Yuzuru Hanyu and other figure skating talk part 16

Who are the contenders for the next World titles?

[quote]I thought ISU/JSF would hold out until the Dec 3rd deadline to announce but they didn't.[/quote]

I think they announced it as early as possible so there’s enough time for Hanyu fans to sell their tickets to Keegan/Canadian fans. Otherwise, they might end up with a fairly empty rink.

The men’s final should be more drama-ridden with Hanyu out. Uno PCS inflation vs Chen PCS inflation + Will Uno’s jumps get called? + Will Chen clean up in time? + At least one of the oldies or Cha will medal + Insufferable Canadian fans. Any info on the judges?

Junior men have an exciting lineup of skaters and coaches with Lambiel, Joubert, Zhou’s coach, and Orser again. I could imagine Orser having an actual medical emergency after the final due to too much stress that would keep him from Russian Nationals.

I thought Chen isn’t competing at 4CC because it conflicts with his school schedule and fans were criticizing the event for using him in their advertising?

So glad now that I didn't make plans to attend the GPF.

Why do people keep talking about Hanyu possibly attending 4CC? Did he ever say he might do that?

I don't think he ever said anything, but fans are assuming he might go to 4CC, so he could skate his programs one more time before worlds.

Was looking for a nice rear end to the thread before but somebody beat me to it - but it's a shame to waste such a lovely POA

"In the Pod" interviews Stephane Lambiel.

About Kolyada: I think the keyword for me is trust. Sometimes, for example Mikhail, I’m not too worried because he’s a strong guy, not only physically, I feel mentally if he lets go, he will be stronger. He can do everything, he really can and I’ve seen him in practice, he’s so strong, he’s so capable, but he wants to control everything. And in competition you just have to do your job, don’t try to control because you’re late on what you have to do if you try to...or try to see yourself doing things. Just do them, don’t try to control everything, put the energy in action. That’s my feeling but I think that’s something you should probably discuss with the skater as a coach. And if you’re not willing to do that, then to find someone [who] can do that approach of making it happen....

....once he will let go, it will feel very easy. But right now because he’s not letting go, it feels really complex. That’s how I feel. (Clara: Yeah, I can only imagine.) It just feels like a mountain. Once he will do it, he will be like ‘Oh my god, that’s actually not that difficult.’ So to be on that edge is always...as a skater, it’s very frustrating because I’m sure he’s ready to skate a great performance, and he will just need to right ‘let go’ to do it (laughs).

* Wait - It's "In the Loop" podcast.

Did Karen Chen withdrew from the LP at Tallin? I can't find her on the results list.

I found this comment in the scrolling thing at the side of the ladies free skate, which is still going on right now at the link: “No just the short program to get entrance to US nationals, like Gracie did”

Thanks R9. I guess she's not recovered enough from her injury yet to complete the LP. However, unlike Gracie, Karen had an automatic by to US nationals from her 3rd place finish last year. She didn't need to compete at Tallin to get in, so why go all this way just to skate for 2:50?

I’m crazy about Lambiel. Always have been. Glad to hear that he’s been enjoying the skating world behind the scenes as a choreographer and coach.

American girls so lazy, they quit after short if they can't win. Might break fingernail.

R12 speaks the truth. I don't know if it's laziness per se (except in Ashley's case), but it certainly speaks to a lack of sporting character. You don't become a top skater by giving up whenever things aren't going your way. Gracie's situation was a little more understandable given her fragile mental health, but she clearly shouldn't have been put out there to begin with. How much of that lies with her vs her coaches and USFS, I don't know.

karen was afraid of me

No, she didn't want to get shown up by ME!

As I expected. EU next year is uncertain at this point.

Itsuki Uno's book was released today. It comes with an interesting postcard... Any Itsuki ass fans?

Shoma's autograph will be given away to a limited number of fans who attend Ituski's signings. Still no word about the charity the proceeds will be donated to, although it's being advertised as a charity book.

The ad on the book says it will talk about Mom's ability ("intuition") to recognize Shoma's talent and how Dad values independence.

[quote]It comes with an interesting postcard... Any Itsuki ass fans?

No doubt this will thrill the ass & taint crowd around here, but for me, personally, it's his overwhelming charisma that bewitches in those tight white jeans. It's obvious which charity he's donating to: us, our loins.

His dad values independence? Like famewhoring on your brother as your career?

R20 That's unfair - I think Shoma also has a figure skating career.

Recent interview with Boyang after IdF. Highlights: he has confidence issues, feels anxious; impacted by criticism he received after deciding not to go to Orser; he feels a lot of pressure to do well; he changed after coming back from Canada (where he worked with Lori) - doesn't want to talk to anyone, lacks energy; when training for Olympics, he would skip meals to take advantage of ice time.

Vincent Zhou wins the silver medal at Tallin. He took out many of his quads in favor of triples, which was a smart move.

r22 I feel sorry for him. I still think not going to Orser was the wrong decision but it's sad to see how negatively the whole affair affected him. But why did he change after working with Lori?

r23 10 pts behind Kovtun? Did Kovtun stay upright in his gadawful (although not as bad as Ponsart's) Carmen?

R23 He still got 4 UR calls - 2 on the quads he left in and 1 each on the 3A and 3S. I think Vincent's goal right now should be to get high GOEs on his doubles and 1eus.

R24 Kovtun fell once but generally skated decently.

Rizzo wins in Bulgaria with 225 point after a messy FS

The winner of the SP at Christmas Cup didn't even reach 60 points

Tom Z is a terrible coach.

Fernandez's sister is the technical specialist at Open of Andorra this week.

The splat at 0.54 is quite good

R19 Of course! It all makes sense now.

Another recent tidbit about Itsuki from the latest AERA online article: Sometimes, he gets approached by his brother’s fans and… he just doesn’t know why nor what to do!

R25 Have you seen how strict the judges have been on the eulers this season? That would still be risky. Anyway, hopefully this recent competition has inspired some new poetry.

Where did Lease hear that Coach Hamada said Zhou can’t skate?

Tom Z happily exclaimed "wow" when he saw Vincent Z's score today

R22 Thank you for the link. It sounds like something happened while he was in Canada.

Now I wish I'd made note of where I got this comment, maybe here lol, but for what it's worth, I kept it - somebody said: "Before the coaching change was off and just after Boyang visited TCC, Orser implied that Boyang was undisciplined and unfocused, like how Fernandez used to be in his early days, so it could be that he needs more structure in his training"

How many quads has Vincent managed to rotate this season?

R33 It was posted in the previous thread. The poster was likely referring to this Phil Hersh article on Brown's/Boyang's move to Orser: "Brian Orser sees a little of a young Javier Fernández in 20-year-old Boyang Jin. 'He is super talented but a bit of a loose cannon, like Javi was when he came to me (also at age 20)," Orser said. "I have to give him direction and purpose. That will come with maturity.'"

Out of the eight quad attempts Vincent made at both Skate America and NHK, all were under-rotated except this one: "4Lz+3T<" (I think that means the 4Lz was deemed ok but the 3T was UR). This was at the free skate at Skate America.

He also UR'd two 3A's.

I didn't check that US International or whatever it's called, his earliest tournament this season.

R36 4 UR out of.4 Quad attempted at US International. 1 3A out of 3

Thanks R35. Wonder what gave Orser that impression? That interview is disturbing - not talking to anyone since being in Canada, not even his mom. I hope the situation improves for him. Seems like a sweet kid.

1 3A rotated out of 3.

R32 I'm so curious now. What the hell did those damn Canadians do to so traumatize Boyang?

What the fuck happened to the men's field this season - Hanyu, Kolyada, Boyang, all the guys that are enjoyable to watch are down and out. Do I have to turn back to ladies now after largely ignoring them for a whole quad?

r36 Counted for the season.

1 rotated quad. 14<. 6.66%

5 rotated 3 axels. 3<. 62.5%

18 rotated triples. 4<. 81.82%

Part of me finds it hilariously ludicrous. Part of me feels sorry for Vincent. He seems talented enough. This just seems like the way Tom Z teaches jumps. I wonder what Zhou could have done with a competent coach.

r35 Boyang seemed to be doing OK previous seasons. He wasn't bombing so he had enough training and structure to get on the podium in GPs. I remember reading somewhere after his 2018 Worlds bomb that he just phoned it in after Olys and didn't train enough -he may have admitted it in an interview, I don't remember. Maybe he got into some sort of a funk or a rebell phase after Olys? And then the whole move to TCC debacle could have indeed worsened his mental attitude, the Chinese fans were reportedly vicious. If he's got some lingerinng injury on top of that, then I guess it sucks for him.

r40 Don't jinx it. The season is far from over, who knows how many of them can still get knocked out.

Idk, maybe it's the post-Olympics syndrome? 2014/15 for Yuzu was a nightmare, Chan was having a break, Machida quit mid-season after the JFS didn't let him sit out GP to finish his degree. I mean, Kovtun was the top GPF qualifier.

r41 Who else did Tom Z coach? I think Max Aaron, but I don't recall Max Aaron having a particular UR issue. Not that Aaron's empty skating was anything to brag about.

R43 Mirai Nagasu who had quite a lot of UR problems in the last years

R33 r35 That was me and I was referring to that article. The loose cannon part really stands out as they (Orser and Boyang) probably didn't spend much time together.

That reminded me that Lambiel's interview about Kolyada 's problems is very different than what Raf said about him recently. I can't bring up the interview right now, maybe someone else can.

R43 He coaches Camden Pulkinen who's in the JGPF.

r45 No quads for Pulkinen yet, but he seems to have a good 3A.

But someone wrote that Zhou was looking into universities so maybe he doesn't intend to invest in fixing those URs.

I'm confused... why are there 2 figure skating threads on DL? "Figure skating XIX" and this one? What's the difference?

Oh, and is anyone going to GPF?

R47: one is for gossip, the other for skating. It started because there were some way too obsessed ppl who talked endlessly about conspiracies, concerning gloves and skaters.

[R48] Hanyu fans tried to take over the old thread and the old times hated it so they (fanyus) created a new one.

R48 I don't think that's necessarily true - this one is for singles, with particular interest in men's, Hanyu and ass. The other thread seems to focus on pairs, dance and ass.

Yeah, I noticed there is no mention of dance in this one whatsoever...just thought it was strange that there were 2 different ones, and this one seems to move much faster

R47 well, I have tickets to GPF but have decided that hitting the slopes for most of that weekend would be a better use of my time. Hanyu, P/C, S/H, every skater/skating team I love has been sidelined. Juniors and ladies look good though.

r51 Neither are really designated for any particular subject. The most active participants on the other thread hate Hanyu and are too stupid to block the people who wanted to talk about Hanyu so they constantly bitched on the thread about people talking about a figure skater on a figure skating thread until the OP here started this thread. It just naturally divided up so that people over there primarily discussed dance and pairs and people here are more interested in singles but both threads talk about everything to some degree and we have people who hate/are disinterested in Hanyu here as well. I'm not sure if that other thread even discusses couples skating much more than this one but it moves so much slower and that's mostly all they talk about.

R52, I think senior/ junior ladies will be interesting as well as ice dance, even in the absence of P/C. Don't really care for Hanyu, but want to see Cha.

r54 If you don't have one, you'll get fantastic GPF tickets probably half-price now.

R54 I want to see Nguyen/Kolesnik. Goddamn I hate her squeaky voice though.

R55 seriously, people are giving them away on gs and ph.

I do have a ticket R55, but a bit worried because I bought it through ebay months ago, not on a skating forum. Good thing is if I have issues, I could probably get another one easily given how many there are currently available

R54 I saw quite a few posts on GS and PH where the person is willing to meet in person in Vancouver to sell tix, so you should be fine. A lot of people are attending but just found better seats so they are selling their old ones.

yeah the only annoying part will be scrambling to PM people. I'm hoping it will work out fine though...

r51 I'm guessing you're new here so just want to give you a head's up. We have one nutter who has semi-regular psychotic fits on here. In the past some people thought this thread was infested with trolls but one click of the ignore button makes it all go away.

R60 the troll is a huge PC fan and told some poor person on the other thread to die because they dared to very lightly praise H/D. Most of the people there have blocked it. For some reason, some of the people here are amused by it, so here it stays.

Oh, he trolls here as well? I have that P/C fan blocked on the other thread as well...

R45 Are you talking about the interview where Raf says Kolyada's jumps aren't stable, even in practice and that there are some "organizational" issues that keep him from training and competing well? Here's the article, but I read it through google translate, so I'm not quite sure I'm getting the full import of what he's saying.

I don't see how either Raf or Stephane could possibly know the answer to fixing all of Kolyada's problems. If his longtime coach and he himself can't figure it out, neither is someone who has barely worked with him for 2 weeks. Everyone has an opinion but who really gives a fuck if Kolyada is too passive and weak to do anything for himself after all this time? Raf and Stephane both have their own skaters with plenty of issues, who they should be focused on. What is the obsession with Kolyada?

So Chan never found his mojo in big competitions, even flopped on his ass when he wasn't up for the individual gold at Pyeongchang. He was the top favorite of judges though, unlike Kolyada, so he had more success.

How would y'all rate and compare both?

so is this the gossip thread

R65 Chiddy was a 3x world champ, 2 silvers at Worlds, Oly silvers (AND GOLD, mind you), GPF champ etc. etc. I would hardly say he didn't find his mojo at the big comps. Yes, he was given PCS candies by judges, even when he splatted. Yes, he choked in Sochi. Yes, many think he should have been a 1x world champ. But I don't think Kolyada could be compared to Chan when Chan basically dominated from 2010-2014, and at 23, the highest Kolyada's risen has been a bronze at worlds in a depleted field.

Kolyada is also favored by the judges. Have you seen his PCS, even when he splats through his program? I guess they're similar in that respect. Chan was a headcase and a cunt, but Kolyada is by far a more perplexing case of unfulfilled promise.

r6 I don't get what Lambiel is trying to say there about Kolyada.

r64 Arutyunyan speaks Russian, maybe he gets the inkling what's wrong, both from Kolyada and from the get go.

R68 It is a little unclear, but it seems Lambiel is saying that while Kolyada is able to do everything well in practice, he is an overthinker and falls apart too easily when things don't go as planned in competitions. As R45 pointed out, this is a little different from what Raf is saying, which is that Kolyada isn't even training well - that he's not landing his jumps consistently enough.

R63 R69 Thank you. I read a translation, but that’s probably the original source. It seems Raf thinks Kolyada doesn’t know how to practice effectively and isn’t doing enough, rather than just suffering from a mental block. Here’s the FS Gossips translation:

[quote][bold]Sometimes it seems that he lacks quite a bit…[/bold] – It doesn’t happen like this, it means that something is not enough. I saw him in my classes in the summer in America, he has mistakes in training. You see, an athlete shouldn’t make mistakes before serious competitions at all. [bold]And how to deal with this? Does he need a tough coach?[/bold] – No, at this age you can’t scold, and the question is not in rigidity, but in organization. It is necessary to keep statistics on completed jumps, to strive for some fixed percentage. And if you have 50 to 50, why do you think that the successful 50 will be at competitions and not vice versa? After all, there will be stress, music, the audience.[/quote]

Zagitova’s dog, Masaru, is now sponsored by Airweave. (Meryl Davis, Mao Asada, and a few other Japanese athletes are also sponsored by the company.) Masaru signed the contract herself.

What Arutunian says about Kolyada reminds me Ouriashev (Gold’s first coach) speaking about Gracie when she was training with Carroll. IIRC, he was asked, she’s doing so well in practice, why didn’t she deliver at Worlds, and he said, I know Gracie, I saw her practices, she didn’t skate well and I didn’t expect her to do well in competition. I think what he (and Arutunuan) meant that for a nervous skater, like Kolyada or Gold, it is better to be overprepared, be in top shape, leave no room for self-doubt.

Lambiel, on the other hand, is a completely different kind of skater. His coach said he always skated better in competitions, even when his practices were a disaster. Lambiel himself said that at 2006 Olympics he skated so poorly during the LP practice that he spent the afternoon crying in his hotel room. And then he won silver. He is one of those who are energized by the audience, by the adrenaline of competition, and he probably just doesn’t understand the mentality of someone who gets completely overwhelmed by it.

R70 Why is her dog so popular ?

A beautiful girl and her beloved dog. Stunning and oh so marketable.

Kind of like Shoma and Itsuki. I think I'm finally beginning to understand Hello Kitty.

R65, Patrick Chan was at his prime in a different era, where you could make a number of mistakes on the harder elements and still win or place high. He did well because of his strong basic skating skills (similar to Jason Brown, who lacked the technical difficulty). His later years emphasized landing quad jumps consistently, and he didn't place as well. This is the world in which Koylada is competing. He would've placed better in an earlier era IMO.

So how many of you here are secretly in the Kansai Photojournalists Association? They just awarded this photo with their gold prize:

R76 The composition in that photograph is just tremendously firm and juicy!! LMAO.

R76 Not to nitpick but that photo would be even better if it was angled slightly. Or if he was wearing one of his Prince outfits.

However, I'll take whatever I can get right now. Thanks for posting it.

Figure skating is just not interesting without our darling Yuzu.

only a couple of words from Vincent this week

For the sake of his mental health, I'm happy that Vincent is feeling better. But Tom Z is still a terrible coach.

I tried to bend down like he's doing in that photo, but my body just kind of stopped parallel to the floor and I heard something pop. I'm not even in my 30s.

I agree R80. I hope Tom doesn't mess up the enormously talented Ting Cui's skating.

Since we’re in a Zhou poetry drought, another fancam to overanalyze and waste your time:

Tomono and Ge 2:38

Daniil 5:21

Tomono’s coach who's missing his signature leather gloves 6:15

Masaru was a gift to Zagitova by the Akita Dog Preservation Society after she said she wanted to have an Akita Inu. They’re a breed native to Akita prefecture. The Akita government also gave a pup to Putin years ago to thank the Russian government for their help following the 2011 Tohoku earthquake and tsunami disaster. (Putin gave the governor of Akita a Siberian Forest cat in return.) So you could say that Masaru is a form of diplomacy between Russia and Japan. Even the Japanese prime minister attended the ceremony in Moscow where the dog was handed over to Zagitova. Masaru is also fluffy, cute, and full of personality, which makes her a better spokesmodel than most figure skaters.

For r72

R83 Didn't expect Yuzuru and Daniil were that warm to each other. From the fancam you linked and this video, you can see Yuzuru suddenly hurried up when he saw Daniil lol.

R83 r86 Misha Ge has such a creeper vibe, especially when he's trying to look grown up and relevant like he was at Rostelecom.

Where are the fancams of my favorite hot coach, Yamato Tamura? He was at Rostelecom with Yuna Shiraiwa and I saw one lousy pic of him at the boards but that's it!! Yet I see a gazillion pics of the resident wannabe and hanger-on, Misha Ge,

r86 It doesn't look like he's hurrying up in either video? Still a nice moment.

r87 Maybe he was in drag! He does make a pretty lady.

R88 LOL was that when he went on a rampage and kissed all the guys on team JPN? Good Lord I love that guy but he does not make a pretty lady.

Why are we always rehashing the same topics again and again?

R88 In R83 fancam, he was chatting with Japanese team, then he stopped smiling and became kind of clumsy when he took a look at backtage ( around 5:16). I thought Danill saw him and greet him first but if you watch fancam R86, you can see Daniil didn't notice him until Yuzuru nodded to greet.

