Theatre Gossip 311- The "Tylenol? When Did I Eat Tylenol?" Edition

Yes, I KNOW I missed the #. I typed it and also hit the E and accidentally erased them both.

Ya know, some guys just can’t hold their Tylenol.

At least the headache went away.

I would have used that line, R2, but someone already did it in the last thread.

Do you people really think this suicide may cause the show to shutter. It's barely been reported.

R5 If that fuck ugly bore that tried to destroy Tyce gets hold of it, probably not

What of Tyce is there to "destroy", R6?

I just can't imagine the average Chicago ticket buyer who is likely from a country with no concept of human rights would care that the director was mean to a cast member and the cast member killed himself.

R4, I was the one who used it in the last thread. Just thought it apropo for thie thread, too.

You’re right. It would have been a much better title and would have tied it in to the source of the news, Chicago.

[quote]and he likes water sports...

Walter! Call me!

[quote]Where we all breathlessly await Part 4 of the Jeff Loeffenholz saga. Brought to you by Wordpress.

Way the fuck too early, people. Jeff obviously had issues, but the pressure didn't help. I was called on the carpet by Bobbie years before his success with CHICAGO. I was young and didn't give a fuck, though, and I was in the right in any case. Whatever issues Jeff had, this could have been better managed.

Saw DOLLY last night and after years of disliking BP, came away thinking she was the best of the three. Don't like Garber much either, but he was charming, and better than Hyde Pierce, IMO. Whole show is in tiptop shape, and Stemp all but steals the show. Audience was in heaven.

Can Bernadette actually sing? Her voice has always been so grating.

This is loverly.

Three cheers for Dame Diana!

I'm no expert on vocal fatigue issues but do not understand why Sunday is the best day to take off for that. Long weekends are nice but aren't two show days the more wearying?

I think walter bobbie is kind of hot. Sorry. Haha.

Amazing this Ambrose thing has gotten to the Post, and quoting an email from Dame Diana? That’s just... shocking and embarrassing. How did Lincoln Center let this get this far? It makes everyone involved, including Ambrose look really bad. She must be PISSED that she’s getting ripped by the company and a living legend in a gossip rag that EVERYONE reads. Backstage is NOT going to be fun tonight.

I worked with Ambrose on the Weekends At Bellevue pilot and she flipped out on the director in front of everyone.

There must be some serious misbehavior occurring backstage for Dame Diana and members of the company to be quoted in that article.

That is fucking JUICY! Three cheers for Dame Diana for enlivening a dull summer.

R15. the article regarding MFL is interesting, but what I can't understand is why Ambrose is wearing that up/down hairstyle and why her hair is so flat? Hair in that period was usually fluffy (no hair spray) and hair on an adult woman was either up or down.

[quote]Three cheers for Dame Diana for enlivening a dull summer.

THIS summer has been dull for you r22?

Who are the chorus boys who arrange the Mercedes Club apartment orgies?

[quote] They have booked their seats in advance, paying an exorbitant price for them to see what they have been led to believe is the original cast.

I agree with Rigg on this point. I looked for tickets a few days ago and was being offered $199 to sit in the loge. I don't mind sitting up there but for $200?

[quote] Amazing this Ambrose thing has gotten to the Post, and quoting an email from Dame Diana? That’s just... shocking and embarrassing.

not just email r19 but he interviewed Rigg as well

[quote]“I learnt, courtesy of a newspaper, that our leading lady will not be appearing in future Sunday matinees,” Rigg wrote in an email obtained by The Post.

Gurl, if you had been reading DataLounge you would have known weeks ago.

[quote]I'm no expert on vocal fatigue issues but do not understand why Sunday is the best day to take off for that. Long weekends are nice but aren't two show days the more wearying?

In my opinion, not really. On a two show day, you already have the voice warmed up, so it's a bit easier to do more vocal work. If she takes off Sunday, she has all day Sunday and all day Monday not to use her voice at all, so it's two continuous full days of vocal rest.

What a spectacular turn of events.

I bet backstage will be...er...um...yeah!

I’m excited for Carmen Jones. Nothing else in theatre seems particularly interesting right now

[quote]In a statement released by Lincoln Center Theater, artistic director André Bishop says, “The decision for Lauren to perform seven performances a week was made due to the intense demands of this enormous, taxing role. Eliza requires a singing actress who can belt and sing in a high, operatic range as well... The most important thing is that Lauren protect her stamina to continue to deliver beautiful shows to our audiences.”

That should read continue to deliver beautiful shows to our audiences who don't attend Sunday performances. I at least hope they are reducing the ticket price for Sunday shows.

And Eliza does not require a belt. It is pure legit soprano (and should be sung by someone who has a legit soprano and not some tv star trying to fake a legit soprano).

Has everyone forgotten how even Julie Andrews had vocal trouble with the part of Eliza?

Rather than get an alternate, she simply stopped singing parts of the score and spoke them like Rex Harrison. If you listen to the London cast album you can hear how much she reduced the singing.

Others have had vocal damage or got alternates before. This is not unique to Ambrose.

If Bobbie is out there harassing his understudies over a few thousand dollars -- I HOPE that indicates they are looking at closing Chicago. That is nasty behavior.

I would hope that Wicked could hold out for a few more years to become the 3rd longest running show. But they have radically scaled back in the last few years --- going from shows happening all over the world to only the Munchkinland tour, West End and Broadway. And either this is because worldwide sales dropped and demanded all those closures -- or because they actually want to shut down the show to encourage movie box office for the 2019 film. They might be planning to shut down Wicked when the movie comes out. So even if Chicago closes now, Wicked wont last long enough?

[quote] It is pure legit soprano and should be sung by someone who has a legit soprano

If they'd simply offered the alternate slot to Jeff Loeffelholz, all this mishegas could have been avoided.

Thank you, Diana.

MAKE THAT BITCH'S LIFE HELL!!!!!

Saw Matt Bomer naked this week . All of him.

[quote]Saw Matt Bomer naked this week . All of him.

How does it feel to have a restraining order? What does one look like? Does it have his signature on it?

Wicked isn’t going anywhere. It’s still doing consistently great numbers.

[quote]Wicked isn’t going anywhere. It’s still doing consistently great numbers.

It will be a show for the ages because there will always be little girls who want to see bitchy rivalry.

[quote] THIS summer has been dull for you [R22]?

I'm genuinely curious as to what you feel has been exciting. The Tonys were awful. The new shows coming in are all boring crap. The Tylenol suicide is looking less and less interesting every day and the New York Times article STILL hasn't surfaced.

Have I missed something?

[QUOTE]Production sources say Ambrose, best known for TV’s “Six Feet Under,” isn’t used to the grueling demands of an eight-show week, although she’s performed two nonsinging roles on Broadway.

Something they probably should have considered before casting her.

[quote] Saw Matt Bomer naked this week . All of him.

More details. Where? Hung?

It doesn't seem like there really IS a Jeff Loeffenholz saga. Bobbie may be a jerk, but based on the narrative that purports to rely on Jeff's notes, this was not much of a kerfuffle. I can't imagine why it would have driven him to suicide--but maybe it drove him to overmedicate for the headache it caused him.

Re Dame Diana: whether or not it's a legitimate gripe, that's incredibly bad form. There must have been other hostilities backstage for that to have happened. Sher's in London or on holiday; don't know who the SM is, but this should have been stopped.

Sher adores Ambrose and had cast her as his Fannt Brice in “Funny Girl” which was canceled (not due to Ambrose but from investors pulling out). Ambrose is one his muses. She gets whatever she wants.

That makes Rigg's rant especially ill advised.

Am I the only one who wasn't wild about My Fair Lady? Ambrose has a nice voice and hits all the notes, but she doesn't know how to act in song and she can barely project past the first 3 rows. What's this thing about hiring actors who can't project to play major roles on stage? She comes across much better on the cast recording than she does on stage.

I have never, EVER gotten the Ambrose love.

Even on SFU, I thought she stunk up the joint.

Don’t get me wrong - she was perfectly cast, but that doesn’t mean she was any good.

To the poster above, Bernadette's voice is very ragged and her pitch all over the map. But, except for the Babs version , who goes to see Dolly! for the singing?

How in the world did Dame Diana's first email get leaked? Who did she write the email to, Andre Bishop?

The book for Dolly (particularly the play version— versus the better movie version) just sucks. It’s so dated and clunky. Who the heck would want to see that again?

I recently revisited Wicked.

I really enjoyed it the first time—with the original cast. This time, without the dazzling cast, all its flaws were more apparent.

Wow, the story is so stupid and the music, terrible.

I can't even imagine what Carnegie Mellon third stringers they've got shoved into Wicked right now.

I saw it in the Fall of 2004 and Cheno had already left. Jennifer Laura Thompson had taken over and was wonderful. Idina was still there and still Idina. I also think Joel Grey and Norbert were gone. I saw George Hearn and Joey McIntyre in their places. I thought the book was the only strong thing about the show.

Hello, Dolly isn't one of my favorites. It's a lightweight little thing, but I have to admit to being won over by this current production. I saw it with Bette last year and went back to see it with Bernadette a few weeks ago and it's just such a joyous evening in the theatre. If any production could make a strong case for the show, it's this one. Bernadette surpassed Bette as far as I'm concerned. She was incredibly funny. I'd say her voice is a little less ragged than Bette's. When I saw Bette, she was modifying "parayyyyyyyde" into "paraaaahhhhhhhhhddddd". It was weird.

Ryan Lowe was very hot in "Naked Boys Singing" years ago.

It would be nice, r52, if somebody, someday did a Wicked opera that was true to it's source material. It deserves it.

Its....

The initial rights belonged to Marc platt at Universal who wanted to develop the novel into a dark film true to the source material.

Wasn't the original take on the material in the musical intended to be darker, but as the show was being developed/previewed they didn't think it was working and deliberately lightened the tone?

They had to, r59, for commercial viability. I totally understand that. But the novel is so wonderfully dense and deserves a big budget mini-series. But we still have to wait for the movie version of the musical. Maybe some years down the line.....

[quote]The initial rights belonged to Marc platt at Universal who wanted to develop the novel into a dark film true to the source material.

They knew that Barbra Streisand couldn't handle dark material, so they hired Walter Matthau and goofy Michal Crawford and made it the light romp we see today. Originally, "Before The Parade Passes By" was titled "Before My Funeral Train Passes By."

Also they threw in the piece about Ambrose being upset that she isn't spending more time with her family to try to get sympathy for her ... yeah, after all, she has no free time at all during the day, every day, plus all of Monday, most of Sunday ....

Julie Andrews played in MY FAIR LADY for two years in the states (with a two-week vacation) and then another year and several months in London. Lauren Ambrose is cutting back performances in under four months of performances.

"there will always be little girls who want to see bitchy rivalry"

Welcome to the #MeToo era!

What a bitchy thing to say, R62 ... and I loved it!

R63, she did with absences due to vocal strain and a growing dependence on sprechstimmeas the run ground on.

She started imitating Rex Harrison's sprechstimme a bit, though he started to sing a bit by the time the London recording came around.

[quote]Also they threw in the piece about Ambrose being upset that she isn't spending more time with her family to try to get sympathy for her ... yeah, after all, she has no free time at all during the day, every day, plus all of Monday, most of Sunday ....

You sort of know that when you take a career in the theater, that you're working when other people are off. It should not have been a surprise to her that she would not be home for her children's bedtime. Theater is not a 9-5, M-F job. If she wants that, there are plenty of secretary jobs open.

I have read that Julie Andrews missed performances from 8-13 through 8-16-1956 due to a throat infection. R66, do you have information about other absences.

And Julie Andrews did the show for more than three years without a body microphone.

Maybe Lauren's taking Mondays off to learn how to act through song. It's a shame, because she has the voice (maybe not quite the power) to carry the show off, but she literally stops acting when she begins singing and it's one of the strangest things I've ever seen. Lots of weird hand gestures, possessed eyes, and strange posture. I remember her singing most of "Show Me" to the ground instead of Freddy. Her performance, up to that point, is rather wonderful, but she doesn't seem comfortable acting through song.

I haven't seen the show but I noticed what you are saying, R71, from video clips I have seen. Very odd.

How thrilled is Laura Benanti right now?

R53

They have Jackie Burns in Wicked. I think it is her last week -- but she is not some third rate Elphaba.

I do wonder why they didn't just go with Laura Benanti (new baby and attendance issues notwithstanding). Isn't she the same age as Lauren? It's not like they were trying to make this production realistic from that perspective either. Is Norbert even 10 years older than either of them himself?

I guess it could be worse. Could have been Kelli O'Hara. (snore)

Because r75 Sher has been trying to mount a musical with Ambrose at the helm for ages. The canceled “Funny Girl” was the first attempt.

Kelli O'Hara got good notices from the British critics for THE KING AND I. I'm surprised they didn't take her to task for her accent.

After seeing My Fair Lady, I can't imagine Ambrose as Funny at all. Is she louder when she belts? I don't know if she has the vocal power for that score.

[quote] Saw Matt Bomer naked this week . All of him. More details. Where? Hung?

On stage, he was't aroused.

[quote]Isn't she the same age as Lauren?

She's a couple of years younger.

[quote]It would be nice if somebody, someday did a Wicked opera that was true to it's source material.

Oh yeah, that's exactly what we need, an opera of "Wicked."

Of course we don't need one, r81, but would you argue that the novel wasn't more operatic in scope than Broadway musical?

R81 -- I'm not the one who suggested a Wicked opera, but I think it could be a good idea. Have you read the book the play is based on? Although the play and the book touch on some of the same plot points, the book is very dark and philosophical, and more about the nature of perception and how that shapes who you are. yes, that is in the play, too, but the book was deeper and darker and extraordinary.

[quote]Rather than get an alternate, she simply stopped singing parts of the score and spoke them like Rex Harrison. If you listen to the London cast album you can hear how much she reduced the singing.

[quote]R63, she did with absences due to vocal strain and a growing dependence on sprechstimmeas the run ground on.

