New Gillette ad raising awareness about toxic masculinity "boys will be boys" sparks debate

They should air it during the Super Bowl.

Loved it.

R1, Agreed.

Love it.

Fabulous! Put it in high rotation!

Shave the last dunce for me

Was not expecting it to feel much of anything after watching but, yeah, that was well done.

I choked up by the end. I love it.

I can see Tucker Carlson, Laura Ingraham and other Fox hosts having meltdowns about this "aggressive liberal pc culture"

All those big strong he-man woman haters are so easily triggered. I love it!

It’s very well done. Never could understand why straight men want to hang on to “toxic masculinity”. Life would be so much easier for them if they let those bs standards go. I haven’t had a straight friend though since middle school so what do I know.

It was good. Although I don't think it's helpful to label the behaviour 'toxic masculinity'. It makes changing behaviour more difficult.

I am going to say this as a Het Woman - toxic slut behavior by women has to stop too - woman to woman - young ladies need to know their worth is more then just "instagram likes" over cleavage and butt shots - cause they flaunting their sexual market. If we are going to get better at this- as a culture - women can't just do what ever they want either. Basically respect of others - can be raised to a higher standard by ALL groups. Respect yourself. Respect others. Is that so freaking hard??? Show respect, be polite.

Most of the comments are from Trump supporters/trolls. Those users with their names followed by random numbers are mostly trolls. Someone might have posted the link to some right-wing website/platform.

I like the ad. Also agree with R12.

R12 So women who are proud of their bodies, respect their bodies and love their bodies need to cover themselves up to avoid men's lustful gaze?

Move to Saudi Arabia.

"What I think she's actually trying to say" says the corporate "douche" not letting the woman speak during the meeting....meanwhile I can't get a word in edgewise among the women I work with lol

R12 Who cares what women do? Let them whore themselves out for likes and tummy tea.

R16, I hear ya. I've worked in entertainment, mostly having women bosses and they are the worst.

What's the ad about? Does the black man shave his ginny after shaving his beard or something?

I think it is their Super Bowl ad. I too think it's well done and moving.

But they'll be pilloried by the public.

Maybe they are hoping all the liberal men who love this will shave their beards?

The absurdity though is that these behaviors are only attributed to men. As a kid and an adult, I've witnessed some girls and women being bigger bullies than the males. It's true that the sexual advances are mostly men, but anti-bullying should address both genders.

How courageous of Gillette! I wonder if they'll start to use heavy set/lanky/less conventionally attractive men in their advertisements from now on?

The comments on that video. I worry for our future

I’ve gone from a male dominated industry to a female heavy industry, they don’t dominate leadership roles but they do outnumber men. My experience is that my current female boss is better than the male bosses I’ve bad before. There’s also less back stabbing, competition and silly alpha postering. There’s more DL style bitchy gossiping and pettiness but the atmosphere is lighter and I get a good laugh most days. Working among men there wasn’t much laughter unless they were mocking someone “weaker”.

R12 I’m not sure I understand your point. There’s just as many male instahoes selling supplements with bulge out and next to nothing on. I don’t class them as being examples of “toxic masculinity” so I’m not sure how girls squatting in booty shorts are displaying “toxic femininity”. Male or female, I don’t see how the insahoes are disrespecting other people. You might say they are selling out and selling their sexuality and disrespecting themselves. I think people who whore out their kids to sell something by posting them on social media are ever worse though. Also I use ASMR videos to fall asleep. Girls in the community get a lot of shit for being slutty and using their sexuality if they show skin in a video or wear too much makeup. I listen mostly to male ASMR and there’s just as many guys doing the same. In fact some guys record shirtless. Almost al of them do boyfriend role play videos. There’s underage boys posting shirtless with hundreds of thousands of followers. Do they get any hate for it? Nope. Not a mention when people are foaming over a bit of cleavage or too much eyeliner. Kind of like how Male pornstars escape the hate and abuse their female counterparts get. If you ask me that’s the result of “toxic masculinity” and I think the reason you are so aware of and concerned about female Instahoes but not the male ones is the same.

I chuckled at the black man stopping the white man catcalling a woman. Didn't quite gel with the video of the woman walking in New York a few years ago, but then it's Hollywood.

A huge blind spot of SJWs is their inability to see people of color as anything but innocent victims. It’s very black and white thinking. They can’t accept that a black man can be homophonic, a Muslim can be sexist, a Latino can be anti semetic. It’s all or nothing. I assume it’s because most of them have very little interaction with people outside of their white upper middle class world.

Still, the ad is needed as evidenced by the comments and they did a great job overall.

R27 if they only knew that Asians were the most racist group

[quote]Was not expecting it to feel much of anything after watching but, yeah, that was well done.

Agree with r6. I was surprised by how powerful the ad was, I wasn't expecting that. I'm not American, how are the issues raised in any way divided by political affiliation or liberal/conservative? The issues raised in the ad affect everyone.

Great ad.

"I'm a man, but I can change, if I have to, I guess"

Hillary Clinton,Elizabeth Warren ,Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez are coming for our BALLS!

The worst bullying and covert backstabbing was when I worked a PR job and it all came from women against other women. Women don't like to see other women succeed and will backstab with a smile.

Wonderful powerful important

At first, I thought it was a bit much, but after thinking about it, good for Gillet. If het males in America got their shit together a lot of problems would be solved (or at least significantly reduced) in this country.

Gillette is owned by Procter and Gamble. I'm willing to bet the deplorables are planning a boycott as we speak.

R33 speaks truth.

Fucking ridiculous bullshit.

Get fucked, Gillette.

They must be marketing to females buying razors for themselves or their husbands. I guess that makes sense for husbands who have their wives do all the shopping.

Иди на хуй, Борис @ r38.

Ok I'm going to be in the minority here but what was the point of this ad? I mean yes guys can act like douches but so can women. Is this supposed to make men think twice before hitting on a woman? Or having a fight with someone? Not everything is socially constructed. Some things are down to hormones and instinct. Men can learn to be more aware and considerate but these kinds of campaigns seem to want men.....not to be men at all. I'd like to see an ad about how women should be more masculine. That would be interesting.

I mean, it's cheesy.

I guess an upside to all this teaching men to be less masculine is possibly that more straight guys will consider gay sex.

Gillette has a hell of a nerve preaching to us.

Fuck off with that shit.

There's definitely toxic masculinity, however this is definitely anti male propoganda. I think Gillette have just screwed themselves.

Lots if comments on YouTube by men who are rightly slamming this as heavy handed and clumsy. Since when did adverts for products become public service announcements?

I think this is only an issue for real conservatives and old people. Most of my friends are straight men and everyone agrees that there's some sort of toxic masculinity that prevents us from being ourselves.

There's nothing int his commercial remotely anti-male, are you stupid R45? It's asking man to handle themselves better, to stand up for women being harassed and stop fighting over stupid shit. Every sensible parent should teach this to their children. Fuck off.

I didn't even know what brand of razors I buy. I just know what the packaging looks like.

No R47. It is implying ALL men are like this. Not true. It's insulting. Why is it always men that are bad evil etc? I don't see how this helps younger men except that anything masculine is equated to negativity and anything feminine is positive. Thats a shitty and damaging message.

They should do a female version teaching women to stand up for themselves, not to use their sexuality to manipulate when it suits, not to go along with sexual encounters if they aren't into the guy, then crying rape afterwards. Not to have affairs with teenage boys and not to backstab each other.

I think we ALL would be better served by being kinder to one another.

Tacky, finger-waving, and preachy.

I agree, R51; the only straight guy I ever knew who was kind and not afraid to show emotion...he killed himself last year.

there was so much talk at his funeral of being kind to one another; keeping his spirit alive, but I haven't experienced much of that.

life has no joy. no love. nothing's ever going to really change.

we're born. we struggle. we die.

Have you ever met a woman in your life R49, or a straight man? Most women put up with this shit every single day. It's not a random occurrence. Most men are acting like assholes to women, I'm sorry if that triggers you. My friends, most of whom are straight are not doing that, but they do struggle with standards that their fathers forced on them to be strong and not show emotions. This is a REAL mental health issue.

I don’t understand the recent popularity of the “two wrongs make it right” argument. Stating that men need to behave better says nothing about female behavior. You have to start somewhere and this is a good start.

R12 Let them do what they want and you do what you want. Then everyone is happy.

I think what Gillette seems to forget is that there's toxic people in every form. Men, women, white, black, Hispanic, Asian, gay, straight etc. Nobody owns toxic behavior yet Gillette has assigned it only to men.

Anyone else think that the guy in the boardroom (at about :30 in) was cast for his resemblance to a young donald trump?

GILLETTE: Buy our razors you horrible pieces of shit.

Yeah we get it, R54. Lesbilogic 101: Men are responsible for everything, women are completely infallible.

R60 I'm a masculine gay man. I've been "accused" by SJW of being toxic because of a so-called heteronormativity, so I am very aware of the absurds of identity politics. I know effeminate gays hate masculinity and radical feminists hate it too.

That being said, this commercial is about a behavior that is toxic to everyone and it is unfortunately very common. Only a dimwit will object to a commercial asking men to be kinder to women, to stand up to them when they're harassed, to stop bullying each other and to love their sons. The fact anyone would object to this message says more about your entitlement and immaturity than about the commercial itself.

Only a dimwit would call others a dimwit for disagreeing, r61.

It's not the message. It's painting all men with the same broad brush when the truth is bad behavior is not isolated to any one sex.

If I want to be assumed a sinner and lectured about behavior I’ll go to church.

If Gillette stereotyped any other group for associated bad behavior the outcry would be deafening and the commercial pulled.

