Stepping into the Holiday Treason! (The Mueller Investigation Part 61)

Link to Previous Thread for Reference:

Previous thread titles for reference:

First Charges Filed in Mueller Investigation (10/27/17)

First Charges Filed in Mueller Investigation, Part Two (10/28/17)

The Four Treasons: Mueller Investigation, Part 3 (10/31/17)

A Man For All Treasons: Mueller Investigation, Part 4 (11/5/17)

It's Beginning to Look a lot like Treason! The Mueller Investigation Part 5 (12/4/17)

Treason Is The Reason For The Season! The Mueller Investigation Part 6 (12/16/17)

Treason to Believe (The Mueller Investigation Part 7) (12/26/17)

I Love You For Sentimental Treasons (The Mueller Investigation Part 8) (1/3/18)

Give Me One Treason To Stay Here... (The Mueller Investigation Part 9) (1/15/18)

Treasons of Love (The Mueller Investigation Part 10) (1/24/18)

For Treasons Which Are Well Known To Them (The Mueller Investigation Part 11) (1/30/18)

Come on and Treason Down, Treason Down the Road (The Mueller Investigation Part 12) (2/6/18)

13 Treasons Why (The Mueller Investigation Part 13) (2/18/18)

By Treason of Insanity (The Mueller Investigation Part 14) (2/23/18)

The Edge of Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 15) (2/28/18)

A Treason to Live; A Treason to Die (The Mueller Investigation Part 16)…(3/10/18)

Treasons of the Heart (The Mueller Investigation Part 17) (3/17/18)

A Stormy Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 18) (3/21/18)

Lovin', Touchin', Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 19) (3/26/18)

Everything Happens for a Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 20) (4/4/18)

For All the Right Treasons (The Mueller Investigation Part 21) (4/11/18)

Treasons Change (The Mueller Investigation Part 22) (4/16/18)

Dangerous Tre'asons (The Mueller Investigation Part 23) (4/22/18)

Don't Stop (the) Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 24) (5/1/18)

Got This Treason in My Body (The Mueller Investigation Part 25) (5/7/18)

I'm Treason on a Jet Plane... (The Mueller Investigation Part 26) (5/14/18)

Treasonnaires' Disease (The Mueller Investigation Part 27) (5/21/18)

You've Lost That Lovin' Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 28) (6/2/18)

Multiple Treasons Why (The Mueller Investigation Part 29) (6/9/18)

For Undisclosed Treasons (The Mueller Investigation Part 30) (6/18/18)

The Apple Doesn't Fall Far from the Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 31) (06/23/18)

Treason d'être (The Mueller Investigation Part 32) (06/30/18)

My Treasons Are Not My Own (The Mueller Investigation Part 33) (07/08/18)

The Treasons a Baby Cries (The Mueller Investigation Part 34) (07/13/19)

Get to Know Your Family Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 35) (07/15/18)

All You Got To Do is Hold Him And Kiss Him and Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 36) (07/17/18)

Fall or Spring? Which Would / Wouldn't Be Your Favorite Treason? (The Mueller Investigation Part 37) (07/18/18)

It's the Time of the Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 38) (07/21/18)

My Treasonal Summer Job Abroad (The Mueller Investigation Part 39) (07/25/18)

Yellow is the Color of the Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 40) (07/27/18)

When will it Be Mushroom Treason? (The Mueller Investigation Part 53) (09/21/18)

The Treason for my Life's Trials and Tribulations (The Mueller Investigation Part 41) (07/31/18)

Hunting Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 42) (08/04/18)

It's Swimsuit Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 43) (08/07/18)

Treasonably Priced (The Mueller Investigation Part 44) (08/12/18)

Tre45onal Affective Disorder (The Mueller Investigation Part 45) (08/16/18)

A Plea for Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 46 (08/21/18)

Untreasonably Hot (The Mueller Investigation Part 47) (08/22/18)

There is a Treason... Turn, Turn, Turn (The Mueller Investigation Part 48) (08/24/18)

The Voice of Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 49) (08/28/18)

The Golden Age of Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 50) (09/03/18)

Treasons for Remaining Anonymous (The Mueller Investigation Part 51) (09/08/18)

Hurricane Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 52) (09/16/18)

All Natural Mushroom Treasoning (The Mueller Investigation Part 53) (The Mueller Investigation Part 53) (09/22/18)

Treasoning with an Alcoholic (The Mueller Investigation Part 54) (09/28/18)

Judicial Treasoning (The Mueller Investigation Part 55) (10/06/18)

Treasons for Hidden Genius (The Mueller Investigation Part 56) (10/15/18)

Trick or Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 57) (10/25/18)

Several Treasons to Get Out and Vote in the Midterms (The Mueller Investigation Part 58) (11/5/18)

Heading Back to the Magical Keebler Elf Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 59) (11/11/18)

It's Turkey Picking Treason (The Mueller Investigation Part 60) (November 18, 2018)

Stepping into the Holiday Treason! (The Mueller Investigation Part 61) (November 26, 2018)

Great title, OP. Appreciate you!

So are the Trump brothers alluding to their annual holiday fisting tradition?

"I'm the puppet!"

"No, I'm the puppet!"

And they both laughed until their fists were sore.

“We’re saying ‘Merry Christmas’ again!”

Interesting prospect concerning this latest accusation of Manafort: "And that 'detailed sentencing submission … sett[ing] forth the nature of the defendant’s crimes and lies' that Mueller mentions in the report? There’s your Mueller report, which will be provided in a form that Matt Whitaker won’t be able to suppress

Nice name OP!

Good news- Moscowfort is going to prison for life. I watched Active Measures this week and fuck this treasonous asshole. Pres Bone Spurs and Moscowfort need to go to jail and be hanged for treason.

I love the title, OP. I just wish I knew now why I blocked you.

Gee R10 it's almost like every Republican in congress is a complete whore who will say and do anything to support Dear Leader.

Sad.

R7 YES! Fucking perfect! Touche’

It’s not the “official” Mueller report that Uncle Fester- Whittaker can mess with, but rather a list of lies and crimes that is going to be submitted to the judge to sentence Manafort to prison.

So, Trump said that the Mueller investigation was in turmoil.

Then Manafort clams up.

Any possibility that Whitaker is pulling a Nunez with Trump?

Any possibility that this is obstruction by Whitaker?

I'd say that's a big affirmative, r14.

But Whittaker is dumber than he looks if he thinks Mueller hasn't planned for this.

We all saw this coming the day Comey was shit canned.

How would we even know if Whitaker was already fucking with Mueller?

r16, how about Trump repeats something he was told by Whitaker, like something about the Mueller investigation...

I think the key thing to watch for here is that the Supremes are going to be deciding a case about whether a person can be tried for the same crime at the state and federal level. There is some concern that if the Supremes rule that a person cannot be tried then it would affect the Mueller investigation. But I'm not convinced. I think we need a real legal expert to weigh in on that. Because it is possible that the issue is so narrowly defines it may have no effect.

This is an interesting post for Political Wire Members, they think Manafort was a double agent:

Most legal experts see no rational explanation for Paul Manafort to break his plea deal with special counsel Robert Mueller by lying in his testimony — unless, of course, Manafort is certain that he’ll be eventually pardoned by President Trump.

The arrangement probably served President Trump’s purposes too, as Marcy Wheeler explains:

Just about the only explanation for Manafort’s actions are that — as I suggested — Trump was happy to have Manafort serve as a mole in Mueller’s investigation.

But Mueller’s team appears to have no doubt that Manafort was lying to them. That means they didn’t really need his testimony, at all. It also means they had no need to keep secrets — they could keep giving Manafort the impression that he was pulling a fast one over the prosecutors, all while reporting misleading information to Trump that he could use to fill out his open book test. Which increases the likelihood that Trump just submitted sworn answers to those questions full of lies.

Please let this be true^^

i think the media isn’t missing the big reveal of the Manafort thing. Most likely, this means Mueller played Manafort like a fiddle. Manafort lied during his umpteen hours of testimony. Mueller knew he was lying but acted like he was appreciating Manafort’s “honesty”. Instead of asking for sentencing for Manafort ten days ago, Mueller told the judge he needed more time to show the full extent of Manafort’s cooperation. The media all read that as a sign Manafort was really stepping up.

Then what happened? Trump submitted his written answers to Mueller. If anyone on Trump’s team relied on cues from Manafort in deciding how to answer those written questions, Trump just committed perjury.

Mueller accusing Manafort of lying must have caught his team completely off guard yesterday.

Trump’s desperate tweets this morning show how freaked out he is.

The noose is tightening.

What were Trump’s desperate tweets, R21?

P.S. I believe Tad Devine is involved with this. I believe he was involved in a computer hack but made the wise decision early on to be honest with Mueller.

I suspect it is Tad Devine who is singing.

Trump freak out

Can someone explain what kind of info Manafort could possibly tell Trump that would affect his written answers to Mueller? I can't wrap my brain around that one.

More

Manafort is pretty sure he will get out of all of this. Why? Did lowlife Trump obstruct justice by promising a pardon?

That’s easy, R26. Let’s imagine Mueller asked Trump whether he was called and updated during the infamous Trump Tower meeting with the Russians. If Manafort told Mueller that Trump was not called and updated during the meeting, Mueller probably acted like he accepted that as fact.

If Manafort’s lawyers or Whittaker passed along how Manafort answered the question, Trump’s written answer matched the way Manafort answered.

All Mueller had to do is sit on his hands to see how Trump would officially testify. If Mueller has proof, that Trump was called and updated during the meeting, they’ve just committed perjury when they thought they were free and clear.

Targets are apparently not sent to the grand jury...Mueller already has what he needs on them. Don Jr., Stone, Pence, Nunes, Ryan, Trump and McConnell will be indicted.

His tweets are just more projection

[quote]And that “detailed sentencing submission … sett[ing] forth the nature of the defendant’s crimes and lies” that Mueller mentions in the report? There’s your Mueller report, which will be provided in a form that Matt Whitaker won’t be able to suppress.

Trump's tweets demonstrate that he never learned the value of "never let 'em see you sweat."

[quote]Which increases the likelihood that Trump just submitted sworn answers to those questions full of lies.

[quote]If anyone on Trump’s team relied on cues from Manafort in deciding how to answer those written questions, Trump just committed perjury.

Just the thought of this is on a par with the best sex ever. Not only in and of itself as the yearned-for game changer; but the possibility, likelihood, that Team Trump blundered so cockily ('I wrote all the answers myself!') into Mueller's exquisite trap.

Dim chubby checkers player thought he could take on stately Grandmaster and win. Not only his loss, but the abject way he'll lose, will cause jubilation and laughter for generations. Trump will be the biggest joke in world history.

This morning's tweets are particularly pathetic. He sounds very desperate -- and, he probably should be. The walls are closing in.

If Mueller has enough to say that Manafort is lying, then he likely has enough to take down the Orange Monster.

I was thinking that the way Manafort could have been played was by Mueller's team making it appear to him that they were desperate and really needed his information (when all along they didn't). I can see them letting him conclude that without Manfort's information, they had nothing. This in turn makes Manafort run to Drumpf (which they knew he would), tell him that they have no case and are grasping at straws, which then gets Drumpfy to submit his written responses (which are of course lies), which then Mueller can use against him when pitted against the information they already have.

That's my hope, anyway.

Wasn’t it known that Manafort was openly talking to Trump every day? Mueller knew and maybe even recorded it.

I thought of something else as well... why would Manafort lie if he was expecting a pardon? I bet Dump was stringing him along—telling him to lie and dangling the pardon in front of him like a carrot. Manafort lies and it backfired on both of them. I would love that scenario.

He is like a ridiculous child, he never knows when to keep his mouth shut. Such a fool! And that idiot is our president.

Still better than a woman.

The plot thickens even more....

One thing....everyone knows that Trump took his fat ass down to that meeting with the Russians. Manafort had told him not to but you know Trump...no one can tell him anything.

Rick Wilson, re: Manafort's meetings with Assange:

This gun...it's...smoking.

Wikileaks pushes back:

Remember this day when the Guardian permitted a serial fabricator to totally destroy the paper's reputation. @WikiLeaks is willing to bet the Guardian a million dollars and its editor's head that Manafort never met Assange.

Trump contradicts himself CONSTANTLY. As r42 said, it would be contrary to Dump's personality and behavior to not attend the infamous meeting with the Russians. As such, there should be NO DOUBT that he would incriminate himself with his own words, both written and spoken. The only people who don't obviously see this are either blinded to the truth by their own bigotry, or they are complete MORONS.

again. he needs a new shtick. It's getting real old. And no, I haven't read it.

Wikileaks would say pretty much anything.

Isn’t this just a lot of speculation? If Manafort isn’t a reliable witness, then it sounds very bad for the investigation, if you ask me.

This has been going on for over 2 years and there’s been nothing major relating to the campaign. If they really had something on Trump, wouldn’t Mueller have arrested him by now? Wouldn’t he be impeached? I’m not saying he didn’t do anything, but the evidence doesn’t appear to be there. Just endless speculation.

I’m prepared for everyone to block me and call me names now.

Not gonna block you r48, but you are a kinda dumb asshole.

Something tells me R48 has been blocked several times over prior to that post.

As you should, R48...

I just blocked R48 for willing obtuseness at best, mouthpiece for Trussia at worst.

R44 WikiLeaks doesn't like it if people investigate them. They love to expose the truth about others, but cover up the truth about themselves. What a tool.

R53, the hypocrisy is unfathomable. I've never seen anything like it!!!!

