7th Heaven

I loved this show when it originally aired. Now I can't help but think about all the kids Stephen Collins was around.

Annie was so fucking insufferable, but in the later seasons Lucy and Ruthie weren't much better. Simon and Happy were my faves.

this show would make even the sanest person in the world join ISIS. BTW, what happened to the paedo who played the dad? Is he in jail?

It was evident early on that Jessica was a lesbian.

I love when the sent the daughter away because she so "bad" and "evil" by going to the movies everyday to watch...CARTOONS!

This show was proto-Duggers. Too many fucking kids and not enough parenting. Kid causes trouble? Just ship 'em off to relatives so you don't have to worry about it.

I'm shocked no one ever picked up on the subtext.

I think i read that originally in the pilot Matt and Mary were supposed to kiss.

Wait, the Dad was a pedo? GROSS.

I watched maybe one episode during its heyday. I hated Ashlee Simpson, though, so that was it for me. Is it worth watching for Camp Value? I tried watching Dawson's Creek last year and it was terrible, even with all of the future Oscar/Emmy nominees.

R7 If you thought DC was bad.......

Dawson's Creek... what a joke. Wasn't every single episode a rip-off of an 80's movie?

google Stephen Collins sex scandal, r7

It was the beginning of the end.

I was most disturbed by Catherine Hicks's Ann Wilson-style weight gain over the course of the series.

The episode with Shiri Appleby as a gang member was pretty funny.

[quote]I was most disturbed by Catherine Hicks's Ann Wilson-style weight gain over the course of the series.

You're such a bitch, Nancy. I'm glad your kids got chocked out.

Back when "Seventh Heaven" first came on, a buddy and I would get together every week, get ridiculously stoned and watch it while talking shit the entire time. I miss being in my 20s.

By the final seasons this show was just brimming with male eye candy. There had to be some gays involved in that casting process. I remember how ridiculous it was when homely, annoying Lucy hooked up with that ridiculously hot cop.

Stephen Collins is a creep.

Who was the semi-hot guy that obviously popped Jessica Biel's character's cherry? The guy that the family let move in with them so they could all have a taste?

Still funny

The muzak-y score in this series always drove me nuts. I couldn't even have this show on as a background noise because of it.

And WEHT Catherine Hicks? Is it true she left acting to beco me a nurse?

R16 Do you mean Robbie?

No, R19.

More like this;

that "Lucy" character was one of the ugliest persons i had ever seen on a screen in my life. How could someone cast her in ANYTHING that requires showing your face is a mystery for the ages.

Which is now this:

Little Robbie all growed up.

The tattoos!!!!

I watched this clip that the poster labelled as funny. I thought it was actually meant to be funny.

I can't believe it was serious.

[quote]that "Lucy" character was one of the ugliest persons i had ever seen on a screen in my life. How could someone cast her in ANYTHING that requires showing your face is a mystery for the ages.

R21 what did I ever do to you?

Young Tyler Hoechlin

Annie flips.

Martin Brewer all grown up.

A very young DL fave...Shawn Styrofoam in the midst of a Tourette's attack.

George and Geoff Stults

Can they show reruns of this or do they do like the BBC hiding all the pedo TOTP presenter episodes from public view? Stephen Collins is America's Jimmy Saville, but without the hideously ugly exterior.

Used to see reruns all the time but once the news about Stephen came out they stopped.

Steven Collins played Dan Broderick opposite DL fave Meredith Baxter!!

[quote]Can they show reruns of this or do they do like the BBC hiding all the pedo TOTP presenter episodes from public view? Stephen Collins is America's Jimmy Saville, but without the hideously ugly exterior.

The shows were yanked off the air when the scandal broke.

Nah, Collins was nowhere near as prolific, creepy or omnipresent as Saville. His conquests seem to be limited to a few teenage girls, that we've heard of. He was just C list actor at best. He didn't mix with VIPS or royalty. Michael Jackson's probably the closest we've had to Saville, appearance-wise and in the types of victims he chose. Who knows how prolific he was, though.

I always thought Collins was kind of hot. Too bad about the pedophilia. How old were the girls and how was he caught?

The show still re-runs in daily blocks (3-4 episodes back to back) on the UP network, and on some other random religious+oldies network.

They air it everyday along with the Duggar knock off family

It was easy parenting that they did on the show . When you kids behave badly you just tell them to stop it . I could raise 20 kids like that 😁

Did Barry ever come out?

Damn Barry is on his third marriage.

^and he'll continue on that path until he faces how much he loves a dick buried in him.

R37 His wife secretly recorded their couples therapy session in an attempt to extort money.

Barry had leukemia.

When his hair grew back, half of it was gone.

The way Stephen Collins described to Diane Sawyer, it was I'll show you mine if you show me yours type incident. He also claimed to have been molested by an older woman while in his teens.

Oh please, for the kazillionth time: It's impossible for straight teen boys to be molested by older women.

101% of them start jacking off to that scenario around age 12.

Stephen Collins interview

^He's such a hot DILF! How could anyone complain?

[quote] Barry had leukemia. When his hair grew back, half of it was gone.

Half of what, r45?

Aside from Stephen i think this was the only other scandal.

Any show that has the fucking DOG in the opening credits...

I don't think too many shows did that.

I still say those twin boys were mongoloids.

They shouldn't have bothered with the twins.

Barry Watson was the only reason I watched that show, hated Jessica Biel then and still hate her now.

For those of you claiming Barry Watson lost half his hair after his cancer, please show of picture, because I can't find a single picture of him with any hair loss. Unless you are claiming he went straight to a hair piece, which you can't prove and I can't disprove.

Shorter hair yes, less hair follicles no.

Always thought Barry was the prettiest lol

The lovely David Gallagher was a frequent subject of my teen jo sessions and started my obsession with thick brows. It’s why I love Joe Jonas, Nick Hoult and Dave Franco.

Though Aaron Carter was a presence in my life at the time, the only teen idol hotter to me than DG was Kevin Zegers. Jesus.

Just binge watched a dozen episodes on amazon prime. What a trip. Did David Gallagher ever come out? I’d forgotten all about Jessica Biel. She was good being the bitchy selfish one.

Simon got slut-shamed for having sex before marriage. David Gallagher explains it here and he's trying so hard not to laugh.

R61 and yet this type of shit was perfectly fine.

R62 The YouTube comments are so fucking funny.

"He left because she was too old."

I think all of the actors were embarrassed to be on this show (much like the cast of Full House was too) but just kept doing it because it paid the bills and always managed to maintain high ratings (until it moved to The CW and was finally cancelled). I know Biel, Gallagher and Watson just left and tried doing more adult/edgier stuff to distance themselves. The show got more ridiculous when they kept having the Camdens take in all these foster kids and adding more people to the cast. Those little blond twins they had were even worse actors than the Jesse and Becky's blond twins on Full House. Also, Ruthie was the weirdest casting choice, she looked nothing like her lily-white family and the actress was clearly Hispanic or part-black.

I think this pretty much sums it up.

The only tolerable characters were Matt, Mary and Simon. Only because Matt, Mary and Simon acted like how normal people would in an evangelical family that pressured them to be all holy 24/7. Mary going through a bad girl phase as a preacher's daughter is pretty realistic. Matt stood up to his family to marry a Jewish girl. Simon slept around. Lucy, Ruthie and Annie were the most annoying characters ever.

Barry still looks good.

Years ago there was a pretty hilarious blog about this show. They always referred to Ruthie as The Mocha Child.

Catherine Hicks is a treasure. She was the best Faith on Ryan’s Hope. She had a short lived show with Tim Matheson Tucker’s Witch. Great support in Peggy Sue got married! A great journeyman actor.

She was also Ann in the 1981 TV miniseries version of Valley the Dolls, R69.

This is one of the many Simon's gay fanfics

This too

Another

It seems like it was popular fan theory. Maybe that's why the writers turned Simon into a straight manwhore.

Nothing more awkward than being in your 20s and having your parents try to control your sex life.

Great acting from Jessica Biel.

I found this hilarious. The writers made Mary act out of character in order to write an excuse to have her shipped off to Buffalo as punishment. If anything, Mary would be relieved as she can live her life without her Bible-thumper parents over her shoulder.

Damn, I thought this thread was about the Janet Gaynor film that won Best Actress award.

It's really a terrific silent film (so many are boring), and the version below has the best music score for it.

Looking ruff.

I don't know how they could reboot this show. That trendy cool Evangelicalism marketing movement (think Veggie Tales, purity rings, WWJD bracelets, Touched by an Angel, coffee and bagel church sermons) has largely died out since the 2000s. I was raised Evangelical and even I knew that despite all the merchandising and attempts to modernize Christianity to keep us millennials to remain in the church. The stuff that was taught in church was incompatible with modern society and growing tolerance towards women's independence, homosexuality, marriage equality and abortion was here to stay. 7th Heaven was a relic of that movement to make Christianity trendy and cater to an Evangelical audience that wanted a fantasy world where Christianity was still relevant. That's why they avoided discussing abortion and homosexuality because there was no way to handle that without alienating both the conservative Christians and the liberal viewers.

Remember when butch Mary got hit by a car?

R81 LOL she didn't even try to move out the way. No blood or anything. Mary was definitely the underdog of the show.

She even tries to seduce her brother Matt in this scene

[quote] Remember when butch Mary got hit by a car?

I always thought it was ridiculous how they would act like the middle daughter was hot. I remember the guy she ended up marrying was ridiculously out of her league.

Beverly Mitchell is also older than Jessica Biel but I guess since she had a higher pitched chipmunk voice and chubby face while Jessica was already tall and mature for 14 they made Jessica the big sister. Similar to Justin and Frankie on Malcolm in the Middle

Part 2 of the almost kiss scene. I wonder if Jessica got into Barry's pants in real life

r84 they probably gave her the storylines and love interests they were going to give to Jessica Biel but Biel didn't want to do the show and hated her character.