There you go again, trying to push your same bullshit lie about what Andrews did during the run. You weren't there. You have no idea what she did. Your faulty thesis is based solely on your estimation of what she did on the London CD.

It's called ACTING, you idiot. After three years, she tried some different things on the London album. But truthfully it's only on "Show Me" (a little bit) and "Just You Wait" (which isn't all that different from her Broadway take). Her opening lines on "Without You" are exactly the same as she did them on the Broadway album. Lerner and Loewe were present at the London recording. You weren't, so shut up wirth your idiocy about Julie's "sprechstimme"

[quote]would you argue that the novel wasn't more operatic in scope than Broadway musical?

It got exactly the kind of adaptation it deserved. Everyone has become a multi-millionaire off of it, and they're all happy, not the least of them Gregory Maguire.

That's why I wrote that I perfectly understood the direction they took to make it commercial, r85. It would still be nice if it would get an operatic or (preferably) mini-series treatment because the novel deserves it.

"the book is very dark and philosophical, and more about the nature of perception and how that shapes who you are. yes, that is in the play, too, but the book was deeper and darker and extraordinary"

But that's not an opera, that's a thesis. Rule of thumb: if it doesn't contain sex, passion, violence and death, it's not an opera.

Mini-series, I agree with. On HBO, preferably. But God spare us from an opera.

'Rigg says Ambrose’s decision to spend more time with her family is “perfectly understandable,”'

I thought Rigg was old school. If that's the case what she said makes little sense. It's always been understood in the theater your career comes first. And I've never heard of an Eliza doing 7 performances before.

I bet it never happened during the original run or during tours or the '76 revival. It is lousy to the people paying for Sunday matinees. Will they be able to exchange tickets? This really is a case of younger performers no longer having physical stamina required for theater. Or simply knowing they can get away with it. I bet there was a time when a performer would have been too humiliated to even broach it to a producer.

People shouldn't be going to matinees anyway. Theater when there is sunlight is just wrong.

Also going to movies during the day as well.

Is that so, R90?

Roll away, Bill...roll away. R92 It's still wrong.

And don't forget us high-heeled Greeks!

It does seem odd that no-one bothered to tell the rest of the cast about it, and they had to learn of a change in their leading lady from the newspaper.

R89, I'm sure Rigg only added the "perfectly understandable" comment in order to be diplomatic and not seem as if she was attacking Ambrose personally, just that she's from a time when virtually nothing got in the way of a performer being there when the curtain rises. Rigg is from the same generation as the late, great Marian Seldes, who I'm sure would have said the same thing.

I can't see My Fair Lady again. The movie is too iconic and I compare everything to how it was done in the film. I even love Marni Nixon's singing. Two for the price of one. Hepburn really is a consort for a king.

The 50th anniversary blu ray is jaw dropping. God they made magnificent movies once upon a time. Just the stately transition from the opening title flowers to the people descending the stairs after the performance of Faust you're like 'Holy shit this is really going to be something.' It probably hasn't looked this good since its original roadshow run. What talented giants these people were.

You in danger Gurl.

I saw Hello Dolly last weekend and Victor Garber looks old. Like grandpa old. Also he did that thing I hate where actors fake breaking character because they want a cheap laugh. Nathan Lane used to do it all the time.

R31 Carmen Jones was great. After a season of mostly disappointingly updated revivals on Broadway, Carmen Jones was a relief. And the cast sounds amazing. I can't imagine Anika Noni Rose will be taking off Sunday matinees like some.

[quote]but she literally stops acting when she begins singing and it's one of the strangest things I've ever seen. Lots of weird hand gestures, possessed eyes, and strange posture. I remember her singing most of "Show Me" to the ground instead of Freddy.

Wow, you captured exactly what I saw as well. When she would sing, I wanted to scream out "Posture! Posture!" It was as if her vocal coach told her to sing to the ground and move her hands in a circular motion to get out more "rounded tones". Song over and then back to acting.

I really dislike the film of MFL. It’s incredibly stagey, and filming the whole thing on soundstages has a deafening effect. How Hepburn could have thought she could pull off the singing is beyond me, if she’d been smart, she should have accepted it from the getgo and worked closely with Marni Nixon, the way Deborah Kerr did, her performance would have been better for it, and so would Nixon’s.

High-heeled Greeks, r94?

Wasn't Steven Schwartz's 'son' an opera composer for a hot minute? Or an opera director? Or was it an opera usher? Maybe he can work on the Wicked opera.

I’ve heard that many news outlets are picking up on the Chicago actor bully/suicide story. This may be the tip of the iceberg.

Scott Schwartz is a director, r103, not a composer. He directed his dad’s opera of “Seance on a Wet Afternoon,” but I don’t know if he’s done other operas.

[quote]Bobbie added: “I am saddened by Jeff’s tragic passing, for him and for his family.” Stifelman didn’t get back to us.

Wow, that is a really tepid response from Bobbie, although perhaps his legal counsel advised him not to say much.

Who was the cast member who posted a tribute on their IG, only to have the person who filled in for him comment “great working with you all last week!”?

Maybe the Chicago scandal is the one that will finally lead to a hard-hitting NYT piece.

This news f4om the cast of Chicago is just shocking and heartbreaking!

Apparently, Bart Sher tweeted something in defense of Ambrose and chastising Rigg!

Don't make Miss Rigg have to don her leathers, Bart!

R87

"But that's not an opera, that's a thesis. Rule of thumb: if it doesn't contain sex, passion, violence and death, it's not an opera."

Wicked contains all of that, even the 'safe for children' musical version: The Wizard roofies Elfie's mom and knocks her up, the unadulterated loathing/whatever that Galinda and Elphaba feel is confused but consistently passionate, Fiyero's violent 'end' is off stage as is the death of the witch but both are required elements of the story.

Let’s not forget that Benanti was ‘destined’ for She Loves Me but ended up displaying the warmth of vanilla ice cream.

Ambrose had no posture problems two Saturdays ago and got a MET Opera diva like ovation after I Could Have Danced All Night.

Mrs. Higgins is the Broadway musical equivalent of Beatrice Straight in Network. Rigg isn’t doing this for her theatre stamina Anglophiles. I hope she’s spending a year of luxe casting paychecks in NYC to get some much needed dental work and a neck lift.

Oh, and someone should do a quick list of all the matinee fill-ins that have been a staple of theater divas over the years.

Gee, who would have wanted to learn that Kathie Lee Gifford was subbing for Carol Burnett in Putting It Together almost 20 years ago?

Hah!

No doubt that article was written by a millennial idiot whose parents probably help keep him afloat so he can cobble together 200 word pieces for Vulture for college credit and think himself a journalist.

Not at all surprising that Sher would weigh in on this. I imagine he would have done the same thing for anyone in the company. I think Rigg really overstepped.

But did Dame Diana really have much of a choice? Her initial email was private (to who, it's not been revealed), not meant for publication.

How The Post got a hold of it, seems unimaginable but. nevertheless, when the paper called her about it for confirmation, should she have denied writing it?

Btw, those MFL wigs.....WTF? Are they made of Dynel??

Went to Sher's Twitter and didn't find any tweets in relation to this.

Well, Sher must have wisely deleted it because it was mentioned earlier tonight on ATC (by its moderator, no less).

Of course not, r117! Durable polyvinyl chloride. Nothing but the best for our Broadway ladies.

Will this woeful MFL signal the end of Sher's regime at LCT and these dreary revivals which progressively get worse and worse?

I agree R44, wtf was she thinking, and what the fuck was “the source” thinking as well? It’s just a total PR clusterfuck and very badly handled all around. I’d be rip shit if I were Ambrose (and really Diana, trying to soften the blow with “she’s giving a definitive performance,” whatacunt.)

And frankly, I hate defending Ambrose because she’s totally wrong for this role and never should have taken it.

R122 She is shit as Eliza, Good On DAME Diana Rigg, I do not actually think it was a direct attack on ginga fuck face, just a general note on how lazy kids are now.

No, this, r102...

"The idea of a high heel or platform shoe is actually a seriously ancient one. One of the first traced high-level pieces of footwear in history belonged to actors in ancient Greece, and were known as kothorni. They were flat shoes with wooden or cork bases up to four inches thick. However, these weren't necessarily worn offstage; they were actually meant as a kind of shorthand about the social class of various characters in Greek drama and comedy. The higher the heel, the more "elevated" the character."

Given the context, though, r112, none of those plot points would matter one whit to a serious opera audience.

WTF R126

A sexed up revision of Baum's Oz would make as much sense as anything else to a serious opera audience. Oz works as a uniquely American mythology that has managed to maintain some degree of cultural relevance in the 21st century.

The reason it is not a good idea is because opera is a very poor way to capitalize on intellectual property. Maguire lucked out and his percentage of Wicked has turned out to be a nice profit. But really the way the story works in terms of theatricality -- it really would probably make a very interesting opera for audiences but a terrible investment for everyone.

R127 HBO's OZ would be worth watching as an Opera, now THAT has all the requirements of Opera

And most current opera productions resemble the physical production of OZ.

Wasn’t there some gossip a few threads back about backstage turmoil in a revival with the cast in rages? Guess it was MFL??

God, when will MFL and Carousel close so we can stop discussing them.

Couldn't it just as easily have been Chicago? With what's come out the past few days, I've been reading that the atmosphere backstage has been toxic for a long time.

Oz works as a uniquely American mythology...

Yeah, yeah, yeah, we know. But opera audiences want the blood and thunder of HUMAN characters caught in the grip of fate, not a kiddie fable with cuddly animals and anthropomorphic inanimate objects, L'ENFANT DES SORTILEGES and CUNNING VIXEN, notwithstanding. And those works have never been crowd-pleasers in any event.

Saw this in a thread at BWW. Jeff as Mary Sunshine in the 1997 Macy's Parade.

Rigg should have said Ambrose was so wrong for the role the fewer performances she gives can only be considered a favor to audiences.

R134 -- that's actually David Sabella's vocal piped in from the OBC recording.

From all the sources about what happened on Chicago, the story is that Jeff L. was put through a bizarre rehearsal in which they kept telling him that he was somehow or other off in his big song. They made him sing it, again and again but, as the story runs, he was told he wasn't doing it right but the MD never went to the keyboard and showed him a correction.

(And Jeff himself says he wasn't doing it wrong.)

I've never heard of a MD saying "You're doing it wrong" but not correcting it (whatever "it" is).

If this is what happened, this is a very unusual incident, a shocking one.

Something is wrong with this story.

What's wrong with it, r127, is that Bobbie and Stiefelman were doing it strictly to gaslight him and get him to quit. They both deserve to be punished for this, but especially Bobbie.

Better keep the tylenol away from Lauren Ambrose after the Rigg bullying!

LOL, r139!

Sher was always going to do this with Ambrose, but the casting Benanti should really be pissed about is KMK, which would be a much better fit for her than the dull midwestern soccer mom

Ive always loved the London production recording of My Fair Lady because it was the one I grew up with. It was in stereo while the OBC was recorded in mono.

The cast sounds amazing. Everyone calls the OBC recording superior, but I’m so used to the London recording.

Amazed that 60-plus years later people are still fussing about the differences between the OBC and OLC cast recordings of MFL. In his liner notes for the OLC, the album’s producer wrote that Andrews was suffering from a cold. Might that not have affected her performance on the album?

[quote]Amazed that 60-plus years later people are still fussing about the differences between the OBC and OLC cast recordings of MFL.

Fuck. You.

Jeff story on FOX News now. I hope Chicago gets shut down. Stupid ass show. Someone making me sing a song over and over would drive me crazy too and saying im doing it wrong after 22 years? NO. Broadway showing its true colors. Fuck bobbie and all the rest of them. Crappy ass show has no place in the longest running shows.

Walter Bobbie directed that classic FOOTLOOSE. Not much of a talent – – unless he’s literally copying Fosse.

The level of conclusion-jumping on BWW based on one account of what happened is ridiculous. Hate Bobbie and the Weisslers all you like (and I can’t stand any of them), but until we at least hear from other actors in the rehearsal, we don’t really know what happened. For all we know, he had a break-up fight with his boyfriend and now the bf is trying to blame it on a bad rehearsal.

^^^Chicago PR in the house

R147 Another actress in Chicago posted this on Instagram Monday, before the news came out that he died.

Plus the fact that he took extensive notes in the first place. I think he was going to file a complaint with Equity.

[quote] I think Rigg really overstepped.

Really now? Rigg has every right to be pissed and say something. She is right , people are paying money to see THE ORIGINAL CAST and will not be getting it. Shows like "Evita" advertised the alternate and people knew before a single ticket was bought. All the people having tickets for future Sundays are being cheated. Also Rigg didn't sign up to work with the alternate.

Broadway can't have it both ways - hyping their 'stars,' especially pre Tony time, and then saying the show is just as good and we're not supposed to care when they're not in. Either they're stars or they're not.

The Chicago story has broken wide and it’s not looking good for Bobbie or the producers. And that music director sounds like a complete cunt. I’ve dealt with her type before and she should be drummed right out of the business.

[quote]God, when will MFL and Carousel close so we can stop discussing them.

We could always talk about FOLLIES some more

I think those people going to MFL and not seeing Ambrose are pretty fucking lucky.

I always have trouble with the “they drive him to suicide” idea.

There was obviously a lot more going on if having him sing a song over and over drove him to suicide

Agree, R137. And it doesn't help that we have only unreliable narrators (Jeff himself said he wasn't doing it wrong? Like he'd say anything else?)

Something is really wrong with this story.

Oh, come off it, R150. Rigg didn't sign up to work with Lauren and only Lauren. Understudies and standbys go on all the time--are you suggesting she can refuse to perform when that happens. And in terms of what the theater-going public's entitled to, this is the producers' issue, not hers.

I still wanna know about John Cariani's detective boyfriend.

