Does anyone follow Canadian politics

I know, OP, it's sickening. I'm not the least bit surprised it happened, it's all a backlash against Trudeau.

R1, some of it has nothing to do with Trudeau.

Alberta has been electing right-wing governments for decades. It was always likely Alberta would go back to the Conservatives. The last Alberta election was a fluke because the right-wring vote was split between 2 parties.

And in Ontario, the provincial Liberals had been in power for 15 years and so voters wanted a change so they voted for the Ontario Conservatives for the first time since 2003.

As a Vancouverite I'm curious to see what happens next. Gas is already close to $1.70 a liter. If they shut off refined gasoline to us, I assume we can block all of their crude oil from the coast. A much greater cost to them than us.

I live in Alberta (just until July THANK GOD) a lot of it has to do with Trudeau. The Yellow Vest racists have been wearing 'Hang Trudeau" t-shirts at their rallies for over a year now. They fucking hate Trudeau here. As for the OP - nothing will be done about climate change...we are doomed.

Google 'is Jason Kenny gay?'

Prince Edward Island votes next week. Could elect a Green Party government and adopt Proportional Representation.

R4, of course they hate Trudeau in most of Alberta. But that still doesn't change the fact that it was always going to be hard for the NDP to win again once the right was united in Alberta.

And R5 is right that Jason Kenney is probably a closet case. Long anti-gay voting record. 50 years old, never married. No kids. Obsessed with gays.

Jason Kenny is a good man. Shut your mouth, R7.

R7: NDP can win in 4 years time. They just hold Edmonton and run the board in Calgary. They'll get a majority of seats. And it'll be easier if the economy still sucks there, and it will, because Tar Sands taint coming back.

R8 = Stephen Harper

Isn't Alberta the only province in Canada without provincial laws about indoor smoking? Not a surprise...

Can anyone believe that Manitoba has become one of the more progressive provinces? Yes, they have a con government, but nothing like Sask, Ont. and Alberta.

R8, I assume you are joking?

The sad thing about Ontario is that electing Doug Ford was a total fluke. The Conservatives had Brown- but he had to step down and then two women split the vote - if either Mulroney or Elliot had stepped down, Ford wouldn't be premier.

[quote] Jason Kenny [ sic ] is a good man. Shut your mouth

I told DataLounge in other threads John Baird was hanging out here!

The only big mistakes I think the Federal Liberals made are: reneging on First Nations/indigenous peoples promises, and ignoring proportional representation. These aren't calamitous enough to bring in Trump-lite as a governing party, but I'd like the Greens and NDP to be in a position to keep the Liberals honest.

The stereotype is that people become more conservative as they age, but for the first time since I moved to B.C. in 1976, I don't mind the NDP government. Gas prices shouldn't the be-all and end-all of a government.

I remember back in 2017 when I warned people that Canada was going to take a hard turn to the right just like in the United States and most people disagreed and said it would never happen her. Fact of the matter is, Canada in the last 40 years always follows US political trends with a 2 to 5 year lag. E.g. Mulroney was our Reagan, Chretien was our Clinton, Harper was our Bush, and Trudeau is our Obama. However, what is happening is unprecedented, with the exception of BC and PEI, Canada is has elected hard-right conservative governments. I also think Trudeau is doomed in October.

[quote]I told DataLounge in other threads John Baird was hanging out here!

Yeah, John Baird is another closeted conservative.

The difference is, he didn't vote against gays in the House of Commons the way Jason Kenney did.

But Baird refused to come out, and he is still not officially out even now that he has left politics.

Baird remains a huge right-winger.

R15: We know, cunt. You used to start a thousand threads saying so while pretending to support him. Couldn't stay quiet though, could ya? New Brunswick actually didn't elect the PCs to office and Nova Scotia Liberals retained their provincial government. And PEI going Green wouldn't be a move to the right either.

[quote] But Baird refused to come out, and he is still not officially out even now that he has left politics.

Wow, I thought it was close to common knowledge he trawled Church Street in Toronto, and I'm the last to know. I don't read that much of Frank Magazine, either.

R18, Baird refuses to actually say he is gay.

Rick Mercer even tried to get him to come out a few years ago when he was in Harper's cabinet, and he wouldn't do it.

Surely Baird's homosexual status is as widely known as Laureen Harper's lesbian status.

R15 nailed it - great observations. I can see a PM Doug Ford or Jason Kenney soon. Trudeau is doomed come Oct, he's a neoliberal with zero gravitas. I'll vote for him but he's been an incredibly disappointing PM.

r21 you are in his riding then? I have a tendency to suspect people who say "I'll vote for him" as trolls because it's a small minority of voters who have him as their Member of Parliament.

I doubt any DLer is in the Papineau riding (Trudeau's); I assume he means he will vote Liberal.

[quote]I doubt any DLer is in the Papineau riding (Trudeau's)

No one in Trudeau's riding reads DL?

Apologies R22, I meant I'll vote strategically (meaning vote liberal)

Yup, R21, R15. I volunteer for my MP, but I don't have a good feeling about this Oct. The trolls and social media got to work on JT almost as soon as he was elected. Soon after the 2015 election, they swooped in on Facebook, online news comment sections, Twitter etc...and the disturbing thing is that the media allows Con lies to stand while Trudeau's feet are held to the fire. The other day, Scheer was blaming the Federal Carbon Tax for the price of gas in BC, and NO ONE in the media called him on it. I like Trudeau, even met him when I attended a fundraiser for him last fall, but I've been nervous about him being a one term PM since the day he was elected. Anyone who watches social media knows he's attacked daily and with a vengeance.

I don't know why he can't get his message across. The Libs lowered the marginal tax rate for middle class Canadians from 23 to 20.5%, lowered the age for OAS from 67 to 65 after Harper raised it, reinstated the scientists working at the Experimental Lakes area, increased EI duration for those affected by the oil patch slow down, and so on. Yet, the Cons, who actually cut funding to Veterans, blame JT for the cut - partially thanks to JT's stupid comment to a veteran, "we can't afford to give what you're asking," and then announced that Canada would be accepting 10,000 refugees from Syria.

