"The Crown" Season 2 is hitting Netflix Dec 7th

Kewl. Foy is brilliant in the role.

What period does it cover?

Cannot wait!!

i thought each season covered a decade in her life.

I hate Claire Foy

Maybe I'll watch it when Olivia takes over.

I'll watch this with the sound off, I just ant to see the clothes. When it's Olivia 's turn, I'll put the volume back up.

Too bad because I really liked Foy as Anne Boleyn in Wolf Hall. It's just that so far her Elizabeth is not very interesting.

The Brits don't have a whole lot going for them, but they've master schlocky camp television. My boyfriend and I watch this like we watch John Waters films. It's so deliciously campy and melodramatic. Does anyone else feel that way or do you see it as a more serious production?

[quote]What period does it cover?

The 1960s because JFK and Jackie make a visit to the Palace.

I like Olivia Colman, but I don't see her playing the Queen. Olivia has that "gummy" smile that doesn't look like the Queen at all.

I hope they get Samantha Spiro to play Margaret.

Well I'm watching for Prince Phillip.Damn he looks good! I guess Margaret's wild ways and her reckless behavior will dominate much of the storyline. Steamy sex with Antony Armstrong Jones. I wonder how much attention his closeted Gay lifestyle will get.

Is Phillip supposed to be well endowed? In a deleted scene there was a reference to that.

[quote]“And then after that there was another scene where we’re walking out from the corridor with the valet and [the director] said, ‘I want you to do something where we get an idea of, he’s well endowed,’ as you’re walking down the corridor. We sort of played with it again and then we just sort of walked out of there and looked at each other and went, “Bloody hell!”

"We sort of played with it again...?" Bloody hell, indeed.

Well the Queen's not really a smiley person so I'm not worried about that. I am interested in how Colman does her voice. The actress has a kind of high-pitched, quavery voice and she speaks fast. Actually, the Queen has the same except I've only heard her speeches in which she speaks veeeerry slowly and distinctly.

[quote]Is Phillip supposed to be well endowed?

Well, most rulers ARE 12 inches, aren't they?

Okay, according to this article, HM has been watching 'The Crown' with Edward and Sophie. I find that so unbelievable, but it's amazing to contemplate.

The biggest problem for me looking ahead is that there's just not much drama in the queen's life in the Sixties and Seventies. Not much happens to her until Diana comes along in 1981 to add lots of unhappiness to the royal family.

I guess we'll have Philip's philandering and Margaret's crazy relationship with Anthony Armstrong-Jones; but what else happens to the royal family between 1957 and 1964? Not much. I don't think any of them even dies.

I would have liked them to add something more thrilling, but since Claire Foy never dramatically says, "Now I'm going to have to fuck your brains out" to one of her prime ministers in that preview I guess that's not going to happen.

They can't start completely making shit up just to make it dramatic. No one expects 100% accuracy out of a drama, but it has to stay fairly true to life.

But the problem is, if they're just going to cover 6 years of her life and they were pretty boring years, what will they do to make it interesting?

I guess they're also going to cover the Macmillan/Profumo scandal too.

But everything has been fictionalized. No one can possibly know what Margaret and Elizabeth or Phillip and Elizabeth said to one another. And I believe a lot of it was manufactured for the series. Do I believe Philip may have cheated or flirted? Yes, very possibly. But I really don't believe he was a wild ass with women. I think he was truly protective of his wife and his children and he was the head of that household. She was Queen, but he was head of the family. Maybe after Charles & Anne were born he had a fling, but He was a dutiful husband, IMO. He was disgusted with Margaret's behavior. That was well known. I know. Phillip was devilishly handsome. I'm sure there was no shortage of women who would have thrown themselves in his path. But I don't believe he would seriously jeopardize his good fortune. He was a penniless young man from a loony family. He was beyond grateful for the life he had with her.

I have to wonder about the trope where the husband of the higher placed woman is unhappy and angry and finds his life purposeless. There are some men in this world who would be fine with a wife who was Queen of England. he'd live in seven different palaces, and wouldn't even have to put toothpaste on his toothbrush. If he really really insisted they would find someone to wipe his ass.

As for his purpose, shit, he has plenty to chose from. He can do the military, he can get into agriculture overseeing management of the estates, he can breed and race horses along side his wife. I mean there's no end to the things he can devote his time and energy. We are not talking about rocket scientists. He wasn't a barrister or an engineer. Hell he could have gone off and designed furniture like Armstrong Jones.

My point is he had a wonderful life handed to him on a platter. It wasn't as if this all was a surprise to him. He knew exactly what he was getting into when he went round to meet Princess Elizabeth. He knew he would walk ten steps behind her and she was Queen. But the movies and the TV shows and the media, magazine writers, etc.etc.etc. always go for the cliche' "I'm the man. I need to be in charge of stuff and if you don't let me run things I'll go wild and chase women."

^ you're right. If they had problems it really shouldn't have been that.

Who plays Phillip opposite Olivia?

R20 Jim J. Bullock.

R21, I love you.

But it happens r17, men can have fragile and insecure egos where they feel like they are supposed to be the head of the household. And you seem to be overlooking the story did not even take place in 2017, but in the 1950s when that mindset was even more rampant.

R23 = Angry lez

Olivia who?

[quote]As for his purpose, shit

Wow, that's my purpose as well!

R23, I agree. But in the particular case of Phillip, he was a penniless third rate nobleman and he knew Elizabeth was heir to the throne of the UK. So all the melodrama they seem to highlight in The Crown, is IMO a bit much, and perhaps an exaggeration to create dramatic tension. That's all.

I al so meant to add that for probably the first time in his life, Phillip had some choices in terms of how he could spend his life and what he wanted to do with it. He was Consort, yes, but was happy to marry and serve a monarch. He lived well, he had a specific role to play, but he also had more choices about how he could spend his life than he had before he hooked up with the House of Windsor. For Philip a desperate, pointless purposeless life fraught with economic uncertainty, and the prospect of being some serial gigolo on the Riviera escorting rich heiresses, was looming large in his future. Thanks to Dickie Mountbatten, he was rescued. I don't think he was too resistant to that and the life it afforded him. Especially when he saw the privation his Greek countrymen were experiencing in the aftermath of WW II.

While it's true that Elizabeth II survived the 1960s without any scandals, it was the most tumultuous decade in British culture since the 17th century. I'm sure there were plenty of events that can be explored through the Queen's perspective.

The first season's episode about Churchill's portrait and the end of his political career was probably the ,most riveting in the season and it wasn't about the Queen at all.

I'm in it for Margaret's shenanigans

I guess I don't really care about any of them, and I don't care about the 60's as it pertains to the British monarchy. The fact is, and this is just my opinion, the most interesting scandals happened when Edward 8th abdicated and the entire scandal surrounding him and Mrs Simpson, and then WW II. It seems to me better effort could've been spent digging into that. I really can't think of anything that focused on the Royal family in that era. We had The King's Speech, and the abdication crisis was peripheral to that, but really, from day one of Edward meeting Wallis, and the dynamics within the family, the other brothers, Bertie & Elizabeth, etc. none of that has really been done the way it ought to be. And Dickie Mountbatten was a schemer and a fuck up, close friend of Edward 8th, when he was still Prince of Wales, and the he fucked up in India too. There is so much really rich, scandalous gossip and history in that era, that generation before The Crown takes place, I wish they had decided to do that instead. Because the further away from that era they get, the less exciting and interesting it is.

I find the Royals fascinating. It must be like living inside a very posh snow-globe. HM got to experience what it was like to be 'normal' (incognito) at the end of WWII.

[quote]For commoners, V-E Day represented a reprieve from years of rationing and penny-pinching, notes the BBC. The motto “make do and mend” was only the tip of the iceberg for a country that withstood thousands of casualties and half a million destroyed homes during the war. When word of the German surrender reached England, May 8 was designated the official day of celebration, and revelers packed every street. Mount reports that 19-year-old Elizabeth and her sister, 15-year-old Princess Margaret, begged King George VI and mother Queen Elizabeth to join the fun. They agreed they could leave the palace at 9 p.m., but only if the girls went with a 16-person entourage.

[quote]“We were terrified of being recognized,” the Queen recalled later. She wore her Auxiliary Territorial Service uniform to avoid being spotted by the crowd. All around her, people were linking arms and walking down the street “swept along on a tide of happiness and relief.” Margaret Rhodes, who was with the entourage that night, remembers Elizabeth and her companions doing the conga through the front door of the “stuffy and formal” Ritz — an impromptu move that did not sit well with every guest. “As one congaed, though, eyebrows were raised,” she recalled.

[quote]A member of the entourage recalls being “picked up by a naval officer” and kissed, writes Mount, and another was astonished at the kissing, hugging, and lovemaking that surrounded them on the streets. A highlight of the night was when the girls were able to watch their parents appear on the balcony of Buckingham Palace (one of eight total appearances that day) as spectators, not participants.

Looking at r32's picture, I know see where Pat Birch got the ending for Grease.

You know they are singing "We go together, like rama-lama-lama, ka-dinkety-ding-dee dong."

For R32

Here's a documentary on the Princess Elizabeth's night out...

I hope Claire Foy doesn't play the queen quite as frightened this season. She always looked like a deer in the headlights.

Given how grateful Philip should have been for being rescued from gigolohood on the French Riviera, it was amazing to me he cheated on his wife as much as he did in the 50s and early 60s. No one in the UK denies that (even among their close friends).

I am curious as to whether they will hint at the rumors "Porchie" (the Earl of Caernarvon, the queen's best male friend) fathered Prince Andrew, who looks more like him than he does like the Windsors or the Mountbattens.

Some new stuff... she looks a bit frightened in some places and tougher in others.

It looks like they're covering her trip to Ghana, where she charmed Kwame Nkrumah.

She specifically asked to visit an American Supermarket during one of her visits to the US. This was after she attended a college football match, also at her request.

but did she tailgate?

R37 Was she down with the swirl?

In Ghana, she discovered the other meaning of "BBC."

R40, R41, Unlike some of the other Royals, HM has never shown any evidence of racism. I'm not particularly a fan of monarchy in general, but I do have a lot of respect for HM.

Matthew Goode is playing Lord Snowdon:

I can’t wait to see what happens next!

Well, I just re-watched the first season, and it ends with Philip going off to Australia for the Olympics and then a tour. He'll be gone for months.

Below are the sites of the first Olympic Games. Why would PP go to Australia?

Sites of the Summer Olympic Games:

1896 - Athens, Greece.

1900 - Paris, France.

1904 - St. Louis, Missouri USA.

1906 - Athens, Greece

He wasn't alive for those four Olympics, r46.

The 1956 Summer Olympics were held in Melbourne Australia.

It is live.

I want to watch the Kennedy episode, but will watch in Order.

Just started second season. God, I love this show.

r7, the Queen is not known for smiling so this shouldn't be a problem.

There is no warmth in Foy's Elizabeth and I think that's a mistake. We've seen video clips of the real queen with her family sort of behind the scenes and she could be quite down to earth and quite funny. One thing I am looking forward to is the Profumo Scandal while McMillan is Prime Minister. I think that happened in the 60's. Sex parties, call girls, drugs Russian spies, it was quite something. Also had nothing to do with the Royal Family. Salacious stuff though.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

THE CROWN compares and contrasts Armstrong Jones' view of Margaret with that of court insider Cecil Beaton. Here's Beaton's Margaret, ca. 1957.

Margaret had that special "something"--a magical presence and dark beauty--that none of the other Royals had. It didn't last long for Margaret, though. She wore middle-age badly.

It wasn't until Diana that any Royal approached that level of provocative, singular beauty again.

Candid photo of Margaret in 1944. Even when she was very young, there was something inherently sophisticated, dark, even hard about her.

Can’t understand the phenomena success of this series. It’s soooooo dull! And this is from one who is a history tragic and expected to love it....

I got about halfway through the first season - and it was the ultimate in meh.

The heavyhanded foreshadowing about Philip's sister...put down the anvil, show.

Matthew Goode is so hot , any gossip about him?

R58 it can be slow but it smolders. It allows us to see the subtle things the Queen had to do to retain her position.

The second season has gotten excellent reviews

Not slow or dull at all and I find Claire Foy quite affecting.

Margaret’s by far the most interesting character.

I still want the actor who plays Tommy inside me quite deeply-he has the sexiest eyes. I gather the actor is a actually bald.

I'm seven episodes into the second season. I thought the Philip-in-Australia arc that comprised the first 3 episodes could have easily been done in two. The season does pick up after that, though. Episodes 4-7 have been quite good. Still, I think the series might have been better if it had been made 10-15 years later, once Philip and Elizabeth are dead. That would have given the showrunners a bit more room to run with the melodrama. Watching the narrative gymnastics they performed to avoid directly showing Philip committing adultery in those first three episodes was hilarious and frustrating.

I assume the show will stop the coyness once it's no longer concerned with Philip and Elizabeth's sex lives. They've been pretty frank about the vagaries of Margaret and Antony's relationship, and Charles/Camilla/Diana will provide plenty of juicy stuff for seasons 3-5. No point playing coy there, when all of the scandals were raked over in the papers repeatedly.

[quote]Still, I think the series might have been better if it had been made 10-15 years later, once Philip and Elizabeth are dead.

10-15 years? With Megs Markle marrying into the family, I don't think it will be that long. Megs will wear a wedding dress that emphasizes her cleavage and both of them will keel over in shock.

Just started season 2 last night and so far have found it to be weaker than season 1. The first season was more episodic; this one feels like a typical badly-paced Netflix show. One episode merges into the next for a very tedious effect.

I disagree, I found the first episode riveting. I love Claire Foy too. She was excellent.

R66, I agree that the first three episodes seem like one overlong episode. After that, it becomes more episodic and the pace improves considerably.

I really miss John Lithgow's gravitas as Churchill, though.

I can’t help but get the feeling that Stephen Daldry REALLY enjoyed directing the episode with the very beautiful pre pubescent boy playing Philip in flashbacks.

The Mrs. Kennedy and King Edward-was-a-big- fucking-Nazi episodes are far and away the best.

The 2 Margaret focused eps were my fave

You really feel sorry for Margaret.

I don't feel sorry for her. As Elizabeth points out late in the season, Margaret relishes her titles and money but doesn't want to do the work and follow the rules the titles and money entail. She could have been Mrs. Peter Townsend, but she chose the Royal Life instead. Once making that choice, she could have married a Nice Young Man who knew the score and would have let her, discreetly, have lovers while they maintained a pleasant marriage and working relationship. She chose the neurotic bisexual artist, with all his baggage.

This was even more true in real life, where by all accounts Margaret was a toxic bitch. Who COULD have married Peter Townsend AND had the money and titles, but ended the relationship anyway. Most of her misery seems self-created.

[quote] R64: Still, I think the series might have been better if it had been made 10-15 years later, once Philip and Elizabeth are dead.

Oh, it will be, of course.

When does Ryan Murphy's Charles/Diana Feud start?

I'm struggling to get through the second episode. Suez Canal is no Wallis Simpson.

The early episodes of Season 2 have been a huge disappointment and, even more frustrating, they actually repeat the entire Episode 1 prologue with Elizabeth and Phillip talking on the yacht in Episode 3. As in, it's the exact same scene.

I'm so excited for the Diana years. I don't know who the fuck they will cast.

Vanessa Kirby is so magnetic... she has the X FACTOR.

2 is the weakest one r75. Episodes 4 and 5 were great.

I was going to stop there, but maybe one more....

