The Final Days of Joni Mitchell

It's sad. But I'm glad I got to see her live once.

She's an old lady with serious physical challenges. She looks pretty cool for an old lady in that pic. Sad? Yeah, death, age, mortality, losing life.... all part of the journey, eh, Pookie?

Did she repair her relationship with her daughter?

If she doesn't leave her a ton of money, after giving her up for adoption just to please her first husband, I'll be utterly disgusted.

she only had one hit

Debbie Harry looking like Pete Burns there

Hardly her final days.

She's lucky to be alive and that's more important than anything else right now.

R3 After mending the relationship, her daughter and she decided they weren't really compatible as adults. But think of the thousands of men who move on from engagement with their children... I don't think Joni "owes" the daughter any more than the father, no? Joni isn't a nice person, she's just a consummate artist, writer. Her songs are just as strong as Cohen, or Dylan or others of her generation.

Her daughter was at the tribute shows, I think.

They have some sort of relationship, but it's not mother/daughter. Joni has contact with her grandchildren

She's been improving steadily for years, and starting at the end of last year had improved so much she could start walking again. She doesn't walk all the time but she's been out and about with a cane as often as with her wheelchair. I guess OP either just assumed or hoped he'd get attention with this.

Morgallen’s is a bitch

Chris and Debbie are looking rough, too. :(

It's too bad. I like Blondie's latest music.

Every thing I've read about Joni, in people's books where they knew her or worked with her etc, makes her seem completely insufferable.

Did she ever prove she had that illness, or do doctor's still think it's psychosomatic?

Whatever you think about the veracity of her Morgellon's complaints... she also had a stroke. That wasn't psychosomatic.

Debbie Harry looks stoned in that photo.

[quote]she only had one hit

And all those albums, you dumb motherfucker.

R16 What a world, eh? R14 thinks Katy Perry is a genius. All those hits....

R14 I wasn't asking about the stroke, that's not a disease. I was asking if she ever proved she had Morgellons because the general medical consensus is that it is a form of DELUSIONAL parasitosis.

Of course it wouldn't be the first time Mitchell would be called delusional.

R18 You may say I'm delusional, but I'm not the only one... I hope someday you'll join us, and the world...

I read that she still can’t speak since her stroke.

What’s her beef with Judy Collins? Is it over that song “Both Sides Now.”

She must hate being so old and grotesque.

I could never get over the fact Joni wrote the song Woodstock but didn't even go because she was scared she miss her DICK CAVETT appearance. She took what Graham Nash told her and turned it into a song but didn't attend the HISTORICAL event cuz she and her manager thought it would be more advantageous for her career to appear on A SHOW! Talk about appropriation haha.

Grace Slick and the rest of the Airplane, David Crosby and Stephen Stills managed to do both. Hell Jefferson Airplane didn't go on until 6am after being delayed from the previous night, no one got any sleep, and they were coming down from LSD and they still made it.

But Mitchell was too concerned with her American exposure. That's all I need to know about Mitchell.

But she ended up with a great song, so....

[quote] but didn't even go because she was scared she miss her DICK CAVETT appearance.

Elliot Roberts encouraged her NOT to go. She was still pretty new at that point and establishing herself, so it might have looked really bad for her to flake on a commitment.

[quote] What’s her beef with Judy Collins? Is it over that song “Both Sides Now.”

Joni was the writer and she got sick of that chirpy hag covering all her songs.

CSNY’s rendition of Woodstock is classic

I think Joni and the daughter tried to live together, and didn't really get along when around one another so much. I'm sure it's better these days, they see one another on occasion. The daughter and her children will get everything. It'll be a surprise to everyone how little there is, though.

Damn, I'm supposed to open for her!

Joni is rich, rich, rich!

R23 clearly isn't a boomer and thus is unaware that Woodstock didn't achieve its legendary status until after it happened. Prior to that weekend, it was seen as just another big open-air festival. While it was happening, it got tons of publicity due to the massive chaos it created - traffic jams and abandoned cars blocking the thruways, people breaking down the gates to get in free, not enough food, water or supplies resulting in a public emergency. And yet, despite the chaos, there were no riots, no unrest. It was peaceful and joyous.

THAT'S why it became an international news story and subsequently, a legendary event after the fact.

I don’t know how well off she is. I remember reading that her records wouldn’t recoup the advance to be record company paid. Maybe Geffen is supporting her.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

Joni's heavy smoking for years did her no favors. She said that it gave her "clarity". Have good health in your old age is much better clarity.

"I could never get over the fact Joni wrote the song Woodstock but didn't even go because she was scared she miss her DICK CAVETT appearance."

Seems like a smart move to me. That "HISTORICAL event" was a fucking mess; no toilets, no food, people wallowing in the the mud, everybody stoned out of their gourd. Hardly anybody could hear the music. Some fun, huh? I think she knew how disorganized and chaotic it would be; acts scheduled to go on at a certain time were told it would be hours before they could perform. She knew it would be hell, so she went on the nice, clean, orderly Dick Cavett show instead. Wise choice.

I remember seeing an interview with her back in the early 2000s. I was taken aback by her raspy old smoker’s voice and claw like hands with a cig between her fingers. I had no idea she’d been a chainsmoker since she was a young teenager (and quite defiant about it, saying she fucking likes to smoke, so there.) You never saw pics of her smoking back in the day. I had no idea.

Yuck. Bet she still smokes too.

Ripped way too many perfectly fine artists for my liking. Bye Joni, won't miss you...

She became a smoker at age 9.

She actually looks pretty good here compared to where she was at right after her strokes. Like someone said upthread I've read she's able to walk short distances and is back to being somewhat socially active again. These aren't her 'final days' anymore than they are someone else her age and health status.

So: where the fuck is her Kennedy Center Honor? Is this ever going to happen while she's still here? They only give it to living folk, not after death. Get on it Kennedy Ctr Committee.

Oh and Chris and Debbie look pretty good here as well, considering their own health issues. Chris was very ill a few years back. Good to see him and Debbie still out and about together, how long have they been on/off partners? it must be near 40 years.

I wonder if she still smokes.

[quote]Seems like a smart move to me. That "HISTORICAL event" was a fucking mess;

And people have never stopped talking about it. Books are still being written and documentaries are still being made. It's part of the culture. I would've put up with some mud and rain for a couple of days to be a part of such an event that's still very much in the cultural consciousness 50 years later.

Do fuck off, r22.

The fuck are you even talking about, r4? She had a lot more than one.

She fucked everybody in the 60s and 70s. I think even David Geffen got a turn, if you can even imagine.

OP=National. Enquirer.

Final days? Proof of that?

OP has Joni Mitchell confused with Olivia Newton John. Happens all the time.

I would’ve fucked everybody, dropped LSD and worn flowers in my hair.

Many of my favorite songs of hers were off her Court & Spark album - People's Parties, Just like this Train, Free Man in Paris...

What a life. Not many people can accomplish what she did. People will judge to make themselves feel better I guess. Not one of them could do what she has done

Here you go R49. This is a great performance. I for one like Mitchell's more weathered voice. She's a great singer actually - in addition to being a fucking genius. She always figured out how to make it work.

So she can't talk or walk. Can she still write? Imagine all those great songs she could write about death's door.

"And people have never stopped talking about it. "

Because it's been romanticized to high heaven. But the actual event was nowhere near as pleasant. People who were there seem to have fond memories of it because they were stoned out of their minds at the time.

R39 She's Canadian? Only US Citizens get the Kennedy thing, right?

No, a person doesn't have to be a US citizen to get it.

Joni has been honored at home.

Joni Mitchell never lies.

