Dustin Hoffman in The Graduate (1967)

Cool, OP, but in light of the horrendous accusations which have been made about Hoffman, I pray you watched the film illegally and did not contribute to his undeserved wad of cash.

They’re showing the film right now on Television.

R1 you said it, ACCUSATIONS. No proof. Innocent until proven guilty.

Huge fan here of the movie. A few articles about the age of most cast members was an issue. The cinematography is very subtle but amazing.

R1 is correct. This psychopath was so entitled that he digitally penetrated a woman against her will with potential witnesses standing just feet away from them. He sickens me, and I will never be able to watch his films again.

He digitally penetrated someone? Wtf.

Great film. Will always be one of my favorites. Hoffman and Bancroft were brilliant.

"And as he’s doing that, he literally just stuck his fingers down my pants,” Kester said. “He put his fingers inside me. And the thing I feel most bad about is I didn’t know what to do. I just stood there. I just froze in the situation like ‘Oh my god, what is happening?’ It’s shocking when that happens to you.”

Kester said that she made an effort not to react for fear that her boyfriend or the other man in the control room would know what was happening. She estimated that Hoffman kept his fingers inside her for 15-20 seconds, until he finished the take. Then she moved away from him.

Why Does every thread need to become some PC witch-hunt thread?!

You can’t even discuss a classic film anymore cause one of the extras may have done something wrong at some point 🙄

The one that turned me against Hoffman was when he came on to his DAUGHTER'S teenage (like 14-15) friend. I always knew he was a womanizer, but a perv? Ewww.

The Graduate: sooooo dated. And I thought so the first time I saw it in a 1973 re-release.

Dusty was one of my early intense crushes.

How is it dated? It’s about a young graduate fucking an older woman that’s using him for sex.

The tone/production/look of it is what is so special. The cinematography, lighting, production design. Its beyond special.

However, Dustin is DONE, correct?

Dustin is fine.

I’m not gonna not enjoy a film cause he’s in it. Ridiculous.

[quote]The tone/production/look of it is what is so special. The cinematography, lighting, production design. Its beyond special.

There's one scene when he's found his room at Berkeley and he's looking down onto the sunlit street from his window that always stands out for me. He's sad but outside the sun is shining bright.

One reason it's dated is because Mrs Robinson would have had access to legal abortion and would never have married Mr Robinson, hence no story. The story is so late Sixties, down to the virginal apathetic graduate who doesn't want to join the rate race and live as well off as his parents. A theme of the times.

Mrs Robinson would have had access to legal abortion and would never have married Mr Robinson

[quote]isn’t he too old to be playing a 20 year old Graduate? He was 30 when cast, and some 30 year olds look very young, and some 20 year olds older, but he looked his age. Why did they cast someone that looked his age (30) to play a 20 year old?!

There are lots of videos on YouTube for you to enjoy where all this is talked about and explained.

[quote] and some 20 year olds older, but he looked his age.

I don't think he does.

Because he was right for the role OP!

He certainly didn’t look 20!

He was very hot in this movie though. Love all the shirtless scenes.

I doesn't matter. He had chemistry

[quote]The cinematography is very subtle but amazing.

Subtle? The visuals are as stylized as it gets.

All that talk about him looking too Jewish for the part.

I never even thought about it and I've watched it 20 times.

The music by Paul Simon for this film was amazing. It added to how special the film is.

R22 I never thought of that either but my stepfather always complained about them casting an “obvious” Jew in the role of a WASP.

It infuriated him.

[quote]The music by Paul Simon for this film was amazing. It added to how special the film is.

Absolutely.

60s music is magical and powerful - the best of it.

Yes, R23, the music made it. Without Simon and Garfunkel on the soundtrack I don't think it would have been as big a hit.

I went to school surrounded by Jewish boys like Hoffman, and I thought his casting was weird. It didn't bother me, just seemed weird.

It's amazing that this was Dustin's first film. A starring role in a major film.

It wasn't his first film, R27.

What was his other film, R28?

Madigan's Millions, made in 1966, released in '68. The Tiger Makes Out 1967.

Some questions answered here.

Thank you for the correction, R30.

But they must have been very minor roles in forgotten films.

