THEATRE GOSSIP #356: "Biding My Time Till the Tonys & Moulin Rouge" Edition

[quote]Annie-in-a-wheelchair

A possible revival title for my triumphant return to Broadway?

This is the first year in a long long time I haven't seen any of the Tony nominated shows/performances. It's not for lack of access, but just lack of interest.

I'll watch the Tonys because maybe something will spark my interest, but unlikely.

Let's give awards for mediocre shows so that they can last longer and charge outrageous prices to see crap.

Will I become a triple crown Tony winner?

Does Gold Derby post its actual accuracy race after the Awards?

Yes, it does, r5. At least, it always does with the Globes and the Oscars.

What they don't do well with are wild cards - ie, like Olivia Colman taking Best Actress away from Glenn Close this year.

Just realized Andre De Shields has been voted an honorary award this year, hasn't he? So maybe they will give Featured Actor to Patrick Page after all.

R2 it has indeed been a disappointing year for musicals, but I thought Hadestown was terrific.

Who is the fuckwit that spams the end of threads and doesn't leave room for a link to the new thread?

the search function is messed up -- so the asshole spamming the last of the old threads is being especially trollish.

I wouldn't be surprised if Mary Testa wins her category if Stoker doesn't. She's a vet and the industry seems to like her.

Nah - if Stroker doesn’t win, it’s going to Amber Grey. Mary Testa’s award is the nomination.

Actually the industry doesn’t seem to like Testa. She’s liked more than Jackie Hoffman, but liked less than Veanne Cox

SJB is gonna have a lead Tony, a steady paycheck, a hot husband, and a cute kid ... plus she legit looks better than ever ... is this all still karma for getting dumped from Wicked

If the industry dislikes Testa, why does she get hired so often?

Where in the world does Gold Derby get their info to make any sort of informed choices?

[quote]She’s liked more than Jackie Hoffman.

That sentence could apply to anyone in the entertainment industry. Jackie Hoffman is a hateful person.

R16 could you elaborate? I know next to nothing about her.

Mwah! Tony, Tony, Tonys.

Record low ratings for the 2019 Tony Awards.

Are you posting from the future, R19?

I had to go on Google to find this thread, as it does not show up in DL's search engine. Fucking ridiculous.

R21, it actually did show up for me, though I still agree the search engine is fucked up.

[quote]Jackie Hoffman is a hateful person.

I've heard/read this for years, so will ask the same question that someone else above asked about Testa: how does Jackie Hoffman continue to get work if she's so disliked in the industry? It's not as if she's a major box office draw like Nathan Lane, so what's in it for producers to keep hiring her? There are plenty of other comedic actresses out there (Beth Leavel comes to mind) who could do what she does every bit as well.

[quote] [R21], it actually did show up for me, though I still agree the search engine is fucked up.

Weird. I checked last night, and I checked just before I posted my comment. I usually search Theatre Gossip (number). Irritating. As long as I can find it on Google, I suppose it's fine, but Muriel needs to pull her head out of Cheryl's rancid twat and fix this.

Didn't Jackie Hoffman and Mary Testa play the nasty, bitchy Greek chorus in XANADU?

I just scroll down the DL home page until I find the newest Theatre Gossip thread, keeping in mind what the next number *should* be (356 in this instance). It doesn't take long to find it, especially in these Tony days. (But, yeah, agreed the DL search command has become pretty useless.)

What's Gavin Creel up to these days now that his brief stint in Waitress is done?

[quote]How does Jackie Hoffman continue to get work if she's so disliked in the industry? It's not as if she's a major box office draw like Nathan Lane, so what's in it for producers to keep hiring her? There are plenty of other comedic actresses out there (Beth Leavel comes to mind) who could do what she does every bit as well.

You basically answered your own question. Obviously, it's not true that she's generally disliked in the industry. There may or may not be some people who dislike her, but obviously not the people who keep hiring her. As you said, she doesn't have anywhere near enough marquee value that she would be continually hired by people who dislike here.

Jackie Hoffman is odd. Some of her Twitter posts that have been posted throughout the years (especially the FEUD threads) are quite bizarre, to say the least.

Search has been working in the last few weeks. Try only searching on “theatre” rather than a string of words

Agree the person who fills up the last dozen posts on every thread is a dick, especially if they don’t link to the new thread

[quote]Muriel needs to pull her head out of Cheryl's rancid twat and fix this.

Muriel's gonna charge your mastercard from the last millennium about 16 times this month you miserable hemorrhoid.

I'm hoping it's just temporarily down, but it seems the Lortel Archives have been removed. It wasn't a perfect database, but it was all we had for Off-Broadway research.

R22 here. You might also just try putting in the number with no words (all I entered into the search box was "356" and this thread came up). Of course, now that I'm posting this, it probably won't work the next time!

I found it by entering Theatre gossip and clicking the by date box.

[quote] I'm hoping it's just temporarily down, but it seems the Lortel Archives have been removed. It wasn't a perfect database, but it was all we had for Off-Broadway research.

Phew, found it. They took it off the Lortel website and gave it its own site. I use it for work, so losing it would be bad.

Gavin's events : gavincreel.com . They include a solo concert in NY at the 92nd St Y, June 17.

R35, can you post a link? I looked for it yesterday and could not find it.

Santino winning will be a low point for me, personally. It's nothing against him, really--but I hated TOOTSIE. I'd be happy for any of the other nominees to take it.

[quote] [R35], can you post a link? I looked for it yesterday and could not find it.

I found it on accident, so I don't even know how to tell you what you should have searched. I'm sure you didn't do anything wrong. I wound up bookmarking it since I use it on nearly a weekly basis.

For a brief second, I thought this thread was titled BIDEN my time LOLOL !!!

I don’t even put “theatre “ - just “Gossip 356” (or whatever) and it comes up.

[quote]I hated TOOTSIE. I'd be happy for any of the other nominees to take it.

Better get used to it. He’s very well-liked and got rave reviews. It’s highly unlikely that he won’t win.

You’ll have to take your pleasure from the fact that Tootsie is almost guaranteed to lose Best Musical and Score to Hadestown (but it may win Book). Plus Hadestown will get Featured Actor (one or the other) and either Amber Grey or Ali Stroker will keep the Tony away from the Tootsie girls. Hadestown is definitely going to get the most awards of the musicals.

I always hate when actors I like win for roles they weren't very good in or for shows/movies that weren't great. It just cheapens everything. Like Julianne Moore for Still Alice. I love her to death, but that movie was Lifetime-level tripe and she's been so much better in so many other things.

for me it's who's the hottest, so it's damon over santino and brooks, we know what happens in the smokehouse after the fowl carnage

[quote]Where in the world does Gold Derby get their info to make any sort of informed choices?

They have three groups. One is “Experts,” which is all entertainment journalists who focus on awards. Second is “Editors “ similarly entertainment journos who don’t necessarily focus on awards. Last is the “Top 24,” the regular users who have the highest number of correct predictions over the course of tue year.

They also can combine them. Combined, which is a total of 510 or so people, Santino still has around 461, Damon Daunno 30, and Brooks 15.

THE PROM's going home empty-handed, right? Will it make it through the summer without any Tonys?

[quote]for me it's who's the hottest, so it's damon over santino and brooks

The hotness quotient in that entire category is piss poor this year. Damon Daunno being the “hottest” is just an example of how bereft the category is of hot guys.

I was watching Frank Dillela's interview this weekend with Brooks and the young actress from "The Prom" and have to say that I don't think Brooks is unattractive at all. He has a cute face and very nice eyes.

R46, in a season of mediocrity, it's pretty bad if they win most mediocre by getting 0 Tonys.

R43 It's still an Oscar

[quote]I found it on accident

BY accident.

Oscar history is filled with actors who won as a compensation prize for years they should have but didn't, going all the way back to Bette Davis, James Stewart, Joan Fontaine, James Cagney, et. al.

Can the same be said for the Tonys? Who would be the actors who only won a s a compensation for losing in the past?

I would argue Kelli O’Hara was a make up Tony. Bernadette was marvelous in Song + Dance but her legacy was her previous nomination Sunday in the Park. Chita winning for The Rink was a make-up Tony

I would say the "overdue" factor helped Patti LuPone in 2008, when she won for GYPSY. Kelli O'Hara (South Pacific) and Jenna Russel (Sunday in the Park...) were formidable threats, but it had been nearly 30 years since Patti's first win (for Evita). Also, some felt she should've won two years earlier (for Sweeney Todd).

R46-THE PROM won't last a week without a TONY.

I feel bad for The Prom. There just isn’t a Tony that would do them any good that it’s likely to win.

Conventional wisdom is that the only Tony that makes a major difference at the box office is Best Musical, and alas, I don't think THE PROM will win that. Although I suppose it's possible.

I think Hadestown has best musical locker up. Tootsie would win in the unlikely event Hadestown doesn’t get it.

{quote] BY accident.

Yes, and unfortunately, your mother decided not to terminate.

When did "Best Score" effectively become "Least Lousy Score"?

[quote]When did "Best Score" effectively become "Least Lousy Score"?

Sometime in the late 1980s.

The idea of Patti's GYPSY Tony somehow being a corrective for her not winning for SWEENEY TODD is the funniest thing I've read in ages. Thanks for getting the day off to a mirthful start.

Go check out Luis Miranda's Twitter and how he says Happy Mother's Day to LMM's wife. i.e. congratulations to MY SON for choosing the best woman to have HIS CHILDREN. Gross, gross, gross. Congrats LMM! Mother's Day is still ALL ABOUT YOU, YOU, YOU!!! Happy Broodmare Day from the Miranda's, all.

I don't think even Patti thought she was going to win in 2006 (well, okay, she probably did) - her competition was Sutton Foster, Kelli O'Hara, Chita Rivera, and La Chanze, and I'm pretty sure the smart money was on La Chanze (who did indeed win), who besides not winning for "Once On This Island," had lost her husband five years earlier on 9/11. But otherwise, I agree that Patti had that "Broadway legend overdue for a second Tony" thing going on when she won for Gypsy - otherwise it would have gone to Kelli O'Hara in South Pacific, which she deserved a lot more than the one she got for The King and I.

...for playing Nellie Forbush as a white nationalist racist!

She played Nellie as written, which is indeed a racist. Did you actually see the show or read the script?

r59 what is wrong with you?

I hope THE PROM lasts through the summer. It's medium-good as musicals go but the positive impact it's having on LGBTQ kids and teens is very moving and, I think, important. And it's a great company.

Maybe they'll wait to see if it gets a bump once schools are out.

I don't know if the Outer Critics Circle Awards are an indication of anything to come but they really didn't like Oklahoma!, awarding it only Best Orchestrations. It lost Best Musical Revival to the Yiddish Fiddler, Daniel Fish lost to Rachel Chavkin and even Ali Stroker lost to Amber Gray.

As a matter of fact, Hadestown took most of their major awards including Best (Broadway) Musical, though Santino did win Best Musical Actor and Stephanie Block won Best Musical Actress..

Yet Emile killing a bully she had no qualms with whatsoever.

RIP Doris Day.

Even if you never did test your mettle on the Broadway boards.

Nellie has racial prejudices at the start of the show. Naturally, being from segregated Arkansas in the mid-20th century (e.g., Little Rock Nine). It's her metamorphosis. I hate this modern trend of thinking that if a movie/show features something negative, then it is promoting it. Or worse, they want every hero to be "all good" and the villains "all bad." No ambiguity. Very back and white thinking!

Exactly, R72. She can recognize her mother's prejudices but can't recognize them in herself until they are tested by her boyfriend having brown-skinned children.

Cynthia Erivo is everything that Patina Miller should have been.

Well, she sang and danced about it, r71..............

I'm going on vacation in a month (will be in NYC on Tonys weekend). Any likelihood of some early closures?

Back to Jackie Hoffman: I know a couple of people who have directed her and they say she is professional, pleasant, and funny. Most people who encounter her in other places seem to hate her.

R62 Do you lack reading comprehension skills? I said nothing of the sort. I merely said that the "overdue" (in quotes, because many people were saying that, not I) factor helped Patti in 2008. I remember people going on about how she was overdue, because it had been nearly 3 decades since her first win. It also helped her case that she didn't win for Sweeney Todd two years prior.

It's been so long since the 2006 Tony Awards, but I honestly don't remember LaChanze being the frontrunner. Like the film, The Color Purple musical also had 11 nominations and nearly went home empty-handed, as well, had it not been for LaChanze. When Best Actress in a Musical came up, I thought LuPone would take it at that point. Foster (Drowsy Chaperone) had recently won. Chita Rivera (Dancer's Life) was already a two-time winner and more recently than Patti. And Kelly O'Hara (Pajama Game) was just there, it seems, although I liked her.

TCP didn't get any Drama Desk Awards nods, either, though the 2015 revival did.

Fortunately for Oklahoma!, it won't be competing with FIDDLER at the Tonys.

I have only encountered her from the audience and it's always been consistent for me. I've hated her in everything I've ever seen her in.

Agreed re: 2006 Tonys. There was a definite possibility that Patti would win because Sweeney was a HUGE snob hit and everyone was talking about how Doyle had reinvented it, and Patti got the lion's share of praise, cast-wise, from reviewers. It wasn't a shoo-in for her, but she was definitely the frontrunner.

TCP was kind of middling. No one really gave much of a shit about it. In fact (as much as I hate to say it because I really dislike her), it was on its way to obscurity until Fantasia took over the lead role. All of a sudden, people saw the show in a new light. I think La Chanze winning was as much a fuck you to Patti as it was honoring a decent, but unspectacular performance.

I saw the Luis Miranda tweet, too, r63. They are shameless.

"there was nothing but Doris Day, 90 minutes of Doris Day. There was nothing to do but pray."

I wasn't watching or paying attention at the time -- Did Oprah go "full Rosie" (or "full Oprah," a la Beloved) in plugging Color Purple?

R63 oh, wow! Does he lack self-awareness? He must be surrounded by yes men.

Mary Testa is not well liked in the theatre community. She's respected as a dependable and talented performer, but she is not liked.