Keep the YouTube clips coming. You guys have me laughing hysterically. I can’t believe they were serious with this show.

As a kid I remember thinking it was very sophisticated and showed “real life” issues. 😂

Ruthie also got Tyler Hoechlin's character too. He was prettier than her

Back when people thought smoking pot was worse than cigarettes, meth, heroin and crack. Also this show is supposedly set in California.

If memory serves, this was an Aaron Spelling production and he just could not stop micromanaging (or at least incompetently managing), which sent the creator packing.

Ruthie dancing and singing. Hilariously badly.

[quote] I can't believe it was serious.

R26, holy shit, that was so fucking overblown and melodramatic.

Young Tyler Hoechlin. Little did we know he'd be Superman.

[Quote] Lucy, Ruthie and Annie were the most annoying characters ever.

Lucy and Simon were my faves. But Lucy became unbearable in the later seasons (as did Ruthie and Annie).

[Quote] The writers made Mary act out of character in order to write an excuse to have her shipped off to Buffalo as punishment.

Well Jessica wanted to do movies. And she kept appearing on the show until season 10.

[Quote] Ruthie also got Tyler Hoechlin's character too. He was prettier than her.

I love that they had this continuous back and forth with Martin and Ruthie, only to have them finally kiss offscreen. Those 2 assholes deserved each other, but Ruthie decides to stick with T-Bone instead.

And Tyler was hot in the later seasons.

I've been told (by someone who knows her very well) that Cathy Hicks is now working for Chuck Schumer.

R96 here. Oops, sorry. It wasn't Chuck Schumer. It was Adam Schiff.

It's amazing to me that with her great beauty and talent Beverly Mitchell did not keep her career moving. You would have thought by now she would be a superstar.

Jessica Biel ended up as the long-suffering wife of Justin Timberlake and is one some Netflix/Hulu/Amazon show. We all thought she was a lesbian but naw she loves the dick. She scored Adam LaVorgna and Chris Evans too.

David Gallagher should have been in more movies when he came of age because he was beautiful. He looked amazing in this Americanized version of The Picture of Dorian Gray that is impossible to find anywhere.

David also was one of the few actors that actually resembled the character description of Dorian in the novel which was blond, light-eyed and fair-skinned with luscious lips and an innocent face. Almost every other actor or book cover model that portrays Dorian is dark-haired, dark-eyed and olive skinned.

R100 Why was the movie never released?

This is another clip.

R102 I have no clue. It was screened at film festivals but I guess they couldn't find a distributor to release it on DVD. The director did upload the full movie on YouTube and it got removed. For some reason he never re-uploaded it.

I remember flipping through the channels one night while I was on vacation in early 2006 and a new episode happened to be airing. I couldn't believe my fucking eyes. I figured it had ended in like 2002.

Didn't Trading Spaces do an episode where they redesigned one of the rooms?

R91 Brenda Hampton the creator was also responsible for The Secret Life of the American Teenager. Which is also hilariously bad and many people hate-watched it for laughs. But she did help Shailane Woodley's career take off.

r105 I killed my father because I had incredible sex and I enjoyed it!

I thought it was creepy that everyone in that weird family was obsessed with dating, including the 5-year-old.

Exactly. All the girls on that show seemed way more boy-crazy than average. It's similar in those Disney and Nickelodeon shows. It's like the writers can't imagine kids and teens have other interests and hobbies than making out and dating. And the parents being typical Evangelical types were so obsessed with the idea of their kids having sex. I'm surprised they never made any of them wear purity rings and do that vow of purity thing that a lot of hardcore Protestant churches do.

[quote]Catherine Hicks is a treasure. She was the best Faith on Ryan’s Hope. She had a short lived show with Tim Matheson Tucker’s Witch. Great support in Peggy Sue got married! A great journeyman actor.

Catherine Hicks also played Marilyn Monroe in a 1980 made-for-TV move, "Marilyn: The Untold Story."

R106

Oh God I can't breathe... the writers had to have been making fun of the radical Christian demographic with this show even more so than 7th Heaven.

I heard that David Gallagher was gay. Can anyone confirm?

He apparently was Megan Fox's boyfriend for a brief time before she was groomed by Brian Austin Green. She confirmed it recently in a Bravo interview earlier this year. But he could very well gay or bisexual too and Megan was an unwitting beard

R78 I LOVE Seventh Heaven! Charles Farrell is so beautiful and has fabulous hair.

[quote]I LOVE Seventh Heaven! Charles Farrell is so beautiful and has fabulous hair.

Charles Farrell was like a father to me!

Barry was in a movie with Helen Mirren and Katie Holmes called Teaching Mrs. Tingle.

Does anybody remember the Darfur episode? It was later on in the run and I swear they must have said the word Darfur over 100 times. It was absurd.

The only reason Matt was able to have long hair being a pastor's son which was frankly unusual was due to Barry refusing to cut it. I'm glad he didn't cave in it made Matt look distinctive and very 90s.

Secret Life of the American Sex

Mackenzie Rosman got all the embarrassing stuff to do. No wonder she's off the grid.

I watched the first 5 or so seasons back in the day. I was a WB kid.

R103 That's a shame. Wish someone would've downloaded it.

I haven't seen David Gallagher in anything after Super 8. The long hair and scruff didn't suit him at all.

R116 I have it on dvd. Kevin's done better lol.

R110 what an iconic line. I think i gave up around season 2. Thank God I never took a shot for everytime they said the word sex or i'd be dead. And I believe Ruthie shows up as a bad girl for a few episodes.

Secret Life was like Brenda Hampton’s mission to outcamp anything she’d done on 7th Heaven. There’s an episode where the brother with Down’s Syndrome hires a prostitute played by Jennifer Coolidge! It sounds like it’s supposed to be intentionally funny but it was written as like this big lesson about supervising your kids and knowing who they’re talking to online.

On that note, there was a really bad 7th Heaven episode that involved a bunch of Downies. They showed up near the end of the episode and taught all the characters a lesson about life with their simplistic, childlike wisdom. There might have been more than one episode like that, though.

Mary always got the best cliffhangers.

MARY’S PREGNANT

You know your show has a problem when the best actor is the pet dog

When I was in 5th grade, this happened. It was all anyone could talk about the next day in school. It was real water fountain TV.

None of the links or photos are working for me. Has anyone mentioned the episode where Annie threatens some delinquent teens hanging out with her son? She thumps her chest while she's doing it.

I like the episode where Lucy tells her entire congregation at Sunday service that God is dead. I never thought they'd go that route.

Mary beats up a bully and still gets in trouble

After Happy the Dog, Catherine Hicks was the 2nd best actress on the show. She was great as mentally unstable ticking bomb that was Annie

Didn’t Annie start going extra crazy after she went into menopause? It was like the writers were building up to a lobotomy story arc.

Annie has always been so fragile and on the verge of a breakdown. Her whole world gets crushed when a 5-year-old Ruthie tells her she hates her after Annie disciplines her.

R129 lol she tells that punk that she's brought 7 children into this world and she can also take one out.

R133 she really did. Annie should have gone on vacation and never come back.

Needed more shirtless scenes

The show has one of my favorite theme songs.

Some interviewers asked Barry about the whole Stephen Collins abuse scandal and he kinda just dodged the question

[quote]Brenda Hampton the creator was also responsible for The Secret Life of the American Teenager. Which is also hilariously bad and many people hate-watched it for laughs. But she did help Shailane Woodley's career take off.

I loved hate watching that show for laughs. The Soup used to constantly make fun of the show.

I was always hoping for the episode where Annie would inevitably cross the line and murder her entire family.

A spinoff would then follow her character as the head of her coven that worships Satan.

Has David Gallagher come out yet?

I have "7th Heaven" Season 1 DVD signed by Catherine Hicks AND Stephen Collins. He was on Broadway at the time in "Spamalot" and yes, gorgeous in person.

R142, I can imagine the signature--"P.S. do you have a 10 year old sister? Call me!!!".

As crazy as Hicks played Annie, she will always have my love and respect for both Star Trek 4 and Child's Play.

Plus her cute husband did the Freddy Krueger makeup.

She's married to Kevin Yagher? I had no idea.

The Annie freakout video is basically an anti-breeding PSA. Who the hell would want kids after watching this show?

Like The Brady Bunch, Step By Step and Full House, I wanted to know how the hell did Rev. Camden support all these kids on his salary in California. I figure the house is owned by the church but did he make that much money in tithes to clothe and feed not only his wife and children but also those dozens of people who they would take in?

The theme lyrics definitely don't match the show:

7th Heaven

When I see their happy faces smilin' back at me

7th Heaven I know there's no greater feelin' than the love of family

Where can you go

When the world don't treat you right

The answer is home

That's the one place that you'll find

7th Heaven

7th Heaven

7th Heaven

Unless 7th Heaven means neverending chaos

R148, Steven Collins wrote the theme song as a message to underage girls "home with me is where you will be safe, I promise!".

Hayley Duff should have been the superstar she so richly (thought) she deserved due to this show!!

Umm, excuse me R150, but she has been in a few Hallmark Christmas movies, watched by over 1 thousand people every year! That's, like, 5000 a decade, ya?

R150 I love how she's holding one of those plastic baby dolls lol.

Haylie Duff had a Hollywood career too, she and Hilary starred in the very iconic 2006 movie Material Girls. They were more famous iconic duo of sisters than Mary-Kate and Ashley, Jessica and Ashlee, Paris and Nicky and Kylie and Kendall.

R152 how much have you been drinking in quarantine?

[quote] very iconic 2006 movie Material Girls

Think you're confusing the song with the movie--the latter bombed.

