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Meryl Streel In Kramer vs Kramer (1979)

I am watching this film for the first time and she is absolutely LOVELY in this movie. Very pretty, soft spoken, poignant and all around TALENTED!

What happened? She’s still super talented but so over the top now! Watch “August Osage County” to see what I’m speaking of.

I loved her in this. Her tears always seemed genuine and not like she was acting ever, and she played well off Hoffman.

Her character was such a mess though. Was she just unhappy with the marriage? With herself? With it all? I felt for her but at the same time feel she shouldn’t have been given custody of Billy! That woman was a mess.

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by Anonymousreply 205November 2, 2020 3:34 AM

Love how she just says “Im Leaving You” as if it’s nothing lol

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by Anonymousreply 1February 19, 2019 2:26 AM

Hoffman is terrific in this scene

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by Anonymousreply 2February 19, 2019 2:27 AM

I love so many of Streep's early performances - Holocaust, The Deer Hunter, Kramer vs. Kramer, Silkwood. She was much more natural in them. I felt she completely became the character whereas she's hamming it up recently and I can see her acting.

by Anonymousreply 3February 19, 2019 2:32 AM

Her line in the courtroom "I moved to California so I could (sob/pause) find myself" was cheesy then and dated now.

I did like the twist at the end though.

by Anonymousreply 4February 19, 2019 2:43 AM

I don’t see how that’s dated when people still try finding Themselves...

Anyway, she was terrific in the final scene.

PS Justin Henry gives one of the best child performances on film.

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by Anonymousreply 5February 19, 2019 2:46 AM

You know I won my first of three Oscars for this role, as G watched from home

by Anonymousreply 6February 19, 2019 2:58 AM

I'm blanking but wasn't it revealed last year that Dustin was terrible to her on this film.? He really went for the jugular during a scene to get a certain reaction from her.

Was it Meryl or another actress/film?

by Anonymousreply 7February 19, 2019 3:18 AM

Al Pacino was up for this role. I’m think he turned it down. I feel Author, Author was his attempt at Kramer vs Kramer. Similar story.

by Anonymousreply 8February 19, 2019 3:26 AM

Yes, r7. He didn't tell Meryl he was going to throw the wineglass at the wall before the take. I think he also slapped her in a scene (in character).

by Anonymousreply 9February 19, 2019 3:35 AM

He slapped her, yes. It was a real slap.

by Anonymousreply 10February 19, 2019 3:36 AM

He also grabbed her breasts to shock her.

But she liked him and doesn’t speak Nasty of him. She enjoyed working with him.

by Anonymousreply 11February 19, 2019 3:37 AM

There’s nothing wrong with the wineglass throw. Her jump and expression was very natural and it worked.

Many actors/actresses have done things to get natural reactions from their costars

by Anonymousreply 12February 19, 2019 3:38 AM

Hi, Michelle Stafford r12!!!

by Anonymousreply 13February 19, 2019 3:42 AM

She was okay in this. Nothing special.

by Anonymousreply 14February 19, 2019 3:59 AM

This is one of Streep's earliest performances and what she does in this scene is better than her entire performance in KvK. You see her conflict, her fear and her complete realization that she tries to hide.

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by Anonymousreply 15February 19, 2019 4:17 AM

I preferred Glenn Copper in Fatal Attraction.

by Anonymousreply 16February 19, 2019 4:35 AM

She only got the part because fucking Aaron Spelling won't let Kate Jackson take the role while filming Charlies Angels. That Oscar fucking belongs to Kate Jackson!

by Anonymousreply 17February 19, 2019 5:37 AM

She was really great in this film, although I thought Jane Alexander was also deserving of the Supporting Oscar.

by Anonymousreply 18February 19, 2019 5:43 AM

Didn’t he whisper something about her boyfriend that had killed himself in her ear? Some real assholish thing.

by Anonymousreply 19February 19, 2019 6:04 AM

R18, Gloria Steinem said that the Jane Alexander character only testified for the Dustin Hoffman character because she was jealous Streep got out of the marriage.

by Anonymousreply 20February 19, 2019 6:05 AM

I sometimes wonder what Kramer vs. Kramer would have been if Kate Jackson was let out of her contract to do it.

by Anonymousreply 21February 19, 2019 6:13 AM

She didn't even want out of her contract, they just would't let her miss a few episodes to allow her to film Kramer vs Kramer. Kate became so bitter that they eventually let her out of her 5 year contract. She must have been a real bitch..

by Anonymousreply 22February 19, 2019 6:21 AM

[quote}She was really great in this film, although I thought Jane Alexander was also deserving of the Supporting Oscar.

She was good, yes. But Oscar worthy? Not really.

It's amazing to remember what a big deal this film was.

I found an old "movie book" called Film '79 or something like that and Kramer was on the cover. Only in the 70s would a film about the breakdown of a middle-class New York marriage be of such importance and significance.

OP, if you haven't seen An Unmarried Woman yet, make it your next.

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by Anonymousreply 23February 19, 2019 6:58 AM

[quote]Her character was such a mess though. Was she just unhappy with the marriage? With herself? With it all? I felt for her but at the same time feel she shouldn’t have been given custody of Billy! That woman was a mess.

She was THE MOTHER. Courts always favor the mother.

by Anonymousreply 24February 19, 2019 7:00 AM

one of the first yuppie movies?

hoffman made filming difficult for streep

by Anonymousreply 25February 19, 2019 7:05 AM

Streep 100% deserved her Oscar.

Idk how you can watch her scenes and say it’s not Oscar worthy. Please.

by Anonymousreply 26February 19, 2019 9:37 AM

Isn't this the movie where it has come out that Hoffman did some bad shit in regards to sexual harassment and touched Meryl inappropriately? I love Meryl.

by Anonymousreply 27February 19, 2019 9:41 AM

Does anyone know why the film's ending is different than the book? In the book, Joanna is awarded custody and takes custody of Billy. In the film Joanna is awarded custody but bails at the last minute. I've done a quick search, but can't find anything that explains why the screenwriter (and others) chose to change the ending of the book.