The Guardian wouldn't go on a limb like this. They know Manafort was there because it's on video. WikiLeaks can deny all they want, but I'm fairly certain this is all on tape.

From the guardian:

“According to sources, Manafort’s acquaintance with Assange goes back at least five years, to late 2012 or 2013, when the American was working in Ukraine and advising its Moscow-friendly president, Viktor Yanukovych.”

Mark my words, Tad Devine (Bernie’s campaign manager who was working in tandem with Manafort in Ukraine) has wisely decided to save his own skin. I anticipate it will be announced that the Sanders campaign worked with Manafort and Assange too. Hope Devine’s under protection.

R48 is a QAnon deplorable. Check out his threads he starts, especially about the California fires.

Thanks, R57. R48 has been blocked. Later, you cunt.

Trump, his clown-assed legal "advisors," his "strategists" Manafort, Stone, etc.,etc. Jared, Hannity, Stephen Miller, and Steve Bannon, are all a bunch of fucking amateurs believing they could game the legal system, the FBI, and the Special Prosecutor. Thinking they could put a certifiable lunatic clown in charge of the Justice Department, appointing "their own" judges, etc. Do they think this has never happened before? Do they think they are the very first ones to believe they could put stooges in place to "fix" everything to their liking?

What fucking assholes they truly are. The most corrupt political machines in our history have all attempted to twist and bend and subvert the Law and the Constitution and they have failed. They have outsmarted themselves. Once you go down the path of lies corruption, dirty $$$, and double dealing, you get entangled to such an extent you can no longer discern the difference and have to keep lying to maintain the fiction you've promoted.

I will be there on the day they all go down and drown in the cesspool of their own filth. Meanwhile. keep resisting. Keep fighting. Check Indivisible. Find out which advocacy groups are out here fighting for the Environment, or fighting the disgusting tear-gassing of children on our borders, or other important issues, find legitimate groups and support them with time, or money or any way you can. Support HIAS and the ACLU. We need to fight on every front. We need to hit them with so much shit they are covered in it, and the weight and the stench smothers them completely. I didn't know I had this much anger in me. A 26 year old mother died yesterday trying to climb a fence at the border. She was impaled.

[quote]This has been going on for over 2 years and there’s been nothing major relating to the campaign.

Flush this liar! Why do they try?

^^^ Responding to R48.

Also, R59, don't forget to call your Senators and Congressional representatives. Demand that they protect the Mueller investigation, and hold all conspirators accountable.

The Guardian's exclusive. Just putting it here for reference.

Sorry, wrong link. Here's the exclusive.

2 great Daily Kos articles mentioned by someone else in the Manafort thread. One of two:

Two of two.

From the other thread. WOWOWOW.

Borrowed from the manafort thread:

From DailyKos:

1. Manafort agrees to a plea deal, promising to tell all. However, what Manafort tells doesn’t just stop short of “all,” it includes deliberate lies and omissions.

2. In addition to giving Mueller a sanitized version of events, Manafort reports back to Trump on what the investigation is asking him, providing invaluable prep as Trump determines his own actions.

3. At the same time, Donald Trump is preparing to answer a set of written questions from Robert Mueller’s team. He delays and delays on providing these answers because … because he’s waiting for his inside man to reassure him that the special counsel has swallowed the “official” version of what happened hook, line, and sinker.

4. Reassured by Manafort that he has sold Mueller’s team on a carefully edited version of the “truth,” Trump turns in his homework.

5. And it’s only after Mueller has Trump’s answers in hand that he marches Manafort back into court and reveals that he knew the campaign manager was lying all along. Now Mueller doesn’t just have Manafort on record lying, he has written proof that Manafort and Trump were conspiring again to deceive and misdirect the inve

Ecuador needs to come clean. They can't hand Assange to the US authorities b/c we have the death penalty... but there are ways.

Assange hasn't been charged in the US yet. When he is, Ecuador will have a bigger issue since there's the whole international criminal court system and extradition treaties and all that. And prosecutors can make arrangements not to seek the death penalty in exchange for extradition.

The fact that Manafort has brazenly lied even after he supposedly made a deal, and the fact that he has violated the house arrest rules, and contacted people etc. in the past, told Mueller he cannot be trusted, so all this new stuff we're seeing, is stuff Mueller was ready for, prepared for, and probably gave Manafort all the rope he needed . I agree it shows he's convinced he will be pardoned. Not only that, but IMO, it indicates Manafort believed he was the shield between Trump and the Mueller investigation, and he was doing it on behalf of his Russian minders. It's very possible something terrible will happen to Manafort while in prison. Relying on guys like Roger Stone who is insane is lie relying on quicksand. Manafort is going down and any attempt to pardon him will be viewed as obstruction. I agree that Tad Devine and Manafort's partner Gates are singing like birds and directing the Feds to some really great lines of inquiry. And let us never forget that Mueller delivered the indictments of 13 Russian GRU agents, with some very specific information to Trump less than two days before Trump met wit Putin in Helsinki and groveled for the world to see. Flynn is the next one to feel the full force of Mueller's wrath. THere will be no quarter given.

Thanks for that breakdown, R67!

I want to see Trump publicly humiliated in a way that does not lend itself to an interpretation. Like the death from one thousand cuts, I want it to repeat each day with new terrible consequences. Who was the guy in mythology who had his liver eaten by a vulture then it grew back so it could happen all over again?

My guess R11 is that you blocked OP because... you're a troll.

r69....

r74 they JUST brought the charges. It still has to work its way through the court system first.

I believe it was Prometheus, r72. For giving man the gift of fire.

He stayed chained to the rock until Hercules freed him. But there is no Hercules coming for fat Donnie. Mueller is going to eat his liver every day until the end of time.

Trump will be at the G20 Summit in Argentina this Friday and Putin will also be there. I'm sure these two will have their own meeting.

There's no shortage of mythology-related analogies for Trump. Narcissus (self-explanatory). Icarus (for daring to go way beyond his station). Sisyphus (for being unable to savor an ultimately futile victory).

[quote]Mueller is going to eat his liver every day until the end of time.

Need it be said? Pics please.

What is it called when someone spreads lies individualized for the hearer, in order to determine who's leaking information?

E.g., I tell A that I'm wearing red to the party, B that I'm wearing blue, and C that I'm wearing green. Suddenly everyone "knows" that I'm going to wear blue, so I know B is the one who leaked.

[quote]Mueller is going to eat his liver every day until the end of time.

I heard he was shopping the other day for some fava beans and a nice Chianti.

[quote]What is it called when someone spreads lies individualized for the hearer, in order to determine who's leaking information?

Disinformation?

R82, yes, it's about spreading disinformation unique to the individual. Just wondering what the overall gambit is called.

Found it!

CANARY TRAP

^ Facebook has used some variants of that to see who was leaking certain internal notifications. They're sensitive about that.

That's why if you're leaking documents, be sure that the document is paraphrased, not quoted directly.

The Canary Trap wouldn't work on me. I have a tendency to not remember the original version and create a new one.

Wikileaks released an obnoxious denial of any meeting between Assange and Manafort, betting a million dollars and the "head" of the Guardian editor.

Jeeze, how shady is Ecuador's government.

In A Clash of Kings, the second book in the A Song of Ice and Fire series, Tyrion Lannister uses the trap to find out which member of the King's Privy Council is reporting to his sister, the Queen Regent Cersei Lannister. To the Grand Maester Pycelle, he tells of a plot to marry his niece, Princess Myrcella, to Prince Trystane of the powerful House Martell, from Dorne. To Littlefinger, he claims he will instead send Myrcella to be raised by Lysa Arryn and married to her son Robert. To Varys, he says his plan is to send his nephew Tommen to the Martells. When Cersei confronts him, and knows only of the plan to send Myrcella to Dorne, Tyrion knows Pycelle to be the leak.

This plotline is also depicted in "What Is Dead May Never Die", during the second season of Game of Thrones, the television adaptation of the books.

[quote]Wikileaks released an obnoxious denial of any meeting between Assange and Manafort, betting a million dollars and the "head" of the Guardian editor.

But so much the tone of the times, given the 'No Collusion!' mantra, and accusations of the worst witch-hunt in history, from the puppet atop the dungheap. Nobody believes a dirty word he says either.

I'm sure the Russians would give Assange the "one million dollars" he needs to make a bet he will lose.

Assange also said he had no contact with Roger Stone.....we see how that worked out....especially after the tweets and emails turned up.

[quote]WikiLeaks is willing to bet the Guardian a million dollars and its editor's head

Its editors Head is worth about 2.50 right now.

Such a busy news day

I love you, R76!!!!!!! You "get" me!!!!!!

It was a busy news day R94

Did anyone notice that MSNBC didn't bother to run Sarah Sander's little press briefing today? They think they can just trot her out to cover when the headlines are particularly dismal, but not today Satan.

Let's please not compare Trump to the great anti-authoritarian benefactor Prometheus. How about some other mythological character who was punished, like Ixion, tied to a spinning wheel for all eternity for trying to rape Hera?

Yes R96 and it was said they would go to her if it was important. Never saw her, lol.

I hope one day, Wikileaks is the subject of its own series of internal leaks. There has to be someone disgruntled there somewhere, right?

I just want to know if they were always Russian propaganda, or if they got taken over when Assange had trouble paying his bills after there was a crackdown on them being able to accept credit card donations.

Just like when Trump announced that the Mueller investigation was full of internal strife.

Wonder how long it took Whittaker to relay THAT Canary Trap? ?

I love how the Russian trolls like to say Pres Bone Spurs hasn't started a war or escalated a war yet he has increased troops in Afghanistan. They fail every time.

Bob Goodlatte is part of the Jim Jordan, Nunes, Gaetz, Meadows, etc., gang. Ivanka could have Emailed Vlad Putty the U.S. nuclear codes, and Goodlatte and cohorts would be dismissive about it and blame HRC instead. These people are not about truth and supporting democracy.

You would think they would learn.....the tariffs, taxes, plants closing....all in Trump country....thats why he brags about numbers...he knows they will believe anything he says and dismiss reality.

Trump's team members have convinced themselves that they're brilliant because they got Trump into the White House. They forgot they had outside help.

Is anyone watching Maddox tonight? Seems like lots of breaking news tonight on the Mueller case.

Trump is playing 4D invisible chess. The deep state is going down.

Oh please, the only thing Trump knows how to play is with himself.

🤣🤣🤣🤣 I know emojis aren't a DL thing, but R107 is funny

Manafort’s Lawyer Said to Brief Trump Attorneys on What He Told Mueller:

I really hope Daily Kos is right and that Mueller really is playing 3D chess...

Notice Trump Jr always pushes his chest out like he’s a pigeon

That's just another reason Dump is like Mussolini, r111. Dump is Il Douche!

A week before Thanksgiving, Corsi gave Trump's legal team a draft plea agreement document that Corsi had obtained from Mueller. Trump was enraged at being named personally in the agreement, and his lawyers complained directly to Mueller. So Mueller was aware that some supposedly cooperating witnesses were, in fact, sharing information with Trump.

Don't these people have fucking lawyers? So you have lawyers cooperating with Trump's lawyers. Then after you're found guilty on, like, ten million counts, and you have to face another trial in another jurisdiction, and you're allegedly broke, no liquidity, etc. so with advice from Counsel you plead out to avoid trial. Your guilty plea agreement voids any cooperation with defense attorneys for anyone else. So how the fuck do you justify your LAWYER sharing information with Trump's lawyers about your sessions with Mueller? That is illegal.Even if you thought you were being slick, hoping to win Trump's support for a pardon, your lawyer had to know this was wrong. So are all the lawyers going to jail too? Because if Trump's lawyers were the ones who suggested this scenario this smells like obstruction.

Its RARE for an attorney to go to jail....they always have an excuse and lawyers protect their own.

Maybe you're right, in general, R115, but do you think Mueller would "protect" any of the rumpots on Trump's legal team, or anyone else in this Halloween horror house cast of characters?

To be fair, Donnie Dotard has a lot of "gut" to work with:

Ya know, there is going to be plenty of time to destroy the cunt, but we need an actual progressive agenda. I really think that we need to come out of the gate in January with a full on progressive agenda, much higher minimum wage, lots of infrastructure spending, actual climate change fight, voter protections, medicare for all, or none of this is going to make the slightest bit of difference.

Miss Nancy has her agenda all fleshed out. She is ready. She was born ready to keep from gettin' ready.

I hope so. she has hesitated in the past, and played around, but I suspect you are right R119, no more fucking playing around.

I hope all of these PRICKS go to jail.

Consider. Suddenly the Greek guy decides he wants to fuck up his plea deal. Then Corsi and Manafort both try to fuck up their plea deals. It's almost as if someone has given them the word that pardons would be very likely. Now. Knowing how good his word is, Trump is the last person I'd trust to give me a pardon. There is no amount of reassurance that would get me to trust the word of Donald Trump.

And Nancy should start by getting up on the House floor day one and announcing I DO NOT CARE ABOUT THE MOTHERFUCKING CUNT OF A DEFICIT, ANYMORE THAN ANY REPUBLICAN CUNT HAS CARED FOR 50 YEARS. Maybe not in those words, cause you kinda classy Nancy, but with that inflection. nobody cares. Democrats stop falling for this fucking con game. nobody actually gives a fuck. stop thinking everyone does.

I love John Brennan.

Pelosi would not use the word cunt considering how fucking sexist it is.

well in fairness, r126. she's probably on the right side there, but she should totally take the spirit of what I posted and run with it.

never, ever, ever, ever in your wildest dreams take a Republican seriously when they claim to care about the Deficit. They are lying, every single time.

