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Why It’s Good That Trans Terminology Is Always Changing

While to some the word transgender feels brand new, the term didn’t spring up out of nowhere with, say, Laverne Cox or Transparent. When transgender entered the popular lexicon through the efforts of activists and aid organizations in the mid-1990s, it replaced transsexual, which had replaced transvestite, which was what they called cross-dressers and before that viragos. Transgender was and is regarded as an umbrella category, and in the mid-’90s the two primary terms under that umbrella were female to male (FtM) and male to female (MtF). These terms captured what were then the major constituencies of transgender identity: those who were born female and lived as men and those who were born male and lived as women. But even at the moment of their emergence into the vernacular, FtM and MtF weren’t sufficient to describe the whole community: They coexisted with terms like third gender, which captured those who didn’t experience gender as incorporating a sense of “to-ness” at all—it wasn’t a journey from one point to another.

The terms FtM and MtF hung on through the early 2000s, but they haven’t fared well in the ’10s. These days, the terms trans-man and trans-woman, or just trans-person, have largely replaced FtM and MtF, with a growing number of folks preferring to use trans-masculine or trans-feminine. From the outside, this could look like another minor semantic disagreement, the infighting of a group often derided for its sensitivity around terminology. But the shift of identity vocabulary within the transgender community merits closer examination: Understanding what the trans community is trying to assert and defend can help everyone—cisgender folks included—comprehend what gender is, where it comes from, and how it operates. These are important lessons in a time where the deadly workings of culturally valorized, indeed “toxic,” masculinity are more evident than ever.

The new transgender terminology has evolved in tandem with a clearer understanding of the categories of biological sex, gender identity, and gender expression. The beginnings of this distinction are evident, in fact, from the movement away from transsexual toward transgender in the late 1980s and early ’90s. The forces behind this shift argued that what was really at stake in many people’s sense of self was not biological sex—genitalia or chromosomes or hormones—so much as it was gender identity and gender expression. Members of the transgender community from the late ’90s onward increasingly opted for social rather than medical transition. A change in pronouns, in clothing, in hairstyle, and name sufficed; surgery wasn’t required. The terminology reflected that reality: It wasn’t about sex; it was about gender.

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by Anonymousreply 12705/29/2018

But even though the move from transsexual to transgender reflected the emphasis on identity rather than physical sex, the terms FtM and MtF recapitulated the emphasis on biology. Female and male (and intersex) are the terms used to designate sex. Man and woman designate binary endpoints of gender identity. Masculine and feminine are used to describe gender expression. Those who chafed against the implications of surgery within the term transsexual also disliked the biological transition implied in FtM and MtF. Couldn’t someone be transgender and not go from male to female? The community increasingly recognized individuals who eschewed medical reassignment altogether.

Starting in the 2000s, the terms trans-man, trans-woman, and trans-person appeared and gained popularity. The prefix trans- still implies movement, change, transition, which is a valid component of identity for many transgender individuals. But the second half of the word—man, woman, person—carries a different gravity. These three terms are gender identities, not biological sexes. The new terms reinforce the idea that biology is not destiny. Moreover, unlike FtM or MtF—terms that wrapped together past identity with present identity, reinforcing the idea that a transgender person never fully becomes their present self but is always a self with a past-as-present—trans-man and trans-woman and trans-person simply place the individual within their present identity.

However, some in the transgender community feel that even trans-man and trans-woman rely on the binary endpoints too much and prefer trans-masculine and trans-feminine. These terms use the language of gender expression rather than gender identity. Gender expression is an outward manifestation of what is inwardly felt or understood and includes elements like one’s hairstyle or clothing.

by Anonymousreply 105/15/2018

In the 2000s, the work of terminology in the transgender community centered on distinguishing between biological sex and gender identity, reinforcing the understanding that the two, though related in a complex way, were neither interchangeable nor determinative. As we head toward the third decade of the 21st century, the work of terminology now is to explore the distinction between gender identity and gender expression. I may be a boy but not be particularly masculine, for instance. Or I may be female and identify as a woman and be feminine. These three components—sex, gender identity, and gender expression—have “expected” configurations within American society, but there is no innate correct alignment.

Gender identity is deeply felt and known. Gender expression is no less important to one’s self, but it is also largely external and interactive. It is crucial that we not only understand this intellectually but also employ vocabulary that recognizes and empowers this distinction. So long as we insist that sex and gender are biologically determined, we deny ourselves the ability to control and alter the norms we set around masculinity and femininity.

