Why do the straights have crotch fruit if all they ever do is complain about them?

[quote]No one talks about the isolation. No one talks about the loss of identity. No one talks about the loneliness. No one talks about losing your sense of self. No one talks about how you had to give up your career because it's cheaper for you to stay home.

Who is she kidding? They can't STOP talking about that shit.

Because it's what they were made to do.

I knew it would suck to have kids, so I didn't.

Because they have no fucking imagination and just go through life checking off boxes on a To-Do list, and having kids is one of them.

Why do they go to their kids' sports practices? I can understand going to the occasional game, but practice?

I know most people don't agree with this (at least when not on DL), but most str8 people have kids so that they will fit in with all their friends, who mostly all have kids. Most people are scared to death to stick out like a sore thumb.

99% of that shit is avoidable if you stay away from straight people.

Breeders like to complain. Always the victim.

Moms have a lot of demands placed on them these days. Succeeding in their jobs/careers, raising a family and maintaining a home. It's not easy, and they need support. If they need to vent, let them vent.

R6 Totally agree. They use kids to "fit in" and to show their FB audience..."hey look at us...we're normal!" But also, it's called grabbing the husbands by the balls..."you can't escape me now bastard..we have kids TOGETHER".

More than that, those of us without kids aren't allowed to complain about being exhausted or anything because we chose not to have them.

I imagine that being married, breeding, mortgage-paying heterosexuals must feel a bit like being slowly squeezed to death in a vice these days.

Declining incomes and a rising cost of living means constant unrelieved financial pressure, comparing today's reality to your parents' lives and your own expectations means a constant sense of disappointment and inferiority, the lies on social media make those feelings worse, the pressure to maintain a perfect home and raise perfect children means constant overwork and exhaustion, the shitty parenting methods in vogue guarantees that your kids will disappoint you, etc.

And of course it's totally not socially acceptable to say what's really bothering you - that you don't adore your kids and that you resent giving up the person you were for their sake. So there's the misery of living a lie, on top of everything else.

It's more than just fitting in. Couples with children will drop their single friends without children very quickly and mostly only participate in other activities with other people with children.

R1 haha so true. You would really think from the whining that it's 1789 and there is not much in the way of effective contraception (or abortion ). It seems every week, there's a fluff piece in some Huffington Post type rag titled something like "Breaking Down A Mommy Taboo ". It's usually accompanied by no actually taboo breaking, just a self pitying suburban Frau talking about how annoying her brats are or how she sometimes wishes for more sleep ,blah blah blah. Guess what honey , everyone else hates your kids too. Where are our think pieces?

They have kids for status, and then expect anyone they can get their hands on, to help raise them. Women who don't want to work, also have kids to pretend to be something more than a couch potato.

Gotta follow the LifeScript or be exiled. Cry me a river, loser mommies!

They have to think about someone other than themselves now. It must throw them into a narcissistic rage.

Kids are born to propagate the species. It’s biology. The problem, as I see it, you have all these college educated women having kids and then acting like it’s rocket science. It’s so complicated and intricate these women need to broadcast how wonderful/awful it is, and aren’t they saints for choosing this profession? When in reality, you civilize the little buggers and send them off. Teaching them please and thank you isn’t enough, little Braedon needs to know algebra by kindergarten. It’s not ever about the kid, it’s always about the mom.

Poor and stupid. Just what America needs.

I think having children in your 30s helps a bit so you don’t feel like a lol of your youth was stolen by your child. Also making the man be a partner instead of sole bread winner. Kids are sick? Great let’s see who’s turn it is to stay home or who can manage it today based on work obligations.

I love that my boss is an aware mother that claims to have gone into motherhood, 3 kids, with her eyes wide open. When her kids are sick, she and her husband will strategize together. Aparently they try not to view on career as more important than another.

The hottest guy in my floor, is this 31 year old father with another on the way. He is soft spoken, workouts 4 times a week, eats healthy, has a normal social life, and a ass to die for (former soccer player). Just all around a perfect specimen of a man, all the gays and fraus would do him if single. He really lights up when taking about his daughter. He makes me want to have a kid the way he talks about his children. I get the draw, but you’ve got to be honest.

I don't know, OP. Why don't you ask your parents why they had you.

Generalize much, gays? Lord, do you gays even know any straight women. I can only imagine the venon you gays would spew if I were to make some general statement about your lifestyle. You gays can dish it out but you can't take it.

Haha that pic @ OP is hilarious

R20 that hot soccer player is molesting his daughter

The ones who complain the most are always the parents who have the most financial and social support.