R120 It's bigger than what Pelosi wants at this point... the momentum of the investigation and the evidence it presents will push her towards confrontation with Trump... not to mention Trump's blatant obstruction of justice is just begging for censure of some kind.

R117 It's hard keeping slim when you get two scoops every night

there will be investigations, oh there will be investigations, and good. but the important thing, the thing that will matter is that progressives actually have a chance to push the envelope toward actual policies that actually benefit the average American. Let's do that, on top of the investigations. :Let's actually push the country toward not being the asshole of the universe for awhile. That will help enormously, both politically and in reality.

Trump is a criminal and everyone needs to stop looking the other way...he needs to be arrested and THAT is the truth.

nobody is looking the other way. Arresting Trumpistas will be a big part of the fun in the next few years. But advancing an actual, real life, progressive agenda will actually benefit far more people.

Rachel and Lawrence were making a little light of all this tonight during their hand-off banter, basically saying that what astounds them is how Trump and his cohorts are doing their treason all out in the open, in broad daylight, for all the world to see. And when asked about it, they will act like what they're doing is the most normal thing in the world. It's either an act of grand stupidity or sheer genius, depending of course on how it all turns out in the end.

I blocked R48. I don't need to read that kind of idiot.

good for them. we can actually be light. I'm kinda a heavy puritan inquisitor at heart. that's me. but the truth is, we are winning this damn battle. have fun with it. wish I could.

the amount of hubris and lack of shame in these people is just shocking and infuriating. Ever since Trump was able to get elected, he and those who want to imitate him have employed the tactic of doing/saying whatever you want and then never apologizing or admitting any wrongdoing when you're caught. Then you keep trying to weasel your way out of legal consequences by telling more lies and continually trying to deceive/scam people

I'm so glad Mueller is competent and isn't falling for the bs. These assholes deserve to get all double the amount of time. Georgie in particular should get more than 2 weeks given his behavior

Corsi should def get time now

Manafort, lock him up and throw away the fucking key

That Dutch wikileaks member Arjen Kamphuis is still missing. Police have no idea what happened to him, he was last seen in August.

I thought it had been pretty much confirmed that Trump couldn't pardon anyone if he was named as an unindicted co-conspirator. And, there's no way that he is not named as an unindicted co-conspirator in every fucking Russian conspiracy charge Mueller is bringing. So, why is there all this talk about Manafort doing this because he knows he'll get pardoned?

[quote]I thought it had been pretty much confirmed that Trump couldn't pardon anyone if he was named as an unindicted co-conspirator.

I don't know who would confirm that since it isn't true. As long as he is President, the Constitution specifically grants him the right to grant pardons for federal crimes, a right that is absolute and cannot be challenged. The only way to take that right away from him is to remove him legally from office.

Or by Constitutional amendment...

Pardons can’t be used “cases of impeachment.” We’re going to find out the exact scope of that limitation.

[quote]Or by Constitutional amendment...

And we know how long that takes....

R133, your both-sides-ism disgusts me. And your talking points that you just posted repeatedly ten times.

The Democrats, particularly Hillary, had and have a progressive agenda. You know who brought the hope of that down? Fake “progressive” Bernie Sanders with the explicit cheating help of literal fascist Putin.

You know who is a progressive? I am. You’re a Kremlin troll.

I hope others can see through your “all very well but America is evil”, “all very well but now we can have a real chance at things”, “burn it all down, start again” posts.

You are not Susan Sarandon. You are not Zisek. You are not Bernie Sanders or Assange. Worse, you are their propagandist.

You fucking dissembling piece of shit, who can’t even sufficiently grasp the nuances of American culture to know that progressive women don’t scream cunt at each other., and yet you try to pass yourself off as a patriot.

FUCK YOU.

I wonder if Don Jr. and Eric have fucked their sister...

I find SNL's Eric Trump sexy. He was making a jerking off motion once and it turned me on.

well now I think I understand why we haven't gotten any of those new indictments...because Manafort was playing the role of Trump's mole so Mueller can't use anything he said for his case. This why when you hear Trump, repub politicians or those assholes on Fox whining about how long the investigation is taking, they need to be told to fuck off. When you have people like Manafort deliberately sabotaging and delaying shit, the investigation will take longer

Here’s a great analysis by a former US district attorney.

Summary: it’s bad news for Mueller. And no, I am not a concern troll. I want to see Trump and co behind bars as much as anyone else. But the magical thinking needs to stop.

[quote]Trump's attorneys are willing to take huge risks because they think they can get away with it.

Trump's MO forever. But his huge risks have never before been so deeply publicly scrutinised. And nothing lasts forever.

Then again there’s this. I don’t know what to think anymore.

Fucking Concern Troll at R148 & R150.

Notice how they announce themselves with "I'm not a concern troll, but..."

R151 dissent is not trolling.

R152 Facetious "dissent" to spread disinformation is trolling.

[quote]Facetious "dissent" to spread disinformation is trolling.

He linked to a thread by DL fave and noted anti-Trumpist Renato Mariotti. I found Mariotti's analysis interesting. How is that spreading "dissent"?

[quote]Can someone explain what kind of info Manafort could possibly tell Trump that would affect his written answers to Mueller? I can't wrap my brain around that one.

Sure. Manafort lied his ass off to Mueller and the FBI. Manafort doesn't know Mueller has evidence proving that he's lying, passes false informaiton on to Donald, who puts Manafort's bullshit in his own written statements. Mueller then has Donald on the record committing perjury. (none of us know what Manafort specifically told Mueller, but we know it was all BS)

"noted anti-Trumpist "

Not exactly a distinguishing trait, as this includes any sane person on the planet, including burn-it-down fake leftists like Greenwald, Sarandon, Bernie Sanders etc.

[quote]That Dutch wikileaks member Arjen Kamphuis is still missing. Police have no idea what happened to him, he was last seen in August.

He fell into my chocolate river and went up the pipe. The Oompa Loompas are looking for him.

[bold]Ivanka: "Lock Her Up" doesn't apply to me and my emails[/bold]

[quote]Ivanka: "Lock Her Up" doesn't apply to me and my emails

We'll see about that, won't we.

Trump is freaking out again this morning:

While the disgusting Fake News is doing everything within their power not to report it that way, at least 3 major players are intimating that the Angry Mueller Gang of Dems is viciously telling witnesses to lie about facts & they will get relief. This is our Joseph McCarthy Era!

And he's retweeted this craziness:

Illegals can get up to $3,874 a month under Federal Assistance program. Our social security checks are on average $1200 a month. RT if you agree: If you weren't born in the United States, you should receive $0 assistance.

Will CNN ever ask Border Patrol agents how they felt having large rocks chucked at them by criminal illegals?

And this not-at-all-nutso meme:

Trump is unhinged. But he's always been unhinged; it's just now there's senility thrown into the mix.

But what I truly can't comprehend is the people that believe him, word for word. You can't go through life with your head in the sand and ignore basic things like facts, but they do.

[quote].@IvankaTrump says she “frequently” disagrees with her father and says he knows where she stands on all issues: “One of the reasons that I have such a good relationship with him…is because I’m incredibly candid with him.”

That's odd. When the media disagree with Trump he smears at them as 'disgusting fake news.' Evidently candour from his baby is tolerable.

Ivanka's remarks could also be seen as the canny placing of distance. Setting up a safe space for when Mueller's motherlode lands.

[quote]But what I truly can't comprehend is the people that believe him, word for word.

People believe the bible, word for word.

Ivanka can be "incredibly candid" with daddy while he's fucking her.

Maybe she meant "incredibly candied"?

That's it! She looks candied! I saw a photo of her somewhere today and thought she looked very strange and doll-like, but couldn't quite put my finger on it...

Donald Trump, a princeling who was raised in luxury, never held accountable for any of his countless personal and business betrayals and failures, and who literally lived in a golden tower for most of his life, is not good with stress. His rage-tweeting shows us that he knows he can’t juggle all the crises steaming toward him, that he knows his astounding power to distort reality for his followers won’t shield him from the political, legal, and personal perils closing in on him.

Playtime is over, and Donald doesn't like it.

The problem with the tweet thread linked at R148 is that to believe that theory, you must believe that Mueller is a fucking idiot. I have seen no evidence to support the idea that he is, but rather he seems to be a man of brilliance, thoroughness and integrity. So I'm gonna stick with that belief until Mueller proves me wrong. Also, the timing of Mueller's legal manoeuvres indicate the 'he was setting Manafort and Trump up' theory has more legs.

Did Trump just get caught acting in furtherance of a conspiracy. this is how Muller might have just caught him red handed....

9/14 - Manafort cuts plea deal, agrees to cooperate

At some point after this, Mueller discovers that Manafort's lawyer is briefing Trump on what is being asked by Mueller

10/11 - Trump's lawyers prepare to answer Mueller's questions, now presumably with knowledge from Manafort's lawyer

11/15 - Mueller asks judge to delay Manafort sentencing for 10 days, i.e. waiting until Trump delivers written answers about campaign activity, e.g. what he discussed with Manafort

11/20 - Trump submits answers to Mueller. In other words, Mueller has Trump's version off events related to the campaign and Manafort

11/26 - Mueller reveals Manafort has repeatedly lied throughout the process and "committed federal crimes." That's definitely lying to the FBI, but were the lies part of a conspiracy to obstruct justice?

Or more precisely, witness tampering

[quote] “One of the reasons that I have such a good relationship with him…is because my vagina is incredibly candid with him.”

Fixed that for her.

This Friday is the sentencing hearing for Manafort. 9:30 AM. I will ve anxiously waiting to see if Mueller confrims RE170 theory.

There’s no way he wrote that first tweet, R161. I would better $5K that he does not know the meaning of not has he ever in his life used, the word “intimate.”

*bet

Maybe he just transcribed it from a Fox News chyron.

I remember that when Mueller asked for a ten-day delay in sentencing Manafort, people were baffled. Why the mystery delay when, as we now know, Manafort was not really cooperating? It makes sense if, as suggested at R170, he was waiting for Trump to finally submit his answers, and didn't want to let Trump know that he knew Manafort was lying.

When Ken Starr says you're fucked ...

r172...its not a hearing....its a scheduling conference....they will set a date for sentencing at that time....my guess is sometime mid to late January/ early February. The judge will also set a date that all filings have to be submitted by prior to that date.

Trump is losing it.....he knows the end is near....he will probably do something drastic as a result.

I believe Mueller knew he was lying all along and he wanted Trump to finish and return his answers to the Special Prosecutor's questions. Now he can confirm the collusion between Manafort and Trump on Obstruction. because there is probably evidence provided by Trump himself that Manafort was feeding him information. That's my take, anyway. I have to laugh at Trump. He thinks he can control information by stopping his CIA lady Haspel from testifying to the Senate. He's a complete fool. The fact is Trump has declared war on the intelligence community. And he is totally unpopular and dangerous abroad. So he is going to feel the full wrath of the intelligence community. None of them fear him, or respect him, and most are as pissed off as we are. He's cornered and doesn't know it and his "advisors" keep telling him to fight on. Just wait. The Senate is getting ready to turn on him. With the economy circling the drain, they will abandon him and the next two years will be to complete unraveling. I bet he has a stroke.

I could see Ivanka stabbing her entire family in the back, including her own husband, to get herself and her kids out of the mess. It's not like she had any role model teaching her integrity and loyalty. I know she did some really shitty things, but if someone rats out the others to save his or her own skin, I would prefer it'd be Ivanka instead of Eric, DT, jr, or Jared.

I think Putin will help him with full on war with Ukraine. Trump will push the Democratic House in defensive mode regarding the response to Putin and it will control the media and push the investigation aside and the Republicans will insist that "now isn't the time to weaken the US by investigating the POTUS! The US must stand strong and united! Bad Democrats make us look weak!".

Pin this.....it will resurface in the future....and it will definitely have implications for Trump (as a participant and as a facilitator...i.e. Trump Model Management)

^^^sorry, link for r183^^^

[quote]^^^sorry, link for [R183]^^^

This is weird ... I started a thread on that horrific story this morning, and it had it just a handful of posts ... but it's been deleted.

r183....interesting....the name Cyrus Vance shows up again....the same NYDA who dismissed charges of fraud against the Trumps.....coincidence ?

Cheeto's WaPo interview is all kinds of cray.

@kylegriffin1

Trump considered reappointing Janet Yellen to serve as Fed Chair, but he appeared to be hung up on her height, WaPo reports. Trump told aides on the National Economic Council on several occasions that the 5' 3" Yellen wasn't tall enough to lead the Fed.

The Senate again blocked an expedited vote on legislation that would protect special counsel Robert Mueller from being fired. Sens. Jeff Flake, R-Ariz.; Chris Coons, D-Del., and Cory Booker, D-N.J., urged brisk debate on the legislation in an effort to prevent President Donald Trump from firing Mueller.

Republican Sen. Mike Lee of Utah objected to the request, blocking immediate action. Lee said the bill was unconstitutional.

Traitors....all of them.

Womp Womp

[quote]Maria Butina, the alleged Russian agent accused of connecting the Kremlin to American gun-rights activists, is being held in solitary confinement, according to a new court filing. The filing, from her lawyers, says she was put in solitary on Nov. 21 and has been held there for 22 hours a day ever since. Jail staff told Butina’s attorney that they moved her there because she gave her lawyer’s phone number to another inmate, according to the filing. “It is the opinion of the undersigned that prolonged depravation of human contact and interaction is starting to have a profound psychological impact on Ms. Butina,” her lawyers wrote. “Unless the court intervenes, she will continue to be held in this manner and ultimately require the attention of mental health professionals.”