Is Lauren Ambrose such a draw that people would be upset that she is not performing at the show they attend? I would file her under "interesting casting choice," but, although I do like her as an actress, she would not be the reason I would see MFL. Rather, it would be to see what different take a director had on the warhorse.

Good actors on stage know how to work with alternates, understudies, and covers. It happens ALL THE TIME. Dame Diana needs to shut her trap.

Why should she shut her trap? You don't shut yours. She has an opinion. And I agree with her. Properly trained actors should be able to do the eight performance schedule; actors have been doing it for a long time--and in this role of Eliza.

She's entitled to her opinion, and maybe she's right. She was stupid to criticize a colleague other than confidentially, and ticket sales are not in her wheelhouse. Whether or not she intended it to be made public, her comment's now everywhere and certainly won't do the MFL company any good.

re: the CHICAGO debacle -- one should be very skeptical of any "investigation" headed by lawyers for the producers, since it is likely that the intimidation by Bobbie and the MD was likely prompted by the producers. If Nixon and Trump warrant a special prosecutor so that the outcome didn't/doesn't look biased, then this too should be investigated by someone without any interest or agenda in the investigation's outcome.

Why does the Chicago MD sound like a complete cunt, R152? Because she didn't comment for a reporter?

Not sure why we're all so quick to believe this flimsy story.

Well....if you ask me.....

The Merm did 8 shows a week. Enough said.

I’ve got no problem performing with an understudy or swing...

Y'all can laugh, but Kathie Lee Gifford was actually pretty awesome in Putting It Together. She was probably more right for the role than Burnett. She asked Sondheim to change "wait a goddamn minute" in Could I Leave You? (she's very church-y) and he changed it to "wait a fucking minute", which, to me, was much more shocking. I kinda wish they'd keep it.

She was also surprisingly good as Miss. Hannigan in a production of Annie. I believe she was also super pissed that the network wouldn't let her out of her contract to replace in Sunset Boulevard. She really does have a great voice.

And of course she says “fucking” because the born agains won’t say “god damn”

She really ought to go back to the wedge.

She should not be airing her opinions publicly, nor should she be emailing the producers or director with her opinion about how or when another performer should be performing their role. The decision had been made, and it wasn’t going to be changed based on her opinion, moron R161.

That "Could I Leave You" was not well-sung and she created her own melody line in parts of it . Next.

[r172] what’s your god damn point?

FWIW, a friend who has become pals with Rigg since she's been in NY says that there was no leaked email, that Rigg called Riedel directly to set the whole thing in motion. I think that the Dame just doesn't give a fuck now that she's soon to be 80.

It's.....

That's right, moron R171, you are the only one who should have an opinion.

I love the Merm and her rendition of the song, but R175 shows why she never had a movie career. Lord, the mugging and awkward body movements she makes.

jesus, r176, try to develop basic reading comprehension. nobody has said she isn't entitled to an opinion. this is about the appropriateness of airing it the way she did, whether or not she went directly to Riedel.

Christ, Mary R178, she has every right to have and email her opinion to a friend or colleague. Emailing to Riedel (if indeed she did) was not a good idea.

Girls, girls! I just got off the phone with Diana and she's absolutely distraught that she's causing such a rift between you.

Hope Emerson???

Here's......

[quote]That "Could I Leave You" was not well-sung and she created her own melody line in parts of it . Next.

Damn it! (Not G_D damn it, of course!) I'm a fucking ARTIST who wrote a Broadway show!!! I need to CREATE!

[quote] nor should she be emailing the producers or director with her opinion about how or when another performer should be performing their role.

Actually, in the email, she complained that the change was not announced to the cast first. She had to hear it on the news. Valid point.

She then expressed her dismay that people who bought tickets expecting to see Lauren Ambrose would get a another actress. Valid point.

[quote]She should not be airing her opinions publicly, nor should she be emailing the producers or director with her opinion about how or when another performer should be performing their role. The decision had been made, and it wasn’t going to be changed based on her opinion, moron [R161].

You sound like a Republican.

So many wonderful treasures on Youtube.......

Would anyone buy tickets because of Lauren Ambrose? (Other than someone else with the last name of Ambrose, of course.)

Don’t bother, R178. Just block it. I did.

[quote]this is about the appropriateness of airing it the way she did

She didn’t air it. Riedel got ahold of a private email. Hd was going to publish no matter whst, but decided to call her to get her take in person. She probably had nonidea what a scummy person Riedel is - probably never heard of him before. Thd most damning quotes comes from her private email.

If there’s someone at failg, it’s whoever forwarded that email to Riedel.

Rather than being about Diana Rigg, this should be about Lauren Ambrose, who has proved herself to be a Broadway lightweight, unable to get beyond four months without cutting her work load down. And she needs “more time with her family”? Sprry bitch, should have thought of that before you signed on to star in a Broadway show.

Fine. She bit off more than she can chew. Get the torches. And one of her co-stars aired the company's dirty linen in public, but that's okay.

Question -- when did limited runs (say, less than a year, especially in plays) and stars vs. qualified performers as leads become not just accepted, but the norm?

Has anyone seen Ambrose's understudy in the part? Friends have told me she's spectacularly talented and much more suited to the role. Is she to be the alternate?

[quote]That makes Rigg's rant especially ill advised.

Somehow I think her career will be ok

I'm sure her career will be fine. That doesn't change my belief that her action was very bad for this company.

I assume Lauren's fine if you're in the first 10 rows or so, but my seats were fairly far up and almost nothing she did was registering. To me, it's not that she can't sing the role (she can more than handle the score), it's that she isn't a creature of the stage. I bet if this performance was to be filmed for PBS, people would probably rave about her. The contrast between her and Diana Rigg is unbelievable. Every little gesture and expression Rigg makes registers. Maybe her performance would seem bizarre if filmed up close, but I think it's always easier to tone down than build up.

Lauren's performance reminds me of two other performances in particular - Jennifer Jason Leigh in Cabaret and Linda Lavin in Gypsy. They were both either panned or got mixed reviews for their performances, because they were too small for the stage. The stage literally ate them up. They were giving subtle film/TV performances that weren't registering. I think you either have a knack for the stage or you don't.

I, too, noticed the weird shift in her acting during the musical numbers. It's very odd to see in person. She really does forget to act during the songs. Someone has to help her with that.

R195 is pretty much the only one who’s been posting anti-Diana Rigg crap and making excuses for unprofessional Ambrose. He’s a scold, and has decided he’s the one who should decide what’s good for the company.

Sher and the producers fucked up big time, first by acceding to Ambrose’s commands, and second by not telling their cast themselves and letting them find out in the press.

But oh yes, it’s Dame Diana Rigg who’s really at fault here.

Youve posted about this several times. We know your opinion. You don’t need to tell us again. We get it, perhaps more than you think.

Well, let's see what ignoring both of you does.

[quote]and Linda Lavin in Gypsy

Which is weird, because Lavin is a very experienced stage actress. Maybe she lost her stage legs doing such a long sitcom run.

I can't believe people still go to musicals. Aren't they sick to death of this shit?

And that goes for operas like Don Giovanni and Tosca too.

None of us needs to hear this stuff ever again.

There are, or at least used to be, clips from boots of Lavin's Rose on youtube. They confirmed the bad stories. Trainwreck.

Fer chrissakes, r201, do I have to do everything for you?

Jesus Christ! That has to be the worst "Rose's Turn" I've ever seen (and I've seen teenage girls, drag queens, and Tovah Feldshuh perform it). What was she even going for? It's like watching your drunk aunt do karaoke. No, it's not the singing I don't like. It's the awkwardness. I don't think she had any idea what that song is about. However, I have to admit, I rewound her "ba rum BAH" right after her first "everything's coming up Rose" a few times. What was she thinking?

I love how it looks like two people have gotten up and are walking out right during Lavin's last "for me"s. That's hilarious!

Sheesh r203, some people.......

As someone who saw Lavin in Gypsy, I can say that - yes, she wasn't very good. That doesn't mean she didn't have good moments during the show. It's probably impossible to a play a role that well written and not at least get a few things right. Every now and then, she did land a few laughs, but there was something small-ish and tiny about her performance. And as many have said before, she would sometimes use a weird Irish brogue during a few scenes. It would come and go, too, which made it even more bizarre.

I do remember liking her more than Betty Buckley and Tovah Feldshuh. They made for very cold and unpleasant Roses. Not a funny bone in their bodies.

Even weirder is this clip of Lavin performing "Some People" on some Jule Styne special. I think this was done at the same time that she was in the show, but her interpretation of the song is so completely different from that clip of her singing it in the actual show. She's actually terrific in this clip and very winning, showing that she could have been a great Rose. Did Arthur Laurents give her bad direction or something? I'd go as far as to say it's one of my favorite interpretations of the song. It's thrilling.

Did anyone ever see Patty Duke play Rose in Gypsy? I remember hearing she did it in some regional theater around '02 or '03. It sounds like she could have been fascinating.

Judy.....

Weirdly enough, that Jule Styne special clip of Linda Lavin singing "Some People" is almost exactly how I always imagined Judy Garland would sing it if she'd been able to do the movie.

I, too, saw Lavin's Rose, and while she was completely incorrect in the part (because she brought out Rose's terrible anger, which is supposed to be only latent, and had none of the playful charm), it was still interesting, because Lavin just isn't a boring performer.

I saw all the Broadway Roses, from Merman on, and Betty Buckley as well, and the role of Madam Rose is so well written that a good actress can't be dull in it. She can be wrong--Buckley didn't get a single laugh, and it's a very funny part. When you hear the Merman audio, you realize how many great laugh lines she has. And some of us may quarrel with this or that interpretation. But in the end, Lavin's was not a good starter Rose, for someone new to the work. But for the jaded aficionado, she was something different. Fresh. Yes, wrong. Wrong, wrong, wrong. But interesting.

And she was great in Superman. If you want to see Lavin in a role that's a perfect fit, she played (in, I think, The Good Wife) a bureaucrat who was really unhelpful to a character we liked. Someone with no personality who simply did everything by the book no matter whom it hurt. If it wasn't The Good Wife, it was around that time.

It was indeed The Good Wife, r211, and Lavin was wonderful. She eound up testifying in a trial.

[quote] Which is weird, because Lavin is a very experienced stage actress. Maybe she lost her stage legs doing such a long sitcom run.

Doubtful since she won a Tony after Alice and before Gypsy.

The whole Diana Rigg email scandal seems very fishy to me. I've worked at LCT often over the years and it's always been a very tight ship of loyal worker bees, many of whom have been there since Andre Bishop began in 1992.

First of all, who would Rigg have written the email to if not Bart Sher or Andre Bishop? And how would any schlub in the offices of LCT be privy to their private emails? If you know Andre you know he's not careless about this sort of thing. Did the original Riedel column mention who was the email recipient? Hmmmmm..........

I don't really get how Riedel got a hold of the email.

She won for a straight play though, r213. Perhaps with this it was a case of it being a musical and also following an actress who had won the Tony in that production.

I hate that so many Roses don't see to realize that Rose is supposed to be funny. At least in Act I. I saw Linda, Betty, and Tovah and they were by far the most humorless. They just came across as downright psychotic from the start or, even worse, just plain cold. They were easily my least favorite "professional" Roses that I've seen. Imelda, unfortunately, comes across this way on the BBC recording, but she wasn't that way when I saw her live. In fact, she was hysterically funny and charming when she was called to be. Bernadette wasn't terribly funny early in previews, but when I returned months later, she was very funny, scary, and brilliant. I think that some people are naturals in the role and some aren't and it takes a little while for them to find it.

I still feel bad that most people will never know how terrific Imelda really was as Rose because of that awful recording.

Keep fucking that chicken, R215.

I loved Lavin's one episode of The Sopranos. She was so entertainingly irritating that you were hoping Paulie and Sil would drive her out to the Pine Barrens and gun her down.

Dame Diana was OFF the night I saw MFL during Tony voting season so she can shut her privileged little trap about her tireless and talented leading lady.

And that email wasn't private-- the whole thing has been elaborately stage managed, as is obvious.

Which chicken would that be, r217? I was merely trying to come up with a reason why an experienced stage actress would be subpar in a role that, on paper, she'd be right for. I ain't got no pony in this race.

R192, I know that in the 1930s, Noel Coward would not do any show for more than 6 months.

But at that time, runs of a year were considered long runs, so I do not know if this was seen as being that limited. And for that matter no one had to be limited because the runs were short.

I was just reading about Lady in the Dark (in the early 40s). It ran two seasons but with a two and a half month summer break during which many lead actors left the cast.

R216, that's why I really loved LuPone's Rose. She was funny and surprisingly sexy--A full portrait of a woman.

Although many people hated Linda Lavin as Rose, when she sang it on the Tonys, it was the first time I understood that Rose's songs actually had melodies. Used to the OBC soundtrack, I thought Rose just shouted everything.

^ yes, I fucking realize it's not a soundtrack

Then why did you call it one?

Interesting NY Onstage this weekend about the St Louis Muny. despite the relentlessly mediocre Frank DiNelli. Is Beth Leavel doing Gypsy this summer?

Don't forget I also toured it everywhere from here to Elk's Ass, r221!

That was a scheduled off, r219. She was filming a High Point commercial.

[quote]Did anyone ever see Patty Duke play Rose in Gypsy? I remember hearing she did it in some regional theater around '02 or '03.

Are you sure you’re not thinking of Follies? Patty played Phyllis in a concert production of Follies in LA around that time. Patty was the only person in the world who didn’t have a good enough voice for Phyllis. I can’t imagine she would have been able to pull off the singing of Rose. (One of her problems is no sense of rhythm. Another is a terrible pitch problem, which was evident in those pop songs she recorded back in the mid-60s.

If she's cutting back at such a young age to 7 performances a week clearly tireless is not a word you can use to describe her.

Lazy, entitled, in above her head on stage. Those you can say.

Funny, r229. I was changing the channel about an hour ago and ran across Billie singing Butterflies.

Patty Duke did both Gypsy and Glass Menagerie but not sure if it was stock or more of a community theatre in Texas or wherever she and her husband made their home.

