work anywhere near as much as Valerie Harper did and on and on. This woman worked nearly to her death and was being paid for that work. She had to sell her house, etc and there's only about $1 million dollars left? HUH?

Valerie Harper was in the 1% of income earners for this country. IF her medical care wiped out her estate like that then we should ALL be outraged by that! What about the thousands upon thousands of us who DO NOT have the well of resources that she had? It will be our only option to choose death because we can't afford medical treatment? Having an estate like Harper's wiped out solely because of medical expense is atrocious and should be brought into the healthcare discussion to show how out of control our healthcare costs are.

OR....

By knowing what happened to all of the money might possibly reveal if the gay husband is a scamster. How dare he approach the public and her adoring fans asking for $5-20 dollars to cover Valerie's health expenses while he selfishly hold onto what may be a fortune for himself!

I feel the same way about any of these celebrities/wealthy people using crowdsourcing as a means to get whatever done or pay for something that they want. And this is all related... but, Whoopie Goldberg-who HAS a rolodex of contacts, Spike Lee- who has a rolodex of contacts, and others, are going to approach the average John Q Public to raise money for projects or whatever that they want, to only flip it for much more money and for personal financial gain? What about the thousands of creative people and projects that go begging for funding and financing but don't have such a deep well of resources?

R257 Setttle down, Beavis.

R257? Are you from JAX? Just curious.

R196 She was in a just released a new promo for the NFL https://www.facebook.com/SNFonNBC/videos/2388740471366348/

R196 She was in a just released a new promo for the NFL https://www.facebook.com/SNFonNBC/videos/2388740471366348/

Betty.

R196 Betty was in a just released a new promo for the NFL https://www.facebook.com/SNFonNBC/videos/2388740471366348/

R196 Betty was in a just released a new promo for the NFL https://www.facebook.com/SNFonNBC/videos/2388740471366348/

I heard that Betty was in a just released promo for NBA. Anyone know about that?

R265 LMAO it seemed like that wouldn't post so I kept trying

R257 seems to really really care. About what, we have no fucking idea.

She was such a great TV mom as Valerie Hogan. I've been watching the marathon on Antenna TV and just realizing how much effort she put into that part I was so sad the way the producers screwed her over.

[quote] Georgia Engel's net worth is reportedly $8 million dollars.

Not anymore it isn't.

[quote] Georgia Engel's net worth is reportedly $8 million dollars.

Not anymore it isn't.

Is there an echo in here?

The only two things I ever saw Engel in was MTM and Everybody loves Raymond. How the hell did she become worth even 8 million, unless she's a good business woman or had someone who invested wisely for her.

Engel was also a regular on "Hot in Cleveland" with her former MTM co-star Betty White (and also co-starred with her in the short-lived "Betty White Show"), and she did a lot of theater. Not that Broadway pays very well.

Are we really quoting Celebrity Net Worth Dot Com as gospel?

Engel performed regularly on stage and on TV for decades after MTM. She was a regular on the short-lived Betty White Show, for one thing, and toured for years with Nunsense. She probably was not worth $8 million, but she earned a comfortable living.

How long have the Reelz channel vultures had her Autopsy show waiting for this moment to happen?

Ed Asner appeared on the one with Mary Tyler Moore.

I just watched 16 episodes of the Hogan Family AKA Valerie marathon back-to-back. I think I love her more than all of you do.

Sweetie, I'm a retired mid-level government employee and my net worth is over $2 million. $8 million for an actress isn't that much anymore.

Wow, my grandfather was right. I should have tried to work for the post office.

Dead....

Dead...

Dead...

Cookie?

Humanitarian.

🎎♥♣🚑

Georgia Engel was also a recurring character on Coach.

Antenna TV, the little dears that they are gave her her own tribute Marathon featuring her Coach episodes.

Trying that Betty link again

https://www.facebook.com/SNFon-NBC/videos/2388740471366348/

Good luck...!

put a single dash between Fon and NBC and it'll work

Has Jason Bateman commented yet?

Those Autopsy shows on The Reelz Channel are hilarious. Mary Tyler Moore was a smoker and she was a diabetic...and both factors contributed to her death. No shit, Quincy!

r283 And, memorably, on "Everybody Loves Raymond."

