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RuPaul won't allow Trans women to compete on Drag Race

And now everyone is losing their shit.

In a new interview with the Guardian, RuPaul stood firm on his stance that trans women and bio-queens are unwelcome on Drag Race. After explaining that drag's political power lies in the dissonance of "men dressing up as women," Ru was asked if he'd allow a "biological woman" to compete on the show.

“Drag loses its sense of danger and its sense of irony once it’s not men doing it, because at its core it’s a social statement and a big f-you to male-dominated culture," RuPaul tells Guardian. "So for men to do it, it’s really punk rock, because it’s a real rejection of masculinity.” When asked if trans women can be drag queens, he brings up season nine contestant Peppermint, who was the first out trans woman to compete on the show. “Mmmm. It’s an interesting area. Peppermint didn’t get breast implants until after she left our show; she was identifying as a woman, but she hadn’t really transitioned.”

The interviewer goes on to ask if RuPaul would allow a trans woman who was actively transitioning to compete. “Probably not. You can identify as a woman and say you’re transitioning, but it changes once you start changing your body. It takes on a different thing; it changes the whole concept of what we’re doing. We’ve had some girls who’ve had some injections in the face and maybe a little bit in the butt here and there, but they haven’t transitioned.”

These statements go to show how antiquated RuPaul's conceptions of trans identity and the queering of gender really are. For someone who is deservedly lauded as an icon of gender****ery, the fact that RuPaul still sees drag as a boys' club is disappointing, not to mention the fact that he reduces trans identity to whether or not a person has had surgery. The notion that the only true power to be found in an art form that has expanded so much since RuPaul came up seems insulting in the face of the incredible female artists — both cisgender and trans — who are doing drag today, largely thanks to the influence of Drag Race.

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by Anonymousreply 233March 18, 2018 6:32 PM

Do trannies really want to take part? Wasn’t it the trannies who demanded drag queens be banned from Glasgow Pride?

A man who says he’s a woman dressed as a man pretending to be a woman. Why?

by Anonymousreply 1March 4, 2018 9:36 PM

Everyone? I don't even watch this shit.

by Anonymousreply 2March 4, 2018 9:36 PM

Already a discussion in the show's official thread.

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by Anonymousreply 3March 4, 2018 9:38 PM

Fortunately, RuPaul is not one to cave to public bullying.

I got my latest issue of Vanity Fair the other day and flipping through the pages I saw a series of ads for dresses at Saks Fifth Avenue. All modeled by former men! Including that hideous creature that was on that reality who whose name I forgot. I think she's dating another model that used to be a woman. I just can't recall their names.

by Anonymousreply 4March 4, 2018 9:39 PM

And an earlier thread.

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by Anonymousreply 5March 4, 2018 9:39 PM

Why would anyone want to watch a woman or a trans woman dress up like a woman? What's the point? Women are expected to dress as women. There's nothing daring about it.

I think these younger people are confusing drag with situations like where Lady Gaga or Madonna used to dress in outrageous outfits. That's not drag.

by Anonymousreply 6March 4, 2018 9:40 PM

A link to an obscure, anonymous discussion board where the comments overwhelmingly support of Ru Paul's position...yeah, "Everyone's losing their shit."

Is it really so hard to dig up authentic [bold]#TrannyPanic[/bold] stories? I guess so. But OP keeps digging...

by Anonymousreply 7March 4, 2018 9:41 PM

LOVE you Ru!

by Anonymousreply 8March 4, 2018 9:42 PM

I laugh at all the young people on Twitter saying RuPaul should be replaced. The show would flop and be cancelled.

by Anonymousreply 9March 4, 2018 9:43 PM

Let them start their own fucking tranny & SJW heavy show, with Peppermint and Sasha Velour as judges. See how long that lasts.

Good on RuPaul for standing strong with his convictions and not listening to screeching kids on Twitter, Tumblr and Reddit.

by Anonymousreply 10March 4, 2018 9:46 PM

I agree with RuPaul.

What the fuck would be the point??

A "woman" dressed as a woman? No.

by Anonymousreply 11March 4, 2018 9:50 PM

The comments in that thread are funny. "Peppermint was always a woman" even before she started surgery and hormones... No. She was, biologically, a man. she may identify her gender as a woman, but you cannot yet change biology. Her brain might be configured more like a woman's, if she is actually trans, but physically she is a man. At least until she gets the surgery and is on hormones. Until then it's just dress-up.

by Anonymousreply 12March 4, 2018 10:09 PM

[quote]R10 / OP Good on RuPaul for standing strong with his convictions and not listening to screeching kids on Twitter, Tumblr and Reddit.

How much time do you spend daily researching this stuff? You sound so well informed!

You scour Twitter, Tumblr and Reddit for all this? When did your fascination start?

by Anonymousreply 13March 4, 2018 10:14 PM

For as long as Peppermint and Carmen Carrera have 'always been women', R13.

by Anonymousreply 14March 4, 2018 10:17 PM

No need to scour. It's all over Twitter. Being heavily promoted by LGBT sites, too.

by Anonymousreply 15March 4, 2018 10:17 PM

How many LGBT warrior trans women of color did RuPaul just literally murder with her words?

by Anonymousreply 16March 4, 2018 10:19 PM

[quote]I'm R10, and not OP

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by Anonymousreply 17March 4, 2018 10:23 PM

[quote]I'm R17, and not a lecturing tranny.

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by Anonymousreply 18March 4, 2018 10:26 PM

Original.

by Anonymousreply 19March 4, 2018 10:29 PM

[quote]Original.

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by Anonymousreply 20March 4, 2018 10:31 PM

[quote]I'm the DL T White Knight, and I won't get this thread reported to Muriel so it can be nuked!

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by Anonymousreply 21March 4, 2018 10:33 PM

R12 there is no “until then”. If you’re born male you will die male. Possibly with bolt on tits or your cock inverted but still male. Hormones and cosmetic surgery cannot change biological reality. Peppermint is, was and always will be a man. He can dress up as an elephant if he wants, he’s not one of them either.

by Anonymousreply 22March 4, 2018 11:16 PM

It's RuPaul's show, if he wants to keep it about male drag culture then that's fair enough. It's a small niche show, and the thing about niche shows is that if they try to include everyone and everything, the point of the enterprise can be lost.

Anyone who doesn't like it is free to start a new drag competition show that allows transwomen and drag kings and anyone else who wants to enter, and if that's what the public wants to see then RuPaul's show will be forced out of the market. But I really doubt that the public wants to see a show about non-drag queens dressing up, the sort of people who get worked up about these things never have any sense of humor, or appreciation of the fabulous.

by Anonymousreply 23March 4, 2018 11:29 PM

I think everyone's basically fine with it....it's just the anonymous Russian bots and trolls (and prissy, cornered Nellie Maes like OP and all his socks replying here, who basically detest women) that are trying to organize some dramatic march to sow discord....

No one else really cares that much.

by Anonymousreply 24March 4, 2018 11:35 PM

Give trannies their own show -- see who can bed a "straight guy" without getting beat up.

by Anonymousreply 25March 4, 2018 11:40 PM

[bold]#TrannyPanic[/bold]

by Anonymousreply 26March 4, 2018 11:41 PM

R26 are you telling us you’re a panicking tranny? Lost your tuck tape?

by Anonymousreply 27March 5, 2018 12:10 AM

The team community becomes more loathsome by the day. I miss the trannys of the nineties who didn't go around demanding shit. Drop the T will never happen, but should have.

by Anonymousreply 28March 5, 2018 12:46 AM

* trans community* , not "team"'

by Anonymousreply 29March 5, 2018 12:59 AM

Does Peppermint and the others not realise that by entering drag race to dress up as women, they are boldly proclaiming that they are NOT in fact authentic women? If they want to try and delude the world that they are and always have been genuine female women, then they have no business in a tv show about men dressing up as women. You can't have your cake and eat it too!

by Anonymousreply 30March 5, 2018 3:16 AM

R30 that's why SJWs are insisting that drag has a different definition. That it doesn't mean a person dressing up as the opposite biological sex.

