Two Brothers

0/10. Not even remotely compelling or true.

There's a difference between screwing up and being a horrible person. If my brother totaled his car and didn't have car insurance, I'd help him out, give him rides, etc. But if he molested children, nope, wouldn't be there for him.

That video is sad and sweet.

I don't think it's about accepting it or understanding what they did - you may not - just comforting a hurting human being you have a long relationship with. And familial love is supposed to be unconditional. You aren't required to help them, just don't abandon them.

My older brother IS a child molestor, or was as a teen and young adult.

I haven't seen him in 30 years, and I don't plan to ever seen him again.

The video is not sweet. Nikolas Cruz should not have survived his criminally psychotic break. He should be given amble opportunities to kill himself, because he won't be able to live with himself and he will waste everyone's time in this limbo. The poor brother.

I would support and love my brother if he had a psychotic break and slaughtered people because my brother has never been a maniac and I don't understand mental illness.

Nicolas Cruz has been a lost cause for years, methodically building up to this spree murder in plain sight of everyone. How horrible is that.

This is tragic. It's beyond sad. Yes, it's beyond sad for those who died as well. But watching these two brothers and the complete despair is heartbreaking. Perhaps he should have killed himself or had the police kill him. His life is over. The demons got to him. The state of Florida will go for the death penalty. The brother is offering his love and support. It's awful that he didn't see this breakdown coming sooner.

I think the brother is doing it more for himself than Nikolas...he can't accept what his brother did it and wants to convince himself that "this is not you"

I want to know who these brothers biological mom is. I am sorry but she needs to be sterilized if she can still have children. Clearly something is not right with the gene pool. Zachary has been caught creeping around the campus after his brother is arrested. This whole story suggests that perhaps nature is stronger than nurture after all. Nicholas looks like a malevolent elf.

That's very disturbing. I have a very fucked up brother as well, who has been in and out of prison. He was a terrible person to me (and the rest of my family) when I was younger. At some point along the way, I realized that he brought nothing but negativity to my life - to say the least. I walked away, and told him to never be in touch again, because our souls were just so different. I ask my mom and dad to not talk about him to me, so I have no idea what he's been doing the last 10 or so years, and I hope I never know. I'm very very surprised he has not murdered or done something like this guy. If my brother had just had theft problems, or drug problems, that might be different, but he has done truly evil stuff, so there is no more bond at all. A brotherly relationship means zero at this point.

R9 do you think he was born that way? Or was he abused somehow early on?

This pisses me off. Nikolas Cruz deserves 17 consecutive life sentences in solitary without visitation privileges. I think of the people over in the "Are you alone" thread who worry about having someone to call if they land in a hospital or leaving their pets to starve if they die alone and no one notices. It's safe to assume that none of them are mass murderers. Fuck this kid. I hope this is the last time he sees his brother or hears a kind word from him or anyone else.

R10 I feel sure he was born that way. We lived together, same circumstances from birth. I can remember when he was barely a toddler, he did weird stuff - was unkind to animals, would giggle at bad things - I remember my mom burning herself in the kitchen and he was laughing. He was outwardly mean all the time. My parents were quite kind, so I think we all wondered where the hell this was coming from. I really think in his case it was an unlucky genetic spin.

R12 that's interesting, but obviously very unfortunate. It's so strange to think of two "normal " people producing someone awful but I guess it does happen. My guess is a brain scan would show something abnormal.

I can't help but feel sorry for him. It was plain as day he needed help for many years. The adults around him failed him as well as all the victims. The story could have had a much better ending. So many lives could have been saved, including Nikolas's. He isn't even 20 years old yet and the rest of his life will be spent in a prison cell. What a waste.

I agree with R11. That murdering p.o.s. deserves no comfort.

It depends on whether you consider the ability to do something like that the result of mental illness or just pure evil.

People have been debating that one for millennia

David and Cameron should get to hatefuck him until he dies, using whatever devices they want.

When I was a kid, my older brother was out riding his bike, and was hit by a car. He spent over a month in the hospital, most of the time in a coma. He's now deaf in one ear, and has a metal plate in his head. He's always been 'off'. My little sister and I spent that time being shuffled back and forth between different neighbors and relatives, having dinner and sleeping in many strange houses. My parents were told that I cried inconsolably, every night, missing my brother. I don't know why: he was always a bully to me. But the bond is that powerful.

When I saw this video, I wasn't expecting to feel any sympathy. But I did, and couldn't hold back the tears. First, I know 19 is legally an adult. But I'm old, so these are just a couple of kids to me. These two kids share the same birth mother, and were adopted by another woman, who then died. So now they were living with another woman. The only blood relatives they know are each other. The shooter will certainly end up with a life sentence, but it looks like his blameless brother is also facing, in essence, a life sentence. I posted the video because I can't make any sense of my feelings about it. Of course, I feel anger, but I see two young guys, one is who is clearly very mentally ill, and the other who's life is bound to his, and that seems so unfair to me.

[quote] one is who is clearly very mentally ill

Mowing down people with a gun does not, a priori, make you mentally ill. "Behavioral problems" are not mental illness. Among other symptoms, hearing voices telling you to kill, having auditory and visual hallucinations, paranoia and delusions, and blackouts and amnesia -- these are signs of mental illness. No mention of these are made when referring to the shooter's past.

As far as his needing help or adults or "the system" failing him, the vast, vast majority of people who face similar situations do not gun down other children. It is neither an excuse nor mitigation for his actions. People are responsible for their decisions and actions - it is not fate, it is not god, and it certainly isn't other people. The shooting was not the result of some spur of the moment decision. At each step along the way, he made very conscious and calculated decisions to purchase the weapons, purchase the ammunition, and MOST damning - hide the fact he was doing it.