[quote]Mary Tyler Moore was a smoker and she was a diabetic

And yet she still lived to be 80.

Didn't Mary Tyler Moore quit smoking at the end of The Dick Van Dyke Show?

Just googled it. She apparently quit in the 80's and was a three pack a day smoker.

She was a dancer. They gotta keep that weight down!

I’m curious about the Valerie/Hogan’s Family thing. She talks about it in her TV academy interview. Says that it was mainly business, and basically bygones. But she also says she was glad she stuck to her guns and ultimately won her wrongful firing lawsuit. She says she was not difficult on set, but hints that she wanted more creative input.

Almost everyone who worked with her had good things to say (even David Groh, who she might have got canned?). But she also fough hard for raises, etc., on Rhoda and Valerie. And she lost her SAG election to Melissa Gilbert, so maybe she wasn’t that well liked in the industry to lose to the Shitbra.

Mary was smoking on the MTM show cause Valerie talks about it in her book.

Yeah, I was surprised she lost the SAG election to Shitbra, I remember reading Gilbert's account of that election in painful detail in her memoir (but I mean really outside of Little House and bonking Rob Lowe and Bruce Boxlietner how else is she gonna fill up 200 plus pages) and she wasn't particularly kind in her account of Valerie, but then again I'm sure 'Half-Pint' was no walk in the park to be around...

[quote]Just googled it. She apparently quit in the 80's and was a three pack a day smoker.

She was interviewed as part of a program about quitting. She said, "I loved every cigarette I ever smoked."

However, she added that her doctor gave her a clear choice: quit smoking or prepare to be blind.

And yet R298 she went blind anyway.

[quote]And yet [R298] she went blind anyway.

Yeah, she did, R299. I find it especially sad when people struggle to quit smoking, finally succeed, then get smoking-related diseases anyway.

I quit smoking 10 years ago this summer. Last year I was diagnosed with lung cancer. I had surgery and radiation. There's no guarantee to anything. I loved smoking but I knew the risks. I'm OK by the way. They found it early as a result of a non related scan. Lucky me.

God bless you.

I find it especially sad when people DON'T smoke and they get lung cancer.

Didn't Christopher Reeves' widow also die of lung cancer? And she also was not a smoker, though I remember hearing at the time that she may have been more susceptible after having spent so many years in smoky nightclubs when she was younger and a singer.

Awwww. I just watched the "damn nice" scene with Georgette, Mary, and Rhoda. All three gone now.

Where'd they go?

[quote] Just googled it. She apparently quit in the 80's and was a three pack a day smoker.

The Reekz autopsy guy looks all the way back to when Mary was in utero. I exaggerate- but not by much. He’s the Dr. Drew of dead celebrities.

The actress who played Georgette died?

R297 Why was the SAG election between Harper and Shitbra so heated?

In the Reelz special they said that Mary thought she was a victim of fetal alcohol syndrome because of her unusual features and her mother's alcoholism.

Yes Georgia Engel died this April 12, 2019 aged 70

Now losing JESSICA Harper would really be tragic.

I downloaded the Rhoda's Wedding episode from YouTube. That show was great although Nancy Walker (Ida Morganstern (sp?) was the real standout with her snappy comebacks. The show is still funny and holds up quite well.

Why are Gayle King and her common-law wife Oprah Winfrey doing a O centered retrospective about her?

[quote] [R297] Why was the SAG election between Harper and Shitbra so heated?

Because shitbra is a massive cunt.

I read the Wiki article on RHODA. Why did they break up Rhoda's marriage when the show was reportedly a big, consistent hit?

R316 The show was slipping in the ratings, and the marriage didn't draw enthusiasm from viewers. Some blamed the miscasting of David Groh as Joe, but I think the writers just didn't know how to make a married couple's problems edgy. So Rhoda returned to being a relatable loser looking for love.

And viewers started staying away in droves...

Thank you R311. I had no idea. Her death is sad too and at only 70, which isn't that old these days.

She belonged to Christian Science R319. We don't know what she died of and if it was curable or preventable.