Should be a companion piece to the Epstein report.

[quote]A new government watchdog memo says the Trump administration waived rigorous background checks for all staff working at the nation’s largest detention camp for migrant children. The memo, obtained exclusively by The Associated Press, says the former director of the federal Office of Refugee Resettlement personally signed off on sidestepping requirements for child abuse and neglect checks at the tent city in Tornillo, Texas.

Since Donald things in terms of ratings, someone should totally convince him that a stroke, heart attack or even suicide would be the perfect capper to November sweeps.

Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, the **former head of the CIA**:

"There is no direct reporting connecting the crown prince to the murder of Jamal Khashoggi."

This Pompeo quote leans heavily on the words "direct reporting."

Could it be true?

CNN Exclusive: President Trump told Mueller in writing that Roger Stone did not tell him about WikiLeaks, nor was he told about the 2016 Trump Tower meeting between his son, campaign officials and a Russian lawyer promising dirt on Hillary Clinton

I don't believe either one of these. Trump knows everything.

Sorry for the dupe, R195

of course he's lying. Mueller surely subpoenaed the blocked phone number that Don Jr called after the Trump Tower meeting so he knows if that was daddy or not. Who else would Don Jr have called on a blocked # ?

The Daily Beast's Justin Miller:

Trump—who says he's got "one of the great memories of all time"—reportedly answered to the "best of his recollection" about Wikileaks and the Russians at Trump Tower.

Mixed bag?

R198, oh, I totally didn't think about his subpoenaing the blocked number from the phone carrier. Nice.

I'm with R192. I think what'll work is for him to fake a stroke or some other temporarily debilitating illness, and resign, while his attorneys cut some kind of deal with Mueller. Eventually, once he's been out of office for a few months he will recover and he can keep going to rallies and raise hell with no restraint or responsibilities. He can "write" another best seller and get his own TV show on Fox. Or better yet, start his own network. At his age he'll probably never live to see it to fruition and his kids will abandon it because they will be spending most of their time overseas in countries with weak extradition treaties.

R195, Trump is leaking these answers because Stone and/or Jr. are about to be indicted.

Breaking - Senate Republicans blocked a bill in the Senate to protect the Mueller investigation. Mike Lee said it was unconstitutional, and only one member of the committee is needed to block it. This despite Flake saying he'd block judicial nominations.

Sorry an hour old.

Fuck no, R201! I'm more than happy for him to resign, but he has to pay for what he's done. He's a criminal and should be treated as one. If you wanna tell me that a sitting president can't be indicted, I'll disagree with you, but then what do I know? Fine, let's say his address protects him for the time being. But once he's out of office he should be charged for money laundering at the very least.

Yes, Flake is going to block judicial nominations for the whole month he has left in his term.

[quote]This despite Flake saying he'd block judicial nominations.

Yeah, that Flake: He's a rock of integrity.

r125 Your link is bad. Here is a good one. The deplorables are going after Brennan with a vengeance.

Mueller She Wrote did an interview with Rob Goldstone over the summer, IIRC, and he was at that dump tower meeting. You should listen to it if you get a chance. It was interesting.

Just throwing that out there.

Also, I expect Mueller or another attorney to petition to have dump's lawyers disbarred for ethics violations. If the prosecution had a deal with Manafort and his lawyers and fat Donnie's lawyers were lying to the prosecution, they should be disbarred.

There are going to be some full jail cells come the end of next year I think.

Questions to those who say Trump would resign:

Isn’t the presidency the most powerful tool he has for defending himself against charges of wrongdoing?

Why would he give that up when doing so wouldn’t save himself from prosecution?

I hope someone can answer my questions. Without a solid basis for resignation, I believe we as a nation and global community are in for an unpredictable showdown with a cornered animal.

[quote]Isn’t the presidency the most powerful tool he has for defending himself against charges of wrongdoing?

Not if he 'won' the 'presidency' by corrupt means. His 'power' by definition is invalidated. As will be every single thing he blunderingly attempted to do while imitating being a 'president.'

[quote]If the prosecution had a deal with Manafort and his lawyers and fat Donnie's lawyers were lying to the prosecution, they should be disbarred.

No, they should be jailed. We’re not talking about little white lies or lies if omission here. We're talking treasonous fucking behavior.

He’s never discussed a pardon for Paul Manafort, President Trump said Wednesday — but it’s “not off the table.”

“It was never discussed, but I wouldn’t take it off the table. Why would I take it off the table?” the president said during an Oval Office interview.

He ripped special counsel Robert Mueller’s probe and charged that Manafort, former political adviser Roger Stone and Stone’s associate Jerome Corsi were all asked to lie by the special counsel.

“If you told the truth, you go to jail,” Trump said.

“You know this flipping stuff is terrible. You flip and you lie and you get — the prosecutors will tell you 99 percent of the time they can get people to flip. It’s rare that they can’t,” Trump said.

I hope Maria Butina gets a bullet in her head by the Russians the day she’s released.

The House must investigate the NRA-Russia connection.

R211, r210 is right. We all KNOW he didn’t truly “win” but no one and I mean NO ONE, will ever challenge that fact. I mean, no matter how much Mueller spells it out, just who and how do we remove him? He WILL fight to stay now as it is indeed his only shield, not only for himself, but his children. I just cannot fathom with this Congress that he will be removed. Which means he will run again, and he’s going to campaign just as hard as he did in the midterms, I despise him, but he is a fighter in campaigning. So 2020, he’s going to fight his ass off to get re-elected, no one can beat him in the primaries, and we are in for a fucking hell of a fight because while all this shit has been happening, nobody has fixed our voting system. They are cheating, and we aren’t stopping it. We have to act NOW if we hope to win in 2020.

This doesn’t mean I’ve given up, if anything, I feel more hopeful than I did before the midterms. We just need to win elections, and deliver true change for the average American. I pray to God that what Mueller has is huge and as ugly as possible. My dream is that he did indeed attend the TT meeting and that Mueller has hard evidence of this. But beyond Conspiracy and RICO, the ultimate victory would be an actual charge of Treason. I would loooooooooove to see the Republican reaction to fucking Treason.

Gates plea agreement had a gag order. Manafort's did not that cannot be a coincidence.

^ this. This needs to be repeated over and over. I read that while it was highly unusual, Manafort’s plea agreement did not have a gag order. Does this not also point toward a trap set by Mueller? Methinks yes.

Hmm, R218, the plot thickens. Really hope there's a good reason behind it.

R211 right on.

If Mueller proves Trump cheated with Russia, then put in the rightful winner, undo every fucking thing he's done since taking office, hang all conspirators and start a campaign to address the failure(s) of the Electoral College.

I'm not sure there's much we can do to address his supporters--that is the real issue. Deplorables knowingly cast their lots with a sociopathic to get power. How do you fix that level of human failure? I don't think we can, but we sure can legislate safeguards to make sure it doesn't happen again.

R220, our Constitution doesn’t have a “do-over.” When will everyone understand this fact? Even when it’s shown 150% that he cheated, we don’t get a do-over. There is no provision for this in our Constitution. The ONLY options are 25th or removal by Congress — THAT IS IT. It’s not fair, it is unfortunate, blahblahblah, but those are the rules of the game.

They're not going to place Hillary as the rightful President.

I would however settle for them taking away his Justice nominations. Again, they won't, but if you didn't win legitimately, then those appointments aren't legitimate.

Why do proven cheaters get the benefits of the "rules of the game," R221? The rules can be changed as the situation warrants.

R223 that's not how the Constitution works.

As soon as Trump is gone, one way or the other, the Democratic Party should push through the "Obama Legacy Act" and reinstate everything Trump dismantled and destroyed from Obama's presidency. Also Kavenaugh should get booted off the supreme court for lying in his confirmation hearings.

[quote] that's not how the Constitution works.

An unprecedented constitutional crisis needs an uprecedented solution followed by an update of the constitution to prevent such a crisis from happening in the future.

Yeah, R226, but again, it's not currently in the Constitution and unless they make that change... the cheaters benifitted from cheating.

For those wanting a redo of the electoral college....NO YOU DONT.....in order to do that, there would have to be a constitutional convention, and that is EXACTLY what the GOP want in order to redo the entire thing...and not anyones advantage but their own. Think carefully about what you wish for.

r227, we can't change the past, but we can move forward making sure that it's not being repeated any time soon.

You think holding on to the current status will make things better? You think you'll find a solution for Trump shitting all over the Constitution in the very Constitution he shits on? That's your idea of dealing with Trump and this constitutional crisis? Or we should just sit and way and let Trump and the Republican Party do their thing until 2020 and keep our fingers crossed that this time a miracle will happen?

R229 learn to read. I said none of that.

Thank you, R221. As an American I'd love to amend our constitution to remove/erase the work of illegally-elected president, and to install a rightful winner.

r230, Learn to read yourself. Since these were all question all you had to do is answer: No, I don't think that. But, for whatever reason, you did not.

r229. An actual polititian like Nancy Pelosi will know when she has enough votes to accomplish that. I doubt she would start something this big without having secured the votes go in her favor.

Again, R232, learn to read. Your deflection back doesn't hold.

Your questions in response to R227 had nothing to do with what was actually said in R227.

Sorry: without having secured to votes to go in her favor.

r234, learn to read, learn to read, learn to read, learn to read.

To be fair, R232, you seemed to have extrapolated a lot that wasn't said in R227.

The original discussion was about how cheaters shouldn't benefit. And unfortunately, as it was previously said, there's no way to go back and change it. Unless something is changed in the Constitution, they are going to continue to manipulate and get away with it. I didn't read 227 as saying nothing should be done.

People also have to learn to understand the context and the subtext of posts.

R229

You’re welcome r231. People here on DL need to understand our Constitution, we have to be grounded in reality and facts.

And r226, just no. In a nation that upholds the Law, we don’t get to say “we suspend the rules NOW” just because. It’s not how the Law works, we must abide by the Law as it truly is the very glue that holds us together.

Now, on the other hand, I love the idea of the Obama Legacy Act. That is something we CAN do. There is in fact, a lot that we can do. However, we don’t get a do-over in the election, so just stop with this, it’s fruitless and a waste of our valuable energy. We CAN remove judges. We CAN force states to change their election procedures. We CAN update the Constitution in the future event of another cheat.

[quote] And [R226], just no. In a nation that upholds the Law, we don’t get to say “we suspend the rules NOW” just because. It’s not how the Law works, we must abide by the Law as it truly is the very glue that holds us together.

So unprecedented means to you outside the law?

Charging a sitting president for crimes would be unprecedented and therefore, according to you, against the law?

[quote]Charging a sitting president for crimes would be unprecedented

No, it wouldn't be unprecedented Clinton was impeached aka charged with high crimes and misdemeanors. Nixon would've been impeached too if he didn't resign.

No, I never said that r241. Everything that’s good that’s changed our nation for the better was once unprecedented. But something can be unprecedented and still operate within the framing of our Constitution. We have to have a law that says we get a do-over to have a do-over. It’s chicken and the egg, you can’t do the do-over without it being written in Law. Please understand though, you and I are on the same side.

Also, though I am emphasizing that we don’t get a do-over, I do think that I support indicting a sitting President. I can’t fathom why we can’t indict him on criminal conduct. I believe that Watergate made it clear that a President must abide by the Law, so indict this mother fucker for Treason, Conspiracy, and yes, RICO. Also, Watergate set the precedent that a President is subject to oversight by other branches.

[quote] If Mueller proves Trump cheated with Russia, then put in the rightful winner

Say her name.

[quote] Everything that’s good that’s changed our nation for the better was once unprecedented. But something can be unprecedented and still operate within the framing of our Constitution. We have to have a law that says we get a do-over to have a do-over. It’s chicken and the egg, you can’t do the do-over without it being written in Law. Please understand though, you and I are on the same side.

And I never posted anything different. I guess way too many posters assumed that "unprecedented" means going on a killing spree or something.

The rulebook, the Constitution, has to speak to HOW to remove a President — and it does. It’s the 25th or Congress. Using the 25th would be unprecedented, but it is outlined in the Constitution. So is impeachment, and a trial in the Senate. That is the Law. When and if he’s removed, the next in line is President. Then, next election, we vote again. That’s it.

I sure hope what we get with the Democratic House is more transparency and people starting to ask the media some questions, like "Why do you love Trump and the Deplorables so much?", "when are you going to ask the Republican Party some real questions and insist that they actually answer them (well, we very well may have to wait for a couple of years for them answering truthfully)?".

Since when does the malignant narcissist in chief follow the law?

He doesn’t, we do.

I’m a bit confused. Manafort’s lawyers had to understand that he pled guilty to state charges as well. They must know Dump can’t pardon those charges. Why would they even interact with Dump at all? The best thing for their client would be to plead to as few charges for the least amount of time.

r220, that's never going to happen.

Corsi thinks he's slick, he's a fucking train wreck and a psycho liar.

Wow, he's going to prison for a long time. He's likely to die incarcerated.

Can someone recap, can't watch.

Jerome Corsi is a hideous frog too with pockmarked skin and a morbidly obese body. He looks like a Dickensian side character in a storyline in which he is suffering from gout.

R253 - Trump just died; and I won the lottery.

Roger Stone is one of the biggest sleazeballs to ever slither across the planet. I can’t wait to see his massive comeuppance.

[quote] I pray to God that what Mueller has is huge and as ugly as possible.

