I fucking hate open relationships, don't respect anyone in them and never will

I've never been in an open relationship, they're not for me. I imagine it would turn me neurotic and make me insecure. However I don't care what other consenting adults do in their relationships. It's not cheating if they agree the relationship is open.

Yes it is, R1. Cheating is cheating no matter what kind of word games you play.

OP sounds like one of those bigots who claim that gay marriage devalues straight marriage. OP's also one of the "Stop with what you are doing! You make ME look bad!" shriekers.

In short: OP's a troll.

R3, this is my thread so YOU are the troll.

I was just about to make the same observation r3 did. If you don't want an open relationship, don't have one, but how is it your business if others choose to?

Because of anti-monogamy jerks like Dan Savage who get publicity for pandering to the worst stereotypes of gay men, including the inability to commit which is one of the worst, one of the most false, and one of the key arguments homophobes use against marriage equality, R5.

R6 would that be the oft-repeated statistic that gay men are far more promiscuous then straights (or lesbians)?

I find that a pretty undeniable truth.

What do you do to deny it?

The fact that I, a gay man, have never, ever committed adultery and never will. But whoever generated that apocryphal and probably inaccurate statistic, which R7 conveniently failed to include.

Stop thinking every other gay man is as irresponsible and self-loathing as you. And your sneer quote around the word marriage tells me all I need to know. Punched AND deleted.

[quote]But whoever generated that apocryphal and probably inaccurate statistic, which [R7] conveniently failed to include…

…didn't ask me.

OP, it's none of your business how others conduct their relationships.

The hell it isn't, OP. I'm tired of seeing gay men bend over backwards to make excuses for their inability to commit.

R7 Your full of shit if you think that Lesbians aren't promiscuous in EXACTLY the same regard as their Homosexual male counterparts. Have met any Lesbians?

I bet you haven't been laid in a year, OP. You need to be fucked, and badly....

Gay men are MALE after all; of course they're going to be more promiscuous. Males are more promiscuous than females.

OP sounds completely unhinged. So much anger. Why do you feel the need to control what other people think and do? You have some serious issues if you get so worked up over something like this.

[quote]Have met any Lesbians?

Yes, and I still think it's nothing but an offensive stereotype created by breeders to justify anti-gay discrimination. Dan Savage is an anachronism.

R14, that is a misandrist remark, and if you are a man, you have some serious self-loathing issues.

Saying men can't commit is misandrist.

Saying gay men can't commit is misandrist AND homophobic.

Many people are unfaithful to their partners, gay and straight.

It's difficult enough to maintain a satisfactory long-term relationship without having to take into account what everybody else thinks is the right way to do it.

Whatever works for your relationship is what works for your relationship. It's not up to anyone else to interfere or impose their preferences and prohibitions on you. It's between you and your partner what sort of relationship you wish to create.

What's next, OP? Scarlett letters?

Our heterosexual friends and family are a model of loving and committed relationships.

I said it before and I'll say it again, R21: just because heterosexuals lie and cheat on our spouses and treat the institution of matrimony as a joke doesn't mean gay people have to. We've earned marriage equality rights, let's accept the responsibility along with it. They're a package deal.

[quote]Yes it is, R1. Cheating is cheating no matter what kind of word games you play.

Actually, no, it's not. "Cheating" means that you're breaking the rules. But if you and your partner have set up your own set of rules, then you're not cheating so long as you follow those rules.

That's what a lot of people get wrong about open relationships. An open relationship doesn't necessarily mean that anything goes. For a number of relationships, the opposite is true: the rules are very carefully laid out, discussed, and followed.

OP is completely unhinged. Put him on ignore and just take it all in.

He derailed the Mrs. Savage thread about this, and when people stopped responding to his ass he started this thread.

[quote] I said it before and I'll say it again, [R21]: just because heterosexuals lie and cheat on [bold] our spouses [/bold] and treat the institution of matrimony as a joke doesn't mean gay people have to

So you're a straight cunt here on a Gay discussion forum telling us what kind of relationships we can and cannot have.

That's just super, honey, what do you do for an encore?

OP = Knee-jerk, bigoted, self-righteous, ignorant Ass Clown.

Relax, it's just sex. You're reducing marriage to just sex. Marriage is a much bigger ball of wax that open couples still only do for each other. for 200,000 years of human history before Christianity, most every marriage was "open" sexually. Most cultures approved of and glorified polyamorous husbands who took lovers outside the home and even had legal brothels, symposia and bathhouses to do it in.

So decolonize your mind from your bullshit Christian dogma and habits. It doesn't suit human beings, especially males.

I can't believe how OP cheapens and reduces marriage more than any polyamorist people.

The OP

[quote]You're the assholes for actively discouraging monogamy and saying cheating on your spouse is no big deal.

Well, except that it's not cheating and few people in open relationships are "actively discouraging monogamy."

[quote]And even if you refuse to call it cheating, it's still cheating

Nope, see R23.

