Careers that attract sociopaths

Politicians, and even lower levels of government. Bureaucrats.

"Academia." It is no longer the world of the "absent-minded professor."

Construction

Proctologists.

Doctors Wall Street stockbrokers Financial managers CEOs of big corporations

Jeez, I made R3 as a list but it looks like a weird run on sentence. Sorry.

Entertainers

Comedians. Probably the unhappiest people on Earth.

Rock musicians.

Entrepreneurs

Republican Politicians own this Thread, if you look up the real definition of a Sociopath!

DLers will now proceed to list out any and every career where someone can earn a six-figure income...

Well R10, there does appear to be a correlation between people who earn a six-figure income and sociopathic tendencies.

So you're not far off.

Recruitment consultants!

There is no other group of people who are worse than these lying, sell their grandmother, stab anyone in the back, cheating, thieving, bullying, conniving, abusing, manipulative, sociopathic, narcissistic piles of excrement. Every single one of them is Hitler reincarnated.

[bold]EVERY.SINGLE.ONE.[/bold]

Based on these selections, it looks like "sociopaths" run the world.

And there you have it, R13.

Life explained.

Is a [bold] recruitment consultant [bold] an Army thing or a euphemism for corporate headhunter?

Trump embodies all of the "qualities", if you look up textbook definition!

46% of Electorate voted for this?

Which aspect doesn't represent him? Anyone?

Dentists

Software engineers

Activism.

I'm not saying that all activits are sociopaths or that beeing an activist is a bad thing.

TSA agents

He looks like a very determined, if somewhat angry, cavity searcher!

chef

Fat acceptance activists.

Clowns

JR Ewing used to say Once you forget your integrity, the rest is easy, so if integrity is foreign concept to begin with, you already have an edge. So R13 is right.

Politicians and corporate types.

I've realize that ALL industries attract sociopaths. Just the ones with higher IQs tend to go in the aforementioned groups.

Officers in the military.

R27: The whole idea of work was created by sociopaths to enslave the gullible.

Trump cabinet member

And r23 is proof that gay men think the worst thing you can be is fat.....

R12 didnt get the job & she is pissed.

Gay rights activist

investment bankers (it's a job requirement)

HR managers

Nurses

Thirty-three replies, and not one mention of DL's sacred, perfect, precious little porn stars?

Data loungers

Trans activist

Actually I have to agree a lot of activists are ... if not sociopaths... unhooked from the real world. I get exposed to them in my work and they play as dirty as anybody when it comes to lying and messing with the facts and hypocrisy. I never thought they'd play it anything but straight and honest, so that was a revelation. Kinda troubles and disappoints me. I guess you really can't trust anybody with an agenda, no matter what the agenda is.

R28 was told he was too fat by a recruiter.

I think activists and nurses have a lot of sociopaths but there are some nice people in there, too - maybe they don't have any power.

Social Workers with a degree and a counseling practice.

Psychiatrists.

Psychoanalysts.

The most fucked-up people I've ever met.

Big bankers

Hedge Fund operators

Major Drug Dealers (pharmaceutical and the illegal)

Some Teachers in K-12

Some Attorneys

Scam Artists

I agree completely with R12.

Used car sales people, slum lords, drug dealers and pimps have more and better ethics than employment agency employees.

R38 How do you think Trump got elected? By playing Fair?? 😂

Lawyers. The natures of most specialties of the field itself ate attractive to sociopaths. Having said that, I know many attorneys who love the law and are absolutely brilliant. But most of the ones I know are annoying as hell, bordering on creepy.

*are

I think the worst are realtors, some types of lawyers, and recruiters...which I wouldn't have thought of if not pointed out above. But, I realized I never dealt with one in my life who didn't make me want to stab them.

Pornstars

Entertainment industry activists are the worst. None of them have any talent, so they go bombard things they are personally offended by while inadvertently harming us in other ways. Exhibit A: GLAAD, which went from a useful organization protesting homophobia in show business to a transcult trojan horse.

Totally agree about hedge funders, investment advisors, pharmaceutical executives, etc.

Know from personal experience. Narcissism, sociopathy, immaturity abound.

OP, this question has come up a few times before. I was watching Hannibal season 2 and Will Graham and Freddie Lowndes were talking about this very subject and apparently this was their source material. See: Link below.

From my own personal experiences I've found :

1) Doctors !!! -. I fucked more than 8 , 3 were certifiable. Something about the need for control and being competitive over the most pettiest things always sends off red flags. Overly analytical but only up to the point of finding a weakness to exploit. Too much to the point it's obvious it's a instinct thing of theirs , not just a by product of thinking about the complexities of the human anatomy.