Pics please.

Perhaps a filter for the "ugly" bits. Perhaps not.

Uday and his princess Guilfoyle are not my idea of a royal couple in waiting to ascend. And Qusay needs to close his mouth and not show those gross gums.

40% of the electorate still embraces the criminal enterprise or deny it exists. And Republicans in Congress enable it.

Fucking Roger Stone needs to die in prison, and be gang raped every day until he croaks.

We all knew things would get much worse before things got better. Just hang on tight.

r260, so very true.

When it's all over, I still want Donald to be elder-abused.

Remember that one insider’s prediction that, “He will die in prison”?

I agree with those who say I want all of his judges removed and his policies reversed. We may not get Hillary rightfully installed but we can and should do that.

R264 It stands to reason that if Trump is proven to have committed treason (which is pretty much a given now), that his two SCOTUS picks should withdraw themselves, or be subject to impeachment. THIS is why we need to win the Senate back.

Adam Schiff has receipts stating that Papadopoulos did Russia thingies with Cheeto's knowledge.

r265 I am worried the Senate is out of reach even in 2020.

It is a given the 2 SC judges need and MUST go. That should be a non-negotiable. We cannot allow cheating to be validated. And no, Pence doesn' get to pick after that. HE was part of this.

[quote] When it's all over, I still want Donald to be elder-abused.

My idea of hell for Trump would be for him having to sleep on mattresses Obama peed on right in front of him. For all eternity laying on wet, squishy mattresses. Oh, and nobody retweeting his tweets.

I've been hearing that as well, R267. The numbers just don't add up at this point for a D takeover of the Senate.

Then again Georgia is purple now, so who knows what the norms are anymore.

You sound "concerned" r269.

The 1974/1976 elections, that's what we're looking at now for 2018/2020.

The map for Democrats is just fine, thanks. Oh and Hyde-Smith will get cunt punted hard if she runs again in 2020 which they are saying she will do.

r271....shes a Senator....its a 6 year term....she doesnt have to worry until 2024. Congressmen are every 2 years.

Right now some states have enacted legislation that requires their electors to vote in accordance with the popular vote. I'm not sure how that would work or if it would fix anything. Because the way I read it, if Massachusetts popular vote is for Clinton, they have to vote Clinton and if it's for Trump they vote for Trump. But IMO maybe it would be different if it was proportional? There are things each state can do. No Constitutional amendment required.

I'm not "concerned", R270, I'm realistic. Magical thinking isn't going to flip the Senate.

The current Senate numbers are 47-53. Gerrymandering makes it difficult for D's to win in some states.

A strong D presidential candidate could help with Senate races in 2020, of course.

I hope that Mueller was playing Manafort against Trump and not that Mueller got played by Manafort and Trump. The thought that those sleazeballs could get away with this makes me sick. I also read that apparently there’s nothing illegal about Manafort’s attorneys talking to Trump’s attorneys. Unethical yes, criminal no.

I just dont know what to believe anymore.

No R272, Hyde-Smith was filler for what’s his name that retired due to ill health. His term would have been up in 2020. She has to run again then for a full 6-year term.

Just believe, r275....

Believe it or not, most of the states that have stringent electoral rules are red states. They will send you to prison if you vote against the winner. Problem is, just like gerrymandering, political intervention fucked up the system. When they redo the voters rights act (already on the menu), they need a provision that the state may in no way impose upon or pressure electorates. They are supposed to vote independently to insure we dont encounter a Donald J Trump.

Gerrymandering has NO EFFECT on Senate races....they are state wide, not districts where gerrymandering benefits the GOP.

OK.....WHY IN THE FUCK HAS CORY LEWANDOWSKI BEEN ALL OVER MSNBC THE PAST FEW DAYS.

STOP GIVING THESE TRAITOROUS FUCKS AIRTIME.

You're right about gerrymandering, R279. My bad.

I suspect part the problem is that rural states are REALLY REALLY red. That is difficult to change. And Wyoming gets as much representation in the Senate as CA, which is ridiculous.

That is correct, r276, unfortunately r272 types before she thinks or maybe she really has no idea what's going on in the Hyde-Smith special election/term. She also has some sort of issue with ellipses.

[quote] A strong D presidential candidate could help with Senate races in 2020, of course.

That's what good and effective grassroot level of grunt work can accomplish. Plenty of time for that. Picking someone who could win with the right support and backing.

WSJ alert: Special counsel Mueller's team believes Manafort lied about contacts with an associate in Ukraine, misled investigators on business dealings.

Word about the rural red states, although there are situations like in North Dakota. This last election pretty much had Democrat -- most of the east side, Republican -- center and west end.

R280 thank you! I was just going to type the same thing.... And Corey is in the top 10 of vile

So since we are in an unprecedented willderness I think that the following scenario is possibly plausible

Let’s say it is conclusively determined that certain states had their elections hacked in 2016 in a way that benefited DJT in close races. In that instance the wrong electors voted on behalf of that state. The electoral votes for that state are thus invalidated entirely since there is no do-over in the constitution, but they still aren’t legitimate votes.

At the point that his electoral votes fall below the minimum mandatory he is no longer president and the process for situations where there is no electoral college winner, which are outlined in the constitution, are followed.

Laws passed by Congress, like spending bills, remain in place, but executive orders and judicial appointments made by the pretender President are nullified.

This would respect the Constitution, maintain the electoral college, incentivize Stares to protect their elections and maintain a sense of continuity.

[quote] Laws passed by Congress, like spending bills, remain in place, but executive orders and judicial appointments made by the pretender President are nullified.

[quote] This would respect the Constitution, maintain the electoral college, incentivize Stares to protect their elections and maintain a sense of continuity.

I very much like that.

r287 LOVE THIS. You must share it with those in power.

R289 I wish I were close enough to those in power to share it effectively. Maybe if our two wonderful DC posters like the idea they could. Otherwise I’d be thrilled if any of you want to share it.

Using that model, Hillary is once again the legal winner with the most electoral votes as well as the most total votes.

r290 I am one of the DC posters (former Congressional intern) and I will share it with my former colleagues but that congressman is on his way out. He retired (replaced by a Dem) and they are busy looking for other jobs and such but I will share it. I hope you send it to your reps and others do as well. :)

r281....thats another misconception thats been circulating uncorrected. The Senate represents the State, Congress represents the People. Each state gets 2 Senators regardless of size because they represent the State. Each state is divided into districts that are SUPPOSED to represent the people. each district then sends 1 elected representative to Congress. Congress is the people....and there are some states that have 1 Congressperson because the population is so small, and then there are dozens of reps from some states because of the higher population.

The plot thickens. AGAIN!

r282...NO. If she was a filler, she would have been appointed by the Gov until the current term was up, then she could run again. This WAS the election for a full term, thats why there were 3 people running for it and why there was an election. This was actually a runoff election because Hyde-Smith and Espy both failed to receive 50 % of the vote in the Nov 6 election. The spoiler 3rd party didnt get to participate in the run off.

Fuck. Is that for real?

As lovely as those ideas are, every one of them has been thought of long ago. They are problematic. The best answer to all of our problems is found at the ballot box. Vote them out again in 2020 and take the Senate too. Trumpism's massive, systemic destruction will have to be undone piece by piece.

R295, from Vox: Hyde-Smith and Espy are vying to finish Cochran’s current term, which ends in 2020.

It's just like Doug Jones in 2016. And now both Hyde-Smith and Jones are going to have to run again in 2020.

Hyde Smith has to run again in November 2020. The remainder of Cochran's term only runs through January of 2021.

No r295, “the win allows Hyde-Smith to complete the final two years of Sen. Thad Cochran's six-year term. Cochran retired in April, and Hyde-Smith was appointed to temporarily succeed him.”

So we get another shot to take the bigoted cunt out in 2020? Good.

But we need to run a better candidate than Mike Espy in 2020; he was not very effective against her.

I really hate people like R295 because they make their proclamations that sound real but are complete bullshit that they didn't even bother to take two seconds to look up on Google.

I agree with R280 and R286, but with one exception: Doesn't Lawrence O'D despise him? It would be kinda fun to watch if he were to appear on O'D's show.

Cory L. has a book coming out. Every time he's been on MSNBC this week, they've mentioned the book.

^^So why is MSNBC shilling for him? Obvious question. Why the fuck isn't he on Fox???

MSNBC should not have that piece of trash on.

Well Chris Matthews mentioned he was going on a book tour next so maybe he's gone for good now?

I will turn the channel if he is on MSNBC. I will not watch any more lies from people associated with him.

R305, because he has a unique perspective, I think. He can semi-credibly speculate as to what's going on in Trump's mind in relation to the Mueller investigation. I think that's literally how one of the anchors framed his appearance. Maybe Katy Tur.

Remember back in the good old days when Larary Flynt used to inverstigate and out scandalous shit about our enemies? WTF is someone who can do the job on some of these shitheels? This Hyde Smith person and McConnell, Nunes, etc need to be raked over the hot coals of public exposure. Hype thecandals!

"Mueller, She Wrote" podcast host A.G. is on tonight's Slate Trumpcast podcast episode.

In 2020, it's IMPERATIVE at a minimum to get either a Dem Senate or a Dem POTUS. Ideally both.

Fight tooth and nail for both Senate and POTUS because those ancient Dem SCOTUSes will start to fall down one by one, and then we're totally fucked with both Senate and POTUS in Rethug hands.

I pray daily (I'm an atheist but all hands on deck as it were) for continued health of RBG and the other three.

So what seats can we flip in 2020? We need either 3 flips with a Dem POTUS or 4 without. But since we have Doug Jones running again in 2020, he's most likely going to lose. So we would actually need 4-5 seats to flip.

Maine and Colorado seem like easy pickups. BYE BYE CUNT COLLINS. North Carolina and Arizona are the next two possible. But the last one? We would need to flip either Georgia, Iowa, Kentucky, or Texas. Even in a wave year, I don't know if we could do it.

Rachel is making a good case tonight for Trump being insane. I don’t think that’s her intention, but it is obvious. She might just be trying to make a case for him being impeachable, but “crazy” comes to mind.

Haven’t seen hide nor hair of the lovely Miss Carter Page or that fat sweaty white guy (can’t remember his name) that was on cable TV nonstop on his coke/alcohol fueled bender. Wonder how they fit into all this.

Am I the only one getting a feeling that something big is about to break ? Think about the last few days...more and more info is coming into the public sphere that is circling around a bullseye and its about to strike. Between Manafort, Corsi, various court filings, statements by people like Gulliani and even Trump himself spelling it out that Trump and Co conspired against the US....Now Corsi, on national television admits his part and that he was helping Trump, and that he and his attorney have been providing info to Trump about Mueller.

The big break will be revealed when we least expect it, I think.

R315, what was that second guy's name?.

Round up Putin's Crown Price with bone spurs, and his criminal cohorts, take them to charred Forest with a two minute head start, then release ManBearPig to hunt down each and rip and gobble.

R318, Sam Nunberg, Stone's guy.

I noticed something interesting on the news today. I don't know if it's just me or if the media is starting to push back?

Anyway, it was on one of the network news stations, I can't recall which, but they were talking about Drumpf and the reporter said, "he is continuing to try to undermine the Mueller investigation..." "his attempts include posting several false statements on his Twitter account."

I just found it really odd as I don't think I've heard them outright declare that he was "undermining," and I certainly don't think I've ever heard them outright call him a liar.

Prince, not price r319

I'm going to be really fucking disappointed if the biggest assholes we get end up being Stone and Junior.

R321, there was also that reporter who fact-checked Trump to his face yesterday and made him run away. One thing I've never understood is the media's seeming ability to use every word in the thesaurus for 'lie' instead of calling his fucking lies, lies.

R315 R318

Come to think of it I’ve caught Ms Carter Page sweating during interviews just as much as Sam Nunberg.

Both are loony tunes that a need to be slapped sillier than they are.

Nunberg, Page, S. Miller.... isn't there a pattern here.

and Stone & Corsi.....

IMO Trump's recent comments about pardoning Manafort, "I wouldn't take it off the table, why would I take it off the table?" is his way of trying to keep Manafort's mouth shut. Dangling the possibility of a pardon is a deterrent to Manafort, Corsi, Stone Flynn, and others so they do not cooperate with Mueller. Whether Trump actually pardons them is a whole different story. I wouldn't hold my breath. I'm sure he will get some ideas and suggestions after he meets with his handler Vlad Putin.

I loved Andrea Mitchell's classy way of calling him a liar "...his statements were counter-factual..."

Someone is so worried that the winner of the 2016 election takes her rightful and legal position. There has been a GOP and Trussia troll campaign regarding this since November 9, 2016. It’s because they know she’s got a case.

Good Trumpcast today

This should be running nonstop on every news channel. The media is complicit:

Anything new on whether or not the government shuts down next Friday?

I only hope Putin doesn’t give Dump ammo at the next meeting.

[quote]I loved Andrea Mitchell's classy way of calling him a liar "...his statements were counter-factual..."

My euphemism is "excrementally discharged".

Please elaborate r328.

R328, Hillary has said publicly that she and her team looked at it every legal way you can and found absolutely no grounds to contest the outcome. I think her campaign staff really wanted to pursue it and they did explore the possibility, but realistically there a re no grounds under the law. It seems grossly unfair and maybe we do need laws and remedies for these situations. In general, it is scary to me how truly fragile out set up is. We've always assumed that even the most limited candidates and Presidents, were all basically motivated by a kind of patriotism and love of country. We never anticipated such a monstrous, corrupt piece of shit sitting in the Oval.