R154 I was being sarcastic. They thought they were iconic but forgot they couldn't act or sing and made one of the worst covers in history.

R155, ok, I feel better now.

She snatched Simon up like a cheap wig 🥴👀

This scene always was bizarre

R158 you could say that about all 250 episodes.

The Stephen Collins thing is still so bizarre to me. He was such a warm presence on the show.

He left a warm presence on my shoes R160

It's baffling to me that his ex-wife leaked it. You're arguing about spousal support, so you kill your husband's ability to earn money to pay you. I get that she was angry, but that was idiotic.

I think it's funny how Lucy is the only one who resembles her WASPy parents in that show. Matt, Mary and Ruthie all looked too dark-complected and Simon and the twins were so blonde. I think Annie got around.

R163 Eric works so late and has so many duties at the church. I get lonely

The guy who played Mary's homeless husband was pretty cute

I remember hating this show for many reasons, but mostly because anytime a character had a phone call they ended it by just hanging up. No "goodbye". No "see ya soon". They would just finish a sentence and hang up. I wonder if that's how Brenda Hampton spoke on the phone in real life.

r147 they did specifically say the house was owned by the church IIRC.

I’ll be honest that I loved this show unironically. I wanted my family to be more like the Camdens.

R168 nosy? neurotic? Overly involved in your love life?

R169 if it meant I got to have a hot boyfriend like Robbie move in, sure. I remember he had a scene in a towel that made me very very [italic]confused[/italic] as a 12 year old.

This is how Kevin Yagher looked when Hicks married him. Horror legend.

[quote] I’ll be honest that I loved this show unironically. I wanted my family to be more like the Camdens

Me too. I always wondered what it would be like to grow up with a large family. Although idealized, it was much more realistic than other sitcoms at the time.

Most of the people I know who came from large families (including my parents) had small families themselves. My father is 1 of 8, mother 1 of 6. They had 2.

When younger I wanted a WASPY middle class family like that, so I tried to watch it, but it never took.

[Quote] A spinoff would then follow her character as the head of her coven that worships Satan.

There was supposed to be a spin-off with Martin, but Tyler wanted to play baseball instead. Smart move lol

[Quote] Hayley Duff should have been the superstar she so richly (thought) she deserved due to this show!!

I liked her character for the most part. But it was kind of random how they just brought her in for Martin to fuck, because he was dating Katie Cassidy, who just disappears.

R175 I wonder if the spin-off would have been just as preachy and Christian as the original show. Or would they have decided to make it as sexualized as the other shows on The CW line-up like Gossip Girl and 90210.

It would have been a cross between Mecca and Showgirls.

R175 I rather have a spin-off about Simon moving to LA as a naive preacher's kid and having his homosexual awakening and introducing his bf to his family.

I wanted David in me deeply.

Those Camden kids were so sex starved that I wouldn't be surprised if Lucy and Simon didn't take turns blowing Happy.

Can you imagine Annie's reaction to that!?!

R180 She would have laughed it off and walked away while quirky transitionary Muzak played!

It was only stupid shit like flipping middle fingers or saying a curse word that was treated as serious, urgent family drama.

One thing I distinctly remember about The Secret Life of the American Teenager is that the knocked up protagonist had a sister who was uglier than Happy’s asshole. I think Brenda Hampton must have bought the actress from the same Chrysler dealership as Beverly.

That mandatory racism PSA episode. That black family that appeared like once lol.

I forgot Gabrielle Union guest starred in this show. Again, there was this black family that appeared once to teach the Camdens that racism was bad. Ruthie looked more like belonged to the black family.

I really doubt Mary and Matt kept that whole purity thing before marriage. Also I forgot how hot Andrew Keegan is.

David was so, so sexy and hot.

David was very sexy and had charisma. I like he clearly knows that the show was stupid and is trying hard not to laugh.

R176 I don't think it would have been as preachy. But I'm sure they Tyler would get shirtless every other episode.

R182 is Beverly [italic] really [/italic] that ugly??

R184 it was the same deal on 90210 with Vivica A Fox. Watching Jason Priestley use black slang is one of the fucking funniest things.

The Camdens were weirdly inconsistent. They make a big deal over marijuana, premarital sex and not going to college. Yet let Matt grow his hair long and smoke cigarettes, let Simon have ear piercings and let Mary, Lucy and Ruthie date around or get married too early. I guess by Christian standards, they were liberal.

I hate that David never had a good career after 7th Heaven because he had great screen presence. But he probably didn't want to chase fame and was content just going to college and taking it easy.

R190 i can't really blame the guy. Lots of child actors get burned out by the time they reach 20. Like the Olsen twins, who also guest starred as bad girls.

R191 Back when they looked normal.

There was also an episode of 7th Heaven with Mila Kunis and Debra Jo Rupp together. The episode had Eric try to stop a guy from killing himself.

Ashley Tisdale guest starred on 7th Heaven too. Before she got her Disney makeover. Simon was a total chick magnet.

R189...Christians? Inconsistent? NEVER

Brenda Song too

Lucy got busted for wearing tons of makeup and talking to an older guy. Annie's reactions are always hilarious and Ruthie is such as brat lol. Also Lily from Grounded for Life is in Lucy's posse

R197 that is AMAZING. Lol, she’s not even dressed that slutty.

R197 she looks like one of the dead hookers from an opening scene of SVU

"Make Room for Daddy... Daddy's Home" - Stephen Collins.

Kids run away scared

Not gonna lie, I totally had the same bowl cut as Simon in r194 and so did both of my brothers. All white American boys who grew up in the 90s had that hideous cut for some reason.

The Funny Or Die recaps are great.

I bet Mary gave Wilson tons of blowjobs. Since having oral (and anal) sex doesn't count as losing virginity

Simon gets drunk

Another incest joke between Mary and Matt.

I'd have given Wilson tons of blowjobs and anal sex.

Robbie, too.

Mary scored all the hot cock.

Why is there no porn parody of this show yet?

[quote]One thing I distinctly remember about The Secret Life of the American Teenager is that the knocked up protagonist had a sister who was uglier than Happy’s asshole. I think Brenda Hampton must have bought the actress from the same Chrysler dealership as Beverly.

That actress on The Secret Life was a total nepotism hire. Her mom is Olivia Hussey.

I got ya number, Hussey.

Gabby Union sure came a long way from being the token black girl in 7th Heaven, 10 Things I Hate About You and She's All That.

AOL Keyword: The WB

R152 It's pretty funny how they do a slo-mo closeup of Hilary's gigantic fake tile teeth in that video monstrosity.

It's annoying how I can find everything else about this Dorian Gray film starring David except the actual film itself. I know it's probably not good but I just want to watch it for David lol.

In the wake of attractive female teachers being pervy towards male students. This scene hasn't aged as well. She even looks like Debra LaFave lol

CALLISTO!

[quote] The Camdens were weirdly inconsistent. They make a big deal over marijuana, premarital sex and not going to college. Yet let Matt grow his hair long and smoke cigarettes, let Simon have ear piercings and let Mary, Lucy and Ruthie date around or get married too early. I guess by Christian standards, they were liberal.

The weird thing about evangelical Christians and Mormons is that even though they hate premarital sex, at some level they recognize that kids have hormonal urges that will have them craving sex before they are 22. Their solution to this problem is to have them get married very early so they can have sex but have God be happy with it. This is evident both in "7th Heaven" and the "Twilight" books.

They hate marijuana--the devil's weed! a gateway drug!--, so that's always present in "7thHheaven" as a threat much more dangerous than guns and equal in deadliness to heroin. If they possibly could they would not have had ear piercings or long hair, but the child actors who played the parts were unwilling to comply because of course it's stupid to think you can prevent someone from piercing their ears or growing their hair long.

R211 Ha, that is soooo early 2000s. Takes me right back to middle school.

R216 I find also a lot of those teens who do the purity pledge and aren't given proper sex education still end up getting STDs or even pregnant. They are too ashamed to be seen buying protection or seeking out birth control and of course abortion is out of the question. If they live in the Deep South, it may be impossible to find a clinic also. And then if their parents find out about the pregnancy then they will usually force a marriage before the baby is born just to protect their "honor".

I still find it hard to believe that the Camdens supposedly lived in Southern California too. I know California is not as liberal as it seems but they seemed to live in a town that was stuck in the 1950s. I did like that Mary and Simon had some conflict over their strict upbringings and acted like normal teenagers would: rebelling and having premarital sex (in Simon's case).

If they do a sequel or reboot of this show. They better make it inclusive of LGBTQ. Of course they will kill off Eric and maybe have Lucy be the main character. Maybe have one of the younger Camdens be gay or trans. Have more Hispanics in the cast since it is set in Southern CA and the Hispanic population boomed. I feel Lucy being a millennial would probably be a more tolerant and less traditional minister than her father. Probably throw in a storyline about the decline of Christianity and how hardcore Evangelicals and also homophobia/sexism in the Bible have been the source of that decline.

If they brought this rotted corpse back, it would be cringier than Secret Life. Brenda Hampton got MORE insane with her second show, not less.

Brenda Hampton is the white female version of Tyler Perry. She's only missing the drag. Tons of hot guys in their shows while all the women get STDs, pregnant and slut-shamed. They both make campy messes and are conservative Christians who lack self-awareness.

[quote]I still find it hard to believe that the Camdens supposedly lived in Southern California too. I know California is not as liberal as it seems but they seemed to live in a town that was stuck in the 1950s. I did like that Mary and Simon had some conflict over their strict upbringings and acted like normal teenagers would: rebelling and having premarital sex (in Simon's case).

I wondered if the town in the show was based off of some predominately Republican Orange County type town.

R222 Small towns and suburbs in LA County, Orange County, Ventura County and Riverside County can be very white, conservative and Republican. But I still find it hard to grasp that every single person in that town they lived in had such uniform conservative views on social norms, sexuality, religion and drugs.