Not something serious. I just find it hilarious.

*backstage

And it was around 3:11 in R86 fancam

Marin Honda made her IG private today, although she’s uploaded an instastory showing her reading encouraging DMs from fans. A lengthy and very scathing article about her and the media attention she’s received was published two days ago by sportswriter Nobuyuki Usukita in ITmedia. Usukita criticized the intense and unusually positive media focus on Honda since she was a junior, despite not delivering results deserving of the commercial support she’s received. An insider revealed mainstream media is reluctant to criticize Honda because her agency (IMG) has the power to get reporters banned from competitions and other venues for publishing stories that don’t feature their athlete in a positive light.

According to others in the know, the media attention, promotional events, and television appearances are also why Honda became distracted and didn’t make the 2018 Olympic team. Though she showed much promise as a junior, surrounding “adults” caused her to veer from her skating path. Her move to sports agency IMG from talent agency Oscar, and her contract with JAL, were suppose to get her to concentrate on skating again. However, these insiders also question whether she fully understands the gravity of her current situation and whether she’s completely separated her mind from her idol image. Usukita had the same doubts after seeing her IG.

At the end of the article, Usukita said that Honda needs to get serious or there will be no tomorrow. She’s already losing to younger skaters like Zagitova and Kihira, and her sponsors will leave her.

I found this comment at GS in Kolyada's thread, so if it's true, it might explain Med's diarrhea tea and slimming stockings: it has been established that the Fed/Ministry of Sports is not paying for Zhenya to train with Orser and no requests to finance anyone's training abroad have been made or considered. I think the theory that Misha [Kolyada] was about to go/be sent by the Fed to Raf can be laid to rest.

In The Loop has an interesting interview with Lambiel (he discusses Kolyada's problem with nerves at the end of it).

R94 I don't get the slavish devotion so many non-Russian fans seem to have suddenly developed for Medvedeva. I understand--to a point--feeling sympathy for her because she didn't win the OGM. But she did win a silver and a bunch of other titles despite her many shortcomings as a skater.

R93 IMG is that powerful? Is this why people pretend Uno is on the same level of Hanyu and the media happily raves about his quads and floop?

Honda is a sweet girl and definitely has skills, potential, and star quality, but as she's not delivering it annoys me how much media at a competition she gets in comparison to some other Japanese girls. Fans shielded her and didn't believe when her old coach said she doesn't work hard enough and was distracted, and turns out the old coach isn't the only one who thinks that way.

R96 I don't get it either. It's really annoying that now Med can do no wrong, or it's either Orser or Eteri who are evil and the cause of her currently deteriorating skills. While Eteri's methods definitely aren't helping her in the present, Med won many golds and OSM with it and the Eteri packaging. There's no guarantee it would have turned out the same if we rewind time and change.

There are a few Japanese singles skaters who I think would do better in ice dance instead, if Japan gave a crap about ice dance. Honda is one of them. (Tanaka is another.)

R98 Satoko too if they stop overlooking her jumps. I've heard someone mention Ryuji Hino.

IIRC the Chinese fed tried to get Yan Han to do ice dance and he refused, preferring to give up their support rather than switch disciplines. You'd think with Scott/Moir being such a huge success, it would be more appealing than it seems to be, especially in a glutted field like the Japanese.

I keep wondering what happened to Chris Reed and Kana Muramoto. It may not be related but she posts little quotes like, "If you're not being respected, then respect yourself and walk away". I keep wondering what happened with them - it was very abrupt and he was not happy about the sudden split. Can Japan even field a team at the World Team Trophy thing after Worlds?

Of course. I didn't marry my Japanese beard for nothing, R100.

Translation from Itsuki's book, seems Uno skated See You Again for a deceased relative. Brian also revealed Hanyu skated Notte Stellata at a previous gala for him. Goodness these Japanese skaters and their PR. If it's true, I don't mind, the thoughtfulness is sweet so good for them, but too many of these appendages like to talk when I'd rather hear from the source. Itsuki has a much better reason to attach his name to Uno than Misha Ge to Hanyu and Itsuki is truly a support for his brother, so I wonder if in his book he went to Ge lengths to toot his own horn.

Has the fervor for Chen died down already? He has built a pretty solid fanbase, but I haven't seen too much of his ubers stepping outside the cave to wax poetry about his skating this year. But I guess they've channelled their efforts into praising how he's the most hardworking skater ever with school and skating.

GPF is one week away. The lack of interesting media is sad or maybe I'm in the wrong place. Is NBC going to hype and spin a narrative of Chen v Uno, or is Chen the biggest gold favorite again? What's with the American media's erasure of Uno and putting him as a footnote. If Hanyu retires, the sudden change in narrative will be quite funny.

[quote]don't get it either. It's really annoying that now Med can do no wrong, or it's either Orser or Eteri who are evil and the cause of her currently deteriorating skills. While Eteri's methods definitely aren't helping her in the present, Med won many golds and OSM with it and the Eteri packaging. There's no guarantee it would have turned out the same if we rewind time and change.

Eteri was hated on here before this season - you all accused her of doping her skaters, child abuse, etc. Now that Zhenya is your punching bag, you try to rewrite history and find ways to make Zhenya the devil. Gee, maybe people aren't cartoon characters and they all have good and bad qualities. Can you wrap your little brain around that?

Someone explain post #103. That's a bit over my head.

Is R103 our resident troll?

R102 However NBC covers the men's GPF, you can be sure that Terry Gannon will remind us every couple of minutes that Nathan is attending Yale.

R103 lol

Btw I hate that Yuzuru is like some kind of winter animal: only ventures into the outside world during the season, otherwise is radio slient. Also, the gossip about him is not juicy enough.

R107 But how can you be bored when the conspiracies surrounding him are so gold? Some of the media and Hanyu's antis as well as his ubers have made sure that he has the most outlandish tales. Kikuchi, his old helper, is a warlock. Hanyu is maybe in a secret rendezvous with Med. Hanyu hates Dai, or vice versa. According to TSL and some gif moments Hanyu also hates Shoma. He also caused the COC crash with Han Yan purposely, and is a diva because of his accusations and reaction to Ten at Worlds '16. His injuries at NHK '17 and COR '18 are a lie or exaggerated to avoid a showdown with Chen and Uno, and Dai. Also he doesn't deserve recognition because he still carries around a Pooh and that's immature. This sub also thinks he has a stalker fanboy in Ge, or maybe they are secret bffs.

Honestly the conspiracies aside looking at his background and history, different degrees of meltdowns, and injuries but ability to get back up again as well as his legendary status, he already is living a primetime drama (or anime). Some skaters probably wish their lives are that interesting.

[quote]Also, the gossip about him is not juicy enough.

Maybe that's why people like to fill the void and just make up shit about him.

R102 Brian said Hanyu skated Notte Stellata for Brian's father. I thought that story was touching. Maybe I'm just being cynical, but I side-eye everything that comes out of Itsuki and the promotional efforts around Shoma. Shoma on his own is great. I love his blunt, sincere, aspie reactions. In many ways, I also enjoy his skating. But Itsuki's interviews and the translated snippets I see from his book seem overpackaged to reinforce certain things people like about Shoma (his cluelessness, his ineptness when it comes to practical life skills) as well as add this "empathy" and "thoughtfulness" dimension to him that I don't really buy.

I haven't seen anything so far from Itsuki's book that strains credulity. I think it's possible that Shoma might have felt some affection for a woman who was kind to him, especially considering how tough his mother is on him. And I think Shoma is serious enough about his skating that being unable to practice would upset him a lot. Other people who know Shoma seem fond of him, so he must have some interpersonal skills. I've only read the few anecdotes helpful fans have translated, but these have already increased my appreciation for Shoma as a person. I'm happy to read the nice things you had to say, [R110]!

R91 No, I still don't see it that way.

R97 Uno is in USM, although they do seem to have the power to quash stories. IMG represents Asada, Medvedeva, and Chen.

R102 Orser's book was written before the Olympics and while he thought Hanyu would be retiring if he got his second OGM. Hanyu wasn't involved and it's more propaganda for Orser.

R107 Hormone doping, the occult, and secret abortions aren't juicy enough? He's surrounded by more gossip and bizarre conspiracy theories than any other skater.

R110 Even Uno fans giving the book 5-stars in their reviews are saying they're not comfortable with some parts of the book and feel parts about mom, Itsuki, and granpa are unnecessary and out of place, and there should be more focus on Uno's skating. Certainly, USM has been trying to use Itsuki to sell Shoma, but the parents have been trying to use Shoma to sell the family, and more and more of Uno's fans are growing dissatisfied with Itsuki and mom. You won't hear about this from Uno fans overseas because they're not regularly exposed to the Japanese media and don't know how far it's gone.

r111 What kind of anecdotes?

[R113], really just the two I mentioned. One describes the relationship Shoma had with his aunt's friend. She was a comforting presence in his life. They played card games together, she had a dog that barked at Itsuki but not at Shoma. When she was hospitalized with terminal cancer, she tried to protect Shoma from seeing her in her weakened state. Shoma wanted to put his silver medal from the Youth Olympic Games in her casket. His exhibition number "See You Again" is performed in memory of her.

The second anecdote describes his anguish at not being allowed to practice when he was injured as a junior. Itsuki and mom were in tears at his frustration. He finally found a doctor who allowed him ten minutes of ice time a day, which saved him.

Neither of these stories sounded exaggerated to me, but I'm very fond of Shoma.

[R112], hormone doping and the occult? If you don't mind repeating such insanity, can you explain?

I haven't heard about the dopping either. The occult thing, I'm guessing is especulation about his many rituals?

R116 I've seen the hormone doping thing - it was even a quora question at some point, worded to make it sound like fact. Something to the effect: "Why is Hanyu still allowed to compete after he failed doping tests." People are crazy assholes.

R112

[quote]Orser's book was written before the Olympics and while he thought Hanyu would be retiring if he got his second OGM. Hanyu wasn't involved and it's more propaganda for Orser.

That's interesting. I've always wondered how much involvement Hanyu had with Orser's book and whether it was to promote Hanyu as well as Orser. I also wondered whether the tone of the new book is a more affectionate and sentimental towards Hanyu because of his second OGM and whether Orser would be as keen on him if he hadn't won. From the bits that I've read, it seems Orser appreciated and was a little surprised that Hanyu cared enough to think about him when his father died and that this was a big step in their relationship. However, it's hard to figure out the whole arc of their relationship when you're only reading selected excerpts. They have been considerably warmer towards each other at comps though.

R93 Thanks for summarizing that article about Marin. I hate to say this because I have tremendous admiration for her skating skills, but I'm not optimistic for her. She moved to Raf to work on her jumps, as if he has some magic solution, but the things he's saying about her now - that she needs to practice, work harder and be more focused - are the same things her old coach was saying, albeit slightly less diplomatically. Raf said it will take 2 years to straighten her out and he's not even planning for her to take on the 3A b/c she's too old. But in two years, there will be quads and 3As, so even if all goes as plan and she improves, will she even have a chance?

R115

Doping: Besides R117's example I've seen people claim he fakes asthma so he can use the medication (or pretend to, while taking something else) to dope.

Occult: El Pais (Spanish newspaper) said the other skaters were nervous of the mysterious, isolated "ghost" Hanyu's "spiritual advisor" Kikuchi, thinking he was Hanyu's personal witch who used mind powers on the other skaters to make them fall. Probably there are a lot of other stupid occult rumors on Japanese Twitter. I can see the crazies grabbing the Abe no Seimei connection and running with it.

Thanks, [R119]! I'm afraid to even ask about the secret abortions. I know there's a lot of crazy going around in this fandom, but I'm shocked it's even made its way into a Spanish newspaper....

Raf is the right coach for Honda. She needs to fix her jumps and Raf is one of the best jump coaches. But I'm not too optimistic about her. Her struggle aren't simply because of laziness. Puberty plays a big part in her struggle with jumps. She is much taller than she was just fews months ago. If Raf can fix her technique to which her new body can adapt, she will be ok, she won't rise on top again though. I think Raf has done a fine job with her given that she even couldn't jump a triple back to March.

But hormone doping? Why hormone?

R122 I think people are talking about HGH (human growth hormone).

R121 Will "okay" be enough for her sponsors not to dump her though, given the wealth of other options in Japan? I frankly don't see her making podium at major competitions.

We believe Marin can make the podium in our major competition.

Well, when we will be back.

R124 I don't see either. But if Raf handles her well, she can make it to top 5 top 6 Japanese ladies, get 2 GPs and not fall into a disastrous road like Rika Hongo.

Who needs to win when you can just be fabulous?

Who needs to win or be fabulous when you can be a doctor?

Who needs to win when you can just have nepotism?

r123 But why HGH? what's the basis of this rumor? Hanyu's hardly muscular or has significant stamina, or exhibits great recovery time.

R130 That's like asking for a logical reason for insanity. There is no reason, that's why these people are insane.

'Hanyu's personal witch who used mind powers on the other skaters to make them fall.' Shit that's hilarious lol

British National Championships ended today

Men:1) Graham Newberry 200.55

(3 skaters overall. Phil Harris didn't compete)

Ladies: 1) Natasha McKay 151.87 (the runner up scored 150.99)

(10 skaters competed)

Pairs: 1) Zoe Jones/ Christopher Boyadji

(only one pair present)

Dance: 1) Lilah Fear/Lewis Gibson 181.89 2) Robynne Tweedale/Joseph Buckland 168.04

(3 couples present)

Great Britain have 2 Dance spots at Euros. 1 spot in Single and Pairs.

Anyone see the sns meltdown recently over the fact that Scott Moir brought a date to an award function? This is literally the first tweet I saw when I typed in Scott's name. For context, the alleged gf's name is Jackie and she lives in Florida.

From twitter....that's how the British Championships ended...

#BritishChampionships 🇬🇧❄ End of Ladies presentation @NatashaaMckay dropped the base of the 🏆 onto the red carpet, Chairman of @BritishIceSkate Rob Jones, presenting the medals, tried to help her pick it up, then fell over with legs in the air! 😮

r134 So the fanfics are not coming true? Well, that's a surprise.

R135 If only they'd used plastic pentagons!

r134 Isn't it normal to bring a date to an award function? Is the uproar just because he's a figure skater and she's female? I never got any gay vibes from Moir - that would actually make him mildly interesting.

R137 we are rich. We can afford 2 big cups + a medal!

R138 nah the uproar comes from the virtue/moir shippers. They dreams were crushed and they're all unstaning.

r128 I think the uproar was because the gf was not Tessa Virtue.

R138 because she is not Tessa! They must be in love! All the passion they show on ice is real! They are so hot with each other. They must date and get married!!!

R135 r139 lmao I love these reports on the D-list competitions (and yes, right now British Championships are D-list competitions). Why so many trophies? Does each one represent a separate category, like swimsuit, talent, public speaking etc?

r140 r141 r142 Ah. Shows how much I follow ice dance that this went right over my head.

I haven't seen a lot of their skating, but I never felt this amazing chemistry between them when I did watch. I'm bewildered by people who think their Moulin Rouge was so hot. Ice dance in general is so bland compared to pre-IJS

144 I agree about the negative comparison with the old system although until this season I've always been able to find a few enjoyable programs. I would have liked Moulin Rouge if the vocals hadn't been so horrible and Tessa's hadn't been wearing an ugly dress.

R115 Last year, a Jitsuwa Knuckles article claimed he’s been addicted to (isu-approved) tranquilizers and stimulants for years, and started injecting himself with estrogen to maintain his lithe body. It also claimed he didn’t withdraw from CoC after the collision with Han Yan because he was high on stimulants, and that Orser not only approved of his drug-use, but was the one responsible for it. (Jitsuwa Knuckles is even lower than a tabloid, but for a while the foreign press thought they were a legitimate news source despite the content of their articles, e.g. stories about underground cannibal cafés).

Since Sochi, beginning with Josei Seven, many tabloids have accused Hanyu’s physical therapist Kikuchi of brainwashing Hanyu with occultish ideas to turn him against his coach and forgo proper medical treatment, and insinuated he OKed the skater to compete in the FS after the CoC collision instead of an actual doctor. Kikuchi was ranting about the harassment those articles sparked during a lecture he gave over the summer. (Browse through the old threads (try looking up “Kikuchi” in DL) for more.)

Those are just a few of the stories that have been published.

^^^ Woooow that's amazing. Thank you for elaborating.

For the life of me, I will never be able to understand why Hanyu provokes such intense and ridiculous hatred, especially from his own countrymen (the usual explanations - Mao/Dai/Political Factions don't cut it for me b/c I don't understand that kind of fanaticism). I watch a lot of sports and Hanyu is one of the most decent, straightforward top athletes I've ever encountered. It took me a few years to warm up to his skating, but even before that, I never saw anything remotely objectionable about him as a person.

R146 Wow. If estrogen allows you to keep your lithe, girlish figure then Eteri should be accelerating rather than delaying the onset of puberty for her girls. She's being doing it all wrong!!!

R148. I don't get it either. Especially from other Japanese. You would think they would be proud of this young man winning two gold medals for Japan. Hanyu has no scandals and again that should make them proud. But no they would rather make shit up and try to hurt him.

R134 So Jackie is his official gf ? Lolll I love it. I'm tired of ST shippers who get brainwashed and believe they are in love and already get married.

Virtue/Moir shippers really are a special brand of crazy.

Is the rumor now that Jackie is still married? This couldn't have happened to a more deserving pair, so glad the coy games are coming back to bite them in the ass.

[quote] lmao I love these reports on the D-list competitions (

one of the best failures is still when the Kiss and Cry bench collapsed at Coupe of Printemps 2018. Actually it was even better because just before he sat down, the skater exclaimed "shit!" and then everything went down

r148 I think it's only a tiny fraction that hate him, he seems well loved and supported otherwise. Anybody at that level of fame and success would get haters, just because they are successful and famous and well-loved by others. Just think Justin Bieber. Tabloids will do anything for clicks, including inventing stories, the more outlandish the better.

I think the percentage of people who love Bieber is 50%, the other 50% is people who hate him.

R143, the skater who wins the short programme also gets a trophy at British nationals, so Graham gets two.

r156 Lol, yeah, that's what he gets for being so super-famous. But the majority of those 50% hating him do so because he's "overhyped" and nothing else. A lot of people are contrary and will hate on somebody just because they're liked by others. Gold medals are as objective measurements of talent and success as they come, so I guess some people have to invent reasons for their hate.

R157 Thanks! Instead of the small medal, they have the small trophy! So I guess one for winning SP, one for winning FS, one for winning everything.

National Championships season calendar

France: 13-15 December

Italy: 13-15 December

Sweden: 13-16 December

Austria: 13-16 December

Four Nations it is Poland, Hungary, Czech and Slovakia rolled together): 13-15 December

Spain: 14-16 December

Finland: 15-16 December

Switzerland: 15-16 December

Russia: 19-23 December

Japan: 20-24 December

Germany: 22-23 December

Canada: 13-20 January

USA: 19–27 January

1-7 December: Australian Championships

When we will see Argentina or Mexico in there. I crave some Latin American ass. I mean talent.

Donovan Carrillo from Mexico is a fun skater, but I don't know if he will be able to get a stable 3A or quad as long as he stays there to train.

So who is going to the Grand Prix Final?