2) Law Enforcement - I did research with a professor who did psych evals and as a gay man I have fucked far too many closet cases. They tend to be Narcissistic/Antisocial by varying degrees. Usually one more than the other.

3) Corporate managers! When I worked for a private researching group I used to have to interview people/administer surveys and found their hyper competitive natures masked by very structured /rehearsed-to-the-point-of-reflex to be scary! There are some people working at the job out of necessity , but when you realize management does shit like sabotage underlings so they can't leave just so they can have someone to bully it gets sickening.

Females sociopaths I found almost wholly relegated to nursing.

A lot of surgeons have some variation of "the spectrum" or perhaps it is sociopathy... not sure. Many surgeons are a bit off.

agree re surgeons, god complex "i literally have your life in my hands"

[quote] Thirty-three replies, and not one mention of DL's sacred, perfect, precious little porn stars?

Porn is not a career. It's a punishment.

Attorneys, lawyers & judges.

University professors, esp. those in admin.

The people railing against nurses, professors, activists, etc. are just naming people they don't like. I think Republicans hate educated people, hence the bashing of professors.

R57 I work in academia and know what I'm talking about

pharmaceutical reps

Also, R57, I'm no Republican, but nice ad hominem

OP & R15 I think you mean headhunters. AKA: Executive Search Consultants. All are pos. I never met one who wasn't a sociopath.

These body pushers see everyone as a dollar sign and they push the candidate on the corporate hiring manager for a hefty fee. They play games with the hiring folks, hold good candidates hostage for more money without the candidates knowledge and at the candidates expense, and bully you to increase the candidates salary so that their commission is higher.

But I wouldn't say the staffing consultants or contract recruiters who work in corporate, as opposed to a private off-site office, are sociopaths or the hiring/staffing people who work in the Corporate HR Dept are all sociopaths. It's the off-site ones we have a problem with, along with some of the HR people. But not typically the in-house corporate staffing people who work under the HR umbrella.

^ Thanks for the distinction between them.

CPS

And this is a shame because children need protection from abusive adults. They need normal, compassionate adults to protect them.

I would say about half of those who work for Child Protective Services are sociopaths. The last people who should be working for a government agency that is supposed to advocate for children are sociopaths, yet they are hired if they have the proper degree, usually a MSW, a license, and a certification.

Sociopaths working for CPS is really no different than a pedophile running a daycare center. Yet they are there anyway.

Calling CPS is a roll of the dice, a 50/50 crap shoot, if they are going to get a normal, compassionate social worker to respond and do the right thing OR a sociopath who will place the child in harm's way and take no responsibility or possibly remove a child from their home where the child isn't being neglected or abused.

If all sociopaths were confined to mental institutions where they should be or in prison for after their first offense we would be living in a much better world and safer too, with a much higher standard of living. But nope, they're allowed to work and live among us. And breed.

Yes, R58 is right. The publish or perish competition combined with people who couldn't really make it "in the real world" breeds a certain kind of sociopath. Oh, and the pressure for tenure... which is exceedingly rare these days but still exists. That will do it too. I suppose it could make people acting like sociopaths rather than being them neurologically, but it could be some of each. When there are 300 applications for 1 job (and all 300 people spent 4-7 years toiling away for the same PhD that is useless outside of academia) you can imagine the nastiness that comes out.

Catholic priests. They believe they turn into God when they perform mass. It's never a good idea for a man to think he's God.

Catholic nuns. Want you to live in misery and be a good martyr.

Pharmaceutical sales reps

Any industry where there is crony-ism and or the ruthless rise to the top

Community college deans.

somebody talking about us?

Alfred Hitchcock, David Fincher, David O' Russell, James Cameron, David Lynch, Stanley Kubrick

Head Imam at a Mosque. The faith for a mass aceptance of pedophilia , mysogony and fascism.

Yes R15, R43 and R61 - I was talking about the off -site, private recruitment agencies who recruit for corporate executives. Some of them are head hunters and some have been tasked by a corporation to find and pre-screen an executive employee. I've had to deal with them for 20 years on both sides - working in corporate HR and heaving to deal with their pushing a candidate "sales techniques" and also using them as a job candidate.

Like I said - the worst pieces of excrement humanity has ever produced - every single one of them.

I've never come across a decent one and have a lot of bad stories. I can't even speak to them politely now.

Pretty much everyone I know who has failed at life or went to horrendous schools / community colleges is in recruiting. Amazing how that works.

What about the average community college teacher/instructor?

Accountants and Pharmacists

You will come across a sociopath in every field, any career. You Marys need to toughen up.

Sociopaths have infiltrated every single occupation/industry. They are now EVERYWHERE.