JT is charming and good looking, but "sunny ways" isn't working.

[quote]Trudeau is doomed come Oct, he's a neoliberal with zero gravitas. I'll vote for him but he's been an incredibly disappointing PM.

I don't think Trudeau is doomed since he won't be as easy to take down as some of the other leaders in Alberta, Ontario, etc. who have been defeated.

He still has decent numbers in the polls and is only a few points behind the Conservatives which can be made up during the Election, as he did in 2015.

But it will be a tougher fight this time.

Personally I believe unless Trudeau does something miraculous, Andrew Scheer is going to be the next Prime Minister. We are living in a moment in time when Conservative parties no longer need to even release a policy platform. All they have to do is engage with white nationalists and boom they win. There are three reasons for this 1) push back against the PC culture 2) frustrations with politics as usual 3) growing fears among white people they are losing power to minorities.

Yeah, R28, I sadly agree with you. Keep in mind that Trudeau's win was in part due to a backlash against the dreary Harper years.

[quote]No one in Trudeau's riding reads DL?

HIGHLY UNLIKELY.

Trudeau's riding

Twenty most common mother tongue languages (2016) : 49.7% French, 6.6% Spanish, 6.5% English, 5.9% Arabic, 4.2% Greek, 3.4% Italian, 2.7% Vietnamese, 2.4% Creole languages, 2.2% Panjabi, 2.1% Portuguese, 1.8% Bengali, 1.8% Urdu, 1.5% Tamil, 1.1% Cantonese, 1.0% Gujarati, 0.6% Mandarin, 0.6% Kabyle, 0.5% Khmer, 0.5% Turkish, 0.3% Polish, 0.3% Russian

Those of us on the left need to get our heads of the sand and realize we're obviously doing something wrong. People is people like R27 and others who are living in a bubble of denial that things will be ok. Over the last three years we've heard: Brexit won't happen, people of the UK vote for Brexit; Trump will never win, Trump wins; Democrats will win midterms by a landslide; they do OK but not the blue wave that was expected; Doug Ford will not be leader of the Ontario Conservatives; he wins the leadership; he won't win the election; he won the election. Alberta is not stupid enough to vote for Jason Kenney; they vote for Jason Kenney.

The only way we're going to start winning again is if we run engaging candidates who not only talk big change and fairness, but who actually do what they say.

There are no gays in Trudeau's part of Montreal, R30?

Montreal has a fairly large gay community.

12 years to what?

The conservatives were always going to win Alberta. The NDP win 4 years ago was a total fluke. That being said I agree with R32 we need to wake up to the fact we keep losing.

It is not an area where one thinks "GAY" R33.

As I mentioned, I like Trudeau, but I have to ask, do you guys think he was the right choice as Liberal leader? I get his appeal, but I wonder if he's too polarizing for many Canadians? Maybe someone like Marc Garneau would have been a better choice in '15 and Trudeau for 2020 or 2024?

I agree, R37. Marc Garneau would have been a much better choice, and I thought so at the time.

I was surprised when he dropped out, R39.

No.

Garneau has no charisma and had trouble just winning his own seat in 2011.

Trudeau has flaws, but he knew how to win and had the charisma to resonate with the Canadian people.

If Garneau had been leader the Liberals would have had another man at the helm who was intellectual & scientific, but who would have lost.

Well, no one wants Trudeau's "charisma" now.

People want a mature, sober, intelligent person. In Canada...and everywhere.

I guess that means Elizabeth May, Jagmeet Singh or Maxime Bernier. I can't see any other mature, responsible intelligent party leader not reliant on white nationalism.

[quote]People want a mature, sober, intelligent person. In Canada...and everywhere.

Is that what the U.S. has in the White House?

Or what Alberta & Ontario now have?

No, it's what NL, PE, NB, MB, and BC have.

Trudeau has great charisma, but he's also so polarizing. Garneau may be bland, (as was Harper), but I think he could have been seen as respectable and steady.

[quote]I guess that means Elizabeth May, Jagmeet Singh or Maxime Bernier. I can't see any other mature, responsible intelligent party leader not reliant on white nationalism.

Those people are all jokes! There is no one to vote for in Canada!

[quote]Or what Alberta & Ontario now have?

Alberta and Ont have voted for conservatives most of the time.

Garneau hardly had any support, R46. He never could have become Prime Minister.

The Liberals had to give him a safe seat in Montreal to run in, and even then he almost lost it in the NDP Quebec wave in 2011.

R37 Harper was always going to lose the 2015 election as it was a change election (Harper was an idiot for not resigning as PM a year earlier rather than go down in defeat). Up until September 2015, the NDP were in the lead of the polls but Trudeau managed to outflank them. He was, IMO, the leader the Liberals needed at that point in time. They were in third place and it appeared they would be in political oblivion for at least a decade and everyone underestimated him. He ran a fantastic campaign that effectively painted him as an agent of change. Fast forward four years later and his charm has pretty much worn off and moderate conservatives who held their nose and voted for him, plus further left voters who only voted for him to block Harper, will not vote for him. Added to that, he's not the change maker he painted himself to be. The cost of living is higher than ever and wages are deflated. People are pissed and as a result, they will vote against their best interest by electing a far right conservative government that will only make their lives harder.

I'm advising every Canadian left-of-centre person to exhort their right-leaning friends, family, associates to go with Maxime Bernier. I don't know that much about him, but it's enough for me that he's not into the alt-right, Russia-backed supremacist. Even Duplessis-era holdovers don't seem as noxious, if they put Canada first.

[quote]The Liberals had to give him a safe seat in Montreal to run in, and even then he almost lost it in the NDP Quebec wave in 2011.

Well, there is no longer an NDP wave, and people are sick of Trudeau. Garneau could have had national appeal.

Max is a racist douche, R51, but he's not a phoney panderer the way Scheer is.

All true, R50, but the shine is so worn off of JT. Maybe we need boring but effective again.

No, R52.

Respected Quebec commentator Chantal Hebert wrote a piece about Garneau during the Liberal leadership race called "Is Garneau Lost in Space" (a reference to him being an astronaut). She explored the reasons why as accomplished as he was scientifically, he had few political skills on the ground and had trouble winning his own riding.