R163 Yes! I really dig Donovan. He has charm and looks fabulous on the ice. I hope he will be around for much longer.

watching NBC version of IdF. Commentators re-writing history again - according to them, the only time Nathan's ever finished off the podium was at 2016 Trophee de France. I'll give the benefit of the doubt and assume Terry meant on the Grand Prix, though that doesn't really seem worth noting.

R164 I AM!!!!

Lol yes Keegan posts on DL. Ok but really..

R166 LMAO but it was such a big deal when Chen didn't make the Worlds 2017 and Olympics podium. I guess two of the most important competitions in figure skating is forgettable.

But commentators and announcers have gotten the details wrong about who won which worlds between Javi and Hanyu from 2014-2016 so can't blame them.

I have some real gossip today but can't access details until later tonight. It was discovered yesterday that Kozuka and his wife have been living separately and likely getting a divorce for "many" reasons. If you remember, they were playing the happy couple on TV last July (not long after Kozuka's interesting comment about Hanyu's performance at the Olympics) where they invited a TV crew into their home when molestor dad was also visiting.

R170 Wow! That is a surprise. I remember your saying that they waited a long time to get married because Kozuka's father disapproved. Kozuka's a shit, but they just had a baby, so that kinda sucks. Between Kozuka and Akiko and maybe Mura (didn't someone say he was saying sad things on insta?), team JPN is not doing well on the domestic front. Are Arakawa and Oda the only ones with stable marriages?

I know Medvedeva is a two time world champion and beloved star and all, but sometimes I wonder why the entire Russian skating community (including former Olys champions) is so fixated on her. Like I get it, you wished she had won gold, Zagitova is a nobody and it's sad. But just what exactly prompts all these big names to retell the tragedy of Pyeongchang? Is Medvedeva that charismatic and won them over? I've read some Zagitova's fans' theories, and they say it's because Eteri is not particularly liked, and these people go about it by elevating Medvedeva while taking shots at Zagitova, but really?

R172 Are you talking about Trankov or did someone else come forward recently?

R173 I'm talking in general, but the most recent one is Olympic champion ice dancer Bestemianova. She gave back to back interviews discussing the Zagitova and Medevedeva drama just a couple of days before Zagitova's GPF, and some of the things she says are just plain weird.

Kozuka has released a statement confirming reports that he and his wife aren’t living together anymore. He said he can’t give further details as they’re still trying to work things out. Interestingly, his wife announced yesterday that she’d signed with Stardust Promotions and will be working hard in a new environment while raising her child.

The friend quoted in the article that broke news of the separation suggested the couple was just too busy and never saw much of each other. However, their daughter was born just last year, they were recently promoting their marriage on television, and Kozuka’s wife quit her high-profile newscaster job with Fuji TV last year so the family could move from Tokyo to the skater’s hometown of Nagoya. The friend also implied that Kozuka was trying to reconcile with his wife, as if she’s the one who wants the divorce.

There have been rumors and alleged sightings of Kozuka visiting hostess clubs and flirting with (fondling) other women for at least 7 years. (Kozuka’s father also had a reputation for frequenting hostess bars.) Oddly, these rumors did not originate from skating forums, and started long before his relationship with his wife was known, before he became well-known outside the skating world. There have been tweets and possibly photos by other club regulars and hostesses over the years.

Last week on a popular woman’s message board, someone reported seeing Kozuka feeling up some woman’s chest at one of the Aichi islands and took a photo that they were thinking of selling to Bunshun. Another person said they saw Kozuka at a club in Nagoya trying to convince a woman to go back to his hotel with him.

R171 I haven’ seen anything about Mura recently.

[quote]I know Medvedeva is a two time world champion and beloved star and all, but sometimes I wonder why the entire Russian skating community (including former Olys champions) is so fixated on her.

You mean just like this board? People love a rivalry, it's that simple. And frankly, Alina is boring...even her dog is boring to me. Nice girl, yes, talented, but there is nothing else to talk about with her.

I would never have guessed Kozuka was such a cad. He always seemed asexual to me.

Sometimes it's the inconspicuous with a hidden ego that are the most dangerous.

Mura seems like a good guy that isn't camp focused, like Oda. Don't want to be wrong about him.

R176 I love Zagitova's dog, it looked so fluffy lol. I think the dog is quite popular in Japan (and Russia too?) because I have seen news/ articles about it. They sell Masaru mascots in competitions where Zag competes and her fans also make banners with Masaru fanarts and photos. It was kind of similar to Yuzuru and Pooh, everytime you see Masaru you will think of her and I think it's interesting. Maybe many don't feel like that, many people don't find Yuzuru and his pooh tissue box interesting or special either.

Alina seems nice, hard working, and classy, which I guess bores people who'd rather latch on to all of Med's drama.

R178 Honestly Masaru makes Zags much more interesting and approachableble. It's not any different from Itsuki being the appendage to Shoma. Both gives the skater more PR and a nicer media image, but Zags wins on this one. Of course, that the brothers genuinely care about eachother and Zags' connection to Masaru is what make it work.

On the other end, the North American media and interviewers continue to be fascinated and stuck on Hanyu's Pooh, or the Pooh rain by his fans. During the Olympics was the most annoying. Funny side effect is that antis and some people think Hanyu doesn't even like Pooh or only use it as PR to improve his image.

R180 I'm clearly not an anti and I don't think he hates it (his very own pooh bear obviously means a lot to him). However I definitely believe that he is getting tired with the dumb media questions about it. I think he also wouldn't mind if fans started to throw something else.

When did Yuzuru get the Pooh. He didn't have it in his junior years and neither at the beginning of his senior years

R181 He is tired of the questions. Watch his face every time someone asks him yet another Pooh question. Probably he wishes the media would ask smarter and relevant questions during a press conference that follows a competition.

I do think he genuinely likes Pooh too, so it's just another conspiracy theory by antis to assassinate his character. However, about the stuffed toys on the ice, no matter what fans throw everyone knows he can't take home everything from every competition so it might not bother him. It'd be different for lesser known skaters with one or two gifts that can take everything and doesn't have to donate. The real gifts to Hanyu are the fan letters and extra stuff latched on to the Poohs or thrown separately (yes, those exists too) and those he can take home easily in a smaller bag.

I don't know if it's conscious or not, but the great unwashed masses need a "hook" - especially with a sort of dying sport like figure skating, and that shower of Pooh bears after his skating, and the crying fans travelling the globe following him, is just the sort of hook that the best PR pros probably envy the cleverness of. Like a symbol of his "rock star" status as Kurt Browning mentions nearly every time he comments on a Yuzu skate. He probably know this sport needs some pizzazz, even if kitsch - I mean figure skating is a whole lot of kitsch anyhow. And aimed mainly at female fans because homophobia I guess...

Anyway, I was reading over my notes because I'm just that ocd, and in an interview, in Japanese, right after his injured free skate at Rostelecom, Yuzu said, "Figure skating is a sport whereby even if you recover from injury and the injury heals. it doesn't necessarily mean that you can skate as well as you could prior to the injury. So after all, I need to give some thoughts overall about my skating."

I wonder if that means, at least at that moment in time, he was wondering if it was time to retire? He also said this year that it wasn't worth competing if he couldn't win - if his quad loop has gone the way of his quad lutz, I don't know if he'd risk competing with a 3-quad program against Chen and Uno, like at Worlds at March. I think he shouldn't let that bother him - with high GOE, he would stand a fair chance of beating them, especially if there are any problems with their skates (which is more likely if he's there because he rattles everybody with all the hype and focus on him etc.)

Anyway, here's the link, if any Japanese speakers want to see if what he actually said implies what I thought it did (the part about needing to give some thoughts...)

R181 His fans won't throw something else until he ditches all of his Pooh towels that he brings to competitions.

Yuzuru has a Pooh box in his first senior year. His present Pooh tissue box emerged in the season of 2011-2012 and has accompanied him everywhere since then, apart from the two Olympics.

R182 I don't know if this sheds light or not - but I read about Takeshi Honda and found an old youtube - and lo and behold, when they show him in the K&C, he's hugging a great big Winnie the Pooh. And I though A HA! I bet young Yuzu saw that video too.

R184 I took it as he might have to approach with a different strategy. He is used to pushing himself on components and technically, but after the latest injury he may just dump or compromise his ideal skate and go with Brian's strategy a la Javi's layout with 3 quads. He didn't succumb at first, pushing for the quad loop in 2016-2017, but seems like even though he was right about it short term in the season which exploded at Worlds 2017, in the long term Brian's strategy seems to be the more reasonable one. Don't forget, his 3 quad program held the WR for a long time and will still do historically for combined. I think if Hanyu focuses on getting more 10's in PCS and +5 GOEs (it won't ever be unanimous across the board because USfed) he can and should still beat Chen and Uno this season.

I agree with you R188 but I think there's a macho "personal honor" kind of thing going on - I worry that Yuzu might feel like a wimp is he waters down his program, and he wouldn't feel like he was deserving if the other guys were doing 4+ quads - I mean I think that's the wrong way to look at it, but otoh, he's done what he set out to do, and then some, so why end on a compromised note? (not to mention ANY further competing endangers his future plans for ice shows because I'm sure he'd want to put out the best EXes he could for the fans).

This honor thing came up with Boyang's recent disturbing interview where he said he didn't feel like talking to anyone since going to Canada:

Q: Many athletes and coaching teams have attempted new approaches towards competition, like watering down their technical elements to improve consistency. Have you ever thought about it?

Boyang: (shaking head): No, it is impossible for me. I just believe this is men's singles, and we should push the limits. I wouldn't be Boyang if I watered down the technical plan.

Q: Has your coach discussed it with you?

Boyang: Well... The key point is that we lost the competitive spirit if we gave us quads for triples and doubles, especially when ladies are now jumping triple Axels and quads. We're men's skating. It's not an issue for discussion. Men's skating is just men's skating. If we all gave up difficult jumps, the competition would lose the excitement.

R184 Surely, there were doubts in his mind. It's time his fans should worry about his retirement. I understand the feeling that you find a "little" motivation to continue but there are many obstacles which much bigger than your motivation. Physical wise, the older you are, the easier it gets to injury yourself and the longer it takes to recover from injury. Mentality-wise, not that I doubt him or his motivation but no matter how strong he is, how motivated he is, he is human, he should be scared and tired of injury, rehab, practice, re injury, rehab, practice.... routine. As long as he aims to win, he will continue to be under enormous pressure and have to push himself physically and mentally. Otherwise, he has to accept getting surpassed and consider losing as a normal thing.

About the Pooh-Bears: he may be tired of the questions but I don't think fans will let it go or even should let it go. Anybody can get "something else", and they do. Only Yuzu gets poohs, by now a pooh is a symbol associated with being a Hanyu fan. It's like wearing a band t-shirt to a concert or a hat in national colors to a soccer game. It's the way of fans to say "I'm here for you" in a shorthand. And lets be real, a 1000 yellow poohs look cooler on the ice than a 1000 various toys and it might actually play a part in the tradition.

r184 is right, non-fans need a gimmick. During the Olympics it was a popular story, but it's not like it replaced anything more substantial, like the outlets would actually talk about the merits of figure skating if there were no poohs.

I like the Pooh rain. He knows its for him. It's also just something fans do for him and attests to his status. Plus it gets me everytime when the muggles are shocked. Hanyu isn't the first and won't be the last star in figure skating, but in history this euphoria will probably add an interesting footnote in his legacy.

R190 Fans already started worrying about his retirement before Pyeongchang. He did say he might consider retiring after PC in a past interview, so honestly Fanyus are just glad he's doing this season and hope for more but will understand if he retires. I think age is a factor, but his recurring physical injuries from his youth and as a young adult holds him back the most. At 25-26 Javi who has practiced and landed the 4lo (just not in competition) has a battered body like most skaters but probably isn't as broken as Hanyu. Maybe it's the way they train and maybe it's also luck and how they fall. Hanyu is an interesting case because he's a 2x OGM at 23 while Javi continued past that age to 26 as well as the multiple uncles who made it to GPF this season.

Hanyu hates losing, but I don't think he'll ever accept getting surpassed unless it's fair, as in he deteriorates to the point that his competitors actually jump better and skate more complex programs with quality instead depending on judges to prop them. I mean, he acknowledges Boyang's 4lz so he seems pretty smart and also self aware of his shortcomings.

R175 That's an inconvenient scandal for Kozuka, given his family history. I wonder if it was the threat of tangible evidence that caused the wife to jump ship, especially if this has been going on for many years.

Whatever happened with the woman who sued Kozuka's father for molesting her?

R184 The Olympic channel has made so many significant translation errors that it's become clear that they're not using a native speaker transcribe Hanyu's quotes, their translator doesn't understand Japanese well enough for professional translation, and they don't have a checker. Also, Hanyu gave more in-depth answers in Japanese at that press conference that the English-language press chose to ignore.

When Hanyu said he had a "choice," he meant he was told he had a choice between performing the FS at Russia and skip the GPF and nationals, or withdraw from Russia and do nationals. He chose Russia , not only because of his Russia connection but because he had been training so much to that point. I don't have the actual quote on me now, but I remember the part in question being more like, after an injury heals, you still need to train to get back to the level you were at prior to injury, so he has to think about that when considering whether or not he can participate in nationals. He might be healed by then but that's not enough. He also said angrily, "I'm not retiring!"

R193 The settlement could be sealed, but it's unclear whether or not it's even over. Someone did a good job of hiding the lawsuit and preventing the mainstream press from reporting on it right away.

Speaking of Alina's seeming lack of drama, here's a translation of some of Bestemianova's remarks re: Alina. The references to her "whims" and failure to train enough in the summer makes me wonder if she is more interesting than we thought. I think there's a kernel of truth in what Bestemianova is saying - that Eteri and Daniil are continuing to paying especial attention Alina b/c of the situation with Med.

“A: Alina Zagitova now trains less as well. Eteri Tutberidze gets it all. I think had Zhenya not left her, Zagitova wouldn’t have been that good. They bear with Alina because they want revenge on Zhenya.

Q: They bear with her? What do you mean?

A: I mean Zagitova didn’t train in the summer to the extent Eteri prefers. Thus Alina was able to save her health. I cannot be 100% sure, but it seems to me, had Medvedeva not left, Tutberidze wouldn’t have spent her nervous energy and bear with Alina’s probably existing whims. Eteri would have turned the other way and started working with young girls.

Q: So, you can say Tutberidze became softer.

A: It was obvious Zhenya left because of the amount of training she could have no longer endured at her age. That’s why Tutberidze and her team became more patient. They probably realized they cannot finish their athletes at the age of 16, and started thinking how they can save them. Zhenya is not the first one who left this group.”

I come to places like dl to avoid seeing things like 'macho' and Yuzu employed in the same sentence but alas seems even here I can't escape. Personally I don't think it's about honour or being perceived as strong but about the quad axel and more long term plans. Yuzu has repeated times and again since Pyeongchang (and even before) that his goal is to jump it. However it's such a dangerous jump that just training it puts him at greater risk of injury and he can't focus on his programs enough hence why he momentarily dropped it. However getting once again injured on a jump which he had in his arsenal before NHK last year probably got him thinking about how he is going to approach things and what is realistic/feasible given his now likely permanent injury. Maybe he might consider some ligament reconstruction surgery at some point. Who knows.

R196 I think the 4A definitely complicates Hanyu's usual approach to competition. I don't see Hanyu as the kind of skater who would be happy with his high PCS carrying the day when other people's programs are significantly more difficult (like Chan), so in that respect, I don't see him dropping 4 quads, especially when he's no longer jumping 4lz. On the other hand, if he wants to land the 4A and doesn't feel he has the luxury of time given his mounting injuries, that might be the temporary compromise he has to make. As Hanyu gets older, maybe the more strategic, methodical side of him will take over from the impetuous, careless side.

R194 Thank you. I'm getting sick of the Olympic Channel's click baity, uninformative segments on Hanyu. The errors in translation piss me off because western coverage of Hanyu is so shallow and uninformed and this does not help. Seemingly innocuous mistranslations "I make people do things for me" or how his injury affects him lead to misunderstandings that are reiterated a gazillion times all over the internet.

Jean-François Ballester, Savchenko/Massot's coach died suddenly of a heart attack.

r198 Were they planning on coming back?

R199 Savchenko threw out the possibility at some point. I don't know how serious she was about it.

Thank you JDC at R194. That's fascinating that he said angrily that he wasn't retiring, when the English translation could be construed to mean that's exactly what he was thinking about - at least that's how I took it.

And can they do ankle ligament reconstruction? I hope so!! Not that I'm desperate to see Yuzuru keep competing - I just worry about him in the long run - so maybe there's a way to have a more painfree life post-skating than I envisioned, but I have a jaded outlook because I danced a lot for 30 years or so - at the level of teaching aerobic dance or zumba - and my right ankle is permanently swollen and has arthritis because of repeated sprains, so I've been imagining that his would be much worse than mine... Hey I might look into that reconstruction surgery myself!

RIP Ballester

He was in Tallin last week with Ziegler/Kiefer. He died yesterday

The R word must be quite upsetting for Yuzu if he showed anger in public. That's so uncharacteristic of him. I wonder how his family feels about him continuing to compete. If he were my kid, I would not be at all happy about it.

R203 He probably said it out of frustration, perhaps at himself and at the media. It's either, Are you going to Beijing? Or, Are you going to retire? He wants to live and compete in the present and it must be so discouraging when the big question keeps on weighing him down because of age and injuries. It's on everyone else's mind and keeps pressing him. In a way, it's also a kind of pressure. His family throws immense support behind him so he can focus on his dreams. They also allow him to make a lot of his own decisions. They probably keep any misgivings to themselves.

The mysterious witch Kikuchi-san is coming out with a book. Hopefully it's as enlightening as Itsuki's tell-all. He should have some good sob stories.

Lmao. Reminds me of my old high school pictures. Both embarrasing and endearing. Also, I see you stretching your arm as much as possible so that you can touch Javi number 2, Yuzu. Holding main Javi close wasn't enough it seems.

More on Kozuka:

He’s no longer a full-time employee at Toyota as of last year despite the wife quitting her much better paying position at Fuji so the family could relocate to Nagoya for him. It’s common for non-figure skating athletes to work at the company that sponsored them, but it was expected that Kozuka would become a pro-skater and coach when he retired. He purportedly took the regular employee position at Toyota before consulting his family.

In January, he announced he would try his hand at race car driving. He entered the TOYOTA GAZOO Racing 86/BRZ Race in late-July but lost in the preliminaries.

According to the recent TV reenactment (where Kozuka played himself) of the development of “Kozuka Blades,” it appears the skater didn’t even come up with the idea of making the blades. A Nagoya high-precision metal manufacturer (Yamaichi Hagane) approached him to use his name and feet to model the blades because he was the top skater in the region and from a famous skating family. They wanted to promote the Made in Nagoya aspect of their product.

At a lecture five years ago, Kumiko Sato, who was coaching and choreographing for Kozuka, said that the skater plays around too much (outside figure skating) and did not elaborate.

Four years ago, an actor admitted on television to going to a Ginza hostess club with Kozuka.

Two years ago, a man tweeted that Kozuka had hit on his girlfriend. While Kozuka’s wife was pregnant, someone tweeted that Kozuka had hit on them. More hostesses are claiming he visited their clubs and is very clingy.

Interesting that none of this was ever picked up by the media.

And the photo of Kozuka fondling some woman at one of the Aichi islands was posted on the popular woman’s forum, but immediately removed by mods.