She works I guess, but not THAT much. In the last ten years she did a featured part in the most miscast shittest Guys & Dolls revival; she did the musical Michael John wrote for her where she went over Niagara Falls, she did a stint in Wicked and she did the St. Anne's Oklahoma which transferred. So yes, her work is steady and she is filling a type but I wouldn't say it's because she's beloved.

Ann without the E, thank you very much.

I've worked with Mary Testa a few times over the last 25 years and don't recall any dislike for her at all in our companies. I don't know what you're talking about, r86.

And I've only worked with Jackie Hoffman once, but again, don't recall any dislike from cast and crew. As a matter of fact, they all thought she was a hoot backstage.

There's a lot of unsubstantiated hate on this thread.

That original Color Purple production was really misguided by director Gary Griffin. As a matter of fact, I think it kind of ended what seemed to be a promising Broadway career.

Mary Testa basically plays the same character over and over

[quote]There's a lot of unsubstantiated hate on this thread.

Welcome to the Datalounge.

[quote]Mary Testa basically plays the same character over and over

That didn't hurt Nathan Lane's career.

But Nathan does it well.

Saw Yiddish Fiddler. Did not like the understudy Tevye. Bargain Basement choices

Mary Testa does not suffer fools. As I have mentioned previously, if you are an actor, she is a great Equity Deputy. If you are on the production side, she can make your life hell. When he watch alarm goes off, it is break time. Doesn't matter if you are in the middle of a number or not.

I don't get the "she plays the same character..." argument. Most good comedians do. Lucille Ball, Phyllis Diller, Gracie Fields, etc. weren't know for their vast range.

[quote]RIP Doris Day. Even if you never did test your mettle on the Broadway boards.

Oh, really?

R89, as a former Chicagoan, I can tell you Gary Griffin never had any talent. I guess the original TCP revealed that. He also frequently abused his position and made guys sleep with him to get roles.

Wow, Don Correia was sexy as hell.

R84 she co-produced it and the marquee even said "Oprah Winfrey presents The Color Purple." I didn't watch her talk show, so I don't know if she had the cast/production on there. I'm sure she did.

I remember thinking at the time, "Why isn't Whoopi more involved?" She wasn't on The View yet.

How come Don is doing a number from Over Here? He's not listed as having been in the cast.

To show everyone his pert ass r102.

I'm not complaining. : D

Don and Sandy's son is pretty cute, too.

And now an announcement from Eartha....

Please, Encores!, throw us a bone and do Over Here! Is it a great show? No, but it's a fun one. Perfect summer show.

I know Mary from the neighborhood. She has a big heart and is a diehard liberal and animal lover. But as was said above, she doesn't suffer fools. I'm sure she's a total pro onstage and backstage. For some reason she's become a DL target

R88

I get the feeling that Broadway isn't the catty, bitchy, toxic work environment that DL wishes it was. It is brutal and hard for women especially because there really are not enough roles and Broadway success no longer provides a springboard to higher paying regular work on Law & Order spin offs or 3 camera sit-coms.

In my experience, first hand horror stories from people working on Broadway almost always actually involve shocking shit they've seen audience members do, not trivial insults and perceived slights or rivalries happening back stage. No one is really getting unhinged over who is sleeping with who or messy divorces and paternity issues or whether the gay chorus boys are keeping themselves pretty enough but people do seriously have a passionate opinion about Trump banner wavers and that bitch in the third row with an ipad out illuminating her face.

And get Alice and Emily, r107.

R108, is she still on Jane Street?

Who's Jane Street, r111?

Does Santino get cast in "Take Me Out" next to prove he's really a guy?

R112 Reese?

[quote]For some reason she's become a DL target

you're new here aren't you? she's got the wrong chromosome, a vajay (presumably), and extra pounds, plus having talent, what's not to hate?

Mary is a cross-eyed ox. She's awful onstage. Always has been. That's where the hate comes from. But bores like R115 love to make themselves feel like they're doing something so they pretend it's because she's a woman.

[quote] I'm going on vacation in a month (will be in NYC on Tonys weekend). Any likelihood of some early closures?

NETWORK is closing June 8. Nothing else listed right now

I’m kind of glad we don’t hear that much about Patina Miller. Sister Act is something I couldn’t trouble myself with and I really didn’t think she was that special in Pippin. She was just sort of doing Lady Vereen. Cast her as a Hair soloist, sure, but I don’t think she’s all that great.

The Prom will be closed by the end of June.

r94 Ah I know that understudy. He is the sweetest guy but not nearly as experienced as S. Skybell. So sorry you missed Mr. Skybell.

I loves The Prom!

Patina just kinda came and went, didn't she?

didn't she have a baby

Who names their kid 'Patina'?

Love Life (finally) at Encores next year. You heard it here first!

Patina is a regular on the CBS series "Madam Secretary", which was just renewed. Broadway got her to where she wanted to be.

I think everyone knew about Love Life. Encores was waiting for the critical edition to be finished--now it is out there and getting produced in Europe, so this is not a surprise.

r111, she lives in The Village but not sure the exact street. Probably though, since I think she's lived in the same apartment for years. I know her from the dog run.

Well I'm sure if Mary is so well liked they'll give her a Tony for her completely charmless Aunt Eller.

Hadestown, worst piece of shit to ever get on Broadway

Sara Ramirez is another Broadway deserter currently on Madame Secretary.

Anyone with a public profile, no matter how slight, will collect enemies without having done anything to deserve it.

You don't have to be a politician. You can be an actor, a writer, a sports figure...anyone at all. Somehow, somebody hates you, often for no specific reason.

And some of those someones will eagerly invent lies to discredit you. Smears.

Like, for instance, Such and so was hated by the cast. Or this or that director has a casting couch. It can be totally invented, but unfortunately some people believe anything they hear and repeat it.

Ask anyone you know who's famous or well-known or even just slightly established in some public career. He or she will affirm this.

But it's not unique to DataLounge. This is what the world is like. If people have heard of you, you will have enemies, and they will lie about you.

[quote]Hadestown, worst piece of shit to ever get on Broadway

DL-ers have very short memories and a tendency toward hyperbole.

What about the recent Ruben & Clay's First Annual Christmas Show?

I'll see your Ruben & Clay show and raise you "Gettin' the Band Back Together."

Sara won the TONY in 2005, left "Spamalot" when her contract was up, and never looked back.

I see everything and raise you Merlin, with Doug Henning.

R132 speaks the truth. My friend is a very small scale actor and filmmaker who's a total sweetheart (you can ask anyone he's worked with) and one of our mutual acquaintances randomly started to smear him a few weeks ago because he didn't like a movie he made and has started saying he's an untalented hack to anyone who will listen, even going as far as to say all the positive reviews he's received have been bought (my friend, in typical indie filmmaker/actor fashion, is borderline poor, so I don't see how that's the case). Some people are just nuts.

That at least had Chita and wasn't Nathan Lane playing her son?

Yes, R139, but even they couldn't get that turkey off the ground.

R138 It's also called jealousy. Not only for actors and people in high profile kinds of professions, but there have been articles that folks are spending too much money trying to keep up with their friends (and the "Joneses") when folks post pictures of all their vacations, their perfect families, dinners etc. (which are only part of the real story). Those folks may be in debt as well. Another reason to avoid Facebook and Instagram, etc. I also try not to get into discussions of peoples' salaries; I never could understand why sports fans pay so much attention to those huge salaries some players make. Doesn't it just at heart make them jealous at the unfairness of getting so much money to get a ball through a hoop, or across a field, etc? Or to hear what the latest movie star is getting for their new film? Let them get what they can, but I'd rather not know, since how do it do me any good?

how "does" it do, I mean

[quote]I see everything and raise you Merlin, with Doug Henning.

Seriously?

[quote]Patina is a regular on the CBS series "Madam Secretary", which was just renewed.

Along with Mr. Stephanie J. Block.

Bring me the vagina of Patina!

[quote]Along with Mr. Stephanie J. Block.

Don’t forget stealth gay Eric Bergen!

[quote]how do it do me any good?

Hey kids! What time is it?

It’s Howdo Domee time!

[quote]Sara Ramirez is another Broadway deserter currently on Madame Secretary.

Where she’s playing some kind of trans something or other.

[quote]Who names their kid 'Patina'?

Hadestown, worst piece of shit to ever get on Broadway

DL-ers have very short memories and a tendency toward hyperbole. —Moose Murders, Gettin' the Band Back Together, Blonde in the Thunderbird . . .

obviously you haven't seen "Gary"

[quote]Agreed re: 2006 Tonys. There was a definite possibility that Patti would win because Sweeney was a HUGE snob hit and everyone was talking about how Doyle had reinvented it

I really enjoyed that production of "Sweeney" and was shocked when it lost the Tony for musical revival (I think to "The Pajama Game," if I remember correctly).

Having seen Doyle's "Company," by the time I saw "Sweeney" I was already tired of the gimmick of actors playing the instruments themselves. Once was enough.

R143, I’ll raise you a Bobbi Boland.

[quote]There was a definite possibility that Patti would win because Sweeney was a HUGE snob hit and everyone was talking about how Doyle had reinvented it

"Sweeney Todd" wasn't in need of reinvention.

[quote]Having seen Doyle's "Company," by the time I saw "Sweeney" I was already tired of the gimmick of actors playing the instruments themselves. Once was enough.

apparently once is not enough, it never stops

If The Pajama Game won that year it was because of the cast, Henry and Kelli, and they played it straight, without silly inventions

I liked it a lot.

R152 I believe Doyle's Sweeney preceded his Company by one year.

For bad shows, there was also "The Story of My LIfe",

I can see THE PROM and BEETLEJUICE shuttering around Labor Day. BE MORE CHILL won't make it through the summer.

Waitress and Beautiful won't get past Labor Day (unless Sara Bareilles and Carole King join their casts).

I'm seeing lots of theatre availability this fall.

Beetlejuice? I thought it was doing well?

Gavin Creel doing a month or so in Waitress was a little odd. Has Bareilles promised him a role in a new show or something?

Any word on Gavin Lee? My niece is his neighbor out in New Jersey...

Is Gavin Lee gay? I know he used to be married.

To the Mary Testa troll: I’ve known her for decades in a professional capacity. She is a smart, soulful, respectful actor held in high regard by her colleagues. You are attempting to assassinate her character with anonymous, baseless slurs; the purest cowardice. You are slime.

Who's assassinating her character? All they said was she is a stickler for union rules. She's a rotten performer, but that's hardly character assassination. It's merely fact.

R167, she’s fundamentally insecure and covers it with a veneer of sarcasm and surliness. It’s the oldest coping mechanism in the book and so common amongst salty character actresses. She’s harmless.

She’s been solidly wonderful in many shows over the years. She has a great vocal, and dramatic instrument. To call her a rotten exposes you as an ass.

Girls! Girls! I am woman enough for all of you!

[quote] She’s been solidly wonderful in many shows over the years. She has a great vocal, and dramatic instrument. To call her a rotten exposes you as an ass.

If your assessment of me is as accurate as your assessment of Mary Testa, I'm not losing any sleep.

Trust me, genius, if she were as rotten as you contend, it’s doubtful she’d be around as long as this, and lavished with as much praise. Sleep well,..

I’ve seen Mary Testa in four or five different shows. The best were Xanadu, where her natural inclination to go over the top and milk her laughs was not at odds with the material, and Wicked, where she was surprisingly disciplined as Madame Morrible. Her rep for bigggg comedy made her even creepier when she played against it as a villain. The worst was Guys and Dolls. Everyone stank in that production, but MT was especially embarrassing with some ill-chosen adlibs.

I did not see her over-Niagara-in-a-barrel turn. I will say one thing, her current blonde hair looks great on her.

I'm sure working, respected and frequently cast actress Mary Testa is CRUSHED that a couple cunty homos on a theatrical online bitch site are down on her.

Keeping her up nights, I'm sure.

I'm sure she's heaving a big sigh of relief, seeing as it took her ten years between her last show and Oklahoma.

Ok, my bad, Hadestown, one of the worst to make it to Broadway

... and win a Tony for Best Musical.

Hadestown is not particularly good, but even with that unlistenable score, it’s not in the hall of infamy of all time worst musicals, not even close.

r175, that is just a Trump-size lie.

[quote] Hadestown is not particularly good, but even with that unlistenable score, it’s not in the hall of infamy of all time worst musicals, not even close.

How bad are the worst if a show you yourself described as "unlistenable" isn't even close to the worst? Are we talking nails-on-a-chalkboard bad or just plain uninspired?

Hadestown second act is unbearable.

Score is typical of newer Broadway shows. R&H need not worry.

They ruined the rhyme by making it into a plural.

Nothing like the magnificence of this show and score! Should win thirteen Tonys, because it's so " Now."

[quote] Waitress and Beautiful won't get past Labor Day (unless Sara Bareilles and Carole King join their casts).

I saw BEAUTIFUL early in the run and really liked it. I got tickets for visiting friends and they all liked it. Then I went back to see it with a friend who had not seen it and HE liked it, but I thought it was just so-so. Maybe the replacements weren't as good as the originals, but the show just didn't seem as compelling the second time.

Unlike three of my all-time favorite shows, SOUTH PACIFIC, PACIFIC OVERTURES, and THE MOST HAPPY FELLA all of which I've seen multiple times and have been enthralled each time, I felt BEAUTIFUL was a one and done.

(Of Course, BEAUTIFUL has had more performances than any of those three shows, so what do I know?)

[quote]How bad are the worst if a show you yourself described as "unlistenable" isn't even close to the worst?

The awfulness of the Hadestown score is mitigated somewhat by the performances of Andre De Shields, Amber Grey, and Patrick Page. And Reeve Carney may be an iffy actor, but he sings well.

Into the Light, Doctor Jazz, The First, Bring Back Birdie, David Copperfield - those would be in my musical stinkers hall of fame.

What about original recipe Carrie?

Revamped recipe "Carrie" wasn't much better. The show still sucked. "Better" shouldn't be confused with "good."