She was up and walking when she met that artist a few months ago, I can't remember his name but they were adorable together.

Now that I've seen some recent photos of her, it probably doesn't matter if she still smokes or not at this point.

R10/ R18 She's been quite the nutcup for years, way before her bout with Morgellon's. I read in article that she believed it to be caused by a government conspiracy to put nano-particles in people's bodies. I felt rather sad reading it.

[quote] Joni is rich, rich, rich!

She's surprisingly not.

She's by no means poor, but her main income over the years was from her songwriting fees. Only a handful of her records sold well. She had tax issues in the 80s and was harassed by her maid (which she wrote a song about).

Which song was that, R61?

The Windfall (Something for Nothing).

Apparently it was Joni's Guatemalan housekeeper, who Joni kicked in the shins.

Joni, you shoulda kicked her in the cunt bone!

[quote] So she can't talk or walk. Can she still write? Imagine all those great songs she could write about death's door.

She and Chaka Khan are friends and hangout. She can do some walking and she can talk. If I remember correctly; Chaka has said that Mitchell can sing again.

[quote] We mostly visit each other. We’ve been going out a lot lately, since she’s been better [Mitchell had serious health issues for years; in 2015, she suffered a brain aneurysm]. She’s making great strides. I’ve been going to her house a lot lately. We live like five minutes from each other. She comes to my house, I go to her house, we play music, we drink wine, we talk, we have a good time. We go out sometimes, to see a band, to dinner — lots of dinners.

I'd love a Chaka sings Joni album.

Old girl IS lucky to be alive and as able to be part of life as she is.

She had an aneursym and laid on the floor for over a day before she was found.

The fact that she can talk and move at all is really a fucking miracle.

Getting ripped off is something she understands. No doubt she is relieved at having finally settled (out of court) with her Guatemalan housekeeper, who tried to sue Mitchell for $5 million after the star kicked her in the shin — a rash act undertaken "because she was ripping me off." The woman ran through a string of lawyers in a fruitless effort to lay her hands on the Mitchell millions.

The star also battled for years against the State of California to win repayment of an arbitrary "wholesale tax" levied against her and a handful of other rock stars. This, she believes, stemmed from the sinister influence of the Evangelical right under Reagan's administration.

"The Moral Majority was beginning to get very hostile towards rock'n'roll. I kept likening it to Nazism in Germany. I said they'll be making us wear stars or guitars on our sleeves or something at any moment, and start confiscating our property.

'Well, in fact they did. The Governor of California levied a tax against 12 of us as an experiment. They charged me 15 per cent of my income between 1972 and 1976, they just took it. I fought City Hall for ten years and finally won."

The State's case apparently hinged on an artistic control clause in the singer's contract. "Neil Young and America were also taxed. Their contracts were modeled on mine. When I got this special slave-with-rights contract, then so did everyone else in my management stable.

"Somehow or other, to these people who knew nothing about the music industry this clause technically made us seem like independents and therefore taxable. So we fought and fought and finally got the money back, but of course it's mostly the lawyers who get fat off it by then. So that woke me up politically."

One of my favorite DL threads forever will always be "Joni Mitchell's vagina here!"

^ That thread was disgusting and extremely misogynistic. A bunch of old gay men calling one of the great poets of our time a slut. So of course a classic for DL oldtimers. They enjoyed the vile miss warwick ebonics threads too.

Oh come on, that Joni’s vagina thread was fun.

Joni gave up her daughter because of ambition. IMO

[quote] Joni gave up her daughter because of ambition. IMO

She did the right thing.

I saw Brandi Carlisle in concert a few weeks ago, and she told a great story about going to Joni’s house after the Grammys. Joni invited her and some other musician (can’t remember who) to her house and invited them to play music for her. They did, and Joni responded by pointedly withholding praise. Brandi confessed to going to comic lengths to win just a nod of encouragement, and got nothin’. In the midst of this strange scene, Chaka Kahn appeared out of nowhere, drunk out of her gourd. She took Brandi’s glass of wine from her, guzzled it, and wandered out of the room.

I'm sure Chake was just drunk...

R70 is off her meds.

R58: the artist is David Hockney.

So he gave up a daughter when she was young. . She probably wasn't emotionally or financially equipped at that time to be responsible for a child. Or maybe she just didn't want to be a mother. I don't fault her for that. I think she did the best thing for herself and the child. By the way, Patti Smith did the same thing; got pregnant young and gave the baby up for adoption. I don't SHE has gotten any criticism for doing that.

R78 Because most people outside of the cool kids don't know who Patti is, and Patti's peers wouldn't judge her.

But Joni was at the level of Dylan, Neil Young, etc. and that's why so many of the men in the industry took glee at slut shaming her with that Rolling Stone article in the 70s, and with the hissing and back talk about Kilauren (before she was found).

[quote]Joni gave up her daughter because of ambition. IMO

I read somewhere that Joan took the baby home from the hospital for a few days before deciding to give her up. Kind of like returning a pet to the pet store because it was too much work.

R77 So apparently Joan can totter a few steps with a cane and someone to hold onto.

But Joni Mitchell, when she spoke to the Press, always went on about honesty, about TRUTH. How so many of her contemporaries were less than real in their music. Her standards of integrity were very high. And then, years into her career, she goes public about a child given up for adoption. When the news came out I felt a bit played.

One of the few people Joni has expressed complete admiration for is Laura Nyro. Joni herself said that she greatly admired how Laura walked away from her career which was at its peak in the early 70's. But Laura could also afford to do so, because her songs were covered by so many top name artists, her royalties were huge.

Joni also greatly resented being put in the league of Carole King, Carly Simon and the female singer songwriter category. She always felt she was a jazz artist, and an important one at that.

She actually wrote a song about it, in *1971*:

Same old ancient monsters here discussing Joni in the same old way. Go back to your Cher and Linda Ronstadt threads if you can't handle a woman who always knew she was an artist with important things to say. Who gave up a child for adoption in the sixties and then tells everyone about it? How much cum did you carry round in your holes during that time old queers?

And don't further undermine men and women by referring to men as "she" when they disagree with you R76. That makes you the most obvious of the ancient queers here. Too old to inspire a bitter stereotype in The Boys in The Band? YUK. It's misogynistic to think that calling someone SHE is a put down anyway. That's drag queen mentality. Like that ancient drag queen miss warwick himself. Disgusting racist woman - hating ancient human being. Calls people "it" or "she." HE"S banned from this joint as far as I know.

Joni Mitchell is correct to be pissed about being included with the barely talented, can't sing but writes dreary soundtrack anthems Carly Simon and the excellent but sometimes only good pop songwriter Carole King. The three of them have nothing in common but James Taylor.

Joni certainly is a jazz artist - among many other things. Some people don't understand what open tunings are and just how creative and gifted Mitchell's songs were or the depth of her musicianship. She's a certifiable genius and an amazing artist. Not one bit American is her problem. She's not a "cunt bone." See Linda Ronstadt for that.

Has Joni been cunty about Dolly Parton?

R85 I remember a story about Eric Clapton visiting Laurel Canyon in the late 60s and looking at Joni playing the guitar, desperately trying to figure out what she was doing... the open tunings. Brilliant songwriter, unique singer, and underrated musician. Carly Simon is to Joni as John Mellencamp is to Dylan.

R86 I’ve never heard Joni speak about Dolly. Certainly Linda Ronstadt has said some negative things about Dolly - or maybe it was Dolly who said negative things about Linda.... I can’t recall.

Linda Ronstadt has her own feature length documentary out in theaters right now.

As Bonnie Raitt said, she was the Beyoncé of her day.