I think this is because they aren't formally diagnosed by professionals (they don't go to therapy OR they go and play head games) and only those close to these monsters and their victims know that they are a sociopath as we eventually begin noticing they possess every one of the top 7 signs and traits.

Since they aren't formally diagnosed where their Name/D.O.B./SS# could be entered into a centralized database the non-disordered adults and innocent, defenseless children aren't protected by these toxic, disordered crazies and consequently they are allowed to influence impressionable children/adolescents in the classroom and young (also impressionable) adults in the college setting as well.

They are allowed to wreak havoc in Corporate USA. And that is what they do. Good, decent ,hardworking dedicated people can't even enjoy their career that they worked so hard to get. They are allowed to practice dentistry/medicine. The "Without Conscience" are even allowed to run for office and get elected to positions they should NEVER hold. They can provide therapy and counsel clients and patients. And the list goes on.

I find it shockingly unbelievable that they aren't ostracized or tagged and micro-chipped and put away where they belong. "Well they're still a human being" is a lie. These people are sub-humans. R74 No, I shouldn't have to "toughen up" because someone is destructive and disordered. How about if they are kept separate from the non-disordered. They only make up one-third of the population, not half or the majority. At least not yet.

The military, unfortunately.

The media is normalizing sociopathy

A/P Clerks

R77 Yes it is normalized, and downplayed and marginalized. Sometimes sugarcoated, "Oh, he's quite a character, isn't he?" when the person is a dangerous nut job. And they are not allowed to say the word unless the person saying it is a MD/Psychiatrist or Psychologist, even if it's apparent and everyone knows.

They claim that if the person hasn't been clinically diagnosed then we can't call them a sociopath or psychopath. But they don't get diagnosed. People with Autism, ADD/ADHD or BPD/Bi-Polar Disorder do, and people with schizophrenia as well, but sociopaths avoid getting diagnosed. These lying, conniving, deceitful, mentally ill people are actually more protected than their victims.

R75 is right. There should be a database.

The media has definitely normalized sociopathy. Its sickening. I'm scared of my generation. This won't end well.

USA military/NATO/IMF/ECB/Federal Reserve, etc

City Council employees

They are not only attracted to high paying jobs, they also like jobs where they can abuse the groups of people they hate or who are most vulnerable and get away with it. Such as nursing and state-run nursing homes for the elderly. My 32 yr old niece is a textbook sociopath and she's an EMT who also drives the ambulance, which is a low paying job. She loves the thrill and the drama and watching people in pain. I shudder to think what crap she says to the patients or maybe what she should say that is comforting that she doesn't say. She has put my sister and brother-in-law, two really great people, through sheer hell.

I also agree with R75 there should be a central data base where these people are registered just like sex offenders so we don't accidentally hire one to care for our child or sick or disabled parents and aside from causing harm so they can't get jobs where they can abuse their power and get away with it. Because that's what they do. Even the ones who increase revenue for an employer cause the productivity to decrease with their entitlements, endless arguments and insane drama. They cause high absenteeism and lowered productivity. Why should these toxic crazies get a job over an equally qualified-on-paper person who isn't screwed up in the head for life.

R83 they like to control and City Council member provides that level of control they like. And HOA too. There's a sociopath on our HOA board. She seems to think she owns the community and that we (all adults over age 40 here) report into her as if she's the boss of us. Last week she warned me and another homeowner "No tomato plants this year, they attract rats." She's the only rat I've ever seen around here.

She got us into a lawsuit last year over the new roofing contract and now our monthly HOA fees went up. Wherever they are everything turns to crap with all their fuckery and we wind up paying emotionally and financially. My next home will be HOA-free because control freak sociopaths like to serve on these boards after they come home from their day job making everyone at work miserable.

I agree it would be great to be able to monitor and weed out these types, but how could something like a database be policed, and who's criteria would they be being judged by? Companies already do so many psych evaluations and background these days, how do we know they aren't the types they have been wanting to attract all along? I do agree that recruitment specialists need to held more accountable, beyond the three month normal trial period, also more arbitration skills are needed in the workplace, especially with managers. Resilience training can be a positive step for someone who feels like they attract workplace bullies far too often.

Another vote for academia. The humanities Ph.D.'s are arguably worse than others as things have moved further and further into theory. So many of them are now the experts of a lot of made up shit that is recognized only by other academics, if at all.

A database or prison would be nice, but it won't happen because workplaces love them. They love these assholes that abuse other people.

Yes, R87. A lot of junk. And it is going more and more that way. More junk and more sociopaths getting bold and taking over the place. With giant but very weak egos, inflated salaries, and dumbing it down...

[quote]Recruitment consultants!