I worked with Mary Testa once. I did not like her. She was rude, slightly nasty and unnecessarily difficult. I thought it was just me but others felt the same. I have heard similar stories from people who have worked and interacted with her. I am not assassinating her character I am sharing my experience with her, maybe others have had different experiences.

[quote]"Better" shouldn't be confused with "good."

Or "nice."

The Doyle gimmick worked much better in "Company" than it did in "Sweeney"

I know everyone here always laughs about the goings-on at ATC, but there is currently a very intense and fascinating debate about the intentions of the OKLAHOMA! box lunch social and whether or not the women who were auctioning off their "boxes" were expected to have sex with the winning bidders.

There are sooooooooooo many reasons to avoid ATC r193. Thanks for adding another.

R193 are people really that stupid? This is what happens when you try to inject modern issues into a period piece.

But even DOCTOR JAZZ had the astonishing Elgin Clockwork s dance, BRING BACK BIRDIE had Well, I'm Not, and DAVID COPPERFIELD had the heartrending With The One I Love in Act Two. Any one of those musical moments is superior to nearly everything heard on Broadway in the last decade. The amateurs have taken over the asylum.

Plus, as awful as Carrie was, half its score was just ravishing. Everything Carrie and Mrs. White sang was beautiful, and way better than most we've heard in recent years. Hell, I'd even put up any of the bad songs from Carrie against the score of Tootsie. Yazbek wishes anything in that shit score even came close to "It's a simple little gig, you help me kill a pig."

Her name was Lola....

I saw the original Carrie, loved it

[quote] Yazbek wishes anything in that shit score even came close to "It's a simple little gig, you help me kill a pig."

Who wouldn't envy such brilliant lyric-writing?

Have you heard "The Red Blues"? "Bianca"? "We Sing of Love"? "The Ritz Roll and Rock"? Cole could write some real stink bombs.

My first theatrical experience seeing Mary Testa was as Dominia in "A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Forum". I know she got some bad notices for it, but I thought she was very amusing. She was great as Maggie Jones in "42nd Street" (second Tony nom.), and I was surprised by her choices for "Guys & Dolls". Pairing her with Jackie Hoffman in "Xanadu" must have been a mouth dropper for some people (they both play "big"), and it was ironic when Jackie took on Madame Dilly in "On the Town", the role for which Mary got her first Tony nomination. I saw a video of the 1996 production and saw the revival twice. I never liked "On the Town" until the revival, and would have to re-visit the 1996 version to re-judge it.

Mary and Jackie are throwbacks to the great character actresses of the golden age like Marilyn Cooper, Jane Connell, Marcia Lewis, Ruth Kobart, Mary McCarty and Patsy Kelly, and more recently, Andrea Martin (another former Madame Dilly). I've never met either Jackie or Mary, but have seen them in multiple things, and what they do on stage always lingers in my memory. They are bigger than life and honor a Broadway tradition of character performers going back to Fanny Brice, Bea Lillie and Sophie Tucker. I'm not much interested in the new "Oklahoma!" (I will see it if I can manage to get a discount), as it doesn't seem worth Broadway prices. Andrea Martin and Mary Wickes' performances as Aunt Eller linger in my memory, and a friend got to see Margaret Hamilton in that part.

None of them could do Charlotte Greenwood's kicks though! If you can't wait, they start around 1:20

I'd give anything to have seen Greenwood in OUT OF THIS WORLD.

R204 Andrea Martin does a very funny version of "Nobody's Chasing Me" on the Encores cast album, but they changed the lyric from "The cock is chasing the chicken" to "The rooster's chasing the chicken". "I Sleep Easier Now" is very funny as well.

Wasn't Charlotte Greenwood the first choice to play Aunt Eller in the Broadway "Oklahoma!"?

Higher....

[quote] Yazbek wishes anything in that shit score even came close to "It's a simple little gig, you help me kill a pig."

[quote] Who wouldn't envy such brilliant lyric-writing?

Datalounge may be a little too difficult for you, sweets.

The OK! producing team is hoping you don't notice that after all this hype, their grosses went down last week. I predict like Be More Chill, it will be gone by Labor Day. Every civilian I know who has seen it pretty much hated it. I found it unbelievably misguided and pretentious.

Fuck off, moron at R208.

[quote]Every civilian I know who has seen it pretty much hated it.

Did they say why they hated it?

I know nobody who has any interest in "Be More Chill". Just the title alone gives them the shingles. I saw "The Prom" for a second time at the Saturday matinee. The house was practically full, and the reception was just phenomenal. Beth & Brooks get huge cheers for their second act numbers and rousing applause at the end. I'm sure it's a great triumph for Beth who was completely wasted in "Bandstand" and since "Drowsy Chaperone" hasn't had a long run. I'd like to see at least one of them take home a Tony, but unless there's some miracle, I doubt that will happen. Hoping it at least continues through the summer to make it to a year long run (at least!).

"Every civilian I know who has seen it pretty much hated it."

have we surveyed the military?

I could see men in uniform really liking it

[quote] Fuck off, moron at [R208].

Sorry, it bears repeating.

[quote] Yazbek wishes anything in that shit score even came close to "It's a simple little gig, you help me kill a pig."

[quote] Who wouldn't envy such brilliant lyric-writing?

[quote] Datalounge may be a little too difficult for you, sweets.

They hated it because there is no emotion, no humor, no romance and a dark directorial vision that is both boring and silly.

At least they didn't call it "Be More Woke".

Or Woke-lahoma!

Theatre report from last week in New York.

I saw in chronological order and in order of preference: Sophocles, written by Tim Blake Nelson and starring the brilliant actor, Michael Stuhlbarg as Socrates; Network starring Brian Cranston who is hilarious and the play moves quickly and professionally, but not many performances of note besides Brian; Hillary and Clinton, which I was unimpressed with and wasn't stimulated by the points they were trying to make, that Clinton is a narcissist and Hillary is a doormat. Then, the play I was most looking forward to, King Lear, which I know and love, with Glenda Jackson as Lear. We left at intermission before the deaths to save our frazzled nerves, but I would say that reviewers captured it well when calling it a "muddled mess." Scott Rudin, the producer, will not allow plastic water bottles in the theatre. Nothing that crinkles!

Now, Socrates is the best acted play I have ever seen. Michael Stuhlbarg's portrayal of Socrates is fascinating and surprising as Michael uses his voice, hands, facial expressions in such inventive ways. Most of the rest of the large cast were fantastic as well, and worked as an energetic and cohesive ensemble.

Has anyone here seen Socrates? It's at the Public Theatre. Bonus points if you know the other movies Michael has been in. One will unfortunately not see the light of the projector: Gore, where Michael plays Gore Vidal's long time lover, and Kevin Spacey plays Gore, so it is on the rehab shelf.

"Nothing that crinkles!"

So Scott won't let in the faces of the NYC society women?

I saw the very loooong first act to Sophocles. Stuhlbarg was fine but I hated it with every ounce of my being and would have left after 15 minutes if I could have.

Lol Wokelahoma

Oklahoma will win the Tony for Best Revival, which may help it somewhat, but what is not helping it is that most people do not like it. Yes, there are a committed group of people who feel transformed by it or whatever, but the majority of people I know either loathed it with passion or we're indifferent. The key to a successful revival of a classic is that different generations can enjoy it. Bring your granny and teenager, etc. I am not sure that I would recommend it to my children or parents.

R186 I saw Bring Back Birdie AND Copperfield in the same month and somehow lived to tell the tale. The level of BBB - Albert and Rose are trying to find Conrad after many years. They meet a fat small town mayor who is no help. As they start to leave, the Mayor burps and they recognize the burp as that of Conrad! Not since Moliere... (And Copperfield was worse. Or at least duller.)

Where do you think Joe Iconis lands after this season? After years of being touted as the next big thing and a blockbuster Off Broadway run of Be More Chill, it's not going swimmingly on Broadway, although he is the only Be More Chill Tony nomination in an easier category.

R220, thanks! I forgot that I fell asleep about 30 times during the first act, but had a reviving cup of coffee at intermission and I was enthralled thereafter.

Icon is has another show, Broadway Bounty Hunter, that the same producers of BMC will be foisted in NYC soon with the hope of transfer to Broadway. I’m sure they will be just as deluded about the new show as they were about BMC.

How is King Kong doing?

He's fine He sends his love.

Marry Me, r228

Broadway has become the new platform for pedestrian writing talents to fail upwards.

I think we're entering a Dark Age on Broadway. We'll have a renaissance down the road. Hopefully in my lifetime.

Who are the composers who will take us into the next decade on Broadway? Tom Kitt? Scott Frankel? Matthew Sklar?

All of the above, I suppose. I'm still hoping for more from Guettel.

And I've about given up on the Bunuel project.

Frankel is in his late 50s.

Everyone I know under 50 loved this Oklahoma!

Me and everyone over 50 loathed it.

It's definitely a generational thing.

It may be easier to love if you didn't grow up with the original. I admired the inventiveness behind it, and I liked some of the performances, and I'm glad I saw it-- but I didn't love it.

And I'm way over 50.

[quote]It may be easier to love if you didn't grow up with the original.

Also, young people have a tendency to follow trends. If someone says something is cool, a throng of teens/twetysomethings will flock to it or will want it and will even say they liked it. These days, anything "woke" is considered cool in young circles, regardless of quality.

All this talk about the sorry state theater is in (most especially Broadway, but Off-Bway is practically non-existent outside of non-profit), can one particular thing be pointed at for the demise? If the AIDS crisis hadn't killed off so many creatives, as well as the audiences who appreciated the kinds of shows that were staples of NY theater up through the early 90s, could that kind of theater have survived alongside jukebox musicals and movie to musical adaptations only for the sake of the brand? Or has the internet developed the current audience of theatergoers (i.e. tourists)?

The current musical writers and composers- did they lose the influence or mentorship of talented writers and directors and producers with the deaths of so many artists? Or can that argument be made at all considering the number of revivals that occur on Broadway of actual great work?

I know- big Broadway chorus boy cock. But stuff like the above really makes me wonder. I'd love to hear what others think. Theory away!

Isn't it Chorus Line that has the line something like "I don't want to hear about Broadway being dead. I just got here!"

Do you supposed this Oklahoma! will be licensed to schools/community theater? I read the other day that it's going on a national tour.

[quote]They hated it because there is no emotion, no humor, no romance and a dark directorial vision that is both boring and silly.

So no emotions were expressed onstage and it's simultaneously humorless and silly?

Pick an opinion and stick with it, hon.

Something can be silly without being humorous.

And now I can't find the video, but Ali Stoker singing "I Cain't Say No" is remarkably non-humorless.

But you do you, non-emotional humorless silly person.

Who made you the arbiter of all things humorous?

[quote] And now I can't find the video, but Ali Stoker singing "I Cain't Say No" is remarkably non-humorless.

Are you talking about the Tonight Show performance?

Does anyone (even here) think Celeste Holm was any funnier singing "I Cain't Say No"?

Ali was utterly charming in performance. Laugh out loud funny, no, but very adorable and sexy.

I loved Celeste Holm. I also thought Ali was charming in performance, but execrable on that YouTube clip.

Am I the only one who didn't like Oklahoma before all the woke bullshit? This new production sounds awful and ridiculous, but I've never understood the love for this show in general.

Big uproar on ATC -- dramedy tried to make a joke by calling Kelli O'Hara a whore -- saying in the message that she had good chemistry with all her leading men. it's a bad joke, but then again he doesn't call himself "comedy".

I can’t imagine Wokelahoma playing well on tour. This production only makes sense to me in Manhattan. I can’t imagine people wanting a nice night at the theater in smaller areas will respond well to a show that looks like a rehearsal.

R238: Skyrocketing rents also had a lot to do with the lack of available theatres for off-Broadway shows. I'd guess a lot of them are Walgreens now.

R195, the script of Oklahoma is pretty much the same so there is nothing to license that is different other than the orchestration.

The real change is the direction, and that is not copyrightable under US law. So while this production is likely to be imitated, there is not anything in the staging that could be licensed.

In point of fact, not a single word in the "Oklahoma" book has been changed.

Direction is copyright protected under US law. You clearly don't know what you're talking about.

[quote]In point of fact, not a single word in the "Oklahoma" book has been changed.

Not completely true. A few lines in the scene of Jud's murder have been changed and/or cut. But, other than that, you are correct.

R254, that is not true. In the Gary Griffin case, it was his alterations to the text that sunk him, not his theft of staging.

And in the Joe Mantello case, it was settled out of court. The scenic designer did win however, since that is covered.

But to date, there has not been any US court that recognized copyright protection of a theatrical director's work.

I'm so grateful to have seen the 1979 revival of Oklahoma! Despite the new sets and costumes (which were quite nice) the production used the original Russell Bennett orchestrations and Gemze de Lappe carefully recreated De Mille's original choreography. With a wonderful cast.

And here's my OH MARY! moment. When I sat down and opened my Playbill, I saw that the production was being conducted by Jay Blackton, who had conducted not only the original Broadway production but also the film. I felt like I had gone to Bayreuth and realized Wagner's Ring was being conducted by Hans Richter, The Ring's first conductor.

Oklahoma!, Broadway, 1979:

^^^ Weirdly enough, there are a few websites that claim directors are protected by copyright. But they are wrong. The SDC has been fighting for this for decades and still has made no headway.

Oklahoma!, 1979 Broadway revival, Out of My Dreams and the Dream Ballet. Other clips from that production easily found by following links from the page.

Oklahoma!, The University of North Carolina School of the Arts production from just a few years ago. This was an attempt to completely recreate the original production in terms of sets, costumes, orchestrations, choreography, etc. Conducted by John Mauceri with the choreography again recreated by De Mille acolyte Gemze de Lappe. Largely successful but not completely. Some of the material is beyond the scope of the wonderfully talented but very young college cast. This is Act One. Act Two is linked on the page.

Was that Christine Andreas in that Many a New Day clip? She sounds quite different than the (sublime) cast recording performance.

I'm late to the thread, but I loved Patina Miller's performance in Pippin.