The ironic part is Gillette sexualizes their women's products and then charges women more than a comparable aimed at men.

But, hey, it's just co-opting a movement to sell you things so it's all good.

They’re demanding we shave our bushes and legs now!

R62, you are a dimwit. This commercial is addressing specific behaviors that are still common among men, how else should it be addressed? Would you rather they called you by your name? I knew at some point the grandpas of DL would come out of the woodwork to blame millennials. I wasn't disappointed. Whine all you want on your fragile masculinity like little bitches. The world is changing and moving forward and you're already history.

Are there any actual men left now on DL or is this place just r/GenderCritical??

Fucking sick of this same bullshit anti male garbage in every thread here.... on a forum for gay men no less.

Not that that stops the femail entitlement they've had socialized into themselves to come here with their whinney entitled bullshit over and over again, even after being repeatably told their male bashing shit is not welcome here.

When we call you offended snowflakes dimwits, that's what we mean. This wasn't an attack on masculinity. It was an attack on very specific toxic behaviors men engage in. The commercial literally spelled out four behaviors they believe need to change. At least three of them DL constantly agrees with, specially bullying and nurturing their sons.

Once upon a time we allowed humans to be enslaved and when abolitionists preached for equality, many whined like snowflakes that it wasn't so. You're just the modern day version of those people. Congratulations on being just as pathetic.

"Being a woman in the west in the 21st century = being imprisoned in chattel slavery."

r68 waddle back to what ever feminist shithole you waddled out of please tubbs.

These kind of things usually spark outrage, so if it only sparks debate, it can't be that bad.

This commercial was made to go viral, it's obvious as water. The outrage is silly and exposes how fragile so-called alpha masculine man can be. If you are offended or threatened by a tv commercial you possess anything but masculinity.

How many fucking blades are on the razor now and how much more will it cost me? Oh, sorry, your agency didn't feel like actually selling a razor just advancing their agenda. Pass.

One thing I've noticed: Women don't want men complimenting them on their beauty on the streets, yet we also live in a time where women, adult women at that, upload selfies in hopes of getting compliments on their beauty on the world wide web.

IDK, I'm in the very small minority in that I actually like a cat-whistle now and then. (I mean, please don't make the jerking off sign as you do it or follow me or anything creepy like that... but I'm down with a guy looking at me and saying "beautiful" as he passes on the street or the waiter telling me I have nice eyes. At the same time, I've never taken and posted a selfie in my life.

I should add that I AM happy that a lot of things are changing, I just appreciate a little flirt now and then, depending on the circumstances of course.

Wow, r66, I was wrong. You aren't a dimwit. You're a fucking dimwit. But, hey, yeah, r68, shall we go into the very toxic behavior that exists in every group? Is it going to be a series where Gillette lectures women for being toxic mean girls next.

R73 I don’t want any man saying beautiful or whistling or hissing on the street. If it happens I ignore and avoid eye contact. The one time in my life that I made eye contact and said thank you (I was 22 and stupid) the man followed me for blocks asking for my phone number and pushing for information. Eventually we were stopped at a crosswalk waiting for green and another man heard him hassling me and told him to leave me alone. He turned and walked away but it really shook me up. Years later I was sexually harassed at work by a creep who cat called women on his way to and from lunch. When I confided in some male colleagues both of them said it didn’t surprise them based on his cat calling behavior so I think most men know cat callers are assholes. The rare, rare times I’ve heard another woman be flattered by a cat call, the cat caller has always been a handsome white man in a suit. Never have I heard a white woman be flattered that a Mexican in ripped jeans hissed at her.

"One thing I've noticed: Women don't want men complimenting them on their beauty on the streets, yet we also live in a time where women, adult women at that, upload selfies in hopes of getting compliments on their beauty on the world wide web."

It actually isn't complicated or anything though.

Women don't have the time to be Superman shifting from 'hit on me' costume to 'don't ever talk to me' costumes or anything in between.

They're on the street and have objectives on it.

They're not particularly interested in a man who is interested in how they look.

When they put up the selfie, they are seeking attention. Very basic language here.

When they walk the street, most often, they're potentially open to attention but probably not.

Toxic masculinity is considering it your gender-given right to discard all social context for the purpose of reducing it to "Woman looks sexy. Woman must want me, a man. I clearly have permission to act as I want now."

And most women will take a compliment on their looks, by the way. Intruding on them in many other ways while doing so, is the problem. Like the ad went - don't rush after the woman as if you're CLEARLY going to be SO important to her day and life. It is disrespectful to her time and agency, but also quite likely a part of your conception of masculinity that she as a hot woman must sit pretty and accept all you, the assertive man, decides to do to her.

They see it not just on the street, but workplaces, parties, etc. No, they're not aloof, they just keep encountering men who have no sense of personal space when there's a woman they like.

So then let's do a commercial on toxic masculinity to sell razo blades because 1 man out of how many on the street doesn't understand boundaries.

Sigh. Why bother tackle homophobia when only one man out of how many beats up a homosexual. When only one dad out of how many sends his son to conversion camp.

R79, no, why tackle in an ad that targets all men is the issue.

I don’t really like it when generalizations are made about an entire group of people based on the actions of a few.

“Men” are not one monolithic group who all act the same.

Assuming so is a form of bias, which is wrong.

I liked it. And it pissed Piers Morgan off, so there's that.

Play it during the Oscars. With Kevin Hart hosting.

Remember when Public Service Announcements were part of TV? The anti-littering Indian--oops, sorry, Native American (although he was really Italian-American), Smokey the Bear (or was it Smokey the Bandit?). Who paid or those, anyway(s)? Anyway(s), what man would be a good spokesperson for the anti-tox movement? Ryan Gosling? George Clooney? Caitlyn Jenner?

[quote] shall we go into the very toxic behavior that exists in every group?

Any civilized society should go on every toxic behavior. Right now this particular brand focused on a group. No one owe you shit, so if you want to address someone's toxic behavior you're welcomed to do so. Judging by your pearl clutching on a stupid commercial, I tend to believe you are a fragile snowflake so you're not even the object of that video, which is directed to masculine men.

Bump.

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 Watching supposedly masculine men whine like little bitches over a stupid commercial. How pathetic. 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[quote]Women don't want men complimenting them on their beauty on the streets,

What about men complimenting fat women for their personalities on the streets? Is there a problem with that?

How about men leave women the fuck alone on the street.

And quit shouting retard, faggot and nigger out car windows to impress their friends while they’re at it.

[quote]1 man out of how many on the street doesn't understand boundaries.

If you think the systemic abuse of women by men is a rarity in the western world you're either clueless, a man or a fat frau. That's the only explanation.

This thread is great for FFing and banning of straight trolls and self loathing losers.

Fat fraus get abuse too. Same kind of abuse effeminate gays, disabled people etc get. My sister was 300lbs and a few times a week she got some jackass shouting fattie or fat bitch from a passing car. In bars dudes often shoved their friend towards her to humiliate him. Teenage boys threw stuff at her. Now she’s a normal weight but she has a Down syndrome foster child and now it’s assholes yelling retard from passing cars. I know a young gay man who loves wearing makeup, the one and only time he went out with a full face in daylight he ended up in hospital with a broken jaw. Even without makeup he’s had rocks thrown at him by college kids waiting at the bus stop. So I absolutely think something needs to be done, this ad probably won’t help because those who need to hear it most won’t listen.

lol agenda city. So calculated. All the bad actors are evil whites and all - literally, all - the stand-up good guys are black.

What about INTERSECTIONALITY and include some of the thug macho culture in our inner cities?

This should rightly be pilloried like Kendall Jenner and Pepsi. What was the POINT of this.

And anyone who uses the phrase “toxic” in conjunction with any sociological construct is a flaming fucking retard. It’s a big neon sign saying you’re a sheltered idiot with no real world experience.

Sure, r85, let's go into the toxic behavior of the frau. A behavior so toxic that it became a meme before the Internet had memes. I say the next Gillette commercial focus on the bitchy female, cause, you know, all women are the same. It's a true monolithic group, particularly the office frau. Hey, then after that Gillette should lecture black people on violence in Chicago, cause again...monolith.

R90, fat frau...says all I need to know about you, troll.

Actually that’s not a bad idea r94 and I come across a female celebrity sending that very message to young women all the time. I would love if some company put that message in an ad. Nike had a campaign aimed at women last year which touched on the notion of supporting one another and the importance of working together as well as the benefits of sports and exercise for women. Maybe they’ll make it.

R96, a message of supporting each other is a far cry from creating an ad that paints all males as toxic. Seriously, how big of an outcry do you think there would be if they painted women in the workplace as they really are: insecure, bitchy and backstabbing.

I choked up

[quote]if they painted women in the workplace as they really are: insecure, bitchy and backstabbing.

This is the truth.

Gillette/P&G are laughing all the way to the bank, much as Nike did when they put Colin K's face on their ad: they made six billion dollars in three weeks after the ad started running around Labor Day last year and their stock rose five percent. Got lots of windbags talking about a boycott that had ZERO effect. Every time some 300 pound Trump-loving cop lights a pair of shoes on fire the word Nike is in the news.

Gillette doesn't care if you smother them with praise for their wokeness or if you storm off ranting - you're talking about them in a day and age when all around them is sound and fury and misspent ad budget dollars.

You're talking about Gillette. And that is all they care about.

r86=moron

If only these snowflakes losers knew the reach of P&G they'd realize it's virtually impossible to boycott this corporation given how big they are.

I stand corrected on the fat frau joke. That was lame and I do realize overweight women are also victims of lots of sexual abuse.