[quote]because it makes a mockery out of the whole idea of two people being in a relationship.

No, it doesn't. It's still two people "being in a relationship."

[quote]It makes a mockery out of love itself.

Only in your fevered imagination. Most people understand the distinction between sex and love and they don't confuse the two.

[quote]Gay men should not have to settle for less.

Gay men should "settle" for whatever they work out with their partner. And what they agree on is none of your fucking business.

[quote]You deserve a man who would give up all other men to be with you.

And if that's what you want, go for it. And if that's not what you want, keep looking until you find what you want. Is that really so difficult for you to understand?

[quote]You deserve respect and consideration.

No part of an open relationship implies lack of "respect and consideration."

[quote]You deserve to be told the truth.

No part of an open relationship implies lack of "the truth."

[quote]You deserve a man who can trust you.

No part of an open relationship implies lack of trust.

[quote]You deserve a man who can be faithful to you.

No part of an open relationship implies lack of faithfulness. Basically, you're wrong on all counts. And I say this as someone who isn't even in an open relationship.

OP, when you've managed to ensare a top long enough to live in the same house, and then after the initial euphoria has worn off, spent the next year trying to fend off his desire to have anal sex every day (sometimes more), you can come back and criticise open relationships.

I consider myself an open minded person, but have never quite understood open relationships. And the touchiness and outward hostility with which the institution's proponents' respond to any criticism make me think there's nothing particularly deep to understand beyond the surface appearance that they are for people afraid to be alone.

I'm in my late 30s, live in Manhattan, and have lived in LA and done the rounds of all the gay touchstones. Fire Island, West Hollywood, Palm Springs, Greece, blah blah blah. And as I've grown up myself, it's been alarming to watch men around me in these parts just...not do the same. And more often than not, an open relationship is involved (when they're attached at all).

Chasing dick, like anything else, should get boring for a person actually developing as a whole human being. I've found that one of the main benefits of being in a relationship is to open up space in your life for other things besides trying to get laid and seek validation from strangers. The couples that still prowl around Equinox hunting for validation and affirmation from someone else as lacking in self esteem are beyond sad. It's a dark, dark version of Peter Pan syndrome. Anything in life worth having--including a successful and truly intimate relationship--requires compromise and sacrifice, and I just see a bunch of dudes unwilling to do that work because they don't believe they deserve it. So they end up with a roommate with benefits. And incidentally, it makes dating miserable (so my single friends tell me) because a bunch of people who are probably better off with someone else never leave their relationship but just fuck around.

I'm not terribly interested in criticisms of being judgmental. It's entirely appropriate and advisable to have an opinion about these sorts of things. Even though a relationship is between two people, it doesn't exist in a vacuum and I'm not sure anyone truly can not have an opinion about what might be a good/better/bad/worse way to look at how we arrange relationships.

R7 here. Are gay men more promiscuous? Yes, of course they are. We all know it. WE ALL KNOW IT. You can clutch your pearls and deny it as much as you like but it's the truth - as this article in the Huffington Post acknowledges.

As for gay 'marriage'. It's marriage in the way Rachel Dolezal is black, Caitlyn Jenner is a woman, and Hillary Clinton is honest - that's to say just inside their heads. So whatever (very sincerely no doubt) two men and women are getting up to when they pledge their troth - and have legal recognition of that commitment it's not marriage. Marriage doesn't fall under the remit of any government, court or human institution to redefine as they will. It's hubristic to imagine they can. I hope that the new administration will replace it with something else that clearly demarcates marriage between a man and a woman from all other unions - even if a certain degree of legal and financial protection seems politically prudent for such people - even as we recognise that these will only very, very rarely be monogamous and faithful in the way that heterosexual relationships commonly are.

Please feel free to vent, spit feathers, block, protest and otherwise shriek at me for stating the blatantly obvious. Oh and your homo-normative insistance that MY experience as a gay man doesn't 'count' simply because it's different to yours. Yeah. Nice irony there, Inclusivists.

Whatever sort of relationship you and your partner choose for your lives is fine.

Don't impose it on other people.

If you are not a partner in an open relationship, or a sexual connection to one of the partners, why concern yourself with what they choose to do.

As an exception, if children are involved, it is not favorable for a family situation.

Most children in straight households have been raised by at least one parent who has partners outside of marriage.

It's been that way for hundreds, perhaps thousands of years. Why people think this is some "new" thing they need to pitch a fit about is bizarre.

r7 I thought that swingers were mostly heterosexuals,but I guess one always learns something new everyday.

r30 we will call it "antimarriage". marriage is a peudo "union" of people having the sad condition of having distinct body parts, antimaariage is the union between those that are naturally united by nature as their body parts are equal and uniform. that is how we should define them.

OP, you raise some interesting points. But Jesus H. Christ, are you ever a bad ambassador for your point of view!

