The Deer Hunter

I haven't seen it since it's original release, OP, but I remember the friend I went with referring to the "interminable wedding scene" for months afterward. I should give it a re-watch, but I think it would stir up too many memories.

Meryl was beautiful.

I misspelled "its." I see it--I noticed first.

Don't forget we see DeNiro's dick too!

That Russian roulette scene was harrowing.

John Savage is heartbreaking in it. Very underrated actor, imo. And De Niro is a god. Don't come at me; I'm right.

For r4

John Cazale as Stan ("Stosh"). All scenes involving Cazale, who had terminal cancer, were filmed first. Because of his illness, the studio initially wanted to fire him, but Streep, with whom he was in a relationship, and Cimino threatened to walk away if they did. He was also uninsurable, and according to Streep, De Niro paid for his insurance because he wanted Cazale in the film. This was Cazale's last film, as he died shortly after filming wrapped. Cazale never saw the finished film.

The day after I saw it on the big screen I’m ashamed to say I felt very uncomfortable going into a fish and chips restaurant that was ran by a Vietnamese family. All these years later and I still feel bad about my internal reaction.

While in college, I watched The Deer Hunter in a theater when it came out in 1978. We were so hungry for movies which could explain the horror of Vietnam. Being from the Midwest, the cinematography and hunting / wedding scenes were on-point.

I recently re-watched it. I had not seen it since 1978. It’s painful to rewatch as it brings back all of the sad memories of trying to make sense of our involvement in Nam. 1.5 million people slaughtered. US casualties were 58,212 men and 8 women. Just kids trying to better their lives or caught in the draft. And for what.

My heart still breaks for their moms and dads who got those damn Western Union telegrams, which is how they informed some families back then. Telegrams.

I can rewatch the movies of that era - The Godfather, Godfather II, Jaws, Rocky, Alien, and Apocalypse Now a bazillion times, but can’t rewatch The Deer Hunter because it is so sadly captures how it felt to grow up in the shadow of that war. I guess that’s good, film-wise, since one of the purposes of film is to memorlize how things were. But still, it’s so painful to watch.

Hi, OP. I thought Christopher Walken was hawt.

As dark as the movie is, I have to say it’s in my top 5 of all time. For me,it was just so relatable. My mother was from the coal mining area of Scranton, PA of Polish descent and the opening scenes of the wedding at the VW Hall, the old ladies with the babushkas, the main characters getting so trashed on beer... This movie was heartbreaking seeing where they all started out as great friends and where they all ended up. It just stunned me.

BTW, Meryl Streep and Christopher Walken were never more beautiful.

Don’t miss Rutanya “Carol Ann” Alda as the bride!

R9 you’re spot on in your analysis. I was in my 20’s as well when I saw this film when it came out. There were three of us and when we left the theater, not one of us said one word for about a half hour we were so shook. It really was heartbreakingly sad. To this day, I still can’t make sense of that war.

I'm in my late 20s, but I remember watching this film as a young cinephile obsessively renting classics from Hollywood Video.

I only saw it once, but what I remember most was the immersive wedding sequence as well as clutching my pillow crying during the Russian roulette scene. I desperately want to rewatch it again now that I'm older, but I'm terrified of enduring the Russian roulette scene again.

Thanks R9, and everyone else, for the perspective of those who were there when the film arrived.

I always wondered why Christopher Walken got all the attention and awards when I thought John Savage was the better performance.

As for Streep all that click click click stuff she is accused of worked for her here. I love how she haphazardly agrees to marry Walken but from the very beginning shows signs that she is really in love with DeNiro.

The wedding scene is long. Cimino liked that stuff apparently. Heaven's Gate also has an incredibly long and lavish graduation scene at the beginning.

[Quote] John Savage is heartbreaking in it. Very underrated actor, imo. And De Niro is a god. Don't come at me; I'm right.

Agree! Everyone talks about the RR scene but it is Savage's terrorized screams with De Niro attempting to calm him which really gets me. There are many amazing scenes in this film and IMO Savage should have walked away the the Oscar that year.

Yes. Those scenes in the cage are terrifying and he is brilliant in them.

............