Early transgender terminology was complicit in this understanding, with terms like FtM and MtF, and a culture that was focused on transition—medical reassignment to create a biological reality. But gender is much more than biology; the transgender community has worked hard to understand this and to express that understanding in the language it uses. Trans-masculine, trans-feminine, trans-fluid: These are terms that matter. Gender expression is a component of self; just because it is external and changeable doesn’t mean it is dispensable. Gender doesn’t just act upon us: We can influence gender.

Norms around what is masculine and what is feminine have changed over time. What hasn’t changed is that these categories are used to assert and enshrine power and hierarchy. We’ve seen the devastating consequences of that in the dynamics that the #MeToo movement has exposed and in the discussions around gun violence and toxic masculinity. One way to tackle these problems is to look at gender: how we construct it, what assumptions we make about it. And as we begin to consider these challenges, we can empower ourselves by looking at the progress the transgender community has made in self-assertion and self-definition. This shifting vocabulary underlines the truth that we, as humans, are not beholden to biological imperatives; we, as a society, can determine what it means to be masculine and what it means to be feminine. We show what we value by how we live and what names we use for ourselves and others.

by Anonymousreply 205/15/2018

I show what I value by ignoring these exhausting attention whores. Bye.

by Anonymousreply 305/15/2018

True r3. It seems everything is offensive including ‘hello’ and ‘nice weather’ so best to just not have anything to do with them.

by Anonymousreply 405/15/2018

I don't know where they're getting "virago."

[quote]vi·ra·go

[quote]noun: virago; plural noun: viragoes; plural noun: viragos

[quote] a domineering, violent, or bad-tempered woman.

[quote] archaic [quote]a woman of masculine strength or spirit; a female warrior.

by Anonymousreply 505/15/2018

Sorry for the bad formatting.

by Anonymousreply 605/15/2018

Read that as 'trans mythology', chopping and drugging and lying is not apart of history of transexualism

by Anonymousreply 705/20/2018

[quote] Why It’s Good That Trans Terminology Is Always Changing

In fact it's doubleplusgood.

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by Anonymousreply 805/20/2018

The story of the 2 men attacked by a cougar in WA is a great example of R8. Both were, in fact, women. Articles initially called them men, but later versions introduced photos, then a blurb about a trans bike riding group. Even later, the family of the deceased requested that her name be used and that she be referred to as their daughter. Some outlets agreed, others did not and also tried to use they/them pronouns for the deceased, making it difficult to tell how many people were involved. Sadly, if it had been a group of 3 or 4, that likely would have deterred the attack.

by Anonymousreply 905/22/2018

Transgender was and is an umbrella term? Do you go under the umbrella to keep dry from the gender fluid?

by Anonymousreply 1005/22/2018

That article was so boring that I feel asleep and peed myself.

by Anonymousreply 1105/22/2018

Are they trying to make people care less? They are right on track.

I remember back in the 80s/early 90s some trannies I used to hang out with, you know, the kind that were gay men that dressed as women for fun, and actually were fun and entertaining people to be around, would refer to the trans people that dressed like a stereotypical frauen, and never really interacted with anyone because they were so serious, and needed to be taken so seriously, were referred to as booger-queens. So maybe they should be happy that's not a thing anymore.

by Anonymousreply 1205/22/2018

R9 I didn't follow the story after I saw the headline, but that's interesting. I had no idea

by Anonymousreply 1305/23/2018

They can call themselves whatever they like (in my day they were “tranvesites”), but I do NOT enjoy being called “cis”. As if I’M the one with the disorder.

by Anonymousreply 1405/23/2018

I agree r14. It's like they need to control the conversation even -- and especially -- when they're not around.

This is the deal with pronouns I think -- they want to be the center of attention when they're not present.

by Anonymousreply 1505/23/2018

today i learned the delightful terms TIW(trans identified women) and TIM(trans identified men). these are transphobic terms that defeat the purpose of saying anyone is trans at all

by Anonymousreply 1605/23/2018

Spotted the TIM at r16.

It’s TIF, btw. Trans identified female, trans identified male, not man or woman. Nothing wrong with the terms, as y’all say, they are simply descriptive and neutral.

by Anonymousreply 1705/23/2018

Transvestite hasn't been replaced either; it's still a good term for men who dress as women. Transgender implies a whole hell of a lot more.

And yes, it's language policing, and it's all bullshit. The easiest thing to do it avoid these exhausting people in the real world where it's possible. Unfortunately they have an outsized voice online.

by Anonymousreply 1805/23/2018

r18 a couple of years ago in my department (I work in academia) they designated one of the restrooms in our building "all gender". One of the administrative assistants (secretary, basically) sent out an email to the department informing everyone of the change.