This was a great commercial. It addressed real issues and the company like R100 said laughing their way to the bank as we are laughing at the insecure beta males whining like children.

I agree, r100. I really find it disgusting how social movements are being monetized.

Or how people like r102 are whining about people who don't like the ad are find it offensive.

The ad does not paint all men as toxic anymore than a Viagra as paints all men as impotent. The ad shows how to combat certain behaviors that are common in males/male environments and offers an alternative. It shows that so called “toxic” masculinity affects men as much as women. I’m really surprised at the responses here, I work with a lot of straight men and their response to this was very positive. Lots of the younger guys saying that they are trying to raise their sons better than they were raised, they let their son cry, they hug their sons and kiss them which their fathers never did. There was a really good conversation in the break room today, so that’s the message they took and these are blue collar baggage handlers and not white collar guys with a liberal arts education.

I'm not whining, I'm making fun of people like you R104. If you are offended by this commercial you deserve to be called a beta male and emasculated moron.

Who cares if men cry, r105. That's not what the ad was about. Again, how about if the ad focused on bitchy women?

R106, if that's the only way you can shut down a conversation then fine. You seem fine with stereotypes, but I'd bet you'd have a fit if it was a stereotype that was anything but a man. Says all I need to know about you.

I'm sick of those damn libcuck police ads telling drivers to not drink drive. #NotAllDrivers!!11!!!

[quote] Who cares if men cry, [R105].

Crying is a biological response of the body. It's required to balance body pressure and brain activity. It's not a luxury you can just unplug. Telling men they can't cry is social engineering that will cause severe stress, anxiety and mental health issues. Anyone with a brain can see that. Maybe not you.

Strawman, r108.

R109, I'm not sure what your point is. I don't care if men cry or not. Again, crying wasn't the point of the commercial either.

No idiot R107 I'm a mature thirty-something adult not a 4 year old. Commercials, films or TV won't affect my life so why should I waste my time crying like a baby or being offended by it? Get it?

Gee, I wonder if this will be parodied on the next, new installment of "Saturday Night Live?"

And with head writers Michael Che and Colin Jost in charge, you KNOW it'll be THE most hysterically funny thing you've ever seen in your life . . .

Yet, here you are r112, arguing about it.

I'm bitching here because this is the reason this message board exists and I have lots of spare time on my hands. Now I'm off. See you emasculated whiner.

R107: To repeat: Gillette doesn't care what you think one way or the other. Or whether or not men cry. Or if women are bitchy. Or if you disagree with R105 and R106.

Proctor and Gamble's Gillette division is a corporation. They buy advertising designed to do one thing: sell razor blades. If a word to the wise re: toxicity can do some good, I'm sure they're fine with it.

But that's not why they did it. The fact that anyone starts ranting about how they have or haven't stereotyped women here is just gravy to them, because you've mentioned their name and extended the reach of their ad.

Why can’t people get this passionate about things that actually matter. With all that’s happening in this country, this commercial is where people draw the line and decide to boycott. Says it all really. Maybe the Cheeto in chief is all we deserve.

R115, has stated her boundaries, lost her argument and flounced off.

I don't watch television and this is precisely why.

[R27] Spot-on comment. It's all a part of the White Savior Package.

They funny thing about the ad is that it doesn't speak well to the child raising skills of women.

Do better ladies.  You're turning out bad men!

LOL at the snowflakes triggered by this ad.

This ad offends me. Not All Men!

What about Black on Black crime! Will Gilette make an ad about that?

Gillette, that makes lots of money due to testosterone, has a go at testosterone.

Jesus. The defensiveness in this thread. How many threads have we had about our macho fathers and how they hated our guts for not being a "real man" when we were growing up?

The message of the ad is don't be an asshole. No, it's not okay to let your sons beat the shit out of other boys, not okay to harass women, not okay to bully other children. I can't believe the whiners here don't remember how a lot of us were constantly bullied and called faggot because we weren't good at sports and just wanted to be left alone. Probably to go to drama class.

That said, I hate the phrase "toxic masculinity." It's off-putting and puts peoples' backs up.

Don't be fooled by Proctor & Gamble doing this ad. They don't actually care about women or what happens to them.

About five months ago in the UK they financially and publicly gave support to the organisations who are attempting to remove women's rights under The Equality Act and remove sex as a protected characteristic.

Just because this particular message is one that chimes doesn't mean it isn't emotional manipulation by a large corporation who's only objective is to make money. I'd prefer it if companies quit virtue signalling altogether because if you dig deep enough it's clear they are usually contradicting themselves anyway.

I liked the ad 😃

[quote]I'd prefer it if companies quit virtue signalling altogether because if you dig deep enough it's clear they are usually contradicting themselves anyway.

This comes about from the guilt and shame that most people in marketing and advertising have about their profession. Rather than own their ability to manipulate stupid people into separating them from their money, they think by adding 'purpose' or 'social responsibility' to what they do they can feel less shitty about it. It's different from Nike/Kaepernick - where at least the sentiment is somewhat related to the brand. This shit is total awards bait, like other P&G and Unilever purpose campaigns before it where they actually believe their face cream or sanitary napkin or razor blade has something to say about the world. And this is why Dollar Shave Club is kicking Gillette's ass.

Anti-male bullshit. Gillette just committed suicide.

"Some things are down to hormones and instinct."

See, I knew men couldn't be trusted because of their hormones.

WW @ R59.

What a stunning failure for Gillette. Their advertising team should be fired.

"Anti-male bullshit. Gillette just committed suicide."

// A R Y !

R130, neither can women. They should not hold positions of leadership because their hormones make them too emotional.

Maybe Gillette should stick to selling tampons.

Oh FANK you Gillette for teaching me how to be a good man.

[quote]They funny thing about the ad is that it doesn't speak well to the child raising skills of women. Do better ladies. You're turning out bad men!

Ignorant comment from a simple mind. The biggest failure of parenting boys in the last century has been due to absent fathers.

I can appreciate the message of the commercial, but MeToo is way too played-out in American media and has been for a long time. The commercial would have been great months ago, but at this point in time it comes across as pandering, saccharine and cloying. They may as well come out with a commercial saying Nazis are bad for their Holocaust-ing.

[quote]how big of an outcry do you think there would be if they painted women in the workplace as they really are: insecure, bitchy and backstabbing.

Exactly, or all gay men a certain way. Fact is, you are only allowed to vilify and discriminate against white, straight men in our culture now. And they're sick of being demonized. There is a HUGE back lash that's growing exponentially every day.......with the popularity of people like Jordan Peterson.

[quote]the only straight guy I ever knew who was kind and not afraid to show emotion...he killed himself last year. there was so much talk at his funeral of being kind to one another; keeping his spirit alive, but I haven't experienced much of that.

Jon always said everything happens for a reason.

I really didn’t know there were so many straight men in Datalounge.

^^You don't have to be a straight man to know hypocrisy when you see it.

Read this in The Guardian earlier today:

In 1984, at a ceremony to honour the fallen of Verdun, François Mitterrand and Helmut Kohl held hands, in a powerful gesture of Franco-German reconciliation. According to her biographer, Margaret Thatcher was unmoved, instead mocking the sight of two grown men holding hands.

Errata: I had no idea there were so many straight right-wing nut jobs on Datalounge.

R59 wins.

I fucking love BRANDS!

They tell me all I need to know!

[quote] I had no idea there were so many trolls spewing bullshits on Datalounge.

Fixed

And who raises these men that you speak of, r136? Sounds like they'd be better off raised by wolves than the person actually raising them.

Dad, can I shave my legs?

Fank you, Gillette!

You fixted my toxic razor!

As a teacher I can say that it’s puberty when (some) boys start to go very astray. I’m really not sure what a parent alone can do. At that age kids are more influenced by their peers and I suppose parents give boys more freedom and don’t really speak to them about their emotions. But there’s been homophobia and sexism and violence since the year dot, through every type of societal structure from polygamy to single parenthood. I have four straight brothers and my mother did her best but she got no backup from my father. He was proud when they were arrested for loitering and public drunkenness. He’d brag about them and how they were becoming men, I was the embarrassment because I stayed home reading and watching TV.

R138 who is Jordan Peterson?

He directed Get Out.

I think he’s the ass who said the Toronto icel mass shooter wouldn’t have done it if the government gave every man a woman. I don’t want to google him because I know he’s a homophobic, sexist douche.

W&W, r149.

R138. He's the latest internet sensation. He’s a brilliant intellectual clinical psychologist taking the world by storm with his unique message of personal responsibility. He’s resonated with millions of young people thirsty for purpose and meaning in their lives.

He destroyed this dim bulb journalist. Poor thing. It's been viewed over 14 million times.

Fuck off Peterson troll.

Sad for you R157.

R153, Jordan Peterson is too intelligent for you. That is the real problem you have with him, but you're too dumb to realize it.

Peterson is the absolute dregs of humanity. Professors are complaining that his followers are literally unteachable. They have to be deprogrammed before they can learn even the most basic things. He's a horror show in every way.

And that's not even getting into all the offensive nonsense he parades around as intellectualism.

Seriously, just fuck off with that Peterson shit.

R156 Watching Peterson debate Cathy Newman is like watching a high school athlete sneak into a schoolyard and DESTROY a group of kids playing donkey basketball. Now ask that high school athlete to play against the pros; he won’t because they play “dishonestly” or there’s a “scheduling conflict.”

Truth is, he’s a Jungian psychologist, not a political scientist or sociologist. These are not his fields of expertise, although he presents himself as an authority on those subjects.

