Everything You Know About Obesity is Wrong

This article is an exhausting read. It reads more like a Fatties Anonymous session than a magazine article. And, like the majority of huffington post articles, it has no payoff. You spend 20 minutes reading about a bunch of people whining about how they're fat and their doctors won't help them. What are we supposed to do about that? And if they think it's bad now, wait until the government tries to implement Medicare For All. Nobody's doctor will give them any time. You'll be passed off to a nurse or physician's assistant.

I wonder how much of the problem is created in childhood.

You occasionally see a fat five-year-old, and the deck just seems stacked against them for life. But quite often the parents do have appalling eating habits. So, maybe preventable.

R2 last week I was driving past a grade school and saw a mom walking with a kid who looked to be about 9 maybe 10 years old but was absolutely enormous, the poor kid could barely move his legs to walk. Yet there was mom feeding him Tim Bits as he took drinks off a bottle of Pepsi.

The fault is with Big Snack and Big Soda. They are the cigarette companies of today, designing food to be seductive and addictive.

^ And meat, dairy and oil.

For extra money I took a night job cashiering at a local grocery store. I couldn’t believe the shit people bought for their kids to eat. Tons of sugary juices, chips and “healthy” snacks consisting of overly sweet yogurt, frozen chicken nuggets and hot pockets.

r5 meat and dairy is not evil. Big soda and snack are.

If you moderately eat meat and dairy it wont make you fat. Sodas, snacks and sugary treats are addicting and even in moderation they arent good for you.

i live in Europe, and i'm always shocked by what average americans choose to eat. I know there are many socio-economical reasons for that, but to me it seems americans can't survive 15 minutes without consuming some hugely fattening "snack".

Although the obese individual is also responsible. One can say no to Big Snack and Big Soda.

Big Soda, Big Snack, and the American need for immediate gratification + lack of self-control.

"Tigress Osborn, the director of community outreach for the National Association to Advance Fat Acceptance". Is this an episode of Portlandia?

Please do not mock Ample-Americans, R12.

Here's how to solve the problem: put Melissa McCarthy in more high profile movies!

We treat obesity as the problem when it's just the symptom or expression of the problem. Find the core reason why the individual is obese, deal with the problem, solve it, close that chapter and then help the individual to lose weight and maintain a more healthy life.

The differently weighted.

Yes, food is different today than it was even 50 years ago. It's destroying our gut biomes. The fat people you see today are just the canaries in the coal mine. They are more sensitive to the ravages of GMOs, artificial/processed foods, and harmful chemicals we all consume every day. Modern day genetically modified grains and sugar are the biggest culprits. They are highly addictive drugs for many people. Until we get back to eating real, whole foods that haven't been fucked with, we're doomed.

R17’s post was better than the article.

R17 is right on the money

I haven't read Huffington Post in years. Cripes was that tiresome!

It sure was, r20. I needed to start my next dozen Krispy Kreme to stay awake.

[quote] Yes, food is different today than it was even 50 years ago. It's destroying our gut biomes. The fat people you see today are just the canaries in the coal mine. They are more sensitive to the ravages of GMOs, artificial/processed foods, and harmful chemicals we all consume every day. Modern day genetically modified grains and sugar are the biggest culprits. They are highly addictive drugs for many people. Until we get back to eating real, whole foods that haven't been fucked with, we're doomed.

Bingo, R17.

Yes, some people are not as active as they could/should be, but that's only a part of the problem.

We still cannot get an accurate listing on how much sugar is in most of the foods we eat on a daily basis! Fuck that. The government is poisoning us.

[quote]The fault is with Big Snack and Big Soda. They are the cigarette companies of today, designing food to be seductive and addictive.

Yes. 100 times yes. Remember that slogan, "Bet you can't eat just one?" I used to think it was just a clever slogan. But no, come to think of it, it's the reality of what food makers are doing with their products. They're deliberately loading up on sugar, spices and flavor enhancers to make people keep craving their products so much that they become addicted. The more they eat it, the more they want.

It wasn't always this way. When I was a kid, food was definitely less flavorful than it is today. Literally, the most "exciting" flavor chips came in was sour cream and onion, and BBQ. That was it. Now, there are literally well over 300 flavors, each one spicier and more loaded with MSG than the next. Ice cream was also pretty bare bones. The most decadent flavor we had was ice cream sundae (walnuts, syrup, banana). Now there's stuff like turtle tracks, birthday cake, crap loaded with huge chunks of candy and cookie pieces.

So, yes, food makers are definitely contributing to the obesity problem by creating items that are so bursting with flavor that people are more inclined to finish a whole bag or container off in one sitting than they might've been 30 years ago. I experienced this myself a few years ago. Lay's always puts out these gimmicky flavor contests every year. One year, it had "Tikki Masala." That was the one that hooked me, bad. As soon as I finished the bag, I'd go, "Wait! Wait! That's it?! No! Impossible! No. I want more, more, MORE!! Gotta get more!!!" To this day, I've never had a snack item impact me that much, where I'd be jonesing for it as soon as I finished.

My take on this is from experience as a dietary counselor. The vast majority of my clients were physically, sexually, or emotionally abused in childhood. This affected their metabolism long before they became obese. The obesity then exacerbated the abuse. Over the ten years I provided this service I only had ONE person who did not have this history and I still believe he was lying to cover his shame.

Good article, OP. It makes a very good point right away: diet plans do not work.

[quote] Big Soda, Big Snack, and the American need for immediate gratification + lack of self-control.

Don't forget satiation.

There is nothing wrong with feeling a little hungry.

If a person gains just one pound each year (as an adult) then 50 yrs later they are 50 pounds heavier. It is very easy to gain a pound in a year, since metabolism slows as you age. That’s why it’s a life long battle even for moderate eaters.

R9, I am in the United States and have traveled through most of Northern, Central, and Southern Europe and I am surprised at what most people in North America eat. Growing up I was surprised at how a lot of people in North America eat way too much meat in huge portions, and do not eat fruit and vegetables, and do not exercise.

But not EVERYTHING we know about obesity is wrong!

r2, I think you're on to something. You see so many fat kids nowadays. I truly think kids are consuming too much not only high caloric, but fake processed foods that by the time they're 12, their metabolisms are ruined permanently. Its sad.

Funny thing is, kids called me fat when I was a kid (80s).

But I look at my photos now? I'm pretty fit compared to most of today's kids. Taller and thicker, yes, but not even remotely fat.

SOMETHING has changed in the last 30 years.

Oh, shut it R24. I am obese and I was not abused in any way. I had an idilic childhood. Great parents and siblings. Lots of love and support. This is a PHYSICAL problem with our brains, guts and endocrine systems that have been irrevocably altered by Frankenfoods---starting in the womb with what our mothers ate.

BTW--I am a food addict. But there are other addictions that I am not affected by in the least. Alcoholics can not last a day with a bottle of vodka in the house. I've had one on the shelf for years collecting dust. Does that make me a better person than an alcoholic? Morally superior? Stronger willed? No. It just means I'm lucky enough not to be addicted to alcohol. That's the only difference.

The difference between food and other addictive substances is that one cannot give up food completely and moderation is hard for any addict.

^^Exactly. Not only that, eating unhealthy foods is sanctioned by our culture. Indulging in drugs and, to a lesser extent, alcohol are not. You can give up drugs and alcohol and you will be applauded for doing so. But try to go to a family Thanksgiving dinner and refuse to eat most of what's being served because it could kill you. See how well that goes over.

I doubt a contributor to the Huffington Post knows what I know about obesity.

Unless you were a client of mine, R24, and I doubt it, I'll continue to talk about the correlation I've seen in my practice. I stopped not that long ago because people became far too offended when you questioned the type of food they ate.