Definitely. From people who work at employment agencies to exclusive recruitment consultants. I had a friend who was desperate for a job. So many agencies actually listed fake jobs on job websites (careerbuilder, indeed, etc) just to get people registered at their agency. Evidently they have a quota of how many new prospective jobseekers they have to register each week and they will prey on people who are desperate and lead them on about fake jobs. They get the people in their office and get them signed up, then they get their hopes up by telling them about a great job they would be perfect for and then they never call the people back. When the people call back they get the bullshit run around that they don't have any job openings but to keep calling. There was no great job to begin with. It was all part of making their quota

Gun manufacturers

As I was reading these posts an ad popped up for a counseling center that teaches and counsels kids, mostly jr high/high school age, to be "emotionally resilient." a nice way of saying "emotionally numb." I like how we have to become someone we don't want to be and numb our self in order to accommodate the mentally disordered. Why don't these so-called professional experts assholes work on programs and develop policies that separate the bullies and troublemaker kids from those who don't bully or start trouble instead of teaching them to be super tolerant and emotionally numb. Why are they in the same classroom, in the same building? In domestic abuse cases that are handled properly they remove the perpetrator. They don't teach the victim to be more tolerant and resilient of disgusting, abusive people.

I've worked in collections and I can assure you that the most successful collectors are sociopaths.

I remember watching a program about a lady who killed herself because a collections person was harassing and threatening her (no joke).

R94 Oh I can believe it. Most debt collectors are relentless (redundant) sociopaths. Some have even called family members and neighbors and also knocked on the door demanding a payment. You really have to be lacking a conscience to do that to someone. Yeah, I get it, pay your bills and that won't happen. But sometimes the unforeseen happens. There is no excuse for tormenting someone. But that is why they get into that field so they can inflict emotional pain on others; shouting and verbally abusing them on a daily basis, and like upthread said get away with it too.

I would be afraid to pay them and start a payment plan with one of them on my back. The sociopath would probably change the terms midway or start demanding more money or keep calling me when they are getting the payment on time. I wouldn't want to be involved with them for any reason and if I owed a debt I wouldn't pay it back to them. Getting involved with these people in any way, including to repay a debt, all while they are still harassing you, can't end well. Like the woman who committed suicide. Very sad.

As our police force becomes more and more militarized, more and more sociopaths are being hired. At this point I would say at least half of all (U.S.) law enforcement are sociopaths.

The bottom line is that they gravitate towards jobs that offer a lot of power and when they abuse that power they know they will not likely be held accountable or the victim will always be doubted. I think the money is second to the power because as some here have said they don't always necessarily choose high paying careers.

Lawyers and Judges. The worst.

There is an idea of a Patrick Bateman, some kind of abstraction, but there is no real me, only an entity, something illusory, and though I can hide my cold gaze and you can shake my hand and feel flesh gripping yours and maybe you can even sense our lifestyles are probably comparable: I simply am not there

R76 and R82 were clearly never in the miltary. It's hammered into you from Day One that you're part of a team, and that no individual is greater than the team. You don't really fight for your country, you fight for your buddies. A sociopath is by definition someone without empathy or concern for others, and unless they're extremely good at hiding their nature, that attitude is not going to get them far.

People watch movies like Apocalypse Now and imagine troops unquestioningly following psychopathic leaders into the jungle. In thr real world, their leaders are well aware they're in command of a lot of armed, trained men who are watching them for signs of hypocrisy, disloyalty or untrustworthiness. It tends to keep people on the up and up. Screw your buddies or your troops over, and you'll get a grenade rolled in your tent or accidentally fall overboard.

DMV workers. Post office workers. Parking enforcement officers. That bitch that works at the special service desk at the supermarket checkout area. Most retail employees and restaurant workers.

Yep, I think in terms of "Careers That Attract Sociopaths" we've covered just about every career. Have we missed any? Like one poster said, they are everywhere. I guess some occupations have more of them than others but it sure does seem that they are everywhere. A more accurate title would be "Sociopaths Are Attracted To All Careers"

The most messed-up people I've known in my long life have been psychiatrists, psychologists and those who engage in mental health counseling.

My husband is a criminal defense lawyer and I must say there are a lot of sociopaths among them also.

My sister recommended me this book. It described a former boss of mine to a T:

A lot of those professions (jobs?) would not attract sociopaths because they have very short attention spans, and need constant stimulation. Sorting or delivering mail or even being a clerk would not appeal to them, or they would not last very long there. They do not do monotonous work. If they work for the Post Office, they're in management. Please stop labelling every person (clerks)you don't like as being sociopathic. Purchase the book in the thread above, and educate yourself.

