Figure Skating Part CV

The incest twins plan to make a new career posing with random celebrities holding their bronze medals.

The expression on Jordan Peele's face is just PRICELESS. He looks all, "Who the fuck are these assholes and why am I here posing like some trotted out prop? Bitch, give me back my oscar!"

Maybe we can keep the Japanese fangurl trolls out of this one.

Yuzu is so handsome and it troubles me that Takahashi and the JSF are disrespecting him. He is so talented. He must be thinking I have won two golds in a row; what more can I do to make you like me.

Can we agree that Daisuke Murakami looks awful as a blondie?

R2 - You just asked for R3.

What is this about Jin Boyang staging some elaborate hoax? Is there a list of the known homophobes and religious nuts in FS?

Why would thread XV just disappear ?

R6 because trolls FFd it.

R5 it is said that he posted a movie ticket in advance on his social media (well, to his fans of course). The ticket reveals the location and the time of the movie he was going to watch. Then his fans rushed to that cinema yet he pretended to be not knowing such scenes at all.

I remembered before the last thread vanished reading a post shouts if you don't like Hanyu's news you can ignore. Man, doesn't that mean I have to ignore the entire thread if allowing them to continue spamming here? That post also questions why shouldn't the biggest star's suicidal tendency be discussed or paid attention here. Wait a minute, the biggest star? To what extent or what kind of consensus is this??

R8, doesn't look like staged to me? People post movie tickets on social media, I don't think he expected anybody to show up. There was a lot if hate and criticism after wc though, so maybe that's why the rumour exists

R9 - Thank you. That doesn't sound that bad even if it wasn't a mistake. I thought it was something actually scandalous, like he hired a bunch of actors to swarm him to make him look famous. He seems really into social media with his live streaming. It's interesting to see the banquets but I don't know how anyone can watch him eat for hours. Is FS and Boyang really popular in China?

R10 - By hate and criticism, you mean his performance at WC or did something else happen?

R11, yes, his wc skate

I bet the Japanese fraus FF'ed the old thread

R11 I'm r8 and I thought maybe there's something lost in translation. The fan I know emphasised "he pretended/acted like not knowing" so probably it's something like what you said "hired". Anyway he told me that comments on Boyang's such act was not positive. He thought it was quite awkward for Boyang to do so, he can't get it. Either can I.

And yes, according to him, Boyang is really very very popular in China. FS is also a popular sport, especially when it comes to Hanyu. He also has a lot of crazy fans in China.

New Ice Dance team according to FSU and Russian forums: Adelina Galayavieva/Louis Thauron. They will be coached by Krylova.

If she is who I think she is, I just remembered she and previous partner had a very trash FD seen at earlier Challengers this season

Hanyu is so handsome. He should have a million girlfriends.

When y'all say the last thread was FF what does that mean?

R8 R14 R15 Sorry, I meant to reply to you and not R9. Boyang is still young so maybe he'll grow out of it once he meets some of his scarier fans. So what are FS fans in China like? Are they young? All ages? Mostly female? Are male skaters perceived as feminine/gay like in North America?

R12 That's not good. I'm glad he'll be getting some training in with Orser and hopefully developing artistry.

R16 Are they still skating for France?

What happened to ice dancing in Britain btw?

R19 I can ask him about it.

However, for your last question, I think under their cultural context the fans may not take male skaters all as gay. They (girl fans) may dream about marrying those guys they love somehow...

[quote] Are they still skating for France?

Probably. Otherwise they should sit out for a year.

And as Zagorski's mother said on FSU: " and the chances of DG releasing either are about as likely as Trump becoming a priest"

I luv Yuzuru! Stop with the haters!

Vincent Zhou and the Knierems will go to the White House on Friday. Not that I was a fan of them anyway but ew.

Yuzuru will always have haters. The other thread probably got deleted cause some kept bringing up his suicidal tendencies.

Finally reading edge of glory...very interesting. The description of Eldredge and Callaghan's relationship certainly reads differently now than if I were to read it then. Has anything similar been written with Vancouver skaters or later?

Nathan looks a lot happier in his group pics from Yale than he does when he's skating.

Japan Federation assigned skaters to groups for 2018/19 season. It's similar to "envelopes" of USFSA, fundings are linked to which group you are in.

MEN

Special group: Yuzuru Hanyu, Shoma Uno, Keiji Tanaka, Kazuki Tomono

Group A: Daisuke Murakami, Mitsuki Sumoto, Ryuju Hino, Hiroaki Sato, Sena Miyake, Tatsuya Tsuboi

Group B: Sota Yamamoto, Jun Suzuki, Kazuki Kushida, Yuto Kishina, Shun Sato, Kazuki Hasegawa, Taichiro Yamakuma

WOMEN

Special group: Satoko Miyahara, Kaori Sakamoto, Rika Kihira, Mai Mihara, Wakaba Higuchi, Mako Yamashita

Group A: Rika Hongo, Marin Honda, Yuhana Yokoi, Nana Yokoi

Group B: Yuna Shiraiwa, Yura Matsuda, Rin Nitaya, Rinka Watanabe, Tomoe Kawabata, Riko Takino, Hanna Yoshida

PAIRS

Special group: no-one

Group A: Miu Suzaki /Ryuichi Kihara, Riku Miura /Shoya Ichihashi

Group B: no-one

ICE DANCE

Special group: Kana Muramoto /Chris Reed

Group A: Misato Komatsubara /Timothy Koleto

Group B: Rikako Fukase /Aru Tateno

Oh no - what happened to that gorgeous French guy who skated pairs for Japan - Francis Boudreau-Audet? He was wonderful!

They paired him with a tiny girl (Sumire Suto) who couldn't do a triple to save her life, but he was a keeper, surely. He even wrote a farewell message in Japanese to Kanako Murakami for her retirement, so I figured he was working on residency or citizenship or maybe already had it?

Interesting timing. Trying to head off a gymnastics-like investigation, do you think?

R29 they split. He is searching for a Canadian partner (he is from Quebec).

Is Michelle Kwan a lesbian?

R32 Well, I love Michelle's skating, but her personality is a bore. Coming out as a lesbian would make her slightly more interesting.

R27 Maybe it's because he's getting his first taste of freedom. Is Nathan truly a skater with great artistry and musicality as his fans and the US media has described? With his dance background, I expected him to be more balletic and connected to the music, even taking into account the elements he's had to sacrifice to add more jumps to his programs. I can't tell if I'm not seeing it because I lack a strong ballet and skating background.

R32 Any reason why we should think she might be?

Duskova/Bidar have split. It's totally out of blue. They are young (1999) and just finished 11th at Worlds.

Both will continue. She wants to train in Czech Rep and combine it with studying. He wants to train abroad.

Seems like a dumb reason to split from him. They were doing extremely well for a small fed pair.

yes, it seems a dumb decision for both of them. I wonder if there is something else behind this move that they aren't telling us. If I were him, I would prefer staying with her and training in Prague than starting from the beginning with a new girl in Canada unless he has a new competitive girl already lined up.

Krasnopolski of Conners/Krasnopolski (Israeli pair, 9th at Euros, 19th and Worlds and Olympics) is on Ice Partner Search. LOL, he has changed like 100 partners in his career.

Pairs summer training camp has already started in China...Grandpa Zhang was present, in first line, in his quest for Beijing 2022

Kostner is in Toronto getting new programs by Lori Nichol. She didn't specify if they are EXs or competitive programs....at this rate Nathan Chen will retire before Carolina.

Savchenko/Massot are taking an "indefinite" break. They will skate in shows during fall and winter. Then they will decide. It looks like they are deservingly monetizing on the Olympic gold.

Judging by his (and other people's, like Nazarova's IG post today) recent social media posts, it looks like Greg Zuerlein is leaving Novi coaching team. Actually, it looks like he's leaving Michigan as a whole.

Ah man, I'm really bummed out by Duskova/Bidar split, I honestly think it was a mistake. They were doing very well (if we ignore Duskova's injury) ... I can't see either of them being this good again.

I'm trying to be a fan of Nathan but I don't really see the artistry either R34. Yet. He does seem to have good posture, I guess. I think he's painfully shy and reserved. When you're used to Adam Rippon or Jason Brown, it's a let-down to watch the jumping beans (him and Vincent, who's worse). But they're only 17-18 years old. Hopefully they'll gain in confidence and then they'll be more fun to watch.

You know, even Nathan's jumps - only occasionally do I think his landings look right. He's so stiff and abrupt when he lands, most of the time, that the jumps just don't seem pretty, like Hanyu or Kolyada or Fernandez. Even with the iffy landings, I like Jin Boyang's and Shoma Uno's jumps better as well, at least aesthetically (though I know Shoma's have technical issues - he still moves like a dream.)

I keep yelling at Nathan on tv - just BEND YOUR KNEE MORE when you land, and there will be a flow out of the jump. I know he can do it because sometimes he DOES do it. It seems like such a simple itty-bitty adjustment that it frustrates me no end... but then I'm not the one putting 4 quads in a free skate so I guess I should shut up. He's more consistent than Kolyada god knows, but I worship a landed Kolyada quad - they're glorious to see, as good as Hanyu's, and his Lutz is better.

Adam Rippon chose not to go to the White House today:

Olympians from the 2018 Games have been invited to go to the White House today. I will not be going. I will not stand with people who discriminate against those that they perceive as different. In lieu of going to DC, I have donated to a few of my favorite causes

Adam, darling, you could have not gone to White House anyway because you have Stars on Ice in another city today. Hence, neither the 2 Shibs, Hubbell, Donohue, the 2 Chens, Nagasu and Tennell went. Only Zhou and Knierims went

Presumably the skaters could have gotten the day off from Stars On Ice to go to the White House if they wanted to.

R41: Who?

R42, Adam Rippon and Nathan Chen announced months ago that they would not be going to the Wihte House.

So it's not because of the Stars On Ice tour.

Kudos to Nathan Chen.

Here's the article from September 2017:

The US SOI can't even give tickets away, meanwhile SOI in Canada has totally sold out. Shows you how bad the US skating scene is right now.

R42 Karen and Bradie are in photos with the Knierems and Zhou. I thought it was the White House event.

I will never understand the appeal of Rippon. He's not all that clever, talented, or hot. The team event is a joke. Literally anyone could have replaced him and the US would still have gotten the bronze. It's not bravery to come out when you're not good enough to actually lose anything. And just because people don't attention whore about it doesn't mean they're not openly gay. Adam is being celebrated for turning himself into a caricature.

I think I'm actually going to miss Patrick Chan. Who else is as entertaining with his cunty, self-indulgent comments. It was fun watching him very slowly coming to realize that he's a has been while never relenting on the self aggrandizing.

Yuzu had his Sendai parade the other day. Huge turnout. Raised $2 million USD. How inspiring he is.

R42 that was the Team USA Awards held on Thursday in Washington. Karen and Bradie left for Pittsburg before the White House thing

Poor Mirai wanted to go but she couldn't fit in her schedule

Mirai Nagasu @mirai_nagasu Wish I could have gone to the @WhiteHouse today. Regardless of my political opinions, it’s a huge honor to be invited as part of @TeamUSA Unfortunately, the cast of @starsonice has a show and I have to stick to what I love: skating. Hope everyone is enjoying their visit!🇺🇸

And here I was thinking the other skaters were being too wishy washy for not commenting on the White House visit. Yes, I think Adam is very overexposed right now and overrated as a skater, but I still have more respect for him than the pathetic closet queens, fundies and bland robots like the Shibs whose every move is calculated for PR. Maybe calling him "brave" is a little over the top, but what else would you call it relative to the rest of that bunch?

Re Duskova/Bidar

A Czech article posted on GS:

- Bidar had arguments with their coach and Duskova's mother.

- They escalated after Olympics. Bidar wanted to spend half of the season in Canada training with Gauthier and half of the season in Prague. Their current coach and Duskova's mother were against this idea, they wanted to carry on as always: 6 weeks training camp in Canada and the rest in Prague.

- Bidar is not from Prague. To avoid daily commuting, he has lived since 14 at Duskova's house with her family. This spring (he's 19 now) he decided to move out and live on his own. The "team" didn't like this move.

- Duskova will finish high school next year (Bidar will finish it this June). She wants to study medicine at university. It's a difficult faculty and hard to combine with competitive skating. So Bidar may have thought she wasn't so committed long term. And waiting a year for her to finish high school before moving abroad wasn't on card if she starts medicine in Prague.

- Verner is helping Bidar in finding a new partner. They are looking at foreign girls.

On other news:

-Loboda/Drodz have moved to Krilova.

-Zuerlein has definitely departed from Shpiland's coaching team.

Yuzuru Hanyu is inspiring. I heard he didn't use any tax payer money for the parade. He is such a sweet guy. I will never understand the people who hate on him.

Team USA has awards?!

R53: Rippon is calculated.

I'll take calculated over kissing the ring of these shitheads R56

R56: I give Rippon credit for making a statement and donating money. I hope he does well on dwts.

I don’t agree with Team USA giving out awards

It appears that Greg Zuerlein has moved from Novi to Wheaton, Maryland (at least I think it's in Maryland). That's where Parsons, McNamara/Carpenter, Greens and Gropman/Sommerville train.

For the desperation from various fag hags.

[quote]Yes, I think Adam is very overexposed right now and overrated as a skater, but I still have more respect for him than the pathetic closet queens, fundies and bland robots like the Shibs whose every move is calculated for PR.

I agree. Say what you want about Ashley and Adam, but when it counted, they stood up and spoke out against Putin and Trump, their policies and their politics. They did this during the Olympics, the height of their skating careers, when the media spotlight was brightest and the potential for earning (or losing) sponsorships was the greatest. Yeah, neither were gold medal favorites, but making any sort of political statement was still a big risk, but they chose instead to use whatever small platform they had to call out the bigotry and homophobia they saw and make it clear they didn't want to associate with it.

That counts for a lot in my book.

You'll never see the incest twins, for example, ever say anything that could potentially endanger their precious sponsorships. They might not go to the White House for political reasons, but they would NEVER say it publicly. Oh no, can't upset the Minute Maid soccer moms.

R54 I guess you can't blame him then. He made all of the sacrifices. I can understand why he needed to live with them as a minor, but they should have let him move out once he was old enough to live on his own.

R60 yes, we all make fun of Ashley and not always intelligent her outbursts but we should remember the idiocy that came out from Charlie White's and Jeremy Abbott's mouth during Sochi.

For those who don't remember....the priceless Jeremy Abbott's quote

"Russia is hosting us. I'm not going to go into somebody's house and be like, 'Um, the way you decorate is hideous, and you need to completely redo this or I'm never coming back.' It's a little rude, so I don't want to say bad things about a country that's hosting the world, essentially"

Ok, they were pressured not to speak about it but he is not very bright, isn't he? He should have just said "no comment" instead of actually talking.

What did Charlie White say? He seems like such a nice guy - dammit...

And what does Hanyu mean when he said, this week, yet again, "I must live a life or have a lifestyle that I will have no shame in while being proud of who I am up until this point." That he's going to abstain from being a serial killer?

R64 White basically didn't want to talk about it. But it was asked and he didn't want to make a "political statement". So a journalist asked him if it wasn't a human right issue rather than a political issue. And White replied that it is just a semantics if gay rights are political or human right issue and that he wouldn't comment further.

Now that he has retired, he spent his whole day tweeting political statements.

With the current administration, visiting the White House seems like the riskier choice, especially if you are gay or non-white. Adam is just one in a long list of athletes, including major NFL/NBA/MLB players, who've declined the invitation. He's not making a brave decision. He's making a very sensible one. Pence is relieved, anyway. Wouldn't want to have to explain to Mother how Adam makes him feel inside.

Seeing Adam makes feel sorry for Johnny. Yes, he could be a hypocrite and was wishy-washy with Sochi, but I still don't think he gets enough credit for what he had to put up with while he was skating competitively.

R64 It just sounds extreme because it's a direct English translation. He's just saying he'll need to continue to work hard to meet his goals, be honest with himself, not get a big head and slack off, etc. Typical comment from a Japanese athlete.

I give Charlie some credit for apologizing for not having balls during his competitive years. He has truly turned around for the better.

Jeremy Abbott is another story though, he is supposed to be Bi or gay (he never uttered those words in his coming out article) and he showed no remorse or sympathy for the situation in Russia. Unlike Charlie White, Jeremy has not apologized for his comments. The only time he came close to apologizing he turned it into him being a victim. Totally insincere.

[quote] Jeremy Abbott is another story though, he is supposed to be Bi or gay (he never uttered those words in his coming out article)

is there a coming our article of Abbott? I missed it

R61 Interview with Bidar

B: Yeah, I think so. I perceived that we are improving faster at each internship abroad, so I wanted to be there more often. But Anicka said she wanted to study and did not want to study at a distance.

B: Well, just. She told me first to stay with her for a year in the Czech Republic and then we will see, but then she told me in the next sentence she wants to study medicine.

Q: You also announced that you wanted to move out of the Duskova household, where you lived for easier commuting to Prague training. Also, your claim for independence has not been met with understanding.

B: I was the first to say to Mrs. Horkolvá [their coach], that one of the problems for me is that I still live at Duskova's. And then she probably told them that I had a big problem with them - and maybe they did not know my other arguments. I wanted to talk to Anika again. But it all culminated in her parents reacting by sending a letter to the Czech Skating Federation that we were breaking apart.

The coach sounds like an idiot.

Thanks R66. I guess it makes sense that it's a boilerplate Japanese answer, since he's said it before. I was reading too much into it because he's so mysterious - probably all for the best, being a Japanese boy-band-like idol.

I'm glad to hear Charlie wasn't too awful - he just exudes so much compassion, it was hard for me to believe he was an ass about it back in the day. And yeah, nobody gives Johnny enough credit imo. I'm a big fan, and I think he's surprisingly understated and astute as a commentator. I hope they keep him and Tara - and not hand it over to Adam and, oh I don't know, Ashley or Mirai or some such.

R69 Good luck to the Duskova team finding a new partner after those interviews with Bidar. How many skating careers have been ended due to overzealous parents now? I'm surprised they didn't break up earlier.

[R34] No, your lack of ballet background has nothing to do with not seeing it. Nathan's artistry is very mediocre compared to many other skaters. With the way that ballet company experience was promoted, I expected him to be far better. He has a long way to go.

There's a YouTube video comparing Yuzuru's jumps to Nathan's, and there you can see a huge difference in the quality of their jump landings. I am a fan of both but worry about Nathan's health with all those wonky stiff landings. He's doing the right thing focusing on his academic future. What really happens to former skaters? Even winning internationally doesn't mean much 4, 5 years later as an American male figure skater.

Nathan has nice posture and lines, but that's it. It's annoying that he gets so highly rewarded for his nonexistent transitions and mediocre skating skills and choreography.

I agree that his jumps aren't that great either - don't have the amplitude or flow of Hanyu. He and Shoma have the ugliest jumps of the top men. I wonder which one will have to retire first.

It's been implied that Christopher Pottenger was suspended for more than having a relationship with a 16 year old when he was 22. Any idea what he did?

R75 The 16 years old skater was whoring himself to get higher marks?

One of the rules broken by Pottenger according to the suspension was:

“A member shall at all times avoid conflicts of interest which can be considered to exist at any time when the actions of the member for his or her self or on behalf of a skater would involve the obtaining of an improper advantage.”

In the Brenann's article he denies having been the coach of the 16 yo but he wasn't asked if he has served as Technical Specialist when the guy was skating. Looking at the competitions he judged, Pottenger was on the panel at Regionals-Eastern Sections held in late 2009 before the 2010 suspension

Fabian Bourzat is also leaving Novi.

The last one, please, turn off the lights!

[quote] Fabian Bourzat is also leaving Novi. The last one, please, turn off the lights!

If Fabian goes back to France, will Laurine follow him?

[quote]Nathan has nice posture and lines, but that's it.

His posture is not even nice. He has really rounded shoulders which give him that hunch back look Sarah Hughes had. Really destroys the line.

I think Nathan won't make it to Beijing. With his jump technique and reckless training habits, I just don't see him consistently maintaining his arsenal of quads for 4 more years without injuring himself again. That, coupled with age, his apathy for skating itself and the demands of school, will no doubt end his career sooner rather than later.

R76 Thanks. Damn. That would be more than a conflict of interest. I wonder how often it happens. Is it common for technical specialists to be so young?

Anyone else notice a lot of Nathan fans are former Patrick fans? Other than both being North American and Chinese descent, they have very different personalities and approaches to skating.

R80. I would like to stress that I don't have inside knowledge on this particular case and I was just speculating. The conflict of interest rule was broken but we need the original document to exactly know what they contested to him.

I don't think it is common to have judges so young but he is not alone. Recently retired ice dancer Alex Benoit, who is 23, is a certified (only for Us domestic competitition) judge and he is training to become a TS. In low levels competititions like novices at Sectionals they call also these judges without experience.

What are the chances Yuzu can win a third Gold Medal in 2022? I give it at 50%.

LOL Yuzuru doesn't have the advantage of hormone roiding like Plushenko did. His body will fall apart before mid-cycle.

Oh boy ! Christopher Pottenger had an affair with a 16 year old ? He had wonderful soft knees and retired too early, but I guess he found other ways to use them.

The oldest figure skater to win Olympic gold was 24 (male Lysacek and female Arakawa). To do it at 27 (which Hanyu would be) in the age of quads seems probably impossible since the battering their joints take is much more. It might even be a challenge for N Chen at 22, especially considering his landings are anything but soft, like Hanyu's.

Well, I'm talking about winners inthe modern era - not way way back when it isn't really recognizable as the same sport as today.

[quote] What are the chances Yuzu can win a third Gold Medal in 2022? I give it at 50%.[/quote]

He's really injury prone and has been traditionally reckless with his health but the new rules are really good for him and he's mentally stronger. If he can hold his body together I think he'll win.

Part of the reason that older skaters haven't been able to win later is because once they reached a certain point they plateaued technically. Hanyu has always planned ahead to make sure he can keep up with the new generation. On the one hand, it makes it more likely he'll wreck his body before the Olympics on the other hand it's giving him a competitive longevity that most previous champions haven't had.

Also keep in mind that Plushenko lost to poor strategy rather than a stronger competitor. He could have easily have won 2010 at 27 years old if he did a 3 jump combo or did a triple instead of a double axel.

Absolutely ridiculous, Yuzuru will be walking in crutches and if anything the new rule will make falls or pop ups, which Yuzuru is known for, more costly.

So whats going on with Vincent Queeny Zhou attending the White House? Is his mother filling his head with right wing propaganda. Face it mom! Vincent is a little gayling.

[quote] Anyone else notice a lot of Nathan fans are former Patrick fans? Other than both being North American and Chinese descent, they have very different personalities and approaches to skating. [/quote]

didn't notice that but Patrick has talked up Nathan and it's pretty common for fandoms to follow their leader. A lot of Hanyu fans are also Boyang Jin and Fernandez fans

I hope Janet Lynn does better on her figures.

R88, in what universe are Chen fans, mostly American, and Chan fans the same ? The only thing they have in common is that they are Chinese. That's pretty racist right there.

Pops have always been the biggest mistake you can make with IJS. Don't see how they're going to be even more relevant now that they're lowering base values of jumps.

Falls matter more but now Hanyu can get more points on his triple axel than the other skaters will get on their quads. I can't remember the last time Hanyu fell on his axel. Hanyu's biggest weakness has always been his stamina and now the program is 30 seconds shorter. Hanyu also requires the least set up of any of the skaters for his jumps so won't have as much difficulty fitting all the elements in as the others. He's also the only one to consistently have actual steps and transition elements directly into and out of his jumps while maintaining flow and height so he's currently the only one to have potential for the +5 GOE

easy R91, you can no longer back load your program, so if you missed a jumped, you're fucked.

jump*

Why can't you backload? The only reason they were doing that is the 10% bonus, which isn't that big a deal if nobody else gets it.

Can you not change your program on the fly if you miss a combination?? And anyway, I don't see why that's a bigger problem for Hanyu. I do see the +5 GOE as a Hanyu advantage over, say, Chen - well, over most anybody else because he's one of the few with both the technical and artistry sides covered.

What I do see as a problem for him - which I think I heard is a new rule - is you can't repeat a quad-type. That's cruel to all of them really - they'll have to kill themselves learning all the different quads which stress the ankle (especially) more than being able to repeat toes or sals...

Hope it's not true.

r94 it's highly unlikely the 1 quad per type rule will pass. Rumor has it that most skating federations will vote against it since it is against their skaters' interest

I also don't see why eliminating the backload bonus will make pops more relevant.