When SJWs don't agree with something they just change the definition.

by Anonymousreply 31March 5, 2018 3:31 AM

Yes r31, like woman now includes man with a barrette and a duper’s delight smirk.

I don’t care what anyone likes to wear or whatever their fetish is but this denial of reality and insistence that everyone must collude in the delusion is obnoxious. Real words have real meanings. Just because you really really really want to be a different sex doesn’t magically turn you into it, even if you wish [italic]really[/italic] hard.

by Anonymousreply 32March 5, 2018 4:09 AM

I agree with Ru but there's nothing punk about a man dressing as a woman. It's so silly. benny Hill did drag before anyone and there was nothing edgy about it.

by Anonymousreply 33March 5, 2018 4:17 AM

R24 Boy are you in for an awakinging my “woke” friend

by Anonymousreply 34March 5, 2018 4:43 AM

From Pink News tranny hysteric

− Avatar Rootkid Izzy 10 hours ago The whole idea of someone being " fully transitioned" only when they had surgeries is so offensive. Someone has transitioned when they reached a point where they can be comfortable at. Noone can decide when that is except the person who is transitioning.

This idiot's rhetoric just makes it clear that he does not understand that a woman is a woman, whether transitioned or not.. Not to mention that saying drag is only for men is not only offensive but nonsensical since this idiot proclaimed drag was a middle finger to patriarchy - how can it be if (in his mind) only men are allowed to do cross-dressing performance art? 1 Reply

by Anonymousreply 35March 5, 2018 4:53 AM

SJWs always lie

SJWs always double down

SJWs always project

SJWs ALWAYS turn on their own

by Anonymousreply 36March 5, 2018 4:58 AM

Caterpillars transition. Humans don't.

by Anonymousreply 37March 5, 2018 5:00 AM

How are women or trans women "cross-dressing" when they are dressing like women? If they want to do what is known as drag then they should dress like men.

by Anonymousreply 38March 5, 2018 5:00 AM

And we think "Avatar Rootkid Izzy" is a real person because.....?

by Anonymousreply 39March 5, 2018 5:05 AM

R25 for the win, hands down. I’d watch that show.

by Anonymousreply 40March 5, 2018 5:06 AM

Im tired of Drags, trannies, SJW and fluids. I never thought i would hate a group of people so much.

by Anonymousreply 41March 5, 2018 5:10 AM

What happened to that trans model show that Whoopi produced?

by Anonymousreply 42March 5, 2018 5:12 AM

I would watch the hell out of r25's show.

by Anonymousreply 43March 5, 2018 5:13 AM

[quote]R43 I would watch the hell out of [R25]'s show.

We know, OP.

[bold]TrannyPanic[/bold]

by Anonymousreply 44March 5, 2018 5:22 AM

They want to be women so they're being treated like women. If you live as a woman and take hormones or have breast implants that's a really unfair advantage.

by Anonymousreply 45March 5, 2018 5:24 AM

R39 is in denial..but I’m glad you concede the total Orwellian mindfuck nonsense of it all. Keep that energy. The scale are bout to fall from your eyes

by Anonymousreply 46March 5, 2018 5:25 AM

*scales

by Anonymousreply 47March 5, 2018 5:26 AM

Okay....I'm waiting. It's just your threads are the only place I see this looming disaster discussed. Certainly no one in my life or circle obsesses about the trans situation. It kind of peaked with Kaitlyn Jenner.

But thank you for keeping lookout (on every obscure tweet feed and internet board in existence, seemingly.)

by Anonymousreply 48March 5, 2018 5:27 AM

You can't pretend to be a woman and do drag.

Drag is for men dressing as women, not for "women" dressing as women. You have to chose, you're a man or a woman but not both or chose whatever advantages you at the time.

by Anonymousreply 49March 5, 2018 5:29 AM

Aside from about 1-2 decent queens per season, there is a collective IQ on RPDR that is equivalent to a petrified turd. Every season, the queens describe who their "drag persona" is, and it's always the exact same: "She's a really fierce bitch! Like she's a total slut who loves men, but is fierce while doing it! Werk girl". It's clear none of these contestants have even an iota of an idea of what a woman actually is. They think because they're not butch footballers, they must be women.

It's embarrassing when the likes of Gia Gunn, Carmen Carerra, or even Courtney Act show up and brag about how they're "unclockable" and "pass as bio queens". They certainly do look "fishy"... went compared to Danny Devito. If you stood any one of them next to an actual female, it's clear that they are nothing more than a man in a dress, and it's obvious!

by Anonymousreply 50March 5, 2018 5:30 AM

Can't say I even regularly watch the show.

by Anonymousreply 51March 5, 2018 5:33 AM

What do you mean, OP, that this show is making everyone "lose their shit"?

Are you taking Ebonics or Diarrhoea?

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by Anonymousreply 52March 5, 2018 5:38 AM

Are people just looking at more creative ways to be offended. Why would a trans woman want to compete on drag race. I thought the whole point was to be a woman not to be a man dressing up in woman's clothes.

by Anonymousreply 53March 5, 2018 5:38 AM

R53 then why all the trans women on social media saying they are offended about what RuPaul said?

by Anonymousreply 54March 5, 2018 5:40 AM

Shockingly, the comments on the article at Pink News (is that "obscure"?? please tell me) are mostly sane and rational.

Top comment: "RPDR is about men creating an illusion of womanhood. If you believe transwomen are women, then obviously, they can't be in the show."

by Anonymousreply 55March 5, 2018 5:40 AM

[quote]R54 then why all the trans women on social media saying they are offended about what RuPaul said?

Maybe because they're all OP's sock accounts?

Who knows. But he seems really obsessed with this footnote in history.

by Anonymousreply 56March 5, 2018 5:42 AM

[quote]R55 Pink News (is that "obscure"?? please tell me)

Well, it's hardly the New York Times. Or even the Village Voice.

by Anonymousreply 57March 5, 2018 5:44 AM

Alright. So a source that's less famous than NYT is to be discounted around here?

Just trying to align the goal posts for future reference.

by Anonymousreply 58March 5, 2018 5:45 AM

Wait a minute, I thought it was wrong to compare trans women to drag queens because one is a "real woman" while the other is just a man wearing fake tits, a wig and a dress?

[quote]A man who says he’s a woman dressed as a man pretending to be a woman

I need an Advil. Reminds me of the movie Bamboozled, where blackface is performed by actual black people.

by Anonymousreply 59March 5, 2018 5:52 AM

Well, your original link is to ATRL. Isn't that Reddit? I mean, now a Reddit thread is somehow demonstrative of anything? It just seems like you grasp at these uncheckable sources, most of the time. How would you even know who the anonymous posters at Reddit, "Pink News," etc. even ARE? I mean, look how many posts YOU make here, pretending to be different people, talking and agreeing with yourself...it's all just one anonymous, blathering opinion, inflated to look like some kind of a groundswell.

Just how stupid do you think people are?

by Anonymousreply 60March 5, 2018 5:53 AM

Most of the women I've seen complaining about it on Twitter are biological women who have pursued dressing up in drag queen style and adopting drag queen characteristics. Not sure why they think what they are doing is the same thing that happens on RPDR.

by Anonymousreply 61March 5, 2018 5:59 AM

“Maybe because they're all OP's sock accounts?”

SJWs lie

“Well, it's hardly the New York Times. Or even the Village Voice.”

SJWs double down

The rest is coming...

(And once enough SJWs crybullies have the momentum this bitch (or plural) will cravenly join in and turn on “transphobic” RuPaul. I guarantee it)

by Anonymousreply 62March 5, 2018 5:59 AM

R60, the thread referenced an article in the Guardian. Yes, the Guardian's readership is probably less than the New York Times, but does it still qualify as a reputable source for you? At least set a standard for us to follow! You guys do like to change the rules on a whim and expect everyone else to follow them, but come on.

You claim to not even watch Drag Race, so why do you even care about this issue? Unless you will watch the show once Ts start competing, at least that makes sense in this context.