Or am I wrong and the book's ending matches the film?

by Anonymousreply 28February 19, 2019 10:15 AM

I never understood why Meryl was said to stand out as an actress among her peers... she's a good actress, there's no question about that, but there are many good actresses. I think because she was a blonde, well to do beauty, she got the excessive attention. Let's face it, they never would have given the same kind of adulation to Sissy Spacek or Judy Davis, actresses who are just as talented. It was because Meryl was this perfect Aryan specimen and, interestingly, she was championed by Jews like Mike Nichols so maybe there was a bit of masochism going on there as well.

by Anonymousreply 29February 19, 2019 10:20 AM

[quote]Or am I wrong and the book's ending matches the film?

I think you're wrong.

by Anonymousreply 30February 19, 2019 10:21 AM

[qupte] she's a good actress, there's no question about that, but there are many good actresses. I think because she was a blonde, well to do beauty, she got the excessive attention.

You bet! Good looking + very good actress = lots of attention. Nothing new.

by Anonymousreply 31February 19, 2019 10:23 AM

[quote]I never understood why Meryl was said to stand out as an actress among her peers

A lot of her accents weren't very good either.

I remember her English accent in "Plently". Maybe the Americans were impressed, but I'm English and I'm here to tell you it sounded like she learned it in Geneva.

by Anonymousreply 32February 19, 2019 10:26 AM

People can hate on M but this, like THE DEER HUNTER, within months of each other, proves her prowess. To be honest, I’d give her it for that over this. Not to mention the unforgettable turn as the lesbian ex-wife in MANHATTAN.

by Anonymousreply 33February 19, 2019 10:27 AM

[quote]OP, if you haven't seen An Unmarried Woman yet, make it your next.

Kramer v. Kramer: yet another also ran.

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by Anonymousreply 34February 19, 2019 10:27 AM

Let there be music!

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by Anonymousreply 35February 19, 2019 10:32 AM

Streep got all that early attention because her family really was well-to-do. When she graduated from Yale drama school, her father got her a press agent.

Except for the hardest of hard news, there is nothing in the press that someone wasn't paid to plant there. She was able to deliver the goods and give the press agent something to work with, but the enormous response by the press was largely because of a press agent banging her drum loudly and regularly.

by Anonymousreply 36February 19, 2019 11:15 AM

OK watch the last scene in THE DEER HUNTER and say M isn’t brilliant. Even her brief appearance in JULIA is masterful. I’m not a M Stan but please...

by Anonymousreply 37February 19, 2019 11:19 AM

All you have to do is watch Sophie's Choice. Even if she'd never made any other movie that one would put her in the top tier of actresses.

by Anonymousreply 38February 19, 2019 11:31 AM

[quote]Meryl was this perfect Aryan specimen

Is that you, M?

by Anonymousreply 39February 19, 2019 11:39 AM

Thanks for posting that scene, r15. I agree that Streep is excellent in it, and I was reminded of how good an actor Moriarty is.

by Anonymousreply 40February 19, 2019 12:59 PM

This is her best work because playing a malignant narcissist is like breathing to her.

by Anonymousreply 41February 19, 2019 1:58 PM

Meryl Streep talks about her FEUD with co-star Jane Alexander. Even after the Oscar nominations got released that didn't even bring the temperature down as Jane Alexander BOYCOTTED the ceremony (which Streep won her first Oscar)

Here Meryl talks about their FEUD

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by Anonymousreply 42February 19, 2019 2:03 PM

R42 here OPPS linked to the wrong video

Here is the video below where Meryl talks about her FEUD with co-star Jane Alexander

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by Anonymousreply 43February 19, 2019 2:04 PM

And when was the last time you heard about Jane Alexander?

by Anonymousreply 44February 19, 2019 2:10 PM

[quote]Meryl Streel

Meryl Who?

by Anonymousreply 45February 19, 2019 2:25 PM

On a side note, what's with people posting clips from movies on Youtube and then putting in the comments, "no copyright infringement intended". Does that really negate the copyright violation?

by Anonymousreply 46February 19, 2019 2:37 PM

[quote] On a side note, what's with people posting clips from movies on Youtube and then putting in the comments, "no copyright infringement intended". Does that really negate the copyright violation?

I never understood why companies pull their clips - it is not like someone is uploading the entire movie. These are 30 second film clips, and it is free publicity to get the people to buy or even pay to download the film.

by Anonymousreply 47February 19, 2019 2:39 PM

The ending of KVK always bugged me. You couldn't decide to give him custody BEFORE all those legals bills got racked up?

by Anonymousreply 48February 19, 2019 2:42 PM

[quote]The ending of KVK always bugged me. You couldn't decide to give him custody BEFORE all those legals bills got racked up?

Sometimes it's about the winning.

You didn't get it .

by Anonymousreply 49February 19, 2019 2:57 PM

[quote]This is her best work because playing a malignant narcissist is like breathing to her.

You forget to sign your post, G.

by Anonymousreply 50February 19, 2019 3:40 PM

Is this an early MRA movie? Would make sense, given the recent women's rights movement at the time. What a load of BS.

by Anonymousreply 51February 19, 2019 4:04 PM

Ah Meryl Streel. Such an underrated actress, OP. I especially loved her work with Clint Westwood in The Bridges of Madison Country. 🙄🙄🙄 Bish...spellcheck!!!

by Anonymousreply 52February 19, 2019 4:05 PM

Kramer was TV movie fare. The way Meryl Streep's talents have been glorified is way out of proportion. I mean Judith Light who is the same age was doing far more powerful work than Streep on the daytime soap opera One Life to Live playing far provocative material but since Judith does not have the looks, she didn't have the same choices available to her.

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by Anonymousreply 53February 19, 2019 4:07 PM

[QUOTE] I am watching this film for the first time and she is absolutely LOVELY in this movie. Very pretty, soft spoken, poignant and all around TALENTED! What happened? She’s still super talented but so over the top now! Watch “August Osage County” to see what I’m speaking of.

Well, considering the character she's playing “August Osage County” is anything but very pretty, soft spoken, & poignant might give you a clue.

by Anonymousreply 54February 19, 2019 4:20 PM

It is almost always male actors who smash glasses, choke, and grab bits to startle and get a rise out of female ones on camera. Power tripping bullshit.