The 10% doesn't make a huge difference and as r95 said, if no one gets it, it doesn't matter. Hanyu gets most of his point advantage in GOE's

If anything, I think eliminating the backload bonus would be to Hanyu's advantage since he has such poor stamina. With no one getting it, he won't feel a need to put the combos at the end when he can least handle them. I always thought it was dumb for him to put the combos in the end of the program even with the bonus since it takes away his options in case of mistakes.

R81 That's still a good point. Why didn't this come out in 2010 when he was suspended? Is it just because of Callaghan and the Nassar mess?

R88 That would explain it though it's surprising Patrick would support him considering the remarks he's made about jumping and skaters like Nathan in the past. I can understand why Hanyu fans might like Boyang and Fernandez given the relationship between the skaters, but Nathan and Patrick don't seem to have much in common or much to do with each other.

R90 It's not that Chen and Chan fans are the same. You'll find on other skating forums that many Chen fans were Chan fans, but these fans do seem to be North American so it could be a regional support thing. Nathan also has a lot of fans in Japan but they don't seem to be former Chan fans.

Yuzuru has poor stamina? Examples ?

r98 I think Chan and Chen did a camp or something together so they had a period where they were skating in the same rink. Plus, Chan likes to throw shade at Hanyu - he even recently admitted to hating him before the 2018 Olympics.

Training alongside the 17-year-old Chen in Zoueva's group in Canton, Michigan, pushed him to revisit the jump. "Nathan trains with me, and he is the epitome of what skating has become," Chan said. "I see how technically stronger he is than I am"

r99 it's not as much of a problem now, but Hanyu used to be famous for collapsing at the end of his programs. But even at the 2018 Olympics, he started running out of gas - which lead to the mistakes.

Agenda for ISU Congress have been published, including proposed changes

Apart that someone at Bosnia Fed was quite bored and presented lots of proposals....the ISU council is against almost all of them...

Netherlands is proposing some judges evaluating only GOE and some only PCS because there are too many things to check and you can't do both in a short time

Skate Canada is proposing the bonus for second half jumps to be limited at 2 in SP and 4 in FS

Japan is propsing "However, only the last one jump element executed in the second half counts for the 1.1 factor in the Short Program, and the last three jump elements for Free Skating."

Japan is proposing "In the Free Skating of the single skating additional bonus points will be given to skaters succeeded six different type of clean triple and/or quadruple jumps in the program."

Netherlands is proposing to increase the multiplying factor for PCS because "the technical- and artistic side of Men skating will be brought back in balance."

Netherlands propose to eliminate the -1 for fall

ISU council is proposing to have at minimum 42 men and ladies, 28 pairs and 35 ice dancers at Worlds. Those without the minimum TES will be called to fill the spots based on the sum of SP and FS highest TES

Bosnia is proposing something very long about judges selection...but basically they want a system that allow judges from countries without skaters qualified to be selected more often

Olympic qualification...ISU is proposing a change to avoid the "US pairs" situation happened last year when US had enough points for 2 spots but there was a limit to spots being assigned at Worlds (16 and if you give 2 spots to US, they would have been 17 spots assigned)...now if you qualify 2 but the limit of the spots being assigned at Worlds is reached and both your teams have qualified to FS, you will get 2 anyway (Nebelhorn will have one less qualifying spot available). If you have enough points for 2 but no spots left and your second pair don't qualify for FS, your second pair can go to Nebelhorn to qualify for the last spots

Finland is proposing to add "not bring any other documents to the Judges’ or Technical Panel’s stand except those specified in an ISU Co mmunication"

Netherlands is proposing to explicitly add "make the required reductions in Program Components for falls, serious errors and interruptions caused by the skater" as a bullet point because "We can observe that Program Components are scored too high when skaters have falls and serious errors in their programs as well as interruptions caused by the skater."

Norway is proposing "An ISU Official must not serve as a team leader in ISU Championships, Olympic Games or Senior Grand Prix Events"

Norway is proposing "an official should not post specific comments about the results of ISU events or post pictures/videos of competitive athletes on social media." because "The officials of ISU events must be neutral and unbiased at all times. Observing the activity of many officials on social media does not always give this impression. We see judges publishing their opinion on marks and skaters, and also pictures of skaters and officials together. Some officials show openly on social media who they cheer for, we now have ISU-officials with a profile picture on Facebook with active skaters! This is not in line with the duties of an official and will be clarified with this rule."

Bosnia has a skating federation? Who knew?

Single & Pair Skating Technical and Ice Dance Technical Committees propose to allow men in tights

Reason: It is not appropriate to single out the word tights. Many men’s trousers are tight fitting for safety reasons.

ISU Technical Committees are proposing

For PCS, in evaluating the Performance, the following must be considered, "projections" is added as something to be evaluated

10 should be only for "outstanding." because "Mark 10 is something special and should not be clearly distinguish from marks in 9s."

Solo jump in SP isn't required of step preceding it because "Steps preceding the solo jump become a plus GOE bullet for any jump element. It’s very controversial to count these steps as a compulsory requirement."

"Any quadruple jump cannot be included more than once in a Free Program (as a Solo Jump or a part of a Jump Combination / Sequence)."

Pair spin combo is eliminated from Pairs SP (because they reduce the length by 30 seconds)

One of the proposals from Bosnia and Herzegovina Fed:

Reason: For 10 years judges with no skaters qualified to participate in ISU Championships are excluded from panels of ISU championships except small chance to be drawn for panel of ISU Four Continents Championships. To be 100% depend of skaters is also not in accordance with code of ethics Which offers to all individual the opportunity for self –knowledge self expression And fulfilment, personal achievement ,skill acquisition and demonstration of ability , social interaction ,enjoyment, good health and well – being. It same time stop on way up to any promotion because of the reason as explained and connected with skaters. Judges are not responsible for development of skaters in their country if there is no other conditions to help development As ice rink available, coaches and so on.

____

I love how some sentences don't even have a verb.

WTH? Japan is proposing "In the Free Skating of the single skating additional bonus points will be given to skaters succeeded six different type of clean triple and/or quadruple jumps in the program."

This helps Nathan Chen - and younger skaters in general - and hurts Hanyu and older skaters, who are more likely to have cumulative injuries that prevent them from doing certain jumps that over-stress one of the ankles or hips, etc.

Why are they doing this?? Though at least it doesn't say, at least in this bullet point, that they would abolish repeated quad-types in a skate.

R106 if they count a triple and a quad of the same type as 1 instead of 2, Chen would have not got the bonus proposed by Japan Fed at Olympics

He did 4Lz, 4F+2T, 4F, 4T+3T, 4T, 4S, 3A, 3F+1Lo+3S....so no Triple or Quad Lo

If by "clean", they mean without a fall, those who would have got the bonus are

Hanyu (4S, 4T, 3F, 3A, 3Lo, 3Lz)...the Lz didn't have a positive GOE though

Fernandez: 4T, 4S, 3A, 3Lo, 3F, 3Lz

Bychenko: 4T, 3Lo, 3A, 3Lz, 3F, 3S

Rippon: 3F, 3Lo, 3A, 3T, 3S, 3Lz

Aliev: 4T, 3Lz, 3A, 3S, 3F, 3Lo

Cha: 3Lz, 3T, 3A, 3F, 3S, 3 Lo

Tanaka: 4S, 3A, 3F, 3T, 3Lo, 3Lz

Rizzo: 3F, 3A, 3Lz, 3T, 3S, 3Lo

Kerry: all triples, even if the Lo had negative GOE

Any proposals from other countries? R99 Hanyu has asthma and it used to get the best of him. His stamina has improved considerably since his move to Orser but he still tires out.

R106 Not necessarily. As r91 pointed out, Hanyu requires less set up and the FS will be 30 seconds shorter, so it could actually be more difficult for skaters like Nathan to achieve all 6 types cleanly while jumping mostly quads.

all the proposals are here

apart those two from Japan and Canada, I can't spot anything else from single Feds...well, apart Bosnia, Netherlands and Norway that proposed a lot of things that I guess will be ignored.

A kind soul on twitter translated a Javier interview on Spanish tv from yesterday....based on what he said about him and Miki Ando, i really can't understand how morozov has a career still.

So, who is the ISU official/judge who has a pic with a skater as profile picture on Facebook?

I don't follow judges on Facebook....come on, Norway Skating Fed, tell us who you are talking about

But being Norway it's probably a judge from Iceland who dared to give to Dr Valter from Finland a higher mark for Transitions than to Sondre Boe

Poor Javi :(

Everybody seemed so happy about his winning Bronze in Pyeongchang but I thought he looked upset (his smiles didn't seem real). I think it was a big blow to have Shoma Uno beat him by less than two points after he fell on his opening quad. But then, Javi turned a planned quad salchow into a double, and Shoma had 4 quads planned and Javi only 3 - he shouldn't have been surprised.

Still, I felt I could see the sadness in him. Maybe he thought he could beat Yuzu but I doubt it. Surely he wasn't reflecting on how unlucky it was that Yuzu was able to skate on a bad ankle? He's not that kind of guy. But missing out on the silver when it was so so close... Oh I don't know. He's just so HOT - it's a pity his skating sort of started tanking that last year, after he lost the world title to Yuzu in '17. And why couldn't he do 4 quads instead of 3? I bet Tarasova knows why - like Aliev, he's too fat!!

Yuzuru has the will of a samurai. He will compete in 2022 and will likely win.

Can't we just go back to when a 6 was good?

R111 a man who often accompanied Javi at KC is an ISU judge but I forgot his name...

Why hasn't Morozov been banned (and arrested) yet? Sexual relationships with students and underage skaters are perfectly fine as long as everyone's straight?

r106 Perhaps JFS is just thinking about what's best for figure skating in general. With one less jumping pass and quads getting counted separately from triples, skaters can hide jumps that they're bad at so rewarding skaters for different jumps will help force skaters to learn everything. The only advantage I can see for Japan is if this encourages skaters to be more conservative with their layout (going for a strong triple instead of an inconsistent quad). This will prevent skaters from beating Hanyu with brute TES point value and since Hanyu has the highest quality jumps he would have the advantage on GOE. But considering Hanyu is more reckless than any of them I'm not sure how much this would help.

I suppose it would also depend on what their definition of clean is. If being not clean includes things like rough landings or wrong take-offs, Hanyu gets an advantage as well since he has such pure technique on all the jumps. But it seems stupid to sabotage their #2 skater for a skater they're not even sure is going for the next Olympics.

r110 Figure skating's marketing strategy seems stupid to me. They're not going to change the minds of people who are prejudiced against the sport. Instead of worrying about skating looking girly perhaps they should just try to expand the market they have. Did Canada's/Scott Hamilton's attempt to butch the sport up bring in any new fans? Other than having successful athletes, I wonder what Russia and Japan did to make the sport popular there?

r116 did morozov get involved with underage skaters?

r105 I like that Bosnia is pushing for judges from small federations to get more involved in the judging. It's in the sport's best interest to have as many judges without skaters from their country as possible

R117 - As for why Japan is such a skating powerhouse, I think the linked article explains it pretty well.

For Russia, the Soviets screened kids for talent and put big resources into developing them so they could dominate the Olympics as much as possible and show off their superpower - competing with America, just like they did with nukes. It also sorta followed their traditional emphasis on ballet - figure skating isn't seen as girly there, just as ballet dancers aren't, well not to the extent they are elsewhere. That's at least some of the answer, anyway - and neither Japan nor Russia has the big emphasis on soccer or other big sports (except maybe baseball in Japan) so they attract talent by being the only game in town (or close to it?) Not sure of all this - but the Japanese article is sound anyway lol.

Here's Zach Donohue spinning Adam Rippon around in an ice dancing lift

And here he is feeling up Yuzuru Hanyu, looking for his dick, it appears. What a man!

[quote] did morozov get involved with underage skaters?

Morozov married in 2016 a skater born in 1998

We can assume they didn't suddenly fall in love the day of her 18th birthday

Rippon at DWTS

Zagitiva SP for next season: Phantom of the Opera! Choreo by Daniil G

R119 Soccer is huge Japan, both in schools and as a spectator sport. There's also swimming, tennis, rugby, volleyball, judo, wrestling, running (marathon), golf, basketball (through high school) and more. Figure skating has a dedicated fanbase, but it's still a minor sport that does not enjoy as many fans as the major sports including soccer. Compared to Canada, there are far fewer facilities and opportunities to skate, so you would think that Canada has the bigger market. I think the media or the federation's relationship with the media has made the biggest difference. Competitions are broadcasted on network television and regular cable channels, and skaters appear on popular TV programs and game shows. This is also true of other minor sports in Japan. Just the other day, I was watching a regular morning news program and they reported on baseball, track & field, badminton, ping pong, gymnastics, golf and a few other sports I can't recall. The night before, Oda Nobunari was on one of the biggest talk shows to promote a cartoon that has nothing to do with figure skating.

That's interesting about the federation's connection to the media, R125. Thanks for the info. They're very savvy.

I wonder if there's some connection to the huge market for KPop and JPop stars - and the predilection that the fans have for those guys to dress and act in an effeminate way, and even make out with each other, to the fans' delight. I know we have boybands but I don't remember the emphasis being on androgyny - at least it wasn't as blatant? Just something in the culture that we don't have here - but it's tailor made for male figure skaters to become "rock star" like idols, as Kurt Browning keeps calling Hanyu.

Oh I don't know. Things just come into fashion in some places and not others - a couple big stars come along and a sport or an industry might just explode. Different fandoms spring up in different countries for a multitude of reasons. Lord only knows why American football or Nascar is so big - I don't get it - but it somehow works in our particular culture.

R126 Maybe in the case of Hanyu, but I don't know about the other male skaters and that doesn't explain Mao who's the biggest star after Hanyu. The core fans are also identical to those in the US -mostly women of a certain age and gay men. Figure skaters aren't the only athletes from minor disciplines who receive rock star treatment. I can name top players from ping pong, fencing, gymnastics and wrestling, not because I follow these sports but because these athletes have appeared on many variety shows. Foreign skaters, too. Plushenko, Weir, Medvedeva, and Zagitova now have been guests on television numerous times and not always to promote a show or competition. There is a cultural tendency to focus on niche fields and very minor industries in Japan, so it's not just limited to sports either.

Sponsors must also play a role somehow. Skaters appear in commercials for multiple products all year round and not just for major companies like Coke or Pantene Pro-V, but even household products such as bath tissue and bath salts.

126 Japanese figure skating did gain K-drama fans after the Korean wave passed around 2010. Not to be confused with Japanese Kpop fans who tend to be high school or university age. The most popular Korean actors were Park Yong Ha and Bae Yong-joon, who were more muscular and masculine than slender and androgynous. I think that was part of their appeal because their fans were middle-aged and Japanese actors were more manly back in their day. Like Hanyu's most dedicated fans, K-drama fans would join international tours and follow their favorite actors around the world.

I think the overlap between Kpop, figure skating and maybe anime fandom is more of phenomenon outside Japan.

For someone who used to be interested in Chinese figure skating fans: I've asked the one I knew and he told me that nowadays many parents choose to send children to learn FS at commercial rinks in China. And yes there are lots of FS fans, thanks to their strong pairs. Jin and Yan have many fans, too. Most of the fans are girls. Boys are included and well, some are gay fans. Hanyu also has many many crazy fans in China that according to him "they often argue with each other on the internet".

He also told me that some are very disappointed with Zhao and Shen. They think Zhao is boastful. It seemed that some fans have direct access to some athletes, he said, like Sui and Wang. The two are quite active on social media, too.

The point about Charlie White is, when he had the chance to really make an impact, to take a stand, he chose not to. His gold medal was worth more than the lives of Russian gay people. In the former deleted thread someone wrote that he blocks people on Twitter who post the photo of him and Putin. And for anyone who thinks that what he said before Sochi about the Russian anti-gay laws was not so bad, here is the full quote and linked article It is such complete bullshit. He is such complete bullshit. Reading the article again makes me appreciate Ashley more.

"Tuesday, the only likely individual U.S. figure skating medalists in Sochi, reigning world champion ice dancers Meryl Davis and Charlie White, also chose not to take a public stand on the anti-gay legislation.

“I don’t think we can speak because we haven’t really talked about between the two of us very much,’’ White said.

“I don’t think the Olympics is really the right place for an athlete to make a political statement,” Davis said.

Asked if this was not a political issue but a human rights issue, White said, “Unfortunately, it’s semantics. To Russia, it is a political statement. And they are the host country. I think that is probably all we will say on the subject.”

That's right, our lives are just semantics.

And the summary of Fernandez's interview posted in the link at R110 actually reminded me to what Fernandez was reported to have said at the time. Now he is saying the interviewer twisted his words

From a 2014 report: "Fernández said: "The Games are about sport and not politics. I have my opinions and I don't get involved in what others think, but I think whether we like it or not, we have to respect the laws of the countries we visit. It's not such a big dilemma. It's better that homosexuals lie low a bit during the Games and then afterwards they can get on with their lives."

R125 baseball is not a minor sport in Japan.

World Standings used for GP assignments have been published by ISU today.

Rules are 2 guaranteed spots for top 12 at World Championships (top 10 for Pairs and Ice Dance), 1 guaranteed spot for those in Season Best Top 24 or World Standings Top 24.

If there are retirements among those in Worlds top 12, skaters from 13th onward move up to "2 guaranteed spots" category. Same doesn't apply for World Standings and Season Best lists.

Seedings are based on result at World Championships. Top 3 seeds can't meet 4-6 seeds.

The situation is as follows

MEN

1) Chen

2) Uno

3) Kolyada

4) Bychenko (retired?)

5) Tomono

6) Vasiljevs

2 spots also to

Aliev (who would move up as 6th seed if Bychenko retires and communicate to ISU before the whole assignment process is done)

Messing

Misha Ge. Retired

Brezina

Aaron. Retired (already taken out from World Standings. So formally communicated to ISU)

Majorov

1 guaranteed spot:

Hanyu

Boyang

Fernandez (won't do GP season anyway)

Zhou (moves up to 2 spots because of Ge retirement)

Voronov

Brown

Rippon (likely retirement)

Chan. Retired

Tanaka (moves up to 2 spots because of Aaron)

Yan. Retired?

Samarin

Hendrickx

Samohin

Kvitelashvili

Rizzo

Savosin

Krasnozhon (if he moves up to Senior)

If Bychenko retires, Paul Fentz gets 2 automatic spots.

Total spots available are 72. Given the likely retirements, I would say around 35 filled by the skaters above. No problems for those with 1 guaranteed spot to get a second spot and around 20 spots will be left to be filled anyway (host spots will likely be 3 French men, a couple of Chinese boys, 1 Japanese man, 1-2 Russian men, at least 1 USA man not listed above, 2 Canadian men)

LADIES

2 spots to

1) Osmond

2) Higuchi

3) Miyhara

4) Kostner

5) Zagitova

6) Tennell

Daleman

Sotskova

Hendrickx

Nagasu

Tursynbaeva

Bell

1 guaranteed spot to

Medvedeva

Sakamoto

Mai Mihara

Tsurskaya

Radionova

Konstantinova

Dabin Choi

Honda

Tuktamysheva

Panenkova

Matsuda

Yamashita (may stay Junior)

Karen Chen

Hongo

Schott (2 if Kostner retires)

Lecavelier

Rajicova

41 spots filled. All those with 1 will likely get 2 spots

PAIRS

Seeding is hilarious given Savchenko/Massot won't do GP Season

2 spots to

1) Tarasova/Morozov

2) James/Cipres

3) Zabiako/Enbert (Cup of China and Skate Canada will fight to get them as top seeded pair)

4) Della Monica/Guarise

5) Moore Towers/Marinaro

6) Yu/Zhang

Astakhova/Rogonov

Peng/Jin (if they won't be split by China)

Marchei/Hotarek

Ryom/Kim (who move up given S/M sitting out GP and Duskova/Bidar splitting)

1 guaranteed spot to

Sui/Han

Duhamel/Radford. Retired

Stolbova/Klimov

Seguin/Bilodeau

Kayne/O'Shea

Ilyushkina/Moscovitch. Retired.

Knierim/Knierim

Boikova/Kozlovskii (who are they?!)

Cain/LeDuc

Alexandrovskaya/Windsor

Duskova/Bidar. Split

Hocke/Blommaert (2 if Marchei/Hotarek retire)

Ziegler/Kiefer

Denney/Frazier

Gao/Xie

Esbrat/Novoselov

Only 48 GP spots available for Pairs. Those above should fill 33 of them. Some with 1 guaranteed spot won't get the second. Those from small Feds like Austrians and Aussies are more likely to stay with 1.

ICE DANCE

2 spots to

1) Papadakis/Cizeron

2) Hubbell/Donohue

3) Weaver/Poje

4) Cappellini/Lanotte

5) Chock/Bates

6) Gilles/Poirier

Stepanova/Bukin

Zagorski/Guerreiro

Guignard/Fabbri

Hawayek/Baker

1 guaranteed spot to

Virtue/Moir. Retired.

Shibutani/Shibutani. Hiatus

Bobrova/Soloviev. Retired

Sinistina/Katslapov

Coomes/Buckland. Status unknown. Not seen at Novi after Olympics.

Kaliszek/Spodyriev

Hurtado/Khaliavin

Soucisse/Firus

Fournier/Sorensen. Have to sit out of GP season because switch of country

Muramoto/Reed (get 2 if C/L retire. Anyway they will get the second slot through host pick)

Popova/Mozgov

Parsons/Parsons

Agafonova/Ucar. Retired

Smart/Diaz

McNamara/Carpenter

Lauriault/Legac

Nazarova/Nikitin

Wang/Liu

Carreira/Ponomarenko. May stay Junior

Skoptcova/Aleshin

Around 34 filled out of 60. Those with 1 will probably get the second spot.

Tina Garabedian/Simon Proulx Senecal have split. She is looking for a new partner (I would assume he is retiring given he's 7 year older than her).

On her Ice Partner Search she says she is not willing to relocate (she is based at Gadbois). So which Canadian mediocre male ice dancer will get her and the assured Euros/Worlds spot for Armenia?

Weaver and Poje staying eligible? Gilles and Poirier?

R133 No one said it was.

R109 Thanks for the link. Did the Netherlands make this many proposals in the past? What's motivating them this time around? Is it just Dutch enthusiasm for rules?

R117 To add onto R122, before marrying his current wife on her 18th birthday, Morozov dated at least three of his other students: Shae-Lynn Bourne, Elena Ilinykh, & Miki Ando. Pottenger was suspended for dating a 16-year old skater he wasn't coaching when he was 21 or 22.

A Senator intervened yesterday to say he is appalled by USFSA's spokeswoman response on Pottenger

USFSA response has been: “As the story clearly stated, the actions described were not illegal in Delaware,”

"I’m just appalled that an official in one of these organizations would seem to condone (this)," Blumenthal, D-Conn., said in a telephone interview with USA TODAY Sports.

“Seeming to absolve it legally appears to condone it, and that’s virtually unbelievable to me.”

Blumenthal, who held a hearing with elite athlete survivors of abuse Wednesday in Hartford, Conn., said he would like USFS to be among those present at the next hearing of the Senate subcommittee investigating sex abuse in Olympic sports, which is scheduled for May 22 in Washington.

"My personal hope is that U.S. Figure Skating will be present. I hope they’ll be there voluntarily,” he said.

"To seemingly condone (a sexual relationship between a 22-year-old coach and 16-year-old skater) sends exactly the wrong message for this governing body. It should be condemning and denouncing this behavior.”

Ilinykh was also underage.

R135 Boikova/Kozlovskii is a Russian junior pair. Guess they may move to senior the coming season but they didn't even make to the jwc this year... so how could they be guaranteed with spot??!!

R142

They finished top 2 in 2 Challenger Series events this season. I totally forgot about it. We go back to the fact that the points available at some dubious Senior Bs are too many

1697 points achieved in

#1 ISU CS Minsk Arena Ice Star 2017 (300 points)

#2 at ISU CS Warsaw Cup 2017t(270 points)

#2 at 2017 World Juniors (315 points)

#2 at ISU JGP Riga Cup 2017t (230 points)

#3 at ISU JGP Croatia Cup 2017 (225 points)

#4 at ISU JGP Pokal d. Blauen Schwerter 2016 (199 points)

#2 at ISU JGP Cup of Mordovia 2016 (158 points)

Is Mervin Tran doing a try out with Olivia Serafini (second place at US Junior Nationals in single a couple of years ago)?

r144 I like Mervyn. He's hot, has good musicality, and decent skating skills and he's clearly been held back by weak partners, but is this the best US Pairs can do? Mervyn will be in his 30s by the time the next Olympics rolls around and its clear that developing a report with a partner is not his strong suit.

Why did nobody ever throw Max Aaron into pairs? Even if he sucked at it, it would have probably been more enjoyable for him and audiences alike than the dour slog of programs we've gotten for the last 6+ years.