You can continue to pretend that it's just one person using 385 devices to argue with you, because that's very entertaining. Carry on.

by Anonymousreply 63March 5, 2018 6:01 AM

Duckling, there aren't 385 replies in this thread....

by Anonymousreply 64March 5, 2018 6:05 AM

That's the best rebuttal you have? Seriously?

by Anonymousreply 65March 5, 2018 6:07 AM

nico @twinkgoth Activity Map Analyse Visualise Alert rupaul thinks he’s allowed to call himself a tr*nny because he does drag but also thinks the group of people the slur is Actually directed at can’t do drag — I expected this one...and expect to hear variations of this ad naseum..but, NO, SJW masters of biological and logical and liguistic distortion, “Tranny” here meant TRANSVESTITE. (which is. In reality, Trans summed up in toto )

by Anonymousreply 66March 5, 2018 6:18 AM

nico

@twinkgoth

Activity Map Analyse Visualise Alert

rupaul thinks he’s allowed to call himself a tr*nny because he does drag but also thinks the group of people the slur is Actually directed at can’t do drag

— I expected this one...and expect to hear variations of this ad naseum..but, NO, SJW masters of biological and logical and liguistic distortion, “Tranny” here meant TRANSVESTITE. (which is. In reality, Trans summed up in toto )

by Anonymousreply 67March 5, 2018 6:19 AM

Glad you got your formatting together. It's a start.

Why are we discussing obscure, anonymous posters' opinions, though. Is nico@twinkgoth somehow notable?

by Anonymousreply 68March 5, 2018 6:28 AM

Drag Race has gained a larger audience among women and straight people overall. They may give some money to Ru and all the queens he has under contract. I'm glad Ru keeps the interest of gay viewers a priority though.

by Anonymousreply 69March 5, 2018 6:32 AM

R68 stop deflecting. Do you agree with RuPaul on this issue or the other side?

by Anonymousreply 70March 5, 2018 6:43 AM

There are no "sides". It's a non-issue.

by Anonymousreply 71March 5, 2018 6:46 AM

Typical SJW “intellectually” dishonest fucking coward

by Anonymousreply 72March 5, 2018 6:51 AM

Clearly it is an issue, since even Drag Race queens are commenting on it in interviews.

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by Anonymousreply 73March 5, 2018 6:53 AM

Cunts like r71 don’t argue in good faith. This craven fool can’t even say if “they” agree or not with RuPauls proposition

by Anonymousreply 74March 5, 2018 6:57 AM

Fucking blue haired omni-pierced 17-yr-olds telling gay men to “educate yourself” about how “trans women invented drag”.. really bitch? Citation fucking needed.

( Like they apparently also started gay liberation..🤦‍♂️)

Seriously .this nonsense needs to slapped down instantly before it takes...remember shemail-gate and lady bunny tranny shack! That was when ithis SJW shit went overground and we capitulated then and ever since...because these ideologues and zealots are never satisfied they only care about destroying and see every accommodation and concession to them as a weakness they can further exploit till they’ve . got totally control and bored moved on to the next person or institution to destroy. Don’t back down, Rupaul! (but I strongly suspect she will)

by Anonymousreply 75March 5, 2018 7:38 AM

[quote]remember shemail-gate and lady bunny tranny shack!

Actually, not all of us do.

What earthshaking outrage was this?

by Anonymousreply 76March 5, 2018 7:42 AM

^Fucking Google, bitch. Bonus: Tranny porn awaits

by Anonymousreply 77March 5, 2018 7:56 AM

If you can't explain the situation in context to what your railing against, why do I have to go scurrying all over the internet? It's not like this Tranny Shack business is on a level with Watergate, and something most people will grasp outright.

Basically, just explain yourself.

by Anonymousreply 78March 5, 2018 8:03 AM

The screeching is really out of control by the "fans" - who also want biological women in the show (well, some do) and continue to talk about Ru comign from "another generation" and being outdated. Also, the continued lie that comes up every time this issue is presented:

[quote]Invalidating trans women doing drag is extremely hilarious considering that the reason we have the rights we have today is because of transgender women who were drag queens.

Nah ah bitch... this was shot down of course, but it ALWAYS comes up.

It's quite a nasty read - most of the comments are ANTI-Rupaul (old, out of touch, transphobic) and pro-tranny / pro-female-queen. I would love to know who the hell these commenters are... teenagers? Girls? Feminine boys who think they're trans?

This link goes to the 700 comments, not the article.

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by Anonymousreply 79March 5, 2018 8:16 AM

Does this meet your impeccable standards as a gays news source of record, r78? I do so humbly so wish it so

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by Anonymousreply 80March 5, 2018 8:21 AM

Do you work for Reddit?

Why are you always trying to steer people over to that hellhole?

by Anonymousreply 81March 5, 2018 8:22 AM

Are you talking to me? Isn't it obvious why I posted it? If not - you're a fucking idiot.

by Anonymousreply 82March 5, 2018 8:23 AM

r79 don’t dignify this idiot with a response. I’m starting to think it’s a lonely senile old tranny chaser

by Anonymousreply 83March 5, 2018 8:25 AM

Yes, it's to you. You're the only one here!

As to your Lady Bunny expose link....it has nothing to do with your Ru Paul what-is-drag topic. Did you even read it?

by Anonymousreply 84March 5, 2018 8:27 AM

R84, you know you can put posters on block and see who has posted what, correct?

This forum is not as anonymous as you think it is, and I read all of your retarded and uninformed posts.

So, I have a question. Why have you been fighting so hard over the last 10 hours trying to claim this is "not an issue" and no news source has covered it? You have repeated the same shit over and over ALL DAY AND NIGHT.

Go to ANY message board discussing the show and this is what they are talking about. Now kindly shut the fuck up, die in a grease fire, whatever... just go away.

by Anonymousreply 85March 5, 2018 8:30 AM

Okay....but you're losing your whole audience.

You can go back to talking to yourself now.

by Anonymousreply 86March 5, 2018 8:31 AM

Here are all the posts by the "It's not really an issue" troll at r84/R86 and above. She wants a link to the New York Times before it's allowed to even be discussed. The entire thread was derailed, as you can see below, by this cunt - for 11 fucking hours (that is dedication!). The whole story is about FAN COMMENTS but links to fan comments do not satisfy her gaping prolapsed hole.

-----

A link to an obscure, anonymous discussion board where the comments overwhelmingly support of Ru Paul's position...yeah, "Everyone's losing their shit."

Is it really so hard to dig up authentic [bold]#TrannyPanic[/bold] stories? I guess so. But OP keeps digging...

[quote]R10 / OP Good on RuPaul for standing strong with his convictions and not listening to screeching kids on Twitter, Tumblr and Reddit.

How much time do you spend daily researching this stuff? You sound so well informed!

You scour Twitter, Tumblr and Reddit for all this? When did your fascination start?

[quote]I'm R10, and not OP

Original.

I think everyone's basically fine with it....it's just the anonymous Russian bots and trolls (and prissy, cornered Nellie Maes like OP and all his socks replying here, who basically detest women) that are trying to organize some dramatic march to sow discord....

No one else really cares that much.

[bold]#TrannyPanic[/bold]

And we think "Avatar Rootkid Izzy" is a real person because.....?

[quote]R43 I would watch the hell out of [R25]'s show.

We know, OP.

[bold]TrannyPanic[/bold]

Okay....I'm waiting. It's just your threads are the only place I see this looming disaster discussed. Certainly no one in my life or circle obsesses about the trans situation. It kind of peaked with Kaitlyn Jenner.

But thank you for keeping lookout (on every obscure tweet feed and internet board in existence, seemingly.)

Can't say I even regularly watch the show.

RuPaul won't allow Trans women to compete on Drag Race

[quote]R54 then why all the trans women on social media saying they are offended about what RuPaul said?

Maybe because they're all OP's sock accounts?

Who knows. But he seems really obsessed with this footnote in history.

[quote]R55 Pink News (is that "obscure"?? please tell me)

Well, it's hardly the New York Times. Or even the Village Voice.

