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LARRY KRAMER NY TIMES: For Gays, the Worst Is Yet to Come. Again.

And gay men are so complacent and terrified of being visible that they aren’t doing a single fucking thing about it.

And he’s absolutely fucking right.

by Anonymousreply 10407/12/2018

Our community is too fractured. The aims and goals should be focused on employment, housing, parental and adoption rights. The nebulous cause of “gender identity”- which has little to do with genuine same-sex attraction- has sucked all the oxygen out of the room.

by Anonymousreply 107/11/2018

[quote]The aims and goals should be focused on employment, housing, parental and adoption rights.

Thank you.

by Anonymousreply 207/11/2018

Apropos:

The Trump administration wants to reallocate money from the Ryan White HIV/AIDS Program to cover detaining immigrant children. Per documents obtained by Slate, the process of transferring those HIV/AIDS funds has already begun.

by Anonymousreply 307/11/2018

Wow, R3.

by Anonymousreply 407/11/2018

With gay organizations as truly bad as GLAAD, we know that we have no one to cover our backs. Get out there and fight, fight, fight yourselves!

by Anonymousreply 507/11/2018

"Why then do I still feel so destitute and abandoned? Surely all gay people fall into the same category as I."

There is the problem.

Some might say that not enough terrible things have happened to coalesce around; others might say we got too far to go back to being angry all the time.

I personally feel complacency is dangerous.

Your viewpoint may depend on your socioeconomic level.

by Anonymousreply 607/11/2018

Thank you for posting this, OP.

by Anonymousreply 707/11/2018

I’m his age. I have no energy to keep fighting. Time to hand the struggle off to a younger generation.

by Anonymousreply 807/11/2018

The problem with this whole thing is that now the LGBT community is basically an arm of the Democratic Party. So now, instead of being fighting mad that money from HIV/AIDS funds is being appropriated to pay for the hosting of illegal immigrant children, we’re supposed to be “for” immigration and open borders at all costs. People don’t recognize that throwing our community and energy and resources into whatever the Democratic Party tells us to throw it into is really, REALLY counterproductive.

by Anonymousreply 907/11/2018

[quote] we’re supposed to be “for” immigration and open borders at all costs

Jesus Christ, you have no idea what you are talking about. You are just repeating right-wing talking points ("open borders").

by Anonymousreply 1007/11/2018

R3, I’m sure pence got a chuckle out of that one

by Anonymousreply 1107/11/2018

[quote] we’re supposed to be “for” immigration and open borders at all costs

Fuck off, fascist. You’re the fucking jackass shitting all ove the DL. Fuck right off

by Anonymousreply 1207/11/2018

R9, the Democratic Party is NOT FOR OPEN BORDERS, dipshit.

How the fuck many times do you need to hear it?

by Anonymousreply 1307/11/2018

[quote]Fuck off, fascist. You’re the fucking jackass shitting all ove the DL. Fuck right off

This type of juvenile mindlessness is what is destroying the community.

by Anonymousreply 1407/11/2018

Their must be too much soy in the diet. People just chuckle and sigh. While our country spins down the toilet.

by Anonymousreply 1507/11/2018

[quote] This type of juvenile mindlessness is what is destroying the community.

Yeah, it's not the people spreading lies. It's the people mad about the lies.

by Anonymousreply 1607/11/2018

Larry went on a similar tirade in 2004. John Cameron Mitchell organized a town meeting after Kerry lost. Larry got up and whined about the end of the world. Next came a tidal wave of advances for gay people. His negative attitude is pathetic. For all his blessings, to have no gratitude is repulsive. Sore losers don't win.

by Anonymousreply 1707/11/2018

"Millions of women and straight people are marching on Washington and in other cities and towns and protesting in the offices of elected officials every week of the year.."

Yeah. Because there are no gay people marching in those crowds.... wtf.