R143 Thank you! I think if they don't move to senior this season soon they'll be left behind by other younger Russian juniors... I quite like their FS the nutcracker last season, much much better than the creepy Candyman

Isn't Max Aaron kind of short? Male pairs guys are usually the biggest skaters around.

So Chen, Zhou, Brown

Tennell, Nagasu, Bell. So has Wagner officially retired?

Han Cong is 5'7, Max Aaron is 5'8.

Max Aaron is no Han Cong though (either in skating or fuckability)

Sui is 4'11"--so Aaron would need a tiny partner to throw around. Well, if Starr Andrews doesn't grow, she'd be short enough for anybody (4'8")

A tweet just for us "Golden Girl Caftan"

Medvedeva has left Eteri!

Oh shit!! I thought she was Eteri's favorite? Is she going to work with Brian Orser so she can be near her dream squeeze Yuzu?

[R152] Hush! Alina is Yuzu's sweetie. The Bear needs to stay far away.

OMG! This skating blogger on Tumblr said there's a rumor she IS going to Orser!! Run Yuzu, you in danger gurl! She gonna rape you!!

"Only recently did I hear that their working relationship was cracking. Apparently Zhenya has always wanted to upgrade her layout and Eteri didn’t allow her to for fear of messing up her consistency... There are two pieces of rumor floating around about Zhenya’s next move: to CSKA Moscow or to TCC with Brian Orser. Needless to say, y’all know which one I prefer, right? Fingers crossed please, sisters and brothers."

Oh - forgot to credit the blogger - it's "the-real-xmonster"

It's been confirmed. Orser IS her new coach.

Look how thrilled Yuzu is.

Jason Brown, today, May 4: “I couldn’t even talk about the experience at the US championship without breaking down in tears...I’m still dealing with low self-esteem or self worth or feeling undeserving or not feeling good enough... I did shatter, I did break but I’m loving the person I’m becoming as I pick up those pieces and I find out who I am... I cannot wait for you guys to see what I have in store for next year.” [he cries in this video at 2:15 – says he’s not quitting skating]

Apparently Eteri told Evgenia to either die or retire if she won't listen to her. WOW. It's good Evgenia left, I hope she gets to be the skater she wants to be somewhere else. Even if I don't think Orser is a good fit for her.

R159, do you have a link to this story ??

Polina Tsurskaya is reported to leave Eteri group for Buyanova at CSKA as well.

Why do I feel a scandal brewing on Eteri camp ??

Let that scandal be naked pics of Daniil G. What a cutie.

Medvedeva is such a terrible skater. If Orser can fix her abysmal jump technique, straighten her positions and develop a decently choreographed program...I will truly consider him one of the coaching greats.

So far he's been super lucky to take on students who already had superb skating fundamentals. Coaching them was simply a matter of adding some finishing touches.

But now he's getting someone whose fundamentals need a complete overhaul. This will be an interesting test. Can Higgins turn this Eliza into a Fair Lady?

Guess we'll see.

So much more potential in Wakaba Higuchi. I'd rather her go to Orser. He's already getting a new male Japanese skater, Shingo Nishiyama.

Saw this at Golden Skate: I think Evgenia wants to become a more complete skater. She's said time and again that she wants to develop the emotional side of her skating. When asked to name a skater she admired, she named Ashley Wagner ... and this was AFTER Zhenya had overcome Ashley by many points, to be World Champion. She said she admired Ashley's abilities to express any kind of music and portray it well.

Are she and Yuzuru really dating? It would be great for him.

Agree, R163. Why don't we read more about Daniil Gleichengauz here? He's hot.

Was it Daniil who Eteri was laughing with during Alina's FS at Worlds? It looked like they were having an intimate moment.

R160 It was reported on one of the Russian forums. Apparently Evgenia said it during her latest fanclub meeting.

Okay, Zhenya leaving Eteri is actually the first bit of truly interesting skating gossip I've heard in a while. Guess Medved isn't cool with being replaced by this year's model.

And, yes, her jumping technique and posture leave a lot to be desired, but she does have nerves of steel and drive. She's also young by non-Russian standards, so there's time to do some work.

This could be interesting. Particularly with the junior Russians doing quads.

Q: So, “Dancing with the Stars”: Can you even believe that you’re competing against Tonya Harding?

Rippon: (Sighs) Ah, I cannot.

Q: What is that like?

Rippon: It’s not a super big deal, but I think she’s got a lot going on, so I’m just gonna let her do her own thing, probably. Probably best.

Q: You’ve met?

Rippon: I did meet her. She’s very pleasant.

Q: Team Tonya or Team Nancy?

Rippon: Well, I mean, Tonya tried to kill someone, so I’m Team Nancy, probably.

[quote]Jason Brown, today, May 4: “I couldn’t even talk about the experience at the US championship without breaking down in tears...I’m still dealing with low self-esteem or self worth or feeling undeserving or not feeling good enough... I did shatter, I did break but I’m loving the person I’m becoming as I pick up those pieces and I find out who I am... I cannot wait for you guys to see what I have in store for next year.” [he cries in this video at 2:15 – says he’s not quitting skating]

I couldn't finish watching...he always gives me secondhand embarrassment.

I'm confused. I thought I even watched the US championships but I don't remember anything about Brown. Did he screw badly - or was he overlooked for one of those coveted Olympic places?

And then for Worlds, wasn't Jason the first alternate but for some reason he didn't do it (and we didn't know why) so they ended up with Max Aaron? Did Jason opt out of Worlds because he had a nervous breakdown?

Apologies if these are dumb questions - I'm new to following the sport.

What a turnaround for Orser. Back in 1988 he was a pariah for losing the gold medal, now he's a figure skating saviour. Goes to show, you can never tell where you'll land in life.

* oops - screw UP badly, ahem...

Also - I was reading another board about figure skating, Figure Skating Universe, and they said Russia will likely refuse to release Medvedeva out of spite -- that they had held on to a pairs skater named Lubov (who I think is now with Orser??) way longer than they even needed to because they had pairs skaters of their own, but she had to wait years for a release, and even then, some politicking had to take place to finally get Russia to release her.

Now the Armenian press has an article saying that because her father is Armenian, she may "soon" be skating for them. But then, Russia would have to release her for that, as well.

She was just with Orser in Korea and suddenly deleted all of her photos with Hanyu on instagram.

R174

Brown was third after the SP at Nationals. Rippon was second and skated the Free Skating before him screwing the last 2 jumps and falling behind Miner and Zhou. Jason had a good shot to stay ahead of Rippon at that point. However, he bombed the FS even worse than Adam and finished behind even Grant Hochstein. If he had stayed ahead of Rippon, he could have hoped to be selected for Olympics.

If Rippon's "body of work" overcame Miner's second place at Nationals, I think they would have done the same for Brown. And I don't think Rippon's BOW was enough to overcome Brown finishing ahead of him at Nationals. Unless if Adam's body of work really meant how many blow jobs he gave to the selection committee.

R176

To train abroad you don't need an official from your Fed. They can cut all fundings if they want to block you, but they can't formally stop you.

To compete for another country, yes, you need to be released. And also sit out 12 months since your last international competition with previous country.

The Lubov mentioned is Lubov lyushechkina. Yes, Russia refused her release once. Not that much when she paired with Moscovitch for Canada, but for a previous partnership she tried.

France (Didier) is notorious to refuse releases out of spite. They did it to Massot. They did it to Zagorski. The most epic one is when they stopped a certain Estelle Elizabeth to ice dance with a chap called Balazs Major for Hungary.

Thanks R178 - poor Jason :( Glad to hear Evgenia can work with Orser without a release. I'd like to see her skate for Armenia - she's said she'd like to follow Carolina Kostner's career path. Hard to do with all those up and coming quadsters and 3A jumpers in Russia.

I think Evgenia is toast. The sport has moved on and she never trained a quad or triple axel (I don't think she could have).

But it would be nice to see her do programs with different choreography.

If she skated for Armenia, she could go for a long time. She'd have the cred of her two world titles and develop as an artist. Major bonus points if she fixed her technique.

Wonder how long Zagitova is going to last? Is it going to be the one golden season or will she pull it back together. She also has technique problems.

Zagitova has better jumps but look at the younger Russian girls, lading Quad Lutzes in combination.

I'm beginning to think some kind of hormonal doping is going on here. Not even Nathan Chen was landing Quad combos at 14.

Here is Anna Shcherbakova landing a Quad lutz/triple Toe/Triple Loop combo.

R182 I don't think it's doping. Gogolev was already landing quad combos at 12. Skaters start training for quads much earlier these days and Russian coaches are less hesitant to push young students.

The reigning silver Olympian is “toast” now? What does that make the rest of the field? Why does anyone bother to compete with attitudes like that?

Three Tims. The one with flames visible from space is also the only one who is not out of the closet.

R176 Most countries would refuse to release an Olympic medalist, I imagine. The US refused to release Morgan Matthews, and all she won was Junior Worlds and Four Continents. Especially in a country like Russia, where athletes not only get their training costs covered by state, but also get salary, and Olympic medalists get a monthly stipend until the end of their lives.

Russ Miner should have skated for Armenia; he could have been an Olympian. Poor Russ. Always a bridesmaid, never a Caroline Zhang.

[quote]The one with flames visible from space is also the only one who is not out of the closet.

The gayface is very strong in that one, I must say.

Shoma Uno was seen working on a new program to this music!! (which I love!) This is separate from a new exhibition number to a jazzy Michael Buble song (ugh) by David Wilson. Could this wild thing be another exhibition? Surely not - so his short?? Apparently it was energetic, Shoma was sore after working on it (at link).

Kolyada intends to work with Rafael Arutyunyan. According to Rafaels' words, it is just a traineeship and if things work out, Valentina Chebotareva will also come to California with Mikhail.

Russia recently released without problems former Junior Ice Dance World Champions (Anna Yanovskaya, Kiril Khaliavin). But yes, releasing an Olympic medallist is not in the same league as releasing a former Jr Champions who isn't at the top in Senior.

Mind you, IIRC, there is a newish rule that if you get the citizenship of the other country , you don't need the release.

However, if Med needs to switch to the likes of Armenia means that she can't get on the Russian team. Therefore, she wouldn't be a threat for the medals.

I believe being Russian #5 is worth more than being the top skater of a small fed. Otherwise Zagorski/Guerreiro would have opted for Australia or Portugal (Guerreiro was born in Australia, from a Russian mother and a Portuguese father) rather than representing Russia.

Russian Skating Federation is expected to make an announcement of Medvedeva's coaching switch tomorrow

Meanwhile, Shoma Uno was the guest star at a basketball match in Japan.....they made him do free shots...at the 6th attempt he managed to throw the ball in.

He did a bit better after that. His quote "I didn't practice throws because i was sleeping".

Isn't sleeping one of Shoma's favorite hobbies?

If Russia releases Medvedeva, watch her sink like a brick in the standings. That girl has been coasting on the inflated scores paid for by Russian corruption since she hit seniors. Without their "protection," the judges have no incentive to prop up such a mediocre skater, especially when you have a new herd of prepubescent, doped-up girls waiting in the wings.

I think Russia's Mikhael Kolyada's skating is beautiful. So balletic. If he would quit doing the goddamned Elvis Presley type shit and stick with classical.

He's just so inconsistent. If Raf could get Adam's 3a consistent, he can get anyone consistent. And consistent is what Kolyada needs! I wish he was switching coaches for good but they're calling his move to Raf an "internship" which I don't know what that means but it's better than nothing. Go Misha!

R156 As annoying as the Shibsibs can be, Jason Brown and Daisuke Takahashi could learn a thing or two from Maia & Alex. Their (Brown & Takahashi) youtube channels are cheapening their image.

Daisuke Murakami you mean

R199 Whoops. Yes, Murakami. Takahashi doesn't need youtube.

Kolyada is boring and tacky...I don't understand the appeal.

The russians always find a way to deliver the tacky drama. Eteri has gone on tv showing private messages with Evgenia where she was asking her to keep Zagitova in juniors one more year. She says she didn't know Medvedeva had quit her group while her own daughter had already deleted all her pictures with her for weeks. Medvedeva also ghosted her.

WOW, this is really getting nasty.

btw, what's with Russia allowing their single skaters to come to America? They stopped doing that in 2002. hmm

I love Mikhael Kolyada's jumps and he should definitely come to Cali. He's always so serious and stoic. I few trips to West Hollywood should do the trick.

R202 I can't read Russian but I thought the messages only showed that Medvedeva had stopped responding to Tutberidze and the comment supposedly made by Medvedeva about Zagitova was spoken, so there's no proof it was actually made or made in the context that Tutberidze described. Tutberidze also shaded Orser in the interview, something about him not praising Trusova's quads.

[quote]something about him not praising Trusova's quads.

Orser knows better than to praise a doper...

yeah you're right i hadn't seen the video but the messages just show Medove ghosted Tutberidze and stopped responding. Orser basically said that the quad was impressive but would probably be a short time phenomenon since that girl is too young and will destroy her body. I guess Eteri didn't like that because truth hurts since that has happened to every single one of her robot students so far. I doubt Evgenia is gonna go to Orser anyways. She wouldn't be able to dope as easily there with Canadian antidoping controlling her.

What exactly is your proof that any of Eteri's skaters have ever doped? Don't say Dave Lease or Christine Brennan because they are completely full of shit.

Because they are doing 4lz3T3lo combos at 13 and all have overwhelmingly better stamina than their competitors. And not just one insanely talented girl, no, all of them. I'm sure they are very talented and work very hard but i'm sure other Russian girls also are very talented and work very hard, or the Japanese girls too and it's just not realistic that there is such a big gap in physical performance alone.

Besides since Rusada is still non compliant with WADA, there is actually no proof that anyone in Russia is tested at all.

USADA managed to test Adam Rippon a grand total of 2 times in the last 2 years. Well, at least they tested SheShib 9 times in the same period of time.

Well Evgenia apparently gohsted Eteri because she was trying to force her to go to Worlds when her injury still hasn't healed. And Evgenia didn't want to go. It's then that she also told her to either die or retire if she wasn't going to listen to her. Eteri is starting to look so bad. Fine, it happens with one student but multiple students have now left her on a very bad note - Pitkeev, Medvedeva, Lipnitskaya, possibly even Tsurskaya. Let's be honest, she's a psychopath who cares only about the results and nothing about the skaters. I'd take someone like Brian Orser or even Raf over her ANY DAY.

Also rumour has it that Evgenia barely ate anything at the Olympics, even her water intake was restricted.

R210 Source? It definitely sounds like Eteri and would explain Medvedeva's sudden change of heart after she said she was sticking with Eteri at the beginning of March. Polina is leaving for sure?

It's early afternoon in Moscow. We should be getting an official announcement anytime now.

R211 Russian forums and those who were at her closed fanclub meetings.

Polina isn't leaving for sure but there are strong rumours she's going to Buianova. It would make sense tbh, I feel like Eteri&co. totally gave up on her.

Medvedeva won all but three international competitions she entered since she started competing in seniors. The winners automatically get chosen for doping control, so that means she’s been tested plenty and by international anti-doping labs, not RUSADA. In fact, since Eteri’s students are mostly winning, they get tested more often than anyone else, which means they are easily the cleanest skaters out there.

For In Competition tests, runner up in ISU Championships is also always tested. It's the third skater to be tested that it's random. The skater tested after SP is also random.

At GPs, they randomly select two skaters not following the ranking.

In Senior B, they must test at least one skater.

These are the minimums. They can add more skaters to the to be tested pool if they wish

In Dance and Pairs they test either the man or the woman but never both of them. So when Bobrova tested positive for Meldonium at Euros, Soloviev wasn't tested.

WADA can do out of competition tests on Russian athletes if RUSADA don't do them. Same for other countries.

In US, USADA regularly publish stats on tests carried out and requested by them (the numbers don't include tests they carry out on behalf of International Federations for international events taking place in US, etc).

In 2016 the most tested skater by USADA was Alex Shibutani with 4 tests

In 2017 Maia undertook 8 USADA tests and Alex 6 tests. They are the skaters with more tests

In 2018 they are all at 1 except for Kayne and O'Shea who got tested twice.

R214 Yes so that means from what we know this year Evgenia participated in one ISU championship : Euros where she finished 2nd so she was tested there. For the rest, there is no indication she was ever tested at all. Maybe she was, maybe she wasn't. So that argument that because she wins more she is more tested is actually untrue.

Anyways, the in-competition tests are not those that catch people (only when they make mistakes on their dosages or something) because the athletes know there will be tests and they plan their substance abuse so that it's not detectable at that period. That's why the out of competition tests are important, but with them training year-long in Russia well there is no proof that they are tested at all.

As for Eteri, obviously she is a massive psycho bitch and an abuser. Pretty much every one of her student has left her with a career ending injury or illness before they were even 18. Medove actually lasted longer! Eteri has obviously no interest in the well-being of those kids at all, do you really think she would draw the line at doping?!

Official announcement by Med:

She thanks Eteri for all the hard work in the last 11 years

She will represent Russia at international level

She will still represent Sambo70 Club at internal level

She wil be coached by Orser

R202, Sotskova used to spend summers in the US training with Arutyunyan when she was coached by Panova.

This is getting better and better

lynn‏ @boyangsupremist apparently medove had to ask borser to accept her five times but got rejected the first four times (it's on korean/jpn fs forums who got it from russian forums).

Philip Hersh spoke to Orser about taking on Medvedeva and the story will be at @icenetwork soon.

Not to be shipping because god knows I don't believe in that nonsense, but Yuzuru is doing Ice shows in only two Japanese cities, and Medvedeva is only doing shows in those same two locations (Makuhari on May 25-27, Kanazawa on June 1-3.) Then she says she’s moving to Canada in June.

I think of Brian as an old softie, if it’s true he’s turned her down before, maybe she told him about being forced to skate when the doctor said not to, and also that she wasn’t allowed to eat or even have as much water as she wanted during comps. Another factor is his work with Javi will be considerably less – maybe with Yuzu as well as he says he wants to do “his own thing” more now that he’s won two Olympic gold. IOW, does Yuzu really need a coach?

[quote]...since Eteri’s students are mostly winning, they get tested more often than anyone else, which means they are easily the cleanest skaters out there

Hahahahaha! A Russian troll has escaped the Treason threads. The cheating methods are documented and notorious, Natasha.

Interview with Orser, in which he says: She told me [with Eteri] it was, 'This is what you're skating to. This is the order of your spins, these are your spin positions.''

Skating Lesson now say Chock and Bates are confirmed as going to Montreal!

Who is left at Igor's? Min/Gamelin, Nazarova/Nikitin and Carreira/Ponomarenko?

Both main assistant coaches are gone.

R220 Yuzuru is doing all Fantasy on Ice shows, it was just published today. And another one in either Nagano or Nagoya, I can't remember.

Medvedeva first texted Orser on April 2nd, but didn't meet with him to discuss the coaching change until April 22nd. Rumors were already swirling in early March and Eteri's group was already deleting Medvedeva from their social media weeks before the announcement. Maybe after Medvedeva withdrew from Worlds, Eteri thought she could scare her skater into believing her Russian team would abandon her if she didn't obey her coach's every word, but pushed her into Orser's arms instead. If she hadn't already consulted Hanyu, Orser's interview suggests Medvedeva could have consulted Fernandez during SOI Japan since their first show was March 31st. The Russian fed seems supportive though? Comments from the big figures like Plushenko and Yagudin have been positive. From the outside, only Eteri and some of the public seem upset but maybe things look different inside Russia.

R212 Can you tells us more about these fan meetings, like how candid are the skaters and how much do they reveal? Are there a lot of insiders?

R225 I never was there, I only read what the people at the fanclub meetings posted on the Russian forums! But since it's a small, rather exclusive fanclub meeting, they tend to reveal a lot more than at usual "big" fanclub meetings.

I'd like to see an Evgenia with clean jumps and good posture--she does have some feel for music and interpretive skills. If she were less bent, I might actually like her as a skater. But there's a lot to fix.

[quote]so that means she’s been tested plenty and by international anti-doping labs, not RUSADA.

There is no effective way to test for Russian hormonal doping, which is widely rumored to be the new it thing in doping.

Oh for fuck's sake, enough with the doping BS. There are many sports where doping is a major problem and none of them are figure skating.

Do Eteri's juniors even need to dope yet? They're still young and like gymnasts, they can continue to delay puberty for a little while with hard training and a restrictive diet. You don't see young girls from other countries jumping quad after quad because they're busy going to school during the day while Eteri's girls are training all of the time. And those girls were selected out of many. Both Zagitova and Medvedeva have gone through puberty and don't jump quads. Those juniors may no longer land their quads once their bodies are developed.

Some random news

- Finland announced the 2018-19 team. The 31 year old Doctor is carrying on

- Voronov, Kovtun and Tsurskaya moved to Elena Buyanova

- Rumors that even Weaver/Poje are moving to Gadbois. And Abachkina paired with an US Junior:::.....I wonder who can he be? They won't split Carreira/Ponomarenko....I doubt Green/Green split....Logan Bye? Isn't he too short to handle her? Ian Sommerville?

Wait, what?Angélique Abachkina left her French partner to skate for the US ???

It must be one of the new seniors boys then? What about the Persons boy ?

R232. Abachkina/Thauron split in March. He has teamed up with Adelina Galayavieva and he moved to Moscow with Krylova. They will skate for France. She was already skating for France. So no need to sit out for 12 months.

Abachkina is still searching for someone. She even had a try out with Pierre Souquet which sounded a bit desperate.

Someone on GS (who seem to know things happening in Novi. Like when Zuerlein had his last day there and where he is moving) said she recently had a try out with a American Junior.

I would guess she would skate for France.

My goodness, Abachkina is such a great talent. What could have happened for the French fed to let her go just like that?

I am not so sure Angelique will skate for France given that I can't think of a junior American skater willing to skate France. Unless that skater is the freshly retired Alex Benoit and he was skating in the Novi team.

But Would Didier release her? Maybe the troubles of getting a new partner is related to one of the two needing to be released.

She was just a junior a year or so ago, she is young enough that she can afford to skip the next Olympics.

She would have the same problem with any of the American skaters as I don't think USFSA would be willing to release one of their skaters.

Tammy Gambill moves to Colorado Springs to coach alongside Tom Zakrajsek and co.

No change for Zhou who was already switching between the 2.

Not sure what will mean for Karen Chen.

Who else is coached by Gambill?

I know she has Yaroslav Paniot (who had a disappointing season). Who else?

Tammy teaches great basics and her skaters are usually well packaged, so a partnership with Zakrajsek (technician) could very well pay off.

So Carmalengo (sp) is now working with Marina's ex-partner ?

Yesterday, Karen Chen posted an Instagram photo of herself hugging Mai Miyahara at Orser's rink in Toronto (with Yuzuru and his mother in the distant background - him skating with his mother looking on through an office window.) Someone said David Wilson was in that office talking to another skater...

Anyway - surely Karen and Mai aren't both joining Evgenia... Probably just visiting. But it's been a crazy off-season...

When is Grant's wedding?

Mai is there for a training summer camp, it seems. No idea about Karen. Choreography, maybe?

Interesting about Karen and the camp - there was a tweet about Jin Boyang on Monday : "Someone saw him on the plane to Toronto and even took a pic of him and she asked if he was going to tcc he said no just going to Toronto first."

Now is he just attending the same camp as Mai - or is he spending more time with Orser (and his own coach) than just this camp - or is he moving to Canada to train most of the time?

What is the situation of Michigan ice dance?

DETROIT

Krylova moved back to Russia

Hawayek/Baker have gone to Montreal

Agafonova/Ucar have retired.

NOVI

Zuerlein is reported to have gone to Wheaton. Bourzat is reported to have gone back to France.

Chock/Bates have gone to Montreal

Coomes/Buckland have not announced anything about their future plans. They are apparently currently in England and have not been seen in Novi since Olympics

Nazarova/Nikitin. They went back to Novi after Worlds. She is now in Ukraine but they were in Michigan until last week. So maybe it is only an holiday

Min/Gamelin...they are still skating in Novi

Mansour/Ceska. Reported to have split. She is reported as doing tryouts in Novi while the GS poster said she doesn't know about him. I guess it means he has not been seen in Novi. He may have retired.

Abachkina/Thauron. Split. He moved to Moscow. She is doing tryouts.

Pogrebinsky/Benoit. He retired, she is searching for a new partner

Junior teams are all there

CANTON

Shibutani/Shibutani are on hiatus. Let's wait and see if it is permanent

Muramato/Reed have started trying for new season in Canton

Lorenz/Polizoakis. Not seen at Canton since Worlds but Joti is in doing the required military stuffs in Germany. They could be back after he finishes his soldier training.

Reed/Saulius (don't pretend I can spell his surname), they are still in Canton

oh well, I couldn't even finish typing that another couple bites the dust.