Who do you guys see as the next Liberal leader? Freeland?

The timeline is less than 12 years. You can't say 12 years a year ago and then keep using the same number. It's now 11 years and some number of months.

Freeland has been a decent Foreign Affairs Minister, R55, particularly having to deal with Trump & his people.

But she's only about 5 feet tall, and I don't think she's fluent in French yet. I'm not sure if she has the gravitas to be PM some day, but who knows.

Geez, I thought every MP other than Preston Manning in his day was bilingual.

The majority of Canadian MPs are not bilingual.

There's a higher rate of bilingualism than in the past, but the majority of Anglophone MPs don't speak French, and there are some Francophone MPs from Quebec who are not fluent in English (eg. Trudeau's National Revenue Minister Diane Lebouthillier).

R54, That was then and this is now. I don't even think Chantal would still stand by that given what Trudeau has been like.

Freeland is repulsive. No one would vote for her.

I wondered about Brian Gallant becoming leader at some point in the future, but after he lost the provincial election in the fall, I'm not so sure.

[quote] Max is a racist douche, R51, but he's not a phoney panderer the way Scheer is.

Exactly. If the conservative, right-of-centre people HAVE to let their racist freak flag fly, I want them to put Canada first, and not Russia.

R60, Trudeau's popularity has certainly declined, but that doesn't change the fact that Garneau would have been another Ignatieff or Dion. Smart intellectually, but not capable politically.

And Chantal's recent columns still say Trudeau has a chance of winning again.

R64, He would have been more likeable than Ignatieff and more easy to understand than Dion.

I don't think Trudeau will win. A lot of people are turned off of him.

Yes, R65, Garneau would have been better than Ignatieff or Dion. But the Liberals still would have finished 3rd again.

As for Trudeau, I don't know whether he will win again, but I don know he's been underestimated before.

I couldn't stand Ignatieff. Ugh. Very smart, but very unlikable.

Maybe, but so many people were sick to death of Harper, R66.

R67. It's the "smart" that people can see through now. He didn't spend a lot of time in Canada, either.

A cat would have won against Harper.

People are that way re Trudeau now.

Harper's could possibly win again, by proxy anyway. He's certainly Scheer's puppet master.

r71 [bold]One[/bold] of Scheer's puppetmasters.

They are all puppets.

I predicted Canada's shift to the right back in 2016, but I believe it will be short lived. While I'm not downplaying the seriousness of string of victories for the far-right, I believe we are going to emerge from this better. Funny enough it was Pete Buttigieg who put into words what I have been feeling for a while: "a half-century of New Deal liberalism gave way to forty years of Reagan supply-side conservatism that created the terms for how Democrats as well as Republicans made policy. And that era, too, is now over. ... If America [indeed, the western world] today feels like a confusing place to be, it’s because we’re on one of those blank pages in between chapters."

We're now at a stage when the neo-liberalism and open markets of the Reagan, Thatcher and Mulroney no longer work as they have been exploited by the wealthiest 1%. Problem is the "political class" haven't yet caught up to this and as a result people are angry and sadly white nationalists have managed to play on this anger while at the same time using it against regular people by enriching their wealthy friends. The middle of the road politics of the 90s and early 00s is dead and in order to win the left have to shift their game plan and move towards more socialist mentality. In all honesty, the most important thing for most people are not the identity politics have been played up for years, but living wages, healthcare, and affordable housing. Anyone who has a dynamic platform that makes these things possible will win.

My prediction that Ford, Kenney and Scheer (in the likely event he wins) will all be one term leaders. I suspect NDP (if Notley says) will win again when many Albertans have buyers remorse, I predict refreshed Liberal party in Ontario will win in 2022.

From your mouth to Provincial voters' ears, r74

R74, The Left does not exist anymore. The main parties are one - pushing corporate power and poverty for the masses. No one to vote for.

[quote]A cat would have won against Harper.

Uh, no.

If you look at the polls for 2015 you will see that Harper & the Conservatives remained competitive throughout the year, and still finished a decent 2nd with nearly 100 seats.

They weren't as easy to defeat as you claim.

I don't want Scheer to win. I'm leaving Trumplandia to return home. I am proud that Canada doesn't have Murdoch-media properties. I'm comfortable with old-style conservatism but Scheer/Ford/Kenney/Harper/Baird can all suck my dick.

R15 So are you saying Scheer is our Trump? That doesn't really make any sense.

R32 There was a blue wave during the 2018 midterms. The Democrats won the popular vote for the House by 9.7 million votes -- the largest margin ever between the two parties in a midterm. And who was saying Doug Ford wouldn't win the election? He led every single final poll; I never saw anyone saying he definitely wouldn't win. People saying that Alberta wouldn't vote for Kenney? When did that happen?

Scheer is Trudeau lite. Here is talking about "LGBTQ2" Canadians.

R79 is correct. Ford was expected to win. The Ontario Conservatives had been ahead for months, including under their previous leader, Patrick Brown. The Liberals had been in power for 15 years, and Wynne had become unpopular.

And the Democrats picked up the largest number of seats in the Midterms since Watergate in the 1970's, so it was a Blue Wave.

R80, Scheer is trying to pretend to be a little more accepting of gays, but he voted against gay marriage, and may still be against it now according to his interview with Rosemary Barton on CBC last year.

I just heard him recently say that the gay marriage vote stands, R82.

Notice that nobody has come up with photos of Andrew Scheer at Pride parades? Even Maxime Bernier isn't afraid to be seen with LGBT people.

I'm hoping none of them will win.

"Pride" Parades aren't even gay anymore.

But he's still opposed to it personally, R83. So he's still a social conservative:

[quote]Andrew Scheer "I Dont Believe In Same Sex Marriage" (2016)

Canada doesn't need social conservatives, does it? Maybe Alberta and Saskatchewan and some regions of Quebec and PEI, but the rest of us treat social conservatives like Drumheller fossils and petroglyphs.