Margaret is needy, insecure and incredibly spoiled. Talk about an entitled prig who gives everyone a bad name. Are we supposed to feel sorry for her? What an empty life she led. I won't give away too much, but I was taken by one scene when Philip was talking about chairing the World Wildlife Fund and doing meaningful things. Shit. Margaret had everything going for her and she could have had an enormous impact. Yes, she was young, but she was still an over-indulged needy little shit.

In real life Margaret was the most unpopular member of the family, did the least amount of work and constantly engaged in embarrassing behavior.

Prince Philip really was a rake! I had no idea that the public had any idea there were troubles. He almost doesn't fit as a guy who would have an affair with a ballerina. The wild parties on the yacht I can see. Elizabeth really has tolerated a lot.

I've only watched Episode 1 from Season 1. Will give the episode 2 a look tonight.

It's too bad that they have already used the actress who played the waitress in the club that meets with Mrs. Parker. She would have made a perfect Diana.

R82, they will probably bring her back to play adult Diana.

In episode 2, when they show the locker room on the ship, one of the men has a tattoo on his back. Did men get tattoos on their back in the late 1950s? And I'm surprised we've been through 83 responses and nobody has rated the man's naked ass!

[quote]they will probably bring her back to play adult Diana.

But we'll already know her as the hooker who broke up Mrs. Parker's marriage.

r85, it won't matter. They are recasting the main roles with new actors who look nothing like the previous ones (Olivia Colman and Claire Foy are nothing alike), so the waitress could come back as adult Diana in a few years.

[quote]In episode 2, when they show the locker room on the ship, one of the men has a tattoo on his back. Did men get tattoos on their back in the late 1950s? And I'm surprised we've been through 83 responses and nobody has rated the man's naked ass!

I just ran the scene again in slow motion and the guy has a tattoo on his ass!! Was he the only actor willing to strip down?

[quote]so the waitress could come back as adult Diana in a few years.

When she's in the lawyers office, they do a full on shot of her face and she looks a lot like a young Diana.

Love this series but too much whiny Philip in season 2.

Damn, that family is fucked up.

There's no way Philip was into that much. I think he got painted as a rake from being in the company of Michael Parker who definitely was a rake. I'm not saying he never cheated. But he was not nearly as wild and obvious as he is depicted in this fictionalized version of the Royal Family. They could have never kept that quiet, and believe me aside from the dust up surrounding Michael Parker's divorce and his silly letters, there was not much on Philip. I think there was an assumption that because he was so good looking and such an exotic bird for the stuffy Royals, he had to be cheating on dumpy Elizabeth.

I wonder if Philip, being 5 months away from Elizabeth, had a fluffer on board ship? Maybe one of the navymen secretly serviced him.

I thought Michael C Hall was an awful choice for JFK. It didn't work at all for me.

Elizabeth in the movie has got the handbag thing down pat, at a real early age.

I am bothered by the time warp. She was queen when I was born and I’m now an eldergay and retired and she & Phillip are still alive and working. How is that possible?

[quote]How is that possible?

I ask that question a lot

God, was Margaret a total lush or what? She's drinking in almost every scene.

r97, drinking, smoking and fucking were things she excelled at.

Like the punchline to the old joke goes, had Margaret been here we could have saved the Bently.

So if there is to be a new Margaret in Season 3 will there be a new Tony Armstrong-Jones? That seems deeply unfair to Matthew Goode. I was looking forward to seeing him as Tony in bed with a West End rent boy played by Ashley Day.

I hope Francesca Annis gets to play Margaret in Season 5 and 6 before she gets killed off.

I want Samantha Spiro as the next Margaret.

[quote]Elizabeth in the movie has got the handbag thing down pat, at a real early age.

I don't understand the handbag thing. Was it her security blanket? In every scene where she meets the Prime Minister, her handbag is sitting at her feet. Why would she need to carry around a purse in her own house? Was she afraid one of the butlers was going to look inside it?

[quote]God, was Margaret a total lush or what? She's drinking in almost every scene.

And smoking. Margaret was a very heavy smoker and drinker which left her in poor health as she aged.

Margaret was useless. It was Anthony Armstrong Jones who gave substance to her personality but in general, her behavior changed very little fro the time she was in her 20's until she died. And she was a lush all her life. Actually she was a bit ahead of her time because she was the epitome of EuroTrash, a term than gained prominence in the 60's and 70's. The people she knew were a lot like the guy she was almost engaged to and dumped after he got into a fight, Billy. Useless rich titled drunks. And then she met the Armstrong Jones crowd and they are similar along with a sprinkling of artists and counterculture types. Margaret would have been famous for being famous had she not been a member of the Royal family. She would have fit right in with the Princess Grace crowd.

How did Margaret's party lifestyle change as she got older? I can understand in her 20s and 30s partying with the young crowd all night. But when you hit your 40s, nobody wants an old drunk around. Were the parties she attended people she had always partied with who were her own age? Did having a family slow her down?

I think the waitress looked a lot like Christine Keeler. In fact I was wondering if she was her? I know they touch on the Profumo affair. I have only watched 3 episodes and I love it. Each is like a movie.

The episode about Phillip’s childhood was incredible. I love season 2.

Who is the actress (the Diana lookalike) who played the waitress?

R100, Samantha Spiro would be ludicrous casting as Margaret. For starters she’s about 5’1”. Vanessa Kirby is statuesque.

[quote]Samantha Spiro would be ludicrous casting as Margaret. For starters she’s about 5’1”.

Margaret spent her later years in a wheelchair. What's your point?

Why are they recasting the main players anyway? They can just give them prosthetics and makeup to show age. It will be disastrous for this show if the actors we have come to love in the roles are replaced.

The actor who played Edward was absolutely perfect.

Season 2 improves greatly after episode 3.

Alex Jennings as David/Edward has been my MVP in this series. He's simply incredible. He's really distinguishing himself in these royal portrayals.

This season was not as compelling as last years, but that episode about Philip's childhood was of the best of the entire series.

[QUOTE] Margaret relishes her titles

She actually only had one title prior to her marriage, is this series saying something other? She was a Princess of The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. In another time she might have also been a Princess of Saxe Coburg Gotha and Duchess in Saxony, but after WWI they abandoned those.

[quote] R104: But when you hit your 40s, nobody wants an old drunk around.

Well, she was the sister to the Queen, though. That’s almost as big a deal as it gets.

The Kennedy episode was very good.

The actress who played Jackie will never work again.

[R106] The foreshadowing for the sister was SO annoying though

I couldn’t disagree more. This is a fantastic season, and although I’ll miss Claire Foy, I look forward to Olivia Colman coming in. She’s one of the great British actresses and will bring even more acting brilliance to this series. The episode detailing Wallis and Edward’s treasonous Nazi treachery was shocking and very well done. I loved this season.

[quote]The actress who played Jackie will never work again.

She was better at playing Jackie than MCH was at playing Kennedy.

R118, oh I love Olivia Colman too. I just finished the third season of Broadchurch and love that show. (IMO, season three was the best.) She and Tennant are great together; hope they do another round.

[quote]She and Tennant are great together; hope they do another round.

I think Season 3 was the end of Broadchurch. Both DT and OC have very busy careers and the show just didn't get the traction that it had in Season 1. Season 2 sucked and Season 3 couldn't return the magic.

She's a champion Numberwang! player as well, r120.

R121, yeah season 2 was terrible, so I was pleasantly surprised by season 3. Too bad they won't do any more. Actually, I'm surprised they did 3 after 2 got such bad reviews.

"Oh look, you already have a Princess."

"That's Tony Richardson"

bwhahahahahahaha.

Who would make a better Camilla, Ed Sheeran in drag or Russell Brand in drag?

I'm not really big on studying the royals...I gave up after a few episodes. Unless they cut off someone's head or had a parylizing speech impediment or something, they weren't very interesting or dramatic people (perhaps a result of inbreeding). They just don't face very many extraordinary issues in their regimented, pampered, isolated lives.

[quote] There's no way Philip was into that much. I think he got painted as a rake from being in the company of Michael Parker who definitely was a rake. I'm not saying he never cheated. But he was not nearly as wild and obvious as he is depicted in this fictionalized version of the Royal Family. They could have never kept that quiet, and believe me aside from the dust up surrounding Michael Parker's divorce and his silly letters, there was not much on Philip.

Actually they did keep it quiet. The British media kept a lot of things about the entire Royal Family quiet over the centuries. They wouldn't even report that Edward was dating Wallace Simpson. It was reported about all over the entire world, except England, Ireland, Scotland and Wales. The general public hadn't heard about her until he abdicated the throne. The same was true about Prince Phillip. There were a lot of media reports in America about him cheating on Queen Elizabeth. They just weren't reported on in the UK.

[quote]Actually they did keep it quiet. The British media kept a lot of things about the entire Royal Family quiet over the centuries.

That's actually dramatized in Episode 3. The chief of staff comes in to speak to Elizabeth about the Parker divorce. He says, "A paper in Baltimore is saying...." The point is that the papers outside the UK had the details and often forced the British press to report on things they otherwise wouldn't.

[quote] Unlike some of the other Royals, HM has never shown any evidence of racism. I'm not particularly a fan of monarchy in general, but I do have a lot of respect for HM

That's cute. I had a good chuckle when reading that. She may not have shown any evidence in public (and really did you expect her to? she's never complained about anything) , but she sure as hell never employed anyone of another race or colour. In recent years she did hire one black person and another person with Indian or Pakistani heritage. It's almost 2018 and she employs 2 people of colour. She is really breaking down barriers

^^^she gets points for her grandson marrying a half black woman though!

The episodes covering Phillip's whoring around the globe bored me to tears.

On the other hand, the Nazi episode was fascinating.

Looking forward to the Profumo scandal.

I think this season they use the flashback technique a bit too much. I'm tired of seeing after the opening credits roll, "5 months earlier" or "One Month Earlier". How about not giving us the ending before we see how events play out?

I think the Duke of Windsor episode was the best this season, they really laid it out how entrenched he was with Germany during the war. He and Wallis were absolutely vile people.

Just watched episodes four and five tonight. Fantastic!!!

On another note, I've decided I'm going to start eating at my dining room table again, rather than scoffing my meals on the couch like a pig at the trough. Maybe I'll even break out the Waterford!

By the time I finish this season I'll probably be wearing my pearls to the grocery store. I want to be CIVILIZED again dammit!

r134 the Queen and Prince Philip actually eat dinner on trays in front of the tv when they don't have any duties to attend to in the evening.

The Queen's study (aka "tv room") at Balmoral. I love that she has a space heater that costs £20 in the fireplace!

R135... Hmmm, this is true. I saw a lot of breakfast scenes in the past two episodes though with them eating at the dining room table. I'm going to bust out my egg cups tomorrow morning.

What is it with their prop people and breakfast scenes? There is one scene where Elizabeth is eating alone and the toast holder has 6 toast halves. Does she really eat 3 slices of bread at breakfast?

Interesting how Philip was sucker punched by the bit of crumpet who really wanted a serious interview. It may have foreshadowed the Thursday affair but it gave great backstory exposition to Philip.

Also, the letters patent regarding him as THE Prince Philip of the United Kingdom raised him back to the status of Royal Prince born which he had to relinquish as a royal prince born of Greece and Denmark prior to his marriage. The remark about being outranked by his son was telling that Elizabeth was aware of none of his grievances while he was systematically being tortured by the courtiers. Good for him and the look from the throne he cast at them.

[Quote]There is one scene where Elizabeth is eating alone and the toast holder has 6 toast halves.

Ha, I noticed the same thing!! "Here's your binge breakfast, Your Majesty. The Jar of Nutella is on its way."

I'm sad that Matthew Goode is aging. He is/was so beautiful, even with a slightly weak chin. He looked a little sickly.

[quote] she gets points for her grandson marrying a half black woman though!

No. She gets nothing for that. She didn't have a choice in the matter. Harry is worth over £38 million. So is William. They can both do what ever they want. If the Queen even tried to give Harry a hard time, he'd have become a private citizen immediately. And William would have been right behind him

William would not have gone private. He’s going to be king, dear.

In case you haven't noticed, William has always seemed to give very few fucks about about that r143. He has tried to live his own life and does as few royal engagements as he can get away with.

Episode 5 gives us the actress who should play Camilla Parker-Bowles. Anne Lambton.

The last four episodes from Kennedy on were very moving. The scene with Elizabeth and Jackie was quite sad.

God, MacMillan’s wife was a CUNT.

He’s not going to abdicate.

I saw a quick peek at the season trailer, it looks like there’s a sequence where HM crowns an ermine robed Prince Philip with the gilded coronet of a royal duke?

THAT NEVER HAPPENED!

He wore that getup one time only, his wife’s coronation. I don’t even expect the coronet to be placed on his coffin. Since he’s a proud naval officer I’m imagining his navy hat and his sword only.

Does anyone know where episode five is filmed? I'm talking about the castle on the lake. I'm assuming that's supposed to be Balmoral, but Balmoral is on a river, not a lake. Is there another castle that the royals own up there?

It looks like the same castle they used to film Victoria & Abdul, as well as the Victoria movie with Judi Dench.

How fabulous would it be if they got Helen Mirren to reprise her role as the Queen in later seasons?

[quote]How fabulous would it be if they got Helen Mirren to reprise her role as the Queen in later seasons

I mean isn't this what everyone assumes will happen? She is the logical choice.

The same guy who is heading up The Crown was also the writer for The Audience and even acknowledges in the end credits that this show is inspired by that one. I have no doubt he'll use his influence and if Mirren is free and feels like playing the role again, she'll do it.

Was there a ceremony at BP where the letters patent made Philip THE Prince Philip of the UK? It styled him a British blood royal prince. Loved the Matt Smith stink-eye at the courtiers.

Some of the casting is dreadful. The actress who played Jacqueline was appalling. Michael C. Hall had none of the charisma or confidence of JFK. And the Kennedy episode would have been much more interesting if they had covered some of the history of Joseph P’s failed Ambassadorship.

When I saw the boy cast as young Philip, with his pouting pillowy lips, I though that Bryan Singer must have directed the episode. The homoeroticism was dialed to 11 throughout that whole episode, which was dragged out to a interminable degree.

If you've seen photos of the young Philip, that kid looked a lot like him.

The woman who plays the QM is too thin. HMQM was a bit rounder...

"She's fat and common and looks like a cook!"

THAT'S how she should have been cast.

Jo Brand would've been a DELIGHTFUL Queen Mother!

[quote] God, MacMillan’s wife was a CUNT.

Hilariously so. The excellent British stage actress Sylvestra LeTouzel was having a grand old time as Dorothy Macmillan relishing her jolly nastiness to her husband--it was one of my favorite bits in the whole series. Usually when the characters in this series are being genuinely nasty (like Vanessa Kirby as Margaret or Pip Torrens as Tommy Lascelles), they basically turn their eyebrows downward and scowl and look evil. But LeTouzel's Dorothy Macmillan said every completely rotten thing to her husband with a jolly smile, as if she were entirely innocent of what a mean and horrible person she really is.

Dorothy McMillan washing her feet in that scene made me throw up in my mouth a little. The actress was excellent, though.

I wonder who will play Maggie Thatcher in Season 4.

When Margaret was storming around her suite I couldn't help thinking about Carol Burnett.

Carrying this comment over

[quote]One of the themes for the season is that marriage is pretty horrible. Almost none of the marriages depicted are happy: Elizabeth and Philip, Mike and Irene Parker, Harold Macmillan and wife, JFK and Jackie, Mountbatten and a... in most of them the partners loathe each other (the queen's marriage is the most functional and even it is unhappy). And of course Margaret's marriage to Lord Snowden is going to be the most miserable of all (although they don;t know it fully yet).