If even the most self-loathing, religious, conservative, and gay-hating gay man can't elude the glamour of promiscuity (Milo Y), then what chance do us loyal and proud gay men have?

this is what God had to do to improve the fucked up "marriage" of heterosexuals. he made them more "homosexual-like" by reducing their toxic sexual dimorphism, thus, he made them very similar to the superior homosexual couples,otherwise everything would be too funny and homosexuals would be making a lot of fun of those freaks of nature.

I'm with you OP.

Open relationships are for fucked up people that pretend to be cool. Nothing more hypocritical than that.

Open marriages are a joke. Why bother getting married? An open relationship makes much more sense. I don't commit to anyone unless I plan on being monogamous. It's a very chicken shit thing to do. Are they afraid of being "alone"?

We have weird trolls attacking open relationships now?

Did they run out of Fuckface von Clownstick trolling shit?

[quote]It's been that way for hundreds, perhaps thousands of years. Why people think this is some "new" thing they need to pitch a fit about is bizarre.

Seriously. What is with this bizarre idea that marriages were normally about monogamy? Through most of human history marriage wasn't even about love, and men, particularly men of means of course had sexual relations outside of their marriage.

Marriage between men and women on view to family life is social glue - it holds society together.

That's why Liberal Gays are schizophrenic about it: on the one hand those who aspire to heteronormativity to demonstrate that gays do participate in that common project and should be welcomed within it; on the other those who say FU to that straitjacket who reject it and take umbrage when people call them out on their promiscuity - as evidenced by R41 above. And then there are those who want both: the veneer of the normalising label 'marriage' but - as OP says - none of the substance. That Ghoul Elton John comes to mind, with his vampire 'spouse'. Brrrr.

I wonder what the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah is about: the people in the biblical account are so ANGRY - angry that their sexual license isn't being validated by the Visitors, angry that this implies rejection of their chosen way of life, angry that it implies disapproval of their way of life. So they want revenge and they want sexual revenge - they're going to rape their way to winning the argument. In the end, then, that blind hatred and anger coupled with a perverse sexual expression of it consumes them, burns them up, destroys them. That's how I understand the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah. They were full of sexualised spite and in that sense, much like the posters on here who talk about heterosexuals straying from their marriage commitments over hundreds if not thousands of years, the first recorded 'gay community' there in Sodom and Gomorrah sounds REMARKABLY similar to the Liberal Gays that post their venom and rage when they are criticised on here.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

And it won't finish well for you, folks - because you are the authors of your own destruction - as the STI rates amongst gay men demonstrate.

I'm not into open relationships, so I don't have them. What other people do is their business. Relationships can be difficult, do what works for you.

My only qualification to that is if one partner is uncomfortable with being in an open relationship and they feel trapped in it. Both partners need to negotiate the limits of their relationship, not one partner deciding for both. That's not gay specific though, that goes for any relationship.

Is R43 loose from some sort of mental institution? She's very strange.

R45 Ah the old mental illness trope. Didn't the Soviets already exhaust that tactic back in the day? I'm just offering an alternative perspective. See it as part of the diverse rainbow of opinions the 'Gay Community' is always so welcoming towards.

She's just mad because a number of her lovers were closeted gay men and now she's hating on gay men as a matter of course because she's convinced herself that she's the reason why they're gay.

You're just some woman. You were just there. You had no impact. You were a toy. A plaything. You were nothing.

Sorry.

R47 Nice piece of projection sweet cheeks but look again:

"Oh and your homo-normative insistance that MY experience as a gay man doesn't 'count' simply because it's different to yours."

That's me. You'd call me a conservative 'self-hater'. But that's just designed to make you feel better. It doesn't do that, of course, which is when you slip in to enraged mode. And, hey look, we're back in Sodom!

I guess those straying heterosexuals over the last few thousands years haven't changed much down to this day - and neither have The Militant Gays.

You're not gay. You're a woman or a straight man who thinks he's gay because he's flaming.

[quote] See it as part of the diverse rainbow of opinions the 'Gay Community' is always so welcoming towards.

Ah. Well then do stop by, my Gay Comminity will "welcome" you with a baseball bat, darling.

*CommUnity

R49! Ha! Marvellous. Thanks for that. Yes - I'd love to be a straight guy. It would make my life WAY more easy. But alas, not. I'm a gay. Just not at all part of your often squalid Liberal community - which is, as evidenced by R50 and R51 prone to deep (genuinely self-hating) violence...

Funny that.

sodomah and gomorrah jajajajajajajajaja I guess that is the proof given to convince idiots that the creator "hate" homosexuals and love heterosexuals instead, with a love "like that', what do they need an enemy for?

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose. C'est vrai !!! les heterosexuels sont toujour la meme merde, n'importe ou. Ils sont toujours maudit par Dieu

what is really sad about this person is that it seems that it has found in datalounge a way to spend their lonely and sad time in his/or her life. this troll is opening threads, posting comments on several threads etc, we the gays must feel welcoming of this poor and lonely soul because she/he is clearly deeply damaged.