Yeah, major studios rarely gamble on new actors in starring roles but sometimes they do and it works

IIRC, Robert Redford was up for the part of Benjamin but Mike Nichols met Dustin and convinced all to go w him.

If you like this OP check out Billy Liar which is sort of the British version - but only sort of.

R36 good call. Not a fan of Redford.

R37 I think this is wonderful! Will definitely check out Billy Liar! Thanks for the suggestion

Also Petulia, OP.

I know you'll love it.

Check out this trailer.

Even the trailer is magical. Shot the same year.

Loved the Anne Bancroft character. Thought the Katharine Ross character was boring. Not sure if the casting was so great for the Dustin Hoffman character (yes, he appeared old for the part). I liked Murray Hamilton (Mr. Robinson), too.

But still, still, STILL, it should have been me!

I adore the film.

One problem.

I don't get why his parents were so unbelievably thrilled Ben was going to marry Elaine. He was a total layabout and he had no job.

I felt Dusty was great in the film. I feel he’s a very relatable actor and talented, just feel he looked too old to pass for 20. Hot little ass on him though.

Elaine was boring but she was a sweet, good girl. She couldn’t even look at a topless woman! Very innocent minded, while her cougar mom just wanted to get fucked.

& who was paying for the hotel room, they were there so many times all the hotel staff knew him by name.

R42 I was confused by that also. He just lays around and his father wants him to do SOMETHING, whether it’s a job or graduate school, but he just wants to lay around all day. Why would you be happy he’s getting married? He will end up living with you, with his wife this time.

R45 probably Mrs. Robinson, they clearly are wealthy.

Another odd thing, typical to movies.

Ben didn't have a single friend? He'd grown up in L.A.

Interesting R36, that the "official" story became that Redford rejected the role, when in reality, Nichols rejected HIM. Redford wanted it.

R48. You are correct. Redford saw it as one of those "iconic, young men who define a particular American era or archetype" roles he likes so much. Nichols stood his ground and said "nope".

One of my favorite camera-jobs from any movie ever is when Benjamin is in the hotel lobby waiting for Mrs R. She walks up. Camera is fixed on the round mirror topped drink table (knee height). You see Anne's face come into focus. Upside down. In the mirror top. And then the iconic "Hello Benjamin". Stellar.

R47 some people are loners. Being in LA doesn’t change that.

My favorite scene is the very end on the bus. Smiling, laughing, we got away. Happy ending. Then both of their faces change to what the fuck have we done. How long do you think Ben and Elaine lasted?

I too refuse to watch this film despite the fact it looks interesting because of Dustin. I can't support that behavior, not now.

[quote] I can't support that behavior, not now.

Your loss.

R53 I'm blocking you.

Oh, MARY!

How sad that people cut off films because of unproven accusations

R52/R54 is a pathetic creature.

I still would have liked to see the version if Harrison Ford had been cast

I loved the sequel........

There’s a sequel?

The unintentional sequel is Kramer vs. Kramer

R60 Yes, unofficial, and kinda bloody silly, but like Evening Star essential for gay completists

Rumor Has It has nothing to do with The Graduate

R63 As I said, unofficial, but to say it has nothing to do with The Graduate is incorrect,

What are the ties between The Graduate and Rumor Has It?

R65 Jesus wept, read the fucking synopsis and see

The Graduate made $104 million in 1967. That is over $770 million in 2019, DOMESTICALLY.

It’s crazy how many people saw movies back then compared to now.

Movies are so awful now and appeal to such a limited audience.

[quote]I too refuse to watch this film despite the fact it looks interesting because of Dustin.

WTF is this? Some kind of new American obsession?

How can you enjoy the world's art, literature, film, music, architecture... if you judge everything first and foremost by the behavior of it's creators?

Your mindset is just so unsophisticated.

I don't have to admire someone who lacks integrity, simply because they have artistic skill.

I just love the sound editing during the wedding scene.

Dustin is a wonderful actor.

I don't think they paid much attention to actual age back then. I think Nick Nolti was playing an 18 year old when he was 35 (Rich Man, Poor Man).

That’s ridiculous lmaooooo.

But boy was Hoffman sexy as fuck. He has a very nice ass.

R4 is a damn fool. Honestly, you are an idiot.