The refusal to treat the whole person - mind, body, and soul - is why so many therapies fail. I had good success and some failure with people losing weight and it mostly involved getting exercise along with sensible eating habits coordinated to their lifestyle.

It's not just one thing, but you can believe it if you choose. Emotional eating is most definitely a thing and it's got a source.

I found it interesting that they paid those using food stamps an extra 30 cents for every healthy item they purchased. Why are things like chips, soda, sugary snacks even allowed to be purchased when you use food stamps? It's seems if you allow an outside agency to provide you with money to buy food, the outside agency should be allowed to stipulate what food is purchased. I know healthy food costs more than processed junk food and the recipient would get less food, but why is that a problem? Nobody addressed how large the portions sizes are now, way more food than anybody needs to consume at one sitting. If perhaps food stamps were tied into a dietary re education program for the entire family, you can have the kids learn what healthy eating patterns should be before they get too ingrained in the unhealthy ones. Physical activities like jumping rope should be highlighted to illustrate you don't need a gym or to even leave the yard to get exercise. Nobody wants to be fat.

I’m on board with the gut biome thing, for at least part of the problem. There are other factors, of course.

And what does the author of the article envision will be the humane solution? It seems that the ideal “solution” is actually acceptance that there’s not a PROBLEM.

I’ve heard the same thing said about cancer treatment; future generations will look at our current treatments and find them cruel and barbaric. But obesity isn’t the same thing as cancer.

Okay I’m rambling so signing off.

Please. All I know is that there were no fat people in concentration camps. Reason? Denied food. It's all about EATING!

Food companies not only add sugar/sweeteners, salt, oil, and flavor enhancers, they are stripping nutrients from foods.

People overeat, but they are still hungry because the food they eat does not have any nutrients left.

The gut biome is most certainly a factor, and my theory is that the rampant use of antibiotics during the 50's and 60's destroyed or deteriorated the gut environment and limited the body's ability to absorb nutrients. Now you're always hungry, starving in fact, because the body keeps demanding nutrition. What do we eat that will satisfy this constant craving? More empty calories without nutrition.

Bait and Switch 101.

He starts off with interesting stories about scurvy and seat belts and asbestos and claims we actually know how to cure obesity ... and then dozens of compelling portraits of overweight people... a line or two about diets not working ... and ZERO FUCKING CONCLUSION!!

Nowhere in the article does he explain how or why we are know the cure to obesity, or even talk to someone who thinks they have a cure or a path beyond "fat acceptance."

Typical HuffPo crap.

Gaining weight is a natural inclination designed to ward off starvation but it has no shut off valve.

r38 = Angelina Jolie

I agree about biomes and GMOs and crap food.

I was lucky that my mother was sort of hippie-ish back in the 70s and we always ate non-processed foods. As in snacks were almonds or apples or strawberries, no junk food in the house, no soda, just water with meals--and I've always eaten like that too and my weight has always been pretty stable.

All those chemicals and carbs can't be good for you, though I'm not sure that makes people eating low or regular calorie diets 300 lbs.

^^I also think the fact that she wasn't a fanatic helped too. So we had ice cream and cake and cookies and Coke, but occasionally, not with every meal.

[quote]Yes, food is different today than it was even 50 years ago. It's destroying our gut biomes. The fat people you see today are just the canaries in the coal mine.

And the fat people we saw 50 years ago were ....?

Antibiotic use in the 50's and 60's destroyed the gut biome.

…..extremely fucking rare!

The food industry sells food that makes us sick and the pharma industry generously offers drugs that help to ease the pain of our food related illnessses. You think you save some money when you buy cheap (fast) food? You pay much, much more in the end when you lose everything to pay the expensive hospital bills, because the food fucked up your immune system and made way for cancer and other shit to spread in your body attacking organs like the liver.

Growing up I used to eat home cooked meals that were minimally processed, even though both of my parents worked. We were allowed to eat some candy or dessert after regular meals and we always had a big bowl of fruit in the kitchen for snacking.

Sometimes my dad would take us to a nice upscale restaurant for dinner. Fast food or sodas used to be a special “bad” treat for birthdays or other occasions.

There was no mindless eating in front of the TV, no snacking on unhealthy foods, and most of our food did not come out of a box.

What this has taught me is that eating healthy and minimally processed foods with the occasional treat and in moderation is the way to stay slim.

R36, healthy unprocessed food is absolutely cheaper. It’s just that people don’t know anything about nutrition or cooking from scratch AND junk food tastes better than an apple, when that’s what you’re raised on.

I am fortunate enough to be a good cook and knowledgeable about nutrition so when we were really broke, I was able to cobble together nutritious and tasty meals. Frozen store-brand veg, manager’s special meats, eggs, lentils and spices.

It seems like insurance should pay for a fat camp where people could be taught how to enjoy fruits and vegetables. If you eat them enough, you start to crave them. A person could be taken off sugar if given a few months.

I love this article

The Metabolically Unchallenged

When I was a kid, one fat boy in school and I felt sorry for him. Even as a 6 year old I could see that the mother was too involved in his life...what was going on? His mom refused to let him play with me, even though we were neighbors.

Most people I know won't touch a vegetable unless it's deep fried or smothered in a fatty sauce and in a much, much smaller portion than the huge cut of meat and cheesey/buttered carb that they are having (and have second helpings of, before they have dessert).

I gain weight just looking at what people around me eat. The contents and the portion sizes are frightening.

Where do you live R56?

The woman whose photo appears in OP's post and who is featured in this article, Corissa, is a messy youtube vlogger who until quite recently was still living with her ex-husband whom she never married after they broke up and he transitioned along with her new non-binary girlfriend who is at least 10 years younger, uses "they" pronouns, and matches Corissa's size except in height. Corissa posts under "Fat Girl Flow" and her partner "J" goes by "Comfy Fat." Corissa has complained about breaking TWO beds because of her size, has shamed other vloggers who lose weight and post about it, calling them damaging to the body positivity community, and regularly vlogs herself and her girlfriend driving around without their seatbelts on (size related, obviously). She's simply a gross human completely unrelated to her weight.

R46 They were pigs. Same as today's fattties. Pigs

One thing I can't stop eating, once I start, are cheese puffs like Cheetos. All major brands of cheese puffs are full of chemicals and MSG. So I bought this bag of organic cheese puffs online, no MSG, less sodium, no orange color, real cheese, organic white cheddar. Long story short, I ate a small amount and didn't want more. Weeks later I found the bag in the cabinet stale as can be. It's the shit in the name brand products that makes them addictive to me. The same kind of product, made with real food I can take or leave, but I guess mostly leave. So I have to just keep away from them or once in a while just buy one of those one portion bags for 50 cents. Only they leave me craving the big bag, so no, I have to just stop buying them.

I'm good with sweets. I can take a bite, cake or candy and it's enough, but damn those salty, crunchy things, especially those puffs. There is never enough. I can eat my way through a mountain of them if I let myself.

R35, people had just as much childhood abuse 100 years ago. Much more so in fact. But take a look at photos of ordinary Americans back then. Obesity was very rare. And they didn't slavishly work out, weigh their foods, or.....God forbid, have to endure banal lectures from sanctimonious "Nutrition Counselors". They ate food that was available to them when they were hungry. That's it.

Something has changed in our food supply and it's deadly. And all the dullards on this thread who think they have all the answers make me laugh. The greatest minds on the planet can't figure out how to solve this. You sure as hell can't.

The picture of the spokesmodel is so, so wrong. I'd rather look at an oversized ham or turkey.

Try this one, R62:

R61, what “greatest minds” are analyzing our food supply?

I’m sure that most processed food is crap, which is why people shouldn’t eat it.

And nobody gets fat because they eat 2 pounds of steamed vegetables a day. People get fat from eating fatty and sugary processed food, and fast food.