High School FOLLIES break.....

They lived in Idaho, r232. Andrea McArdle was the (awful) Rose in Texas.

I can’t imagine having to sit through Patty Duke gargling her way through Rose’s songs.

Could't Patty have interpolated "Funny Little Butterflies"?

Isn't Patty Duke mute and deaf? How was she performing in musicals?

That’s her twin you’re thinking about, R236

Yes, we get you too R197, you tired old twat. Blocked.

LOL at r238, the troll who always has to announce when he’s blocked someone.

The Anti-Rigg Troll, who’s been posting on various browsers, is actually an old “friend” of the DL theatre threads. He never really went away, but when he gets riled up about something, all the old earmarks show up.

Why do people have to announce they've blocked someone?

[quote]Why do people have to announce they've blocked someone?

Ugh. Blocked!

To bump my earlier question, does anybody know anything about Ambrose's understudy? I assume she's the new alternate and I've heard from friends she's much better in the part.

Patti Lupone IS Eliza Doolitle

I just saw Patti on an SVU rerun from just 3 or 4 years ago. She is no Eliza Doolittle unless Eliza is older than Mrs. Higgins.

R152, that music director Leslie Stifleman IS a cunt. I’ve dealt with her on numerous occasions. Just a toxic person to deal with.

The Justice for Jeff blog was updated today with an interview with someone who briefly survived that infamous Les Miz tour based on the first production. He quit, called the Hal Prince org and told them what was going on and the tour's musical director was fired the next day, according to him. I've read stories about that tour for years.

He has also worked with the Chicago MD before and didn't have much nice to say about her. He's out of the business now.

Hal Prince had nothing to do with Les Miz

Lavin chose to use the same bizarre character voice she used as Kate in BROADWAY BOUND.

If only Terri had the opportunity to essay the role on Broadway

R247 It was Phantom he contacted Hal Prince's office about. So he was told he was bad in Les Mis. He was told he was bad in Phantom. Could it just be that he actually wasn't very good?

[quote]Hal Prince had nothing to do with Les Miz

My bad. I conflated stories he told about being in the first Les Miz tour with later stores about being in a Phantom tour.

[quote]DuSold called director Hal Prince’s office the next day and told them the same thing, and to their credit, they fired the conductor the next day. Then DuSold got an earful from the cast, particularly the understudies, who had been enduring the same type of treatment for years. Some of them even cried. “They were all grateful that I had taken a stand,” he said.

[QUOTE]DuSold’s niece fought hard for two years. When she died, it occurred on a holiday and he called the show’s stage manager, Maureen Gibson, for a single day off to go to the funeral. Her response? “We don’t mourn our loved ones in the theater,” according to DuSold. “We don’t celebrate holidays. She’s not a blood relative and you’re just looking for a day off. No.”

Can we get Maureen Gibson a job on My Fair Lady?

Very good, r253.

Is this all from an article r252? Link please

It is linked several times above, r255. Google "Justice for Jeff blog Wordpress"

OK, I did it for you, r255.

Has this been posted before? The Rose's Turns posts up thread made me look up Bernie's stunning Tonys performance and I came across this video of her recording the song for the cast recording. I'm kind of astounded at how much emotion and power she musters alone in the recording booth. I saw Bernie's Rose late in the run and whatever hiccups there may have been earlier in the run, that performance still stays with me.

Thanks r256 this whole thing is very sad.

DuSold doesn’t give the best examples of bullying. He went on for the lead in Les Mis and apparently sucked, and he was told it was an “amateur”performance. Which may not have been all that nice but is not some horrifyingly terrible thing to say. DuSold calls that “harassment” and says that kind of remark “erodes (his) happiness.” Maybe the audience’s happiness should matter too.

Then he talks about how he went into Phantom, and didn’t fly into rehearse until the night before and was “vocally fried,” and wanted to skip parts of the rehearsal. He seems shocked the conductor was unhappy about that and told him he was wasting the conductor’s time. It sounds like he accepted the job with little notice but he doesn’t seem to understand why the conductor would be annoyed that he’s not ready for a full rehearsal.

His third example with the niece’s funeral is pretty bad, though.

[quote]Will this woeful MFL signal the end of Sher's regime at LCT and these dreary revivals which progressively get worse and worse?

Huh? You're bonkers!

Bart Sher's production of "The King and I" was one of the finest stage productions I've seen in 35 years in NYC! I saw the original lead, and replacement leads and both were superb. It was an excellent production!

Oh, and Linda Lavin has the MOST bizarre vocal production on earth! She ALWAYS slides into this weird Irish accent caused by her active tongue darting all over the place(?), and her tendency toward WEIRD vowel sounds. Her intensely overrated performance in "Broadway Bound" was a head-scratcher, yet Frank Rich demanded we see it as one for the ages, Irish brogue and all! Funny how difficult it was for Lavin to play a depressed Jewish lady, which of course she IS! She had no such difficulties in Charles Busch's "The Tale of the Allergist's Wife" where she wiped the floor with everyone.

She was followed in the role in "Broadway Bound" by Elizabeth Franz... who was superb.

R158,

I've met John Cariani's boyfriend. Nice man. As is John.

What about the infamous and legendary Les Miz purge?! Weren’t many actors bullied and fired without cause and humiliated during the whole ordeal? Info please!!!

R258 Thanks for sharing! That was a powerful performance. I think Bernadatte's my favorite Rose from the footage I've seen... or at least her "Turn" is my favorite.

R262 Thanks! I love John Cariani. He seems like such a sweetheart.

R219, she is Dame Enid. Enid is her actual first name and that is what is used regardless of what she is known as professionally.

Um. La Rigg hasn't been called Enid since God was a boy and would never answer to that, except maybe from her mum. If you were called Enid, you'd opt for something else sharpish, as well

R266, you miss the point. How a Dame is addressed has nothing to do with personal preferences. It is set in stone and the individual has no say in the matter. She is Dame Enid regardless of whether she or anyone else likes it of not.

Kevin Kline has that same problem, r196, especially his Hamlet - it's like going big and hammy (Pirates, On the 20C) is his only way to project beyond the stage

[quote]What about the infamous and legendary Les Miz purge?! Weren’t many actors bullied and fired without cause and humiliated during the whole ordeal? Info please!!!

As far as I'm concerned, the Les Miz purge was a near heroic thing. Richard Jay Alexander was called on the carpet, actors who had grown lazy were either pushed to deliver or sent packing. All contracts were honored, no one was "bullied" (whatever the hell that means), payouts were given and the show was in infinitely better shape when it was done. I'm sure Cameron Mackintosh can be a real dick (most successful producers are), but in this instance, I think he did the right thing.

[quote]I saw Bernie's Rose late in the run and whatever hiccups there may have been earlier in the run, that performance still stays with me.

There was never really any hiccups. Bernie, a human being was very sick in previews in the dead of winter. That was unforgivable to Reidel who made it a point to make her feel more miserable than she already was by reporting her out daily.

Lavin used that Irish voice thing in Anne Frank too. Bizarre. She did not use it in The Lyons and was great

Still not getting this. Who hasn't been called on the carpet at work? How do we know his death wasn't an accidental overdose--how long would it take for a "handful" of Tylenol and a tequila chaser to either kill someone outright or put them into a fatal situation? Did Jeff leave a note, or is all this being pieced together because he left notes about his confrontation with Bobbie (which I assume he would do if he intended to take the matter to the production office or Equity).

I have seen actors being called out at work and harassed and have experienced it myself. It’s part of the deal sometimes — some people are just assholes and sometimes life is unfair. If he worked with these monsters for 22 years then he knew how awful they could be. Not sure if this is why he died to be honest. Sounds like an accidental suicide.

I remember the feel in the audience at the 2003 Tonys when Bernadette stunned everyone and performed Rose’s Turn and got a standing ovation (which was rare 15 years ago) and then moments later her lost the Tony to Marissa, (who is lovely and a great performer) but it was still like, what the hell just happened?!?!

R260, R272, and R273 are part of the problem.

A combination of factors played against Bernadette that year. She was the only Rose on Broadway who had no tryout prior to playing the role for eight a week. Merman had an out of town tryout, plus the role was tailored for her. Lansbury had London and a US tour. Daly had a year-long national tour. Lupone had Ravinia and City Center. Even steel-lunged Merman blew out a blood vessel singing the score, missed performances and had the keys lowered when she returned, so it's demanding for even the most formidable performers. Bernadette got sick about midway into previews, returned to open the show, missed a few more performances after opening, and then came back too soon and was not in full health throughout Tony voting season, so in some ways, her loss was not necessarily a surprise (though her Tony wins are probably for two of her lesser Broadway performances). She was in command of the role once she was in good health and all of the tension surrounding the production had subsided. Too late for award glory, but she did find her way. Those who wanted more of Rose as a hard-driving battle-ax may not ever have dug her performance, but she found many unexpected moments throughout, sang the score well, landed the jokes and thrilled in different ways from some of the other women who played the role.

I believe that there needs to be an investigation r275 and I think there was harassment and abuse but where is the line drawn between giving notes and harassing? Obviously this was way out of line but sometimes notes can hurt feelings - that’s not harassment right? What will the union do ?

[quote][R134] -- that's actually David Sabella's vocal piped in from the OBC recording.—M. O'Haughey

Yes, r136. Reinking's braying "Are you kiddin'?" coming from Hartley's mouth was a dead giveaway :) Still, nice to see the original ensemble, even if Michael Berresse's fabulously furry chest is covered up. Anyone seen Rhe Cher Show in Chicago yet? I read he is playing Bob Mackie

[quote]From all the sources about what happened on Chicago, the story is that Jeff L. was put through a bizarre rehearsal in which they kept telling him that he was somehow or other off in his big song. They made him sing it, again and again but, as the story runs, he was told he wasn't doing it right but the MD never went to the keyboard and showed him a correction. (And Jeff himself says he wasn't doing it wrong.)I've never heard of a MD saying "You're doing it wrong" but not correcting it (whatever "it" is). If this is what happened, this is a very unusual incident, a shocking one. Something is wrong with this story.

I had a very similar thing happen with Bobbie once, [e137]. I won't give details, because it would instantly reveal me to some (I'm a nobody, but some people would recognize me), but I was told I was "doing it wrong" and my only notes were to "do better". I think he's more an incompetant director that got lucky than he is a malicious, though.

Miss Rigg had it relatively easy.

And what do you perceive the problem to be, r275? I'm just trying to figure out what might actually have occurred.

I think we all agree that Miss Kay Medford was truly the gold standard.

Rigg is throwing herself an 80th birthday party at the end of the month. Wonder who will or will not show up. (Plus, I totally believe she set the whole thing in motion.)

P.S. The Times is covering it for the Style section.

R269, thanks for that insight on the Les Miz purge.

I wish people would stop bitching about Marissa Jaret Winokur. She was wonderful and Tracy Turnblad is a great part. She earned that Tony. Laugh out loud funny, and she charmed the hell out of the audience . She and Harvey made a great team. Sondeimites think as long as you're playing Rose you get The Tony.

And people were paying Broadway prices to see Bernadette “find her way.” She was not up to the role, at least at that level.

Sondheimites do not consider GYPSY to be pure Sondheim

Yeah, they do especially "Rose's Turn". They had conniptions when he let "Glee" change the lyrics for Curt.

What’s the deal with the Chicago music director Stifelman? She’s a married lesbian with a small child and from what I’ve heard she’s excellent at her job amd many folks respect her.. and while she’s not warm and fuzzy perhaps she’s just got weird social skills? Are there other stories about her? Is this out of character?

Wasn't the story that Rose's Turn was essentially written after rehearsal one night by Sondheim with input from Jerome Robbins and John Kander (who I think was a rehearsal pianist or something) while Jules Styne was at his country house for the weekend?

yes. not sure about the Styne part of the story (I thought he was there for this), but evidently Robbins and Sondheim brainstormed the breakdown, with Robbins acting out the movement.

Very sad to discover cutie-patootie Mike Tacconi is straight. Look how cute in the center here.

Straight to the next gay bar

3 things- r284 it does seem that anyone who plays Rose is treated as if the Tony is presumptively theirs to lose. I saw Lavin I suppose on a good night. Sharp and funny & charming and one of the only times I understood why Herbie might stay. Perhaps not intense enough but definitely among one of the better Roses. Funnier than Tyne for sure. Why do we always end up discussing gypsy?

R293 - because it's the "King Lear" of leading musical theatre roles for women of a certain age?

[quote] I wish people would stop bitching about Marissa Jaret Winokur. She was wonderful and Tracy Turnblad is a great part. She earned that Tony. Laugh out loud funny, and she charmed the hell out of the audience . She and Harvey made a great team. Sondeimites think as long as you're playing Rose you get The Tony.

Horseshit. Winokur was terrible. She has a strident and unpleasant voice, she's a bad actress, she can't dance at all and she's charm free. I've said this before, but Tracy needs to be charming and charismatic and a fantastic dancer, better than all the other girls on the show. And Winokur couldn't pull any of that off. She constantly made you think- Why is Link so interested in her? Why does everyone think she's so amazing? When Nikki Blonsky played Tracy in the movie version, she was everything Winokur wasn't. If she had played Tracy onstage, she would have deserved that Tony. And Ricki Lake was through the roof charming in the original movie. She ultimately turned out to be a very limited actress, but she shone in that role and her later success was not a surprise.

Yet the Tony voters disagreed.

yes, they did. They have made many worse mistakes.

Ya think? Hi, my name is Lindsay Mendez.

Keirsten Anderson, the Eliza understudy/alternate is early 20s and spent over a year touring as Maria in the SOM revival. She was right out of school and, from what I've heard from friends who saw her, has a beautiful voice and made a lovely Maria.

Mrs. Anna and Rose are both roles that always automatically garner a nomination if not a win.

That would now be true of Dolly as well, r300.

One would think Eva Peron would be a slam dunk Nom as well but I was beaten for a nom by some Christian singer named Osnes.