We actually show up to support and defend a wide array of progressive causes, but too few straight people vocally stand up for their gay friends, colleagues and family members. There's the true invisibility imho. It's an uncomfortable and contentious truth because it doesn't blame gay people for their own predicament and struggles, which is the more common and easier avenue of complaint.

by Anonymousreply 1807/11/2018

For some reason, I feel like the women’s rights marches have a ton of gay attendees. I also don’t think we feel particularly attacked as a group lately and her helping other maligned groups.

by Anonymousreply 1907/11/2018

Agree, R1

by Anonymousreply 2007/11/2018

R18, I see and hear many straight FEMALE voices supporting gays. Some loudly, some softly. Some marching, some just on social media. Who I hear very little support from, as always and as usual, are straight MALES. White ones, in particular.

by Anonymousreply 2107/11/2018

I'm working class and I'm pretty goddam complacent. I've earned it. (I'm also in my 30s and have been happily partnered for years, so maybe that accounts for some of my contentment.) So are most of my gay friends, in real life (the good ones, not the losers who never grew up). Thankfully, none of them have been infected with Trump Derangement Syndrome (transmitted through sharing dirty social media and unprotected mass media consumption.)

Over time, I've come to realize how perpetually unhappy some people choose to be and, worse, how many of them channel their misery into outdated struggles. It's almost like some people use the all-encompassing and nebulous threat of homophobia to cloak their own personal failings so they can shirk responsibility for bad decisions, bad habits, etc. Maybe the cashier at CVS isn't homophobic, Harry, maybe you were an asshole? Maybe your landlord wants you out, Mark, because you suck as a tenant?

Maybe it alleviates their depression if they can pretend they are oppressed and fighting for justice but really it's mere role-playing and indulging these fantasies is about as helpful as pretending men can get pregnant and dicks can be female. (What a world, what a world.) These people are never happy. Some of you reading this are deeply unhappy reading this but you'd be deeply unhappy reading The Far Side or Confederacy of Dunces, too.

Also, it's funny how most of you would normally clutch pearls at anything with a whiff of America First, yet this is exactly what you're doing with gay rights. Most of our time and money and attention could be best spent not on LGBTQUIAADONKEYLIPS bullshit at home, but gay rights abroad in the various shit holes that still murder men and women for same-sex attraction. That would be effective altruism. But no, America in 2018 is some hell hole to a bunch of loud, privileged dopes who don't know how to live happily ever after. It's like Dorothy clicks her heels, skips straight past the farmhouse, squealing that she needs to get home to Aunt Em.

Instead of worrying about helping a five year old future gay guy block puberty, instead of making sure unaattractive narcissists attention-whore themselves without being rightly made fun of, instead of entertaining the delusions of closet cases and straight people with a fetish, we could be actually helping our cause where it's needed the most.

by Anonymousreply 2207/11/2018

I just want focus placed on R1. Then after legalization of all of that, I don’t care about Republicans, Muslims, Christians, immigrants, borders being open or closed—don’t care. I have my rights—hate away. I’ll move to a predominately gay place which won’t have (or at all) those groups listed above.

by Anonymousreply 2307/11/2018

Larry Kramer is so fucking whiny.

by Anonymousreply 2407/11/2018

[quote]Also, it's funny how most of you would normally clutch pearls at anything with a whiff of America First, yet this is exactly what you're doing with gay rights.

Wow, grasping at straws, bunky. Maybe you need a nap. Gay, women, POC, immigrants. They are all rights I find worth fighting for, everyone I know feels the same way. Glad I’m not a schlubby complacent guy like you.

by Anonymousreply 2507/11/2018

I've been screaming the same for over a decade here at the DL.

by Anonymousreply 2607/11/2018

[quote]Gay, women, POC, immigrants.

Gay rights and women’s rights woukd offend the other two on that list. I want gays to have their freedoms, and then gay people need to run.

by Anonymousreply 2707/11/2018

[quote] Our community is too fractured.

This alphabet salad LBGTBQIAA business is greatly responsible.

It enables and encourages gays to identify with one letter or another.

It pits one letter against another.

It does not promote a shared cause.

