It's not limited to Russians. Freeze their assets and keep them out of the US.
It's Time to Hit the Saudis With the Magnitsky Act
|by Anonymous||reply 87||10/17/2018|
Hopefully Congress can do this without Trump. He's afraid of losing munitions business with them. Asshole.
|by Anonymous||reply 1||10/11/2018|
Yep. But never gonna happen.
|by Anonymous||reply 2||10/11/2018|
Will never happen with them being the largest counterweight to Iran in the MIddle East. They're a long-term house of cards anyway; they've almost squandered all of their oil wealth. They've been quietly trying to economize for a number of years. Soon, the Hadj will become one of their only income streams.
|by Anonymous||reply 3||10/11/2018|
Trump's lying about the $110 billion in arms sales. There is no such deal.
|by Anonymous||reply 4||10/11/2018|
Democrats must lead here.
|by Anonymous||reply 5||10/11/2018|
You think Congress, under either party, would actually do that to Saudi Arabia? Oil prices would go through the roof. Not to mention all the other companies that Saudi royals and nationals control. It would create a major economic incident. It is the same reason why the act will never be applied to China, even though their human rights record is just as bad or worse. Russia was an easier one, to target, because they are not as major of a player in the international economy, and even then the Act only applied to certain individuals and left most of the "Big" names off the list.
Not to mention that Saudi Arabia is a counterweight to Iran, and has begun to work with Israel.
|by Anonymous||reply 6||10/11/2018|
R6 Well you're right but it's about time that scenario was changed. There are so many levels of wrong with it.
|by Anonymous||reply 7||10/11/2018|
Magnitsky MBS and his buddies. All of them.
|by Anonymous||reply 8||10/11/2018|
The Saudis own congress and the White House. That’s why they felt so comfortable doing this. Even if. Khashoggi was an American citizen, they still would’ve killed him.
|by Anonymous||reply 9||10/11/2018|
Turks tell U.S. officials they have audio and video recordings that support conclusion Khashoggi was killed
The Turkish government has told U.S. officials that it has audio and video recordings that prove Washington Post columnist Jamal Khashoggi was killed inside the Saudi Consulate in Istanbul this month, according to U.S. and Turkish officials.
The recordings show that a Saudi security team detained Khashoggi in the consulate after he walked in Oct. 2 to obtain an official document before his upcoming wedding, then killed him and dismembered his body, the officials said.
The audio recording in particular provides some of the most persuasive and gruesome evidence that the Saudi team is responsible for Khashoggi’s death, the officials said.
“The voice recording from inside the embassy lays out what happened to Jamal after he entered,” said one person with knowledge of the recording who, like others, spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss highly sensitive intelligence.
“You can hear his voice and the voices of men speaking Arabic,” this person said. “You can hear how he was interrogated, tortured and then murdered.”
A second person briefed on the recording said men could be heard beating Khashoggi.
|by Anonymous||reply 10||10/11/2018|
Any peep about this from Hillary Kamala warren schumer?
|by Anonymous||reply 11||10/11/2018|
Not going to happen
|by Anonymous||reply 12||10/11/2018|
Some Saudis are very hot and you can let these guys in. They are majorly sexy .
|by Anonymous||reply 13||10/11/2018|
R11, there is no reason for Clinton to comment. She's not an elected official. I thought you guys wanted her to go away, anyway.
Sanders is gearing up for 2020. What's he saying?
|by Anonymous||reply 14||10/11/2018|
[quote]Not going to happen
Thank you, Assange.
|by Anonymous||reply 15||10/11/2018|
Clinton can post if she wants too. She is always welcome on DL
|by Anonymous||reply 16||10/11/2018|
why did they kill him? did he have info ?
|by Anonymous||reply 17||10/11/2018|
Russia hasn’t got anything much America wants. So it can be magnitskied till the cows come home. It doesn’t really matter.
But the Saudis on the other hand - way too many problems in sanctioning them. There’s the oil of course. And the labyrinthine financial ties the saudis in power have with the top echelons of money and power in the US. Plus the whole finely balanced house of cards that is Middle East geopolitics...