He kept his plans quiet. He hid his plans and his intent from other people. Unlike truly mentally ill people, he KNEW what he was doing was wrong and didn't want to be stopped from doing it.

As for the huge crocodile tears of contrition - he's suddenly mentally healthy again? How exactly is he being treated while in prison such that he now fully understands the enormity of his transgressions? What possible leaps in mental health treatment must he have taken in order to go from shooting up a school to full knowledge and contrition in such a relatively short period of time? I don't buy it. I think he's sad - sad that he's in jail. However, I don't believe he's all that sad he killed a bunch of people.

Nikolas is adopted? Is he from Russia? A lot of those kids are very difficult and grow up to be really messed up.

R19 your profile is false. That asshole publicly said he would become a school shooter and it was reported and he was interviewed by the FBI!!!!!!! At which point he must have disavowed his plan. But he didn't hide his degrading mental health and sometimes did predict his crimes to come.

[quote][R19] your profile is false. That asshole publicly said he would become a school shooter and it was reported and he was interviewed by the FBI!!!!!!! At which point he must have disavowed his plan. But he didn't hide his degrading mental health and sometimes did predict his crimes to come.

Your facts regarding the FBI are wrong, according to news sources such as CNN who provide a timeline of events. The FBI were not able to determine who he was before the shooting though two tips were reported.

And again, if his crocodile tears are so authentic, he must have received stupendous mental health treatment in prison that allows such significant progress in such a short period of time. His case should be studied by all mental health experts to instruct them on how to cure such severe mental health problems.

Do you honestly think people are all good or all evil? Some part of him may very well regret what he did, and the tears are authentic, even if they are for himself.

As far as mental illness goes - I don't think anyone who can kill a bunch of people like that is fully sane. It doesn't mean I think he should be treated as a mental case and is innocent of his actions, but I don't think evil is a sane condition.

[quote]Do you honestly think people are all good or all evil? Some part of him may very well regret what he did, and the tears are authentic, even if they are for himself.

Of course, no one is all good or all evil - that is the silliest question and worst rhetorical contrivance used in any discussion. Well, sure his tears probably are authentic - for himself and maybe his brother. But contrition or remorse for the people he killed or the lives of the families and friends he's affected- very doubtful.

The notions of "evil" and "good" have little relevance. They are labels with limited value used as shorthand, but don't provide any meaningful taxonomy for categorizing actions.

R24 you're the one throwing around absolutes like you know exactly what he's thinking and why. I'm making the point that it isn't necessarily as black and white as that.

[quote][R24] you're the one throwing around absolutes like you know exactly what he's thinking and why.

No one knows what he's thinking, including you. However, it doesn't take a genius to recognize that people who have a conscience and are capable of empathy for other people would not go to a school and murder 19 people.

Nor does it take a mind reader or telepathic ability to recognize that one does not suddenly develop a conscience or learn empathy after such a short period of time while in prison. Whatever he may be feeling or thinking, it's unlikely that someone who lacked such basic human compassion has developed it in such a short period of time.

And here, I will throw around an absolute. Yes, there are some things that are black and white. I'm willing to go out on a limb and say that anyone who guns down innocent people in a mass shooting deserves no sympathy and should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of applicable laws.

Just a bunch of strung together statements R26. You are being a contrarian for what? All people are saying is that he could be both insane and murderous AND well aware that what he did was insane and murderous. Like a compulsive action. I'm certainly not arguing he deserves "sympathy". You're an asshole, however.

My brother did drugs and sold drugs, even to children. While I don’t condone or accept the bad things he’s done, he is my brother and family. You can love at the same time you don’t have to condone or accept what he’s done. You can cry with them and you can cry for them, knowing that they have destroyed their lives. It’s complicated, complex, and not always easy to understand. if you had a reasonable and good relationship early in life, and that family member, in my case my brother, fucked up royally, it’s painful to watch. I don’t like it and I think it was wrong what he did, but he’s my brother and I still love him.

[quote]Just a bunch of strung together statements [R26]. You are being a contrarian for what? All people are saying is that he could be both insane and murderous AND well aware that what he did was insane and murderous. Like a compulsive action. I'm certainly not arguing he deserves "sympathy". You're an asshole, however.

Pot, meet kettle.

I think that it is very acceptable to "abandon" , sex offenders, fraudsters, paedophiles ( latent or active) and domestic abusers if they are family. What right has somebody in the name of "familial love is meant to be unconditional" to say that family have to put up with this fuckshit? So one has to put THEIR family at risk in order to support nonces, domestic abusers, murderers of a "hair trigger" disposition just because they are "family"?

Has the knowledge that most criminality is committed due to proximity not known by most people anymore? Shit you don't even have to be altruistic on behalf of society to know this. You just have to have a sense of self preservation.

Any of you remember that weirdo mother who hasn't abandoned the son who killed her daughter and that a goodly amount of us can see the train crash waiting to happen down the line?

I just don't dance to that "parental guilt" tune that would have me harbouring slackness/evil past the age of old school majority, 18.

I know that what Nikolas did is unforgiveable: I can't forget the families of all those kids that he killed or injured, or the fear those kids must have felt. I'm most angry that that disturbed kid was able to buy an assault rifle in the first place. It's just that, when I first watched that video, I saw two scared kids, clinging to each other, asking each other what Mom would have said, how Mom would have reacted (she died several months prior, so the two kids felt they only had each other). The shooter will probably never get out of jail, and his brother will be left trying to keep his brother's spirits up for the rest of his life.

R31 is OP, sorry.