The article talks about one woman eating a yogurt and some Ritz crackers to lose weight. She needs to learn how to eat real food and stay away from the processed junk. Who the hell eats Ritz Crackers to lose weight? She probably eats that one day and stuffs her face the next day because her body is hungry and screaming for nutrients and real food.

People who are obese, eat too much. End of story.

Stop stuffing your face with processed crap and never drink pop. As Michael Pollan said, "Eat food, not too much, mostly plants."

No pity for Sniffleupaguses sitting next to me on the plan with their udders and hooves wedged into my ribs. It’s always the hallmark of the Flight from Hell (™) when one of these mouth breathers moos how they “have to have” the aisle seat I paid for. I refuse. I paid for it. They’re always in the middle seat; they should be in 2 seats due to weight and size. I’ve been on flights where these circus freaks have demanded two seatbelt extensions. Da fuq? On one flight to Orlando, several Heft ly Hos had to be “deplaned” when they ran out of extensions. Chris P. Jeebus on Toast.

The Chiub-akas have tried to get pre boarding ahead of people in wheelchairs, demanded upgrades to business and first because the coach seats were too small.

totally out of fucks to give. Most years, I fly between 100 to 200k miles per year and the fatties are the only group who are a problem.Well, schoolgtoups on overnight international flights are worse. But fatties? Fuck. I pay to upgrade every seat on every flight on my primary carrier to reduce my chances of being someone’s sweat absorber. I keep disposable shower wipes (“Dude”) in my carry on bag so I can get rid of the fat stink.

Sound hostile? Try six hours with a sweaty ham hock in your rib.

The statement about patients being treated deficiently if they are seen mostly by nurses and physician assistants, instead of mostly by physicians, is wrong and is insulting to the skills and knowledge of non-physician medical professionals.

I had a heart attack last month and spent a week in the cardiac ICU. The skill and professionalism of all of the people who treated me and cared for me was outstanding. True, it was ultimately the cardiologist who brought me back from the brink of death, but once he did, I was cared for impeccably by everyone.

I was lucky to have good medical insurance. And yes, I am a fat frau, and now I'm attending 'boot camp' with exercise physiologists and nutritionists.

The statement that 'something' has changed about our food in the last 30 years is right, but no one has found the 'magic bullet' yet. Gulping down fish oil capsules? There's no overwhelming evidence of its effectiveness. Although most of the doctors I've seen in the last 15 years have recommended Omega-3 supplements, I've also been told that it may not be such a great idea because the FDA does not regulate nutritional supplements, and thus there is no standard testing institution to confirm that there the advertised dose is actually present, or that there aren't impurities present.

Aspirin at 81 mg/day has been accepted for a long time, but then there was a recent study saying that 'healthy' people don't need it, so it could be superfluous or counterproductive.

Gut biome is an interesting concept, but the field is too new and too vast to make conclusions at this point. I became fascinated with this a few years ago, to the point where I was making my own sauerkraut, but ultimately I was still having GI problems while pounding down the kraut, yogurt, and acidophilus supplements.

There were some interesting articles about the question of whether contemporary commercial bakeries were producing frankenfood loaves of bread because there is no longer slow-rising bread. I decided to experiment with this because I'm a type-II diabetic, and I was maintaining a sourdough starter, making my own slow-rise bread, but ultimately eating that was still raising by blood sugar just as much as eating regular commercial bread did.

Probably the worst thing I was doing for myself was my addiction to Diet Coke, but now that I'm weaning myself off of that, I don't expect to suddenly become svelte.

R67, read about the Esselstyn diet. No gimmicks, just real food.

My partner’s father switched to this diet after his heart attack a few years ago and has been doing well since then. He was not very overweight before his heart attack and in decent physical shape, but he’s lost weight without trying since he changed his eating.

This sounds promising.

Sarah is famous.

I would guess that many people eat more than 2,500 or 3,000 calories (or more) a day with the large portion sizes they eat as well as sweets and snacks. No wonder they are overweight. I think if they would be honest and count their calories, they would be shocked. They have to relearn how much and what to eat. Then they have to get off the couch and move.

For realz R66?

I fly a little less than you do-- 50-75K miles but have only been sat next to a seat-extender needer once. Most of them seem to know they need two seats or a first class seat.

I've always wondered what companies are legally required to do about that.

He types fat.

Here's what I know for certain without any hesitation or equivocation. When you consume more calories daily than you burn, you gain weight. When you continue to do this over months and years, you become obese. Obesity leads to all sorts of health complications, some of which make losing weight even harder.

However, the root cause for obesity is consuming too many calories, especially too many empty calories with no nutritional value.

Put the fork down, fatty.

Lord have mercy. The only thing that causes obesity is eating too goddamn much. It’s not any more complicated than that. I’m obese, and I have no one and nothing to blame for it besides myself. I eat too much and that’s why I gained weight.

Corporations (Big Whatever) didn’t make me do it and GMOs (everything that humans have ever grown is literally a GMO) didn’t do it. Just stop eating so much and you will lose weight. Yes, it’s easier said than done, and I find it extraordinarily difficult. My metabolism is messed up, and that doesn’t help, but stop with the bullshit.

People don’t understand that you will gain weight if you eat more calories than your body needs. You can eat 50-100 calories more above your daily caloric need and you will gain weight. This is not complicated and doesn’t require extensive scientific research.

It’s easier to control your intake than to “burn off” calories, unless you’re Michael Phelps. Most people overestimate calories burned during workouts.

Also, most people who are obese don’t eat the right foods, which can lead them to think that they eat very little. And they’re not wrong or “lying”. You can eat 2 pounds of steamed broccoli for 300 calories or you can eat 2 Reese’s cups or 2 TBSP of olive oil for 240 calories.

I get comments about being genetically gifted all the time, because I’m skinny. I’ve noticed that when I try to explain that there’s no magic secret or genetic miracle in my case, some people get very defensive because they have the mindset that they can’t lose weight. Everybody can lose weight, but it requires being honest about caloric intake and changing their “diet” aka lifestyle for life and not for a few weeks on the latest trendy diet.

Sorry for writing a book here, but it’s such a frustrating topic. The solution is so simple, but because we have this huge industry trying to sell us junk and fast food, diet foods and pills, and medications to help with illnesses that are caused by obesity, we seem to be unable to understand that the solution is not some miraculous cure that is yet to be discovered, but it’s already readily available at your local grocery store.

“As a kid, I thought that fat people were just lonely and sad—almost like these pathetic lost causes. So I want to show that we get to experience love, too. I’m not some 'fat friend' or some dude's chubby chasing dream. I'm genuinely happy. I just wish I'd known how possible that was when I was a kiddo.”— CORISSA ENNEKING (woman pictured in OP's post)

Except that Corissa regularly vlogs about being too depressed to get out of bed and recently made a video where she talked about getting a massage for her low back pain and the masseuse suggested she start wearing a maternity belly band for her massive gut; she's not pregnant. And, as stated above, she puts her messy personal business out online for the word to see. So how "genuinely happy" is she and the others featured in this dumb article?

I work in the nutrition business, for a healthy food company. What I've learned is quite simple: if people eat mostly fruits, legumes, and vegetables, along with whole grains - ie: a whole food diet - they will lose weight. If they eat lots of meat, dairy, and the like, they will gain weight.

We have a (free) program for overweight people who will follow this diet and the results are pretty amazing: anyone who sticks to the menu loses weight. It's really that simple.

But no one wants to believe it. At least, not in a country with junk food and meat and dairy industries making zillions of dollars a year off of keeping people overweight.

I was a fat kid, but learned about nutrition and exercise and have been in shape all of my adult life. All the kids who called me fat in school are morbidly obese.