It is fracturing.

by Anonymousreply 2807/11/2018

I remember a time when GLAAD actually “stood for” Gay and Lesbian.

by Anonymousreply 2907/11/2018

[quote]We actually show up to support and defend a wide array of progressive causes, but too few straight people vocally stand up for their gay friends, colleagues and family members.

This. Exactly this. Thank you R18.

by Anonymousreply 3007/11/2018

R9 R10 R12 R13 R23 R25 I've never given a repub a vote for any national office but I know I don't feel safe when dems have federal control over our borders.

Some of the repeat offenders that break our immigration laws scare the hell out of me as much as any repub can.

When people can come & go both NORTH & south numerous times you just don't know where their loyalties are & if they indeed have any.

When a rapist can be caught numerous times it seems like the dems don't care about the crime victims that an open border policy can produce.

Case in point...

by Anonymousreply 3107/11/2018

Using bad apple examples of immigrants is like the use of African American crime statistic. The majority of immigrants want to work hard and have a better life for them and their children. A few immigrants committing crime does not invalidate the pure and honest purposes of the vast majority. This kind of argument seems eerily similar to what I heard growing up about AA - because you could see some horrible crimes, they were used as emblematic of an entire race or group of people. Kindness and democracy require nuance, fascism does not.

by Anonymousreply 3207/11/2018

[quote]I've never given a repub a vote for any national office but I know I don't feel safe when dems have federal control over our borders.

Then you're a fool, r31. There is no "open border policy," which shows that you're just regurgitating lame talking points. And immigrants, both legal and otherwise, commit crimes at a lower rate than do "true Americans."

by Anonymousreply 3307/11/2018

R19 exactly. There isn't an organized gay movement going on right now with a clear goal like there was 10 years ago with gay marriage, or 25 years ago with protease inhibitor access. There are other communities with much more urgent causes, like immigration, police brutality. sexual assault.

Trump hasn't gone after the gays yet, and gay couples in Republican hellhole states who can't have two-party adoptions isn't as immediately important as immigrant children being torn from their parents and kept in cages, or literal Nazis marching in the streets.

by Anonymousreply 3407/11/2018

ME ME ME ME I AM SO GREAT ME ME ME ME YOU ARE ALL FAILING US ME ME ME ME ME ME I WAS HONORED AND REWARDED ME ME ME ME YOU ARE ALL SCUM AND IT'S ALL DESPERATE FOR ME NOW ME ME ME ME I'M SUPPOSED TO BE DEAD BY NOW ME ME ME ME I AM SO GREAT ME ME ME ME YOU ARE ALL FAILING US ME ME ME ME ME ME I WAS HONORED AND REWARDED ME ME ME ME YOU ARE ALL SCUM AND IT'S ALL DESPERATE FOR ME NOW ME ME ME ME I'M SUPPOSED TO BE DEAD BY NOW ME ME ME ME I AM SO GREAT ME ME ME ME YOU ARE ALL FAILING US ME ME ME ME ME ME I WAS HONORED AND REWARDED ME ME ME ME YOU ARE ALL SCUM AND IT'S ALL DESPERATE FOR ME NOW ME ME ME ME I'M SUPPOSED TO BE DEAD BY NOW

by Anonymousreply 3507/11/2018

[quote]Trump hasn't gone after the [italic]rich[/italic] gays yet

Corrected it for you. Diverting funds from the Ryan White HIV/AIDS program is most certainly going after economically disadvantaged gays.

by Anonymousreply 3607/11/2018

[quote] Gay rights and women’s rights woukd offend the other two on that list

Fuck off you racist slime ball. Eat shit and die.

by Anonymousreply 3707/11/2018

[quote]I've never given a repub a vote for any national office but I know I don't feel safe when dems have federal control over our borders.

You’re a bigot and liar. Eat shit

by Anonymousreply 3807/11/2018

[quote]Some of the repeat offenders that break our immigration laws scare the hell out of me as much as any repub can.