RuPaul won't allow Trans women to compete on Drag Race

Well, your original link is to ATRL. Isn't that Reddit? I mean, now a Reddit thread is somehow demonstrative of anything? It just seems like you grasp at these uncheckable sources, most of the time. How would you even know who the anonymous posters at Reddit, "Pink News," etc. even ARE? I mean, look how many posts YOU make here, pretending to be different people, talking and agreeing with yourself...it's all just one anonymous, blathering opinion, inflated to look like some kind of a groundswell.

Just how stupid do you think people are?

Duckling, there aren't 385 replies in this thread....

Glad you got your formatting together. It's a start.

Why are we discussing obscure, anonymous posters' opinions, though. Is nico@twinkgoth somehow notable?

There are no "sides". It's a non-issue.

[quote]remember shemail-gate and lady bunny tranny shack!

Actually, not all of us do. What earthshaking outrage was this?

If you can't explain the situation in context to what your railing against, why do I have to go scurrying all over the internet? It's not like this Tranny Shack business is on a level with Watergate, and something most people will grasp outright.

Basically, just explain yourself.

Do you work for Reddit? Why are you always trying to steer people over to that hellhole?

Yes, it's to you. You're the only one here!

As to your Lady Bunny expose link....it has nothing to do with your Ru Paul what-is-drag topic. Did you even read it?

by Anonymousreply 87March 5, 2018 8:36 AM

But isn't he endorsing the fact that transwomen are 'women' and therefore it isn't 'drag'? Shouldn't they be giving him kudos for confirming their 'female' status?

This just proves the trans are mentally ill and love to the victim / pissed off.

by Anonymousreply 88March 5, 2018 8:36 AM

All 700 comments on reddit are sock accounts of the same person, R86? You know that site has screen names and you can read everything they have ever posted for years... quite a lot of work to accomplish!

by Anonymousreply 89March 5, 2018 8:37 AM

The postmodernist campus ideologues and there clueless SJW puppet minions are now deconstructing “problematic” drag into “empowering” meaninglessness. Because progress. Enjoy.

by Anonymousreply 90March 5, 2018 9:01 AM

^Oops There but it identifies as “their*”, so don’t question it’s identity

by Anonymousreply 91March 5, 2018 9:04 AM

The show's called RuPaul's Drag Race. He can make the rules. Let SJWs have their own Politically Correct, but FIERCE, Race.

by Anonymousreply 92March 5, 2018 9:14 AM

I thought drag was, by definition, men dressing up and acting like women. So if trans women were on there wouldn't they be admitting they are men playing dress up? I don't see what the controversy is. Women like Lady Gaga, Elvira, and Bjork dress in over-the-top costumes like drag queens, but I have never thought of them as drag queens because they clearly aren't men. Transgender people always bitch about people trying to "invalidate their identity," and now they're complaining when they aren't and trying to invalidate their own. WTF?

And now Rupaul will probably get in trouble for this silly nonsense. I wouldn't be surprised if they get him fired or get the show canceled altogether. SJWs are notorious for bitching on and on and on until people finally get tired of hearing it and give them what they want so they just shut up.

by Anonymousreply 93March 5, 2018 9:49 AM

Remember Ru, "We Shall Overcome".

by Anonymousreply 94March 5, 2018 9:51 AM

If women aren't allowed to participate on Drag Race, then they're not allowed, period. If a trans woman is a woman then they're included in the "no women" rule.

by Anonymousreply 95March 5, 2018 10:03 AM

Haha, no, that’s not how it goes down, r95. You will be sent for “re-education”

by Anonymousreply 96March 5, 2018 10:48 AM

So transwomen demand to be included in gay male spaces but if we call them gay or male or transvestite or even drag queens (unless THEY capriciously decide they are just that, when it’s convenient) then that is offensive and transphobic; AND they also demand to be included—because they are, after all, REAL WOMEN and NOT drag queens or transvestites, because they are MEN! —female beauty contests and other female-only spaces. This is a translogical clusterfuck of irrationality beyond Orwell 1984 meets Alice beyond the looking glass proportions

by Anonymousreply 97March 5, 2018 11:15 AM

R76, militant trannies have been going after Ru for a while now, despite his having done more for their acceptance than almost anyone.

by Anonymousreply 98March 5, 2018 11:20 AM

The Independent hit piece is peak transology manufactured-outrage nonsense

by Anonymousreply 99March 5, 2018 11:25 AM

OK but what about a post-op trans man in a wig and makeup?

by Anonymousreply 100March 5, 2018 11:46 AM

R97 mentally ill men are unreasonable and have unrealistic expectations that everyone else must obey their conflicting whims. That’s about it really.

by Anonymousreply 101March 5, 2018 11:47 AM

“Drag is about recognising that you are God dressing up in humanity. It’s a totem, a constant touchstone to say, ‘Don’t take any of this sh*t seriously.’” @RuPaul

So is RuPaul saying only men can be gods????!!

by Anonymousreply 102March 5, 2018 11:52 AM

Peppermint wasn't the first out trans woman to compete on the show. Also, have we forgotten the spinoff where the drag queens dressed up frumpy women in drag?

by Anonymousreply 103March 5, 2018 12:01 PM

R103 Yeah but that was Drag U. That was an opportunity for women to learn from gay men how to be adequate women. One must never presume that a straight woman is adequate without the guidance of a gay man in heels.

by Anonymousreply 104March 5, 2018 12:05 PM

Fuck off, OP, and take your trannywhore gurlfriends with you!

by Anonymousreply 105March 5, 2018 12:16 PM

Trans women have a dirty little medical secret. Hormone ablation/replacement therapies result In peri menopausal side effects. No wonder they all transition into viragos; it’s the most predictable and permanent outcome associated with hormonal adjustment.

by Anonymousreply 106March 5, 2018 12:46 PM

Trannies usually don't know how to apply make-up or wear women's clothes anyway, so why would viewers want them to compete. Even after they transition, most of them look like ugly transvestites.

by Anonymousreply 107March 5, 2018 1:05 PM

How can you say such a thing r107? Thank goodness I have my yellow plastic pearls to clutch!

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by Anonymousreply 108March 5, 2018 1:37 PM

I think it's simple.

Drag = Male body transformed into female appearance.

Physically male but trans-identifying dressing as female = For performance purposes, it's drag

Transitioning by making physical changes so a person is physically female = NOT DRAG.

Being a woman in a man's body permits drag performance within the convention.

Being a woman in a woman's body is not drag.

It's really very simple. Drag is about externalities. Period. You're a woman inside but not outside, you can do drag for the show. You're a woman inside and out, you can't do drag BECAUSE A PHYSICAL WOMAN BY DEFINITION CAN'T DO DRAG.

Duh.

by Anonymousreply 109March 5, 2018 1:46 PM

r105 Yeah..but just a cursory read through that RPDR reddit and you’ll see the battles is already as good as lost. These cunts are calling the shots now. The SJW hysteria tide is in their favour and ALL of the progressive media are already onboard manning...I mean personing..the oars or are be too pusillanimous to go stand up against it

by Anonymousreply 110March 5, 2018 2:05 PM

Yeah isn't he just reiterating the "woke" party line here? A transwoman is a woman (lol, but let's go with it), and women can't do drag, so neither can transwomen?

Also, people who "lose their shit" are virtue-signaling snowflake nightmares who should be slapped violently ... for the rest of their lives.

by Anonymousreply 111March 5, 2018 2:11 PM

@104, how was that teaching women to be "adequate" women? It wasn't a makeover show, it was a costume-y campy makeover show. I would never recommend a biological woman cake on makeup and pad herself ridiculously, and act that over the top to be "herself". Drag is predominantly about over the top camp. It's an exaggerated contrast of gender roles, not a good look for day to day life for common folks. I'm a cisgendered homosexual male fwiw. But Ru out of drag doesn't exactly exude masculinity to the extent she embodies femininity.

by Anonymousreply 112March 5, 2018 2:12 PM

[quote]A transwoman is a woman (lol, but let's go with it), and women can't do drag, so neither can transwomen?