The wedding sequence is wonderfully rich and provides a great build up to the Vietnam segment. Current movies would cut right to the “action” with little regard for the rich characterizations and context created by such a preamble. Great performances all around as well (especially Cazale, Savage, and De Niro).

I always figured the wedding scene was to let you know that they had already lived through something worse than being held as a prisoner of war in a cage in the river with rats, barely able to keep their heads above water.

The wedding scene was brilliant. Subtleties lost on most viewers.

well aren't we superior r21.

[Quote] well aren't we superior

Oh calm down, Mavis.

Nope

My parents took me to see it when I was — what? — 11? I perceived a story of unrequited same sex love between de niro’s character and walken’s character— the end left me devastated. I was so depressed after seeing that movie. Deeply depressed.

I need to see this movie again and reevaluate it.

I saw it when it first came on cable TV, and at the time I thought it was an overlong and rambling mess of a movie - the same reaction I had to Cimino's subsequent Heaven's Gate.

And understand, I'm saying that as someone who has loved some long movies - like Godfather II, Fanny & Alexander, Barry Lyndon, etc.

In contrast, when watching The Deer Hunter I felt like I was watching an unfinished version of the movie - kind of a rough draft.

What a brilliant movie about an awful, awful time. So many lives wasted for nothing, so much horror and mindless brutality.

Brilliant, but I never want to see it again.

Beautiful soundtrack.

@ 0:53

Heartbreaking.

"One shot".

I was reading about the film online and I did not know the film was so divisive and controversial when it came out. I was just a kid when the movie was released so that is not something I would have been known.

Some vets hated it, because they couldn't relate to the scenes depicting the war in Vietnam. Too fantastical. And some liberals hated it, because it was too right-wing and patriotic.

I can understand the vets to some degree. Having actually been there, wanting to see scenes that felt authentic and true, emotionally makes sense. I wouldn't care as much about the metaphor either. But it's the criticism that it was too reactionary and right-wing that baffles me. Obviously, not all leftists shared that point of view. Liberal Hollywood recognized it's brilliance after all, but I was just surprised to read that.

bump

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" God Bless America," an ironic anti-war message or a portrait of people who truly believe in the country, despite all they have gone through?

Here is the scene...

My first nomination.

Has moments of power, but is also overlong and full of pacing issues. A good movie, but far from a great film. I don't think it has aged as well as some other films from that time.

Meryl never really seems to like the film. She always sounds slightly judgmental when she discusses it. I think she feels her character was too passive.

Might as well have named the film [italic]Michael[/italic]. Michael! Michael! Mike! It just kept getting more and more exasperating. Apart from that, good movie.

Brilliant film. So many incredible scenes and performances. The wedding sequence is excellent - and necessary. There is a sense of something is coming and life is about to change. I think Cimino did a brilliant job transitioning from America to Vietnam. He literally just throws his character into the heart of war and it's jolting.

Agree about John Savage. His performance stays with you. But Walken had those Russian Roulette scenes which were very disturbing and haunting.

Question: I remember on the IMDB forum there was a question about whether Christopher Walken's character Nick was the father of Rutanya Alda's character's child and there was huge debate about it. I never picked up on this. Did anyone else?

[Quote] but is also overlong and full of pacing issues. A good movie, but far from a great film. I don't think it has aged as well as some other films from that time.

Ukrainians.

I’m watching it now. I love this film. Blue collar, hard working. I relate so much to it. I first saw this film when it came out back in 1978, I had just retired from Ford living in blue collar Hamtramck, Michigan at 60. I worked the line—wasn’t an engineer or anything like that. Blue collar. I was out to a few at work. I think most knew. I was quiet and kept to myself. Times have changed.

A sad but fascinating movie. Christopher Walken never looked better. De Niro was amazing. It makes you wonder if we were more or less divided as a country then as we are now.

It seemed to really capture the era and the people in Pennsylvania at the time.

Hanoi Jane hated this film because it because it basically reaffirmed love for country despite its flaws and it competed against her execrable Coming Home for Oscars.

r41, regarding whether Nick is the father of Angela's baby:

1. Someone has been sending money from Vietnam to Angela, presumably it's Nick. Nick might be helping his disabled friend out of loyalty, but if he's the father he has an extra motive.