My father was a sociopath. The damage he did to our family basically broke us and we all keep our distance from each other.

If you'd have met my father, you'd have met a charming, intelligent, caring and generous man. Because that's what he wanted you to see.

Like all sociopaths, my father was looking after himself and using any one he met to the best advantage he could. Like most sociopaths, my father never broke the law. (That we know of.) Being seen as a law abiding citizen was part of his act. Like most sociopaths, he could keep the con going for decades.

1 in 4 people are sociopaths. Or so I've read. Are we really going to put a quarter of society on a database?

What we should be more concerned about is the way sociopathic behaviour is being held up as 'good' 'desirable' and an example of how to behave.

We need to address that before we address anything else.

R105 -From what I've read, 3% of males, 1% of females are considered sociopathic.

Publicist and politicians.

Most cops are criminals or bullies.

Police forces have now revised their application forms, and the first question is:

Are you a sociopath?

Be careful here, it's a trick question.

[quote]From what I've read, 3% of males, 1% of females are considered sociopathic

I think it is a lot higher than that.

Adding to the book mentioned above, check out -

Sociopath Next Door by Martha Stout

Without Conscience by Dr.Robert Hare

It's imperative to have this knowledge before someone ruins your life. I'm speaking from experience.

My former psych professor and two therapists whom are not sociopaths (or otherwise crazy) have all said that 1/3 of the total (18 yrs+) adult population, at least in the U.S. where we all live, are sociopaths/psychopaths. None of these professionals know each other or have collaborated in any way. So, that's the statistic I choose to believe. Since these horrid people don't typically seek therapy, nor do they all admit that they are an S or a P, determining the exact percentage isn't likely. It's anyone's guess.

One thing is for certain though, sociopathy is not at all uncommon or rare. As I said, I believe all combined, sociopaths/psychopaths make up about one-third of the (over 18 yrs of age) adult population. That's pretty significant and means that the chances of running into one is high. The reality is that you may actually know a few, but aren't aware that they are mentally ill because they hide it from their non-victims. And they are quite skilled hiding what goes on behind the mask/closed doors.

My mother (whom I am estranged from) is a classic textbook sociopath. But unless you knew her well you'd never know that if you didn't live under the same roof as her or have worked closely with her in the workplace. All others thought she was the perfect mother; loving, caring, concerned, sincere and genuine when she was actually the exact opposite. She didn't care about anyone but herself. She didn't even care about her own children and rarely ever put our needs first. That's how they are.

She really should have been behind bars by the time my siblings and I were toddlers and the oldest in elementary school. But these people are allowed to have children whom they torment, as they are the perfect victim since they are dependent and have nowhere to go. Being dependent upon these people at any age and for any reason = hell.

R112 - I stick by my statistic. If you research this by Google, the consensus is at 4% - 3%male, 1% female. Our society would disintegrate if 25 - 33% of the populace was sociopathic. It's dog eat dog world with that small percentage already. I've become very attuned to weeding them out, fortunately I don't come across many of them.

I really think it is at least 20% and we seem to be in an age that is celebrating sociopathy, so it will go higher.

The number is growing R113. Really. But no, it is nowhere near even 5%.

I think man of think anybody you can imagine a selfish motive for must be a psychopath. No, rather you may be the psychopath because you should be able to imagine selfish motives for absolutely everyone no matter what they do. This is something different.

I don't think society could function with 25-33% psychopaths. I think that narcissism has increased (and become more visible lately) - and this has a fairly strong overlap with psychopaths, though they do have a conscience (if they can be bothered to access it). They don't get off on risky behavior but some do manipulate others like psychopaths... there aren't clear borders on these things. Doesn't "Snakes in Suits" give an estimate? Given that Hare is one of the authors, I'd trust whatever they think it is.

Even in prison populations, Hare doesn't find a full 25% psychopaths. It's been a while since I read the book, but it's definitely not that high.

Not surprisingly, psychopaths are overrepresented in prisons; studies indicate that about 25 percent of inmates meet diagnostic criteria for psychopathy.

[quote]I don't think society could function with 25-33% psychopaths

I think the number has gone up, and I do not think society is functioning as well.

bump

R119, if it is 25% in prisons, you think it is higher outside of prisons? Society isn't functioning well for a myriad of reasons, but I don't think you are factoring in how fucked up things would be if 1 in 4 people had no conscience. It's amazing that one person thinks it is 3% and one person thinks it is 25%.

There was another documentary on it that showed some differences in the brain, found on fMRI ... but the crazy part is that the researcher in the study turned out to be a psychopath himself (per the MRI)..but he actually has a family and gets along with everyone fine. He wasn't even a "psychopath" behaviorally. .. but he had the neurological structure of one.