Kavita Lorenz announces her retirement. So it's the end for Lorenz/Polizoakis.

What's the story behind Vincent Zhou being a gun-toting anti-trans fundie?

R242, It was reported that Chinese coaching team is considering sending him to tcc with his coach, presumably for short term training, but nothing is confirmed yet. He is probably getting choreo from Lori Nichol now, thats why he said he's not going to tcc. Im not sure how this whole Medvedeva thing will or will not affect Boyang's situation since Orser said he will accept only 1 or 2 new students and some Japanese male skater already transfered?

Apparently Medvedeva will go to Canada in the mid-June, so maybe it's still possible for him to do some sort of summer camp

Where will Kevin Bottom train? Where will Star Andrews record all her music? Will Deniss V become ascendant on the world stage? Will Loena Hendrickx 6th place in the free skate at world's finally break her out of the shadow of her mediocre gay brother?

Why are we discussing 9th tier ice dancing couples when we could be discussing the real issues?

R248

1) Mark Mitchell but we want him to move to Orser. Not to Raf because he was already there when Junior.

2) maybe when he will get a proper coach instead of a sugar daddy

3) Jorik got a boyfriend. See below.

4) because 9th tied ice dancers are still more interesting than US ladies.

Oh crap - about Zhou R245. But I guess it makes sense - he has even less stylishness (can't think of a better word) than Nathan. Is he from Utah too? WTF? They've taken over the dance world so now skating as well? Yokels dancing and skating - only in Amurika. Grim jumping beans reign supreme while the delicious Adams and Jasons crash out. (We'll always have Johnny, not that he ever won anything much...)

Poor Denis Vasiljevs - well, maybe it's poor Stephane - can Lambiel ever get a "protege" client to make a splash? Didn't Plushenko take on the OGM Adelina and then she just petered out? It may be harder to break into coaching than skating (and harder to figure out how to be good at it)

Vincent Zhou is from Palo Alto, so go figure . . .

Seriously, I can see Deniss getting an Euro medal at some point. At World stage, I can see him maintaining the top 10 finish he got this year. He can land the quad on one feet at some point...but with one quad you don't usually medal.

This season the Russians that jumped ship will realize they cannot actually cannot figure skate.

Russia poured millions to win medals and not the development of skaters.

I’m kinda liking Eteri now.

Why has the latest TSL video been deleted?

R254 Don't know but before they deleted the video, they deleted some of their own comments.

Obviously the Russian Fed supports Medvedeva since they're allowing her to train in Canada, but this interview and Bobrova's comments suggest Medvedeva has their full backing and had been in touch with them about the coaching some time before she first texted Orser. What is the likelihood that the Russian Fed itself advised Medvedeva not to speak to Eteri?

R255: Eteri is not there to train adult skaters. She runs a school. I could see Rus Fed telling Medvedava to keep quiet about a change.

Russia has another two or three years before the quad jumpers can join the seniors. It’s not a loss for them to move older skaters to new coaches.

The costume of Uno's new EX is really atrocious...

R254 The video has been uploaded again. They (Dave) claim they accidentally deleted the video but they were deleting some of their comments in the original upload before the video disappeared. One was reiterating that Hanyu hates Uno, but it didn't get much hate or attention as the arguments about the correct definition of a "valley girl." The most controversial part of their video was how dismissive Dave was about Erin Andrews' sexual assault. I don't know if they removed their own comments about that since I didn't get a chance to check them again before the video disappeared. I don't remember seeing anything heated about Medvedeva and I think Dave would have said something if Russian trolls suddenly stormed the comments. I don't know how easy it is to accidentally delete a youtube video but TSL's Dave Lease is a fickle person who doesn't take criticism well. There's no way he's not on datalounge, maybe he'll explain.

Well, it is possible to accidentally delete a youtube video. God knows I got in trouble when I accidentally deleted a client's video.

[quote]Why are we discussing 9th tier ice dancing couples when we could be discussing the real issues

If we can treat an Olympic Team Bronze medalist like Rippon as if he's skating royalty, why not?

I don't believe Dave's assertion that Yuzuru hates Shoma. There are fan videos of them together, buddying up, like I've never seen any other pair of skaters. Shoma even mimics Yuzuru a lot - there's a video where Yuzu realizes Nathan has beat him, and he puts his face in his hands dejectedly - sitting beside him, Shoma does the exact same thing! It's weird.

And Shoma has never beaten Yuzu, which is the only reason I can even think of why he would "hate" him. I really don't get this, at all. And unless he speaks Japanese, I can't imagine that Dave would have any inside info.

I can imagine him maybe hating Takahashi - he used to speak highly of him quite often and I noticed he hardly mentions him anymore (though he's forever going on about Plushenko and Weir). Or Patrick Chan, who has said some pretty dismissive things about Yuzu. Or Ten or Yan Han, etc... But Shoma?? Makes no sense to me. [note I don't think he hates those others either, but there would at least be clues or reasons to believe he might]

[R258] Thanks for the explanation. I don't even know him that well but I thought it might have been an excuse.

[R261] Dave said that? That's stupid. He's been reading too much fanfic. Maybe it's because Japanese media / netizens like to take the rival angle, and he might buy into any Japanese info thinking it's more authentic or something.

Well that's at least an explanation, R262 - thanks - the Japanese fans are hardfuckingcore, good lord. I was coming up completely blank. If somebody asked me who were the two closest male skaters (to each other), I'd have said Hanyu-Uno - they act just like brothers (with a pronounced big brother-little brother dynamic but that's the Japanese way). There's a video of Hanyu worrying about Uno being cold and taking off his own jacket and putting it on little Shoma, fixing his earphones at a news conference, he pats him on the head all the time etc etc...

If anybody cares about Russian men (or Eteri's continuing losses): Male skater Ilya Skirda left Eteri for Viktoria Volchkova (Butsaeva).

Maxim Kovtun returned to Elena Vodorezova (Buianova) and took Sergei Voronov with him (or other way round - not sure) but Buianova was about the only remaining Russian coach Maxim hasn't trained with before. Sergei and Dmitri Aliev are invited to The Ice show in Japan later this summer.

Lease said that to up the drama but it's obvious Hanyu would never agree with Orser taking on Uno (or Chen for that matter). Like yeah he trained with Fernandez but they grew up to be those top competitors from the promising skaters they were at the time, it's different than taking on your number 1 rival and help him to beat you. (Hello Marie France btw). Also i don't believe it comes from hate, but i have no issue believing Hanyu is somewhat more competitive with Uno than with someone else, a bit like you are more competitive with your siblings/friends than with random strangers

Why is grandpa Voronov still skating? Maybe he should skate for Isreal like I did and actually would be able to compete at Euros and Worlds.

[quote] Sergei and Dmitri Aliev are invited to The Ice show in Japan later this summer.

The Ice (4 shows, 2 each in Osaka and Aichi)) full cast is

Nathan Chen

Dmitri Aliev

Sergei Voronov

Takahito Mura

Nobunari Oda

Kazuki Tomono

Mirai Nagasu

Satoko Miyahara

Kaori Sakamoto

Mai Mihara

Marin Honda

Gabriella Papadakis and Guillaume Cizeron

____

Tomono's new SP is done by Misha Ge. It will be premiered during Dreams on Ice shows.

Sakamoto is currently working with Benoit Richaud who already did her programs last season.

R63 I agree.

R264 Of course they're competitive. Hanyu's said that Uno has helped drive him since they were juniors; Uno's said Hanyu's his eternal goal. You're right, it's a different dynamic to a skater from another country. But at the same time they seem very supportive. (And Shoma doesn't seem very competitive, maybe in gaming haha). Also, who says Shoma wants to move to Orser? He seems super loyal to his coach, he said he didn't even want competitive programs choreographed by someone other than her.

Meant R263 ^

Didn't realize kovtun is only 22, maybe he could still take the third Russian spot

R261 Dave deleted his comment so maybe he doesn't believe it anymore. I don't get why he felt the need to delete it in the first place because it wasn't a big deal. Or maybe it didn't generate enough attention? The reupload still hasn't been announced on TSL's twitter though you'd think Dave would want to promote it as much as possible with the DWTS Tonya stuff and Medvedeva scandal.

Uno is very competitive despite his cutesy laid back appearance. He's talked about losing sleep over his scores and he's been saying he wants to beat Hanyu to become number 1 for a long time. His obsession with gaming might also be tied to his competitive personality. I don't think Hanyu sees Uno as his main competition and is more competitive with himself than anything. Both skaters seem more disappointed in themselves than spiteful of their competitors when they lose. The Japanese fed wouldn't allow them to train together after the Oda-Takahashi-Morozov disaster even if both were open to the idea anyway.

R263 How many skaters have left Eteri just this off season? Four? When are Polina's parents going to spill the beans as promised?

Oh I'd love to hear about the Oda-Takahashi-Morozov disaster, R270! I'm new to skating and particularly fascinated by Daisuke - but also Oda, since I read he was caught coming out of a gay bathhouse in Osaka and then soon got married and had kids. I think he comes from a line of nobility and the ancestor, his namesake, is famous for being a gay samurai, so why the pressure on Oda (I'll never understand Japan..)

I can buy the idea that Hanyu would never want Uno with Orser due to the rivalry but it was Dave's use of "hate" that I took umbrage from - I really really don't think they hate each other at ALL. Anyway, who could hate awkward little Shoma?! Who follows Hanyu around like a puppy and has said hes happy for Hanyu to get the attention/fans/pressure because it makes his life easier. And yeah, I do believe he'd love to be #1 and beat him - but I can't help but believe he understands that he does benefit from less limelight because he doesn't speak a word of English and doesn't like being put on the spot - which Hanyu constantly is coping with.

Although... that's made me wonder why anyone would think it was a good idea to have Boyang Jin and Yuzu with the same coach. They're just as much rivals and him and Uno, especially in the quad competition. Uno's quads are ragged though consistent but Boyang's are his calling card - Orser fixing his skating skills would make him a HUGE thread to Yuzu.

OTOH, I'm not sure Yuzu even needs a coach anymore. He's said he wants to skate "a little bit longer" - that his ONLY motivation is to land a 4A in a valid competition - that he wants to do his OWN thing, not do all the crap necessary to win - and Nam said that Yuzu's typical training would be trying 60 quads in a day's session! If his only motivation is the 4A, I'd imagine that would be the bulk of his training, other than working with ShaeLynn on a very personalized set of programs.

Speaking of which -- isn't Shoma working with Shae Lynn on that Native American number? If that's an exhibition, then why did David Wilson (or maybe Buttle) do a very dull 1960s kind of exhibition number for Shoma to a fucking Michael Buble' number? So he either is working on two exhibitions -- or the crazy hippy-Indian outfit is for his short in which case -- look out, Shoma - the SJWs are gonna get you!!! You'll hear them roar even if you don't understand a word of English.

Oh no, poor person who thoughtlessly uses another culture that is oppressed and catches flak for it! How horrible of people to not like it! /s

Oda's grandfather made the claim that they're related to Nobunaga, but it's not actually something that they can prove. Japan's ancestor registry is strict about it and he doesn't have the papers to back it up, so it's largely known to be a "self-proclaimed" thing.

As for the Oda/Takahashi/Morozov disaster, I understand that Oda reached out to Morozov while Takahashi was already there, and since they were rivals and Takahashi was dealing with self esteem and injury issues plus Morozov's renowned favoritism issues, he couldn't deal with it and left Morozov, who had helped him rise to stardom, and returned to Japan, where his career never really was the same. Oda later confessed to feeling guilty about Takahashi leaving because of him.

Good point about the thoughtlessness but I'll blame Shae Lynn instead of Shoma... not sure why, I just can't blame Shoma for anything. He seems like one of the innocents of the world (and I'm probably so so wrong lol). Anyway, as Yuzu says, "He's so cuuuute!!!!" If they go ahead with the Native American outfit, oh boy.... Anyway, apologies for the insensitivity.

Thanks so much for the scoop - it starts to possibly explain some things. And Hanyu coming up out of nowhere like a lightning flash, winning that medal at Worlds in 2012 at 17, with his fierce determination, or as Takahashi says, his "carnivore" spirit, it must have felt like a thunder cloud over his head, dooming the rest of his career. But then, Hanyu is 9 years younger so how much longer did Daisuke think he had at the pinnacle of the deep Japanese field anyway?

Oh I don't know what I'm talking about but I sense all manner of darkness around the whole Takahashi drama, and the Oda/Morozov situation goes a long way towards explaining the odd atmosphere. I worry about all these skaters (and elite athletes in general) when their time in the sun is done - it's not always a smooth transition from star of the ice to has-been, and to have it happen when you're still so young. But it is what it is - at least in Japan there's quite a market for their shows, unlike the States.

Uno is very competitive ??? Really. From what I see, he just sees skating as his job. He doesn't know the reason why he competes, why he skates. He said who was happy the most for his Olympic silver medal is his coach, he didn't see Olympics different from other competitions. Not that he was bitter he lost gold but he didn't care about it. He is like a peaceful employee who simply goes to office, fulfills his responsibilities and goes home, never thinks of promotion. If he were that competitive, he wouldn't have let Chen and Hanyu take over him time after time when he apparently got the chance to beat them. The one who is hypercompetitive is Hanyu. He can't forgive himself if he lets someone take the gold that he thinks to be his. And he will seek to win at all costs next time. The so-called Hanyu Uno rivalry is just the drama Japanese media tries to built up to make competitions more exciting.

I think it's not so simple. I think it was Lambiel who recently remarked that Shoma was indeed very ambitious and competitive - he cried when he came 7th at his first Worlds as a senior. OTOH, he strikes me as extremely stoic. Maybe he didn't know how to feel (at the Olympics) because he didn't really win -- there are plenty who are appalled when they're second instead of first, like Hanyu, for example. But he certainly wouldn't let on, because, well, he does respect Hanyu and Hanyu helps him out, through the endless ceremonies and press conferences, that he struggles with, socially.

Oh who knows? If he communicated in English, I think we'd have a better grasp of what he's really thinking, but I think of him as pretty stoic but inside, and he even used the term, "envious" --- now he said he was envious of others' excitement -- but maybe he was envious of being the undisputed #1 which he's never been (though he's won Japanese Nationals a couple times, I think -- I need to go looking for youtubes of his reaction to 'that' - maybe he doesn't have as much trouble accessing his excitement when he really WINS. I kept thinking Javi looked devastated (but smiled through it because what else could he do?) Surely he most have known that the base value of his long program was lower than Hanyu's and then he popped his third and final quad -- so surely he wasn't upset about losing to Hanyu -- but 1 or 2 points behind Shoma, who fell on his first quad? That must have hurt a bit.

Speaking of our pocket prince, here he is in the controversial hippy and/or Native American outfit -- if I'm reading correctly, he and his mother designed it! Maybe Shae Lynn can make some adjustments - maybe it is an exhibition number, not for competition? and the cheesy Buble' thing is either his short or another EX. It's gonna be a long wait to see if this turns out to be a disaster (maybe it will never make it to the ice)

Even without the cultural appropriation, Uno's outfit is an abomination.

R271 Morozov took on Oda causing Takahashi to leave, so Oda was accused of pushing him out. Then Oda was blamed whenever Takahashi didn't do well and almost quit skating because of the guilt and harassment. If Hanyu and Uno trained under the same coach, the skater that performed better would be accused of hogging the coach from the other. If one left, the other would be blamed for forcing him out. Hanyu and Fernandez work because they come from very different skating federations and Hanyu wasn't famous when he joined TCC. Otherwise, we would've had a Yagudin/Plushenko or Medvedeva/Zagitova situation.

There were suspicions Oda's marriage was not only to cover up the gay sauna thing but to distract from the drunk driving charge (he went drinking with his university friends at the sauna and then tried to drive his motorbike home), but he didn't get married until three years after that happened and his girlfriend was already four months pregnant by then. He's had three kids before turning 30, which is overkill by Japanese standards. I think he's the type of person who's willing to sleep with anyone if pushed enough. Even if Oda is related to Oda Nobunaga, which no one takes seriously, Nobunaga was not an aristocrat so no nobility, just a fun fact to share at parties.

R272 We may never know the true story but according to Morozov, the rift was already there between him and Takahashi before Oda. He was convinced Takahashi's agent was interfering with his coaching and pulling the skater away, so he took on Oda as a preemptive measure. He claimed Oda approached him first but Oda said it was Morozov who approached him.

R274 Uno is very competitive according to his own brother. See below:

I remember a quote from Shoma on one of the interview shows in Japan - something close to this: "Well, it's disappointing that I never win and always come second, but I guess it's good that I don't fall apart."

I found that odd. But it does suggest that he's not altogether happy with silver after silver after silver...

R274 Uno said the Olympics felt like any other competition but he's been talking about winning the OGM since he was little. No one just stumbles onto the Olympics. To get to this level of skating, you have to be competitive. Nothing wrong with that.

Of course every elite skaters have to be competitive to some extent to get such high level of skating. Someone like Javier can be more competitive after his World wins I don't see others aren't lol. Sure, Uno is competitive but his competitiveness isn't remarkably more than other elite skaters. He is OSM going into Worlds. He should have done everything to take over Chen ( who finished 5th) at Worlds. But he blew his chance away holding on silver. Don't bring his boot issue up. Without it, I doubt he could do anything better. If he is /that/ competitive, he wouldn't have let him be beaten again and again.

Competitiveness isn't just " ok, I'm not happy with my silver, I feel like I could have won if ..., I feel I could have done much better, I feel sorry about mistakes". It's more about "I'm fuckin' win next time, just wait and see." That said, if Uno competed against someone fragile like Takahashi, he would have dominated Japanese skating long ago lol.

"If he is /that/ competitive, he wouldn't have let him be beaten again and again." So winning is just a matter of feeling competitive enough? Lol. So when Hanyu lost to Nathan or Javi, he was a different person? That's not how sports work. Nerves, physical condition, anything can make a split second change and make you slip. That he's been on the podium every competition of the season shows that he consistently delivers through the highs and lows.

Uno is very competitive, but he's also very intensely inward-focused. Hanyu is easily influenced by outside factors, but he also can transform that pressure into power, which is something he often talks about. It's a delicate balance - he talks about all the pieces of the glass having to fit together for it to work - but when it's there it's phenomenal. And he likes attention and excitement and absorbs other people's energy, and has a lot of explosive emotions to go around and isn't afraid to show them. But Uno is the opposite kind of person - I think he's more narrower-focused, like the "fewer friends but deeper friendships" type of person, and admits to not trusting strangers easily, so he wouldn't want to be caught vulnerable in front of cameras. He also seems to get overwhelmed by sensory overload, and just zones out because he doesn't know what to do with all of it, which makes him look stoic. He probably sees every competition as similar because he treats every practice like competition and every competition like practice, and has learned to block out the unnecessary stressors and nerves that affect him. It's not that he doesn't care - he cares a lot, but he has so much respect for Hanyu's skills that though he'd like to reach his level, he also admits that Hanyu is simply much much better than him.

No one can tell how much a skater is affected by nerves until they /really/ have to deal with it. No one expected Chen bombed his Olympics sp that badly under pressure, same with Alina Zagitova at Worlds. No one, even Nathan himself, saw much in him matter of nerves until Olympics. He did struggle many times before Olympics but many thought it was because of his highly demanded programs. Many used to think he wasn't affected much by circumstances until Olympics. The pressure skaters have to with different competitions is different. Uno sees every competitions similar because he doesn't understand that difference. He's overshadowed by Hanyu for years, from which he benefits. It's only when that he has to fight not only for himself but also for his supporters, his country, when he is Japan's only hope for medal at major competitions that he will directly experience the weight of pressure and fully understand that each competition is different. The only and lastest time he directly had to deal with that was at Worlds. And he chocked.

R279 Do you think Cohen was less competitive than Arakawa and Kwan was less competitive than Hughes ? As for Uno's performance at Worlds, his coach had to carry him after the first practice, so his injury was more than a small boot issue.

R280 "I'm fuckin' win next time, just wait and see." -That's the very attitude his brother described in the Nikkan Sports interview. It drives him crazy to lose and he'll do whatever he can to win next time. Whether it comes to skating or video games, he will watch each competitor closely, analyze his own performances, and work painstakingly to improve himself in secret. But sometimes it's not enough. You can be as competitive as can be and still not win. There's more to being the best than having a strong desire to win, especially when it comes to sports. You've got to have the goods, too. In any case, coming in second isn't too bad.

So what's the latest on Chen ? Last time we heard he looked pretty happy to have a normal college life.

I'm thinking he is going to lay low for 2-3 years while still maintaining his skating fitness. He's probably coming back just to win the Olympics.

I don't see how you can lay and expect to come back and win in four years. But I do get the feeling that Chen's ambition was to win gold and then retire from skating. He could have done it, too--he just needed to not switch up his lay-out during the short and then stick the long.

Oh well.

Given his content, it would actually be a good idea to lay low (not pound his body too much) in order to maintain his body healthy. He could work on his artistry which he stopped developing when Rafa started training him for quads. His billman spin was pretty good and it's such a shame he dropped the personality and the spins when he started focusing on the quads. I don't think he ever forgave his parents for taking him away from ballet which he loved.

IMO he will try to jungle between competitive skating and Yale next season. He may not to be able to successfully combine both and then next year he will have to take a decision on his priorities. But next season is the best one to try and combine both. If you can't, you still have time to reassess everything before 2022

He can go three years prioritizing school and skating part time, which is what he'll probably end up doing. He ain't staying to win world championships, he already has one of them. He is obviously staying for 2022.

I read that Yale doesn't allow students to go part-time, so that's a real issue. Polina Edmonds is full-time, but her skating career seems kind of shot at this point. Wonder if she's even going to compete net year. Also, pre-med at Yale is a different kettle of fish than communications at Santa Clara.

R289 Polina is not even in the USFSA International Pool anymore IIRC when it was released last month

[quote]I read that Yale doesn't allow students to go part-time,

Chen is not going to be a part time student. He has made it very clear that school is his top priority, as it should be. His almost robotic work ethic will do wonders for him on Yale.

Skating wise he said he'll take lessons from Raf on skype. He'll probably do Nationals and call it a season.

Carreira/Ponomarenko will move Senior next season.

Damn! It's going to be very crowded at at US nationals.

Arutyunyan also sounded skeptical, like he'll eventually have to choose between Yale and transferring to a more convenient school to remain competitive. Nathan believes he can do it all right now because his school breaks coincide with the competitions, but I think he's underestimating travel and practice time.

Knierims changed coaching team. They will be coached by Aljona Savchenko!

5/14/18) - Two-time U.S. pairs champions Alexa Scimeca-Knierim and Chris Knierim announced today they will begin training with Aljona Savchenko and her coaching team this summer. The pair has trained under Dalilah Sappenfield in Colorado Springs, Colorado, since 2012.

The pair will train in both the greater Chicago area and Oberstdorf, Germany.

"We are extremely grateful for the relationship and career we have built with Dalilah and all of our coaches at the World Arena," Alexa said. "We will always cherish those experiences we shared together over the last six seasons."

"We are incredibly excited and motivated to start our journey with the newly crowned Olympic champion Aljona Savchenko and the members of her team," Chris added.

Savchenko won the gold medal at the 2018 Olympic Winter Games, and is a six-time World pairs champion.

"I am so happy that I am able to share my passion with such a hard-working and intelligent pair," Savchenko said. "I'm excited to work with Alexa and Chris."

[quote]Arutyunyan also sounded skeptical, like he'll eventually have to choose between Yale and transferring to a more convenient school to remain competitive.

Nathan will have to choose. Sorry, no fucking way can he prioritize a full-time, pre-med degree at Yale, while maintaining his elite status as a skater--especially nowadays with all the quads. He had to train like a madman, putting his body through intense (maybe even reckless) training, to acquire and retain his arsenal of quads.

You cut that down to half, plus add age into the mix, lack of competing, diluted focus, etc...and the math just doesn't add up. He might get to 2022, but the idea that he can do skating "on the side" for 2-3 years, then walk into an Olympic season and be at a prime competitive level, is ridiculous.

Hmm. Does this make Hanyu OG #3 more likely? Open the door for Zhou or Jason Brown? How would +5 GOE rule change affect Chen - I would think he'd need to work on higher quality in his quads to keep up (or maybe they're ok but his landings look so stiff to me).

Oh well, it's a long time till '22. Maybe Chen will quit Yale to make a run for it - I think he implied that in an interview. That if part-time skating practice didn't work, he might have to delay his education several years.

Vasiljevs just said he plans to start university in Switzerland next fall. So he plans to stay at Lambiel's for the full quad

Skate Canada announced today the retirement of Liam Firus. Last week they announced the retirement of Baldé. I guess in the next 2 weeks they will put out a press release for Kevin Reynolds. Can anyone tell them that they don't build up exciting by sipping the retirement announcements of second/third tier skaters already assumed as retired by everyone?

well, it turns out (per FSU dance thread) that the rumoured Abachkina's "US Junior man" is Alexey Shchepetov. Color me disappointed.