R221 hot guys, trifling hos, and good Christian values. Sounds like perfect entertainment to me.

Lucy’s friend is a cutter.

The one thing Twilight and 7th Heaven have in common is that they both pretend that Kristin Stewart and Beverly Mitchell are these stunning beauties that all the hot guys want to bang/marry.

Lol R226 ouch. At least Beverly has a bubbly personality going for her, she seems like a cock-eyed optimist. Kristin on the other hand...sullen, bored with everything, and the personality of a corpse.

R227 Beverly is a sweetheart and hot guys don't always fall for looks so that's true. Kristin seems boring and gives off bigger lesbian vibes than Jessica

God, that Brenda Camden / Tyler Perry comparison is perfect. Spot on.

Oh fuck me David! Damn sexy.

MTV (for God knows why) made a behind-the-scenes special about 7th Heaven. Brenda Hampton straight up admits she based the show on 1950s wholesome sitcoms so it's supposed to be antiquated.

You can tell Barry, Jessica and David are so over this show. Also why did Jessica mess up her face with plastic surgery she was gorgeous?

Jessica and Beverly had crushes on Barry. I don't blame him, he was gorgeous and aged well still.

Part 3

Why did Beverley Mitchell stick around? All the other kids headed for the hills at one point or another.

The fandom for this show is bizarre. Before Stephen Collins had his huge fall from grace, the fans would refer not to just to his character but Collins himself respectfully as "The Reverend."

r228, are you trying to suggest I am anything less than a stunning beauty?

She's had a little trouble with adult acne, the poor thing.

[quote]MTV (for God knows why) made a behind-the-scenes special about 7th Heaven.

I think they did specials on any show that had some popularity with teens at the time or did ok ratings wise.

R236 To be fair, I feel she was more relatable to the teen girl audience because as opposed to her other siblings (Matt, Simon and Mary) who looked like catalog models, Lucy looked like an average teenage girl.

I always found Ruthie after she went through puberty to be a bit basic too. Pretty but nothing really special or out of the ordinary. Yet the older male writers on seemed hellbent on objectifying her and showing off how well she grew up which comes across now as a bit creepy. Similar to Ashley from Fresh Prince but Tatyana was actually really stunning.

The closest the show would ever get to interracial dating. I find it a bit odd how even though Sarah is Jewish, she still didn't know the difference between Catholic and Protestant. Isn't that common knowledge? Also, they never specified what type of Protestant the Camdens were. I always figure they were non-denominational Evangelical though. They were a cute couple though I liked that Matt stood up to his parents for her.

Wow, Catherine Hicks really did become a heifer over the course of the show.

She preached so much about self-control but couldn't put down the damn fork!

R234 I think Beverly was realistic about her acting skills and stuck around because as mentioned before 7th Heaven was the highest rated WB show and on for 11 years. She made a ton of bank. Jessica and Barry tried doing Hollywood but it didn't work for them. Though Jessica is probably the richest of the cast due to being Mrs Timberlake now.

Didn’t Brenda Hampton create “Fat Cunt” for Kirstie?

r236 The acne is nauseating but it looks like she's actually grown into her features a little bit. When she was younger her face just looked so wonky.

Here's a candid shot of her at a fan convention in 2005:

And a picture of her more recently:

R246 She may not be pretty but Beverly looks like a real person until Biel who lately has been looking plastic af. Being Mrs Timberlake is a very stressful job.

Barry aged but still a beautiful man.

R242 She had the cope with her husband liking little girls and her own guilt of having all those extramarital affairs which is why none of the kids look alike.

I never watched a minute of this show but I still smile when I think of the DLer that compared the ugly sister's face to a Plymouth Valiant

Barry in What About Brian?

R182 I don't think the sister was ugly. She would actually fit right in the IG/TikTok big-eyes/big-lips Bratz doll look. Shailene wasn't that pretty either.

R235 He was a cute older man. The fangirls probably dreamed of him giving them special Bible lessons. I really doubt anyone watched 7th Heaven for the wholesome Christian content. That's why they casted mostly pretty people in it and had campy soap opera level drama.

Did Jess Biel play a lez on the show?

R254 I think it's agreed that Mary and Simon are the most suspect of the Camdens lol

Aside from the lip plumping, what other work has Jessica had??

And I liked What About Brian, so of course it got cancelled lol

Are Jess and Bev still BFFs? I think they were bridesmaids at each other’s weddings

R257 I think so. Jessica still mentions Beverly on social media from time to time.

Everyone in the cast still seems close. Even Jessica who unlike her husband, she didn't completely abandon her roots. Stephen Collins of course went incognito and actually married a much younger fangirl, he does seem sorry and seems to be seeking help which I honestly give him kudos for. I don't think he was ever rude or inappropriate with any of the cast members which is why they are sympathetic to him. David Gallagher still does the voice of Riku in Kingdom Hearts but he has no social media presence at all.

Anyone with a big family can relate to this

R260 that lava lamp! That phone! You weren’t a 90s kid if you didn’t have them.

God... I love how Mary was one violent bitch who you didn't want to cross. She probably was a dominatrix in the bedroom. Typical Christian mindset that violence is appropriate in family show but implying consensual sex isn't.

Matt and Mary give off stronger incest vibes than Greg and Marcia Brady. Matt always acts like he's jealous and Mary always trying to mount over him.

[quote] I don't think he was ever rude or inappropriate with any of the cast members which is why they are sympathetic to him.

Reverend Molesto scolded Jessica Biel for posing for those men's magazines and called it "child porn". I don't think anyone should be sympathetic to the hypocritical old perv.

I wonder if Jessica gave her any tips for this photoshoot?

R264 Okay I found the article. I wonder if Jessica laughing at him right now.

Melissa Joan Hart also got in hot water for racy photos during her Sabrina days. Miley Cyrus copied Jessica Biel and did racy underage photos also which got her in hot water with Disney. It seems all these girls sign contracts that stipulate their behavior in the public eye because children and teens watch their shows

Jessica and Barry also both starred in horror films. Jessica in the 2003 remake Texas Chainsaw Massacre and Barry in the movie Boogeyman.

I still haven't seen Boogeyman. But the Texas Chainsaw remake was ok. Jessica's outfit was silly though.

R269 clearly to show off her big boobs and ass. She could have played Tomb Raider after Jolie left.

Catherine Hicks came for Stephen pretty hard when asked about a reunion.

When the conversation shifted to whether or not a 7th Heaven reunion is in the works, the tone dramatically changed. Hicks dished out a literal seventh degree burn, and said she’d only do the reunion if the father was dead. Savage.

“I don’t know. I mean, we’d have to open with Stephen’s coffin,” she said.

R265 Jessica and Mackenzie were both just copying what their TV mom did in her youth.

R271 That's pretty much the only way they could do a Cosby Show continuation too. Rename it "The Huxtables" and kill off Cliff. They did with Roseanne too

R270 it was an amazing ass. And I'm surprised she isn't part of the Marvel/DC franchise. I think Jessica could pull off She Hulk.

I wish more actresses with her physique were popular instead of picking twigs and getting them to bulk up.

Beverly had a nice body which is enough for many straight guys. This scene is so awkward and clearly pandering to horny teen boys lol.

Also why couldn't they get a scene with Matt and Simon prancing around in their underwear?

R275 The uploader's caption: Bet the Reverend's loins were stirring! Do teenage girls do this in front of their fathers and brothers?

[Quote] Beverly had a nice body which is enough for many straight guys. This scene is so awkward and clearly pandering to horny teen boys lol.

This scene was so random. I remember someone on imdb calling Lucy a slut because of what she's wearing. Maybe they were a big Robbie fan.

Beverly was in an early SAW sequel.

Simon got cockblocked by everyone.

[quote] Catherine Hicks came for Stephen pretty hard when asked about a reunion. When the conversation shifted to whether or not a 7th Heaven reunion is in the works, the tone dramatically changed. Hicks dished out a literal seventh degree burn, and said she’d only do the reunion if the father was dead. Savage. “I don’t know. I mean, we’d have to open with Stephen’s coffin,” she said.

Which is hilarious, when I had her sign my "7th Heaven" Season One DVD. She took it, looked it all over and said and I quote "Oh my Stephen I miss him so" which I told him when I met him.

I love how Simon calls out Matt for marrying his wife just to fuck her. Everyone in that town Glenoak is so conservative that Simon's gf can't find a place to get birth control.

Mary was such a hot mess. The daughter of a minister who is a complete fuckup. The writers seemed to love making her character messy even after Biel returned. She was great foil and got fuck a ton of hot guys. Much more realistic to people I know from those strict religious backgrounds.

R265 God those pics are creepy. She looks like she is posing in her trailer for the neighborhood perv.

David shirtless in extremely tacky 2000s fashion.

Why would he want to show off that body? He looks like a 12 year old with zero muscle tone.

Fuckin' Datalounge.

This show is on CBS All Access so it looks like I'll be spending this rainy weekend binge watching it.

You're in for a cozy weekend R286.

R285 Pretty face but he's like 17 or 18 there so it's a bit understandable he's skinny. Unfortunately there's no pictures of his body as he got older because I hoped he filled out better as he aged.

Gallagher was cute as fuck when he appeared on Smallville as one of the Wonder Twins.

He had dark brown hair.

R289 David and Tom's amazing jawlines... yum

It stands out now when you watch the credits: for the kids, instead of age order, they put the boys first, then the girls. Can't let them Jezebels out of their place!

If David actually used his Twitter, I would tweet him about why that Dorian Gray film never released. Here's a pic of him with fellow hottie Josh Henderson.

Barry's hot af

R291 lol it wouldn't fly today in our SJW age

R294 Don't most shows go in age order? And it's not like David Gallagher was a big star.