I worked with an internist who used to hospitalize grossly overweight diabetic patients and fast them for a couple of weeks to prove to them that it was possible for them to lose weight and to get them started on a healthy diet.

What I've learned: from my doctor:

In every single human obesity study you will ever look at ever at all in the history of medical literature, the more protein people eat the better, always, completely, like there's no exception.

R80, where’s that study? Even the picture in your attachment talks about fiber.

r67 Put the carbs down!

R82, why? What’s wrong with carbs?

And, r79, every single one of those patients gained all of the weight back and then some after they stopped starving themselves. All you're doing is proving that the article was correct.

[quote] Gay people like other gay people

Clearly this writer never reads here

Everything R1 said about the article was right. What a waste of time reading that. There's no conclusion or point in the end. Just a long 20 minute read of whining about how difficult it is to lose weight. Yeah, we know.

One of the biggest problems (and it's actually mentioned here) is that it becomes very difficult to keep weight off once you lower calories and lose weight. The article says your metabolism starts changing once you lose as little as 3% of your weight, which is pretty disturbing... but explains why most dieters fail and regain. So the answer is what then? If you can't lose more than 3% of your weight without your body fighting against you, that's pretty self-defeating before you even try. By the way, there's to know what people were eating in those 3% studies. It would be a different story if the food didn't raise insulin levels & cause adaptive thermogenesis (the major reason why people rebound after a diet - not ketogenic but low calorie & carb heavy)

R86, you need fewer calories to maintain 120 pounds than 220 pounds. That’s not a “slower metabolism”, that’s a fact. The way this is worded in the article is confusing.

Also: Good CARBS don’t make you fat. Eat whole grains, whole wheat, and load up on vegetables, food, and fiber. One cup of chicken = 335 calories, zero fiber. 2 pounds of broccoli (carbs) = still 300 calories and 23 grams of fiber.

Unless you’re with the Cattle Farmers Association in Texas, stop pushing a ketogenic diet as a weight loss solution. Loads of cholesterol and fat will not help your heart health or your colon health.

[quote]Also: Good CARBS don’t make you fat. Eat whole grains, whole wheat, and load up on vegetables, food, and fiber.

Did you meant fruit instead of food, r87?

^^^^^mean

R88, I did. Mean, meant, food, fruit.... Typing is hard today. Yeah, don’t load up on “food”, that might not work so well.

The ketogenic diet might work for a person without any heart issues, but to suggest the ketogenic diet to someone who’s obese and has heart problems is like telling them to jump out of a window. Atkins himself had a heart attack the year before his death that he didn’t like to talk about and that he didn’t attribute to his diet. I would love to see his autopsy report.

The problem with keto is the same one that cropped up with low-fat diets.

People have this mistaken idea that they can eat as much as they want so long as there are no carbs in it and not gain weight.

That's just not true.

Fats and protein are supposed to fill you up and so you won't overeat, but plenty of people figure a way around that.

A ketogenic diet can work, is being used by athletes to improve performance, but there's way more to it than just "don't eat carbs"

R61 displays the usual ignorance masked as "it's just common sense" when it comes to food and diet in the US.

Go to any vintage photo blog and you will see tons of large people from 100 years ago -- far fewer than today but not "very rare." Starting in the mid 1920s mothers and maids and society matrons were portrayed in movies by fat women, while fat actors had long careers as character actors. And vintage advertising shows exercise regimes and diet pills date back to antebellum America.

Clearly, weight loss and diet were big concerns 100 years ago, and this didn't all happen recently. But the increased occurrence of obesity is recent and well worth study.

It just seems like we won't get anywhere if people keep saying "well soda was a rare treat when I was a kid and fat people hardly existed until 1975."

R87 - 120 is not 3% of 220. The article says that the metabolism adjusts after 3% of body weight loss. That is not due to a smaller body. It's due to changes in metabolic pathways from reduced food intake. Specifically in the article:

[quote]As early as 1969, research showed that losing just 3 percent of your body weight resulted in a 17 percent slowdown in your metabolism

This happens when you go from 220 to 213.

R91 - Ketogenic dieters usually count calories more carefully than most people because they have to ensure that they are getting over 60% of their calories from fat. Most people on keto (if they're doing it right) eat from a spreadsheet, every day - or you can't possibly do it all in your head. The suppression of insulin cannot be ignored, but it is willfully being ignored by people in this thread and most of the medical establishment, contrary to what is actually known about diabetes and obesity. Watch:

Americans eat constantly. Graze all through the day.

R77, I eat a ketogenic diet (good fats, protein and low-carb veg). Quite the opposite of what you recommend.

I’m not saying your way is wrong; just that it’s not the only one. I’m trying to avoid the diabetes that runs in my family, and wind up eating with an eye on the glycemic index. That means most fruits have too much sugar for me.

I’m thin and healthy.

I wouldn't rely on any statistics quoted in that article. It's HuffPo, for fuck's sake, not JAMA. At one point the writer claimed that between 1/3 to 3/4 of overweight people are "metabolically healthy" (whatever that means). Really? Between 33-75%?? That's quite the point spread. It's so large it's practically meaningless.

This thread would be more interesting if people with weight issues would comment. There are so many of you patting yourself on the back for being in shape, you'd think it's an article about how special slim people are.

Let's hear from those who struggle with these issues. They're the ones who can speak from experience, who can tell us what the article gets right or wrong.

BTW, I am slim, so don't go there.

I was talking to a person who had worked for years in a big pharmaceutical company evaluating studies. They have been researching diet and its effect on gut biota and the immune system for decades. The finding she emphasised was how inflammatory omega 6 is on ingestion. The other finding I would like to pass on was that lactose in conjunction with cow immune system products is detrimental. In relation to these points the recommendations were cut out the grains and if eating dairy chose things such as yoghurt and hard cheeses as the lactose has already been digested. I asked her about how she felt about government guidelines and she replied 'they are well meaning but misinformed'. I leave these thoughts here- make of them what you will.

What are "cow immune system products"?

I know two clinically obese individuals out of all my friends, relatives etc. One has gone as far as to have to bariatric surgeries, and prior to that was a devoted vegetarian. However both of these people have childhood pasts that are strictly off- limits for discussion and I am convinced they each experienced their share of extreme abuse. And aside from what I would qualify as "normal" meals I have seen them consume in public, I have seen the pantry cupboards of both: packed to the gills with enough candy, ding-dongs, and chips to convince me their true eating habits were obsessive in nature. As an aside I have two autistic kids who like most with this disorder are HIGHLY exclusive about their eating habits (to the point of regurgitating non-desirable food). One son eats primarily meats and fats, while the other mostly dairy products and carbs ( granola bars, Graham crackers etc.) Which son do you think we are having the weight concerns about despite regular physical activity?

I don't have major weight issues - but I noticed that every time I settle at a weight above my normal baseline, I can NEVER get back to my prior baseline. The 3 percent statistic in the article is cherry picked & just one study from the 60s (agree with r96) - BUT that being said, there is a problem that I've dealt with similar to what is said there. In my early 20s, I was in the low 170s. Late 20s, high 170s. Early 30s, low 180s up to 190 by late 30s. These days, upper 190s and not budging. Is this really age-related metabolic slowdown?

If so - what's even more odd is that I can pig out on pizza, Chinese food, ice cream, or candy (you wouldn't believe how much I can eat) - and then I go right back to my existing weight (once the sodium / water retention is gone).

I can then go on a diet of 1200 calories & run 2 miles a day - and lose 2 lbs after 3 weeks of this....which come back instantly. I really have a strange metabolism. I'm 6'1 so I am now officially "overweight" per BMI, which is irritating. People still claim I am "thin" though, and ask "did you lose weight" which is another thing I can't figure out. I think it's because the fat has migrated to my ass from my face. So my pants don't fit - but I look gaunt now - at 195! And a lot of fat is under the abdominal muscle - the most unhealthy. I lift weights all the time but I am not muscular enough for 195 to mean I am fit. I mostly do it for metabolic benefits (not sure if I am getting any...better than nothing I guess).