By the way, creep at r1, Hoffman deserves every penny he has made.

I love this movie it's in my top . I'm 35 and first saw it one day when I was hope sick from school.

Even if Dustin Hoffman is a pig how does that take away from the hard work of everybody else involved in the film? Why should nobody watch it because of one actor? In my opinion his performance isn't even the best in the movie.

R77 I’m 31 and seeing it for the first time today. I always knew about it but never cared to watch. Today I decided to and it was wonderful. Incredible acting, script, editing, cinematography, MUSIC etc.

I REFUSE to even glimpse the works of Caravaggio. And Leonardo Da Vinci? Forget it!

I liked "The Graduate." The only thing I thought was wrong about it was Dustin Hoffman. Oh, his acting was great. But he was SO physically miscast. The character of Benjamin Braddock was a blonde, bley eyed, surfer boy type, a Robert Redford type. Short, homely, semitic-looking Hoffman stuck out like a sore thumb. And he was supposed to the son of of couple of WASPS! The actors who played his parents didn't look like they were even remotely related to him. And Mrs. Robinson lusts after him? If Ben had been played by a good looking actor her violent attraction to him would have made sense, but with Hoffman playing him it's WTF?I tried to explain it away by telling myself her sexual fixation on short, homely Ben was a measure of how disturbed Mrs. Robinson was.

For some reason I always thought Pete Duel would have made a great Benjamin Braddock. He certainly had the looks for it; Mrs' Robinson wanting to jump his bones would have been completely understandable with him in the role. And I think he would have given a great performance. He had a flair for comedy as well as being a fine dramatic actor. I would have loved him as Benjamin Braddock.

Idk R81, I found Hoffman attractive.

My issue is he doesn’t look 20 nor does he look like a WASP.

I don’t doubt there would be women that look at him and find him sexy. Some don’t find that tall, blue eyed blond attractive. Some would take a Hoffman over a Redford any day.

It’s a pretty fascinating film. One scene, where the camera pans away from Anne Bancroft and she “shrinks”, soaking wet and defeated, into a bright white background, struck me as so stark and expressionist. I also loved the supporting characters and the tight close-up scenes of their faces, shadowed by the harsh glare of direct sunlight, full of all the false joviality.

The actress who played the mother was so good, particularly when she “explodes” with rapture when creepy Benjamin announces that he and Elaine are to be married.

I also loved the leopard skin hat and collar Mrs. Robinson where at the church, like an animal. I found that scene amazing but not for Hoffman’s part, instead for when Mrs. Robinson hisses at Elaine “It’s too late!” and Elaine replies “Not for me”. I thought that was really powerful, and Bancroft belts her across the face, twice, with all the rage and disappointment her character has stored inside her.

I think Nichols had a stroke of genius to cut the audio and show only the angry mouths of the groom, her parents, all baring their teeth at her while yelling. These are some of the clever touches I admired in that film when I first saw in high school. Hoffman was good, but the film overall is pretty great.

Interesting book I read last year which explores various aspects of the film, its look, the performances, casting, etc.

Well said R83. To me, it is these moments that Mike Nichols used so effectively that just are so rare - currently or historically. The wedding scene you mention ..... I can see the silent shouting and the groom's hissing blue eyed WASPy countenance this very moment. And then the sound comes back in. Joltingly.

Re the comments above about Dustin not right for the part Nichols said in an interview that if he cast Redford or some other actor w a strong presence, it would dilute Mrs R's strength over him. He wanted to highlight that era of youth where they just were so damned unsure/skeptical/lost about the world around them; however, they were certain they would eschew the shibboleths of their parents' generation. They weren't sure of much. But sure that they didn't want what came before them. Benjamin is the crystallization of that character. That era.

I actually felt a bit sorry for Mrs. Robinson, so unhappy in her marriage.

I don’t even think she longed for Benjamin cause he was so “hot”, but it was deeper than that. She wanted someone young she could control and have how she wanted to have them and when she said. She probably never felt she had control over anything.

Add on the fact they slept in different rooms and she clearly had a strong sexual appetite, she wanted a good fuck as many times as she wanted, something only a young man could provide.

For God's sake, it's a comedy, Ben's goofy and unsexy, which is part of the joke.

He becomes more attractive as the movie moves on.