On the bright side, he’s more famous than he’s ever been.

R198 That's very sad. He's still young.

R203 He said it without prompting or being asked.

R206 that looks like a lot of fun.

I didn't know Jean-Francois's name, but he was always entertaining in the kiss and cry. Damn, he looked about 10 years younger than his actual age, and apparently he has a toddler. Two sudden tragic deaths in skating in less than a year is pretty awful, and it seems like Aliona & Bruno were close to both of them.

R207 Well, I guess we should commend Kozuka for doing mid-life crisis in high style: hookers, fast cars, adultery, unwanted groping, a career in shambles. I'm a little greedy and will be impatiently waiting for further reports on transexual hookers, blow, and an out of wedlock child with Miki Ando, but this is a nice start.

So I guess I'd better download all the Hanyu backcounter-3A gifs from Tumblr before they take all the porn down.

I have a fear that if Hanyu ever comes out he will still be boring as hell and no juicy scandals for us. He will just stay at home with his boyfriend. No prostitutes or adultery for him.

But Hanyu nation will be shook.

Don't know if this is definitive or anything - but Dave Lease said that Gogolev's family was mad about Brian's attention being less focused on him, since Med I guess, and he left for Lee Barkell. Someone here said he was still considered Brian's student, but the ISU listing has Brian as "former coach" and Lee as his regular coach.

Considering how much PR Brian has given Gogo, I have to say I'm shocked. Unless the listing doesn't mean anything - but I 'think' it means that's how Gogolev wants it listed.

Yuzuru's coach listing now reads "Brian Orser, Tracy Wilson, Ghislain Briand" - so Gogo could have left Brian in, and I think Ghislain wasn't always included on Yuzu's.

A day after the big news about Kozuka, weekly tabloid Jitsuwa published a short and hastily written online article about Hanyu being a narcissist for competing in Rostelecom while injured. Curiously, Jitsuwa did not report on Kozuka, a top story that most tabloid and non-tabloid news covered over the past three days.

Also yesterday, Friday Digital posted an online story about Hanyu’s Rostelecom injury, providing no new information. They also skipped the Kozuka story yet wrote about another athlete’s divorce.

Today, two other tabloids, Flash and Josei Jishin, have come out with similar articles about Hanyu while keeping silent about the actual figure skating scandal. If you were wondering, a 3-week old nonstory about Hanyu will not garner more attention than a fresh story about Kozuka’s high-profile separation from his famous wife.

R214 The bottom of Gogolev's bio says it was updated December 3rd. You might be on to something.

From a Gogolev fan blog:

"One thing to note: Brian Orser is no longer one of Stephen’s coaches. His ISU biography also has Brian listed as a former coach. This biography was updated today. As of November 24 Brian was still listed as a coach. The change likely happened shortly after JGP Canada. Stephen is still training at the Cricket Club. He’s just soley under Coach Lee Barkell’s care now. I hope this is the best decision for his future, and that there are no hard feelings.""

If the Gogo's think this is bad, imagine how much worse it would have been with Boyang at TCC, with the Beijing Olympics coming up and Brian eyeing that fourth gold medal! (I think even he knows that Med's very far from a sure thing for gold in 2020 - though I imagine his dreams have a Korean flavor yet again)

R211 LOL I was wondering how you would survive.

R214 That's very interesting! I didn't take much stock in the rumor before because I didn't think Brian was Gogo's main coach to begin with, but if it was updated recently as JDC pointed out, then there might be some truth to it. It seems kind of strange to do that after one bad competition. But of course, we don't know how divided Brian's attention has been.

R215 Is Kozuka's family that powerful or is he represented by a powerful management company or something else? Did the story get out through online forums and then got squashed by mainstream media? Or did someone actually publish it?

R215 Sorry I totally missed the first paragraph of your post. So it was covered by most outlets. Kozuka and his family are so damn shady.

R215 It's upsetting how much they attack Hanyu for simply existing. He keeps to himself and on the downlow, so isn't that enough? His home country that he loves so much attacks him the most, sadly.

I wonder why they would even bother since Hanyu isn't even at GPF and doesnt need the "any publicity is good publicity" stunt.

He's probably the easiest target because he doesn't have an agency to buy people off or bribe people to hide scandals, and simultaneously allow others to use his image for cash grabs.

R218 Kozuka has the Toyota connection, but there's also the Fuji TV connection, and he's called on TV to promote/represent Uno and Takahashi who are both part of USM. His dad being a coach and his family being founders of skating in Aichi makes him important to JSF. The criminal investigation into the dad was somehow hidden for a year, until the victim also filed a civil suit.

Curiouser, "new blogs" (the ones that publish paid articles like the Rivaland ones about Hanyu and Mao using Medvedeva's diarrhea drinks) have been saying that Kozuka was a pure innocent guy when he met his wife who seduced him, so he couldn't have cheated on her.

R220 I guess I wasn't clear enough. The few tabloids that chose to write an old story about Hanyu are the same ones that ignored the Kozuka news which was/is a top story even among mainstream news. Your question about "why bother" is there.

R221 Kozuka's seriously running with the "actually, my wife's the whore" angle? This guy is a bigger turd than I thought. I'm curious, who broke this story? The chronological account you gave in r207 - is that what you've heard through the years, or are the articles now recounting all the rumors/accusations that have cropped up over the years? Thank you!

r221 I find it mindboggling that cheating and divorce of an ex-skater - not even a top one - who was doing some commentary/presenting garnered a 3-day mainstream media attention and that a skating family name is known well enough to the mainstream public to warrant it.

Brian was always Gogolev's main coach. Something was definitely up at that last JGP event where the kid bombed--after the scores came up, Orser said something like "well I just don't know." It was very odd--I don't recall ever seeing him act like that in the K&C. From what he's said in interviews I don't think he has much patience for young skaters who aren't driven or much tolerance for interfering parents.

I do wonder how long Gogolev can continue to skate at TCC. Adam Rippon tried that after he broke up with Brian--he wanted to work with Ghislain--but it apparently became too uncomfortable for everyone there.

r224 I always got the opposite impression, that Lee Berkel was the main coach. I recall Orser mentioning Gogo a few years ago as "we have a talented 10-yo who can jump quads blah blah blah" but he never said Gogo was his student. I think Orser was supposed to take over once Gogo hit juniors, and he partially seemed to have, sitting with Gogo in K&C and everything. If it's indeed the lack of enough attention from Orser that affected his performance, then maybe sticking with Lee Berkel is the way to go. Gogo's been with TCC for many years, he knows the coaches, coaches know him, it's not the same as with Adam Rippon.

Orser seems to have a decent track with juniors, he took a 14-yo Nam and a 14-yo Cha, though it took the promised year-and-a-half to start turning in results. Gogo doesn't fit the pattern because he's been with the TCC since forever, but he's also a bit younger, so maybe he really just needs more attention than Orser can give him with Yuzu, Junhwan and Evgenia on his hands. (Btw, isn't it bizarre that it's Junhwan who Orser's going to the GPF with?)

Previously, Orser was listed along with Lee Barkell as Gogo's coach. It seems pointed to now drop Orser altogether and list him as a "former" coach. Isn't TCC always touting the team teaching approach? Gogo could have easily shifted to working with Barkell without making things so official, since Brian is high profile and pretty good with the PR aspect even if he doesn't have time to pay as much attention to the day to day. I want to know what went down!! I hope Gogo/his 'rents are total drama queens so we can look forward to at least 8 years of Canadian/Russian bitchery and theatrics.

R226 Yes, it seems very "pointed" to me too. There is no way Brian would stop being that kid's coach (after all those years of bragging about him) unless something significant happened--this was Brian's chance to finally be the coach of a CANADIAN OGM winner.

In thinking about it some more, I wonder if Brian's relationship with Cha was the issue for Gogolev's parents.

Great Britain for European Championships

Ladies – Natasha MCKAY (reserve Karly ROBERTSON)

Men – Graham NEWBERRY (reserve P-J Hallam)

Pairs – Zoe JONES and Chris BOYADJI

Ice Dance – Lilah FEAR and Lewis GIBSON + Robynne TWEEDALE and Joe BUCKLAND

R227 The Canadian OGM thing is big and Brian was always really proud of having this prodigy. Your theory re Cha is interesting because Cha is likely the one who will be one of Gogo's rivals this quad going into Beijing. But are people actually betting on 2022 for Gogo? He will be a very young 18 then, a little too young I think for a men's champ.

I actually think Gogo's skating would be much better if he were more of a bitch and an attention whore, but he seems too shy and unassuming for his own good.

R230 I think it's very likely that the kid's parents want him to win that OGM in 2022.

They’ve done it again. The international Hanyu fans hung a birthday poster at Hanyu’s old bus stop. They were heavily criticized the last time they did it and believed to be one of the reasons why Hanyu stopped taking the bus to TCC.

R222 I think Sponichi Annex was the first to release the story, but the wife announced she was joining Stardust Productions the day before, so either that prompted some sleuthing or her team leaked the separation. No one major is reporting on Kozuka’s habits yet, but more coverage is expected as the divorce is supposed to happen by the end of this year. The chronological order I gave is something I compiled myself though there’s probably a lot more.

R223 Kozuka married up. The wife is the famous one. The Kozuka name is only important to the JSF and Nagoya. The couple was on a very popular television show this year to show off their great marriage and home, and Kozuka was on a big TV special just last week, so it’s a story with potential. It’s not like they were the only story of the day, but one of the top celebrity and sports stories following a similar shocking end of a retired athlete-celebrity marriage.

Cha has been with Orser for over 3 years and I think Gogolev’s parents would be familiar with Orser’s skating partner/rival method.

R232 Yuzu shouldn't have been taking the bus in the first place.

As for Cha, he's starting to break through now and Orser seems to find him delightful. I can see where that could cause tension in his relationship with the boy wonder's parents. Dave Lease needs to sniff out the truth for us! lol

R232 If Kozuka married up, then why was his father so dead set against the marriage (sorry, don't expect you to be a mind reader, just curious whether it's something that's known).

R233 What's wrong with Hanyu taking the bus, especially in the early days when he wasn't being stalked?

Was the objection as simple as the fact that she's 5 years older? Maybe she did seduce sweet and pure Kozuka!

R232 Jeez. Fanning out online and at competitions (in the audience) is fine but when people start trying to push stuff into his sphere of daily life, that's so fucking invasive. And Hanyu's probably not even in Toronto to see that poster, even if it were still his bus stop.

Don't see anything wrong with that poster. Is not like they decorated the whole place. I think most people won't even notice it.

Gogolev will be 17 next Olympics. If he wins Gold, he will be the first Canadian champion, the youngest man to win Olympics in history, which is possible, he surely has more than enough time to build momentum going into Beijing. And Orser will be the coach who coaches his students to win 4 straight Olympics and the hero of Canadian FS. I would be surprised if he doesn't consider it as a big deal. I mean Cha has potential but he's far from Gogolev's "level". Gogolev has big Fed behind him, PCS boost is nothing. He has quads which is favoured by judges nowadays.

r238 In that case, I'm glad Gogolev left Orser. Seems that if Hanyu lasts through Beijing and Cha becomes a contender, Brian has a huge conflict of interest.

Yes, I realize that was also true when it was just Javi and Hanyu, but that's just it - it was just Javi and Hanyu and look at all the problems they had to deal with. Throw a third male skater into the mix, add personal nationalistic ties, and divide his attention further with Med in the ladies.

Who knows if Med will stay with him until next Olympics lol.

People have been hyping the "quads" of the Russian ladies and Gogo in juniors, but the judging for juniors have been lenient compared to seniors. Once Gogo reaches seniors he might be the next Uno or the next Zhou. Judges can prop him up or let him fall. Growth spurts will also happen. 17 falls within the age range of puberty and physical changes. It's really too early to predict how the seasons leading to Beijing goes.

Btw, how different is Gogo from younger Nam? I hope TCC or whoever it is makes sure the next rising star for Canada's men doesn't struggle in the same way and lose his way.

R241 No one is predicting what's going to happen. Gods know how the future will be like. I'm talking about the potential, the possibility based on what is going on at present. And only delusional Canadians thought Nam would become a great skater. His speed bothered me a lot. He was slow like a turtle, it took him forever to lauch into a jump. Your speed will likely to get slower when you grow up and have to skate to more difficult programs. Won't waste time comparing them but Gogolev is much better than young Nam.

R237 I'm sure those fans meant well, but it probably would feel invasive and alarming to realize that people are following, watching and keeping tabs on your whereabouts, especially if you're someone like Hanyu who values his privacy but is constantly hounded by stalkers and the press.

[243] But it's a bus stop near Cricket, not his home. How can it be invasive? I suppose it's just another gap between eastern and western mindsets, so I don't think Hanyu was bothered last year or is (will be) bothered now.

R244 How would you know which bus stop someone takes unless you're following them and waiting for them? Hanyu had to stop taking public transport because fans figured out his route and followed him, which seemed to freak him out A few months ago, tabloid photographers stalked him outside TCC and apparently followed him home. Let's not forget DL fave Sadako who shows up at his hotel, outside competitions and at the airpot (possibly on the same flight).

I totally get that you think it's an innocuous, sweet gesture and in another context it might be, but this is clearly someone who does not want to be sought out at his club, his home or anywhere in between. I'm not sure what you mean by the difference between eastern and western mindsets?

R234 r235 Dad does prefer to grope women in their early 20’s, not early 30’s. He supposedly blamed her for his son not making the Sochi team and he also thought she wouldn’t be willing to step back and support Kozuka’s post-skating career because she was older and more established. She was based in Tokyo and dad was probably hoping his son would return to Nagoya to support the family business.

R237 It was a nice gesture, but drew more attention when he’s trying to be low-key and showed they knew about his bus routine when Toronto was supposed to be a safe space away from the fandom. Fans living in the area were following him on the bus to/from practices and waiting at his stop, so it must have crossed his mind that some of them were involved. The organizer had visited inside TCC (maybe for a class?) before and moved internationally to not far from the club before the first project. The move was probably a happy coincidence but you can see how it could look a little unsettling. TCC apparently accepts Hanyu fan mail so why not give it directly to the club?

R244 It was inspired by Kpop fan practices. It’s not a Japanese practice and surprising from a Japanese standpoint.

His birthday isn't even until the 7th. Aren't there laws about putting stuff up at bus stops in Canada? It's illegal here.

Any livestreams for Golden Spin?

Or starting orders? All I can find is the entry list.

Patrick Chan will be the athletes' ambassador at GPF, and Meagan Duhamel will be interviewing the skaters. My 2 least favorite Canadians!

R250 Ngl they just made GPF much more interesting. Would be even better if they put their foot in their mouth or throw some shade. So far this year nobody has beat Ito at NHK.

R248 r249 here's the link to golden spin live stream.

Bless you R252

R249 STarting orders and results will be here

So the Men's most likely between Shoma and Nathan - which of them would you rather won? Shoma and his prerotation and crossovers or Nathan and his balletic artistry? Which winner's hype machine will be more insufferable?

Technical Panels for Grand Prix Finals

Men (both senior and junior)

Controller:

Yukiko OKABE (Japan) * Member of ISU Technical Committee

Specialists:

Myriam LORIOL-OBERWILER (Switzerland) *14th at 1984 Olympics, 11th at 1984 Worlds

Jae-Eun CHUNG (South Korea)

LADIES (both Senior and Junior)

Controller:

Ms. Vera TAUCHMANOVA (Czech Republic)

Specialists:

Ms. Olga MARKOVA (Russia) * Silver at 1996 Euros, bronze at 1994 Euros, 5th at 1995 Worlds

Ms. Franca BIANCONI (Italy) *19th at 1980 Olympics. Current coach of Rizzo

R255 What a choice. So fucking sick of both of them. And so relieved I didn't make travel plans for that event.

R252 Thanks for the link. Curious to see how Jason and Bradie and Mariah do at this event.

PAIRS

Controller:

Ms. Kerstin KIMMINUS (Germany)

Specialists:

Ms. Laurene COLLIN-KNOBLAUCH (Canada) * She was active in the late 80s

Ms. Whitney GAYNOR (USA) *9th at US Nationals in 2000...not sure if she had done anything better

ICE DANCE

Controller:

Mr David MOLINA (France)

Specialists:

Mr György ELEK (Hungary) *26th at 2007 Worlds, 20th at 2007 Euros

Ms. Judy BLUMBERG (USA) *4th at 1984 Olympics, Bronze at Worlds 1982-83-84

Alla SHEKHOVTSOVA is the Referee in ID

R255 Well, Chen's 4F got called while Uno's 4F earned some of the highest GOE of this season so far. Obviously Chen is in bigger trouble.

Starting Orders

Messing

Cha

Brezina

Chen

Voronov

Uno

______

Samodurova

Tuktamysheva

Kihra

Miyahara

Sakamoto

Zagitova

___

Sinistina/Katsalapov

Hawayker/Baker

Zagorski/Guerreiro

break

Stepanova/Bukin

Hubbell/Donohue

Guignard/Fabbri

r259 I imagine now that Yuzu's out, Shoma's overscoring will reach new heights. This season I prefer Nathan's programs and I'm sick of Shoma getting overscored on GOEs so in theory I'd rather Nathan won. But if Nathan wins the American media will spin him as the best skater and artist ever and I'll just get even more sick of that. So despite the fact I think Nathan's more deserving, I'm kinda rooting for Shoma.

R261 Why even choose? It's not like Nathan is as deserving of his PCS when he begins to drop things.

The last quad for men leading to PC was so interesting. Anyone could top the podium. One season later it's hell to watch, even with the new generation talents Chen and Uno leading the way. Interesting that Hanyu is considered an uncle now so by the time of Beijing Chen and Uno will probably be considered uncles too because of their long success in senior men.

Podium predictions: 1. Chen 2. Uno 3. Brezina - 1. Zagitova 2. Kihira 3. Tutakmysheva

If Chen wins GPF he'd be defending the title. Maybe he'll even aim to beat Hanyu's total and consecutive GPF titles. That'd be interesting.

And babyface towers over them all. Shoma once said he hates going last, but that's what he's got to do. I guess I'm rooting for him, just to put a little variety in the mix. And I feel a bit sorry for him, always the bridesmaid and never the bride (except on the podium, with his arm locked in Yuzuru's...)

Anyway, Nathan will be defending Worlds Champion too. If he wins GPF, Worlds, or both, I imagine the excitement will propel him through the coaching/Yale situation for another year - and Raf said he planned to go to Yale two years and then take a break to prepare for Beijing. If he keeps succeeding, I'd imagine it's full steam ahead - if he started faltering, he might give up and just go to school. And then what would we (the US) do. Our ladies are flaky as hell - and then there's Vincent and... Jason? Camden? Oblivion?

The shadows on Cha's sweater makes him look as if he has boobs lol

R265 Maybe you should've treated Keegan a little better. Canadians are glad finally a Canadian made it to GPF once Hanyu WD since it was in Vancouver and it was sad they didn't have anyone in for men or ladies. Could've been different.

Indeed R267 not to mention Paganini - Dave Lease and I were eyeing her with sad regret recently... But Bradie it is. I like her pretty legs, so there's that.

What the hell has Shoma done to his hair? Once we get Nathan straightened out, then Uno dumps a bottle of Lady Clairol Auburn all over his head - and doesn't bother to get it thinned out so it's a bushy reddish mess. I think he's been spending too much time with Dai. Come home to mommy Yuzu, Sho - he can fix your hair for you.