Respect, bitches. Even Joni respects Linda.

Joni Mitchell hit me in the head with her fondue pot.

R89 Was Bonnie Raitt insulting Linda Ronstadt or propping her up? Honestly, I have no idea who Beyoncé is beyond her name and the fact that my iPhone autocorrected it when I just spelled it incorrectly. She’s got some power, that’s for certain. Is she any good? Linda is fab!

[quote]r60 I read in article that she believed it to be caused by a government conspiracy to put nano-particles in people's bodies. I felt rather sad reading it.

Speaking of conspiracy theories, I wonder how Shelley Duvall is doing.

And Joni stuck up for Linda after Rickie Lee Jones dissed her in an interview The writer tried to compare Jones effort Girl at a Luau to Linda's own album of standards, and Jones got all offended at her "work of art" being trivialized. Joni saw through her bullshit and told Rickie she knew nothing about the standards and to lay off her friend Linda.

BOTH of her parents lived to be more than 100; considering she started smoking at age 9, I'd say she's doing pretty well, and I bet she'll be around a good while longer. She's a terrific musician. I just listened to Hissing of Summer Lawns this afternoon, for the first time in years, and I was astounded by how good it is, and how it doesn't seem outdated at all. It's nearly 45 years old. The OP link has nothing to do with the "final days" of Joni Mitchell.

That was probably more about seeing off the upstar Rickie Lee than defending Linda. And it was an EP called "Girl at Her Volcano". Linda was a covers queen. She's not comparable to Joni, Rickie, or any other notable singer-songwriter.

Holding out (faint) hope for another record. Who knows? Stranger things have happened. But I suspect Joni is done with all of it once and for all - for physical heath reasons if not only to preserve her mental health... it must be a brutal business for the true artists.

Aw, r94, now you made me.....

It wouldn't be brutal for her now. It would be her last record. It would receive way more coverage than any of her other latterday records.

No, to whomever asked, the Kennedy Center honors are not only given to Americans.

R85 Yeah, we know she’s an ARTIST, dammit! She’s told everyone so many times.

She may tiresome, she may be pompous, she may be a fucking cunt on wheels but there is no denying the song writing genius of Joni Mitchell. Only a fool or a jealous rival would pretend she's not a fucking genius.

And to the person who felt "played" when Mitchell talked about her daughter, she wrote a song about giving the kid up and stuck it on an album in 1971. You must not have been listening.

R101 She is a genius and her art isn't bad, either.

She is great, but there's no need to put down other women.

Linda Ronstadt is one of the most versatile singers ever. Probably even more so than Streisand.

Covers queen is just a cheap shot. She's a first rate interpreter of song the same way Billie, Ella, Sarah and Judy were.

She is maudlin and full of self-pity. She is magnificent.

New documentary in theaters now.

This is just JM and a guitar, filmed live in London in 1974. The banter about the song at the beginning is from another concert, in NY in ~1971, don't know why it was included here. This song is from For the Roses, released at the end of 1972.

If you think a Linda Ronstadt standards album stacks up against the greats, some of whom introduced standards, well...

It's scary and humbling how fleeting life can really be. Joni, Linda, Carly and Barbra burned like supernovas in their youth, and now they're all old women with various health problems. How is that even possible? Weren't we the chosen ones who would never get old?

I feel a panic attack coming on right now just thinking about it.

It's a Blondie backstage photo. JM dropped in. At first, I was hesitant to think the other woman in the photo was D. Harry. But it's her. Sheesh.

"The daughter and her children will get everything. It'll be a surprise to everyone how little there is, though. "

She is reputedly very, very wealthy. Those were David Geffen's exact words about 20 years ago, and for him, I can just imagine what that phrase indicates. He invested her money for her before she severed ties with him. Look up her supposed wealth on the internet; last time I looked it was more than 495 million $$$. Look up the list of enterprises she owns or has a stake in.

[quote]r101 And to the person who felt "played" when Mitchell talked about her daughter, she wrote a song about giving the kid up and stuck it on an album in 1971.

So she profited from abandoning her own child?

#classy

For the gays: Wigstock '87.

Debbie is wearing a silly wig, which she is wont to do.

Patsy darling, are my tits straight?

Eddie, you’re drooling.

r109's pic is great. Joni was a very pretty woman in her youth.

Joni Mitchell Highest-Paid Singer in the World... and oldie but a goodie!

Except that she hasn't sung since about 2001... I know she's rich, I posted the link above about what D. Geffen said about her wealth.

Brandi Carlile - Down To You (Joni 75: A Joni Mitchell Birthday Celebration)

Joni had good reason to withhold the praise on this one R119

Her original is a masterpiece. Classic Joni Mitchell. A beautifully framed work that hangs in the middle of her career, offering colours from both her past and future sounds and artistry, but while also remaining firmly in its time and place.

Joni Mitchell and Laura Nyro. My God, I wonder what they were talking about! Men, music, meditation? To be the fly on that wall....

Hang in there, girl!

DL fave Laura Benanti sings Joni.

All these mothers just giving away their children .... such a shame!

r97 Are those summer lawns full of eldergays?

Barbra

She was right to apologize...

Byron was a lesbian. Mitchell probably dint see her as competition, esp. after she disappeared from view.

CaroleKing was not a gifted singer but wrote songs far less selfconsciously songwriterish. And 5he idea of Joni as a jazz artist? A few really forgettable albums.

[quote]She and Chaka Khan are friends and hangout. She can do some walking and she can talk. If I remember correctly; Chaka has said that Mitchell can sing again.

Hilarious. I see a future movie script about this. Like the odd couple, but with famous older female pop stars.

chain smoked for many years.....it has killed u madame......thx for all the kool tunes my dear.

Who knows if it was the smoking. Nonsmokers get aneurysms too.

R110 Joan’s dentures look too big for her mouth.

She was a very pretty woman in her day. It's easy to see why so many guys wanted to park their dicks in her.....and did!

Uh, MediaMass is total bullshit. They say EVERYONE is rich.

She is not mega wealthy. I think most of her wealth, such as it is, is the land she's purchased over the years. Beyond that she has probably several million dollars. But she isn't filthy rich. Geffen didn't invest her stuff and she was near broke in the 80s.

Listen, it’s got to be said *now.* I’ve never ever heard more cry babies obsessing over fucking *smoking.* Do you need to call your mommy to tell her that Joni won’t stop smoking??? Kids, we all smoked like you stare vacantly at your Smartphones, mmkay? Smoking was just ingrained in our culture, again, just like you are with your phone. Smoking was everywhere, many/most of us had parents and other family that smoked, all of our friends. I was told more than once that I looked sexy smoking — smoking could be super sensual on either sex. And yes, it DID give you clarity, nicotine is a stimulant after all.

Yes, it’s also disgusting, yes, it’s great that it’s changed and that it’s ended. But please, stop with the Smoker Shaming. We fucked, we drank, we snorted, we smoked. It was a different time. Don’t judge us, we won’t judge your addiction to technology and utter lack of social skills.

She's got Bette Da-a-vis lungs....

Incidentally, Bette Davis had her massive stroke around the same age Joni had hers.

I liked her song Cactus Tree, about alll the men she fucked. They were all in love with her but she was “too busy bein’ free.”

Written about David Geffen, who didn't want it on the album.

Joni Mitchell is one of the all-time greats, up there with Beethoven, Michelangelo, Kurosawa and Dickens. Most other artists are mere gnats compared to her.

R94 Yep, I listened to "...lawns" a couple months ago and was taken by how fresh the music and arrangements and production sounded. Her music/songs are so unique, unusual, artful... it always sounds like "right now."