Swiss single skater Stephen Walker is having tryouts in Ice Dance in Milan. He was recently pictured with Cappellini, Lanotte and other ice dancers from their club (their club also have single skaters) and singled out as one of the "new entries". Now he is also on Ice Partner Search, so the switch is confirmed. Interestingly, in that group photo there was also Giada Russo. So she may try to switch to Ice Dance too.

I think college and skating is doable--if you can go part-time when necessary. Davis/White both went to the University of Michigan while competing, though I don't think either has ever graduated. Mirai Nagasu is slowly working towards a degree.

The only way I'd see Yale working is if, somehow, the skating and the coaching were right there, but they're not. Edmonds chose SCU (she wasn't injured at the time) because her coaching and rink were nearby. Not the case with Nathan and Yale.

I think he thought he was going to medal and could go hang up his boots.

Are the Shibutanis ever goIng to put those bronze medals down somewhere?

R302 Madison, you don't need be to bitchy

[quote]Nathan will have to choose.

My son do everything!

[quote]My son do everything!

Except deliver when it absolutely counts.

Are there any promising junior US men who will eligible in 2022?

Rippon and Harding are in Dancing with the Stars final. Mirai has been eleminated last night (losing the head to head to Adam 64 to 36% in the televote)

I'm so tired reading about all these posers who will be forgotten by the time the next Olympic cycle comes around.

Can we talk about Legend Kwan? I haven't seen a single contemporary performance that connected to the music as wonderfully as she used to. I'm really glad I found this deep cut... it's phenomenal, a technical and artistic masterpiece.

[R307] With Mirai now off the show, will she go back to being her usual pouty self on tour.

R309 she will go back at being forgotten

Now time to concentrate on my absent shirt and tight pants

New boyfriend for Cizeron?

4 years in skating for a female skater is an eternity in terms of height and weight. The 14 year old Russian girl doing quads will either burn out, get injured or lose her jumps from a height/weight change.

DWTS has now had the entire ladies podium of the 1991 nationals and worlds on the show. Are they saving the shib sibs for the fall season, I would think at that point their stock will have fallen.

I wonder if Johnny or Tara may do the show, besides them I can on think of boitano in terms of big name skaters who have done the show. I think Hamilton claimed to have turned it down but did two shitty reality shows instead. One of them skating with celebrities was in direct competition with DWTS and for years show producers wouldn’t allow celebrities who did that show to compete on DWTS.

Russian media reports that world silver medalists Evgenia Tarasova and Vladimir Morozov have left Nina Mozer and will be coached by 2014 Olympic gold medalist Maxim Trankov. He's a red head (is there another ginger skater?) and she's a blonde.

R313 And on GoldenSkate someone reported that the juicy rumour is that Tarasova and Morozov have broken out as an off ice couple (which sounds plausible judging by their recent social media activities) and that she's now dating Klimov.

Any idea who that is, R311? Great to see Guillaume post it though!

[quote]Nathan will have to choose. Sorry, no fucking way can he prioritize a full-time, pre-med degree at Yale,

Chen already chose. He [bold]chose[/bold] Yale.

He'll be a part time skater at most, maybe give it a run for it in 2022, if he feels like it.

The Neterlands Skating Federation tabled an emergency proposal for ISU Congress on raising the minimum age to skate as senior to 17.

LOL. They are out to provide the fun.

More interestingly, ISU Council tabled an urgent proposal that would ban serving presidents of Federations to be on judging panels

That's the "Leanna Caron" rule.

And also this "Persons appointed by the ISU or by their ISU Member to act as an Official at the Olympic Winter Games shall not act as an Official at the national championships of another ISU Member during the period beginning July 1st of the same competition season as the Olympic Winter Games and up to the start of the Olympic Winter Games."

Not sure what/who they are after with this proposal.

CHALLENGER SERIES 2018

August 1-5 - Asian Open Figure Skating Trophy, Bangkok, THA

September 12-16 - Lombardia Trophy, Bergamo, ITA

Sept. 12-16 - U.S. International Figure Skating Classic, Salt Lake City, Utah, USA

Sept. 19-22 - 26th Ondrej Nepela Trophy, Bratislava, SVK

Sept. 20-22 - Autumn Classic International, Oakville, CAN

Sept. 26-29 - Nebelhorn Trophy, Oberstdorf, GER

October 4-7 - Finlandia Trophy Espoo 2018, Espoo, FIN

November 11-18 - Inge Solar Memorial – Alpen Trophy, Innsbruck, AUT

Nov. 26-Dec. 2 - Tallinn Trophy 2018, Tallinn, EST

December 5-8 - Golden Spin of Zagreb, Zagreb, CRO

__

New events are Insbruck and Bangkok. Autumn Classic changes location. Got rid of Warsaw and Minsk

August isn't a bit early?

Bangkok in August--OMG, that has got to be sweltering and humid beyond belief.

The Goldenskate fraus seem to think Yale will bend over backwards to accommodate Nathan's skating career. I'm sorry, but he's not so fucking important that he deserves special treatment. If he can't manage both then he will have to sacrifice something, and of course it will be skating.

I really don't find his skating or his jumps beautiful in the slightest and I won't miss him a bit when he inevitably retires.

Full ISU 2018/19 calendar

Only Worlds, Euros, 4CCs, Grand Prix, Challenger Series will count towards SB list

Everything listed count to get minimum TES. They count towards World Standing as long as there are enough competitors and the panel of judges meet the requirements. The panel requirements aren't usually a problem, insufficient number of competitors from different countries often is though.

What's an SB list? (sorry, I'm just getting into figure skating since Pyeongchang).

And why did Nathan have to choose Yale? He's just in pre-med. Surely an LA university would be just fine for the undergrad degree and then for med school, he could pick a better one. Or why doesn't he switch to a nearby coach - isn't there one in New Jersey?

This is just weird. He did say he might try it and then take a break and delay it for skating if it didn't work out -- maybe with a celebrity like Nathan Yale would make an exception. And the Asian-Americans will lead us out of our hell hole of American despair and hopelessness, I suppose. Maybe they should just take the whole place over. God knows the Scots-Irish deplorables (or whatever they are) are leading us to doom.

R323, I think Nathan's from one of those Chinese immigrant families who believes that there are only 10 colleges that matter--the Ivies, Stanford and MIT (maybe CalTech) . You don't turn away the opportunity to go to HYPSM.

Why the fuck should Yale make any exceptions for Nathan because he's a "celebrity"?

Hasn't Stanford been the choice of many skaters? They're certainly used to accommodating Olympic athletes. Great medical school, too, better than Yale across most if not all specialties. Also the best in the world for statistics, which Nathan also wants to study. I thought he would have gone with Stanford if was he serious about continuing skating. Maybe he wanted to move to the East Coast? But Harvard would have been a better choice for skating, medicine and statistics on the East Coast.

I think he wants independence and be away from Mama Tiger, Papa Tiger, and Tiger Coach Rafa. How can we blame him?

He already did his job for the USFSA and won them a world championship. He's going to med school and gives no fucks.

I hope they don't R325, but maybe they would have their reasons (fund raising? bragging rights?? hell I don't know but maybe they think he's a feather in their cap and they'll bend the rules for him). I don't like his skating and don't give a shit - I hope he gives up skating and becomes a doctor. Seems stupid not to, imo. Fame usually just fucks people up.

Not to mention I bet there's a physical price to pay in one's later years -- the more years of pounding those joints on those extreme jumps will make severe arthritis more likely. Why do that to yourself when you really don't care that much and you have a greater ambition that would last you a lifetime.

Even if Yale makes some accommodations for him, I still don't see him making it work.

Michelle tried doing the same thing at UCLA back in 1999, but she couldn't cut it, even just taking one class a semester if I remember correctly. Her skating suffered, she lost worlds that year, then decided to stop school to refocus. Ended up finishing her education after she retired.

[quote]Fame usually just fucks people up.

Just look at Yuzuru...

American skaters don't need to worry about "fame."

Unless you are me!

R323 SB list stands for Season Best scores. It is one of the criteria used at the end of the season to allocate Grand Prix spots

We couldn't finish Michigan University. And I, He-Shib, was taking Communications Cinema and Televison

Bit we are lovely

Who is Stephane Lambiel’s boyfriend?

[R327] That's exactly what I would do if I were in Nathan's shoes. Get far far away. Hopefully Tiger Mama won't follow him.

Christopher Trevisan, I assume, R336 .

R336 Isn't it Chris Trevisan who is Lambiel's and Vasiljevs' manager?

Karen Chen confirms she will follow Gambill to Colorado

And Avanta Boot Labs will be following Karen Chen.

I've been wondering why Yuzuru Hanyu seems to sweat more than other skaters. On DWTS and Strictly, I've noticed some of the male pro dancers sweat more than anybody else - Mirai's partner Alan sweated more than she did after their quickstep, and he wasn't doing any more than she was. Men seem to sweat more than women with comparable effort, but with Yuzuru, he sweats more than the other male dancers - is he working harder than they are? He certainly seems faster than a lot of them, so maybe that's it.

* I mean Yuzu sweats more than the other male SKATERS -- I was just rambling all over the place and wanted to say I'd noticed the same thing with the male dancers on the dance shows. You'd think they'd sweat less because they'd be in better shape than everybody else, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

R342 Sweating, especially from the neck above, is a symptom of asthma. If it's not the asthma, he could just happen to be a naturally sweaty person.

So Krilova confirms that Camerlengo is currently working with Shpilband. But he will come to Russia this summer to work with her group

On the intimist style being popular right now ice dance, she says: "all are Papadakis but not many are Cizeron".

Loboda/Drozd have moved to her.

Nathan is talking about his Grand Prix assignments so I guess it's all systems go for his Yale Freshman year + skating as usual:

According to some details from a Stars on Ice Meet & Greet with Nathan, sounds like besides Skate America (which is pretty much a given) he is interested in IdF (France) for his second GP event. The Feds still have to officially agree on things, of course, but it sounds like Shoma's choices will be Sk Can, Moscow, Beijing, and NHK. This is pretty much what we were already thinking, but it seems like Nathan is confirming this...Thx to hhh for sharing the details...Please Sho -- Sk Can!!!!

"...we then chatted about Grand Prix and he said it looks to be SA and the French Int’l but we asked wouldn’t COR made sense too but he said most likely will be the French Int’l though the committee hasn’t finalized the assignments, plus he needs to look at the class schedule."

For some reason, Didier was bragging that Hanyu would be at IdF this year. Surely though don't need both Hanyu and Chen at that dinky thing??

Neither Chen or Uno can do COR if Kolyada does it because top 3 seeds can't meet. I think (correct me if I am wrong) host picks are done first. So if COR choose Kolyada, Chen and Uno are immediately off the table for Russia

The Milan FS splat fest actually produced a weakish field for Seeds 4-6. So top 3 probably don't have to worry too much if they end up with Hanyu as one of the non seeded skater in their GP assignments given they get Tomono or Vasiljevs as 4-6 seeds

Bychenko was 4th at Worlds despite 7th place short program and 7th place free skate WTF? -- Anyway, has he retired? (and that's why you didn't name him along with Tomono and Vasiljevs)?

Yes, I am not sure of his status. If he confirms retirement before the assignments are done, Aliev takes up the 6th seed.

Technical requirements for Ice Dance 2019/20 contains some gems to get a 10.0 in Components:

genuine motivation from “heart” by both

projection exceptional (to audience or inwards if music requires)

projection exceptional (to audience or inwards if music requires)

wide range of inspired movements linked with personal gestures

dance mood (FD): 100%

Bu they added "With falls or serious errors, marks in 9’s cannot be awarded for any Component"

It must have been frustrating for Nathan to have listen to his fans telling him what to major in and how to schedule his training at Yale. It's one thing to discuss it on an online forum but to actually approach the skater himself and tell him what to do is a bit much. He already gets it enough from his family. Those fans must be very young.

Why did Bychenko switch to representing Israel? There doesn't seem to be any competition in Ukraine or did he just outlast all of them?

[quote] Why did Bychenko switch to representing Israel? There doesn't seem to be any competition in Ukraine or did he just outlast all of them?

Bychenko switched in 2009

In the run up of 2014 Olympics Yakov Godorozha was the top Ukraine skater.

2013 Worlds: 23th Godorozha 31th Bychenko

2013 Euros: 14th Bychenko 15th Godorozha

2014 Euros: 10th Bychenko 22th Godorozha

2014 Olympics: 20th Godorozha 21th Bychenko

2014 Worlds: 15th Bychenko 25th Godorozha

So no guaranteed to be Ukrainian number 1 but it would have been achievable

In the run up of 2010 Olympics when Bychenko was still skating for Ukraine...at Nationals he was runner to Anton Kovalevski (2007) and Vitali Sazonets (2008). Kavaleski is the one who went to 2010 Olympics finishing 24th. Kavaleski has as top results: 13th at Euros, 16th at Worlds.

So yes, the competition in Ukraine wasn't impossible to beat...

I guess Israel Federation can offer more money than Ukraine Fed. Isn't Boris Chait (the Israeli Fed president) quite rich? The whole Israeli skating is a pet project of him. First, when his daughter was doing ice dance (I mean, that controversial bronze at 2002 Worlds.....), then now that she is coaching all Israeli skaters in New Jersey

r310 for an elite athlete, Adam's body isn't all that impressive and his self indulgent preening is such a turn off.

Not sure who mentioned nationals, but Shoma won nationals twice but Yuzuru wasn't competing in either.

r261 I think the only time you could argue that Shoma beat Hanyu was at the 2017 team thing where Yuzu ended up in 7th place after the short and won the long by only a couple points. But since they were on the same team, not sure if either of them would count it. I also get the sense that Yuzu doesn't have strong emotional feelings toward his rivals - it doesn't seem like he hates any of them, even the ones who haven't treated him that well. He's always seemed respectful but strategic. He's said in the past that he only sees himself as his rival and has repeatedly said that if he skates clean he wins.

I'm curious to see how their relationship will develop if Hanyu stays until 2022 and Uno isn't able to overtake him - doesn't matter how close they are, it has to be grating to always be second. I imagine if Hanyu ever gets to the point that he can't win without other people making mistakes, he'll just retire.

Also curious how Nathan's education and skating will mix. Hanyu's been staying at the top while doing a top 10 school with a scientific field of study with a name too complicated to remember. But I think Waseda is set up to work with athletes and even then, it probably has affected Hanyu's career a little.

Really excited for next season and the upcoming quad for the men. Will Hanyu be at top form after injury? Will Chenflation get even more rampant. Is Chen actually going to get transitions and skating skills to match his scores? Is old man Hanyu or 6 quads and nothing else Chen's body going to break down first? Looking forward to the first Hanyu/Chen showdown. Will Boyang became a front runner? Will Uno ever do better than 2nd at a major competition? I wonder if Tomono will become the real deal.

r343 also, some people just sweat differently. I sweat profusely from the face but don't even need antiperspirant. To an outsider it would look like I sweat more than most but it's just because I sweat the most from the most visible area. Maybe it's an Asian thing.

Has Misha Ge retired ?

I fear the -5/+5 GOE will produce even more WTF marks and inflation for the usual favorites

The Ice Dance criteria published today

To get +5 you need more than 8 positive features and no negative features.

To get +4: 7/8 positive features and no negative features

To get +3: 5 -6 positive features

+2: 3 - 4 positive features

+1: 1 - 2 positive features

Negative GOE: More negative features/errors than positive features

POSITIVE FEATURES

1. Good quality - correctness, cleanness and sureness of Edges/Steps/Turns **double feature

2. Edges deep. **double feature

3. Smooth/ Effortless **double feature

4. Reflects character/style of the chosen rhythm

5. Body lines / carriage of both partners elegant.

6. Glide and flow maintained (movement across the ice)

7. Holds and positions precise / consistent and close spacing between partners

8. Unison and oneness

9. Maximum utilization of the ice surface with the correct Pattern

NEGATIVE FEATURES

1. Loss of Balance by one

2. Stumble by one partner/ Loss of Balance by both partners

3. Major errors (Steps/Turns /holds not according to description)

4. Does not reflect character/style of the chosen rhythm

5. Poor quality / Laboured / Uncontrolled

6 Lack of glide/flow (movement across the ice)

7. Holds and positions incorrect / uncontrolled / variable spacing in between partners

8. Lack of unison and oneness

9. Pattern incorrect (including crossing the Long Axis – exception for 2018/19: Tango Romantica Steps #3-5 and Steps #10-12 )

10. . Not started on the prescribed beat (for each Section/Sequence)

The reduction when there are negative features is quite discretional. For example, with "Major errors (Steps/Turns /holds not according to description)", grades reduced by 1-4...

I mean, -4 to the original GOE or -1 is quite a difference!

I wouldn't even trust some of these judges being able to count to 8 anyway.

The ISU Ice Dance Technical Committee in all its glory....why did they meet in the middle of nowhere in Armenia?

[quote] [R310] for an elite athlete, Adam's body isn't all that impressive and his self indulgent preening is such a turn off.

The preening is revolting. Can't stand to look at him at all anymore.

R353 Interesting about Boris Chait and his daughter. Bribes and death threats. How was he not sacked after that? Right after the pairs scandal at the Olympics, too. I guess it would be more advantageous to choose the Israeli fed over Ukraine.

R354 No more Chenflation, please. At least Nathan deserved to win Worlds. Patrick Chan should have been a one-time world champion.

R355 He did but it doesn't feel like it given all of the shows he's skating in and programs he's choreographing.

What caused the split between Orser and Rippon? Adam's preening is going to get worse after his reality show airs. He seems kind of one-note though? Personality-wise.

There's a long interview of Adam on The Skating Lesson and I tried to figure out what he was saying when he talked about his time with Orser (and after) but he focused mostly on the mess between Yuna Kim and Orser - and even there, I don't remember exactly what he was saying - he was very vague. There's a cute part near the beginning when Adam says that Raf told him he was really huge - really fat - when he came back after some off time when he was working out with the pairs guys.

Who he r338?

R358 [quote] Interesting about Boris Chait and his daughter. Bribes and death threats. How was he not sacked after that? Right after the pairs scandal at the Olympics, too.

If no-one managed to get rid of Didier from French Fed, Papa Boris will lead Israeli Fed forever given the whole Fed is basically him. And there weren't proofs of anything, other than allegations.

Apparently, Shoma Uno's team got the message that his Native American "costume" was inappropriate. Some interaction at his current ice show:

Q: "do you like today's costume?" Shoma: "mmm, not really..."

Shoma: "I'm not sure why but I couldn't wear the previous costume anymore. I don't know the reason why but we had to go buy [this] in a hurry."

Q: "eh? you bought it yourself?"

Shoma: "no I just wore it because it was bought [for me]. (smiles)"

Other than Oda and Takahashi, Japan's male skaters are deficient in personality. I miss Takahashi, with his sweet button face and edgy haircuts. And one of the few men who could do a decent layback.

Daisuke is back with a decent hairstyle

The new one may not be offensive but it is still awful.

Q: "is there an overseas skater that you're on good terms with?"

Shoma: "???"

Q: "it means a person you're at ease with"

Shoma: "I see, umm I forgot their name."

Shoma: "uhh, well he's a Russian skater"

fan: "Kolyada-kun?"

Shoma: "ah, yes that's right. he talks to me about a bunch of different things so I'd say we get along."

r365 lol, those costumes make me so curious about the program. Can't wait to see it!

r363 Without the doucheness of Patrick Chan to spice things up anymore, I actually think that the top Japanese men are the most interesting in the field. Canada has Keegan Messing. Americans have a couple hard working Asian kids groomed by their PR machines. Russians have a couple head cases. China has perky Boyang. Have any of them said anything interesting?

The Japanese are by far the most distinct personalities: Shoma - who always seems stoned and has that interesting dynamic with Hanyu. btw, if I could only put my money on one, I think he's the most likely to be in the closet - says he's not interested in love and doesn't plan on ever getting married.

Hanyu - the dichotomy in his personality. Pathologically competitive but also motherly towards one of his closest rivals and extremely affectionate with his biggest rival in the past quad. Has taken on so many public responsibilities that none of the other skaters deal with but also childlike to the point of dysfunction. The survivor's guilt and depression over the years. The most androgynous in look and style but by most accounts he actually has a very alpha male personality. Never seen a skater cry so much but also have so much grit.

Oda - competing with Hanyu for biggest crier. I think he's so adorable. Such a big personality.

Takahashi - about as close to openly gay as you're going to see in Japan. That tension over the years between him and Hanyu/Oda.

Wang/Liu and Hong Chen/Yan Zhao are heading for Montreal for the summer training

Is there any space left in Gadbois?

R367 The Americans are so bland across the board. Can't even tell if some of them actually enjoy skating and competing. I don't even care for Ashley but I hope she returns to spice things up.

I agree R369. I haven't been interested in skating since Johnny Weir - until this Olympics and I discovered Yuzuru Hanyu (and then Shoma Uno). They're still the only ones I'm really interested in, other than Kolyada who seems to have a fetching, wry personality, but with the language barrier and lack of info (no problem with the Japanese), it's hard to work up much of an obsession (but I would if I could - his skating can be gorgeous but he's always fucking up so much.)

I hope better access to Evgenia info will help me follow her - the Japanese girls seem quite like what I would have expected of any Japanese - quiet, polite, not much of interest, but maybe I'm wrong... Haven't run into much ado on the post-Mao ones, anyway). But Zhenya shows some promise, and the two lead Japanese men are really something! (sorry I missed Daisuke but at this point, he just seems like a poor-poor-pitiful me whinger - sexy though, but the attitude sorta kills it. Plus he's not in the news much.)

Yuzu and Shoma are suitably weird (for this American) that I'm just perplexed and continually surprised, as much as fanning-out. I like anime in a sort of mild way, so it's intriguing to see the Japanese culture through a new lens.

I don't think I've ever seen a more boring duo than Nathan and Vincent, and I include Lysacek in that - at least the closet gave him a bit of allure (quite a small bit...) At least he went on DWTS - and still ended up a nonentity because he has no personality apparently. Hate on Weir as much as you want, at least he's interesting.

Daisuke is still hot

Yes he is R371. I had hopes when he moved to NY and said he was going to study English that he'd stick around and maybe be a commentator on American tv or some other endeavor stateside. He said at the time that he felt so much freer (and I assume happier) in the West compared to Japan. But it looks like he changed his mind and now he does Japanese tv (though he said he hated it - but maybe he just meant that tv series he was doing and he's ok with sports/news commentary - but in any case, it's in Japan!) Come back, Dai!!

Poor Mirai. From her Instagram:

"After getting over the initial shock of being eliminated, I’ve had time to reflect and decided it would be unlike me to not share my genuine feelings. Ultimately, although I realize it is a reality television show, it hurts to have been eliminated. I’ve been sent direct messages about how entitled my personality comes across and how egotistical I am. I want these people to know that after being knocked down so many times, my self-confidence is something I’ve truly had to work to build. At the end of the day, to be told that my personality sucks is truly hurtful and this has led me to question myself. I will not apologize to anyone I’ve offended because the sarcastic, dry person I have become is someone that truly loves herself and I’ve had to crawl up from the lowest of places to do so.

It was also not easy to sleep an average of 3-4 hours every night and to learn a style of dance that I’d never even heard of before. Not only that, to have a skating show later that day and in a different city every day wasn’t easy. For those difficult moments, my skating family was always there and for that I am grateful. To have them wake me when I’d fallen asleep mid-show is a kindness I will not forget. While this was a demanding experience, it was the best time I’ve ever had because the hard work was incredibly rewarding...

ouch, she didn't take it well.

She sounds more heartbroken than when Shin Amano calls her 8 URs in 7 jumping passes.

She should just ignore DMs from people she doesn't know.

r371 did you see his new dye job? Yuck. Why do Asian men ruin their looks with terrible blonde hair

r373 With all the attention whoring she's done, you would think she'd understand how social media works. Popular skaters have to deal with a lot more hate than she does. Though it does seem a little far to message her directly about it.

r374 You would think by this point Mirai has accepted the fact that she's irrelevant in the skating world so it makes sense that she'd have higher hopes for something new. I'm guessing she saw dwts as a way to make her mark so I can understand why she'd be more disappointed to fail here

[quote] [R374] You would think by this point Mirai has accepted the fact that she's irrelevant in the skating world so it makes sense that she'd have higher hopes for something new. I'm guessing she saw dwts as a way to make her mark so I can understand why she'd be more disappointed to fail here

I feel sorry for any contestant who signed up for this mess of a season. What a waste.