R127, I think it is 80 - 90% in prison and 25-30 % (at least ) in the general population

^ We could also factor in ASPD, Anti-Social Personality Disorder to that 25-30%. Most of them are destructive and also cause divorces, bully people, con and dupe them, damage relationships, wreak havoc in the workplace, etc. as do psychopaths and sociopaths.

That's why the majority of people over the age of 30 with at least a few years out in the real world, in the workforce, have encountered one at their job as they did in high school or college or in the dating arena and even in their own family/extended family. There were several in my high school that I know of and I didn't know every person I graduated HS with. But out of the 50 or so I was close with there were at about 10. The Uni I attended there were several in my group. They are common in the workplace.

It seems that the older we are the more likely we are to think the numbers or percentage of these awful people is higher because of the more experiences we have throughout life and the more experiences we have dealing with them; the older we are the more of a history we have to draw from. When I was in my 20's I thought it was only 1-2% (which got me into BIG trouble) and now in my early 50's I think it's closer to R122 post.

Most people aren't clinical psychologists and are confusing other disorders or ass holes for psychopathy. If the foremost researchers in the world (Robert Hare, specifically) have given their estimates, I really don't think anecdotal evidence from people on the internet with no formal training should outweigh that.

He is not a know-all Holy Man, R124. And it is not really a science.

A lot of vicious "assholes" are psychopaths/sociopaths

I agree R125

Psychopaths don't like exposure about their disorder as the more educated and knowledgeable people are about the disorder, the more of a challenge it is to lure people (victims) into their web of deceit. What they hate most is exposure more than anything else. So they play down the disorder or claim that it's not common so we lower our guard. I think it is more common than most think. I have a friend who was raised by a psychopath and one of her five siblings is also one. Then she married one, got divorced six years later, had to change jobs because he got her fired and unbelievably she started working for one in her new corporate job.

She said aside from observing them up close, front-row seat every single day for the first twenty years of her life where she lived at home with her disordered parents, and in her life afterwards as well, she has studied these disorders for the past ten years and is also self-educated; extensive research and reading, blogging, has an undergraduate degree in psych but is an Employee Relations Officer for a major corporation for the past 25 years.

She is not a therapist and doesn't have any training or ability to treat or counsel anyone, nor does she want to, but she knows exactly what it looks like. Right off the bat. She told me it's 1 in 10, in her opinion. That sounds about right to me. I hate these people so I never cover for them, minimize this disorder, normalize crazy or play it down in any way at all. It's serious and these people are all around us, like Robert Hare said himself. He said they are not uncommon because he knows "they are living and working among us".... his words. That 's why he authored several books about these people. He wants us to know they are everywhere and they are skilled hiding their disorder until the damage is done. The majority of people aren't disordered, but majority isn't all.

I'm one of the few who don't think sociopath is a real thing or at least so black and white. Don't get me wrong I do think a certain amount of the population is born defected with no conscious but something else is happening here. We live in a culture that no longer has any morality. These people have been conditioned to become sociopaths, and would easily change their manipulative ways if society wasn't so superficial and narcissistic.

There is no morality any more; there is no respect for the concept of morality - that is what is making their numbers increase. TV and the media is feeding us an unending stream of sociopaths from Game of Thrones to Survivor to House of Cards to real life corrupt politicans and shows about real life murderers -it's a kind of brain washing . It normalizes sociopaths and demoralizes the population. .. and it emboldens the sociopaths. It expands in the workplace and at school. A lot of "music" now celebrates sociopathy . It is wall to wall.

I don't think they are born that way. They are weak individuals who learn quickly to get what they want by mistreating others.

No some people do start with some sociopathic tendencies and then develop something of a conscience as they mellow and age. As you get older you definitely notice it. I am always amazed at the way that having children can make a relatively immature person suddenly straighten right up, for example. The opposite happens as well with a seemingly well adjusted person who gets blinded by the "love" (really the inner need they have to manipulate) for their child, and they are creating the monsters and sociopaths of the future.

[quote]They are not only attracted to high paying jobs, they also like jobs where they can abuse the groups of people they hate or who are most vulnerable and get away with it. Such as nursing and state-run nursing homes for the elderly. My 32 yr old niece is a textbook sociopath and she's an EMT who also drives the ambulance, which is a low paying job. She loves the thrill and the drama and watching people in pain. I shudder to think what crap she says to the patients or maybe what she should say that is comforting that she doesn't say. She has put my sister and brother-in-law, two really great people, through sheer hell.