Thanks to R107 - For the Roses is poetry, and that mid-70s voice is my favorite... the crisp and shining edges of her waif-folk voice have been knocked off by some hard living, but it's not the deeper shredded rasp of her later albums. I think the song, like Blue, is about her failed romance with James Taylor.

Wonder what brand she smokes. Do you think she’s a Marlboro gal? Or maybe some fancy French smokes cause she’s an ARTIST and she likes her fancy French cologne.

R142 American Sprit

OMG. If I ever run into one of you Joni-Mitchell-thrashing jackasses in real life I will slap you right in the face.

It's interesting that JM is beloved by both Rick James and Prince.

When I smoked, American Spirits would make me nauseous. They're strong AF, Marlboro Reds aren't even as strong as those.

R146 Strong, but they have no additives, just pure tobacco. Boomerphobes, stop reading here.

I am 25 years sober, 20 years without cigarettes, but I get Mitchell's romance around smoking. Simone Signoret smoking in Room at the Top. Sexiest thing in the universe. If I had my way I'd go out in my last hour chain smoking Dunhills...with three fingers of Glenlivet 18.... listening to Coyote... oh yeah, and smoking indica with a crack pipe chaser. Ok, ok, maybe our generation made certain destructiveness too romantic. But Joni wouldn't be Joni without her smokes.

Are you psychic, R66?

The good news is, Chaka Khan has ALREADY recorded an entire album of Mitchell tunes.

The bad news is, somebody, somewhere - the record label? Joni? Khan herself? - decided to shelve the album a few months ago.

Are you psychic, R66?

The good news is, Chaka Khan has ALREADY recorded an entire album of Mitchell tunes.

The bad news is, somebody, somewhere - the record label? Joni? Khan herself? - decided to shelve the album a few months ago.

I don't know if I need a whole album of Chaka singing Joni Mitchell. These things never work out well, except maybe for Holly Cole's Tom Waits album.

Mary Chapin Carpenter did that gorgeous version of Amelia with Shawn Colvin. It's pretty hard to cover later Joni tunes. This is one of my faves.

R147 Yeah, real sexy those smokes.

When I smoked I felt the way Joni did about it. It was the only thing tying me to the Earth it seemed.

The anti smokers are so fucking boring. Like most people I gave up smoking quite a while ago. But I LOVED smoking for all the years I did. And I look good bitch.

Joni can be quite funny too. She's very cute and a bit self deprecating at times. Great storyteller, with or without music.

I don't smoke anymore, but I loved every single cigarette I ever smoked. If it wasn't deadly, I never would've quit. So there!

The gross thing is that you can smell it on them- that nasty cigarette smoke permeates their hair and clothes. They reek of stale cigarettes.

The best cover of a Joni song is James Taylor’s version of “River” on the tribute CD.

[quote] The best cover of a Joni song is James Taylor’s version of “River” on the tribute CD.

I love Joni, but River is a dreadfully whiny, boring song, and somehow James took it from its sad minor chords (the only thing that made it interesting) and made it sound like a Shower The People ripoff. Ugh, I hate that version.

Didn't she write 'Silver Threads And Golden Needles'?

I hate "River."

R159 Me too. I love 98 percent of everything she's written, but that's near the top of the ones I hate.

Who her songs are about...

Did Joni mostly tour without backing singers? The bank of vocals arrangement is really missed from this.

I saw her 4 times, 3 with big bands, no other singers.

Joni looked a lot like Taylor Swift in her youth. I'm surprised that Taylor hasn't tried to star in a biopic on Joni yet.

Was David Geffen fucking Joni? Wasn't he fucking Carly Simon?

Weren't they touting Swift for a movie adaptation of that "Girls Like Us" book. Joni said "I think the fuck not."

"Silver Threads and Golden Needles" was written by Dick Reynolds and Jack Rhodes.

Why are we talking about Dusty Springfield hits on a Joni Mitchell thread?

That's correct R165. Taylor most certainly has tried to portray Mitchell. I saw Alicia Keys in The Nanny Diaries last night and I forgot how pretty and easy a presence she was. Evey singer wants to star in films, How bizarre. Streisand wasted the best years of her life making or not making shitty films instead of sharing her one great talent: singing. At least Whitney's films only elevated her status as a great beauty and singer and Janet Jackson is a better actress than singer by far. Adele is going to play Dusty Springfield, mark my words.

Joni however is an artist and a musician. She likes men and compliments but she hasn't the vanity of an actress.

I love the background singers here.

^The background vocals there are all....Joni Mitchell. She famously multi tracked her own voice on many of her songs. But in very interesting and different ways. She's beyond musical - yet like most artists everything stems from childhood or some experience with love. She wanted to sing the descant parts in the church choir and you'll often hear her doing exactly that in the background of her own songs.

This article is a fascinating look at her vocal musicianship, among other things. It's a bit long, but well worth it.

"And Joni stuck up for Linda after Rickie Lee Jones dissed her in an interview."

Rickie Lee Jones has always been crazy as a bedbug. Very full of herself and enthralled at her own "artistry." Yet she's always come across as street trash. She was a heroin addict for some time. I remember her accepting a Grammy for Best New Artist; she seemed totally out of it. And after accepting the award she walking back into the audience, instead of going offstage. Obviously stoned.

Rickie Lee Jones has a good live album called "At Red Rocks". She tells some interesting stories, from working as a backing vocalist for a two-hit wonder ("Hully Gully" and "Hully Gully Again") to narrowly avoiding becoming one of a pimp's "girls". She lived quite a life befor making it as a musician.

Rickie Lee Jones is very talented, but she is the epitome of what Mitchell has been accused of and isn't. She's self indulgent and sloppy as a singer and willfully obtuse as a personality. She's troubled without the genius part. But undeniably sensitive and uniquely talented.

Why are the YT videos of Joni in London (1974) so awful? The original tapes were lost?

This is why I subscribe to DL. Thank you R107 for posting that live performance! She’s incandescent here!

Rickie kept her voice much longer than Joni did.

R174 - those *are* the original tapes...the footage is bootlegged. Do you have any idea about the quality of videotaping equipment in 1974? I did not ever see a "personal" video camera until 1980 - it was double the size of a shoebox, and weighed about 15 pounds. And of course, there was no digital. Mitchell did not have these things filmed, they were likely made by sound people who were working the shows, who just happened to have the equipment.

Are you kidding? Those "London 1974" videos are shot from multiple angles. It was professionally shot, dear. With multiple cameras.

However they came to be, they are the best record there is of that tour, and it was the highlight of her career as a performer. I'm glad they were preserved and are accessible.

It seems to have been taped for the UK TV show "The Old Grey Whistle Test", which aired a highlights version. Hopefully, the full concert is stored somewhere safely.

Joni and Johnny.....

Carey:

I know that Datalounge posters are quite old, but I'm still surprised that so many here think that Mitchell's early songs and voice were her best work. They weren't. Not everything she did is gold, but she's worthy of celebrating the more jejune work too. Her young voice is painfully folky and way too upstairs choir for me. It's painfully pure and a bit silly. She got better with some wear and the jazz fusion that never left her after Court and Spark. But these posts of Carey and Cactus Tree songs make me believe that she really did defend Linda Ronstadt. Ha. That stoned pony. I still find it hard to believe. But they were both ladies of the canyon, serious women about music and men. Long before some of us were born!

I know that Datalounge posters like R183 are quite stupid. Boy, do I know it.

R164

We know Joni loved Laura Nyro, and she was at least friendly with several of her colleagues like Carole King (she sang backup on one of Carole's songs), Carly Simon, and Linda Ronstadt.