Well, she didn't use the "correct terminology" -- I don't even remember now what she used; it was innocuous -- but apparently it was very objectionable to someone trans-identified in the department, who sent a nasty reply. The administrative assistant sent out another email, apologizing profusely. Underpaid, overworked, and treated like shit, basically, for just trying to do her job and make everyone happy.

I think it was then I realized the perniciousness of the trans movement.

by Anonymousreply 1905/23/2018

Cults do this.

by Anonymousreply 2005/23/2018

Yep. It’s called Loading the Language. Robert Lifton wrote *the* manual on brainwashing and thought control back in the 60’s based on his work with Korean War vets and escapees from Mao’s regime. His work has been used extensively in studying and breaking down the tactics used by cults.

[quote]Loading the Language: The group interprets or uses words and phrases in new ways so that often the outside world does not understand. This jargon consists of thought-terminating clichés, which serve to alter members' thought processes to conform to the group's way of thinking.

by Anonymousreply 2105/23/2018

r20 yes, there is a certain amount of shaming/thought-policing that goes into the movement (see r19)

I liken it to the "satanic ritual abuse" craze of the 1980s. See: the McMartin Trial. Obviously I have empathy for abused children -- no question. But that doesn't mean "satanic ritual abuse" is real or widespread. False accusations ruined lives and tore apart families. In the same way, I have empathy for people who feel they were born into the wrong-gendered body. But that doesn't necessarily mean I fall lock-step in with the trans movement.

by Anonymousreply 2205/23/2018

[quote]Transvestite hasn't been replaced either; it's still a good term for men who dress as women.

A transvestite is anyone who cross-dresses, not just men. It's just that in popular media (Glen or Glenda), it's men who are depicted as transvestites. Also, people don't see women as transvestites. When women cross dress, people think it's cool, chic or political (or just assume they're lesbians) but when men do it, people find it abnormal and upsetting, so slap the label of "transvestite" on them to say, "This is abnormal."

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by Anonymousreply 2305/23/2018

One of the more infamous Satanic Panic trials resulted in a false convictions that sent a gay man (Bernard Baran) to prison. Baran was specifically targeted because he was gay.

by Anonymousreply 2405/23/2018

That’s because for men, transvestitism is overwhelmingly coupled with sexual arousal, r23. It’s rare that women do it for sexual reasons.

by Anonymousreply 2505/23/2018

Hardly descriptive when it makes it even harder to understand what it means r17. Does Trans Identified Female mean a bio female who identifies as male or the other way around? I have no idea and I doubt many outside of the trans community do either.

Also very interesting info r9. I had no idea that was the case either and, yes, it does make a difference to the story because cougar attacks are fairly rare but wild animals have been known to sometimes go after women on their period. And,yes,the theythem language does make it unclear just how many were attacked. Did the cougar just go after one of the women? Both? More?

Language should clarify, not muddle the situation.

by Anonymousreply 2605/23/2018

The whole trans movement has served to cast an even greater pall over GLB acceptance than ever before, except for the beginnings of the AIDS epidemic. So I personally don't give a shi t about their terminology. They have about as much in common with LGB's as a horse does with a pineapple.

by Anonymousreply 2705/23/2018

[quote]That’s because for men, transvestitism is overwhelmingly coupled with sexual arousal, [R23]. It’s rare that women do it for sexual reasons.

Transvestisism isn't about sexual arousal. It's about people for whatever reason becoming fascinated with the gender norms of the opposite sex, as in, "I'm a boy but gosh, those things that women wear and do are so pretty!!! I want to be pretty, too! I want to play with makeup and girl clothes, too!"

I'm no psychiatrist but I believe that transvestitism is the result of society not allowing people like that to channel their fascination with the opposite sex in a healthy, creative way. For example, a boy who absolutely loves "female things" is probably just a fashion designer, makeup artist, performance artist or drag queen in the making. If he's allowed to be those things, he'll probably be those things but if he's not then he uses himself to express his obsession with female things.

by Anonymousreply 2805/23/2018

r24 I was unfamiliar with this story. Christ.

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by Anonymousreply 2905/23/2018

[quote]The whole trans movement has served to cast an even greater pall over GLB acceptance than ever before, except for the beginnings of the AIDS epidemic.

Not only that, but it's also being weaponized against women and all the strides they've made over the past 40 years. Gotta love it how whenever women say that gender-confused males aren't real women, some activist will point to a transgender who looks like Paris Hilton, a 1940s pinup or blow up sex doll as proof that they're wrong. Right. Because "real women" look and dress like Barbie dolls, have big tits, long nails, speak in a vocal fry, wear glitter makeup, obsess over designer clothing and have hair extensions. They don't also have small boobs, feel more comfortable in jeans and sneakers than they do in F me pumps in miniskirts, have no idea how to put on makeup and have short hair.