And OOF that blonde looks BAD on Biel.

R295 Jessica and Beverly are older than David though.

R296 that's my point. The credits go Barry, David, Jessica, Beverly, Mackenzie. That's...odd.

R297 If it was up to me. Happy the Dog would get top billing

R272 Yeah, I was surprised years later to find out that she did nudity. It's hard to imagine her as anything other than a mom.

R284 That's an odd picture. Simon did appear shirtless in the series and his body looked way better than that.

I preferred the Texas remake over the original. It's one of the few exceptions.

MAD Magazine did a hilarious comic book parody of this show too that is hard to find online.

R299 Beth Broderick who played Aunt Zelda on Sabrina was in a softcore porno, nude and everything. That was also hard to process.

R300 I can't find many pics of David shirtless but he looks more filled out here.

[Quote] Mary was such a hot mess. The daughter of a minister who is a complete fuckup.

I believe Chyler Leigh (and her real life husband) had a part to play in Mary's downward spiral.

[Quote] She looks like she is posing in her trailer for the neighborhood perv.

Isn't that Maxim's target audience??

[Quote] Gallagher was cute as fuck when he appeared on Smallville as one of the Wonder Twins.

He should guest star on the new Superman show.

[Quote] I preferred the Texas remake over the original. It's one of the few exceptions.

Can I ask why?

R305 David Gallagher should guest star because they got Tom Welling back for it too. He still acts regularly according to his IMDB. I respect he keeps his life private. Tom is really private too.

R306 I meant Tom Welling reprised his role in Crisis of Infinite Earth crossover special

All these WB/CW shows borrow so many actors from each other I get confused lol. Tyler is playing the new Superman.

R307 fans were annoyed that he had such a short cameo. Yet they still want him to do another SM show. The man played Clark Kent for 10 years. They need to let it go.

R308 I have lost track of how many CW shows Katie Cassidy has done lol

R209 I'll be honest Smallville's finale was a bit disappointing. We get he played Clark Kent and that's what he signed up for but people just wanted to see him be Superman Superman. When Man of Steel was announced many were disappointed it was Henry Cavill instead of Welling. I'm more surprised Brandon Routh got a reprisal since people hated that movie Superman Returns though like Halle Berry in Catwoman, it had more to do with writing and direction than the actors themselves.

The WB/CW/DC and Marvel all use the same actors in everything. Ryan Reynolds (Deadpool/Green Lantern). Ben Affleck (Daredevil/Batman), Tom Hardy (Bane/Venom), Brandon Routh (Superman/The Atom), Chris Evans (Human Torch/Captain America) etc, etc. You would think they wouldn't want to cross-pollute actors from competing franchises but they don't care lol.

Katie Cassidy is in a lot of CW stuff I noticed despite many complaining about her piss-poor acting. I didn't know David Cassidy (may he RIP )had that much influence to get her so many roles

R310 i gave up on Smallville when they put Lana with Lex, it was getting a little too soap opera for me. But I understand the fans frustration at never actually seeing Tom put on the suit. Superman Returns is a dream compared to Man Of Steel. But like you said, it wasn't the actors but the writing. Though i'm not sure who thought Kate Bosworth was a good fit for Lois.

Katie was fine on 7th Heaven. I really enjoyed her as a demon on Supernatural. But her character got screwed over on Arrow, and I don't know what's happening with the spin-off. I can't imagine David being much help in her career, I don't think they were close. I had no idea who she was until I found out she was dating (my crush) Jesse McCartney lol

R311 Oh yes Jesse McCartney. He was the big heartthrob between 2004 to 2006 before Zac Efron took his spot. He, The Cheetah Girls and Hilary Duff were the big three Disney pop stars before Miley, Selena, Jonas Bros and Demi. I remember that show Jesse was in with Aunt Becky and Zac Efron called Summerland there was also a hot older Australian surfer in it too. I think Katie was in that music video Beautiful Soul (or maybe She's No You).

R312 I loved Summerland. And Ryan Kwanten is the Aussie you're thinking of. Although I remember finding the dad hot too.

Katie and Jesse made a cute couple. But neither of them are looking good these days. And his music career tapered off fairly quick. I think Jesse voices Alvin in the Chipmunks movies.

Jesse also does the voice of Robin/Nightwing in Young Justice and Roxas in Kingdom Hearts. I noticed a lot of Disney or Disney-adjacent stars voice act in Kingdom Hearts, David Gallagher is also famous for voicing Riku in Kingdom Hearts.

R308 I don't blame you for getting confused 😄

Who is that fugly Wonder Woman?

Ewww I totally forgot about the awful, talentless, nails-on-a-chalkboard voice Ashlee Simpson joining the cast. Here's a review of her on the show, it's pretty brutal but true.

Ashlee Simpson? 1 May 2013 | by strwrs1977 – See all my reviews Ashlee Simpson had to be the worst actor on the show. not to mention her voice was so irritating she should stick to lip syncing because her voice is horrible! the first few seasons were good but after season 6 the show just got rubbish! seriously why did they hire the less hot, less attractive sisters of two big pop stars at the time! the show really died when Jessica Biel, Barry Watson & Adam LaVorgna left oh and don't get me started on Season 11. by the last season only Eric, Annie, Lucy & Ruthie appeared and even Ruthie was absent for the first 6 episodes of that season. and the whole plot with them taking in the 3 teenagers! that was just a horrible storyline. the best ending i think for the show was the season 10 finale because everyone returned for that episode and it left no loose ends!

R316 a cosplayer who likes Superwonder.

R317 She was big in 2004 alright for that MTV reality show and Pieces of Me. Then SNL happened.... Her sister Jessica can't act either.

I agree with the reviewer, yes, every family show adds a younger addition to the cast as the original kids age but this show was ridiculous with it. They already added two little twins but I guess when Barry, Jessica and David left they needed more hormonal teenage hijinks.

R319 Don't forget this epic fail at the Orange Bowl. Being booed by 70,000 people is kind of a big deal and was the nail in the coffin after SNL. She deserved it because of sucking so bad.

They really went overboard with the casting after Barry and Jessica left in season 6. The show is supposed to be about the Camden clan but after season 7 they added so many non-relatives or significant others/spouses to the cast.

From Wikipedia: Geoff Stults George Stults Rachel Blanchard Ashlee Simpson Jeremy London Tyler Hoechlin Scotty Leavenworth Sarah Thompson Megan Henning Haylie Duff

R320 This

Hahahaha that was awesome R322.

Another IMDB review

Politically Correct is an Understatement

bonecounty6 October 2014

This show takes political correctness to a whole new level. This series is centered on a Reverend, his wife, and ridiculously attractive children who all sit at a dinner table together and talk in grand detail about all the problems in their life. Everyone is so touchy- feel and cliché, it's almost unbearable to watch.

These are the most annoying things about this show:

1. It thinks the world is black and white. It's wrong (and immoral) to lie, smoke, drink, have sex, date outside your religion, not go to church, not go to college, or even have fun.

2. The females in this series are so obsessed with dating and making out with guys all the time. Their self-esteem goes down the toilet if they haven't had a date in 2 whole days! I guess being abstinent makes you all horned up.

3. The little girl - Ruthie- is far too wise to be realistic. How does someone who's barely learning her ABCs understand the complex issues (and has a solution for) that have troubled humankind for ages? The little twins are annoying. Trying way too hard to be cute.

4. We get it, you're super hot, super smart, and super romantic. You're prince charming. They seriously hire the most attractive men they can find, have them smile for the camera, and say the cheesiest things. Give me a fing break.

5. They teach you that if you drink one beer, regardless of the circumstances, you're very evil. You're evil if you smoke, if you stay out late, have premarital sex, or even *gasp* don't go to church.

This show is over-the-top on a high horse, and think that Christian values are the only values you can have to be a good person. They teach you that you need a man everyday in your life to be worthy of something, and that having fun without it involving God is downright immoral.

Another hilarious one:

A show about parents who stalk their children

mariondowning-427-4693448 December 2013

The Camden parents are constantly stalking their kids and pushing them away because they have the nerve to live life without telling them everything. The kids constantly lie about little things and overall this seems realistic of religious families to me- having known children whose parents are nosy self-righteous ministers and gossipy self-righteous wives.

Every situation is blown out of proportion and the whole show does not make Christianity appear to be an appealing option for young people who are experimenting in their "finding a purpose" stage of life. As the siblings grow older they also join in on the stalking and nosing into the business of their younger siblings- like they are the moral compasses in the world. Also, the fact that the father feels bad as subsequent kids don't blindly choose to follow in his footsteps and be ministers shows the truth behind the indoctrination into religions (i.e. kids do everything their parents want without thinking about it).

If you are a family member who "rebels" by smoking a cigarette, having sex or even kissing a boy who your parents don't know (because they're overbearing and you have hidden him from them and lied) etc- then you are pushed away until you beg forgiveness or get sent to a psychiatrist (where you also lie and or just turn up and then leave). Even if the actors did "something wrong" (being paid to model- Jessical Biel) in their private lives outside of acting they were punished and ousted like the "devils" they are.

These nosy parents don't ever learn and they keep being overbearing throughout the whole series- even after self-righteous "Annie Speeches" that include the words "We need to let them come to us when they're ready" and "maybe they don't feel comfortable telling us" (ya think?). They're slow and I guess the producers are also ministers because they don't ever develop those parents beyond snooping stalkers.

Annie smoked pot

Annie Camden was a freak in her college days

Aaron Carter

David Gallagher had the best resume of the three (him, Beverly and Jessica). He'd already been in two feature films with John Travolta, plus TV work, when he was cast. Beverly had some TV work and Jessica was just starting out. It wasn't sexism that got him higher billing. It was experience.