She's been asked hundreds of times about younger musicians and has been pretty blunt when she hasn't cared for them. And she's talked about the syndrome where artists who came after her and were compared to her - Rickie Lee Jones and Suzanne Vega are but two - would say unflattering things about her in interviews. She called it the "kill mommy" syndrome - that the other artists had to bring her down to elevate themselves.

I'm willing to bet that I'm the only one on this thread who has met Joni Mitchell, more than once R184. You don't have to agree with me, but you should hesitate to call me stupid. I am a musician who definitely understands more about music composition and vocal production than you. You are welcome to enjoy Linda Ronstadt for the rest of your days. Someone has to. But don't mess with me about Joni Mitchell. I am aware of everything she ever recorded. I've played her music quite a few times at tributes to her. She's been there, We've met and talked. She knows my name. I know what's mind blowing, what's good - what's only pretty or fun and a few things that are cringeworthy. Guess what? So does she. There are only two posts on this thread that demonstrate any knowledge or understanding of music. Yours is not one of them. Keep up you passion for Linda and enjoy a pleasant weekend.

R187, I’m a different poster. Can you explain open tunings??? And how that relates to Joni? And her vocals?

R187 is Joni's former Guatemalan maid.

Oh God. Are you the Whitney Houston Troll, r187?

r188, the standard tuning of the guitar is (low to high) E-A-D-G-B-E; there are various other tunings, often called "open tunings," that change the note of anywhere from one to 3 (or more) of those strings. This changes everything, especially the fingering of chords, so if you're used to standard tuning and watch someone's hands, the patterns of their fingers on the fretboard will be unrecognizable if the guitar is in another tuning. Joni devised many weird tunings of her own, and learned others from David Crosby.

R188 I'm not R187 but this may give you a bit more info on tunings.

Linda Ronstadt had some good songs. I've never been a huge fan, but she was very talented.

Remember that time Chrissie Hynde and Carly Simon got into a huge fight at a Joni Mitchell concert? Good times.....

"Mitchell took the stage at around 9:40 PM and opened with "Refuge Of

The Roads." Midway through the hour and a half set, Chrissie Hynde

roared her approval--gushing very audibly "I love you , I love you" as

well as occasionally bellowing, hooting and clapping her hands from

her center rear booth. Carly Simon, glaring at the rather tipsy Hynde,

finally got fed up and suggested that Hynde sit down, and if you'll

excuse the expression, "shut up." That's all it took. According to eye

witnesses, Hynde leaped up, grabbed Simon around the neck, and shoved

her to the ground, where she began to pummel her--not once but twice."

Rondstadt found some good songs, often other people's hits.

Her tunings have been called "Joni's weird minor chords."

I'm the bitch who complained about River upthread. Listen to Joni's original version of River and then James Taylor's version from the Joni 75 album. His is in a more traditional tuning.

Re Joni/Carly/Chrissie

The announcement that the elusive Joni Mitchell— whose last live concert had been more than a decade back—would sing again in New York came a day before curtain. No drumrolls from flacks - just a notice on the chalkboard of a basement club in Greenwich Village. But there was time enough for nearly every music celebrity in town to cancel other plans.

The atmosphere at Fez - where the stage shakes as the subway rolls by on the other side of the wall - was subdued to the point of reverence, with one lone exception: Chrissie Hynde, after a few pops, started yelling "We love you, Joni!" and "Joni, you rock!" Mitchell was flattered. But Carly Simon suggested that Hynde clam up. Bad move. Hynde wrapped her arms around Simon's neck while Liz Rosenberg, Madonna's publicist, turned white. Natalie Merchant stayed out of the fray.

"That," said Hynde, referring to Mitchell, "is a real singer." Simon exited in a huff. Afterward, an enthusiastic Hynde "climbed me like a telephone pole," Mitchell would recall.

"I was a little in the bag," Hynde told me, "but she was fantastic, brilliant. I was probably going a little over the top because people speak of her in hushed tones.... She's a great singer, she plays great. She's always looked fantastic, but never flashed her tits. The only thing she ever flaunted was her songs.... I was yelling, 'Go for it, bitch!' She's only human - everyone needs to be told they're loved."

I love her songwriting but Joni's swooping way of leaning on vowels is a terrible vocal affectation.

Ronstadt is a singer, Mitchell a songwriter. They are completely in different categories. Maybe because of that, Mitchell has never said anything against Ronstadt.

I don't know why Ronstadt keeps being brought up. Are we going to chat about Helen Reddy next?

[quote]Rondstadt found some good songs, often other people's hits.

And? Tons of singers have done that. Did Frank Sinatra ever write a song?

R187 What are the two true posts about music in this thread that you are referring to?

[Quote] And? Tons of singers have done that. Did Frank Sinatra ever write a song?

It's probably best not to bring up singers of standards while talking about Linda Ronstadt. It's not kind to her.

The DL has someone who LOOOOOOOOOOOVES her some Linda Ronstadt.

Debbie Harry? I thought that was Penny Marshall for a second.

R187 seems like the most insufferable, asshole cunt imaginable. Truly an unbearable prick.

r205 he sucks the life and joy out of any music you can think of.

Girls! Girls! You're both cunts!

R187 is no good.

Carly Simon was asked in some article to comment on some singers. I remember she said Bonnie Raitt was "a good ol' girl", Joni took chances, and Linda had "the best white pipes in the business".

You're the old granny smacking your lips in disapproval of Joni (or any other woman) giving up a baby for adoption R205. I don't approve of the word cunt. It marks you as a very old, woman hating fag. My prick is big and bearable, not that you'll ever know. I discounted you @ R183. Don't turn this into one of those kind of threads. I know who I am and what I know. Stay in your lane old man. Sad that your attachment to Linda Ronstadt makes you blind and deaf to your potential better taste. R187 is a babe and a handsome man, a considerable talent, funny and instructive. Now leave me alone or you'll be out of this joint by tomorrow.

R205 is answering himself at R206! That's pretty desperate man.

I was not the same poster at r205.

Why did OP post a photo of Lee Grant, Tom Petty and Donald Sutherland?

R210, you are a retard. I never expressed any disapproval of Joni Mitchell on this thread, much less dissed her for adopting out her baby. And I'm not what you would call of fan of Linda Ronstadt's; I liked a few of her songs, and that's it. You sound like you're a raving nutjob. As for your "prick"...well, I doubt that you even have one. Anyway, you're a raving loser retard. "Stay in your lane?" HAHAHA! You poor cunt!

If DL has a Buffy Sainte-Marie troll, we beckon you to join this thread.

R214 is the Universal Soldier. He used retard. loser and cunt in one paragraph, with 'raving' repeated twice. Quite a gift for cadence and expression.

Cadence, of course, gave us the Everly Brothers. Did Joni dismiss them?

I always enjoyed that Joni said Prince had the "eyes of a puffin."

She is the genius of her generation, a better singer, songwriter and musician than Dylan or Cohen.

Wow, I thought Joni was ugly all those years ago until I saw that picture of Babs, man she was and is always so ugly. I hope Joni isn't as ugly on the inside too as Babs is.

Joni loved Teddy Pendergrass. Harold Melvin & The Bluenotes. Wake up Everybody.

I think we can all agree that Laura Branigan's songs have aged better than Joni's. They're just more accessible to the general public than Joni's poetic lyrics, and Laura had a better voice.

I think Joni was always jealous of Laura's talent.

^^^ Um, Laura NYRO, you mean?

I hope Miss R221 means Nyro.

I mean, I did appreciate Self Control and everything, but......