Americans need to wake the hell up as to what's happening. So many people here at DL have nailed it. It's an Orwellian "Trojan Horse" designed to set women and LGB back, aided and abetted by the media and morons who just latch onto any cause that is spoon fed to them as "progressive", without actually thinking about whether it's genuinely progressive and not based in anything cynical. It's about forcing women to conform to a narrow, sexist definition of what a woman is supposed to look and act like, and it's an out that homophobic parents to convert their burgeoning gay son or daughter into a heterosexual man or woman.

by Anonymousreply 3005/23/2018

Thank you, r30.

by Anonymousreply 3105/23/2018

They're doing a series of stories about a MTG in Philadelphia who owns a chain of beauty parlours and how offended he gets when men talk to him in a condescending manner because he's a 'woman'...bit if anyone refers to this freak as a man he still gets offended. I think that they actually stopped running the series because of pressure from straights and gays. He was clearly in it for publicity for his salons.

by Anonymousreply 3205/23/2018

Where was the series published, r32?

by Anonymousreply 3305/23/2018

I just say trans, or trannie if I'm feeling peckish.

by Anonymousreply 3405/23/2018

These people are exhausting.

The ultimate in form over substances.

by Anonymousreply 3505/23/2018

The whole idea of gender as culturally determined stereotypes is regressive, what does a “male” look like? What does a “female” look like? Other than the difference in genitalia & hormones, that is. Certainly not clothing & hairstyles!

by Anonymousreply 3605/23/2018

Exactly, r36.

by Anonymousreply 3705/23/2018

r36 there is no one more wedded to gender stereotypes than a T activist / munchie mommy. "George" from the Nancy Drew stories must be relieved she was around in the 30s.

by Anonymousreply 3805/23/2018

Good, let them keep changing shit, it's just a sign of their fucking flakiness and allows people to not take them seriously.

by Anonymousreply 3905/23/2018

r30, you mean like this? These navel gazers are really fucking reaching. Big deal, you didn't get to have big tits at prom, lots of people looked crappy at prom, we were teenagers, not known for being gorgeous. These fuckers swear that everyone else lives their high school lives getting blow jobs in Hef's jacuzzi and they were singled out to be miserable. No, asshole, high school sucked for everyone. Have you never heard someone say, "I wouldn't be a teen again for all the money in the world!? Also, I'm sure the kids who got shot at school will be sending you a gift basket to commiserate. Asshole.

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by Anonymousreply 4005/23/2018

[quote]recreates prom

Predictable.

by Anonymousreply 4105/23/2018

Well, hell, let's just do a whole Rebirthing Ceremony! (Hope you saved the placenta to bury)

by Anonymousreply 4205/23/2018

R33 The Daily News maybe? The transpeople name is Baldini....owns a salon in the Gayborhood.

by Anonymousreply 4305/23/2018

[quote]Transvestisism isn't about sexual arousal....I'm no psychiatrist...

Clearly. Because here’s the DSM-V in transvestitism:

[quote]Transvestic disorder is a specific paraphilic disorder in which the individual is sexually aroused by the act of cross-dressing as the opposite gender, and yet finds the act of dressing and the resulting arousal distressing (The American Psychiatric Association, 2013)

Regardless as to your own personal interpretation, it is considered a paraphilia and treated as such by mental health standards.

by Anonymousreply 4405/23/2018

They are making up words left and right, "to-ness"? wtf? is this newspeak for destination?

"They coexisted with terms like third gender, which captured those who didn’t experience gender as incorporating a sense of “to-ness” at all—it wasn’t a journey from one point to another. "

by Anonymousreply 4505/23/2018

Anyone who does not want a "he" or "she" can be "them" and "they."

But fuck with me and you're an "it."

by Anonymousreply 4605/23/2018

As long as they keep calling me "queer," I'll call them whatever the fuck I want.

by Anonymousreply 4705/23/2018

R23, I think there is a perfectly reasonable explanation for that. To put it simply, clothing and fashion for men is less complicated and more comfortable.

Women wearing their hair short, refusing to wear makeup, and dressing themselves in trousers and comfortable shoes makes sense. The way we expect women to labor over their appearance, hair, makeup, jewelry, and wear uncomfortable dresses and heels is ridiculous. So it makes sense that a woman who "cross-dresses" is seen as normal, while a man jumping through all those hoops to look "feminine" is ridiculous because of the work involved and the fact that the clothes are so uncomfortable. And yes...as much as many if you might be refusing to admit it, it is a sexual kink for most cross-dressing men. If they didn't get off on it sexually, they wouldn't go to the trouble.