Did you see the pictures of Shoma at around five years of age in Itsuki's book, [R269]? His hair was a very light, reddish brown. Shoma's hair is a constant source of fascination--maybe that's why Yuzu, Nathan, Mura, etc, are compelled to ruffle it?

Like his coach does, I just assumed that Shoma had red streaks applied to his hair - and this latest time, he put more dye on it - but you think it's natural? (and maybe I'm just not remembering very well how much red it had in it before?) It is interesting how people can't keep their hands off Shoma, whether it's his hair or his body - as Yuzu said, he's just so cuuuuute!! Kawaii !!!

I think that's the real reason I'm rooting for him. He's the cutest. And I suck as an arbiter of skating - I don't really see this "prerotation" thing - I mean, I'll take everybody's word for it but I don't see it. I like the way he sort of presents his jumps, with the whooshing arm movements - and I don't like the way Nathan just sort of jumps, lands, sometimes with a nice enough knee bend, sometimes not, but they never impress me like the others do. And his attempts at looking cool or edgy or whatever in his skating - just looks awkward to me and nothing like his shy nature.

If I thought they had a chance I might go for Brezina or even Voronov, but what's the use of getting interested, at their advanced ages lol. And Keegan is just weird - I do love his Spinal Tap coach though, especially when he's out there doing corny homages to the 1920s. Oh and Cha's adorable but I fear he's grown too tall for his quads to last - but he's Brian's saving grace this season, with Gogo gone-gone (in a huff), Med practically crashing out (and flipping out), and Yuzu yet again on the casualty list.

r267 How was Keegan not treated well?

I don’t care for Keegan’s programs so I wish another substitute had made it in instead

R265 Good looking group in spite of hair issues with a few of them. The only one that I don't think is at all attractive is Keegan. Nathan's hair looks great in this picture.

r269 lol, not sure if Yuzu is the one anyone should be going to for hair advice, at least off ice. I always thought that ugly bowl cut was exhibit A for why he might not be gay (or at least not full on twink)- what gay man lets himself look like that so often when he's proven that he has the potential to look so fabulous?

Conversely, I always thought the way Shoma constantly fiddles with his hair was evidence for why he might be gay - though that bit of evidence is a mixed bag - on one hand he spends more time on his hair, but on the other hand, he does such a poor job of it.

r255 Tough choice. They both seem like good kids so personality wise they're a wash, though Shoma's more interesting. I think overall Shoma's skating is superior and I do feel a little sorry for him always finishing 2nd. Plus, I'm American so Shoma's PR affects me much less than Nate's so I think I pick Shoma.

But, it is getting really grating how they're both getting credit that they really shouldn't be getting credit for and Shoma's benefiting more from it. Honestly, given a choice, I'd want anyone except them or Messing to win (nothing against Messing, just don't want to deal with smug Canadian fans). I'd be happy if judges just started following the core bullet requirement, no matter who won

Well, I guess since Yuzu isn't here we should feature different ass. I've already brought you Nathan pics so I suppose we should start throwing Shoma into the mix

R273 the next alternate was Samarin and I wasn't too impressed with him either. I guess the third one, Matteo Rizzo, would have been my choice. But hey, I get to see the straggled haired hippie throwback coach again. He makes me laugh.

It's so hard for me to think of Shoma as gay or straight lol. Maybe the day will come... There's a little bit more personality coming out, I guess since the ice shows this summer where he talked in interviews about realizing as a headliner he had a responsibility to bring entertainment to people - himself, personally! when he's just been a tag-along puppy for so long. He's so sweet natured, I really like him. And you're right R274, both he and Nathan have really likeable personalities, so I'm ok with either one winning. Or any of the others, come to that. It's weird not having a Patrick Chan to hate on - almost like something is lacking ?

Sorry but aside from his uncalled pretotations and underrotations, Shoma's unfortunate proportions and one-note intense expressions makes his programs a turn off. He only does one intepretation for all of his programs - sp, fs and ex. At least Nathan has been trying. It's Uno's 4th senior season and he is still coasting through on ugly jumps and the same damn glaring face and dramatic arms "artistry". In the long run he won't be the next Dai but instead the next Patrick. My vote goes to Nathan.

Uno's "quads" having gotten +4,+5 across the board and being on the same level as Hanyu reminded me how unfair life is. Jugdes must have set different standards for him. Tons of Crossovers into Jumps( checked), ugly air position ( checked), bad take off and landing ( checked), small jumps (checked). This is the only reason why he got such absurd GOEs. Nathan vs Shoma. Nathan's jumps >>>> Uno's, Nathan's programs >>>>> Shoma's( please he has skated the same programs for years)

Shoma did have a jazzy style EX in the past year - Buble' or some such - and he also had a kind of dramatic Native American themed one, done by Shae Lynn. So at least for Exes, he's stepped out of his usual box. I'm just glad a propped skater, if that's true and I'll accept it's true even if I love to watch him skate - anyway, I'm glad a propped skater has a sweet personality, after years of the douchey Chanster.

But I agree the scoring should be fair and I wish it was - but I don't know what to do about it - so I'll just keep on liking him anyway since I find him (and his skating) appealing.

Beautifully put, [R279]. I'll keep on liking Shoma, too. In fact, the more harshly others criticize this sweet, humble boy, the more I like him.

R280 lol No one was criticizing him as a person. They were criticizing his ugly jumps, flawed technique, empty programs,...Did sweetness, humility, hard-workm... whatever mean much in this case ? No, his personality has nothing to do with his skating and doesn't make his scores well-deserving.

I guess there are no Chen ubers here? Haven't seen a post come to his rescue yet about how despite being a propped skater at least he has a humble and sweet personality.

R282, I wish people would stop criticizing Nathan Chen! He deserves every single high mark he gets from the judges.He has such cute curly hair and such a humble and sweet nature. I wish others could see the sweet boy I watch in front me me, sorryfully lamenting to his passionate nemesis choreography, no doubt over some beautiful boy who broke his heart. I luv him till the end of time. PS any gay rumors?

Golden Spin is not updating scores live.

Actually they are not even updating results after the competition. Or better, they are updating them randomly. For ex Junior Rhythm Dance result page is not updated (it was held last night at 10 PM) but the protocols are up

They have not update with the starting orders of Men SP to be held this afternoon

But they updated the Ladies starting order. As there are 37 entries, they start at 8 AM tomorrow

I am surprised they are providing a working livestream.

Chen doesn't have ubers but neither crazy haters. He's just very boring. Not interesting enough to stan, not interesting enough to hate.

R285 Then lucky you. You haven't seen Chen's ubers claiming that out of all the active male skaters this season Chen is the most well-rounded and complete skater, he deserves higher PCS, he has the best jumps because he has done all quads except the 4A, he has the best artistry because he does modern programs, and he is the most hardworking because he's juggling elite skating and elite schooling.

R283 If he's lacking gay rumors then we can get the ball rolling. I ship Raf and Chen! Now all I have to do is gif moments of them and decipher the true meaning behind each gesture. Let me try to muster the motivation and interest to do it first.

Golden Spin IT clerk finally woke up...

Jason Brown skates as #6

Immediately followed by Samarin, Samohin and Kolyada.

Majorov skates as #5. Fentz as 11th. Bychenko as 16th. Vasjlievs as #22. Grassl is the last to skate

R283 I love Nathan's curly hair. For real.

r286 The same great love story as betweem Zagitova nad Gleikhengauz, I assume.

R286 let's call this ship Rafthan.

Chen 's Apple watch and many of the clothes he wears come from his ubers. They also complain when he likes photos of pretty girls on IG. He also has some nationalistic fans and the weird Canadian fans at GS.

Jackie’s practice notes: www. rockerskating. com/news/2018/12/5/2018-grand-prix-final-practice-notes

Is that a typical practice for Eteri’s quadsters? Will Petr Gumennik be joining the seniors next season?

R269 I think mom the hairstylist is a genuine longtime Takahashi fan. Uno’s eyebrows are also perfectly shaped.

Itsuki just [italic]had[/italic] to add that is brother was a “very” late speaker when thanking fans for buying his book. Now you can not only get his autograph, you can also take a photo with the younger Uno at his book signing this weekend. Shoma’s costumes and medals will also be on display, and you can get that clear file autographed by the skater if you’re early, so they did make Itsuki’s event kind of worth it if you’re a local Uno fan who can’t make the GPF.

R291 Is it for the fans or are the books not selling well though?

'Chen 's Apple watch and many of the clothes he wears come from his ubers.' Oh my god, I love it. Can't believe he does that lmao. How did you discover this though?

Jason Brown 95.50

Samarin 86.29

Samohin 85.

Majorov 83.87

Shulepov 78.52

Kolyada 97.04

Koylada finally avoids wiping out. Also, my livestream just froze, anyone else?

It looks like Hanyu is going back to Toronto and talk with Orser about Japan nationals and other competitions. I hope he doesn't do nationals. That would be very foolish.

R291 It's the best-selling book of the day on Amazon in the "soft-cover non-fiction sports" category, but also likely the only one in the category that was recently released. The second best-seller is not even on sale yet. But it's a book only fans of the skater would buy or know about, so they have to appeal to those fans as much as possible and the super ubers are away in Vancouver. It would look bad for Itsuki if a lot of people don't come out since the event is in Nagoya.

R293 It was in his thread on GS.

Good for Brown and Kolyada.

R296 Mine too. But they are re-doing the ice. Maybe they will back when they have finished

Livestream is back for me.

Golden Spin organizers don't want us to miss Paul Fentz. How kind

So Kolyada finally doesn't flop at a competition with low stakes. How consistent.

R297 He's already back in Toronto but maybe he arrived yesterday or keeping away from TCC until Orser returns from GPF.

If Paul Wylie is supposed to be closeted, who has he been linked to? His wife is bigger than him...fucking Amazon.

I think that Michelle Kwan is a lez...

The USA judge for Men at GPFinal is the one who served at Autumn Classic (Judge 2 there, the one next to the Irish judge)

There was buzz on twitter today - apparently some online tabloid / Yahoo wrote about how arrogant Yuzuru was to have skated in Russia and that he shouldn’t “look down” on nationals, along with a quote from a “JSF official” that he’s skipping nationals because he’s scared to lose.

Nobody wants to share the article (not wanting to gove the editorial attention, rightfully so, plus some fans are furious because it came out a day before his birthday) and I can’t read Japanese so I can’t find it, but if anyone (JDC, please help!) could shed more light that would be great.

Bychenko 72.something

I thought Bychenko was going to retire after the Olympics. Given how he's skating this season it might not've been a bad idea.

Oh why couldn't you do this in a grand prix, Misha (Kolyada). Love those tight pants and big leg muscles too. Here's his 97 point short program in Zagreb today

Bychenko spent the whole summer at the beach with his girlfriend judging by his social media. And it is really evident in his performances

R306. I saw that on Twitter as well. I really hope that tabloid doesn't pressure hanyu to compete at nationals. He must take care of himself first.

Oh god I'm cringeing through this interview at GPF with Keegan, Patrick and Elladj. Where's Tracy - PJ - Kurt - Carol - anybody else??

Practice pairs just finished

Damn Enbert and Cipres have amazing butts

313 Cipres has amazing everything.

Juniors are live-streamed on ISU youtube channel

r305 Maybe Doug Williams will cancel out Locatelli’s love for Uno since Hanyu isn't there and we’ll have a fair fight between Uno and Chen.

r306 It’s an article I referenced in r215 from Flash. (Yahoo and Livedoor repost articles from other publications.) It had a quote from “someone connected to the JSF” saying the fed is very angry at Hanyu for taking nationals lightly and many people, including Japanese judges, are sick of his words and his team’s arrogance. The article also suggested Hanyu didn’t pull out of Rostelecom because he wanted to avoid facing Uno and Takahashi at Nationals. If Uno performs flawless programs and Hanyu makes a mistake, he will lose and even though he may get more TSS than Takahashi, he could lose to Takahashi in PCS and it’d hurt his pride.

However, since the injury, aside from the few tabloids and antis, almost everyone (from morning news and sports shows, to journalists and photographers, celebrities and fans) has been saying that Hanyu doesn’t owe anyone anything and should rest until Worlds at the very least.

r306 According to a person from PH, that article is a typical tabloid fare. Unnamed sources which means there's no source just inventing shit. The person also reminded that JFS had said that they'd suppport Hanyu's decision.

It sounds like the article is just that, sensationalist clickbait, and not means to pressure Hanyu. It was pointed out that by pressuring an unhealed Hanyu to participate in Nationals JFS would run the risk of fucking him up before Worlds, which are in Japan too.

I hope Hanyu's "talk to Orser about Nationals" is not about Yuzu feeling pressured, just a sign of recovery going well and his wishful thinking, and that he can be persuaded to give it up.

r309 Is Mikhail's SP emptier than it used to be? Or maybe it seems emptier because of the unusual camera angle. He also looks kinda slow. I don't know, I used to quite like his SP but this didn't impress me even though it was cleanish.

has our super clever Vincent confused Switzerland for Sweden?

because I don't think Switzerland is generally defined as a Nordic country, at least not in European terms.

Junior men warming up now - Gogolev Gummenik Pulkinen Shimada... a couple more. Streamed here with the sweet Ted Barton commentating.

Gogolev 78.82

Gummenik just behind at 76

Shimada just below 74

Camden is cute.

Pulkinen over 80. Takes the lead

The French guy is going to be last by quite a distance

The French scored 66

Hiwatashi does worse

Nary a mention of Brian Orser when Gogolev skated though David Wilson was namechecked as choreographer. Whoa. Lambiel looking hot as ever, and he coaches Shimada and they said he choreographed Camden Pulkinen's short. Two Biellmans! And some Chopin-like tops. Wonder if it's Yuzu's influence? Well, I guess ombre tops are pretty commonplace. First three very skinny and leggy - might get tall. The others were thicker.

And Camden's aging out as he'll be 19 in March. Maybe Zakrajsek will finally have a winner since Vincent's flailing (I watched Vincent the other day and he lands every jump on a diagonal skate that he then straightens out - whyyyy??? It makes them all UR, at least I think that's the problem. Dave Lease says Tom sucks as a coach. I guess Tammy too as they seem to always be a team.

Good performance for Camden. Not sure if he can hold off Gogo and his quads in the long, we'll see.

I have to agree with TSL, but I also think Tom isn't a great coach. I took some group lessons from him back in the day (when his prized pupil was AP McDonough), and I wasn't that impressed with his technical instruction. He also seemed a bit high on himself and lacking in the humility he'd need to constructively assess what his students need and get the shortcomings fixed. I've taken a lesson or two from various well known coaches, and Frank Carroll comes out for me in turns of his quality of instruction and professionalism, whether he's dealing with Michelle Kwan or a group lesson of teens struggling to land their axel. I loved Yuka Sato too, she's super kind and encouraging.

R327 Great to hear from someone who was actually coached by those coaches. Many seem to think Yuka Sato would be a great coach for Gracie Gold if she really wants to make a serious comeback.

That's what Dave said R327. From my notes on his vlog after Rostelecom: "Yuka Sato doesn’t have an ego like Tom Z, who's thirsting for a student because he needs the ego burst – Sato has been a champ so doesn’t need that. It should only be about what Gracie needs." He was also fussing big time about Vincent Restencourt, who I think was there with Gracie though he used to work with Tammy ?? he's really a piece of work - tarred and feathered out of France (legal issues?), fired by Ting Cui's dad, just ignored Gracie in K&C in Moscow)... sorry to rehash - I'm new to skating this year and fascinated by the coach intrigues which are complicated and it's hard to get a grip on the details.

It was great to watch an almost clean competition with such variety of programs.

I found Gumennik the stiffest and Pulkinen the most fluid. If sokmeone starts talking about Chen's balletic arms, show them Pulkinen because in him you can actually see them. Hiwatashi's got great dynamics. Please for all that's holy, let Pulkinen and Hiwatashi be successful and replace Krasnozhon and maybe Zhou in the top ranks of American me, they're both infinitely more watchable. Pulkinen looks quite thick though, I hope his body type won't get in the way of quads. Siao Him Fa had great step sequence. Gogo was on point, sharp. Shimada... not that impressed to be honest. Good music but felt sort of empty, like Gumennik, and the step sequence was overinterpreted.

R329 I'm not new to the sport but, with the exception of Hanyu, I'm finding the coaches much more interesting than the actual skaters they coach. At the moment the big question for me is what triggered the Orser-Gogolev split. That's a really big deal and I'm wondering how it will end up playing out. Orser is not just another coach at TCC; he's the BIG CHEESE. Would not surprise me if Gogolev eventually ended up being coached by Raf.

Interesting R331. I don't know the timeline but supposedly Orser talked to Japanese fed/Mao Asada - I wonder if that was before or after she trained with Raf.

And Adam Rippon tried switching to Ghislain after the Yuna Kim incident - I saw an interview and he blamed his disillusionment with Brian on the situation with Yuna Kim, though I didn't quite understand it - I guess he agreed with her that Brian was being disloyal by talking to Mao behind Yuna's back?

Anyway, Adam ended up with Raf. And imagine the environment of Gogo and Nathan Chen training together for the Beijing Olympics under Raf (since Nathan plans to train full time after two years at Yale). Javi/Yuzu Part Deux? And Brian can sit there with sourfaced Med - unless Yuzu sticks around or Cha hangs in there but I'm still nervous about his size (and Conrad Orzel's alas - what a beauty but he's too damned big - should probably go to ice dance or pairs? I mean it's Canada not Japan)

r331 Please no Raf. I'd like Gogolev to transform into more than a jump machine.

Warmup just ending for junior GPF ladies

Camden has really interesting eyebrows.

[R329] Ting left Aston because her tiger parents were making demands that couldn't be met. Let's see how long she lasts at WA.

Kostornaia just glorious in first with 76.32 points. But the quads will pass her up in free skate I guess. (Trusova second at 74.43 - Scherbakova fell on 3A and screwed up her combo and is last place at 56.26 but maybe her quad lutz could claw her back to 3rd?)

* My link isn't working for me. Here's a better one (if anyone cares lol - I think I'm getting too obsessed with all this)

Predictably, the who-gets-overscored-more battle is fully on between Uno and Chen. I can't even tell.

I feel sorry for the unfavored.

I thought, even watching warmup and earlier practice, that something's wrong with Uno. There was a longer, more intense hug from his coach than usual, and she grabbed hold of his arm like she was helping him walk to the k&c. Oh well.

None of them were as exciting as Kostornaia. Eric Radford tweeted, "She's exquisite." Adam Rippon: "Honestly, my fav." Jackie Wong: "ALENA. KOSTORNAIA. IS. SO. FRIGGIN. GOOD."

Why aren't the junior boys doing any quads?

It tickles me to see Russian fans get mad over Rika's rise in PCS and that no one is complaining about it. I dunno, maybe its because she's a queen and deserves them?

Ironic.

Great to see Rika land that 3A and do so well. Sad to see Satoko in last place.

R341 - during the gps, there were some quads in men's juniors - Gogo had a 3-quad free skate at Bratislava; Orzel had 2 quads at Linz; others with quads include Grassl, Savosin and Torgashev (who dropped out of GPF letting Gogo in). I just checked the first two GPs - probably there are others.