The biggest repeat offenders are our elected officials, jackass. You are a troll or sean hannity

Kindly fuck right off

by Anonymousreply 3907/11/2018

[quote]Trump hasn't gone after the gays yet

What a fucking idiotic thing, you trolls are scary.

by Anonymousreply 4007/11/2018

Oh please... having lived through the great plague, I can assure you this is not the worst of times. Baffling.

Is this really how some of you guys wake up every day and live your lives? Waiting for some invisible shoe to drop? We are doing just fine, gay marriage isn't going anywhere, AIDS is still around but relatively under control. Some of you Chicken Littles really need therapy.

by Anonymousreply 4107/11/2018

Gay marriage might be going somewhere . .

by Anonymousreply 4207/11/2018

Larry Kramer put the words drama and queen into the term DRAMA! QUEEN! He has always been so perpetually angry and alarmist at everyone and everything that people stopped listening to him years ago.

by Anonymousreply 4307/11/2018

[quote]AIDS is still around but relatively under control

Tell that to the 1 in 2 American black MSM (men who have sex with men) who will be diagnosed with HIV during their lifetime, if current trends continue.

by Anonymousreply 4407/11/2018

Because the next generation is as selfish as the baby boomers. They'd rather post pics of themselves half-naked all day long instead of vote; they'd rather invent words like "non-binary" and "fluid" instead of accept their gay/queer label identities; they'd rather fuck bareback than use protection. They're a horrid, spoiled lot and the plague they may face will be whatever comes our way socially due to this Republican administration.

by Anonymousreply 4507/11/2018

I've done my fighting. I don't have it in me to fight for stupid people.The fact that HIV is still a thing in the gay community is disgusting. We have known for over 30 years how it is contracted and how to protect yourselves. No excuses if you get it today. I have no interest in fighting for the rights of men who think they are women stealing hard fought rights away from actual women. I make no apologies for being a white gay male and have no interest in being apart of the new movement to erase our history.

by Anonymousreply 4607/11/2018

I'll tell it to the Darwin awards for fucking bareback when there are deadly STDs around. Christ, at some point you have to take responsibility for your sexual health.

by Anonymousreply 4707/11/2018

Not sure who sounds more miserable. Kramer or the posters on this thread.

by Anonymousreply 4807/11/2018

R43, and good for him

by Anonymousreply 4907/11/2018

[quote]I make no apologies for being a white gay male

Me either.

by Anonymousreply 5007/11/2018

Im tired of the fight too. “They” want to fight us, while we all should be fighting the 1%.

I’m sitting this one out.

by Anonymousreply 5107/11/2018

we think that now we can get married that we are accepted. that's our fatal flaw. we have not been accepted. we are still hated. it will take decades. DECADES. we can't even donate blood. Instagramming rainbows and tweeting about KJ Apa's abs (which are fantastic btw) is nothing. We still have to fight every day for our existence. To stop them from destroying our marriages and sending us back into hiding or to conversion camps. Or else we all flee to Europe and Canada.

by Anonymousreply 5207/11/2018

[quote] Me either.

Oh, dear.

by Anonymousreply 5307/11/2018

Flee to Europe? Where Muslims are taking over?

by Anonymousreply 5407/11/2018

The GOP is trying to divide us by making policies specifically hurtful to Trans. Don't fall for it!

by Anonymousreply 5507/11/2018

R54, Muslims are 3% of the population in Europe. Lots of hysteria but not taking over for sure.

by Anonymousreply 5607/11/2018

[quote]Larry Kramer put the words drama and queen into the term DRAMA! QUEEN!

Thank you.

[quote]we have not been accepted. we are still hated.

Oh please. Stop playing the victim. A significant majority of Americans now support gay marriage (and, by extension, gay rights broadly). If you're surrounded by bigots, it's in your power to change that by moving elsewhere in the country.

by Anonymousreply 5707/11/2018

[quote]I make no apologies for being a white gay male

How dare you.

by Anonymousreply 5807/11/2018

[quote]Flee to Europe? Where Muslims are taking over?