All of Saskatchewan, Alberta (aside from Edmonton), and most of rural Canada votes Con, R88.

Is that because they see themselves as "old-stock" and therefore super-privileged? Or are they as easily swayed as their southern kin?

Last I saw, the Liberals are as fond of global commerce as the Cons are.

"Oh please, please befoul our water and our earth with carcinogens and foul chemicals if it means chasing the Moo-slims and bumb-an-dits away!"

[quote]Last I saw, the Liberals are as fond of global commerce as the Cons are.

They are. All the parties are the same now.

r91 then there's no reason a well-informed, intelligent voter who isn't full of hate propaganda to vote for a Tory candidate in October.

They're not the same, R91.

Yes, the Liberals are too pro-corporate, just the way the Democrats are.

But just as people found out that there WERE differences between Bush & Gore and that there WERE differences between Hillary & Trump, there definitely WILL be differences between what you'll get with Andrew Scheer & the Cons and what you'll get with Trudeau & the Liberals.

Scheer is not Trump. They are all the same in Canada.

Trudeau is pro-pipeline, pro-rich, pro-secret trade deals, just like Harper.

R94,Trudeau is not as left on economic issues as his father was, I agree.

But he is not the same as a right-winger. He's progressive on gay issues, women's issues, believes in science, climate change, the environment, etc.

And he is not stacking the courts with as many right-wingers like Harper tried to do.

No, actually Trudeau's trans bill is bad for gay people, children and women - not progressive. It is also an anti-science ideology. He isn't serious about climate change and the environment. The pipeline push and a standing ovation from the oil industry in Texas prove that. (As well as taking an entourage of a hundred to Paris to talk about the environment....)

I think you are thinking of a right-left divide which does not really exist as it did four decades ago.

[quote]All of Saskatchewan, Alberta (aside from Edmonton), and most of rural Canada votes Con

With a few exceptions.

Long-term Liberal MP Ralph Goodale has held a riding in Regina for several decades.

And the NDP also holds a couple of seats in Saskatchewan.

The Liberals also won a couple seats in Calgary in the Trudeau wave in 2015.

Not that it counts for much, but northern Manitoba and other places in the north usually vote NDP or Lib.

True R98, it doesn't count for much.

Pierre Trudeau was a much smarter man & incredibly intellectually curious. His son is gorgeous but an empty suit. He's the anti-Bernie Sanders in so many ways & he will be responsible for us having a conservative PM in the next election.

About Ontario, people are forgetting that at one point the NDP were a point or two a head of PCs and were actually forming a realistic path to victory because people didn't like Ford. There are two reasons why the NDP didn't win: 1) NDP failed to seal the deal in the final 2 weeks of the campaign. They needed to switch their messages to that of a victor, a party that was ready to govern and a true agent of change but they stuck with Horwath's mixed "postive" campaign messaging. 2) They faced an attack on two fronts from both the Liberals and the PCs and didn't do anything to counter the arguments being put forward. Indeed, the Liberal's campaign became wholly anti-NPD in order to lure some Liberal voters back which effectively blocked an NDP victory (there was a point when polls were showing the Liberals would only win one seat). Wynne conceded defeat a week before the election and created this whole BS campaign about voting Liberal would equal a minority PC government.

Elizabeth May is one ugly, crazy cunt.

What is she saying today, R102?

R103 just in general.

The millennials on the Canadian subreddits worship her and the Greens.

She has some good qualities, R104, but there are reports from inside the Green Party that she has a massive ego and can be difficult to get along with.

It's good that she got elected to Parliament, but in her decade as leader she hasn't been able to get anyone else elected.

R104 I don't see much May/Green worship on any major subreddits. The Canada reddit is downright hostile towards her. And the Canada politics subreddit is predominantly Liberal/NDP supporters, I'd say.

Anyone who believes UCP will be held to one term knows nothing about Alberta.

Green Party leading in new Prince Edward Island election poll:

Green Party: 40%.

Progressive Conservative: 29%.

Liberal Party: 26%.

NDP: 3%.

Prince Edward Island is small potatoes.

If Trudeau was so pro gay he wouldn't be so tied to an ideology that wants to kill us.

He is tied to TWO ideologies that want to wipe out gay.

Not that again.

Trudeau is the most pro-gay PM Canada has ever had.

He has already appointed the first TWO openly gay cabinet ministers in history -- Scott Brison & Seamus O'Reagan.

First PM to go to Pride Parades.

And it was just announced there is a new coin being minted by the Federal Government today to honour gays.

Superficial pandering.

So if Andrew Scheer wins, does he bring back Harper's policies --putting a gag order on scientists, shredding environment studies, the Barbaric Cultural practice hotline etc?

This is what confuses me. The Greens are growing more credible as a party because climate change is recognized as real by more Canadians. i do not understand how hiding/ending scientific research on the environment, as the Conservatives must surely have kept on their platform, would be in the best interests of Canadians.

Canadians are not anti-environment. They just want to kick out Trudeau who everyone hates now..

R116- If Canadians are not anti-environment, then they'd better hold their nose and vote for Trudeau. The party platforms are pretty clear no matter who leads the parties. Conservatives get you tax cut for the rich, more taxes on the poor, less money for social safety net, more pipelines and less environmental controls, less gun control. Maybe they'll even try some abortion restrictions or a rollback on gay rights.

Conservatives in Canada and Republicans in the US are basically cut from the same cloth...even if the Canadian cloth is a little softer to the touch.

Trudeau is just as corporate as Scheer. People are unhappy with the "choices" but feel strongly about kicking out Trudeau.

R117 gives a good summary of the situation.

R115, Conservative governments are already campaigning against the carbon tax and are already trying to put roadblocks in the way of environmental progress.

How does a true "independent"/swing voter with above-average knowledge of national and global politics fail to connect the Conservative Party of Canada to US Republican Party?

Is it possible to view the GOP as gutless oligarch-suckling sociopaths and present evidence that senior CPC members are outwardly critical of our southern neighbour?