That said, I am at peak trans. I am done with this nonsense. It is anti-gay, anti-women, and anti-science. My "peak trans" moment was when they started pushing the idea that children should be put on puberty blockers. Um. No. Fuck off. So add "child abuse" to the list.

by Anonymousreply 4805/23/2018

I am surprised the trans loon hasn't showed up to tell us how we are all BIGOTS!

by Anonymousreply 4905/23/2018

[quote]Clearly. Because here’s the DSM-V in transvestitism

I studied studied psychology and abnormal psychology (including gender disorders) in school. The DSM is not what you think it is. People think it's like a medical encyclopedia or journal, where once an illness is clearly pinpointed and defined, that's that and there's no arguing against it. But that's not the DSM works. Not everyone in the psychiatry industry is 100% on the same page on what does and doesn't constitute a disorder, but psychiatrists can't wait around forever for the industry to come to a consensus before diagnosing patients, so the DSM offers at best a "rough idea" for them to go on. This rough idea is based on the opinion of the people who contribute to the DSM, opinions that don't necessarily reflect the views of psychiatry on the whole and sometimes are colored by prejudices, supposition and outside influence.

The DSM-V is the most controversial of all the editions to have been released to date. A lot of psychiatrists have openly revolted against it, so I don't know what the point of your bratty response of me not being a psychiatrist is supposed to prove. No, I'm not a psychiatrist, but the DSM-V isn't a bible, either, in which everything in it is above question and not subject to debate, question or controversy.

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by Anonymousreply 5005/23/2018

Since I work in mental health, I already know this r50. But the diagnosis and treatment of sexual paraphilias including transvestic disorder have remained largely unchanged. Why the person on this thread refuses to acknowledge the extremely high correlation between male cross dressing and sexual fetishism, I have no idea.

by Anonymousreply 5105/23/2018

The mandatory terminology of trans:

DICK: We use this word to describe external genitals. Dicks come in all shapes and sizes and can belong to people of all genders.

FRONT HOLE: We use this word to talk about internal genitals, sometimes referred to as a vagina. A front hole may self-lubricate, depending on age and hormones.

STRAPLESS: We use this word to describe the genitals of trans women who have not had genital reconstruction (or “bottom surgery”), sometimes referred to as a penis.

VAGINA: We use this word to talk about the genitals of trans women who have had bottom surgery.

by Anonymousreply 5205/23/2018

Who knows r51? Probably the same person who shouts us down on other threads with no facts at all and just screeching "drama queens, LOL" yeah good argument.

by Anonymousreply 5305/23/2018

That "Front hole" shit infuriates me, its so fucking reductive, god I hate these people and I will never call myself cis.

by Anonymousreply 5405/23/2018

[quote] I will never call myself cis.

You must, R54. It is required.

by Anonymousreply 5505/23/2018

[quote]But the diagnosis and treatment of sexual paraphilias including transvestic disorder have remained largely unchanged.

Was going to make another response about the DSM's infallibility until I realized a day later that you did something very shady. In my response in R28, I spoke specifically about transvestism, which is about the act of cross dressing. You then jumped in and said that the DSM-V had an entry on it saying it was a sexual fetish. I assumed the DSM-V had because I haven't looked at it in some time and trusted you at your word. But then you came back and quietly slipped in that it doesn't have an entry on transvestism at all but "transvestic disorder", which is not transvestism at all but is a sexual fetish involving clothing of the opposite sex that results in social and emotional impairment.

[quote]Transvestism is not a mental health condition and is not listed in the DSM. However, transvestic disorder, which is described as the practice of cross-dressing when accompanied both by sexual excitement and emotional distress or social impairment as a result of the excitement, is listed as a paraphilic disorder in the DSM.

Fool me once, shame on you.

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by Anonymousreply 5605/24/2018

[quote]cisgender folks included

^^^ indoctrination

T is a cult.

It’s language is unstable because T has no foundation. Gender is imaginary.

by Anonymousreply 5705/24/2018

R14, and “queer” is a slur yet that is what they insist on calling gays & lesbians without our approval.

Where’s the long article espousing the history, controversy & usage of “queer”...?

How come the gay community cannot name itself? Every other minority group does.

And how about the slur “terf,” which is used to bully lesbians to suck lady dicks & so forth?

by Anonymousreply 5805/24/2018

I really hate the term TERF r58. It exposes the trans movement for the misogynistic cesspool it is

by Anonymousreply 5905/24/2018

Wow r21.

Perhaps “The Manchurian Candidate” was more realistic than I realized.

by Anonymousreply 6005/24/2018

R23, “tomboys” are considered cute.

But when a male cross-dresses as female...he is slumming & humiliating himself.... because females & anything feminine (“sissies”, sadly, were never considered cute like tomboys) are devalued (worthless) in a patriarchal society.