I was thinking that too as I watched this season. I mean it is accurate that all of these marriages had so much trouble, but yes watching this season does not make one in a rush to get married.

[quote] I wonder who will play Maggie Thatcher in Season 4.

Oh, I couldn't possibly consider it. I don't know how I would fit it into my schedule. But if they can find roles for Mamie and Grace, then I might just take a peek at the script. But really, I am not like Dame Helen Mirren. I rarely go back to roles that I've already assayed.

I was surprised to see an American played Billy Graham because his accent was all over the place. There are enough videos of Graham preaching that the actor should have been able to pick up the North Carolina accent.

I agree that Victoria Hamilton doesn't look like the Queen Mother, but her monologue at the end of Episode 5, when they are getting ready to meet the commoners, was perfect. She really nailed it.

She’s doesn’t appear to be old enough, and she’s not fat enough. Even the hair isn’t right, the QM didn’t wear her hair in such a tight fussy style, it had more volume.

She’s really very poor casting as the QM. Only bad casting choice on this.

I've finished the season now, and I enjoyed the middle episodes most. Episodes 1-3 were too drawn out and boring, and Episodes 8-10 were BLEAK. That shot at the end of Episode 9, with poor lonely Charles peering out his bedroom window, knowing he has five more fucking years at that horrible school, really got to me. (Though I suppose it does set up his emotional impoverishment issues well, which will be an important plot point in later seasons.)

I was also irritated at how they again talked around and around Philip's adultery in Episode 10. If they can't face his adultery head on, I'm not sure why they made it such a major plot point. Overall, I feel like the lesson of Season 2 is that Philip is, and always has been, an emotionally constipated dickhead.

I'm looking forward to future seasons, where we can concentrate on actual, documented scandals and quit worrying about Philip and Elizabeth's sex lives, which the series will never address in an honest manner. I also think Olivia Colman will bring more gravitas to Elizabeth, and give the series a dramatic anchor Season 2 was missing because of the departure of Lithgow as Churchill.

Margret was not "statuesque" she was short, and as she approached middle age, a bloated drunk and a pill popper. As for her partying? It never stopped and sometimes she partied with people her own age who led empty dissolute lives, and other times she partied with a younger set. She loved to be around celebrities and music people and Mick Jagger was often part of the set. It was a pretty tacky bunch.

What is the deal with Philips' cock? I'm not picturing anything worth writing home to Mother about.

In a cut scene from season 1 they implied Philip was well-endowed.

R153 Philip was made Prince Philip in Feb., 1957 but I can't find any evidence of a lavish ceremony.

For fun, here's newsreel of Philip giving a speech about his 4-month cruise.

I love Clare Foy but she lacks warmth. The real Elizabeth is warm in private and quite funny and chatty. I wonder if the portrayal of her as tightly wound is an interpretation that centers on her need to be perfect and do everything right and show discipline. As for the QM? Ugh. I cannot stand that actress. I've seen her in other pieces and she's repulsive to me. She has a face like a pug, and always looks rather pitiful. Especially trouncing around the Scottish country side. And those fucking sweaters? really? The QM would never run around B'ham Palace or Clarence house in a skirt and a cardigan.. Earrings! Caftans! She needs to be plumper, more smiley., and haughtier in just the right way. Under her veneer of elegance there needs to be a cold lethal hard woman, especially when it comes to her brother-in-law the Traitor. The real QM was always elegantly turned out, a bit haughty in a comic way, and delightfully anachronistic.

I thought Clare Foy struck the perfect balance. She is personable, warm and very family-oriented in some scenes.

BTW, the scenes about Philip as a young man were interesting.

Will add that I do believe the QM and Tommy Lascelles did everything they could to box Elizabeth in and provide structure and "guidance" to maniipulate her in the earlier years. I believe it took a while for Elizabeth to begin to resist that and understand the game.

I thought Claire Foy was a little overpraised last season, but I thought her work was excellent in this season. She really blossomed into this role.

The Edward VIII episode with the Nazis made some absolutely damning accusations. I don't buy for a second that he was keen on Germans bombing his own people into submission. It's disgusting propaganda. Is peter Morgan jewish?

There was no investiture. Philip was made a Prince of the U.K. and that was that. Years later there was an investiture for Charles when he was presented to he Welsh people as POW. He had already been POW for years though. It was just a fancy show.

Ever see Charles’ princely coronet? Weird looking but I sort of like it.

Perhaps you should actually research the facts instead of flying off with unnecessary anti-semitism r177.

Directly from the telegrams released

[quote]“Duke believes with certainty that continued heavy bombing will make England ready for peace,” the telegram states.

r177, yes Peter Morgan is Jewish.

r179, that memo was sent by a NAZI OPERATIVE. Obvious propaganda to try to divide Britain from within. And yet Peter Morgan had Lascelles say it was the truth.

[quote]The Edward VIII episode with the Nazis made some absolutely damning accusations. I don't buy for a second that he was keen on Germans bombing his own people into submission. It's disgusting propaganda. Is peter Morgan jewish?

They did show pictures at the end of that episode that shows how close Edward was with Hitler. I have no doubt that Edward would have sold the British people out for his own gain. It happens today. Barack Obama handing Iran nukes, Bill Clinton allowing North Korea to get nukes. They will sell out their own people for personal gain.

R177, surely you jest? It is a proven fact and it happened. This is the one segment in the series that was fictionalized very little. The Duke of Windsor did consort with the Nazis and there is documentation of it. That is why he was "assigned" to be governor general of the Bahamas. They wanted him away from the War and the Germans who had planned to "kidnap" him and hold him hostage until after the German victory, and then install him as leader of the UK. That and the visits and meetings with Hitler and the leading members of his government absolutely happened. And he saw the Luftwaffen attacks on London as strategically "necessary" to help end the war.. It was his way of forcing England to make Peace. He was a twisted, bitter man, and his letters to the Duchess, which were read aloud, complete with nicknames and dripping with contempt for the Royals were true. He was a nasty little bitch. I think he was a closet case hopelessly bullied by his father, and held his poor stammering brother harmless blaming all the adverse decisions on the Queen Mother. In his mind, she was The Big Evil.

r182, it was a state visit in 1937, before Hitler showed his true colours. Edward VIII survived the First World War and did not want that horror repeated. He wanted to build English and German relations... but all you see is 'Nazi' and you make instant assumptions.

They had Edward say those exact same things himself r184, but Elizabeth refused to buy it.

You can defend him til you're blue in the face, but sorry, most people are not going to be okay with his friendly Nazi ties.

Edward VIII in his brief reign showed great interest in modernising the monarchy and changing the plight of the working classes in Britain. There is no way some memo from a Nazi official claiming Edward wanted his own people bombed is evidence of anything. Edward just wanted to make sure England and Germany never went to war again and Prime minister Chamberlain had the exact same sentiment. Hitler's actions in the late 30s are no reflection on Edward.

Right, R184. Edward VIII knew what Hitler was like. He kept close tabs on what was happening in Germany and by 1936 Hitler's delusions were not a secret. They bonded over their shared attitude towards racial superiority. And over Edward's German heritage which he emphasized during their meetings. The anguish he felt during WWI was because he was conflicted about his ancestry. YOu fucking Neo Nazi apologist.

r185... the show took the memo of a Nazi official and basically used artistic licence to make out it was the truth. Edward VIII was provocative in the same way Princess Diana was but that's as far as it goes. You don't know how humiliating the Treaty of Versailles was on Germany because of Britain. That is a huge reason some people in England were Nazi sympathisers long before anyone knew what the immoral facts of the regime were. You can't judge a person based on what happened afterwards, you have to consider the time something was happening and take the history of the two nations into account. If Edward had initially admired Hitler, it was admiration for a man who took a nation from chaos and recovered it spectacularly, it was nothing to do with racial ideologies or invasion or anything of that sort. You people never take the First World War into consideration here... there were people who lived through it and wanted to make sure it NEVER HAPPENED AGAIN.

R188, it's actually a perfect Nazi strategy: used Edward as a patsy in order to divide Britain from within. He probably had no idea.

[quote]If Edward had initially admired Hitler, it was admiration for a man who took a nation from chaos and recovered it spectacularly, it was nothing to do with racial ideologies or invasion or anything of that sort.

Laughable. You don't know this, that is what you chose to naively believe.

[quote] basically used artistic licence to make out it was the truth.

Tommy Lascelles believed it to be true. He told that to Elizabeth.

Implicating Edward over some claims from Nazi officials makes for great drama, but I'd take it with a grain of salt.

r190, you don't know anything yourself. It just fits the narrative you want to believe.

Edward was more modern than Elizabeth and that's why the establishment wanted him out. They wanted to maintain the status quo.

Many historians agree that Edward and Simpson admired Nazism. The fact is like many things in history it can't be known for sure.

But when there is smoke, there is often fire.

They had Edward VIII's two way communications and he was the center of a nest of Nazi Sympathizers among the Elites in Great Britain at the time. Some openly ran for Parliament. Do not ever delude yourself or others that Edward the VIII did not fully understand what Hitler was up to. He was. Hitler made no secret of his agenda. He didn't suddenly pop up with it in the late 30's early 40's. British Intelligence was monitoring the build up of armaments closely and there was conflict among some in Parliament because they were with the Chamberlain belief that Hitler could be appeased. But they knew his agenda. Edward VIII also overreached himself by attempting to place the Monarchy on a path that was in direct conflict with the foreign policy of his country. He should have kept his narrow ass out of the situation instead of jumping on the bandwagon . I suppose you're also of the belief that there's "nothing wrong with Trump wanting to have better relations with Russia?"

r195, progaganda.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

It's exactly what they did with Pricness Diana: oh, she's a loose canon, she's mentally ill, she's a whore. With Edward it was: oh, he visited the Nazis to try to maintain good relations, it means he was in on the Final Solution and wanted his own country invaded!!!

You people are so guillable. Then again, Jewish writers are exceptionally talented and imaginative turning fairy tales into facts.

You half sound like you should be flying a Nazi flag yourself r198, which is unsurprising.

r199, just because I know how sly those Jews are doesn't mean I agree with the Holocaust. Far from it.

To be accurate, many Nazis did not agree with or were unaware of the extent of the holocaust. They still subscribed and supported an ideology of hate and that allowed it to happen.

Ok Edward was a nazi sympathizer we get it. I'd be far more interested in seeing Matthew Goode engaging in some bisexual action next season.

[quote]I'd be far more interested in seeing Matthew Goode engaging in some bisexual action next season.'

Matthew Goode is done playing the character I am sure.

But yes, while I am glad they included he that he would hook up with the same-sex, I definitely noticed they would not actually show it. I was hoping for a little kiss between him and that guy, but nothing. Instead we get the very graphic sex scene between him and that asian dancer.

R133 I think the Duke of Windsor episode was the best this season, they really laid it out how entrenched he was with Germany during the war. He and Wallis were absolutely vile people.

I was cheering watching it. Finally, a British show tells the real story. The Duke and wife finally got nailed. The former KIng was a traitor and a big one. I hope the scene of Elizabeth calling him out really happened.

This has always resonated with me. I went off on a rant on here about him a couple months ago. Back in the late 90's - the History Channel did a show on this. They showed copies of letters from him and Hitler, etc. (I don't think his actually visiting the building of the camps was mentioned.) But it was very damning. Especially the deal he made with Hitler and his giving Germany some of England's military secrets. That was included in the History channel show. They also laundered money for Hitler when they were in the Bahamas.

After watching the show, I mentioned the whole thing to my father. He was an unflappable man who didn't usually show emotion.As I told it, He turned white and was incredulous. He said -- you are talking about the King of England being a Nazi! Aiding the enemy. The NAZI's! He almost didn't believe me. He had to sit down. My Dad was a 19 year old Lt., on a B17, was shot down, half of the crew was killed. He then was a POW in Nazi Germany for a year. This betrayal really hit him. And then he said, something about - imagine how the military who served from England feel. Can this be true?

Anyway, I assume some shit hit the fan. The History Channel didn't air it again. At least not that I saw.

I would say it reminded me of Ben Barnes bisexual character from "Westworld", they showed a guy lying in the same bed with him, but made sure they were not shown actually touching.

In related news, Lord Haw Haw is now trolling Datalounge.

Lord Haw Haw and Axis Sally dismissed all news of Nazi atrocities as propaganda from "FDR and his Jewish boyfriends".

r204, it's always gratifying to certain people when propaganda is presented as fact. You are no different.

[quote] As for the QM? Ugh. I cannot stand that actress. I've seen her in other pieces and she's repulsive to me. She has a face like a pug, and always looks rather pitiful.

As opposed to the real Queen Mother, who was such a ravishing beauty at the time!

R207 Defending a Nazi tells me all I need to know about you. I love the block function on here.

I read an account where when the Duke of Windsor got drunk he would affect some German accent and would rant that his blood was pure German. He was also a fan of German marching music. Wallis supposedly would turn a blind eye, else just mildly scold him “oh David!”

I'm not going to attempt to wade into any arguments here. But, as an American, I don't think most Americans are really aware of the extent of Fascist sympathies at that time. When I learned this, it was very disturbing to me. There were British Nazi sympathizers, as well as a number of prominent American ones, too.

Just remember that plenty of people were looking for ways to discredit the Duke of Windsor (the British establishment) or use him a patsy without his knowledge (the Nazis). He was the perfect victim for both British and German officials in that he was led by the heart and not the head. Like Lady Diana.

r211, a great film about British Nazi sympathisers in the 30s was Remains of the Day. You can find it on Netflix. It's actually very sympathetic to the very people which The Crown chooses to vilify.

Let's not forget the Milford girls.

[quote]It's actually very sympathetic to the very people which The Crown chooses to vilify.

Because it's FICTION, Heinrich.

r215, no it portrays British Nazi sympathisers as in over their heads and not aware of the full picture. Which is what Edward VIII was :)

R215, again I call nonsense. He was a twisted bitter man and his wife was a hateful woman. They despised the Royal family especially The Queen Mother. When he saw an opportunity to return as king with Wallis as his queen as offered by Hitler, whom Edward VIII believed would win the war, he jumped at the chance. Do not paint him as some innocent dupe. He wasn't. Wallis fed his ambitions. She wanted him restored and she wanted to sit on that throne. It would have been vindication after what they both saw as humiliating treatment. He was never satisfied with his allowance or with being out of the mainstream. the two of them constructed an elaborate world of fiction where they had liveried servants a lived about as royally as one can contrive to live. He was always complaining to his brother that he needed more money. The fact was, that it was because of his relationships with Hitler's Germany, and ties to Neo Nazis at home that he was not allowed to live in the UK. He was told he could not stay there and arrangement was made with the French government to allow him to reside in France....after the kidnapping plot was uncovered he was hustled off to the Bahamas because France was no longer safe.

r217, malicious fabrications by establishment figures with an agenda.

[quote]r215, no it portrays British Nazi sympathisers as in over their heads and not aware of the full picture. Which is what Edward VIII was :)

And like I said, it's fiction. Your point?

Those photos at the end of the Nazi episode do not lie. Unlike our resident Axis Sally.

The best part of episode 3 was Philip sitting there holding that fairy godmother wand-thing like some stupid Disney Princess at the end of the investiture ceremony.

The CGI scenes with the Royal Yacht were start of the art for 1992. They could done better there.

While he was off boffing the natives wasn't she having a thing with her horse trainer, or did that come later?