2. The baby has very light blond hair. Nick is blond.

3. Angela lingers at Nick's grave after the burial.

I was really into cinema but I was too young to see The Deer Hunter in the movie theatre. I convinced my mom to take me....we were 15 mins late, mom was freaked out by the loud audio. We left halfway through the roulette scene...mom could't take it anymore and I was pissed with myself for putting her though that. I recenly bought it on blu-ray and the movie looks great. It's a shame what happened to Michael Cimino though.

[quote] I first saw this film when it came out back in 1978. I had just retired from Ford living in blue collar Hamtramck, Michigan at 60.

you were 60 in 1978?

To hell with the 3 male leads, that Vietnamese actor who was the ringleader in the RR scene was DEVASTATING.

I was R49.

The church is a Russian (not Ukranian) Orthodox church in Cleveland--my college roommate's family were members. The church got a new roof in exchange for the film being shot there. The gricery stor was in the same neighborhood. Even though there were steel mills nearby, they used one in Wierton, WV for the steel mill scenes. The deer hunting scenes were shot in Washington State---which is why they seem "off" . Thailand stood-in for Vietnam.

The wedding scene is one of the best things about the film--it really captures a white ethnic wedding from those days. The big guy was a local Cleveland actor. John Savage was very good in this. Sadly, he seemed to get typecast--he had a similar role in "The Onion Field" which was released shortly afterward--perhaps that's why he wasn't nominated. Cazale's story is very sad--he was Fredo in the Godfather movies. Strong performances all around. Streep didn't have much of a part--no wonder she doesn't talk about it.

I loved Meryl Streep in this. She’s so innocent, fresh. She has great chemistry with Robert De Niro—and in Loving too. I think that was the name. I watch that film only because of The Deer Hunter.

John Cazale was fantastic. He had terminal bone cancer throughout out the entire film process—from the very start of production, he was dying. I wonder what kind of career he would have had—only 42 years old. He would have had a brilliant career.

The director was dishonest about service in Nam.

R52, thanks for mentioning that the hunting scenes were shot in Washington State, those aren’t Pennsylvania mountains.

Meryl seems to not care for her earlier work before Kramer. She only did Holocaust for the money but won an Emmy for it. As for TDH she said her character is essentially a mans view of a woman, she’s beaten down by everyone but never gets angry about it. She probably did it for the money too and to support John Cazale.

You’re probably right, R55.

I don't relate to this film in any way, shape or form, which is why it's one of my all-time faves. I love movies and books that get under my skin purely by virtue of their makers' talent. It's also the only war movie I ever cared for, precisely because its war is metaphorical. And I adore the wedding scene - they were so happy...

R44, are you really 100 years old? Wow.

I am R57.

r44, are you...Olivia de Havilland?

r12 Rutanya is on facebook and ready available to all her fans..she is a doll!

Congratulations on your sharp mind, R44. My dad, who died in 2015 at age 76 and used to be technologically savvy in his day, had never mastered the use of a PC beyond playing solitaire.

I think Meryl and Cazale were doing this to maintain their health insurance for his treatments.

She doesn't seem to like the film. She always says when a man comes up to her and tells her his favorite film of hers is the Deerhunter she knows all she needs to know about that person. (Bill Clinton told her this was his favorite film!)

I know we joke a lot about M, but her performance in the final scene of this... it's revelatory. To be alongside her acting idol, De Niro, was probably a thrill for her as an ingenue, but she brought some deep level of pathos that I don't know if is even comparable. Plus, she actually could sing, making it even more heartbreaking. I'm sure the death of Cazale lingered heavily and informed her performance since they were so deeply in love. A masterpiece. Easily one of the Top 30 greatest American films ever.

I'm not sure why M disparges the film sometimes. She calls the character "a woman who waits" and says she can't relate to her because she is not a woman who waits. I think she thinks the character is not a good feminist portrayal.

But other times I've heard her talk quite proudly about how DeNiro saw her in a play and wanted her in the film. He cast Savage and Walken the same way. In that interview she seemed honored to have been chosen.