It was barely a comedy...

I would take Hoffman over Redford any day. Hoffman had this untapped, youthful semetic sexiness in his youth, whereas Redford was basically a well groomed Aryan--boring.

Plastics.

[quote]It was barely a comedy...

of course it's a comedy, you idiot

[quote]Plastics.

That wasn't funny.

R42, I think that shows how different things were in the 60s; white middle class people were not consumed with economic anxiety. Hoffman’s character came from a good family and had gone to a good school; he could walk into a stockbroker or advertising job the second he stopped moping.

"I would take Hoffman over Redford any day. "

I wouldn't. I think if you asked most women (and men, for that matter) who'd they rather fuck, a young Dustin Hoffman or a young Robert Redford, I think Redford would win by a landslide.

R94 you think everyone loves WASPs. Some of us like our men with some seasoning.

AND, R49, Redford's line was "I didn't look like a 21 year old who hasn't been laid," right in tune with the later heartthrob Redford. Totally created out of thin air to satisfy the image.

I don't know about that R94. It's very hard for women because they have to chose a guy hoping he'll be good in bed and is not a selfish ignorant asshole. Redford is not only very reserved with women on screen, he seems shy and buttoned-down off screen. Hoffman, though not handsome, is a far better on screen lover. Off screen he's funny and spontaneous. Hoffman would win - or get as many women interested - as Redford any day. (I asked)

I don't think Robert Redford would have been right for the role of Benjamin Braddock. He had the looks, but not much else. As for Hoffman, he's a good actor but quite awful. When he first met Meryl Streep (she was his co-star in "Kramer vs. Kramer") he grabbed her breast. I think he thought that was funny. Her first impression of him was that he was "a pig."

R97, you don’t need to tell us that Hoffman and Streep co-starred in Kramer vs Kramer.

Love the entire finale of the film.

Love the Church scene

The scene where Elaine finds out he’s been fucking her mom is fantastic

IMBD says Warren Beatty was up for the role as well.

He was an OK actor, never really a great one.

I tried to bump up the thread where one journo confronted him with the accusations during a screening of Wag the Dog.

Did anything come out of those accusations, did he buy himself out of it? Does he still have so much sway that he can escape those accusations?

R99 Yes, that last segment, where the camera pans away from Mrs. Robinson (“Goodbye, Benjamin”) is extraordinary.

Isn’t Hoffman known for groping his female costars? He did it to Meryl, he grabbed Anne Bancrofts breast without her knowing he was gonna, and he pinched Katharine Ross ass during their screentest and she berated him. He thought he lost the role there but the director loved and needed his awkwardness.

You also have to put the off-beat ethnic casting in the context of the period.

The early/mid-1960s were some of the dullest years in Hollywood history because the star system and studio dominance were evaporating but nothing was yet replacing it. The young male stars of those years were mostly pretty boy non-actors. Suddenly there were The Beatles and any number of shaggy off-beat types who young girls went absolutely ape shit over. Casting Dustin was seen as admirably rebellious and led the way for a slew of ethnic and quirky young men who changed the standard for male sexuality.

From IMDb

Robert Redford screentested with Candice Bergen for the part of Benjamin Braddock, but was finally rejected by Director Mike Nichols. Nichols did not believe Redford could persuasively project the underdog qualities necessary to the role. When he told this to Redford, Redford asked Nichols what he meant. "Well, let's put it this way", said Nichols, "Have you ever struck out with a girl?" "What do you mean?" asked Redford. "That's precisely my point", said Nichols. Redford told Nichols that he perfectly understood the character of Benjamin, who was a social misfit. He went on and on about his ability to play the part. Nichols finally said to him, "Bob, look in the mirror. Can you honestly imagine a guy like you having difficulty seducing a woman?"

Who would have been a better Benjamin at the time?

R107, Burt Ward.

Dustin was only paid $17,000 for this movie.

He made $1.25 million for Papillon in 1972.

You can buy the DVD for $4 on Amazon

Mrs. Robinson is the most interesting character in the film. Ben is going to end up like his father. With any luck, Elaine will get away from these depressing people and avoid her mom's alcoholism. Being stuck with Ben would have driven Carrie Nation to drink.