This movie really does seem pedestrian when you look back on it.

by Anonymousreply 55February 19, 2019 4:24 PM

R53 Why did Viki choose to tell Megan about Karen's being a prostitution whore as she (Megan) lay dying?

by Anonymousreply 56February 19, 2019 4:53 PM

r56 how the fuck should I know? My point was that actresses like Judith Light were doing far superior work to Meryl at the time, and yet Meryl is held up as this phenomenon.

by Anonymousreply 57February 19, 2019 6:31 PM

Meryl is a phenomenon.

And she was lovely in this b

by Anonymousreply 58February 19, 2019 6:33 PM

[quote]Kramer was TV movie fare

Horseshit. It was a A list movie. A huge hit and Best Picture winner. At the time there wasn't 200 channels or Lifetime movie channels. Small movies telling simple stories were normal. Cable killed them.

by Anonymousreply 59February 20, 2019 12:06 AM

r59 something like that had no business being on the big screen. The screen is supposed to be for spectacle, it's a visual language, not a language for words.

by Anonymousreply 60February 20, 2019 12:14 AM

The screen is many things.

You must be a Michael Bay fan.

by Anonymousreply 61February 20, 2019 12:15 AM

wtf?

streep is excellent in this film.

by Anonymousreply 62February 20, 2019 1:24 AM

R60 Nestor Almendros was one of the greatest cinematographers ever, and his work on Kramer vs. Kramer is stunning if you see it on the big screen. You could never (especially at the time the movie was released) have seen in a TV movie anything remotely like the colors and light Amendros captures and creates. Just because it isn't filled with spectacle and special effects doesn't mean it isn't visually deft.

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by Anonymousreply 63February 20, 2019 1:36 AM

Wow. DL Queens LOVE an Unmarried Woman. Every other thread some queens post a photo of Jill Clayburgh throwing up in Soho.

by Anonymousreply 64February 20, 2019 1:39 AM

No, kidding. Should we see a therapist?

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by Anonymousreply 65February 20, 2019 1:47 AM

sorry, that should be no kidding! NOT no, kidding.

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by Anonymousreply 66February 20, 2019 1:49 AM

[quote]R3 I love so many of Streep's early performances - Holocaust, The Deer Hunter, Kramer vs. Kramer, Silkwood. She was much more natural in them. I felt she completely became the character whereas she's hamming it up recently and I can see her acting.

Well, for the most part, many of her later scripts feature dumbed-down writing, and aren’t comparable to those earlier projects ... some of which were made in the 1970s (considered by some to be Hollywood ‘s most exciting and artistically free era.)

One can’t be anything more than hammy in THE DEVIL WEARS PRADA.

by Anonymousreply 67February 20, 2019 2:09 AM

DL bitches. Did you hear about the X rated version of the Devil Wears Prada. It's called THE DEVIL WEARS NADA!

by Anonymousreply 68February 20, 2019 2:15 AM

I preferred The French Lieutenants Boys.

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by Anonymousreply 69February 20, 2019 2:19 AM

I have enjoyed her throughout her career. She is one of the few performers who constantly manages to surprise.

by Anonymousreply 70February 20, 2019 2:20 AM

Meryl Streep was not pretty in this movie she was BEAUTIFUL.

by Anonymousreply 71February 20, 2019 2:21 AM

I thought she handled that question about Jane very well. Respectful but still honest.

Weirdly, I thought she wasn't hammy in Devil Wears Prada r68. I think it's her truly last great performance.

by Anonymousreply 72February 20, 2019 3:58 AM

r28

No she gives back custody of the boy in the book too.

(It is a little bit different in fact the whole character is different. In the book she is more irresponsible than troubled. When she leaves them she just has an affair with tennis instructor. Doesn't go to CA to find herself like in the movie. I think that is why they wanted Kate Jackson. The character wasn't as deep. When they hired Meryl they knew she was grieving John Cazale. The director let her play with the character a bit and she made her more sympathetic. The writer director also changed the script to make it more even and make the mother less of the villain she is in the book. In the book in the final scene she just shows up and says I can't take this I changed my mind. I can't handle him. The movie made it look like Johanna had really come to the conclusion that she was hurting the kid (again) by taking him. Plus there is the hopeful tone that they will co-parent now when she asks to go upstairs and Hoffman allows it and then tells her she looks fine when she asks.)

BTW if you are wondering how I know all this I went to a discussion Leonard Maltin did with Robert Benton last year at TCM Festival.

by Anonymousreply 73February 20, 2019 4:26 AM

Oh and the author of the book hated the movie. He wanted it to be a real indictment of women. Robert Benton felt that if Johanna wasn't somewhat sympathetic the film didn't work. Benton said she is the most important character.

by Anonymousreply 74February 20, 2019 4:28 AM

I love the ending. They truly put the child before themselves.

If it were made today, it would probably be a different ending.

by Anonymousreply 75February 20, 2019 4:33 AM

I revisited Adaptation recently. She’s really wonderful in this as well.

by Anonymousreply 76February 20, 2019 5:05 AM

[quote]R73 Oh and the author of the book hated the movie. He wanted it to be a real indictment of women.

Well, HE sounds charming!

by Anonymousreply 77February 20, 2019 6:56 AM

Maybe he overstated that r77.

Not an indictment of women but more an indictment of how they get easier treatment in child custody cases (at least at that time. I think he was a divorced father who didn't get to see his kid as much as he wanted.)

by Anonymousreply 78February 20, 2019 7:37 AM

Make that maybe I overstated that.

by Anonymousreply 79February 20, 2019 7:38 AM

When Kate Jackson was unavailable why didn't they get Shelley Hack?

by Anonymousreply 80February 20, 2019 10:01 AM

The way I remember it Kate was going to do the Jane Alexander role. I like Kate Jackson but choosing her over Meryl I don’t think so. Somewhere along the way history was changed to Kate missed the chance to play the mother.

by Anonymousreply 81February 20, 2019 10:39 AM

no no no r81

you are wrong

by Anonymousreply 82February 20, 2019 10:41 AM

Hands down, the greatest actress on the American screen.

by Anonymousreply 83February 20, 2019 10:43 AM

Gail Strickland was actually hired for the Alexander role but Hoffman antics rattled her so much she had to leave the part and get Aleaxander who had just done All the Presidents Men and said she could handle Hoffman.

by Anonymousreply 84February 20, 2019 10:46 AM

The actor who played Margo on Charlie's Angels classic Angel on The Line was first choice for Johanna.

by Anonymousreply 85February 20, 2019 10:53 AM

Jane Alexander was a wonderful actress she an almost pornographic HBO series and seemingly vanished.

by Anonymousreply 86February 20, 2019 11:20 AM

She did an. I meant.

by Anonymousreply 87February 20, 2019 11:20 AM

Say You Love Me

by Anonymousreply 88February 20, 2019 11:47 AM

Her early films cemented her reputation as a strong actress who consistently gave good performances that got recognized.