OMG! I meant Laura NYRO. Although Joni never had a feel-good classic like "Gloria."

The thought of Joni singing disco is pretty hilarious.

She tried and we have DOG EAT DOG to thank for it.

"Dog Eat Dog" is to disco as rap is to music.

Who Aden those hideous freaks shes hanging with in ops photos?

She looks like she's about to join the 127 Club.

So I had the person who supposedly knows Joni on ignore already which I thought was weird, and it's because they're a rightwinger who is apparently a Brit pretending to be American on a political thread.

Alert the media!

And speaking of your famous friends, what’s the latest on Joni Mitchell?

All I know is that she’s doing the work that she’s supposed to be doing, which is rehab, rehab, rehab — metaphysical and spiritual. She quit smoking, and apparently that’s made a big difference. It’s always in the wind that I’m supposed to go visit her, but then something happens and we can’t do it or she’s not feeling up to it. - Judy Collins.

The anti-smoking trolls are getting on my last tit.

JM and Judy Collins did *visit* recently. There were tabloid shots of them and their handlers heading into a restaurant for lunch in LA, published sometime in the past month or so.

The James Taylor version of River that I was referring to was not from the Joni 75 recording (which I’ve not heard), but from the A Tribute To Joni Mitchell album from 2007. I’m sure it’s still not to the dissenting posters taste, but let’s at least refer to the same version.

I remember RDJ sang River on Ally McBeal. Were Mitchellites appalled?

JM must be getting a lot better: since January, she's been photo'd out at an art gallery in LA, to see a David Hockney show, and was shown talking to him, walking with a cane; she went out to lunch with J. Collins, again on foot I think; and dropped in to see Blondie, which strikes me as kind of an odd choice for her, I'm impressed. I hope she is finally healing up, as folks have been insisting ever since she was first in the hospital. She looks pretty happy and spry in the photos I've seen.

R218, did she really? That’s great! He does.

Or, did, rather.

I just have to add, in terms of her smoking and what she said about clarity, nicotine does help with focus which is why a lot of ADDers can’t quit. I know a few like that, and JM probably figures she’s made it this far, so why stop?

To honor her music, will she be buried in a parking lot?

^^^ Right after she has sex for the last time in the pink hotel. You know, the one with the boutique and the swingin' hot spot.

Who was the hairline receding guy in "Just Like This Train"? James Taylor?

Wow if Joni can quit smoking I suppose anyone can. Her cig addiction was off the chain.

Why is she wearing sunglasses indoors?

Is she in a 'home'?

It takes lung bucket-fulls to make any difference, not little wasp breaths.

She looks like Mae West in that pic.

It's one thing to say "X doesn't ping for me". It's quite another thing to state "X isn't gay", as if you fucking know.

Who is r247 talking about?

Wrong thread, r248

I assume it's a wrong thread incident.

In tribute to Joni we should all start smoking.

I love that she wrote a song (Car on a Hill) about waiting for a trick to come over.

She was raised on robbery, r252.

She was a trouble child, breaking like the waves at Malibu.

She has been to sea before.

She saw all those people at that party, they had a lot of style.

The "Raised on Robbery" performance at that 1974 London date rather exposes her vocal limitations. They take it a bit too fast, though.

She usually doesn't sing that fast AND high at the same time.

He let her go there by herself. That's such a lonely thing to do.

But she couldn't let go of L.A. City of the fallen angels.

If she had her way, she’d just walk through those doors and wander down the Champs Elysées.

She would tie on coloured feathers and beat the drum like war.

I don’t consider her part of my generation, more like my parents. But I was high the first time I listened to The River and the lyrics made me cry. So I feel if I took a deeper dive into her oeuvre I would like her. Why such much hate for her smoking? That’s just what people did back then and not quitting is her choice.

[quote] He let her go there by herself. That's such a lonely thing to do.

No regrets, Coyote. I just get off up a ways.

Know what would be super clever? Posts that play with Joni’s song lyrics!!!

r265 Fever in the scum brown bowl

I'm a wild seed again.

She's looking like a moooooovie queen!

You're always disappointed, nothing seems to keep you high.

Drive your bargains, push your papers Win your medals, fuck your strangers

So cool.....

R270 That's a great song. Not all the Mingus tunes really worked but that was one that did.

Her stroke was more than likely triggered by smoking. Smoking is a huge risk factor for strokes, and, as many have pointed out here, Joni has been a chainsmoker for the last 65+ years. She is frankly lucky that she's gotten off with just a stroke after all that abuse. Does anyone know if she's regained her speech? I seem to remember reading that she couldn't speak properly still, which at this point may be permanent.

She had a brain aneurysm, not a stroke. One in every 50 people are walking around with an unruptured brain aneurysm.

We wonder why DL sisters are so ballistic about cigarette smoking yet they take recreational and pharma drugs, including MJ, like crazy?!?!

Smoking also increases your risk of a brain aneurysm, R273.

Yes dear, I know. But you were still wrong about what happened to Joni Mitchell. You are only here to talk about smoking R275. You're not fascinating in the least.

Joni will raise her good hand to put her smokes out in your eye!

How is that Joni is 75 and Debbie is 74?

Well, because Joni was born in 1943 (and will be 76 in November) and Debbie in 1945!

It does seem impossible, but it's true.

But ... how old does that make ME!

You're ageless, doll.

Why does it seem impossible? Both were in the career prime in the same decade (1970s).

Debbie Gibson is 74?

r283 = Tiffany

Debbie seems like she should only be in her early to mid 60s, because she seems so young in Blondie's heyday, but she was past 30 when Blondie finally hit.

Chrissie Hynde, whose ascendance in music is in a similar timeframe to Blondie, is 67.

And even she was pushing 30 when the Pretenders had their first hit in 1980.

Whereas Lulu is about 70, maybe 71. She was but a babe when she topped the charts.

R287 exactly. Whereas Dusty Springfield would have been 80 this year.

According to Wikipedia, Lulu is 70. And damned thin.

Yeah, Debbie Harry was in her 30s when Blondie hit. Before Blondie she was in a hippie outfit called Wind in the Willows that released an LP in 1968. She'd been around.

R290. What was the group she was in just before Blondie? Punk band, couple of other women. Performed at CBGB, they dressed as nuns.

[quote] She'd been around.

She's gonna get ya get ya get ya!

The Stilettoes.

And Debbie Harry even cited Lulu as an influence, though not in an effort to appear younger.

Debbie Harry is virtually talentless. Why is she taking up so much space here?

Probably because she's in the pic at the top of this thread.

Oh, I thought that was Mr and Mrs Dick Van Dyke. Thanks R295.

Could we maybe get back to talking about ME now?

I thought it was Talk TO Me, not Talk ABOUT Me, you old crow!

Hahahaha bitches.

Joni on Canadian TV in 1965. Pure folk.

It's the "Summer of Jeffrey"!! Here's a live version of JM's "Edith and the Kingpin" about some sexual commerce. Yes, it sounds willowy and ethereal and "personal", but it's quite deadly in its intent. "The plane in the rain is humming [what a great line]....You know, they dare not look away..." Nothing sentimental about it.

But she did this, amongst other very amazing things.

I think most all the greats mentioned here realize she is the greatest...

Will Kilauren write a juicy tell-all after Joni dies?

When I was in college a bunch of us dropped acid in the dorm and listened to "Herjira" on constant repeat from a friend's 8-track player for about 12 hours

*Hejira sorry

My least favorite Joni song ever, with truly the most bizarre video.

(And yes, that's Billy Idol and Tom Petty's voices in the background.)

Those cats probably scratched her fucking eyes out after this video.