I’m shocked to hear Bancroft didn’t get work until 1972 despite the film being a critical and box office hit.

Her Oscar nod is also considered category fraud.

For me, once Mrs. Robinson leaves the story it becomes far less interesting, not unlike with Margo Channing in All About Eve.

Oscar fraud in what sense, r113?

Sorry, meant category fraud. She’s nominated as Lead but she’s clearly supporting, and even absent from most of the films second half.

R113 Bancroft was on Broadway twice between 1967 and 1972; she won an Emmy for TV work in 1970; and in 1971 was pregnant with her son. She had plenty of work.

This scene was wonderful. The editing is fantastic, as well as the music.

And Hoffman had a hot little body on him.

I was enthralled and frightened by Anne Bancroft’s character. She gave me all the feelings.

The continuation to the scene at r118

Best thing he did.

I never liked this movie. But then again, I read the book first.

As far as I'm concerned, the only really good film Hoffman ever did was Midnight Cowboy.

There have been a handful of movie stars over the years whose film debut introduced an original persona unlike anyone the public had ever seen before onscreen. Katharine Hepburn, Audrey Hepburn and Dustin Hoffman would be three of them. This is not about talent.

Any others?

Is the book worth reading?

Charles Grodin was also up for the role of Ben.

Here's a story about all the cast changes, involving Gene Hackman, Doris Day and Redford.

Redford never had the role. He was rejected fast cause he wouldn’t be believable in the role.

Hoffman was good in Kramer vs Kramer, Tootsie and Rain Man also. He’s had many hits.

If you adjust all his movies for 2019 numbers, he’s has so many massive blockbusters.

PS, Meryl was wonderful and subtle in KvK. Her acting has become so over the top hammy now. I could only imagine how she would play the scene out now if she filmed this in 2019

According to that story at R125, Susan Hayward and Patty Duke were considered for Mrs. Robinson and Elaine. They lost the roles but went on to cinematic history the next year in Valley of the Dolls.

Dustin have a very beautiful speech when he won his Oscar for Kramer vs Kramer. It was gracious and humble.

I've never bothered to check (lazy, sorry) but I remember a rumor that even Anne Bancroft and Katherine Ross were somewhat close in age to play mother/daughter.

Ann was 36, Dustin was 30. Katharine was 27.

William Daniels who played Hoffman’s dad was only 40.

"Dustin have a very beautiful speech when he won his Oscar for Kramer vs Kramer. It was gracious and humble."

It should have been. Peter Sellers deserved to win the Oscar that year, for "Being There."

Sean Connery played Hoffman's father in "Family Business": he's seven years older than his on-screen son.

I always assumed both families were Jewish...what did I miss?

Robert Redford could not have fit that part.

Streep was in some western with Hoffman. She told a story about how he was in a bathtub scene in the movie and she had to put her hand in the tub for the scene. She said when she put her hand in the tub Hoffman wasn't wearing underwear and she accidentally put her hand on his dick. She told the story while laughing about it, as if the whole thing were a joke.

R135 it is a joke

Yeah, where does everyone get this idea that Benjamin's family is so WASPY?

In the book, the family was definitely full on WASP. Nichols later said he wanted both families to appear less so on film in order to highlight the general underlying malaise affecting ALL Americans at the time. He tried to make them somewhat more accessible to all audiences. In fact, Katherine Ross seems to be the only actor he kept truer to her book-character in looks.

R135 Streep and Hoffman never made a western together. There is a bath scene in "Little Big Man" with Hoffman and Miss Dunaway.

R106, Redford married when he was barely 21 and was for the most part was a faithful husband, he wasn't used to hitting on women or striking out. I always saw that quote as about Redford's ignorance. Women probably hit on him frequently, he didn't have to do much.

R67, NO movie made $100+ million in 1967, 68, 69. The numbers you site are faulty. Perhaps after 10 years of release and re-release, and TV sales.

R105, years before The Beatles (who get credit for far more than they deserve) films depicting working class Brits where different kinds of actors were used, such as Albert Finney, Alan Bates and Michael Caine, were extremely popular with American audiences. The anti-heros of foreign films paved the way for US films. I don't disagree with "nothing replacing" the US contract system, yet that was far more destructive for actresses than actors.