I am seriously reading some Alina ubers say that there should be a bigger gap between Rika and Alina's PCS and that no way for real does Rika deserves to be that close to Alina in PCS. Also that Rika's GOE are overscored. Oh, figure skating fandom.

I was right that men would be a bore.

R342 Because she's Japanese. If you are Japanese, you're supposed to: 1. Get underscored evertytime you skate. 2. Be a superior skater with cleaner jump technique, better SS.

Kihira's PCS and GOEs are too high. She has the very high GOEs on spins, Stsqs and the highest GOEs on jumps.

Zagitova and Kaori combo were URed. Especially Zagitova's 3Lz3Lo. And not called.

r341 In SP junior men aren't allowed to do quads according to the rules. They can in FS so prepare for splats tomorrow.

R341 Juniors are obliged to do a 2 Flip or 3 Flip as solo not Axel jump in the SP

Japanese judge put Chen 4th in PCS

French Fed has abandoned Shoma. No Philippe and this judge ranked him 5th in PCS

Overall only Japan and Canada had Uno first. France (Brezina second) and Korea (Cha second) had him third, Czech Rep had him 4th

Japan had Chen third (Cha second)

__

Russia and Georgia put Zagitova first. In PCS they score Kihira 5th. Korea and Japan (different judge compared to Men) had Kihira behind Zagitova in PCS. USA, China; Canada, Finland and Spain had Kihira in the lead in PCS. These countries also generally tied Zagitova and Miyhara in PCS.

Looked into Men's planned content, only Pulkinen and Gumennik aren't planning on doing quads. Chen is planning four quads but Voronov has a 4Lo in his layout. Is that completely new? He wasn't doing it in the GP, was he?

r332 Orser later took back his statement about being contacted by Mao’s agent and her team and JSF denied ever approaching him. Mao was fired by Raf and left Tarasova because she had to stay in Nagoya with her mother who was dying of liver disease. At the time, Mao's situation was kept secret and since it was during the height of the Yuna-Mao rivalry, many just assumed her team was lying when they said she was looking for a Japanese coach. Unfortunately, the rumor still lives on despite her situation being revealed after her mother died in 2011. But I think Yuna's team also denied Mao was the cause of the breakup with Orser at some point.

Pulkinen is actually shorter than Shimada. The other finalists are just tiny and very young-looking. I keep forgetting Gumennik is already 16 going on 17 this season.

R340 Kostornaia is such a beautiful and complete skater.

R348 The Japanese judge for mens, Masako Kubota, was also accused of inflating Uno’s SP scores for 2018 4CC, though the underscoring might be new. She also judged 2017 Nationals, 2017 4CC, 2016 Nationals (referee), and 2016 Skate America.

Skating Scores already up:

And the Golden Spin scores

Kolyada outscores Brown in PCS for 3 judges out of 7

Ladies SP at Golden Spin has started at 8.45 AM and will finish at 1.45 PM

Bradie Tennell is currently leading with 71.50

R333 I also would like to see Gogolev end up being more than a jump machine but I would not be surprised if his parents only care about the medals.

And what if Gogolev grows a lot in the next few years? I doubt Nathan would be such a human jump machine if he were several inches taller.

R332 Maybe Brian is better off without having Gogolev to worry about--all that pressure to try and end the "Canadian curse" is now lifted from his shoulders. And he no longer has the daily hassle of having to coach a kid and deal with (possibly) his obnoxious parent(s). In an IceNetwork podcast he did a few years ago, Brian admitted he doesn't have a lot of patience for coaching teens and dealing with all their teenage angst.

Ain't that a kick in the head for him though R355.

During the Olympics, Scott Hamilton interviewed Brian and he said that Brian had been emailing him videos of Gogo doing quads - bragging about the wunderkind he had. So I would think this is embarrassing for him since he bragged about him so much, far and wide. Even Yuzuru has bragged about Gogo in interviews. Just WTF could have happened? One bad competition and it's over? He could easily have left his name on the ISU list and just shown up with Lee - I think that's how Gabby handled it (if she was ever Orser's but he talked about her as if she were - "I've got a lady here, Gabrielle Daleman" - he said that at the Olys too)

Top 10 of 34 ladies at Golden Spin: 1 Bradie TENNELL USA 71.50 2 Anastasiia GUBANOVA RUS 69.56 3 Anastasiia GULIAKOVA RUS 67.85 4 Mariah BELL USA 67.82 5 Maria SOTSKOVA RUS 60.35 6 Y. YAMADA SUI 58.78 7 Ekaterina RYABOVA AZE 57.28 8 Hongyi CHEN CHN 56.81 9 Nicole SCHOTT GER 55.44 9 10 Megan WESSENBERG USA 53.23 10

R357 Gabby's coaches are still listed as being Lee, Brian & Tracy. And I too want to know WTF happened to end Brian's association with the kid. When Brian made his "well I just don't know" remark in the K&C, it sounded to me like he was exasperated about something other than that particular skate. So my guess is that some sort of serious conflict must have precipitated their split. Makes me really wonder about Gogo's parents.

R355 Yes, it is a kick in the head for him. And although I've been critical about Orser at times, by all accounts he seems to be a good guy with a great sense of humor. And he did coach my beloved Yuzu to two OGMs--including doing an incredible job this year of conning everyone into thinking Yuzu had recovered from his injuries and thus psyching out his competition. If you love Yuzu, you gotta be grateful to Brian for pulling that off.

Last group is warming up in Zagreb.

Shulepov is currently in the lead ahead of Fentz and the young Georgian.

I have to head out, please summarize what happens in the final group wonderful DLers. Particularly if Misha & Jason manager to stay on their feet. ;)

Majorov in the lead with 227 points

Samohin 230.54. Into the lead

229.82 for Grassl

237.84 for Samarin. Fell on the quad

Now Carmen Kolyada

popped Axel

one fall

I think the initial 2S was a pop too as it was very high

253 points.

1tJason BROWN tUSAt263.42 t2t1 2tMikhail KOLYADA tRUSt253.14 t1t2 3tAlexander SAMARIN tRUSt237.84 t3t3 4tDaniel SAMOHIN tISRt230.54 t4t6 5tDaniel GRASSL tITAt229.82 t6t4 6tAlexander MAJOROV tSWEt227.47 t5t7 7tAnton SHULEPOV tRUSt225.82 t7t5 8tPaul FENTZ tGERt210.12 t8t8 9tIrakli MAYSURADZE tGEOt207.60 t9t9 10tAlexei BYCHENKO tISRt192.21 t10t12 11tAleksandr SELEVKO tESTt186.09 t12t10 12tCatalin DIMITRESCU tGERt181.66 t11t15 13tDavide LEWTON BRAIN tMONt180.51 t14t13 14tNikolaj MAJOROV tSWEt177.03 t18t11 15tAlessandro FADINI tITAt171.68 t17t14 16tLuc MAIERHOFER tAUTt167.80 t13t17 17tJavier RAYA tESPt164.71 t15t18 18tNikita MANKO tKAZt161.59 t16t19 19tThomas KENNES tNEDt161.20 t19t16 20tGeorgii RESHTENKO tCZEt136.38 t21t20 21tYamato ROWE tPHIt134.68 t20t22 22tChadwick WANG tSGPt127.47 t24t21 23tLap Kan YUEN tHKGt125.27 t22t24 24tDiego SALDANA tMEXt119.63 t23t23

Jason. Brown is cleanish, a messy 2 feet landing was there in the middle

And wins by 10 points

I wonder if that's Karen Preston in the k&c with Jason. He looked so desperate, clasping his hands in prayer or whatever, waiting for his scores. So glad for him to get a win. This last year has really been hell for him. So... guess the new rules have benefited him the most?

Jason's 3Lz had two -2 and a +3

Someone gave +2 to Kolyada's 1A

Bychenko had 2 nice 1A...and a dreadful TES

R369 yes, she is

This was a low stakes competition. Did Jason try a quad?

If he didn't I'd be disappointed.

R371

No

2A

3A+2T

3S

2LO

3A+2T+2Lo

3F+3T

3Lz

and this produced the highest TES of the event

6 triples win the event? Embarrassing

R372 ugh. I like Jason as a person but he is pissing me off. Zhou falling back this season by getting UR calls is his blessing. Why don't he just take it?

Well, outside a few fans and circles no one is giving 2 fcks about Mens SP at GPF. Huh... Without the obnoxious fanyus drama, where are the "right" kind of figure skating fans at?

r374 Why do believe nobody gives 2 fucks? The audence wasn't that empty.

R374 I've seen the same people commenting and keeping with the competitions at various platforms.

R375 R376 Because the post discourse seems very sparse. Perhaps I'm wrong then.

R375 audience was surprisingly empty for a gpf in a country where skating is appreciated. My section was pretty empty and it was on one of the long sides. Curious to see how well attended men's is tonight since it's the last event and ladies are on Saturday. Brezina looked very hot in his new button down shirt.

It's great to hear Jason won. I agree that he's still not going to get as far as he'd like without trying a quad. I hope this motivates him to keep working hard on it.

R378 Oh, yes. Glad Brezina at least tried with a costume (tried being the key word). Now I think he didn't bother with the assignments in case he didn't qualify, the lazy bastard. Still, I'll never forgive him for wearing that black t-shirt.

Figure skating is a dying sport. The ISU has been doing everything in its power to kill it and it's succeeding--and getting lots of help from (mostly) unimaginative coaches and skaters. And it's not very popular in Canada either anymore, despite what those crazed Canadians claim on the GS forum.

Cain/LeDuc both took falls right near the end of their free skate on the exit of a lift (?) - Cain fell on her head andlooked completely dazed after the fall, she's got a neck brace on right now

R381 I imagine broadcasters going after the youtube uploaders too isn't helping.

R383 that's the thing. I'm pretty sure it was ISU going after the YouTubers, not the broadcasters. ISU pretended not to know a thing about it when people complained directly. Then some of the YouTubers took pics of their cease and desist notices and it showed the org claiming the copyright infringement was ISU.

R382 She got up and continued like nothing. Skaters are made of pure determination.

Referee (Slobodan Delic) is getting some criticims because he didn't stop Cain/LeDuc

One of the worst fall I remember is the one of Totmianina at Skate America 2004. He lost balance while he was raising her and she went down with her face on ice

it is at 2.08

Also the Obertas /Palamarchuk one at Nice Worlds. From 4m20

The girl was just crying and not caring much about him. He was fainting and they were moving him around without too much attention.

These 2 never skated together again IIRC

That was a weird fall. He kind of tripped on nothing. For a moment I thought she had killed him with her crotch.

Gogo wins.

Fall on 4Lz but otherwise the kid was on fire. Whatever troubles they go through at TCC, it seems to have been solved satisfactorily, because Gogo probably would have won even if Pulkinen hadn't had a meltdown.

Gumennik second, nice 4S, he might be the Russian future.

Of course both of them need to survive the growth spurt.

wow keegan messing has a nice juicy ass two bad he ugz

Uno loses the overscoring battle.

Cha gets the bronze.

r392 Maybe JSF and US Fed made a deal. Uno gets worlds, Nathan gets everything else. Uno actually got scored fairly this event. It seemed like from the beginning the judges/tech caller decided Nathan would win.

Nathan deserved it. Both Shoma and Nathan better watch out for Junhwan Cha, though. He could be the one in 2022.

Three years to Beijing, and Cha may be the one to do the hat trick for Orser... be fun if neither of the two overhyped ones ever gets an OGM.

Doug Williams confuses even more, only judge to put Chen second.

i want nathan chen's tongue in my mouth

I can't fucking stand Nathan as a skater. He's stiff and ugly. What does he have to offer besides jumps and they aren't great this season. Uno, for all of the overscoring and his flawed technique, is at least someone who is engaging to watch.

r398 Nathan has a very watchable SP this year, I can admit that much. Great choreo and he does a good job on it, it's not your run of the mill fare.

IN FS this was the first time I got into Uno's, despite all the small errors.

But it's the tech that rules and Uno's tech sucks more than Chen's.

Not that judges couldn't get around it if they wanted to. and this time they wanted Chen to win.

When skaters get overscored thousands times, suddenly they are scored fairly just once and that immediately make an "illusion" that they get underscored even if they absolutely aren't lol.

This was the final? The entire men's field has been lacklustre for this Grand Prix season. This final is a highlight of that. Take away the scores and only looking at the skating, it's not that pretty.

One or two more point away and Chen would have beaten the fs world record. The judges must be seething that they didn't make it happen. They tried so hard. Chen was favored over Uno, but I care for neither.

R400 That's the story of this era's top ladies and men, honestly. In fact, Uno aside we can write a whole book about that concerning the cycle of Russian anointed ones.

I tend to roll my eyes at Fanyus who say the men's GPF isn't worth watching without Hanyu but this event kind of validated them. Other than Jun, it was pretty terrible all around.

Hanyu can fail just as hard or even harder than Chen or Uno. There was no guarantee he would do well here or even last year. But at COR he seemed to have gotten his SP down to deservedly WR scores and his FS to just about good enough minus the falls. He was ready to peak.

The problem at this final was that neither Chen or Uno peaked, and even if everyone else splats the top 2 finishers not having memorable skates is a detriment to the impression of the field.

The GS thread for GPF post discussions concerning men is at least looking to offer some popcorn. Hanyu ubers and randoms not enthused about the competition. Chen and Uno ubers salty that they aren't cumming over it.

Hanyu could fall on his ass several times, his fans still say competition is interesting. They basically kiss the ground he walks on.

I hope he doesn't read what his international fans wrote. What they have written on SNS so far are unfair, terrible, sometimes disrespecting to his rivals. I mean overscored Uno, Nathan made me sick but c'mon are you even not tired of bringing up nonstop scorimg discourse, bashing their programs everytime they skate ? Not that they aren't allowed to discuss those shits but if you do, at least be honest and fair, I just can't stand their "Hanyu-is-a-God he- is- stunning-incredible- amazing-briliant" tone. They're just into looking for drama. Not sure about his Japanese fans but from some tweets on my TL, they seem all respectful and polite.

The butthurt from Uno ubers is absolutely delicious. Glad Nathan won just for that. A bit disappointed for Brezina, Cha has many years in front of him to medal whereas it would have been nice to have an uncle on the podium this time.

And wtf is wrong with ISU going after fs youtube videos and accounts. It's like they want to actively kill the sport and especially hide Yuzu's achievements and popularity. Things like this piss me off so much that I want Yuzu to retire and this dying sport to be dead for good. And don't tell me it's about broadcaster rights. These videos don't take anything away from those.

That's a very nice looking podium. Very symmetrical, look at that height order.

r404 Are those discussions inn the paid sections? I'm feeling craving for salt.

R402 It isn't worth watching without Hanyu because the ISU has ruined figure skating. Only the most extraordinary skater can make watching it worthwhile now because most of it is sleep inducing. Yuzu for me is like Torvill & Dean; almost everything he does and they did is original and thus worth making the effort to watch and follow him . And as with T&D, Yuzu pays great attention to detail--like them, he mind fucks every single aspect of his skating. He really, really cares what he puts on the ice every time he skates.

I just wanted to say that I miss Yuzuru Hanyu. That is all.

Ok I finally watched all the free skates. Damn none of these men skated clean, why are the Grand Prix Finals like this? I guess that podium is fair considering what the others did on the ice. Messing should get a recognition medal for Most Dramatic Fall.

Bradie Tennell won Golden Spin earlier, with Mariah Bell in 3rd.

R410 It is kind of offensive that Chen’s FS almost broke the world record, but the future isn’t entirely bleak. Even with mistakes, the junior men were quite interesting. Some of those boys have greater artistry, spins, and skating skills than some seniors and they’re only going to get better if they survive puberty. All of them are likeable as well. But it must be killing Orser to be let go just before his former star pupil won the JGPF.

According to rumors on Russian boards via FSU, Gogolev’s parents were complaining about the lack of attention, and the addition of Ekaterina Kurakova and Orser’s constant devotion to her may have been the final straw. (Kurakova can jump quads). That explains the timing, but what’s happening to Phan and Daleman then? Medvedeva who needs as much help as possible? Hopefully Orser isn’t just trying to recreate his success with Yuna because he can’t let go of how their relationship ended.

Med’s broke ass will be back in Russia this time next year.

Gogolev is a junior skater. How much attention does he need?

Zagitova 226.53

3Lz landed on two feet and could attach only a single jump

the rest so far

Sakamoto 211

Samodurova 204

Miyhara 201

Tukta 215

Rika Kihira wins

Wow. Now that's a GPF competition! The ladies put the guys to shame.

Rika is miles better than Alina atm. Alina's jumps are so labored.

Girls killed it.

Miyahara was the most enjoyable for me.

Then Tuk. Med should take interpretation lessons from Tuk.

Did Kihira just beat Zagitova on PCS? Skating after imperfect Zag must have helped her.

I kinda felt for Zag when she was starting her skate, she looked nerve-wracked. No wonder the mistakes.

But the hegemony of Russian girls has been broken, let's see if it lasts.

Zagitova won PCS by 0.3. She won Transitions and Composition. Kihira won Skating Skills and Intepretation. Performance was tied

r422 Thanks! I wonder how their respective PCS will shape up in tghe next competitions, Kihira's should be on the rise now that she's proven herself to be a top contender, and Zagitova's might stall now that she's proven to be beatable. Of corse. Of course in a fair world neither of them should top Miyahara or Sakamoto, but oh well.

R421

[Quote]But the hegemony of Russian girls has been broken, let's see if it lasts.[/quote]

The Russian ubers have been sniggering at Rika's 3A's because they are so sure she will be trampled by their junior "quad" queens next season.

Anyway, Rika deserves her win. Can't wait for the Alina ubers to start ranting about her PCS again without grasping the irony about Alina's. Also, the lies the antis have been spreading about Rika's jumps being bad technique. That's when you know for real that a new queen is in town.

Ladies press conference

R424 Kihira has two quads although the 4T isn't consistent yet, I think.

None of Zagitova's URs were called. She can't beat Kihira at tech and skating skills anyway if we're being honest. Silver is the best Zagitova could get if both go clean and not a bad place at all. Tuk also got bronze. The Russians will probably sweep the podium in juniors. There's nothing to complain about, except Daniil's choreography and music.

R414 "Hopefully Orser isn’t just trying to recreate his success with Yuna because he can’t let go of how their relationship ended."

It does seem like it, doesn't it? And if that's the case, I feel really sad for him. He's been the coach to the best male figure skater ever--even Raf A speaks about Yuzu with awe. How can that not be enough for him?

R415 If Med ends up back in Russia this time next year, her fans will go completely and utterly batshit.

R427: Her fans better start buying her poop tea and leg slimmers.

Go Rika!

Waiting for Alina ubers and sympathizers to start invalidating Rika's win because apparently Alina was skating while injured.

by this time next year, Med will be headed to Russia for retirement. Zagitova will be skating at the Golden Spin with Nicole Schott

R421 I forgot to say that Hamada-antis have been spreading those rumors in Japan for years and she’s also has Mao ubers after her. But Kihira seems to have a strong head on her shoulders.

I understand the disappointment from Zagitova fans, but what angers me most is how much Japan has supported Zagitova (and other Russian skaters), far more than even her home country and far more than their own figure skaters. Many Japanese figure skating fans actually wanted Zagitova to win because they either felt sorry for her or find her more aesthetically pleasing. The Japanese judge was generous (and Japanese judges are often kind to Russians girls) while the Russian and Georgian judges tried to take down Kihira yet again. But the Russian fans constantly rip on the Japanese ladies. There always many Russian comments on their videos talking about how ugly, fat and untalented they are.