There are a couple of reasons why conservatives still win elections:

1) Conservative voters don't give a shit who the leader of their party and politicians with in the party will fall in line at least in public (e.g. it's well known most of the Ontario PC caucus HATE Ford but he won the election so they're all falling in line). The left is too ideological about party leaders and more prone to resisting anything they don't like about that person.

2) The left vote gets split because there are too many party options. Whenever the conservatives win, you can bet that more people for other parties than for them. In the Ontario election 60% of the province did not vote conservative but the vote got too split between Liberals, NDP and Greens. I keep saying the left parties need to unite if they want to start winning almost constantly.

3) Economically the Liberals and Conservatives are too similar, and socially NDP and Liberals to are too similar. People have the perception that basically the same shit will happen regardless of who is in power.

The Conservatives had a full mandate and didn’t roll back gay rights or abortion r117.

I don't know that Conservatives are cut from the same cloth. I can get along very well with conservative relatives in Canada, they don't do dumbass vitriolic hostile shit like brigade and shun and can have decent conversations. The US ones spaz out if anyone should even wrinkle their nose in disapproval at dem dere real good Christian faker/pickpockets.

Not true R117....Trudeau is pushing that pipeline forward no matter what.

The pipeline is needed. But I think the Liberals will delay approval until after the October election.

He's just such a douche. He doesn't seem to have a sincere bone in his body. He's Hillary with a dash of charisma and better hair. Just like Hillary supporters in NY an CA his supporters don't realize how much he is hated outside of Vancouver and Toronto.

He really is, r126, and it’s all self inflicted.

His popularity has certainly taken a hit, but he's not hated everywhere.

He still has better approval numbers in many places than Scheer and Singh and still attracts big crowds according to the journalists covering him.

It would be ridiculous to attempt to ban gay marriage or abortion. The SCC has ruled on both issues. Thankfully, the SCC is not like the SCOTUS. Harper tried to appoint a candidate, who, apparently, would follow Harper's line on the law. It was challenged and the SCC ruled that the attempted appointment (made through a budget bill!) was unconstitutional.

There is zero evidence the Harper government intended to change the laws on gay marriage or abortion. In fact? Harper specifically stated there would be no vote on abortion.

I voted for Trudeau but now regret it. Harper was a better PM.

Good PMs don't initiate constitutional crises that necessitate the intercession of the Governor General.

Recent polls have the Green Party really surging. While I think their actual vote share will be lower than they poll (as it typically is), I could see them eating into NDP support. The NDP could be decimated this election. We know they're already going to be all but wiped out in Quebec, but with a third of their MPs retiring and a lack of funds, I could also see them collapsing in the rest of Canada as well. That could help both the Greens and Liberals.

The pipeline is absolutely not needed & AB is a redneck wasteland

R130- Stephen Woodworth who was a Conservative MP tabled an abortion restriction bill that Harper had to vote against - but the fact that a Conservative MP even attempted it just shows that the Conservative Party is always trying to find a way to muscle through restrictions. On top of that, didn't Harper push through a regulation that no foreign aid would be given to any foreign pro-choice services?

The idea that Conservatives in Canada consider abortion rights to be a closed subject just doesn't point to the facts.

You'd think that Alberta would have already learned their lesson. The whole world is moving slowly towards less reliance on oil so wouldn't now be a good time for Alberta to diversify? They shouldn't be putting all their economic eggs in the oil basket because we've already seen what happens when the price of oil drops.

It's hard to believe that in a province the size of Alberta that the ONLY thing they can develop for economic security is oil.

Also in terms of environment, isn't there some research being done on moving oil in a solidified fashion? I thought I saw something about transporting oil in small semi-solid "balls" so that if the transport broke down, nothing in the environment would end up contaminated and there wouldn't be any need for clean up because the oil wouldn't seep into anything. Why not put more money into that research since it would be the only way to keep the environment safe without killing the oil industry?

You’re an idiot r133. Do you like healthcare? Quality education? How the fuck do you think that’s paid for???

R135, oil is not the only industry in Alberta. Plus if you believe the world is moving from oil, you need a lesson in reality.

Do you use a computer? A cell phone? A sidewalk? A road? All are made with oil.

R132 The NDP elected the wrong leader. Nothing against Jagmeet Singh, but he's really just Trudeau-lite. Charlie Angus, despite his reputation for being a bit of a drama queen, would have been a better leader.

Someone mentioned Brian Gallant, the former Liberal Premier of New Brunswick, as a potential leadership for the federal Liberals. Without getting into too much details Gallant didn't marry that beard just to stay out of politics. Expect him to run for a federal Liberal seat in October which he'll win given his personal popularity in NB and then he'll eye the Liberal leadership Trudeau loses in October.

[quote]There is zero evidence the Harper government intended to change the laws on gay marriage or abortion.

Actually, you're forgetting that one of the very first things Harper did in 2006 when he became Prime Minister was to hold a vote in the House of Commons to reopen the gay marriage debate.

There weren't enough votes for it to happen, but he allowed most of his Conservative MPs to vote to reopen the gay marriage issue. If the Conservatives hadn't only had a Minority at that time, it would have been a dicier situation for gays. It was the Liberals, NDP & BQ that stopped gay marriage being tampered with again.

R136: With taxes, jackass. I must ask you to now sit down, shut up, and stop wasting this thread's time.

Exactly R139, the future is green energy & China is leading the way there.

For R136 - we have 12 years you dipshit

Taxes from oil sands, idiots @ r139 and r141, account for just under 10% of government revenue. Alberta sent over $20 billion more in revenue to the feds than they received back in 2016, the height of oil collapse in the province. It’s sent over $600 billion more for distribution to other provinces in the past four decades. Sure, give it up and see how your standard of living fares, you know nothing assholes.

Oil is not just about cars. Bitumen is used for various purposes in the construction industry and to pave roads. Oil is used in the pc or mobile you are using to post here.

At this time, green energy is not efficient. China still imports dirty coal, a lot of shipped through BC ports (no green protests about that!), to meet its industrial needs. Germany has upped coal fire plants as well. Alberta’s NDP paid over $2 billion in subsidies for electricity, which will be the case indefinitely, and had had to purchase electricity from Montana, when for the past decade it’s been in surplus and cheap in Alberta, thanks to shuttering coal.