Doris Day was offered the role as Mrs. Robinson, but she turned it down due to required nudity.

Remember the times. It was Eugene McCarthy for President on film. I always though "In the Heat of the Night" was Robert Kennedy for President on film.

Everywhere states The Graduate made $104 million

[Quote] My favorite scene is the very end on the bus. Smiling, laughing, we got away. Happy ending. Then both of their faces change to what the fuck have we done. How long do you think Ben and Elaine lasted?

Mine too. The first time i watched that scene i thought it was a happy ending. The second time.......not so much.

The ending, where the couple stare ahead, carried off into an unknown future full of indifference, feels very existential. It’s very poignant.

The ending was definitely NOT happy. They got out of the church and onto a bus, but what happens after that? They're both college students with no job or income (I don't think either one of them has a trust fund). Elaine is legally married to someone else. Where will they do? What will they do? How will they live? I think they're thinking of all of those things once their fleeting moment of freedom and escape has passed.

[quote]Where will they do? What will they do? How will they live?

They're both young, attractive, educated.

Ben's parents will probably take them in for a while, while they sort themselves out. His parents are nice people. Ben will get a job in no time. So will she.

R135 That is the movie. I never saw it didn't remember the name of it and for some reason, I thought it was a western. I just remember her talking about it and wondering why she thought it was funny. She was talking about how he always played practical jokes.

"They're both young, attractive, educated.

"Ben's parents will probably take them in for a while, while they sort themselves out. His parents are nice people. Ben will get a job in no time. So will she."

They're also penniless and have no job experience. Not exactly in a position to take on the world. Boy, are YOU desperate for a happy ending.

Ben's parents would probably be infuriated with him. They wanted him to go to graduate school and make something of himself. I'm sure they would find his erratic behavior (storming the church, running out with the married Elaine) appalling and embarrassing. I don't think they would be too inclined to "take them in while they sort themselves out." I think they would be mad as hell. And of course there's the little matter of Elaine having a husband. No, Ben and Elaine were up shit creek and they knew it, hence their expressionless faces as the bus spirits them away to nowhere.

Her marriage can be annulled. They never fucked.

That makes a lot of sense, R146. However, THIS IS A MOVIE!

"However, THIS IS A MOVIE!"

That's just my take on it. It's like "Gone With The Wind." Some people think Scarlett got Rhett back. My opinion on that is that no way in hell did she get him back. That's just my view.

R128 don't know about Susan Hayward but Patty Duke did not lose the role of Elaine, she turned them down 👍

Any documentation on that, r153? I find it hard to believe that Mike Nichols would have cast Patty Duke. The studio may have been interested in her, as they apparently were in Doris Day as Mrs. Robinson, but was the role really officially offered to Patty (or Doris, for that matter)?

Now, if these were studio offers before Nichols was hired, I'd believe that.

Katherine Ross was a better Elaine than Patty Duke would have been as she is much prettier. She also does look like she could be the child of her on screen parents.

Sexy Jewish schlubs like Dustin, Elliott Gould, Richard Dreyfuss, Richard Benjamin and Charles Grodin had to be paired with the likes of Katherine Ross, Mia Farrow, Ali McGraw, Cybill Shepherd and Candice Bergen.

Katherine Ross may have been "right" for Elaine, but Patty Duke would have been 100% more FUN.

R156, it was just an ethnic version of Revenge of the Nerds started in movies with James Stewart, Jack Lemmon and the like decades before.

Didn't anyone think it might have been a good marketing tool to reunite Bancroft and Duke 6 years after the "Miracle Worker"?

I love this movie and Hoffman's acting, and shock...i don't give a fuck about the allegations really. Flame away in horror.

R158 💯

R154 just what I read over the years.

Dustin was HOT in this.

But his face couldn’t pass for a 20 year old.

This is easily one of the better movies. One of my favs

This film is highly overrated. IMO Midnight Cowboy is Dustin's best work.

Dustin was hot in this

I know r147 was being sarcastic but back then young kids can do something crazy or fucked up but they can bum around for a couple of years get a responsible job, have kids, buy a house etc. You can't get away with that shit anymore unless your super rich. You have to get a well paying job right out of college or you'll never make it. You can't backpack across Europe.......