It’s why Bruce Jenner is considered “brave”....and transmen still get raped.

by Anonymousreply 6105/24/2018

Can we talk about the use of the term “folks?” Damn. That word annoys me.

by Anonymousreply 6205/24/2018

I think it's a fad that's gotten WAY out of control!

by Anonymousreply 6305/24/2018

"Why I'm a Lesbian (Not Queer)"

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by Anonymousreply 6405/24/2018

Ever shifting like the sands of its foundation. It is unstable not due to heightened evolving linguistic/social self-examination, but because the movement is inherently unstable.

by Anonymousreply 6505/25/2018

r62 I think Pres Obama was the one who used folks all the time, but it's since become a fave in the SJW lexicon. Cringeworthy.

by Anonymousreply 6605/25/2018

He did, and I always wanted him to stop it. One of his few bad habits. Well, the "um" thing got on my nerves too, but come on. Compare him to the orange turd we have now and he's positively Lincolnesque.

by Anonymousreply 6705/25/2018

Good article r64. One of the reasons I hate the word queer in addition to its long history as a slur is that it's also completely meaningless in its "reclaimed'" usage. Gay, lesbian, straight and even bi have specific meaning in terms of sexual orientation. Queer and all the 60 or so "gender identity" terms mean different things to everyone who wants to splash around in the gender identity pool for a time.

The more the terminology changes, the more people will just tune it out as a stranger's gender identity is of little interest to anyone other than those caught up in the trend themselves.

by Anonymousreply 6805/25/2018

It is meaningless, we just had a thread about that straight couple who had a kid and for some reason, call themselves "queer" and don't want to be known as "mom" and "dad". So they're basically co-opting the real struggle of gay parents and people let them get away with this shit. It's ridiculous.

by Anonymousreply 6905/25/2018

This is a lawyer for the ACLU, FFS. Chelsea Manning's lawyer. What on earth has happened to the Left? How are we supposed to fight climate change deniers and young earth creationists with this stuff out there on social media? These idiots are handing them ammunition on a silver platter.

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by Anonymousreply 7005/25/2018

That article wore me out.

by Anonymousreply 7105/25/2018

Oh for fucks sake “biological sex is not a fixed scientific concept” - yes it fucking is! Every cell in your body contains at it’s nucleus your chromosomes. Unless you have Klinefelter Syndrome your chromosomes will be XX or XY. This is measurable, provable fact.

by Anonymousreply 7205/25/2018

[quote] We are assigned sex at birth. Not born “a girl”.

So speaketh the logic of the ACLU. Five year olds know better.

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by Anonymousreply 7305/25/2018

That dude on twitter is getting so much shit, it's hilarious. Some moron is trying to stick up for him saying bio sex "shouldn't be treated as fact" and "breaks down upon examination"...

"Shouldn't be treated like fact? Where the hell do you think babies come from? No, biological realities do not break down on examining them. Fucks sake it's this kind of garbage that is harming the trans community more than anything else."

by Anonymousreply 7405/25/2018

Chase Strangio is a woman. A pathetic, self-hating, thoughtless, mindless (& cockless) woman, but a female all the same.

by Anonymousreply 7505/25/2018

It's hard to know how to feel about these women, R75. I want to have compassion for them as butches who were/are oppressed by patriarchy, but there's no getting around the fact that they are doing immeasurable harm to other women (and to gay men, too). Why can't they see that? How can they be so cold and cruel?

by Anonymousreply 7605/25/2018

Tell Chase to get another "guy" friend and go cycling in the cougar infested woods, then we'll see what's what and how manly they really are.

by Anonymousreply 7705/25/2018

R70 The lawyer looks tranny as well, TIF

by Anonymousreply 7805/25/2018

r78 you think she's also a tourist in forest?

by Anonymousreply 7905/25/2018

R79 Snort, yes, has that empty erased look most Tourist in Forests have, like they are missing something....like mental health and a cocok

by Anonymousreply 8005/25/2018

TrannyZinnia opines:

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by Anonymousreply 8105/25/2018

And let us not forget Sophia the Homophobe:

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by Anonymousreply 8205/25/2018

I love it! I love a movement that doesn't understand the implications of sterilizing themselves and ignoring how the populace is created. Let em do it. Check the replies to this fuckwith opining the same types of things. On gender not being determined at birth:

Yeah, actually it is. Stop making trans people seem like complete idiots. Most know what their sex is. That is the whole god damned point of sex reassignment/transitioning. FFS.