This is an example of how harsh heterosexuality is to a weak psyche at a very profound level of consciousness,they must always fall into highly violent philosophies and theological musings in order to make up their own reality where they may feel that they are not cursed and mistreated by God himself, this is how they build their own mental cocoon to feel safe from the real wrath of God. They all come from the same origin, from the darkest minds.

OP, unfortunately FOR YOU, and others like you, this is the reality. Move into the future with open fluidity. Staunch monogamous relationships like mom and dad's will hold you back.

Since this thread began I have been accused of being heterosexual and have had ableist slurs hurled at me by proponents of "open" "relationships" which only prove once and for all that I was right.

"Ableist" = big fat fucking troll - always.

In summary, if you don't like open relationships, don't be in one. It's really that simple. But, hey, if you want to run your blood pressure up over nonsense, be our guest.

It is not nonsense, OP. And saying "if you don't like it, don't be in one" is like saying "if you don't like the air, don't breathe."

[quote]Well, except that it's not cheating

Yes it is. Cheating by any other name is still cheating. If you're not committed to your boyfriend 100%, you don't really love him.

I'm always accused of being straight when I question threads when people confess to having had 400, 500 sex partners on their lives. Yeah, that is totally normal and healthy. So, I'll just back away from this thread.

R59 is the one who decides what love is and is not?

I had no idea. Tell us more, child, we are fascinated by this magical power you are claiming.

I've checked the OP's severely limited posts on the browser that she's using for this thread.

She's definitely a troll.

They have open relationships at the Bellagio.

[quote]And saying "if you don't like it, don't be in one" is like saying "if you don't like the air, don't breathe."

This is unfathomably stupid. You just murdered the concepts of analogies.

A lot of the gay couples I know who have low term relationships wouldn't be able to maintain them if the relationships weren't 'open.' Many of them came close to breaking up, and then they started to 'swing' together, and the relationships survived. I don't know why this seems to be common among gay couples. It's not for me, but then maybe that's why I'm alone and they're not.

^^^^ long ^^^^^

There are no rules except that you deserve to get what you want.

If you demand the excitement of change that comes with a constant turnover of new partners, find someone who wants the same thing. If you crave the stability that comes with being a couple without all that intrigue and drama, you have a right to a partner who feels the same way.

Sneaking around behind someone's back or using threats of ending your relationship to blackmail your partner into situations that cause him pain are not the way to go.

Every relationship needs to define itself.

Anyone who assumes that there is any "norm" that must be followed has absolutely no fucking clue what a relationship even is.

r66 Great advice, but a lot of people don't know what their partner truly wants until they're so invested in the relationship emotionally, and sometimes financially, that they can't walk away.

Eons ago and went out and found a guy that also believed in monogamous LTRs. While I don't understand the other side I certainly don't begrudge them their 'freedom'. Live and Let Live

r67 How does a relationship 'define itself'? It's not tangible. I assume you're saying it's either going to work or it's not. And if you can't handle your partner's sense of what their 'norm' is, then you have no clue what a relationship is? I can only assume what type of relationship you're in, if you're in one.

R70 - A relationship defines itself by communication between the partners within that relationship. Without open, honest and occasionally selfish communication there can be no understanding between the partners about what they want/need from the relationship or, for that matter, life itself.

It is also important to understand that both partners wants and needs may and probably will change over time. Sometimes these changes can lead to an end of the relationship. Sometimes the changes can lead to a deeper love, which, to me, is actually what a relationship is all about.

Oh, and I have been in a loving relationship for 37 turbulent and fascinating years.

Oh, I forgot to mention R70 - Enjoy your loneliness!

Always quizzical when people want to determine for me what is right and what is wrong

I understand people wanting monogamous relationships but everyone still seems oddly hung up on sex being the defining characteristic of stable partnership.

What is wrong for one person is wrong for everyone and "open" "relationships" are wrong because they are not real relationships and never will be, and none of your moral relativist and therefore wrong arguments make it any less indefensible . "Honey, I love you, but you don't satisfy me sexually so I'm going to sleep around and you're going to accept that or I'll dump you" is emotional blackmail, and that's what an "open" "relationship" really is, and anyone who defends them on this thread or anywhere else is a troll.

Dear god r75, you really are an ignorant troll.

[quote] I understand people wanting monogamous relationships but everyone still seems oddly hung up on sex being the defining characteristic of stable partnership.

It's one of many things. There's also mutual interests and complementary personalities, too.

Not currently in a relationship and not looking to be in one, open, monogamous, whatever. Also, I'm in the live and let live camp, but don't judge me as a prude when I say three ways with you and your partner or Saturday night swing parties are not my thing.

OP has declared his boundaries. Next.

Can someone explain who the OP is and who gives a fuck what she thinks?

[quote]He derailed the Mrs. Savage thread about this, and when people stopped responding to his ass he started this thread.