Wanted to add that we assumed that there would be respect for the rule of Law as well. Shit. Even Nixon with his corrupt ass knew he was breaking laws and was wrong. He respected to process in Congress too. Trump is a whole other kind of vile.

Speaking of trolls, contrary to idiocy like what is at R328 there is no such legal mechanism.

When I look at the unsavory cast of characters surrounding Trump it makes me sick. He has no standards. Looking at a complete asshole like Matthew Whitaker installed as "acting AG" there is no way he is qualified professionally. We used to have standards. WTF.

By the by, How's Coffee Boy doing after his third day in stir? Has someone already fed his coin slot?

Why don't we run Richard Painter? He looks like he just had a stroke but is so pissed off that won't stop him from ripping your ass and good. His campaign speeches would be riveting! Imagine the debates!

From wiki: In July 2015, Painter was diagnosed with shingles and Ramsay Hunt syndrome type 2 which left his face partially paralyzed.

R340 I fucking love Richard Painter! Haven’t seen him in a while on the news.

I hope he starts making the rounds soon. You know he’s just frothing at the mouth to pounce Trump for his blatant disregard pf. the emoluments clause. And now, Painter will have Dem support to do some ass kicking.

I'm assuming you just saw Painter on MSNBC w/Brian Williams. He was great.

R343

Ohhhh no! I missed him. I was with Don Lemon.

Thanks for the heads up. It’s good to know Richard is back out there.

Roger Stone/WikiLeaks gossip gurl Randy Credico is feeling zesty this evening

R345 Is that seriously Randy Credico's twitter account or just some troll?

Corsi is filing a complaint with Whitaker claiming Mueller violated something. See? This is all a ploy for Whitaker to justify closing down Mueller's investigation. First they tried to discredit him. Actually that's ongoing. They they tried to smear him with allegations of sexual improprieties, and now they are going to insist he went too far or violated some rule or WTF ever in his role as SP. People are all talking about how fast things are moving, but I don't think Mueller has much choice. He knows the hammer could come down at any moment. I do believe Mueller sometimes gives them more credit than they deserve. They're really keystone cops in a lot of ways. Now Corsi is not a dummy. But he is no match for Mueller. Mueller has been adhering to the highest standards for a long time. He approaches his tasks with rigor. It's a long standing habit. And while Corsi and the others may possess a low cunning, they have not applied themselves or challenged themselves to any standards for years. They are arrogant, dishonest, sloppy and careless. So I'm gonna bet on Mueller. Of course Whitaker has no standards.

If Uncle Fester-Whittaker closes the investigation or redacts parts of the finished report, can the Dems hire Muller and allow him to continue the case in January?

I get nervous thinking Whitaker could fuck this up.

I love Richard Painter, too. Here's his Twitter feed.

Painter on Ivanka Trump defending her use of email, "There is no equivalency. Clinton is intelligent, she is not clueless about what’s going on in the world, she did not help her husband and her father betray America to the Russians, and she did not use her government position to sell clothes."

Thank you R349

I should’ve known better, and watched MSNBC tonight. Instead, I tuned on Don Lemon, and watched that pouty sour puss Rick Santorum whine endlessly.

Lol at "and she did not use her government position to sell clothes."

Hilz didn't get Chinese trademarks for voting machines either.

R350 Lol!

Go Painter!

R351 Brian Williams will be repeated at 11pm out here on the West Coast. I'm pretty sure it's repeated on the east as well, at 2am.

^^You can also go to the MSNBC site and the segment will be on there.

Vladimir Putin's English-language Twitter account @putinrf_Eng is suspended.

Wow, R330, thank you for that link. After all this time, after arguing with so many fucking far left nutjobs who didn’t believe Russia hacked the DNC/Podesta emails, FINALLY those two assholes are on record saying it was Russia?!

When I think about how angry those fuckers made me. The people at The Nation magazine, too, pushed the “Maybe it was an in-person download” theory. Glenn Greenwald. “Sane Progressive” Debbie Lusignan and her cult of conspiracy theory fans. That Assange-loving Australian bitch (I forget her name).

Not that I ever had any doubt, of course, but hopefully that will finally shut those assholes up once and for all?

Natasha Bertrand co-authored a piece for The Atlantic tonight about George Papadopolous was bragging to a confidant that he had business deals in Russia that he was working on, that would make a lot of money for himself and Donald Trump. This was in 2016, before and after the election.

George Papadopoulos is super swarthy. Is he biracial?

And super dumb.

[quote]He ripped special counsel Robert Mueller’s probe and charged that Manafort, former political adviser Roger Stone and Stone’s associate Jerome Corsi were all asked to lie by the special counsel.

[quote]“If you told the truth, you go to jail,” Trump said.

Thus Trump is now in effect accusing the special counsel of colluding in lies, and obstructing justice. Are not such allegations themselves actionable?

Robert Mueller and his team of the nation's best lawyers cannot take kindly to having their professional integrity so glibly smeared.

Trump in his narrowing corner has little option - given his idiocy - but to double down and lash out. Nonetheless, I found this raising of the stakes astonishingly reckless.

Expecting Trump to behave any differently will not happen.

Pressure has to be put on both the House and the Senate to account.

R361, just think about this idiotic statement. Trump is saying that by questioning these people, Mueller is forcing them to lie...because if they tell the truth they will go to jail. Is that right? That's what he said: "If they tell the truth, they will go to jail..." When I saw that I had to laugh out loud.

I was encouraged by the Yemeni vote yesterday. 63 Senators. A Bi-Partisan vote. Now everyone knows the Saudis have spread a lot of money around over the years. So if those fuckers could vote together on this, there is hope for other "bi-partisan" efforts.

Day #4 of 14 for Coffee Boy's incarceration. Is he having fun yet?

In an email to Stone, Corsi suggested they start spreading rumors re: Clinton’s health, as the topic was likely to feature in the forthcoming Wikileaks dump. 2 days later Stone’s Infowars associate released video accusing Clinton of having host of ailments

If telling the truth lands you in jail, it seems to me that you have broken the law. Trump has a problem with this? I thought he was the Law and Order President.

Back to that photo in OP's post: a fist pump is a sure sign of deep intellect.

NYT: Michael Cohen to plead guilty to new charge in Mueller Probe per MSNBC

And apparently, according to the OP, Cohen has made some kid of official plea agreement with Mueller now.

President Donald Trump's former personal lawyer Michael Cohen pleaded guilty Thursday to lying to Congress about a real estate project in Russia, as part of a deal with special counsel Robert Mueller in the probe of Russian interference in the 2016 U.S. presidential election, the Associated Press and other outlets reported Thursday.

Cohen made a surprise court appearance at federal court in Manhattan on Thursday morning, where he admitted to making the false statements.

r369 here, sorry I meant Cohen has a plea deal with Mueller according the the AP not OP. Sorry.

This latest Michael Cohen news is big stuff.

He's pleading guilty on one account of lying to congress about Moscow Trump building.

Oops

I bet Cohen has been lying about being in Prague too all this time.

He was in Prague in 2016. The Dossier was right all along.

CNN: According to information which is being read out in court, Cohen made a false statement regarding Trump Tower deal in Moscow that he was working on in 2015 and 2016. He had discussion about the project even later. Cohen had previously said the deal was stopped in Jan 2016

NBC: The discussions about Trump Tower were going on as late as 2017.

Not clear when in 2017.

I heard as late as August 2017 r376.

Cut to the chase. When is Trump done?

I hesitate to say (for the millionth time) that Trump is toast, but...

this aint good for him at all.

Trump....you in danger girl.

@matthewamiller

Trump's attacks on the Mueller probe late last night and again early this morning raise a huge question: did Whitaker brief him on what was coming today?

This is beginning to smell like latter day Watergate...

just sayin'

GOOD question r382.

I'm loving the Cohen news. However, I can't lie and say I'm not wary that there's a possibility that he's pulling a Manafort and has been discussing things with Dotard?

He previously said he would take a bullet for him and then all of a sudden it was an about face. I know he could have been scared into cooperating to protect his family or felt betrayed by Dotard... but I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility that he's also singing like a bird to the Orange one.

Trump has repeatedly said that he had no business dealings in Russia, tweeting in July 2016 “For the record, I have ZERO investments in Russia” and telling reporters in January 2017 that he had no deals there because he had “stayed away.”

Such statements would be undermined if Cohen is now asserting conversations about the project continued past January 2016.

This news drops just as Dotard is leaving for the G20 to meet his handler.

As much as I hate it, Trump is just going to defend his statements about not having any investments or deals in Russia by saying that the Trump Tower Moscow deal never went through...therefore he didn’t lie.

CNN: After Cohen stated his allocution, a prosecutor stood up & added that Cohen had also “minimized his contacts with the Russian government” to Congress, and that in fact Cohen had had a 20-minute conversation with a spokesman for the Kremlin. Cohen acknowledged that was correct.

NBC: Trump is changing his story right now, "When I'm running for president that doesn't mean I'm not running a business."

Donald Trump tweet, January 11 2017:

Russia has never tried to use leverage over me. I HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH RUSSIA - NO DEALS, NO LOANS, NO NOTHING!

But he was still trying to do the deal in 2017 and he was not suppose to be trying to make that deal, he is a lying sack of shit ...just like every Republican in Washington.

Correction: ".When I'm running for president that doesn't mean that I'm not allowed to do business."

Also something to the effect that Cohen is a very bad hombre.

Until now: I had no business with Russia! I have the best memory! I have the best people!

@PopeHat:

Though Trump isn't named explicitly, he and his organization figure prominently and obviously in the charging document and plea. That's not something federal prosecutors do lightly.

This strongly implies further action against someone.

Now, we don't have the written factual basis yet (the statement of supporting facts that Cohen agrees to). But reports of Cohen's plea suggest he admitted to these lies to help Trump and Trump's narrative, but notably NOT claiming that Trump knew he'd lie to Congress.

But the conclusion that the President of the United States knew that his personal counsel was repeatedly lying to the Congress of the United States about the President's business is inescapable under these circumstances.

So Trump will now become increasingly desperate. Is that why Kelly & Mattis are sticking around?

Schiff : We'll investigate credible information that Trump business deals with Russians involved money laundering. (I assume Russians buying Trump properties in the US). We also will release the transcripts of our witnesses to the Special Counsel but it shouldn't wait till January. There are a number of other witnesses who haven't been truthful with us and we want to call them back.

Trump: Cohen is lying and he's trying to get a reduced sentence for things that have nothing to do with me.

Of course Dotard is saying that Michael Cohen lied in this new plea deal.

Does Dotard know that lying to the court and Special Counsel is a crime?

Does he also know that Cohen isn't just vocalizing, and that the Feds have documents to support what Cohen is now saying?

LOL "I wasn't trying to hide anything about the Trump Tower project."

This morning:

LOL "Cohen is a weak person and not a very smart person."

This "not a very smart person" worked for him for what, 20 years?

He has the best people!

Do you think Trump’s lawyers took sick time for the rest of the day/ week/ year?

NBC: As late as June 2016 Cohen discussed the status and progress of Trump Tower with "Individual 1" on at least three occasions and briefed family members of "Individual 1".

Trump tweets just now:

Based on the fact that the ships and sailors have not been returned to Ukraine from Russia, I have decided it would be best for all parties concerned to cancel my previously scheduled meeting in Argentina with President Vladimir Putin. I look forward to a meaningful Summit again as soon as this situation is resolved!

(This after the WH confirmed last night the meeting would happen ... and Trump said this morning it was happening.)

Can't wait to see trump ejected from office and settled all nicely in jail.

That tweet at R404! Yeah, ok Donald....sure.

r404....its still happening....TRUMP IS A LIAR.

Also note, the charging documents state Cohen was planning a trip to Moscow to meet with the Russians, but instead went to Italy to avoid detection since Russia was a hot topic at the time. Who else, in the same time period, mad a few trips to Italy ?.....the same person who bragged in an email of how he was helping Trump/Russia and would be set for life...George Papadapolous.

"until this situation is resolved." "Things are happening." "It's being worked out."

Fat Nixon just assumes crisis matters get resolved by magic, without any action on his part.

REMEMBER....even with guilty pleas, etc....all the people we are seeing going to court for various things WILL BE CHARGED AGAIN WHEN THE CONSPIRACY INDICTMENTS COME DOWN...thats why we havent seen any specific Russia charges against people who we know are involved.

Well for me the other take aways from this are that Michael Cohen is finally earned some credibility with Mueller enough so that he has a deal and he is singing like a songbird. The other thing that is important is that Mueller is charging people for lying to Congress. That's very important because it gives the committees credibility and muscle.

I know the media is focused on "Trump lied to us!!!" and yeah, he did. But there are other aspects of this is very important. I also have to smile at the way the announcement of Cohen's deal and his plea, coinciding with Trump getting ready for another Putin Meeting. LOL! Yeah.

Lol Cheeto covering his ass about not meeting Putin now.

Edward Burke's office represented Trump's companies for twelve years. Today, the feds visited, told everyone to leave, and taped brown paper to the office's windowed entrance.

Wow @ R412.

I wonder if Donald will ever get to see Putin again?

r414...dont be niave....Trump will see..and spend time with Putin tomorrow if hes not on the phone with him already.

Andrea Martin is making a good point that Putin's spokesman Peskov is directly named in the Cohen plea deal, and Cheeto canceled the meeting just after the plea became public knowledge.

Maybe not the only fact that got Cheeto to cover ass but certainly interesting.