[QUOTE]What are "cow immune system products"?

Yeah, what is this?

Grazing all day is actually better than sitting down and eating big meals. The problem is what they are grazing on.

R97, I posted R74. I’m on the lower end of obese. I didn’t read the article (the comments here and the fact that it’s on HuffPo told me all I need to know), but I agree with others that there is no magic spell yet to be discovered that will unlock the secret to losing weight. You just have to stop eating too much.

I gained weight because I ate fast food every day for 15 years. There is no other reason. I got away with it health-wise in my 20s and most of my 30s, but as I approach 40, my blood pressure has started creeping up. I’m smarter about food than I used to be and the fact that they plaster how many calories are in things all over the packages and the fast food menus has helped me tremendously.

R46 Is he going to eat that dog?

Yes, I’ve been seeing a nutritionist and have been learning about healthy snacking. I’ve never been much of a snacker. I would prefer to eat one huge meal a day and be done with it (part of the reason for my penchant for fast food), but that’s really bad for you.

Yea - the calorie info finally being widely available has been a huge help. The innocent muffins at Whole Foods are over 900 calories. I can't even count how many of those I ate over the years without knowing that or even estimating it was remotely close to that. They're so good though.

I mean I would've estimated 400-500 calories, not 950 or whatever they are.

[quote] Ketogenic dieters usually count calories more carefully than most people because they have to ensure that they are getting over 60% of their calories from fat. Most people on keto (if they're doing it right) eat from a spreadsheet, every day - or you can't possibly do it all in your head.

That's the thing chief--few of them are doing it "right" or even giving it much thought.

Look at R95 ("I eat a ketogenic diet (good fats, protein and low-carb veg")

That's what most people call a "ketogenic diet" meaning they think they can eat all they want of "good fats" (and they all have their own interpretation of "good fats" which, top level, is "anything that's not buttercream frosting") and protein and so long as they're not eating white bread and blueberry muffins and cookies then they're okay to eat as much as they want.

You are correct in that people who do a medically prescribed diet to control diabetes do count calories, etc.

My point was just that "keto diet" has come to be an all purpose term for people who don't eat a lot of carbs.

A friend has two sons who have the same eating habits as your kids (no autism, though). The one who wants to eat pasta every day has had weight issues since childhood. The other son could be a model for Hedi Slimane. In their case their father abandoned them when they were little. They were brought up by their mother and their grandparents. They've only recently met their father. Both have emotional problems.

^^Much in the same way that "eating clean" has become this catch-all term that, for many people means "tonight I am not eating anything from a fast food restaurant."

But I've heard people refer to those Acai bowls (which can easily be over 1K calories) as "eating clean" because you know you can't see all the sugar. Or something.

[quote] I can then go on a diet of 1200 calories & run 2 miles a day - and lose 2 lbs after 3 weeks of this

That's crazy!

You should be able to lose way more that two lbs if you are 6'1" and 200# and you'e only eating 1200 calories.

You say you lift weights regularly and then you're adding in the running too?

Something is off.

“ As early as 1969, research showed that losing just 3 percent of your body weight resulted in a 17 percent slowdown in your metabolism—a body-wide starvation response that blasts you with hunger hormones and drops your internal temperature until you rise back to your highest weight. Keeping weight off means fighting your body’s energy-regulation system and battling hunger all day, every day, for the rest of your life.”

The author cites a study from 1969! There have been more recent studies with different conclusions. 1. The metabolic slowdown seems to be temporary. 2. There is no mention of possible muscle loss that could contribute to a slower metabolism. 3. The metabolic “penalty” ranged between 20-100 calories per day in one of the newer studies that I found, which is hardly “battling hunger all day, every day, for the rest of your life.”

I’m not sure what the author’s intention was when she wrote the article. Just give up on weight loss, because it’s so hard? Disregard any established obesity health risks and just be nice to obese people because they can’t lose weight? So many excuses in this Huff Puff piece, and no solutions to the problem.

And yet, R113, she more or less explicitly promises one up front by saying "Years from now, we will look back in horror at the counterproductive ways we addressed the obesity epidemic and the barbaric ways we treated fat people—long after we knew there was a better path."

So what's the better path?

Never offers one up

r101 maybe you're burning glucose instead of fat. If your mitochondria is burning more glucose than fat you will be fatter. If you are on a mixed diet and you eat a bunch more carbohydrates you will immediately raise your respiratory quotient (RQ). Anybody's RQ can be elevated when you feed them more carbs and glucose, because glucose completely controls metabolism and substrate oxidation.

An important contributing factor for obesity is reduced fat oxidation and increased metabolism of carbohydrates.

r72 yeah. it’s a mess and flight crews will tell you stories about the challenges they have. The ATA rules hold any passenger over 250 lbs is required to purchase two adjoining seats. Not many do. You have those who purchase 2 seats, non adjoining and the gate agents will push seats around to accomodate families traveling together. So the large customer suddenly doesn’t have their 2 seats. Fun ensues.

It’s a damn zoo in the air, and it doesn’t matter which airline it is. I try to get 5 am flights now which reduces the likelihood for full flights which mostly occur betwee 8 am and 1 pm. I won’t fly on 757s. That’s a cramped design On Delta, it’s a 3x3. If I have to fly cross country, most of my flights connect through Atlanta, and I try to find flights on 767s where it’s 2x seating on the outside.

The best thing I ever did was go vegetarian when I was 19. It taught me to pay attention to what I ate and that I couldn't just eat what sounded good. As I've aged I've paid more attention to nutrition and eating healthy.

The majority of my life has been on a pescatarian diet, the last six years have been on a vegan diet. I don't have to count calories, I just eat a ton of vegetables and fruits and some legumes.

I'm a 61 year old lesbian with a BMI of 19.5

The second best thing I've done is to take up yoga, it's my fountain of youth.

Unfortunately, I drink too much beer/wine.

R80 is practically insane. The WHO, and every other respected health organization, recommends no more than 7-12 percent of your diet come from protein. Otherwise you are risk for many internal organ issues.

Same here as R117, except the part about being a lesbian. Sorry! Most of my life I've been plant- and occasional fish-based., but I've never really bothered with strict dieting and counting calories. Anyway, I weigh the same now as I did 40 years ago in college. My shirt size has not changed in that time. I don't know the science behind it, but being plant-based just works.

At 75, it is hard lose fat. I did it by counting calories. The age old method works. I proved to myself.

Within reason every food is available, although I am mostly a plant eater.

And my BMI is now 23 where it was way up in 29 range

R101, maybe it’s just simple math and 2 weeks of running and eating 1200 calories per day can’t make up for the excess of calories that you’re eating while binging on junk food? Do you count how many calories you eat on your chest days?

Do you count and measure every drop of oil and every ounce of food that you consume? You’re obviously storing unhealthy fat, and that only happens when you’re eating more calories than you burn.

I need about 2600 calories a day to maintain my weight, and that’s with 5-7 hours of moderate exercise every week. That equals 18K calories per week or 72K calories every month. If I ate 5200 calories for 7 days, I would have consumed more than half of my monthly calorie allowance for the month. I would need to do a lot of running and very little eating to make up the difference and to avoid weight gain. It helps to look at intake over a period of months vs a few weeks.

WHO's recommendations of 7%-10% protein aren't helping the Chinese and Indians lose their diabetes.