Skating Scores:

R431 Seeing how Japanese ubers act with Dai, Uno, and Hanyu, LMAO it's no wonder. Alina should have gotten some UR calls too, her injury is sad, but that's just facts. Worlds is in Japan this year so if Japanese fans and the fed don't back their biggest gold medal threat then they should just stop doing fs altogether.

But out of all, wanting Alina to win because they find Alina more aesthetically more pleasing than Rika is the biggest joke. The competition is on ice and take away their faces, and Alina skates like a stiff bent over board compared to Rika.

Kostornaia has beaten Trusova

SHCHERBAKOVA fell on both quads

Kostornaia wins the following layout

2A, 3Lo, 3Lz2T2T, 2A, 3F3T, 3S3T(2ft), 3F

We missed the Australian National Championships yesterday

Men: Brendan Kerry (second place for Andrew Dodds)

Ladies: Kailani Craine

Pairs: Aleksandrowskaya/Windsor

Dance: Kerry (sister of Brendan)/Andrew Dodds

I am disappointed Andrew Dodds doesn't do also Pairs

Yes, Kostornaia! I wonder if Eteri will rethink her strategy and get her other skaters to focus more on SS.

R436 Is there anyone who does both pairs and dance (at the same time)?

So happy for Kostornaia and for the PCS gap between her and Trusova. Trusova is boring as hell, frankly. If it weren't for her quads no one would care.

Zagitova's skating is stiff and ugly and she looks like she hates every minute of it. I wish there were a place in skating for Satoko. What a beautiful, elegant skater.

Rika lights up the ice in a way Zagitova has never done for me. She also seems to recover quickly from bad programs and falls. Also, her being more prominent means I get to see more of my fave Tamura, and not just for shallow reasons either, you judgmental queens. I like his personality, he's very blunt and funny.

R431 the Mao/Dai Ubers are vicious, insane and have a lot of time on their hands. It's the worst possible combination. It pisses me off that they're going after Rika along with the crazy Russians.

R414 Which of the junior men are you excited about? I like Petr and of course Gogo and his jumps can't be ignored, but I don't really see anything special about the other guys. I guess I don't consider Camden a true junior.

Some of Hanyu-Med fans were straight up saying Zagitova's injury was fake. Loll. Not sure if it was true or not I don't know about her injury, but I think I know the script, if Zagitova withdraws from Nats, they will say she's scared of losing to quadster girls and Med at Nationals.

On a different note, it seems all spotlights are now on Kihira. Uno's media hype should rest in peace.

Are high and low scores thrown out?

R442 Are Hanyu fans really saying that? I hope it's antis that are posing as fans because that's ironic.

So Uno prefers to be in Hanyu's shadow and for Hanyu to deal with the media. I guess now he has found his equivalent in the ladies field. Itsuki's book fansigning event was in vain.

LOL, R431, so typical of the Russian and Georgian judges to try to cheat their skaters ahead of the clearly deserving winner. Kihira is only 16 but skates with such speed and maturity. She doesn't seem like a junior at all. The Russian assembly line will keep cranking out forgettable skater after forgettable skater. Zagitova is good but bland. Medvedeva was interesting but had her flaws. Sotnikova won an Olympic Gold, but does anyone really remember her? But the Russians don't care. Whoever the flavor of the month is in 2022 on the Russian side will get hyped and likely "win" no matter what.

Itsuki’s event had some busted mannequins. I’ve only seen a couple of tweets about the book signing so far (and only photos of Uno's costumes and clear files), but apparently there was an overwhelming amount of press, likely to ask Itsuki about his brother’s GPF performance. A fan was asked to speak on camera, so maybe there will be something on local news.

R431, I’m not sure about the fans and judges, but I was listening to Tarasova’s commentary about Kihira’s FS and she was very complimentary.

R445, I disagree that everyone on that ‘assembly line’ is forgettable. Samodurova, artistically speaking, was quite fun and exciting to watch. She was a revelation for me at this GP.

Also from Itsuki's event:

[quote] Messing should get a recognition medal for Most Dramatic Fall.

I always root for him, he has such lovely skating technique. That fall was an 😱😱😱 one. Ouch.

R443 yes

The Georgian judge job yesterday seemed to be to be sure that the Russian scores are kept in.

She will judge Men at Worlds. So she shouldn't cause too much problems. Kolyada will pop and fall enough time to make scores not relevant and Aliev will likely forget half of his program.

GALA

Gogolev

Hawayek/Baker

Kim

Mishina/Galliamov

Voronov

Guignard/Fabbri

Sakamoto

Tarasova/Morozov

Brezina

Lajoie/Lagha

Peng/Jin

Myihara

Balde

__

Messing

Kostornaia

Della Monica/Guarise

Cha

Shevechenko/Eremenko

Tuk

Pulkinen

Sinistina/Katsalapov

Zagitova

Uno

Hubbell/Donohue

Kihira

James/Cipres

Chen

451 Pulkinen? A non-Canadian junioe 5th place finisher got a spot with the medalists? He must have a killer exhibition.

Very happy for Kostornaia in jgp. As for Alina, I think many people are (voluntarily?) forgetting that she grew 8 cm in a period of 6 months which of course would impact her jumps. Look at Marin Honda or for men at Nam Nguyen or even Cha when they had their growth spurt. The fact that despite growing so rapidly and having her body mature she can still be silver at gpf is a testimony of what a fighter she is. Also she never was Eteri's favourite before Med's departure, far from it with how she was treated, so I see her as not crumbling if Eteri starts giving more attention to the junior girls. Can never be worst than Eteri telling 14 years old Alina with a broken leg that she was lazy and should not come back if she can't train. As for Kihira, I certainly prefer her to Satoko and her micro underrotated jumps as Japan's top lady so I hope she can keep her hegemony.

I heard Zagitova's father is very tall. Maybe growth spurt won't leave her alone anytime soon.

I love Jason Brown but he'll never be a World or Olympic champion. He doesn't have "killer instinct" and was raised and trained in much too soft and gentle a manner.

He needs a REAL MAN to teach him how to compete and WIN.

Which real man

r455 Excuse me.

I think Jason's bigger problem is that he doesn't have a consistent quad.

Yes, a REAL MAN like Yuzuru! I wonder if Yuzu would be a good coach? It must be difficult for a perfectionist to watch and not have it all in his hands - but Brian said Yuzu was just like him as a young man and I guess he manages (at least with a certain type.)

R455 I'm available.

So Hanyu needs to fuck our virgin Brown to turn him into a REAL MAN.

I see.

Both of them are virgins and need to fuck each other. Perfect.

Javi is still around (#2) - someone upthread or on the other thread? said: "Javier Raya is still around...I mean on ice, not on grindr"

And there's this old photo where Yuzu is stretching to reach him. Maybe there's stuff we don't know about our hermit prince?

Nah I don't believe it. No one has hit that bum, otherwise there would be rumors floating about.

Why do people think Brown is a virgin? Unlike Hanyu he does seem to have social life and no stalkers to make him paranoid.

[R465] Prob because he acts like a little kid.

He seems to do everything with his parents and be really close to them. I'm not sure Brown is necessarily a virgin given his age, but I think it's unlikely he's been in any relationships of any duration. It's not uncommon for elite skaters to have limited to no love and sex life well into their 20s.

Maybe we can help Jason find a hot Canadian now that he's in Toronto.

I was a little surprised that Hanyu flew back to Canada ONE day before his birthday. It made me think there was someone up there he wanted to celebrate with, instead of his family. I mean as far as rehab, how much difference can one day make?

Lots of National Championships next week-end

Number of Senior entries

MEN

France: 9 + the guy from Monaco as a guest

Italy: 8

Sweden: 7

Austria: 6

Four Nations (it is Poland, Hungary, Czech and Slovakia rolled together): can't find the entry list

Spain: 2

Finland: 3

Switzerland: 7

LADIES

France: 7 + 1 guest representing Switzerland

Italy: 12

Sweden: 15

Austria: 12

Four Nations (it is Poland, Hungary, Czech and Slovakia rolled together): can't find the entry list

Spain: 1

Finland: 12

Switzerland: 18

PAIRS

France: 4

Italy: 2 (Italy have 3 spots for Euros)

Sweden: 0

Austria: 1

Four Nations (it is Poland, Hungary, Czech and Slovakia rolled together): can't find the entry list

Spain: 2

Finland: 0

Switzerland: 15-16 December

DANCE

France: 4

Italy: 6

Sweden: 0

Austria: 0

Four Nations (it is Poland, Hungary, Czech and Slovakia rolled together): can't find the entry list

Spain: 2

Finland: 1

Switzerland: 2

R468 Who told you he was back Toronto one day before his birthday ? Loll

R470. I'm not R468 but I saw it all over Twitter. R468 who do you think he wanted to celebrate his birthday with? And don't say Med lol. I'm trying to think who would be there for his birthday.

Media only had chance to interview Brian when he and Cha arrived in Vancouver for GPF. Who knows when Yuzuru was back Canada ?

Yuzu's birthday is usually during the GPF, I doubt he's had opportunity to celebrate it properly (meaning on the exact date) for years. Most likely it's not a big deal for him, especially with the way he prioritizes his skating.

It was reported in multiple places - you should keep up with the Yuzu forums :) Some were happy he'd be able to see that big fan poster put up at a busstop near TCC on his actual birthday. But missing it so many years, you'd think the one year he was in Japan and could have celebrated with his family - his father, sister (and her family?), grandparents, etc., that he would have, unless he had a good reason.

Anyway I was certainly NOT implying he was going to be with Med lol -- but being there since 2012, surely it's possible he's close to someone in Toronto that we don't know anything about? He pretty much hides from view whenever possible, so why not?

R474 Like no. Apparently 12/6 was the day Japanese media interviewed Brian when he was at GPF with Cha and knew about that. Not necessarily the day Yuzuru was back to Canada.

His height is listed as 176 cm, R454, hardly “very tall.”

R468 You know that Hanyu's mom went back to Toronto with him, meaning he has a family member to celebrate with. He doesn't even go to tcc without her but sure he went back to have a cosy lovey dovey evening with Medov. You are no better than the lowest Japanese gossip rags with these thinly veiled allusions. As some people have already mentioned for years his birthday happened during gpf meaning he probably doesn't even care about celebrating it. And he has always gone back to Toronto in the past years once the resting period was over and it was time to start rehabilitation. He is probably also under a lot of pressure for missing gpf and potentially nationals so that might explain his hurry to go back to TCC. Though I hope the results of silver collector Shoma at gpf have shut the trap of most antis for some time.

pic taken during Helsinki GP, I guess

from right to left....I am not sure but I think he can be the referee of the Ladies event, Brian Orser, the Technical Specialist for Men and Ladies, British skater Phil Harris, the Technical Specialist for Dance, the Assistant Technical Specialist for Men and Ladies....

What? Med is the last person I'd think Yuzuru would go back to Toronto for, sheesh.

Oops I meant to sign that R468 - and I still find it unusual that he'd go on back to Canada then but hey, it may have nothing to do with anyone up there (other than a rehab specialist and maybe to watch the GPF with some other TCCers - but not her - god no.

r478 Brian and the tech specialist look cozy. But Cha and Hanyu still got hit with URs.

R478 OK but I wonder why Phillip Harris was there.

R482 to get the points to beat Virtanen!

R481 wow they're practically on each other's laps

R483 If you think that tank top is an useful tool...

OMG I've never heard Meryl Davis' voice before. I've heard 3 year olds with a lower pitch. Surely she's not going to become a commentator?

Here's Brian talking about Yuzuru and whether he'll complete the season. He seems to say yes - and then he says he doesn't know a lot about the situation. Anyway, bring back Elladj please!!

R485 In ISU headquarters the tank top from 1989 is still considered fashionable

R486 You must not have heard Avonly Nguyen voice either.

Oh lord. It's like she's sucked helium out of a balloon before speaking. And so anxious to drone - well, squeak on and on about demons in them and their program or something... Ugh.

Apparently Mao fans think Rika was being arrogant and disrespectful for saying she wants to win in 2022. Also, someone edited the gpf wiki to say that Hanyu's reason for WD was death. I often wonder who these people are. Are they posting from the psych ward?

Huge crush on Daniil (灬´ิω´ิ灬). He's so cute and galant.

r468 r474 He was already back in Toronto for rehab and further treatment when Orser was interviewed by Japanese press on the 5th. Flying during the week is the best time to travel to avoid detection. Unless plans have changed, he also has to return to Japan by the end of the month for some important TV appearances. He’s an adult, so he’s not going to rearrange his schedule just to celebrate his birthday on the day.

About 60 fans came to Itsuki’s event according to local TV news. Still no video. More photos on the bookstore twitter: @junku_nagoyaten

r486 Sounded to me like Orser was saying: nope, no Nationals.

Good point R493 - I took him too literally when at the beginning he says, "He has every intention of competing for the rest of the season..." but then he goes on to say Yuzuru will stay off the ice as long as the doctors tell him to, will take it slow, etc. So I guess he didn't mean that at all - or he simply meant he has every intention of competing at Worlds in late March. It makes me cringe to think of him at Nationals - it's just too soon. It's getting to the point that I cringe every time I think of him jumping at all, after what's happened the last couple years. I think Yuzu said something like there wasn't enough ligament left in his ankle to cut on (they cut and tighten frayed ligaments - when they can) Ai yi yi...

TSL Zagreb/GP - 1 hr 53 mins! A whole lot of pairs and ice dance that goes in one ear and out the other, but a lot of analysis of who's good and why, and vice versa...

Biggest detail that jumped out at me: Minute 44: Rika Kihira is going to Colorado to work on quads in January/February in high altitude (she's landed quad toe and quad salchow, don't know about others). So look out Zags - you and Med may have a lot to commiserate about soon enough.

They think Gogo should go back to Orser but Brian is too stretched thin - especially the stupid week-long trip to China (with promise of more) and his other newbies - but lately a "shit sandwich" for Brian with Gogo distancing himself, Med's troubles, Boyang mess. 28 Karen Preston with Jason; looks like he's given up even thinking of 4S anymore. They think Kolyada should be vying for world champ but something's really wrong in training. 34 Rumor of Ashley at Nationals but Dave doesn't believe it. 52 Sad about Camden going downhill - something's wrong with his training too with Tom/Tammy. Why aren't they fixing his crossed leg air position?

54 Pairs/Ice Dance all the way to 1hr 27. Then men. Don't like the way Nathan has watered down his programs so much - empty artistically. Shoma: how long can we keep watching him make so many mistakes, same wonky foot technique, the "checking with the arm". Called Jun the "gentle giant" but he needs ballet to improve posture - he's too floppy, Jon said his hands are "dead energy." But in ladies - Tuk's aggressive internet strategy is clouding judges' eyes to her sloppy empty technique (other than her jumps, which are great). Dave's friend said watching her was like seeing a leaf being blown around in the wind.

Satoko losing confidence in her jumps - Kaori benefited from going after Satoko because she has power/speed/big jumps but low artistry. Hates Sofia's bent tano but thinks she should go to Worlds over Med because consistency (unless Med is amazing at Natls.) But Zag is faltering: wouldn't even deserve 8's if not an Oly champ. Bad balance, bad posture, throwing herself into jumps, even 2A labored. Bad music, clutter, arms overchoreo'd. Does have great spins and is pretty; works hard but nobody's fixing her flaws. Rika not Satoko-level artistic but she's "in the music" and good details on the beats. She's stronger mentally than Zags. A joy in her skating.

A bit about jrs: Trusova being a one-trick pony and they shouldn't send her and Anna out there with low-percentage quads (Jon called her skate a "freak show") -Trusova should have only had the toe, which she landed. Their technique sucks and won't last. While Kihira's team is doing it right - with quads carefully, slowly coming along.

* I think it was actually Kurt Browning who called Cha the "gentle giant" - I listened to his commentary on the GP today. And Patrick Chan! I have to admit he was pretty good at commentating. Not one bitchy comment! Amazeballs!

I strongly agree with the comment about Cha. He needs to strengthen his back. The 'floppy' comment is right on point.

I think TSL is being a little harsh on Trusova, she's only 14 and a junior. But I agree that her team needs to help her develop more of a full package so she's not reliant on those quads. I was relieved Korstanaia beat her at the JGPF as rrusova was subpar.

Re Jason Brown, TSL thinks he's given up on the quad sal, did they mention if he might go for another quad like the toe loop? He landed a beautiful one that was only slightly underrotated at Skate America one year.

Interview with Zagitova where she basically comfirmed she doesn't get involved with Med now, she won't say what happened between them and she thinks there is no real friendship in sports. Tbf if anyone believes in their fake looking af friendship at PyeongChang, it's their problem.

I don't understand why anyone would've thought Med and Zag were close. I'm sure they had a professional and polite relationship when they trained together, but that's different from a close friendship. It's rare for close competitors to be friends (Kristi Yamaguchi & Nancy Kerrigan was an exception back in the day).

Even as a regional level competitor, my friends at the rink were generally recreational skaters, hockey players, or competing in a different discipline. I temporarily lost a friendship with another skater when we went from being at different levels to direct competitors - things just got too heated between us. When she switched to synchronized skating we once again became friends.

[R498] Agree so much with what was said about Trusova. Hope she can become more than a one-trick pony.

What they said about Jason was in regards to not leaving all that empty space in the program for the 4S. It's much better now without it. Dave implied nothing about giving up on the jump in general.

I think TSL is right in that Trusova and especially Shcherbakova are being pushed to do difficult layouts before they're fully ready and at the expense of other aspects of their skating. Trusova's program is disjointed and weird so when she splats there is nothing else to latch onto. Shcherbakova left out the two 4lz in Bratislava, skated cleanly and got a higher score. Shcherbakova can be really expressive and lovely to watch so I don't know why they're forcing her to put in the quads before she can land them consistently - she's seems to be losing confidence and looking distressed.

I'm glad Rika is with Hamada. Hamada is clearly playing the long game, and if you look at her skaters - Satoko, Rika, Yuna - they have nice, detailed programs with amazing flow and ice coverage so it's clear they care about more than just jumps.

R492 I had wondered how all the promotional activities would affect Uno. He seems like someone who benefits from being left alone, so he doesn't have to think about his image, fans, sponsors, legacy etc. The eagerness from his camp to capitalize on his OSM and increasing status seems to be distracting for him and now that JSF is focusing on Rika and he's being dropped like a hot potato, I wonder how things will turn out for him. Maybe it's a good thing and he'll actually have motivation to correct his technique, but is it just too late to do this? Do we have examples of athletes who successfully corrected serious flaws in technique later in their career? Mao had big issues with her jumps - URs, flutz, 3A take off, 3f and think she might have fixed some of these by the end of her career, but she also became less consistent.

R499 This is what I respect about Zags, even if I dislike her skating. She's straightforward and honest and doesn't play PR games. Unfortunately, I think this season is her last best chance of getting a WC to go with the OGM. When her tech is surpassed by younger skaters, I don't think they'll be able to justify propping her up on PCS.

r504 I think Zag still may be relevant next season. Little quadsters seem inconsistent and so is Rika Kihira.