Trump's terrified of meeting Putin because they both know the jig is up. Trump would be treated with offhand but total contempt. The biggest Useful Idiot in history has failed, as Putin knew he would. But, the incredible damage has been done.

Trump hasn't a white hairless leg to stand on. He can't emerge from this with any advantage whatsoever. His failure on all fronts will be abject and absolute.

I think Trump was going to the G20 meeting with Putin until his people convinced him that the meeting was not a good idea.

I believe Trump will see Putin but it will be off the record.

To the person wondering if Cohen might be funneling info to Trump: he isn’t. Trump has nothing nice to say about Cohen. Complete contrast with Manafort. Trump has spoken about both of them and his characterization of the officially flipped Cohen is completely different from how he talked about PM.

Cohen's lawyer is no friend to Trump.

Andrea Mitchell, not Martin duh!

But we liked Andrea Martin so much better...

Chuck Rosenberg is a former prosecutor and he has a dull delivery, but his analysis on Andrea Mitchell is absolutely stellar. He is one of the best legal minds they have on TV analyzing this. He is very professorial. His insights onto strategy is so reassuring I want to kiss is bland ass. Andy video clips you get to see on MSNBC look for him. In general, Andrea and Craig Melvin on MSNBC are excellent on this. From 11 AM until 1 PM all you need to know. I have to go back to work in a minute, but damn this is good shit. And yes, a lot of the journalists and the Analysts are saying Trump cancelled the Putin meeting because of the Cohen development. Rosenberg asserts that certain language in Cohen's plea indicates that he said things that were unnecessary and indicate Mueller has a lot more then anyone realizes.

[quote] The other thing that is important is that Mueller is charging people for lying to Congress.

Given that Democratic senators and representatives have said that witnesses were lying to their faces and the Republican members of investigative committees pretty much aided and abetted the lying, this could get very interesting.

Charging people with lying to Congress means you have the goods on the truth.

GO TEAM MUELLER!

Like he has a choice, R414.

Mmmmmmmm, justice!

Now that Dems control the House, can the Ethics Committee investigate Devin Nunez?

I’m sad that Russian oligarchs and their wives were denied the chance to enjoy the delights of the Ivanka Spa in Trump Tower Moscow. Especially on Take-Your-Nubile-Teenage-Daughter Day.

How many handguns in the study desk might be deployed after that final large whisky at 2.00am, one wonders.

Good for you, Rose at R418, you got one right!

R429, I'd love it! Hopefully someone or some organization will file an ethics complaint against him to get the ball rolling.

I kinda want "stay tuned, fatso" from a Randy Credico tweet to be in an upcoming Mueller Investigation topic title

Someone asked earlier who "the other fat guy" is and WEHT him. I think you were talking about the gross, disgusting Sam Clovis. Apparently he is some kind of buddy of Matt Whitaker's and a lot of Republican Senators are hoping that Trump names a permanent AG very soon because there is such an obvious conflict of interest. Sam is implicated in the Russia investigation. He was not a major player but he was implicated. The Hill reporter was talking about it on MSNBC at noon.

Also: Deustche Bank offices were raided yesterday. They said it was because of some information related to the Panama Papers. Hah.

According to the links within, Trump’s Chicago tax filer was raided by the Feds, the staff was asked to leave, and brown paper was put over the door. Also they went to another of his offices.

“[–]Weekendsession 32 points an hour ago Seems to have been reported by Chicago Sun, who said they turned up to his City Hall office (he's Finance Committee Chairman ) as well as his ward office.”

They speculate that this is related to property taxes in Chicago’s Trump Tower that were reduced in Trump’s favor. Burke abruptly severed his ties with Trump after twelve years, this year.

Memba this?

Die Cohen, you snarky, smug, and aloof CUNT!

Go Briana Keilar!

Here’s the article related to R436

Trump is not having a good day."

the fact that 3 stories all happened so early in the day makes me hopeful they'll be at least 1 more breaking story this afternoon or tonight. I'm ready for MORE.

Remember though, unfortunately any new info Mueller learns during this time from Cohen that could be used as future indictments could be blocked by Whitaker and we wouldn't know about it until the probe is over. I wish Mueller and Cohen had made this plea agreement while Sessions was still AG

Serenity Now?

[quote]Trump hasn't a white hairless leg to stand on.

Surely this will be an inspiration for a mini-challenge on All Stars season 4.

Where is Pence in all of this? Is he clean? I don’t see his name mentioned in anything.

R433, if he pushed for Manafort then chances are he isn't clean.

[quote]Who else, in the same time period, mad a few trips to Italy ?.....the same person who bragged in an email of how he was helping Trump/Russia and would be set for life...George Papadapolous.

Is this around the same time that Ivanka was found to be spending quality time in Croatia together? That was early-mid August 2016.

so no matter what horrors they find Whitaker can snuff it all out??

I'm old enough to remember when U.S. presidents didn't characterize people who cooperate with law enforcement as "weak and not smart" and those who lie to law enforcement as "very brave."

R446 unless Whitaker has recused himself (and so far there's no indication of that), anything new filed or requested by Mueller can be blocked by him. Those rumored numerous sealed indictments that were filed while Sessions was still AG cannot be blocked though.

II would think a plea agreement happens before a criminal's information can be used as evidence to build the case and indict others. Given what a liar Cohen has been before he flipped, it's a given that Mueller already has corroborating evidence for whatever he would say.

R443 Pence was brought in by MANAFORT. Hand picked and as a result Chris Christie was cast aside...

Beside Woodward, who's has an ongoing outline for a book after this is over?

I have faith that Mueller would be able to work around any fuckery that Whitaker might try.

I’ll be a bit of a Pollyanna—it’s Christmas season, after all! I think Whitaker will not derail the investigation. If it’s as bad as we think, I’m hoping he realizes he could be entangled legally in this mess, derailing his career for the foreseeable future (or forever) if he tries to subvert the process. All of this hinges on Whitaker having half a brain and realizing too much has been uncovered in the investigation. I do think he’s warning Dump, though, on upcoming things like what happened with Cohen today.

Sessions being fired was a threat for about a year, right? I'm sure that Mueller and team therefore had plenty of time to prepare for several scenarios of obstruction that might come there way.

I agree r453. I think there are ticking time bombs already in the court system that Mueller planted.

Outgoing Sen. Jeff Flake (R-AZ) flaked again when he withdrew his “no” vote against controversial judicial nominee Jonathan Kobes.

Flake has pledged to stage an epic protest against President Donald Trump and Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY), who refused to allow a vote on a bill to protect Bob Mueller.

“So my commitment to not vote for judges before the committee or on the floor until we get this done stands,” Flake told reporters Wednesday.

“That’s not an idle threat,” CNN host Jake Tapper said when Flake announced his protest. He noted “if he votes against any of the 32 judges that come before the Senate floor, that makes it 50-50 and [Vice President] Mike Pence gets to be a tiebreaker.

That’s exactly what happened Thursday, when Sen. Jim Inhofe (R-OK) was unable to vote, though he would have been a “yes” vote. Flake’s “no” vote would have prevented Kobes from being confirmed. Instead, Flake withdrew his “no” vote so that the vote would be 49 to 49 and Pence would have to cast the tie-breaking vote.

That’s not unreasonable, R452. Think about it. Cohen’s career is over. Manafort life, ad he knew it, is over. Roger Stone is over. His disgusting grandson is online begging for donations. Papawhatever is over. Corsi is over. And on and on, all of these people related to Trump are at the end of their careers. They will no longer bask in the glory of their spoils. They won’t be recruited, won’t be hired, won’t be invited, won’t be funded, won’t be sought for anything. At some point, Whitaker will realize that his only chance at furthering his career is to disentangle from Trump.

Is there a well-edited Wiki-type site for all of this? Gosh how I'd love one — links to all the articles cited, all the people having their own pages, a daily update page....

He really so just like the rest of the deplorables. But, I take solace that his ass is out of office in a few weeks time and a Democrat is taking his place!

The Wikipedia page is pretty good...

MAGA Haberman, doing her part to help her good friends again. This "article" basically serves as a bullhorn for Giuliani.

FYI, R221 and its subsequent posts have a whiff of attempted demoralization...and it is posting nasty, racist shit on the Jada Pinkett thread.

[quote]Flake withdrew his “no” vote so that the vote would be 49 to 49 and Pence would have to cast the tie-breaking vote.

Sounds like he will have a great career ahead of him!

So if Cohen's statement today about TTMoscow lines up with Cheeto's written homework, and yet Cohen is lying, the conclusion is that Cheeto also lied to Mueller.

That's the logical conclusion from NYT talking to Cheeto's lawyers.

Geniuses.

but remember about Whitaker, the FBI is actively going after the company on which he was a board member for their scam. They were fined millions of dollars. So Whitaker clearly isn't smart enough to realize how bad it looks for him to preside over the Justice Department with all that going on. He was the one making threats to customers who complained about the company's fraudulent behavior. How will he not get in trouble himself? Therefore I don't know if he'd hold back from interfering in the Mueller probe

Rudy Giuliani is always about 10 steps behind.

Good point r465... again, it depends on whether Whitaker has half a brain or no brain at all.

Rudy also inadvertently suggesting what everyone knows, that Cheeto didn't write a damn line of his answers and it was all lawyers. But he took all credit so he's on the hook for official testimony.

ABOARD AIR FORCE ONE (AP) — White House: Formal meetings with Turkey, S Korea canceled; Trump will instead speak informally with leaders at G-20.

Donald is obviously lying in a fetal position on the floor of Air Force One.

Oooh, r469, I hope so! I’m happy if this guy, who’s made our lives miserable, is himself miserable.

[quote]Donald is obviously lying in a fetal position on the floor of Air Force One.

I doubt that Air Force One has that much floor space.

My guess is he is screaming hysterically at anyone who will listen on AF1 and they’re letting him cancel meetings, or maybe talking him into it somehow, because they’re afraid he’ll go beserk in front of anyone who happens to be nearby.

You know if he does a press conference, the whole thing will be about what a monster Cohen is, even if the subject is supposed to be global warming or something else.

Anyone want to bet the only “informal meeting” that’s going to happen is Trump trying to chase down Putin like a baby duck following its mommy? Of course, Putin will pretend it has nothing to do with him. For all we know, Putin suggested to a few of these people that now would be a good time to talk to Mueller. He’s probably just as sick of Trump as we are.

Don’t say that, r414. Why must you be so cruel?

Wonder what Sentrx Lindsay has to say about all this...

R472 "For all we know, Putin suggested to a few of these people that now would be a good time to talk to Mueller. He’s probably just as sick of Trump as we are."

Stranger things have happened. I would die laughing if this were the case though.

Hope everyone is watching Nicolle Wallace’s show on msnbc if they can. Pretty much must-see TV. Maddow even called in to discuss the gravity of today’s event so.

WATCH THIS! Watch it now! Watch it on full-screen, bitches.

Good read

I hope Mueller gets to see the video at R477. He could probably use a good laugh about now.

I'm enjoying the comments to the idiot's tweets in his twitter feed.

Sorry about the hideous photo above.

Can we make "Traitors Get Fucked" the next thread title? (Per the R477 video?)

Donny Deutsch just explained it all in the simplest terms on Nicolle W’s show.

For all of you salivating over this, get your pink triangles ready for when Mother Pence gets in power via her spouse.

Hahahahahahahahaaaaaaaa! Ha.

GtFO, r484. We’re not scared.

Yeah, don't even try it, R484. Pence is damaged goods, too, any way you slice it. He'd have no time and no chance to pull anything like that.

Investigate Russia is another good resource for understanding the history, people, timeline of events etc. in this whole mess.

Oh, I hope this all doesn't ruin the lives of these dear caterpillars.

Opinion piece just out.

From R490

Mr. Cohen’s plea is also significant because it represents the first charge that Mr. Mueller is known to have pursued for false statements before Congress. Though other Trump associates, like George Papadopoulos, Rick Gates and Michael Flynn, also pleaded guilty for false statements, those were all made to investigators. A multitude of other Trump associates who gave testimony before Congress — such as Roger Stone and Donald Trump Jr. — now have additional reasons to worry about Mr. Mueller’s next moves.

R328, it should happen, it should have happened in early 2017. I just don't think it will come to pass. I'm not a Russian troll or anti-Hillary. I'm pro-reality.

What most fucking definitely WILL come to pass is the resurrection of Hillary Rodham Clinton. Prior to the 2016 Russian/Rethuglican attack she was one of the most admired politicians in America and consistently on the Top Ten Most Admired Women in the World list, with good reason. As Trump falls, she rises.

R490 last paragraph:

The potential risk to the president on three investigative fronts — obstruction, collusion and campaign finance — continues to grow. We know that the president has a tendency to hit back twice as hard when he is threatened. That puts the investigation at greater risk. Legislation to protect the special counsel was once again blocked by Republican leadership from a Senate vote on Wednesday. The coming omnibus spending legislation will provide a must-pass vehicle to try again to enact these protections, and we hope the supporters of Mr. Mueller, and of democracy and accountability, on both sides of the aisle will seize the moment. The course of justice may depend on it.

... It is highly likely Mueller suspected Manafort’s plea agreement was a charade and an attempt to place a spy in the enemy camp from the very beginning. It is highly unlikely that during the barely two months of Manafort’s “cooperation,” the special counsel shared anything important with him. The investigators certainly didn’t disclose the contents of other witnesses’ testimony or provide him with critical documents or any other clues about their ultimate plans.