OMG, those Christian Science people are insane. YOu would think that when one of them gets really sick they would say fuck this ridiculous shit and go to a doctor. I'd say how awful for her but I guess no one was twisting her arm.

The Reelz channel should be all over that one by now. But I don't think they could get anybody to release Engels medical records but who knows those vultures seem to get ahold of a lot of stuff they shouldn't be privy to.

Hypocrite that I am I still watch.

I think Valerie was unfairly characterized as a bitch. Brandon Tartinkoff and NBC really tried to make it look like she was a difficult worker. I'm sure Valerie had her faults - and she even admitted in one of her interviews that she takes ownership of things she did - but she had a number of years as a professional actress and had already appeared on two hit shows, and this show was about her and named after her. I don't think it was a Suzanne Somers kind of thing. I don't think Valerie was asking for crazy money. I think she felt she was entitled to more $ and creative input.

Killing off her character and calling the show "Valerie's Family" was really disrespectful to both Harper and viewers.

However, I think in the end, it just wasn't the right combination of star and producers although the show was doing fine. . I think Valerie was still somewhat stuck in the '70s while Miller-Boyett had a vision of doing family comedies with ensembles.

David Groh had very little charm or charisma. He also didn't have much in the way of any comic chops, which wasn't necessarily an issue since Joe was usually the straight man who fed Rhoda her lines, but they also made Joe very gruff and quick to anger (and they also did something that they hadn't done that much with Rhoda- make her combative) so without that charm or comic ability, Groh had a hard time diffusing Joe's unlikeable nature. As a result, it was hard to want to spend time with the character, and because Rhoda was so beloved, you wanted her with someone who deserved her.

Has Roman Brady released a statement?

I'm still dead bitches!

Why didn't they just recast?

They didn’t talk about it back then, but was it implied that it was an abusive relationship with Joe?

David Groh should have played a cop in a cop show. He didn't have comedy talents but he had pecs and ASS and a sexy ass way about him.

I agree with the assessment of Joe. The character of Rhoda on MTM could have been very dislikable, if Valerie had played her differently.

I loved her in Chapter Two as Marsha Mason's acerbic best friend Faye. But I was shocked at how thin and drawn she looked. It was disconcerting after only knowing her Rhoda look . Her hair was blonde which also looked strange.

Valerie's performance on Rhoda was incredible. There would be long interrupted takes, almost like a play, where Harper would have long comic monologues and she always hit it out of the park.

One of my favorite of those is the episode where Joe stays out all night after a fight and Rhoda tells Brenda and her friend Beverly (?) her worst cast fantasy scenario of Joe meeting another woman. "Princeton '65" in an affected blue blood voice was her impression of the mystery woman's estranged husband.

Rest in peace, sweet lady.

The Shower episode. Comedy gold. With Linda Lavin no less.

whoops here's the link

Judd Hirsch and Valerie had incredible chemistry when he did a 2 parter.

The reason to watch Rhoda was to see Julie Kavner. Valerie was funnier on MTM than her own show.

^ just NOT true

I hated Rhoda's "divorcee" apartment. It was depressing.

R313 I think Rhoda, in her wedding dress, running into her mother's neighbor, who's taking out the trash in a housecoat is hysterical. "Hiya Rhoda! What's new?"

Rhoda and Joe reunited and discuss why it was decided to have Rhoda get divorced. As Valerie says, the writers thought Rhoda lost her comic edge as a married character and the show was about to be renamed "Brenda." What a cool, earthy woman she was.

If the show would have been spun off in the eighties, it would have taken the whole season before they would have been engaged with sexual tension and all. Maybe the second season married or maybe by then they would have discovered that Rhoda played better single.

I read a good article that pretty neatly summarized why Valerie was at odds with NBC and Lorimar. She came from the classy adult sitcoms of CBS in the 70s. After Cosby's success at NBC, the sitcom experienced a revival as an art form, so Valerie thought she could replicate that. But her producers Miller/Boyett came from a very broad, juvenile sense of humor (Laverne and Shirley, Mork and Mindy, Happy Days) that was unlike anything else on NBC at the time. Valerie's inexperienced, controlling husband was brought on as EP and that surely didn't help matters.