It may just be a difficult film for her to think about since Cazale was dying throughout it. Probably a very painful time in her life.

I have always been a little intrigued by the scene where Christopher Walken is in the hospital in Saigon, and he takes Meryl Streep's photo out of his wallet and looks at it. Does he not want to return home to her because he was so traumatized by the whole Russian roulette experience? Does he see her as some kind of perfect goddess and he is now tainted by this? Is he guilty, knowing he's the father of Rutanya's baby? What is it that makes him decide at that moment that he can't go home?

Jane Fonda said in the press room that The Deer Hunter was the pentagon's version of the war. (then later admitted she hadn't even seen it.)

I guess she was bitter that it beat Coming Home for the Best Picture. (I never get the appeal of Coming Home. I watched it again a few months ago and it doesn't really affect me.)

Comparing THE DEER HUNTER to COMING HOME is like... comparing Meryl Streep to Jane Fonda. No comparison.

I can’t relate to this movie. I had bone spurs. I’m also a pussy sociopath.

I lose it every time I see George Dzunda (sp?) blubbering as he's whisking the eggs.

Meryl & DeNiro were stunningly beautiful & I remember being so moved by her timid yet simple request of "Couldn't we just comfort each other?"

Just a brilliant movie with searing work by all the actors involved.

Thank you r30. One of the greatest scenes in film history, IMO. Incredibly terrifying. Savage was spectacular.

R65

Thank you for asking this question. I've always wondered this too.

I think M's character was in love with De Niro's and Walken was secretly in love with M... M should have been with Walken, but was too protected and wrapped up in her family life (taking care of her abusive father), so Walken ended up knocking up Rutanya's character and had to "make good" and get married ASAP. I think De Niro knows this and so does M, so the final scene has so many shades of loss... and he realizes in that moment he loves her, too. Just my thoughts.

Both of them, R60?

But why did Nick stay in Nam & keep risking his life via RR?

Did he have a psychotic break? I would think if I was lucky enough to survive the hell of that war I'd run like hell to get out of that country.

It's implied during the wedding scene that DeNiro's character is in love with Streep, but he doesn't act on it because Nick is his best friend. Nick is clearly besotted with Streep as well, as I don't think he has any idea that DeNiro is in love with her too. I do think Nick sees her as some kind of untouchable angel - he asks her to marry him during the wedding and seems almost surprised when she agrees. Meanwhile, he may have been going to Rutanya for sex behind Savage's back; at the end of the wedding, when Savage drunkenly confesses to Nick that he hasn't even slept with her, Nick just pats him on the shoulder and says "don't worry about it." Later that night he begs DeNiro's character not to leave him "over there" if he gets killed, a promise DeNiro keeps, even though he's too late to save him.

I just can't figure out what keeps Nick over there; the doctor is asking him a bunch of questions and he just goes mute and starts crying. It's not clear whether or not he knows at this point that Savage has lost his legs, or whether Michael is alive or not. And as horrible and traumatic as the Russian roulette was, it seems too early for him to become addicted to playing it. Unless the whole experience has taught him that life and death is just a crap shoot, ("one shot") and even the love of his ideal angel woman back home is not enough to pull him away from this truth. And he sends all the money he wins back to Savage as acknowledgment of his guilt over the baby and somehow knowing about Savage's disability. When he sees Michael all those months later I think he does recognize him, but despite his long winning streak against all odds, he knows he is beyond saving at that point and chooses death, perhaps knowing that Michael will take his body home. That's the best I've got. That's the best I can come up with.

"Plus, she actually could sing,"

I agree, but you wouldn't know it if you've seen her in Mamma Mia

I believe the vocals in MAMMA MIA! are intentionally what they are... it's sort of "Oh, look how cute Aunt Mary is rocking out to ABBA!" at a wedding party karaoke feeling. Very messy and spontaneous. Obviously, the formula has worked given that the franchise has grossed $1 billion thus far. Not saying I love it, but it is what it is. Obviously, her vocals in DEATH BECOMES HER and POSTCARDS FROM THE EDGE, as well as INTO THE WOODS, are very respectable.