Do the British deliberately mispronounce “foreign” words?

Yes they do. We do the exact same thing so we are not in any position to complain. Ever been to Havre de Grace in Maryland?

Someone call my valet!

I always think of this SNL sketch with Jimmy Smitts

Well, I never!

I don't know why they say "BEHR-rak Obama." Just go with how he pronounces it.

Ask a Brit to pronounce "jaguar."

Hilarity will ensue!

Yes, R6, I know. And I don’t understand it. They know how it’s pronounced. Are they just trying to demonstrate cultural superiority by refusing to pronounce non-English words properly?

It's pronounced, "Bombay."

We do it because in our view it's less pretentious to anglicise names than to go all Ricardo Montalban in the middle of our conversations. That's why we say Parisss and Vienna rather than Pareee and Veen. That's why you say Noo Yawk and Noo Awleenz rather than Nyoo York and Noovel Aur-lay-ong.

Americans are closer to the Spanish when they say jaguar but why don't they go ahead and make the J sound like an H -- isn't that what the Spanish do? So we sort of do the same thing. Approximate some of it and Anglicize some of it -- like Honduras with a strong H sound -- isn't H silent in Spanish? And do even Puerto Ricans say Porto Rico or do they say the more correct (I think) Pwayr-to Rico).

Oh and Rio Grande -- Why do we leave off the "ay" sound at the end and just make it "Grand"? And Albuquerque is butchered beyond belief - whatever we're doing with it, it ain't Spanish, which I think would be something like, Ahl-boo-care-kay. I think my biggest gripe is American (and English??) pronunciation of the French word lingerie. It should be close to "lan-zhair-ree" (with a short a sound in the first syllable, rhyming with can, and the last syllable rhyming with me.

Brits are horrible at pronounce foreign languages. Unbelievably Americans have a better chance of a more correct accenting, esp. Spanish

YES OP. I have noticed this, especially on cooking shows where foreign names for dishes come up. Americans may do it as well, but not as brazenly as the British. You here “pass-ta” for pasta, for instance. I remember one where this idiot British judge kept pronouncing the l in paella—like “pa-ella,l like Ella Fitzgerald. Someone finally called him out on it and he said, “we’re not Spanish.” The other retorted, “actually, I AM Spanish.” He just kind of smirked.

I’ve noticed, though, that they make more effort to pronounce French words correctly. Americans are much more likely to anglicize those, I think.

Sorry, thay should been, pronouncing the l in paella, like pa-Ella Fitzgerald.

The BBC have a habit of doing this. They've renamed Pakistan to park-ih-starn, largely to avoid having to say the word "paki" on TV, but have yet to rename Afghanistan to arf-garn-ih-starn.

I don't like the way the Brits pronounce the "er" sound.

The name Peter is said like "pee-TUH".

My English grandfather, who had a career in the Diplomatic Service for many years, used to complain about the two miserable years he spent serving as a junior officer at the embassy in Buh-GOAT-uh, Colombia.

He also pronounced Kenya as KEEN-yuh, which on its own is enough to get one labelled as racist nowadays.

Pronouncing Jorge as "jor-ghee." Is it really so hard to say 'hor-heh?"

Jaguar is actually not originally a Spanish word. It's from the South American tribe's name for the big cat.

In South America it's usually pronounced like cha-KWAR, so American pronunciation is closer but still not 100% correct. It's not as awful as the British pronunciation though.

The British can change pronunciations if they want, who cares? They did it with Zebra, for instance. The Congolese word for it uses the long I vowel, and the British used to pronounce it that way, but over the past century or so they decided they didn't like that, for reasons best left to them, and they now say "zeh-brah."

I think it must take some thinking and effort on their part since they add and take away shit for no apparent reason. If you hear them sing a song, for the most part they sound American, but when they use the same words when talking, they really try to lay on the accent. There are some exemptions though. A Champaign supernova, champagne supernovar in the sky. And they replace s with f in some words but not others. It’s pretty random. Never understood why their math class is maths class but that’s the only class they add an s to. I think they must go to speech class and not speechths class. But maybe they do? Not really sure.

The British are concerned if they say, "whore, hey?" every Spanish woman on the street will turn around and say, "si?"

[quote]The Congolese word for it uses the long I vowel,

Sorry, meant the long E vowel....

Haven't had this thread for a good two months or so. Fun distraction from that President who, among his thousands of other cognitive impairments, struggles to say the word 'anonymous.'

I'll tolerate no unnecessary criticism of British pronunciation. They are the masters of the English language.

RP sounds lovely to the ears, but the misplaced short A sound in words like Pavlo, gamba and Nicaragua is super irritating

... and who expresses admiration for thuggish assault as his halfwit racist crowds cheer.

But does everything have to be about our horrible political situation? Can't we amuse ourselves with silly banter a bit as well.

[quote]They are the masters of the English language.

Ha ha, not anymore. Tail's wagging the dog now. Go to the UK and you'll hear Americanisms nonstop.

Even the British can't explain how lieutenant came to be pronounced "leftenant." That's barmy!

They pronounce St. John "sin gin." Quite bizarre. Oh and Marlborough is pronounced "malbruh." LOL!

Well pardon us for giving the world the English language.

Just as long as they pronounce my name "day-BORE-ah" I am fine.

Actually three sets of conquerors, French, Germans and Romans, gave the world the English language.

R26 Lieutenant is pronounced lieutenant, leftenant is a different word.

Guess how Taliaferro is pronounced?

Tolliver

There's always the added pronounciations too.

Angela is "Ange-ler" and so on.

R31 Uh, no.

I don't think it matters - obsessing over the length of a vowel sound seems like the narcissism of small differences. Variations are charming and amusing, and it's usually clear what's being referred to.

I've heard 'Don Quixote' referred to as 'Don Kee-ho-tay' and 'Don Kwick-shot' for example, and suffered no great confusion. Similarly some pronounce the J in 'Majorca', others make it a Y. Tomayto, Tomahto, variety is the spice.

I've heard Malaga as Muh LAG err

[quote]Never understood why their math class is maths class but that’s the only class they add an s to.

Because it’s an abbreviation of the word “mathematics” which they treat as a plural. This group includes algebra, geometry, calculus, trigonometry, etc.

We treat “mathematics” as a singular noun.

R9, Americans describe "Spanish J" as "H", but that's not quite accurate. "Jose" != "hoe-say". "Spanish J" is more like an indescribable combination of "h" + "y" + the sound Hebrew makes for "ch" in words like "chaim" (with regional variations... Cuban 'j' differs from Mexican 'j' and Puerto-Rican 'j').

Which makes a certain amount of sense... Spanish was influenced by Arabic, which evolved side by side with Hebrew. It lost most of the throat-gagging sound of "chaim", but the vestiges remain in the modern sound of Spanish 'j'.

Our vocab is actually rather Americanised lately, and provincial accents are all sadly flattening out into a sort of light Estuary.

Go back a hundred years and listen in on a couple of toffee-nosed gays, and you'd have far more of a comprehension problem.

[quote] That rARther p-p-p-pale one, my dear - plaing the piARno - is having a rrchHAYVing affHAIR...

My absolute favorite British spelling quirk is the deliberate mispronunciation of proper names associated with the aristocracy so that only those who have heard them before know the correct way. This separates the U from the non-U. For example, the Spencer estate Althorpe is pronounced al-trop. If you say al-thorpe, you brand yourself a poseur.

I'm with you, R23. British English is the gold standard. And, at this moment in history, the U.S. is not exactly in a position of intellectual or cultural authority.

Look at the Americans complaining about British pronunciation of English, a language filled with words whose pronunciation is entirely arbitrary with no connection to how they are spelled. I ought to be through with such a thoughtless drought of thought.

Um.....it's THEIR language, so they know how to speak it better than we do in the US......I also thing their pronunciation of the word "Jaguar" is the correct way.....Jag-U-are.

This lady knows how to speak right and proper English. Let's have a listen to her:

Read that Churchill used to deliberately mispronounce French when speaking with De Gaulle because he enjoyed annoying him.

This dude also speaks hella good English, even when he's pissed off! Let's have a listen beginning at 00:50

Ha, ha!

Aluminium !

Cholmondeley Featherstonehaugh

I dare you to pronounce it.

I ain’t got a clue, r48.

The Queen's accent is mesmerizing, R43. I could listen to it for hours.

Is Her Majesty's speech RP?

What most people don't realize is that the English Received Pronunciation is totally made up.

People in England didn't talk that way three hundred years ago.

....

Brits are tards

The British tend to Anglicize foreign loan words, conforming them to English pronunciation rules. Witness how they pronounce French derived words like garage, duvet, ballet, etc., as opposed to Americans who approximate the original French pronunciations.

R37 thanks for the explanation. I was genuinely confused on that. I guess we are a little more explicit in our schooling in America. I would hate to sign up for a general math class only to find out it was an algebra class when I showed up. Or calculus. I’d hate to show up at the gym with my physics book only to find out it was a physical education class because I signed up for physics. Is maths the only one or do they have classes like histories and languages and they just show up for class hoping they will learn the language they wanted to learn about or the history they’d like to learn about?

Ballay but not Valay, the say Val-let

Lab-or-a-tory.

anna-thing

BBC presenters have still not figured out how to say Barack Obama correctly.

This thread has to be a troll, surely.

But, in the interests of continuing the tired old tit for tat ‘we’re better than you’ trope, it is pretty hilarious given the current President can barely string a sentence together. And why do American adults refer to cats as ‘kitties’ ? Grow the fuck up.

[quote]BBC presenters have still not figured out how to say Barack Obama correctly.

By contrast, each and every one of them knows that 'Trump' is pronounced 'Cunt.'

The poor dental hygiene is rotting their collective brains

R58 more like Luh Bore a tree

[quote]Pronouncing Jorge as "jor-ghee." Is it really so hard to say 'hor-heh?"

I have a Mexican-American friend (born in California) named Jorge, and he INSISTS on being called "George." (But he won't spell it that way.)

Americans pronounce the country as I-ran. It's correctly ih-RAHN. Iraq Is ih-ROCK, not I-RACK.

I love the way they pronounce ‘aluminum’.

I'm pretty sure that it's I-rahn with emphasis on the first syllable or the same on both.

Another thing about Britspeak that I find so irritating is their way of using the plural for certain terms instead of the singular. If they talk about an airline company for example they'll say "Delta Airlines ARE doing this or that", as if there is more than one Delta Airlines company. I know that's done a lot in Europe but it sounds completely idiotic. It's "Delta Airlines IS doing this or that", thank you.

Yeah, what's with the "anna-thing"? It's the biggest giveaway when British actors do American accents.

Shed jew ul

I am studying MATHS at uni.

More fighting reported in The Lebanon.

The Lebanon WHAT??

The Lebanon, its sorta like The Argentine.

The Brits have no issue properly pronoucing aluminium. They spell it as the pronounce it—with an extra i and thus an extra syllable.

And The Ukraine.

The Congo

Because "She was only the fishmonger's daughter, But she laid on the slab and said fillet" doesn't work if you pronounce it fill-aay of course.

I suppose the English who speak proper English should now pronounce their words like American trash? Do you expect them to start dropping vowels from swords like colour too? The American "Empire" is over - something the English have experienced already.

R79 thinks all Brits are like Downton Abbey characters.

Cherries so red, strawberries ripe.

At home of course they'll be storming.

Never mind the abuse, you've got a good excuse,

You've been to Covent Garden in the morning!

R80 thinks all Americans live in big cities and summer in the Hamptons.

What's this? Poppycock is what it is! Why, in MY day the entire world knew that we British were the apex of absolutely EVERYTHING! Before the start of World War II, it was the British Empire which stood as the world's preeminent power. We did everything in the correct fashion, and if some frog complained of our pronunciation of the word "valet," then it was a misguided complaint because although the word originated in THEIR language, it was THEY who pronounced it wrongly and NOT US! I was just remarking to my good, esteemed friend Mrs. Councillor Nugent that we Brits will always be worthy of emulation.

And to answer your reason for calling, NO! This is NOT the local Chinese Take away!

-Hyacinth Bucket, YES! BUCKEEEEEEEEET!

Yes R56, it’s total chaos. You just have to apply for “languages” and hope for the best. I wanted to study French but four years later ended up with a degree in Arabic. If only we could be explicit like you clever Americans.

R10. The American side is the Rio Grande; the Mexican side is the Rio Bravo.

R82 I don't think anyone could possibly believe such a thing especially after Trump. But so many Americans seem to believe everyone in Britain speaks with Received Pronunciation.

R84 I thought it would be called “Langs”. Yes we let loose but don’t knock it until you try it. You might want to come to America and take a French class. In America we are cleaver enough if we did make a general “langs” class it would be so you’d have to spend more money and time learning all languages.

Why do the defensive Brit tards keep referencing American pronunciation of English when the thread is about their tard pronunciation of non-English words?

[quoye]The Congo

Inthink you mean the Conger

Why can’t the US President pronounce simple words properly? Let’s start from there before we throw stones at commoners in England.

I had a laugh when some American friends said they were staying in the "Meryl Bone" section of London.

[quote]An island of dumb trash

Totally now superseded by Trump and Putin's America. Congratulations.

Let's ask Fidel what he thinks down in Cuber

At least the British never talk for the sake of filling a silence. There’s an American couple staying at my London hotel who have made themselves the object of derision due to this very trait.

R91 ..as in "She Knew"!

Why can't the English teach their children how to speak?!

And they pronounce “jaguar” like “JAG-you-were.” Intentionally.

and they call cookies, biscuits!!! can you believe that??? And fanny is a cunt!!!!!

Potato chips are crisps. French fries are chips. And a fag is a cigarette. Anyone care for a bit of Spotted Dick?

Yes they do. They always say “Mitch-igan” instead of Michigan.

Americans are so stupid, they've simplified the English language.

OP, do you mean the way that American say "France"? Who says it more like the French?

If you played this game all the way through, you'd lose. You can tell an upper class American speaking a foreign language before an upper class Brit.

I'm English, and I can't stand the way English men say the word issue.

It makes them all sound like Quintin Crisp.

[quote]OP, do you mean the way that American say "France"?

The worst was Britney Spears "singing" the word France in her Work Bitch song.

What the fuck? Dude! I love ISS-U. It's the correct pronunciation of the word. There's no "H" in "iss-U" (I-shoe)

This one will grab you: Those fabrics and materials you're wearing on your body right now? They're not "close." They are "CLO-THE- ZUH"

R48 - “Chumley Fanshaw”

When Americans can say Mirror without sounding like their gums are glued together and say Notre Dame properly we'll accept your criticism.

Is it really idiotic, R69, or just different? Let's extend your Delta Airlines example. When an American replaces "Delta Airlines" with a pronoun in a sentence, would he replace it with "it", or would he replace it with "they"? I imagine he would choose the latter -- the plural pronoun "they" -- by saying something like this: "I hate Delta Airlines! [bold]They[/bold] always lose my luggage, and [bold]their[/bold] flights are always late!"

So, when we say "Delta Airlines are..." we are simply recognising the noun's plurality by using the plural form of the verb. I know that is different to what Americans do, but at least we are consistent. We simply tend to treat examples like this, as well as collective nouns like "police", as plurals, using the corresponding plural form of the verb. And it's not just the British who do this, but rather most of the rest of the English-speaking world -- except, of course, for most Americans.

i love how brits pronounce jaguar.

hate the way urinal and skeletal is pronounced by brits.

The one that absolutely cracks me up is how British sportscasters incorrectly pronounce Bernabéu (Real Madrid's stadium). They consistently pronounce it Bernabow (as in an actor taking a bow before an audience) when it's Berna beh oo. I have no idea how they get "bow" from "béu." Very puzzling. They are capable of making "beh" and "oo" sounds. They are capable of pronouncing Camp Nou (Barcelona's stadium) correctly "noo."

Well, they certainly mispronounce French words because they loathe those smug froggie bastards.

r38 The strong sound of the j/g in Spanish (strong h for you) is not related to Arabs. Dutch have an stronger pronuntiation, or even Germans, and this has nothing to do with Arabs either. You always make a reference to Arabs when speaking of Spain, when in fact, their influence was not that great and the population do not mixed much. There is more genetic imprint from jews than Arabs in Spain. We were populated by Mediterranean and Northern European tribes.

The roots of the Spanish language is Osco-Umbro and other Mediterranean tribes, Celtic, Germanic, and Latin mostly.

Regarding of pronuntiation of Spanish words by anglos, none of you get it right: Florida is pronounced Florída, not Flórida. Los Ángeles is pronounced Los Ánheles, whith the h very strong. Penélope Cruz is (Pehnehlopeh Crooth). South American accents aren't the best guide to pronounce the genuine Spanish=Castillian.

R23 stfu.Your correct but stfu lol

Mr. Billingsbee

I miss Randy and Pauler.

We're right on shedule!

British sound more elegant than Americans, even if they don't speak like the Queen. Same for Spaniards and Portuguese compared to Latin Americans.

I don't know about Spaniards compared to the Latin Americans, R118. Although I was born and raised in the U.S., Castillian Spanish was my first language and despite greater, lifelong exposure to Mexican or L.A. Spanish, I still retain my Castillian accent (I'm 54). Sometimes, I'm really struck by how mush-mouthed or muddy I can sound. It's freaky when an American asks me how a word or phrase is pronounced and they repeat it back to me complete with my accent. WEIRD! It's just not the lisp.

I don't know if it's true or not, but I've always heard that Colombian Spanish is the standard for the nicest or most easily comprehensible pronunciation and it's what Spanish-speaking broadcasters in the U.S. strive for. To me the "worst" Spanish accent is the Chilean one. Jesus, it's so thick! Might as well be speaking gibberish as it's so incomprehensible to me. Spanish from Andalucia is also pretty difficult more me to decipher and is totally different from the other regions in Spain.

R119 Chilean Spanish must be what Scottish English sounds like to Americans.

LIEUTENANT / LEFTENANT

The word was originally two Latin terms, "locum" meaning in place of, and "teneris" meaning holding, together the phrase applied to anyone "holding in place of" someone else. Over time the word "locum" evolved into the French word "lieu", which is pronounced in French as it is spelled. It is possible that when the English heard the French pronounce the compound word lieutenant, they perceived a slurring which they heard as a "v" or "f" sound between the first and second syllables. Most English speaking nations, with the exception of the United States, still pronounce the word as though there is an "f" in it. So, although the spelling changed, the British kept the pronunciation.

r 119 What you call lisp is not a lisp, is the correct pronounciation of Z/C, different from S in Castillian Spanish. When do you say in English "therapy", "thanks", "tooth", are you lisping or are you pronouncing it right? For me the standard is the Castillian. I don't know what they consider the standard in the US. I don't like Latin American accents, except for the Bolivian.

Oh, I forgot. I have a question, why are Americans so obsessed with accents?

Yes, Estuary is really beautiful.

Yes, that's a very apt comparison, R120. The only English language film (that I know of) subtitled for theaters is Ken Loach's "My Name is Joe" which featured a working class Scottish cast. I wouldn't have been able to follow it without subtitles.

GFY, R122. What would you have me call it when "lisp" is what describes it in the most understandable way to unpretentious non-linguists? (I presume the majority of us here aren't ivory tower types unlike yourself).

r125 Sorry if I sounded petulant. It was not my intention. Only I am feed up with this "lisp" thing.

Hear that, Onslo? R118 thinks you,re real elegant!

The Brits have deliberately mispronounced menu French for years. What's the point of appreciating the accomplishments of people you despise?

Nonetheless, "anyone who says 'clark' is a jark"

What are you lot on about? I love our British Cousins. Prime Minister’s Minutes is proof of their superiority. Imagine Donald Trump facing Congress in rapid fire Question and Answer sessions the way the PM does Parliament. The Great Pumpkin would expire.

R128, and anyone who pronounces “derby” as “darby” is a...well, you get my gist.

For years the Brits pronounced Liza Minnelli’s first name as “Leeza” and Bette Davis’ first name as “Bet.” And Whitney Houston’s last name as “Hoostin.”

I remember in the BBC miniseries The Life and Loves of a She-Devil a Spanish character named Garcia was called “GAR-see-uh” by all the Brit characters. I mean...COME ON. That’s flagrant mispronunciation.

Just heard someone on BBC World Service refer to “The Gambia.” It’s just GAMBIA, dickhead. It’s just Ukraine. It’s just Lebanon. Is this some antiquated remnant from back in the days when Britain actually had an empire?

It's not a colonial-era remnant at all, R133, but rather the official name of the country as chosen by the people. The Gambia is one of only two countries whose self-standing short name for official use should begin with the word "The" (the other one being The Bahamas). Upon independence in 1965, the country used the name The Gambia. Following the proclamation of a republic in 1970, the long-form name of the country became Republic of The Gambia. The administration of Yahya Jammeh changed the long-form name to Islamic Republic of The Gambia in December 2015. On 29 January 2017 the new President Adama Barrow said the country's name will go back to Republic of The Gambia, dropping the "Islamic Republic" designation from the official name.

The linked audio from BBC News, below, explains it a bit more, as well as mentioning The Lebanon and The Ukraine. Don't let your head explode as you listen to it.

Brits are "vunerable" to accusations they mangle foreign words. They get very "crative" in their mispronunciations.

As a Brit watching The BBC, I'd cringe ever so slightly each time I heard "Bare-Ick O'Bomber". Painful really. I have always striven to pronounce given names as their owners.

I've only heard elderly people refer to "the Ukraine" and never heard "the Lebanon".

Are you a Brit, R137?

R134, you provided a pitiful defense (Yank spelling). Please try harder next time.

It's probably the most British thing the British do, OP

They are showing you that they are superior to those bloody wogs and are not going to pronounce the names of their foods incorrectly.

[quote] The only English language film (that I know of) subtitled for theaters is Ken Loach's "My Name is Joe" which featured a working class Scottish cast. I wouldn't have been able to follow it without subtitles.

My clever German friends with bilingual fluency in English could not follow the comedic monologues of Glaswegian Rab. C. Nesbitt. Even I occasionally lose the thread of what the character is saying, as a native Brit raised deep inside the English countryside where incomprehensibly-thick regional accents abound.

[quote] RAB (on The Dosser jumping into the Clyde): "Eff yoo DROON, ahm ganna fell GELTY."

Yes, R138.

From the people who pronunce Notre Dame “Noter Daym”.

R137 You are correct. The use of “the Ukraine” derives exclusively from the form in Russian. It’s offensive to Ukrainians and should not be used.

[quote]I've only heard elderly people refer to "the Ukraine" and never heard "the Lebanon".

How about "the Levant?"

I seriously question the judgement of someone who considers the absolute truth to be a poor defence, R138.

Everyone going on about aluminum / aluminium, you do know the US is the only country that’s says aluminum? The rest of the world says aluminium. They got it from the Brits who invented it.

I met an older guy years ago R146 who worked for one of the big US aluminum companies.

I'm originally from the UK and I brought up the spelling difference. He told me it actually came from a typo in the US paperwork giving them the rights to produce it (or some such thing). They missed out the i, so for simplicity they continued to spell it that way.

I have no idea if it's true, but I don't see why he'd lie about it.

[quote] They got it from the Brits who invented it.

Please explain how someone "invents" a naturally-occurring element.

R147 It was a Danish scientish who discovered the element, aluminum, in 1825. It’s the most common metal on earth.

[quote]That's why you say Noo Yawk and Noo Awleenz rather than Nyoo York and Noovel Aur-lay-ong.

No American pronounces them that way. You must be drunk.

^^^Ya seem pretty certain of dat, Bro...

[quote]Noo Yawk

[quote]No American pronounces them that way.

Apart from Frank Sinatra in the most famous song ever written about New York.

On Sky News a few days ago the anchorman pronounced “Chappaqua” as “Chuh-PACK-kwa” and Barack as “BAHR-uck.” So amusing.