"Valerie" limped along in the ratings during season 1 and half of two. Miller/Boyett did what they were good at - find a breakout character that appealed to kids and center the show around that. Jason Bateman was the recipient of that gift, and Valerie suddenly became a boring middle aged mom giving advice to her teenaged heartthrob son, with the other sons basically an afterthought. That would be pretty touch for an accomplished actress and comedienne to take, though she had good company in Esther Rolle and Pam Dawber. The ratings started rising towards the end of season 2 with the introduction of Edie McClurg. Valerie could see where this was headed, but she also thought she would use the better ratings as leverage to get more money and perhaps more control. So I can see her being unhappy after the heights of Rhoda.

A real problem after the divorce was that it became Brenda's show and Kavner's whiny voice, perfect for Marge Simpson, was really hard to take. We also spent a lot of time in her cramped apartment which was claustrophobic. Even Rhoda and Joe's apartment felt tight.

Those of us who grew up with Rhoda on MTM just couldn't see her with David Groh. William DeVane almost had the role, so that tells you what they were going for. Ironically, if they got Ray Buktenica who would later play Brenda's boyfriend, we might have believed it and we might have cared a bit more about their relationship. Groh made it very clear that their relationship was about sex and that's about it. They had almost nothing in common. Rhoda had a schlubby boyfriend in Jonas, played of course by Steve Franklin. Even though it didn't click with the viewers, they looked right together, they seemed right together. Joe and Rhoda were all wrong for each other. I think the first time he meets Mary, he's incredibly rude and mean to her. Rhoda was naive but she wasn't dumb and that should have told her that this guy was bad news.

There were a couple of others, even Ron Silver and Rene Auberjonois who challenged the audiences as Rhoda's boyfriend but the bloom was off the rose and it was too late.

The older David Groh looked a lot like Kirk Douglas in the clip in R360. I thought he was so hot, in my teenage years, when Rhoda was on air. Of course, my imagination went beyond the hairy chest...

Old "Rhoda" thread.

r331 reminded me of this classic exchange:

IDA: Anyway, it's nice to be with my two girls - Rhoda Faye and Brenda Faye

RHODA: That's nice.

BRENDA: You know, Ma? I always wondered -- if you liked the name Faye so much, why didn't you just name one of us "Faye?"

IDA: I didn't like it THAT much!

Joan Van Ark was drop dead gorgeous as Joe's first wife and the mother of his son. It would have made at least a little more sense if he somehow decided he wanted to go back to her. Their break up came out of nowhere. No Rhyme or Reason for it.

Since their marriage came out of nowhere, their divorce did as well. But there were lots of signs of trouble and they even went to couples counseling. What also pushed Joe out was the fact that Groh was not well liked and also had a loose lip badmouthing both Rhoda and CBS. In TV guide, he blasted Cher and her show that he guest starred on.

Maybe they could have had him die at his construction site.. Rhoda could have been a merry widow living off his life insurance settlement.

I asked a pal if he knew who Valerie was and he said, 'yeah. the Hogans.'

Wasn't Rhoda also the first regular TV series character to get divorced? Seems like I read something like that at the time.

Lou Grant got divorced. I am sure there were others. Miss Kitty?

No. Ann Romano was divorced before Rhoda.

Actually Maude was the first divorcee R353.

I just googled it. It was actually on I Love Lucy in 1962 where Lucy shared a house with the divorcee Vivian. Anyway, Maude was before Ann Romano, so at least I got that right.

You got nothing right because the question was whether Rhoda was the first TV character to GET divorced. As in we know their mate also. And they split up during the run of the show. Maude and Vivian and Anne Romano all played divorced women.

Oh fuck off R356. Being a divorced woman had its stigma. Really, you are a fucking idiot to be arguing about whether a fictional character was divorced before the show or during the show.

^That was the question moron. And watch your mouth. So many crazy old men on this site.

It is a matter of interpretation R358. She wasn't the first character to get a divorce.

Fred Silverman the head of CBS demanded that Rhoda get married right away.

I find the beginning of Rhoda so depressing and the opposite of all the character development that had happened with the character on MTM. She was no longer desperate for a husband on MTM.