I get a sense she will quit after this season. She considered to retire last season, Eteri said so,and Zags herself said so, she also stressed many times how hard it was to comeback post Olympic season after winning Olympic Gold and never mentioned about next seasons, next Olympics... She seems already satisfied with her career and ready for a new life outside skating.

R505 Is Kostornaia turning senior next year? Her tech content isn't far below Zags and she's a more well-rounded skater. Rika was inconsistent in juniors but she is much better this season. Shcherbakova is inconsistent and shouldn't be including quads in her program right now. Trusova is more consistent (with some generous judging), but who knows whether her technique will survive growing pains and greater scrutiny.

So sure, if Zags wanted, she could be "relevant" for another couple of seasons. But as an OGM, is that all she wants to be? I think she wants that WC and this season is her best chance.

R504, I agree. I like Alina's personality. I thinks she'll do fine after she retires, she's got a good head on her shoulders.

Will Med even podium at Nationals? Will she get picked to go to Worlds?

R509 who are serious contenders right now? Zags, Tuk, Med, Sofia? If she doesn't seriously fuck up, I think Med has a good chance.

Samodurova has been very consistent this season and it seem unlikely the Russian fed would choose Med over Tuk and Zagitova no matter how nationals go.

r503 I agree completely. It would’ve helped if his family provided a safe place from that pressure, but they’ve chosen to exploit his fame instead. His coach should also stop choreographing his programs and allow him to try something new.

It’s finally happening. Tabloids are starting to report Kozuka’s infidelities. Most of the sources (“sports writers” “friends” and “witnesses”) are likely from tweets and photos that were around a long time ago, and some of the information is common knowledge in the figure skating community (Kozuka’s partying habits with Takahashi and Hirokazu Kobayashi when they were young), but there are some specifics. Kozuka would often go to a Shibuya club (Camelot probably) after competitions and work, and always take a girl back to the same hotel. He had a birthday party at the club this year in the VIP area and called over one of the pro male dancers to have a dance off because he (Kozuka) thought he was a better dancer and wanted to show off in front of the girls there. Since he was always out drinking or partying and often didn’t come home, the wife was left to take care of their child and house by herself. She moved out with their daughter two months ago and returned to Tokyo.

R511

[quote]He had a birthday party at the club this year in the VIP area and called over one of the pro male dancers to have a dance off

damnit. I thought you were going somewhere else with this.

R511 It seems like the Japanese press is pretty good at covering things up until they can't or don't want to anymore. What are the chances that Hanyu is living it up while the rest of the world thinks he's a hermit living in his cave? I guess I think it's unlikely given the scrutiny he's under and the people who are eager to dig up shit on him, but I wonder sometimes whether he has more of a life than we think. Are there any credible rumors in the Japanese forums about him?

I feel like since he lives in a closet the closest thing we can get on Hanyu is checking his browser history for porn and hentai. He apparently watches so many things that surprises people. The boy doesnt have a social media but doesn't mean he isn't on it also. Perhaps as a sweet boy he destresses as an online troll. After all, he's free to post anonymously on this thread.

R514 He's Daitroll

He writes all that wacko stuff that can be found about him on the internet.

R514 He's Dirt Czar. Notice all the dirt on Dai, Miki and Kozuka and the absence of dirt on Hanyu. I'm choosing to ignore Dirt Czar's fluent English. Give us something salacious about Hanyu, Dirt Czar, or consider yourself unmasked.

He is CanadianSkaterGuy.

R518 LOL I was thinking of him too.

R514 Didn't someone find Hanyu's youtube account at some point? Evidence being that a folder called Hope & Legacy (with Joe Hisaishi's music) was created before his program was publicly announced? The saved videos were exactly the type of videos you'd expect Hanyu to save, unfortunately - skating, jpop types stuff.

Linked is the account some say is Hanyu's - or rather, was, because it hasn't been added to in ages. (I'm not saying it is! I have no idea - just saw a link to it once, on GS I think, or maybe PH)

r512 Sorry, even his cheating is uninspired. (Actually, the most common reaction to this Kozuka news has been, “But his skating is so boring…”)

R513 He’s a self-professed homebody. I don’t think living it up is his thing and the same could be said of most of the current generation of Japanese skaters. They did grow up watching the drama-filled previous generation with their unplanned pregnancies, criminal relatives, secret lovers, drunk driving, coke binges with famous actors, and sudden marriages and divorces. Tanaka, Hino, and Hanyu do plan to do some traveling together once they’ve all retired.

R517 R514 The same username had an account on OKWave in 2013 that politely asked some questions about homework (he was thinking about writing a report on illegal downloading and iTunes for an IT class) and Puzzle & Dragons (he spent 9000 yen on the game in two days and shared his ID so other gamers could add him to their friends list). He admitted he was a minor living overseas and his profile indicated he was a university student originally from Miyagi prefecture.

Now, if that really was his youtube account, it adds to the rumors about him and Yukiko Fujisawa. (Kanako Murakami allegedly once said that Fujisawa and Hanyu were dating. Some think “yy” could be “Yukiko and Yuzuru.”) But the account shows his full name, which is why some also think it isn’t him despite the timing of the Hope & Legacy playlist.

yy, aww that's cute.

Hanyu, if you're reading this, go get laid, boy

Anyone saw Cha's style at GPF banquet party ????

You mean this? Apparently he's also kind of injured - boot problems, on painkillers.

Despite the Uno push, seems Japan found their new star in Kihira. A long-awaited GPF gold medal mean much more than silver or the OSM, I guess. Ratings for ladies were around 17% with 22% at Kihira's score. Men were at 13% with around 18% for Uno's score.

R521

[quote]secret lovers...coke binges with famous actors

Okay, I can attach names to most of the deadly sins on your list except for these two (unless "secret lovers" is just Miki and Kozuka). Tell us more!

Poor Hanyu just wants to retreat to his room to play games and illegally download music. Hopefully, Rika's rise will take some of the pressure off him so he can be left alone and go live his life.

R525 Yeah, maybe Korean guys are suckers for that street style but c'mon it was at a banquet party. I started to think Phillip Harris's tank top is more fashionable.

The ad for Japanese Nationals has Dai as the third man and not Keiji - or Tomono, who earned them that third spot at Worlds! Yuzuru and Wakaba in the picture too. With four women pictured, you'd think they could have made more room for a fourth or even fifth guy.

R521 What happened to Yukiko Fujisawa? I watched that youtube video and she had terrific jumps and nice spins for a 12 year old. LOL the video had over 90K views for a novice skater most people have never heard of. Wonder why. Poor boy can't even pine for his ex on the internet without people gawking.

Is there a deadline to announce withdrawal from Japanese nats? I'm wondering how long Yuzu is going to wait unless he really intends to compete. And if he doesn't go, I suppose Brian will go with Med to Russnats.

why aren't we in the poster?

R532 Because your star wattage would overshadow all those pretenders.

Cha looks ready to play chess with the senior citizens at the local park.

R534 Are the Dr. Scholl's orthopedic comfort shoes part of this look or is it because he's injured?

I thought this thread would appreciate this gif.

R536 Yes, yes, YES! That is what we need to see more of here.

Such a perfect little tush is so deserving of two OGMs.

R535 I think is part of the look. R536 I still don't know what he did during that program because my eyes were glued to his ass. Such a treat.

The chance of that yt acc not being his is nearly zero. Maybe he created a new one or set it to private after people found out about it.

1. He hadn't been too famous back then when he created it. There was no need to worry people knowing its existence and freaked out so no need to use other ID trying to hide his name. Like who cares Kanaka Keiji, Hino ryuju,Shingo Nishiyama.. . having a yt account or not and which video they liked, which playlists they created today if they have one?

2. Yuzuru Hanyu name itself won't put the acc under suspicion. Just based on the chanel name or the ID, who would believe it was his acc when there are tons of SNS accs named after him. Sometimes, the more you try to hide, the more suspicious-looking you are.

3. Jpop, Bump of chicken, games, skating, jumps, anime... well it was so Hanyu

4. That Hope & legacy playlist. If it wasn't him, who on earth not only created a Joe Hisaishi playlist but also named it H&L even before the program was announced.

5. The acc hasn't linked or added more videos after it was rumored to be his acc.

I don´t know when the deadline for him to withdraw from Jnats is but he withdrew from the GPF the Thursday before the competition and my guess is that we will see him withdraw by Thursday or Friday !

R536 Not a fan of the PPS, but dear god they made his ass look magical.

R540 After media fuss created during GPF passed. Maybe next 2 or 3 days. I guess.

R527 Ando and the secret father of her child. (Ando and Kozuka are close though he's probably not the father and Ando doesn't seem like his type.) Sugiri for the drugs.

R529 Takahashi works for Fuji and his comeback story is a big part of nationals. Fuji has also been filming something about him that hasn't been released yet. Tanaka hasn't produce results but it is strange they left out Tomono after he medaled in Russia and kept that big space open.

R530 She retired last year at Eastern Collegiate sectionals. She didn't place high enough for nationals. I think she also graduated from university and is probably living a regular adult life now.

Suguri

R539 Can you please drop that subject already. It was old 2 years ago. Whether it's his account or not, unless you are an asshole who doesn't give a crap about his multiple requests to respect his privacy and just want to cause drama and gossip, it's completely unnecessary.

I'm sorry what? Of course we want drama and gossip! Why are you here for then? And btw I didn't know about the account, so thank you to whoever brought it up.

R546 There are plenty of attention whores happy to satisfy your hunger for fresh gossip without resorting to pulling out old shit which was never proven about a guy who lives like a monk and begs people to leave him the fuck alone.

R547 The only thing I get from that youtube account is that Hanyu in his private life is pretty much as he appears in public. What "old shit" are you talking about?

The link for the livestream of Swiss National Championships....if you really have free time during the weekend...

R547 thank you for protecting Hanyu from the horrors of the DL, I'm sure he's very grateful lmao.

What's wrong with bringing the channel up?

And wtf with Yuzuru living like a monk ? You are labelling him fuck you.

Link to follow Swedish National Championships during the weekend

R549 Thanks, Alexia. "Fans" is correct. Your popularity on DL is second only to quaddoctor.

R553 Finnish Skating Association wants us to pay to see Nationals with QuadDoctor, Emmie Peltonen and Viveca Lindfors

please, choose the worst dancers from the banquet...from 10.50

R554 thank you!! I was going to purchase the season pass, but it seems I've missed out on most of the competitions for this season, like the 2nd Nat'l Synchronized Skating Qualification. How did I overlook this????!!!!!

We should get a livestream of Spanish National Championships this weekend

There is the big Men show down between

FRANCISCO JAVIER RAYA BUENACHE

HÉCTOR ALONSO SERRANO

r555 I'd like to see everyone win, so can I vote for all of them? Nathan especially has sick dad moves.

R557 I had no idea that was Raya's full name.

R559 Me neither...the only real objective of Spanish Nationals is to see once in a year the full names...

and the Spanish version of Kiril Khaliavin name which apparently is KIRILL JALYAVIN TOPOROV.

Created a new thread.

I dont know about you but I do want to see the spanish nationals, especially ice dance Arent italian nationals this weekend too? Whoever can provide links, ilu

R562 yes, Italian Nationals start tomorrow. Last year they had a free livestream on youtube

Results page is up

Link to result page for French Nationals. They start tomorrow

Tuk has pneumonia and won't be competing in Nats.

The Olympic channel sure knows how to get those retweets and likes for little effort.

R566, wow... they sound like the awkward uncle who tries to be hip at family gathering R563, R564, thanks for the links! Guess this weekend is all sorted

Yuzu: I miss Javi Javi: sorry, you were saying something?

(Picture from Eric Radford's instagram, posted 1h ago).

Is Javier Fernandez going to Spanish nats?

R569 He's not competing, but will make an appearance at the gala.

R566 Meryl's a pretty good interviewer, despite her voice. She tried to goad Orser into talking about Gogo by asking about the future of Canadian figure skating. He said there were promising juniors, especially in the men's field, but didn't name Gogo specifically. Orser called Jason "the Mayor" and says he gets along with everyone. Said that the reason Javi wants to go to Euros is because he wants to break Plush's record (however, he forgot that Plush was the one holding the record).

R568 This is caption to Eric's post: "It seems I have a thing with Spanish guys"

R517 If I were Eric's beau, I would start worrying.

R572 You think so? Seems all in good fun, though I wouldn't be surprised if Eric's accidentally slipped it in once or twice while bf was looking the other way. Remember Med's post from this summer with Eric and Javi making a surprise appearance?

Oh-kay, picture at R568 is hot. Or maybe i'm just really horny. Maybe both?

R569 The real question is: "is he serious about competing at Euro?"

R571 If it had been asked months ago, he would had sung "I have a talented junior whose name is Gogolev, my team is doing amazing with him" song.

R575, you're right. if I get my head out of my pants, the Gogo-Brian cooldown is the juiciest scandal going on atm. Too bad we have so next to no inside info about it, just speculation. (Eric and Javi remain hot however. Is there any chance they're fucking? Who knows how far Canadians go to make a Spaniard feel welcome in their country?)

R575 Look at the field at Euros though. How serious does Javi have to be?

Saw some delusional person try to argue that since Gogo is still part of TCC and Brian is head coach at TCC, Brian is still technically Gogo's coach. Uh huh. That's why Gogo changed Orser's status to "former coach" posthaste even when there was no need. Something definitely happened between Orser and Gogo/Gogo's parents.

R577 He might not lose to Kolyada but he can lose to anyone else Aliev, Brezina, Moris Kvit..., if they do their best and he fucks up.

R578 You're right. I was only thinking of Kolyada and Aliev. I'm actually rooting for Brezina. He's been working his ass off all season and has been pretty consistent.

Euro podium will obviously be 1) Virtanen 2) Boe 3) Basar Oktar

I don't know r580, Basar Oktar has a lot of momentum from his third place finish at Bosphorus Cup.

R568 Cue Javier's Instagram with a new post proclaiming mad, passionate love to his GF, or since we're talking about Javi here, maybe even a proposal. Isn't he due for another one any day now?

Dirt Czar, educate us! There is some scandal involving the commentators at JNats that I'm seeing on twitter but don't have time to figure out. What's going on?

Meryl should have come right out and directly asked Orser about Gogolev. And figure skating fans wonder why no one takes this sport seriously.

R577 It never ceases to amaze me how dumb so many FS fans are. What they should be debating is how long before Gogo leaves TCC.

Misha Ge will be at JNats with Tomono.

R585 Just MIsha or will Misha's assistant (aka Tomono's real coach) be joining him?

I am the real coach.

R587 Sorry! Hopefully you'll be wearing your signature leather gloves so we don't get confused.

Tuk out of Russian Nationals due to pneumonia.

Well, sucks for her. She was on a roll, probably would have qualified for Worlds. Now it's probably the end of season for her.

R589 Nah, I bet she's still going to Worlds. It's one thing if she were WD because of an injury. This is just pneumonia and she should be fine by Worlds. My question is, if Med places above Sofia, would RusFed still give both Mishin students a pass to Worlds?

R584 I hope the reason for the split is something else besides just inattention - last season was Olys where TCC had 3 contenders, so it's understandable the focus isn't going to be on some 12 year old, no matter how talented (and even then, Brian managed to plug Gogo in all the interviews he did about Javi/Hanyu). This season, Brian has taken on new students, but the fact of the matter is, Gogo bombed one competition. Hardly surprising at his age and level of difficulty.

A big issue for Gogo, besides growth, is his utter lack of charisma. He's doing super difficult stuff but he's just going through the motions and it shows. Brian is good at selling the complete package bs, so at least if he's with Brian, people will find a way to see "artistry." It might not matter though, the Canadian crowd gave him a standing O after each performance and the promo videos at GPF described him as "the future." If Brian and the parents don't patch things up, I think it would be weird for Gogo to stay at TCC. Who's going to promote him? Lee Barkell can barely emote in the K&C. Maybe Doug Haw can go on TSL and wax poetic about his jumps and artistry. What would be a good place for him besides TCC? He should go to Eteri. I hear she's good with young skaters.

r591 I don't think Gogo just goes through motions. He matched the music quite well - both in timing and in expression. His sharpness suited the type of music he skated to and there were moments he seemed quite fierce. I agree that he lacks certain outward expressivness, but his programs hide this weakness. Personally, I don't need him to become a Hanyu, if he becomes a Nathan with more transitions, I'll be pleased.

Nationals this week

Spain

France

Italy

Sweden

Finland

Poland-Hungary-Slovakia-Czech Republic (they hold one together)

Austria

Switzerland

Israel (I hope they can hold it in a regular size rink this year)

maybe some other country...

R592 Sorry, we'll just have to disagree. I'm not comparing Gogo to Hanyu, they are obviously very different skaters. Nathan's skating was more playful and expressive at around the same age. Nathan can still be playful and expressive when he's not worried about all his jumps.

The other juniors at GPF all had something I liked - Petr wasn't really on this competition, but when he is, his carriage and jumps are beautiful. Adam, Koshiro, all had nice elements in their programs (Camden, before his meltdown, was obviously great, but he's too old so I'm not going to be unfair and compare Gogo to him). Gogo skated the same way in both his programs. He has a super cute, super thick Canadian accent, I'll give him that. If he finds a way to work it into a program, I'll be charmed.

If Gogolev were just another 13-year-old, I'd cut him some slack on the performance aspect and say we should give him time to mature. However, he's a 13-year-old whose country wants him to be an OGM in 3 years at the age of 17, so I'm skeptical.

I would hope no one here is ignorant enough to compare Hanyu to any other skater, let alone that Canadian human jump machine. There is simply no one like him in figure skating.

Gogo's lack of charisma when he skates is apparent to anyone who knows what the word means. And I don't recall Orser ever saying anything about him having artistry, just that he's young and needs to develop as a skater. My guess is that mommy and/or daddy are push, push, pushing him and if that's the case, things may not end well for him.

R583 I'm answering your question in the next thread.

Lack of charisma ???? C'mon. You don't like his skating and don't like him personally ofc he has no charisma in your eyes. Did anyone here finds Med has charisma, or so called Xfactor likeability, star quality.... which her fans ramble day and night ? No? Did anyone here find Rika Kihira of 2 years ago has the aura which everyone hypes up these days about her ? No ?

Finishing out this thread, here are some delightful photos of Mao Asada and Yuzuru

R598 LMAO, you're apoplectic that people find Gogolev lacking in charisma? There can't be differing opinions about that sort of thing? 2 years ago, was Rika hyped to be the next OGM in 3 years? I don't like Med's skating but yes, she had charisma, even as a young skater.

r600 Geez, and you don't sound hysterical at all. have to agree with r598. Gogo's got enough for his age. I enjoy watching him no less than others and more than most.

r595. Why can't we cut him some slack? Just because his fed wants him to become a OGM at 17? He won't. The fed may push him as much as they want to but Gogo won't win the next Olys just like Nathan didn't. Other than the history being against him, in 2 years when he switches to seniors the growth problems will start full-force. There's no way he will remain unaffected. Gogo's fine, lets hope he survives the growth spurt and that all the push won't fuck him up.

In other sorta news, apparently Kovtun lost 13 kilos before this season? Maybe that accounts for the fact that he's got the 6th highest average score of all men this season according to the site below, which means he fucks up less than others. Maybe he actually can beat Kolyada who fucks up majorly, all the time and will be under pressure at Russian Nats.

The site being scatingscores.

Why is this still open. Bye!