Patina Miller gave Ben Vereen’s performance in Pippin.

Yep, r261. The great cast of that revival was Andreas (they had to change Jud's lyric of "her long yeller hair" to "her long wavy hair"; Laurence Guittard as Curly (a slightly weaker performance); Christine Ebersole at her very best as Ado Annie; Harry Groener a great Will; Mary Wickes the perfect Aunt Eller; and Martin Vidnovic a chilling Jud Fry. You couldn't have heard the proverbial pin drop during Vidnovic's and Andreas' smokehouse scene, it was so tense. Not before or since have I ever seen that scene scare an audience so much.

Why did the 1979 Oklahoma! only get two Tony nominations?

New Yorkers can keep this bastardization of a classic. The rest of the world is too smart to fall for the pretentiousness. New Yorkers can look at it, say they like it, and consider themselves sophisticated.

Who knows, r265? It was directed by Oscar's son James Hammerstein.

That production and the early 90's Hytner revival of Carousel at Lincoln Center really made me revise my feelings about the R&H canon, which I mainly knew from the well sung but weakly acted and Bowdlerized film versions. Those shows can be extremely effective pieces of theater, not just 1940s folk operetta.

Could have heard the proverbial pin drop, not couldn't, during the smokehouse scene. Sorry.

Someone on BroadwayWorld said that during the "Dance Ballet" someone actually scoots their rear across the floor like a dog?

Are you talking about the Dream Ballet in the current Oklahoma revival. r269?

I've read that the Ballet has been moved from the end of Act I to the opening of Act II and that the climactic moment is when a bunch of boots drop from the ceiling suspended by chains.

R&H originally conceived the ballet as some sort of circus dream, à la Lady in the Dark. de Mille, without consulting them, took it much more seriously and staged it as a young woman's exploration of her sexuality and rehearsed her dancers downstairs in the theater with dance arranger Trude Rittman at the piano expanding on Rodgers' melodies. Eventually someone went to Rodgers and said:

"I think you better go check out what Agnes is doing in the basement."

[quote]The great cast of that revival was Andreas (they had to change Jud's lyric of "her long yeller hair" to "her long wavy hair"; Laurence Guittard as Curly (a slightly weaker performance); Christine Ebersole at her very best as Ado Annie; Harry Groener a great Will; Mary Wickes the perfect Aunt Eller; and Martin Vidnovic a chilling Jud Fry. You couldn't have heard the proverbial pin drop during Vidnovic's and Andreas' smokehouse scene, it was so tense. Not before or since have I ever seen that scene scare an audience so much.

I believe the lyric was actually changed to "long raven hair" for that 1979 revival. I believe the current, horrendous production changes it to "long wavy hair," presumably because Laurey is played by an African-American, and no one would ever refer to an African-American as having "raven hair." (This actor doesn't have an Afro, so I guess "wavy hair" was the best they could do.) And I agree with you about that Jud and Laurey scene between Andreas and Vidnovic, but that scene does not take place in the smokehouse, it takes place at the Skidmore ranch, where party happens in Act II.

[quote]That production and the early 90's Hytner revival of Carousel at Lincoln Center really made me revise my feelings about the R&H canon, which I mainly knew from the well sung but weakly acted and Bowdlerized film versions.

Some of those film versions are deeply flawed, namely CAROUSEL and SOUTH PACIFIC. But OKLAHOMA! and THE KING AND I are not "weakly acted," and those two aren't severely "bowdlerized," either.

[quote]I've read that the Ballet has been moved from the end of Act I to the opening of Act II and that the climactic moment is when a bunch of boots drop from the ceiling suspended by chains.

Not quite. A bunch of boots do drop from the ceiling, but they are not suspended by chains :-) They all just fall onto the stage, making loud "thud" noises. Total bullshit.

Don't start that insanity again, R159. You take every weak opportunity to dump on "The Story of My Life" and it's a super touching show with a fantastic score.

[quote]Are you talking about the Dream Ballet in the current Oklahoma revival. [R269]?

Yes. Jordan Catalano mentioned it on the Oklahoma! review thread. I'm a lurker and not a member so can't post.

[quote]Has anyone here seen Socrates?

He was here five minutes ago, but left with Kelly.

The Story of My Life is quite a turkey. That absurd butterfly song stinks to high heaven.

Tony Awards 2019: Who Will Win (and Who Should):

r277, "Tony Awards 2019: Who Will Win (and Who Cares)"?

If Glenn plays Max in yet another revival of Sunset would she be eligible? Looking for silver lining for my “buddy”..

Christine Andreas should have changed her name. She was forever doomed to exist in the shadow of you know whom.

Speaking of names, it's typical of this benighted site that people yammer on and on about stuff without even knowing what it is called. FYI, peeps, it's SOCRATES at the Public, not SOPHOCLES -- two different men altogether. And Michael Stuhlbarg is magnificent in it. (Extra props for pronouncing his surname correctly without having to ask him.)

I recently tried to watch the production of Oklahoma with Hugh Jackman, and it was my first exposure to the show (outside of single songs I've heard from it). Never saw the movie or anything. I was bored stiff and couldn't make it through.

Why does Ben Brantley always include off-Broadway shows in his "should have been nominated" category? Does he not understand the concept of "should have been?"

It was only the one poster who mentioned the long first act who got the title wrong as Sophocles. All the other mentions correctly labeled it “Socrates.”

[quote]Christine Andreas should have changed her name. She was forever doomed to exist in the shadow of you know whom.

No, we don’t know who you mean. In whose shadow is Andreas doomed to exist?

[quote]If Glenn plays Max in yet another revival of Sunset would she be eligible? Looking for silver lining for my “buddy”..

She’s had plenty of Tony Award silver linings, unlike some people.

The picture at r277 looks like Tony Geary and Beto O’Rourke

No point in correcting anything or anyone here. For instance, no matter how many times one points out that it's Ali Stroker, some illiterate goon insists on calling her Ali Stoker -- and then insulting her in the bargain. What a world, eh?

I am also trying to figure out whose shadow Christine Andreas lives under.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-4uKgXRnpI

Slave Play was the worst piece of garbage I have seen in many years. I went to see Paul Nolan naked ( glorious, I might add) and had to sit through the entire mess until the end when he revealed himself. If it ever sees the light of day again and you have the chance to go - do so, only if you are a member of the SJWs, who subscribe to the idea that no matter what a white person says or does, he/she is always inherently racist. That's it; there is no more.

I also liked SOCRATES, and Stuhlbarg is giving one of the great performances of the year. For my money, it could have been 20 minutes shorter, but ultimately it was a terrific experience. I wish I had boned up a bit more on my classical lit, but it's entirely accessible without that prep.

We need a new Sondheim or Andrew Lloyd Weber show

Saw the last Oklahoma! revival with two of my favorites: Patrick Wilson and Andrea Martin. Even they could not save this dated and boring show.

Bat Out Of Hell: The Musical playing City Center August 1 through September 8. Is Broadway next? Will critics be kind? Will audiences care?

I have a feeling we're not going to get the new Sondheim. And is ALW still active?

Its Webber, not Weber ,,,, jesus h christ !

ALW is writing a modern SJW Cinderella with the Everbody’s Talking About Jamie writers.

I think we've seen that "Next to Normal" was sort of the best Tom Kitt is ever going to give. Everything since has been functional at best. The off-Broadway thing with Baldwin was a serious disaster, and made me wonder if Kitt is a better arranger than he is composer. It was just plain bad.

I saw Bat Out of Hell in London. It’s got to be one of the worst things ever put on a stage. I’m shocked that Jim Steinman approved that trash.

Totally agree, r248

R299, If I am not mistaken, he wrote it. I believe it is a reworking of a musical he wrote back in his Public Theater days.

Do Tom Kitt and Brian Yorkey not work together anymore?

Kitt did the Dear Evan Hansen rip off Superhero without Yorkey and Yorkey did the Sting show without Kitt.

I wonder if they are better together than apart?

R290 why are they so fucking tone-deaf?

[quote]No, we don’t know who you mean. In whose shadow is Andreas doomed to exist?

Veteran porn star Pedro Andreas, of course.

Can someone explain why Moulin Rouge and Frankie and Johnny didn't open a few weeks earlier so they could have been Tony eligible? Seems like rather poor choices.

R280 no excuse, but my shame in not noticing the auto correct for Socrates at R218.

I'm glad you enjoyed Michael Stuhlbarg's performance. I think he's the greatest.

R306 the greatest what?

R307, chiropractor, Rose.

With Moulin Rouge!, the producers assumed King Kong (another of their shows) was going to be a contender. Frankie and Johnny really *could* have squeezed in.

Please say you're joking, r297

I always loves Christine Andreas' voice. It wasn't like your typical shrill soprano. There was some grit behind it. Oklahoma has never been one of my favorite shows, though. I wouldn't want to see it re-staged to resemble the original production and I certainly don't want to see it totally stripped down like it is right now. Hell, the only semi-enjoyable things about the show are the lush orchestrations, sets, and costumes.

I enjoy the score of "Oklahoma", but when seeing the (traditional) staging or movie, I only really enjoy the book scenes of Ado Annie, Will and Ali Hakim. Laurey's such a bitch, Curley's rather passive-aggressive toward Jud, and Jud doesn't deserve all the tzuris he gets from them.

I was going to ask about Ebersole in On the Twentieth Century. This is all I've found. She seems, on paper anyway, to have been a perfect choice.

I don't like her vibrato, r311.

An extinct bid has come back from the dead--it's in the news. Maybe the Dodo will be next, in honor of Doris Day! That was one of her nicknames, you know.

and by "bid" you mean "bird," yes?

Yes, darling!

Frankie and Johnny is having serious ticket selling trouble. It's hard to be in previews and building momentum when all the press and audience attention is on the last season's shows.

Even with Audra?

Audra is not an attraction when she isn't singing.

For me, I am focused on seeing as many of the Tony nominated shows as I can. Consider that 10 of them opened in April alone. Not to mention there's a ton of non profit theater right now that I'm interested in. I figure I'll see Frankie and Johnny this summer after everything closes. Plus, I've seen Audra on stage a thousand times.

R312 God forbid the protagonists be unlikable or even morally ambiguous.

You can also see the last production of "Frankie and Johnny" at TOFT Lincoln Center (unless they've been told to keep it unaccessible while the current production is on Broadway), where you can see Stanley Tucci naked, as well as Edie Falco (musn't forget our lesbian friends here).

R322 If you want to sit through a story of basically will Curley or won't Curley take Laurey to the box social for three hours, be my guest. I'm more rewarded by listening to the OCR.

"In whose shadow is Andreas doomed to exist?"

Me, bitches

Concerning last night's episode of "Fosse/Verdon". Did anyone notice how attractive all those men were in the chorus of the "Chicago" rehearsal? One thing I specifically remember from the original production was how downright average and/or homely some of those male dancers were. They were terrific dancers, but my 21 year old self wouldn't have fucked any of them with even paper bags on their heads. I figured it was a Fosse "thing", since he seemed to be more interested in beautiful women than good looking men.

To be fair, men's fashion was very ugly in the '70s. Very few men looked good in retrospect.

[quote] I'm still hoping for more from Guettel.

Why would he bother? Now that Mother Mary is dead and with no kids to worry about, he can lie back and wipe his ass with $100 bills if he wants to.

By all accounts, Guettel, while finally clean and sober, still fights a lot of demons, and he can't really focus on anything for any amount of time. He starts and abandons promising projects so often, so that collaborators and producers don't bother any more. Even LCT which has basically been controlled by R&H for the past decade, has given up trying to work with him. He's constantly jetting off around the world for "rest." Sad, because he is talented. But the narcissism, and the privilege and the demons are just too much.

What demons does he have?

He pulled no punches on Twitter during the Kavanaugh confirmation hearing (he was pro- ) and was seriously dragged for his opinions. After that, he shuttered all his social media accounts.

Guettel just did a very starry top-secret reading of his newest work. ALW is working with David Zippel on the Cinderella project.

Very happy to hear that (Guettel, not ALW).

Does Adam Guettel financially benefit from the Rodgers and Hammerstein catalog still?

the script of Oklahoma is pretty much the same so there is nothing to license that is different other than the orchestration."

The entire psychological component of the dance elements in Oglaucoma!, intrinsic to the script, have been excised or bowdlerized. And let's not even talk about tone or intention.

Ogclacoma is treatable if caught early enough.

"If you want to sit through a story of basically will Curley or won't Curley take Laurey to the box social for three hours..."

The same silly and lame reduction that's been said by pundits for 70+years. If you haven't figured out that there's an underlying metaphor and subtext that's kept it resonant for audiences all that time, well, I can't help you.

What is the metaphor and subtext, please? Seriously.

I saw the OK revival with Patrick Wilson. Although he was rather nice to look at, I was bored out of my mind. I missed the metaphor and subtext, too, R338. Without even trying to remember the story, I could make shit up like how the old way of life was changing, and how our perception of people is not always correct, etc, but I would just be looking for something that I don't is really there. So..what is the metaphor and subtext, please?

r298 who told Kitt he could write lyrics? Superhero's words were way more atrocious than its tunes

R340 could you give us a sample?

R339, hopefully the poster will return with the metaphor and subtext. Unless it's someone with a parody of the pretentious NYC theater queen. I really am curious.

The corn is as high as an elephant's eye is a nice metaphor, but overall you can tack on whatever you want about the show's overall metaphor. Basically it's about that darn box social and all the trouble it cause. Sue me if I'd rather listen to the score than see the show and if I'd rather watch "My Fair Lady", for example.

Nah, it's just apparel. Quite a few male dancers of that time looked like science teachers, complete with pronounced bald spots. I'm judging by old TV clips, though.

*It's not just apparel.

Guetell is still drinking.Which is good because his new musical is "The Days of Wine and Roses"

It's Guettel.

Renée Fleming and Dove Cameron in the piazza. Yea or nay?

absolutely not renee fleming. oy.

r346 can't spell Guettel but knows he's drinking. Right-o.

Dove Cameron is fantastic. She should be a bigger star.