It’ll be interesting to see Peterson’s debate with fellow pufferfish Slavoj Zizek - at least they are equally full of hot air. It promises to be a showcase of fallacies about Marxism, critical theory, etc. cloaked beneath incomprehensible academic jargon that sounds “intellectual.”

Republicans view society’s love of mascubity as very positive; Democrats are split.

[quote]Republicans view society’s love of mascubity as very positive; Democrats are split.

Oh DEAR.

It's not masc and mainstream to spell words correctly.

[quote]The biggest failure of parenting boys in the last century has been due to absent fathers.

This is a failure of women to be more selective about the type of men they spread their legs for.

[quote]I chuckled at the black man stopping the white man catcalling a woman.

My experience in NYC is that black and Hispanic men do more catcalling than white men. Just what I've personally observed.

Than middle class and above white men, yes. Face to face in the street I’ve only been whistled or hissed at by black and Latino men. However, I’ve been yelled at by white guys passing in trucks and pickups when I’m walking home from the track in the morning in baggy sweats and a hoodie.

what do you know

"This ad offends me."

My reply: I think you may be easily offended, and will probably continue to be offended until you learn more about empathy and basic human decency.

I dont get why people are offended. I didnt see anywhere that it stated all men are like this but some men are. Those that are need to change.

[quote]My experience in NYC is that black and Hispanic men do more catcalling than white men. Just what I've personally observed.

Our current PC culture would never allow that to be shown in a commercial.

R161, please tell us some truths about Marxism. Feel free to use the Soviet Union, Communist China, Cambodia, Vietnam, etc. as examples. They were all wondrous, Marxist paradises, except not for the 100 million + corpses.

"...incomprehensible academic jargon that sounds “intellectual.”" babe, that's the very definition of postmodernism and victim studies courses, which is why no one studies that crap. They produce nothing but brainless ideologues incapable of critical thought. Meanwhile, Peterson, Harris and others have thousands of people watching their complex and lengthy lectures and discussions.

Is r167 a man or a woman?

I don't know how Jordon Peterson isn't a DL fav. He's famous for refusing to comply with the law in Canada that forces people to use certain pronouns.

[quote]Jordan Peterson doesn’t refuse to use they/them pronouns. He has stated several times that he is willing to do so based on a reasonable request from an individual. His objection is to creeping totalitarianism in the form of the government choosing peoples words in Canada's Bill C.16. He’s a passionate believer that this is one of the worst things humanity has ever done ie. the regimes of Stalin, Mao and Hitler, all of whom increased their power by controlling what could and could not be said.

R172: Cry harder, you straight bitch.

Brainy ultra-liberal Russell Brand interviews Jordan Peterson. Interesting exchange of complex ideas. No anger. No attacks.

[quote]"...incomprehensible academic jargon that sounds “intellectual.”" babe, that's the very definition of postmodernism and victim studies courses, which is why no one studies that crap.

R172 That’s the irony - Peterson rails against post-modernism yet employs the very methods he supposedly abhors. For instance he deconstructs cultural narratives and uses impenetrable jargon much like a post-modern philosopher would. He also over-simplifies the subject and claims that feminism, LGBT rights, and PC culture are all part of a neo-Marxist, post-modernist agenda, lumping all activists and proponents of social change together in the same extremist SJW Looney bin.

Cutting to the chase, Peterson believes we are trapped in biological hiearchies that should not be challenged, such as male over female. He yearns for the patriarchal, heteronormative society idealized in 1950s TV shows. Women and homos bring chaos, straight men bring order. He believes Christianity is the perfect model of the Jungian archetypes imbedded in human psychology, and its tenants should be adhered to for a just and orderly society. That’s Peterson in a nutshell.

Peterson claimed he didn’t support marriage equality because he didn’t want to ‘...give Marxists a win’

Oops - I meant TENETS of Christianity, not TENANTS.

[quote]That’s Peterson in a nutshell.

LOL, R177. You aren't even on the same planet as his "nutshell"

"I don't get why people are offended. I didn't see anywhere that it stated all men are like this but some men are. Those that are need to change."

"Those that are" are unlikely to change.

R181 True. Asshole men and women will always exist. A true prick doesn't care what others think. A perfect example being Trump.

Wow - what an incisive rebuttal, R180 [slow clap]. You’d be Peterson’s dream debate partner.

R177, you sound like you read Cathy Newman's Cliff Notes on Peterson's many books and hours of lectures and discussions. In a nutshell, he encourages all people to read extensively, learn to think critically using evidence and reason, contribute to the betterment of one's self, family and community, take responsibility for your life and actions, learn to express yourself well, and tell the truth.

As for hierarchies, his point is that there are hierarchies everywhere, often for good reason and often based on competence. One is wise to be aware of this and the impact this has one one's life.

[quote] This comes about from the guilt and shame that most people in marketing and advertising have about their profession.

That is true. I began my career as a copywriter and quit out of guilt, then went to PR which is even worse.

R183 oh no I'm sorry it was too simple for you and that I didnt take the time to write a bunch of bullshit jargon!

So what about toxic femininity? The backstabbing? The hating other women because they look better? The belittling of men and then condeming them if they get angry? All of these are heterosexual women behavior norms deeply ingrained? Where's the thought provoking Kotex commercial celebrating the end of that?

I hate SJW as much as I hate the pseudo babble of Jordan Peterson. They're almost like two sides of the same coin.

Peterson, as any conservative, is the antithesis of evolution and progress . Anyone in 2019 that still fears boogeyman cultural marxism is a moron on my book. Peterson is a clean-cut anally retained version of Milo, minus the fun the pedo apologist bring us.

A Youtube comment pointed out that almost half of boys today are raised by single mothers and over 3 quarters have female teachers. And yet toxic masculinity is a thing.

Interesting stats.

I can hardly wait until Jordan Peterson opines on Gillette’s calling out of brutish male behavior. He’ll probably explain how feminism and the birth control pill created rape culture, not toxic masculinity. And: there are hierarchies, yo!

Finally watched this; this was great.

[quote]A Youtube comment pointed out that almost half of boys today are raised by single mothers and over 3 quarters have female teachers. And yet toxic masculinity is a thing.

What was that thing about personal responsibility again?

Here you go, R187:

Not ALL men!

What about FEMALE bullies?

Black people are racist, too!

Looks like r195 is bothered by the truth.

Sterotype: a widely held but fixed and oversimplified image or idea of a particular type of person or thing.

This ad is the very definition of playing to a stereotype and you, r195, are a lemming for falling fir it.

R195 is the way the truth and the light. No one will come to the correct take on this ad except through him.

Dad can I shave my legs

Sure son. Its the only way you will win the Tour de France.

How many times does it have to be said, this ad targets certain behaviors by some men. If you or your friends son't do this why get upset. If you do and you didn't realize it is obnoxious behavior, now you know.

[quote]It's not the message. It's painting all men with the same broad brush when the truth is bad behavior is not isolated to any one sex.

You can tell the posters with attention deficit disorder who couldn't make it all the way to the end of the commercial before jumping in with their idiotic comments. The entire last part of the commercial is men doing good things, yet still you whine.

Sure, r199, let's begin a commercial with the worst of any race or how awful women can be and then end it with Gillette approved appropriateness and we'll see who whines the loudest.

R200 = triggered, red state opioid adict.

Sure, r201, whatever fantasy you need to help you deal with the fact that I don't agree with you.

[quote]A Youtube comment pointed out that almost half of boys today are raised by single mothers and over 3 quarters have female teachers.

That's where they learn to be bullies.

“Don’t be a dick; don’t raise ‘em,”

Who would this trigger other than dicks?

R200 is correct. Can you ever imagine a make up commercial that shows half-naked women acting like catty, bitchy sluts and whores and then condescendingly lecturing 'all' women about how they need to clean up their act? There would be an ocean of SJWs with blue hair, tattoos, nose rings and pussy hats marching and screaming in every city.

R204: Exactly. Hence all the KGB-style whataboutisms about women on this very thread.

It's only whataboutism when you disagree, r206.

No, it fits the definition of whataboutism just fine.

[quote] Whataboutism (also known as whataboutery) is a variant of the tu quoque logical fallacy that attempts to discredit an opponent's position by charging them with hypocrisy without directly refuting or disproving their argument, which in the United States is particularly associated with Soviet and Russian propaganda.

I’m a decent human being but this ad makes me so very angwwwwy!

This ad bothers you because it’s holding a mirror to you. Not an asshole? Then you don’t care.

Fair point

No, r208, people like to hide behind "but it's whataboutism" when they don't agree. Its a fair to bring up that if the same commercial were made about women that the shouting would be deafening. But, hey use that definition of whataboutism to shield yourself from unpleasant realities.

R200 If you look at crime statistics, women don’t have much of an act to clean up. Rare are the “half-naked women acting like catty, bitchy sluts and whores” in comparison to the number of abusive men and boys in America. Not just abusive to women - abusive to each other.

Equating the epidemic of male violence and sexual harassment to a supposed “epidemic” of mean girls in slut clothes who make nasty comments to each other is bizarre... although a somber ad campaign addressing it WOULD be hilarious. I doubt the “blue-haired SJWs” would even be outraged over it because the concept is so ludicrous.

Sure, r212, cause the commercial depicts only criminal behavior.

We can replace the cat calling segment with the teacher who fucks her students. They tend to be women. Or, if you don't want to go all criminal behavior then the bitchy, female colleague who undercuts other women in the workplace will do just fine. We can save the slutty, baby mommas for another commercial.

[quote]We can replace the cat calling segment with the teacher who fucks her students. They tend to be women.

Less than 20% of the cases are female teachers. 80% are male. You are an idiot with such an obvious agenda that you can't even bother to get close to the actual statistics.