Bigot.

by Anonymousreply 5907/11/2018

r54 ahahha that was done especially for a fuck like you to answer. my mates owe me 40 euros altogether for that!

by Anonymousreply 6007/11/2018

THIS IS WHY WE MUST STILL KEEP FIGHTING AND BE PROACTIVE

by Anonymousreply 6107/11/2018

r57 Why should we have to move? It's time to destroy the haters .

by Anonymousreply 6207/11/2018

GLAAD is not a lobbyist or political action committee. It's for Hollywood, not the law or government.

by Anonymousreply 6307/11/2018

r1 is just a right-wing troll trying to divide and conquer BOTH gays and trans.

by Anonymousreply 6407/11/2018

The tide will probably turn back to thinking of gays as mentally disabled. And then they'll figure out the DNA correlating to it and eliminate us. But get that selfie on and take steroids in the mean time, hollow heads!

by Anonymousreply 6507/11/2018

If you’re screaming for the abolishment of ICE, you’re for open borders. There’s no replacement for them. Tons of Dems are running on getting rid of ICE.

by Anonymousreply 6607/11/2018

Chechnya has a gay concentration camp, R65.

by Anonymousreply 6707/11/2018

Seriously, young guys these days mingle with gay guys without issue and not even just on reality TV. Coming out in high school, unthinkable in my day, is becoming more and more common. I just don't buy all this supposed hate projected against and honestly never did. And I had friends who were religious and smalltown, frat brothers especially, and NOT ONE of them ever gave me an ounce of trouble, then or now.

Sadly, the worst offenders, the ones who tried to stir up trouble and out gays (not me but good friends) ALL ended up being closet cases who tried to look back on it all and laugh, especially when confronted by me. I never found it funny and continue to despise them to this day.

by Anonymousreply 6807/11/2018

It is true that Kramer has become sort of this Tiresias-like oracle to be resurrected from his casket to pronounce doom.

But I also question the effectiveness of trotting this old warhorse out (and he deserves a break) but no one to take it consistently. Not GLAAD, HRC or The Advocate, etc. They aren't the ones to look to; we have lamented the absence of orgs for some time now...

by Anonymousreply 6907/11/2018

r9 THE CONSERVATIVE TROLL TRYING TO DIVIDE AND CONQUER THE DEMOCRATS AGAIN

You're so transparent, just STFU

by Anonymousreply 7007/11/2018

[quote]R1] is just a right-wing troll trying to divide and conquer BOTH gays and trans.

Employment and housing rights affect trans people too you fucking moron.

Might I suggest using *both* hands to shovel your shit into your mouth r64? It’ll keep you from typing.

by Anonymousreply 7107/11/2018

Larry's engaging in a bit of Henny Penny the sky is falling, but he's right on one thing. We've become complacent and we need to move forward and not allow our enemies to push us backwards. We still don't have anti-discrimination protections in law, we still can't legally adopt in all fifty states, we can't use surrogates in many states (including blue states) and we aren't represented openly in most major professions. There are a lot of vehicles we can collectively use to push and yet, because we have no effective leadership, we haven't effectively utilized them.

When that fat whale Huckabee got denied service at the Red Hen, we should have used that as a rallying point to say conservatives should be discriminated against until we CAN'T be discriminated against. This should have been the moment where we pushed for the Equality act that has been languishing for many years. That's effective activism and yet it is woefully missing today.

Instead of talking about the closet queens in Hollywood and elsewhere here on Datalounge, we should be writing to editorial boards and using the kinds of tactics earlier activists used to out high profile people. When people like Miss Lindsay Graham and Tom Cotton try to attack our community, we should be outing them in public. When people like Miss Shawn Mendes or Ryan Seacrest or Aaron Rodgers try to put on the appearance of being straight in an obviously comical way, we should be outing them in public. That's effective activism.

When Republicans claim we shouldn't be able to adopt and right wing mommies claim we shouldn't be allowed to use surrogates, we need to point to the "wonders" of straight parenting in the amount of abusive households, abandoned children and poor households straight people foster to show why not only should we be parents, but that we are more times than not better parents than straight people. Having a public campaign on the perils of straight parenting will help to bring to light the injustice against us into perspective and see a pushback moving forward. That's effective activism.