Dove's original nose was fine. It's a rotten industry.

Finally, an interesting rock artist is coming to Broadway. Announcement later this week, I hear...

Dove's fine. Fleming's not.

Just saw the latest London ORPHEUS DESCENDING -- Seth Numrich wonderful YET AGAIN -- why is he not a bigger star? The rest of it not so great, alas. Vanessa Redgrave's shadow looms large.

Does Numrich tend to look like this? He's probably only skinny fat here but that's almost worse at his age.

Huh? Can you rephrase the question?

He seems to be more concerned about Seth's weight than his talent, apparently.

Patty Duke was extraordinary as Aunt Eller in the revival a few years ago. Like Reba she deserved a replacement Tony.

Are we pretending that looks play no part in stardom?

R302 gets extra credit for quoting “Magic Moment” In his comment about Kitt and Yorkey.

[quote]Its Webber, not Weber ,,,, jesus h christ !

Actually, it’s Lloyd Webber, not Webber. Lloyd isn’t his middle name, it’s part of his unhyphenated last name.

Ohhhh glaucoma

Where the mist comes right across your eyes!

Rock artist= oxymoron

[quote]Does Adam Guettel financially benefit from the Rodgers and Hammerstein catalog still?

He still gets royalties off the songs & shows, but he no longer has a piece of the company. Well, actually, he never did. Mary and Linda gave that up for them and their heirs when they approved the original sale to Imagem.

Back in my distant youth I always thought Oklahoma! to be incredibly corny and dull. The 1979 revival completely turned that around for me.

I'm also a big fan of the Hugh Jackman London video (and I don't even like Hugh Jackman.) Somehow or other that production lost all its energy and magic when it moved to Broadway a few years later.

You couldn't get me to this new production with a cattle prod.

Y'know, in case anybody was wondering.

"The corn is as high as an elephant's eye is a nice metaphor..."

It's not a nice metaphor, since it's a simile. Still waiting for the subtext and real metaphor.

[quote] Somehow or other that production lost all its energy and magic when it moved to Broadway a few years later.

r366 the word was that Trevor Nunn wasn't available on the schedule they built for NY so he was barely there. They put it up as a copy but it was never really directed. It was so deadly. Also some drama over casting Wilson vs some other choices not sure they made the right one

Since Jackman had turned the NY run down (because he was already heating up in film), who else was a choice for Curley besides Patrick Wilson?

On paper Patrick Wilson would seem a great choice. He's handsome, masculine, can sing and act, but I don't know what it is. Lack of star power or presence? Something just doesn't add up.

Mary and Linda Rodgers actually were on the hunt for a sale, and Imagem gave them the best deal. I don't know the reasons, but I suspect since they were both elderly at that point, they were tired of the hassle of overseeing the company (which, officially, they still did, even though Ted Chapin ran the company and had sole decision power over many major issues.) They also knew that, without major copyright law changes, the era that their heirs faced would see many copyrights expiring. They got a huge deal, took the money, and ran.

where the hell is Roger bart?

He was just on The Good Fight a couple of weeks ago, r372, although it was a surprisingly small part. I think his career is pretty much all tv/film these days.

Roger Bart is basically a stock player at FreeForm these days.

R367 Similes have the word "like" in them.

R375, even someone of limited understanding can recognize that the words "like" and "as" share the same function.

This was a good attempt at playing stupid, but no one is ever stupid in the way that you pretended to be.

Patti didn't deserve a Tony for "Sweeney Todd", her tuba however.....

[quote]What is the metaphor and subtext, please? Seriously.

The metaphor and subtext of OKLAHOMA! is about people maturing and learning to live together as a community. Although the show is of course not as deep as CAROUSEL, it's not so shallow as some people make out, and it's not fair to say that it's "about a picnic," any more than it would be fair to say that CAROUSEL is "about a clambake."

[quote]Any word on Gavin Lee? My niece is his neighbor out in New Jersey...

He is going to be the Candelabra at Paper Mill next month.

"The Prom" may not win the Tony, it will however be a movie and "Tootsie The Movie Musical" will never be.

R372 I believe the line is "Who the hell is Margie Hart?"

Or, if it's "The House of Mirth: The Musical," it's "What a gas, it's Lily Bart!"

Did Doris Day turn down the film South Pacific?

R362: Yes, it's Lloyd Webber, but after he was made a lord, usage decreed that his name be hyphenated.

It's really a technicality, as no one seems to use it. But in actuality he is now Lord Lloyd-Webber.

[quote]He pulled no punches on Twitter during the Kavanaugh confirmation hearing (he was pro- ) and was seriously dragged for his opinions.

Interesting. Is Guettel a Republican? Or worse, a Trump supporter?

[quote]Did Doris Day turn down the film South Pacific?

I had always heard that she was asked to audition for it, and she refused. At that point in her career, she figured everyone already knew what she could do.

They turned Doris down, since she wouldn't informally audition at a party.

I think there was also concern that her personality would overwhelm the material.

If she wouldn't informally audition at a party, it sounds like she turned them down.

I loved ‘Oklahoma!’ (and I’m over 50). The big revelation for me was hearing the score with the simpler arrangements for the seven piece country band. Those song never sounded better, though Daunno is the only excellent singer. You could hear every lyric clear as a bell too. Speaking of Damon Daunno, he looks sexy in some pics, homely in others and he’s as skinny as a wraith. But when he sings those love songs while playing his guitar and swinging his hips, he’s damn sexy.

And why have none of the critics mentioned how homoerotic the Curley/Jud scene in the smokehouse is? It’s played breathily in the dark as a gay seduction. Not complaining — it gets lonely on the prairie — but I’m surprised it hasn’t been written about more often.

While the oval stage with the audience all around works wonderfully well for this show, I could have done without the community hall decor, the gimmick of serving out chili and cornbread (no, I didn’t have any, I wouldn’t be caught dead) and the blindingly bright lighting (I’m over 50 remember). But maybe the latter helps the audience to bond with the actors and production.

The one thing I absolutely loathed was the modernized ‘dream ballet.’ In truth, I have never cared for the Agnes DeMille one either. I always find it obvious, pretentious, endless. Well, this one is all those things as well as completely senseless and unintelligible. Plus it goes on for 18 minutes! Really dreadful.

But this production seduced me, I really loved it.

Re: Doris Day and “South Pacific” the official story was always that Day had to choose between that and “Pajama Game” because they were scheduled to shoot at the same time, and she chose the latter. But it’s hard to believe that Logan wouldn’t wait for a star as big as Day. But supposedly Doris’s husband and manager Marty Melcher was a crook who expected a kickback and too large a percentage of the gross for delivering Day, and as Logan was difficult (and bipolar) himself and in no mood to placate Melcher, that deal went south and Logan went for the more docile (and much less talented) Mitzi Gaynor, who had been goodish in the underrated “Les Girls.”

I never knew this, but just read that Doris was offered Mrs. Robinson in The Graduate.

Doris played the mother in "Please Don't Eat the Daisies", "The Thrill of It All", "With Six You Get Eggroll" and on her tv series (at least for the first years before the kids were written out), so I wonder why maybe she didn't want to go back to movies to play the mom of teenager or older kids? I guess going to tv back then, like Shirley Jones expressed when she did "Partridge Family", kind of meant your movie career was over. But Doris could have come back playing some older Moms, aunts, etc. had she wanted to. I guess she figured 39 films was enough.

Oklahoma and The Sound of Music should both be retired from all venues.

Doris turned down Mrs. Robinson because it "went against her values."

She could have done "Hello, Dolly!".

[quote]Patti didn't deserve a Tony for "Sweeney Todd", her tuba however.....

Please don't bring that up. I still have PTSD from being blown by Patti.

[quote] Re: Doris Day and “South Pacific” the official story was always that Day had to choose between that and “Pajama Game” because they were scheduled to shoot at the same time, and she chose the latter. But it’s hard to believe that Logan wouldn’t wait for a star as big as Day.

I've never heard anything but the story of Doris not wanting to sing for Dick Rodgers, and it turned him off to her (that and the tentative demands Marty was floating, as you pointed out, which had already raised red flags). But in any event, the story you heard is neither official nor true. The Pajama Game filmed from Nov 1956 till January 1957. The casting of South Pacific wasn't even completed till the end of May, 1957, after Ezio Pinza (who was originally going to do it) died from a stroke. The movie then filmed from mid-summer to early fall, '57. Filming began a full seven months after The Pajama Game wrapped. In fact, The Pajama Game was released to theaters while South Pacific was only in its second week of filming. Even Teacher's Pet, which filmed in April, 1957, was wrapped well before filming started. Tunnel of Love, Day's next film (after Teacher's Pet) filmed in January 1958, so it wouldn't have been a conflict for Day either.

[quote]Interesting. Is Guettel a Republican? Or worse, a Trump supporter?

No and no, sort of. His thing with Kavenaugh was part of his "men's rights, straight men are so abused" mentality. And he was shocked that so many of his Twitters users turned against him in reaction to that, to the degree that he floated the idea of liberals being so bigoted and judgmental. And that's the point that he shut down his social media accounts.

The reasons why Day didn't do South Pacific are multiple and complicated but r388 gets the main reason right, nobody wanted to deal with her corrupt husband/manager, who always demanded a producer's position and inserted himself onto her film sets. Nobody wanted the drama of dealing with him. He also demanded too much money.

It was Joshua Logan, not Richard Rodgers, at the private party where she declined to sing as an informal audition, confirming his aversion to using her.

I'm laughing because I'm the one who likes to mention "The Story of My Life" as one of the worst musicals ever, and someone else did earlier and was mistaken for me. So, "Story of My Life" fan, there's clearly more than one of us who loathes that show that you oddly seem to adore. But I'm not here today to rattle your cage. I'll say that "Glory Days" was possibly worse, as was "In My Life."

No one's mentioned "High Button Shoes" on this thread... Hmm... Didn't know the show or score, but I was really taken with it. Yes, it's corny and the book is severely dated, but that score! Jule Styne and Sammy Cahn had it going on! I loved the music, and it made me sad that nothing this season can come even close to "Papa, Won't You Dance With Me?", "On a Sunday by the Sea", "I Still Get Jealous", etc. And of course there was the amazing "Bathing Beauty Ballet" that Robbins did early in his career. The reviews weren't great for this show, but I tend to go on Sunday evenings when the cast has had a few chances to perform the work, and I was pleasantly surprised.

The reviews weren't great for *any* of the Encores shows this year. I Married an Angel was definitely the worst received, and has permanently ruined the show's reputation. Call Me Madam seemed to be hurt primarily by the lack of an appropriate leading lady (especially one who could live up to Tyne Daly, from the first Encores version). I guess High Button Shoes fared the best, although it still wasn't great. This has to be the worst-reviewed Encores season in memory.

Shouldn't they be answering the 2020 season soon? One person already said that they were finally doing the Kurt Weill-Alan Jay Lerner "Love Life," which would make sense, but that's all I've heard.

[quote]I'm the one who likes to mention "The Story of My Life" as one of the worst musicals ever,

Speaking of The Story of My Life, the book writer, Brian Hill, has done the book for the revised Brigadoon that was done at the Goodman and is now playing at the Shaw Festival in Canada. Aside from making Mr. Lundie into Mistress Lundie, and making Tommy and Jeff returning WWII soldiers with PTSD (hence Jeff shooting, not tripping, Harry Beaton - didn't someone describe that upthread?) and a black Fiona and an Indian Charlie Dalrymple, there doesn't seem to be a lot that's changed. Has anyone seen it?

Oh, and Tommy is played by hottie openly gay actor George Krissa (see pic)

Damn Aaron T and Danny B can't catch a break for the Tonies ... both of them would have had a pretty weak field this year

r383 and r396, re Guettel's Kavanaugh issue: I saw it less as a "poor downtrodden white men" and more of an attempt to express a rational point of view about Christine Blassey Ford's testimony. In his view, she wasn't making her case. I don't recall that he supported Kavanaugh. Whatever, the blowback was immediate; at first he tried to deflect it with humor/irony, but ultimately he just took his bat and ball and went home.

I can't recall if that was about the same time his personal life took a hit.

ps to r401 and others: the plural isn't "Tonies."

R402, they do it annoy. Ignore them.

[quote]The reasons why Day didn't do South Pacific are multiple and complicated but [R388] gets the main reason right, nobody wanted to deal with her corrupt husband/manager, who always demanded a producer's position and inserted himself onto her film sets. Nobody wanted the drama of dealing with him. He also demanded too much money.

Yet Jack Warner put up with him for [italic]Pajama Game[/italic] despite having canceled the last two Transcona projects for Judy Garland after [italic]A Star is Born[/italic].

"The metaphor and subtext of OKLAHOMA! is about people maturing and learning to live together as a community."

Isn't this the basic theme of every play or musical?

R400 Jesus! Must every production of a classic musical be cast like the United Nations? For once, I'd like to see a traditional casting. That would be novel.

404: Yes because Day began her career with a seven year Warners’ contract and the studio really wanted her to stay there, Melcher or not. She immediately went to MGM to do “Love Me or Leave Me,” which grossed more than any of her Warners films (and had Cagney, another Warners alum). Any studio would have wanted her by 1957 even with her asshole of a husband. I guess the chemistry with the creative team on “South Pacific” was just off and everyone walked away in a huff. And ‘SP’ was a smash, even without Day. It’s just those awful color filters that make it unwatchable today.

R400, thanks for the story on Brigadoon. I was thinking of going to the Shaw Festival to see it, but now I wouldn't go across the street to attend. I guess I'm not woke enough.

Albert Brooks tried really hard to get Doris for "Mother".

In spite of those changes, it sounds, from the Goodman reviews, like this Brigadoon isn’t much different from the original. All the songs are there, sung by the same characters as before. Apparently they’ve added a bit of Scottish, but that’s it. At the Goodman, it wasn’t cast the way it has been at the Shaw Festival,

The average age of Shaw festival attendees is 80ish. They are not going to like the tampering, since the festival used to pride itself on producing plays the way they were originally intended. Stratford was more experimental. The only think "woke" about Shaw audiences is when the lights come on after the show and they stop their nodding off.

r387, your thoughts on O! reflect mine almost exactly, except for a few salient points, most not worth mentioning. But the homoerotic tension of Poor Jud was indeed heady and the ballet a sad mistake.