This is why the same people are so strongly in support of "biowomen" doing drag as well. It's a workaround to get past that hurdle.

by Anonymousreply 113March 5, 2018 2:17 PM

I think R104 was sarcastic.

by Anonymousreply 114March 5, 2018 2:17 PM

You better work!

by Anonymousreply 115March 5, 2018 2:18 PM

[quote]This is why the same people are so strongly in support of "biowomen" doing drag as well. It's a workaround to get past that hurdle.

How can a bio woman do drag? What's the point of it then?

by Anonymousreply 116March 5, 2018 2:19 PM

"Inclusivity".

by Anonymousreply 117March 5, 2018 2:20 PM

If biowomen can do drag, there's no excuse anymore to not accept transwomen.

They just use biowomen, they don't care about them. Biowomen don't want to do drag anyway.

by Anonymousreply 118March 5, 2018 2:21 PM

No vag allowed! Artificial or otherwise.

by Anonymousreply 119March 5, 2018 2:22 PM

Do you think Ru would rather cancel the show than cave to hysterical SJWs? I hope so. This whole thing is ridiculous, and that’s saying something when we’re talking about a drag queen competition.

by Anonymousreply 120March 5, 2018 2:23 PM

Don't all biowomen "do drag" anyway, by nature of their being women?

I mean at least in the sense of dressing as women.

The realness of Drag is its fakeness, which is why a woman can't do it, barring a Blake Edwards-esque comedy scenario.

by Anonymousreply 121March 5, 2018 2:24 PM

R116 Because it challenges the patriarchy, silly. It confuses the PATRIARCHY! It’ll bring down the stinking cishetnormativecapitilistichegemonic PATRIARCHY!!!! Just like a biological man putting on a lipstick did

by Anonymousreply 122March 5, 2018 2:25 PM

R121 Drag and trannies are not the same.

by Anonymousreply 123March 5, 2018 2:26 PM

An acquaintance of mine is a huge proponent of allowing bio women (sorry, not gonna start using CIS female like she and all the other SJWs do) to do drag. What's not to get, hun? If a bio woman dresses up and performs then she's simply a performer.

by Anonymousreply 124March 5, 2018 2:26 PM

He has a point about that, R122. It certainly is a stronger statement for a man to be in drag than a trans.

by Anonymousreply 125March 5, 2018 2:28 PM

That’s HEGEMONIC* — for all you undereducated lumpen proles

by Anonymousreply 126March 5, 2018 2:28 PM

[quote][R121] Drag and trannies are not the same.

Who said they were? And "tranny" meant transvestite before it meant transsexual.

by Anonymousreply 127March 5, 2018 2:28 PM

Even today, people think drag and trans are one in the same. You see it here on DL all the time.

by Anonymousreply 128March 5, 2018 2:32 PM

Drag != transitioning, and I would think the T advocates would want to work very hard to keep that distinction alive and not blur it.

by Anonymousreply 129March 5, 2018 2:32 PM

Billy Eichner said that a queen named Inclusion Rider will win the next season of RPDR!

by Anonymousreply 130March 5, 2018 2:34 PM

Can you see this thing sashaying down the catwalk on Drag Race?

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by Anonymousreply 131March 5, 2018 2:37 PM

For a biowoman to do drag, she would have to dress up, and present as male, i.e. she'd be a drag king. There are some women who perform as drag kings.

by Anonymousreply 132March 5, 2018 2:46 PM

This is why people dislike transgender in the gay community. They take over everything.

by Anonymousreply 133March 5, 2018 2:50 PM

I guess they could be like Victor/Victoria -- a woman posing as a man posing as a woman.

by Anonymousreply 134March 5, 2018 3:28 PM

A few years ago everyone made that distinction quite clear, R129, but I noticed with the Ellen Degeneres-Liza Minnelli joke at the 2014 Oscars, people were saying her drag joke was offensive to trans. Since then I've seen a lot of conflation of drag with trans.

I suspect it's mostly online activists. In real life and in the LGBTQ orgs I belong to, I've never come across a trans person who has said drag is the same as trans.

by Anonymousreply 135March 5, 2018 3:47 PM

The official trans organizations are at fault for the conflation of trans and drag. They pushed for the idea that a man could claim to be a woman without making any physical changes.

This has led to a lot of attention seeking people who probably aren't trans using that label for their own benefit because it's currently "trendy" and comes with a protected status.

by Anonymousreply 136March 5, 2018 4:00 PM

Good lord! Lecturing a 60-odd-yr-old veteran in the game. These fucking narcissistic cancerous cunts —-

ANGUSRAZE @ANGUSRAZE Replying to @RuPaul

you have zero right to gatekeep drag, drag is an art form, it can be interpreted and executed in many different ways, drag was always about freedom, liberty and self confidence, disallowing particular people that luxury in your eyes is limiting and wrong, but go ahead block me 5:28 pm · 5 Mar 2018 13 Retweets

306 Likes ANGUSRAZE ANGUSRAZE @ANGUSRAZE · 1h Replying to @ANGUSRAZE and @RuPaul

Your peers and fellow pioneers of drag have historically taken trans people of all surgical basis under their wing for them to survive and be protected within the lgbt community as shown in Paris is Burning, it’s a betrayal of the core values of when we’re the lgbt community 1 6

102 ANGUSRAZE ANGUSRAZE @ANGUSRAZE · 1h

Not the G community not the L community but the LGBT community and your gatekeeping and restriction breaks that cultural and artistic bond, it’s so wrong and I’m actually sad about it

1 6 78

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by Anonymousreply 137March 5, 2018 5:59 PM

This ugly freakazoid piece of shit is calling rupaul TERF trash and blaming cisgays

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by Anonymousreply 138March 5, 2018 6:12 PM

So nice to see our lowest expectations for this population met, R138. Proof and proof and proof again.

by Anonymousreply 139March 5, 2018 6:16 PM

Ooops apparantly I added couple extra years to Ru’s age. As if he didn’t have enough stress on his hands lol

by Anonymousreply 140March 5, 2018 6:23 PM

The average non-LGBT person does not understand the difference between transgender people and drag queens. I’ve had difficulty getting the point across to dozens of friends, family and coworkers even when I explain that drag queens are gay nightlife clowns who dress up in exaggerated, non-realistic costumes and usually only do so as paid entertainers, and transgender people are “cross dressers” or transsexual people who are born physically as one sex but dress as the opposite gender. People have a hard time understanding that they are not the same thing.

by Anonymousreply 141March 5, 2018 6:33 PM

Perfidious Pink News going in for the attack and twisting his points and presenting only the tranny side as they pile on against a “problematic” “cis” gay man...typical

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by Anonymousreply 142March 5, 2018 6:34 PM

Pink news is cancer. It makes no attempt at impartiality or evenhandedness. It’s a trans propaganda publication now..or overwhelmingly so

by Anonymousreply 143March 5, 2018 6:37 PM

Yay RuPaul!

Too bad Indigo Girls didn’t do the same for MichFest when the owner didn’t want bio males on the land. They bought the T bullshit

by Anonymousreply 144March 5, 2018 6:39 PM

^^^ Yes, and now two Mitchfesters and their son are dead at the hands of one of the triggered trannies.

by Anonymousreply 145March 5, 2018 6:47 PM

Not possessing nor indeed requiring a mooncup I didn’t know about Indigo Girls. How are they regarded now by the womyn? I knew about Kathleen Hanna and although not an L or B that’s gotta be hard being as she kicked off the whole third wave era and a genuinely iconic heroic badass. That must’ve hurt to see her go from mitchfest to now supporting this madness

by Anonymousreply 146March 5, 2018 6:54 PM

Sorry Ru you created a big monster by yourself

by Anonymousreply 147March 5, 2018 7:06 PM

R145, are you kidding me? I've been out of the country off and on for the last 5 years, so I missed that. When did this happen? I complained just yesterday that we have no idea what's happening in the rest of world unless we go looking because of the orange terrorist holding our media enthralled. Now I'm really angry.

by Anonymousreply 148March 5, 2018 7:36 PM

R148 Anti Michfest M2T trans activist Dana Rivers murdered Patricia Wright, Charlotte Reed and their son Benny Diambu-Wright.