Green energy no doubt is the future but we are nowhere near where it is affordable and sustainable.

If I were Alberta I'd be wanting to beat Quebec as the first one to leave Canada.

How do we pay for this? Taxes! AOC does read datalounge!

R142: MARY!!! We found the oil slut.

The R0C is the oil slut. They all spread their legs for 600 billion.

Here is the oil slut

Stop swooning over Justin Trudeau. The man is a disaster for the planet

Trudeau is obviously flawed, but at least he & the Liberal Party believe in science & climate change and are trying to do something about a carbon tax.

If Scheer & the Conservatives win in October, you can kiss any progress on the Environmental file goodbye.

No, r145. Just a realist.

How does a carbon tax change behaviour? It hasn’t where I live. It would have to be at least 10x higher before people stop driving and heating their homes.

The US is Israel's bitch and Canada is the US's bitch

Canada is really far more like the US politically than either they or we would like to admit.

It has the high density population "coastal elites" (NY and CA for the US, Toronto and Vancouver for CAN)

It has a heartland that has very different priorities- for CAN it's more oil whereas US is a mix of oil/gas, agriculture and some other stuff.

R150: You really are just a stupid ass troll. The goal is to decrease use of carbon products, not stop driving and heating the home, you fucking twat.

You're done. Now, LEAVE ME! I will not see you again!

Cute Green Party candidate killed in canoeing accident in Prince Edward Island:

I love Pierre Poilievre. He always kills me during Q&A

You’re the twat, r153. A broadly based carbon tax is designed to change the behaviour of consumers, and it’s failed to do that.

You are mistaken r152. Vancouver is mostly a blip in Canada. Everything revolves around the Montreal-Ottawa-Toronto triangle.

Alberta is about far more than oil. However, the revenue from oil and gas generally is higher, so in that respect, it dwarfs other industries.

There is a lot of agriculture throughout the prairies (Alberta, Saskatchewan, and Manitoba).

The gay Premier of Prince Edward Island lost his seat in the election tonight.

So both openly-gay Premiers have now lost (Kathleen Wynne in Ontario was the other one).

Of course, many people suspect new Alberta Premier Jason Kenney is a closet case.

I hate to say it but it would be beautiful never to have to look at or listen to Kathleen Wynne

Trudeau on 'The Simpsons':

it's turning out just like I said it would.

So if Scheer wins, will his first duty be to invite Trump to Ottawa? He'd have to, wouldn't he? Like Mulroney and Reagan. A Conservative PM would look kind of funny if he didn't invite a Republican President.

The Ghost and Mrs. Muir

R161, how is it turning out?

Turning out like the Green Party of Prince Edward Island is in a position to choose which of the PC Party or the Liberal Party it will form a coalition with. I suspect the Green Party will align itself with the party most likely to live up to its promises to incorporate the Green Party's promises and goals into its mandate.

It looks like the new PC Government is going to happen, R165.

But it won't be a far-right government -- the new Premier already says he won't fight the carbon tax:

Some people within the LBGTQ community in Canada are not happy about the government's "gay coin." There's a feeling that Trudeau is capitalizing on a mythical event since homosexuality was not actually decriminalized in 1969 - an amended was added to the criminal code that basically allow men over the age of 21 to engage in anal sex in their private home. Nothing legally changed and gay men have been continued to be arrested even as late at 2016.

And so it begins.. Globe and Mail: Conservative politicians, oil executives map out strategy for ousting Liberals in growing collaboration

[quote]Top Conservative politicians met with oil-industry executives at a private conference to map out strategy for ousting Justin Trudeau’s Liberals in a sign of growing collaboration between the Alberta-based sector and its political backers ahead of the federal election this fall.

[quote]Federal Conservative Party Leader Andrew Scheer delivered a keynote address, the document showed. His national campaign director, Hamish Marshall, and veteran Conservative organizer Mark Spiro spoke on a panel about “rallying the base” by using friendly interest groups that operate independently of the party.

[quote]Industry supporters have been energized by the election of Alberta premier-designate Jason Kenney, whose United Conservative Party swept to power with a populist campaign that stoked industry grievances and turned on a hard-line pledge to sue environmental critics, cut corporate taxes and roll back policies aimed at combating climate change. Some hope those same tactics can deliver a federal Conservative triumph this fall.

Trudeau showing his assets during the flood relief:

Another pic of Trudeau in action:

^Bags of money from Lavalin

Globe and Mail: Conservative politicians, oil executives map out strategy for ousting Liberals in growing collaboration

I bet CPC uses "climate change is a myth" talking points while ON, QC and NB residents are still awaiting insurance payments .

R171 = Andrew Scheer, busy trying to pressure his wife into having a 6th child.

Most of the oil industry doesn’t dispute climate change, and supports oversight of industry.

I don’t think the Conservatives will deny climate change. I think they are trying to develop a strategy they believe is more effective, though I don’t know how successful they will be. But they can’t go into an election with no alternative strategy.

Economists have stated carbon taxes work IF there is little regulation. Canada has the worst of both worlds- lots of regulation, even government picking winners and losers, and carbon taxes.

Justin looks so natural and genuine filling those sandbags . LOL. Does he keep hot sauce in his purse?

[quote]Green Party of Prince Edward Island

Every time I hear "Prince Edward Island" I roll my eyes.

PEI has a population of 150,000 people. That is basically 5 rural, small cities. It doesn't matter.

You're right. They don't matter. Only campaign in the Toronto area and the Vancouver area. It's a sure path to victory. Ig fucking nore everyone else.

Well, in a close election, every seat matters.

Obviously most seats are in the big cities and surrounding suburbs, but other seats matter, too.

And they're also hayseeds who grow potatoes who also vote conservative. FUCK PEI.

R179, PEI usually votes Liberal federally.

Trudeau won 4 out of 4 seats in PEI in 2015.

Toronto (Includes Mississauga / Brampton / Etc.), Vancouver, Montreal and POSSIBLY Calgary & Edmonton.

[quote]Does he keep hot sauce in his purse?