Shawn Colvin is almost too in love with Joni. Still this is a great at home recording of a young song. Just because it's a young Joni song doesn't mean it's not great, because Cactus Tree is a great song. Now done this way.

Shawn Colvin and Mary Chapin Carpenter's version of Amelia from the TNT tribute concert is lovely. It always makes me cry.

Why they never came out with an album of that concert is a mystery to me.

(It's at about 57 minutes in...)

say bye bye too the Marlboro Woman

Joni would NEVER smoke Marlboros!

The Mary Chapin Carpenter & Shawn Colvin version of Amelia is not only beautiful and still and a kind of magical moment in time - it's also the most appreciative anyone has ever seen Joni Mitchell be of anyone who sang her music for her. I love that too R310. The isolated song doesn't seem to be on youtube anymore. There are a lot of good and some not great performances that night, but all were sincere and they didn't choose anyone who couldn't sing. Cyndi Lauper did an adventurous percussion driven cover of Carey that night too. It worked and she was excellent. Still nothing compared to the beauty of MCC's voice and the lovely harmonies with Shawn. They sing and play together along the years and it showed. How pleased they must have been to have done so beautifully. Joni doesn't necessarily care about her songs that way. I think it surprised her to hear it sung so true and sound so pretty. A guess.

organic vegan, she rolls her own cigs.

Is Cyndi Lauper known for moving like that?

she known for bein a dam grouch back stage. creepy old broad

Her fine legacy aside, she won't truly rest easy unt they print Morgellon's as cause of death on her certificate. She truly believes it's what's killing her.

Lauper is many rungs below the brilliant Joni on the ladder of talent.

R314 You jest, but... She smokes American Spirit (see upthread). Pure organic tobacco, no additives.

I do believe she finally stopped smoking after her health woes.

I doubt Cindy would disagree with you, R318, but then so would most musicians with any modicum of self-awareness. Mitchell is an artistic titan and they are few and far between.

Regardless of any of that, Cindy Lauper is one of the better artists out there.

R183 What is Joni's feeling about her earlier music as compred to her later work?

Not R183 but Joni doesn't like the singing on her earliest albums. Shortly before her illness she compiled a box set of her work and declined to include anything before Blue, though she did include the later orchestral version of "Both Sides Now."

It’s a nice 4 volume set...

Joni had a period when she thought she was a black man too.

R321 I think Ms. Lauper would slap you and say, "It's CYNDI, you skank!"

omg, wandering thru laurel canyon in the seventys, chasing rock stars, hearing joni and her vocals as I drifted from one man to another.....my Chelsea morning angel of the American spirit

R323 That's a shame. Her singing could be insufferably twee in the earlier years but "Clouds" and "Ladies of the Canyon" are still great records. I also enjoy "Song to a Seagull" but David Crosby mucked up the production terribly.

Agree R328...there are some gems tucked away on those albums, in addition to the well known classics. "That Song About the Midway," "Gallery," "The Arrangement," "Rainy Night House." I think Joni has also felt a little bitter over the years that people tend to disregard her later work, especially from the 80s on.

[quote]Lauper is many rungs below the brilliant Joni on the ladder of talent.

Good to see you can still post here in your sad final days, Joni!

Cyndi is only missing the O from EGOT.

Everybody "Say Yeah" for Cyndi's O!

R329 "That Song About The Midway" in particular is up there with her best. Her jazz period was definitely the high point, but there's something to be said for a straightforward acoustic folk song with a killer melody and lyrics.

^^^ "Mingus" was her HIGH POINT?! I don't know whether to laugh, or cry, or vomit.

R333 She released several jazzy albums through the mid and late 70s, but I do consider Mingus as part of her peak, yes. “God Must Be A Boogie Man” and “The Dry Cleaner From Des Moines” in particular are really great.

At least I’m not a “Dog Eat Dog” apologist.

Those later LPs of hers (everything after "Don Juan," which even has its saggy moments) all have good things on them. She fell for all that fake electronic musicianship, which really killed a lot of music in the 80s and 90s. Synthesized dreck, most of it. She's smarter than that, and I wonder why she went along with the craze. It killed music, for me.

Because she wanted to be "relevant".

Probably so; but very few musicians were as careful about the actual sound of their records as she was, and for me, that care is a real hallmark of quality for music, the way it sounds, the texture. She did all those arrangements and recorded all the background vocals herself. Not many in pop music in the past 50 years have done that. And I like her later records, I just don't find myself wanting to listen to them that much.

A friend of mine who doesn't pay any attention to DL, straight family guy, mentioned the OP photo to me this weekend, so it got around.

Bonnie's Midway.....

They should shroud her coffin in a big ass Marlboro blanket u can buy on their site....

and place a lit ciggy in her mouth when they give a pvt showing of the bod

Cyndy was so off note we all threw gumdrops at her phat asssy pooo

[quote] At least I’m not a “Dog Eat Dog” apologist.

It's pretty dire.

I like the Michael M duet and there's maybe two other songs on there that are listenable.

She nailed a lot of topics in terms of lyrics....but it just wasn't very listenable.

My bottom 3 of hers are Dog Eat Dog and her last two studio albums.....

R335 Jaco Pastorius' odd fretless bass fit with her hunger for unusual textures... Dog Eat Dog, Chalk were not pleasing then, and time hasn't been kind to them. Wild Things had its moments. Things got better by Night Ride Home... which still had some of Jaco's shadow in it.

I really like Snakes and Ladders, r343.

Dog was the nadir.

Chalk Mark was uneven but it had My Secret Place, which is (a) one of her finest songs of any era and (b) the first time in years where it was like, "Oh....THERE's the Joni we know and love." The first four songs on Chalk Mark are solid. After that, it gets weird and messy.

Same with Taming the Tiger. The first four songs are pretty solid and then it goes to shit.

One big difference between Joni's classic 70s albums and the later stuff is that she self-produced all the albums from Clouds to Mingus, with the help of an engineer named Henry Lewy. The 80s and 90s albums were produced by her bassist husband Larry Klein, who was more of a tech hound and tried to update her sound. For Dog Eat Dog they brought in Thomas Dolby but Joni ended up resenting the way he took over the record (and it certainly didn't help sales, I remember seeing it in cutout bins pretty quickly). I still think there are good songs on it though, probably more than on Chalk Mark.

It took 31 years for Joni's album Clouds to go Gold. And that has Chelsea Morning and Both Sides Now on it. I'm not sure what that means. For someone so famous, she was never for the masses? When she does die, we know some headlines will say - Big Yellow Taxi singer, dead at __.

I’m aware I’m in the minority here, but I think her first album is still her best, with Marcie being one of the most beautiful songs ever written.

And to piss you guys off even more, I also think David Crosby did a stellar production job.

I put a Joni album on once at a gathering. I think it was BLUE. More than one person asked me to turn off the "screechy" woman. The GP found her resistable.

[quote]I’m aware I’m in the minority here, but I think her first album is still her best, with Marcie being one of the most beautiful songs ever written. And to piss you guys off even more, I also think David Crosby did a stellar production job.

[italic]Joni Mitchell[/italic] was my favorite Joni Mitchell album until 1997, when I bought a turntable again (after getting rid of my old one in 1987 when I switched to CD). The only other one of her albums I bought in the 1970s was [italic]Ladies of the Canyon[/italic]. I still like the self-titled album more than any except [italic]Court & Spark[/italic] and maybe [italic]Hissing[/italic]. And like r348, I thought the sound quality was terrific.

I love a lot of Joni material around the Court/Spark era, but before that, and including, Blue, is screechy. Later material is hit and miss. Mostly miss.