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by Anonymousreply 149March 5, 2018 8:14 PM

Latrice royale just shared this on Facebook

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by Anonymousreply 150March 5, 2018 11:06 PM

Ridiculous how some of these queens, who would be still performing at their crappy local bars instead of touring the world, are turning on Ru just to look 'cool' and 'woke' with the unbalanced SJW. The worst so far has been that trash Willam, going on and on about it on twitter while 19 and 20 years olds who haven't experienced shit are all 'YAAAAAS! LOVE YOU!!! GET HER!!! DRAG HER!!!' ugh....This for an attention whore who said much worse and then had to apologise when he realised he might sink further into irrelevance....but not before getting a camera and filming the whole thing, you know....for education and of course the views and likes.

This is why we can't have nice things.

by Anonymousreply 151March 6, 2018 12:41 AM

Ru already apologized for this on his Twitter account.

by Anonymousreply 152March 6, 2018 12:45 AM

I'm sure you were all waiting for this.... mental heavyweights Carmen Carrera and Gia Gunn weigh in on this:

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by Anonymousreply 153March 6, 2018 3:24 AM

i'm sorry, what exactly is stopping these people from starting their own show that includes women and transwomen?

by Anonymousreply 154March 6, 2018 3:37 AM

resources, plus no one would watch

by Anonymousreply 155March 6, 2018 3:40 AM

Right ON, Ru!

Drag is DRAG, NOT dress up for trans people, who generally are INFURIATED by drag, because denying that is their schtick is an imperative!

by Anonymousreply 156March 6, 2018 3:59 AM

[quote]These statements go to show how antiquated RuPaul's conceptions of trans identity and the queering of gender really are.

Just keep telling yourself that.

The "queering of gender" is the most nonsensical phrase I've ever heard.

by Anonymousreply 157March 6, 2018 4:03 AM

No, no, no R154 . Transwomen don't do their own work, they ust bitch and whine about the work done by other people. And they certainly don't, spend their own money and time to create things for themselves. They just identify their way into other people's established projects and then demand leadership because "Most oppressed" and "Dysphoria!".

by Anonymousreply 158March 6, 2018 4:04 AM

R154 knowing that trans-centered programs have thus far all failed.

by Anonymousreply 159March 6, 2018 4:06 AM

The trannies on Twitter are already claiming they invented drag - the very art form they don't cease demonizing. Is there anything these people won't lie that they invented?

A Twitter tranny upon hearing someone say that Alan Turing, a gay man, invented the modern computer: "Oh really? And a trans woman of color invented Alan Turing, so there!"

by Anonymousreply 160March 6, 2018 4:10 AM

Has any gay journalist or writer of note mentioned the fact that EVERY gay organisation of today has to be LGBT+++. Literally any organisation today that wanted to cater to just gays and lesbians would be attacked until it was closed down. However, trans are totally able to have their own trans specific groups/organisations. The hypocrisy of 'what's mine is mine, and what's yours is also mine'.

by Anonymousreply 161March 6, 2018 4:19 AM

Peak trans!

by Anonymousreply 162March 6, 2018 4:25 AM

r151 Willam was one of the ones who piled on that Stonewall movie because "trans WOC did the riots!!!"

by Anonymousreply 163March 6, 2018 4:27 AM

[quote]Fucking blue haired omni-pierced 17-yr-olds telling gay men to “educate yourself” about how “trans women invented drag”..

Yes! Right after they started The Stonewall Riots, but when the newspaper photos showed up they craftily "transitioned" into white men!

by Anonymousreply 164March 6, 2018 4:29 AM

After years claiming that drag is a transphobic version of blackface, that drag queens are agents of cispatriarchy and that their work justifies the Literal Murder of trans women of color, trans Twitter suddenly finds out they actually invented drag. You can't believe these people - the only thing that redeems their cognitive dissonance is how hilarious their mythomania is.

by Anonymousreply 165March 6, 2018 4:37 AM

He's right of course. If the point of the comp is to be the most convincing, then men who dress up as women shouldn't have to compete with men who dress up as women but also cheat by taking female hormones and undergoing cosmetic surgery to mimic female sex characteristics.

by Anonymousreply 166March 6, 2018 4:52 AM

Now that RuPaul had to 'RuPaulogize', is this still a "non-issue", R71?

by Anonymousreply 167March 6, 2018 4:57 AM

The pro-trans bunch are suddenly quiet, hmm...

by Anonymousreply 168March 6, 2018 5:01 AM

I'm sure it's DL's fault somehow that RuPaul had to comment. It surely would have stayed a "non-issue" had we kept quiet.

by Anonymousreply 169March 6, 2018 5:10 AM

These online SJW activists have to do it online because if they did it in real life, we would laugh at them.

90% of transvestites look ludicrous.

They don't like coming out in daylight because they look so bizarre.

by Anonymousreply 170March 6, 2018 5:17 AM

Will all the offended queens drop out of Drag Con now? Will the 14/15 year old gender non-binary they/xyr people give back their tickets? Since it is RUPAUL'S DragCon and the man is so not woke and obviously has done nothing but perpetuate offensive stereotypes and create non-safe spaces, it's the logical thing to do, isn't it? At least it is if you have real principles and not just jumping on a bandwagon (*cough*Willam*cough) to seem 'socially' conscious.

by Anonymousreply 171March 6, 2018 5:53 AM

I've read about it on others sites and it has been an interesting experience.

So, there was this person who was repeating again and again than RuPaul was discriminating about trans but when we ask him how it was discriminating, he just say that he read it somewhere but didn'tr eally know himself how it was discriminating. He said he was ignorant about it, but he gave his opinion anyway to be part of the coll kids.

Others said that people were women as soon as they "feel" like a woman. And here again no one was able to explain what does feeling like a woman means.

They all repeat what they have read elsewhere but never thought about those issues and are unable to argue besides I've read it's offensive so it must be offensive.

I don't know if I must laugh or cry. The generation is fucked up.

by Anonymousreply 172March 6, 2018 6:16 AM

R166 if you're going to troll a gay site at least do a little research on Drag Race or drag in general. The point of competition is not to be the most convincing imitation of a woman. It's more about spectacle, entertainment and performance.

by Anonymousreply 173March 6, 2018 6:53 AM

Is RuPaul the most successful openly gay black man in the television industry? Probably more successful than Lee Daniels since Ru owns his own properties.

RPDR and its spinoff events employ countless numbers of gay men and has a ripple effect throughout the world for everything from Drag Race viewing parties (a big boost for gay bars with razor-thin profit margins) to live production teams who go on tour with the queens.

At a time when we have so many LGBTQ "leaders" who don't actually do shit for gays and lesbians .... Yes, let's destroy RuPaul to appease a screeching handful of nuts on social media who don't even consider themselves gay.

And the ungrateful cunts who are RPDR alumni need to be slapped into the realization that Mama Ru has literally put roofs over their heads and food in their stomachs. Prior to Drag Race, their options would have been hosting 2-for-1 nights and "sex work."

by Anonymousreply 174March 6, 2018 7:08 AM

R173 bullshiit, you failed male tranny loser

Half the appeal is seeing the transformation from male to female the juxtaposition..seeng them out of drag as MEN. the whole “challenging notion of gender stereotypes and patriarchal expectations” is shown to be complete bullshit when half (and from here on in the flood gates are open ) the “drag queens” aren’t challenging what it is to be a man *really* but using it as an excuse to play at being a real laydee and wearing a lady frock and lady nails and lady makeup — because REAL LAYDEE. (But too fucking cowardly to reveal this..because drag queen environment , as you know, is obviously a bastion of regressive conservative patriarchal values!!!). Try again, dishonest freak.

by Anonymousreply 175March 6, 2018 7:35 AM

Interview with Lady Bunny from about two weeks ago, where she talks about the aggressiveness and shortsightedness of Drag Race fans who don't know the real world of drag, largely because a good deal of them are not even old enough to enter a bar (and get their drag knowledge from YouTube makeup tutorial videos).