Mirai was the best dancer by far and tackled the most difficult choreography. DWTS was never going to allow an all-figure skaters final and were going to keep Adam and Tonya til the end. I really believe she worked the hardest out of all of the contestants but it was clear as day before the show even started that she would be cut right before finals with or without the votes. I think the Sports Illustrated article hurt her more and the elimination was just salt in the wound. She really is horrible at speaking and sounded full of herself in her DWTS interviews, but I don't think she's that arrogant on the inside, esp compared to Adam. Just look at his instagram.

R375 - here's a recent photo of Daisuke and he's changed his hair again. Not really back to black but sort of light-to-medium brown on the front and black in the back (I think). In any case, a vast improvement over blond. I like blond on some Asian - there's a KPop star that I think rocks it - but usually I don't like it either.

And I'm not linking it but there's a video in Shoma Uno's thread at GS of Tessa and Scott coaching him - I don't know how long that's been going on but maybe it's related to his skating skills being so good. He has a jumping coach in Chicago who used to work with Gracie Gold but I can't remember his name - a Russian or Ukrainian I think. Wonder with Yuzuru's new focus on doing his own thing, if Shoma can break out of his shadow (of course there's Nathan Chen for him to get past as well).

[R378] The coach you're talking about it Alex Ouriashev.

Thanks - I remembered him speaking highly of Uno and found this quote: "Sometimes you get people you really like, and you are entirely happy to help them," Ouriashev said. "Even if we don't speak English, his [Shoma's] personality is such that even if you are in a bad mood, he puts you in a better mood. He is bright, like good weather."

Adam's ego will grow even more now if it is possible

I didn't need to watch 5 minutes of DWTS to know he was going to win that dumb fixed show. But I did watch his dances from tonight and they were fucking terrible. Was he cosplaying Johnny Weir? He looked like he was totally phoning it in. I can't stand Tonya Harding, but at least she was genuinely into it & having a good time. Dare I say she was robbed?

I suppose he'll go on their tour now & not skate another season. Whatever.

ok that Fox News is not quality journalism but they really did a "Adam Rippon's beau is moving from Finland to L.A. to be with him" article earlier this month.

It must have been a very slow news day!

[quote]Just look at Yuzuru...

How has fame fucked him up, R331 ? Did he say something douchey?

well, it's good to know that ISU doesn't know maths very well.

They published the new scale of values for Ice Dance with the -/+5 GOE

ISU state "The 3 ISU Technical Committees used a percentage principle for creating the SOV in which every step up or down in GOE results in increasing or decreasing the Value by a certain percent, same through the whole Table."

Then you open the file and pick a table at random. For ex Man Synchronized Twizzles:

Level 1: base value 2.42. If you get a -1 GOE the score will be decreased by 0.36

Level 4: base value 3.17. If you get a -1 GOE the score will be decreased by 0.36 again.

0.36 on 2.42 BV it's 14.8% decrease. 0.36 on 3.17 it's a 11.3% decrease.

They meant rows instead of tables.

The new scale have been tested at Grand Prix Final and at Tallinn Trophy. The test in Tallinn was to check how it works in rigged competitions?

[quote]Patrick Chan is finally gone.

[quote]Max Aaron has retired. Will anyone miss him?

Please, can they take Carolina Kostner and Ashley Wagner with them?

New values for jumps per Goe published

Did anyone else see Charlie White's take down of Courtney Hicks on Twitter?

Are these new proposals for the jumps? I find it somewhat ridiculous. It is as if they are targeting Hanyu.

[quote] Did anyone else see Charlie White's take down of Courtney Hicks on Twitter?

[R388] Ha! Thanks for posting that even though it's a couple of months old. Go Charlie! Courtney Hicks is making herself seem more of an idiot every day.

Article by Hersh that expands on R318 Urgent Proposal No. 6.

"The International Skating Union’s biennial congress early next month will consider a proposal that might have been unnecessary if the top Canadian figure skating federation official had a more accurate ethical compass. So you can call Urgent Proposal No. 6 the Leanna Caron Rule, since the proposal obviously was spurred largely by the actions of Skate Canada president Caron."

"Urgent Proposal 6 would prevent national figure federation presidents (and the senior-most figure skating official in countries where one federation governs both figure and speed skating) from doing what Caron unreservedly did last season: be an ice dance judge in the team event ice dance and the ice dance events at the Olympics as well as be an ice dance and men’s singles judge for junior and senior events at the Grand Prix Final."

"When I first wrote about this issue last November, I found Caron and then USFS President Samuel Auxier unique among major federation presidents in having this conflict: the presidents of the Chinese, French, German, Japanese, Kazakh, Russian, and Spanish federations, all of which, like Canada and the U.S., have had senior World Championship medalists since the 2014 Olympic season, were not on the ISU list of referees, judges, technical controllers, technical specialists, data & replay operators for the 2017-18 season."

"At the 2018 Olympics, according to data on skatingscores.com, she placed the second-best Canadian ice dance team, Kaitlyn Weaver-Andrew Poje, third of 20 entrants in the free dance, which was three places higher than their placement by any other judge. Caron also had them third in the short dance, two places higher than any other judge. Weaver and Poje would finish seventh in the free dance, eighth in the short dance and eighth overall."

"And then there were her free dance marks for Gabriella Papadakis-Guillaume Cizeron of France, who won that segment while finishing second overall to deserving champions Tessa Virtue-Scott Moir of Canada: Caron’s raw scores for the French, both in technical and components, were substantially the lowest of those given by the nine judges. Virtue-Moir won gold by .79 points."

R389, why do you think the rule changes are targeting Hanyu? A lot of commentators say he has beautiful flow out of his jumps and the entries, often out of steps or back counters and what not, are difficult. Wouldn't those things increase the GOE?

And Nathan Chen has more simplified entries and, in general, uglier landings and less flow out of them. Shoma Uno has some quality issues too, that he said he knew he had to address because of the new rules.

I'm no expert but I'd think the +5 GOE would help Hanyu most of all - they'd help Kolyada if his jumps became consistent because his technique is beautiful - I think Boyang Jin's problems center more on skating skills than the actual jumps, which are pretty good quality (though not as pretty as Hanyu's).

I'm not saying these younger guys can't improve the quality of their jumps, but under the new rules, they need to, more than they used to. I thought that was the whole point - to increase the artistry and quality of jumps and not reward the jumping beans Chen and Zhou (and Jin?) as much.

Sean Rabbit posted a pic yesterday of his brand new Audi. Wasn't it Sean who started a Go Fund Me less than a year ago for some medical equipment needed by his mom? I feel a disconnect.

R391- Now maybe Hersh can do an expose on US judge Sharon Rogers. Just to balance everything out.

R394 maybe he can do an exposé on all of them.

The thing is when you move down the ranking, I sometimes wonder if judges are getting bored and scoring randomly or if some of them have particular fetichism/hate for some little known skaters.

Even leaving aside the likes of Alexander Gorojdanov, Stanislav Babenko, Yuri Balkov, Ece Esen, etc who are well known, a "who is worse" ranking is particularly difficult.

The Shibs fans will always complain about Andrzej Dostatni

The Canadians will complain about Sharon Rogers

The few not asking at Gadbois will complain about David Molina

When Sergei Ponomarenko is on the panel, some eyebrows are raised at Shpilband's teams scores

Who is the French judge who "loves" Shoma? Philippe Meriguet?

And so on.

But we can try! Nominate your worst judge!

R393 You're right. They're still $10,000 short of their goal. He seems like a nice guy and not a materialistic person. I think he just wanted to reward himself after all of the hard work he's put in and care-taking he's had to do, but his mother's situation looks more urgent. The medical lift is also for his own benefit since he currently has to carry her up and down the stairs.

[R392] I saw these numbers yesterday on Twitter. It looks like they changed it now. However, the 4A BV has not changed? Or am I missing something? And who has said they want to land the 4A?

Proposed BVs from Twitter yesterday:

3T = 4.2, 4T< = 7.13 3Lz = 5.9, 4Lz< = 8.63 3F = 5.3, 4F< = 8.25 3Lo = 4.9, 4Lo< = 7.88 3S = 4.3, 4S< = 7.28 3A = 8.0, 4A< = 7.5

Sean is an entertaining skater and seems like a nice guy, but if the family needs a go fund me, I think it's time he grew up and got a real job. How can any family keep paying for an adult kid who wants to keep ice skating? I'm puzzled as to how these older skaters in their late 20s can afford to keep training and living at/near a rink, with little income coming in. Coaching part time can't possibly support it all.

Courtney Hicks should also call it a day. She jumps big but can't land them. Clunky skating.

Other news: it appears that Nathan and Karen Chen are dating. Lots of pics of him with his arm around her, incl. a Stars on Ice video. But we can't talk about it on Goldenskate lest the uptight Nazi patrol start banning people.

Michelle Kwan helped her sis choreograph a SP for Angela Wang.

Ashley Wagner has had a bf since breaking up with that other athlete; she looks so worn out and gaunt these days.

Word has it that Grant Hochstein will continue competing.

Does Jason Brown have a new coach yet? He's traveling all around but I have no idea where he will settle down and train.

Congrats to Adam Rippon for winning DWTS. He was awesome, though that last freestyle looked like a lot of stomping around and posing. He and Mirai were heads above the rest. Tonya Harding danced a lot better than I expected but she still looked awful.

Chen and Chen--okay, that just isn't interesting. Though maybe she can help with artistry and he can get her to speed up the rotatino of her lutz.

Or at least introduce her to his bootmaker.

R400 Where is Karen's training base? Nothing's gonna come out of it, skatingwise or not, if Nathan Chen stays in Yale.

R397 they've now changed the 4A< base value. It is 9.38 now. They made a typo in the first release...they probably got the formula in excel wrong and went with it with the whole GOE table. LOL!

Denney/Frazier have moved to Zimmerman/Fontana

Maria Sotskova's new programs are: SP Latin themed music (she had to convince a perplexed Buianova) FS: Summertime. Both choreos are by Peter Tchernyschev

Alexander Majorov is threatening us to skate one more season

Voronov, Brezina, Zhang, Paul Fentz, Chris Reed, Valtter Virtanen are continuing....because some people will never go away!

I find Mirai's skating incredibly dull except when she lands the 3A, but she was badly robbed in DWTS. She was far and away the best dancer this season and should have won. I hope she can bring some of the expressiveness in her dancing to her skating and make it more interesting.

How will Chen and Chen date when she's heading to Colorado and he's at Yale?

Will Ashley Wangner's new bf please feed her?

[quote] I'm puzzled as to how these older skaters in their late 20s can afford to keep training and living at/near a rink, with little income coming in. Coaching part time can't possibly support it all.

Some of them clearly come from rich families. But they don't open go fund me pages.

Some of the European skaters who go on and on tend to come from countries with heavy state fundings into sport (Germany, Austria, Italy still use the military system to give athletes a salary)

However, yes, there are some cases where I wonder how they can afford all of this.

[quote] And who has said they want to land the 4A?

Hanyu. His new goal has been highly publicized since Pyeongchang. This new proposal benefits Zhou and Chen. Hanyu should see his scores go up, however, if GOE is applied fairly.

In any case, I'd assume Hanyu gets to keep his records in short, long, and combined, with last year's scoring system. You can't really compare that to any numbers in the new system because it's been changed so much. There's a new documentary out and Orser says that Yuzuru was a bit disappointed he didn't break his own WR in the free in Pyeongchang. Sheesh - greedy much, Yuzu?

Also in doc, Orser that Yuzu still had a lot of pain at the Olys but they said he didn't (and that he thought it was a miracle he skated as well as he did) - but hell, I bet most of the skaters skate with pain, not to downplay his ligament issues which I think are pretty major. He's had right ankle injury problems since he was a child. But still... at Worlds they carried Shoma out of practice two days before he had to perform, etc. for most of them. Brutal sport on the joints.

* I meant Yuzu was disappointed he didn't break his WR in the SHORT PROGRAM, not the free. He was 1 or 2 points shy of it.

[quote] You're right. They're still $10,000 short of their goal. He seems like a nice guy and not a materialistic person. I think he just wanted to reward himself after all of the hard work he's put in and care-taking he's had to do, but his mother's situation looks more urgent. The medical lift is also for his own benefit since he currently has to carry her up and down the stairs.

[R396] Plus Sean could have bought a cheaper brand new car and still had reliable wheels. But I don't live in So Cal where I'm sure image is everything. Or he could have bought the car and enjoyed it without posting a pic on social media. If I had been a contributor to his fund, that would have me shaking my head.

Nobody wuz robbed on DWTS. The show is scripted. Adam's freestyle was the worst ever and the fact that he won with that is laughable. But it was a fake season. Nobody will remember.

I had a look at Ashley's IG and her latest post is shilling for Bridgestone Tires. LOL.

Harding finished third. The NFL guy was second.

I guess Rippon was way ahead in public vote (he scored 64% against Mirai) and even if the judges rated him low he would have won. So they kept them high even if he didn't deserve them not to have a winner recognized as weakish.

Anyway, it's an old skewing show with viewing figures eroding each season.

There is no way this 5 GOE system will be applied fairly. Chen, Zhou and Uno can start celebrating right now. Hanyu is safe though, unless his injuries make it impossible to skate. Seems like he still can't do quads, and its been several months already. Also, his new show costume is atrocious.

I think Johnny Weir's frog suit leaves Hanyu's yellow floaty shawl in the dust.

And Evgenia's dresses make her look either fat or pregnant. Hmmm.

Here's one of Evgenia's dresses - the other one is either one picture up or down. Lots of ugly ensembles, if you're into that sort of thing, by scrolling up or down at this site.

[quote] Sheesh - greedy much, Yuzu?

Can't blame him knowing how generous judges have been with the American and Canadian men.

Quality spins and steps will be less important under the new rules as well?

r412 I'll take awful over boring. I would even enjoy Nathan more if he had the guts to perform in Johnny's frog suit. At least an effort is being made. The costumes are the most entertaining aspect of most of these skaters.

At least they didn't give Nathan the WR for his free with 5 or 6 quads, either at the Olympics or at Worlds. He's still boring as hell - and yeah, I agree - his costumes are so blah, on such a dull, shy performer in the first place. And Vincent is worse. I know they're young but I don't see much potential when it comes to excitement from those two.

[R415] I also heard quality steps and spins will be less important. This is favoring Nathan Chen. I do not like the direction the ISU seems to want to take figure skating.

USFSA officialize the Chock/Bates move to Montreal

(5/25/18) – Madison Chock and Evan Bates announced today they will begin training with Marie-France Dubreuil, Patrice Lauzon and Romain Haguenauer this summer in Montreal, Canada. Most recently, the team trained under Igor Shpilband in Novi, Michigan.

“We are so appreciative to Igor and his team,” Bates said. “He helped us advance our careers and reach new heights and we are very thankful for that.”

“We’re really excited to start a new chapter in Montreal,” Chock said. “I’m looking forward to getting back on the ice this summer once I’m fully recovered from my ankle surgery.”

Chock and Bates, who are six-time U.S. medalists and two-time World medalists, finished fifth at the World Championship in Milan. The duo has been to two Olympic Winter Games together, while Bates skated at an additional Olympic Games with partner Emily Samuelson.

Chock and Bates will join the American duos of Madison Hubbell and Zachary Donohue and Kaitlin Hawayek and Jean-Luc Baker in Montreal.

Does that leave any top ice dance teams left training in the US? What's happened to Detroit?

I think those left in USA are

Novi: Min/Gamelin, Carreira/Ponomarenko. Maybe Nazarova/Nikitin (she is currently in Ukraine since beginning of May but they went back to Novi after Worlds). Maybe Coomes/Buckland if they don't retire

Canton: Muramoto/Reed, Reed/whatever the Lithuanian blond boy is called

Maryland: Parsons/Parsons, McNamara/Carpenter

Detroit: no-one.

I am not sure if Weaver/Poje will stay in New Jersey with Morozov or will move too.

Do Chock/Bates and Hubbell/Donohue get along? What has Papadakis said to make everyone hate her?

Johnny's green lace thing looks hideous. He also wore a ridiculous burgundy dress looking thing at the Legends show in March. He's a good looking guy who can still skate well, but is making himself look like a crazy goofball. How can the other skaters around him stifle laughs seeing him in those get ups.

R421 Madison C and Madison H get along well. And they are friends with Papadakis. Who hates Papadakis?

GP assignments will be decided on June 26-28 in Toronto

Is that Sean Rabbitt who's posting in the US skating threads on GS?

I don't know, but there's a snooty former "elite" skater (not just competitive, mind you, but ELITE) who likes to remind everyone of his or her eliteness, even when no one's intending to ruffle feathers. The people monitoring the forum also are quick to issue warnings or ban posters. So when someone mentions possible relationships between Shoma-Alina or Yuzuru-Alina, all we can do is guffaw at our computers.

I don't want to derail the thread. Maybe just a comment or two from the skating pros. I'm not that much into skating. The Olympics here and there. When I, Tonya came out though I started watching some of Tonya's stuff. YouTube led me to even older programs. I found I enjoy the older programs a lot more. They're so much more graceful and, obviously because the jumps aren't as hard, I don't sit there waiting for a fall. What I enjoy most though is the excruciating detail paid to choreography. It seems every second of a program is perfectly matched to every second of the music. Does anyone else enjoy these old programs and what do you think of them?

I've also learned a lot about what figures did for the skater. I've watch a few videos of the skaters doing figures. Surprisingly it wasn't boring at all. After learning what the figures were I watched some of these older programs while just watching the skater's feet. You see the figures come through in just about everything the feet do.

Here's one older program I particularly enjoyed. I especially loved the classy way she skated her ass off the ice when she was done. Don't even start on the way they presented the scores.

So I'm just curious. Any big skating fans enjoy these or is it really all about the jumps now?

[R427] I very much enjoy the old skaters for all the reasons you mentioned. The emphasis on jumps has ruined the sport. It's not fun to watch a skater end up at the top of the podium with multiple jump errors and falls. That's ugly. Not familiar with Jennie Walsh until tonight. Beautiful program.

R427 You have to keep in mind that only the best and most interesting performances from those days have been uploaded to youtube. There were a lot of skaters who spent all of their time doing crossover-jump-crossover-jump with a spiral here and there. I do miss programs like Oksana Baiul's Swan Lake, but that's what the exhibitions are for, although even the exhibitions feel less inspired these days, too.

I feel the reverse, actually, R427 . I used to watch figure skating when I was a kid in late 80s and 90s and I always skipped the ladies, for example, because they just seemed boring. All of them, including the top ones, like Michelle Kwan. Men were marginally better. But now singles are my favorite disciplines, I'm finding the programs much more complex, with skaters offering much greater variety of styles. Sure, there are some boring skaters (sorry, American ladies this season) but now I'm finding singles actually interesting in general. Dance, though... it's the displine that suffered a lot, creative-wise, from the introduction of CoP, whereas other discplines benefited.

R430: What variety? Waving your arms around and jumping is not complex or interesting. Most of the top skaters cannot skate.

If you are bored by other styles, fine, but let’s not pass off today’s skating as interesting or complex.

I'm sorry, R431, if I had known my personal impressions would cause cause such an offense, I would have phrased myself in a more roundabout way. I didn't mean to hurt your feelings. By greater variety of styles, I meant more departure from the clasical beauty /pretty princess image and more variety in music styles. I actually don't mind classical style now, but it was hard for me to find the programs memorable when it seemed like everybody was doing pretty much the same. By greater complexity I mean, well, I just like more steps in the programs I watch, I guess. I don't always find Zagitova-like clutter a good thing, but really, give me a Higuchi anytime. Not to mention how the whole Lambiel/Takahashi/Chan/Hanyu/Fernandez progression compares to the 90s. I'm only hoping against hope that the new judging system manages to continue in that vein, and not go in the direction of Nathan Chen-like programs. So yes, right now, I unironically think that today figure skating is much more engaging. Again, I'm sorry if it offends you.

I don't think he was offended, just being direct. I think there still isn't enough variety in styles now - I'd love to see not only bodysuits on women and tights on men, but pairs skating that don't depend on heteroromantic fantasies and more ethnic and genderbending programs that don't get punished for it - but it's still good to see some variety. But a lot of variety seems to come at a cost, e.g. focusing on looking cool instead of having good form, or not paying attention to intricate footwork in favor of looking for big fancy jumps. I wish commentators and the skating community in general really paid more homage to interpretation, deep edges, and detailed footwork just as much as they point out quads.

In 2 weeks ISU congress will vote on tights for men. A breathtaking moment....will any Fed vote against it?

Christine Errath was nice to watch. For fuck sake she was 15 here. What's the youngest you can be to skate in these things? She seems like a skater who would have made it in today's jump a jump world. I love her music.

Jennie Walsh was amazing for her times, but it's weird to see a competitive skater with a normal womanly body. Now the top skaters doing triples are mostly stick thin little girls, some of whom look anorexic. Btw I had a brief interaction with Walsh a while back. I had signed up for lessons with her, but once she saw I was an older skater she pretty much dissed me.

In the Jennie Walsh clip, I know it's a nothing move, but what she does at 0:48 does it have a name? It's my absolute favorite thing the skater does. Where she puts her toe pick into the ice and spins around. It's probably easy as hell but I love that. Whatever it's called. If it even has a name.

@mishageofficial on Twitter: Its funny how people not very value Yuzu private friendship & life.Everyone want know everything,but he is also human. By not posting much pics with him people to me“where is the photos?you guys dont talk?” We value friendship, and not all have to be on the camera

He's so annoying.

R438 Yeah, bringing up Hanyu will definitely make it better now. I was surprised that Misha was invited to FaOI because he's not as well-liked in Japan as he is outside the country although he choreographs for some of their skaters. People were really complaining this Olympics about how he yet again got to perform at a gala over skaters who placed higher and enjoy more popularity. I think Orser or Hanyu's team asked Misha and Evgenia to cool it with photos of Hanyu which is why they keep dropping hints or making references to him on twitter instead. Evgenia is still a teenager but Misha is 27. Oda, Weir, and Plushenko have been talking about Hanyu and uploading photos with him since Pyeongchang as usual, but they never come across as desparate like Ge.

desperate*

Hanyu himself brought up tabloid reports of him and Evgenia - and he said he wasn't involved and felt like he was reading about some other Yuzuru Hanyu. He wasn't asked about this - he brought it up himself.

Anyway, I don't understand why he's so touchy about the fan shipping. Maybe because I'm in America and celebs seem to go out of their way to create the suggestion of a fauxmance any chance they get, bearding everywhere you turn, etc. Celebs in the West 'want' to be in the tabs - plant stories - do outrageous things to get there. Why is this driving him crazy? C'est la vie of an Asian idol.

Doesn't he like the upside of being so famous? Like lotsa yen for endorsing Procter and Gamble or whatever. Daisuke Takahashi seem to be prone to depression, maybe due to his similar fame?? There must be something I'm missing re the Japanese/Korean/Chinese fan scene.

R441 Hanyu is an athlete, not an idol. A couple of years ago a tabloid reported he was engaged to one of his high school mates and implied he once got her pregnant. Both his ubers and antis stalked and severely traumatized her. The same tabloid recently reported that Evgenia was pursuing Hanyu and trying to rent an apartment in the same complex where he lives.

He's trying to stop the stories before they escalate. Evgenia is also somewhat responsible for the shipping and he could be trying to send her a message without being direct or hurting her feelings. She's a fangirl. She's been liking tweets that ship them and copying some of his quirks and interests for some time. He might also have a girlfriend/boyfriend or another person on his mind.

Takahashi is depressed because he's not as famous as Hanyu or as popular as Mao. He's written about it in his books. There are other Japanese figure skaters who also love fame like Miki Ando and Mao's sister. Even with many sponsorships and endorsements, Japanese athletes don't make as much as their foreign counterparts and the JSF takes a huge cut of Hanyu's earnings. He donated all or most of his prize money to charity this season. His fame may not be as lucrative as you think. Even foreign athletes make more money in Japan than domestic athletes.

Thanks for the intel, R442. You know your stuff! I'm a bit stunned that Daisuke admits he's depressed because he's not as famous as Hanyu (or as popular as Mao). I thought he 'was' as the forerunner of Hanyu in the pop-idol sense. I hear what you say that Hanyu is an athlete but he sure seems like a pop-idol to me - fanbase following him everywhere, on and offline - even Kurt Browning has been calling him a "rock star" since way back when he first hit the scene - before Sochi even. He can hate aspects of it, but the only way out is for him to get off the stage and, well, start that school he talked about, a la Plushenko, or whatever his 'second career' plans are.