Effie in DREAMGIRLS too

Albin and Georges have gotten a few nods over the years.

What's the word on Laura Osnes?

Every actress who ever played Aimée Semple McPherson in SCANDALOUS has been nominated. I expect that record to hold.

Bernie started getting a bad rap about missing shows when she was in The Goodbye Girl. Clearly miserable with the whole show, Betsy Joslyn ended up subbing for her alot. There was also one performance where Joslyn got sick mid performance and Nancy Hess finished the show. In recent years, she's never missed a performance of Follies, ALNM and Hello Dolly!

Bernadette also left Into the Woods fairly early.

Is that why she wasn't nominated? I remember Phylicia Rashad performing at the Tonys in that role. Also... wasn't Bernadette the one who gave Joanna Gleason the Tony for Into the Woods? What was going on?

[quote]Mrs. Anna and Rose are both roles that always automatically garner a nomination if not a win.

Don't forget us!

That was always the plan, r308. She only did the role as a favor.

Bernie had other things booked and told the ITW producers from the beginning that the most she could give them would be six months. Sondheim likes her and the producers wanted a big name to open the show, so they agreed to a six month contract.

6 months?? Such a long time!

^ Meant to add that there were no health problems or backstage drama that led to Bernie's leaving the show early. She played out her full contract.

High School Rose.....

Holy fuck, that high school clip at R315 is pretty great for a high school. The girl is obviously too young for the role, but she does show talent. It must be a very elite school, because how else would they be able to afford a decent orchestra like that. Does anyone know where and when this was?

Leslie Stifleman should get herself, her lover, and her baby a couple of blonde wigs and get the f. out of Dodge before they’re ran out. That woman has blood on her hands and the Broadway community cannot and will not stand for it.

It's funny, r316. I thought, I bet she wanted them to do Wicked.....

A friend who worked with Leslie Stifelman some years ago said that she is a monster.

well, r292, he went to a Christian college and posted that his new woman has given him an "unexpected" adventure...

Disappointing as he is so cute on Indoor Boys

That high school Rose is pretty good. She's basically just doing exactly what LuPone did, though. Then again, she's probably too young to really find that character for herself. Does anyone else think her speaking voice sounds like Winona Ryder?

There's a full video of Lavin's Rose that's out there and it isn't very good at all. It almost feels like they filmed a rehearsal. Then again, that one bootleg of Bernadette's Rose that's been going around is equally as awful. I think it was filmed during one of the infamous early previous and all Bernadette does is shout the entire time. It's very unpleasant. I saw her later in the run and she was phenomenal. I'd never seen a performer come so far from where they originally started.

We're never getting that new Sondheim musical, are we?

Wish Sondheim would team up to do a musical with Kander. Steve could write lyrics.

Not till Duffy Square come to Dunsinane...

Hats off the High School Rose.

I beg to differ, r326!

Steve Kazee is probably looking at writing a 'justice for steve' blog

no, R323, I don't think we are. he can't finish it.

Someone should grab that high school Rose for a production of Funny Girl.

I've often wondered why it's so hard for the people playing Rose to get the stuttered "Mama"s out right. I hate when they make it seem like Rose is thinking of her own mother. Even worse is when they look to the sky and scream out "maaaammmmmaaa!!!!" It's hilarious. Hasn't Sondheim gone on record as saying that that portion of the song is about Rose thinking of the conversation she just had with Louise where she says "Mama, you've got to let go of me"?

Oh, come now. We all know Lauren Ambrose will be playing the next Fanny Brice...4 nights a week.

[quote]Oh, come now. We all know Lauren Ambrose will be playing the next Fanny Brice...4 nights a week.

And by the time they get that production mounted, she'll have learned to act a song.

And Dame Diane Rigg will be *begging* to play Mrs. Brice. Begging!

[quote] Effie in DREAMGIRLS too

Really?

[quote] Effie in DREAMGIRLS too - Really? - —Sharon Brown, non-nommed for the only other Bway Dreamgirls

Sharon, dear, if you're talking about that '87 revival, YOU WEREN'T EFFIE when the show opened.

R273- There is no such thing as an "accidental suicide".

Well, according to this, Ruthie Ann Miles isn’t in The King & I in London now.

R337 Probably for the best

So what's up with these electronic cast boards and slips in programs announcing who will be performing AT THAT PERFORMANCE. It's confusing but that's probably the point. Management doesn't want to draw attention to cast absences. But it really is misleading.

Prayers for Ruthie.

That's so sad. I'm sure she believed she could do it, and it was kind of Sher to hold the role for her, but after such an enormous loss....

So is Walter Bobbie’s career effectively over because of this? What about Lezzlie Stiefelman?

Why should their careers be over. Worst case, they were harsher than necessary with a member of the company, who couldn't deal with the stress and either did or did not suicide. So far, no one on this thread has come up with a fact-based narrative that they caused this man's death.

There's a concept in law called the "eggshell skull", where a person can't be held liable for manslaughter if the victim had an underlying condition that put him at greater than average risk but couldn't have been ascertained by the perpetrator.

Sharon, dear, if you're talking about that '87 revival, YOU WEREN'T EFFIE when the show opened.—Lillias White

Fine, Lils darling. But your fat ass wasn't nominated either.

[quote]Horseshit. Winokur was terrible. She has a strident and unpleasant voice, she's a bad actress, she can't dance at all and she's charm free. I've said this before, but Tracy needs to be charming and charismatic and a fantastic dancer, better than all the other girls on the show. And Winokur couldn't pull any of that off.

[quote]Yet the Tony voters disagreed.

And a year of sold out audiences. But of course everyone else is wrong, only R295 is right, just ask him.

[quote] And a year of sold out audiences. But of course everyone else is wrong, only [R295] is right, just ask him.

And six more years of them AFTER she left. Clearly SHE was the draw. God, you're smart. Here we all thought it was the show.

Is it possible that both Winokur and the show itself were beloved enough to receive Tonys as well as attract audiences for years thereafter?

Didn't Bernadette have attendance issues going all the way back to Song & Dance. I know that's the beginning of when her voice started to sound like crap.

Spongebob is closing to no one's suprise

Look at that photo. That...fat girl on the right is going to be playing the Jessica Lange role in Tootsie the Musical.

Ethan Slater's fuckable. Also, isn't their theatre being renovated later this year? Seemed like its time was limited regardless.

R350, yep, the Tootsie casting is deadly, ESPECIALLY with the adaptation, the beloved characters aren’t going to be so beloved, not good...

The Great Santini: The Musical

It has potential, right?

Does Walter Bobbie really HAVE a career that could "effectively be over" now?

Walter was just in the Condola Rashad Saint Joan. So he can still pick up acting roles when he isn't directing.

Not to everyone’s surprise, R349. There were a few idiots on here who insisted it could move to another theatre when there aren’t any decent ones that are available.

Walter Bobbie can’t direct traffic

Yes, Ethan wears those pants very, um, well.

Was Sponge-Bob still doing decent business, or is it just because of the theater situation. It did get surprisingly good reviews.

[QUOTE]Was Sponge-Bob still doing decent business, or is it just because of the theater situation

Reading the article would've answered that for you

[QUOTE]The show’s producers attributed the closing to plans by real estate developers to temporarily shutter the Palace Theater, where the musical is running, to begin a complex project that would lift the theater above street level in order to build retail space underneath. But the musical has also been underperforming financially, compared to other large-scale musicals; it runs strongest during school vacation periods, with weekly grosses ranging from a low of $543,000 the last week of April to a high of $1.5 million during Christmas week.

A friend just told me that someone he knows said that Jeff Loeffelholz’s parents both committed suicide as well. Could this possibly be true? If so, it sounds like depression was hereditary for him.

[quote] A friend just told me that someone he knows said that Jeff Loeffelholz’s parents both committed suicide as well. Could this possibly be true? If so, it sounds like depression was hereditary for him.

Yes, apparently George Abbott and Hal Hastings humiliated them during The Pajama Game because they both had a run of the play contract.

[quote]where a person can't be held liable for manslaughter if the victim had an underlying condition that put him at greater than average risk

I don’t think anyone supposes Bobbie would be charged with manslaughter, or charged with anything at all. But the international press is running with this now as well (I just read an article in Spanish), and the bullying aspect is what everyone is pushing to the forefront. I can’t imagine a producer would be rushing to sign him as a director right now.

He’s a middling talent who got EXTREMELY lucky with Chicago. He may have to stick to acting from here on in.

Harold Hastings should have humiliated Janis Paige during The Pajama Game, or at least asked her when she was going to deal with her massive pitch problem.

Leslie Stifleman is the reason SpongBob is closing. The woman is a menace. Arrest her pussy.

[quote]Ethan Slater's fuckable

That’s what his wife says.

I just saw an episode of "Death in Paradise" in which a doctor was arrested for murder because he advised a friend of his that he had a terminal, degenerative disease (ALS), which he did NOT have, thus causing him to commit suicide.

OK, so who will play the fictionalized versions of Loeffelhokz and Stifleman on Law & Order:SVU? Because you know it will be done on that show. I guess it would have to start out with the lesbian music director being raped.

I was at a small community theater this afternoon, and before the show the head honchette came out to discuss the rest of their season. Here's the one that made me cringe: They're going to do "The Taming of the Shrew," as set in Bedrock. (And outdoors, to boot.)

So Fred is Petrucchio, Wilma is Kate, Betty is Bianca and Barney is ...?

Walter Bobbie has directed seven shows on Broadway in the twenty-plus years since Chicago. The only one that ran more than eight months was Footloose, which was still a critical and commercial flop. I don’t think ANY of the five commercial productions ended up having a profitable run on Broadway.

The only show he’s directed on Broadway in the past five years was Bright Star, which probably lost its entire investment.

Anybody see Royal Family in the Berkshires? The review in the Times was wicked harsh; but the WSJ loved it. Which is it?

Dolores Gray turned down Pajama Game. If she'd accepted, would John Raitt have got the male lead? It seems a bit odd that two stars of a flop (Carnival In Flanders) would be paired again for another new musical in the same year. Or perhaps Gray turned down the Paige role before Flanders' floppage.

That has to be one of the worst decisions Dolores Gray ever made.

Whoever thought The Pajama Game would be a hit despite George Abbott directing? A romance set against a union fighting for a higher wage in a pajama factory? It has dreary written all over it. And then it opens and it's the sensation of the season.

Was Dolores really in a position to turn down such a promising musical? She would surely have heard the score--a wonderful one. And the union background creates a unique story. A George Abbott show?

The true is that Dolores kept getting considered for roles because she was such a terrific singer. But she lways got passed over because she was hell to be around.

And she had that mother, too.

So what is Wesley going to do now

If I was dating Isaac Powell I am sure I could come up with a list of things to keep me preoccupied in my unemployment.

But it was based on a popular book of the time, r375.

This is kind of interesting. Based on this little bit of each, I vote Bernadette. However, I saw her and Tyne and preferred Tyne overall.

But it’s annoying how many of the women sing “may” for the last word. I get the vocal reasoning, but it’s annoying.

If I hear that damned Rose's Turn one more time, I will cut somebody.

I'll do it for you, r381. For you! For You! For YOU!

Patty Duke did several plays and I think 1 musical (Gypsy) in Spokane Washington, which was just over the bridge from where she lived in Coeur d'Alene Idaho. She also did Follies in Los Angeles, California as part of the Reprise Series. I read that it depended on what night you saw her doing this, if you thought she was right for the part or not 😀

No review of a musical can be considered a "rave" when it leads off by stating the score is forgettable and doesn't work (as friends corroborated this weekend)...

Bernadette's wig is easily the worst.

I also read that Patty Duke was absolutely wonderful in Gypsy, in Spokane Washington. I think it also depended on what night you saw it, how well she sang the part, but regardless of what night you saw it, her acting was always spot on.

What show are you talking about r384?

Patty also played Aunt Eller in the last "Oklahoma" revival on Broadway

....and Mme Morrible in San Francisco!

Anybody hear more about the Justice for Jeff campaign? Will it really change How rehearsals and actors are treated?

[quote]Will it really change How rehearsals and actors are treated?

Probably not, but Walter Bobbie and the Musical Director should be grilled. What was the rehearsal for? What was the proof Jeff wasn't doing the role correctly? What needed to be changed about his performance?

And if Jeff were a black person, Cynthia Erivo would be all UP in this shit!

tempest in a teapot.

From the latest blog post:

“In the family’s letter to the producers it stated that their “intention is to end the institutional intimidation, harassment and bullying at the Ambassador Theater by the immediate removal of Leslie Stifelman and discontinuing Walter Bobbie’s access to the theater and cast.” Furthermore, their hope is there will be an examination of these reported practices in the theater.”

Wow.

I can see Patty Duke acting the shit out of Rose, but singing it? I can't even imagine. She could barely handle Phyllis in Follies and I always thought that was a role even your drunken aunt could sing.

[quote]tempest in a teapot.

Or, for our British readers, storm in a teacup.

Which is more likely to happen:

Kevin Spacey gets a starring role in a new Broadway play

Jodie Foster appears in "Assassins."

I kinda love that one clip in that Rose's Turn montage where the roses are let loose from above and one musicians leaves the orchestra after each "for me" until Rose delivers the final "for me" without any accompaniment. It kinda sounds like what the creators originally intended with the song. They were just going to have Rose screaming "for me" with tons of dissonant strings shrieking in the background until Oscar Hammerstein said the audience needs to applaud it's star so they gave the song an ending.

Anyway, very interesting staging. I think Bernadette and Liza come across the best in that montage. Liza really did have Rose in her. A shame she never got to play the role.

I do wonder why so many people tend to sing "for MAY" instead of "for me" at the end of the song. Is "may" easier to project and a more pleasant sound or something? I did notice that some of those who sang "me" instead of "may" sound a bit strained and lacking heft. Except for Buckley who owned that final note.

[quote] Liza really did have Rose in her. A shame she never got to play the role.