My friend's stepfather was also a sociopath. He worked as an EMT for a decade before he became a small town cop. As a cop, he made a little more money, but in both jobs he enjoyed abusing people because of the power. He got fired when town government found out about his corruption. My friend's mom divorced him a few years later. As an adult, my friend says he always shudders when he sees cops in public.

Yes, it is a science ... Jesus, people with no psychology education are polluting this thread. I posted the story of the researcher who found the fMRI signs of psychopathy...did anyone even bother to look at it? Do you know who Robert Hare is or his methods? He practical IS the "know-all Holy Man" in this topic. I have his book and the book someone posted above & I even read it too - imagine that. Unlike your "estimates" which are based on confirmation bias and being improperly informed, he's actually used a variety of methods to reach concussions on the topic. Perhaps you've encountered an unusual number of people like that (which is the problem with anecdotal evidence). Actual researchers (and yes, again, this is as close to science as psychology can get - it's not physics but it's not astrology either) .

Prevalence.

I've underlined it. The old underlining in blue is from when I first red the book.

Credentials.

Let me know when you've received your PhD and published 100s of peer reviewed papers. Then, I'll believe your "estimates".

EMTs are more likely to be psychopaths. Most psychopaths don't have the patience for med school (they could cheat but they'd probably be caught eventually). I was talking to a police officer who told me about a dirty cop. He'd stop people for speeding but say he's let it go if they gave him money. He had sex with young girls working at Tim Horton's caught stealing, and he was finally caught when he walked into a hardware store in his uniform and walked out with a chainsaw. Who knows if he is a psychopath but he is a terrible, greedy person.

Yes it is an exact science in terms of the signs and traits and behaviors. But the debates rages on as far as far as the etiology of sociopathy. Even the experts disagree on the etiology. Some think we are born that way and others believe they are made that way.

Based upon my experiences with them I personally have reason to believe we are born with a predisposition and then our environment or upbringing either makes it much worse or in the case of a sociopathic child in a healthy, nurturing environment becoming a toned-down version but still without a conscience and compassion. I have witnessed too many children display sociopathic tendencies from a very young age to believe anything else, my niece being one of well over a dozen, (I am the second oldest of 32 cousins) to believe anything else. So I agree with the experts who believe we are born that way, not the ones who believe sociopaths are made.

Looking back, the sociopaths in my extended family showed signs as early as their preschool years. I also grew up on a street with about 25 or so kids. When my parents moved there we were all between 2 yrs and 13 yrs of age. Only one of the neighbor kids showed signs of sociopathy at an early age and is now serving prison time for insider trading.... this after three divorces and abandoning his last family of 4 children.

But on another note, really, we don't need to be a psychologist to determine if one is a psychopath/sociopath. Only if we are going to provide a formal diagnosis for their permanent medical files and also to treat them in a clinical setting, which is stupid and senseless because there is no cure. That is the main reason psychologists and therapists author these books, so we can learn how to identify them without having a psych degree and background because we need to know.

This is not playing pseudo-psychologist or armchair doctor because we need to know what it looks like, meaning the signs, traits, behaviors, etc. in order to protect ourselves and our loved ones as well. My friend just prevented her 17 yr old teen daughter from getting involved with one, 19 yrs old, who was luring her in because my friend knew the red flags. It's not rocket science. As I said in my previous post that's why the experts have authored these helpful, insightful books, as a warning, so we can learn to identify them BEFORE it's too late. Not because they wanted to showcase their extensive knowledge. The only people who defend them are them.

I think If there were a way to identify them, I think they should be euthanized. I was the victim of a true one 20 years ago, when I became interested in Robert Hare's work. I've also learned difference between a narcissist, psychopath, and an ass hole (and so on). I wasn't posting the prevalence info to defend them in any way. I just think the issue is being overblown with numbers like 25% - which makes it seem like the whole world is full of dysfunctional people. There are more now because they do very well in cities and on their own. We live in very isolated ways, so they can do their scams and fuck people over and just move on. 200 years ago, you couldn't get away with that. Btw, I don't think psychopaths care if you know about them. They have no fear. They can't experience it, and they typically don't even care that you know what they are because they think they'll still be able to manipulate you. That's been my experience with the one I mentioned, at least. I told him what I thought he was and he actually used that information to his own advantage.

I agree with whoever said publicists. Just no humanity whatsoever.

Also, whoever said HR managers. The scum of the fucking earth. It's amazing to me that there isn't more workplace violence involving them.

4% is bad enough. Those of you saying 20-25% are including run-of-the-mill jerks as sociopaths, I think? Jerks are bad enough. And very common.