We also need to remember that fighting for the rights of the gay community elsewhere in the world does benefit us. Much of these American based anti-gay groups spend millions of dollars on campaigns every year in other countries besides our own. They spent money to re-ban marriage equality in Bermuda. They spent money pushing bans on marriage equality and adoption in European countries. They spent money making the lives of our community in Russia hell under Putin. They spent millions endangering the African gay community in places like Uganda. They spend this money to build bases of support worldwide to attack us in international organizations like the UN and to put us on the defensive here at home. If we want to continue to have our rights respected here, we need to fight for them elsewhere as well. Weakening the bigots everywhere means they have no place to go and prosper, helping us stay comfortable by giving them no place to run off to and hide. That's effective activism.

by Anonymousreply 7207/11/2018

Cont. Really, the problem is HRC is a total crock organization that holds parties for their wealthy donors while kissing the ass of the powerful while not effectively challenging these institutions. They have ignored the grassroots and the consequences of that are obvious. We need new leadership and we need organizations that will aggressively challenge power even in our community. We're vulnerable until this occurs.

Hopefully, enough people wake up and begin to take these steps. Honestly, it's probably better to wait until the attacks against us become more aggressive. The most effective attacks against Trump and his cronies are when it's in response to something he's done, not as an offensive against him that's unprovoked. It builds leverage and exposes the right wing bigots for the bullies they are. Even if I'm not confident that the HRC's or GLAAD's of the world will help us, I'm confident that enough of us will act to make a difference. After all, as even Larry Kramer said, it took just a few thousand people to make a difference during the AIDS crisis. That's an attainable number and I hope we get it soon.

by Anonymousreply 7307/11/2018

Actually, r56, it is more like 5% according to the PEW Foundation in 2017. However, the real, unofficial percentage is certainly higher and it depends what country you are talking about: France - 8.8%, Sweden - 8.1, Netherlands - 7.6, UK - 6.3, Germany - 6.1.

There is no denying that Europe has become a much more dangerous place, especially for women, children, gays and Jews because of the increase in the muslim population. An increasing muslim population has never been a good thing anywhere for the past 1,400 years.

by Anonymousreply 7407/11/2018

We need to be vigilant to protect what we have gained in the past decades, partially due to Larry Kramer and other activists, but Larry and everyone else should realize that the worst is behind us now. Most gays today are living healthy happy successful lives that simply were not possible in the past.

by Anonymousreply 7507/11/2018

R9 is an easy block.

by Anonymousreply 7607/11/2018

I’m too busy eating this delicious box of Chick-Fil-A’s nugs to give a good damn.

by Anonymousreply 7707/11/2018

Uh R76. Huh.

by Anonymousreply 7807/11/2018

Whatever you want to say about Kramer, he’s was 100% accurate on the thing that has mattered most to gay men in the last half-century or perhaps ever.

by Anonymousreply 7907/11/2018

Less than half the community wanted gay marriage to be the main issue on the agenda before a vocal minority of middle-class gays put it there. When it did, it took millions from the truly important issues of helping gay kids on the street and AIDS funding. Now many gay men are dying alone and without social or medical support because all the community funding went to this stupid effort to "mainstream" gayness via gay marriage.

I'm sorry but aping straight people with glamorous ceremonies and feeling persecuted because a redneck won't bake your cake for it is not a real struggle, and it's too bad so many of our under-40s have been so brainwashed to believe this, and Larry of all people should know better than to be fanning the flames.

by Anonymousreply 8107/11/2018

Yeah I don’t buy that we are going to go back to the pre-1980 days. By being visible we were able to dispel the hidden myth that it doesn’t exist and “well raised” children don’t become gay. Yes there will be backlash - a la AA civil rights - but I do believe those who live in most of the US are safe. Some rural areas are less exposed to knowledge in general but been they see it on tv and it has helped even rural,gays come out. I am against marriage in general but appreciate the meaning behind it - after hearing Evan Woodson give a speech in 1993 about it, I understood how the right to marriage is key to embedded social acceptance.