But I guess Lady Bunny is not a credible source and is too "obscure".

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by Anonymousreply 176March 6, 2018 7:37 AM

r176 By that comment section, it seems Frauen have completely taken over drag fandom.

As someone who doesn't care about drag, that shouldn't bother, but it sort of does.

by Anonymousreply 177March 6, 2018 7:51 AM

I know far more straight girls that love Drag Race, and watch it religiously, than gay guys.

All fine and good, but that's as much as they know about the drag world. Drag Race is a TV show, first and foremost.

by Anonymousreply 178March 6, 2018 7:58 AM

The T want to be a cork in every bottle.

MtFs want to compete both in female beauty pageants and in male drag shows.

They want to be the only special unicorns who’re allowed to do both.

by Anonymousreply 179March 6, 2018 8:11 AM

It's a shame Ru caved. But I hope bio women start pushing their way into gay culture now so the rest of you gay men will finally wake up.

by Anonymousreply 180March 6, 2018 9:15 AM

r180 There already is a movement of "female" drag queens pushing for insertion in gay spaces, threatening us with being accused of misogyny if we don't let them.

by Anonymousreply 181March 6, 2018 9:21 AM

Drag has evolved. RuPaul didn't invent drag he just brought it to the masses. When RuPaul compared drag to punk rock, which is what,40 years old now, he is showing how out of date he is. If, as he claims, drag is a F. U to men dominate culture,. Well what's wrong with others getting in on that? Performing in drag should be entertaining. If it ain't entertaining who's gonna watch?

by Anonymousreply 182March 6, 2018 9:32 AM

Humiliating climbdown

As Pink News gleefully notes:

“The television personality has since apologised for the comments after being schooled on the importance of intersectionality by the likes of former contestants Courtney Act and Monica Beverly Hillz.”

“SCHOOLED “ a fucking 60-yr old Drag veteran p. THE premier drag queen in the world! These fucking people. Courtney Act needs something to happen to shim..something career ending. Same with some of these other twats

by Anonymousreply 183March 6, 2018 9:49 AM

The ire for rupaul is so absurd. These freaks (the trans and the trans-loving-fans) need to channel their rage somewhere else. Last season, he crowned Sasha Velour who didn't go ONE episode without saying the word "Queer" at least 10 times. And, btw, there was a ton of shade about that on social media... how wrapped up in her head she was about her "queer identity" - like gurl - bye... you are really not fun & we are over you. Still, Ru had her win.

Second, Peppermint was in the final four, and she "presents as a woman" in real life (even though that bish is a man).

I feel like giving into the freaks over the she-mail controversy was a huge mistake. Classic case of "You give an inch and now they want a mile." However, I think it may have been Logo or sponsors (?) that finally made this happen because Ru never saw any issue with she-mail.

by Anonymousreply 184March 6, 2018 10:40 AM

Incorporating transgender people into the gay rights movement has become a problem for many gay people since trans people started aggressively lobbying for their own rights.

And the more freedom all of us have, I have to be honest with you, the less I feel like I am a part of the LGBT *or* the gay community.

Is it time to rethink this movement overall?

I’ve written my feelings about this here before. I’ll be 40 this spring. I grew up in the 80s and 90s when it was perfectly fine for boys to bash my head into school bus windows and do all sorts of shit to me in plain sight from 7th grade through 12th grade without a single adult ever intervening. I was never closeted, but the way the world treated me, I tried to pinpoint exactly how I could kill myself without fucking up, and I accumulated pills throughout my youth for the time when I couldn’t take it one more day. I kept all this to myself. And it was against a backdrop of the AIDS epidemic, when being gay felt like a curse and a death sentence—yet it was my nature and I wasn’t ashamed. I did learn to distrust and resent most people.

I wrote and I drew and I painted—and I still do. The obviously gay men I saw on TV were oddballs, all of them creative or artistic, not in drag but otherwise multitalented people like Drag Race contestants. And I DID have a latent pride in “our tribe” because my notion of being gay was that our natures are simply different: we are observant, insightful and imaginative and creative beings.

Something happened after we started becoming acceptable. I don’t like what happened. The nonconformist, balls-out creativity vanished, replaced by the most conformist of all groups, this new gay ideal of young Adonises who have identical musclebound bodies, and who live to fuck and think it’s a source of pride and their right to bring fucking up in any situation—Adam Rippon at the Oscars in bondage gear, the people who tweeted that he is “representing.” Representing who? I am not ashamed of being gay, but I am honestly ashamed—disappointed is a better term—of what the idea of being gay has transformed into following our acceptance and integration. We are now ultra-conformists. Look at nearly every thread here, which worships random Instagram narcissists and criticizes the appearances of anyone who does not look like a model. Years ago on a forum like this there’d be an appreciation of art and artists of all sorts; now, that’s rare—it’s all appreciation of “hotness” or cruel remarks (as cruel as the names I was called throughout school that made me want to die—I mean that seriously) about less-than-perfect-looking people.

I feel more distant now from the “gay community” or the “LGBT community” than ever before. As 40 approaches, I am more self-confident and self-assured than ever. I am not ashamed of being gay. But I also don’t relate to the present culture of body worship and conformity at any cost. That is all to me contrary to the notion I held all my life about the nature of being gay. Nowadays I find I have much more in common with artsy straight men than I do with supplement-chugging, PrEP-and-cum taking gay men who seem only to live for the sake of lusting over young gymnast types and having sex. There IS so much more to life and nowadays even saying that makes me feel defensive, ready to be attacked by gay men, who simply don’t share my world view.

So my conclusion at this point is that there is no common gay or LGBT community. We were artificially glued together by oppression. With gayness now accepted for the most part, gay men overall show no sympathy whatsoever for trans people. Like our grandparents, gay men today think coming out as trans is an annoying fad and not truth. At this point I feel like to be true to myself I should withdraw from gay and LGBT subcultures because I am beginning to feel ashamed, not of who I am but because I feel shallow and guilty by association.

by Anonymousreply 185March 6, 2018 11:06 AM

Gay people are SO 2005. We're in 2018 now. Trans, non-binary, and gender non conforming people for the win. Get with the times.

by Anonymousreply 186March 6, 2018 12:03 PM

I'm so over militant trannies. They're ruining everything.

by Anonymousreply 187March 6, 2018 12:50 PM

[quote] I wasn’t ashamed.

Your self-loathing, sex negative post says otherwise. Please seek therapy.

by Anonymousreply 188March 6, 2018 12:52 PM

[quote]“SCHOOLED “ a fucking 60-yr old Drag veteran p. THE premier drag queen in the world! These fucking people.

Remember these same Twitter activists are unleashing all this shit on an openly gay black man who was born in the civil rights era and came of age during the gay liberation movement. And that means absolutely *nothing* to them.

by Anonymousreply 189March 6, 2018 12:57 PM

Because they are all about "cancelling" anyone and anything they don't like.

Twitter is becoming very fascist.

by Anonymousreply 190March 6, 2018 1:00 PM

First-world problem.

by Anonymousreply 191March 6, 2018 1:52 PM

Well, it is a little silly to say that cunts can't be on Drag Race.

Pretty much all I see are cunts.

But Ru was right. A woman is not doing drag. It may not be a binary world, but drag is a binary game. You declare on one side of the line or on the line, and if it's on the woman side, you're not doing drag.

Women, SJWs and the transnuts (as I fully support transgender rights, just not the foolish nastiness of some lunatic rads) just wait to pounce on anything that challenges their recreation of the world in their confused likenesses.

by Anonymousreply 192March 6, 2018 2:03 PM

Most women don’t care about tranny/drag infighting r192. We’ve got actual problems to deal with.

by Anonymousreply 193March 6, 2018 2:10 PM

Trannies have hijacked the gay rights movement and we all have to bear the brunt of the backlash they are causing.

by Anonymousreply 194March 6, 2018 2:19 PM

Thank you, R149. I'd thought it actually happened there. I never got to go and was super sad when they ended it. I never asked anyone why, but I came out rather late in life and really wasn't in the know.

by Anonymousreply 195March 6, 2018 2:23 PM

R188 inadvertently hit the nail on the head.