Schweety, I'm not dead yet. I jusht need to have my replacement hipsh and kneehs replaced again and I'll be jusht fine.

The "eeee" sound is closed off and hard to sustain, whereas the "Maaaay" is wide open. I think that's the only explanation.

R394 as I said in my other posting, it really depended on what performance you saw of hers. Some were on Pitch, other times maybe not so much LOL

Could Patty have been worse than Tovah? I saw her and not only was she humor-free and charmless, but she had the range of a bass or baritone and I think she was "singing" in Roz Russell keys. And she sure loved pulling out that head voice a lot when it wasn't needed.

Did anyone ever see Tovah play Dolly? I can't imagine her being very funny.

Didn’t Tovah play Dolly with an Irish accent? And wasn’t that the show where she notoriously threw a cast party, but there were some stipulations attached - can’t remember what exactly.

I think she was just bringing the plates or something. Everyone else had to bring the food.

Everyone's coming up Rose's what?

Why is Bway so boring this season? I have a Weds off and there's nothing I want to see.

A Broadway actor commits suicide over a rehearsal where he was bullied and nobody has any more dirt on the suvject? It’s all about Rose’s Turn and Follies yet again. Ugh

Well, I don't think any of us were in the rehearsal room, dear. So, about Follies...

High School FOLLIES!

Anybody see Tovah as Leona Helmsley?

Paper plates. Terri informed the cast that she'd bring the paper plates for the party.

Patty Duke had no sense of rhythm and little sense of pitch. The woman was NOT musical.

r405

that makes me laugh everytime

Hopefully she took TV and stage legend Miss Julia Meade's advice, r411.....

Saw Julia Meade in an off-off-OFF Broadway showcase in the 80s. She was made for commercials.

I saw her in a tour of Move Over, Mrs. Markham, r415. While she was signing my program I told her I wished I'd brought a Chinet plate for her to sign. Her look......

Perhaps the countertenor was losing his range? Voices can change as people age. It’s not unreasonable that he was now being taken to task for not being able to deliver the same performance for which he was hired, if that was the case.

If you can’t sing the word me correctly, you have no business starring on a Broadway stage.

R412 if you are talking about when she did Follies, Gypsy, and Wicked, it really depended on what performance you saw. If you watch YouTube videos of when she did the Mike Douglas show, the Merv Griffin Show and sang on those shows, she sounds good. I guess all those years of smoking, does not help one's singing voice 😀

[quote] Patty also played Aunt Eller in the last "Oklahoma" revival on Broadway ....and Mme Morrible in San Francisco!

It was the sit down "Wicked" in San Francisco and they kept extending her run. I think it was three times. Audiences loved her. I asked why she didn't come into to the NY show and she said. "They didn't ask me". Simple as that and she would have done it in a heartbeat.

r380 I don't know what note Chita sang at the end (or how many, even) but I'm pretty sure it wasn't the right one.

When Tovah played Dolly, Papermill sent out a press release saying she was the first woman ever to play Dolly GALLAGHER Levi with an Irish brogue.

I saw Yvonne De Carlo play Dolly with an Irish brogue in 1969. De Carlo, btw, was a first rate Dolly.

Tovah also wore a black gown for the Dolly number because she was, after all, a widow.

Sharon Brown was the best Effie hands down. And I saw them all including Holiday who huffed and puffed and screeched her way through the role. Brown was just heartbreaking mostly because she looked like a lost little girl which made her transformation in Act 2 that much more stunning. She's currently a standby in Head Over Heels.

[quote]If you can’t sing the word me correctly, you have no business starring on a Broadway stage.

Eat my twat.

Oh youuuu, r423. You made me look. I'll say the black over-layer does make it seem rather.....

Ppzpz

Actually that dress of Tovah's photographs much redder than it did on stage.

[R267] Sorry to break it to you, but while Enid may be part of La Rigg's entire name, she is not, never has been and never will be known as Dame Enid. If you don't believe me, hustle your ass to the Lincoln Center stage door and ASK HER !

For shame, r429...you know very well the fate that befell the last poor soul that did that. The blood stains remain.

Lee Aaron Rosen, the current understudy for Joe Pitt Is HAF! I just saw him in A Kid Like Jake. Has he gone one? Has he flashed the goodies? Is there any gossip?

Of course, Tovah would find a way to drain the fun out of even Dolly's dress.

I believe DeCarlo was a great Dolly. I'd have loved to have seen her. Did anyone ever see her Rose in GYPSY? It was after Follies. Maybe late-70's or really early 80's?

It's RED Mama!

Okay, I'll throw it out there after all this discussion: Gypsy is a greatly over-rated show.

Paper Mill finally changing those god awful worn out seats.

I don't think Gypsy is overrated, but it's been overdone recently. Let's wait 10 more years and lure Toni Collete back to Broadway to do it.

[r436] Mandy P is Herbie!!

Trans Mandy is Gypsy!!

Mandy shouldn't be allowed anywhere near Gypsy. Or anything else, really.

Mandy plays ALL the roles, including all three strippers.

Laurents' book is over-rated--the score remains as brilliant as people say.

Papermill does good work but has just about the ugliest house I've ever been in. I doubt they'll spend enough to change that even if the seats are more comfortable.

I encourage you all to go to that link at R433 and read some of Richard Skipper's ruminations on Tovah's turn as Dolly. Full of asides and non-sequiturs that will make your head spin!

One example:

[quote]Jerry Herman, we all love. He is an inspiration to us all not only because of what he has composed but also of what he has survived. He is one of the first miraculous survivors who got this disease when it was a killer. It was killing people and he had the money at that time and the wherewithal to outlive the fatality of that disease. That is extraordinary. She was invited to his apartment several times on Central Park West when they wanted her for Mabel. She remembers it was all grays and elegant. He was a designer. He had a great eye.

Jerry Herman is poz?

[quote]erry Herman is poz?

Yes, and he has been for many years. He was on death's doorstep at one point. But I think they found him a drug cocktail that worked.

Yes, r444. I've always heard that's why didn't write anything for several years after La Cage; he was too ill. But he responded very well to the new drugs in the 1990s. Can't source that, just what I heard from friends.

Meanwhile I read a little while ago on BWW that Richard Skipper's Call on Dolly website is down for a couple of days while he moves it to a new server, but it will be back.

A friend worked on a show with Tovah and Tovah had my friend as a Secret Santa. All my friend got were CDs of Tovah’s music. Merry Christmas, folks

[quote] Oscar Hammerstein said the audience needs to applaud its star so they gave the song an ending.

In her biography, Merman insists it was her idea to end the song so she could get her applause

[quote] And I said "Look, I have to have a finish for this. I've worked too hard. I demand that I have a finish - 'for me, for me, for MEEEE!' Vooooom! Then let her (Sandra Church) come in."

I don't think Laurents' book is overrated. It's easily one of the best books of a musical ever made, but these days, some of the jokes don't land and I remember him cutting and changing bits here and there in the last revival to keep up with the times. I thought they were all good cuts and changes.

R447, that’s reminiscent of back in the mid 1970s when Vulva Toadstool was in Stratford, Connecticut for the summer and couldn’t understand why the company hated her so much. Her agent advised her to throw a picnic for them. She put up a big poster backstage which announced she was hosting a picnic on Stratford Common-and “Bring your own food and drinks” was prominent and underlined at the bottom of it.

r449 What are the best and worst changes to a play or musical that has been continuously tinkered with over the years?

I'd say the worst has to be Wait Until Dark, which while not high art, was a damn near perfect little trinket of suspense. It wouldn't surprise me if all the re-tooling was a response to Roger Ebert's asinine movie review (he couldn't get over how somebody in the 60s could have an unlocked door).

The recent Jesse Furgason Fully Committed was chock full of needless updates. You'd think if they were going to spend time revising a comedy they'd at least try to... make it funny?

I don't mind the movie-ifications of Grease and Sound of Music. Grease is terrible to begin with, you might as well turn it into a movie jukebox musical and SoM is so culturally engrained that I understand why some people would crave the comfort of the original song order (and I Have Confidence is quite winning).

Rannells is on Colbert now. Is he wearing a wig?

Holy Christ, that Richard Skipper thing needs to be read to be believed.

Is Rannells off book?

[quote]Is Rannells off book?

I'm not sure what you mean, r454, but he and Colbert seemed comfortable with each other.

R452, his hair looked good but not all that natural. I don't know what that means.

He just said he'll be 40 next month, which makes me feel old, and he related a couple of moderately funny backstage stories from BITB.

[quote]he and Colbert seemed comfortable with each other.

That’s because they’re fucking.

R327 Don't call the show "Gypsy" that fucking Mockingbirdgirl will start call yoiu a racist.

There’s nothing wrong with the book with the book to Gypsy that couldn’t be fixed by bringing in Harvey Fierstein as a script doctor!

ummm- go on telecharge and look at any Hello Dolly performance with Bette- there are TONS of tickets available. So much for that fake 'extension sold out on day 1' rumor...

and why the hell isn't the show taking TV ads like they did for the past year (or print ads for the matter)....

row H on the aisle available for the 2nd weekend matinee for regular prices???

So when will the Broadway SJWs insist the title Gypsy be renamed Rose-Louise?

[quote]Papermill does good work but has just about the ugliest house I've ever been in. I doubt they'll spend enough to change that even if the seats are more comfortable.

You've never been to Bucks County Playhouse obviously.

I've seen the play "Crimes of the Heart" several times. It's long for a play, I think it usually clock in around 2 hours 20 minutes. But when they make cuts, they always cut some of the really good bits.

The last time I saw it was off-Broadway. Kathleen Turner had directed it and it laid there like a stinkbomb. She didn't get the Southern gothic humor. I don't even think she understood it was a comedy. Sarah Paulson played the middle sister who left to be a singer. She was meh.

Stephen Colbert likes all the gay boys. He secretly fucks them all. Remember him and andrew garfield?...Rannells better be off book or im calling walter bobbie.

Gypsy cuts: Thank goodness that awful Mr. Kringelein scene in the hotel was cut,. It always fucking lays there and stops the show cold. And not in a good way. It's just not funny. However, I did miss the 'Small World' reprise after Herbie walks out.

It was that cunt Cindy Adams who told the world Jerry was pos back when it was still only known to jerry and his friends. Cindy is one evil bitch. Had something against Jerry and is anti-gay.

They could cut Little Lamb from Gypsy and nobody would miss it.

Over my dead body.

Finally saw BITB and I thought Ranells was one of the best things in it. Larry is not the greatest part to begin with, but he got every laugh including ones that aren't even there. Everyone did a good job (though Matt Bomer tended to recede into the wallpaper a lot,) but oy, that play does not hold up well. Creaky and offensive. So many of the lines that once were funny just feel old.

The worst rewrites were Tennessee Williams' rewrites to Glass Menagerie.

While it has been discussed, the Wait Until Dark rewrites completely baffle me. The make no sense and ruin the play. I am sure that one of the reasons is that the female lead appears to be too much of a victim. However, that is kind of the point. The audience needs to be surprised when she rises to the occasion.

I wonder about the rewrites to Noises Off. The play never seems to be quite as good with the new script.

Speaking of Noises Off r469 why has nothing ever achieved the perfection of the original Broadway proaction. I recall laughing harder than I ever have in a theater but no subsequent production has even come close, even taking into account my inevitable lack of surprise at the proceedings - but now it's really a bore

Alchemy, r470......

Richard Skipper’s DOLLY website has some good information and potentially good interviews but the lack of writing skills, organization and grammar make it a trial to read. I’ve often thought of “gently” suggestioning he hire an editor but I think any criticism would send him into a complete tailspin and melt down.

He legitimately believes he will get a book published?

[quote]why has nothing ever achieved the perfection of the original Broadway proaction. I recall laughing harder than I ever have in a theater but no subsequent production has even come close, even taking into account my inevitable lack of surprise at the proceedings - but now it's really a bore

Because you need actors who can play farce. Farce is rarely done anymore and American actors have lost their "comedy" chops in general. The Brits are still good at it because every Christmas they put on Pantos which require that exaggerated style of comedy.

For example, In the 2001 American revival, Patti LuPone was cast as Dottie Otley. Patti LuPone isn't funny. This was a role that was originally created by Patricia Routledge, the queen of farce. LuPone stank up the role so bad and missed half the sight gags.

I was disappointed I didn't get to see how Jane Curtin fared in the role, r473.

R469, I think this is why none of the rewrites Williams did for later productions of Glass Menagerie were ever published.

All that most of us have access to are the acting edition and book edition of the first script. The book edition seems to be what they went into rehearsal with and the acting edition is what they opened with.

Yes, the Brits have many farceurs. Look at the casts of The Play That Went Wrong.

[quote]I was disappointed I didn't get to see how Jane Curtin fared in the role

I wish I had seen her too. But I bet she didn't reach the level she could have. If the director doesn't build all the funny little tics into Dottie's character then the actress can only do so much. It's not a play that runs well on just the dialogue.

One of the things that both Patricia Routledge (London) and Dorothy Loudon (Broadway) were given was the room to build in all the little silly farce things like double takes, "well I never" takes, etc. And that's what made the show funny.

For "Noises Off" the actress playing Dottie really has to be a "Marie Dressler in Dinner At Eight" type. It can't be faked like Patti LuPone tried to do. She's a grand actress slumming in the provinces in the role of a cockney maid. Part of the humor is how the mighty have fallen. LuPone never got that.

I don't recall Loudon doing grand-slumming in it - but it was long ago

Loudon didn't play it as a grande dame; however she was extremely funny in the role. She was befuddled at times and dogged in her attempts to get that can of tuna fish, even more than the thousands of actors and actors who still do those fucking overdone Christopher Durang tuna fish monologues which casting people hate.

and actresses

Sardines, r480.....

The music director for "Chicago" has been ok with all those non-singers (Wendy Williams, Christie Brinkley, Melanie Griffith...) when they stunt cast it, but this gifted and trained musician isn't cutting it for them?