Dan Savage is a lying racist asshole. People like that deserve to be lonely and obscure, not the rest of us. "Open" "relationships" cheapen love and cheapen sex by essentially saying you don't matter as much as any random hookup you might want to have.

Monogamous gays are loyal, loving, and giving. We are the ones who deserve to be held up as role models by the entire gay community. And we do not deserve to be insulted and condescended to by a bunch of cheaters who act like cheating is a virtue. I don't care what kind of euphemisms you use, you are still cheaters, you make it harder to find faithful husbands, and you make me embarrassed to be gay with your behavior and your refusal to consider how cheating hurts the other partner. If you can't promise to be faithful, you shouldn't be in a relationship to begin with.

Every other gay man I've talked to in person about it has said essentially the same thing: eventually in "open" "relationships," they have sex with everyone but each other.

Gay men do not need to mimic the values of the worst heterosexuals.

This is why the straights won't accept us as equals in their society!

R83, nice straw man argument. If you want the truth, I fucking HATE heterosexuality. I HATE it. I HATE seeing hot men with women. I HATE the lie that children need two opposite-sex parents in order to grow up to be something other than criminals and losers.

No, we should be idealizing homosexuality because two men devoted to one another exclusively for life is the gay male ideal. It should be celebrated, encouraged and defended at all costs. Monogamous gay men deserve to be put on a pedestal. After all the insults we've put up with from cheaters, we've fucking earned it.

And after all the attempts you fucking cheaters have done to try and actively break up monogamous gay relationships, nothing you say or do will ever make me respect you or consider you anything but an embarrassment to the gay community.

Monogamous gay relationships are the only acceptable kind of relationship of any kind. There are no morally acceptable forms of heterosexual coupling. None whatsoever.

R83 Hilariously subscribing to the view that there are heterosexual morals - and by extension gay morals - and thus by extension black morals and white morals - and by extension Canadian morals and American morals - and by extension morals in 212 Acacia Avenue and morals in 213 Acacia Avenue - and by extension my morals on Tuesday and my morals on Wednesday - and by extension NO MORALS WHATSOEVER BECAUSE ONE MAN'S GOOD IS ANOTHER MAN'S EVIL.

So let's get this clear: There are just morals. Period. Not gay, not straight, black, white, brown or rainbow. Just morals.

I HATE moral relativism. It's such crap.

Slow long clap for R87.

R87 are you also r84?

I only ask because you certainly seem to hate a lot.

Or, I should say, you certainly seem to HATE a lot.

You sound like a real catch.

Two men devoted to one another exclusively for life is not the gay male ideal at all. Most gay males aren't very interested in complete and eternal monogamy.

Don't get me wrong - I understand your anxiety. It is becoming harder and harder to find partners that will accept your demand for absolute monogamy. Soon the only guys who will accept that kind of lifestyle will be those who are so unattractive that absolute monogamy is their only chance to find a partner.

R33, and that is suppose to be virtuous?

Heterosexual men will grasp at any straw to justify cheating. As gay men, we owe it to ourselves to be better than that because we are better than that.

r90 "Soon the only guys who will accept that kind of lifestyle will be those who are so unattractive that absolute monogamy is their only chance to find a partner."

God, that is rich. Did you take your TRUVADA today?

R90, stop projecting your irresponsibility onto the rest of us. Ever hear of "Thou shalt not commit adultery." Well that rule applies to everyone.

. = ?

Out of curiosity - who among the monogamy at all costs crowd is in a relationship, and for how long?

I'm with my partner for 16 years. We've had a few threesomes. Wasn't a big deal at all and in fact made sex afterwards with each other, hotter. (just our experience).

I have been seeing my current boyfriend since December 2014 and I wouldn't cheat on him for anyone. Ever.

If you are on an open relationship and you stick to the agreed rules, you are by definition not cheating.

R94 you are quoting the Old Testament on a gay site to prove your point? Are you completely mad?

There are many different reasons for people to enter into non-monogamy. They are not all born of the same cloth.

Yes, sometimes the reason is for guys to get a license to be self-involved when it comes to intimacy, and of course I agree that can be rooted in immaturity, and can be a recipe for disaster, even when both parties are consenting to it. Also, given that we are a subculture that has historically been marginalized for our sexuality, it's very easy to hold on to the slut banner with pride, and disavow anything approaching monogamy, despite the onset of our equal rights.

But sometimes there are other circumstances at work. Some couples have needs that eclipse such intimacy, and they certainly can make an open relationship work. It can even enhance their connection. I know of some couples like this, and I totally respect their choice and situation. Sometimes love really does extend to the art of sacrifice of portions of your partner's intimacy, and it might be the best thing for you.

That said, I am a monogamist. I've experienced two open relationships, and I learned that I don't ultimately find enough value in them to keep that going. I found that after a while, when I really started to fall in love with my partner, sex with another guy started to feel sad, and I'd miss being with my partner. Also, I have already slept around a lot in my youth, and enjoyed myself, but as a poster mentioned above, it did get boring for me.