I do think we need to turn attention to gays in repressed countries and to the ravages of hyper-capitalism. I think immigration is just one leg of the issue which has been caused by global hyper capitalism. And the insensitivity of modern global capitalism and the anonymity and vitriol of internet dialogue are oil and flame that will burn many aspects of human civility and civilization.

by Anonymousreply 8207/11/2018

[quote] Whatever you want to say about Kramer, he’s was 100% accurate on the thing that has mattered most to gay men in the last half-century or perhaps ever.

Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.

by Anonymousreply 8307/11/2018

We needed ENDA.

by Anonymousreply 8407/11/2018

How does a thread like this pull in anti-muslim and anti-immigrant views? Those are from trolls. There are also a lot of idiots out there who believe that ICE is the only agency of border security, and again, they are either trolls or too stupid to live:

"After the massive reorganization of federal agencies precipitated by the creation of the Department of Homeland Security (DHS), there are now four main federal agencies charged with securing the United States’ borders: the U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP), which patrols the border and conducts immigrations, customs, and agricultural inspections at ports of entry; the U.S. Immigrations and Customs Enforcement (ICE), which investigates immigrations and customs violations in the interior of the country; the United States Coast Guard, which provides maritime and port security; and the Transportation Security Administration (TSA), which is responsible for securing the nation’s land, rail, and air transportation networks"

by Anonymousreply 8507/11/2018

It's really disheartening to me to see Mr. Kramer demeaned once again. He may be tiring at times, but he always was.

Unfortunately he was and still is our canary in the coal mine. Please, please pay attention. These are dangerous times for gay men and women.

Being "accepted" is a slippery slope. We are, by our very nature, different and that alone could put us right back to where we were. Closet cases like Mike Pence and Lindsey Graham will cut our throats given half the chance. Constant vigilance is our only hope.

& p.s. It always was about the SCOTUS. Too bad nobody was listening.

by Anonymousreply 8607/11/2018

[quote]If you’re screaming for the abolishment of ICE, you’re for open borders. There’s no replacement for them. Tons of Dems are running on getting rid of ICE.

Not that this has anything to do with this thread but you're wrong on all three counts. No, Democrats aren't for "open borders." Yes, there is a replacement for ICE. If nothing else, we can go back to what was there before. And no, there aren't "tons of Democrats" "running on getting rid of ICE."

by Anonymousreply 8707/11/2018

ICE which also threatens journalists

Don't vote and by next year they'll be a full fledged secret police

by Anonymousreply 8807/11/2018

I assure you I’m not a troll, but the major problem with the LGBTQIA+++ community nowadays is, like I’ve said before, prominent gay groups MUST be perpetually outraged at the housing of immigrant children, islamophobia, trans “kids”, etc etc etc.

While HIV is STILL an issue, while the community is ravaged by meth use, while gays in Islamic countries are being put to death, our organizations have decided that we have to be involved in each and every cause picked up by the National Democratic Party. It hurts us and fractures the cause.

I have many problems with the Black equal rights groups (and I am black), but one thing I’ve always respected is that they keep black issues first and foremost. They’re not standing ‘in solidarity’ with immigrants, “POC,” etc. Because of that, they’re able to make real gains in the realm of criminal justice, class action lawsuits, etc.

Our problem is that our two most prominent organizations HRC and GLAAD are both starfucking jokes that do absolutely nothing but hog resources, attention, and energy, and that we have no real leaders, just jackasses who do reality tv and Netflix shows who pontificate on gay rights when it’s time to do promo for the latest shitty season or Orange is the New Black.

by Anonymousreply 8907/11/2018

[quote]our organizations have decided that we have to be involved in each and every cause picked up by the National Democratic Party.