The end of toxic masculinity is good for gay men, stupid. And, no, they're not going to fuck you anyway, so you can stop defending the straight bad boys you lust after. Sorry your mom didn't like you.

^^^triggered Frau

Guess what? For better or worse, masculinity built the world we live in today. There wasn’t some vast conspiracy, a “patriarchy,” that made things the way they are — an infantile concept about as accurate as the reptiloids or the Elders of Zion.

Want men to be more like women? Fine but women aren’t all that great either — not violent, no, but just as “toxic” in their own way. Just look at study after study that indicates that women hate working for other women.

But ok let’s end toxic masculinity and make men more like women. Then set the stopwatch and wait for some other culture to run us over like a Mack truck.

R215, just makes me more sure that I hit it right on target. Again, sorry about your mom.

Sorry your dad raped you r217 but not all men are degenerates like that. Sorry about your dad ramming his cock up your asshole.

[quote]Guess what? For better or worse, masculinity built the world we live in today.

Only the world since the industrial revolution and, honestly, the world has gone to complete shit since the industrial revolution. WARWARWARWARWARWARWARWAR. Masculinity at work. It will end us all and probably ruin the entire planet before it's over.

R218, leave your fantasy life for your diary, dear. Haven't seen you detailing the loving relationship with your mom in defense so, again, I was on target.

Seriously, R213 - you must have one fucked up family if you view women that way, and while I sympathize with men who were abused by female relatives as boys, you have to come to terms with the fact you got emasculated by a sick person(s) who does not represent women as a whole, and move on. I’m guessing you have a skewed view due to a very unfortunate family situation.

Yes that’s right r219 and you are a beneficiary of the west being better at WARWARWARWAR than other cultures.

Now either apologize and accept your life is made the way it is by that, and while you’re at it also apologize for being a hypocritical asshole, or...

Put your money where your mouth is and reject this evil masculine world that supposedly oppresses you and go live in a female centric culture.

Let us know how that works out for you, Kk? Rock that look, girl!

R221, the world today is shit. Have you not been paying attention? Anywhere in the world where women gain power, the standard of living of everyone goes up. Are you really supporting war? WTF is wrong with you?

And, please, go ahead and explain how toxic masculinity plays no role in gay bashing. You are arguing for your enemy to continue to stay just the way they are. Moronic.

[quote]Rare are the “half-naked women acting like catty, bitchy sluts and whores”

LOL. Oh my sides.

[quote]Equating the epidemic of male violence and sexual harassment to a supposed “epidemic” of mean girls in slut clothes who make nasty comments to each other is bizarre

No more bizarre than claiming there is an "epidemic" of male violence and harassment. There isn't. This is just invented feminist mythology. There has never been a better time in history or a better place in the world for women than the USA in 2019 in terms opportunity, health and safety. If you think otherwise, spend some time in Syria, Africa or Afghanistan.

Women need to sort themselves out and stop blaming men for their failures. Life is hard for everyone. Stop whining. Get over it and start looking within to improve your chances of a happy future. It's a strategy that will be far more successful for you in the long run.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

R219 needs to learn some history.

R224 - I get you are a Jordan Peterson fanboy, but can you at least develop your own style? That was a boilerplate JP response. Or: you could be a troll parodying him (if so, bravo), or even: the MAN HIMSELF. If that’s you JP, can you please tell me who your tailor is? He’s fantastic.

Why are there so many straight men here?

Why is it always the biggest whiners who run around yelling for everyone else to stop whining and ‘get over it’???

[quote]I get you are a Jordan Peterson fanboy, but can you at least develop your own style? That was a boilerplate JP response. Or: you could be a troll parodying him (if so, bravo), or even: the MAN HIMSELF. If that’s you JP, can you please tell me who your tailor is? He’s fantastic.

Why would I reinvent the wheel when he so perfectly and eloquently makes a point people really need to hear. I'm not handing in a term paper.

I love his style too, but he's getting rather thin lately.

The fall of that Peterson fella will be real and spectacular

R230 Well, fangirl, do you agree with JP’s claim that feminists have an "unconscious wish for brutal male domination?” If so, is this a biological norm for women, or just feminists? Since you are a lady, I’d love to hear your opinion about this.

Wow, this thread has gotten tedious.

Shocker

Gilette should market to trannies

[quote] Why are there so many straight men here?

There aren't, polls have shown a minuscule 1% of DL are straight men. It's basically half male/half female, with the women divided between lesbians and straights (more straights.)

I love cunts lick lick lick

Paul Joseph Watson is absolutely on point. He explains not only how this ad is silly, but how it is harmful to developing men.

[quote]do you agree with JP’s claim that feminists have an "unconscious wish for brutal male domination?"

No, and neither does he? Not in the way you are interpreting it, anyway. He talks a lot about the natural law. Things we do, choices we make based on our lizard brains which evolved over millennia. You aren't as much in charge of your choices as you think.

[quote]There aren't, polls have shown a minuscule 1% of DL are straight men. It's basically half male/half female, with the women divided between lesbians and straights (more straights.)

Shhhh, don’t bother trying to have a conversation with a triggered rad dyke — it’s like trying to have a debate with a closed system. There’s no room for any opinion other than hers.

Just nod and agree that it must be a straight male and back away looking for the nearest exit.

Both women and gay men are attracted to dominant males.

All I saw in this ad was don’t beat up other kids, don’t bully or tease other kids and don’t bother women on the street? And in the end it’s other men/boys who step in to stop the bad apple/jerk from misbehaving. What is all the fuss about? I’m old, when I think of all the homophobia (and sexism) we were exposed to growing up on tv, in church, in school, in books.......how is this one ad driving grown men into knots and triggering hundreds of YT videos in response.

R239 Ok - that makes more sense. Where he’s going with that is what confuses me. Is it that some types of non-consensual touching or sex shouldn’t be criminalized because it’s a biological (e.g. “God-given”) fact that women want to be dominated and that men by nature want to dominate?

If JP believes men are domineering by nature, the Gillette ad actually reflects his viewpoint because it shows that as men we have to fight against our lizard brains by being kinder to women and better role models for young boys. Heck, he may even ENDORSE this ad because of it’s old-time chivalry and “do unto others” credo.

I'm going to start calling myself Lady Gillette.

R232, I can't tell you how many woman I know admitted wanting to be brutally fucked by Tony Soprano, even the most leftist/progressive/woke woman I know told me this last weeek, who, incidently, is married to the biggest passive, failure of a man that there ever was....after a somewhat urbane life in Manhattan they moved to a small city in the southwest and he has been making minimum wage, or slightly above, for three decades.

She is so angry at Trump and white men in general. She really has no clue who she is really angry at.

That’s a random thing to discuss, are you a member of a Soprano’s fan club?

A response to the commercial...

By 2019 I thought we’d be taking Vitavetavegamin and flying around like the Jetsons. Instead gays are up in arms about a commercial that says boys shouldn’t bully and beat the shit out of their classmates. And all the alpha males are triggered and recording themselves whining like bitches into their phones over a tv commercial 😩

R248 Ironically, it's the alpha males who don't give a shit about the ad. Many of the men who do are ones who aspire to be alphas or feel like liberal brainwashing ruined them.

Total BS..

R247 Which guy in that “response” represents you or the men in your life? Heroes like that are not exactly a dime a dozen in the U.S. - land of the chubby desk jockey and home of the neckbearded professional video game vlogger.

And the benevolent homeless men, lol. Most I’ve encountered are aggressive psychotics or addicts. There’s a reason homeless shelters have to be sex segregated. But then I don’t live in Mayberry, where all these noble protectors of the weaker sex must reside.

On the other her hand, firefighters and cops ARE courageous (and hot) - but their heroism has been depicted in numerous feel-good Hallmark style commercials that are usually aired during major sporting events or the holidays.

Hmmm.

^^ Gillette has either come a long way, baby, or their toxic masc ad is simply a ploy to boost sales of their lady shavers (I’m guessing the latter.)

R211, absolute nonsense. You present textbook whataboutism and then follow through with exactly what whataboutism says you'll do.

The only men whining about this are the ones it applies to the most.

This ad is clearly aimed at the female purchaser of a household.

Ever noticed all the adverts aimed at the female purchase of a household, where the man (the husband / partner), is shown to be stupid, lazy, idiotic, retarded etc whilst the female in the advert is shown to be wise, hard done by, intelligent, savvy?

Where's the outcry about those sexist adverts where men are belittled to make smug women feel better about themselves?

The fact that you took an ad for a mostly male-directed product made by a male-lead advertising firm for a male-lead company that has only males in it and used it as a springboard to attack women should give you pause and actually proves the commercial is 100% on target.

.......

On its way to becoming the most disliked video in YouTube history. You self righteous types can stop acting so smug. Some Women may fall for this patronizing bs but no man with common sense would.

This video is saying one basic thing. You are either on the side of the bully or you stand against the bully. Pick one. The answer here seems to be to side with the bully and then pile on more and more and add a huge dose of sexism on top of it. Whiny losers all over this thread.

R260 Completely misses the point

The ad is pretty decent. Nothing to get triggered or upset (unless you're a smooth brained reactionary clown who doesn't care to do even the slightest bit of introspection).

I don't really care to defend corporations, most are unethical and they are run by elite pricks with way too much money. Gillette just scored by all this outrage, had they done a flaccid overdone boring commercial they wouldn't have a quarter of the press they currently have. So smart for them, they might even hoodwink a few easily impressed ignorant leftists who genuinely think Gillette gives a crap about MeToo.

Also this thread has been brigaded by simple minded right wing chuds but that was predictable

Only disliked by right-wing assholes.