When the Duke and Duchess lived in the Bahamas, Wallis sent letters to friends complaining about the locals. She called them "lazy, shiftless n-----s."

CHARMING woman, that Wallis.

r223, Prince Philip is a racist and this show commends him... your point?

[quote]but all you see is 'Nazi' and you make instant assumptions.

Yup. I totally do that. Guilty as charged.

r225, so you deny Hitler completely restored Germany after the Depression?

I firmly believe that Hitler took Germany away from its belief that Mary Poppins is the best film ever made.

[QUOTE] so you deny Hitler completely restored Germany after the Depression?

Well, WE sure felt depressed under Hitler

r228, don't evade the question. Do you deny that Hitler brought Germany back from the brink?

I've had enough of this: just because someone questions the agenda of a Jewish writer does NOT make them pro-Holocaust. Just because Edward visited the Nazis does not make him privy to their doctrine or policies. Tired of fucking liberals screaming "Nazi" if anyone chooses to see the ambiguities of a situation instead of the blacks and whites.

R230 - Stop talking.

[quote]I've had enough of this

Said the person who started this, has continued to derail the thread, and has been obsessed with defending Nazis. Discussing was humming along well unless you disrupted it.

Ugh

Discussion was humming along well until you disrupted it*

Nobody was defending Nazis you fuck. The defence was for the Duke of Windsor.

I think R229 is Poo shoes

Edward VIII was a treasonous pig who’s lucky it wasn’t a few hundred years earlier in England, as he would have found himself in the Tower, and shortly thereafter headless on a pike.

Edward and Wallis were fabulous. Fuck y'all!

r232, it's an anonymous board you know... virtue signalling isn't required.

Blocking all the Nazi apologist loons here.

Meanwhile, back at the point...

I do think JFK and Jackie were grossly miscast, but the story line was heartbreaking.

No Nazi apologists here. Loony liberals.

You'll notice it is just one poster r239. Who just used the phrase "virtue-signaling", I don't think you can get more cliche.

[quote]I do think JFK and Jackie were grossly miscast

The reddit thread on that episode is full of people bitching about that.

Nazi apologists complaining about "virtue signaling".

Motherfucking 2017, y'all.

R178, does that crown pick up his local NBC affiliate?

Great acting, great productions, one of the very best series I've ever seen if not the best.

My favorite line of season one was David announcing, Let's fuck.

I get all tingly in the naughty bits over Matthew Goode, the man who finally won Lady Mary's heart a second time and now shagalicious as the wicked Lord Snowdon. He has a magical sexuality.

Matthew Goode and Vanessa Kirby were truly electric together in their episode. It was sizzling and is what made that episode a classic.

[quote]Let's not forget the Milford girls.

Oh Dear!

R169, you missed my point that Vanessa Kirby is statuesque. The actress they chose to play Margaret should at least be physically similar to KIRBY, not the real Margaret. Samantha Spiro has been fabulous as UK icon Barbara Windsor but Margaret she ain’t. And, incidentally, Margaret won’t be in a wheelchair until at least Season 5 when it will be yet another actress playing her, who I hope will be Francesca Annis.

[quote] Matthew Goode and Vanessa Kirby were truly electric together in their episode.

While I agree with this 100% it does deserve a: MARY!

Alex Jennings really is perfectly cast as The Duke of Windsor. He dies in 1972. I saw a photo of Elizabeth with him and Wallis in 1967, so that should be interesting.

I like how Smith plays Philip as a holder of the old guard. Kirby is superb at showing Margaret for the self centered cunt she was.

[quote] The actress they chose to play Margaret should at least be physically similar to KIRBY, not the real Margaret.

I would argue the exact reverse.

No that poster is right, this is a TV show. You have to try to follow what you established in the world of the show.

[quote] No that poster is right, this is a TV show. You have to try to follow what you established in the world of the show.

This is a historical TV show. And as we move into the late60s and 70s, there will be people (particularly in the UK) who have very clear memories as to what the royal family looked like during that period because they were alive then.

[quote]The actress they chose to play Margaret should at least be physically similar to KIRBY, not the real Margaret.

Why? Claire Foy and Olivia Colman don't look similar.

A few things they've let slip about seasons 3 & 4 (which they're writing together), other than that Olivia Colman will be playing the queen (they've not said yet who the other actors will be):

*Season 3 will involve the breakup of Margaret's and Snowdon's marriage

*We will be introduced to Camilla in Season 3

*Season 4 will heavily feature Diana and Margaret Thatcher

r257,between Diana and Thatcher, I think Season 4 of The Crown is going to be the greatest season of television ever made.

So the Kennedys were drug addicts!

Never heard the "Dr. Feel-good" story r259?

[quote]By May 1962, Jacobson had visited the White House to treat the President thirty-four times

[quote]By May 1962, Jacobson had visited the White House to treat the President thirty-four times

I could understand him because he had a lot of back pain. But I didn't know she shot up as well.

I was hoping the Kennedy episode would have The Queen responding to news of Marilyn Monroe's death which was a huge deal (foreshadowing Diana's in many ways)... specifically the Queen comparing her own life to Marilyn's, since they were the same age, and maybe using Marilyn's death as a cautionary tale for Margaret. Anyway i would have included that.

[quote]The Queen responding to news of Marilyn Monroe's death which was a huge deal

Er, I doubt the Queen would have been that affected by the news. Doesn't seem worth including.

What was the Queen's relationship with Thatcher like?

The Queen disliked Thatcher.

r262 = Willy Russell writing another verse of "Marilyn Monroe" for Blood Brothers

Now Margaret, she was wild

A solid fuck that girl could throw

But her life, it had no meaning

Just like poor, Marilyn Monroe

r263, for the Diana foreshadowing, it would have been interesting I think.

r265, in Peter Morgan's play The Audience, there's a scene where the Queen receives Thatcher, who basically rakes her over the coals and compares their lives, stating that she began life as a green grocer's daughter and has come up from the bottom... it was quite hilarious, and I think Morgan will include it in The Crown.

The Queen actually met Marilyn during the timeframe of Season 2

The Queen was sympathetic to Jackie. She sent Philip to the funeral. I may be remembering this wrong but I think she wanted to make a rare appearance except she was pregnant with Prince Edward. She almost never goes to funerals of heads of state. She went to the funeral of King Baudoin of Belgium for some reason.

I don’t think Jackie liked royalty all that much. Queen Fredericka of Greece represented her husband King Paul, and Jackie scornfully referred to her as “that awful Queen of Greece.”

The Queen was pregnant with Edward at the time of JFK's funeral. And as we saw from The Crown, she had to stay at Balmoral on doctor's orders.

Just finished episode 9. Man, what a powerful episode.

Phillips back story was so heart-breakingly done and young Phillip was a fantastic find.

Also I enjoyed how they showed the complicated relationship with Charles and how both of his parents failed him. Elizabeth largely ignored him, and Phillip was too convinced that what worked for him would naturally work for Charles, and was disappointed that he wouldn't just "toughen up"

[quote]When I saw the boy cast as young Philip, with his pouting pillowy lips, I though that Bryan Singer must have directed the episode. The homoeroticism was dialed to 11 throughout that whole episode, which was dragged out to a interminable degree.

While you are obsessing over his "pouty lips" (which yeah he had), I was struck by how effective he was. Great casting.

r272, this gives me an idea that Peter Morgan will seek to demonise Diana and portray Charles and Camilla in a favourable light.

Foy looks too human to play Elizardbeth. The next actress should be a known Repitilian.

There were two scenes in the episode with Margaret's engagement party in which Foy actually reminded me of Reese Witherspoon. (One being that moment when she's noticing Snowden's interaction w/ his lover.)

I can't imagine any of these people ever having to go to the bathroom.

Olivia Colman would be a good Camilla if she went blonde.

DL being DL, I can't believe there's not at least one thread on Finn Elliot, who played young Philip. Is he the breakout star of Season 2?

He's all of 15.

I dont recall threads devoted to minors here. Even Dylan Geick was 18.

We all laughed out loud in my household to see the young Phillip had big pouty lips. Stephen Daldry is a legendary perv.

O.M.G! Lilibet, Philip, Jackie and Jack, the frission between Lilibet and Jackie was palpable. This episode should be retitled: Whose Afraid of Lilibet Windsor. The interracial dance in Ghana was as close to Hump the Hostess as I have ever seen.

Philip came from a fucked up German/Danish/Greek family and tortured his son as he himself was tortured. More power ti Charles for breaking the cycle of abuse. Pity Lilibet sacrificed Charles to Philip. Philip was a nasty cunt to her.

It was very telling that Philip threatened "their agreement"/marriage with Elizabeth when it came to Charles' education. I don't entirely blame her for yielding to Philip.

It's a classic case of a narcissistic father making bad choices for his child.

What's heartbreaking is that men like him really believe they're making the right choice, without actually seeing/knowing their child. I've been there.

And season two ends with the christening of Edward.

What a tour de force for Foy!

the totally-not-defending-Nazis guy is also the one who talked about "sly Jews" but of course he's not an anti-Semite

[quote]What's heartbreaking is that men like him really believe they're making the right choice, without actually seeing/knowing their child. I've been there.

It's not like Elizabeth knew Charles any better, she was a largely absentee parental figure in his life. Though by all accounts she finally was a mother to her younger two children.

[quote]and tortured his son as he himself was tortured. More power ti Charles for breaking the cycle of abuse.

It is absurd to call Gordonstoun "tortue", Phillip loved his time there. It ended up not being an environment Charles could be happy in, but the right boys would love it.

Charles sent his sons to Eton, but Harry probably would have been happier at Gordonstoun than Eton.

Back in the day, I guess they believed that you had to "make a man out of him" by rough treatment, bullying and physical hardship like cold showers and military style workouts and hikes. The one thing that struck me is when I think Philip stopped by to say farewell to Michael Parker, and they were talking about Elizabeth wanting more kids, and he said that with the first one, Charles there was the problem of him being the heir to the throne, so she was always going to relate to him differently, but with the other kids she could be more relaxed. or something like that.

Yes I thought that scene was an interesting way to explain why the relationship between Elizabeth and Charles was a little cold and distant r289.

[quote]between Diana and Thatcher, I think Season 4 of The Crown is going to be the greatest season of television ever made.

I'd imagine Season 4 will also have the assassination of Dickie Mountbatten.

If they are following the same pattern.

Season 3 will cover 1965-1975.

Season 4 1975-1985.

So what will be in season 3, I imagine one of the last episode will be the attempt to kidnap Princess Anne which happened in 1974.

Philip really is a nasty piece of shit. She should have stood up to him from the beginning. Unfortunately, I think she loves him. But he knows just what to say to disarm her. What a sad marriage for her.

Diana is going to be very hard to cast. She was such a unique presence and right from the early days, had something which set her apart. What actress do you predict could potentially be cast as Di? I'm thinking they will get a teen/early 20s Di and a late 20s/30s Di.

Also if it ends with Season 6 that will be 2005.

So it will end with the marriage of Charles and Camilla.

[quote]Philip really is a nasty piece of shit

I like Phillip, and I think Elizabeth was attracted to his strength and honesty. I think the show has done a good job explaining him. He was this strong self-reliant man who overcame tons of adversity, distinguished himself in war and then is put into a situation where he is treated like a child who has to be managed and made to feel completely useless and the most unimportant figure in his house. It wasn't easy for him.

Also, the problem with Elizabeth and Charles was the great Royal reserve. There is a news reel where she and Philip had been on a long trip away when Charles was a boy. In the news reel, you see Elizabeth get off the ship (or plane, sorry can't remember which) after weeks of not seeing her son. She walks up to him and pats him on the back and then goes on. She daren't hug him in public which is probably exactly what he needed.

I notice that the actress playing the Queen Mother has not had her teeth browned for the role. Imagine the halitosis!

I don't think of Philip as a nasty piece of shit so much as a product of the times and a victim of his own personal history...as depicted in this series. I believe they definitely loved one another,and honestly all the angst about "What do we do with Philip" and all the "She is your job!" is IMO a lot of dramatic contrivance.

They had a model. They had Victoria and Albert. Victoria was queen, but Albert was head of the family. And in addition to running things as far as the physical plant, the estates, the operation of the castles, etc. Philip did have the role and responsibility to keep an eye on those things.

Also, and it was touched upon in passing very lightly, he was chair of the World Wildlife Fund and took it seriously. He attended the meetings and he was no dummy. He kept up on politics, on foreign affairs and on political gossip.

We look at him as racist, homophobic, etc. of course, and in addition,he was certainly blunt and indelicate, lacking tact in his various pronouncements, but their decision to cultivate him as a personality separate from his wife, and having him out here performing his duties not simply as an appendage of The Queen was a wise course to embark on.

Wanted to add that Elizabeth creating him Prince Philip, was extremely important to elevating his status in the public mind.

R101, The Queen explained her use of handbags once, it was a instrument used to alert her staff when she had had enough of a certain individual during a social event. She would change the bag to the other arm and they would come and move the person along.

[quote]Elizabeth was attracted to his strength and honesty.

And his lavish penis. Do not forget his lavish penis.

I certainly never do.

Philip was rescued from the life of obscurity led by other deposed European royals of the 20th Century. She was the best thing that ever happened to him. Without her, he would have spent his life on the Riviera, wining and dining the bored wives of wealthy industrialists and selling them a bit of reflected glory from his lost Royal title. Frankly, Elizabeth could have done much better. He gambled that she would not become Queen for a great many years then came up short on his bet. And what a sore loser he proved to be in his luxurious digs, stomping about and whingeing about his sad lot in life. He tipped his hand when he insisted on "Mountbatten" being the last name of Prince Charles. Elizabeth should have arranged an "accidental" death for him at that moment. Problem solved.

He had successes and contributed some valuable things to the successful reign of Elizabeth. But on the whole, he was an insufferable, insensitive, narcissist.

Sadly, Matt Smith is unable to do much more than squint and project his enormous forehead. His only saving grace in these 20 hours is that he has great armpits.

[quote]His only saving grace in these 20 hours is that he has great armpits.

That is grace indeed.

I read - just recently - that she made him a Prince very suddenly so he would not be called to testify in his best friend Mike's divorce. He would implicate himself if he did. Not sure why making him a Prince protected him from testifying - but it did.

[quote] as he would have found himself in the Tower, and shortly thereafter headless on a pike.

The head would have gone on the pike, not the headless body.

The handbag is for her glasses (as the series showed in her speech at the Jaguar plant, even in the 50s she needed glasses to read).

The handbag is for her eyeglasses and for tissue. The Queen cannot be seen with snot pouring out of her nose or the stray booger clinging to her royal nostrils.

[quote]The Queen cannot be seen with snot pouring out of her nose or the stray booger clinging to her royal nostrils.

Why ever not?

Though Elizabeth was probably following the raising of her children the way she was raised. I'd imagine the idea of doting, hands on mother in the royal family probably never existed til Diana. It was expected you would let others do much of the day to day work.

I just finished watching the new season and I thought it was a bit lackluster compared to last season.

Philip was an over compensating high achiever in his youth. He was almost always at the top of his class at both Gordonstoun and the Naval Academy. He was a fine naval officer and since he wouldn't have had any inheritance and barely a stipend from his rich relatives, the navy would have been his career. He had just come off the most exciting time of his life with his war experience. He was a world traveler. To go to the gilded imprisonment of the palace must have been a complete shock to his system. Surrounded by women who wield power and supercilious toadies and umpteen protocols must have completely grated after a Royal Navy career.

So it took some time to adapt.