On Rhoda she meets Joe on a vacation to NYC and within a week or something quits her job, leaves Mary and Minneapolis (there is that whole episode of MTM we just had a thread on where Rhoda states all the reasons she can't move back to NY) and moves in with Brenda.

[quote]I just googled it. It was actually on I Love Lucy in 1962 where Lucy shared a house with the divorcee Vivian

Ah yes, the lost episodes of "I Love Lucy" from 1962.

Was Valerie’s husband on Valerie’s Family/The Hogan’s the first major sitcom character to be widowed during the run of the series?

She’s a trailblazer!

I'm more familiar with I Love Lucy so that is what I typed when I should have typed The Lucy Show. I don't know why you have to been an ass about it.

[quote] don't know why you have to been an ass about it.

It's Datalounge Honey, it's the law.

[Quote] It's Datalounge Honey, it's the law.

It's Datalounge, honey. It's the law.

[quote]Was Valerie’s husband on Valerie’s Family/The Hogan’s the first major sitcom character to be widowed during the run of the series?

Not at all. When Kathy Nolan wanted off "The Real McCoys." Richard Crenna's character, Luke, was suddenly a widower. When Jean Hagen (Lina Lamont from "SIngin' in the Rain") wanted off "Make Room for Daddy," Danny Thomas's character was a widower for a short while before Marjorie Lord was introduced as his second wife.

I can't fathom the people who actually find Joe to be attractive. I find him abrasive and humorless. How he got cast I'll never know.

[quote] I'm more familiar with I Love Lucy so that is what I typed when I should have typed The Lucy Show. I don't know why you have to been an ass about it.

Because some DLers have absolutely nothing going for them beyond a photographic recall of 50+-year-old pop cultural phenomena.

R367

Joe's head was huge and he was overly hirsute and you could tell by looking at him he had B.O.

[quote]Joe's head was huge and he was overly hirsute and you could tell by looking at him he had B.O.

OH, DEAR LORD....

Hello, Queens! It's 2019! David Groh has been dead since 2008. It's one thing to have a memory but to live eternally in them is a problem.

And that's a problem......because?

It’s also apparently a DL law that a snarky post will be the one that gets doubled!

r370

I bet he still stinks, well he probably smells worse now.

I liked Valerie Harper on "Valerie," but honestly she had zero chemistry with those TV children of hers. This is why it was so easy to replace her with Sandy Duncan. Valerie never seemed like a mother to them. She had the same chemistry Lucy Ricardo had with Little Ricky or Viv had with Sherman.

I liked her other sitcom "City." But Valerie is not believable as the maternal type.

Rhoda was awful the third year because Rhoda was portrayed as desperate for Joe to come back. This IS NOT RHODA.

Sure Rhoda was the lovable loser but she had standards and was tough, she didn't beg for any of her dates on Mary. Even when the gorgeous businessman turned forest ranger played by Michael Callen, she dumped him because she was not going to live his life, even though he loved her.

Rhoda actually got better each year, slowly by the last season it was again really funny but by then it was too late.

[quote] I just googled it. It was actually on I Love Lucy in 1962 where Lucy shared a house with the divorcee Vivian. Anyway, Maude was before Ann Romano, so at least I got that right.

I didn't say Ann Romano was the first, I only said she was before Rhoda.

Lucy does divorcee......

People:

Inside Valerie Harper’s Final Reunion with Her Mary Tyler Moore Costars

R374 I agree, Sandy was much better on that show than Valerie was.

GoFundMe

The Valerie Harper Cancer Support Fund

The organizer has currently disabled new donations to this fundraiser.

$66,181 raised

JULY 12, 2019

by Deanna B., Organizer

Thank you to all who have shown support, contributions and messages. We realize there are questions and appreciate those who understand the journey that life deals us. There comes a time when our careers are behind us and the unexpected is in front of us. I also personally know how the world stops when you are fighting cancer. The life you once knew is now different. Health insurance and patient care are out of our hands. I've been working with Val and Tony on various projects for over 20 years and there was no hesitation when I was called a few months ago to help them out again.

Thanks to everyone for your support and well wishes to Valerie.