I watched a video of his ice show and I thought he looked down/defeated - something was off. My suspicion is his ankle is still hurting. IIRC, it kept hurting when the doctors couldn't find a cause - that happens - ask any athlete with repeated injuries to the same joint. At some point, you've got a chronic problem, whether it's early arthritis or whatever - you can't sprain/stretch/tear ligaments an unlimited number of times. Well, I hope that's not the case but it's one explanation for his uncharacteristic lack of enthusiasm. Or maybe he's fine...

Anyway, Evgenia should know better than to 'like' tweets from shippers of her and Yuzuru. Good lord. I don't blame him for speaking out. That's rather shocking actually.

Wakaba Higuchi was in Toronto recently working with a jump coach at the Cricket Club. Shae-Lynn Bourne will choreograph short next season and Yuka Sato will craft the free.

Misha deserves to have a house fall on top of him. Everyone wants to know about Yuzuru??? Bitch please.

Yuzuru is a closeted queen with balls the size of a peanut. What else is there to know about?

Anyway, I wonder if P/C feel like moving now that their home rink is crowded with their biggest rivals.

In terms of her training at TCC, Wakaba worked on her 3A with Ghislain. she wants to include it in her jump layout in the upcoming season, as well as have more transitions. she also worked on jump timing and consistency. Goals: win nats, make it to GPF every year, and 2022 Olys.

Japanese girl Rika Kahira has been landing triple axels consistently - she's doing an ice show now and it's in her EX. At the 2017 JGP Final, she became the first ever woman to land a triple axel-triple jump combination in an international competition organized by the International Skating Union.

She turns 16 in July - wonder if she'll be eligible to compete in seniors next year. With Higuchi and possibly Kahira doing 3As, will Evgenia have any podium hopes, even with TCC help?

yes, she is age eligible for Senior 2018/19.

unless the ISU Congress vote for the Dutch amendment next week but I can't see it happening

R445 Are there any juniors moving up who could also threaten P/C?

I don't think there's much hope for Wakaba and Kihira if the judges aren't willing to play fair. They're hard on the Japanese girls and seem to prefer a specific body type. Evgenia has to worry about her own countrywomen.

The Greens are the only juniors I could see contending with the French, talk about talent.

Mcnamara/Carpenter needs a new set of eyes. Ship them to Marina I say.

R450 Junior World Champions Skoptcova/Aleshin have to move up because he was born in 1997. I am not sure where Russian Fed will put them in their internal ranking. But probably behind Stepanova/Bukin, Zagorski/Guerreiro, Sinistina/Katslapov and Popova/Mozgov.

Carreira/Ponomarenko are moving up. They will be Shpilband's top priority given what is left at Novi. She is still quite basic. I can see them going into Parsons/Parsons and McNamara/Carpenter's type of scores next season.

I think the rest will likely stay Junior.

A smart dance team would take this opportunity to move to Marina--she's got something to prove and she's got the goods to do it.

Wonder how Hawayek/Baker will do with Gadbois now that everyone's crowded in there?

Is Richard Callahan finally being called out on his pedophilia??? He ruined the lives of Craig Maurizi and Todd Eldredge...Tara Lipinskis parents knew about him but didn't care because he wasn't into girls....wasn't he Christopher Bowman's coachmat one point too??? It would explain a lot!

He groomed sweet Todd Eldredge, didn't he? I remember people used to call him the wife...

Todd is conflicted and probably Bisexual. I just don't think he could ever go against Richard. He'll take that secret to his grave.

R443 Takahashi didn't explicitly name them but said as much. He was the first Japanese male skater to achieve fame and success, but was never that popular as a personality among the general public. As for his mood lately, Tatsuki Machida was just showered with praise for his commentary during this Olympics so now he has to worry about not only Oda but also Machida threatening his commentating job. An entire documentary devoted to Machida's new program at Prince Ice World also just aired while Takahashi didn't even get to appear in the Tokyo & Yokohama shows. He's still loved and known for his steps. He would receive a lot of media attention if he choreographed an exhibition for a competitive skater like Shoma but he's said he's not comfortable choreographing for anyone but himself.

There were whispers that JSF and sponsors pressured Hanyu into adding all of the shows after his own. It is the best time to perform while he's still riding that 2-OGM high and I don't think they could have kept him off the ice, anyway. It was also rumored that the JSF didn't allow him to announce his withdrawal from Worlds until the very last minute to prevent demands for refunds and empty seats. Travel and tour companies also rely on his appearance at these events.

From IFS's Facebook page:

[quote]China's Boyang Jin will join Brian Orser and Tracy Wilson's team at the Toronto Cricket Club in mid-June. Orser said this will be a permanent arrangement. "Technically he is very sound, so we will be giving him the direction and the guidance that we gave to Javi. We want to go through the same kind of process with him," Orser said. "I think he is mature enough to handle it. Also with the Olympics being in Beijing, it is important to get him prepared to medal at the Olympics." Jin is already in Toronto working with choreographer Lori Nicholl on new programs for the upcoming season.

Getting a little crowded there, isn't it?

I find Machida to be unattractive and so pretentious in his PIW program. Yuck. But Takahashi seems to be a negative nelly, having said he doesn't like doing broadcasting-reporting work, and now it seems he doesn't like doing choreography either. What else is left for an aging former competitive skater, just coaching then, and he's probably thinking he's too young and too big of a star to do that.

Yuzuru-- it was good for Misha Ge to address the obsessed fans bugging him about Yuzuru. I agree the poor guy should be able to hang out and enjoy time with fellow skaters without worrying about being photographed at every turn. Misha seems like a good, genuine guy. Some of his skating was over the top drama, but I like him about as much as one can like a skating celebrity without knowing them in real life.

Ice dance... I could really care less about most of the teams. C/P were lovely at worlds. Shibs are pleasing to watch. Hawayek and Baker look mismatched. They're all a bunch of rich overgrown kids hyper emoting and trying too hard to be sexy.

The obsessed fans wouldn't be bugging Misha if he didn't constantly namedrop and give the impression that he and Yuzuru are BFFs. He is a major famewhore and hanger-on (though I do like his skating, for the most part). The crazy Yuzu fans are pathetic, for sure, but Misha's ego & immaturity really grate at times.

R458, Jean-Luc Baker only wishes he were overgrown. Poor Kaitlyn, girl cannot gain a pound.

R457 The Chinese fed has made the right decision.

R458 Oh, please. He wants drama. If Misha didn't bring Yuzuru up, those irritating fans would've moved on but now that's all they're going to be talking about. R459 What makes it even more annoying is that several of the skaters on the tour are far closer to Yuzuru than Misha and some are even longtime friends. Now it's going to be awkward on the tour.

Didn't Misha tweet something like this before? He needs to learn to ignore it.

I'm glad some of the more mature skaters are on this tour with Yuzuru - Plushenko, Buttle, Lambiel, Weir (or are they on every Japanese tour lol?) Plus Oda and Akiko. I can't imagine a better group if Hanyu's stressed, though I like the way Shoma treats him (and distracts him somehow from all the hubbub - he's so busy mothering the little guy).

Boy, Brian Orser has busted through the fucking ceiling with signing the stars. Boyang and Evgenia to prep for Beijing, oh my. Raf must be green with envy - though he has little Marin Honda, a favorite of mine. And Wakaba working with Ghislain and Shae-Lynn, I mean, doesn't that make her a TCC major client as well? Then he still has Cha and the new Japanese guy Shingo something whose Facebook showed his room with posters of Yuzuru on his wall. Orser is riding Yuna, Yuzu and Javi to the top of the field, isn't he?

And Misha should shut up about Yuzuru and be happy the Japanese fed hired him to work with Kazuki Tomono, who saved the day for the Japanese at Worlds. Some compare him to Takahashi but I thought I saw a little Yuzuru in him - he's got a natural flair I think - but then, at 20, he isn't really a kid, in skating terms. Anyway, if we didn't have our jumping beans, we'd have nothing, so I guess the ISU giving a big bonus for all the different jumps will prove an important boon for Chen/Zhou and keep the USA at least slightly in the game? Though with Yale... well, we'll see.

ISU didn't feel confident that the pro Chen/Zhou "different quad" rule would pass. They fear all small Euro feds will vote it down.

I hate the proposal that no quad can be repeated - yet you can do ALL the quads, singly. Maybe because I'm one of those Godforsaken fanyus (not too rabid but still protective...) It's the worst thing for him because certain quads put too much strain on his weak ankle - the flip, loop and especially Lutz (I know he doesn't do quad loop anyway, but... wouldn't the same thing sorta go for all the skaters? Not being able to specialize in one of the quads and repeat it in combination -- it just invites too much experimenting with all 5 of the damn things and breaking their bodies.

It also seems too partisan towards the younger ones and especially Chen, Zhou and Jin, and maybe Uno but the +5 GOE may be a challenge for him especially - and I think Chen needs to smooth out his landings for the judges don't seem to care so why should he? Does the ISU want the men in the same situation as the ladies may be coming to (even younger), where their bodies fail them by 22, due to HAVING to do all the different quads?

* I meant Hanyu doesn't do quad flip -- I know he does (or did) the loop. Oh and they lowered the value of quad axel. Or at least it's proposed. Maybe that's why he seemed downtrodden Saturday. WTF? Let's all prop Chen, why don't we, since he's a Yank and all.

Stephane has gotten more striking with age. Best part of FaOI. Would've had all of the ice kings if Joubert was there.

Favoring Chen seems risky when he might lose interest in skating after he begins this new chapter in his life. Is Zhou consistent enough to become a medal contender in the future?

Pavlov (Ukraine) switches from Single to Pairs. He has been paired with a 13 years old girl. So he will stay Junior. He will be 20 in September.

He lost out to Paniot at Nationals this season but then Paniot was awful at Euro and Olympics. Pavlov went to Worlds and he didn't make the FS cut.

Paniot trains in California with Gambill. Not sure if he will move to Colorado or stay in Cali with another coach. He is still in Cali Now. So I guess going back to Ukraine is not in the plans.

Jason brown to Orser? Isn't it too much? In terms of number of skaters they can handle

Della Monica/Guarise's music choices for next season

SP: a song by Joe Cocker. Choreo: Raffaella Cazzaniga

FS: Tristan & Iseult by Maxime Rodriguez. Choreo: John Kerr

Y. Paniot is too busy munching on Latin cock to even notice that Gambill has left the building.

I am so glad Della Monica/Guarise are continuing for another year.

When asked if he would be primary coach for Evgenia Medvedeva, Yuzuru Hanyu, Jin Boyang and Jason Brown, Orser replied: “Jason will be a team effort. Me, Tracy (Wilson), Karen Preston and Lee Barkell.”​

Skating Lesson tweet: Karen Chen tried out with Alex Ouriashev last weekend. (the Chicago based jump coach who works with Shoma Uno? or maybe he's a coach in general but just works with Uno on his jumps - apparently he worked with Gracie Gold)

David WIlson will do Brown's FS.

The SP choreographed for him by Rohene Ward is likely to be kept. Orser saw it on video and said it looked good.

If Jason could get a solid quad and not injure himself further, he'd be force with which to be reckoned--he is a truly beautiful skater. Vincent Zhou can jump, but he's a bit of a mess to look at overall. I'm not sold on him yet.

Jason needs at least two quads. Male skaters will need at least two different quads if they want to medal at worlds and Olympics.

What I'm getting from this movement at Orser is that Fernandez is gonna do 1-2 competitions next season as his swan song and Hanyu is going to retire after next season (worlds are in Japan) and bow out. I hope Hanyus ankle can heal enough that he can go out on top instead of low end top 10 finish at worlds and Javi gets his final European title. Is Shoma going to be the top dog after this if Nathan is doing his school thing and Boyang isn't there yet? Are japanese going to travel for Shoma like for Hanyu to bring in the money for ISU? If not is there a female skater to become the next Mao (Honda was a flop last season so propably not her)?

Do you mean Marin Honda, R476? She's only 16 and just signed up with Rafael. Surely it's not yet time to write her off - she's so pretty. And a new one, Rika Kihira, already has a stable 3A and her first year in seniors is this coming season, barring ISU rules changes.

I hope Mikhael Kolyada can stay with Rafael - when he lands his quad Lutz, it's BEAUTIFUL. he's just so inconsistent. Pretty sure he has other quads as well. His form is exquisite, he just seems to be a headcase. Raf is bound to be desperate to have his own stable, as he sits in Cali watching Orser build such a program and also while he watches his crown jewel move 3000 miles away to become a serious Yale student.

Jason Brown heads north... leaves Kori on good terms (she may consult)

Orser: "Jason came to the rink during a break in the U.S. Stars on Ice tour and he fit in so well. He is such a great energy to have around the rink. Tracy was really pushing for it, so we just had to do some juggling and figure out how we could make this work."

I like all three skaters joining TCC, but they have big personalities and are slightly immature emotionally. Fernandez and Hanyu seemed to handle themselves well off ice in their own way, and the other skaters at TCC seem chill except for Daleman maybe? Yuna was also reserved and low-key until the end of their partnership. I hope they don't drain Orser and the team. At least Tracy the mom is there.

Marin Honda may be pretty but did you see her recent Prince Ice World performance? Even her double double jump looked low and subpar. Even Rafael may not have enough magic to save her if the pretty girl can't land triples. Wakaba is a great athlete but I can't get over her legs looking like they're 2 to 3 inches too short. Just unattractive to see. I'm looking forward to seeing how Kaori Sakamoto and Rika Kihara do this season.

Good for Jason finally leaving for Orser. Kori seemed too buddy-buddy with him and was always dancing around acting silly in videos. He needs a serious, professional coach at this late stage in his career. And maybe Boyang will finally get good music and choreography.

Rika Kihira. English media has been misreporting her name for years. "Kihara" is an entirely different surname.

Kolyada's SP will be choreographed by Lambiel. He will do a training camp in Switerlzand soon.

FS will be something "classical".

On his Olympic SP:

"I don’t remember how I went back home to my bed, because I was totally devastated. I didn’t want anything – not to skate, not to live, not to eat, not to sleep, nothing. "

Next season he will do Nepela and one between Finlandia and Tallin. His preference for GP is doing Cup of China again.

Mikhail is so boring, like a poor man's Vasiljevs. Yeah, yeah, he landed a nice quad lutz. Once. The rest of his performances sucked.

Ah, so Lambiel noticed how pretty Kolyada is - as well as his skating. I love thinking about those two together.

Wonder what the Russian fed thinks of his working outside the country? Have they liberalized, what with Zhenya and Misha's westward ho-ing?

Since Lambiel is getting Vasiljevs on Fantasy on Ice this summer, maybe Misha too, soon? He has such a fun personality - when he's not crashing and burning at his latest comp - though he got bronze at World's, so he'll do Cup of China and likely Rostelecom. Chen's already asked for Skate America and the French one, IdF or whatever. So Uno = NHK and Skate Canada (both typically Hanyu favorites as well - hmmm - will he go to both and Shoma continues his 2nd-place streak? or will Hanyu's injury finally bump him off the top? I'm nervous for him - it's always sad to see the biggies float down the rankings and go out in a blaze of water-down-the-drain)

When Kolyada arrives in California, his world will be rocked.

I hope someone takes him to visit West Hollywood.

Kolyada already had a summer camp with Lambiel last summer so it's not really a new thing for him

So what does someone like Javi F DO after he retires? Not all skaters can coach or be commentators, and at some point they age out of ice shows. (I wonder this about all top-drawer athletes. Most just seem to... disappear. Like, what's Michael Phelps doing now -- inspirational lectures on the corporate offsite circuit? Autograph shows?)

Muller/Dieck (German ice dance team #2....likely #1 now that L/P split?) move from Canton (they usally split time between Canton and Germany) to Moscow

When even M/D are leaving you, the situation starts to become desperate

Anyone see the prices for 4cc? Are they hoping Hanyu shows? This is a reason why figure skating isn't popular in the US.

R489 It's the only title he doesn't have so they probably do expect to see him. But over x2 GPF? Why is the service fee over x4 as much as GPF? Plus no Russian showdown.

Well, Lysacek lucked into his job being an asst. or whatever to Vera Wang. I'm not sure what Jeremy Abbott's doing but he joked that he was open to doing maintenance work now that he's barely invited to any shows. Sasha Cohen got her degrees, like Tim Goebel, and works in NYC. Michelle Kwan doesn't seem to have a job anymore. She's at her family's rink doing choreography for Angela Wang, but she probably doesn't need any more money. Michael Weiss is in the home construction business.

4CC prices are ridiculous. I'm probably not going, and neither are top dogs like Yuzuru Hanyu and Nathan Chen. I'd rather go to nationals.

I thought Evan was working in real estate, I think his only big paycheck after the olympics was dancing with the stars. Is kwan the last American skater to make a significant amount of $$? I know most of it came from endorsements. Tara stopped skating after 2002 and was out of the scene for years. Sarah Hughes skated one more season after the olympics, went to college, came back and did a season of SOI where she had trouble landing double jumps.

What's the point of Javier and Yuzuru continuing after Olympics? I don't get it.

I think it must be hard to pour everything you've got into a sport and then, all of a sudden, just full-stop. In Yuzuru's case, it's been his life since he was 4 years old. Probably nearly as long for Javi. I read that Yuzuru didn't want to do as many ice shows as he's doing this summer but the fed pushed him. Maybe they're part of it? And he's just 23 - he's said that he studies sports science and the male body is at its peak at age 30. (I wonder if that includes skaters doing quads who are basically abusing their joints for years on end - especially him - Nam said a day's practice for Yuzu might be trying to do 60 quads...)

As for Javi, I don't care what he said abuot not caring about the color of the medal, his face looked regretful during the medal ceremonies at Pyeongchang - I bet he thought he had his hands on the silver but ended up with the bronze (unfairly). Anyway, he says he wants one more European championship - I think he wants to leave with a good taste in his mouth and not the bitter loss of a medal level.

Both of them are probably famous enough to make a living off of skating the rest of their lives (maybe) but what about the rest? Oh and they're using a photo of Nathan Chen in the ads for 4CC in Anaheim. How can tickets cost $500 plus a $95 service charge from Ticketmaster???

I thought Nathan can't go because it conflicts with Yale's term.

[R494] That 4cc price is insane. That doesn't factor in the cost for hotel, food, and gas. I was thinking to go until I saw those prices. No way I'm spending that.

R494: 60 a day?! How is that responsible training. He’ll be crippled by 30.

500 ?! Is Jesus making a personal appearance at 4CC?

[quote] When the Japanese Skating Federation approached Orser about having Hanyu work with him in 2012, the coach asked Fernández to sign off on the idea. Orser approached the Jin situation differently with Hanyu when they met in April at the Japanese superstar's apartment in Toronto." I didn't really ask [Hanyu] for permission," Orser said. "I just threw it out there to get his reaction, and I didn't really get one. I'm sure if there was an issue, I would have heard about it by now."

Hopefully Orser and Hanyu are aware of each other's cultural nuances by now but no reaction leans more toward a "no" than a "yes." Maybe Hersh mischaracterized what happened or Orser didn't give a very good description. Hanyu is Jin Boyang's number one cheerleader. Jin may be the skater he'd least likely object to and Jason probably comes in a close second even if his Japanese obsession borders on fetishy at times. But add in Evgenia with a Russian and Chinese media presence, that's a lot to handle at once, especially without being consulted like Javier was when they considered bringing Hanyu on board. He may goof off with the other skaters during gala practices and dinners, but he keeps to himself most of the time. From his interviews this season, it sounds like he would return to training full-time in Japan in a heartbeat if it were possible. Hopefully this won't create any resentment between coach and skater but I'm kind of shocked Orser didn't even ask, unless Hanyu doesn't plan to stick around much.

I can see Jin, Jason and Evgenia hanging out together outside the club. They will support each other. I'm very curious about US nationals and what the other US men think of Jason's move. He might not be a great technical threat but if his new team packages him well, he could get more media attention and support, of which there is little to share in a country that doesn't care about figure skating.

I actually understated the cost of the ticket to 4CC, R496. It's more!! From FSU board: "Just so you know the service fee for the $599 seat is $96.75. That is ridiculous. I hate Ticketmaster." I don't know if that's some special level of ticket and there are cheaper ones, but good lord. I've seen the ad with the huge picture of Nathan Chen on it. Imagine paying for a ticket expecting to see him (or Hanyu) and then neither one shows up.

It's interesting that Orser was so open about how he broached the subject at Yuzuru's Toronto apartment without actually asking him point blank. In the past, he's said that Yuzuru is so polite, he always says yes to everything and then he finds out otherwise later and he learned that 'yes' means 'no'. Now maybe he was just talking about their interactions in the moment - like practice on the ice - and not understanding, Yuzuru just tries to go along. I've noticed in interviews that he never says he doesn't understand - if he starts a response with "I don't know..." and then starts talking (without answering the question), that means he didn't understand it. Something about Japanese and not wanting to be blunt??

Anyhow, I bet that's how they've come to communicate. I know they've disagreed before on adding the loop and other things, and Yuruzu got his way in the end, so I'm assuming he has someone tell Brian what he wants (or doesn't want) without having to look him in the face and argue (hard to do in a language you're not adept at -- and doubly hard to do if you're Japanese and can't stand to disagree.) So when Orser says he's sure he would have heard by now if Yuzuru was upset about Jin and wanted to veto it, then he believes Yuzuru would have had someone communicate that to Brian.

With Javi gone, I would think he'd be fine with Boyang since they've always been so friendly and the "rivalry" with Javi turned out to be helpful to him - also Jason is practically Yuzu's fangirl - not to mention Evgenia ahem - so, well, I trust all's well. At least Orser made it clear he's the main coach for only 3 of the big competitors: Yuzuru, Boyang and Evgenia (and Jason said he'll feel out the team and pick one of the others as his main one eventually - the team being Tracy, Karen Preston, Lee Barkell, and he'll be working with David Wilson as well.

I doubt Yuzuru is going to be competing for the next 4 years, so Jin moving to the rink isn't a big affront to him. When is Yuzuru supposedly rehabbing his ankle when he's slated to skate in so many shows this summer?

R443 You were saying Hanyu looked tired. He's been awarded the People's Honor Award (Kokumin Eiyosho), perhaps the most prestigious award in his life, and had to prepare a statement in advance which was just released. I can't think of a good western equivalent (less common than knighthood) but the award comes with a lot of expectation and responsibility. The ceremony will be held on July 2nd.

A couple of new programs news

Soucisse/Firus FD: Earned it (TheWeeknd), from Fifty Shades of Grey

Lauriault/Legac SD: Chicago (I guess Cell Block Tango)

Zagorski/Guerreiro are getting a choreo by Christopher Dean

Sinitsina/Katsalapov: both programs by Zhulin

Kolyada FS: " very well known, very powerful music and it is in the classical direction"...I guess it means a warhorse

R499: it could be a big affront to him if he doesn’t realize he won’t be competing in four years.

I see the four skaters now at tcc history and as placeholders until the shiny new skaters hit seniors. Three of them make money, so it’s smart business wise. Also who else is out there at the moment?

From the Hersh/Orser interview: When the Japanese Skating Federation approached Orser about having Hanyu work with him in 2012, the coach asked Fernández to sign off on the idea. Orser approached the Jin situation differently with Hanyu when they met in April at the Japanese superstar's apartment in Toronto. "I didn't really ask [Hanyu] for permission," Orser said. "I just threw it out there to get his reaction, and I didn't really get one. I'm sure if there was an issue, I would have heard about it by now."

.... If he intended to take on Boyang whether Yuzuru liked it or not, why go tell him about it one month (April) before it ended up being announced (late May)? I'll take him at his word that he doesn't think Hanyu has an issue with it. Yuzu has said his "only motivation" is landing the 4A and he planned to skate "just a little bit" longer. He's flat out said "no" when asked if he was going to Beijing (though I may not have heard all the interviews - I know in one he said that IF he went, he'd go to win, or some such...) Can you imagine the online ugliness between Chinese/Japanese if those two guys were head to head at the Beijing Olympics? Ai yi yi. Don't do it Zu - you've had enough suicide-inspiring squabbling fanbase drama...

Based on this part of the interview (below), when I read that Orser considered Javi a "loose cannon" and he thinks Boyang is, as well, I must admit I'm surprised. They both seem laid back and gentle to me - Yuzuru is the one who seems like a little spitfire of determination (though I guess that's not really a "loose cannon", which I think of as someone with a raging temper???) Oh well, Orser seems excited about Boyang. Wonder what the Japanese fed thinks of it, re little Shoma's 2022 hopes? Anyhow, it is what it is. At least it'll be interesting to follow, as a fan. Oh, and why is Orser going to a Hanyu ice show? Surely not to skate. To be interviewed about Yuzuru on stage (and tv)?

"Brian Orser sees a little of a young Javier Fernández in 20-year-old Boyang Jin. "He is super talented but a bit of a loose cannon, like Javi was when he came to me (also at age 20)," Orser said. "I have to give him direction and purpose. That will come with maturity. Although Jin is in Toronto doing choreography with Lori Nichol, Orser does not expect to work with him until mid-June. The coach is going on vacation next week and then to Japan for a Hanyu ice show..."