Of course they haven't, which is why you can't support this drivel.

by Anonymousreply 9007/11/2018

R89

[quote]they’re able to make real gains in the realm of criminal justice

And what might those be? Seeing police murders of black people skyrocket since Black Lives Matter? Seeing not a single killer cop sent to jail? Not seeing marijuana and other drugs decriminalized? Seeing more aggressive criminalizing under Jeff Sessions? Seeing the jail population rise to the largest in the world, including the third world? Seeing the blackballing of those who even discuss the issue ie. Colin Kaepernick? What gains are you talking about? If anything, black civil rights have gone backwards in recent years, more so than even in the gay community.

Not that I think that our community is doing a good job of advocating for our rights in this day and age, but to think we should follow their activism model that lacks intersectionality is a really foolish idea. Building coalitions is key to gaining power. United we stand and divided we fall. While we need to be more forceful in making our issues heard and acted upon throughout the larger activist community, to suggest that we go at it alone is a really stupid idea. Take the black community's lack of success on any of the things they care about as proof of this fact.

by Anonymousreply 9107/11/2018

Don't bother, R91. R89, contrary to his assertion, is indeed a troll, and a rather clumsy one at that. A quick look at the websites and news reports about the two organizations that he refers to shows that he is lying about those organizations. Both of his posts on this thread were complete bullshit.

by Anonymousreply 9207/11/2018

[quote]Flee to Europe? Where Muslims are taking over?

Lies. You trolls are so stupid

by Anonymousreply 9307/11/2018

Do you think it's safer to flee to Europe where 3% are muslim or stay home where 30% are deplorable but Christian? I'm worried.

by Anonymousreply 9407/11/2018

Well, I know which group has more of an impact on my life, R94.

by Anonymousreply 9507/11/2018

💩💩💩💩 the worst for gays is getting fat and old and unfuckable

by Anonymousreply 9607/11/2018

Hardly. It also means a Drama-free life, as well. And avoidance of the Gross and the Shallow like R96. I'm sure I've met him in real life.

by Anonymousreply 9707/11/2018

r91 coalitions have to have willing partners who are true partners. That's not the case with BLM, and radical Ts. The place for a coalition is a national political party, as someone upthread said. That's where the compromises and general philosophies should be ironed out into a moderate policy platform.

I don't think our needs will ever be met by this model, because we (and women) have been a historical sacrificial lamb. The closet also has a negative effect on gay rights, IMHO, because a lot of closeted pols use their positions to go out of their way to avoid suspicion of being "them", in a way that other groups don't experience. I'd rather have an GLB group for our interests that can be radical if needed.

I think Kramer is important as a link to the past, and as one of the few voices who can, and will, go against whatever current threatens the community, even from within. I take him with a grain of salt, just like I'd take anyone else opining in public in a social media age.

I'm a junior eldergay, just a shade too young to experience the plague years. Reading about it afterwards, it strikes me as the same climate now: the rise of resistant STDs (this time due to Prep); gains made in rights, without full equality; the edge of a stock bubble, and corporate domination. Kramer might be onto something.

by Anonymousreply 9807/11/2018

Nobody cares about the will and consent of the people more than me, trust me. I represent what the American people agree on.

I just think Vladimir Putin is the best person so anyone who opposes him should split apart and let Putin have his way.

by Anonymousreply 9907/11/2018

If it's not okay to deny gay people their equal rights, then it's not okay to deny trans.

You can't be selective about who gets rights and opportunities, fuckwad.

by Anonymousreply 10007/11/2018

r100 that's not the point. The point is trans can have their own advocacy groups, and we can have ours. Everyone is in their lane, no one shits on anyone else (because they're not part of the same advocacy and funding) and Bob's your uncle.

If you're concerned about numbers re: transgender, then push for the Democrats to have a broad enough platform that would include T by default.

by Anonymousreply 10107/11/2018

Expect it to get worse. There's lots of money in private prisons.

by Anonymousreply 10207/11/2018

Thank you Larry Kramer for years of advocacy work. If we need help get our message out there all we need to do is ask. The Me Too Movement, women marchers and the Parkland students will be there for us.

by Anonymousreply 10307/11/2018

[quote] their own advocacy groups, and we can have ours.

Ay, there's the rub.

by Anonymousreply 10407/12/2018
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