The gays are happily following along the straight breeder narrative, OP, and are just as likely to act like martyrs for springing more sproggen on the planet.

[quote]Lord, do you gays even know any straight women.

Yes, they all come here for some reason.

R25, the people with the most financial and social support usually have the least realistic expectations.

So they have an excuse to complain, OP.

To my knowledge my parents never complained about having me r21, unlike yours who left you on the steps of a church. Do fuck off.

I kind of understand having two. You don't know what you're getting into, really, and you fear never having that storied special experience - I mean look at Elton John and Michael Ja... well never mind him, but you envy people who have someone who loves them unconditionally (and they think that'll continue when they're old). And having one would make you worry about having an only child who'd be lonely or spoiled or whatever.

But three? I mean you've had that unique experience, two times over. So WTF?? All I can figure is some people like having kids. What else could possibly explain it?

Accidents R31. I am one of three and the last one was an accident.

All these complaining fraus out themselves as idiotic followers with no capacity for independent thought.

It was your choice to become a mother. Why didn’t you think it through before making that decision?

R15 you just described my sister.

So they can make more gaylings... otherwise I’m against crotch fruit

One of the main reasons that people breed is to gain attention. Complaining about their children is attention-seeking behavior.

A big part of the problem is that we tell women they can have high powered careers and then all of a sudden the reality of having kids hits and they're totally unprepared for how much time and energy are actually needed.

Some of them are okay with outsourcing the whole thing, hiring nannies and all that, but most women seem to want to actually be there for the kids and are torn between this notion of "women should be in high power jobs" and a corporate environment that makes no time for kids.

The luckier ones are married to men who also have high powered careers and they stop working, and nothing is more dangerous than a mother with degrees from Yale and Harvard Law School attempting to channel those skills into being a full time mom.

R31 I think with some people it's a compulsion and for women a way to avoid the workforce. In most middle class families, a third child significantly reduces the quality of life for the existing kids. Two is enough.

It seems to me that the bigger issue is, why do gay men resent straight women so much? Is it because you are like us (share common interests, etc.) and you see in us what you hate in yourselves? Do you consciously or subconsciously want to be women, and hate us for having the lives and straight men you truly desire? A combination of both? There is pathology at play here, and I'd just like to know if you understand why you hate us so.

In this day and age, having children is a choice. I have no sympathy for parents (female OR male) who whine about “how hard it is” to raise children. No one forced you to have them.

It’s particularly annoying to hear complaining from the parents of twins or triplets. Uh, when you forked over hundreds of thousands of dollars for fertility treatments (or got your insurance company to do it), did you read the fine print about the likelihood of multiples?

Most straight women hate other straight women too, R39. It's not a mystery.

Most of us don't hate you R39

Though reading DL you'd easily come to that conclusion.

I think there is a sizable population of DLers who do fit your analysis

They think they are doing us a favor by breeding, that's why the rest of the humanity must know how hard is the life of this heroes.

Having kids is egocentric - the end. There is absolutely no reason other than narcissism to choose to have a kid. That - and the stupidity of getting pregnant by accident which is scarily how most kids are conceived even in 2019. It’s a crime,

Long acting birth control and cheap, easily available abortion should be encouraged. But even though it’s a feminist cause, it’s being blocked by the crazy number of women who are “pro-life” because they had their baby and think it’s the most important thing they’ve done.

[quote]Couples with children will drop their single friends without children very quickly and mostly only participate in other activities with other people with children.

Thank god. Just keep them away from me.

Christ what a bunch of shallow people are on this thread. And fucking stupid too.

[quote]There is pathology at play here, and I'd just like to know if you understand why you hate us so.

DL is spilling over with pathologies. Your own may be: hanging out on a site with people you find hateful. I'd just like to understand why you do that...

Fuck off Frau cunt r39.

[QUOTE] They have kids for status, and then expect anyone they can get their hands on, to help raise them.

This. A million times this. My best friend of more than 20 years is a a straight female and there is almost nothing I wouldn't do for her. Anything she needs from help with moving to cleaning to shopping to borrowing money to bailing her out of jail to giving her a fucking kidney. I love her dearly and would sacrifice anything for her.

Except spend five minutes with her fucking kid.

You made that choice, hunty. Not me. I'm not kid friendly and I'm not a fucking babysitter. And I don't owe you that just because you made that life choice.

Fuck that noise.

r19, did you not see how 2016 came out?