R252 Bingo! Gillette's market research showed that while men are moving to Dollar Shave Club at a rapid pace, the majority of purchasers of their products are women. Women buying for themselves or women buying for their spouses.

This was a very successful project and manipulative as can be.

If they were being honest, they would have shown Latin men doing the cat calling. Only the most sophisticate and well dressed Latino(and gay ones as well) do not whistle and cat call. Black men are less likely to do so unless the woman is also black with a giant booty. Then all bets are off.

R238 is spot on. Bravo.

Why would anyone give a fuck about what an alt-right conspiritard you-tuber says about literally anything?

Boys are naturally competitive. They also like to express themselves through touch and occasionally rough play. Engaging in sportsmanlike behavior should be encouraged.

Men are driven by behaviors that will allow others to see them as leaders. Discouraging this tendency is no less than denying young men their true natures. Pitting the sexes against each other is counterproductive since the genders should complement each in unique ways. Having men be more like women and women more like men is not what we should strive for.

R267 yes cause men have always made for better leaders than women worldwide and for years.......oh wait

It's sad that there is even a debate about men being respectful and courteous towards women. There is such a thing as "toxic masculinity".

It just goes to show why Deplorables love Trump. He's everything they want to be - and more.

R268 Please elaborate.

Conservatives were losing the culture war as society transformed into a more secular country. Now the far left has gone too far and, as the Youtube comments demonstrate, are losing the culture war that they had been winning for decades. It seems that they have surpassed centuries of religious dogma by perpetuating something even more regressive. As with the evangelical types who could only lead by false virtue and not example, they have now become the new religious right.

I think it's getting to the point where companies almost have top this sort of thing to get their names out there. Then they go back to their usual type of advertising. Lynx pulled a stunt like this a fe years back and now they're back to a modified version of the old "use Lynx, get laid" angle.

R270 Men have long been leaders of this world and its mostly fallen to shit. The hesitation to let more women lead should end. Not saying it would be perfect and they wouldn't fail but more opportunities should be given.

I think many liberals are confusing anti Trump sentiment with a desire to embrace progressivism even if it defies science and common sense. Trump will eventually leave office and the Democrats will have to distance themselves from ideas like toxic masculinity or own it at their own peril. Jordan Peterson didn't exactly become famous for saying anything revolutionary. In the words of many of his detractors, he spouts mostly common sense, yet stuff like this ad is evidence that we need more common sense in this world.

[quote] Men have long been leaders of this world and its mostly fallen to shit. The hesitation to let more women lead should end. Not saying it would be perfect and they wouldn't fail but more opportunities should be given.

The world has fallen to shit due to religious extremism which has been used to justify slavery and suppression of women. America and other industrialized countries, on the other hand, have done very well in the past century and have overseen incredible economic growth. The last few decades, especially, resulted in incredible progress. The best case scenario is for men and women to work together.

Bravo and bravo again, r267. The disrespect and casual dismissal of boys and young males is what is truly toxic in this society. But this eventually, too, shall pass because you can't fool Mother Nature (irony of ironies) and biological imperatives will always prevail.

If it weren't for bold and brilliant MALE leaders in every discipline: art, science, politics, philosophy, technology, etc., you all would be living in mud huts.

So, you know.....you're welcome.

Talk about circular logic

R276 speaks the truth, like it or not.

Thank you for everything.

R276 is supposedly a woman with cankles and kids. Who hangs out on DL 🤔

^^Oooooh, look at R279. Quite the super sleuth. LOL. You know you've lost when you have to resort to stalking. You must be new if you didn't know there are LOTS of women here.

[quote]But this eventually, too, shall pass because you can't fool Mother Nature (irony of ironies) and biological imperatives will always prevail.

So, males acting like bullies and assholes is now a biological imperative? Toxic masculinity is nothing more than a culture that rewards males for acting like bullies and assholes. Stop acting like bullies and assholes and there's no more toxic masculinity. But, for some reason, men can't quite understand, let alone accomplish, that simple task.

[quote] So, males acting like bullies and assholes is now a biological imperative?

Women are just as likely to bully other women. Would you call that toxic femininity? No. Cyber bullying is certainly not a male phenomenon despite what the ad shows. Women in positions of power are also just as likely to bully their subordinates.

[quote] Toxic masculinity is nothing more than a culture that rewards males for acting like bullies and assholes. Stop acting like bullies and assholes and there's no more toxic masculinity.

Our culture does promote masculinity, not toxic masculinity. Men have traditionally been raised to be protectors of women for a long time. The role comes with the responsibility of being an effective leader and provider. Men who display those traits are still considered more desirable to women. However, it's become quite complicated as of late since men and women now work alongside eachother at a rate never seen before. Obviously, there is going to be a long period of adjustment.

As a young man, it took me a long time to find out how to be assertive without being overly aggressive or too timid. It takes practice and experience.

[quote] But, for some reason, men can't quite understand, let alone accomplish, that simple task.

It's not so simple as women are more likely to be believed. We also have seen in the wake of metoo that there is no path to redemption for men who are accused of wrongdoing.

MeToo has only backfired in women's faces. Men will no longer sit with female business colleagues on a flight, socialize with them after hours, book rooms on the same floor of a hotel etc. It cuts both ways. Lean in, lean back.

[quote]Our culture does promote masculinity, not toxic masculinity. Men have traditionally been raised to be protectors of women for a long time. The role comes with the responsibility of being an effective leader and provider. Men who display those traits are still considered more desirable to women.

So, the problem seems to be that you can't tell the difference between masculinity and toxic masculinity. What you are describing is masculinity. No one is attacking that. Those traits, taken to an extreme, become toxic. Men approaching women and pursuing them in a bar is masculine. Men groping, raping, stalking women is that trait of masculinity turned toxic. I think the people who have a problem and are acting like reactionary assholes about this commercial don't make that differentiation.

[quote]As a young man, it took me a long time to find out how to be assertive without being overly aggressive or too timid. It takes practice and experience.

You are literally describing the hoped for outcome of taking on toxic masculinity earlier in life. This is what this commercial is saying. Instead of having to spend years figuring this out on your own because no one bothered to teach you, men like you should be modeling and teaching this learned behavior to boys and young men so they don't have to figure it out themselves, leaving bad impressions and victims in the wake of their learning process of how to be a better man. Men have failed at this. They need to do better. That is what the movement to take on toxic masculinity is about.

R283, so you are going to defend the men have childish reactions instead of changing their behaviors? Those women should have just let those men keep harassing and discriminating against and raping them because otherwise the men will just take their "balls" and go home? Really, that's your stance?

Dearest, r285, it's your perceptions that are childish. You see everything in black and white, no middle ground, all men are dogs. I pity you. Men of honor and integrity, who have always treated women with propriety and respect--like the majority of men--are rightly taking a "stance" by acting with prudence and wisdom in order to protect themselves against the mania of the times. Your post is indicative of them. If you are also r281, the biological imperatives are what r267 described and to which I responded. Yes, boys will be boys--when they're boys. That was the topic. If something happened to you to sour the cream, I'm sorry but my brethren and I aren't responsible for it. No doubt you're a SJW of the first order. Be careful though, lest your rage be mistaken for Daddy issues.

R286, you lack reading comprehension and the ability to make your argument so you just throw out attacks without thought. I also happen to be R284, which you knew but failed to cite because what I wrote there directly opposes your unwarranted attack. Having men play the victim when it comes to MeToo is just laughable. Grow up.

R284 Appreciate the measured response but respectfully disagree. Certain things have to be learned through experience and intuition. Being lectured to or reading from a text won't teach anyone what to do in the real world. In the new Spiderman, the uncle basically teaches Miles Morales a come on which could easily be interpreted as assault in today's climate. I don't remember anyone making a fuss about it though.

I just buy the cheap razors.

R288, it wouldn't be taught through lecturing and text books. It would be taught through men guiding and modeling proper behaviors from the time boys are very small. One example in the commercial is the boys beating each other up, or one boy beating up another boy, in the back yard. Today, too many men react to that by saying "let them work it out" or "eh, boys with be boys" or "they'll be fine...all boys do that". Too few men go over right away, break it up, and then discuss why they're fighting and better was to deal with it. Some do. And some men model great behavior all the time in those situations but I'd say the majority fall into the first group.

Young boys and girls are both emotional. Boys have emotions forced out of them. Some of that is biological as it has been shown that they literally produce fewer tears and we all know that the two sides of their brains are not as integrated as women's which means they can compartmentalize better which means they can detach more readily from their emotions in the moment. But the emotions are still there. It is also known that baby boys are held and touched and goo-gooed at less than girl babies. All of this is part of the development of toxic masculinity and, no, it is not just how men are, it's just how they are trained and allowed to be.

And, the irony of so many men reacting so badly to this and attacking women so vociferously about it, is that the toxic masculinity is hurting men just as much as the men who suffer from it are hurting women.

To risk stating the obvious, there should be distiction drawn between physical bullying and simple roughhousing.

There should also be a distinction between roughhousing and beating someone. I was a tomboy. I roughhoused with boys and girls as a kid. It's not just a boy thing. In fact, to go along with 'toxic masculinity', I'll say that not allowing little girls to roughhouse is a part of 'failed femininity'. The difference being that little girls not being allowed to roughhouse hurts the little girls themselves whereas upping the stakes and letting little boys get carried away with roughhousing until it turns into beating or bullying hurts other people.