What does this phrase mean?

r179 PEI Provincial election percentages: 30.62% Green, 29.52% Liberal, 2.99% NDP, 36.52% Conservative. Most PEI voters don't cast ballots for Conservatives.

PEI voted conservative for their provincial election this year. They're split between "Conservative" and "Liberal" generally.

BTW Americans : Canada's "Liberal Party" is Centrist. The PC's are Right. NDP is left. Green is far left.

General / provincial, whatever.

R182 it’s a reference to Hillary saying she keeps hot sauce in her purse, which was seen as pandering to Black people (even though her fondness for hot sauce has been documented over decades).

R186, how does that apply to Justin lifting sandbags for flood relief?

Alberta will not elect any Liberals, r181.

If Canadians get to know Jagmeet Singh, who has impressed me as very thoughtful and the best of the 3 major party leaders, I think Vancouver could split between the NDP and the Liberals.

I thought Scheer's talking point against Trudeau was the SNC scandal? Now their talking about is going to be about carbon tax?

It sounds more like their campaign plan is to throw everything at the wall and see what sticks. They probably shouldn't follow Ford's Ontario plan to screw around with health care because that's landing with a thud.

They were attacking the carbon tax before SNC. The problem is the Conservatives offer no solution, so they have to find a position.

American here. Canadian snowbirds from Alberta, Saskatchewan and Manitoba seem to absolutely detest Trudeau. They are obsessed with him. Very bizzarre.

That's because they're old, R191.

My niece just turned 18 and also hates Trudeau.

I'm with him!

And his ass, R194?

FUCK OFF People like R195.

Why so hostile, R196?

We always talk about Trudeau's ass here.

R191- Alberta is like Texas and the other prairies are similar- so no, it's not really that bizarre.

R198 - I grew up on the Canadian prairies, and years after I had left home, my parents moved into a rural town of around 2000 people, after selling the farm. I don't really know why, but my father was always a staunch socialist, and even once tried to get all his neighbours to join a farmers union.

And in this very conservative, and wealthy Alberta town, after all the votes were counted in a federal election, it turned out the NDP candidate received two votes. . .

R199, in the old days, the Prairies used to be more NDP than they are today. Today they are much more Conservative.

Under NDP leaders like Tommy Douglas (grandfather of actor Keifer Sutherland) the NDP used to do well as the voice of the Prairies.

R200 = Interesting that when people struggle, they tend to left leaning in their politics, and form co-operatives, credit unions, establish single payer health care, and help their neighbours. And then when they eventually become rather wealthy, decades later, they become greedy, I've got mine, fuck you conservatives.

R193 No one gives a fuck — here or anywhere else — about your fucking niece’s opinions.

Well r202, I don’t give a fuck about your opinion either.

R201, I disagree. UCP won the last election precisely because of Alberta's struggling economy.

Most left leaning parties around the world now think they're running a Twitter account instead of a party and/or government. That's why they're losing support.

R188

Really? You must be paying attention to a different Jagmeet Singh, because all I've seen so far, even in his leadership campaign, is a Trudeau-lite - too many of Trudeau's liabilities, with few of his assets. I think the NDP ended up repeating one of their major mistakes lately, choosing a leader, as if they were fighting the previous election, not the next one. He has all the gravitas of someone running for student council.

R174 The environment has always been the Conservatives' weakest link. I don't expect they'll reveal their environmental platform until the election, however articles like R168 don't help their already weak credentials on the environmental file. It leaves them wide open to the suggestion that their climate policies, whenever they do come out with them, are crafted by and for the oil patch in Calgary. The problem with their approach so far, is that they are effectively cornered advocating against a market-based solution like carbon pricing and in favour of a heavy regulatory approach. Given that most of their base is already skeptical to climate change to begin with and industry is generally less in favour of regulations than a broad-based carbon tax, I'm not sure where that will leave them.

Caveat to the oil industry supporting oversight and climate change action - yes, the big players are in favour, they know they have to think long-term. Smaller players however are not, as they feel this is an increased barrier to their entry. It's those whom the Conservatives are playing to.

Agreed, R206.

Tom Mulcair may have lacked the charisma and personal touch with voters that Jack Layton had, but he went into the 2015 Election with a lead in the polls and was seen as a potential Prime Minister.

Singh is still way behind Trudeau & Scheer on whether he would make a good Prime Minister, and the NDP is still a distant 3rd in the polls. They're in a much weaker position than at this point in 2015.

R159 I’ll take Kathleen Wynne’s WASP lesbian teacher voice any day over Doug Ford’s “oratory” (if you can call it that), which lands somewhere between carnival barker and used car salesman.

[quote]Another pic of Trudeau in action:

Thanks, R170. Sadly, not everyone appreciated his contribution.

The poor guy can't win. When he helped, his critics said it was just a photo-op. If he didn't help, they'd say he was callous and uncaring.

Couldn't he have found a pair of jean that didn't look like he just bought them that morning?

His downfall started with the dreadful India trip. Whoever planned that fiasco, should have been fired.

Do people hate his wife. I've seen clips of her and every single one has made me loathe her. Especially the singing shit. This is about the cringiest thing I've ever seen in politics. The first time I saw it I cringed so hard my bone marrow leaked out of my eyes.

I liked the one who dressed up in a Star Trek uniform

More singing for her fellow human beings. She wrote the song and trust her it wasn't planned.

I predict that once Trudeau is no longer Prime Minister, they will get a divorce. Sophie all but acknowledged that Justin has fucked around on her (this was before the election) and since the rumours of his affair with a Cabinet Minister in 2018, her public profile has dropped a lot. My guess is since it's an election year she'll be seen more.

The reason why the right is doing so well right now is 1) centrist politics is dead as people are becoming more radicalized on either side due to anger (see point 3).

2) PC culture has gone too far a lot of people and folks[particularly white people] are feeling that this whole "multiculturalism" is costing them jobs. This is not actually the case but that is how people are interpreting things like diversity quotas.