I don't take diet advice from anonymous DLers who don't know as much as my doctor does, and who do not practice family medicine. Who's mentioned fat oxidation, glycogen, cellular respiration, HbA1c, waist-to-height-ratio, homeostatic model assessment? Give me the reply numbers (leave mine out).

I didn't read the HuffPost essay, but I'm willing to eat as many grams of simple carbohydrates per day as the number of times the essayist mentions fat oxidation, glycogen, waist-to-height ratio, HOMA-IR, insulin resistance, metabolic disorder or metabolic syndrome, cellular respiration,

The value of nutritional advice is inversely proportional to its distance from advice to eat steak and eggs.

The people I know who switched to low-carb (under 50g net) and eliminated omega-6 fats, refined added sugars, grains and dairy also lost weight, and kept it off. There's more than one way to lose weight and keep it off, and I'm for the method that staves off metabolic disorder, lowering my risk for the most common, and expensive to treat, chronic diseases.

Hilarious! The Huffington Post article is about the cruelty inherent in fat-shaming and the damage it causes in people’s lives and all you bitches can do is trade dieting tips!

What a stupid world.

R122, and yet there is no increase in diabetes in rural China or rural India.

Sedentary lifestyles combined with unhealthy food choices are contributing to the problem as well as more western fast food choices which are higher in protein, fat, and sugar and less nutrient dense than the traditional or rural diet.

Low carb and ketogenic diets do not lead to more weight loss in the long run. Your Dr. Naiman has a nice muscle Mary website with lots of colorful charts and pictures, but it doesn’t do much for me. I prefer data and scientific studies.

R123, this thread has actually been great and informative until you decided to comment. What do you want us to do? Share a box of Kleenex and a bag of Cheetos and cry about fat shaming?

^^^^^ Then the HuffPost editor of the essay, or the OP, miscomprehended the essay and wrote a misleading title for it. The essay should've been titled "We must stop cruel fat-shaming."

Suggestion:

SHUT YOUR PIE HOLE AND PULL AWAY FROM THE TABLE HEIFER!

Fat people should be ashamed. It’s unhealthy and unattractive and with all the information at Americans’ disposal today, there’s no real reason for it.

r124 India has a huge problem with diabetes. So does the Middle East.

Post your picture, R128.

R127 most definitely did not read the article, but wanted to share with us his anger issues nonetheless.

I read part of the article, but it was obviously going nowhere other than, stop fat shaming.

Being fat isn't healthy. Yes, some people are obese and somehow have low cholesterol and normal blood-pressure, but those people are the exception.

I am 5 foot 8 and I am 48 years old currently. On May 1st 2017 I weighted 231 pounds - obese according to the BMI. To lose weight I did the following:

Started counting calories and watching what I ate, usually something along the lines of:

Breakfast - 1 egg fried in a small amount of butter, one ounce of extra sharp cheddar cheese with one sausage link or one slice of bacon on a home made tortilla (about 7 inches - I portion them by weight before rolling them out and they are 100 calories apiece) topped with Salsa without added sugar (Herdez or home made.)

Lunch - Homemade pizza - 100 grams of dough with 1 ounce of mozzarella, tomato sauce without sugar added, four slices of pepperoni, a couple of mushrooms, and a couple of sliced olives

Snack - 1 serving of Cheez-its (I buy the box, portion them out, and put them in a canister with a time release lock on it. The canister unlocks, I take out the baggie, and reset the timer for 24 hours and lock it.

Dinner - A flatbread salad made from a homemade tortilla, 2 ounces of meat (pork loin, chicken breast, ground beef taco meat, etc...) one ounce of extra sharp cheddar, 30 grams of salad dressing (from the refrigerated section - not shelf stable stuff.) Or maybe homemade chili - if I make this I make a batch that will last a week and use one pound of 93% lean ground beef in the batch, so it is mostly vegetables

Dessert - 1/2 cup of light ice cream or four ounces of homemade yogurt with 1 tablespoon of preserves

In addition I stopped driving my car for the most part. When I go to the grocery store I walk. On days I go to the office (uncommon) I walk to the light rail, and take the train to the office, walking again on the other side - this totals about 2.5 miles of walking round trip. I also started walking the dog more. I have to go to the grocery store a bit more frequently, but walking also makes you consider more what you are buying - heavy things like bags of flour, jarred items or milk go in a backpack, and lighter things in a reusable bag.

On May 1st I weighed 168 pounds - 63 pounds lost. I weigh pretty much the same amount, give or take a pound or two right now.

I'll pig out a bit more on holidays, but weight can be lost, and it can be kept off. You have to move more, and eat less.

[quote] I am 5 foot 8 and I am 48 years old currently....Started counting calories and watching what I ate....On May 1st I weighed 168 pounds

How many calories a day do you now normally eat to maintain your new weight (since you track them)?

r132 Excellent weight loss result! I bet you look and feel much better. The time-release lock on the canister sounds brilliant. What would you have titled the HuffPost essay (or, only because the opportunity presents itself for wordplay, "puff piece")?

R133 I try to stay at about 1800 calories on a normal day, or 2000 if I am more active. 1600 if I am less active.

R134 I definitely would have called it something else, because I HATE articles titled with things like Everything You Know About X is Wrong, We Need to Talk about X, and other bullshit like that. Based on the context of the article I would title it "Doctors are Mean to Fat People" With a sub-headline "Scurvy easily preventable."

Honestly, I think the article was largely useless, other than as an "I'm fat and it's been difficult, but now I love myself and all my rolls!" sort of blather that is so typical in web based media these days.

Of course the majority of the posters in this thread are taking raw loads.

The article is wrong on so many levels because all diets work. Eventually. But who the fuck wants to diet?

I thought the author was going to get into gastric bypass with all these "horrible" and "barbaric" ways we treat fat people, medically. But the article had no conclusion whatsoever & a major weight loss method for obese people isn't even mentioned once. The few people who kept their weight off after "The Biggest Loser" had gastric bypass. Many of the others gained it all back.

R99 r102 immunglobulins

Why aren't more people talking this schlock "author" to task on the comments section? I read the whole thing waiting for some type of "solution" and as pointed out, got none.

I can't believe "journalism" has fallen to this low.

[quote] At one point the writer claimed that between 1/3 to 3/4 of overweight people are "metabolically healthy" (whatever that means). Really? Between 33-75%?? That's quite the point spread.

Someone expressed doubt over the claim that 1/3 to 3/4 of obese people are metabolically healthy. The truth is 10% to 25% of obese people are insulin sensitive or metabolically healthy. You can have two people of identical obesity and the person who has overstuffed their fat cells and had adipocyte hypertrophy is going to be inflamed and insulin resistant. But someone who can sprout new little. baby fat cells is going to stay insulin sensitive forever.

Recommendations for obesity treatment should distinguish the metabolically ‘healthy’ from ‘unhealthy’ obese phenotype to identify early the obese person who will benefit the most from losing weight. In addition, novel antiobesity treatment strategies targeting adipose tissue dysfunction are needed.

R141, but the information, as given in the article, is garbage. We are years, maybe decades away from making use of "the metabolically 'healthy’ from ‘unhealthy’ obese phenotype to identify early the obese person who will benefit the most from losing weight." The best we can do now is run an A1c and hope people can make use of the number and adjust their lifestyles accordingly. I consistently work with people who lose eyesight, limbs, and organs to uncontrolled diabetes even though the diagnosis and management are well understood. Articles like this Huffpuff piece do nothing to address currently known risks and treatments for morbid, crippling obesity and its complications.

r142 you and I are not in disagreement; I love you already for using "HuffPuff piece." I had three paragraphs ready to go, one commenting on how the essay and its ilk are mostly garbage, but chose to focus on correcting what I chose to read. My glaucoma and myopia improved when I lost weight -- I take 1/4 as much medicated eye-drops and I can drive sometimes without eyeglasses.