Deanna

July 23, 2019

Message from Tony Cacciotti

I have been told by doctors to put Val in Hospice care and I can’t [because of our 40 years of shared commitment to each other] and I won’t because of the amazing good deeds she has graced us with while she’s been here on earth.

We will continue going forward as long as the powers above allow us, I will do my very best in making Val as comfortable as possible.

There are two special ANGELS on this planet masquerading as humans who live and work together, that have made it possible to have all of Val’s needs taken care of.

For those of you who have been in this position, you will totally understand that “it’s hard letting go.” So as long as I’m able and capable, I’ll be where I belong right beside her.

Many, many thanks for your outpouring of kindness and support.

Tony

Still?

Yes, still dead.

Rhoda should have divorced Tony.

Here is Harper on Late Night with David Letterman in 1990 talking and joking about "Valerie" and why her name remained on the title after she was fired. In an earlier clip, Dave jokes with the FCC chairman about the show's name.

R380 So according to that point in time he denied her hospice care believing what, that it meant they were giving up? So did she get palliative care at the end and have pain relieving medication and comfort measures given in preparation for death?

She probably wanted to die at home. Did you read the article right above? She was bed ridden.

^^^There is nothing about hospice care that precludes it from being given at home or any other place.

Just stumbled across this Rufus Wainwright song I haven’t listen to in decades and he references Rhoda at :40 seconds. Later he mentions Bea Arthur, he’s a gay icon for sure.

Sad.

I wonder if her picture will be towards the end of the dead people slideshow at the Emmys in a few weeks.

ONG! Stop the press! When did this happen?

Valerie Harper Laid to Rest in L.A. as Daughter Gives Speech During Funeral

Valerie Harper died on Aug. 30 after a long battle with cancer

By Johnny Dodd and Eric Todisco September 07, 2019 06:00 PM

Valerie Harper‘s friends and family honored the late actress on Saturday for a powerful and emotional funeral service.

The actress was laid to rest at Hollywood Forever Cemetery in Los Angeles, near graves of late stars Mickey Rooney and Chris Cornell.

In attendance were director James L. Brooks, actor Elliott Gould and actress Frances Fisher.

The service was filled with tears and laughter, especially when Harper’s daughter, Cristina Cacciotti, shared loving words about her mother’s much-celebrated toughness during her cancer battle.

“I don’t have balls, I have steel ovaries,” Cacciotti recalled her mother saying. Other speakers also recounted Harper’s lifelong acts of charity and political activism.

Harper died on Aug. 30 at age 80 after years of health issues, including leptomeningeal carcinomatosis, lung cancer and brain cancer. The actress was diagnosed with leptomeningeal carcinomatosis in 2013, just four years after she beat lung cancer in 2009. The condition occurs when cancer cells spread into the fluid-filled membrane surrounding the brain, known as the meninges.

Following the news of her death, Harper’s daughter Christina shared a heartwarming message on behalf of her father Tony Cacciotti.

“My dad has asked me to pass on this message: ‘My beautiful caring wife of nearly 40 years has passed away at 10:06 a.m., after years of fighting cancer,’” Cristina wrote on Twitter. “She will never, ever be forgotten. Rest In Peace, mia Valeria. — Anthony.”

Throughout Harper’s years-long struggles, Cacciotti, her husband of 32 years, remained by her side. He took it upon himself to ensure that his wife was as comfortable as possible in some of the final moments of her life.

Despite their professional opinion, Cacciotti said he was not willing to listen to them because of how much he adored Harper and vowed to do what he deemed best for his wife.

“I have been told by doctors to put Val in Hospice care and I can’t [because of our 40 years of shared commitment to each other] and I won’t because of the amazing good deeds she has graced us with while she’s been here on earth,” he wrote in a Facebook post on July 23.

At the time of her diagnosis, doctors told her she only had three months to live, but Harper beat the odds and continued to live well beyond their expectations by six years.

“She was happy every single day because she was given six weeks to live,” Harper’s close friend, Sue Cameron, told PEOPLE. “Her goal was to teach everybody with cancer how to live with dignity, and with as much fun as you can.”