They’ll get away with it. Probably get a serious talking to. But they can push it much, much further before the west would retaliate in any meaningful way. Hell - my elderly Ukrainian grandfather is constantly ranting about how The West failed to come to Ukraine’s aid when Putin invaded Crimea. That was invasion of a sovereign state. You think killing a journalist even rates? (Oh - and there’s been three - or is it four now? - killings by Putin of inconvenient people this last week alone. And what can anyone do about that? It’s a tough world and life is cheap outside the insular American bubble!)
|by Anonymous||reply 18||10/11/2018|
r18 - you need to relax. You seem to be getting too worked up. Have you taken your meds?
|by Anonymous||reply 19||10/12/2018|
Maybe it’s time for a little retaliation. Saudi official on tape entering [somewhere]. Never seen again. Deny any responsibility in the face of blatant evidence. (Trump does that all the time.)
|by Anonymous||reply 20||10/12/2018|
Bomb Riyadh - this would get their attention.
|by Anonymous||reply 21||10/12/2018|
r3 is correct. Internally, Saudi Arabia is a mess. I've said this here before, but I think that the Saudis will take care of the MBS problem themselves-- once the king dies. Maybe with a little help from the CIA. The House of Saud does not tolerate kings who jeopardize their wealth (see King Saud, who was deposed and maybe also King Fahd, who was assassinated).
|by Anonymous||reply 22||10/12/2018|
Saudi Arabia is essentially tribal. Any tribe can step up beside the house of saud which itself is very young.
|by Anonymous||reply 23||10/12/2018|
It would surely cause an oil embargo. Remember the 1970s?
|by Anonymous||reply 24||10/12/2018|
The Saudis (and the Russians; and the Israelis) own Trump.
Trump’s not going to stand up to Americans being dismembered because it might interfere with his Condo sales and the money he “skims” from arms deals.
“You want to ‘expedite’ an weapons delivery - let’s your delegation and mine discuss over dinner and breakfast at a Trump property. “By the way, what hotel is your delegation staying at.”
|by Anonymous||reply 25||10/12/2018|
Obama probably wouldn't have done much about this either.
|by Anonymous||reply 26||10/12/2018|
^^^^ J. Kushner
|by Anonymous||reply 27||10/12/2018|
Everyone is pulling out of the finance summit in Riyadh this month. No tweet about this from the Twit or what?
|by Anonymous||reply 28||10/12/2018|
The Saudis were behind 9/11, everyone knows it, nothing was done about it. After murdering thousands of Americans in their own country hell yeah, they can kill individuals anywhere with impunity. They know it, we know it, everyone in the world knows it.
|by Anonymous||reply 29||10/12/2018|
Withdrawing from Riyadh summit: Branson, nytimes, economist, CNN, CNBC, world bank, financial times, Viacom, Uber.... and counting.
This is what is happening this time r29. Come out of the basement and try to keep up.
|by Anonymous||reply 30||10/12/2018|
Despite #Khashoggi disappearance, Treasury Sec. Mnuchin tells CNBC he will still attend Saudi conference: "I am planning on going at this point. If more information comes out and changes we can look at that...Saudi has been a very good partner."
|by Anonymous||reply 31||10/12/2018|
Haha r31 the (grim) jokes on the Munchkin and the US 🤦♂️😂
|by Anonymous||reply 32||10/12/2018|
The Saudi family might be monsters but they are merely guarding bigger monster ; Islamic fanaticism. Their absolute control over the 2 holy city of Mecca and Medina gives them a huge influence within the billion plus Sunni Muslim community. Should they were removed ala Game of Thrones the kingdom will be instantly plunged into a civil war and dragging the entire Muslim world with it. So it is an American and western interest to keep the kingdom intact regardless of all the crazy shit they did.
|by Anonymous||reply 33||10/12/2018|
It's those white dresses they wear. Men are not supposed to wear dresses!
|by Anonymous||reply 34||10/12/2018|
|by Anonymous||reply 35||10/12/2018|
This is highly interesting even though I've never paid attention to Saudi politics. It's pretty confusing with all the half brother princes. Anyone know what the crown succession custom is? It's tribal and factional and all over the place it seems.
MbS will have to go if the dynasty is the retain power. Will he? He's a guy who kept his own mother under house arrest. His dad the king has Alzheimer's. MbS threw Mohammed out in a family coup in his incapacitated dad's name. A dangerous but dynamic man.