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by Anonymousreply 8305/25/2018

And he brings up a valid point; if all of this is "made up" and "subjective" then why the fuck do you insist on SRS?

by Anonymousreply 8405/25/2018

Do these people know that these synthetic hormones cause very real world problems? As in extra estrogen causes cancer. It's pretty well proven. My mother is dying from what first diagnosed as breast cancer. She did not smoke, not a drinker, no drugs at all, vegetarian/vegan for the past twenty years. She's dying with cancer coursing through her veins. It wasn't because o what she did "wrong". There was something else.

by Anonymousreply 8505/25/2018

They can’t change their skeleton.

by Anonymousreply 8605/25/2018

R86 skeletons are transphobic! They don't exist! They are an illusion!

by Anonymousreply 8705/26/2018

[quote]Do these people know that these synthetic hormones cause very real world problems? As in extra estrogen causes cancer.

Nah, they’ve convinced themselves that it’s utterly harmless or the benefits of treating their dysphoria outweighs the increased risks of various kinds of cancer, heart attacks, cardiovascular diseases, etc.

A generation of idiots is pushing this nonsense at the same proclaiming their health is not a “medical experiment” like that moron Strangio at the ACLU.

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by Anonymousreply 8805/26/2018

I don't even understand that logic, r82. Is she (?) saying that evil Western Europe was the only society on Earth that divided people into male/female?

by Anonymousreply 8905/26/2018

Apparently so r89. Before evil white people came the brown people were wandering around pushing their cocks into random objects because they didn’t know they were supposed to put them in the socket designed for them.

by Anonymousreply 9005/26/2018

Why doesn't anyone call these people out on their ahistorical bullshit?

by Anonymousreply 9105/26/2018

Seriously r91? Same reason we only talk about it here, do it in real life and you're trans phobic and engaging in hate speech and you'll be doxed and fucking threatened.

by Anonymousreply 9205/26/2018

I'm R85, and apologize, was posting while intoxicated again.

Meant to include that my mother took hormones while going through menopause to help going through "the change". Because god forbid that should be a normal part of living. That is what I was referring to with additional hormone treatment.

She was also among the first users of the birth control pill, and I remember her telling me how horrible it was on her body. Not sexually, but overall made her feel like crap. Maybe that's where this fibro shit comes from. Who freaking knows what these drugs that are allegedly for our betterment actually do to us in the long run.

by Anonymousreply 9305/26/2018

Sorry about your mom. I can't blame you for the drink. Hang in there.

by Anonymousreply 9405/26/2018

[quote]god forbid that should be a normal part of living

Way to minimize and dismiss appalling health problems there hunty. Some women have few problems with menopause. Others, like my sister, had enormous difficulties. She couldn’t sleep, lost her hair, gained forty pounds without eating more, had hot sweats all the time, joint pain, couldn’t concentrate... it was hell for her. Small dose HRT gave her health back.

by Anonymousreply 9505/26/2018

Well, as long as she got her office job back! Thats what's important! LIVE Love Laugh!

by Anonymousreply 9605/26/2018

Candy Darling died of cancer from hormone pills.

by Anonymousreply 9705/26/2018

Medical professionals are gate keepers and party poopers. They're haters who don't want trans butterflies to spread their wings.

by Anonymousreply 9805/26/2018

W&W for op to try to offset the censors who have grayed out a fair topic.

by Anonymousreply 9905/26/2018

Done r99 but it's not grayed out for me, is your setting to "delicate flower" or "asbestos eyeballs"? Mine is the latter so I don't see lots of grayed out things.

by Anonymousreply 10005/26/2018

Agree, R48, and that the blockers and cross sex hormones STERILIZE children who cannot give true consent is horrifying. It is not reversible. Another reason that medical transition should be delayed until adulthood. Then, if they choose, eggs and sperm can be frozen to preserve the option of a biological child. Puberty serves obvious purposes for the body but is also a time of tremendous brain development. There is NO research on the effect of blockers and cross sex hormones on the brain. That so many kids on the T train are on the autism spectrum or have one or more co-morbid mental health diagnoses in addition to the dysphoria is SICKENING.

by Anonymousreply 10105/26/2018

R70, it is those EARS she should have dysphoria about. WORSE than a Windsor. Yikes.

by Anonymousreply 10205/26/2018

Jerron/Jazz is sure an example of that, R86. Hormones blocked and added but shoulders like a linebacker. Geez, just give it up and learn to love yourself, the task of all adults. Carving himself up and bleaching himself brought Michael Jackson no peace, but dealing with his childhood sexual abuse and his reenactment of it might have. Surgery is not a cure for dysphoria.

by Anonymousreply 10305/26/2018

My understanding of Trans Terminology is as follows:

Trans = Ignored.