22,219 solo engagements in his years of service to the Crown. By God he worked it.

At the end of every episode, it lists a Hungarian crew. Does anyone know what was filmed in Hungary?

That's just my cabal of Hungarian rentboys r311. A little sizemeat keeps the creativity flowing.

I bet the older Hungarian hair/make up ladies had fabulous stories about what a stupid cunt Madonna was when she shot Evita there.

Speaking of Evita I can only guess that Jonathan Pryce will finally play somebody in Season 2.

Oops, I mean Season 3.

I've done quite a lot of reading about Louis Mountbatten and he was a lifesaver to young Philip, but he was also the consummate shit stirrer and was very manipulative and ambitious. If you watched the episode where there was a dinner ad Louis was proclaiming the house of Mountbatten trying to manipulate Philip into insisting that had to be the name of their House after George the 6th died and Elizabeth was becoming queen. I don't blame Pilip for wanting his family name to be Mountbatten-Windsor. But he was led down the path by Louis Mountbatten. Charles found a sympathetic ear in Louis too. Lord Louis Mountbatten was a bi-sexualist or a secret homosexualist. His wife a, Lady Mountbatten, had a much publicized affair with Nehru when they were governor general of India and he presided over India's independence from the UK. He was a completely inept embarrassment who fucked up every single assignment he was given. They ended up giving hi India as a joke, knowing it was already lost. Truthfully one of these days they need to do a mini-series on the Raj, and the Mountbattens. They were a fascinating couple lots of gossip and intrigue ...and farce, and an interesting period in British/Indian history.

I found S2 a bit more well written than S1.

OMG...

[quote] To go to the gilded imprisonment of the palace must have been a complete shock to his system. Surrounded by women who wield power and supercilious toadies and umpteen protocols must have completely grated after a Royal Navy career.

I would HATE all that! Much nicer to sip from my puddle and wear my old newspapers.

[quote] Truthfully one of these days they need to do a mini-series on the Raj, and the Mountbattens.

They beat you to it already by three decades.

And as for a mini-series on the Raj... this is one of the greatest miniseries British TV has ever done.

Starving Darfur Orphan, those would have qualified as designer clothes.

We were naked before we died.

I love those old British miniseries they used to make. Remember the one about Winston Churchill's mother Jennie... starring Lee Remick?

I've watched all of season 2. I wasn't that impressed. Episodes 1-3 are draggy. The middle gets better but I was really disappointed by the end. Episodes 9 and 10 seem like a waste, like they were just padding the season out and stuffed it with filler.

I think episodes 5, 6, and 7 are the best of the season.

Agreed r323... the main problem with Season 2 is how they acquaint us with new characters (such as Eileen) and give her huge screen time for two episodes and then that's it. They should stop concentrating on secondary characters and focus on the Queen in relation to them.

Yes, that was highly annoying, the way each episode would concentrate on a new character in relation to the Queen, showing their personal lives. It's like, we don't fucking know these people... this show is supposed to be a soap about the Windsors, not a fucking anthology series.

I also found the scenes with Matthew Goode's character and Margaret horribly dull and predictable. They could have been confined to one scene and we would have gotten the gist of that story. It was horribly dragged out.

But a naked Matthew Goode was worth it.

I also thought some of the writing was bad.

Possible spoiler alert: In episode 10, when the PM resigns, Elizabeth gets all nasty with him and says: "I've been Queen ten years and I've had three Prime Ministers, they've either been too old, too ill or too weak. A confederacy of elected quitters." Bitch please! Winston Churchill was PM when you came to power and guided your sorry dumb ass through your first few years as Queen. Not to mention that he brought the UK through the difficult times of WW2.

It was just such a poorly written scene.

I thought she summed up Churchill, Eden and Macmillan at the time.

Who was the actress that played the waitress who worked at Philip's club? That's definitely a future Diana candidate.

[quote]I thought she summed up Churchill, Eden and Macmillan at the time.

I don't think the real Queen would have ever said that about Churchill.

Why do they have to replace Matthew Goode in Seasons 3 & 4. It would be easier to age him. He's too damned sexy to get rid of. Are they getting rid of Matt Smith too?

Of course they are getting rid of Matt Smith. All the cast knew they were only doing the the roles for the first two seasons.

At least it is not as bad as that series "The Queen" where a different actress played Elizabeth II in every episode.

Apparently Matt Smith will be replaced but they're keeping his replacement under wraps. Word is Paul Bettany is among those being considered.

Patricia Routledge for the Queen Mother! No substitutes will be accepted.

I found that like many shows with a fantastic first season, The Crown waned in quality this year. It was a underwhelming follow up from solid first season. As other reviewers have stated, they spent too munch time dealing with Elizabeth and Philip's bumpy marriage - which in reality where no where near as tense as what we saw on the show - and skimmed over the more interesting stories like Lord Altrincham , the Kennedys, Ghana, even Margaret and Tony's romance felt rushed. One of the challenges for the writers I'm sure is that this period between the late 50s and mid 60s were overall fairly quiet years compared to what was to come in the 70s, 80s and 90s.

I am looking forward to season 3 which will likely focus on the breakdown of Margaret and Tony's marriage and Margaret's affair with Roddy Llewellyn, the Silver Jubilee, and Charles and Camilla's first meeting.

An entire episode devoted to Lord Atricham, an episode devoted to the Kennedys. In a 10 episode series is that really rushing it?

I think they did a great job crafting an excellent season out of a period of time that was honestly relatively drama free for the Windsors.

I had issues with the first few episodes. But from episode 4 onwards I thought it was an excellent season.

I very much hope the Bettany rumor is true. He deserves better than his recent run of schlock.

But who will play young adult Prince Charles? Why must they be so hush-hush about this? Oh, the suspense!

Really sad that Bettany backed out of Masters of Sex. I hope he does The Crown.

On ep 8. 2nd season is excellent so far.

Next season will open on Churchill's funeral. Mark my words

Agree r342,

I'd be very happy if they cast Game of Thrones alum Harry Lloyd as Charles.

R341 Season 8 was the best episode of the season IMO with episode 9 being the worst.

[quote]His only saving grace in these 20 hours is that he has great armpits.

oh please tell, in which episode are these glories revealed?

R338 I agree that the writers did their best with a period that was pretty calm for the Windsors.

My issue was the whole Philip and Elizabeth back and forth all season, I found it annoying. One week there was so much tension, next week they're back in love. And you're telling me the Queen held on to the picture of that Ballerina for 6 years and Philip never noticed it was gone?

I'm up to S2: E6 so I've just finished watching Lord A break a tooth on some toffee and help modernize the monarchy. Margaret, Margaret, Margaret. Stumbling drunkenly around such elegant surroundings while listening to elegant songs on her record player. A bit overdone but enjoyable nonetheless. I love the actress who plays her. I don't like the guy who plays Armstrong-Jones. I think the real one was much cuter. One question. Does Margaret catch him with a man in one of the upcoming episodes?

[quote]I've just finished watching Lord A break a tooth on some toffee

Riveting.

So we've had 20 episodes so far and in my opinion, the entire story so far could have been told in 10.

Love the pacing as it moves from one focus to another. The Philip/Charles episode was brilliant juxtaposition.

The Philip/Charles episode was hard to watch. It was the only episode I ff'd some it. Just cruel.

[quote]The Queen's study (aka "tv room") at Balmoral. I love that she has a space heater that costs £20 in the fireplace!

My favorite line in the whole series is when the Queen Mother bangs the TV to get better reception and the Queen scolds her: "Mother! It's rented."

[quote]it was a state visit in 1937, before Hitler showed his true colours.

British intelligence knew that David and Wallis were passing sensitive information to the German embassy in London.

The Nazi part was not very historic as many, many people had already known.

What was historic was the portrayal of Elizabeth hosting Mrs. Kennedy to tea where she was absolutely Devonian regarding her scone. That, my dears, was an unknown piece of Lilibet's puzzle never even dare whispered in court circles. Cream first. jam on top.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

Keira Knightley as Diana!

Carey Mulligan as Diana!

Imogen Poots as Diana!

Lily James for Diana!

Who ever plays Diana has to be able to play the Shy Di role as well as someone who is natural and spontaneous. In a certain way, Diana's youth has to come through without making her look like a silly teenager which, she was actually borderline.

You know, one thing that strikes me and I have to remind myself, England really experienced hardships we have no experience of in the aftermath of WW2. And in the 50's TV was in its infancy. So even going up to the mid 60's the UK was still playing "catch up" with modernity and the way things were done there is not how they got done here. Those drafty old palaces and rented TV sets, and other things were a curious mix of the archaic transitioning to modernity and a conflict with the necessary frugality imposed by the War effort.

The monarchy was elaborate but not opulent. And whether she actually said it or not, Jackie Kennedy's description of Buckingham palace was accurate if not kind.

None of the casting ideas above work for Diana because Diana was tall-about 5’9”-and it was a large part of who she was. It was one of the reasons Naomi Watts was such a crushing failure when she played her.

Just watched Babs on my flight to London and although Samantha Spiro makes a superb Barbara Windsor (she played her onstage at the National as well as a film) she is NOT a viable Margaret.

The Phillip/Charles episode was the best one of the season.

That you apparently found it so hard to watch r352, is a testament that it was able to evoke real emotions from you.

[quote]So even going up to the mid 60's the UK was still playing "catch up" with modernity and the way things were done there is not how they got done here. Those drafty old palaces and rented TV sets,

In fairness, the color TVs that people rented in England were far superior to the ones Americans bought.

Laverne Cox has signed to play Diana.

If Season 4 and Season 5 deal with adult Diana in her 30s, Keira Knightley will definitely be cast.

[quote]The Nazi part was not very historic as many, many people had already known.

Keep telling yourself that hon, if that's the kind of delusion you need to get through the day.

In Season 3, do you think there will be an entire episode dedicated to Carol Burnett's imitation of Queen Elizabeth? Who will play Carol? And will the Queen be watching it on a rented television?

R356, I've never known about the scone thing. But I did some Googling, and found this. It actually reads as those HM makes scone herself. Is that really possible. She seems to get the details correct (and BTW, I actually have come to recognize her handwriting).

Apparently, the English papers are in an uproar that the series implicates Prince Philip in the Profumo affair.

There are rumors that he was a naked waiter at sex parties. One rumor was that he wore a mask. Another was that he was naked except for a small lace apron.

[quote]a small lace apron.

Pity, that.

NETFLIX! GET YOUR SHIT 2GETHER!!! I watched 27 minutes of season 1 epi 1 before i realized i was not on season 2.....why can't they just put the correct season up when it starts??? jesus.

Yes, R375, it is Neflix's fault that you are stupid.

I wish season 2 had more gay content, not even a gay kiss wtf?! So disappointing.

Everything is written so carefully because of British libel laws and that Elizabeth and Philip are both still alive, so they never come out and scything. Everything is implied.

I thought they were implying that Philip had a fling with Stephen Ward.

The writers made a point of:

Ward being accused of sexual perversion at this trial.

Ward drawing Philip's attention to a nude drawing he had done;

Elizabeth doesn't accuse Philip of being with a woman (only in the distant past with the pic of the ballerina), but says she is strong and open minded but just needs to know what it is she is dealing with -- and that she knows he needs to "blow off steam."

And the scandal is at risk of being revealed by drawings made by Ward of Philip. Presumably this is not the one he made of him at Buckingham Palace wearing a suit. It is implied, with the earlier drawing, that they are nudes, which would indicate an intimacy. Hence the scandal in them being revealed.

Indeed, that was Philip the apron. He passed around pigs in a blanket and we used to call him Philomena.

As far as the Profumo scandal, I don't think Philip did anything, no, not even in a mask wearing an apron. I think he crossed paths with a subject of the investigation and it looked bad. Ward was the key to a lot of what happened. A real kinky guy with his two lady friends Christine Keeler and Mandy Rice Davies. I'm not suggesting that Philip was a saint, but I am saying he was not a fool. Philip would have never allowed himself to run around naked at a sex party with other people. Ever. And for all the scenes where we saw him tooling around in his sports car, better believe he had security somewhere in the vicinity.

The funniest thing in the season was the Queen showing off for Jackie Kennedy.

"Make way for the Queen's Guard [or we will trample you, you silly American twat]!"

R381 that scene made me laugh out loud. I posted in the other thread that I thought the writers were basically doing that as camp - it was so over the top - especially with the guards on the stairs, scaring Jackie.

Was something off about Margaret's accent or was she just playing drunk? I'd have to re-watch it to give specific words / examples, but it sounded very odd at times - or perhaps slurred. The vowels were dragged out in a strange way. It might just be me... I thought Lithgow sounded odd too - more like Eric Cartman than Winston Churchill. But then he won an emmy, so it's probably just me.

I wonder who thought Michael C Hall would be a good choice for JFK because that was so bizarre.

Michael C Hall was awful as JFK.

Was the show taking liberties with fact, showing JFK beating Jackie back at the Ritz after she wowed Paris?

The dress Elizabeth wore when the Kennedy's visited was HILARIOUSLY ugly. I thought the show had done it as a joke, but it was the dress she wore.

No wonder she felt mousy.

According to this article, Jackie did make cutting comments about the Queen and the Palace, although there is no evidence that it got back to her.

Elizabeth was, however, up to sabotaging Jackie's visit, which may have led to the resentment.

[quote]Traditionally, divorcées are not invited, so the queen has been reluctant to welcome Jackie’s sister Princess Lee Radziwill, who is on her second marriage, or her husband, Prince Stanislaw Radziwill, who is on his third. Under pressure, she relents, but, by way of retaliation, singularly fails to invite Princess Margaret or Princess Marina, both of whose names Jackie has put forward. Jackie’s old paranoia returns: She sees it as a plot to do her down. “The queen had her revenge,” she confides to Gore Vidal. “No Margaret, no Marina, no one except every Commonwealth minister of agriculture they could find.”

Jackie told Gore Vidal she thought that the Queen resented her and that there was no relationship between the Queen and Philip.

I think the point of the Kennedy episode was that the UK still hadn't pulled itself out of WW2 mentality. The US had this lovely, fashionable couple and they looked anything but dowdy like the Queen. But I agree that is seemed like there was a lot of fiction in it. Would Jackie have apologized to the queen? Would she have admitted she was a druggie? It seemed like they wrote Jackie as too needy, almost like Diana. And Elizabeth having the revelation at the funeral, "She hasn't changed her clothes because she wants everyone to see" was just stupid. Oh, and the actress who played Jackie was crap. She didn't even attempt Jackie's breathless voice.

Can anyone explain the thing about Jackie "deliberately" wearing the blood stained clothes? The QM said "can't they just find her better clothes to wear" but HM says "no - I think it's deliberate" after carefully studying the screen. There's a brief discussion of it on reddit, but I trust opinions here more.

Oh, and why were was the Queen of England renting a TV? I know they were frugal & TVs were expensive, but it just seemed illogical. They could afford one, and they weren't wheeling the TV out of the palace every few days when it wasn't in use to save .

[quote] They could afford one, and they weren't wheeling the TV out of the palace every few days when it wasn't in use to save .

Wasn't that scene done at Windsor or Balmoral? I can understand them not having a tv at a residence they only visit two weeks per year.

Probably Balmoral - which explains it. I forgot though, but I'm guessing you're right.

When I lived in England in the 70s, EVERYONE rented their TVs.

This seemed odd to me, but the picture was so much better/bigger than the TV we had in the US. The British broadcast standards for color were superior.

I think there was a lot of historical exposition placed in the mouths of characters.

No, Jackie would not have admitted to being drugged.