So, now that I'm in a monogamous LTR, I have many benefits I never had before. In particular, there's a certain kind of intimacy that is geared toward only my partner, and such intimacy connects into our sense of friendship, romance, love, sex, partnership, travel, debate, arguments, agreements, and day to day life with each other. Such intimacy does not feel like a sacrifice at all, to either of us. We recognize we are both men, and geared to be attracted to other guys around us at times, but the need to act on that attraction just isn't there.

Also, it really is a great thing to have unprotected sex and not need to get testing. That alone is really hot...and increases intimacy and trust.

So, I'm in the live and let live camp, but I hope that I explained my position well, in supporting monogamy.

I wasn't going to weigh in here since OP sounds batshit crazy, however as someone who is in a monogomous gay relationship, I have to say being in an open or poly relationship is not "the gay ideal". It is your ideal. That is it.

I have never understood why so many in our demographic feel it is necessary to belittle those who choose to have just one partner they share their life with. I constantly hear the same degrading comments as to why I need to move into an open relationships - it's the gay way of life, or you are trying to hard to lead a heteronormative life, or why would you want to be monogamous when being open is better/more fun/more open minded, etc. Jesus, what the fuck does it matter if my partner and I want to be monogamous? Why does our way have to be taken apart and disrespected? Live the way you want, but don't harass or belittle me for not being open.

R29, R36, R66/71, and R100 - Agree, and well said all of you.

Why is monogamy so difficult for some people? If you're with a great guy and you're attracted to each other, why would you want to risk it all for one night of pleasure with a stranger whom you'll never see again, and might have had an STD and not known about it?

[quote] I wasn't going to weigh in here since OP sounds batshit crazy

That is ableist hate speech, which is too bad because the rest of your argument is sound, but that was just a really offensive low blow when we are essentially on the same page.

[quote]don't harass or belittle me for not being open.

This. Since cheaters have dished it out at every opportunity then had the nerve to accuse the rest of us for "being judgemental" (textbook psychological projection), they're gonna have to take it from now on.

I never had a period in my life when I wanted to sleep around and play the field.

R89 No, two different people. I have a bad tendency to capitalise. What can I say, I'm hard of hearing. SORRY.

Ok R87. Then I don't HATE you.

OP has anger issues.

Its funny the sheer number of people on this thread who feel so butthurt and bullied by the fact that some couples have an open relationship.

Even the ones who say they are live and let live about the subject can barely conceal their contempt.

Personally, I think both are equally valid. It's personal to what the two people involved negotiate.

But to the lockstep monogamists - what is it that infuriates you so? I mean, knowing that you would never find yourself in an open relationship, where does the judgmental anger and bile come from? How is it personal to YOU? Ask in all seriousness.

OP has so many chips on his shoulders, it must be hard for him to get up in the morning. I never understand why anyone would be so concerned about other people's private business. OP's intolerance and hatred for those in open relationships remind me of how homophobes view gay people: same urge to condemn what they don't understand and to control other people's lives. It's really disturbing.

[quote] OP's intolerance and hatred for those in open relationships remind me of how homophobes view gay people

The defenders of cheating on this thread act the way homophobes believe all of us act.

And I should care about how homophobes perceive me R110?

And I have always needed your respect OP.

[quote]We are the ones who deserve to be held up as role models by the entire gay community.

No, you really, *really*, REALLY don't.

The more you dismiss and disparage monogamy, the less likely gay people will be to even try it. And how can you say monogamy doesn't work when you obviously haven't even tried it?

It's the defenders of cheating who have chips on their shoulder because some of us can see you for what you really are: immature, irresponsible, and unready for the responsibilities of a real relationship. If you don't love a man enough to give up all other men to be with him, then it's not really love.

[quote]Why is monogamy so difficult for some people?

Why is it any business of yours and why do you care?

[quote]It's the defenders of cheating who have chips on their shoulder

Talk about projection....

Yes we do, R113. We deserve to be held up as role models because we have proven that gays are capable of showing love and commitment. If monogamy were really unnatural, all those statistics would be extremely lopsided and show "open" "relationships" as 100% of all gay couplings. It is not, therefore monogamy is not only possible but natural, healthy and rewarding. It should be encouraged, idealized and celebrated.

We deserve to be held up as role models because we have proven that gays are capable of imitating heterosexuals in every possible way.

"The more you dismiss and disparage monogamy, the less likely gay people will be to even try it. "

Maybe in your retarded group of gays. But most people I know aren't that impressionable and without their own sense of what works for them.

[quote]Yes we do, R113.

You missed the point, R117. You, personally, *really* do not "deserve to be held up as a role model." Your anger, your intolerance, your stupidity, your inflexibility render you unfit for that designation.

[quote]We deserve to be held up as role models because we have proven that gays are capable of showing love and commitment.

Nothing about an open relationship demonstrates lack of "love and commitment."