by Anonymousreply 10405/26/2018

r100, good catch. My setting was on the default 50% and I changed that to Max so the Op is clear again. But it still shows the hall monitors were close to shutting it down. I often W&W posts I don't agree with if it appears a mob is trying to gang up against a fair source or discussion.

by Anonymousreply 10505/26/2018

Me too r105. The threads where there is no cogent argument to be made are the ones the trannies f&f into oblivion. Discussion is their downfall because there is no reasonable, logical way to defend the multiple points of craziness, like “biological sex is a myth” vs “I am the opposite sex than my biology says I am” - the dissonance is blindingly obvious to everyone except themselves.

by Anonymousreply 10605/26/2018

Magdalen Berns was beaten up in the street by some guy! She says they got him on CCTV, though, so hopefully they will catch him. But she's been fighting a brain tumor, and this asshole beats her about the head??? And no, I don't think it was just some rando...

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by Anonymousreply 10705/26/2018

R107 Fucking hell, That is insanity, She is golden, and also bloody funny around the trans mentals, so they totally fucking hate her.

by Anonymousreply 10805/26/2018

Demanding an apology because trans people weren't centered in the fight for abortion rights in Ireland.

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by Anonymousreply 10905/27/2018

R109 Well, if it helps people reach peak trans, but fuck that is tone deaf and stupid

by Anonymousreply 11005/27/2018

Trans need to fuck right off.

by Anonymousreply 11105/27/2018

The account @ r109 is now protected. I read some of it earlier and they were being torn apart for the oblivious narcissism and ridiculous posturing.

by Anonymousreply 11205/27/2018

R112 And even the trans handmadiens were shocked at the tone deaf stupidity of the 'proclamation'

by Anonymousreply 11305/27/2018

There was a reddit comment calling them The Trannish Inquisition. I am so stealing that.

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by Anonymousreply 11405/27/2018

They’re fast....

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by Anonymousreply 11505/27/2018

Ok, r115, that made me laugh

by Anonymousreply 11605/27/2018

Sending good vibes to Magdalen...probably was a trans-identified MALE

by Anonymousreply 11705/27/2018

R117 Read her tweets, and sounds like a mentally ill man who was looking for violence and making little sense. England. I really hope wasn't a tranny, escalating violence towards women from them would lead to Gods Know What

by Anonymousreply 11805/27/2018

Love the comment at R114:

"They probably see women being allowed to have abortions as insensitivity to their inability to carry children."

by Anonymousreply 11905/29/2018

Well, you'll love this even more, R119: "You Complain About Your Period, But Trans Women Would Do Anything for Your Pain."

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by Anonymousreply 12005/29/2018

R120 For Jessica Christs Sake

by Anonymousreply 12105/29/2018

From r120: "A lack of fertility often also denies trans women romantic possibilities. It doesn’t take long for a trans woman’s natural fertility to end once HRT begins, so their inability to have kids is often cited as a blanket reason for both male and female cis people to exclude them from the dating pool.

yeah...that's why. It's good he admits though that that shit sterilizes you pretty quickly.

by Anonymousreply 12205/29/2018

"Someone's childhood dreams should be respected, huh? How about my childhood dreams to not have every freaking aspect of my life fetishized by a dude in a dress? What about my childhood dream to be considered a person, not a grab bag of organs that a delusional man wants to own for himself? What about this ass hats wife, and her dreams to have her pregnancy be about her body and her baby, without this dudes ego making it "all about him all the time"? Oh, but we are merely uterus bearers, not super sexy, delicate flower "laydees".

by Anonymousreply 12305/29/2018

[quote]["You Complain About Your Period, But Trans Women Would Do Anything for Your Pain."

Would a trans do anything to also have all the complications and issues that sometimes go along with having a period and uterus? Like excruciating pain from endometriosis and fibroids that can have you doubled over and bed-ridden for days, and splashing out enough clots and blood all over the floor to make a bathroom look like a crime scene? Would they give anything to have horrible mood swings that come with having a period and in some cases, the diarrhea and bloating? The embarrassment of bleeding through clothes in public at the worst possible moment? The monthly expense of hygiene products?

Oh, wait. In Trans Land, a woman's experience is what they imagine it to be, devoid of any inconvenient truths to sully their little fantasy. Never mind.

by Anonymousreply 12405/29/2018

Many trans hate women.

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by Anonymousreply 12505/29/2018

Why the fuck would you want to be in pain and bleed?These people need mental help!

by Anonymousreply 12605/29/2018

They don't actually WANT to be, silly r126! They just want t bitch about how they can't be and make everything about them. How fucking exhausting, there is literally NOTHING a woman can say that won't offend them because they are not women too.

by Anonymousreply 12705/29/2018
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