Not sure why so many here seem to take personal offense at its existence, as if it will never be produced in the classic way again. I don't think it will have a long run, but I'm grateful that they looked at it with new eyes.

I'm over 50, too.

[quote] I could have done without the community hall decor, the gimmick of serving out chili and cornbread (no, I didn’t have any, I wouldn’t be caught dead)

I'm friends with someone involved with the production who shares who's lined up for chili.

Joseph Gordon-Levitt, John Krasinski, Anna Wintour, Lin-Manuel Miranda, Donald Glover, all caught eating chili.

They should call it [italic]Be More Chili[/italic].

Choosing some shows from 1940-1975, here's some ideas for Encores to consider (none have been done or had full scale revivals): 1940: Panama Hattie. 1941: Best Foot Forward. 1942: By Jupiter. 1943: Early to Bed (Fats Waller music). 1944: Sadie Thompson. 1945: Up in Central Park. 1946: Call Me Mister. 1947: Allegro (Classic Stages cut it to ribbons). 1948: Look Ma, I'm Dancin'. 1949: Miss Liberty. 1950: Arms & the Man (I originally thought of choosing the Jean Arthur Peter Pan, but that could be worth a Roundabout revival.) 1951: Make a Wish. 1952: Three Wishes For Jaime (Wish You Were Here requires a big set for the pool). 1953: Me & Juliet (the only Rodgers & Hammerstein never revived in NY). 1954: The Boy Friend. 1955: Silk Stockings. 1956: Happy Hunting. 1957: Jamaica. 1958: Goldilocks (or Say Darling) 1959: Destry Rides Again. 1960: Wildcat. 1961: Sail Away! 1962: Mr. President. 1963: Tovarich. 1964: High Spirits. 1965: Pickwick. 1966: Walking Happy. 1967: How Now Dow Jones. 1968: Golden Rainbow. 1969: Dear World. 1970: Look to the Lillies. 1971: The Grass Harp. 1972: Sugar. 1973: Seesaw. 1974: Mack & Mabel. 1975: Goodtime Charley.

With "Verdon/Fosse" they could do REDHEAD, NEW GIRL IN TOWN; the third show could be something else as their other titles are pretty standard rep. Maybe HIGH SPIRITS, since Gwen turned it down for some reason; she'd have been great in Tammy Grimes role, adding more dancing as being flown about.

Why not bring back [italic]All-American[/italic] and stick it to those modern-day nativists?

Encores! already did Allegro. Pretty deadly, alas.

Allegro was one of the first Encores. APAC did a really strong production a few years ago before all their productions went to shit.

I was under the impression that Jerry Herman was not supportive of Encores! so Dear World and Mack & Mabel would not be done.

Fosse/Verdon is very disappointing. Fosse did it all before with All THAT JAZZ and it was way better.

I think Encores should do The Human Comedy.

"Love Life" would be great, but I hopefully it gets bigger audiences than the "Golden Apple" which had been anticipated and wanted for many years before they finally did it.

Jerry Herman apparently wants a guarantee that his show would go to Broadway like "Chicago" did, and Encores can't guarantee that.

LOOK MA, I'M DANCIN starring Jackie Hoffman -- can you imagine?

Well, she kind of is a Nancy Walker type.

[quote] Fosse/Verdon is very disappointing. Fosse did it all before with All THAT JAZZ and it was way better.

That's because Fosse was telling his own life story while accurately predicting the cause of his own death. Much like how Howard Beale died at the end of [italic]Network[/italic], then Peter Finch died for real. Except then there was much less of a lag time between the movie death and the real-world death. Self-fulfilling prophesies?

[quote] Jerry Herman apparently wants a guarantee that his show would go to Broadway like "Chicago" did, and Encores can't guarantee that.

That's rather short sighted on his part. With the exception of La Cage and Dolly no one is mounting Broadway revivals of his shows these days.

I saw Jackie Hoffman as Princess Winifred WAY off Broadway in "Once Upon a Mattress" (Lypsinka as the Queen), and she made the show. I had seen a video of Sarah Jessica Porker in it, and Jackie was WAY better.

Hoffman has a really good belt voice, plus she can be a clown. Hoffman was also very good on "Feud" playing Joan Crawford's maid. SJP is a comedic actress but not a clown. She was miscast in "Mattress".

[quote]Not complaining — it gets lonely on the prairie

We know, we know.

Come to think of it, why hasn't there been a Mame revival?

A lot of people are waiting for Jerry Herman to die and then some exciting things will happen. And let's be clear, he's been dying for like, 10 years. He never even made it to the Bette Dolly.

[quote] Come to think of it, why hasn't there been a Mame revival?

Because the show is dated as fuck. They tried with the Baranski production in DC a few years ago but it went nowhere.

When did skeevy Michael Shannon get so buff?

[quote] Come to think of it, why hasn't there been a Mame revival?

The same reason there hasn't been a bevy of video, DVD, and Blu-ray releases of [italic]Song of the South[/italic] like there have been for all its wannabes: it gives white Southerners too much credit for being able to change and grow and learn from past mistakes.

[quote] I had seen a video of Sarah Jessica Porker in it, and Jackie was WAY better.

The very definition of damning with faint praise.

No, just.....

[quote]Come to think of it, why hasn't there been a Mame revival?

This is an oft-discussed topic in the DL theater threads. The show hasn't aged well, certainly not as well as "Dolly." Even in 1966, it was already showing its wrinkles. Yes, the score is mostly wonderful, but the book is a relic. I saw the D.C. production. Not even Baranski and Harriet Harris (surprisingly disappointing as Vera) could save it.

Looking at the coverage from the New Dramatists Luncheon for Nathan Lane and I didn't realize he and Brooks Ashmanskas were such good longtime friends. How did Brooks escape Nathan's notorious vitriol for understudies and replacements in THE PRODUCERS?

[quote] LOOK MA, I'M DANCIN starring Jackie Hoffman -- can you imagine?

Only if the title was changed to LOOK MA, I'M HIDEOUS

Watched a clip last night of Jackie Hoffman & Mary Testa performing "Evil Woman" from "Xanadu"; Mary seems to overpower Jackie, although it's really her number, so that's appropriate.

[quote]Come to think of it, why hasn't there been a Mame revival?

"Mame" was revived on Broadway in 1983 with Angie reprising the title role. It only ran for 41 performances.

I think a revival of "Auntie Mame" the play would be better than the musical.

Did Gwen Verdon get any offers to do any of her hits in London when she was Broadway's top star? Did she ever perform there in something like the Royal Variety performance? Or did she not want to be away from Fosse?

Unfortunately Dame Maggie is too damn old, r443.

Emily Blunt might be able to do the play or the musical.

People are never going to get a new Sondheim musical so how about an old Sondheim musical that no one ever saw. By George, the one he did when he was 15 that Hammerstein said was the worst thing he'd ever read.

Just for fun

"Aside from making Mr Lundie into Mistress Lundie, and making Tommy and Jeff returning WWII soldiers with PTSD (hence Jeff shooting, not tripping, Harry Beaton - didn't someone describe that upthread?) and a black Fiona and an Indian Charlie Dalrymple..."

And so, amidst this hellzapoppin' farrago, how does Lerner's theme of romanticism vs. realism actually play out?

[quote]By George, the one he did when he was 15 that Hammerstein said was the worst thing he'd ever read.

Hammerstein didn't live to see Broadway in its current state. Hell, the bombastic banality of the 1980s British mega-musicals would have made him weep like the miracle of St. Bernadette.

The book of Mame should be rewritten to incorporate more of Auntie Mame, a much smarter script. Cut 'St Bridget' and either cut Ito or give him something to do.

Well with the success of Wokelahoma and the gender bending Company I assume we'll now see all sorts of new takes on Sondheim's work.

It still cheeses me that they'd rather make Bobby a woman than a gay man.

[453] Agree...I have seen the show twice on Broadway, and Bobby read as gay both times (though he was played by Larry Kert and Raul Esparza, so there's that.

[quote] "Mame" was revived on Broadway in 1983 with Angie reprising the title role. It only ran for 41 performances.

My understanding was that it wasn't just the show that was the problem, but that the whole production was misconceived. It opened with very little advance publicity in the dog days of summer. It was a scaled-down set that got lost in the barn that is the Gershwin Theater.

I guess the producers thought Lansbury's SWEENEY TODD fans would be interested in seeing her again, but the gays were out at Fire Island, the tourists, who had yet to see her in MURDER SHE WROTE, all wanted to see CATS, and Jerry Herman fans were more interested in trying to get tickets to LA CAGE AUX FOLLES, which was opening at exactly the same time. The ghastly artwork couldn't have helped matters either.

From all accounts, however, Lansbury was magnificent, although Jane Connell, at age 58, was a little harder to buy as a pregnant Agnes Gooch.

(Utterly useless trivia department: Byron Nease, who played grown-up Patrick in the '83 revival died in 2013 at age 59 after living with HIV for years. After MAME, he went on to originate the role of Raoul in the Canadian production of PHANTOM. Frankie Michaels, young Patrick from the original production, and the youngest person to win a Tony, died in 2013 at age 61. And dear Angela is still with us at 93).

The Mame Tyler Moore Show

"Cut St Bridget"

Even as a throwaway, it's one of the most innovative, melodious and best f**king songs in the score!

Even the worst song in that score is better than most modern Broadway scores.

The 1983 Mame was supposed to tour but it was doing horribly so they cut the tour short to come to Broadway.

'We are coming in with no advance sales,' Miss Lansbury said. 'We have to pray a lot.' 'Damn it all,' she added, 'it's a great, great vehicle for me. I can wear it as easily today as I did 17 years ago.' Miss Lansbury was 41 years old the first time she played Mame. 'We haven't changed one tune or one dance step. This is something a woman of my age needs to do - to prove that I can still do it. I don't think it is necessary to pack it up and do character roles. Theater is magic. I believe I can spin a web of magic and make people believe I have turned the clock back.'

"And so, amidst this hellzapoppin' farrago, how does Lerner's theme of romanticism vs. realism actually play out?"

That's not the point, which is to be woke. Theme be damned; it's more important to give more opportunity to women and minorities than to adhere to theme or intent. I long for the day when we can see " Hello Davey" or " Thoroughly Modern Manny."

This was the glamorous Playbill cover for the 1983 Mame.

And, of course, what self-respecting gay wouldn't want to see this version of " Sweet Charley"?

I can't find it but didn't some reviewer comment that Jane Carr at 58 having a baby in Mame was more Agnes of God than Agnes of Gooch.

I saw the Brigadoon at the Goodman and was impressed by the changes in the book. (There was none of the multi-culti, Mistress Lundie stuff that apparently is going on at the Shaw Festival). The smartest thing Brian Hill did was to make you walk out thinking "Yeah, that was the Brigadoon I remember and love, but somehow the story was better." The songs are all there, the dances, the story, the humor but it all seemed more, for want of a better word, motivated. Making Tommy freshly home from WWII, helped a lot. He was a guy who seemed lost psychologically, having trouble fitting back in to the world he went back to.. Not much time is spent on that but it is there, in the background, and it helps his decision at the end. The other good change is Mr. Lundie's story about how Brigadoon came do be is changed. No more witches and demons threatening the place, rather the very real clan wars raging in Scotland at the time, to which Brigadoon kept losing more and more of its young men (hence the thrill when one of them actually gets married.) That's the rescue Lundie prayed for. Another nice touch was moving "There But For You Go I". In this version Tommy returns to the bridge at Brigadoon but Fiona does NOT show up. He sings the song there and that is what makes Fiona return. Actually a lot better than the original. But Like I said, the adaptation does not draw much attention to itself, it just sort of smartly makes the experience better. Would other "re-imaginings" of other shows would have done the same.

R463, that was John Simon and he surprisingly liked it.

The odd thing about Mame is that it is rarely done in Europe where even Funny Girl gets a revival. I would have thought Katharine Mehrling would have got her claws into it by now. It is so American, the Europeans should love it. The Peckerwood segment would not bother people who have Black Peter and Mohr im Hemd. (Song of the South is available on DVD.)

[quote]I believe I can spin a web of magic and make people believe I have turned the clock back.'

Me too, doll.

[quote]I can't find it but didn't some reviewer comment that Jane Carr at 58 having a baby in Mame was more Agnes of God than Agnes of Gooch.

Jane Carr and Jane Connell are not the same person.

Well, shoot, now I'd like to have seen Jane Carr as Gooch. She played Angela's daughter in Something for Everyone, after all.

R464: On the "rescue Mr. Lundie prayed for," shouldn't that be the "rescue Mr. Forsythe prayed for"?

Mr. Lundie is telling the story about how Mr. Forsythe arranged for Brigadoon to disappear. Or did this new version combine the figures of (the late) Mr. Forsythe and Mr. Lundie? It sounds like something the revision might have done.

Eloquent, r464, but I'm skeptical: it was Alan Jay Lerner, the uber-romantic and serial monogamist, who, adapting an episode from folklore--not historical reality--through the prism of his own experience and DNA (like Shakespeare), endured the agony of getting it on the page in the first place, and in collaboration with Frederick Loewe, created a full-fledged and classic work of musical theater that examined romantic and cynical attitudes in the aftermath of WWII without having to literalize the metaphor (the scourge of contemporary theater) by making the war backstory and, in the process, diminishing its power. Where's the romance (in the sense of an appeal to the imagination) without witches and demons? Perhaps I'm wrong but it sounds like this BRIGADOON 'revisal' has either not been thought through or is cynical in its own right, and the antithesis of what Lerner intended, just like the recent ON A CLEAR DAY...and MY FAIR LADY revivals. No one can revise his experience or POV, nor improve upon it nor make it better--it will forever be Lerner's own, and the rest are pipsqueaks standing the shoulders of a giant.