She could do a bunch of shit now, and she’d still be praised just based on her reputation.

by Anonymousreply 89February 20, 2019 12:20 PM

R88, it's Tell Me You Love Me (and my buns*)

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by Anonymousreply 90February 20, 2019 12:49 PM

Meryl was phenomenal in this film

by Anonymousreply 91February 21, 2019 9:17 PM

Not the Meryl Loon here, but she is special and deserving of all acolades.

by Anonymousreply 92February 21, 2019 9:21 PM

By the way, is the Meryl Loon male or female?

Was that ever established?

by Anonymousreply 93February 21, 2019 9:22 PM

That's when Meryl was fucking amazing and pursued the material worthy of her talent instead of being the indiscriminate caricature of an actress she's become in the past 15 years or so.

by Anonymousreply 94February 21, 2019 9:51 PM

That's true r94. For someone who has so many Oscar nominations and three awards, plus an Emmy, her filmography is not that high in terms of truly great films. For me, The Deer Hunter, Kramer vs. Kramer, Sophie's Choice, Silkwood, and Out of Africa and of course Death Becomes Her are all classics.

by Anonymousreply 95February 22, 2019 1:59 AM

[quote]R94 That's when Meryl was fucking amazing and pursued the material worthy of her talent instead of being the indiscriminate caricature of an actress she's become in the past 15 years or so.

We could say that about De Niro, Nicholson and Hoffman, too.

Pacino (and Julie Christie) may be the only one who said No to high paying crap (?)

by Anonymousreply 96February 22, 2019 2:07 AM

Pacino is the biggest caricature of all!

by Anonymousreply 97February 22, 2019 2:32 AM

I had a crush on Dustin Hoffman back then. This was the last film in which he still looked good. He never recovered from over plucking his eyebrows to play Dorothy Michaels in Tootsie.

by Anonymousreply 98February 22, 2019 2:38 AM

[quote]. For someone who has so many Oscar nominations and three awards, plus an Emmy

two Emmys r95 you bitch

by Anonymousreply 99February 22, 2019 3:31 AM

[quote]R97 Pacino is the biggest caricature of all!

What films has he done that were unworthy?

by Anonymousreply 100February 22, 2019 3:40 AM

Your career is out of order!

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by Anonymousreply 101February 22, 2019 3:44 AM

Why was Meryl in the Best Supporting Actress category? If it was just because of her lack of screen time, there are other actresses who've won with little screen time. Then Jane could have won best supporting.

by Anonymousreply 102February 22, 2019 4:03 AM

Jane was fine, but there wan't much to her role.

by Anonymousreply 103February 22, 2019 4:07 AM

I think she is a supporting character r102. She is in the first scene then disappears for about an hour and then just has a few scenes.

I love the scene when she first turns. Just the way she is in the coffee shop watching Dustin drop the kid off at school. Just the way she has her hand pressed on the window. The hand makes it seem so desperate. Like she wants something. When I saw it with an audience recently people sort of groaned like awwww, she's back.

by Anonymousreply 104February 22, 2019 4:51 AM

She was 100% supporting. Dustin Hoffman was the sole lead of the film.

by Anonymousreply 105February 22, 2019 1:23 PM

If anyone should have gotten a nomination for supporting it should have been JoBeth Williams bush...

by Anonymousreply 106February 22, 2019 2:35 PM

Meryl starts spinning out of control around Out of Africa. The award chasing really has become epidemic this century. Her best post-Sophie's work (A Cry in the Dark, River Wild, Prada, maybe Postcards from the Edge) were when she relaxed and didn't try to be a serious thespian (Serious Thespian!). She had those moments early in her career too (French Lieutenant's Woman), but they became her real artifice early.

A shame, cause as noted upstream, her early output is classic on its own. If she died in 1984, she's a legend just for that.

by Anonymousreply 107February 22, 2019 3:06 PM

Joanna is totally supporting. It's Ted's story.

by Anonymousreply 108February 22, 2019 3:10 PM

Everyone's supporting to Justin Henry, the film's only lead.

by Anonymousreply 109February 22, 2019 3:13 PM

I think that the aforementioned award chasing simply forced her to adapt to what passes for "great acting" with the Academy: take an IMPORTANT event and its protagonist, use them as a template, and measure how much the actor conforms to their physical appearance, speech patterns, physical mannerisms. If it involves a substantial amount of physical transformation, even better. When did this become the yardstick measure of a great performance? I'm guessing sometime in the 90s. The 80s still had a large number of movies made based on quality literary pieces or good original scripts.

by Anonymousreply 110February 22, 2019 3:18 PM

Joanna is Supporting. The story focuses on a man coping with his new life after his wife leaves him and he is now a single father. It’s his story, not Streep’s or Henry’s.

by Anonymousreply 111February 22, 2019 3:36 PM

I actually think that these measurements for 'acting' that R110 describes started with Brando and with it the emphasis on both performative 'realism' while still maintaining the much older ability for transformative performance as seen in the likes of Paul Muni, Olivier, etc. Whereas Muni, etal would use makeup and prosthetics to transform, the newer breed of performer would physically transform themselves, e.g. DeNiro in Raging Bull, Day-Lewis in...everything and the press for the film became as much about the physically transformative component of one actor as it did about anything else. Streep and her accents which began with 'Sophie's Choice' were part of that movement but it had been going on since Brando, though Streep might be the first female to become really renowned for 'disappearing' into a role.

by Anonymousreply 112February 22, 2019 3:38 PM

Justin Henry gave one of the better performances I’ve seen from a child actor. Very honest and real.

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by Anonymousreply 113February 22, 2019 3:41 PM

Melvyn Douglas didn't think so.

by Anonymousreply 114February 22, 2019 3:43 PM

I think it’s telling that both Streep and Henry both acted circles around Hoffman in their scenes together.