My doctor was tied for third in a global top-ten list of physicians helping their Type 2 Diabetes patients attain the greatest drop in HbA1c (tops were Dave Didden and Mark Cucuzzella) while prescribing a low carb diet.

Any article featuring interviews with someone name Tigress and Cat Pausé has got to be hilarious. Unless they're strippers...

Was this pushed to everyone's iPhone today? I saw it pop up all over other discussion sites too . It was on my phone in the news section for hours...what a shitty article to get so much attention.

Fat people are jolly.

So many excuses! No matter how you slice it, what you weigh is a result of what you eat and how much. As we get older, we have to reduce the number of calories we consume to stay the same weight. It's part of the price we pay for the privilege of getting older. So it comes down to motivation. Food as fuel; not comfort, recreation, a cure for boredom, or a requirement for celebrations. And, here's a thought - parents who starve their kids are prosecuted and have them removed by CPS. Why not treat parents of obese children the same? And I agree with the poster above that junk food should not be on the menu if paid for by the government, along with cigarettes and alcohol. I also agree that obese people should not be shamed, discriminated against or demonized. But neither should the myths that fat people can be healthy, fat is beautiful, fat is another kind of normal, be propagated.

R97 I am overweight by about 15 pounds (BMI of 26) , a couple of years ago I was obese (BMI 36). Personally I agree with the 'eat less move more' thing, as long as you eat enough 'proper' food and keep the junk food to a minimum. I grew up in the 60's and 70's when most people were a normal weight without having to think about it, thats because food was relatively expensive, most people couldn't afford to over eat, and people were more physically active in their every day lives. I've returned to that way of eating, smaller portions of plain food, keeping the 'treats' as an ocassional thing, focussing on eating enough vegetables and walking a lot more. It is a struggle for me though because I put weight on very easily if I don't watch what I eat.

And just to add, the low carb diet doesn't work for me, I just feel constantly hungry if I don't eat bread, perhaps because I don't eat meat or like a lot of fatty food. If low carb works for you then go with it.

I suppose I'm a average fatty. I'm borderline obese, but probably just overweight if I include bone structure. I was a muscular active kid until I got a bad bout of hep A at 9, which slowed me down a lot. After that I was always chubby and occasionally teased about it, but looking at old photos I was probably just at the top end of the healthy weight range.

I learned to live with being a size or two bigger than I should be and didn't obsess about it. Every couple of years I'd notice clothes getting too tight and cut out sweets etc for a few months. Still the weight crept up slowly.

I was more concerned about the arthritis in my knees that started in my late teens and really restricted the kind of excecise I could do. By my early 50's I HAD to do something about the knees as they were very painful and effecting my sleep, ability to work etc. It was crunch time. I did the rounds of GP, physio, rhuematologist, nutritionist, podiatrist, acupuncture and excercise etc. Each medico did their bit to help the knees along, but it was clear I really needed to lose weight if I was to approach old age healthy and reasonably pain free.

So I've been dieting, excercising more, eating healthier etc. Can't say I've had great results. I've managed to lose 7kg over two years and keep it off. But I didn't have a bad diet to start with and I'm not going to starve myself.

I've tried cycling to work, but at 10 miles each way it's a bit too far for my knees, so I'll probably get an electric bike. Hopefully that will get a few more kilos off.

There is no magic bullet, I doubt I will ever be genuinely slim, I just want to be healthy and reasonably pain free, part of that is losing weight.

I just want to wish everyone well in this thread who is taking responsibility for their excess weight and working to do something about it.

It shouldn't surprise me that some people not only didn't read the article, but didn't understand it. R41 says the article claims we know the cure for obesity, but what really happened is he misread what the article said about scurvy. Past medical treatment of scurvy mirrors current treatment of obesity, which is why the author brought it up, but the author did not say we know the cure for obesity.

R51 insists that healthy food is cheaper, but the article not only explains that that's not true, but offers helpful links to studies showing that. Perhaps you should check it out, instead of just assuming that what you believe is the truth.

The people insisting that it's nothing except a matter of calories in obviously didn't read the article either. There are links in the article to studies showing problems with metabolism after weight loss, psychological effects of poor medical treatment, lack of treatment causing problems, etc. and all you idiots want to say is, "just eat less and don't drink pop."

If it was that easy, half of Americans wouldn't be obese. But DLers never want to let go of the idea that they are superior to others, and they generally can't empathize with other human beings either, unless they're all chatting about how great it was to eat in a department store cafeteria in 1958.

[quote]I read part of the article, but it was obviously going nowhere other than, stop fat shaming.

I'm not sure why we're supposed to listen to the opinion of somebody who didn't read the article, but okay.

The article made it clear that medical professionals on all levels using fat shaming actually made the obesity problem worse. They link to studies that said so, it was not simply opinion.

Anyone who claims to care about obesity should be caring about tactics and methods which have been proven to make the situation worse.

[quote]But some DLers never want to let go of the idea that personal responsibility is a myth, that everyone is a hapless, helpless victim, and they refuse to contemplate the possibility that others don't necessarily share their view,

R152 I have read the article, and I disagree with it. I think you'll find a lot of doctors who do as well. As I'm British I find the advice of the NHS quite helpful, which is basically eat 'real' food in the correct portion sizes and do some real exercise, including resistance training. Works for me, and I think it works for most people unless they have complex health conditions.

As for 'fat shaming' there's a middle line between saying 'fatties are disgusting weak willed people' and 'it's not your fault you're fat and in any case obese people can be just as healthy as thin people so it doesn't really matter'. What is wrong with expecting people to take some responsibility for their own health (and parents for their children's health)?

The article implies that issues of self control are closely tied to a sense of self respect, and that overweight people’s low place in society undermines both.

Assertion is that doctors undermine fat patients’ self respect and therefore make it harder for them to lose weight. Raises the question of why it falls to a medical doctor to fluff a patient’s self worth. That’s pretty much the challenge of life - what am I doing and why does it matter. I’d bet a lot of fat people who have trouble resisting food have few to no other sources of enjoyment in their lives - boring job that sucks up all their waking hours, then bitching at their kids & spouse and plopping down in front of the TV with a bag of Doritos.

The lack of civic and cultural life is probably more to blame for obesity than a bunch of medical doctors who see someone with a physical problem & describe the biological way to combat it in insufficiently soothing terms.

"The lack of civic and cultural life"?? Try a simpler explanation. How about the ubiquitous availability of cheap, addictive, high-calorie food and the fact that people use it to reward themselves, cure ennui or self-medicate?

^ I also live in America & am surrounded by nasty faux-food. But I have unrelated ways to reward myself - history, art, music, reading, biking, swimming, travel, talking to people I have nothing in common with, building shit out of wood, volunteering and even the occasional “religious” attempt. I eat anything I want whenever I want and have no weight or “body image” concerns. According to online tool I just found, my BMI is “normal” at 19. The smell of Doritos or McDonalds turns my stomach.

It seems true that addictions are fed by emptiness, loneliness & unhappiness. Disgusting junk food is apparently an addiction like any other. You can’t make the gas station stop selling fucking Doritos, but you can fill your life with pleasure that doesn’t involve them.

R151, I am saying that I have had to feed five people on $20/day (that budget included items like shampoo and toilet paper) in one of the world’s most expensive cities. I was able to do it because I know about nutrition and how to cook. It is very possible to eat healthfully on a budget. We fucking DID.

Maybe if I hadn’t grown up the way I did, I would have bought shitty convenience foods and we’d all be fat. Maybe not everyone has the knowledge and willpower to do it.

Here's something I just want to add to the conversation, asinine as it may be, and related to other issues altogether: Beer doesn't make you fat. I spent the summer eating nothing but halibut poached in tomato / lime / chili peppers, salads, sushi, and other light fare. I also decided to take up drinking copious amounts of beer in order to a) deal with the heat wave in my city, and b) satiate my ongoing need for an alcoholic buzz.