Thinking about this has made me consider something. I wonder if the push for tamping down toxic masculinity now is a reaction to men not evolving or changing as much as women have over the last few decades. Women have embraced a lot of the masculine qualities that they weren't allowed to express even a few decades ago. Everything from 'little girls wear dresses and don't get dirty and don't swear, etc.' to the Mad Men type of work bullshit that used to go on and be accepted by women have changed. Men have been less able or willing to embrace their feminine qualities in a natural progression or evolution. Those men who have are made fun of and put down by other men a lot of the time. Maybe this whole thing is men needing to be hit over the head with something in order to get them moving or acknowledging some truths that they are reluctant to otherwise embrace.

R292 Interesting point - I remember back in a bio class discussing how some primates have more sexual differences than others depending on the mates selected by females over millions of years - human females seem to go for males less likely to murder their offspring and nurture them instead. Also, intelligence being more important in mate competition than brute force led to less sexual dimorphism in people than apes.

R293 I think it's a harmful stereotype that masculine men can't be intelligent or emotional. There is absolutely no correlation between hyper masculinity and low intelligence. In fact, those men who are typically described as alpha types have a high degree of social intelligence.

R294 Where did I say brains and brawn are incompatible? I think men who have both social intelligence AND masculinity arguably have the greatest chance of finding sexual partners, while males with weaker physical traits and low social intelligence are, on average, less successful. Brains, brawn, and sexual attractiveness are on an intersecting spectrum; they are not binary traits. Women have varying mixtures of those characteristics as well. I think you are projecting here.

Instead, I was explaining why sexual dimorphism decreased in humans over time, while other species like chimps got stuck in an evolutionary rut. I also don’t think masculinity means harassing women and bullying minorities or weaker people (the acts of insecure cowards). A true alpha protects the vulnerable, is secure in his maculinity, and does not give a shit or whine over how he is “seen” by others.

You can literally read "boys will be boys" to defend the racist maggot boys who bullied that Native man today if you read the comments at USA today.

Guess Gillette really is going to bring awareness to this problem.

Good for them.

R296 WOW. The mob of teen boys in MAGA hats vs one elderly Native American (Vietnam veteran, no less) pretty much encapsulates The Problem we have in America today. This is ugly.

R297 And this has to do with toxic masculinity how?

R298 How do YOU define “toxic masculinity?”

What's confusing to me is how people can attack toxic masculinity while at the same time praising those exact same traits when they are displayed by women. There is no such thing as toxic femininity as far as I can tell, but isn't denying women the choice to take on a more traditional role inherently anti feminine? Most people should possess complementary traits that are both masculine and feminine. I see toxic masculinity used as a synonym for garden variety sociopathy, which is not inherently a masculine trait whether taken to the extreme or not. One is either hyper masculine or not, toxic does not enter in the equation.

[quote] A true alpha protects the vulnerable, is secure in his maculinity, and does not give a shit or whine over how he is “seen” by others.

Everyone cares how they are viewed by others even if they say they are not. It's especially true in today's image obsessed culture. Are countries that subjugate women that way because of toxic masculinity? No, it's because those societies are not civilized.

Wouldn't be much of a stretch to think that all those kids from Kentucky in MAGA hats (and their fathers) hated that Gillette ad.

This thread is like catnip for all sad alt-right trolls, Jordan Peterson and John Paul Watson shills, sad and angry RedPill incels with nubbins for penises, etc. Leave them in their little playpen and F&F them, don't engage them. Also gives Muriel something to do on Monday.

R300 The dozens of young men from the private all-male Catholic school who harassed the Native American elder can’t ALL be sociopaths, can they? I mean - seriously - what are the odds? Maybe the red dye from their MAGA hats seeped psychoactive toxins into their scalps. I happen to think it’s because they're entitled, middle-class pricks with conservative parents who routinely encourage them to behave this way towards women, minorities, and tbe elderly because “boys will be boys” and - hierarchies.

Dear Students of Covington All-Boys Catholic High,

Thank you so much for proving our point. The timing could not be better! As a token of our appreciation, we’d like to send each one of you a Limited Edition Mach 3 Turbo razor gift set. Best wishes,

Sort of bugs me that they put "bullying" in as a part of toxic masculinity. Girls bully kids just as much as boys especially nowadays.

R305 Girls do bully eachother. Girls and young women who are victims of bullying are even more likely to take their own lives. Boys are more likely to lash out at their tormentors. It's an awful problem but putting the entire responsibility on men to "do better" while ignoring the relentless bullying of young women by their peers is extremely short sighted. Men and women are in it together but that's not the narrative that's popular right now.

We are talking about men now. Usually when people try to change the subject or do the whole "yeah but what about..." thing, the message is hitting the mark. And, if you want to talk about the difference between male and female bullying, the females don't take guns to school to get revenge. School shootings are another symptom of rampant toxic masculinity. So is gun culture in general.

Women may bullly each other one on one, but they don’t rove around in violent packs like feral dogs, breaking into your home, raping your children, or murdering other people quite as much.

r308 is on the rag

Women are much much much much worse! What about how they use Wicca to make penises shrink?? Thanks to these whores, I’m forever a eunuch who trolls gay message boards instead of getting laid ‘cause these bitches want CHADS ONLY and ignore non-Chads like me - despite our superior-than-average intellect - solely because of our weak chins, shrill voices, and curvaceous hips.

What about TOXIC FEMININITY like how chicks ask to see the manager if you look at their boobs while asking do they want fries, or laugh at you at the pool for your tiny bulge - SHRUNKEN BY THEIR WICCA. Thanks, Gillette, for throwing manhood under the bus.

R310 says it all

Dear incels, we on DL don't care. Now, please kindly fuck off back to Reddit and 4chan.

How about toxic feminity or trannity

Of course it's toxic masculinity. All-boys school Covington Catholic parents have a new MAGA hat to wear. It says, "My Asshole (kid's) Grounded Again."

[italic]You've got to be taught to hate and fear, you've got to be taught from year to year.

It's got to be drummed in your dear little ear. You've got to be carefully taught.

You've got to be taught to be afraid, of people whose eyes are oddly made.

And people whose skin is a diff'rent shade. You've got to be carefully taught.

You've got to be taught before it's too late, before you are six or seven or eight.

To hate all the people your relatives hate. You've got to be carefully taught.[/italic]

Rodgers and Hammerstein: South Pacific.

I have relatives in Covington, and have been there many times. This MAGA bigots don't surprise me at all. The place is a pit, in a state full of pits.

The whataboutism in this thread is off the charts.

This argument will go on forever because the supporters will continually shift the goal posts. The ad focuses on men who are in power. If people really gave a shit about men growing up without role models, they would focus on broken familes and low income neighborhoods where the type of violence that is being associated with toxic masculinity is really an epidemic.

The well-off, parent-accompanied (and apparently parent-encouraged) students from Covington Catholic High School in upper-class Park Hills, KY exhibiting the kind of violence towards others we're reading about as they toured Washington, DC don't come from broken families or low-income neighborhoods.

They're just good, pro-life Catholics.

What about Chicago!?

What about Chicago?

R316: The whataboutism in this thread is off the charts.

Pity the Pump Room is gone, though...

Toxic masculinity is a bad name for several reasons. First, it isn’t precise. It tries to tie in racism, sexism, violence, aggression, and God knows what else into a single diagnosis, which doesn’t make sense. Second, it isn’t accurate. Masculinity makes it people think it can only apply to men. Women also can exhibit these behaviors. Third, it is ironic that it is meant to be progressive/PC, but it is actually the opposite because it stereotypes a single group. Allowing one group to be singled out sets equality back several generations. Toxic masculinity is an ill-conceived diagnosis that the American Psychoatric Society didn’t think through and Gillette was too quick to jump on the bandwagon.

It was great for gays that homosexuality determinted not to be a psychiatric disorder. However, just because an organization did something right years ago does not make that organization infallible. Psychiatrists today are not the same as a generation ago. Reimbursements have gone down, the work has become more difficult, and therefore less qualified individuals are becoming psychiatrists. It’s one of the easiest residences to get, so the worst (dumbest/laziest) medical students usually choose that field.

Gillette would have been much wiser to show a more diverse group of individuals making mistakes. To make only white men look bad is undoubtedly going to trigger white men and those who sympathize with them. If their goal was truly to teach social responsibility, they would have been more effective by not singling out one particular demographic.

"The whataboutism in this thread is off the charts."

What about the whataboutism on OTHER threads, hmmm?

R321 Dyname post!

[quote] Masculinity makes it people think it can only apply to men. Women also can exhibit these behaviors.

Women are praised for exhibiting masculine behaviors. Meanwhile women who stay home and have children, work in social services, or pursue creative endeavors that don't make a lot of money are called shallow, lazy, stupid, or gold diggers. Women who are overly sexual are called sluts, etc. Women who are depicted as tough action heroes are cheered like they are the second coming even though we've had strong female archetypes going back generations now.

[quote] First, it isn’t precise. It tries to tie in racism, sexism, violence, aggression, and God knows what else into a single diagnosis, which doesn’t make sense.

Exactly, which is why it's impossible to win with an argument with these people. They can't even define what toxic masculinity is. It's just everything bad.

Toxic masculinity is when men, whether a lone mass shooter or a MAGA mob at the Lincoln memorial, behave in overt and destructive ways to society and their fellow citizens as a means to show their bona fides as defined by the stereotype of the alpha male

"New Gillette ad raising awareness about toxic masculinity"

So who ISN'T aware of it already?

Society's problem is neither toxic masculinity nor femininity but a toxic culture, devoid of myth, moral grounding and the rites of passage that enable individuals to make a successful transition to adulthood. Instead, we're manipulated by the media, distracted by gadgetry and drowning in anomie and despair while we amuse our narcissistic selves to death.