Can he be ousted? By whom? The king has many wives, and therefore there are many rivalrous half brothers. Who will step up? Will Mohammed who MbS ousted be able to come back? Obviously the sick king can't make the decision.
Will the US retain MbS or support another? Jared is pally with MbS being cut from the same cloth. They have deals going on so he can't afford to lose MbS as the power. A lot hinges on the US elections and Mueller I'd imagine.
Watch this space for a family coup or coup attempt.
|by Anonymous||reply 36||10/12/2018|
So why did they kill him? They must want something he knew to remain hidden.
|by Anonymous||reply 37||10/12/2018|
Remember they imprisoned a bunch of Sheiks and billionaires in 5 star hotels until they "returned" billions of dollars ?
Also a friend used to work in the middle east, it doesn't matter what the law or religion says...they do whatever the fuck they want, the drink, eat, and chase after women. My friend was blonde and quite pretty, she was followed by cars more than a few times.
|by Anonymous||reply 38||10/12/2018|
This investigation won't stop. Jamal comes from a very wealthy family. Jamal is cousin to Dodi Fayed, Princess Diana's boyfriend that died along with her in the limo crash. The irony is Jamal's uncle Adnan Khashoggi was a billionaire arms dealer with ties to the U.S. whose name came to fame during the Iran Contra scandal.
Jamal interviewed Bin Laden several times in the 80s and 90s and he was worked for Saudi intelligence services. He knew a lot especially regarding the Saudi royals and 9/11. He was a harsh critic of Wahhabism and was fired from several newspapers in Saudi Arabia for criticizing the clerics and Wahhabism. Jamal was fearful for his life in the past several years. He knew MBS was after him. MBS purged any Saudi royal that was critical of Trump notably Al Waleed Bin Talal who made harsh tweets about Donald Trump.
|by Anonymous||reply 39||10/12/2018|
Iran must be enjoying this. Israel must be worried and wondering how to turn this to its advantage. America must be online shopping.
|by Anonymous||reply 40||10/12/2018|
Trump has worked with Italian and Russian mafioso killers since the 70s so this Khashoggi hit means nothing to a guy like him. Trump only cares about the money of course.
Humanitarian principle is not in his lexicon.
Jared Kushner is also a sneaky devious character and has emboldened Prince Salman to take autocratic rule and crush all opposition. Don't forget Kushner's secret trip to Riyadh days before the Ritz Carlton arrests. MBS is simply acting in the way Trump wishes he could act. Trump would kill or jail all his opponents and squash the free press if he could. He'd be a madman dictator if this wasn't the US
|by Anonymous||reply 41||10/12/2018|
[quote] Humanitarian principle is not in his lexicon
Oh it's not just the Twit. The country will not lose any sleep over the death of an Arab.
|by Anonymous||reply 42||10/12/2018|
R42, indeed but anyone who follows international politics (which excludes 95% of Americans) should be alarmed and concerned by this development and the possibility of a coup/removal or unrest in Saudi Arabia.
Let the Saudi kingdom fall and be ready for 10.00 gas.
|by Anonymous||reply 43||10/12/2018|
R43 It won't fall. There are other royal half brothers, cousins and uncles in the inner circle waiting to kick MbS off the throne who will take his place. But it might become more conservative.
|by Anonymous||reply 44||10/12/2018|
Saudi-American relationship is bigger than Trump or partisan politics. American and the UK have been the patron for House of Saud since FDR. Remember Obama was against the lawsuit attempt by the 9/11 victim families against Saudi government few years ago. If both Bush and Obama can ignored the Saudi antics why would Trump be any different?
|by Anonymous||reply 45||10/13/2018|
But what about the Ivanka Fund and the Saudi $100 million donation???
Won't someone think of the women???
|by Anonymous||reply 46||10/13/2018|
Remember when Trump had to sell a yacht during one of his bankruptcies?
The guy who saved him was the Saudi prince Al-Waleed, the Citibank one, cousin of the bone-sawed Jamal Khashoggi.
|by Anonymous||reply 47||10/13/2018|
[quote]Let the Saudi kingdom fall and be ready for 10.00 gas.
This isn't 1973 any more, R43. The Saudi's can't afford a uniliateral oil embargo or to restrict supply. Oil prices have been low for a decade now, and all of the oil economies are already stressed. In the meantime, the US has increased domestic production to the point where we're a net oil exporter. Cash-strapped Venezuela and Russia and Iran are going to be more than happy to fill any void from the Saudi's.