Just lost a post so I'll try again and be brief -- the last thing I'd think of to call Javi or Boyang is a "loose cannon". And I wonder why Orser is going to a Hanyu ice show?

From the Hersh/Orser interview: Brian Orser sees a little of a young Javier Fernández in 20-year-old Boyang Jin. "He is super talented but a bit of a loose cannon, like Javi was when he came to me (also at age 20)," Orser said. "I have to give him direction and purpose. That will come with maturity. Although Jin is in Toronto doing choreography with Lori Nichol, Orser does not expect to work with him until mid-June. The coach is going on vacation next week and then to Japan for a Hanyu ice show.

I can't recall the exact interview but Brian once said Javi used to show up late to practices and suffer from typical teenage angst (I think that was Tracy's description) in their early years together. I think he's implying Boyang is still immature and unfocused when it comes to training, maybe easily frustrated. Hanyu is extremely popular in China, more than its own skaters, and fans love the brofest between him and Boyang. Boyang is also well-liked in Japan. I don't think there will be any ugliness between the two countries for figure skating. I think you're more likely to see nationalism in pairs but the Japanese won't be a factor.

I don't think Hanyu would have objected to Boyang if asked but could be miffed that Brian didn't offer him the same courtesy he gave Fernandez, if what Hersh wrote is true. Boyang isn't the only skater who's joining them. There are rumors that some students will be leaving TCC, so maybe there is more room to fill than we know.

What's the story behind Tessa Virtue and David Pelletier?

[quote] There are rumors that some students will be leaving TCC, so maybe there is more room to fill than we know.

Tursynbaeva?

I don't count Raya as no-one care about him anyway.

"Loose cannon" isn't someone with a raging temper, but someone who's unpredictable--never quite know what they're going to do or fire off--the full saying is "a loose cannon rolling about the decks."

R508 TSL says Tursynbaeva is leaving for sure and might try pairs.

If she can get a quad and a partner with a quad, I would definitely watch them I wonder if Boyang's mom will go with to Canada. I agree there is some similarity between him and Fernandez, but there are differences as well? Aside from a cultural aspect, I think he's really attached to his parents and I don't know how it will all go

There's a video on youtube of Tursy doing a quad. But then she got injured - don't know if it's related... Orser said she was just too little and the judges see her as a junior and undermark her. There's a pairs skater named Lubov something - maybe she could help Tursy get into that - she certainly has the physique for it. I'd be surprised if she weighed as much as 90 pounds.

He said something similar of Cha, though like Nam, he's really grown, maybe too big for singles? (he's 5'10") - Orser thinks Cha is in the top six or seven men in the world, but the judges don't see it that way. (sorry - can't spell his first name)

Also, back during Olys or thereabouts, Orser said he wanted two to four new skaters. I also noticed he quit sitting in kiss and cry with Gabby Daleman though he used to - now it's somebody else all the time, so I'm not sure he's her "main" coach anymore. Hope he's still got Cha though.

And TCC has a teenaged Japanese guy (he's 16 I think) named Shingo Nishiyama, who said in a day's session, he might have 30 or 40 minutes with Brian, and the rest with other coaches - he said they have so many coaches and specialist trainers that he doesn't even recognize them all but SIX coaches are on his "team". What a place! (he describes it pretty well in linked interview)

R512 Lee Barkell is Daleman's primary coach

As far as I know orser was never Dalemans main coach

Tursynbaeva did a quad? I'm surprised because she has always looked so little and weak, with little jumps. She's 18 or maybe even older but looks like a starved 12 year old. I don't think she'll ever be a star, but pairs seems more promising than continuing in singles. Her mom likes the limelight a bit too much. She needs to give some of her food to her daughter.

Russia announced proposed composition of National Teams for 2018/2019 season. Fundings are related to them.

MEN

Dmitri Aliev

Sergei Voronov

Arthur Dmitriev

Alexei Erokhob

Mikhail Kolyada

Aleksandr Samarin

Reserve: Andrei Lazukin, Anton Shulepov, Vladimir Samoilov

LADIES

Alina Zagitova

Stanislava Konstantinova

Evgenia Medvedeva

Maria Sotskova

Elizaveta Tuktamysheva

Polina Tsurskaya

Reserve: Anna Pogorilaya, Elena Radionova, Serafima Sakhanovich

PAIRS

Boikova/Kozlovsky

Zabiyako/Enbert

Pavluchenko/Khodykin

Tarasova/Morozov

Stolbova/Klimov

Reserve: Efimova/Korovin, Zhuk/Miroshkin

ICE DANCE

Bobrova/Soloviev

Evdokimova/Bazin

Zahorski/Guerreiro

Popova/Mozgov

Skoptsova/Alyoshin

Stepanova/Bukin

Reserve: Sinitsina/Katsalapov, Loboda/Drozd, Morozova/Bagin

The major thing is the absence of Astakhova/Rogonov from the list. Split? Retired? There was a big age gap between them. So she is young enough to continue.

It looks like Yuzuru Hanyu's 4T is back.

Tursy's quad salchow at link. She'd be good at triples in a pair - that Canadian guy (Francis Boudreau-Audet) who was paired with Sumire Suto (Japanese skater) should look her up - his old partner fell and fell and fell...

impressed, but she's had a hard time this year landing most of her triples. well, I heard Castelli and Tran split, so maybe Tursy can team up with Mervin Tran. How could he not be able to find a Canadian partner? Surely one of those Canadian girls can land a consistent triple toe.

Stephane and Johnny flirting again. Just friends? They were quite cute together when they were touring for Kings on Ice.

Stephane has a longterm partner and he has better taste than to go for Johnny. He flirts with pretty much everyone (albeit some more than others, hehe).

I do wonder if Johnny will ever find himself another man. I can't' imagine who could find him attractive with the way he presents himself these days.

Oh, now that I think about it...

Btw, how many times does Misha need to remind us all that he is a Real Artist? I feel like these things are always better left for others to say or decide. But what do I know.

R522 Think about what...? Misha's like a 13-year old girl on twitter. I forget he's almost thirty.

Misha's photoshopping is worse than Gabby Daleman's.

Is this Jason's way of coming out?

Astakhova/Rogonov are done. Someone in the know posted on FSU that it's her who wanted to retire. He would have continued with her but at 30 he would not start all over again with a new partner. So he retires too.

R519 Tran is getting paired with an US girl, Olivia Serafini. I think he moved to California

When will Misha stop acting as if he were Hanyu's life-saver ?

Well, Misha has just done a new IG post about Hanyu

ISU Congress start tomorrow. It will be streamed live on ISU Youtube Channel.

Bradie Tennel is going to do Romeo and Juliet next season...

Gabby Daleman is making Youtube vlogs now. She says that her favorite cities are Italy and Paris. I couldn't watch very much because her drag queen makeup is so distracting and, well, she's just not very bright.

[quote] Gabby Daleman is making Youtube vlogs now. She says that her favorite cities are Italy and Paris. I couldn't watch very much because her drag queen makeup is so distracting and, well, she's just not very bright.

Has Gabby always lived in Canada? She sounds so much like a California Valley Girl. This was painful. I think I've watched my last Gabby vlog.

Oh, lord. Misha deletes the Yuzuru post after he presumably got a lot of shit for it, and posted this. More attention whoring. Sometimes it's ok to just STFU!

I couldn't even read the whole Hanyu post by Ge. It was too long....

Anyone can show me how to make Misha shut up ? Annoying AF.

Can Daleman photoshop herself in her VLOG?

R530 Do we know which Romeo and Juliet? I can't imagine any version working for her. I thought they wanted to mature her up.

Oh, Misha... Other skaters were posting photos with Hanyu and he was feeling left out. But Hanyu looked slightly irritated when Misha asked for the photo. I don't think he would have relented if it wasn't Misha and Evgenia's last day of the tour. There was clip of a different performance where Hanyu and Plushenko were having a moment and Misha tried to insert himself.

R537 Not yet. She just put the hashtags #freeskate #romeoandjuliet in her IG post.

Choreo is by Benoit Richard like last year's Cinderella

Oh my, that was awkward, R537.

I don't think Misha is a bad person, but he's just so immature and extra in everything he does. And he's 27!!! How embarrassing.

[quote]Bradie Tennel is going to do Romeo and Juliet next season

Will she interpret the balcony?

Different angle. Anyone have a copy of the deleted Misha post?

Misha Ge about Yuzu on 6/3/18 w/photo: Good friends with you not when you on the top only, but also with you when you at the bottom. Now he is a superstar, idol, and received many more great achievements. But as friend i know what he been through to be here today ( and even though i know it partially, because to fully understand a person “you need to walk in his shoes” ). By growing up together and going through up and downs, i think we do became more valuing our friendships and respect to each other. (And is not by the pictures only). He is the person with many great talent, respect, power, abilities and i have a lot of respect to him. He is the person that very care about his fans. To be a superstar and live it live, is a very hard thing that most of us can’t even imagine. To see our friends happy is also our own happiness, as a friends and the fans (i do believe so). I think we all want to see him happy and smile not only from outside but also from inside. So i wish that fans can understand, he is also human, and not a machine. He achieved so much, he done so much, and he love you guys fans so much (and i know you guys love him even more). By that rule of mutual respect, please care about each other, like we do in our friendship :) #ThankYou

Is messy hair a thing in Japan?

Misha Ge needs to find a new way to hype himself. What he's doing now became boring and stale shit.

Alexander LAKERNIK (Russia) is re-elected unopposed as ISU Vice-President in charge of Figure Skating

Elections for ISU EXECUTIVE...5 members for Figure Skating. Candidates:

Mr Benoît LAVOIE (Canada)

Ms Marie LUNDMARK (Finland)

Mr Tatsuro MATSUMURA (Japan)

Ms Ubavka NOVAKOVIC-KUTINOU (Bosnia & Hrzegovina)

Ms Maria Teresa SAMARANCH (Spain)

Ms Patricia ST. PETER (USA)

Ms Rita ZONNEKEYN (Belgium)

SINGLE AND PAIRS TECHNICAL COMMITTE:

Election for Chair:

Mr Fabio Bianchetti (Italy)

Susan Lynch (Australia)

Election for 3 other members. Candidates:

Mr Fabio BIANCHETTI

Mr Artem KNYAZEV (Uzbekistan)

Ms Leena LAAKSONEN (Finland)

Ms Susan LYNCH (Australia)

Ms Ubavka NOVAKOVIC-KUTINOU (Bosnia & Hrzegovina)

Ms Yukiko OKABE (Japan)

Mr Jeroen A. PRINS (Netherlands)

Ms Florence VUYLSTEKER (France)

Ms Margaret WORSFOLD (Great Britain)

Ms Rita ZONNEKEYN (Belgium)

ICE DANCE TECHNICAL COMMITTEE

Halina GORDON-POLTORAK (Poland) elected unopposed as Chair

Candidates for the 3 spots:

Mr Sergii BARANOV (Ukraine)

Mr György ELEK (Hungary)

Mr Shawn RETTSTATT (USA)

Ms Hilary SELBY (Great Britain)

Ms Alla SHEKHOVTSOVA (Russia)

Voting is on Friday 8th

R545 Which of them has a checkered past?

R545 The Yuna Kin uber-fans still hate Alla Shekhovtsova. She was on the Ladies panel in Sochi. And she is married to Valentin Piseev who has been for many years the chief of Russia Skating Federation.

They will also vote a proposal by ISU not to link the skater elected on the Athletes' Commission to the Skaters' Representative on the Technical Committees

Their reasoning is "Due to timing issues, the need for continuity and experience within the Technical Committee membership, budgetary factors, practicality, and fairness to Skaters who have been appointed to the Technical Committees, it is fairer and more beneficial to separate the roles of the Athletes Commission and of the Skater representatives on Technical Committees. "

Fairness sounds as a random concept....is it not fair if the other skaters vote out the representative? It seems they are suggesting it.

The current situation is that the two skaters elected to the Athletes Commission (one for Single/Pair and one for Ice Dance) join the respective Technical Committees. Unless they are still active. In that case they can't sit on the TC.

You may say it's fair because otherwise they could back proposals that favour them. At the same time ISU don't find the same situation is problematic with the coaches' representative. He can back decisions favouring the skaters he trains.

Also, the sudden resignation by Nathalie Pechalat from the Ice Dance Technical Committe in the run up of Olympics was never fully explained. Pechelat joined the Committee even if she lost the election to the Athletes Commission to Alper Ucar. Given Ucar was still competing, he couldn't be on the Technical Committee and ISU appointed Pechelat. Then she resigned in January 2018 citing " potential conflict of interest situation related to her double function as Figure Skating media consultant and Ice Dance Technical Committee member". But she was worked for Eurosport France also before...so not sure why this potential conflict of interest suddenly became important only at the end of January 2018.

misha is so annoying he's such a famewhore

It's actually worse than that clip. From around 17:00, the skaters are thanking the artists and going backstage while Misha and Evgenia hang around for Hanyu. He hides his face while they take the photo and looks pissed after the two leave the ice (18:18-18:23). Everyone else had been taking their photos either during practice or backstage.

Yuzuru mainly looked exhausted by then. But what about him coming out wearing the pooh headband? He looks incredibly silly. Is that what his crazed fans in Japan go for? So weird.

The Pooh head band was silly, sure but pretty adorable. I find the whole ice show thing almost unwatchable and cringeworthy most of time, but Yuzuru is so game and goes all in it's hard to begrudge him.

He really did look exhausted but he did what? Two or three quads and three triple axels, several in the last few minutes? After months away from the big jumps. Respect.

And as for our favorite Uzbeki: I think Yuzuru is due for a breather from his number one fanboi – wait, best friend who grew up with him and stood by him through his up and downs:

@mishageofficial will attend the 57th ISU Ordinary Congress in Seville, Spain as the representative of Uzbekistan skating federation. Misha Ge

He also recently choreographed the ice show in Korea that Brian Orser was in charge of.

And this Instagram post makes it sound like Misha Ge is the new coach for the Japanese skater Kazuki Tomono, who placed 5th at Worlds (ahead of Keiji Tanaka) and along with Shoma, secured three spots for Japan.

What did Henry II say – will no one rid me of this meddlesome ex-skat.. I mean priest?

I don't think Misha will get invited to Fantasy anymore. Only the show's professional photographer is allowed to take photos from the ice until the end of the show. People are saying it was more awkward in person because the skaters were supposed to leave the ice to allow the audience to clap for the musical guests and Misha interrupted their moment. But what I would give to see Misha interact with these other ISU officials. Just imagining him tweeting about the congress makes me smile.

Do you think we'll get selfies of Misha and the ISU officials, maybe during the voting?

[quote] And this Instagram post makes it sound like Misha Ge is the new coach for the Japanese skater Kazuki Tomono,

He is his choreographer. But being Ge he made it sound like he's the new saviour of Tomono

[quote] Do you think we'll get selfies of Misha and the ISU officials, maybe during the voting?

I hope we will get one of them during the vote on the proposal to ban officials posting selfies with athletes on social media.

Misha Ge is unprofessional and annoying. Hanyu wanted the audience to clap for artist guests and thank them at the end of show. He was clearly exhausted and just wanted to end the show immediately. Then Misha jumped out and dragged him into taking a stupid trio photo. No wonder he looked pissed.

Skate Canada motioned to strike the proposal forbidding presidents of fed from being on judging panels...and they won the vote.

Leanna Caron can go on and judge whatever she wants...

Raising age limit already thrown out from the agenda

Ms Weiguang Chen and Mr Huang Feng from China, respectively judge at Men event and Pairs event at Olympics, are under investigation by ISU

Majority of votes were to keep the two urgent motions (age limit and banning presidents from judging) in the agenda. But a 4/5 majority was required. Both votes were 6x for yes and 3x for No

USFSA voted to keep the age limit motion into the agenda. Same Germany, Italy, Czech Republic.

Russia, Canada, Japan, France were against.

China abstained.

Russia spoke out agains "no rep Quad" rule. Austria, Norway, Sweden, New Zealand all spoke against it

Anyway the Congress is entertaining......watching it you realize why judging is a mess.

At one point they didn't even understand what they were talking about. They were all confused....quoting proposals with wrong numbers....

there was an incoherent rumbling about quads by one delegate. It ended with "it's all complicated!"

I hope to god they don't pass that stupid quad rule. You can count on one hand the number of men who can jump multiple quads beautifully. The rest are ugly, bad quality, UR, prerotated, etc.

Skate Canada announces that world champion Kaetlyn Osmond will skip the 2018 Grand Prix Series

Looks like Tursynbayeva has joined Team Tutberidze unless Daniil is trolling. Does Eteri really believe in Elizabet or is this her way of getting back at Borser?

The Russian delegate basically destroyed the ISU Technical Committee this afternoon

"For many years the skaters were doing [connecting steps before solo jumps] and the judges were able to distinguish it. What is the problem now? Either the skaters now cannot do them, or the judges cannot figure out where the steps are?"

I sense that Osmond is only going to go downhill from now. She got lucky at Worlds.

Poor Tursy will continue to postpone puberty as she tries to compete with 14 year olds at Eteri's rink.

Most skaters in the US have to find work outside the skating world after they retire, but what about Canadian skaters? Will Osmond really be able to make bank now with her Olympic and Worlds medals?

They voted to keep CDs for music instead of switching to USB stick

They voted for Japan proposal against backloading. Only 1 in SP and 3 in FS now allowed. 46 yes 15 no 1 abs. 2/3 majority (42) required.

Russian news source confirmed Tursynbaeva moving back to Eteri.

If you need to watch something cringeworthy, ISU congress is here for you.

The beginning when they try for 10 minutes to understand who is present and who is absent and how to use the voting machine is priceless.

Then there is a long debate about CDs.

I didn't know that Misha has a Korean grandparent...he doesn't look Eurasian at all!

Eteri and Tursynbaeva's mom in the Kiss & Cry: comedy gold?

Have some of these skaters even seen a CD before?

Someone suggested to send the music by cloud/online system.

I thoghut isu would reply back with we prefer the gramophone"

They passed the "anti Felipe Montoya" rule. Reformed the Olympic qualification system

Raya and Montoya couldn't go to Olympics on the back of Javier again. They would be forced to go to Nebelhorn to fight against others.

Another wild day in Seville...

- Proposal by Norway: ban judges from posting on social media their opinions on skaters and photos with active skaters. Skate Canada delegate: "but we can't control social media. If someone take a pic of me with a skater because we are at the same rink..I can't control if he posts it on social media". Norway: "erm, the proposal talks about YOUR social media"

- Alper Ucar fanning himself. Actually, he was the only one using the fan provided with the ISU logo

- Beatrice, the legal rep: "I think I know what you wanted to say but what you wrote in the proposal doesn't say that"

- Top of the day: they discussed a proposal wrongly written...

- "the wording is wrong but we all know what we are talking about"

- and they actually voted for it: "proposal approved but Fabio, you must give us the correct wording, without the mistake"

Tomorrow morning they should resume with the topical moment of the Congress: Proposal 245 about allowing men to wear tights. Reason put forward by the Technical Committee: “It is not appropriate to single out the word “tights”. Many men’s trousers are tight fitting for safety reasons.”

And I think they vote on the proposal to limit quads to one per type per program - yikes! The pro-Chen rule, I guess it could be called. Who else has more than two quads - Boyang Jin, Shoma Uno, Vincent Zhou, and if his ankle is healed, Yuzuru Hanyu. Anybody else? They'll all be killing themselves to learn the damned things. Someone on a board said if you do the third quad, then you can't do two triple axels, but I didn't understand the reasoning.

* I meant for every quad you do, you'd have to do a different type (if the proposal passes)

"You got to be a man to wear tights"

yes, the "not repeating quads" rule is to be voted tomorrow.

R555 Sadly, No selfies so far but we do have instas from the voting.

Is there more information on the two Chinese judges under investigation? What about Lorrie Parker? She was almost as blatant as the Chinese.

I read that Uzbekistan brought up a proposal that was quickly disposed of (having 3 different sets of requirements to help the young skaters who are doing both juniors and seniors, making 3 different sets instead of 2). Anyway, I wonder if that was Misha Ge? And how did he feel about the rule that judges couldn't do selfies with skaters LOL? Judges OR ISU officials, Misha? Still wanna represent Uzbekistan (but I know that wasn't the proposal but at least the subject came up).

I still can't get over how he pestered Yuzuru at the end of that last ice show - when he was trying to give the musicians their due. WTF? He was minutes away from being backstage where he could ask for his stupid damned picture - and he already had one w/Yuzuru that he'd posted on Instagram (the one he got so mad about 2 out of 100 comments being negative). And how he "reminded" Yuzuru he'd been beside him when he was down. Really? Somehow I doubt it, but you don't brag about it on Instagram, in any case.

Everyone else was taking photos with Hanyu during practice, so Hanyu must have kept turning Misha down and this was Misha's only opportunity to force a photo, or Misha wanted to make a show of their "friendship" to silence all of the doubters. I guess both is also a possibility. You have to admit, it is kind of funny after everything Misha wrote about honoring Hanyu's privacy and not needing selfies to prove their "lifelong" relationship.

R583 Misha made it look like the other photo was taken down due to fans but for all we know, Hanyu's team or FaOI management could have asked him to delete it after he pulled that stunt.

Speaking of Misha Ge. Saw this from Twitter. Apparently Misha posted this on his weibo. I wonder if Hanyu saw this? Misha is no friend doing this to Hanyu.

Still can't understand what point he was trying to make with the long ramble he eventually deleted. Can anyone enlighten me?

I know that skaters tend to be emotionally stunted, but it seems especially bad in Misha's case. No wonder he's never had a serious relationship (that Zabiajko farce doesn't count).

R586 When was that posted? Where is his weibo account? Can't read Chinese.

We're getting close to the end of this thread.

No wonder Yuzuru covered his face with that Winne the Pooh headbank in the trio photo that Misha forced him to take with Evgenia. I am really shocked!

I hope we'll have a new skating thread -- the ISU votes on the quad rule tomorrow! And lots is happening with coach changes - Jason Brown to Orser!! after Dave Lease said he would never ever take Jason, and I saw a video where Orser himself said that dealing with the American fed was so much trouble he'd probably never take an American skater again. (Maybe only his "main" coach has to do all the testing and certification and crap - and that won't be Brian.)

[R589] on the photo it says:

Misha: Hanyu you jealous of it?

Hanyu: Your faces are too close, take your hand down.

Why would Misha do that? Hanyu doesn't need him in his life. He must be thinking who he can truly trust.

R586 Apparently that's one of the many shipping memes Evgenia's liked. Here's another that also takes a dig at Ashley Wagner and Satoko Miyahara: I hope Ashley's seen it, haha.

what does that meme mean? I can't speak Russian

[quote]I read that Uzbekistan brought up a proposal that was quickly disposed of (having 3 different sets of requirements to help the young skaters who are doing both juniors and seniors, making 3 different sets instead of 2). Anyway, I wonder if that was Misha Ge?

it was from Artem Knyazev, their pair skater from a decade ago and ISU Technical Specialist

The proposal was to have one World Standing for Senior and one for Junior. Artem took the microphone to say "we need 3 lists...there are those who skate both Junior and Senior in the same year"

Artem seems to speak at random sometimes. "Artem, what are you talking about?" is one of the highlights of the first day. He went on and on complaining about a rule citing the number of another one leaving the chair totally confused

[quote]I And how did he feel about the rule that judges couldn't do selfies with skaters LOL?

That rule was rejected. So he can do selfies, selfies and even more selfies!

[quote] Is there more information on the two Chinese judges under investigation? What about Lorrie Parker? She was almost as blatant as the Chinese.

they said the Disciplinary committee would decide on them this week. Verdicit to be published next week?

On Monday they gave some more info on Alexandre Gorojadanov at Golden Spin. The accusation was that he constantly looked at the screen of the judges at his right (Maria Abasova from Russia) and left (John Millier from USA) before/after imputting his scores.

The referee of the man event (Daniel Delfa from Spain) was sitting behind the judges stand during Short Dance and filmed Gorojadanov's behaviour

After being notified that he was under investigation, Gorojadanov sent ISU a letter asking to be removed from judges' list and promised them he would not ask to be re-inserted for at least 3 years. ISU therefore stopped the disciplinary action because they would have not suspended him for more than 3 years.

So all in all, Goroajdonov will be back in 2021?

New thread

R598 Decide on just the two Chinese judges but not Parker or including Parker?

R598 Only Chen and Huang have a disciplinary action pending according to the slides shown on Monday at Congress on the work of Disciplinary Committee.

Parker wasn't mentioned or her name shown.

R599 Thanks!