Little Justin Henry was able to express emotion through his expressions and eyes, while Hoffman always has the same facial expression.

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by Anonymousreply 115February 22, 2019 3:43 PM

I can't stand Dustin Hoffman's acting. It always felt like he was showing off to me.

by Anonymousreply 116February 22, 2019 4:01 PM

I loved Hoffman in The Graduate. Not much else.

by Anonymousreply 117February 22, 2019 4:03 PM

One of the funniest line readings in the history of movies.

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by Anonymousreply 118February 22, 2019 4:06 PM

I wonder if she had a lesbian affair?

by Anonymousreply 119February 22, 2019 7:38 PM

Joanna Kramer? Or Meryl?

by Anonymousreply 120February 22, 2019 8:24 PM

" She enjoyed working with him."

No, she didn't. She conceded that he was "gifted" but she's always very careful when she's asked about him. It's like she's straining to hold her real feelings about him in check, in order to be polite.

by Anonymousreply 121February 22, 2019 8:28 PM

She loved him. Please.

by Anonymousreply 122February 22, 2019 8:38 PM

The American public was slightly familiar with Meryl from her "Holocaust" tv miniseries the previous year. I like how the movie expanded how men are viewed as fathers. It was revolutionary at the time, to say a man could be an equally good parent.

by Anonymousreply 123February 22, 2019 8:43 PM

One of the all time dumbest movie plots. A man in the Hoffman character's position would have, hired a nanny, fobbed the child off on a relative, or sent him to boarding school.

by Anonymousreply 124February 22, 2019 8:44 PM

"She loved him. Please."

She didn't love him. She respects him as an actor but she's well aware of what a dick he is. At their first meeting "He came up to me and said, ‘I’m Dustin - burp - Hoffman,’ and he put his hand on my breast. What an obnoxious pig, I thought.”

by Anonymousreply 125February 22, 2019 8:49 PM

What’s wrong with grabbing women by the breast? I grab them by the pussy!

by Anonymousreply 126February 22, 2019 9:30 PM

....

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by Anonymousreply 127February 23, 2019 12:23 AM

The scene that is missing from Kramer Versus Kramer:

Hey Johanna, why don't we have joint custody. We both work. We live in the same cities. We could do like practically every other divorced couple. How'd we get into this all or nothing thing?

by Anonymousreply 128February 23, 2019 1:26 AM

Meryl got pissed off when Dustin smashed a glass during a scene that was ad-libbed

They had done the scene twice, where Dustin just storm out of the restaurant. He said he wanted one more take, and then he proceeded to smash a glass, which took Meryl by surprise, but she stayed in character.

She was later pissed off, because that was a breech of professionalism. Dustin said if he told her, she wouldn't have that natural reaction that got captured on film'

Go watch for yourself below

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by Anonymousreply 129February 23, 2019 1:31 AM

R129 that’s been discussed above. And many actors do things like that to their costars for natural reactions.

by Anonymousreply 130February 23, 2019 1:36 AM

Hoffman would also walk up to Streep in the courtroom scenes when she had to be emotional and say "John Cazale".

To make her cry.

Douchebag.

by Anonymousreply 131February 23, 2019 2:00 AM

Who's John Cazale?

by Anonymousreply 132February 23, 2019 2:04 AM

Her fiancee who had just died prior to shooting the film. He was an actor (Fredo in The Godfather.)

by Anonymousreply 133February 23, 2019 2:05 AM

That's fucked up. Her acting in the courtroom scene is so good when shes breaking down. If he really did that then it wasnt really acting but using her past to bring real emotion.

by Anonymousreply 134February 23, 2019 2:11 AM

Meryl got away with her looks because she has charisma.

by Anonymousreply 135February 23, 2019 2:16 AM

Well I think she’s gorgeous.

by Anonymousreply 136February 23, 2019 2:38 AM

luminous in this film, great hair too

by Anonymousreply 137February 23, 2019 2:40 AM

Shes quite pretty in this movie.

by Anonymousreply 138February 23, 2019 2:40 AM

Dustin Hoffman is a great actor but a complete asshole.

His douchiness and John Olver's grilling of Hoffman have pretty much ended his career.

by Anonymousreply 139February 23, 2019 2:44 AM

r134 from the account's I've read his saying Cazale didn't make her cry but just made her mad. She was a pretty experienced actress on stage and at Yale plus some TV so she didn't really need his help.

As to him smashing the glass in the scene above she supposedly very calmly responded "I'd wish you would tell me before hand when you do something like that."

Meryl was credited with being confident enough even at this point to handle Hoffman. As I mentioned before Gail Strickland was originally cast in the Jane Alexander role. She got so flustered by Hoffman (and she was an experienced actress too) that she developed a stammer and couldn't complete scenes.

The director called Jane Alexander and explained what was going on. She had just worked with Hoffman on All the President's Men and told the director she feels she can handle Hoffman's tricks."

by Anonymousreply 140February 23, 2019 2:46 AM

[quote] The director called Jane Alexander and explained what was going on. She had just worked with Hoffman on All the President's Men and told the director she feels she can handle Hoffman's tricks."

Ironically it was Jane Alexander who feuded with Meryl Streep, and still to this day refuses to speak to her

by Anonymousreply 141February 23, 2019 2:49 AM

What was the basis of the feud? I listened to the interview above but didn't quite get what Alexander was mad at.

by Anonymousreply 142February 23, 2019 2:53 AM

Asked if she is jealous of Meryl Streep, Jane Alexander tells the Boston Globe YES

Jane seemed particularly incensed by the fact that Meryl’s picture is on the cover of Time Magazine in connection with the cover of "The French Lieutenant’s Woman." Jane called it "a fluke. That cover is a combination of politics and luck. It’s media machinery set into motion. And it fills a need. The public wants its heroines, needs heroines. It’s America’s equivalent to royalty. I’ve never part of that. Yes I regret it.."

by Anonymousreply 143February 23, 2019 2:57 AM

Jane Alexander even boycotted the Oscars because she knew MERYL would be there, and it would have been humiliating to lose to Streep

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by Anonymousreply 144February 23, 2019 2:59 AM

"Who's John Cazale?"