Patricial Routledge also did not play Dolly Otley as a grande dame. In fact, I cannot think of anyone who has played it that way.

The script specifies that she is a well-to-do TV actress. She is not posh.

[quote]The script specifies that she is a well-to-do TV actress. She is not posh.

But she thinks she's posh. She thinks that she really shouldn't be slumming it with these other amateurs. It was a forerunner of Routledge's "Hyacinth Bucket" character. She thinks she's more than she is.

Yes, you're right -- sardines.

What gifted and trained musician are you talking about, r483?

[quote]Finally saw BITB and I thought Ranells was one of the best things in it. Larry is not the greatest part to begin with, but he got every laugh including ones that aren't even there. Everyone did a good job (though Matt Bomer tended to recede into the wallpaper a lot,) but oy, that play does not hold up well. Creaky and offensive. So many of the lines that once were funny just feel old.

Saw it last week and the house roared through out. I saw the movie and didn't laugh once and this was funny thru out. Matt Bomer didn't recede, his character got out of the way as each did because everyone got a chance to shine. My favorite was Zachary Quinto, who barely had a line that wasn't laugh out loud funny. Loved every minute of it.

Bomer in underpants is never a bad thing.

Annie's MUCH too curvy for Erte.

R483 EXACTLY. By the way, where are the Sardines?

That Erte number is a treasure. Simply delightful. She really is a superstar.

[quote] Annie's MUCH too curvy for Erte.

Honey, everyone is too curvy for Erte. Even in his time her was criticized for designing for the bodies of 13 year-old boys. .

I'm not too curvy and I look fabulous in Erte, r493. Of course I do still have the same body as when I was 13. O.K., O.K., maybe not EXACTLY the same.....

R484, Celia Imrie played her as posh in the Old Vic production I saw a few years ago. And it didn’t work.

Noises Off is kinda the same as Boeing Boeing. When they're good, they're hysterically funny, but when they're not...oh, boy. The issue is that the dialogue in both of those isn't really that funny. They have funny situations that have to be sold by the actors. You have to make sure you cast people who can do farce, which is hard to find these days.

I was in productions of both of these shows and had always heard how funny they were...and then I read the scripts and realized it was our job to make the shows funny. The scripts were no help.

The Moulin Rouge stage.

Wow, that Moulin Rouge set looks fantastic. Is that a rendering of the potential Broadway stage? or is that what is in Boston? It seems rather elaborate and expensive to do all that for a Boston try-out.

Yeah, that's the set from Boston.

R495, I adore Celia Imrie, but I cannot see her in Noises Off. She just in't a physical comedian. She is great at verbal banter, and she does play posh well (she really isn't playing it. She is posh.) I would imagine that her performance just didn't have the manic speed of the other actresses.

It seems odd that the windmill and elephant are off stage. Also, the mill is wrong. That is a dutch windmill not the Moulin Rouge. The actual mill is squatter and has straighter sides.

The real Moulin Rouge windmill

It looks styled after the old one.

R503, it is still squatter and more turret like than the stage set.

That may be, but the stage musical does not purport to be a real-life documentary about the windmill.

I think the set looks fantastic! Who cares that it's not exactly? And the elephant is too grey. And the chandeliers should have ten light bulbs. It's supposed to evoke, not recreate. I might be in Boston this summer, and hope I will get a chance to see it, and Jagged Little Pill, if it's still open.

I love that both musicals are having Boston tryouts. That was the norm when I was a kid there, but it seems so much goes straight to Broadway now, with no chance to work out the kinks.

How unsurprising that the windmill poster is the same tedious poster who went on about Diana Rigg being Dame Enid.

R507 He really needs to get out more

Justice for Jeff

If your death notice is posted on AOL, are you really dead?

I HATED the original production of "Noises Off". It's not a very good play, and I may be in the minority with this one, but none of the 3 Broadway productions have been any good, nor have they been casr well. Every production has been tedious.

Yes r510 but you died in 1999

I saw The Royal Family of Broadway in the Berkshires and the NYTimes was dead on and the Wall St Journal very far off.

Laura Michelle Kelly was as boring, small and sad as she usually is and her love interest has great arms, which his costume showed off well, but his Grindr and Scruff profiles showed off better.

Sounds like a huge lawsuit is comin' a Chicago way.

I doubt it. What would it be based on? Wrongful death based on the mere speculation of his friends that the "bullying" led to his suicide a week later?

I know a few semi-name directors whose idea of direction is to tell people to do it again, only better. It might just be the only thing Bobbie is guilty of is a lack of talent.

When Andrea Leeds committed suicide who was sued?

Bobby Steggert explains why he left the theatre as opposed to the theatre being through with him.

THE ROYAL FAMILY OF BROADWAY has an excellent score, one of Finn's best - maybe his finest (although I am partial to ROMANCE IN HARD TIMES, another never-was/also-ran). The new material is very effective, so Finn clearly hasn't lost his touch (despite what LITTLE MISS SUNSHINE would have you believe). "I Have Found", "Stupid Things I Won't Do", "Listen To The Beat", "Bad Boy" and "The Girl I'll Never Be" are all on the level with his best work. The nasty NYT review seems to indicate that the problem lies more in the staging/structure/casting than the rest. I'm not sure Rando is the one to guide it to success, so perhaps they are sunk. One assumes it will not be seen again thanks to that review, so perhaps it doesn't even matter now. After 20 years of development, it will be a sad day if this does not find life going forward with a score as wonderful as it is. Is it just too hopefully outdated in concept/execution to catch on with modern audiences?

I would have sued Kate, r517.

I love Harriet Harris but she ain't Fanny Cavvandish. Paging MaryBeth Peil!

the Moulin Rouge set is literally breathtaking

Steggert’s manifesto is almost as poorly written as Richard Skipper’s

I liked Steggert as an actor but that was self important and insufferable.

R500, I like Celia Imrie in a lot of stuff but she really was very badly miscast in Noises Off. And Brooke was played by a redhead which was unforgivable.

Matt Lucas didn’t make it to his opening night in Me and My Girl in Chichester this week. The excuse is he has voice problems, which I think is bullshit. Lucas is absolutely atrocious casting as cockney geezer Bill Snibson. Good story about his understudy’s big moment, though:

Celia Imrie has the same acting style as Maggie Smith. They're not physical actors. It's all about the withering glance or the crackling dialogue.

"the Moulin Rouge set is literally breathtaking"

And the story and music will leave audiences gasping.

Really, R527? The greatest pop songs of the 20th century and one of the most romantic and dramatic tragedies ever written (Orpheus's CAMILLE), based on one of the most iconic movie musicals ever... yes, it's just like SPONGEBOB.

Ethan Slater is waaaay more interesting a performer than Aaron Tveit. Ethan plays a sponge, Aaron has the charisma of one.

So? MOULIN ROUGE! is not going to be sold on the stars. Although Tveit and Karen "I can't dance, peoples!" Olivo aren't bad choices. Who would you suggest, R529?

How can anyone even cast The Royal Family anymore? And Finn doing the music?

Is this a 9th circle of hell musical?

R478 - that clip was hilarious. I'll admit, I haven't seen many pre 40's films. Hell, I haven't seen that many pre 50s films. It looks like a hoot, though. Worth checking out? (And, no, I've never seen the stage production)

Here's a tweet about some of the new songs featured in Moulin Rouge

[quote]there was a royals (lorde) /we are young (fun.) mashup, diamonds are a girl’s best friend/raise your glass/ i wanna dance with somebody mashup, karen sang firework (katy perry), aaron tveit sang???? never gonna give you up + the one that goes take me on take on me

The original London production of Noises Off was breathtakingly funny. No production since then has matched it.

The online clips of the Royal Family score sounded.....realllllllly bad.

[quote][R478] - that clip was hilarious. I'll admit, I haven't seen many pre 40's films. Hell, I haven't seen that many pre 50s films. It looks like a hoot, though. Worth checking out? (And, no, I've never seen the stage production)

That's the funniest part of the whole movie and it comes in the last 5 minutes of the movie. There really isn't a plot to the movie, just various people in different scenes that all come together for dinner. It's fun to watch Paulette Goddard in the movie, but the movie itself can be a real bore.

[quote] It's fun to watch Paulette Goddard in the movie, but the movie itself can be a real bore.

Yikes!!! I meant Jean Harlow. it's fun to watch Jean Harlow's scenes.

Richard Skipper Presents is something every DL baby should experience at least once, it’s simply TOO too MUCH!

I'll agree with every single criticism of Richard Skipper talked about above but between his personal blog and his Dolly website he has preserved an enormous chunk of Broadway history that has not otherwise been preserved and needs to be.

Oh, my darling, r528...

Dahlink, R540... regrets.

So is Moulin Rouge a failure or a hit?

Dinner at eight is a wonderful comedy/drama. A cast from heaven, nice melodrama, Harlow giving a great comic performance and Barrymore giving a magnificent one.

And of course a super glamourous MGM production. Just accept that this sensibility is from a very different era. One of my favorites. I can't understand how people aren't able to put films in the context of the era they came from. I found it easy to do from a very young age watching old movies on TV.

Right R485. She is not Marie Dressler in Dinner at 8. She is not the real thing--she is a wannabe.

FWIW, the early reaction to Moulin Rouge on BWW was thumbs up for the physical production, but meh to the book and “score”.

I tried watching Moulin Rouge on tv but the editing was too much. I can't get into a scene that way. The same thing with Chicago. I happen to like long takes which can for me make what's happening more compelling in what the actors writers and directors are trying to do. They have to sustain interest.

I guess people today are very easily bored.

In other words R545, the exact same reaction to the movie.

[quote]FWIW, the early reaction to Moulin Rouge on BWW was thumbs up for the physical production, but meh to the book and “score”.

Gee, it was the first preview of an out of town tryout. How disappointing , perhaps that should close it today

This is from the Towleroad article, which I guess is from the campaign. The very end is what makes all of this supposition a big non-starter for me. If I were on a jury, I'd shrug my shoulders. Sounds to me like a boss being tough for a reason.

According to Loeffelholz’s own handwritten notes after the rehearsal, he went upstairs where he greeted the dance captain with a hug and the usual pleasantries and when asked how he was, he replied he was great but he was “ready to rehearse.”

At that point Hyslop said he received a text from Bobbie saying he hadn’t slept all night and was running late. By now it was 1:15 and much of the cast had started to arrive. Bobbie finally arrived at 1:20 and after small talk with Stifelman and Hyslop he said to Loeffelholz, “I want to hear you sing,” adding that Loeffelholz was “never on” and he wanted to know why. Loeffelholz hadn’t performed the role since the last week of February.

Loeffelholz sang Mary Sunshine’s signature song, “A Little Bit of Good.” Silence from Bobbie until he said, “Again.” Loeffelholz sang it again. Bobbie then told Loeffelholz he should quit “overperforming it and being draggy” (i.e., like a drag queen), because “it is not a drag role. You need to be believable,” according to Loeffelholz’s notes.

Loeffelholz sang it again at which time Bobbie told him he couldn’t hear his lower register and he asked Loeffelholz for “more volume! I don’t believe what you’re telling me!”

Bobbie then said he was very disappointed and upset and stormed into the theater’s lobby at which point Stifelman took over the rehearsal instructing Loeffelholz to start in the middle of the song, adding “You always do it wrong.”

Loeffelholz sang it again. Bobbie entered the theater again and Stifelman repeated to him that Loeffelholz always does this part of the song incorrectly and could they do it again, according to Loeffelholz’s notes.

Loeffelholz sang it again after which Stifelman told him he was singing the wrong notes and that it was impossible for her to follow him when he performs the role.

Loeffelholz sang “A Little Bit of Good” for the sixth time. Stifelman alleged that Loeffelholz was “oversinging it and talking too much,” according to Loeffelholz’s own handwritten notes. Stifelman had Loeffelholz sing the middle part and told him he was singing the wrong lyrics. Loeffelholz’s notes simply state, “I was not.”

Stifelman then asked Bobbie if he wanted Loeffelholz to sing it again. Bobbie said no, adding, “We’ve wasted enough time.” Bobbie then said to bring in the rest of the cast and Loeffelholz approached him. “I walked up to Walter and he just stared at me,” his notes read. “I stared back and wanted him to say something.”

“I appreciate your loyalty,” Bobbie finally said to Loeffelholz, according to his notes. “But I am an actor too, and you have to respect the production.”

Agreed. Asking someone to do their job is not bullying

As some of us suspected, a tempest in a teapot. And with all due respect to Jeff, there's no reason to think he's the cause of the accusations and ensuing drama--sounds like overzealous friends stirred this shit.

How will Wayman survive without Bobby Steggert?

John Logan's book for The Last Ship contributed to its swift closing. Not surprising that it disappoints in Moulin Rouge as well.

R549 is part of the problem.

Hated the "Moulin Rouge" movie. Can't imagine I will like the musical any better.

I will like the musical better because I’ll know enough not to actually see it.

Can’t ever unwatch the piece of crap film, but I can easily never watch the shit show on stage.

[quote]Agreed. Asking someone to do their job is not bullying

Wasn't the point that they were ganging up on him because he was making too much and wanted him to quit so they wouldn't have to pay him out? That's not just asking someone to do their job.

[quote] How will Wayman survive without Bobby Steggert?

Steggert and Ivan Hernandez made a handsome couple in YANK!

r557, that may be true, but that accusation and every single embellishment as to why (and whether, for that matter) this was a suicide is coming from Jeff's friends. ATC even included a post in which Jeff's "notes" on the alleged bullying is characterized as his suicide note.

NONE of this is fact; everything other than his death is conjecture and speculation. Ridiculous.

How so, R554? By reading the deceased's own notes and forming an opinion? This campaign is trying to string up two people for what, to me, looks like them doing their job. From the accounts posted so far, it sounds like the director and music director were trying to clean up the show and make sure everyone was still up to snuff. This process happens all the time. If this guy had not committed suicide, who knows what he would have done after some reflection. Absent a suicide note that says "I'm killing myself because people at work were mean to me," none of us know what led to his suicide. The "ganging up on him" because they "wanted him to quit" is pure speculation. Maybe he realized he was slipping as a performer and knew his future opportunities were limited?