Anyone notice how all the adults/elders are fucking EVIL in this film?

It is a very interesting take on people over 40-

Everyone is miserable, violent, and nasty except the youthful characters-

R167 I think it has more to do with how the world is viewed through the eyes of a young person vs someone older whose had experience

"Anyone notice how all the adults/elders are fucking EVIL in this film?"

Here's a quote from the sixties (I don't know where it's from): "Don't trust anyone over thirty." It was the youth rebellion of the times. It was pretty stupid.

Women still marry to keep the baby, esp. in middle class homes.

Redfield wouldn't have been relatable and he has no flair for black comedy (or regular comedy for that matter) which is a big part of the film. He couldn't have carried off the absurd scuba scene or the discomfort with Mrs. Robinson's seduction. Hoffman was a good fit for the part even though he was a old for it.

Hayward would have been interesting. Duke couldn't have carried off the upper middle class thing--Ross didn't have to have a lot of range here and she projected the right social background. Despite the Mid-Atlantic accent Daniels is believable as the father.

Being friendless growing up in LA is very believable. Friendships often seem to lack depth there (have had family there for decades)

Doris Day would have sucked as Mrs. R--better "against type" casting would have been Donna Reed. She got an Oscar for being a prostitute, after all. She also had coolness and sometimes brittle quality that would have worked for the part and obviously would be believeable as the mom next door.

Isn't Mitchell on record saying Scarlett didn't get Rhett back?

I saw the movie when I was a kid back in the 70's like another poster. Back then the ending was considered pretty exhilarating and despite the uncertainty filled with possibilities. Maybe young people are more financially trapped today. Also the ending is a steal from and homage to Harold Lloyd. Nichols was a friend of his and openly credited him.

And Hoffman was considered very sexy and cute by a lot of women back then. He was hot in this film and it gives it much of its drive.

Redford is a terrific comic actor. Who is the crazy person who doesn't think he has comedy chops?

Redford is always the straight man in his few comedies.

Anne Bancroft must have hated having to say "I'm 20 years older than you" to an actor only six years her junior, which explains why she grits her teeth when saying it.

Yeah, as it went on, I thought much of the metoo stuff was BS, or overblown. But the stories that Dustin Hoffman's victims told were so heartbreaking. I actually cried reading one of the women's stories. And his weird, grandiose, entitled reactions/answers made it even worse. He is a PIG, and holy shit remember that Tootsie interview where he started blubbering- what a fucking asshole.

That said, I think he was a great actor in his day, and I don' t think any of this could preclude me from watching his old movies.

[quote]One reason it's dated is because Mrs Robinson would have had access to legal abortion and would never have married Mr Robinson, hence no story

What an asinine remark. This doesn't "date" the movie, it merely sets it in an earlier era. The movie was made 52 years ago, genius.

Oh R172 so you are the crazy person. Redford could deliver a zinger with the best of them. A not inconsiderable talent. Life is so unfair.

Interesting how certain people like Hoffman are strung up in the meetoo movement and others just as guilty get off without a murmer. Life is very unfair.

Hoffman didn't look like he would be the bio kid of those two parents.

This is a trend now too, see the girl playing Collin Farrell’s daughter in Dumbo or the girl playing Hawkeyes daughter in Endgame. Jeremy Renner and Linda Cardellini are white as hell, and their two sons also but their daughter olive skinned and ethnic looking? Come on.

This has always been one of my favorite movies ever since I first saw it. Great acting, cinematography, and soundtrack all brought together by Mike Nichols' genius choices and direction. R81's post represents the sort of conventional thinking the Nichols defied when he cast Hoffman in the role. He took a big risk and it paid off. He and Hoffman broke the mold of the Hollywood leading man and expanded the definition of who could be eligible for such a part. Hoffman struck me as odd at first, but his acting was superb. What's more, as the film draws you in, he becomes quite attractive, and yes he did have a nice little body then. I thought Bancroft was terrific, beautiful, sexy, hilarious and tragic in her jaded discontent. Of course, I'm disappointed at the revelations about Hoffman's private behavior, and I've lost a lot of respect I used to have for him. But my opinion of this movie is hasn't changed: it's still a classic with a great turn from Bancroft and a star-making performance from Hoffman.

Brilliant performance