And, no, the Queen would not have known Jackie had worn that pink suit (not Chanel BTW) on purpose.

Yes, Jackie did indeed stay in the bloodstained clothes to make a statement. The Queen, understanding what it means to make a public gesture, of course would have recognized what Jackie was doing.

R392: We know Jackie said "Let them see what they have done" NOW, but at the time it would have been assumed that she was in too much shock/grief to give a shit about what she was wearing.

The writers were making the Queen far more wise than she is.

Someone's claim above that they are going to cast the next set of actors to look more like the first set of actors rather than the actual historical figures is just wrong, and the casting of Olivia Colman to succeed Claire Foy proves it.

Foy and Colman look absolutely nothing alike, although both look a little bit like the queen in very different ways (Colman more than Foy, of course). They are clearly trying to evoke the queen, not Claire Foy, by casting Colman, and I have no doubt they will also do this with the new casting for Philip, Margaret, and Charles.

I agree Paul Bettany would be excellent casting for Philip as would Harry Lloyd for Charles.

I don't think we'll see much of Diana next season--she was really not in their lives much until 1980. We might see a little of her when Charles dates her elder sister Jane.

I will be curious if Olivia Colman tries to get the voice down better than Foy did. Foy sounded upper class, but it's so hard to get the queen's voice exactly--it's so bizarre.

R395 The Crown left out all the bit where she is such a fucking scold.

R382, I watched a few youtube videos last night, all about the accents the actors had to learn. The one who played Margaret explained how the royal family had their very own accent, like no one else in Britain, because they had a strong German influence on how they spoke. Claire F. mentioned in multiple videos how Elizabeth says "One" like no one else in Britain. All the actors mentioned that they had a speech coach there at all times who was very particular and thorough. (They joked he carried a cattle prod.)

I don't know though, I suppose Margaret was supposed to be drunk too.

What was going on with the editing in the final episode? I think the Queen went up to Balmoral in the spring, but then it was snowing, and then towards the end she was cutting bright, full roses outside while there were leafless trees in the background.

The one who played Margaret = Vanessa Kirby

I love the actress who plays Margaret. She does a great job of making Elizabeth seem dull.

BTW, some of the cinematography is lovely. And stunning in 4K, although I get the impression only some shots were SHOT in 4K, The scene with Jackie going up the stairs with all the guards was great in 4K.

Although the CGI for the Britannia and the Royal Wedding were done no favors by the higher resolution on a big screen TV.

That makes sense r397. I guess I notice it more with Margaret than Elizabeth, but she's also more emotional when she talks. I might re-watch a few parts & see if I can find examples. I'm sure they are all the "correct" way of saying things as the family pronounced them given all the work that has gone into it. Margaret's version just sounds strange every so often.

Thank you R399, I was being lazy, although I've looked her up a couple of times now. She's quite talented.

I have such respect for all of these British actors; I like how so many perform on the stage as well, like true thespians. If I had a child who wanted to become an actor or actress I'd encourage him or her to study over in England (if possible).

R401, I just remembered that one of the videos was about something I think was called a "dropped vowel." The guy was showing how when Elizabeth said the word "man" it sounded more like "men."

Maybe Margaret's character was also being more whiney/melodramatic too. Or maybe more upper crust/prissy?

That describes it actually. Maybe Kirby just held the vowel longer & it was more noticeable.

Instead of "that" - it's more like "thet"

At the end, you see Margaret asking Elizabeth to tell her if there was "something she knew" about the fiance... but I am still puzzled (despite the mess with Townsend) why she did't say anything. After they investigated him & found what he was doing - Elizabeth should've said something. She wouldn't have ruined the situation to tell the truth and still let Margaret decide what to do with the info. By not telling her (well, assuming this all happened) - she set her up for failure and more scandal.

Sorry, it's actually called the "trap vowel."

I go the impression from that video that Vanessa Kirby had an onset fling with Matthew Goode.

[quote]After they investigated him & found what he was doing - Elizabeth should've said something

I think the show imputes information to characters as a way of providing historical exposition to the audience.

So Elizabeth is told about all of Tony's affairs and that he is bisexual on the show.

But I doubt this happened in reality. From the accounts I have read, Elizabeth and her mother were very pro Armstrong Jones. I doubt that would have been the case had the Queen known, in the 50s, that he sucked dick.

Then again, Margaret already held it against her sister for ruining her first romance, so Elizabeth may have thought, "I'm not going to take the blame this time, too. You silly git."

[quote] At the end, you see Margaret asking Elizabeth to tell her if there was "something she knew" about the fiance... but I am still puzzled (despite the mess with Townsend) why she did't say anything. After they investigated him & found what he was doing - Elizabeth should've said something.

The point they were making was that after the mess with Townsend and Margaret's repeated accusations against Elizabeth ruining her life by preventing that marriage marriage, there was just no way Elizabeth could tell Margaret that Tony Armstrong-Jones was a bisexual cad and slut without making Margaret hate her more. Margaret would undoubtedly have gone with the wedding just to spite her sister. Margaret married Armstrong-Jones as a consenting adult, and had to be responsible in the end for her own bad choices; Elizabeth knew that Margaret would at least not ever blame her for an unhappy marriage.

I think it must have been exhausting to be Margaret's sister, given how immature and emotional she was.

Then it must have been good prep for them for Diana, R409.

Except Margaret was interested in many things, particularly the arts.

Princess Di was an airhead. She pretended to be interested in things only for PR. But she never read or thought to go see a play.

I don't know how much the queen and Philip even dealt with Diana that much. They don't seem to have much to do with Charles in the first place. The queen resents him for one day supplanting her; her husband resents him for having an unhappy childhood and laying the blame on him.

R411 Au contraire, Diana was an avid reader....

of Barbara Cartland novels.

I need to rewatch it, but did any else notice that Charles and Anne were little kids in one episode and in the next they aged about 3 years. Also, I loved the scene where they are playing the same music from her coronation as she’s debuting her signature hair style and the exchange afterward between her and Phillip.

[quote]I need to rewatch it, but did any else notice that Charles and Anne were little kids in one episode and in the next they aged about 3 years.

I noticed that. There's a huge time warp in Season 2. Season 2 only covers 1956 (Suez & Melbourne Olympics) to 1964 (Edward born). Charles was born in 1948, so he should already be 8 by the time the series starts. In Episode 9, you sort of get the idea that Charles is aged 10-12 because the actor they cast is puny looking. But really by then, he would have been 15-16. They should have put the Charles boarding school episode before the Kennedy episode because Charles would have been 15 when Kennedy was assassinated.

I suppose another reason Elizabeth didn't want to tell Margaret about Armstrong-Jones was because it would have only rubbed salt in the wound that was her ruined relationship with Townsend who didn't have those same skeletons. It would have just reasserted how Elizabeth screwed up her fate and she should have been with Townsend.

Elizabeth didn't tell Margaret about Armstrong-Jones sucking dick because he was servicing Philip and she didn't have to do it.

Will season 3 open with Beatlemania?

My favorite scene by far is the Queen Mother being horrified about Elizabeth hosting common people with common jobs (like the car dealer and the bus driver) and going off on her "the stings and bites we suffer" rant

The Jackie Kennedy episode was the weirdest. It's impossible to imagine the queen dissing her sister to Jackie, or Jackie admitting to the queen that Jack abused her and they both took drugs from a Dr. Feelgood. There were a lot of clinkers in that episode: would Margaret also have been so bitchy to her sister as to casually drop that their mutual friend knew Jackie had said bitchy things about her at a party?

[quote]Jackie admitting to the queen that Jack abused her and they both took drugs from a Dr. Feelgood.

You're right, that's tough to believe. Jodi Balfour, the actress who played Jackie, is one to watch though. I think we'll be seeing a great deal more of her. The camera loves her.

The Profumo episode was very light - they could have devoted four or five episodes to that little affair - but the ramifications and fallout from the Affair were, well, titanic. It's one of the murkiest and sleaziest episodes in British public and political life (if you've never seen Scandal - no, not the Kerry Washington vehicle - bloody well do). In fact, if Netflix wants something really juicy to sink it's teeth into, they could always do a series on the whole little mess. The fallout lasts to this day (the file into the investigation, which has interviews with *one hundred and sixty witnesses* is still classified as secret).

I get the feeling from this season that they're setting up the sixteen-year-long saga re: Margaret and Snowdon's divorce. Look into that and you'll find something far juicier and soapy than any trashy American soap drama. Margaret was, well, a snobbish cunt and she more than met her match in Snowdon. What's even more damning is that the *other* Royals cared more for him than her, even when his multiple affairs made their way into the papers. Another thing they hit on was the common insult for the Royals is that they're out of touch with the everyday person in the UK - Margaret was the clearest example of this.

The one episode I found slightly disturbing was Charles at Gordonstoun. It's well-known fact in the UK that Charles actually "liked" his school, although he did refer to it as "Colditz in kilts". I always felt - especially upon hearing from a distant cousin of mine who attended the school in the fifties - that Charles glossed over a lot of what happened at Gordonstoun (if he loved his own school so much, then why did William and Harry get sent to Eton? Fatherly affection for one's school is incredibly strong in the upper classes in the UK).

Didn't care for the JFK episode. No one cares about JFK and Jacqui as much as the Americans.

The reason that the Suez Crisis was so prominent in the early episodes was that Suez - not the independence of India - was the event that slammed the foot on the accelerator re: decolonisation and the dismantling of the British Empire. Anthony Eden, the Prime Minister at the time, fucked up spectacularly. It also dented UK-US relations for a few decades (it's claimed that because the USA refused to get involved with Suez, the UK Government refused to send UK troops to Vietnam). Again, this is something that Netflix could create an entire series about. I don't think a lot of modern-day commentators understand how nationally demoralising and humiliating Eden's actions were - we had gone from an Empire to a political laughing stock in less than twenty years, our Prime Minister (Eden) had lied and manipulated the situation to his own end through Parliament.

I did have to laugh at the queen in the posts above who seemed to claim that the UK don't seem to have anything scandalous: darling, we're a fucking hotbed of scandal. Profumo was the biggest - so far - but just wait until the series shoves into the 1970s...

[quote]that Charles glossed over a lot of what happened at Gordonstoun (if he loved his own school so much, then why did William and Harry get sent to Eton?

How much influence do you think Diana had over that decision? Charles seemed to be rather weak-willed and I wonder if Diana was able to influence his decision.

Also, was Eaton the top school? I imagine any school in all of the UK wouldn't turn away the future King, whether he had the ability to go there or not.

Eaton is the top school. And it was closer to Diana.

[quote]The Jackie Kennedy episode was the weirdest. It's impossible to imagine the queen dissing her sister to Jackie, or Jackie admitting to the queen that Jack abused her and they both took drugs from a Dr. Feelgood. There were a lot of clinkers in that episode: would Margaret also have been so bitchy to her sister as to casually drop that their mutual friend knew Jackie had said bitchy things about her at a party?

As has been said, a lot of historical exposition is placed in the character's mouths: Things that they would never reveal/know at the time, but things that are generally known now.

That said, I find if very believable that Margaret would rush to tell the sister she resented every slight, but with a "don't listen to them" after telling her.

I think it is telling that Armstrong Jones's first TWO selections for Best Man had to be passed over when it was found they each had criminal records for homosexual activity.

But that Vanity Fair article, which oddly elides AJ's bisexuality, quotes a palace rep writing: "At least he's not a homo, as is so often the case now."

[quote]That said, I find if very believable that Margaret would rush to tell the sister she resented every slight, but with a "don't listen to them" after telling her.

I always felt that Elizabeth would rise above such stuff like that. I know that doesn't make for an interesting dramatic arc, but I can't imagine Elizabeth losing a wink of sleep because Jackie Kennedy said something mean. Elizabeth is on the throne until death. Jackie only had the possibility of being First Lady for 8 years. I think Elizabeth had other things on her mind besides Jackie Kennedy and her low rent sister Lee.

The actress who played Jackie seemed like she was on thorazine. She did attempt to drop vowels but it resulted her her sounding a little slow.

The line Tony said about Margaret looking like a jewish manicurist was interesting. I have always thought Elizabeth looked a little jewish.

Interesting that this was Claire Foy's favorite episode. It seemed the most preposterous to me, though her acting was marvelous and it was still fun to watch.

I love Matthew Goode but he looks so old. Do you think they aged him for this? The lighter hair does him no favors.

^^ He looked better when I married him. But, truth be told, he's rather small where it matters.

"Oh, Lillibet, you know I'd rather have tap water in my scotch than repeat this, but . . . "

[quote]I can't imagine Elizabeth losing a wink of sleep because Jackie Kennedy said something mean. Elizabeth is on the throne until death. Jackie only had the possibility of being First Lady for 8 years.

You know almost nothing about women, right?

[quote]I love Matthew Goode but he looks so old. Do you think they aged him for this? The lighter hair does him no favors.

I agree with this. They should have saved him for the next season.

The "Jewish manicurist" quotation was something he actually said.

Or just people r431. Of course someone like Jackie made Elizabeth feel insecure.

You think her position somehow made her above that? As they had Jackie say, the whole idea of a royal family feels very silly and outdated to many.

[quote] The actress who played Jackie seemed like she was on thorazine.

To be fair, that's exactly how Jackie was. Norman mailer infamously commented after the television tour of the White House that Jackie seemed as if she were stoned.

[quote] The line Tony said about Margaret looking like a jewish manicurist was interesting.

It was something he actually wrote to her in one of the nasty notes he left around the house for her to discover during their most intense period of loathing.

[quote] As they had Jackie say, the whole idea of a royal family feels very silly and outdated to many.

From all accounts, Elizabeth has never believed that herself for one moment in her entire life.

Charles and William: yes. Elizabeth: never.

My two favorite characters so far have been the two clearly gay ones: Cecil Beaton with his ridiculously pompous recitations during his photo sessions, and the hilariously conspiratorial couturier who urged the queen to "flaunt it" next to Jackie (even though the A-line dresses he was foisting on her were well behind the times).

R436 To me, no one can touch Margaret. That actress steals every scene.

I'm watching some of it again and it's definitely the "trap vowel" ... like "theht" for "that" and "whendsdee" for "Wednesday" . It sounded drunk before but it's just her accent I guess. Thanks R403.

I've also had a chance to look more closely at the sets... holy shit. Everything is just totally over the top. I guess that's why Jackie's drab comment didn't seem to fit (though in real life, it probably seemed drab). There must be 100 miles of drapery fabric in the palace alone.

I always have had an interest in the British royal family since the early 90s (more with the medieval Plantagenet age), but this show has made me realize how little I knew of the older Windsors, in particular Prince Philip and Princess Margaret. I guess due to all the drama surrounding Charles & Diana (and a lesser extent, Andrew & Fergie), there was no interest remaining into delving into the lives of the older members of the family. I had no idea until a few years back of Prince Philip's family ties to Nazi Germany, and I didn't know until watching Episode 9 that his heavily pregnant sister died in a plane crash with her family. Nor did I know of all the drama in Philip and Elizabeth's early years, or of Margaret's tumultuous relationships (no one was talking about her during the Diana years).

Good God, was the Duke of Windsor ever a precursor to the stereotypical DL eldergay! I laughed out loud at the birthday party he and Wallis held for their fucking dog.

I can't help but be curious as to if any of the actual Royals have any interest in the show, especially as we're approaching current times in the plot, where the characters portrayed are mostly alive, and will know what's true and what is artistic license.

I can't wait until the Diana years.