Rumor is that his husbear was dumping him because he had only gone on once this year and didn't have any drive to get out of the house. There was a big falling out culminating in the opened bottle of Tylenol. Wracked with guilt, the husbear is the sole person behind the "friends of Jeff" campaign.

See how easy it is to speculate?

At this point, everything about Mr. Loeffelholz suicide has to be treated as speculative, but certainly the circumstantial evidence strongly indicates he was subject to work place intimidation and abuse at the June 22nd rehearsal. There are very good reasons why abuse and intimidation are actionable. When an employer abuses and intimidates an employee (for whatever reason) they are assuming the risk of damaging that employee's mental health for some kind of gain. Whether that gain is psychological on ( sociiopathic) or , an expression of a toxic work environment or financial, abuse is a tactic and using that tactic comes with some real risks.

I would bet that nobody involved wanted Mr. Loeffelholz to take his own life. However, that rehearsal could have played a very signficant role in Mr. Loeffelholz decision to take his life. There IS responsibility under the law for how employers treat employees and for the work environment an employer creates for their employees.

Nothing in the circumstantial evidence I have seen ( and I have only seen what I have read on the internet) indicates there was a real effort to correct whatever was unsatisfactory about Mr. Loeffelholz performance. It certainly seems the rehearsal was called not to address performance issues, but to assert an employers desire to remove an expensive (and in their view) replacable employee throughmeans of indimidation and humiliation.

When a producer desires to replace an actor there is a documentaion process that takes place. Specific notes, evidence etc., of the performance deteriorating or the backstage behavior creating issues of employee safety etc. are gathered and carefully noted.

This is a very sad, regrettable and entirely preventable tragedy. Here you have (by many accounts) a man of rare talent who performed a difficult role for over 20 years and it appears he was treated with little respect or kindness, which is something everyone deserves and is owed.

Why the producers just didn't buy him out, respecting the agreement they entered into with him remains a mystery. Obvioulsy, if they plan to run the show more years, they would still be saving money hiring a new term player an scale +10 or scale. If they are planning to close the show in the next year, they still could have saved money. It doesn't look good.

One thing i can tell you with 100 percent certaintly is that every producer, company manager and instituion that produces professional theater will pay very close attention to this situation and take steps to make sure everyone has a working understanding of bullying and abuse, creating internal controls to prevent situations like this. I'm willing to bet every PSM and SM has already gotte word to be on the lookout for anything brewing.

There is a culture of abuse and humiliation in professional theater. The expectation has always been that actors will adapt to the bad behavior of anyone in a position of power over them. That is an immoral expectation. I predict this will change and change very rapidly as the result or Mr. Loeffelholz death. Legal exposure here is huge, expensive and honsestly, noboby want to be revealed as a bully.

For those eager to defend the behavior described in that June 22nd rehearsal: Everyone needs help sometime staying on track with their professional work. Actors are no exception. By many accounts Mr. Loeffelholz was a kind and talented man. His death will not be in vain.

What's the point of making someone sing a very difficult song 5 or 6 times in a row and expecting better results? Especially when you aren't giving specific notes as to what you want the performer to correct, or what he is doing wrong. The regular actor in that role is only singing that song once or twice a day on a matinee day. The voice tires after a while, especially when singing a high-lying aria like "A Little Bit of Good" as a countertenor. Why was Bobbie telling him "more volume"? -- the fucking show is all miked after all. This whole rehearsal sounds like intimidation and bullying.

[quote]Bobbie finally arrived at 1:20 and after small talk with Stifelman and Hyslop he said to Loeffelholz, “I want to hear you sing,” adding that Loeffelholz was “never on” and he wanted to know why. Loeffelholz hadn’t performed the role since the last week of February.

He was a standby. Don't standbys only go on as needed? Why would Bobbie think there's a reason?

I'm not rushing to defend either side, but if the production starts to question the quality of performance from a long-time standby or understudy, it is possible that the production would hold off putting that actor on, unless they had no other option. So, in the case of Walter Bobbie wondering "why," that could be a legitimate reason. Also, in the account of the rehearsal, it sounds like Bobbie had a very specific thing he was looking for. It sounds like they were concerned that Jeff's performance may have become too "draggy," since that part depends upon the big reveal. I doubt that "A Little Bit of Good" is anyone's favorite moment in Chicago, so it might be why they were holding the performance to a higher standard. There have been some very convincing Mary Sunshines over the years, and the few times I've seen the production, I have heard audible surprise from the audience when the male actor is revealed.

I sincerely doubt the Mary Sunshine standby performance was the squeaky wheel in a tired 22-year-old production. There's no way this targeting of him wasn't partially a financial decision rather than exclusively based on performance. Especially since Bobbie specifically mentioned his salary.

[quote]I sincerely doubt the Mary Sunshine standby performance was the squeaky wheel in a tired 22-year-old production.

And there have been some really TIRED performances. And we all know that some of the choreography was curtailed for the Roxie and Velmas that weren't dancers.

[QUOTE]Don't standbys only go on as needed? Why would Bobbie think there's a reason?

He had last gone on in February. Someone posted here that the regular Mary Sunshine had been off on vacation recently. So presumably that means that they had to hire someone to cover that vacation, rather than use the standby, which has to raise some eyebrows.

As for the claims that they weren't telling him what he was doing wrong - nobody can say that. The fact that Jeff didn't detail that in his notes doesn't mean they didn't say anything.

It sounds like they purposely chose not to put him on possibly in order to frustrate him and to illustrate that there was no reason for him to stay, he was never gonna go on again except in an emergency.

[quote]Question -- when did limited runs (say, less than a year, especially in plays) and stars vs. qualified performers as leads become not just accepted, but the norm?

This applies mostly to plays, not musicals. Because of high ticket prices, and other reasons, you hardly ever see a play produced on Broadway nowadays without at least one big star in it. And the exceptions to that rule almost never run more than a few months. (And almost all of them set limited runs to begin with.)

[post]Although many people hated Linda Lavin as Rose, when she sang it on the Tonys, it was the first time I understood that Rose's songs actually had melodies. Used to the OBC soundtrack, I thought Rose just shouted everything.

Umm, whether you like her voice or not, Merman sings all of the notes on her GYPSY recording -- she doesn't "just shout everything."

[post]Oh, and Linda Lavin has the MOST bizarre vocal production on earth! She ALWAYS slides into this weird Irish accent caused by her active tongue darting all over the place(?), and her tendency toward WEIRD vowel sounds. Her intensely overrated performance in "Broadway Bound" was a head-scratcher, yet Frank Rich demanded we see it as one for the ages, Irish brogue and all!

Yeah, that Irish brogue thing she does is very strange. I've heard her do it in several different shows, but only briefly at odd moments. FWIW, Bette Midler has an Irish moment in DOLLY! when she sings "That Sunday shine is a certain sign that you feel as fine as you look." As for that video of Lavin doing "Rose's Turn" -- you may disagree with some of her choices, but I think it's a very good performance, not even close to a "train wreck." Is Frank Rich a DL poster?

[quote]Mrs. Anna and Rose are both roles that always automatically garner a nomination if not a win.

Also Eliza in MFL.

[quote]So what's up with these electronic cast boards and slips in programs announcing who will be performing AT THAT PERFORMANCE. It's confusing but that's probably the point. Management doesn't want to draw attention to cast absences. But it really is misleading.

Yes, and when even the CRITICS don't know which actor they're seeing perform, that's a really bad situation.

[quote]Perhaps the countertenor was losing his range? Voices can change as people age. It’s not unreasonable that he was now being taken to task for not being able to deliver the same performance for which he was hired, if that was the case.

This thought occurred to me as well. But if course, if that was the situation, the director and musical director should have handled it differently than what has been reported.

[quote]I think this is why none of the rewrites Williams did for later productions of Glass Menagerie were ever published.

Can you summarize or detail some of the rewrites you're referring to? I know the original reading edition is different from the original acting edition, and I prefer the former.

Sorry about the formatting screw-ups in my post R570

It was wrong for them to use bullying as a tool to get rid of him. IE the crime was that they tried to force him out of the show in spite of his contract in violation of Equity Rule 34 NOT that they were trying to get him to kill himself.

Yeah Nick Adams had a telling instastory about going to see the first night of moulin rouge and on and on about how incredible the set was but notably didn't say anything good about the actual show (which his bf is in)

Unfortunately, r572, a violation of an Equity rule, if one occurred, isn't a crime.

From the Denise Nickerson Suffers Stroke thread....

R570, I do not know the rewrites because they have not been made public. I thought you were talking about them?

Actors have discussed William's giving them rewrites. Notably Maureen Stapleton and Pamela Payton Wright described in the New York Times getting rewrites during rehearsals for the 1975 revival.

[quote]As for the claims that they weren't telling him what he was doing wrong - nobody can say that. The fact that Jeff didn't detail that in his notes doesn't mean they didn't say anything.

The stage manager should have been in that rehearsal. He or she would be able to shed light on whether they were actually trying to get something out of him or just rehearsing him without cause.

Pamela Payton Wright always sounded like such an Actressy name to me.

What a horrible thing to do, r561. F&F this hateful person.

[quote]Pamela Payton Wright always sounded like such an Actressy name to me.

She’ll always be Dorian Lrd’s feeble-minded sister Addie to me.

Creating a hostile work environment is a federal crime under harassment statutes. Depraved indifference is a state crime. Bobbie's crimes much worse than Harvey Weinstein. Laws have caught up to govern dangerous behavior like this. I hope DA investigates and indicts.

[quote]I hope DA investigates and indicts.

This is New York. We just had our DA resign in disgrace and the woman who took his place is lost at sea.

Jeff L didn't go on for Ryan Lowe's vacations because, according to his contract, he would end up making too much money and it's cheaper to bring in a vacation replacement and keep Jeff on as standby. The cast of Chicago has been pretty tight lipped on social media but I have a feeling when they get their chance to speak this whole thing is going to blow wide open.

r570

when did Linda Lavin sing from Gypsy on the tonys?

I haven't commented yet on the Jeff L case until now. How do we know that Jeff wasn't terrible, and that irritated Bobbie and the MD, because they knew they couldn't fire him, even if he deserved to be fired? It's entirely possible. They might have taken out their frustration on him because of that, but, dear god, who here has NOT had a boss who was demanding and unreasonable?!? I for, one, was somewhat surprised that they even still had rehearsals for the show, thinking that it was set it stone and just coasting along. I'm glad to see that they continue to make sure the performers are on their toes and acting to the best of their ability. Bobbie might be a dick --I have no idea if he is or not -- but being rough on an actor is not that unheard of.

She'll always be Tillie to me, r580.

I don't think it would be possible to establish depraved indifference in these circumstances. Would a reasonable person know or have reason to know that his actions could result in a suicide the following week? Probably not.

Harassment under federal statutes that would apply to these circumstances is criminal as opposed to civil? Really?

[quote]Wasn't the point that they were ganging up on him because he was making too much and wanted him to quit so they wouldn't have to pay him out? That's not just asking someone to do their job.

We do not know that they were trying to get him to quit. This is the kind of thing that drives me crazy about the Internet. I’m not pointing fingers at this particular poster, but it worries me when people read something online and automatically assume it’s truth.

[quote]Yeah Nick Adams had a telling instastory about going to see the first night of moulin rouge and on and on about how incredible the set was but notably didn't say anything good about the actual show (which his bf is in)

Why would he comment on it? It was the first preview not opening night. Only Theatre Queens review previews.

Get him to quit...free. Fire him... $30,000 pay out. A lot of shit is coming out about Stifelman. Tick....tick....tick......

Not a single word that's available online with respect to this Chicago matter is fact: these are opinions, hearsay, speculation and gossip, mostly on a website established by Jeff's friends on which they make all manner of pronouncements and reach conclusions based on them. Eventually someone who attended the rehearsal or otherwise has access to facts may come forward and may be a reliable narrator. Meanwhile, it's impossible to draw conclusions as to what happened, let alone suggest criminal activity.

If Roxie had just asked Fred so sing a song over and over again without giving feedback, she would never have had to stand trial.

"Justice for Jeff--How Bullying Ended the Life of One of Broadway's Brightest Lights"

Hyperbole at its best. I wonder how long it's going to be before Chicago management goes to court to get this site closed down as libelous.

Speaking as someone who was bullied out of his job in the corporate world, I can relate. I was with the company for 15 years. Severance would have been very, very expensive so, instead of laying me off (they had no reason to fire me) they made my life hell. I couldn't do anything right. This was wrong, that was wrong, they analyzed me to death asking if I was happy, was I depressed, did I really want to be there, was this really the job for me. Finally, after nearly a year they caved and offered me a package if I would just go away. I took it and let all that shit go. I wish Jeff would have done the same.

I don't know what happened but based on what I've heard, that's not the way to get a better performance out of someone. If it was indeed harrassment to get him out, why would the Director and Musical director care? They aren't losing money. If that were the case, they must have been given orders from higher up, say...oh I don't know... some one like ... the Weisslers?! You know, the producing couple who just hireed someone to look into the matter. Pretty fishy to me.

I cannot let this edition conclude without pointing out that, if Bobby Steggert married Walter Bobbie, he'd be...

A second understudy is alleging abuse at Chicago.

We know. Bobby Bobbie, bubie.

R574

I think workplace harassment is a crime as described above by other posters. The Equity Rule however ropes in all the actors who depend on their union to provide a reasonable workplace environment as having been wronged -- not just the actor who was abused.

I'm just guessing. But it seems that just because Jeff died, they aren't off the hook. They still have to deal with the ongoing issue that they have created a hostile work environment for actors in violation of agreed rules.

I don't know, it just seems excessive to kill yourself over.

Has Part 312 been made yet?