As I said, this is related to other issues. But when it comes to empty calories....I honestly thought I would have a massive beer ass or gut, and I just don't. And I am not naturally thin. I eat incredibly well, I have no car, I walk everywhere, but I have been drinking a LOT.

So I don't think booze makes you fat. It's probably the nasty crap people eat when they're drinking or drunk that is the issue (buffalo wings, nachos, pizza...). So, in sum, I'm not obese, but my pancreas and / or liver are probably going to give out on me in the next five years. Any threads on here someone can link me to?

I agree about the drinking r159. I eat a lower carb diet and drink vodka mixed with la Croix sparkling water. I am still able to lose weight while drinking at least 4 nights a week.

Interesting article on studies on the keto diet. Bottom line: don't do it - it's killing you. Focus on plants.

Ultimately, I think that digestion/metabolism are too complex and specific to individuals to ever be boiled down to simplistic rules allocating diet among protein, carbs and fats. You need to look at overall nutrition and keep away from fad diets.

People on keto / low carb diets eat lots of vegetables. The only vegetable they don't eat are potatoes. Sounds like most of you have no idea what you are talking about.

Potatoes are unfairly maligned. There is absolutely no reason someone should give up potatoes--especially something like Yukon Golds that are roasted and boiled, tossed with garlic and dill and a bit of olive oil. If you're baking Russets and slaughtering them with cheese, chili, sour cream, bacon bits, etc, I promise you.....the potatoes are not the problem. If you peel the skins (perhaps the most healthful part of them) and mash them up with cream, butter, salt, and whatever the fuck else, no, they aren't going to do you any favours. They are nutritious, loaded with nutrients, and can stabilize your blood sugar if you are a carb-craver.

Is it true American meat farmers are allowed to give the animals growth hormones?

I remember my doctor saying to me years ago that he'd observed that babies that had been treated with a lot of antibiotics were more likely to be obese children. This is backed up by current research with points to a gut bacteria /microbiome connection.

I love potatoes!

[quote]So I don't think booze makes you fat.

Give it time, R159.

The article at R161 is a perfect illustration of the problem with fad diets.

The ACTUAL keto diet is quite healthy and encourages people to eat lots of leafy green vegetables, sweet potatoes, etc. as well as protein.

In practice, people think it means "I should only eat meat and cheese and butter" and so it becomes massively unhealthy.

Same way the low-fat thing made people think they could eat entire loaves of bread or boxes of Snackwells because there was no fat in them.

R165 I believe there has been anecdotal evidence linking antibiotics and weight gain for awhile. I've always been convinced that is part of the problem. People who eat meat regularly, particularly chicken, are consuming daily doses of antibiotics and that messes with the gut biome. The increase in obesity has trended along with the increase in chicken consumption. Maybe coincidence, but worrying nonetheless.

My guess is that eventually protein v carbs v fat will come to be seen as largely irrelevant, but that a high-fiber diet is key for weight maintenance.

Yes, R164, cattle in the US are given bovine growth hormone, both dairy and beef cattle. And that could be why 25% of American girls get their period at the age of 8. Now - it could be the hormones are making the girls obese, which makes them produce estrogen and thus menstruate. Or it could be the hormones are making them produce estrogen which in turn makes them obese. In the 1940s, the average age for starting menstruation was 14 and it has come down through the years and is now between 11 and 12.

R171 Jesus. That's disturbing. Is there at least an organic/ non hormone alternative meat industry? Or would one have to go vegan to avoid it?

What about chicken that says hormone free and anitobiotic free? Most Purdue and big brands say that

This may sound naive, but I've always been told really obese people need to eat A LOT just to maintain their weight .

Let's say an avg person weights 175lbs has a daily caloric intake of 2,000 calories. if that person exerts around 2,000 calories day he will basically maintain his weight. yet if she eats 2500 calories a day and exserts 2,000, over time she'll gain wait.

Now take an morbidly obese person, say 400-500lbs.. "Conventional Wisdom" is that he must eat some multiple of 2,000 cals a day just to maintain all that weight. But this person at 400lbs also exerts around 2,000 cals a day, and only eats the same 2,000 cals, as the person above would she remain 400lbs?

I've been part of an on-line Keto group for the past year and the participants results are absolutely astounding: morbidly obese individuals losing hundreds of pounds, type II diabetics drastically reducing if not outright getting rid of their insulin all- together. Even odd inflammation related results such as minor vision improvements and people being able to toss their eyeglasses. I started because I was infirm in bed after a year after a couple of major surgeries- heard protein was important to heal, and didn't want to gain from not being able to move a lot. Not only have I NOT gained, I've lost a few lbs, my skin and hair is glowing (how many patients can say that after 3 surgeries/yr) and all my basi vitals - cholesterol/blood pressure/HR are great. As a totally different aside, my paternal 94 yr. Old grandmother and her kin come from a tiny mostly Indian village in Ecuador called Otavalo. Many there live well into their 100's. Although my grandmother has had her share of ailments she's still plugging- and need I say it-she and her family's diet- beef, butter, and the occasional vino. I do think some things are ultimately in our genes.

Something on Whole Foods, r107.

I read a couple of subreddits devoted to weight loss. There are people that lose an impressive amount of weight counting calories and exercising to make sure that they have a calorie defect.

This woman has lost 128lbs since January doing just that.

R171 makes sense that poorer families would be consuming more growth hormone. Organic meat is expensive.

I'm on a low carb diet myself. I think most if these things do work in the short term.but as the article says. The stats prove that dieting just doesn't work long term.

I want to try low carb as a jumpstart. Any advice on how to start?

R179

I started with an app called MY GI on my phone that tells you the GI ( Glycemic Index) of each food. Keeps blood sugar stable. After that I kind of wentba bit overboard, cutting out all the carbs I could, which made me sick. So now I eat low GI, wholegrain stuff too.

i'm counting calories for the first time in my life with an app called Yazio. I had to shed 10 kg since forever, and being really aware of how many calories i'm ingesting is working... slowly but steadily.

R171, I saw a special on PBS about puberty, and I believe the key factor for the onset of menstruation is weight. Once the threshold of 101 lbs is reached girls start having their period. Stands to reason they weigh more earlier so puberty. Is it pronounced 'poo-berty' or pube-erty?

I think it's puh-BERTIE.

R174 400-500 lb. people aren't eating 2000 calories (and yes, they would lose weight if they did). They are probably eating 4,000 - 6,000 or more a day. They demolish bags of cookies, pints/gallons of ice cream, bags of Doritos, etc. They can't stop eating. 2,000 calories to them would be a starvation diet because the portions would be so small for them.

I'm lighting a cigarette, so a fatty can walk by and make a little cough of shame.

JFK looks ancient there.

Smoking will do that to you.

R117 I aspire to be you one day!

^ with a BMI of 37

Jk

Healthy keto is lots of leafy/above-ground vegetables, some lean meats and healthy fats. Find me a doctor that would advise against that. Find me a doctor that says stable blood sugar levels are shortening my life.

There are keto people who eat lots of cured meats and processed frankenfoods. I can’t defend that.

In my case Keto worked great. I never have taken off so much weight and never felt hungry. I went off the keto diet and then gained a ton of weight so I am back on it. Actually, I am a little lazy with it. I don't pay attention to the numbers but basically avoid carbs when I can. I do eat lean meats mostly because I don't enjoy red meat. Take a look at the posters on the Keto forum on Reddit. They have some amazing results. I assume any diet that limits calories would do the same but keto seems to work for me. Oh, I am not eating slabs of butter either. It is really a normal doet with limited carbs.