3) People are angry with status quo as they feel increasingly left behind. The right has capitalized on this by tapping into people's anger and their nostalgia for the good old days. Brexit, Trump, Ford etc. Yes, some people believe them and are just racist, homophobic ass-holes, but a lot of people voted for them out of political protest e.g. anything has to be better than they way they are now. "Make America Great Again" plays into nostalgia when people [incorrectly] feel there was more opportunity for them.

This is why Trump will likely win in 2020 not people like him but Biden (who will likely be crowned the democratic nominee) is just another status quo politician.

[quote]I predict that once Trudeau is no longer Prime Minister, they will get a divorce. Sophie all but acknowledged that Justin has fucked around on her (this was before the election) and since the rumours of his affair with a Cabinet Minister in 2018, her public profile has dropped a lot. My guess is since it's an election year she'll be seen more.

It's possible that Justin & Sophie will split some day, although Trudeau posted a photo of them together for her birthday a few days ago.

You're right that there are a lot of rumors in Ottawa (which the press is aware of) that Trudeau has had affairs.

Could you imagine being married to her though? She seems insufferable. I bet she cries a lot and is on every psychotropic drug you could imagine.

It was probably her that thought up all this shit too.

[quote]Sophie all but acknowledged that Justin has fucked around on her

It's not surprising -- a lot of people want a piece of Justin's hot ass.

r218 Many women who marry closet cases are.

R218, like his mother, Margaret.

Bingo, r222

Sophie seems more stable to me than Margaret.

It's well known in Ottawa in that Trudeau had an affair with a female staff member before he became Prime Minister, and there is a great deal of gossip that he had a fling with cabinet minister Mélanie Joly while she was minister of Canadian heritage.

R213 If she makes Conservatives’ collective heads explode, she’s a-okay in my books! Technically she’s not even “in politics,” so I couldn’t care less..

R225, I thought the rumor was that Trudeau had an affair with Environment Minister Catherine McKenna.

Liberals lead in new Quebec poll from Leger:

Liberals 31%

Conservatives 23%

Bloc 23%

Greens 9%

NDP 6%

People's Party 4%

* NDP at risk of losing all 15 Quebec seats since they have fallen to single digits.

R228, so, in the province of Quebec, 69% do not support the Liberals. Unbelievable.

R229, Quebec isn't in love with any of the parties right now, but Trudeau & the Liberals have the edge there. Looks like Trudeau won't win as many seats in Quebec as originally expected.

But it's the NDP who are in the most trouble -- they could lose everything.

Conservative leader Andrew Scheer being really super comfortable with all this gay stuff..

Where are all the people that post in Justin Trudeau threads that keep insisting he has this election in the bag?

Where are they in this thread?

I'm glad for this thread, because there is much more realistic commentary about Trudeau chances. Anytime a Justin Trudeau thread pops up and people start talking about his chances or losing, trolls always swoop in and accuse you of being a Russian troll!

New poll shows that support for PM Trudeau, Liberals has plunged

The political scientist says people are TIRING of Justin Trudeau and his non-answers. And Andrew Scheer popularity is RISING. Plus the political scientist says there is NO WAY for Trudeau to turn this around

Doesn't look good for Trudeau

[quote] I remember back in 2017 when I warned people that Canada was going to take a hard turn to the right just like in the United States and most people disagreed and said it would never happen her. Fact of the matter is, Canada in the last 40 years always follows US political trends with a 2 to 5 year lag. E.g. Mulroney was our Reagan, Chretien was our Clinton, Harper was our Bush, and Trudeau is our Obama. However, what is happening is unprecedented, with the exception of BC and PEI, Canada is has elected hard-right conservative governments. I also think Trudeau is doomed in October.

If you write this in any Justin Trudeau thread, the trolls swoop in and call you a Russian Troll.

R234: Hiya, SKANK. You got your original thread closed, tried to bring back another dead thread, I SPANKED you there and now you post this shit here. I'm here to beat you again. That video says NOTHING of the sort you typed. You are a liar and spam troll. Not to mention you're talking to yourself in this thread.

I can't wait till you get your red tag, you cinnamon roll retard.

Maybe the anti-Trudeau troll is Andrew Scheer!

R236 is the Troll I talked about in R235

Enjoy being on IGNORE so us adults can have an adult discussion

R238: Adults don't post the same illiterate pro-right wing lies verbatim in 3 separate threads within an hour of each other. Dumb ass skank.

R227 Yes he [allegedly] fucked around with Catherine McKenna.

R234 The summer months into September is when the election will largely be decided. My gut is telling me Trudeau will lose and that we're going to be stuck with a Conservative Government. What even more unusual is that every province, except for BC, will have Conservative government in place as well. Canada is so fucked.

The new Ipsos poll shows the Liberals have recovered a couple points since the SNC-Lavalin controversy has subsided.

Ipsos/Global News (Apr. 23-25, 1,000 surveyed online):

36% CON (-4)

32% LIB (+2)

19% NDP (-2)

Justin should have grabbed that "volunteer" at the sandbagging event, R210, and tossed him to the ground a la Jean Chrétien and his famous Shawinigan Handshake.

The anti-Trudeau troll could be Sophie.

I don't think she would post about anything but herself. So if we ever have a Sophie thread we know she's here.

Maybe if we're lucky Sophie will get mad with Justin one day and post his nude pics.

R242 I'm thinking either minority Liberal or Conservative government. I think a weak NDP (particularly in Quebec) that is seeing support siphoned off by the Greens could push it to the LPC.

The one rumor I hear about Justin is that he's an alcoholic and it's starting to get pretty bad.

R248, is Seamus O'Regan his drinking buddy?

Justin is not known for being a heavy drinker, so I'm curious where you heard those rumors.

Speaking of Seamus O'Regan, we had a DL poster here a couple of years ago who claimed he gave him a blowjob.

Liberal MP Andrew Leslie announced that he is not running for re-election. Leslie will be testifying for the defence against the Trudeau government in the Mark Norman trial.

R253, as has been pointed out on Twitter today, Andrew Leslie is not really testifying 'against the Trudeau government' -- it's more accurate to say it's a case where one military officer is vouching for the character of another fellow military officer.

Some good thoughts in this post given all the shit doing down with Doug Ford right now.