[quote]Both women and gay men are attracted to dominant males.

That explains the prevalence of older (dominant) men into younger (not dominant) men who are being paid (not dominant) as opposed to being the one who pays (dominant).

The living commodity isn't dominant.

[quote]Women are praised for exhibiting masculine behaviors.

Men are overtly rewarded by society for masculine behaviors. It's when those behaviors go too far that they become toxic. That is the definition of toxic masculinity. Normal masculine behaviors that go too far to the point that they negatively impact society.

The ad was not criticizing men per se, but the way we are culturally indoctrinated to be stoic, emotionless, sexist, and macho. The ad was showing ways to reverse that. Why ask Gillette to critique women, though? Gillette is a masculine brand which is why the ad was about men, directed at men. If there really is a toxic femininity problem, Kotex should do their own ad, instead: “Don’t be a hag when you’re on the rag.”

R308 I would say the bulk of Human Resources is a pack of feral dogs.

A positive shout out to the everyday man.

No apologies...........

[quote] The ad was not criticizing men per se, but the way we are culturally indoctrinated to be stoic, emotionless, sexist, and macho.

In this outrage culture, I don't think it's bad if we see a return to more stoicism. Many life saving jobs rely on the ability to remain clinically focused.

R333, how about the emotionless, sexist, macho part?

R333 I think you’ve revealed what most conservatives actually HATE about the ad - it “pussifies” men and promotes respect and emotional intelligence. But you ain’t going to get any converts from the left if you frame your argument that way, so put a leftist spin on it by saying “it hurts our feewings -whatabout the mean mean women who are bullies? SEXISM.” Since DL is majority liberal, that’s the gist of most rightwing counter-arguments in this thread. Even though it’s fallacious, it resonates more with people like gay men who’ve experienced our own negative portrayals in the media. It’s a brilliant rhetorical strategy.

R333 Anyhow, thanks for your honesty. At least you shoot from the hip as a real manly man (or butch lady) should, rather than pretend to be offended as some of the MRA asswipes on this thread have done.

Gosh, R332 makes me think men are idiots. "Men account for 93% of workplace fatalities"?

You fucking dumbasses, watch what you're doing!!

I love how the video in R332 is a collage of the numerous OTHER videos, ads, and stock footage that portray men as positive, heroic, protectors of the free world - romanticized images that have gone unchallenged for decades. I don’t think anyone has ever mounted a protest against a single one of those videos that this YouTuber “borrowed,” and parts of the maudlin Gillette ad would fit right in with that sentimental mess, ironically.

I agree with those saying the whole concept of "toxic masculinity" is bad. What about(heh) being anti-bullying, anti-rape, anti-violence, whatever. If you are anti toxic masculinity you ARE anti masculinity and thereby anti men. That's what everyone is hearing and feeling, that's just how our brains work.

It's not healthy for little boys, who never chose being born at all or as boys, who learn they are rotten by nature, but could always strive to be some kind of second class woman. So some will just choose rotten, cause fuck it I'll own it, others will be depressed and devoid of self esteem.

That's quite a leap of illogic, R338. The entire point of the ad is that acting like a sexist piece of shit asshole is not inherent to being masculine or male. It's inherent to the malignant form of masculinity that is taught to and modeled to young boys by a lot of the men in society.

I'm not sure why some of you can't understand that masculinity and toxic masculinity are two different things. I mean, I know reading comprehension isn't a male strength but, come on! (Just kidding. Hope no male egos were bruised in the kidding.) (Just kidding about the ego thing, too...)

Where were the women at the barbecue? None of them broke up he boys wrestling, they were all in the background cruelly tearing up whichever women weren't able to attend.

Look, R340, Paul divorced Claire and the guys just aren't comfortable seeing her around the barbeques anymore.

It's what's best.

R339 - I think R338 made a good point - that “toxic masculinity” could easily be read as “masculinity IS toxic” instead of “masculinity THAT IS toxic,” making boys and men feel leery about expressing all masculine behaviors, even if they are positive or innocuous. It’s not a matter of poor comprehension - butting those two words together makes the adjective taint the noun, almost subconsciously. And I do know some women who think ALL masculine behavior is toxic, just as MRAs think all femininity is toxic.

It’s a double-edged sword: shame for being too masculine by modern standards, shame for not being masculine enough by traditional standards. Any man who feels emasculated by feminism should also consider how war, industrialization, child abuse, and high-risk jobs have contributed to male suicide, homicide, PTSD, substance abuse, and domestic violence. Capitalism and technology has also reduced male-dominated occupations through automation and outsourcing, leaving men homeless and unable to be providers.

After thinking it over a bit, I agree that we should retire the term “toxic masculinity” and go back to using precise terms like violence, rape, sexual harassment, etc. instead of generalizations. “Toxic masculinity” is just another case of overzealous branding in our slogan-obsessed society.

I understand the message and their intention but this is very handed for a shaving company

"that 'toxic masculinity' could easily be read as 'masculinity IS toxic'

Of course it could--and will--and that's EXACTLY what was intended, no one will convince me otherwise. Men are this year's fashion in villainy.

Toxic people doesn't refer to all people. Toxic chemical doesn't refer to all chemicals. Toxic behavior doesn't apply to all behavior. Why would toxic masculinity apply to all masculinity? Healthy masculinity vs. toxic masculinity. Why is that difficult to understand or differentiate for so many men?

What would some of you have bad behaviors that are 95% done by males called? I think a lot of the problem is that men usually only listen to other men and respond to social pressure coming from other men. It has been posited that only men can stop rape. Women can march and fight back and call for action and on and on but until good men stand up en masse and say "No more." and hold those other men responsible, it won't matter because those men who would do these behaviors defined as toxic masculinity will never listen to or care what any woman says or does.

You should be celebrating that people aren't referring to all masculinity as toxic and are instead differentiating typical masculine behaviors from those that are detrimental to everyone involved. Healthy males should be striving to take down those acting in toxic ways and giving them all a bad name every single day. That's what they ad is saying and that's exactly what the entire second half of the ad explicitly shows.

R344, you're so wrong.

It's WHITE straight men who are this year's fashion in villainy.

White straight CIS men, R346.

This is their theme music.

Gillette made a bad decision.

It's offensive to suggest that men who shave need a razor/shaving-supply company is needed to educate men on appropriate behavior.

But I don't use Gillette's lousy products anyway. And I don't beat women or humiliate children, and I didn't even need their help in not doing that.

Shits.

GIllette is a tiresome and tedious scold.

[quote]And I don't beat women or humiliate children, and I didn't even need their help in not doing that.

R348, have you ever actively done anything to stop other men who do? If not, you're part of the problem.

[quote]It has been posited that only men can stop rape.

Women on campus can stop rape by getting their alcoholism under control and not getting blackout drunk at frat parties.

R351, you are just so...typical.

You’re full of shit R350. I’ve never stopped a man from beating a woman or humiliating a child and I am not part of any problem. I never saw a man do those things to anyone I care about. If I did, I would stop him.

It is obvious that toxic masculinity (TM) is an attack on men. I spelled out in R321 why TM is completely ridiculous. Just imagine a diagnosis of toxic blackness, toxic jewness, toxic femininity, toxic Asian behavior. I can easily make up random criteria to each of those diagnoses and claim “oh- don’t be offended. It doesn’t apply to all negroes/Jews/frauen/chinamen” but I would be labeled a racist or mysogenist in a heartbeat.

Either you’re mentally handicapped or you think we all are.

You're making distinctions in the abstract that would occur among intelligent people at a civilized dinner party, r345. But we're talking about a commercial designed for the masses as a sound byte. It has to have punch and get straight to the point--that's what sells. And that message is...Toxic Masculinity. Period. And since our culture is notorious for its simplistic, good-bad way of thinking (which the polarized media manipulates 24/7), the blanket generalization is what the viewing audience--with one eye on the idiot box and the other on the pizza they're scarfing down--will take away from it. The fact that a commercial (!!) is lecturing anybody on anything is an irony so staggering it simply beggars belief. Leave the sanctimony for the Oscars (insert huge eyeroll emoji here).

R349

So is Liz Warren. At least Gillette's not running for President

R353, you sound guilty of apathy if you can't figure out how to do something about men being violent or harassing people unless it's done right in front of you to someone you know. You are part of the problem. If you don't want to be grouped with men who do those things, fight against the men who do those things or accept that you are being grouped exactly where you belong. By your own words, you would have been the white guy during the Civil Rights movement who said, "Eh, I'm not a racist. Nothing I can do about it. I never personally saw anyone getting lynched."

R356,

We can’t fight ever battle. You have no idea what I do to improve my community and I am very comfortable with my contributions to society. The fact that you’re judging someone whom you know nothing about speaks volumes about you and nothing about me. What a dumb bitch.

R357, you're so full of shit. And, of course, your sexism and misogyny end your comment. All I need to know about you. Toxic.

New superhero: Anti-Toxic Man Man! Able to defeat bad guys via the internet!!

[quote]What would some of you have bad behaviors that are 95% done by males called?

They should be called what they are. Bullying, which is featured heavily in the ad sure as hell isn't done by males 95% of the time. I don't even think for sexual harassment you will get 95%, though obviously there men will at least be in the majority. For rape you will probably get 95% males, but that isn't even in the ad, and it has a perfectly good word to describe it: rape.

I also think playing football/soccer should usually be called playing football/soccer or team sports or sports not "healthy masculinity" (even though it's done by boys and men about 95% of the time).

The target audience for this ad doesn't shave. Male or female.

Who are you talking about R361?

[quote]Gillette/P&G are laughing all the way to the bank,

They aren't today!