I can't find this answer anywhere but I'm sure someone here will know...When the Queen and the QM wear those jewels that dangle like metals on their sashes, why do they have little pieces of square fabric behind them? Why can't they just be pinned directly to the sash? It looks weird - like they accidentally pinned the fabric from the box it came in on there. Obviously it's deliberate and happens every time those jewels are out. Just wondering what that's about.

Woops I meant "medal" not "metal"

[post redacted because independent.co.uk thinks that links to their ridiculous rag are a bad thing. Somebody might want to tell them how the internet works. Or not. We don't really care. They do suck though. Our advice is that you should not click on the link and whatever you do, don't read their truly terrible articles.]

Ryan Murphy's Charles/Diana "Feud" is supposed to be broadcast next year. I hope we don't get Charles/Diana fatigue.

[quote]I can't help but be curious as to if any of the actual Royals have any interest in the show, especially as we're approaching current times in the plot, where the characters portrayed are mostly alive, and will know what's true and what is artistic license.

R439, It's been reported that HM herself has watched it and enjoyed it: I don't know if it's true or not, and can't post a link, apparently.

[quote]But it seems the tell-all show has been a hit with the sovereign, who has reportedly watched all 10 episodes of the series, after being encouraged to do so by her son and daughter-in-law, the Earl and Countess of Wessex.

[quote]According to The Sunday Express, the couple arranged for Saturday night screenings of the show in Her Majesty’s private apartments at Windsor Castle.

[quote]“Edward and Sophie love The Crown,” a senior royal source has said. The source confided: “It has been a longstanding arrangement that they drive to Windsor at the weekend to join the Queen for an informal supper while watching TV or a film. They have a Netflix account and urged her to watch it with them. “Happily, she really liked it, although obviously there were some depictions of events that she found too heavily dramatised.”

If she had any class, she would sue the producers and Claire Foy herself.

"Our snatch was NOT shaved!"

Carol Burnett used to be much beloved for her imitation of the queen (always with Harvey Korman as Prince Philip, called "the King," and Tom Conway as Private Newbery, who makes her lose it every time). Although she's obviously an American imitating a royal, she almost gets to a closer approximation of it than Claire Foy does, since she allows her voice to get into the queen's higher range from when she was younger.

Here she is in the first of the famous "me and the King... the King and I" skits from the 70s.

"They got VANILLA!... they got CHOCOLATE!... They even got COCONUT PAPAYA! But there is NO SUCH THING as ANIMAL FLAVORED ICE CREAM, you hollowed-out little CREEP!"

i'm sure the Queen loves it. She is portrayed very positively for the most part.

r440, you obviously do not know what a Royal Family Order is.

pity

Anyone can use Wikipedia, r450.

I've spent enough time on the internet to know that, NO, many people apparently cannot use wikipedia. Or google.

Yes, R50- obviously I do not know what they are, and that is is why I asked.

I did google various terms but nothing came up regarding the "royal order" . There are people more fixated on the monarchy than me who are able to answer. Sorry to inconvenience you so much.

I meant r450

Michael C Hall's portrayal of JFK was simply awful. You have a sea of actors with fine performances on this show and Hall comes up with this sub-par performance? SMH. He sounded NOTHING like JFK. A rare misstep for this show.

Claire Foy is consistently good. Lithgow from season 1 was brilliant. Alex Jennings as the Duke of Windsor is also very good.

r451, hunty, see r453.

You are wrong.

Are you people fucking retarded? If you do 15 different google searches and nothing comes up to answer the question - it doesn't mean you don't "know how to use google or wikipedia". For fucks sake, I finished a dissertation and got a PhD - I can use far more resources for research than 99% of the population. I doubt you've even used JSTOR or know what it is. Wikipedia is for idiots, written by idiots - the most perfect example of regression to the mean in existence. I don't understand why you're all so obsessed with "using wikipedia" as some badge of honor.

[quote]r440, you obviously do not know what a Royal Family Order is. pity

It's more of a pity you're such a insipid queen that you actually get off on knowing more about jewels the queen wears on her sash than other people. I mean, seriously, that is quite a bit of faggotry you have put on display there. Kudos to you.

LOL @ the poster above who thinks Philip wasn't cheating on Elizabeth constantly! He was an insecure man who came from a dysfunctional family with an insane mother and a distant and cruel father. His sisters were Nazis. He'd be working in a Greek restaurant serving Moussaka if it weren't for Elizabeth. He couldn't handle being second fiddle to Elizabeth. It brought out his childhood insecurities.

In another era where divorce would have been acceptable for Elizabeth and Philip(as Royals), they would have very likely divorced.

Philip really comes off as an insufferable and pompous whiner in this series.

Snowden's bisexuality was no secret. A friend told me he was in a pub when the engagement was announced, and the barmaid said: "The question is luvs - who'll fuck who?"

I was also interested in R440's question, and am happy to have an answer. Now let's try to be civil. Sometimes people are crankier than they realize.

I think if Margaret came from the right era and from the right family she could have succeeded in life. Don't forget, her parents didn't formally educate Margaret and Elizabeth. Margaret had to live life in a fishbowl and always be second fiddle to Elizabeth even though Margaret was witty and bright. If she could have been educated, she could have thrived. Instead, she became an alcoholic who smoked way too much and always felt unfulfilled with her life. She aged poorly too.

[quote]There must be 100 miles of drapery fabric in the palace alone.

The Buckingham Palace interiors are mostly shot at Lancaster House, that stands diagionally opposite Buckingham Palace. It was originally the town palace of the Dukes of Sutherland, and that delighter in rough-trade, ducal son Lord Ronald Gower. How he must have loved swanning in it.

With respect to the Duke of Windsor(King Edward VIII), the British government (people like Churchhill) were looking for any excuse possible to get Edward out of there. They knew he was bad news and an ally to the Nazis. Edward would have sold his country and people down the river and let the Nazis take over. Churchill and Company were looking for any excuse to get rid of the SOB Edward and to their relief, they found their answer with Wallis Simpson. Edward could come off looking as a romantic hero, abdicating for Wallis and British Parliament could be rid of the dangerous and crazy Nazi Edward.

Edward was really a vile human being. Look at the comments Edward made when his epileptic younger brother Prince John died. Edward referred to him as an animal and he was relieved that he died.

My favorite part was in Africa when Philip is presenting hole at Treetops (?) and QEII snaps a pic.

[quote]Edward would have sold his country and people down the river and let the Nazis take over.

Just think how many millions of lives it could have saved. Including jewish lives. Because it would have enabled Hitler to continue with the Madagascer Plan of merely shipping them out of Europe. No one likes to admit it, but when all is weighed up, appeasement was the far better option.

Yeah and we would all be speaking a second language R467.

I doubt they'll get to it until Season 4, but I hope there is an episode where Margaret is partying at Studio 54. I wonder who will play Liza?

R467 = useless cunt

If we just let the Nazis have free reign over Europe everything would've been great guys!!!

And the Nazi apologist is back with a different IP address.

STOP CHANGING YOUR DAMN IP ADDRESS, Heinrich. I want you good and properly blocked.

Ooooh, damn.

Those are some fine jewels in the crown right there at R466.

if phillip's matched matt smith's, lilibet was a fortunate girl, as those jewels are ones you want on constant display

In Anne De Courcy's biography of Antony Armstrong Jones she reports that everyone from schoolmates to lovers noted he was quite well endowed.

Margaret was the one who was dickmatized. Though perhaps both of the windsor sisters were size queens lol.

r474, where is that from

What went down for Phillip to be a German speaking Prince of Greece and Denmark? Was his family that high ranking in the Nazi party to get such a big funeral?

I still don't understand Phillip's progeny.

matt smith and his gf took some sexy selfies and were hacked

Actually when Matt Smith did "Christopher and His Kind" they wanted him to be naked, but the Dr. Who producers said no way, no how. So that's why you see that extra get out of bed and walk by with his dick flapping in the breeze. Coz they had gotten permission to show a dick and damn it there were going to use one.

[quote]What went down for Phillip to be a German speaking Prince of Greece and Denmark? Was his family that high ranking in the Nazi party to get such a big funeral?

Phillip was born in Greece, but his family was forced out when he was quite young so they settled in Paris originally. However his four sisters all married German nobleman and moved to Germany. Given Philip had little contact with his Mother (who was in a mental institution) and his father (who abandoned the family), what remained of his family was thus in Germany.

When his sister died, of course the funeral was in Germany as her husband was German and that was where their home was. This was 1937, of course Germany was ruled by the Nazis. As they have said, all of Philip's sisters were married to people associated with the Nazis.

R481- Thanks, but where does Denmark fit into it?

OMG, the best scene in Season 2 was far and away where Elizabeth is heavily pregnant and Philip asks her to 'role-play' being a barmaid. I was howling!!!!

In 1862 the first king of the independent Greek state, Otto, was overthrown. The next year the Greeks offered the throne to Prince William of Denmark (who became George I of Greece), the second son of the King Christian IX of Denmark.

So members of this royal family of Greece were styled "The Prince/Princess of Greece and Denmark" to acknowledge that legacy. I mean this isn't long we are talking about, Phillips grandfather was first king of Greece and he was very much Danish, didn't even speak Greek that well.

Hope that clears it up r482.

Thanks R484, so Phillip is actually Danish.

This series becomes more campy, schloky the older it becomes. It's beginning to make Downton Abbey look like Shakespeare.

Was Jackie K really such a two-faced, raving cunt?

[quote]Was Jackie K really such a two-faced, raving cunt?

Hell to the yes! There was a story about a Democratic fundraiser that Eleanor Roosevelt attended. During the dinner, Jackie's place sat empty. She just wasn't there. When Eleanor asked a close associate why Mrs. Kennedy didn't attend, she was told that Jackie couldn't get her hair right and so wouldn't show up.

^ wow. Unreal.

Foy played that episode masterfully. Damn, she's good.

Thanks for the clarification, R484. Philip looks Danish and not Greek in the least.

Phillip is Danish and German I believe.

Through his German relations he was related to the last Empress of Russia and they used Phillip's DNA to help identify her body.

[quote]DNA analysis represented a key means of identifying the bodies. A blood sample from The Duke of Edinburgh (a grandson of Alexandra's oldest sister, Princess Victoria of Hesse and by Rhine) was employed to identify Alexandra and her daughters through their mitochondrial DNA. They belonged to Haplogroup H (mtDNA). Nicholas was identified using DNA obtained from, among others, his late brother Grand Duke George Alexandrovich of Russia. Grand Duke George had died of tuberculosis in the late 1890s and was buried in the Peter and Paul Fortress in St Petersburg.[76][77][78]

Philip's grandmother was Olga Constantinovna of Russia. So yes, he was a relative of the romanov dynasty.

Would the royal photographer Cecil Beaton be what you could refer to as ‘a mincing prisspot’?

Beaton had more mince in his walk than a butcher's shop window, R493.

You know, I always like the comparisons between Snowdon and Beaton. Beaton believed he was creating art via the camera, whilst Snowdon seemed to believe that the art lay in capturing the ordinary or mundane or even extraordinary beauty in unusual circumstances. Beaton's work was always staid and dull, whilst Armstrong-Jones made a bit of an effort with his work.

I wonder if he really spoke that way to the royals when photographing them?

[quote]I wonder if he really spoke that way to the royals when photographing them?

I was disappointed that the final scene of the series was him droning on. Claire Foy deserved better for her exit from the role.

r486 Don't be ridiculous. Downton Abbey is tripe of the lowest order. Even the weakest of The Crown episodes tower over the drivel that is DA

Season 2 was a bit of a disappointment for me. Too much Philip. The Duke of Windsor episode and the Margaret/Tony episodes were very good but the Kennedy episode was awful and the final two eps were so drawn out. Foy is brilliant but she can't carry the whole thing.

S2 suffers because S1 had Churchill as a strong co-storyline. The blandness of Eden and Macmillian can't compare.

And, maybe it was already noted, but to the people who keep thinking/hoping S3 will pick up in the mid 60s , that's not happening. The producers have already said they're jumping up to 1970 or so to account for the recasting of all the actors. Which makes sense since Charles and Anne will need to be major players for the new series and since that will cover several years they'll want to have actors who can play the role for both Seasons 3 and 4 so they'll need actors who can pass for early 20s to mid/late 30s.

Besides, the late 60s were very interesting IN the UK but not so fascinating for the royals....Margaret & Snowdon were living it up but that's about it.

[quote]Beaton had more mince in his walk than a butcher's shop window, [R493].

Slay, kween!

I hope Season 3 begins with the company of Hair performing nude at the Royal Variety Performance. Elaine Paige had quite the bush back then!

Philip's family has had a great deal of tragedy. The show refers to the death of his sister and her entire family in a plane crash. And it will show the assassination of Lord Mountbatten and his grandson in the 1970s. But, in addition, his grandfather, the King of Greece, was assassinated. His two great-aunts, Czarina Alexandra and Grand Duchess Ella, were assassinated, as were Alexandra's five children, Philip's first cousins, once removed. And, of course, his mother suffered from both deafness and mental illness, and his father, after nearly been court-martialed in Greece for treason, became a boulevardier and died young. Philip, as a boy, had no real home and was largely raised by his maternal grandmother, Princess Victoria, who lived in Kensington Palace, and his uncle, the Marquess of Milford Haven.

Season 3 is supposed to kick off circa 1970 so that means we should have:

1) Charles and Anne as young singles on the dating scene...Anne dated Andrew Parker Bowles, Camilla's first husband 2) Anne's wedding....her kidnap attempt in 74....her equestrian career and Olympic competition in 76

3) Britain faltering under inflation. Heath as PM (with Thatcher in the cabinet) until 74 when Wilson (Labour) returns for 2 years after a messy contested messy election.

4) Margaret and Snowdon's marriage collapsing and her affair with Roddy Llewellyn and her suicide attempt. The Snowdon's divorce in 78.

5) Queen's Silver Jubilee in 77.

6) 78 had the Blunt Scandal and the Mountbatten Assassination

Lots of juicy material!

I love this show. Viva Vanessa Kirby, who makes me think of Elizabeth Taylor. I hope to see more of her in other projects.

I wonder if Bryan Singer was pissed that there was no nudity in the cold shower scenes with young Philip and his schoolmates.

Loved Philip's blue Bentley convertible, although I do wonder how he drove it to the airport, got in the plane with Charles, flew to Scotland, and then had the blue Bentley waiting for him in Scotland to drive it to the school to drop Charles off.

Dickie and Edward. What do you think is going on underwater?

[quote] Beaton's work was always staid and dull, whilst Armstrong-Jones made a bit of an effort with his work.

You couldn't be more wrong. Beaton brilliantly moved forward in the 60s. His radical minimalist portrait of the Queen in an admiral's cloak was recognised as a breakthrough work even then, and remains one of the best portaits of the 1960s of ANYONE period! Certainly no royal portrait has bettered it until Chris Levine's recent study. As another example, check out Beaton's portrait of Twiggy. Fresh, fresh, fresh.

Beaton's 60s Queen.

R504 That would be Dickie and DAVID. No one called him Edward.

Dickie was quite the looker.

such a royal BITCH

r507, thank you for beating me to the punch. r508 needs to be at the palace gates to receive a trencher.

I usually don't get into these kinds of shows but there is nothing on with Christmas and NYE coming up. I got to the scene where Queen Mary told Elizabeth that she is no longer just Elizabeth, she is Elizabeth Vagina. I was so taken aback by that. Why would she say this?? Does it have something to do with producing the future king or being seen as some kind of ancient fertility symbol in ancient times?