Brian Hill is Canadian. Is that why it is happening at the Shaw festival? It was not well-received at the Goodman and none of the NYC nonprofits picked it up...

Shaw goers are very conservative in their tastes. After all, they were all contemporaries of George Bernard Shaw.

[quote]And so, amidst this hellzapoppin' farrago, how does Lerner's theme of romanticism vs. realism actually play out?

Mistress Lundie is romanticism, and Jeff’s gun is realism!

With just a few lines, they’ve made it clear that Mistress Lundie is trans, and presents as a different sex each time Brigadoon wakes up. If Tommy and Jeff had come the next day, they would have gotten Mr. Lundie.

Mame's book needs a facelift, but that score is beautiful. The issue is finding someone who can sing/act/dance it who also has star power AND can get butts into seats. Most Broadway starlets could sing and dance it, but most of them can't act it or have the star power needed.

The only way Mame will get revived is if she's played by a trans sex worker of color.

cynthia erivo live from lincoln center was a snoozefest. one note. no dynamics. all pop music. she belonged on BET.

Mayor Pete's husband showed up at The Prom event for the road voters today. It was a LOVE fest. Well played. Well played.

I've always thought the problem with reviving Mame is it was written pre-cultural revolution, so by the time we got to 1968, all the daring, risque, avant garde events of the show's book were incredibly tame by comparison (except for the nude fish family game, which is just plain gross.) So the whole show became downright quaint in the couple of years after its opening.

yes r478 so disappointing and she was cold as ice too

[quote]examined romantic and cynical attitudes in the aftermath of WWII without having to literalize the metaphor ... by making the war backstory

True, but the original was produced just two years after WWII ended. The war was backstory in everyone’s lives then without being specified.

Interesting review of the Goodman in the Chicago Tribune. Jessie Mueller’s dad played Mr. Lundie.

I think I made it through three of Erivo's numbers and then turned it off. I just didn't care for her song choices (none of which I'd ever heard of, but still). Annaleigh Ashford takes the mic this Friday night on PBS (check your local listings).

It's probably just me, but every time I watch a Live from Lincoln Center concert from the Appel Room (I think that's its name) I spend most of my time watching the flow of taillights down on the street, not to mention looking at the windows of the apartments across the way to see what anyone's doing. The performers have to be mighty strong to overcome the Wall of Distractions behind them (what's happening outside may not be as evident in the room as it is on TV).

Poor sad big mouth Cynthia Erivo. Pack it up and head back to London, hon. We’re done hearing you shriek “I’m Here.” You’ll always have Twitter!

"True, but the original was produced just two years after WWII ended. The war was backstory in everyone’s lives then without being specified."

My point exactly, r482, thank you. But don't you think the self-selecting audience that attends BRIGADOON would be able to infer that? Or is it necessary to hit contemporary, history-ignorant imbeciles over the head for them to get it?

This is how young Angie felt....

So, Tootsie tour next year ...

Oscar winner Helen Hunt to make her musical theatre debut:

"Hamilton" sets closing date in Chicago:

Just because Helen Hunt is doing "Working" doesn't necessarily mean she will be singing. There are non-singing roles. Even those with outstanding, once-in-a-lifetime theatre voices can get stuck with them.

"originally presented on Broadway in 1978, the musical is adapted from Studs Terkel’s book exploring the lives of those in the American workforce, by composer Stephen Schwartz and librettist Nina Faso. The updated adaptation features additional material from Lin-Manuel Miranda, Gordon Greenberg, Craig Carnelia, Micki Grant, Mary Rodgers and Susan Birkenhead, and James Taylor."

[quote]is it necessary to hit contemporary, history-ignorant imbeciles over the head for them to get it

And there you have answered your own question. There are plenty of people who don't know what World War II was, or that we even fought in it? I was born in 1963. Growing up, of course we learned about it, and all of our parents had lived through it. It was a very tangible part of our own "backstories." But it has grown farther and farther away as there is much less curiosity these days about the past. Forget the 40s, even the 70s and 80s are considered uninteresting and not pertinent to modern life. There are people who don't know what the Vietnam War is, or even the First Gulf War. The same people have no interest in past actors or movie stars, and in composers or lyricists or playwrights whose heyday was the 30s through the 60s.

what's your issue, r491?

Not r491, but the article makes it sound like "Working" is a musical by Stephen Schwartz &Nina Faso, and that the additional material "from Lin-Manuel Miranda, Gordon Greenberg, Craig Carnelia, Micki Grant, Mary Rodgers and Susan Birkenhead, and James Taylor" has all been newly added, when most of those songs were always in the show. Only the LMM and Gordon Greenberg material is newly-added.

Holy shit, that's weak, R461. They literally put zero thought into that. I've seen community theater programs that were more inventive than that with a tenth of the kind of budget Playbill has if that.

The [italic]Mame[/italic] revival ended right in time for Angie to do a TV movie right before [italic]Murder She Wrote[/italic] began called [italic]The First Olympics[/italic] which David Odgen Stiers was also in.

What are BroadwayWorld photos always so awful? Everyone looks ancient and wrinkled, no matter what age.

It's not a little surprising to discover how shrill, strident, misjudged and just plain embarrassing some of the entries in the PBS American Songbook series actually are. More like "How To Alienate Audiences in 45 Minutes." Only Marilyn Maye and a select few manage to escape unscathed.

Did Marilyn Maye get a solo concert? Or just a number or two?

At first I was going to yell "flop" when I read Hamilton was closing in Chicago, but it DID play for three years. That is pretty darn impressive. Given that more people have seen it in Chicago than in NY -- and it has been running for much less time -- I wonder if the theater it is in is just too big. If they had a smaller theater, perhaps it would run longer.

And why is Working being presented as an off-Broadway Musical when it played on Broadway?

As crazy as it may sound, I've heard from reliable sources that EVITA will be done at Encores next year. It may not be part of their regular season but more of a LADY IN THE DARK type affair.

You heard it here first.

As has been said here 1000 times before, MAME no longer works because all of its humor and most of its characters are based on a shock value that no longer exists.

I don't think it's shock value as much as the source material was written in an acerbic, biting style. Mame is zany and madcap and...very self-centered. Nowhere in the books does she have a My Best Beau or If He Walked Into My Life moment. He comments on the other characters but they aren't there for shock value. The play gave the character heart and warmth, thanks in no small part to Roz. The musical dilutes the wit of the original script, but Angela dazzled. Does anybody think MAME would have had as long a run if it had opened with Nanette?

Shock value? This isn't exactly [italic]Pink Flamingos[/italic]. It's a critique of bigotry in both the North and the South.

Peckerwood and the Upsons are just two plot points in a book filled with other plot points. I don't really think it's a critique on bigotry. Dennis makes them comic fools.

Yet the play, movie, and musical deliberately chose to focus on those two during the apex of the African-American Civil Rights Movement.

[quote] I wonder if the theater it is in is just too big. If they had a smaller theater, perhaps it would run longer.

The CIBC Theatre (formerly the Shubert) has 1800 seats, about the same size as larger Broadway houses. However, it’s 500 seats more than the Richard Rodgers, so that accounts for the claim that more people have seen it in Chicago.

[quote]Does anybody think MAME would have had as long a run if it had opened with Nanette?

I do!

Here's a rumour: there's iphone video about to drop of the nature of "don't you know who the hell I am" behavior. This one makes Reese's tape look like a walk in the park. Especially since the perp is the angel of Broadway. It'll be fun to see how he gets out in front of this, since he's such a skilled politician. Remember, smoke and mirrors, people. Smoke and mirrors.

R509, is it Doug Henning?

[quote]Hammerstein didn't live to see Broadway in its current state. Hell, the bombastic banality of the 1980s British mega-musicals would have made him weep like the miracle of St. Bernadette.

Agreed. Not only because those shows were so awful overall, but more specifically because they were through-sung with no dialogue -- because no one involved had even the slightest talent for writing dialogue. Not that they had much talent for writing music or lyrics either, but you know what I mean.

[quote]The other good change is Mr. Lundie's story about how Brigadoon came do be is changed. No more witches and demons threatening the place, rather the very real clan wars raging in Scotland at the time, to which Brigadoon kept losing more and more of its young men (hence the thrill when one of them actually gets married.) That's the rescue Lundie prayed for.

Sorry, for someone to pray that the village would disappear for 100 years every night is still not a blessing it's a curse.

[quote]Another nice touch was moving "There But For You Go I". In this version Tommy returns to the bridge at Brigadoon but Fiona does NOT show up. He sings the song there and that is what makes Fiona return. Actually a lot better than the original.

So then, "There But For You Go I" now happens right before the very end of the show? It's a gorgeous song, but that sounds WAY too late for a ballad like that. I think that song works just fine where it is in the original.

[quote]As crazy as it may sound, I've heard from reliable sources that EVITA will be done at Encores next year. It may not be part of their regular season but more of a LADY IN THE DARK type affair.

City Center has produced some musicals outside of the Encores! umbrella, but LADY IN THE DARK wasn't one of them. That was a production of Master Voices, with City Center used as a rental venue. If City Center is planning EVITA, maybe they're planning a concert version with Patti, who can still sing all of those songs in the original keys. Now, THAT would be something to see, and actually, I can't imagine them doing it with anyone else. It could be even more exciting than Ellen Greene coming back and triumphing in LITTLE SHOP.

Who on Broadway is big enough to pull the "don't you know who I am" card? Nathan Lane is big enough to expect to be known, but he is not anyone's idea of an angel. The only other possibility is Hugh Jackman, although I don't think of Broadway when I think of him.

Lin, of course.

Stephen Schwartz really did not like Bob Fosse as a person.

I missed the Carol de Guire interview when it came out. I guess we aren't surprised?

R513 I know, right? I'm sitting here reading the article about Helen Hunt saying to myself, damn that's a lot of "In The heights" people. Lo and behold as I keep reading, fucking Lin Manuel OF COURSE. haha.

A video of LMM acting all uppity and entitled might have the same effect on Broadway as if Trump was secretly recorded saying he thought his base was made up of dumb fucks who he wouldn't even have dinner with.

R509 - Billy Porter. He’s getting a lot of attention for his runway looks in the general media lately.

I have heard through the grapevine that he can be a nasty one. I heard of one occasion where he swept into a midtown eatery with “I’m a Tony winner and must make my call time, so I will be seated right now.” This was in front of a line of other people all waiting their turn - some of whom were on the same schedule as him.

[quote]A video of LMM acting all uppity and entitled might have the same effect on Broadway as if Trump was secretly recorded saying he thought his base was made up of dumb fucks who he wouldn't even have dinner with.

So, R516, I take that to mean you think that it wouldn't bother anyone in the slightest? Certainly Trump's fans have proven they'll eat whatever shit he dishes out.

Dear 412, Let’s have a drink and talk about “Oklahoma!” Signed 387.

[quote] So then, "There But For You Go I" now happens right before the very end of the show? It's a gorgeous song, but that sounds WAY too late for a ballad like that. I think that song works just fine where it is in the original.

Elder Gay memory, but I thought the play ended with Tommy and Jeff on the Bridge and Mr. Lundie appearing. He says something to the effect that Tommy must really love her to have woken him up. Tommy and Mr Lundie walk into the mist and Jeff remains. I don't remember Fiona being in the ending at all.

R517 Yes. A friend and I met him on the street in NYC right after his tony win. We loved his song "love is on the way" for years. Since "the first wives club". We stopped to congratulate him on the Tony and tell him how much we love that song and he completely blew us off and walked away. Saying something like, "that's an old song". Didn't say thank you or anything. We have never listened to that song again. Nor do I care to watch him in anything now.

[quote]I don't remember Fiona being in the ending at all.

She is. In the original version, comes in at the very end to greet Tommy, but I don't think she has any lines. Except now, in this rewrite, it sounds like she comes in and takes Mr. Lundie's, excuse me, MISTRESS Lundie's dialogue about if you love someone strong enough, and then they go off.

One of my favorite parts of the Brigadoon score is Fiona's "Dinne ye know, Tommy?" intro to "From This Day On." Rebecca Luker on the McGlinn album nailed that exquisitely, my favorite recorded version. although someone named Janis Kelly on a London studio CD and the original, Marion Bell, do beautifully with it , too. Kelli O'Hara didn't quite pull it off, and neither, really, did Shirley Jones.

[quote]it'll be fun to see how he gets out in front of this, since he's such a skilled politician.

That comment alone points to LMM, although the "angel of Broadway" comment does, too. But if anybody knows how to work it, ie, his IG, his Twitter, his routines before the show when he was doing Hamilton, all the PR - it's Lin-Manuel. A politician, indeed.

r517 yes the "celeb" at r509 must be billy porter since he was an "angel" at the very recent Met gala. (The most fun part of good blind items are hidden clues like that. And no r524 "angel" wouldn't be natural term to describe Lin, even if one likes him)

Now of course that doesn't mean it's true

What exactly is "campy" about that outfit? Over the top? Yes. Ugly? Yup, Campy? Nope.

Are you sure? Because Billy Porter is not a "skilled politician" with the public, nor would it surprise anyone for a video to leak with him pulling the "Don't you know who I am?" bullshit. His self-adulation and haughty attitude have been on full display numerous times. No one expects him to be a nice guy. And if it were him, no one would care, and it certainly wouldn't ruin his career. It would be just one more outrageous thing, and frankly, his Met Gala appearance was so beyond the pale, a video of him being obnoxious would seem tame by comparison.

this is why blind items are so much fun. and way better on a gossip thread than follies casting and brigadoon debates

You might be right about Porter not known as skilled politician

Please please please let it be LMM.

It's gotta be Lin. Politician = Hamilton. Now, watch, it was actually that uppity William Daniels.

Fiona does not appear at the end of Brigadoon in the original script, in the original production, and in countless Brigadoons into the 1960s. Mr. Lundie comes out, says, "If ye love someone deeply, anythin' is possible...even miracles," and leads a stunned Tommy into Brigadoon.

At some point, directors started adding Fiona into the ending, because it seemed too dry and unromantic without her, almost as if Tommy were ending up with Mr. Lundie instead of Fiona.