The billing should have been if based on experience

Catherine Hicks Stephen Collins David Gallagher Beverly Mitchell Jessica Biel Barry Watson Mackenzie Rosman

Did the Camden teens ever masturbate?

R331 I feel they did everything except penis in vagina sex lol

Did they add Ashlee Simpson to the cast because she and the Simpson family were outspoken "wholesome Christians" who waited till marriage? It's not like Jessica's career was hot, she was more known as Mrs Lachey.

Of course now we know the real deal with them. Papa Joe Simpson being creepily incestuous with his daughters and also gay. And Jessica and Ashlee being party girls who went crazy from being sheltered so long.

R329 That would explain why David and Beverly were much more natural actors than Jessica who still can't act.

I though Jessica did a good job in The Sinner, and she got rave reviews.

R335 Looks interesting. I'll check that out.

She was funny on Bojack

[quote] Ashlee Simpson joining the cast.

"This sister of a B-list star will become a major D list star in 2004"

Tara Lapinsky was on 7th Heaven too. Not sure who thought that was a good idea.

R322, that was the funniest thing I've seen all day. You could replace "Ashlee Simpson" with "Millie Vinilli" and it would be the same.

Ashlee Simpson is unrecognizable now. We're talking Jennifer Grey territory.

R341 Ashlee Simpson gets a lot of hate because she was also a poser. I mean I don't know why anyone fell for her edgy "I'm not like the other pop girls" pop punk persona. She was already on 7th Heaven and came across as a vapid blonde like her sister. It's funny how all she had to do was dye her hair black, were eyeliner and girly punk attire and people bought into it. Ashlee Simpson, Lindsay Lohan and even Hilary Duff were all trying to copy that Avril Lavigne bubblegum punk high schooler aesthetic. Avril herself is a poser too but she did it first. Now they all went back to being bubbly blondes married with kids (except trainwreck Lindsay)

David Gallagher was in Boogeyman 2. So Barry, Jessica, Beverly, Catherine and David were all in horror films.

[quote] Ashlee Simpson, Lindsay Lohan and even Hilary Duff were all trying to copy that Avril Lavigne bubblegum punk high schooler aesthetic

I remember when Lindsay Lohan made fun of Hilary Duff and Avril Lavigne on her first SNL appearance. It was actually pretty funny.

R344 That's hilarious. Avril is still a successful musician with her fanbase and Hilary is kind of a IG influencer nowadays. Lindsay hasn't done anything of note since Georgia Rule. She is trying though to rebuild those bridges she broke, so I will give her that. But what she does have that the other 2000s teen starlets don't is a whole Wikipedia page on her life.

R326 How could you just drop a bomb like that on me?!

R341 Ashlee really didn't need a nosejob. It's always funny seeing them overcompensate by blowing up their lips.

R342 I can't really talk shit because I still own both Ashelee and Lilo's albums.

R345 Avril still has a career? And Lindsay was really good in Georgia Rule, but I'm not sure how much acting she was doing....

VH1 during it's "mid-2000s celebrity culture era" covered the Hilary-Lindsay-Avril feud and of course the Lindsay-Hilary-Aaron love triangle. All just typical high school drama but with teens with too money and cameras on them.

Megan Fox should have guest starred on 7th Heaven.

Even Kaley Cuoco guest starred.

R348 She should have. And Chris Evans too.

I find it ironic it aired on The WB, the same network that had racy sitcoms like Unhappily Ever After, The Wayan Bros and The Jamie Foxx Show, dark supernatural dramas like Buffy, Angel, Supernatural and Charmed (that would be accused on being "Satanic" by hardcore Christians) and of course all the teen shows with premarital sex like Dawson's Creek, One Tree Hill and Everwood and it was produced by Aaron Spelling whose catalog of shows are far from squeaky clean.

But apparently the show got a lot of heat from very strict Christians as the show never really went into detail of Christian doctrine (the show avoided using terms like "Holy Spirt", "hell", "damnation", "Jesus", "the Devil", "anti-Christ", etc etc) and they felt the Camdens were actually too liberal.

[Quote] But apparently the show got a lot of heat from very strict Christians as the show never really went into detail of Christian doctrine (the show avoided using terms like "Holy Spirt", "hell", "damnation", "Jesus", "the Devil", "anti-Christ", etc etc) and they felt the Camdens were actually too liberal.

None of that surprises me 😆

Beverly wants a reboot. I think it could work if they hire good writers and absolutely do not give Brenda Hampton too much creative control.

Somebody must be desperate for cash. I don't think anyone else would care.

Ashlee was later on the Melrose Place reboot. Barry later starred in What About Brian (remember that?hot guys on that show).

Beverly does seem to be the only one who still has a lot of fondness for the show. Everyone else doesn't seem to care. Barry snarkily said in some interview that nobody ever asks for a What About Brian? reboot, Jessica is busy with her new TV show, David went incognito, Mackenzie doesn't act anymore but, who knows, probably would be down for the reboot, Stephen well that is self-explanatory, one of the twins' actor died this year, Catherine may return. Brenda Hampton just can't write to save her life and her views are too outdated for the "woke era". So a new writer should be used.

[quote] Barry snarkily said in some interview that nobody ever asks for a What About Brian? reboot

Could it be that it was some show no one ever heard of that was cancelled after two seasons? I don't get people like him. It's not like he went on to some great career after leaving 7th Heaven. I mean, yeah it's a cheesy show, but it's not like he was able to do any better.

The only other thing of note Barry did was Samantha Who? with Christina Applegate. His filmography in general is very lacking and seems stuck in Hallmark/Lifetime movie fare.

[Quote] Ashlee was later on the Melrose Place reboot. Barry later starred in What About Brian (remember that?hot guys on that show).

Katie was in the Melrose reboot as well. I guess it just didn't have the same "spark" that 90210 did.

I remember my mom and I used to watch 7th Heaven while waiting for “Angel” to come on. When Ashlee Simpson started getting popular as a singer, I told my mom that Cecilia from 7th Heaven had a new music career. My mom said, “Really? I don’t imagine she sings very well since she can’t talk very well.”

R360 She's not wrong. Ashlee and Jessica Simpson trying to act was embarrassing. And the show dropped the ball when it became less focused on the family dynamic and more on trying to add more teens and young adults to the cast to compete with other teen shows airing at the time.

I avoided this show like the plague when it originally aired. Nevertheless, this thread was fun/funny to read. Some thoughts: 1) It's so strange that Beverly is older than Jessica in real life since Bev looked like a pre-pubescent 12 year-old and Jess looked like a model in her early twenties when the show started; 2) Barry Watson is married to Natalie Wood's daughter and they have a kid; 3) David Gallagher looks really different these days. He was in a Lifetime movie called Babynapped that came out in 2017. His hair is darker and receding and he's a little chubbier now. I didn't recognize him at all.

R362 It's nice to know David is still working. He has no social media and seems to keep it private nowadays. Can't blame him, he's been acting since he was a toddler, so probably just wants to enjoy the fruits of that labor.

[Quote] He has no social media and seems to keep it private nowadays.

I wish more celebrities would follow suit.

I can see his hairline receding here. He's still attractive nevertheless.

Interesting how David's hairline is starting to match Stephen Collins'. He was the only one that believably looked like he could be Eric and Annie's child.

Funny or Die’s take on the pot episode:

See, I would ONLY want a reboot of this show if Brenda Hampton had full control. Can you even imagine the trainwreck it would be as she took on today's issues like BLM and police violence, Trans issues, Karens refusing to wear face masks?? I would watch every minute!

Pray the COVID away, most of the Camden girls in the original were basically Karens so they have to take sensitivity training, one of Lucy's, Mary's and Matt's kids could be trans, bring back the Hamiltons for a very special BLM and police brutality episode and Mary gets divorced because she must never win or be happy.

Beverly Mitchell and Brie Larsen played race car drivers in an old Disney Channel Original Movie called Right On Track. Nobody would have predicted Brie would end up a big Hollywood actress.

I honestly don't get all the Brie hate. She was good in Room and Scott Pilgrim.

She was pretty good in The United States of Tara, Scott Pilgrim and Hoot. And now she's Captain Marvel. I imagine she gets a lot of hate for being outspoken about her beliefs similar to Scarlett Johansson and Jennifer Lawrence.

Brie, ew. The cheese and the "actress". Double ew!

What's most important for DLers is that the reboot has hot guys (preferably shirtless).

I am pretty sure Brenda Hampton is very much aware that the hot guys is what kept this show running for 11 years and Jessica Biel certainly helped keep the straight male audience watching.

The fan wiki is hilarious:

"Cecilia Smith is a fictional character on the WB Television Network's most popular television series 7th Heaven, played by singer Jessica Simpson's shadow and younger sister, Ashlee.

Cecilia is a really annoying character that, for unknown reasons, Simpson chose to portray with an irritatingly sultry, croaky voice for her entire run on the series."

"They were partly named after the R&B duo Sam and Dave, and are quite possibly the worst characters of the entire series."

"From the animated facial expressions to the constant state of perkiness, and then to the incessant whining, she is the single most maddening character of the entire series. "

"Annie Camden is presented as the perfect wife and mother, but has an interesting past. In the season 2 episode Who Knew?, in which Matt is accused of smoking marijuana, Annie confesses to Eric that during the summer before college she experimented with drugs, alcohol, and anonymous sex with multiple partners, earning her the nickname ‘All the Way Annie‘ — a moniker that would stick with her for many years. Eric is shocked upon hearing this and the admission will haunt him (and their marriage) throughout the rest of the series. Her experimentation ended when her friend's boyfriend drove under the influence and was killed. During her college education, Annie studied everything from art to business and economics, and in later seasons returned to school to earn her Masters."

R347 While on the topic. Remember this abomination? Pretty embarrassing to star in a movie called Raise Your Voice when you don't...raise your OWN voice. Especially when you purport to be a "singer".