No one Hates women more then another woman. So the nasty Gash that post remarks about ' Gays not even knowing other women ' can take that nonsense over to some Mommy blog....We have your number...Dear.

Right r51. She’s probavlt the same Frau-type who posts inspirational quotes on Facebook all day but sits in inbox desperatley ripping other women on her timeline apart to her fellow fraus. GTFO with that.

My brother in law wanted kids with every fiber of his being. He now has three children he adores. One day he said "Why didn't my parents tell me that I was so lacking in imagination? I had no idea how hard this would be".

These women seem to expect praise for doing the job they're supposed to do, raising & caring for the children they chose to have. They're not warriors or heroes but they like to think they are. I'm a single, straight woman with a son and I've never once felt the need to go on Facebook and whine about how hard it is. They also like to post ridiculous sayings like "If he can't cope with you at your worst, he doesn't deserve you at your best". Usually after said boyfriend or husband has dumped them!

Frau cunt @ r39, those reasons you suggest seem about right, plus another - annoying differences in the social behavior of men and women are overlooked in the fog of attraction and the chase for sex. The Gays lack this mediating impulse.

My own mother likes to remind my brother and I how much trouble we were to raise. "It was just so STRESSFUL!!!" How can you not know that it's going to be that way? Kids aren't hamsters.

And now she's resentful because neither of her offspring had children. We both have excellent observational skills (no imagination needed), took a look at child-rearing and said hell no!

Like all parents they're unconsciously imitating their own parents.

[quote] And now she's resentful because neither of her offspring had children.

That's unfortunate. She should be congratulating you for your good sense and taking pride in having raised intelligent children.

She kind of sounds like a narcassist r56, with respect.

Having children is the ultimate SELFLESS act and reflects that one has grown up. It's about putting you and your needs aside for someone else. Gay men cannot identify with that.

Sometimes it's necessary to have children to solidify one's position as a Royal duchess and to force one's husband's family into accepting you as one of them.

They love playing the martyr.

R61, get the fuck off of this thread...fucking loser, hijacking the thread , dribbling you MM hate saliva on everything. Stupid Stan asshole.

Settle down Beavis

[quote]And now she's resentful because neither of her offspring had children. We both have excellent observational skills (no imagination needed), took a look at child-rearing and said hell no!

Hell to the no, is right !! She just wants a grandchild, why? Because ALL HER FRIENDS have them. Fuck that.

She wants to join in grandma bragging, spoil the grandkid, and at the end of the day, turn it back over to its parents to take care of.

The worst are the ones who drag their whole family into poverty with that extra twat dropping they just had to have. The oldest winds up being a caretaker and having no resources, youth or future because bitch mom ,who had no life skills, couldn't use contraception . Later on everyone wonders why the older one, after years of being a caretaker for mentally ill bitch moms kids, feels resentful and unhappy. While the younger ones wind up fine. They get their freedom! The older one has to give up their hopes , dreams and sense of freedom In the prime years of their lives but isn't allowed any anger.They wind up a living fucking corpse. At least parents made a choice, the sibling whose life was wrecked made no choice and was forced into a role they despise and now they have fucking nothing. Too many women think they are devoid of any responsibility over considering how many kids to bring into this earth and with what resources.

A selfless act is one where you get absolutely nothing out of it. That is not why people have kids. People choose to have kids and put themselves through the challenges and suffering and changing diapers and sacrifice of time because they want to be loved and remembered and feel their life has a purpose. Having and raising children is not a selfless act. It’s a sacrifice in order to receive - or hope to achieve - something in return. You want to make a sacrifice - go ahead. But don’t pretend like it’s a selfless act - that is the whole point of this thread.

Every single breeder with kids I've ever known--to the man--has said to me (when I explain why I don't want children) "but who is going to take care of you when you're old or sick?"

It's their standard fucking response.

You had kids because you want someone around when you get old who is obligated to bathe you and wipe your ass for free.

Spare me the "selfless" bullshit.

Then they get a kid they don't want, too gay, too smart too whatever, and push that kid away.

This guy probably asked himself that same question OP.

Preach r68. I am always gobsmacked when people say that. It is the most selfish fucking thing ever, expecting your offspring must of course rearrange their entire lives to wipe your ass when you get old.

I've actually found that narcissists tend to have more children. Look at Kris Jenner, she has six!

Prime example

Having is just part of the heteronormative cycle of life. That's why so many coupled gay, striving for acceptance that heternormativity brings, decide to have children.

Thank you, r58. She has narcissistic traits, r59. Borderline traits as well. So it was often quite STRESSFUL having her as a parent.

You're right I'm sure r65 about the grandkids thing. That's why I appreciate r67 and r68 essentially debunking the parenthood as 'selfless act of sacrifice.'

r60 is homophobic moron. Go back to mums.net you cunt.

Oh for God's sake, people don't just have children out of narcissism and to explain their failed careers! Okay, that's part of the reason, but people also have children because they want to love and be loved unconditionally.

Of course they don't realize that the "unconditional love" becomes very conditional indeed as the kid develops a mind of its own and stops trusting the parents completely, so the fact is, that parenthood actually involves experiencing unconditional love and having it withdrawn. If a person really wants unconditional love and trust that lasts a lifetime, they need a dog.

Well said R77 . I agree with the “be loved unconditionally” and that their love was always subconsciously “conditional”. Most parents who wrap up their identity and self-worth in their children end up disappointed in their children. Serves them right.

Aren’t they always telling us to stop shoving our sexuality in their faces?

[quote] Having children is the ultimate SELFLESS act and reflects that one has grown up. It's about putting you and your needs aside for someone else. Gay men cannot identify with that.

Revision in the text:

Having children is the ultimate SELFISH act and reflects that one has given up on having a meaningful life. It's about putting you and your needs for validation and attention above all else.

Because the goddamn idiots insist on following the crowd, even though they really have no great love for children. Why can't they admit that they don't have room in their lives for children? People refuse to be honest with themselves or others.

Jesus, what a miserable thread. Want kids? Have them. Don't? Then don't.

It's supremely gross to see a not-long-ago persecuted group judging human rights so harshly.

[quote] It's supremely gross to see a not-long-ago persecuted group judging human rights so harshly.

OMG! Mommies are so oppressed! This thread is LITERAL MURDER!

This is fascinating. I wanted my kid, had her when I was 45. Best thing I have ever done. Realized I was so done with I. I. I. I. done with it. Made sense to have a child, and make it all about them. them. them. BUT I am an old fucker. NO WAY I have a kid when I am 20 or even 30. Then it was Me.Me.Me.Me. If you have kids too early, you are really fucked. You cannot blame THEM, but you do resent them? DON"T HAVE KIDS UNTIL YOU HAVE EXHAUSTED YOUR YOU.

Oh, stop it, R83. Go back to Reddit.

Gawd, so much bullshit and projection on this thread.

No, most people don't have kids just for attention! No, they have kids because they have ridiculously unrealistic expectations!

They're old enough to realize that other adults don't love unconditionally, they either love extremely conditionally or not at all, and they always always always put themselves first. They think a child might give them the love and forgiveness they never had from their parents, friends, or lovers, and forgive them everything and accept them just the way they are. And I suppose kids do, for a little while. Of course they grow up to be just as self-centered as anyone else.

My understanding is that the women have some sort of biological clock, or at least societal expectations thing, so that they browbeat their men into having kids. Unfortunately, in most cases the men don't always have the same drive.

I've yet to encounter straights who have that attitude toward their children who *didn't* choose to have a child per year until they were done. Notice how even that cartoon features two kids who are, at most, two years apart in age.

If you have one child and wait several years before you have the next one, you'll be much better off in the long run. My mother had only me, and she never lost her identity or her job, and she had plenty of time to shower and put on nice clothes.

Also, double-wide strollers are an abomination. Just the need for them shows how stupid straights are about children. The only time a double-wide should ever be necessary is if a couple is cursed with twins.

Somebody must have linked this thread to mumsnet r83.

When most friends straight or gay have children I know our friendship is done at least for 16 years.

Why would you want to be friends with someone who ignores you for 16 years?

R88 I have witnessed the exact same thing. The incessant whining about the financial and personal stress of having children, all while continuously spawning more. Inevitably the older kids are fucked over and essentially made into babysitters.

R84 is a thoughtless idiot who waited till she was 45, then put her child in danger...by being such an old woman when she gave birth.

It's worth it to dress them up as Hansel and Gretel or Bonnie and Clyde...

I never thought about this until I worked with a woman whose only two topics of conversation were her kids and her fibromyalgia. Fuck was she annoying and she had the nerve to complain about work despite doing less hours than everyone else, I hated sitting next to her!

People don’t have kids for a “reason,” it’s a biological drive that eclipses all reason

[quote] No one talks about how you cry in the shower because your day was overwhelming.

Well, that's a little extreme.

Can we at least tip our hat to people who, usually very unintentionally, produce a world of wonderful, exciting, interesting and beautiful GAY people!