It has been staged that way pretty much ever since.

Anybody go to the NY Philharmonic Spring Gala starring Patti LuPone last night?

I live nearby and, while walking home from the subway, I passed dozens of cute gay couples in tuxedos heading to Lincoln Center.

Wish I had the money

Risky statement.....but I believe that THE CHER SHOW got screwed. It has a better written book than PROM and not nominated for “Best Choreography”? The “Dark Lady” number is the best dance number currently on Bway. The songs were used effectively and not just jammed into the show as has been done with other shows of that ilk. Was there animosity towards the producer, Cher?

R531. Thanks for confirming I am not losing me Elder Gay mind.

Now, for my second question. I seem to remember a production where the cynical Jerry is the one who returns looking for Brigadoon. Not sure how that would have worked. Tommy stays? The return is done twice?

"The Cher Show" is one of the most misandrist shows I've ever seen on Broadway. While I enjoyed it for the music, the glitz, the camp and Stephanie J. Block's performance, I came out of it not really liking her anymore because of her attitude towards how perfect she was for the men she was involved with and they screwed it up by betraying her in some way. Seeing "The Prom" again last Saturday and then "Tootsie" on Thursday made me appreciate "The Prom" all the more, and while I know it's only my fantasy, I wish Brooks and Beth would go off with the Tony's. Their characters were much more believable even in musical comedy terms than the oh so perfect Cher and Michael Dorsey/Dorothy Michaels, and their redemption from complete narcissists to people who grew from their experience and came out better people was far more a better message than what Block and Santanio Fontana seemed to come out with at the end.

[quote] I believe that THE CHER SHOW got screwed. It has a better written book than PROM and not nominated for “Best Choreography”?

Not to mention that sexy Christopher Vo dancing his hot little ass off

Yea Christopher Vo can get it. I forgot all about him. Sexy ass.

I've never heard of a staging like that, R534. Why would Jeff come back to Brigadoon?--he scarcely believes the town exists in the first place.

If we see him again at all, it would be in a detective's interrogation room trying to explain how he happens to be the last person to see Tommy Albright alive.

I think the iphone video is Lin. As awful as Billy Porter supposedly is, I really don't think him being a cunt on camera would matter in the way that Lin would. Lin can do no wrong, he's carefully cultivated an image that he's supportive and happy and good-natured and loves Broadway and all that shit. Having a diva moment caught on camera would not align well with his brand, whereas Billy Porter's brand is more sass and cunt. Additionally I wouldn't be suprised if Lin is feeling bitchy of late, his work in Mary Poppins was generally agreed to be the worst part of an ehhh film and he hasn't been able to own Fosse/Verdon in the way that he owned Hamilton.

I guess it could also be Ben Platt, but daddy would get that shut down immediately. Maybe Andrew Rannells, he does seem pretty dumb.

[quote] What are BroadwayWorld photos always so awful? Everyone looks ancient and wrinkled, no matter what age.

Agreed. It's like my mother is taking the photos.

[quote] Certainly Trump's fans have proven they'll eat whatever shit he dishes out.

Stop it, you're making me hungry!

and r496 is that the site where they run 18 variations of every crappy red carpet photo of each person

[quote] "The Cher Show" is one of the most misandrist shows I've ever seen on Broadway.

Cher hates men. Unless they used to be lesbians.

I'm not familiar with Working -- what role do we think Helen would play? Besides "menopausal anorexic."

I can't believe Stephanie Block is going to win the Tony, which everyone is predicting. You might as well hand it to Rich Little.

Wouldn't LMM also be able to shut down a video, r539?

It would be funny to find out that Lin Manuel Miranda is not the poster boy for "Mr. Nice Guy" he comes off as. I always suspected that the frog was really a frog. Put lipstick on a pig, and you've got more colorful pork chops.

Was it Lin and his handlers or a chicken press that ended up changing the tune of an article around him around the time of Poppins?

[quote]Put lipstick on a pig, and you've got more colorful pork chops.

Watch it, R547.

Is that a chicken joke, R548?

R549 Hey, at least I paired you with a frog!

Based on the timeline and subject I'd say Disney had a hand in trying to put the kibosh on anything negative, R548. Movie critics tried to boycott them over their blackout of the LA Times over the paper's unflattering investigative journalism about Disneyland. I would not put anything like that past them. Underneath their carefully crafted "aw shucks" public image they're as slippery as eels.

R532, I saw Patti at Lincoln Center last night. She was in fine voice and sang all of her big songs. It was absolutely delicious!

I had front row seats for Patti in "War Paint". She obviously notices the good and the bad of what is happening in view point. I noticed her looking on at my friend and I who applauded enthusiastically at the end of my big number. Of course, I took the battery out of my phone so there would be no accidents. Bernadette did the same for "Hello, Dolly!". It is obvious that they appreciate the audiences who focus on what's going on the stage and give them feedback when everything is great.

Am I the only one who remembers when Madonna went to Hamilton and starred at her phone all night and Lin Manuel posted about it but then suddenly the posts and the story disappeared. Always wonder what exactly happened there.

He let Madge suck his dick.

[quote]I noticed her looking on at my friend and I who applauded enthusiastically at the end of my big number.

Maybe she was looking at you because you were singing and applauding at your big number during HER show.

While the BI probably isn't Billy Porter, I will say "the angel of Broadway" could also refer to him having played Teen Angel in the 1994 revival of Grease.

And yes, Porter is a massive asshole.

R557 Ha ha! I can't believe my fingers typed that! (Maybe I wished at that point that I was Helena Rubenstein....)

That would certainly be a hoot, an audience member just letting loose with a big number during someone's show.

And if it was during Tootsie, infinitely more skilled and entertaining.

This reminds me of the Tony year of Titanic, The Life and Steel Pier....All got massive nominations. None really lasted, and Steep Pier went down quick. That what it feels like when people talk about Hadestown, Tootsie and The Prom. Beetlejuice equals that season's Jelly & Hyde - which was completely shut out, and ran for four years. The real hit of that season was CHICAGO. The real hit this season is Moulin Rouge.

I just watched Indecent on Broadway HD. Wow, what a fantastic show!! How did this not get any acting nominations, though?

Tootsie on Good Morning America looked....well, I'm not sure what that was. It is because they were missing set pieces? They were all sort of walking around in formation like some weird Broadway drum and bugle corp.

[quote] Why would Jeff come back to Brigadoon?--he scarcely believes the town exists in the first place.

And yet, he trips and inadvertently kills a man to keep it from disappearing forever.

Read what you just wrote, r565. Jeff inadvertently kills Harry Beaton. Harry’s death is an accident. Jeff is not invested in Brigadoon’s fate.

[quote]That what it feels like when people talk about Hadestown, Tootsie and The Prom.

No, not at all. Hadestown, Tootsie, and The Prom all got raves or near-raves. Titanic, The Life, and Steel Pier did not. Steel Pier especially got mixed to negative reviews.

Very rare music I found on youtube. From off-Broadway’s America Kicks Up Its Heels with Patti.

"Beetlejuice equals that season's Jelly & Hyde - which was completely shut out, and ran for four years. "

And still lost money

[quote] No, not at all. Hadestown, Tootsie, and The Prom all got raves or near-raves. Titanic, The Life, and Steel Pier did not. Steel Pier especially got mixed to negative reviews.

Yes, but you have to admit that theater criticism has changed immeasurably in the past 22 years (as has most media criticism). Things that would have been eviscerated in the past are now getting good reviews, that's how low the bar has been set. People don't criticize, they "review." They're also under a lot of pressure to say good things because everyone relies on everyone else to make whatever little money is left that isn't being sucked up by the internet. Newspapers need revenue from ad sales. Magazines are owned by big corps who have movie studios, etc. And 95% of the people writing reviews these days, if they're not being pressured to be more positive, are hack bloggers who write in order to get to see things for free, so not only are they not skilled writers/critics, but they don't want to bite the hand that feeds them free tickets.

[quote] I just watched Indecent on Broadway HD. Wow, what a fantastic show!! How did this not get any acting nominations, though?

I do wish Richard Topol and Katrina Lenk had been nominated.

I thought the younger woman (Adina Verson) and the actor who played Asch (Max Gordon Moore) were also fantastic. I would have been happy to see them nominated, too.

Really there wasn't a weak link in the cast. And looking over the list, they could have easily thrown out Richard Thomas in Featured and Corey Hawkins in Lead and put Topol and Max Gordon Moore in their places, respectively.

And did Condola Rashad really need another undeserved nomination over Lenk or Adina Verson? Or the massively overrated Jayne Houdyshell?

Day was too old for Nellie. Look at her in TPG. The next year she was going to play a naive 22 year old hick?

If Rodgers and Hammerstein wanted Day a refusal to sing at a party would not have been a problem. They clearly preferred Gaynor who is quite wonderful. As everyone says the filters are the problem. Neon magenta and sickly yellow are not colors one associates with the south seas. But that orchestra playing the score in 6 track stereo is a wonder.

[quote] Day was too old for Nellie.

Nonsense!

Was Doris Day really that much younger than Mitzi Gaynor?

Mitzi was nine years younger than Doris.

R518 Nope, I think such a video of LMM or tape of Trump saying shit about his own base might actually upset the deplorables, if the media really played it up so they couldn't ignore it. As for LMM, the Broadway and theater community is a lot smaller world. It'd be like his whole image was shattered, and his pre-shows at "Hamilton" were a big media-calculated condescension among his other PR.

cut the "a video of LMM or" from the first line. Deplorables haven't a clue who LMM is.

Glenn Close was 53 when she played Nellie Forbush in the 2001 TV remake. In fact, she turned 54 a week before the premiere.

I saw JR's Broadway 3 times because the bathing beauty ballet was one of the most wonderful production numbers I've ever seen. Dazzling spectacular and hilarious. Those who saw that and the recent Encores how would you say they compared? I didn't want to go and be disappointed by it because it wasn't as breathtaking, elaborate and brilliant.

R560 It was said that Al Jolson did it, singing "Liza"from the audience when wife Ruby Keeler starred in her first show and she got stage fright, barely singing. It's even in the "Jolson Story" though Ruby had them change her name there. Of course, he was a much bigger star, and the audience was thrilled. Apparently the story goes, she then found her (frankly, little) voice and continued singing.

Difficult to believe Rodgers and Hammerstein chose Mitzi Gaynor over Doris Day.

I mean, the late '50s was the last gasp of the studio system. If somebody wanted Mitzi Gaynor to be a star, they certainly were going to try.

R573 Isn't there a way with today's technology to get rid of those color filters in the film? Did Logan ever confess that they were a mistake? Most people hate them.

I'd prefer to see Adam Kantor's jerk off tape to Billy Porter/Lin Manuel's diva tirade.

R580 I think the "Bathing Beauty Ballet" worked even better in the Encores "High Button Shoes" because there was a context for who a lot of those people were (a number of them were principals) and what they were doing and why. It was really well done. I enjoyed it in "JRB" as well, but didn't know why they were acting that way except that a bag was being pursued by everyone.

It should also be mentioned that R&H wanted their movies to be about their show and not a star vehicle.

R580 I have a video of the original "Jerome Robbins' Broadway" and watched the ballet clip before going to City Center last Thursday. It is my favorite moment of that show, and going into see "High Button Shoes" had the tune running through my head. They did an exceptional job with the ballet because they utilized both the waves and the changing rooms, and of course, I wanted to hear the audience's reaction as well as get in every moment for myself visually. Of course, the gorilla gets a huge laugh. The one major difference in the bow in "Jerome Robbins' Broadway", the gorilla ends up with the bag. A friend of mine who knows Debbie Shapiro Gravite says that she told him that the dancers had couches backstage to collapse because it was so high energy and they really needed to catch their breath. The number got a huge round of applause in "High Button Shoes" and it went on for nearly a minute. It was as well received as the whole "You're Just in Love" number from the recent "Call Me Madam" production.

Presenters for the Chita Rivera Awards, honoring dance and choreography. Which one doesn't belong?

The Chita Rivera Awards, taking place at The NYU Skirball Center for the Performing Arts this Sunday, May 19, announces presenters for the evening. Presenters include Chita Rivera, Andy Blankenbuehler, Camille A. Brown, Ariana DeBose, Luann de Lesseps, Micaela Diamond, Damon J. Gillespie, Savion Glover, Marilu Henner, Brian Stokes Mitchell, Tiler Peck, Lee Roy Reams, Michael Riedel, Ethan Slater, Mary Testa and Richard Thomas.

I saw JRB at The Muny last summer, and the Bathing Beauty ballet was perfection. They also had the space for a really big lifeguard station for that fall, and lots of depth for the doors. Huge cast too..

R590 Checked out info on that production. Looks terrific, and Rob McClure is very talented, a shining light in the otherwise mediocre "Beetlejuice", along with the rest of that cast. It should be noted that just a few years ago, there were three productions of Jerome's on Broadway, all terrific, "The King & I", "Fiddler" and "On the Town".

OK. Somebody create the next thread and post a link.

In the meanwhile can we just grieve over the fact the LMM blind item is random and fake. In today's social media world, if that video has not been broadcast all over already it is either a.) nonexistant, or b.) about somebody no one cares about being less than shocking...

Three more weekends until the Tonys.

I always go to see a movie on Tony night. I can't afford to have my heart broken year after year watching a celebration of mediocrity.

Adam Kantor is phenomenally sexy and I would crawl across broken glass to see the infamous jerk off video and him playing with his ass.

Do you think he has a butthole?

"South Pacific" was a star presentation on Broadway for the original cast: Martin and Pinza.

It eventually greatly helped the sale of the original cast recording.

After Sinatra, R&H probably wanted to avoid big stars for their movie adaptations.

Not necessarily true. There may be a shakedown going on. Some of those NFL/NBA men beating their women security footage vids didn't leak until months later.

New thread

What is known by B'way insiders is that LMM is very competitive and mean. And he does it all with a fake earnest good boy routine. A film of him showing his true colors would be a treat.