Who indeed. There's a documentary about him called "I Knew It Was You." It begins with people on the street being asked if they know who this guy was (they're shown a picture of him). Most don't know; the best some of them can come up with is "Fredo", his character in "The Godfather." But they don't know his name. Cazale was a very homely actor, but there was something about him that intrigued people. He had the distinction of being in five movies, and all of them were nominated for Best Picture Academy Awards. He met Meryl Streep when they did a play together, and they immediately clicked and became a couple. In Streep's biography "Her Again" an acquaintance of theirs remarked on their hot romance; "her lips were totally chapped from kissing!" Her lips were totally chapped from kissing John Cazale? Yech! Anyway, although he was quite unattractive physically Cazale had no problem attracting women and people loved him even though he was a strange bird. He took forever to do things; eat a meal, show up for dinner, smoke a cigar. He was so "slow" because he was supposedly fascinated with everything. I guess in the entertainment industry that kind of eccentricity is considered interesting but in the real world most people would find it unbearable. Anyway, he and Streep were meant for each other, but he died from lung cancer at age 42, probably from smoking all those cigars. Streep was with him right to the end. She was totally devoted to him. Al Pacino said "I've hardly ever seen a person so devoted to someone who is falling away like John was. To see her in that act of love for this man was overwhelming."

by Anonymousreply 145February 23, 2019 3:24 AM

Anybody remember Streep's performance in "Holocaust", the mini-series? Her character, the Aryan wife of a Jewish artist was "relentlessly noble" as she put it, but she was absolutely natural and affecting and in one of her earliest performances. Also luminous and beautiful. She won and Emmy for it, her first.

by Anonymousreply 146February 23, 2019 3:29 AM

What did Streep do that Alexander should not want to speak to her?

Be a movie star? That's an innate thing. Streep was born with that and Alexander wasn't. So Alexander was angry at Streep? Was Streep undermining her on the set? That I could understand.

But otherwise it seems like old fashioned clichéd actress jealousy. Something out of an old Cukor or La Cava movie.

by Anonymousreply 147February 23, 2019 3:31 AM

Jane and Meryl in happier times.

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by Anonymousreply 148February 23, 2019 3:41 AM

And the first time I saw Streep she was a complete unknown. In The Cherry Orchard at the Vivian Beaumont. I was like who in the world is that the minute she walked on stage in a supporting role. Really.

by Anonymousreply 149February 23, 2019 3:41 AM

r147 Alexander and Streep only have one scene together: when Jane is testifying and Meryl is listening. No interaction at all really. Jane's just jealous that Meryl became Meryl and she stayed Jane.

by Anonymousreply 150February 23, 2019 3:51 AM

and remember Jane's son was recently arrested for child molestation.

by Anonymousreply 151February 23, 2019 3:52 AM

Jane was probably jealous of Meryl's skyrocketing success. I mean, from 1977 to 1980, Meryl won an Emmy award and two Oscar nominations, including winning one Oscar.

by Anonymousreply 152February 23, 2019 4:03 AM

Meryl got #metoo'd on this film by Hoffman.

by Anonymousreply 153February 23, 2019 4:14 AM

Hoffman is insufferable. Breaking the glass by surprise was totally unnecessary. Meryl would have responded in character even if she knew it was coming. It’s called acting. Olivier has to remind that tiny ham about it too.

by Anonymousreply 154February 23, 2019 4:18 AM

Legend. Who is Streel?

by Anonymousreply 155February 23, 2019 4:21 AM

Streel starred with Shitley Maclaine in Postcards from the Edge.

by Anonymousreply 156February 23, 2019 4:28 AM

But actors and directors have done this in the past. It is not unknown. Though usually not appreciated. Sometimes though you have to wear people down or exploit them to get what you want out of them. Kazan and Wyler were notorious for this not completely trusting an actor's talent to give them what they want.

by Anonymousreply 157February 23, 2019 4:45 AM

Jane and Meryl in the same room!

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by Anonymousreply 158February 23, 2019 4:57 AM

Meryl was out acted by Julia in August OC. And Meryl has never forgiven her for it.

by Anonymousreply 159February 23, 2019 5:00 AM

Only in Julia’s mind.

by Anonymousreply 160February 23, 2019 5:41 AM

Debbie, you should know first hand what's it's like to work with a cunt who hates younger gals.

by Anonymousreply 161February 23, 2019 5:48 AM

Why are you all acting like he threw the glass in her face? Many actors and directors do this.

by Anonymousreply 162February 23, 2019 10:47 AM

Margot Martindale whipped both Julia and Meryl in that film.

by Anonymousreply 163February 23, 2019 11:36 AM

Streep would never make it now if she were starting out. White, blonde, good family... all the odds would be stacked against her.

by Anonymousreply 164February 23, 2019 12:40 PM

Streep was really beautiful and unconventional too with her nose and all...she looks to be wearing little makeup in KvK. Stunning!

by Anonymousreply 165February 23, 2019 1:10 PM

R146 I remember Holocaust. It was an incredible series and that is also where I first noticed Streep. She was amazing. I also love Jane Alexander.

by Anonymousreply 166February 23, 2019 1:11 PM

I agree she is a great actress but beautiful she’s not...

by Anonymousreply 167February 23, 2019 2:07 PM

She was also luminous in another early film, "The Seduction of Joe Tynan." You do have to suffer through the queasy-looking Barbara Harris and a gooey Alan Alda to watch it.

by Anonymousreply 168February 23, 2019 2:22 PM

[quote] Anybody remember Streep's performance in "Holocaust", the mini-series? Her character, the Aryan wife of a Jewish artist was "relentlessly noble" as she put it, but she was absolutely natural and affecting and in one of her earliest performances. Also luminous and beautiful. She won and Emmy for it, her first.

Meryl has gone on record saying she DESPISED the script for "Holocaust", HATED her character and had but disgust for the entire project from start to finish.

But she did that TV mini-series for one reason, and one reason only. The money. John Cazale was sick and needed more than what his medical benefits were provided for him. So she did the movie to make money so Cazale would be comfortable in his final days.

She didn't go the EMMY ceremony and (according to the recent Streep Biography) when she received her Emmy in mail, she left it (unopened) in her den, leaning against the wall, And it stayed that way for many many years, not being put out on display.