She is fascinating, and I devour all I can read about her, but you don't listen to Joni to dance. You don't listen to Joni for much of anything except to lick your wounds while in a bad relationship. Most of her songs aren't catchy. Her lyrics are like a short story--who has time? Sure, she's an intellectual, and I appreciate that component of her, but it usually doesn't translate to a listenable song.

She is what she claims all around her are: boring.

I appreciate her earlier albums but my main Joni catalog runs between Ladies of the Canyon and Wild Things Run Fast.

There is simply no artist, of any gender, who had the creative run that Joni had between Canyon and Mingus. That's such an amazing decade of albums right there.

R351 "... like a short story. Who has time?"

This is why we can't have anything nice. This era sucks.

The early stuff like Marcie is OK but as Joni herself says, it's very similar to Joan Baez, etc.

The real "Joni" began to emerge on Clouds and, to a much larger extent, on Ladies of the Canyon.

"I Think I Understand" from Clouds just popped up on iTunes shuffle. I'm glad I didn't get to know a lot of Joni's music until the late '90s, this album among them. I could have bought it when it was new. I don't know why I bought so few of her albums, especially this one, as I loved [italic]Joni Mitchell[/italic] .

R342 She used to perform the title track on the piano when she did it live and the lyrics were really wonderful. It was a more outward, political approach but still quintessentially Joni. I really wonder how her 80s albums would've been received if she had produced them herself.

The video doesn't show it well, but Two Grey Rooms, one of her best later songs, is about two men - one in unrequited love with the other. He rents a room above where the second man works so he can catch a glimpse of him a few times a day. I think it was based on a story.

Oh wait, the details were in the YouTube page I linked to......

"So, I finally found a story in some magazine about a German aristocrat, a homosexual and friend of [Rainer Werner] Fassbinder, who had a lover in his youth that he never got over. He lost track of him for many years. One day, he discovered that his old flame was working on the docks. He moved out of his fancy digs and into a couple of dingy rooms that overlooked the route where, with his hard hat and his lunch pail, his ex-lover walked to work. He lived to glimpse him twice a day, coming and going. He never approached him."

Such glorious bone structure, r358.

In this video too, R360

Good Lord, how much longer is this going to take?

^^JM's not going anywhere. She's got the genes to live to a hundred. She's obviously a tough cookie.

Like Linda Lavin and Brenda Vaccaro, Joni has been the recipient of SCTV's brilliant cutting scalpel.......

Joni Mitchell, Neil Young, Laura Nyro, Harry Nillsson- they are all gifted songwriters but their albums are so self- indulgent! Stop with the vocal gymnastics! And Neil Young and that fucking guitar! Seventies artists are notorious, Hey Jude- did it really need to go on and on? Same thing with the Boxer by Simon and Garfunkle. Mind you, I bought it all back then. But now I listen and I cringe.

How vivid, R365.

R365 Yeah, Neil Young and his guitar...…………………………...…………...….. what the fuck are you thinking?

^^I listened to most of his new CD "Tuscaloosa" last night (recorded in '73). I haven't paid much attention to N Young since that time, but that concert recording has some great guitar in the mix, and the sound quality is 100% better than the sound on all those "live" LPs from back in those days. The sound is crystal clear. It's worth a listen. And there is also "Powderfinger" from his collection, "Decade". It's terrific.

Joni has smoked clouds from both sides now

Okay, I give up. Linda Ronstadt's new interview in The New Yorker convinced me that she knows a lot. A lot about music and a lot about our culture. It's excellent. Some thoughts about Joni and Janis and Dolly, Emmylou, Sia and Gaga in there too.

She said that she saw Joni every night when Mitchell played the Troubadour. " She sang better, played better and looked better than the rest of us."

https://www.newyorker.com/culture/the-new-yorker-interview/linda-ronstadt-has-found-another-voice?

No it's not.

R371 I find it amazing that Linda Ronstadt lives in a house with windows that look out on the house next door 50 feet away. If I had money my #1 requirements would be outdoor space and privacy.

Here's the link for R370.

Wow, what a great interview.

Yes, thank you R373.

R372 Jesus pictures on the wall and in the window too. And Caucasian Jesus at that.

She recorded "A standards album," New Yorker? Just the one, dear? By my count, there's "What's New?," and "Lush Life," AND "For Sentimental Reasons."

The less said about Ronstadt's standards albums the better. I'm sure the New Yorker mentioned only one album to be kind to Linda's clumsy, mostly terrible interpretations. Nelson Riddle was indeed the best and her candy box cover albums were hits before my time. But her whole approach to the material managed to be dead serious, coy AND twee. Mixed with her blaring choppy singing....they're not great albums. Many other vocalists proved to have a better understanding for the American Songbook. Natalie Cole deserves the most credit. Mitchell herself did some good salty tears work. Ronstadt, as usual, was just earnest. And loud.

Linda is very, very tough.

r371 When did she turn into Shirley Feeney?

I did Reiki Raindrop Therapy in a small group in Sedona with Linda, oh god, ages ago

I’m very loosely knowledgeable of what reiki is, but what is reiki raindrop therapy????? I must know.

It doesn't work R382. Don't sit up too much. Don't stand in a doorway & never spit into the wind.

Move away from Republicans - but don't ever go outside in San Francisco! It's not important to be a good person, it's most important to be rich enough to only see what you want. Pay taxes where you care. It's all the fight that's left.

I loved her song "At A Hundred Seventeen, Or Looking Like It."

take your toxic misogyny and ageism to 8chan, r384, and allow the rest of us to appreciate Joni's body of work

I forgot this is a Joni thread...

It took me a while to realize that was Debbie Harry in that pic. It's weird not seeing her with her iconic platinum blond hair.

After listening to the new Lana Del Rey album, I've come to the conclusion that Lana is better than Joni. She's a better songwriter and a better singer.

Ha ha. You don't believe that. You're just trying to jumpstart this thread.

How's the weather in St Petersburg, Boris r388?

Happy old lady... happy

Too bad she can’t speak. Or walk unassisted. All those years of chain smoking came back to bite her but she’s a stubborn old thing and still hangs on.

My mom cried half the day when Joni died. She really loved those old folk songs. She said that Joni Mitchell left all her money to the natives of Saskatchewan, which is pretty damn cool. When my mom was a teen in the late sixties, there used to be coffee shops in a place called Yorkville and Joni Mitchell would sing real good for free. Then she met Gordon Lightfoot and had his baby - a little boy she soon gave up for adoption. That's the source material of her song, The Wreck of The Edmund Fitzgerald. My mom played some of Joni's rock albums when she died - she told me that Joni had been heavily influenced by Chubby Checker! Then we smudged the room and danced in our stockings. Joni's song Someday Soon was playing....going with him, someday soon. RIP Joni.

Thanks r393

R393 … writing after taking Ambien.

Viz. Woodstock. I was 10 years old and living in Hicksville, Long Island, New York. My next door neighbours Debbie and Gerald, two well brought up Jewish girls, left on Friday afternoon for the festival. They were back mid morning Saturday. They said they arrived, saw the overflowing shit, rivers of piss, festival goers stoned out of their minds, and drove right back home.

Yes, Gerald was a popular name among well brought-up Jewish girls in the 1960s, your story rings totally true, r396

O.M.FUCKING.G:

I wonder if she wore plaits especially for him.

Reflections:

Friends:

^ Who is Gregory? Does anyone know?

Cute.

Is she still living in L.A.?

Is she still living in L.A.?

Turbulent Indigos:

Cheers:

The threads were her downfall

Pleats Please really is a Gal’s Best Friends: