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BREAKING: CNN Reports Saudis Preparing to Admit Jamal Khashoggi Was Killed in ‘Interrogation Gone Wrong’

CNN reported on Monday that Saudi Arabia is preparing a report in which they will admit that Jamal Khashoggi, the Washington Post columnist who went missing earlier this month, was killed in an “interrogation gone wrong.”

Khashoggi, a prominent Saudi dissident, went missing after walking into the Saudi consulate in Istanbul on October 2. Turkish officials said they have proof he was murdered and dismembered by a team of Saudi agents, a charge the Saudi government vehemently denied.

Per CNN, however, the Saudis are preparing a report admitting that they intended to abduct and bring Khashoggi back to Saudi Arabia, but that he was inadvertently killed in the process. The report is intended, per CNN, to absolve the Saudi government of responsibility for the murder by claiming the operation was not cleared.

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by Anonymousreply 399November 3, 2018 1:12 PM

Fuckin animals.....

by Anonymousreply 1October 15, 2018 8:00 PM

Wow.

by Anonymousreply 2October 15, 2018 8:04 PM

We didn’t mean to butcher him honest!

by Anonymousreply 3October 15, 2018 8:06 PM

No, they're not. It was just a bunch of random thugs breaking into the consulate who did it.

Nothing to do with our good friends the Saudis!

by Anonymousreply 4October 15, 2018 8:14 PM

Huh. So Trump either lied or got played.

by Anonymousreply 5October 15, 2018 8:16 PM

We were just going to abduct, torture and imprison him. You know, for being critical. Cool?

by Anonymousreply 6October 15, 2018 8:18 PM

He went to pieces on them.

by Anonymousreply 7October 15, 2018 8:20 PM

I am a little surprised that we are all so trusting of what the Turkish authorities are telling us, Turkey isn't exactly the most honest of parties. They have many journalists locked up in prison. The Turkish President was just recently gifted a Boeing 747-8, worth an estimated $400 million by the leader of Qatar, an enemy of Saudi Arabia.

Suddenly Turkey finds that Saudi Arabia killed a journalist and is all up in arms about it.

by Anonymousreply 8October 15, 2018 8:23 PM

what kind of torture methods did they use on him?

by Anonymousreply 9October 15, 2018 8:29 PM

This feels like an episode of Homeland. When it was good and properly chilling.

by Anonymousreply 10October 15, 2018 8:29 PM

was he gonna publish something ?

by Anonymousreply 11October 15, 2018 8:29 PM

Hey, aren’t those the same guys who attacked us on 9/11? How will our nation respond this time? Maybe by invading Iran?

by Anonymousreply 12October 15, 2018 8:32 PM

R9: They said the torture was gruesome. Did they cut digits while he was still alive? Sounds like it!

by Anonymousreply 13October 15, 2018 8:33 PM

Boston Globe columnist Michael Cohen:

Who among us hasn’t traveled up a foreign country with a bone saw and autopsy expert and accidentally dismembered a political dissident?

by Anonymousreply 14October 15, 2018 8:35 PM

And then left with oozing diplomatic bags.

by Anonymousreply 15October 15, 2018 8:37 PM

They wouldn't be admitting anything if it wasn't on video and audio. They know they're fucked, so they are coming up with some excuse so Trump can save face. He will crow about how it's an unfortunate incident but they didn't mean to dismember him! It was an accident.

by Anonymousreply 16October 15, 2018 8:49 PM

They need to release the audio for the world to hear how Saudi Arabia tortured and killed this man.

by Anonymousreply 17October 15, 2018 8:54 PM

Cannot wait to hear how Trumpkins explains this away. How "rogue" can you be inside a secure government facility such as a consulate?

by Anonymousreply 18October 15, 2018 9:05 PM

Thank you, R14

by Anonymousreply 19October 15, 2018 9:07 PM

Khashoggi was a Muslim Brotherhood colleague of Osama, both with the same goal of taking down each Middle Eastern government in favor of a Muslim theocracy. Fuck him and the camel he rode in on.

by Anonymousreply 20October 15, 2018 9:15 PM

So the Prince will come out sorry about this terrible mistake and will continue his private property dealings with the Trump family because that's why Trump was hesitant to cut any ties and that's why the US went over there today to come up with this lie. It's not about arms deals. It's about Trumps personal fortune. And BS R20.

by Anonymousreply 21October 15, 2018 9:19 PM

Maybe this is a stupid question, and I hope it doesn't sound like victim blaming because I'm horrified at this crime, but why did Khashoggi go there? Didn't he know how dangerous it was?

by Anonymousreply 22October 15, 2018 9:34 PM

He was getting married and he needed a document. Yes, he knew it was dangerous which is why he transmitted the audio to someone using his Apple Watch.

by Anonymousreply 23October 15, 2018 9:39 PM

total bullshit story invented on the fly when they found out the turks had the receipts.

the orange mussolini will do a better job covering this up than w did protecting the perpetrators of 9/11

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by Anonymousreply 24October 15, 2018 9:41 PM

Duke U professor Timur Kuran predicted the following this morning -- I'd say he's probably right on all points:

I hope I’m wrong, but a 3-way deal is in the making: 1. Some rogue KSA team blamed. 2. MbS cleared of wrongdoing. 3. US-Saudi arms deal survives. 4. Turkey gets economic deals from both sides. 5. All 3 leaders return to usual business. 6. Free journalism takes yet another blow.

by Anonymousreply 25October 15, 2018 9:47 PM

It's patently absurd what this administration has asked us to believe. ABSURD!

by Anonymousreply 26October 15, 2018 9:48 PM

The only way to get justice is for the audio tape to be released to the public. Then the public can hear for themselves what they're getting for all that Saudi money. If corporations refuse to cut ties, then it's up to consumers to boycott those companies. But it has to be long term, not just a temporary boycott and it's got to hit all of the major corporations.

Of course, all this is dependent on whether the majority of the general public is made up of decent people or deplorables.

by Anonymousreply 27October 15, 2018 9:59 PM

Wow, it's a good thing the Saudis had a bone saw handy in case the "interrogation" accidently got out of hand.

by Anonymousreply 28October 15, 2018 10:18 PM

Apparently, they brought the bone saw with them from SA. You know, better safe than sorry.

by Anonymousreply 29October 15, 2018 10:24 PM

"Who among us hasn’t traveled up a foreign country with a bone saw and autopsy expert and accidentally dismembered a political dissident" @speechboy71

I have a feeling that this explanation isn't really selling very well. But that could just be me.

by Anonymousreply 30October 15, 2018 10:26 PM

Sorry did anyone think Saudi Arabians were nice people? They committed 9/11 and funded Bin Laden we just won't do anything because they control all the oil. Had we followed Obama's plan to get off oil instead of putting oil execs in as secretary of state, we might be in a better position but honestly, they can do what they want. Like the Russians, we are powerless to stop them.

by Anonymousreply 31October 15, 2018 10:28 PM

We are no longer dependent on Saudi oil, R31.

by Anonymousreply 32October 15, 2018 10:29 PM

"The largest sources of U.S. imported oil were: Canada (40%), Saudi Arabia (11%)"

But according to Trump, Canada is a "national security risk" so the US probably shouldn't be importing oil from them, right?

by Anonymousreply 33October 15, 2018 10:35 PM

[quote]Huh. So Trump either lied or got played.

why choose when you can have both?

by Anonymousreply 34October 15, 2018 10:36 PM

r32 who said anything about being dependent. You do know who sets the price right? The Saudis could drive the price of oil sky high and fuck the economy on a global scale.

by Anonymousreply 35October 15, 2018 10:42 PM

They have billions and billions of dollars invested all over the world in many countries. They use that to control things now, the oil is just how they get the money.

by Anonymousreply 36October 15, 2018 10:44 PM

They just chose not to over the past decade? Out of kindness?

by Anonymousreply 37October 15, 2018 10:44 PM

r37 They just threatened to. They have not threatened to use oil prices as a motivator for decades.

by Anonymousreply 38October 15, 2018 10:45 PM

Ask anyone in energy in Texas or Louisiana, and the price of oil in Saudi Arabia determines the health of the oil industry here. Too high or too low and we're fucked.

by Anonymousreply 39October 15, 2018 10:45 PM

We may import oil from SA, but we don’t have to.

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by Anonymousreply 40October 15, 2018 10:46 PM

Except of course they're lying. Trump won't do shit.

by Anonymousreply 41October 15, 2018 10:49 PM

But didn't they dismember the guy? Did they give the body back to the family? If they haven't done it yet, won't they have to do it after they admit their mistake? How is the family going to react? Will the Saudi's buy their silence?

by Anonymousreply 42October 15, 2018 10:53 PM

the movie, I Dismember Jamal

by Anonymousreply 43October 16, 2018 5:41 AM

What a fucked up world we live in. With fucked up "leaders" at the helm of it.

When is it going to end? I really hope November brings about a positive change. I'm really sick and tired of Trump and the republicans.

by Anonymousreply 44October 16, 2018 5:59 AM

"Oopsie. Good we brought the buzzsaw along ahmed!"

by Anonymousreply 45October 16, 2018 6:29 AM

Claire Danes must investigate!

by Anonymousreply 46October 16, 2018 6:33 AM

A few months ago, Canada publically criticized Saudi Arabia for human rights violations and the Trump administration refused to stand with Canada. Could this have helped to give Saudi the green light to murder Khashoggi?

by Anonymousreply 47October 16, 2018 6:35 AM

I'm sure it's going to be pretty easy to round up 15 "rogue" killers who will confess before they are shot or beheaded or whatever it is that Saudis do. Trump will commend this.

by Anonymousreply 48October 16, 2018 6:56 AM

It's not the oil per se, it's the weapons deals. Both the US and Canada have various defense contracts with Saudi Arabia. The other poster was also right that Saudi Arabia, through OPEC, has influence on international price controls. They also tried to diversify their national holdings much later, due to internal power struggles, so they haven't done as well as they could have.

r21 not that anyone wants to hear it in the Righteous Indignation Age, but the situation is more complicated than mainstream outlets portray. He worked for Saudi Intelligence before he got into a spat with one of the many Princes. He is allegedly a supporter of the Muslim Brotherhood, who are at odds with the Saudi ruling family. Both support terrorists.

He does not give a shit about democracy or civil/women's rights in the KSA; it is only a way to get back at the Prince who ousted him by aligning with the West. Not that he deserved to be tortured and murdered of course, but he is not a "dissident" in the traditional sense.

by Anonymousreply 49October 16, 2018 7:16 AM

R49 no legitimate reporter would ascribe motives to the victim unless he said so specifically what his intentions were.

by Anonymousreply 50October 16, 2018 10:04 PM

I agree with r49 that he was taken out for murky, internal reasons rather than because he's a dissident. He had worked for the Saudi royal family for decades-- the faction that is now out of favor. The real reason they killed him will never come out, just like the real reason they detained all those high profile businessmen last year will remain buried.

by Anonymousreply 51October 16, 2018 10:07 PM

It's not that we directly rely on Saudi oil, it's that the price of oil worldwide depends on how much oil Saudi Arabia is pumping. The more they pump, the lower the price and the less domestic (US) production. Right now, Saudi Arabia is pumping a lot because they are trying to lower unemployment and fund very expensive projects like the war in Yemen. The arms deal is secondary to that. If I recall-- and I might be wrong on this-- Saudi Arabia's recent arms deals with the UK have been worth more than the real and promised ones with the US. The US is instrumental in their War with Yemen more directly because US military personnel based in Riyadh help the Saudis launch their foreign-made missles.

by Anonymousreply 52October 16, 2018 10:16 PM

He had a horrible traumatic death, they attacked him the minute they got him inside with no attempt at interrogation. Seven minutes of torture and screaming.

Animals - no subtlety or sanity in their killing methods. Ever hear of injection first, or strangulation?

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by Anonymousreply 53October 16, 2018 10:28 PM

suuuuuuure....it really went wrong when they chopped up his body after they tortured the guy......way wrong. JHC.

by Anonymousreply 54October 16, 2018 11:16 PM

Now, we should follow Trump's lead and not say "guilty until proven innocent".

They took a bone saw to an "interrogation".

Guilty.

by Anonymousreply 55October 16, 2018 11:24 PM

We aren't sure why he died, we only cut off each of his limbs, but he still wouldn't talk...

by Anonymousreply 56October 16, 2018 11:26 PM

"I think it's now safe to assume that the US is no longer "leader of the free world". Get back to us after you ditch Trump." --sane countries of the world.

by Anonymousreply 57October 16, 2018 11:27 PM

It was a complete accident. He tripped. Those bone saws can do a lot of damage when you fall on them 20 or 30 times.

by Anonymousreply 58October 16, 2018 11:29 PM

So sad, RIP

by Anonymousreply 59October 17, 2018 12:29 AM

Environmental activist just got murdered in Brazil over the land grabs and development in the Amazon. Shot his head to pieces in his home. He was wearing a flak vest.

by Anonymousreply 60October 17, 2018 12:46 AM

What is pissing me off the most with this administration right now is the attempt to paint this guy as sympathetic to terrorists. Donald Jr. need to shut the fuck up. He has no official reason to speak up about any of this.

I hate these people with the white hot heat of a quasar. RIP, Khashoggi. You deserved better than this end or the way it's being treated.

by Anonymousreply 61October 17, 2018 12:49 AM

If the Dems take the House, I sure hope there will be 10 'Benghazi' commissions to investigate Trump's collusion with his merry band of dictators.

by Anonymousreply 62October 17, 2018 2:29 AM

So many leads to follow up.

Hell, if the Dems take the House, it’ll be an embarrassment of witches.

by Anonymousreply 63October 17, 2018 4:11 AM

So apparently now the Saudis are going to go with the story that an officer did it without the knowledge of MBS. That the officer did this on his own and it was just going to be an interrogation that got botched.

Right.

It's being pointed out that no officer in SA would dare attempt this without MBS' okay. And they're also pointing out that MBS' own security guards were in that 15 person group that murdered Khashoggi. How are they going to explain that?

by Anonymousreply 64October 17, 2018 4:15 AM

R63- Can the Democratic House get all of Trump's financial records? Not just tax returns, but every file and record of money transactions? I'd be willing to bet that a lot of Saudi money is tucked away somewhere in there.

And hasn't Mueller been questioning Trump's bookkeeper? That guy must be a wealth of knowledge.

by Anonymousreply 65October 17, 2018 4:17 AM

[quote] It's not the oil per se, it's the weapons deals.

And how much Tiny Trump and Jared make.

by Anonymousreply 66October 17, 2018 4:22 AM

r61 he fucking WAS, regardless of whether or not the Trump clan are using it for their own ends, that doesn't make it false. He's also Adnan Khashoggi's nephew, which could open up a whole other can of international Underworld worms, i.e. other people might not be upset he's dead. (Not that I believe someone else was responsible, but that was a shocking intelligence failure on the CIA's part.)

William Buckley didn't deserve to be tortured, either, but that is what happens when you're involved at a high level with international intelligence agencies, and you're either arrogant or foolish enough to think your status will protect you. When every second cabbie in Beirut knows who you are, what you do and where you stay, or you effectively walk onto enemy territory in the middle of a deadly power struggle, for a bizarre reason in a non-neutral third country, it's not going to end well.

r66

by Anonymousreply 67October 17, 2018 5:27 AM

It took seven minutes for Jamal Khashoggi to die, a Turkish source who has listened in full to an audio recording of the Saudi journalist's last moments told Middle East Eye.

Khashoggi was dragged from the Consul General’s office at the Saudi consulate in Istanbul and onto the table of his study next door, the Turkish source said.

Horrendous screams were then heard by a witness downstairs, the source said.

"The consul himself was taken out of the room. There was no attempt to interrogate him. They had come to kill him,” the source told MEE.

The screaming stopped when Khashoggi - who was last seen entering the Saudi consulate on 2 October - was injected with an as yet unknown substance.

Salah Muhammad al-Tubaigy, who has been identified as the head of forensic evidence in the Saudi general security department, was one of the 15-member squad who arrived in Ankara earlier that day on a private jet.

Tubaigy began to cut Khashoggi’s body up on a table in the study while he was still alive, the Turkish source said.

The killing took seven minutes, the source said.

As he started to dismember the body, Tubaigy put on earphones and listened to music. He advised other members of the squad to do the same.

“When I do this job, I listen to music. You should do [that] too,” Tubaigy was recorded as saying, the source told MEE.

A three-minute version of the audio tape has been given to Turkish newspaper Sabah, but they have yet to release it.

A Turkish source told the New York Times that Tubaigy was equipped with a bone saw. He is listed as the president of the Saudi Fellowship of Forensic Pathology and a member of the Saudi Association for Forensic Pathology.

In 2014, London-based Saudi newspaper Asharaq al-Awsat interviewed Tubaigy about a mobile clinic that allows coroners to perform autopsies in seven minutes to determine the cause of death of Hajj pilgrims.

The newspaper reported that the mobile clinic was partly designed by Tubaigy and could be used in "security cases that requires pathologist intervention to perform an autopsy or examine a body at the place of a crime”.

These are the first details to emerge of the Saudi journalist’s killing. Khashoggi was last seen entering the Saudi consulate in Istanbul on 2 October to retrieve paperwork.

To date, Saudi officials have strongly denied any involvement in his disappearance and say that he left the consulate soon after arriving. However, they have not presented any evidence to corroborate their claim and say that video cameras at the consulate were not recording at the time.

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by Anonymousreply 68October 17, 2018 5:33 AM

R53

Sorry for the duplication.

I’m just shocked at how amateur the operation was. MbS done fucked up big.

by Anonymousreply 69October 17, 2018 5:37 AM

NYTimes identified several men as close confidantes of MBS.

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by Anonymousreply 70October 17, 2018 5:41 AM

I don't understand. How do they get all the info regarding who came into the embassy to chop up the body etc? their names?

by Anonymousreply 71October 17, 2018 5:42 AM

R71

CCTV.

Facial recognition software.

Social media accounts.

We live in Minority Report.

by Anonymousreply 72October 17, 2018 5:47 AM

Stupid Trump told them not to confess. Trump believes the truth never serves his purpose. So let the lowlife Republicans go down his evil path with him.

by Anonymousreply 73October 17, 2018 5:52 AM

r72 these people are also all being tracked by Western intelligence agencies because of the Saudi political situation right now. The airline industry also gives them access to travel data, & no doubt there are covert methods, too.

by Anonymousreply 74October 17, 2018 5:55 AM

What happened to the three other Saudi princes who were also kidnapped in 2015-17?

by Anonymousreply 75October 17, 2018 5:56 AM

omg, that guy says, when i do this job, i listen to music, he makes it sound like he does this every fucking day! who else have they killed?

by Anonymousreply 76October 17, 2018 5:57 AM

how did the newspaper get the recording? and how do we know it wasn't edited?

by Anonymousreply 77October 17, 2018 5:58 AM

In best Homeland tradition, did the Turkish Government have the embassy illegally wired, then leaked the tape to local media?

by Anonymousreply 78October 17, 2018 7:14 AM

The claim is that Kashoggi activated his iWatch prior to entering the embassy and that it recorded and also streamed it in real time. Or something.

by Anonymousreply 79October 17, 2018 7:42 AM

[quote] how did the newspaper get the recording? and how do we know it wasn't edited?

R77 Do you think it might have been edited? To what end?

by Anonymousreply 80October 17, 2018 7:48 AM

To insert Beethoven’s 9th

by Anonymousreply 81October 17, 2018 7:56 AM

Pompeo shaking hands with the prince and all smiling and happy ---- did he think he was there for some kind of celebration?? Talk about being totally tone deaf to the situation.

by Anonymousreply 82October 17, 2018 7:57 AM

Admit? Surely you mean "lie" OP?

by Anonymousreply 83October 17, 2018 8:03 AM

Just BOMB that whole FUCKING region to GLASS.

by Anonymousreply 84October 17, 2018 8:05 AM

The kill team also had to pass through passport control at the airport.

by Anonymousreply 85October 17, 2018 10:18 AM

MBS is so screwed. Whomever said upthread this was a totally botched amateur operation is right. This didn't have to be handled so messily, now it's a major international incident.

The press - who likely feel connected to Khashoggi as journalists - are really doing their job here and digging out details like no tomorrow. They've already id'd many of the killers by name, and placed them in MBS's circle. This is all not going to end well at all.

by Anonymousreply 86October 17, 2018 5:00 PM

He was a dissident, R67, well known until the new regime barred him from his work in SA, and hardly the terror sympathizer because he interviewed Bin Laden. Are journalists now to be affiliated with their subjects and condemned?

He was critical of the growing alliance with the US, and had Islamic and democratic leanings and this isn't and shouldn't be anything that requires labeling him a terrorist. That's pure bullshit and plays directly into their excuse for slaughtering this man.

"According to interviews with dozens of people who knew Mr. Khashoggi and his relationship with the Saudi leadership, it was his penchant for writing freely, and his organizing to push for political reform from abroad, that put him on a collision course with the crown prince."

This is another oligarch move for total control and to quiet effective opposition in the media. It was savage and needs to be condemned in all US diplomatic channels.

by Anonymousreply 87October 17, 2018 6:00 PM

Trump needs to be cut up with a bone saw.

No, Saudi Arabia is not our friend.

Pampas is as big a jerk as our president.

by Anonymousreply 88October 17, 2018 6:05 PM

Pampeo

by Anonymousreply 89October 17, 2018 6:10 PM

Trolls be a' trolling - blood attracts them like sharks

by Anonymousreply 90October 17, 2018 6:13 PM

The Saudi ambassador the brother of MbS went back and is not expected to return. How do we read this?

by Anonymousreply 91October 17, 2018 6:50 PM

The claim that he recorded his death on his watch is being dismissed as false. The story was possibly created by the Turks to hide the fact that they had the embassy bugged.

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by Anonymousreply 92October 17, 2018 7:03 PM

It's a good thing it was bugged then. Not that everyone else doesn't do this.

by Anonymousreply 93October 17, 2018 9:40 PM

Lord, what a horrible death; if they wanted to kill him, couldn't they have just ;put a bullet in the guy's head? I feel nothing but despair for the kind of world we live in!

How long will it take for that mincing prisspot Lindsay to come sashaying out and loudly proclaim that the Saudis are being framed or that this guy deserved it? Yeah, he made some feeble noises about punishing the Saudis, but you know Derr Dump told him to STFU.

by Anonymousreply 94October 17, 2018 9:52 PM

R94 Actually missy has been the most vocal and manly about this

by Anonymousreply 95October 17, 2018 9:58 PM

Pompeo now says that MBS has to "own" it. WTF does that mean? If MBS admits he gave the order for Khashoggi to be tortured and butchered, will Trump then say "Oh see, he's admitted he made a mistake. Everyone deserves a second chance, now back to business."?

There's no way out of this for Trump. No one buys the "rogue attacker" theory because everyone in the know says that there is no such thing as anyone going "rogue" in SA. Saudi doesn't have any other option except for MBS admitting it and that will never happen.

by Anonymousreply 96October 17, 2018 10:24 PM

MBS won't admit he gave the order but he'll take responsibility because his guys were the murderers. That will resolve this temporary blip in the Saudi-US relationship. This whole thing will be forgotten in a week.

by Anonymousreply 97October 17, 2018 10:28 PM

Fucking Saudis - no one will stand up to them because they're too afraid of Iran. Look what they're doing in Yemen. America, UK, EU - all looking the other way.

by Anonymousreply 98October 17, 2018 10:32 PM

R97- It doesn't look like Turkey is going to let this matter be forgotten too soon. They keep giving out little bits of information on this. We'll keep hearing more gruesome details and maybe they'll release the audio tape directly to the public.

by Anonymousreply 99October 17, 2018 11:06 PM

I don't have an apple watch, can it really record?

Also, they said it took 7min for him to die but the recording sent to the newspaper was only 3min long. so you do the math. was it edited???

by Anonymousreply 100October 17, 2018 11:12 PM

Duh, it was edited. For whatever reason.

I too would like to know what an Apple watch can and can't do. And assuming it can record and broadcast in real time -- to whom did the broadcast go out? Not to the victim's fiancée, who waited patiently in front of the consulate till midnight for him to come back out...

by Anonymousreply 101October 18, 2018 8:12 AM

Turkey is damaging both Trump and the Saudi Prince at the same time by exposing their cover up of this murder. Well played.

by Anonymousreply 102October 18, 2018 8:20 AM

The Sauds do not countenance challenge to their absolute, iron-fisted rule. They will deal with Turkey as they deal with all who foolishly presume to challenge their authority like Khashoggi - in their own good time. And no on will be foolish enough to presume to expose or hinder their efforts.

by Anonymousreply 103October 18, 2018 8:50 AM

I don't get Turkey's motivation in going public with all these facts and details.

It's just proving that they bug other countries' embassies/consulates, which is not going to help them politically. And they didn't need to go there: they could just have publicly demanded an answer from the Saudis, and said "We deplore Mr. Khashoggi's disappearance, but have no access to a foreign country's exterritorial consulate. So it's not our problem". And then they could have left it to the journalists/ world opinion/ international bodies, all of which would of course have ended up going nowhere.

Why are they pushing this officially? Kahshoggi wasn't a Turkish citizen or asset.

Are they in a political clinch with the Saudis over Syria/ Yemen/ Iran? I confess I can't follow all the byzantine politics in that region.

by Anonymousreply 104October 18, 2018 9:15 AM

I think the only word that should be in quotes here is "Interrogation."

by Anonymousreply 105October 18, 2018 10:02 AM

Mashal Saad al-Bostani, 31, a lieutenant in the Saudi Royal Air Forces, and one of the 15 Saudis who arrived in Turkey the same day Jamal Khashoggi disappeared has died in a “suspicious traffic accident” and the Saudi consul in Istanbul could be the “next execution,” according to Turkish media reports.

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by Anonymousreply 106October 18, 2018 6:22 PM

Lie down with dogs, get up with fleas, r106.

by Anonymousreply 107October 18, 2018 8:14 PM

Breaking News!

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by Anonymousreply 108October 18, 2018 11:38 PM

Who's still going to the Davos of the Desert?

Pepsi, McKinsey, PWC, Ernst & Young, Deloitte, BCG, Oliver Wyman, and Bain & Company, Siemens, SWFI, Roland Berger, Goldman Sachs, EDF.

by Anonymousreply 109October 18, 2018 11:53 PM

Well good most of Goldman Sachs ends up in GOP cabinets anyways so it's like the US is still going! Careful of the bonesaws boys.

by Anonymousreply 110October 19, 2018 2:01 AM

[quote]Pepsi, McKinsey, PWC, Ernst & Young, Deloitte, BCG, Oliver Wyman, and Bain & Company, Siemens, SWFI, Roland Berger, Goldman Sachs, EDF.

Disgusting, every single one. Won't be drinking Pepsi or Pepsi products for a while.

by Anonymousreply 111October 19, 2018 2:04 AM

Pompous-peo has allegedly heard the recording of the torture and most likely has a transcript.

If Trump has been briefed about irrefutable evidence that MbS thugs murdered Khashoggi, and isn't talked out of sanctions, the entire world order is facing serious consequences.

The Petrodollar is central to the reserve status, and any break in relations would inevitably result in accepting gold yuan for oil.

Multiple players are at hand. Putin has already dismissed it and welcomed MbS. Xi has been trying to get KSA to accept yuan for years. Iran and Russia have close ties, as do Russia and Israel. Brokering a stand down from all parties would be beneficial to everyone except America.
I recently referred to the ghost of Franz Ferdinand haunting Istanbul, but perhaps cooler heads will prevail.

by Anonymousreply 112October 19, 2018 4:09 AM

R110 business is amoral. They are figuring out how much a murder is worth in dollars.

by Anonymousreply 113October 19, 2018 6:27 AM

Did he have an appointment? because the Murderous agents were waiting for him, right? Its not like they stalled him in the waiting room while the entire team flew in.

The thugs told the Saudi attache (diplomat) in the consulate to shut up if he wanted to live.

I bet the Crown Prince will kill a few of the thugs. Hahaha the joke is on them, then.

This all seems more intentional than accidental. The Saudis intentionally murdered this "journalist" in a way that would be easily discovered.... Stakeholders are getting something out of the scandal.

by Anonymousreply 114October 19, 2018 6:59 AM

[quote]The Saudis intentionally murdered this "journalist" in a way that would be easily discovered

Punishment for transgressions in Muslim countries such as Saudi Arabia are public as examples and warnings of what happens to those who transgress/challenge. This is the same.

by Anonymousreply 115October 19, 2018 7:14 AM

yes, R115. And what do the democracies expect they can do about it? Nothing. Thats an absolute monarchy, which sharia law, but a royal family who has power balanced relationship to their own clerics, who they themselves dislike. Guardians of the faith is marketed to the rest of the Muslim world. The House of Saud does with it wants for their own benefit. And all democratic leaders suck those Saud dicks. This scandal is a charade.

by Anonymousreply 116October 19, 2018 7:19 AM

The House of Saud most certainly does what it wants for its own benefit. So do the al Thanis, al Sabahs, al Nayans, al Saids, Bolkiah, Khamenei, etc. etc. etc. And no Western leader or medium would dare to publicly challenge, let alone condemn, actions/shenanigans that they've ignored for decades.

by Anonymousreply 117October 19, 2018 7:33 AM

Any change will have to come from within. What is uncertain is if any change is seen as buckling under western pressure.

by Anonymousreply 118October 19, 2018 8:04 AM

Change? In absolute, brutal, authoritarian regimes? Surely you jest R118.

by Anonymousreply 119October 19, 2018 8:08 AM

Let me tell you, I've met a lot of Kings. The King of Morocco, the Kind of Siam, Larry King, The King of Nambia, Don King. Don't get me stared on Princes. The Saudi's love their Prince. I think he likes me. I like him. I had him to the White House. That was a bit sad. They have wonderful classy palaces over there in the desert. Like my palaces. I wanted to have the Prince to Mar El Lago. That's my house. One of my houses. I have the best houses. The Queen's houses, I don't know. You didn't hear it from me. Drafty. Musty, like a old working lady. My houses and ladies are the best. Right, Ivanka? Come on up here Ivanka! I still think she would be the Best UN Ambassador. Jared is doing a great job with the towel heads. You know I don't have an Ambassador in Saudi Aruba. Wouldn't Ivanka be the best. I think she could help them and the USA a lot. They respect their leader and love the Prince and the King. That's what we need in the USA. Not Fake News.

by Anonymousreply 120October 19, 2018 8:21 AM

Thank you ladies and gents. I'll be here 6 more years. Take a bow, Ivanka, honey. Isn't she pretty! I call her my Princess. I though Jared was a bit fruity when I met him. But he's a good boy. The Saudis love him. And he's Jewish. Imagine that, folks! They love Ivanka. I guess she's Jewish. She says she is. The Jewish Prince and Princess. This is the future, folks. She's my princess. And we're solving MORE problems than the Muslim President Barack Hussein Obama ever did. Wasn't that crazy? That guy, was secretly a Muslim, and. Well - it was a hardly a SECRET because I told you all. And well he could solve anything with the Muslims but my Jewish Prince and Princess can solve everything. Take another bow, honey. Give your Daddy King a kiss. Just kidding! I'm very Presidential. Watch me. It's true.

by Anonymousreply 121October 19, 2018 8:29 AM

R47, the green light to murder Khashaggi was given when the Saudis agreed to a billion plus “arms” deal with Trump.

What Trump failed to understand, was that MbS would demand that actual “arms” be dismembered from Saudi journalists without any pushback or interference from the United States.

by Anonymousreply 122October 19, 2018 8:59 AM

One cannot "inadvertently" cut off digits and limbs, and then administer drugs to stop the screaming.

Not can one "inadvertently" carry the instruments of torture into an embassy.

But defensive-posture crossed-arms Trump will publicly accept this, and add, "Many countries have done bad things. It's not like the United States is so innocent. What did Crooked Hillary know about Benghazi? Maybe SHE should be questioned sometime about THAT."

by Anonymousreply 123October 19, 2018 9:20 AM

"Nor"

by Anonymousreply 124October 19, 2018 9:21 AM

Meanwhile tinytrump incites violence against journos in the USA

by Anonymousreply 125October 19, 2018 9:24 AM

Exactly, r125. Of course Trump's not going to criticize this murder unless someone twists his arm hard -- it's what he fantasizes about doing to all his critics too.

What I still don't get is why Turkey blew the lid off this and revealed all these details, including that they had obviously bugged the Saudi consulate.

What's their skin in this story?

It sure isn't freedom of the press, since they're busy locking up every critical voice they can get their hands on, including foreign reporters.

by Anonymousreply 126October 19, 2018 9:34 AM

Trump applauds Gianforte for body-slamming reporter

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by Anonymousreply 127October 19, 2018 9:38 AM

Throwback to 1973

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by Anonymousreply 128October 19, 2018 9:42 AM

The end of oil can’t come fast enough. It has literally destroyed the world pretty much across the board.

by Anonymousreply 129October 19, 2018 9:43 AM

[quote]Thank you ladies and gents. I'll be here 6 more years.

Man, if that shit happens….I’m DONE. With voting and even thinking about politics. If people are too fucking lazy to vote out someone this dangerous, inept and CLEARLY against their best interests...what’s the point? And fuck this "Your vote means something"--I live in Texas, btw so kinda not really. I’m voting Beto and doing my thing during the midterms but...FUCK, I don’t know. It's frustrating. GOD, I cant' look at that walking Cheeto and his ghastly, trigger-happy spawn for ANOTHER term.

by Anonymousreply 130October 19, 2018 9:55 AM

[quote] What I still don't get is why Turkey blew the lid off this and revealed all these details, including that they had obviously bugged the Saudi consulate. What's their skin in this story?

I'm thinking Putin asked them to. This has his stench all over it. It continues the lowering of US standing in the world as a moral authority so no push-back when he starts rolling his drunken troops into Crimea and the Baltics. What I don't get is Jared, and by proxy Uncle Bibi's, love for the Saudi princeling.

by Anonymousreply 131October 19, 2018 9:59 AM

One does not bring a bone saw to an "interrogation".

It was a premeditated murder that was completed according to plan.

The rest is rationalization.

by Anonymousreply 132October 19, 2018 10:03 AM

[quote]One does not bring a bone saw to an "interrogation".

Maybe it was already there R132. Standard procedures and such. Hello?

by Anonymousreply 133October 19, 2018 10:07 AM

"...interrogation gone wrong..."

I TOLD them to take the hand saw instead.

by Anonymousreply 134October 19, 2018 11:26 AM

Maybe, R133;

though the reports are that the Saudi doctor, who specializes in autopsies (among other things), brought the saw with him.

by Anonymousreply 135October 19, 2018 11:30 AM

R130 People must get out and vote. All effort must be made for that.

At the same time, the political opposition must produce an agenda that people can get behind. Being Not-Trump or Not-GOP or Lesser Evil is not enough.

That is why it is difficult to motivate the democratic base to come out and vote.

by Anonymousreply 136October 19, 2018 12:17 PM

Why bother calling it an interrogation at all? It's absurd on the face of it.

Khashoggi was a journalist, not a spy. His job was to give out information (whether welcome or not), not to keep secrets. And he obviously did spread a lot information MbS didn't like.

What more could anyone have expected to get out of him? There was never any plausible rationale for "interrogating" him.

by Anonymousreply 137October 19, 2018 12:27 PM

R94, 7 minutes. They started sawing at his limbs while he was still breathing. I’m guessing they grabbed him, beat him, restrained him, and started cutting.

I’m also guessing that the only reason he was shot up with a fatal dose of morphine, or ketamine, was because 1) someone in the group finally couldn’t take it anymore, and demanded he be euthanized, or 2) the first dosage give to him had not been enough, so they had to give him a second dose, or 3), they only gave him one dose, and it took up to 7 minutes for it to do the job, or 4) it was done this way on purpose, in order to send a clear message to those in the room, in order for that message to make it back to other high profile persons in MbS’s circle, who may have building grumbling against MbS.

I’m going with number 4.

There was absolutely no reason for this poor man to be dismembered while alive. One shot to the headbwould have taken care of him immediately, or a proper amount of drugs would have been administered straight away, and his executioner would have been human enough to not dismember him while he was still breathing.

These people are savages. A weapons deal. This is what a man’s life is worth to Trump and his family. There is absolutely no way this murder would have happened how it did, where it did, and when it did, if MbS had thought for one millisecond that Trump or his administration would have cared in the slightest.

Donald J. Trump, his grown sons, his grown daughter, and her husband, are a band of sociopaths. If there was ever ANY doubt, allow that to be completely quelled at this time. These people are criminally evil.

by Anonymousreply 138October 19, 2018 1:00 PM

E101, depending on the version/model, it c an record. It does everything you iPhone does.

All files are automatically sent to the cloud if you have it set up to do so, including voice data.

The girlfriend waiting in the car with his iPhone, had his password, or his phone was unlocked. Either way, she, or anyone who had his password or an Apple device synced to watch, could access the cloud and find this recording.

I’m assuming that he had the phone on “record” before he walked in, thus the girlfriend holding on to the phone.

There is no way to tell that the watch is recording if the watch is displaying its normal screen display at the time of the recording.

by Anonymousreply 139October 19, 2018 1:11 PM

[quote]There is absolutely no way this murder would have happened how it did, where it did, and when it did, if MbS had thought for one millisecond that Trump or his administration would have cared in the slightest.

This illustrates such woeful ignorance of the Sauds, the Turks, and the mentality, culture and power politics of the region. None of the players thought for a nanosecond about what the US would say/do because they know they are immune to consequences and censure. To blame Trump for behavior that has existed for centuries, that has been ignored by everyone from FDR to Nixon to Carter to Bush to Obama, is patently naïve.

by Anonymousreply 140October 19, 2018 1:23 PM

What r140 said. You morons believe if Hillary were president, the Saudis would've magically turned into peaceful people, despite millennia of being bloodthirsty savages. Newsflash: The Saudis couldn't give two shits who the American president is.

by Anonymousreply 141October 19, 2018 1:39 PM

An Interrogation Gone Wrong? WTF?

According to reports, they sliced off each of his fingers one by one and he was killed soon after his arrival at the consulate. I would say that was planned, cold and calculated. Duh.

by Anonymousreply 142October 19, 2018 1:48 PM

You're right in principle, r139, but Khashoggi's E101 didn't have any connection to anything: it had a foreign data plan that couldn't connect to the cloud (or anything else) from Turkey, and he was too far away from his iPhone in the car for bluetooth to work.

And since Khashoggi has officially "disappeared", watch and all, it's not like anyone can listen to anything recorded directly on his watch.

So the watch story is a red herring from the Turks.

See r92 above, or link below.

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by Anonymousreply 143October 19, 2018 1:58 PM

The turks obviously bug the embassies on their soil and don't want to admit it.

by Anonymousreply 144October 19, 2018 2:02 PM

The most chilling thing is that this should have been a straightforward execution. They didn't really want to question him, and it wasn't to be publicised as a lesson for other dissidents, so the torture was completely gratuitous.

Either these animals thought they were in some fucked up middle eastern version of Reservoir Dogs, or the Saudi Royals wanted him to suffer just for funsies. Or more likely a bit of both. Fucking monsters.

by Anonymousreply 145October 19, 2018 2:21 PM

[quote]The turks obviously bug the embassies on their soil and don't want to admit it.

I'm sure every other country on Earth does the same thing.

by Anonymousreply 146October 19, 2018 2:30 PM

What R141 said.

Saudi doesnt care as long as they can trick other nations via their own terrorist actions to occupy oil/gas rich nations and provid Saudi access to their resources, Or Russia

by Anonymousreply 147October 19, 2018 3:01 PM

Like how Saudi tricked you with the 911 stunt when they flew a plane into your world trade center.

The next world war will be fought over resources.

by Anonymousreply 148October 19, 2018 3:03 PM

Turkey should work with the International Court of Justice or the UN Human Rights etc etc to set up an international outside party investigation.

The USA should not be a part of this.

by Anonymousreply 149October 19, 2018 3:47 PM

R144, one does not need to physically bug a building in order to receive and recover data. There are a number of solid options that work in order to spy on persons in a building, without accessing the building.

Of course, I’d expect the Saudis to know this, and hedge against that with various ways to block transmissions, but depending on how an outside system is set up, data can still be retrieved.

The Apple Watch doesn’t have to be synced with another Apple device to upload to the cloud, though it must be set up individually to load up to the cloud.

I believe it could have gone either way, or both ways. The watch, and/or implementation of spyware.

Had I been Khashoggi, I would have set up my watch to record. That said, had I been him, I would not have set foot in that embassy at all, whatsoever.

This is the part of the story that bothers me to no end. I’m obviously extremely bothered about his manner of death, but why did he find it important to marry this woman? Why even risk anything, at anytime, regarding setting foot in Saudi interests?

He was a bright man. He had to have known that there was real risk in what he was about to do.

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by Anonymousreply 150October 19, 2018 4:16 PM

r150, in order to upload anything to the cloud, the Apple watch has to have a data connection, and Khashoggi's most likely didn't, because he wouldn't have had a Turkish data plan for the watch (for the iPhone, maybe, but he didn't have that with him, and the watch was too far away for bluetooth to work).

It was something else. Either someone inside the consulate leaked it to the Turkish authorities (it could conceivably even have been the consul himself, since it seems he wasn't on board with the killing), or the Turks had it all bugged up.

by Anonymousreply 151October 19, 2018 6:29 PM

Here's a good analysis of why and how Turkey is acting in this case, courtesy of the NY Times.

TL;DR: The drip by drip leaks are a calculated media strategy to keep the world suspended as the mystery unfolds. It serves the deeper agenda of pushing the United States to pressure Saudi Arabia — while shielding the government behind the news media to avoid an open and potentially damaging diplomatic rupture with the Saudis.

Erdogan has a beef with MbS, and since he has Trump's number (who doesn't?), and knows full well that Mango Mussolini woud love to whitewash his rich buddy and sweep the case under the carpet, he's dribbling out the receipts bit by bit to keep the heat on.

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by Anonymousreply 152October 19, 2018 8:07 PM

Thanks for the recap, R152!

by Anonymousreply 153October 19, 2018 9:19 PM

The Turks both distrust and dislike the Saudis. I think they had the consulate bugged. I don't know how an Apple Watch works but if he had internet access while he was in the building then he should have been able to record and upload on to his cloud storage. What I don't understand is why they went about it like they did. They left traces everywhere, and then they killed him in the most obvious and horrific way imaginable.

by Anonymousreply 154October 19, 2018 9:31 PM

R154, in order to send a strong message to anyone and everyone who is a Saudí national, inside or outside of the Kingdom.

The fact that the leaks are also happening have nothing to do with executing that message. Though it does slightly help propagate the fear intended from that message.

This was meant to spread to specific individuals. Now, everyone knows.

by Anonymousreply 155October 19, 2018 11:37 PM

For a smart guy, Khashoggi made an unbelievably stupid move. Beyond understanding.

by Anonymousreply 156October 19, 2018 11:49 PM

"CNN reporting that Saudi Arabia government is now acknowledging the death of Jamal Khashoggi, has detained 18 Saudis, calling it a "fist fight" gone bad, no word on how he died or where is the body."

A fist fight gone bad?? THIS is the best they could spin after 2 weeks?

Are they forgetting about the 15 guards and autopsy expert who boarded a plane with a bone saw?

Yes, I guess a fist fight would end fairly badly if one party had a bone saw with them.

Please tell me that no one is buying this load of crap.

by Anonymousreply 157October 20, 2018 12:00 AM

Where is the body? And are the fists still attached to it?

by Anonymousreply 158October 20, 2018 12:01 AM

They fell off during the fight.

by Anonymousreply 159October 20, 2018 12:09 AM

CNN: "Saudi Crown Prince will head commission to investigate death of Journalist Jamal Khashoggi"

He and OJ will team up to find the real killers.

by Anonymousreply 160October 20, 2018 12:10 AM

Clearly the bone saw was never meant to be a weapon. They just took it along in case someone needed to file their nails. But then that "fist fight" got out of hand....

by Anonymousreply 161October 20, 2018 12:12 AM

He should have played it smarter. He had contacts within the journalistic community so he should have made it known before he went to the Consulate that if anything happened to him his disappearance would be reported in the press.

by Anonymousreply 162October 20, 2018 12:13 AM

It has been reported r162.

by Anonymousreply 163October 20, 2018 12:15 AM

HE SHOULDN'T HAVE GONE IN. PERIOD.

by Anonymousreply 164October 20, 2018 12:17 AM

Ed Whelan must have come up with that cover story. That's the only explanation.

by Anonymousreply 165October 20, 2018 12:25 AM

R163: Yes. However, it's obvious whoever decided to murder him wasn't smart enough to think it all through. Maybe he thought he'd be safe enough meeting the consul, but his killers had other ideas. If he'd made it known that if anything happened to him it would be reported in the media they might have had second thoughts.

by Anonymousreply 166October 20, 2018 12:30 AM

It happened just like this.

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by Anonymousreply 167October 20, 2018 12:33 AM

I think the Saudis are going to have to come up with a Plan B story. This one ain't gonna fly.

by Anonymousreply 168October 20, 2018 12:34 AM

Saudi justice is a modern oxymoron

by Anonymousreply 169October 20, 2018 12:37 AM

As if the Saudis could give a shit, r168. They've always done whatever they want to do, and will continue to do so. They're too wealthy and powerful of a country, with their hands in the pots of too many other countries, for the rest of the world to do much of anything. They could've executed this guy in Times Square and nothing would've changed their power or influence.

by Anonymousreply 170October 20, 2018 12:38 AM
by Anonymousreply 171October 20, 2018 12:38 AM

R157, I make it a point to listen to about 15 minutes, give or take, of FOX FAUX News. It’s almost unbearable, however, I find it important to hear their spin.

So plenty of FOX devotees will buy this spin about of fist fight gone awry. And frankly, some will take up the view of Pat Robertson, and consider it fair play and hold steadfast to this being part and parcel of pursuing business interests with the Saudis.

Trump has already thrown out a few bones, with firing a few people.

The majority of conservatives in this country do not give one flying fuck about Khashoggi’s torture and death. They view him as an Arab, despite his US residency, and they will conveniently buy into this administration’s whisper campaign already being waged against Khashoggi via social media and conservative news outlets.

by Anonymousreply 172October 20, 2018 12:39 AM

Trump, getting rid of Muslims, one Muslim at a time.

by Anonymousreply 173October 20, 2018 12:41 AM

I remember reading the memoirs of some CIA guy who had to work with the Saudis during the soviet invasion of Afghanistan. They gave a lot of money to the mujahideen to buy weapons and set up training camps. Anyway, he mentioned in the book constantly how lazy, debauched, and completely incompetent they were. Apart from the money they provided they were completely useless and usually fucked up anything they tried to organise without outside assistance.

by Anonymousreply 174October 20, 2018 12:55 AM

[quote] Newsflash: The Saudis couldn't give two shits who the American president is.

Of course they care, Moron. They pay hundreds of millions every year to affect policy in Washington.

by Anonymousreply 175October 20, 2018 12:59 AM

[quote]Anyway, he mentioned in the book constantly how lazy, debauched, and completely incompetent they were. Apart from the money they provided they were completely useless and usually fucked up anything they tried to organise without outside assistance.

All their money has made them lazy, like trust fund brats.

r175 the Saudis will do whatever they want regardless of who the US president is. You don't think if Hillary were president they would've stopped being a dictatorship? LOL!

by Anonymousreply 176October 20, 2018 1:11 AM

Died during a fistfight.....

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by Anonymousreply 177October 20, 2018 1:19 AM

Let’s not all pretend like Hillary wasn’t also in bed with, and taking money from these pieces of shit.

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by Anonymousreply 178October 20, 2018 1:21 AM

And this is what truly sucks, R178.

We cannot ever have fair leadership throughout the world, when nations like the Saudi Arabia, are holding all of the purse strings.

Hillary Clinton as president would not have made one iota of a difference. I’m a liberal who totally agrees with this.

The only thing that could fix this, is to bomb the shit out of these countries, and start over. In no way am I ideologically in line with something like that, however, I’m pointing out that this would actually be the only solution.

I predict that in 500 years or less, these countries will wipe themselves out anyhow, unless Democracy becomes extinct, or unless they become a Democracy.

by Anonymousreply 179October 20, 2018 1:39 AM

R178, Trump is in bed with them too— he’s gotten millions from apartments sales (he said this on the campaign trail) and hopes to build towers in Saudi Arabia.

Hillary isn’t president. She doesn’t have to answer to her involvement, real or not. Trump is president and does have to answer

by Anonymousreply 180October 20, 2018 1:41 AM

Saudis sponsor wahabi terrorism around the world and funded Osama Bin Laden. And we kiss their asses because of their oil

by Anonymousreply 181October 20, 2018 1:43 AM

None of these excuses as to how he does makes sense considering he was killed minutes after entering the embassy and they used a bone saw to hack him up

by Anonymousreply 182October 20, 2018 1:44 AM

R178: Yeah, and I bet they now want their money back. There's supposed to be all kinds of academic fellowships, think tanks, and foundations, that are funded by Saudi money. That's what happens with a lot of these senators, congressman and state department hacks. They get hired by one of the above and pick up a fat check once a month.

That's how the Saudis launder their bribes. It's like they've got the majority of Washington on the payroll.

by Anonymousreply 183October 20, 2018 1:49 AM

A country of tribes who hit the oil jackpot. What can one expect?

by Anonymousreply 184October 20, 2018 1:55 AM

I'm so tired of those wasabi terrorists too, R181

by Anonymousreply 185October 20, 2018 3:21 AM

They're hot stuff.

by Anonymousreply 186October 20, 2018 3:47 AM

[quote]Died during a fistfight.....

So what? So he was beaten to death with his sawed-off fists, okay? You think this is something new? It happens. I grew up in Queens, okay? Let me tell you, stuff like this happens. I've seen it many times. Many times. It happens, okay? What are you gonna do? It happens.

by Anonymousreply 187October 20, 2018 3:56 AM

Now it’s in the open. Now we see the West will accept this because of weapon sales and Trump financial interests. .Money. And the high profile Christians now,say they accept this for money. So Now the world is at notice.

Anything goes.

The walls are down.

Get ready for a wild ride, people.

by Anonymousreply 188October 20, 2018 4:07 AM

Every day a little death...

by Anonymousreply 189October 20, 2018 4:17 AM

"We are this close to Saudi Arabia pulling out MBS’s handwritten calendars that showed he was at the gym with Tobin and Squi"

"A lot of people don't realize that "bone saw" is actually the name of a drinking game."

AKA- nobody is buying this.

by Anonymousreply 190October 20, 2018 4:38 AM

couldn't he have sent his lawyer to collect the document on his behalf?

So sad.

by Anonymousreply 191October 20, 2018 5:08 AM

[quote]Now we see the West will accept this

The West has "accepted this" for the past 100 years. Today is no different from yesterday or last year or last century.

by Anonymousreply 192October 20, 2018 5:12 AM

For a VERY big retainer, R191...

by Anonymousreply 193October 20, 2018 5:13 AM

R192, what I really mean is now it’s out in the open and not disguised under a blanket of “holier than thou morality.” The pretense of Christian values are no more.

by Anonymousreply 194October 20, 2018 5:52 AM

I don't know about you R194, but I would much rather be gay in San Francisco and London than in Qatar or Cairo.

by Anonymousreply 195October 20, 2018 6:00 AM

Sissy

by Anonymousreply 196October 20, 2018 7:02 AM

It's not that she took money from the Saudi's but what she did when confronted with their evil.

Bill was before 9/11 and was free from the Bush co Saudi love affair that whisked the Bin Laden family out of the US.

Obama kept them at an arm's length.

And Hillary had no reaction while she was SoS.

You can take money from pieces of shit. You cannot let them you buy your actions.

by Anonymousreply 197October 20, 2018 7:25 AM

Interrogation Gone Wrong didn’t fly. Their murder was too messy. So Pompeo gave MbS “a few extra days” to concoct a story that Tiny Trump could try to claim fits the Saudi’s violence.

“A fight.” Sure, let’s try that.

A fellow goes into a government office to get a marriage license. A bunch of lying-in-wait security guys and a Doctor Mengele-type, armed with morphine syringes and a bone saw, come at him.

“But you see, there was a fight!”

by Anonymousreply 198October 20, 2018 10:46 AM

R195, being gay in SF is better than in Cairo, not because SF is Christian but because SF has specifically rejected religion as its guide to morality

by Anonymousreply 199October 20, 2018 10:50 AM

I’m confused as to how an interrogation or a fight leads to dismemberment by a bone saw

by Anonymousreply 200October 20, 2018 10:51 AM

[quote] I'm so tired of those wasabi terrorists too,

Now I’m suddenly hungry for sushi

by Anonymousreply 201October 20, 2018 10:54 AM

r199 being gay in Mobile or Charlotte would still be a helluva lot better than being gay in Cairo.

by Anonymousreply 202October 20, 2018 12:15 PM

[quote]Yes, I guess a fist fight would end fairly badly if one party had a bone saw with them.

[quote]Please tell me that no one is buying this load of crap.

Such a thorough and plausible explanation seems to be acknowledged by Trump. You know, that 'President' who this of all weeks thought it amusing to imitate a body slam applied to - a journalist.

by Anonymousreply 203October 20, 2018 12:19 PM

They did this as they felt they had nothing to fear from the United States-and they’re right, especially given their dealings with the plumpkin and his son-in-law. But Jared doesn’t make good decisions, does he? Always a fuckup.

by Anonymousreply 204October 20, 2018 12:24 PM

R198, it's really all very simple. There was an arcane irregularity with his marriage papers. So MBS very courteously sent a crack team of legal experts to the consulate, to provide their expertise. As for the bone saw, SA is a country of rich tradition, including a wealth of adages. One of them is "To find the truth, one must saw through the thickets of prevarication." So the saw was brought as a SYMBOL, for good luck. But Jk, in a fit of irrational rage, assaulted the very people who were there to help and in his excess of emotion, fell upon the saw, fatally wounding himself. A tragic misadventure.

by Anonymousreply 205October 20, 2018 12:37 PM

If President Donald J. Trump believes it, I do too. I think r205 has a plausible theory of what happened. He fought men holding the saws, and accidentally got hacked up.

by Anonymousreply 206October 20, 2018 12:40 PM

Kind of like in "Flamingo Road" when Joan Crawford asks Iris Adrian why she's (I.A.) spending time in the prison farm: "Ah, my boyfriend cut himself on a knife I was holding."

by Anonymousreply 207October 20, 2018 12:51 PM

Who hasn't been in a bar fight with seventeen buddies punching another guy, only to end up accidentally dismembering the dude and lying about it for days afterward?

by Anonymousreply 208October 20, 2018 1:06 PM

Yes, r207....

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by Anonymousreply 209October 20, 2018 1:17 PM

Yes, r208. Happened all the time with my drinking buddies during my college years. Plus a girl got raped during the fracas when she accidentally fell in front of my penis. It was crazy.

by Anonymousreply 210October 20, 2018 1:30 PM

The disconnect taking place in Donald Trump’s brain is unbelievable.

He decides to applaud Gianforte for body slamming an American journalist, on American soil, during a critical global event regarding the gruesome torture of a US Resident in Turkey, by MbS.

How can this man not understand the horrible optics of this? And the most fucked up thing is that all of the people at his rally cheer him on, save journalists, who are there to record and report on the rally.

I am very disheartened this morning, more so than usual. Our country is filled with Americans who’s values are absolute garbage, and they are invigorated by assault, and even murder. These are there values. This is what they respond to, and am I being dramatic, when I say that these people who are so obviously blood thirsty, would participate and applaud a government where Americans, especially journalists, are lynched, as the grand finale of these rallies? How far off are we from something like this? I don’t think this is an unreasonable trajectory from where we are, currently.

We are living in a country where our fellow citizens have absolutely zero issues with violence against the free press. And these people get NOTHING from Saudis, and are consistently disenfranchised from resources, due to Republican administrations. But perhaps they would be assauged, if a liberal or a journalist were murdered monthly, on national, live TV.

Don’t say it could never happen. Stop and look where we are now, right this minute.

by Anonymousreply 211October 20, 2018 1:38 PM

[quote]Who hasn't been in a bar fight with seventeen buddies punching another guy, only to end up accidentally dismembering the dude and lying about it for days afterward?

This is exactly what happened with Patti Lupone and Betty Buckley on the sidewalk outside Elaine's after the 1982 Tony Awards.

by Anonymousreply 212October 20, 2018 1:45 PM

How can this man not understand the horrible optics of this, r211? You added "all of the people at his rally cheer him on". You answered your own question.

by Anonymousreply 213October 20, 2018 1:58 PM

This is a good article about Saudi politics. There are going to be big changes in the House of Saud. I have often said on DL that MBS won't ever be king, and it looks like he might not be Crown Prince much longer.

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by Anonymousreply 214October 20, 2018 2:04 PM

Was talking to a deplorable last night. According to him Khashoggi was a Muslim Brotherhood terrorist and good riddance. Zero sympathy for his way of death. It was chilling.

by Anonymousreply 215October 20, 2018 2:09 PM

[quote]Prince Khalid al-Faisal returned home from Ankara with a bleak message for the royal family: “It is really difficult to get out of this one,” Prince Khalid told relatives after his return, one of those family members recalled this week. “He was really disturbed by it.”

A Thousand and One Nights Tale for gullible Westerners. But then that's what the NYT does so well.

by Anonymousreply 216October 20, 2018 2:12 PM

I'm no fan of the NYT, but that article is not spinning a story sympathetic to Saudi Arabia. As that article states, the House of Saud has never had a problem they couldn't buy their way out of. Until now. That is what scares them.

Of course Khalid et. al. aren't "good guys" committed to justice and truth-- they are worried about the bottom line. This scandal is terrible for the House of Saud. In the past, they've taken out senior royals and even a king who rocked the boat. No one looks good in the NYT story.

The knee-jerk reaction to any and all NYT reporting might feel good, but it's more suited to Twitter.

by Anonymousreply 217October 20, 2018 2:23 PM

R215, yep. That has been the repeated message on sites like The Drudge Report, Brietbart, and from Fox News pundits.

The man was actively dismembered while alive. He was conscious for SEVEN MINUTES, while he was dismembered of his fingers, hands, forearms, up to his shoulders. I’m guessing he lived while his fingers and hands were being cut from his body, at the very least.

This is one of the MOST brutal murders that I’ve ever read about. I’ve been reading the Turkish news, specifically the Daily Sabbah, and I’ve been watching news programming in either French or English, and our reporters and news casters in America our sanitizing this to death (no pun intended at all).

This is an unimaginable crime, and the savagery, inhumanity of it, are literally stomach churning. Only to be matched by the comments sections of ultra right winged, conservative rags, that spew pure filth and hatred.

If you are an American, or from anywhere, really, and you find that your values are in lockstep with The Drudge Report, Brietbart, and even FOX, there is 100% something broken WITHIN YOU. It is absolutely no mistake that you respond to this sort editorial and “spin”.

I am so fucking angry right now. I’m having an extremely difficult time processing what is happening in our country right now. There is never a bar. Never a line too far to cross, never a boundary.

I am not certain how we are going to be able to heal from the damage that these psychopaths currently in office have incurred.

by Anonymousreply 218October 20, 2018 2:28 PM

R215 This is why the full audio should be released by whoever has it. Not that I would ever listen to it.

by Anonymousreply 219October 20, 2018 2:30 PM

....

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by Anonymousreply 220October 20, 2018 2:47 PM

That should be Turkey to reveal all unless the Sauds come up with enough bakhsheesh for Erdogan's Swiss bank account.

by Anonymousreply 221October 20, 2018 2:50 PM

Even if the audio is released, the Deplorables will not listen to it, or listen to it, and say there is no proof that this is Khasghoggi being murdered, and it’s a bunch of “actors”, speaking and screaming in Arabic.

There isn’t anything out there to change their minds. The only thing that will jarr these people is if DJT shot their very own children in the head, on 5th Avenue.

by Anonymousreply 222October 20, 2018 3:10 PM

I don't think even Deplorables are fond of the Saudis.

by Anonymousreply 223October 20, 2018 3:44 PM

Deplorables have no clue who the Saudis are.

by Anonymousreply 224October 20, 2018 3:50 PM

Exactly, r224.

by Anonymousreply 225October 20, 2018 3:51 PM

How do you know that r224? It's not like the Saudis are an obscure group of people.

by Anonymousreply 226October 20, 2018 4:22 PM

They take their cues from Trump. As long as he defends the Saudis, so will they.

by Anonymousreply 227October 20, 2018 4:30 PM

[quote]How can this man not understand the horrible optics of this? And the most fucked up thing is that all of the people at his rally cheer him on, save journalists, who are there to record and report on the rally.

Republican David Frum: The Republican Party Moves Beyond Hypocrisy.

The president’s supporters live a double-folded state of being, in which the same action that’s shameful for Democrats is praiseworthy for the GOP.

You can call this “the politics of bad faith,” as many Trump critics do and will. But it’s actually weirder than that. Republicans keep trying to revive themes from the Nixon and Reagan eras—and keep bumping into the truth that not only their president, but also many of their voters, believe exactly the opposite.

Republicans are conscious of Trump’s incitements at the time they occur. Yet they somehow cannot retain the memory of those incitements between the occurrences. “Republicans produce jobs, Democrats produce mobs” has become the party’s closing slogan—even as it urges voters to think of the election as a referendum on the record of Trump, the mob-leader-in-chief. How is this even done? Where does the mind find these resources? It’s beyond hypocrisy—it’s a double-folded state of being, and it will go on so long as the need to make excuses for Donald Trump continues.

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by Anonymousreply 228October 20, 2018 4:31 PM

Turkey needs to release both the AUDIO and VISUAL evidence they say they have to the world. The perverse inhumane brutality needs to be seen by those who would discount it. Let the deplorables try to explain it away. Any deplorable with a glimmer of light left within them won’t be able to. And those that can, well, we’ll know without doubt who and what they are. Psychopaths, right up there with the executioners.

by Anonymousreply 229October 20, 2018 4:42 PM

Someone needs to explain to the deplorables that Trump is supporting a murdering Muslim country.

by Anonymousreply 230October 20, 2018 4:52 PM

“Lord Vader, have you completed your investigation into who used the Death Star to destroy Alderaan?”

No one is swallowing this load of swill. But if MBS is now in charge of overseeing their General Intelligence as has been reported, then the Saudis are digging in. MBS isn't going anywhere and they're likely hoping that all this will die down.

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by Anonymousreply 231October 20, 2018 6:03 PM

PRINCE MOHAMMED BIN SALMAN: All right. This one time -- this one time I'll let you ask me about my affairs ...

PRESIDENT TRUMP: (whispering) Is it true? -- Is it?

PRINCE MOHAMMED BIN SALMAN: (quietly, shaking his head) No.

Hahahahaha!

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by Anonymousreply 232October 20, 2018 7:36 PM

Toronto Star Washington correspondent:

In March, Trump said the Saudi military deals would produce 40,000 jobs.

A week ago, he made it 450,000 jobs. Wednesday, 500,000 jobs. Yesterday afternoon, 600,000 jobs.

Yesterday evening: "The million jobs."

by Anonymousreply 233October 20, 2018 7:36 PM

Hmmm. I have a feeling that MbS will be “taking a very long vacation”, within the next year or so.

If he isn’t murdered or imprisoned ASAP, they (meaning his family/subjects/armed forces/ etc.,) are truly fucked.

Either get him out now, or suffer now and later.

What do you DLers familiar with Saud affairs, think? I’d like to learn more about how things are done over there. Insight from some of you would be very appreciated, because some of you are very knowledgeable, and really smart.

TIA. 👍🏼

by Anonymousreply 234October 20, 2018 8:06 PM

This opinion believes this slaughter will be allowed to pass with no censure. If this becomes true, then we probably can expect more horrific executions in the future with the White House’s indifference. Normal course of events now?

Also, have you noticed how quiet the world is over this? The only direct condemnation I’ve come across is Merkel speaking out. Nothing in the USA press giving any voice to what other countries, except maybe Turkey, are saying. It’s very quiet. Maybe the New World Order is to slip back into the Dark Ages where who wins is one who slaughters dissenters outright.

I truly believe the mess in the White House has put the world on notice that such brutality can be done with no consequence because we have a President who outright calls for violence and who openly admires the most brutal tyrants and advocates for them. The President of the USA is no longer the leader of the free world. And now the psychos can and are openly coming out to play.

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by Anonymousreply 235October 20, 2018 8:25 PM

[quote]Hmmm. I have a feeling that MbS will be “taking a very long vacation”, within the next year or so.

I believe MBS will stay right where he is and will suffer no consequences at all.

by Anonymousreply 236October 20, 2018 8:32 PM

Maybe, R236, and maybe not. If he manages to hold on to power he'll have to mind his P's and Q's for years and I don't think he's capable of pulling that off.

by Anonymousreply 237October 20, 2018 8:35 PM

Perhaps the Saudis can explain by saying they had hired a failed British architect to build an embassy but instead he built an abattoir.

"The tenants arrive here and are carried along the corridor on a conveyor belt in extreme comfort, past murals depicting Mediterranean scenes, towards the rotating knives. The last twenty feet of the corridor are heavily soundproofed. The blood pours down these chutes..."

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by Anonymousreply 238October 20, 2018 8:59 PM

I agree, sadly, with r236. Read they NYT article from yesterday: MBS is currently #1 and #2, there is on one else in charge. I don't even believe his father can stand up to him at this point. He's successfully neutralized any family members who might challenge him.

King Salman has a younger half brother , Ahmed, who is very respected by the Sauds and the family, but he of course ran afoul of MBS and is now 'permanently vacationing' in London. Those are the last two sons of the "Sudairi Seven", the seven full blood sons of old King Saud who were the most powerful faction among his children. Kings Fahd and Salman were from this group, as were several government ministers and Crown Princes. In fact I believe they are among the final surviving children of Saud. That leaves 100s of grandsons/great grandsons jostling for power in a vacuum.

MBS is one of Salman's younger sons, from his last marriage. How did this "kid" obtain so much power, so young and fast? That's my question. Can the old King so something to neutralize him or at least rein him in. This is a guy who jailed his own mother when she spoke up to him; what would he do to his elderly father?

by Anonymousreply 239October 20, 2018 10:39 PM

R235- Canada has just issued a statement via Chrystia Freeland.

Considering the US - not to mention, the rest of the world - didn't side with Canada a few months ago when Canada publically condemned SA's human rights violations, Canada probably doesn't feel obligated to go out on a limb against SA again.

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by Anonymousreply 240October 21, 2018 3:40 AM

Saudi Arabia has been committing horrific human rights abuses for decades and getting away with it. Recently an Indian slave worker was run down by his Saudi employer in a car. The Saudi then jumped out of the vehicle with three of his friends and beat the poor guy to death while he lay prostrate in the road ( no one was charged, or even arrested afterwards ).

by Anonymousreply 241October 21, 2018 4:03 AM

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

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by Anonymousreply 242October 21, 2018 4:05 AM

He's going down for this. There is one thing that the House of Saud will not tolerate and that is a threat to the grip on power that the dynasty has in the country.

by Anonymousreply 243October 21, 2018 4:20 AM

Oh please. Nothing is gonna happen. Gonna be business as usual once the shit storm passes.

by Anonymousreply 244October 21, 2018 4:33 AM

I'm not saying he'll be arrested, r244. I think they'll force him out of power. He's a liability to the entire dynasty now.

by Anonymousreply 245October 21, 2018 4:48 AM

[quote]I'm so tired of those wasabi terrorists too,

Especially that evil fiend, Col. Mustard

by Anonymousreply 246October 21, 2018 5:14 AM

r246, That would have been Col. Kimchi

by Anonymousreply 247October 21, 2018 5:17 AM

I'm the one who's been saying they'll take him out for two years. Saudi Arabia is very unstable and MBS is bad for business. It's not just this scandal, although this is probably a wakeup call for the king. All of these businesses pulling out of the conference is really, really bad news for MBS. The IPO and the war in Yemen are also bad for the family business. Thousands of senior royals live the good life because of the way things are now. All Saudis live on cash payments personally doled out to the tribal leaders by the king. MBS threatens the entire system. Last year an anonymous letter condemning MBS was circulated among the senior royals-- it's not like he's a popular guy with anyone apart from the king. Also last year countrywide protests were threatened, and MBS quelled the unrest by distributing cash. Public opinion or twitter is irrelevant and I do not believe that he's as popular as Thomas Friedman and other idiots say.

The senior royals forced forced a king to abdicate before. There have also been numerous assassinations and failed assassination attempts among the royal family. MBS might stay put until the king dies, but long-term, he's fucked.

The US has very little influence over internal politics in Saudi Arabia-- although the intelligence services are probably in contact with some of the royals who oppose MBS. Probably the house arrests of senior princes were intended to stop that contact.

by Anonymousreply 248October 21, 2018 12:05 PM

The Prince has been a major liability since he took power. Locking up the entire family in the Ritz? No. I’m surprised he’s still alive, frankly. He’s far too toxic on the world stage now, and has mortally wounded himself. Even for the world in its current repulsive state, this was too far. He won’t be in power much longer, either deposed or dead shortly.

by Anonymousreply 249October 21, 2018 12:17 PM

R248, I dotknow much about this particular “dynasty”, but I agree.

He a loose screw with loose screws in his head, so why continue down this path? A huge liability to all of them.

He signed his own death warrant. He will be taken out. The father might order it done after he’s gone, or it might happen sooner than we think, but I agree. He fucked himself royally, pun intended.

by Anonymousreply 250October 21, 2018 12:23 PM

Decent Reddit thread. I’m learning a bit about MbS, his family, etc.

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by Anonymousreply 251October 21, 2018 12:28 PM

When did SA start to get such power? The 1970s?

by Anonymousreply 252October 21, 2018 12:50 PM

“Nobody has told me he’s responsible. Nobody has told me he’s not responsible. We haven’t reached that point . . . I would love if he wasn’t responsible,” Trump said in a phone interview with The Washington Post.

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by Anonymousreply 253October 21, 2018 1:02 PM

Beginning with the 1973 oil embargo, the Sauds and despots from Morocco to Brunei watched and learned how easily Western governments and institutions could be manipulated and subdued. They invested their oil wealth most advantageously in the West in property, banking, donations to both left- and right-wing political organizations and media, donations to top US and UK universities in the trillions of dollars. Currently, the Sauds hold about $167 billion in US debt.

by Anonymousreply 254October 21, 2018 1:04 PM

[quote]Currently, the Sauds hold about $167 billion in US debt.

Which means that the US will not do shit about this matter - or about [bold]any[/bold] matter concerning SA.

by Anonymousreply 255October 21, 2018 1:49 PM

With the Sauds having more than a trillion pounds invested in the UK, neither will the Brits.

by Anonymousreply 256October 21, 2018 2:30 PM

With the Sauds having approximately 15 billion Euro invested in France, neither will the French.

by Anonymousreply 257October 21, 2018 2:32 PM

Germany, the Sauds largest Euro trading partner, dared to openly criticize the Sauds. The Sauds immediately recalled their ambassador and cut back on business with the Germans.

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by Anonymousreply 258October 21, 2018 2:42 PM

Well, someone needs to speak out.

MbS is a goner. He’s a cancer. A possible malignancy, which became a malignancy, that is now aggressive and on steroids.

We all know what people with lots of money do, when their money is diagnosed with cancer.

Adios, M Bitch S!

by Anonymousreply 259October 21, 2018 4:13 PM

It sounds like this might weaken our Jared.

[quote] Trump had told reporters Friday that the Saudi explanation was credible, but U.S. officials said he has privately grimaced that his son-in-law Jared Kushner’s close relationship with the crown prince has become a liability and left the White House with no good options.

If Jared feels sidelined, who knows what nasty shit he'll unleash to get revenge on Trump.

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by Anonymousreply 260October 21, 2018 4:22 PM

MbS, allegedly bragged to others, claiming that Kushner gave him a “hit list”, detailing the enemies of MbS. A list that had been put together by US Intelligence, for internal WH business, not for Jared to slip to the Prince.

I actually believe this. Jared is said to be an absolute ignoramus, with no loyalty to anyone or anything but himself, and money.

by Anonymousreply 261October 21, 2018 4:32 PM

....

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by Anonymousreply 262October 21, 2018 4:37 PM

Jared did give the guy a hit list. Shortly after Jared’s little visit over there is when MbS started consolidating power and family were either “vacationed” or held under house arrest.

by Anonymousreply 263October 21, 2018 4:39 PM

I think Jared Nd possibly Trump are involved up to their eyeballs in this shit.

by Anonymousreply 264October 21, 2018 4:40 PM

If that's true then it shows what a devious piece of shit Kushner is, r262. If he really did give him a list and it's proved it came from Jared, then this could potentially destroy him.

by Anonymousreply 265October 21, 2018 5:03 PM

Mister Bone Saw (MSB) of the House of Sawed trumps America.

by Anonymousreply 266October 21, 2018 5:04 PM

“No seriously, we were just asking him a few innocent questions and his body parts just came off! It was CRAZY! I’ve never seen a man go all MR POTATO HEAD before. What can you do? You can’t take him home like that? Do you know how hard it is to get plane tickets for body parts that have spontaneously disconnected. Sheesh. The paperwork!”

Inshallah, there was nothing to do but plant trees across Turkye in his memory because that’s what he would have wanted. You know we have to bury by sundown, so we followed strict law and quickly buried his SPONTANEOUSLY DISCONNECTED body parts because NOTHING SUSPICIOUS happened. We had an Imam look at it, and we gave himi the obligatory 10 Million bak’sheesh and he agreed it was the will of Allah and there’s the fatwa proclaiming it as such. End of investigation, because we have 15 witnesses.”

by Anonymousreply 267October 21, 2018 5:11 PM

How I hope this is true R261 and credible evidence of it is blasted worldwide by the international media.

[quote] The only thing that will jarr these people is if DJT shot their very own children in the head, on 5th Avenue.

I'm not sure even that will. They will consider it a worthy sacrifice to the cause and pray for their babies eternal comfort in Jesus' heavenly kingdom.

by Anonymousreply 268October 21, 2018 5:26 PM

Private planes, not excess baggage on commercial flights r267

by Anonymousreply 269October 21, 2018 5:27 PM

Never thought I'd say this about a German, old fart that I am, but Merkel's got more balls than the combined "leaders" of UK, US, France...

by Anonymousreply 270October 21, 2018 5:41 PM

of course Jared is up to his eyeballs in all this. Don't forget, his father is Mossssadd. (misspelled on purpose). He could very well be too.

Him and his shitty brother filed false paperwork with nyc and drove tenants out of their rent controlled apts. He's a real piece of shit. I fucking hate him and hope he goes to prison like his daddy.

Oh, don't forget. He's so stupid his daddy had to donate millions (ill gotten no doubt) to Harvard and NYU law school so they would accept him.

by Anonymousreply 271October 21, 2018 6:25 PM

Here we go...

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by Anonymousreply 272October 21, 2018 6:29 PM

I'm sure Jared would pimp his wife out if they paid him enough money. They love blonds over there.

by Anonymousreply 273October 21, 2018 6:34 PM

But his is the ass they love.

by Anonymousreply 274October 21, 2018 6:43 PM

[quote]Adios, M Bitch S!

Don't count on it. He's gone a long way toward accumulating power, removing and weakening those who could threaten him. Personally, I think he'll set someone up to take the fall for him and count on time and money to take care of any further objections. History demonstrates that works all too often.

by Anonymousreply 275October 21, 2018 7:04 PM

The real truth is Jared got plowed by MBS when he went on his unannounced trip to Riyadh. He stayed in a hotel room with MBS for two days straight getting his ass plowed, while at the same time giving up top secret White House intelligence.

by Anonymousreply 276October 21, 2018 7:06 PM

Dope on Khashoggi had to have been compiled in Washington. As a WaPo journalist he was therefore a part of the declared enemy, the media. He was a critic of the ruling elite of Saudi Arabia that is cosily in bed with Trump and Jared.

That US intelligence on him and other critics of Saudi Arabia would have come to Jared, the senior adviser on the Middle East is inevitable, a requirement.

Whether Jared discussed this intelligence with MbS is not certain.

But what are friendships and influence bought for? MbS would've expected it. Would he have continued his relationship with Jared and Trump otherwise?

by Anonymousreply 277October 21, 2018 7:34 PM

If it quacks like a duck, r277....

by Anonymousreply 278October 21, 2018 7:37 PM

[quote]“They’re two young guys. Jared doesn’t know him well or anything. They are just two young people. They are the same age. They like each other, I believe,” Trump said.

Even though he makes Helen Keller seem commanding, this is breathtaking loose talk. Suddenly the 'hidden genius' SIL is 'just' a young person - who 'likes' the prime suspect MBS! Incredible confused conflation.

Thus the generational peer bonding is now underlined in the world's eyes. Nice work, Donald. Bone saw to bone spurs in far fewer than six degrees of separation.

by Anonymousreply 279October 21, 2018 7:40 PM

They keep on showing a manual bone saw, but please, the Saudi Autopsy Doctor would have brought an electric bone saw.

What are you? Barbarians?

by Anonymousreply 280October 21, 2018 7:42 PM

Wasn't MBS behind the deal that pumped money into Jared's property empire. He was in serious debt before that happened. I think Jared was a toadying little bitch, scrambling after Saudi money in order to get himself out debt.

MBS probably expected something in return and the intelligence from Kushner is what he got.

by Anonymousreply 281October 21, 2018 7:46 PM

I wouldn't trust the Intercept as a source...

by Anonymousreply 282October 21, 2018 7:52 PM

R279 The rest of the Arabic world and Iran are deathly silent.

With Turkey and EU also pressing on, airily dismissive notes from Trump may not fly. UK may buckle as usual, but also because of the hapless domestically embattled May. Germany has a big Turkish population and Merkel will not be so easy. Macron has strong anti-Arab sentiment always nipping at his heel. With low popularity ratings because of his economic agenda he cannot afford to fan these flames. Both have been alienated and insulted by Trump. So has May but she can't afford to be proud.

Can Trump go to his patron Putin for this? I am not sure.

This is a tough one and not far from over despite US making light of it in order to move on.

by Anonymousreply 283October 21, 2018 7:52 PM

Putin kills with impunity , bin Salman kills with impunity, and all our president can do is look on wistfully...

Evil asshole

by Anonymousreply 284October 21, 2018 7:55 PM

Oh the other resounding silence is from Israel. Also key.

by Anonymousreply 285October 21, 2018 7:55 PM

Oopsies! Did we do that? Our bad!

by Anonymousreply 286October 21, 2018 7:56 PM

It's kind of surprising that this has dominated the news all week.

by Anonymousreply 287October 21, 2018 8:10 PM

"(The) Saudis got a lot of explaining to do," he said.

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by Anonymousreply 288October 21, 2018 8:23 PM

Bloomberg....

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by Anonymousreply 289October 21, 2018 8:29 PM

They just cut his body up after he was dead.

What in the world did they have against him? He was not radical in any way. Jared and Trump have made a very nasty friend.

by Anonymousreply 290October 21, 2018 8:37 PM

They should have offed him at a consulate here in the US, we would have never made a fuss like the Turks.

by Anonymousreply 291October 21, 2018 8:43 PM

The Royal Family will do nothing until the central players are sure they won't be the ones to meet the bone saw in the middle of the night.

As far as our government's response, anyone with colleagues or friends from the ME, especially those who speak Arabic saw how things would play out when the Sauds made Trump dance in front of the King.

Trump was dancing with the "help" - the bus boys, security thugs and the guys that poured the tea with a quick turn for the cameras by an elderly non-entity prince from the House of Saud.

A colleague remarked seeing Trump up there in that conga line, "ahh...Submission...bought and sold."

That was played out for the Arab world indicating who's really the boss.

by Anonymousreply 292October 21, 2018 10:47 PM

R292: No. I'm no fan of the asshole-in-chief, however, the Arabs do like to stage pathetic - and supposedly humiliating - little put downs that in reality are meaningless. I remember when Tony Blair met Gaddafi for first time in the desert. Gaddafi wore a shoe with hole in the sole, that apparently when shown to a guest, is supposed to be a gesture of contempt.

The whole thing didn't mean anything and Gaddafi still ended up being butchered by his own people.

by Anonymousreply 293October 21, 2018 11:07 PM

MbS spoke with Khashoggi on the phone minutes before he was killed.

Allegedly.

Right wing source so far, translated from Turkish, so no link.

by Anonymousreply 294October 21, 2018 11:20 PM

[quote] Arabs do like to stage pathetic - and supposedly humiliating - little put downs that in reality are meaningless

You are not the intended audience. As with Trump dancing with busboys, as r292 says -

[quote] That was played out for the Arab world.

There are regional agendas where Trump is being used. Like the north Korean denuclearization farce. The thrust is anti US in East Asia: Kim and Moon pursue unification and getting rid of US presence in the Korean Peninsula; also supported by Xi, isolating Abe, and to get Taiwan and HK.

Similarly here - the US is to be defanged in the Middle East where the struggle is really Sunni-Shia or Saudi-Iran. Jared is put there to represent Israeli interests here, not US, as its main fear is Iran.

Meanwhile, Jared lines his pocket, and keeps Trump complicit by cutting him in as Trump still couldn't point to Iran on a map I'm sure, and is only interested in money.

by Anonymousreply 295October 21, 2018 11:38 PM

[quote] MbS spoke with Khashoggi on the phone minutes before he was killed. Allegedly.

Interesting.

by Anonymousreply 296October 21, 2018 11:49 PM

If it’s true that Khasghoggi spoke with MbS before being dismembered and beheaded, it means that the Prince wanted to avoid the mess in Turkey, if at all possible, but was determined to take him out regardless. Duh. I know it’s obvious, but here is my question: Why was Khasghoggi such a huge threat to MbS? Writing about him in WaPo? BFD. Why is that such a huge threat to MbS? It’s not like anyone thinks well of him, especially after imprisoning his entire family at the Ritz Carlton, and extorting fortunes out of each of them, and torturing and killing another man in the fancy schmanzy hotel.

Everyone knows he’s a ruthless animal. Khasghoggi wasn’t telling anyone anything they didn’t already know.

by Anonymousreply 297October 22, 2018 1:13 AM

R 293 and Tony Blair still receives millions of pounds every year from the Gulf Arabs.

Tony (and other Western leaders both political and business) can look back fondly at the hole in Gaddafi's shoe knowing that being held in contempt by the Arabs does have its advantages.

by Anonymousreply 298October 22, 2018 3:02 AM

Is Rand Paul wearing a wig? I saw him on TV commenting on this issue and his hair on top looks so fake and dried up looking!

by Anonymousreply 299October 22, 2018 7:11 AM

[quote] Why was Khasghoggi such a huge threat to MbS?

No idea.

by Anonymousreply 300October 22, 2018 8:52 AM

He was an Arab native posting from the freedom of a US residency about the serious issues in the Kingdom.

He was an existential threat.

by Anonymousreply 301October 22, 2018 8:54 AM

This gets even more sickening.

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by Anonymousreply 302October 22, 2018 10:25 AM

Weird story, r302.

On a tangent, I wonder how it feels to be Gen. Ahmad al-Assiri when the shit hits the fan and you're reading in in black and white in the international media for over a week that the royal cabal is planning to pin Khashoggi's death on you. In a country that enthusiastically executes the death penalty.

BTW, based on the pictures I've seen, al-Assiri looks really dark-skinned, like Sudanese. In fact he reminds me a bit of Neal de Grasse Tyson. Khashoggi, on the other hand, was apparently very light-skinned and could have passed for a generic Mediterranean type, Italian or Spanish. Yet they're both Saudi nationals. I was under the impression that Saudi Arabia was basically created from a conglomeration of tribes living on the Arabian peninsula. Was there really such a broad range of skin tones among the indigenous tribes of a fairly small area? (Allah knows the variations can't be from immigration, since they don't allow anyone in...)

by Anonymousreply 303October 22, 2018 1:40 PM

"Is Rand Paul wearing a wig?"

It's his double. Oh oh...

It's wrong, but I feel angry at JK for being stupid enough to go into the consulate.

by Anonymousreply 304October 22, 2018 2:48 PM

Asked about the credibility of a Saudi investigation of the killing that took place in their Istanbul consulate, Kushner told CNN: "We're getting facts in from multiple places."

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by Anonymousreply 305October 22, 2018 3:04 PM
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by Anonymousreply 306October 22, 2018 3:20 PM

R305, They're gonna love him in the slammer!

by Anonymousreply 307October 22, 2018 3:21 PM

Dr. Mengele has been reincarnated in Saudi Arabia.

by Anonymousreply 308October 22, 2018 3:55 PM

Jared has that Cruel Sissy-Nazi mien, the kind that would hold a bespoke handkerchief over his nostrils as he inspected the camps.

by Anonymousreply 309October 22, 2018 4:01 PM

Oh my mohammed!!! the video of the body double is unreal!!! These Saudis are wilding out.

That country should be blown to holy hell. I can't fathom what they tried to pull off. Thank god for Turkish CCTV.

by Anonymousreply 310October 22, 2018 4:15 PM

I'm sorry but Jamal Khashoggi was a fool. He was persona non grata as they say and an enemy of the Kingdom of Saud and waltzes into their consulate in Turkey with his wife outside like another idiot. He should have gone there with several policemen and a bodyguard and told several people what was going on. He writes those scathing pieces on Saudi and then doesn't realize he could have been in MAJOR danger???

Dummy.

You don't see Salman Rushdie vacationing in Tehran or Islamabad do you??? No, because he knows better.

Headlines you're unlikely to see: "Salman Rushdie has gone missing after writer takes trip to Imam Reza's Shrine in Mashaad, Iran ..."

by Anonymousreply 311October 22, 2018 4:22 PM

Not to blame him (really), but apparently the day before he had told several friends of his plans, and they had strongly discouraged him. Maybe he deluded himself into thinking that his past importance in the Saudi regime would serve as a protection? But he did give his fiancee the name of someone to call, if there was a problem. I imagine the sickening and sinking feeling when he first realized he was trapped.

by Anonymousreply 312October 22, 2018 4:31 PM

He had already been to the same Turkish consulate and left without incident. They told him the papers weren't ready and to come back for them. Whether Khashoggi should or shouldn't have bothered getting his divorce papers, the fact remains that Crown Prince Muhammad bin Sawbones sent a death squad to kill him.

What I really want to hear is the phone call between MbSawbones and Khashoggi that is alleged to have taken place right before Khashoggi's murder. I'll bet the Turks have it, along with every minute of the torture and dismemberment, every word the death squad spoke in the consulate and every move they made in Istanbul.

How fucking "accidental" was it if they brought along a bonesaw and a look-alike to pretend Khashoggi was out and about in Istanbul after they killed him?

MbSawbones has to go.

by Anonymousreply 313October 22, 2018 5:19 PM

R313, the Turks claim to have all of it. I don’t understand why they just don’t release it. They really should.

How much cash is MbS depositing into a special account for Erdogan? All in diamonds, I assume.

by Anonymousreply 314October 22, 2018 10:15 PM

I'm curious why the Turks are pushing this like they are. Is there some reason why Erdogan is going after the Saudis so hard over this?

by Anonymousreply 315October 22, 2018 10:24 PM

The Turks said they will release the whole shanda on Tuesday.

by Anonymousreply 316October 22, 2018 10:52 PM

[quote]Is there some reason why Erdogan is going after the Saudis so hard over this?

It was called the Ottoman Empire, and Erdogan wants it back.

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by Anonymousreply 317October 22, 2018 10:58 PM

Attempted cover up

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by Anonymousreply 318October 22, 2018 11:09 PM

Turkey is doling out bits and pieces so that the Saudis can be caught lying through their teeth--Saudis said at first they had no clue what happened and claimed Khashoggi left the embassy. So Turkey gives out a few nuggets here and there and now we see that Saudi had a body double on hand. So Turkey can now show that Saudi was lying right from the start.

by Anonymousreply 319October 22, 2018 11:13 PM

Turkey has played this very well. I can't wait until the big reveal tomorrow!

by Anonymousreply 320October 22, 2018 11:21 PM

Sounds like the killing was skyped and the Prince may have watched it.

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by Anonymousreply 321October 22, 2018 11:21 PM

Trump and Co. keep saying that the US-Saudi relationship is needed because Saudi is a counterbalance to Iran.

But if they can kill a Washington Post journalist, lie about it and then have the whole thing unravel to show their utter incompetence - just look at the "body double" they thought was going to fool people; did they think no one would notice the fake Khashoggi has a full head of black hair???--then honestly, what use are they in keeping Iran in check? Why would the US trust them on anything Iran-related?

by Anonymousreply 322October 22, 2018 11:26 PM

He should not have gone in there alone. I think he should have sent a lawyer or a proxy.

His ego is too big. Of all people, he should have known what those cunts are capable of. Did he think he could say all those things and they would let him get away with it?

RIP. too sad.

by Anonymousreply 323October 22, 2018 11:32 PM

I have always wondered why we prefer the Saudis to Iran. The Iranians seem more civilized and less tribal, in a relative sense.

by Anonymousreply 324October 22, 2018 11:33 PM

That sadly wouldn't surprise me R21. The whole brutal torture part didn't make sense given it should have been a simple execution if they just wanted rid of him. This screams personal and the phone call/skyping to the prince makes much more (albeit fucked up) sense. Monsters.

by Anonymousreply 325October 22, 2018 11:41 PM

Skyping a hit is a whole new level of depravity. Jesus.

by Anonymousreply 326October 23, 2018 5:31 AM

[quote] Why would the US trust them on anything Iran-related?

It's Jared. He delivered his father in law in exchange for money to keep 666 Fifth avenue. His father in law gets monies too.

There's no reason to ally with Saudi Arabia except money.

by Anonymousreply 327October 23, 2018 6:21 AM

Criminal prosecutions of MBS and other Saudi officials could be brought under the U.N. Convention against Torture, to which Saudi Arabia is a signatory. The convention prohibits acts that inflict “severe pain or suffering … inflicted by or at the instigation of or with the consent or acquiescence of a public official or other person acting in an official capacity.”

Through the principle of universal jurisdiction, any country that is a party to the convention, including the United States, could refer a case to the International Court of Justice and seek an order for Saudi Arabia to prosecute or extradite MBS and the other suspects.

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by Anonymousreply 328October 23, 2018 8:09 AM

[quote]You morons believe if Hillary were president, the Saudis would've magically turned into peaceful people, despite millennia of being bloodthirsty savages. Newsflash: The Saudis couldn't give two shits who the American president is

I'm sorry....who's blaming Trump? I know there's pressure for him to do something about it--despite his obvious financial ties to them--but I'm not seeing any DIRECT blame on him in this situation. Am I missing something?

by Anonymousreply 329October 23, 2018 9:23 AM

Sound like a plan, r328!

We'll just hold our breath while we wait for the Trump administration to refer a case to the International Court of Justice, and then we'll hope Saudi Arabia "prosecutes or extradites" the heir to their throne quickly.

by Anonymousreply 330October 23, 2018 12:14 PM

Except for this, R328: if Jared did indeed give MbS a “list” of his enemies, nothing will be done.

MbS already tortured & killed a man at the Ritz Carlton in Riyadh, where he held is entire family hostage, extorting them of their fortunes in order to reduce their power. That was done a week after Kushner left Riyadh, therefore, MbS bragging about that list given to him by Jared, might be true.

We didn’t do anything then, so we may do absolutely nothing now.

Trump & Kushner are dirty as hell. America will most probably do nothing, despite it now becoming an international event.

by Anonymousreply 331October 23, 2018 1:10 PM

They found "some" of his remains. It's breaking now. He was dismembered.

by Anonymousreply 332October 23, 2018 1:30 PM

Awww

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by Anonymousreply 333October 23, 2018 1:37 PM

"Am I missing something?"

Yes, R329. Trump has reached a nadir of morality that is a tacit encouragement to all the despots. His scorn for the media and his all-round degeneracy send a message that it's fine to be a barbarian.

by Anonymousreply 334October 23, 2018 2:03 PM

The Turks are leaking that remains were found on the grounds of the Saudi Consul General's home. No wonder that little fucker got out of town in such a hurry the day they announced Khashoggi was missing and presumed dead.

by Anonymousreply 335October 23, 2018 2:51 PM

You know, dismemberment is so gruesome, was this some kind of ritualistic dismemberment so they could bring the Crown Prince a trophy? I'm serious. I can see that psychopath telling his death squad he wanted indisputable proof, including physical evidence that the journalist was dead. Like, "Bring me his heart!" Or, in this case, " film it. Make a snuff film for me!!"

by Anonymousreply 336October 23, 2018 2:54 PM

Horrible

I wish there was something to be done but all I can do is vote.

by Anonymousreply 337October 23, 2018 2:59 PM
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by Anonymousreply 338October 23, 2018 3:05 PM

R336, it was Skyped “live” to MbS, according to Turkish intelligence.

I’ve never used Skype, I FaceTime. Can one film it while Skyping live?

It was probably filmed from another device, anyhow. Those present probably had their cell phones.

Fucking sick. MbS MUST go down for this. This is totally unforgivable. No question.

If DJT doesn’t take a stand against this in a profound and meaningful way, then the entire world will see him as a complete weakling, as well as morally bankrupt to the core.

by Anonymousreply 339October 23, 2018 5:05 PM

CNN: Trump feels betrayed by Saudis over journalist's murder.

WTF? Who is feeding CNN this swill? Like Trump gives a shit.

by Anonymousreply 340October 23, 2018 5:32 PM

R340, CNN correction: "Trump feels envious"

by Anonymousreply 341October 23, 2018 5:39 PM

Skype can be hacked. I think you can record Skype. I don't use any of these spying apps.

by Anonymousreply 342October 23, 2018 5:44 PM

r339 If Dems currently running in tight races for House or Senate seats (or any seats for that matter) don't use this and pound this idea home over the next two weeks then I don't know what they are doing running in the first place.

They should use this to hound the hell out of Trump-supporting Repugs. It may not help in really red, backwater areas but in swing areas such as Texas this should be used as another nail in the coffin.

by Anonymousreply 343October 23, 2018 5:46 PM

Prince was given his fingers?

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by Anonymousreply 344October 23, 2018 6:47 PM

garbage people

by Anonymousreply 345October 23, 2018 6:49 PM

Ok, the Saudis have said it was an interrogation gone wrong.

They didn't expect him to not survive having his arms and other body parts removed during questioning?

by Anonymousreply 346October 23, 2018 6:52 PM

[quote]Ok, the Saudis have said it was an interrogation gone wrong.

Meaning that JK gave the 'wrong' answers to the interrogation. Not that there could possibly have ever been 'right' answers, given the investment in the outcome.

by Anonymousreply 347October 23, 2018 7:05 PM

This is some serious medieval shit.

by Anonymousreply 348October 23, 2018 7:13 PM

Precisely R346

Well we only maimed a bit, he just uncooperatively up and died on us.

by Anonymousreply 349October 23, 2018 7:16 PM

See? I knew it !!! I had a feeling that Muhammed Bin Salman, the Crown Prince got some kind of Trophy from Khashoggi How sick. This is vile. Savage. What a fucking animal. Then he meets with the family and shakes hands with the son who has been barred from leaving the country? See? John McCain would have gone over there and demanded the release of his family including that son. This is barbaric. McCain saved the life of the Russian journalist Putin TWICE poisoned and tried to kill. He was a pallbearer at McCain's funeral and when he was interviewed he said McCain saved his life.

by Anonymousreply 350October 23, 2018 7:20 PM

Does this confirm that Khashoggi was cut?

by Anonymousreply 351October 23, 2018 7:25 PM

Well the press is reporting that his disfigured FACE was found the other day, what does that tell you r351?

Face only was specifically found. No detail was given if the face was still attached to his head.

by Anonymousreply 352October 23, 2018 7:28 PM

MBS has the eyes of a psychopath. You know his family hid the pets and younger kids from him growing up.

by Anonymousreply 353October 23, 2018 7:45 PM

Somebody needs to kill that fucking Crown Prince, cut off his fingers and shove them down his throat, then cut off his dick and shove it up his ass. Cut his heart out and nail it to his forehead. Then carve Jamal Kasshoggi on his belly.

by Anonymousreply 354October 23, 2018 8:21 PM

He needs to be imprisoned, tried, convicted, and sentenced to death.

Trump just gave a press conference, it was on FAUX News, not sure if other stations aired it.

Anyhow, he opened with “we are currently investigating this, blah, blah, blah”. He followed up with how fantastic the economy is doing, how unemployment rates are at a record low, how well the stock market has done, how he will build a wall to keep migrant caravans from South and Central America out of US soil, and how well he is doing as our POTUS, & everything is going swimmingly because he’s in office.

Basically, he just said, in his long winded, deceitful, and misinformed way, that nothing will be done regarding MbS, & the brutal torture/murder of a US Resident, journalist, who worked for “fake news” WaPo.

What a disgusting piece of shit this man is. Wow, just wow!!!

by Anonymousreply 355October 23, 2018 8:31 PM

Just when you thought it couldn’t get any more depraved. Imagine being forced to shake hands with the man who had your father slaughtered in a staged political stunt photographed for the entire world to see. Also note, the poor son is not allowed to leave the country.

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by Anonymousreply 356October 23, 2018 8:37 PM

I'm pretty sure Trump said specifically last week he wasn't going to punish the Saudis at any cost to our economy.

So, what does that leave? A severe verbal scalding?

by Anonymousreply 357October 23, 2018 8:39 PM

It means Trump and slimeball kushner are worried that the Saudis will stop pumping money into their companies, r357.

by Anonymousreply 358October 23, 2018 8:53 PM

R356, Khasghoggi’s son must be absolutely horrified and scared for his life in a way that we here, may have never experienced, unless placed in a situation where we knew we were under real threat of life and limb.

I am so saddened and horrified for this young man. I wish there were a way to demand that he and his entire family be released.

by Anonymousreply 359October 23, 2018 8:59 PM

If the right amount diplomatic pressure was applied, then I'm sure Erdogan would be willing to give them sanctuary, r59.

by Anonymousreply 360October 23, 2018 9:05 PM

Any tweets from Tiny Twit on this lately? How is this playing out in the elections?

[quote] [R339] If Dems currently running in tight races for House or Senate seats (or any seats for that matter) don't use this and pound this idea home over the next two weeks then I don't know what they are doing running in the first place.

by Anonymousreply 361October 23, 2018 9:15 PM

That's exactly it, R348. The mindset is pure 10th century, with all the latest 21st century gadgets. It was said that the prince was puzzled by the world reaction to the murder.

by Anonymousreply 362October 23, 2018 9:16 PM

because of Trump, and the forces behind the scenes that keep him propped up, there is now almost no where in the world where a person can go and feel safe. I guess Canada, the UK, and some other European countries, but the United States is no longer a safe haven. Ifeel like I'm wading through sewage every time I watch Trump speak. he's a filthy bastard.

by Anonymousreply 363October 23, 2018 9:56 PM

For a minute I thought R321 found his head.

It's what I thought. They removed the fingers that typed the criticism of the evil prince. I don't want to know the rest.

by Anonymousreply 364October 23, 2018 10:33 PM

Well...well...

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by Anonymousreply 365October 24, 2018 12:29 PM

Asked about the crown prince’s possible involvement, Trump said: “Well, the prince is running things over there more so at this stage. He’s running things and so if anybody were going to be, it would be him.”

Trump told the Wall Street Journal he had closely questioned Prince Mohammed about Khashoggi’s murder, posing questions repeatedly and “in a couple of different ways”.

“My first question to him was, ‘Did you know anything about it in terms of the initial planning’,” Trump said. Prince Mohammed replied that he didn’t, Trump said.

“I said, ‘Where did it start?’ And he said it started at lower levels.”

Asked if he believed the denials, the president paused for several seconds. “I want to believe them. I really want to believe them,” he said.

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by Anonymousreply 366October 24, 2018 3:31 PM

Body found

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by Anonymousreply 367October 24, 2018 5:59 PM

Not according to most sources.

by Anonymousreply 368October 24, 2018 6:19 PM

The prince, in a PR stunt, met with the family of the slain journalist.

That was pathetic

by Anonymousreply 369October 24, 2018 6:35 PM

Pathetic? It was disgraceful, r369. A slap in the face of that young man who's being held prisoner in Saudi and had to shake the hand of his father's murderer.

by Anonymousreply 370October 24, 2018 8:52 PM

I think the Prince just wanted to shake hand with the son so that he could compare his fingers to the ones in his collection.

by Anonymousreply 371October 24, 2018 8:55 PM

And unfortunately this is yesterday's news because....you know....

by Anonymousreply 372October 24, 2018 8:56 PM

And now.....

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by Anonymousreply 373October 25, 2018 1:08 PM
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by Anonymousreply 374October 26, 2018 2:29 PM

Khashoggi's son was finally allowed to leave and is now in the US.

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by Anonymousreply 375October 26, 2018 2:35 PM

Thank god. Will he ever overcome the nausea he must feel from that handshake.

by Anonymousreply 376October 26, 2018 10:19 PM

THere is some speculation that the Crown Prince is being stripped of his power and his father has reasserted control of the Kingdom. If that's true Daddy better cop that fucker's head off before he loses his own head. That Muhammed Bin Salman is a treacherous bastard. He's apparently been after Khashoggi for three years because Khashoggi was collaborating on some radio or TV show with a relative he wasn't getting along with. Is that some shit or what?

by Anonymousreply 377October 26, 2018 11:27 PM

The King is isolated and suffering from dementia and the Crown Prince rules having no other rivals left standing.

However, other Royals may become sufficiently alarmed at possible curtailing of their shopping and real estate deals in the west and may act.

That is, as long as they present a united front. Otherwise they'll be picked off one by one or one family at a time.

In the meantime the response of the oval office seems to be don't get caught again..oh...and keep the checks coming.

by Anonymousreply 378October 27, 2018 5:40 AM

I don't think the old man is as far gone with dementia as Jr. wants us to believe he is. The old Prince is the one who forced his son to face the family and offer condolences and apologize for the death of Jamal to Jamal's family in an act of humiliation. It was a Muslim thing. And then the son who had been barred from leaving was suddenly allowed to go along with his family. I wouldn't underestimate the old Prince. He might kill MBS. The treachery among these Saudi families should not be underestimated.

by Anonymousreply 379October 27, 2018 5:50 AM

[quote]The old Prince is the one who forced his son to face the family and offer condolences and apologize for the death of Jamal to Jamal's family in an act of humiliation.

Uh, no. It's called "sulkha", accepting blame to avoid or end a blood feud between families/clans. It is considered honourable, not "humiliating".

by Anonymousreply 380October 27, 2018 5:55 AM

"The old Prince"? Do you mean the King?

by Anonymousreply 381October 27, 2018 8:58 AM

The fiancée of the murdered Washington Post columnist Jamal Khashoggi declined an invitation from US President Donald Trump to visit the White House, she said Friday.

"The statements Trump made in the first days around his invite and the statements he made afterward opposed each other. They were simply statements to gain public sympathy," Hatice Cengiz said during an interview with the pro-government Turkish channel Haber Turk.

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by Anonymousreply 382October 27, 2018 2:20 PM

Thus perhaps the ten thousandth example of Trump's absolute cluelessness as to how he comes across to normal intelligent people. And why they don't want to be anywhere close to him. Of course, it's all the media's fault.

by Anonymousreply 383October 27, 2018 2:52 PM

All this fuss just because MBS is TRANSACTIONAL.

by Anonymousreply 384October 27, 2018 5:00 PM

And in further news....

U.S. Secretary of Defense Jim Mattis said Sunday that Saudi Foreign Minister Adel-al Jubeir agreed that a complete investigation into the killing of dissident journalist Jamal Khashoggi was necessary, according to Reuters.

"We discussed it. You know the same thing we talked about, the need for transparency, full and complete investigation," Mattis told a small group of reporters traveling with him, referring to a meeting with the Saudi official on Saturday, the news service reported.

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by Anonymousreply 385October 28, 2018 9:16 PM

God, I feel so sorry for General Mattis. Unfortunately, we can't spare him right now. He'll have to stay on a while in Crazyland.

by Anonymousreply 386October 28, 2018 11:02 PM

Bumping ....

by Anonymousreply 387October 29, 2018 9:51 PM

Will the CIA finally decide he is a liability?

He was aided in his bid as successor to the throne by the CIA, before the elections. They thought he could be controlled.

They were wrong, and world geopolitical events unfathomable a few months ago are at the front line.

The number one question is will MbN be able to oust MbS even with CIA support?

by Anonymousreply 388October 29, 2018 11:29 PM

Did the CIA really think he could be controlled? I've been watching this since King Abdullah died, and I've thought all along that MBS would not last. The CIA worked for decades with Mohammed bin Nayef. I don't think MBS was someone anyone wanted except the King.

by Anonymousreply 389October 29, 2018 11:39 PM

[quote]I don't think MBS was someone anyone wanted except the King.

I don't think MBS was someone anyone wanted except for MBS. He pushed his ailing father around, threw his own mother in prison and made a big power grab.

by Anonymousreply 390October 30, 2018 1:02 AM

And in news that seems old.....but isn't....

ISTANBUL — Turkey’s public prosecutor said Wednesday that Jamal Khashoggi was strangled and dismembered upon arrival at the Saudi Consulate in Istanbul earlier this month as part of a premeditated plan to kill the prominent Saudi journalist and dispose of his body.

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by Anonymousreply 391October 31, 2018 4:12 PM

r389, it's not necessarily about control, it's about positioning. They'll do anything to be in the best position to influence/control the tap flow.

The Americans don't have a good record with this. The old Arabia hands in the UK were appalled when they decided to back the House of Saud. Apparently, they were considered violent, fractious, and difficult even by ME tribal standards.

by Anonymousreply 392October 31, 2018 10:10 PM

They seem to imply that there was no torture, R391. How likely is that.

by Anonymousreply 393October 31, 2018 10:20 PM

Let's hope. Bizarre when that's the good news (at least he wasn't tortured).

by Anonymousreply 394October 31, 2018 10:30 PM

r393 it's probably 50/50. The goal was to kill him, i.e. they weren't necessarily trying to 'send a message' or get any info from him. In that case, why bother with torture?

On the other side, if the Prince was trying to send a larger message to other dissidents/potential dissidents, it's entirely possible. Even if it was denied, it would still get out and serve as a warning to others. It could also be personal.

by Anonymousreply 395October 31, 2018 11:16 PM

Jamal Khashoggi's body was 'dissolved', says Erdogan adviser...

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by Anonymousreply 396November 2, 2018 5:34 PM

Nobody cares anymore.

by Anonymousreply 397November 2, 2018 5:56 PM

I think they'll eventually find some remains. This is not a Science Fiction horror movie. Dissolving his body in some kind of acid solution might disfigure or destroy soft tissue, but it won't get rid of the bones. That's what the Saudis dread. If they find any remains that will be the end of MBS.

by Anonymousreply 398November 3, 2018 1:04 PM

Why would that make a difference? It will still be "this terrible act was done by rogue agents"

by Anonymousreply 399November 3, 2018 1:12 PM
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