Maybe the award is a just a reminder of Cazale, so she just doesn't want to look at it.

by Anonymousreply 169February 23, 2019 3:09 PM

Jane Alexander is a good actress but she's like Lee Remick, not a star. Streep is a great actress and a star. That's a tough combination to beat when you're an everywoman actress.

by Anonymousreply 170February 23, 2019 3:29 PM

I had totally forgotten about this, but in "The New Centurions", which came years before KvK, Jane Alexander did this scene with Stacey Keach. It's almost identical to Streep's scene in KvK.

Dorothy : Roy, I'm leaving you.

Roy : When did you decide this?

Dorothy : I don't know. It's been coming on a long time, I guess. I guess after Kilvinski retired and you decided to stay on and go on to vice, I guess that's what did it.

Roy : Yeah, but Dorothy, I'm, I hate this assignment, I'm not gonna be doing this forever.

Dorothy : It doesn't matter, Roy. It doesn't have anything to do with that. And it has nothing to do with you being a policeman anymore. And it's not because I'm a girl who doesn't like to be alone or because I worry about you. I stopped worrying about you months ago. I learned months ago to go to bed by myself. It's none of those dumb, cliched reasons, Roy.

Roy : Then what is it?

Dorothy : I just don't care anymore.

Roy : Why?

Dorothy : Oh Roy...

Roy : What about Becky?

Dorothy : What about her?

Roy : I'm her father. You're taking my daughter away from me.

Dorothy : I can't help that.

Roy : Hey, Dorothy. You're taking my daughter away from me!

Dorothy : No, you've done that Roy. You risked too much, Roy. Your health, our life, your family. And for what? To keep some psychotic kid from holding up a liquor store? I don't understand that, Roy. I grew up in a house wherre those you love come first. You and Kilvinski, you're two of a kind. Only the sad thing is you could've been something better. Goodbye Roy.

Roy : Wait a minute! Before you go, I'd just like to ask you something. In all the time we were together, did you ever say, "Whatever you wanna do, Roy, I'll back you up. I'll see it through, no matter what." You know, when I quit school, you gave me the feeling that I cheated you. It was like I deprived you of something more. That my being a policeman wasn't good enough. Well that's what I am. But you want something more. You don't want me. So go on, fly home to mother. If it brings you comfort, let's leave it that way. I let you down. I'm not letting Becky go. Dorothy, do you hear me? I'm not letting her go!

by Anonymousreply 171February 23, 2019 3:33 PM

sorry, Barbara Harris is one of my all time favorites, a scene stealer.

by Anonymousreply 172February 23, 2019 3:46 PM

Love Barbara Harris. Don’t you say anything about Barbara Harris or zi will cut you.

by Anonymousreply 173February 23, 2019 3:47 PM

Barbara Harris was great in ‘Tynan’. And whatever happened to Blanche Baker who played the daughter? She was in ‘Holocaust’ too in addition to ‘Sixteen Candles’ which costarred Kramer’s Justin Henry. (And mom Carroll Baker was in ‘Ironweed ‘, although she shared no scenes with M).

by Anonymousreply 174February 23, 2019 4:02 PM

R99 I’ve won three Emmys dear. This proves you’re not the real me. Picked up another two years ago. I always keep an accurate account of my award hardware.

by Anonymousreply 175February 23, 2019 4:03 PM

I think Meryl was quite beautiful in her youth. As someone upthread state luminescent.

by Anonymousreply 176March 1, 2019 4:51 PM

She really wasy, r176. Have you seen Manhattan? She looks more hoursey than Jessica Parker. If anything shegot better with age.

by Anonymousreply 177March 2, 2019 11:39 AM

"Meryl has gone on record saying she DESPISED the script for "Holocaust", HATED her character and had but disgust for the entire project from start to finish."

I never heard anywhere that she DESPISED the script, HATED her character and had had nothing but disgust for the project from start to finish, except on Datalounge. Where's the credible source that assumption comes from? I don't think there is one. And by the way, "Holocaust" was definitely NOT "garbage." I don't think Meryl Streep would have been so stupid as to call it that.

by Anonymousreply 178March 3, 2019 2:30 AM

She is quoted in the book, "The Meryl Streep Story" by Nick Smurthwaite

“Unfortunately the stage just does’t have the resonance that a piece of garbage like Holocaust did. I really hated the writing in Holocaust. They made me so noble it was sickening. I did it for a very specific purpose at that time in my life – the money.”

by Anonymousreply 179March 3, 2019 2:57 AM

She may have done Holocaust for Cazale’s medical bills but even she knows it helped put her on the map. It was a worldwide phenomenon.

by Anonymousreply 180March 3, 2019 3:05 AM

JoBeth Williams deserves recognition for her nude scene, that shocked me as a 12 year old when I saw it in the theater. Always wondered how she was in so many things, she was pretty average.

by Anonymousreply 181March 3, 2019 3:11 AM

"She is quoted in the book, "The Meryl Streep Story" by Nick Smurthwaite."

Who the hell is Nick Smurthwaite? At any rate, that quote seems suspect. It's a pretty strong statement; seems it would have been reported by other sources if she'd actually said that. And it's inaccurate; "Holocaust" was NOT "garbage" by a long shot. It was criticized by some because it "trivialized" the Holocaust by not showing the true horrors of the Third Reich (how could it? You couldn't show anything graphic on tv back then) and "commercialized" it by NBC's profits from advertising. But it had an incredible cast (Fritz Weaver, Rosemary Harris, Michael Moriarty, James woods, David Warner, Ian Holm, Robert Stephens), amazing acting and was the first time many Americans had seen any lengthy dramatization of the Holocaust which introduced character portrayals of victims and their personal stories. Definitely NOT "garbage."

by Anonymousreply 182March 3, 2019 3:25 AM

Jane Alexander has 4 Oscar nominations, a Tony and 2 Emmy awards. That should be enough recognition to keep the ugliness of jealousy at bay.

by Anonymousreply 183March 3, 2019 3:35 AM

In that recent Streep biography "Her, Again" he describes Holocaust as being something she just did for money. I don't remember her disparaging it. She was just very distracted through the whole thing because of Cazale's health so she was more detached from the production than she usually was. I think he describes her as filming her final scene and then going right to the airport to get home to Cazale.