Nice to see that not only are you amoral and irresponsible, but an ableist bigot to boot, R119. Monogamy works for everyone. If you don't believe me, then maybe you should actually try it for a change.

Just because breeders cheat doesn't mean gays have to. It is contradictory to claim "gays shouldn't try to ape hetero norms" and then go on to ape one of the absolute worst norms of HATERoSICKsual "culture": cheating.

Being faithful to my boyfriend does not involve telling him he can only stick his dick in me.

[quote]It's not cheating if they agree the relationship is open.

Yes it is.

Dear God what a fatuous discussion.

It looks like the next generation of gays is starting to wake up…

This thread is a petri dish of dirty trolling. And so many are falling for it.

The concept of monogamy never entered the gay culture until the aids crisis. At least not in my experience. Oh,we pretended to be loyal,but any bitch out there who says they werent cheaters is a liar. Ive known many gay men in my 55 years,many long term couples,some 20-30-40 years,and I only ever knew ONE couple that didnt have sex out of their relationship. Just ONE. And quite frankly that was because they werent terribly attractive. We are not like straights,we will never be like straights,and aping the straights is still never going to make us accepted like straights. You dont want to fuck around on your man,then dont. But dont kid yourself that he wont fuck around on you.

R128 Thank you for your honesty.

(Although you're stating what should be obvious to anyone as I said before.)

I just feel that the people who get so viscerally worked up about open relationships are terrified of the competition.

Relationships are not a fucking game, R130, so why should I or anyone else be afraid of the "competition."

You sound like one of these sows on Springer/Maury afraid some bitch is gonna steal her man, who by the way, just got out of prison, whose sole income is welfare and has 4 kids with two different women.

Yeah, you're a real dreamboat, R130.

Wow R129, so much vitriol towards anyone who doesn't conform to your version of 'normal'. Sounds like the reason you only knew one monogamous gay couple is because you surrounded yourself with those who choose to only feel the way you do about the subject. Maybe those in monogamous relationships avoided you because of your negativity about their choice. What a closed and narrow minded view you have. Sad.

And no, many do not cheat on monogamous relationships, despite your derogatory statement to the contrary. Monogamy is not about being straight, just choosing not to fuck outside of the relationship.

[quote] In summary, if you don't like open relationships, don't be in one. It's really that simple.

I agree, it's about mutual consent. However, so many cheaters will try to justify their cheating by saying that "other couples have open relationships" with the implication being that almost no one is monogamous therefore the cheater has a right to hurt their partner/husband/whatever.

And a lot of people who believe in monogamy are like the OP with their anger. However, those in open relationships just LOVE to lord it over monogamous couples about how their relationship with multiple fuck conquests is far superior and "normal" and certainly, happier. No one likes having their relationships diminished regardless of whatever agreements a couple makes.

For myself, I would never want to be in an open relationship/marriage, but if my husband ever strayed I would not react with such rage as the OP. I would be very calm and kill them both and dispose of their corpses where they will never be located for generations.

Op, you're being extreme. If you say that all gay couples should be monogamous, then you might as well say that they all must have children, too. Why not? Gay couples should show what excellent parents they're capable of being. Homophobia might decrease if more people are raised by gays. Young gays can follow their example, and form monogamous relationships and families of their own. After all, after what we've been through, don't we deserve an idealized scenario like this?

The truth is this: not everyone is meant for monogamy, just like not everyone is meant to raise children. If you're saying that non-monogamous people don't deserve a main partner in their lives, then you're wrong. Adults ought to decide what works best for them in a relationship. Forcing monogamy on them, just like forcing children on them, will result in a very unhappy couple, in which resentment, distrust, and lies will occur and flourish. Your principles might not favor an open relationship, but at least have them favor an [italic]honest[/italic] one, in which all involved parties are happy and at peace with themselves.

This OP is the same one who created a a thread whining that people have been f&fing him.

But what is really fucking funny, is he is a 22 year old virgin that knows NOTHING ABOUT RELATIONSHIPS.

Is that not just perfect? You can't make this shit up.

Straight couples do worse.

They usually CHEAT while pretending be in a monogamous relationship.

At least in open relationships the partner is aware.

Monogamy is for ugly people. Open relationships and cheating are bonuses in life for being HAWT.

Different strokes for different folks

R136 is a cunting Bump Bitch™ for bumping this toxic thread.

Fuck off breeder

I’m confused by open relationships. Infidelity can happen over time and that’s understandable. But to go into a relationship knowing other people would be coming and going is... well, it wouldn’t be my first choice.

Our little zealot/bigot claiming otherwise:

I fucking hate open relationships, don't respect anyone in them and never will You're the assholes for actively discouraging monogamy and saying cheating on your spouse is no big deal. And even if you refuse to call it cheating, it's still cheating because it makes a mockery out of the whole idea of two people being in a relationship. It makes a mockery out of love itself. Gay men should not have to settle for less. You deserve a man who would give up all other men to be with you. You deserve respect and consideration. You deserve to be told the truth. You deserve a man who can trust you. You deserve a man who can be faithful to you. Don't let ANYONE, no matter how famous, tell you otherwise.