Oh My God this is great!

Hilary made the worst covers ever. Not only is that Material Girl and Our Lips Are Sealed covers, she and Haylie did absymal. Her cover of Last Christmas is terrible and it sounds like she's trying too hard to copy George Michael's accent.

Jessica and Ashlee singing. Did neither of these girls get any vocal training? Papa Joe should have paid for classes. Jessica has a good church voice but a terrible pop voice. She's not Whitney or Mariah. Ashlee has no harmony to her voice and sounds tone-deaf.

What the hell did Jessica's parents feed her? I can't believe she's like 13 here and Beverly is like 14 but looks 11. Also this scene is awkward.

R383 Ewwwwww. Jessica's facial expressions and gesturing make her look like she is on the spectrum. They both suck!!

R385 Jessica did an awful cover of These Boots Were Made For Walking. I actually had the Dukes of Hazzard movie on DVD and it was a pretty fun movie but Jess can't act at all.

Miss PIggy's cover was better.

Jessica deserved an Emmy for this

Ruthie was darker than her siblings. At first I assumed she was adopted.

R389 Yes, Ruthie didn't really look white. The actress is part Lumbee which means Euro, Native and Afro descent.

Annie and Eric watch Ruthie kiss Tbone. So awkward and clunky. Also, they made such a big deal of Mary kissing boys but with Ruthie it's okay.

Interesting .... I didn't know Mackenzie was Lumbee. She really doesn't look that dark-complected to me. I just thought she was a curly-haired Jewish girl.

Ruthie being the youngest girl definitely got less strict parenting than her older siblings. That's probably why she's not as repressed.

I don't think Matt looks related to Eric and Annie either. Maybe he was also adopted?

I do think David and Beverly were good actors, their dialogue is very believable.

"Lumbee"? Who says that? Sounds derogatory.

She's not an octoroon?

R383 I liked Jessica Simpson's first two albums. I played the shit out of that song she sang with then husband Nick Lachay. I didn't really care for her when she started doing mostly covers.

So Mackenzie isn't Jewish? I thought for sure she was.

Her last name comes from her German grandfather who probably has Jewish ancestry since Rosman is an Ashkenazi last name according to that EthniCelebs link. She's from Charleston, South Carolina, so I mean I wouldn't surprised if she had a little bit of everything in her because a lot of white Southerners have black DNA.

Jessica can actually sing but she doesn't use a proper technique and goes way too overboard. She either tries to sound extremely powerful which can be ear-splitting or sound way too nasal/sultry/breathy which just sounds like she's making fun of herself. "I Wanna Love You Forever" is probably more of what she could have done and she could have been a white Mariah or more hip Celine if given proper guidance and vocal training. Nick could have gave her lessons but I feel he didn't want her to be more successful than him and let her sound ridiculous.

Ashlee sounded painful for most of her career. I admit Pieces of Me and LOVE are guilty pleasures of mine though. But she improved drastically when she married Evan Ross and he taught her how to sing. Kinda like Marc Anthony helped J Lo sound tolerable. Marrying into a musical legacy family like the Rosses made her get her act together because Lady Diana Ross wasn't having it.

Ashlee drunk.

R386 i remember liking Jessica's version. Also all the rumours about her fucking Johnny Knoxville.

R391 i'd really like to know whose idea it was to name the character T-Bone 😆

R402 that's tame compared to the shit that happens now.

R401, I didn’t know J.Lo actually sang, I always heard she used ghost singers on her tracks. Did her ghost singers get voice lessons?

R404 She actually does sing on her songs but they just blend her voice, so the better actual singers overpower her thin vocals. That's why she sounds so different on a lot of songs. Like in "I'm Real", she is singing the lyrics but Ashanti is clearly on the chorus. Everyone gets credited and paid because she would have been sued to death if not.

She's not really great or anything but I bet Marc told Jenny she better improve if she wanted to get on stage with him

R403 Johnny isn't a bad-looking guy and he's known to be nice, he probably made Jessica feel special which is what the ladies loev. Nick Lachey was a tool, watching Newlyweds now is cringe because he and Jessica had no chemistry and just got married to bone each other.

R407 i haven't seen Newlyweds or Ashlee's show since it originally aired. The only ones i keep revisiting are Laguna Beach and The Hills.

I never understood why the critics were so harsh with Jessica initially. People compared her to Britney and Christina but I always thought she was a more talented version of Mandy Moore, who got all the praise at the time.

Jessica's issue was her lack of identity. Her father ran the show and didn't how to market her. Unlike Christina who was tough, stubborn and fought hard to have her albums in her style which was R&B and soul flavored. Jessica was a naive country girl and just kind of did what people told her. She didn't have the charisma or dancing skills as Britney because Britney had more experience than her being on Mickey Mouse Club and also did a lot of plays and pageants. Britney also worked with Max Martin the hottest producer at the time. Jessica had the talent but didn't have the right guidance and sense of who she was. She and Britney are actually quite similar but Britney got much luckier and had better circumstances but her breakdown and conservatorship is tragic. Jessica is extemely rich and seems stable so she is doing well.

As for Mandy getting praise. I guess because her style was more low-key and slow jams rather than energetic which made her stick out more. She is more talented as an actress honestly.

[Quote] Jessica is extemely rich and seems stable so she is doing well.

Thanks to her shoe line. The alcoholism didn't shock me, but the sexual abuse did. I hope she really is doing good these days.

R410 Agree Mandy is a better actress than singer. Her (and Chrissy Metz's) singing in This Is Us was always cringey and I had to skip those scenes.

Jessica Simpson still sings. She released some songs for her book that are pretty good. She sounds much more comfortable with herself here.

The writers for this show was obsessed with having Ruthie sing and dance. It was cute when she was 6 but once she hit her teenage years, it got so cringey.

The gangbanger teenage girl

Matt begging his younger siblings for money to see some girl in Philly. Total SIMP

R414 I just remembered they did a musical episode. But I think Beverly did most of the singing.

The later seasons were so weird with Matt, Mary and Simon not around and Ruthie being a moody teen and the twins getting so big. Eric and Annie looked like senior citizens but had a teen daughter and two annoying little twins to raise. Even the film lighting got darker.

This is from the musical episode. Only Stephen Collins had a decent voice here in this clip.

The YouTube comments think Simon is Aaron's real father not Martin.

I feel bad for Ruthie

R419 Martin wishes that was true lol

R420 the hugging only makes it worse.

If Simon was the dad it be interesting to how Eric and Annie would handle that, their son having a child out of wedlock.

Television Without Pity had hysterical recaps of 7th Heaven.

I wonder if you can still getting those online.

Ewwwww....remember when Ruthie wanted to assert herself as a sexually mature teen, and did a sexy dance while staring at the dad?

Lucy was the character I liked the least. Even as a kid I wanted to tell her to shut up. When she died in Saw 2, I wasn't sad at all, but her death was one of the weakest.

Why does she smile at him?????

R425

As the commenter said, "He left because she was too old"

I feel bad for Toni Braxton. They made a mockery of such a good song.

Ruthie was a cute little girl who's bratty remarks were entertaining. But as a teen, she was sooooooooooo boring and annoying and her acting actually got worse. Here is the most awkward kiss in TV history.

And to answer my own question, yes TWoP can still be read online.

I love how they would hang up on everyone. No one had any concept of phone etiquette. Or etiquette, period.

And I resented that Lucy was awful but everyone worshipped her, and she got a dopey but cute husband.

Lord, they had a special episode on cystic acne.

Fuck Stephen Collins for being a sex pest. I used to enjoy his dimpled face.

Wasn't Morgan Fairchild in one episode? I think she played the reverend's ex-girlfriend or something.

Young sexy Tyler Hoechlin in baggy jeans.

Also this show is so slow-paced, every scene is dragged out. Basically feels like 90% of the show is just filler scenes. Today's ADHD audiences wouldn't be able tolerate it.

The twins were so creepy with the monotone voices and finishing each other's sentences.

When the Olsen twins played bad girls. They led Simon down the dark path.

Early 2000s time capsule

Special Guest Stars:

Usher, Mary-Kate and Ashley and Lance Bass

Poor Lance having to kiss girls to prove he's straight

Great acting from the late Deborah Raffin.

Also Barry's sexy chest hair is so distracting.

Aunt Julie was the best recurring character. So hammy.

R431 God those girls were fugly chipmunks. Still are.

R435 Honestly apart from Jessica Biel who was stunning. I found most of the girls on 7th Heaven to be plain looking even Ashlee Simpson and the girl who played Rose. The guys like Barry Watson, David Gallagher, George Stultz and Tyler Hoechlin though were very very pretty.

Ruthie got a tattoo

Obligatory school shooting episode.

Annie Camden is gangsta and rap music is evil!!!

Simon's going to hell

Eric gets shot!!!!

This show predicted Columbine, Parkland and Virginia Tech.

R422 it would be a disaster.

R430 Ruthie always knew Martin was sexy.

R436 I fucking hated Rose. Thank God they didn't get married.

I remember the last episode like yesterday. They all just hopped on an RV for a road trip and that was it. Felt anticlimactic asf. No Matt, Mary or Simon either.

Jessica Biel looks so hot here. It's a shame they gave her such an awkward scene to be her last in the show.

The guy from Mallrats was in this show I forgot

R445 Jessica looked great in Blade Trinity and Summer Catch. I always forget she's in that terrible Chuck and Larry movie with Adam Sandler.

Holy shit R447 that gives Phoebe Cates a run for her money!!

Jessica Biel has a very athletic build.

Jessica Biel is probably stronger than Justin Timberlake.

Wilson left Glenoak to start a cult in LA

R448 she is fitness-wise. But I think Phoebe is prettier.