Queen Mary was portrayed oddly. When she came out in that all black lace dress and black lace veil, she did this slow & emotional bow to to the new Queen Elizabeth - and they seemed to have portrayed that in a very dark way. It was her son's funeral, sure, but they filmed it like Elizabeth was about to fight her in a duel later that evening.

But seriously, Elizabeth Vagina???

r510, you figured out a cute little joke to make, but then like so many Dataloungers, you had to ruin it by overplaying your hand.

Why did you have to repeat yourself? Did you think we would somehow not see it the first time?

Obviously I was joking about the duel... I don't really understand your reply.

r512, of course you don't; you'd have to acknowledge you own obviousness to understand. The wit in the place used to so charming and scintillating. This is simply pitiful and self indulgent.

Eat my vagina, r513. Wait - not now - there's a baby CROWNing right now... get it , CROWNing??

Ugh r511 is the same condescending queen from r450. I was wondering why that reply was so cunty for a stupid joke, but that answers that. Her stink is all over the thread, yet she complains about OTHER posters at this board was filled with so many people who were "charming and scintillating"? Gurl - you're far worse than a stupid joke about a name - and also the reason that "charming and scintillating" people don't want to post here.

No, r515, I am not r511 and r450. I am r450 and r513.

Lord save us from gits and oiks who are simply swanning about in their ignorance, family order or not, are not worth the time. Ta, duckies!

[R511, marry me.]

If they skip ahead to 1974 they get to show Princess Anne’s attempted kidnapping. She was pretty brave, basically fighting back and doing so slick moves to escape the vehicle when she saw the opportunity.

r510=Andy Cohen

Wasn't Elizabeth pregnant with Edward when Kennedy was assassinated? He was born in March 1964.

Yest she didn't appear to be in the rented TV room.

Did JFK really bum cigarettes from his wife? I found that most shocking!

Omg duke of Windsor was a damn Nazi!

[quote] Wasn't Elizabeth pregnant with Edward when Kennedy was assassinated? He was born in March 1964.

She would have been five months pregnant.

Ok, its stupid, but I cried. I was only a toddler back then.

How very telling that Jackie trotted out Caroline and little John John at that dedication to JFK at Runymede and yet Queen Elizabeth's children were no where in sight.

r524, it was not a tribute to their deceased father, you cunt.

Still no announcement as to who’s playing Philip, Margaret, the Queen Mum and Anthony for Season 3?

Philip will be played by Charles Dance. Margaret will be played by Zoë Wanamaker. Queen Elizabeth, The Queen Mother will be played by Brendan O'Carroll. And Tony will be played by Timothy Dalton.

Make it so, #1.

^^^Actually, HM,TQM is to be played by Miriam Margolyes.

For season 3?! R527. You are going way too old. Looking for actors in their 40s/50s

I found a preview of Season 3 with Olivia Coleman as HM The Queen .

Patient Zero is THE QUEEN!!!!!!

[quote]Margaret will be played by Zoë Wanamaker.

The only place Zoe Wanamaker would be playing Margaret would be on the sitcom "The Windsors." She's too old, too overblown and too elfin.

What about Katherine Kelly as Margaret? She played Lady May on "Mr. Selfridge."

Here is a link to Princess Anne and her husband talking about the kidnapping attempt.

This bit is priceless - when the gunman wanted her to get out of the car she said that no, she didn't think she wanted to go...

Her actual words at 2:09

[quote] I was scrupulously polite cause I thought (she chuckles here) it's silly to be, you know, too rude at that stage. And we had a fairly low key discussion about the fact I wasn't going to go anywhere.

While I'd love to see some of my fave Brit stars assume the lead roles in the next season of The Crown, I'd rather they were portrayed by the appropriate actors, even if I've never heard of them. I'd never seen Claire Foy or Matt Smith or Victoria Kirby before and that may have made their characterizations ring even truer to me.

Mathew Goode and Michael C Hall, OTOH.................

I just found this radio interview w/ Margaret and I realized Kirby's accent is really quite impressive. It can't be easy to pull this off.

We were not aware that the Queen was a Reagan Republican... alas... 8:01-8:30

And just how far into Alzhimer's was the gipper here anyway? Look at Nancy. She's watching him like a hawk as he makes some bumbling comments about supervisors getting paid based on some "law" that fixes their salary to the # of people they supervise.

Reagan talked like he almost made sense r536. In government a supervisor is measured by the range of the number of subordinates. If there is a reduction in subordinates, the supervisor is either downgraded or transferred or more employees are moved under the supervisor. He hoodwinked the Queen and she fell for it. The original Republiconjob.

By the time they get to the adult Diana years (Season 5), Keira Knightley will be old enough to play the role she was meant for.

Oh - in government... ok makes sense now. thanks r537. I thought Reagan was just generalizing about all companies & I was like... I highly doubt there was a law like that in the 80s. But, with the government's ridiculous administration and bureaucracy that makes sense.

I was surprised at the Queen's comment that "all democracies are bankrupt now... because of the way the services have been planned for people to grab" as if ms. thing hadn't grabbed quite a few services of her own.

Matt Smith's Mapplethorp movie should be coming out soon.

From Philip to fisting.

Now THAT is stretch!

[quote] Christmas and NYE coming up. I got to the scene where Queen Mary told Elizabeth that she is no longer just Elizabeth, she is Elizabeth Vagina. I was so taken aback by that.

9/10. Elizabeth Vagina could be DL's new "WHET." Well done, r510.

read the thread r541, who are you r510 trying to save face way down thread?

Already excoriated and dismissed.

0/0

R542 is the policewoman of this thread. Her cunt has stunk it up mightily (and most foul).

Quick side question: The series often uses the term "one another" when referring to just two people. In the U.S., I was always taught that the correct term is "each other." In the U.K., is "one another" acceptable when referring to just two people?

Sorry, I am the fresh, dewy ingenue of this thread. And I agree, R542's pussy truly stinks. I think less time spent "excoriating" others and more attention to personal hygiene is the answer. Elizabeth Vagina...long may she reign.

Elizabeth Vagina shall not happen.

word is it is a little fox

I'm LOVING the second season to bits. it paints prince philip as a HUGE cad

[quote]The show refers to the death of his sister and her entire family

You mean his favorite nazi sister and her entire family?

Yeah, not too bothered by that.

And the interminable funeral for his favorite nazi sister and her entire family was truly tedious.

Casting a thin actress as Queen Elizabeth The Queen Mother was unforgivable. The Queen Mother had pumpkin shaped head, she was short but very plump. David and Wallis used to call her “cookie” or “cake” behind her back, which they also did on the series, however on the series it didn’t ring authentic. They also got her hair wrong, the QM was still dying it a glossy black at the time of the coronation.

it's true that the queen mum was a little muffin of a woman

[quote]Was Jackie K really such a two-faced, raving cunt?

I'm surprised no one has responded to this yet.

My understanding is yes, she absolutely was. I do know for sure that she was very popular at Miss Porter's which cannot happen unless you are a terrible snob who takes at least some delight in being vicious. It's kind of what the school is renowned for.

As for her constantly turning her American nose up at royalty I have to wonder if some of that was due to her own insecurities about her social status. Wasn't she the daughter of a very ambitious social climber? And she was a Catholic. There had to have been some feeling of a being a bit of an imposter in some of the circles she found herself in.

Then of course there was the comment she made to Oleg Cassini about her outfits having to be original so that she won't see any "fat little women hopping around in them." It's not that the comment is so outlandish, but it does come across as immature and petty. Very Miss Porter's though.

Am I blind?

Victoria Hamilton, who played the Queen Mum, looked perfectly plump and pie-faced to me. She didn't look any less than her real life counterpart than Claire Foy or Matt Smith.

[quote]Victoria Hamilton, who played the Queen Mum, looked perfectly plump and pie-faced to me.

But not as plump as the Queen Mother actually was. She was a real porker.

lol @ you signing that Bar Bush!

I'm surprised that the King ended up with the QM when he could've probably done a bit better.

Hamilton looks NOTHING like the QM. Helena Bonham Carter was better casting.

Just finished watching Season 2. It started slow but WOW, the last few episodes were each amazing. Interestingly, when Elizabeth is just watching the events, it gets more involving. She really is a bland queen, but she's exactly why the monarchy has survived despite being ridiculous in the 21st century.

It's amazing that the QM lived as long as she did, with being so fat and drunk all the time.

[quote]It's amazing that the QM lived as long as she did, with being so fat and drunk all the time.

The woman had zero stress in her life. If all you had to do was sit around all day and push buttons to get a gin & tonic, you'd live as long as she did too.

Apparently she was a smoker too, if this is accurate. I have had a hard time finding out. (It's in the answer on top - the question is about The Queen, but someone mentioned the whole family around her smoked & she did not).

yeah, I found it odd that the queen was the only one not to smoke.

Glad I found this thread. Just watched the show and totally loved it!

Thought Season 2 was better than Season 1.

Best Episodes: The ones that revealed the Duke of Windsor's Nazi ties and the childhood of Philip. Both were just devastating. Honorable Mention to the episode that introduced Tony A-J. Vanessa Kirby's acting was on pointe.

Best Acting: Claire Foy certainly was the stiff controlled queen I always see. She did incredibly well but had the most limited range to work with. Matt Smith was fantastic as the frustrated father w/Charles in the airplane scene. And that entire episode tore me to bits. Huge props for both young actors playing Charles and Philip. But really Vanessa Kirby and Alex Jennings are the stand outs. They elevate every scene.

Meh: Adding drama to Philip's sister's story. Good Lord it's sad enough. The PMs except John Lithgow. The final episode.

Yes!: Whenever Tommy came to the rescue. The amazing cinematography and writing quality. Greg Wise as Louis Mountbatten.

The absolute best expression Foy had was when she confronted her husband about his ties to the Profumo scandal osteopath. It was a stunning mixture of exasperation and hope. That one moment alone was enough to elevate her as a supreme actress

Hey, Samantha Spiro loon, she’s in an Oscar Wilde play in the West End so she wouldn’t have been available to play Margaret, anyway. She can be in Season 4 as Babs Windsor who no doubt was getting porked by Philip.

[quote]Babs Windsor who no doubt was getting porked by Philip.

Babs Windsor got around. She went on one date with the non-gay Kray twin. I guess it only took one date with her.

[quote]Hey, Samantha Spiro loon,

Fie! Fie upon you!! I've played Kate in Shrew, I've played Adelaide in Guys & Dolls, I've even played Fanny Fucking Brice. I could play Margaret, HRH.

Spiro is too vertically challenged to play Margaret.

Foy was perfect.

Phillip is more physically intimidating in his masculinity and -when young - Germanic handsomeness. Icy blue eye gaze cuts right through you.

Queen Mum was wildly wrong: in real life, very ebullient, upbeat and sardonic. In a word: bouyant. One of life's winners, who lived it as such. (Lots of energy -- after she left the bedroom at 11am.) Not downbeat, sour, puzzled and irritated as she was played in the series. Never, never, never, never, never, a thousand times never!

I want a threesome with the guys who play Mountbatten and Tommy!

HOpeful for Paul Bettany to play Philip next.

Yes, Spiro is 5 inches taller than Princess Margaret, but Vanessa Kirby is 6 inches taller.

Wait! Helena Bonham Carter is only 1 inch taller than Margaret. Lets hire her!

let's hire anyone

Did you know that every morning a bagpipe player stood in the yard at Clarence House to play for the Queen Mother as she was awakening?

Who shall be cast as the bagpipe player? Will there be a scene where the Queen Mother flashes her tits at the man? Or will there be a scene where she opens the window and yells "I bloody left Scotland years ago. Knock that shit off. Rudolph, you poof, bring me a gin and tonic."

[quote]Did you know that every morning a bagpipe player stood in the yard at Clarence House to play for the Queen Mother as she was awakening?

Dear god in heaven that would be annoying.

Helena Bonham Carter is playing Margaret?

[quote]Helena Bonham Carter is playing Margaret?

Not strident enough. We need to see a Margaret with fire. We need to see a gutsy, ballsy Margaret.

she's a whore, darlin'

HBC drunk off her tits at a New Year's party not a week ago. In other words, the perfect fit for Margaret.

excellence

HBC is ideal. Never thought she would accept since she was QM already. And I think she got an Oscar for it.

Will need a strong Tony now.

And I'm still dreaming of Paul Bettany for Philip

I think David Tennent could play Philip but he’s already been paired with Colman on three seasons of Broadchurch. Michael Sheen is apparently in the running but he’d be horrible for Philip.

Helena Bonham Carter? miscast

Helena Bonham Carter does not have an Oscar but she did have the honor of being nominated.

Why HBC? Why not hire a lesser-known actress for the role? Nicola Walker would have been great as Margaret she kinda looks like Kirby too

[quote]Why HBC? Why not hire a lesser-known actress for the role?

Because it is Helena Bonham Carter? Why would they go for some no name when they have an actress of her proven talent and high profile name recognition that wants to do it?

That's an easier decision for any producer.

R585 Because HBC is HBC, and HBC gets anything she wants, bitch! Can't believe anyone would ever ask that question, least of all here on DL. I bet the showrunners couldn't believe their luck when an A-lister said yes.

R585 HBC is fantastic. She's a huge get and adds even more prestige to the show. Other high profile actors will want to hump on board now too. And Margaret sounds like the best role for the next round. Liz will be boring Liz. Phil will philander and yell. Charles will meet Millie and then dump her. Greg Wise had BETTER come back as Louie. Anne should be a bit interesting. She gets a wedding and a kidnappping attempt. But really Margaret's total breakdown sounds like the real juice...

I think Nicola Walker is a great actress. But there's no way she would be believed as Margaret. She's too earthy.

R57 that isn't 1944. It's Margaret right after she announced she wasn't going to marry Group Captain Townsend.

Helena Fucking Bonham Carter? Do you promise to bleach her moustache? And for what role? One of the Corgis? As Margot, you say? Too bloody ugly.

Just started S1 in the last few weeks. Almost done with it.

Love Claire Foy. Matt Smith is great as Phillip, and for the first time, I find him sexy. And Vanessa Kirby is perfect.

I agree with the posted upthread who said that the Queen Mum is all wrong. She was as the earlier poster said, ebuillient. A younger June Whitfield (Edina's mother) would have been more the physical/emotional type. The actress playing "Cookie" now reminds me too much of Cora on Downton. Just as dire.

I have a new appreciation for John Lithgow. In the haze of 3rd Rock From The Sun I've forgotten how fantastic he could be (I mean, Roberta from Garp is in his range) and definitely think he did fantastic work as Churchill.

I do think the casting of Helena BC is curious. Partly because she's very well known, and partly because I don't see her as late period Margaret. I would think for this time frame they need someone who would much more adequately capture 60s/70s-esque Margaret.

Even if she wasn't literally hanging out with them, THAT Margaret would have been more the Onassis/Warhol/Studio 54 era one, if not in actual attendance, then in the soggy, decaying despair of the exceedingly wealthy - especially after her divorce.

(Is there to be a part 2, or will the other unfinished thread be used?)

I say this thread is far more intriguing and exciting than the series itself! Some of the facts are waaay off, but the basic interplay of civilised disagreement is right up there.

R408 viz. HM and the QM being pro-Armstrong-Jones. Noel Coward was lunching with them and mentioned the engagement and in his diaries said a distinct froideur ensued.

I always thought the Queen referred to herself in the plural. "We are not amused." How come that isn't written into the series?

The Royal We, of course.

One is not amused.

One is an old cunt and a useless drain on the British economy, too.

Ta ta and cheerio!