by Anonymousreply 184March 3, 2019 3:37 AM

"In that recent Streep biography "Her, Again" he describes Holocaust as being something she just did for money. I don't remember her disparaging it. "

I never heard of her dissing it, either. All I ever heard was that the main reason she did it was because she needed the money, and that it was very difficult for her because she was at the same time dealing with the impending death of John Cazale.

by Anonymousreply 185March 3, 2019 3:39 AM

Streep originally auditioned for the Jobeth Williams part. Then when Kate Jackson fell thru the brought her back for another audition. Hoffman knew she was grieving Cazale and told the director she's very vulnerable now. Her interview for the film didn't go very well apparently since she was so depressed at the time. I think they thought she could use that depression for the role.

by Anonymousreply 186March 3, 2019 3:44 AM

I've written this on other threads..... Anyone here read the book? What's funny is... the Joanna character, as written, is Kate Jackson to a tee! She would have been absolutely perfect. Kate's not necessarily an actress of great range, but she's capable of giving a very good performance under the right circumstances, (Decent script, director, etc.). No reason this part wouldn't have catapulted her. I think she was dating Dustin around that time which was why she was even considered.

Man - I don't blame her for being pissed at the producers of Charley's Angels. Her consolation prize ended up being the gay cult classic Making Love. When that movie bombed, she had to settle for that CBS series, the name of which I can't remember nor her hot co-star. Bruce "something"

by Anonymousreply 187March 3, 2019 5:01 PM

Jane was big name herself in the late 70's early 80's, on Broadway and in movies. Why would she feel jealous of Streep?

by Anonymousreply 188March 3, 2019 5:19 PM

Meryl hated Holocaust because it obscenely made bank off the backs of its millions of victims.

by Anonymousreply 189March 3, 2019 5:55 PM

"Meryl hated Holocaust because it obscenely made bank off the backs of its millions of victims."

I assume you're just a trol trying to stir shit. Anyway, if "Holocaust" "obscenely made bank off the backs of its millions of victims" then so did "Schindler's List" and "Life is Beautiful", the "feel good" Holocaust movie, both of which were showered with awards and praise. "Holocaust" was no different from either one of them.

by Anonymousreply 190March 3, 2019 9:13 PM

I watched Still of the Night recently, and Meryl is awful in this. Her performance is so affected and you really get what Katharine Hepburn meant when she said you see the "click, click, click" when Streep was acting. She touches/adjusts her hair at least twice in every scene, which is so distracting. There's one scene where she attempts to make googly-eyes at her boss and fails miserably.

by Anonymousreply 191March 3, 2019 9:25 PM

Even she lists that as her worst film.

by Anonymousreply 192March 3, 2019 9:47 PM

Justification?

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by Anonymousreply 193March 3, 2019 9:57 PM

Hepburn's career was on the wane when she said that.

SHE was the jealous one!

by Anonymousreply 194March 4, 2019 2:42 PM

I loved M in Still Of The Night but I was a 12 year old gayling when I saw it. I thought she looked so beautiful, and she had a great monologue at the end.

by Anonymousreply 195March 5, 2019 12:07 AM

She was a beauty when she was young

by Anonymousreply 196June 23, 2019 12:24 AM

Fantastic performance. Very nuanced.

by Anonymousreply 197August 12, 2019 1:02 AM

She was radiant in KvK and captivating in her very few scenes. Meryl spins straw into gold with this small and underwritten role. Well deserved Oscar. The film itself is quite stylish and well made and Dustin Hoffman looked terrific here as well. This definitely is the perfect companion film to An Unmarried Woman.

by Anonymousreply 198August 12, 2019 2:56 AM

Heh, so Meryl catapulted to fame just as my group was graduating and starting our professional careers. Everyone was creaming their pants over her but I had my doubts. I felt she was an outrageous indicator and terribly mannered. It wasn't til Silkwood when I felt she had come in to her own. Kind of liked her bit in Manhattan as well. Hated her passionately in The French Lieutenants Woman, (my favorite book) My actor friend thought I was crazy.

Well, eventually later in her career she started mentioning how she thought she sucked in her early career, especially in FLW! Hah, vindicated!

So I saw Betty Gilpin do an interview about how grateful she was for her role in Glow cause had been doing, so many "girlfriend roles" and then she did a small bit to show what she meant, and there it was to see, young Meryl Streep's tremulous hesitant, looking away, than smiling, ingenue. All Meryl's early mannerisms on display. Her early schtick.

Jane Alexander was jealous because Meryl sucked in the beginning.

I love the rest of Meryl's career from Silkwood on.

by Anonymousreply 199August 12, 2019 4:44 AM

OMG, her false modesty in that Today show clip at R42 is SICK MAKING! What a phoney!

Of course her publicist got her the cover of TIME magazine - which was significant because that was pre-cable news, back when people used to read a weekly news magazine. It’s not like Santa Claus got it for her.

Meryl Streep is SO overrated. She’s given a lot of good performances but to pretend that she excels above all others and is the standard to which others should aspire (and in keeping with the Streep brand - can never reach) is just tiresome. There are a lot of great actresses working - and there would be more from her generation if she just said no once in a while. She’s done a great job of narrowing the field of competition in her generation by taking up all the roles herself, roles she wasn’t particularly suited for. For all the frothing at the mouth over her recent work, she made a fool out of herself in BBL2 with her ridiculous screaming and fictitious teeth.

by Anonymousreply 200August 12, 2019 5:58 AM

Who the heck is Meryl Streel?

by Anonymousreply 201November 1, 2020 4:23 PM

[quote] You know I won my first of three Oscars for this role, as G watched from home

Meanwhile, I was up for best actress and I lost to the fucking flying nun!

by Anonymousreply 202November 1, 2020 4:33 PM

Reading this thread lead me to this video and I had no idea Steven Spielberg was so handsome

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by Anonymousreply 203November 1, 2020 4:50 PM

Why does Hoffman look so pissed that Benton won? It isn't like he didn't just win himself.

by Anonymousreply 204November 1, 2020 11:28 PM

Is Goldie Hawn stoned in that clip, R203?

by Anonymousreply 205November 2, 2020 3:34 AM
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