R451 felt like he was everywhere in the late 90s/00s. The high point being 10 Things I Hate About You.

R451 He was hottest in Teenage Caveman. I taped it off of cable and watched it over and over.

R444 Wasn’t it like the whole damn cast packing things for the trip in excruciating detail and then a shitload of them piling into the RV, one by one? And that’s literally the only thing that happened in the whole episode? It was like a really long RV commercial.

R454 Apparently, Season 11 was low-budget due to The CW cutting the funding. That's also why Catherine and Mackenzie were absent for a couple of episodes. David likely didn't return because of the slash in cast salaries too. The whole season was rushed including the series finale.

Season 10 was supposed to be the last but The CW renewed at the last minute and moved the timeslot to a Sunday deathslot (competing with The Simpsons and Family Guy). I also think The CW wanted to get rid of The WB baggage but 7th Heaven had high ratings, so they had to intentionally killed the show. They also cancelled Gilmore Girls too. They kept One Tree Hill, Supernatural and Smallville running because they probably felt they still had a viewership base with the young audience though One Tree Hill should have ended with 7th and Gilmore too.

Beverly can actually sing.

Terrible show, period. I'm surprised that so many gays watched this shit.

R457 My excuse is that I used to have 7th Heaven on in the "background" while doing my homework when it aired. Touched by an Angel was the "homework" tv show I put on in the background on Sunday night to finish any straggling assignments for the week.

[Quote] Touched by an Angel was the "homework" tv show I put on in the background on Sunday night to finish any straggling assignments for the week.

Another show that went on for 10 seasons.

It was terrible but unintentionally hilarious. I started watching because I thought the oldest son Matt was hot and then Simon grew up nicely too.

I dont mind Touched by an Angel and Highway to Heaven. They were more along the lines of "be a decent human being and don't judge others". Della Reese being a black woman and Michael Landon being Jewish in more prejudiced times both understood that well.

7th Heaven was bit too preachy and judgmental at times especially in regards to drugs, drinking and sexuality. Camdens needed to chill out. But their overreacting is what made the show so funny imho.

Apparently David Gallagher was casted in some film called Coldwater but it never was released (or maybe it was never filmed).

r462 - Coldwater did come out, but not until 2013 and David was too old for that role. The article was 2002.

[quote]I dont mind Touched by an Angel and Highway to Heaven. They were more along the lines of "be a decent human being and don't judge others". Della Reese being a black woman and Michael Landon being Jewish in more prejudiced times both understood that well.

I enjoyed both of those shows for the "be a decent human being" aspect. But, both shows had some very stupid episodes.

Highway to Heaven. Blechhhhh!

R463 I can't find Coldwater anywhere online just like I can't find that Dorian Gray movie. Some of his filmography is very obscure. I guess David doesn't really care either way.

David tried his hand at singing. He's not good but at least he tried. I think only Beverly Mitchell and Stephen Collins can sing.

Eric serenading Annie.

Great acting from Haylie Duff. Movie theater is conveniently empty too.

R463 It's still weird to me that a film can still get banished to obscurity even in this day and age. I guess there is not enough interest in David's career at this point.

R469 Yeah. That's not how labor works.

Never seen Highway to Heaven but Little House still holds up pretty well today.

Little House is the spiritual predecessor to 7th Heaven in a lot of ways. Set in a town where everyone knew each other. The main characters' parents were always right and wise. They added tons of foster children and teens to the cast after the original kids got too old to be cute or have teenager problems. Tons of male eye candy too. Laura and Lucy are very similar, spirited and a bit jealous of their more beautiful older sisters who both end up suffering great tragedies. The youngest children are just there to be there, like living props.

R469 the actor who plays Martin's dad will forever be known as Friar Fuck to me because of SATC 😆

What is Stephen Collins doing these days? Living in CA? Is he broke? Whom did he molest? I just saw him on a 1974 Barnaby Jones episode. So hot.

R475 He is keeping a low profile, see the link at R259

Jessica sounds good

Jessica singing again.

None of them are likable. None.

R479 you'd be an asshole too if you had parents like Annie and Eric.

They should have had a very special episode where Simon discovers that Annie is getting fucked by the pool boy while Eric watches.

Simon: "But we don't even have a pool!"

Or Lucy gets possessed by a demon and Eric must exorcise it.

Lucy Demon: "Annie, your mother sucks cocks in hell...Ginger told me so!"

Annie: "Ahhhhhhh!!!"

Simon orders those xrays glasses from the back of a comics and walks in to show his parents.

Bumping just to once again comment on Martin's hotness.

One wonders if Stephen Collins replays the second half of this clip over and over?

Can't believe this entire thread has almost 500 posts and yet no mention of 50's screen goddess, DL fave, and professional cryer, BARBARA RUSH?

R483 you're welcome.

Who was Martin? What a crap show. I liked Barry Watson much better in What About Brian (2006ish).

R487 this is Martin. And any other tv show is better than 7th Heaven.

R84 Lucy Camden was like the Lady Edith, marrying "up". :) They even kind of resemble each other come to think of it but Lucy is homelier I think.

R101 There is a telemovie for Picture of Dorian Gray from around 1973 I guess and they had a blond actor play Dorian. It was produced by Dan Curtis(Dark Shadows, Winds of War, etc). I came across it a year or so ago on Amazon Prime and watched it. It wasn't bad.

R490 There's a 1970 European adaptation starring Helmut Berger as a Dorian Gray set in contemporary London. Helmut like David fits the book description too, blonde, youthful and innocent.

I can see this type of show making a comeback as people are growing tired of irony, cynicism and moral ambiguity that has oversaturated the market.

[quote] Laura and Lucy are very similar, spirited and a bit jealous of their more beautiful older sisters who both end up suffering great tragedies.

And don't forget, Laura and Lucy were played by equally beautiful actresses!

As long as you put out and give good head. Guys will fall in love with you. Lucy was loose and desperate. Girls like Mary would make you actually work to get in her pants.

R494 that makes sense considering how insecure Lucy was in comparison to Mary.

What About Brian? Let's talk about that insane show.

R496 I haven't seen What About Brian since it aired. Refresh my memory. What was insane about it??

I remember reading it was marketed to the people who used to watch Melrose Place. They could watch it with their children.

R498, 7th Heaven or What About Brian?

R185 I was an extra in a movie that he did - A Midsummer Night's Rave, when I lived in Los Angeles. Gorgeous skin, jet black hair, and he was actually a really nice guy in-between takes.

He looks a little rough now but he is 41 years old. He resembles that guy from the America Ferrera show SUPERSTORE. - Ben Feldman

7th Heaven

Aunt Julie should have been in more episodes. She was great!!!

Annie Camden's best moment.

Beats chest * "You wanna a piece of this? I brought seven kids into this world! I can take one out!" * Beats chest again

The cast in 2016

Barry is still hot.

[italic]Buffy[/italic] and [italic]Dawson's Creek[/italic] both on the [bold]The WB[/bold] during the same time had gay and lesbian characters. So I feel Brenda could have tried to have a token gay even if he or she were Christian celibates.

Glenoak is likely Altadena, a small town in Los Angeles County. The house filmed the show in for the first few seasons is located there.

R506 they'd probably have Mary be a lesbian or bi.

Mary did give off a lesbian vibe. A lot of people thought Simon would be gay but I guess because he was pretty boy.

George Stults

George Stults

[quote] Catherine Hicks is amazing...well, if she were acting in an Almodovar film.

Wasn’t Bad Education basically a remake of 7th Heaven?

The WB was progressive with it's gay characters. Even allowed Thomas Dekker to be himself as little gay fanboy with a crush on Johnny from Grosse Pointe. Dekker played Vincent on 7th Heaven.

Where is Thomas Dekker now? Dead career?

Thomas got a hubby now. He must be relieved after the trauma of those years he had to pretend to be "straight" and being mocked for failing miserably at it. He's a sexy queen and he embraces it.

R514 I think Thomas had his high point with the Terminator series. And i remember being annoyed how his character just disappeared on Heroes.

I also liked him in My Sister's Keeper and The Secret Circle.

The Waltons is probably the best American drama about a large family. It didn't talk down to its audience, didn't shy away from serious topics and focused on the actual rough lives of a impoverished farming family during the Great Depression/WW2. It helped it was a period piece and based on the creator's actual early life in Virginia. Also they were Christian but not judgmental and more focused on being good people and surviving in their environment. John-Boy was a sensitive intellectual and Olivia, Grandma and Mary Ellen were strong intelligent women. It may be a bit corny at times especially in later seasons but it still held up well and has artistry and poeticism to its writing.

While the Camdens in 7th Heaven were nosy and pushy and seemed to want a Christian theocracy. The women in the show came across as ill-tempered, stupid and vapid especially Mary, Lucy and Annie. The problems in 7th Heaven were "first world" problems and mostly caused by the characters themselves for being stupid or meddling in strangers affairs. If anything 7th Heaven was a good PSA against Evangelical Christianity and having a large family. 7th Heaven was meant to be throwback to classic "wholesome" TV but honestly most people admitted to watching it because the over-the-top writing, unrealistic reactions, detachment from reality (this came out in the 90s yet the show seemed set in the 1950s at times) and unlikable characters made it hilarious.

[Quote] The problems in 7th Heaven were "first world" problems and mostly caused by the characters themselves for being stupid or meddling in strangers affairs.

Secrets. Always keeping secrets.

R513, DAMN he was hot. Never heard of him, but now I'll be up all nigh!

So what happened to the pedophile dad?

R519 here. On second thought, heading for bed.

Definitely WAS hot. Now...well...

Oh gawd. My bad. I thought Thomas Dekker was the hot hunk...but that's some actor named Al Santos.

Dude looks like a young Marlon Brando. Not sure what happened but his last credit was in 2013.