In the meantime, Saudi is waging an expensive and fruitless war of aggression against Yemen that further exacerbates their need for cash.
|by Anonymous||reply 48||10/13/2018|
Interesting and relevant nugget:
Saudi Arabia was founded by Saud who united various tribes in 1932. Oil was discovered in 1938. He had 20+ wives and 100+ children. Of these 45 were sons. Of them 6 have followed Saud as king, one half brother after another. So obviously there is no primogeniture as in European royal families.
MbS is the son of the current king Salman who has Alzheimer's. MbS put his own mother under house arrest to become crown prince.
His power grab will move the monarchy to the next generation: that of Saud's grandchildren.
It also means he has no more right to the throne than any of his uncles or brothers or cousins.
|by Anonymous||reply 49||10/13/2018|
MBS's "reforms" are superficial bullshit. Let women drive while arresting women who speak up publicly. See?
Happily, the House of Saud is a snake pit as a family. MBS killed, kidnapped, tortured and held his own family and friends prisoner in the Ritz Carlton where he extorted money from them.* They will eventually kill him and take back what he took, or the next one in power will keep it all - for a while. This is why any relations with the House of Saud must be more distant than Trump and Kushner can handle.
|by Anonymous||reply 50||10/13/2018|
I think that Mohammed bin Nayef, who was Crown Prince until MBS had him ousted, could quietly amass support and remove MBS. He worked with the US for years until he was removed. But there is a large number of senior royals who are very unhappy with MBS and his proposed changes. If some of the more important tribes begin to feel that their cash streams are threatened, then they will withdraw their support as well.
The only thing holding the country together are large cash payments from the coffers of the House of Saud to all the tribes. Once King Salman dies who knows what will happen. As long as he is alive, I don't think that anyone will move against MBS.
|by Anonymous||reply 51||10/13/2018|
My uncle worked off and on in Saudi Arabia for years, and he said the whole country should just be nuked into glass.
|by Anonymous||reply 52||10/13/2018|
33 year old MBS enjoy the support of the country youth ( 70% of the population is under 30 ) and the military. Its not easy to oust him without external support.
|by Anonymous||reply 53||10/14/2018|
I feel like in the end they should have allowed Saddam to march in there. It would actually be a freer society because of it.
|by Anonymous||reply 54||10/14/2018|
Trump has too many business connections with Saudi Arabia to let America pass any sanctions. Just like with Russia, if Congress passes anything, he’ll just ignore it
|by Anonymous||reply 55||10/14/2018|
Is there anything even a little bit good about that family? They seem to be rabidly evil from beginning to end.
|by Anonymous||reply 56||10/14/2018|
The Arab monarchies don’t follow primogeniture, where the eldest son gets the throne. This, the sons have to usually fight amongst themselves to win the throne. The current guy killed his way to the throne and the next can do the same tomorrow.
|by Anonymous||reply 57||10/14/2018|
It’s amazing that we still lick the asses of the Saudis even after they funded. 9/11. Nearly ALL the hijackers were from Saudi Arabia but, at first, Saudis in America were exempt from having to report to the FBI/INS. It wasn’t until there was public outrage that Bush changed that rule.
|by Anonymous||reply 58||10/14/2018|
They are desert tribesmen who were under the Turks. As desert tribesmen with no water to bathe in they are probably cut. As once under the Ottomans, they probably have the brains of dust bunnies.
|by Anonymous||reply 59||10/14/2018|
It's unclear whether the under 30s support him beause people are too scared to say what they really think about anything.
|by Anonymous||reply 60||10/14/2018|
What have the two religious forces said? The wahabbis and the other one. Where do they stand
|by Anonymous||reply 61||10/14/2018|
Crown Prince is a millennial himself and his plans to ease up on the gender restrictions and give women driving rights is popular with the youth.