“Valerie said, ‘I’ve been given six weeks to live, but I’m going to have the best time,’” Cameron recalled. “And then she kept on living. She kept giving interviews saying, ‘I’m still here, still having a good time.’ “

By Johnny Dodd

By Eric Todisco

Sue Cameron must be friends with everyone in Hollywood. She has been on three shows discussing her friendship with Rebecca Schaeffer, was with Debbie Reynolds at her death, and yaps about all of it.

^^^ Maybe she’s like those cats in nursing homes who cozy up to those about to die. Beware if she befriends you!

Being she was diagnosed with metastatic cancer to the brain in early 2013 and given 3 months to live, she was fortunate to have gotten a 6 year extension on life, and actually just made it to her 80th birthday. She tried a treatment that actually worked for her and basically had her cancer on remission until just recently. I'm happy for her that she made it as long as she did.

"so it's probably better that she's passed.

She DIED, she didn't fucking "pass," you imbecile.

I wonder if Ed, Gavin, Betty and Cloris were at the funeral. Not to mention Julie Kavner. She was friends with Cloris in fact.

And STILL no word from Susan Fucking Dey!

Does anyone know if the gofundme donations will be refunded?

[quote] In attendance were director James L. Brooks, actor Elliott Gould and actress Frances Fisher.

So essentially there were only two celebs there? How do you go from James L. Brooks and Elliott Gould to Frances Fisher?

Has anyone seen the death certificate? How do we know she died of the cancer? I bet she died of something else.

^^Let us know what you find out, Jessica Fletcher.^^

R401

I bet she died because she was old not because she was sick. Where's the death certificate?

Or is this another Prince cover-up?

[quote] Where's the death certificate?

She was 80 and had been seriously ill for years. What the fuck difference does it make?

R404

Why bother having any death certificates at all then? Everyone else with this cancer dies within three months if treated and in weeks if not treated. So what was up with that? She said she took a pill but the charged her like 3 million dollars for it over a course of six years. If the pill extended her life, then it would've been great publicity for the company and they would've given it to her for free.

Something isn't right.

Prince obviously had AIDS, but they refuse to list it because he died from being a druggie. But he still had the AIDS.

[quote]Why bother having any death certificates at all then?

Why?

Silly....

The only celeb at MTM's funeral was Bernadette Peters.

I really do hope she was getting palliative/hospice care. As others have said you don’t have to send the patient away and many people receive hospice care in their home. I was the carer for my grandmother who had lung cancer that spread to her brain and I kept her home but under hospice care. It means that the patient will no longer receive treatment to try to cure them or extend life but rather to make the end of life as easy and pain free as possible. If new symptoms occur you don’t go ER now you call the hospice team who will try to alleviate the symptom so it doesn’t cause the patient distress or the caregiver. At the end of life some symptoms are far more distressing to the caregiver watching that to the patient. Anyway, I’m rambling but it seemed like Tony was suggesting that putting Val under hospice care would have been giving up and admitting defeat and he was still hopeful that she could fight on longer. I do hope that’s not the case and Val received appropriate care in her final weeks and days.

I'm sure this is a DL'er....

Famous Graves - VALERIE HARPER - Remembering Rhoda At Hollywood Forever Cemetery

Is she still dead?

No.

I met her a few times in LA and she was as nice as everyone is saying.

She really was the best friend you wanted.

Good Lord, that was quick !

Unlike Liberace, she apparently kept her death a secret. I bet she had a regular old person's death and they're covering it up.

Let's face it she was supposed to die before Mary and Georgia and they beat her to the grave.

[quote]I really do hope she was getting palliative/hospice care. As others have said you don’t have to send the patient away and many people receive hospice care in their home.

I think her husband meant they didn't want to move her out of her home for hospice. Who doesn't want to die at home as opposed to a strange place no matter how comfortable they try to make you.

I have to say one of the funniest things I ever read on the DL was on MTM's death thread from a few years back when someone posting as Valerie wrote, 'Well...this is awkward'

If you're going to a cemetery, as least have the dignity to dress a little better, in a collared shirt, maybe even removing your hat. I'd be pissed if this guy trekked over the graves of the people I loved.

I'm still dead bitches!