Nice compilation

[quote]President Donald Trump’s company planned to give a $50 million penthouse at Trump Tower Moscow to Russian President Vladimir Putin as the company negotiated the luxury real estate development during the 2016 campaign, according to four people, one of them the originator of the plan.

[quote]Two US law enforcement officials told BuzzFeed News that Michael Cohen, Trump’s personal lawyer at the time, discussed the idea with a representative of Dmitry Peskov, Putin’s press secretary

Nice summary site from CAP.

[quote] R140: I thought it had been pretty much confirmed that Trump couldn't pardon anyone if he was named as an unindicted co-conspirator...I don't know who would confirm that since it isn't true.

The argument is that a President cannot pardon himself. Related to that, is this argument that you can’t pardon co-conspirators. It will have to be settled by a court, since you just know that his children will be pardoned, at least.

Ari Melber is talking about the article at r496 now. It was just posted 15 minutes ago.

... In short, the case for collusion, at least in part, posits that Russia hacked the emails and gave them to WikiLeaks to release at an advantageous time, and that “Corsi got information on how WikiLeaks planned to use the emails and passed it to Stone, who he knew was in regular contact with the Trump campaign.”

Corsi and Stone are denying the allegations, but if proved by documentary evidence, we have at least the basic outline for how a conspiracy would have operated. Trump, in his answers to Mueller, claims he never spoke with Stone about WikiLeaks, and did not know about the Trump Tower meeting. (The Post reports that Trump and Stone had ongoing middle-of-the-night conversations throughout the campaign, but the content of those discussions is not yet known.)

Just hear those handcuffs jingling ring-ting-tingling, too

C'mon it's lovely weather for a perp walk together with you...

This December will be very interesting... The Dems aren't in control of the House just yet, but the showdown between Team Mueller and Team Trump is already boiling over.

Corsi and Stone are so screwed.

They are all screwed. Hope there are enough empty jail cells.

Congrats, TJ Cox. What a name!

I agree, bringing in Whitaker forced Mueller’s hand. He is SO DUMB. “My lawyers didn’t write those answers, I did it myself!!” He’s a fucking MORON. And, it is truly amazing to think about how frequently Trump has fucked up golden opportunities. He bankrupted a casino, even after daddy bought $4 million in chips. He bankrupted the Plaza. He went bankrupt, what was it, six times? After his father had willed/given him something like $451 million, almost all completely tax-free? He totally publicly humiliates his first wife with his mistress, she calls out his rape, he could have ended it on decent terms and not made a complete enemy out of her.. He has dozens of business enterprises that went under, he can’t sell anything well!!! He used legal settlements to slime his way out of jeopardy numerous times. He is literally a PT Barnum, only much much much dumber.

If he hasnt tried this last huge grift with Russia, he would still be merrily fucking porn stars and fucking people over in real estate deals!!! Same for ALL of them, it just blows me away, the cockiness, the arrogance. They “had it all” so to speak (at least according to their shallow values) and yet, their greediness has ensured this fate. None of them knew when to say no, when to get out of the game, when to cut their losses. These were not truly street wise people — they are all just dumb, thick bricks. Not a single one of them is sharp, not even that twat of a daughter.

Clink Clink bitch

Great explanation of where things stand now

I just listened to a pundit talk about how it was interesting that Cohen was charged with lying to Congress. They mentioned Cohen got in troufor basically doing the same thing Kav did and that it was interesting if they have decided that lying to congress is something they are going to start charging people for.

That got me thinking.... does this mean that Congress could choose to charge good ole Brett with the same thing?

Pooty Poop expects that rim job. And C. B. Spurs craves to oblige.

R509, Miss Lindz would stand in front of Kav with an AK47 if anyone tried to touch him.

ANYONE ELSE HAVING AN extremely hard time getting this page to load and scroll down when it gets to 500 replies in length and there are many, many links posted?

My iPhone took like 10 minutes to scroll from r470 to r500, and it stopped dead whenever there was a link that someone posted. It also capitalized all the letters at the beginning of this post because it couldn’t keep up with me when I started typing. Anyone have any suggestions for how to avoid this? I’m using Safari on a 6S phone.

Love it r501!

I'd love to see Bannon and Hoe Hicks charged with lying to Congress as well

of course repub pundits are pushing back! but but but what about what about Clapper, Brennan and Hillary? They all "lied" to Congress! They should be indicted! Watch this be the new Fox story for the week

and lmfao this Cohen news, the Deustche Bank news and the Chicago news are all just ahead of the Argentina meeting...G20 should be a damn SHIT SHOW

Explain to me how, how the hell the repugs in congress can credibly say, when it's all said and done, they didn't know what we all fucking knew about this. None of this is shocking. Members of Congress know what was and did go on. Yet they went along with his agenda, with his judges, all while knowing the horrible shit that went down.

They must be held accountable. They could have stopped this early on.

I have to wonder if Miz Lindsey and one or two other big shots had "a talk" with Whitaker. It is highly likely they could have. Pointed out that he had a bright future ahead as a lawyer and Conservative Republican...maybe even a lifetime appointment to a federal judge ship. (not the Supreme court, but still...) and all he had to do is be a decent administrator, let the DoJ do their jobs and get out of the way. Nicole Wallace confirmed tonight that Rosenstein is still running the Mueller investigation and the Department of Justice ethics division has not yet finished investigating Whitaker...and his suitability. Meanwhile he is being sued by at last count 15 State Attorneys General, for being an illegal appointment, and then there is also the ongoing FBI investigation into one of his companies. I also think the IRS is looking at the money he paid himself from his non profit set up to put him on TV to defend Trump. So I'd say Matt has a pretty full plate and Miz Lindsay, Grassley, Hatch and a few others with real clout and a long reach may have had a talk with him about their old friend Sessions. Best advice anyone could giv eMatt is "Keep you head down, and get out of the way."

There is so much despair and anger in rural America, with suicide and overdoses happening in record numbers, the Dems could really make huge gains with the right message and policies. I think they can overlook their racism (I know that damn correct LBJ quote is true but) and finally realize conservatism doesn't work for them and never has. Keeping themselves isolated isn't working, either. I think the time is right to make huge advances there. If we did, bye bye repugs forever.

r519, who is supposed to overlook their racism? The Dems?

Fuck that.

Feds raided Trump's former tax attorney's office today.

Is Trump going to answer a single question from the press at the G20?

The current mood around him must be positively funereal.

And we haven't even reached the Junior and Jared chapters of this story.

My Bernie-Bro cousin has not seen the Jill Stein photo where she is sitting with Putin and Flynn in Oct 2016. Now, in his defense, he voted for Hillary and gladly did so, he was actually more in her corner after the leaked speeches to banks (he said he actually felt much better about her after reading the transcripts) and he did not go around disparaging her. He is very into politics so I was shocked he never saw the photo.

I would love to see Democrats make big gains in the heartland, R519. On the other hand, I think it won't be an immediate thing. There's a lot of stubborn people. That said, it will be interesting to see how they react to the unmistakable truth that what they currently represent is coming to an end.

[quote]Mueller is going to eat his liver every day until the end of time.

Foul gras

Radiating sunshine and happiness upon their arrival in Argentina

Descamasados! I am one of you!

So why did the orange turd leave the tree lighting ceremony early yesterday?

Soiled diaper?

Que, R528?

r528 Descamisados, tonto.

“the current mood around him must be positively funereal.”

No worries. Mel will give him a hand job in the Air Force One lav and it will perk him right up.

HA !.....Melania hasnt touched him since Barron was born.

Any urinating Russian hookers in Buenos Aires these days?

What's new, Buenos Aires?

I know, you're gonna be just a little stuck in me. I want you in me, too!

Eva was prettier, r528.

I trust Mueller's methods, but I'd be lying if I said I didn't want Barbie and Jr. to have been eviscerated by now.

One more time...

Yaas

The hits keep coming

Wow, R527, that doesn’t even look like Trump. It looks like a different person. Melanie's concrete face looks about the same of course. It doesn’t move.

With Trump, you never know if the hysteria you’re seeing is something significant or just Thursday. But he really seems scared, as opposed to just worried or depressed.

What if Trump and Concrete-Face are both completely freaking out, like Hitler and Eva in the bunker? What on earth do they think is going to happen? I thought they thought they were Teflon coated. Nothing would ever stick no matter what.

Does it ever occur to their staffers and Secret Service that Trump might do away with himself? I wonder what the protocol is for a President that is suicidal.

[quote]ANYONE ELSE HAVING AN extremely hard time getting this page to load and scroll down when it gets to 500 replies in length and there are many, many links posted?

Yes, my phone does the same thing.

r544, hopefully the 25th Amendment.

Yum... Eric Swalwell on CNN with Don Lemon in three minutes.

Thanks for the heads up r547!

Jill Wine-Banks looks like she is about to cum gallons talking about how she thinks Pres Bone Spurs is fucked either way.

The idea of a suicidal president is interesting. I'm assuming he'd be kept far away from the briefcase with the nuclear codes. Also, it's interesting to speculate on whether or not the White House has an on-call psychiatrist. I imagine they do, but it's obviously not something publicized.

He'd quit before he commits suicide.

Turn on Brian Williams now! Great panel.

I'm a gay man and yet I'm madly in love with Maya Wiley, Jill Wine-Banks and Mimi Rocha. Great ladies and great attorneys.

Why are you all so hot for Pence?

R551, we'll see about that.

If Trump is removed (or resigns), I think Pence should also be removed or forced to step aside. They were on the same ticket; therefore, if Trump's election was illegitimate, then so was Pence's. Both were installed, not elected. That means, if one goes, both should go and Nancy Pelosi should assume the Presidency.

Troll alert at R551.

Don't forget, R556, Pence was head of the transition team. And he lied about Manafort.

Pence would accomplish what exactly, as a lame duck with a Democratic House?

Someone is definitely trolling here.

If Pelosi somehow became President in all of this mess! Oh that would be (I'm going to be super gay here) DELICIOUS!

Nothing would make me happier than to see Ivanka, teary-eyed and mascara running, doing the perp-walk. Whenever I see her on tv speaking in that measured, robotic monotone, trying so hard to sound "intelligent", I wanna slap the damn veneers out of her mouth.

R559

My point is that he will be openly running the executive department with no one to stop his Christian executive orders.

Pence would be *WAY* too fucked if he tried that, R562. Seriously, if he assumed the presidency, it would be Gerald Ford 2.0. There's little chance of him getting to do anything other than be a placeholder.

Pence might as well be thinking about what type of guy he wants for a prison daddy (as should Miss Lindsey) because I think all the traitors with their collective heads up Dump's ass are going down with him.

If Trump goes down under the Russian collusion charge, there is no way Pence can keep himself at a distance. He was chosen by Manafort!

I'm so tired of the pence is worse trolls. The law matters. Does anyone really think we should ignore the felonies and treasonous behavior because pence is bad news?

YOU better believe there are members of the GOP Senate caucus right now trying to figure out how they can ignore or subvert the rules to obstruct or stop as much as they can, Democrats doing anything. You have no idea how unethical and vile these bastards are. They will fight for every inch they give up. Power concedes nothing without a demand. We are going to have to be smarter and tougher because the next few months are going to test us big time. So let's not break out the champagne yet....but I do think it's time to put it on ice...

Hell, if Trump goes down, the whole GOP goes down. There is no "we didn't know" excuse after so much aiding and abetting Trump's behavior.

Not ignore it, but the sheer glee at wildly Christianist Pence is my point.

This could be a thread of its own, but which Republicans would we most like to see go down with Trump, Pence, Jared and the children? I'm thinking McConnell, Lindsay, Paul Ryan and just because he's older than dirt and it would break his heart, Charles Grassley.

Mitch McConnell probably knows about all this shit! I wish someone would just bash his head against a very hard wall.

Of course he knows....hes part of the Gang of Eight...he gets regular briefings on it.

Ivanka's self-inflicted vocal fry is getting worse. I can't bear to listen to it. Her capacity for self delusion remains about the same.

May they lose everything in years of financial stupidity, prosecutions and lawsuits only to all end up living in the doomed 666 Fifth Ave.

It could be an American MADNESS OF KING GEORGE, R573. Or a Republican GREY GARDENS.

President Pelosi has a nice ring to it.

President Pelosi would cause heart attacks and massive pants shittings among them.

I really wish we could live in a world where Dems had some balls and fucked with the Repugs by making Hillary Speaker of the House.

I really want to see somebody do this Trump.

Remember this? I always believed Lanny Davis meant every word of his original reveal.

If he was right, Trump is fucked.

R561 I want to see Daddy shove her out the door while he tries to save his own ass.

I don't suppose we could get a House of Cards scenario between Donald and Ivanka?

Adam Schiff is going to make Pres Bone Spurs Shitt.

How fucking delicious would it be for Dotard and his original 3 offspring to all go down.

And not the way Ivanka does for daddy.

I want Pelosi, Schiff, and Waters to tag team him.

I googled Ivanka vocal fry and a DL thread came up in the links.

Link to new thread for when this one maxes out.

Don’t forget the Russians also hacked into GOP emails. I am sure Putin has plenty of dirt on Repugs he can unleash if he wants to. And since the Steele Dossier is being proven factual.......

Anyone want to make guesses as to what Rethug emails are being used against them?

[quote]How fucking delicious would it be for Dotard and his original 3 offspring to all go down.

We'd be just fine with it!

And how is Tiff doing at Law School? Maybe she can rep Big Sis in a few months.

Remember, they don't ask questions they don't already know the answers to.

Closing

this

thread

Out

Link to new thread below:

r559, like nominate judges?