What isn't popular with Sauds is the war in Yemen, his war on the press, his arrests of his own royal family, and his bosom buddy relationship with Donald Trump/Jared Kushner.
|by Anonymous||reply 62||10/14/2018|
Iran will prevail. Arabs can never be united and are their own worst enemy.
|by Anonymous||reply 63||10/14/2018|
Why are Arabs such psychos?
|by Anonymous||reply 64||10/14/2018|
Same as Christians and Jews. They all have that our one true god thing going on. Islam takes it a step further and actually calls for killing those who don't agree. Christian Arabs are fine fine fine. Dated one.
|by Anonymous||reply 65||10/14/2018|
I've known some Coptic Christian Egyptians and Christian Lebanese, and they were all lovely people. Muslim Egyptians and Muslim Lebanese? Well...........that's another story.
|by Anonymous||reply 66||10/14/2018|
Remember when the Saudi crown prince paid for a gay wedding at the Plaza?
What was so important in March that this man ruling a country for his supposedly dottering dad HAD to be in NYC?
|by Anonymous||reply 67||10/15/2018|
oh, and congratulations, boys!
|by Anonymous||reply 68||10/15/2018|
So the Saudis went in with mops and disinfectant before the Turkish investigators arrived. A staging of a sham investigation? Why?
|by Anonymous||reply 69||10/16/2018|
And now the Turks have found the place freshly painted over. Egads!
|by Anonymous||reply 70||10/16/2018|
And the Saudi consul has fled the country:
"But, according to Turkish media, Mr al-Otaibi left Turkey on a commercial flight bound for Saudi Arabia hours before his official residence was due to be searched."
|by Anonymous||reply 71||10/16/2018|
The world we live in.
|by Anonymous||reply 72||10/16/2018|
This is straight out of a political thriller.
|by Anonymous||reply 73||10/16/2018|
I wonder what MbS mom is thinking. He'd put her in house arrest as she didn't think he was any good. And his dad came to the throne already with dementia. You can't make this shit up r73!
|by Anonymous||reply 74||10/16/2018|
[QUOTE]Remember when the Saudi crown prince paid for a gay wedding at the Plaza?
I wouldn’t be surprised if MbS made that gay couple have sex in his hotel suite while he sat in the dark and watched as a condition of payment for their wedding. You can tell he’s the type.
|by Anonymous||reply 75||10/16/2018|
Don't Fuck with the Saudis
|by Anonymous||reply 76||10/16/2018|
The Turks used to rule Saudi Arabia, which has been the kingdom it is now only for 70 or 80 years. They have no respect nor fear of them. They'll fuck with the Saudis even if the US cowers.
|by Anonymous||reply 77||10/16/2018|
Good, R77, that means we'll all be hearing those Turkish tapes of exactly what happened, no matter how many lies the Saudis and Trump and White House Ken and Fake Pompeo tell.
MBS is fucking busted.
|by Anonymous||reply 78||10/17/2018|
Political and religious dissidents, apostates and free-thinkers are killed all the time in islamic countries, sometimes hacked to death on the street, no on is ever punished. Why is this case so fucking different?
|by Anonymous||reply 79||10/17/2018|
He's a permanent American resident, R79. He's a journalist for the Washington Post. He's a Khashoggi.
He's not some random guy hacked to death in Saudi Arabia. Jamal Khashoggi has powerful friends. This happened in Istanbul, in Turkey. The Saudis can't go around slaughtering whomever they want, whenever they want, especially not a PERMANENT AMERICAN RESIDENT you fucking moron.
MBS will have to go. This is unconscionable and if he wasn't such a spoiled brat/fucking moron, MBS would have known that before he arranged it. He's out of control, he's a danger on the world stage, he is destabilizing the relationship between the United States and Saudi Arabia. MBS must be removed.
|by Anonymous||reply 80||10/17/2018|
[quote]He's out of control, he's a danger on the world stage, he is destabilizing the relationship between the United States and Saudi Arabia. MBS must be removed.
But he's my soulmate.
|by Anonymous||reply 81||10/17/2018|
|by Anonymous||reply 82||10/17/2018|
Suck it up, White House Ken, go pick another, thinner, younger Saudi prince to take his place.
|by Anonymous||reply 83||10/17/2018|
Har har har!
|by Anonymous||reply 84||10/17/2018|
R80 go fuck yourself.
|by Anonymous||reply 85||10/17/2018|
Trump sure picked a bad time to get stuck in an such an overtly icky moral quandary. To have public opinion start to sway against him even amongst conservative hard liners - right before mid-terms. Niice.
|by Anonymous||reply 86||10/17/2018|
Is quandary really the right word?
|by Anonymous||reply 87||10/17/2018|