This mess started in the 1990s with the “sex positive” trend.

Silly me....I thought being “sex positive” meant having a healthy, as in not repressed, sex life. You know....like being out & proud instead of dangerous, shamefilling, anonymous hookups in parks & toilets.

But nope. The sex poz folks meant — be positive about freaky sex!!! Any kind of sex. Anything goes! Get your freak on! Everybody’s queer! No shame in fuck fetishes if you’re sex positive!!!

And you know what happened? “Sex” no longer meant bio sex. It now means fucking.

And since “sex” was changed to mean “fuck,” some people were embarrassed to talk about it! So “gender” became the euphemism for bio sex.

It replaced sex on driver’s licenses, birth certificates, passports, etc.

And then people invented genders to avoid sex role stereotypes!

It’s fucking crazy.

Show me one medical doctor who says it’s possible to change bio sex from male to female or vice versa.

Gender isn’t real. So of course it’s mutable. It means nothing! So it means anything!

by Anonymousreply 196March 6, 2018 6:20 PM

Nice and twisted headline

by Anonymousreply 197March 6, 2018 6:21 PM

[quote]R185 I’ve written my feelings about this here before...

[italic]No ! ! !

by Anonymousreply 198March 6, 2018 6:37 PM

Ru displayed some logic here. Transwomen are WOMEN. They identify as such. While drag queens are definition MEN dressed as women. So WOMEN being drag queens makes no sense. The whole point of this kind of drag is that you are dressing up and performing as the opposite of your life. Now if a TRANSMAN wants to be a drag queen, that is fine.

by Anonymousreply 199March 6, 2018 7:06 PM

A "trans man" is a female, R199.

A female can never be a female impersonator. She's the real thing.

by Anonymousreply 200March 6, 2018 11:40 PM

Reading this whole thread has given me a giant headache.

by Anonymousreply 201March 7, 2018 1:22 AM

It’s interesting that the trans community is now arguing that trans-women aren’t real women and should be allowed to compete on a show where men dress up like women. Their insistent need to complain about everything has them taking up a position that is contrary to everything they’ve always said in the past.

by Anonymousreply 202March 7, 2018 3:34 AM

LGB.

T

by Anonymousreply 203March 7, 2018 4:10 AM

The nerve of these little brats disrespecting RuPaul. They should all be kicked in the cunt.

by Anonymousreply 204March 7, 2018 4:44 AM

Agreed, R204, some of these self righteous millenial Miss Thangs need to get cunt punched for disrespecting Mama Ru. The nerve!

by Anonymousreply 205March 7, 2018 5:00 AM

Transwomen are transwomen. Women are women. And men in drag are men in drag.

Unfortunately people who believe the above is "literal" violence have all the power.

by Anonymousreply 206March 7, 2018 5:28 AM

And once again, the transgender community creates nothing.

They live to feed off of the hard work of gay men and lesbians.

by Anonymousreply 207March 7, 2018 5:34 AM

RuPaul was fighting for gay rights way back when these little SJWs were learning how to wipe their asses.

Show some respect, you ungrateful twats!

by Anonymousreply 208March 7, 2018 6:02 AM

I lost all respect for the trans community when they rewrote history and decided they were the true heroes of the Stonewall riots.

by Anonymousreply 209March 7, 2018 6:14 AM

In fact, today's Trans appropriated Transvestite's history.

They don't do the difference between a man dressing as a woman and a man believing he's a woman.

That's why those fuckers pretend to have invented everything about gay culture, cause they're appropriating something that is not theirs.

I hate those fuckers.

by Anonymousreply 210March 7, 2018 6:47 AM

Team RuPaul!

by Anonymousreply 211March 7, 2018 7:07 AM

R185, as your contemporary, I say excellent post! I identify WITH you, not AS you.

by Anonymousreply 212March 7, 2018 7:24 AM

LIKE YOU ALL GONNA DIE WITHOUT THIS STUPID RACE???!

by Anonymousreply 213March 7, 2018 8:18 AM

I loved the earlier seasons (through season 7), and i honestly wish iconic RuPaul would just cancel the show. It had already become too self-important and lost the surprising charm and heart that came with the originally intended parody style by season 8, but definitely season 9. Just the tone of the times that couldn’t help but seep in, especially with the heavy importance of social media to propelling the snow. It was a good run, Ru!

by Anonymousreply 214March 7, 2018 8:46 AM

I wouldn't laugh at that if I were you, Ms Twanz, R213. Not when trans claim pronouns are "responsible for the deaths of thousands an million and billions of trans women of color every day!!!1!!".

by Anonymousreply 215March 7, 2018 8:47 AM

Uh, no, Peppermint. Women have always been allowed to dress as women.

HuffPoUK:

Transgender 'Drag Race' Finalist Peppermint Addresses RuPaul Trans Controversy

'Unfortunately it won’t be the first or last time we will hear a woman can’t do something a man can.'

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 216March 7, 2018 3:57 PM

Since Peppermint isn’t a woman what the fuck is he whining about?

by Anonymousreply 217March 7, 2018 6:11 PM

R217 she is now, she fully transitioned after her season

by Anonymousreply 218March 7, 2018 6:13 PM

No r218, he may have had cosmetic surgery but that won’t make him a woman. It is impossible to change sex. Absolutely impossible.

by Anonymousreply 219March 7, 2018 6:18 PM

[quote]Fucking blue haired omni-pierced 17-yr-olds telling gay men to “educate yourself” about how “trans women invented drag”.

Remember when the blue haired ones were elderly women from the upper east side who went to weekday matinees and noisily & lengthily unwrapped their hard candies?

by Anonymousreply 220March 7, 2018 6:20 PM

[quote] ALL of the progressive media are already onboard

Which puts in context the 𝘰𝘵𝘩𝘦𝘳 stances of the "progressive media".

by Anonymousreply 221March 7, 2018 7:38 PM

A man pretending to be a woman pretending to be an even bigger woman????

by Anonymousreply 222March 7, 2018 7:58 PM

So when will the gays finally wake up and see how homophobic the TQs are?

by Anonymousreply 223March 7, 2018 8:22 PM

R223 We always knew it

by Anonymousreply 224March 7, 2018 9:20 PM

I mean in general, not just here at DL

Many gays and lesbians still support the TQs, certainly the younger generation

by Anonymousreply 225March 7, 2018 9:22 PM

R110 What you call "progressive media" I call idiot media.

by Anonymousreply 226March 7, 2018 9:28 PM

A writer at The Advocate called Ru an old fart.

by Anonymousreply 227March 8, 2018 8:34 PM

Who can be a drag queen? RuPaul's trans comments fuel calls for inclusion

The Drag Race host sparked anger after saying he would ‘probably not’ allow trans women on the reality show

Sam Levin in San Francisco, Thu 8 Mar 2018 04.00 EST

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 228March 8, 2018 11:10 PM

Christ, that lip sync wasn't even close.

Morgan is such a good sport about the cards she's dealt.

by Anonymousreply 229March 9, 2018 1:45 AM

^ Whoops, wrong Drag Race thread. There are so many now.

by Anonymousreply 230March 9, 2018 1:51 AM

Love you r75! Right on!

by Anonymousreply 231March 11, 2018 1:00 AM

Ru Paul has backed down, R75, See R216's link.

by Anonymousreply 232March 11, 2018 1:53 AM

[quote]Transwomen are transwomen. Women are women. And men in drag are men in drag. Unfortunately people who believe the above is "literal" violence have all the power.

r206, it's incredible that speaking such basic truth is now considered hate speech. And I have yet to find anyone who can explain to me what gender dysphoria has to do with homosexuality, and why they are combined into LGBT+++++++++++++

by Anonymousreply 233March 18, 2018 6:32 PM
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