[quote]EMTs are more likely to be psychopaths. Most psychopaths don't have the patience for med school (they could cheat but they'd probably be caught eventually). I was talking to a police officer who told me about a dirty cop. He'd stop people for speeding but say he's let it go if they gave him money. He had sex with young girls working at Tim Horton's caught stealing, and he was finally caught when he walked into a hardware store in his uniform and walked out with a chainsaw. Who knows if he is a psychopath but he is a terrible, greedy person.

My parents had a friend who was a firefighter and he said he knew several firefighters and EMTs who stole from patients' homes and sometimes they would steal things from accident scenes. He said some were fired and others with help from unions found ways to keep their jobs. Last year, there was an incident in my city in which an EMT stole a debit or a credit card from a patient's home while responding to a heart attack call. The EMT went on a spreading spree. Some people were shocked, but I wasn't.

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Re "psychopaths do very well in cities "...I spent some tme (years) in a rural area and came to the conclusion that they were all psychopaths and that rural communities are deeply dysfunctional.

R141 Having lived in both a major city and a few rural areas, twenty years each, I agree. They are everywhere.

As an aside, I also agree with R136 it was much harder for them to get away with it many decades ago. People weren't as transient as today and they also lived in smaller communities where everyone knew everyone. Families all lived near each other. There was a sense of community and people valued that and protected it. If they tried to disrupt that cohesiveness they were usually ostracized if they were seen as trouble. But not anymore.

But they do care if we know who they really are when they are trying to reel us in, unless they know we have no power over them and then they may show us who they are right away. Many of them are charming in the beginning so they can reel us in, establish trust, and then scam us. It's true they have no fear and don't give a shit what anyone thinks. But that has nothing to do with hiding who they are as playing that game is enjoyable to them. Most hide their disorder quite well because they like the thrill of the game; pulling the rug out from underneath us, or throwing us under the bus, or ghosting us after a 3-month relationship. They enjoy the thrill of knowing that we fell for the charm, their act.

People were shocked to learn my mother is a psychopath. She hid it remarkably well from many people but then didn't bother to hide it from certain others. It depends upon what they have in store for you, and if they plan to use and abuse, or deceive and then con and scam you, or whatever. If they show their true colors too soon they may not be able to win their sick game or pull off their plan and get away with their destruction. They like the thrill of the game when victims realize they were duped. They enjoy causing pain.

Actually people were more transient decades ago. People don't move like they used to.

Modern American society actively encourages sociopaths and sociopathic behavior. Sociopaths are the ones who get to the top in any given field and at the end of the day - that's what America is all about.

R99 is right. The military likely screens against these people. Reals Navy SEALS are some of the most genuinely nice, well adjusted people I've met. I work with some of them during training.

Yeah, I still think most people conflate "psychopath" with "narcissist" just like they do "histrionic" with "narcissist".

That said, I met a real psychopath at work some years ago. He was quite good looking and well groomed, and I got a sinking feeling in my abdomen when he was around. Somehow I just knew that he was completely incapable of guilt or shame. Everyone thought he was handsome and great.

I had to be alone with him and he looked at me like "Yeah I know that you know." A few weeks later he was fired for all sorts of violations.

My dad is a sociopath. What I realize about most sociopaths is they really are cowards. They operate based on circumstance. Unlike truly mentally ill people, sociopaths know how to alter their behavior when they need too. Sociopaths don't have a conscious, but they crave empathy. they are know missing something thats why the feed off others emotions like fkin vampires. The most daming thing you can do to a sociopath is ignore them and then remove from your lives.

Also I think people should stop saying coworkers and such are sociopaths. They may be true but unless you've work with for them for 30 years or befriended them closely outside work you can not really be sure if that is a sociopath or just a good old fashion jerk or greedy sob. There's a particular kind of interpersonal involvement there when you really get to know a sociopath. I think most of us who have encountered sociopathic relatives easily spot them with friends or lovers throughout our lives.

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R147, maybe I am misunderstanding what you are saying. I think you can tell the difference between someone who is a jerk and someone who is a sociopath without knowing them really well. There is a level of evilness in a psychopath that puts them beyond jerk level.

I am very grateful for all the books, blogs and movies out there that have helped us to understand psychopathy. When I encountered a psychopath it was the late 70s and there was very little written about them outside of a few bits in abnormal psych books.

^ True, I agree R151. And I would know as I was raised by psychopaths and then married one. From the frying pan into the fire. Short-term marriage though.

R147 to add to your post, as an fyi to "easily spotted." Many victims, especially those raised by these evil people and living under their roof for 18-20 yrs, become desensitized to the evil. They do spot them but they are so desensitized to the crazy that they make the wrong choice, meaning not running from them sooner than later. It happens. A lot.

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^ Not all of them. Some are actually victims of the evil sociopath/psychopath.