I fucking hate open relationships, don't respect anyone in them and never will Yes it is, R1. Cheating is cheating no matter what kind of word games you play.

I fucking hate open relationships, don't respect anyone in them and never will R3, this is my thread so YOU are the troll.

I fucking hate open relationships, don't respect anyone in them and never will Because of anti-monogamy jerks like Dan Savage who get publicity for pandering to the worst stereotypes of gay men, including the inability to commit which is one of the worst, one of the most false, and one of the key arguments homophobes use against marriage equality, R5.

I fucking hate open relationships, don't respect anyone in them and never will The fact that I, a gay man, have never, ever committed adultery and never will. But whoever generated that apocryphal and probably inaccurate statistic, which R7 conveniently failed to include.

Stop thinking every other gay man is as irresponsible and self-loathing as you. And your sneer quote around the word marriage tells me all I need to know. Punched AND deleted.

I fucking hate open relationships, don't respect anyone in them and never will [quote]But whoever generated that apocryphal and probably inaccurate statistic, which [R7] conveniently failed to include…

…didn't ask me.

I fucking hate open relationships, don't respect anyone in them and never will The hell it isn't, OP. I'm tired of seeing gay men bend over backwards to make excuses for their inability to commit.

I fucking hate open relationships, don't respect anyone in them and never will [quote]Have met any Lesbians?

Yes, and I still think it's nothing but an offensive stereotype created by breeders to justify anti-gay discrimination. Dan Savage is an anachronism.

I fucking hate open relationships, don't respect anyone in them and never will R14, that is a misandrist remark, and if you are a man, you have some serious self-loathing issues.

I fucking hate open relationships, don't respect anyone in them and never will Saying men can't commit is misandrist.

Saying gay men can't commit is misandrist AND homophobic.

I fucking hate open relationships, don't respect anyone in them and never will I said it before and I'll say it again, R21: just because heterosexuals lie and cheat on our spouses and treat the institution of matrimony as a joke doesn't mean gay people have to. We've earned marriage equality rights, let's accept the responsibility along with it. They're a package deal.

When asked for comment, those in open relationships were too busy fucking, getting laid, having a good time and in general, having a life to respond.

Meanwhile, the flapping of the incredibly nellie hissing prisspot OP's caftan was mistaken for a helicopter chopper, and the FAA grounded her.

I agree OP. IMO, they’re the worst of both worlds.

What part of "thou shalt not commit adultery" do you not understand?

SEX? With the LIGHTS on?

HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS! HISS!

[quote]Why is it any business of yours and why do you care?

Ask all those squares on the AIDS quilt if the gay men they represented were still alive.

R147 You are truly the dumbest person who ever lived.

EVER.

Cheating by any other name is still cheating.

So-called slut-shaming is justified if it keeps gay men, or anyone else for that matter, from spreading STDs.

“Cheating” is not the same as an open relationship.

Mary! So many pedants, so little time.

As if we who are happy in our open relationships give a good goddamn what you think of us.

OP and her supporters must be a lot of fun at dinner parties. And in life.

Cheating can be very fun

And cheating makes sex hotter sorry it’s true

OP sounds like a frau clutching her pearls. God forbid people have fun sex.

I'm surprised at the under-40s' cavalier attitude toward affairs. They joke about it, tease ("Just don't sleep with the neighbor!" hee-hee).

I think that's the future: discreet liaisons and serial monogamy. They could never deprive themselves a chance at a hot time.

Saying open relationships discourage monogamy it's the same nonsense said when gay marriage was legalized: that it would lead to less straight marriages because they would be demoralised and thinking it had no point.

Bitch if a unrelated couple having a open relationship affects and discourage you, maybe you're not so monogamous.

Anyone who feels monogamous will stay that way.

R156 You can't be monogamous by yourself, retard.

R11, I'm NOT tired of seeing them bend over forward to do the same!

Why was this thread from 2016 bumped? Defacto being an annoying asshole again?

I would find an open relationship intolerable

Agreed OP. You see how dangerous are these people in open relationships.

Every open relationship is different. There are healthy and unhealthy ways to navigate them. If an open relationship is not right for you, don’t have one.

Will and Jada apparently had an open marriage.

It’s not for me, at least so far. Most of all it’s not for me to say or impose on another couple. I wonder why you think you know better OP?

PS, how are they dangerous R161? People in open relationships pose no threat to me.

I think there are a handful of couples who can actually handle it, and where the enthusiasm for the openness is equal in both partners. Mostly I think one person assents in order to keep the other person.

2016 thread

2016 thread

2016 thread

2016 thread

True r167. But while the faces may have changed, the hassles are still the same.

And probably some of the cranks and trolls.

Tell me you're terminally single and can't get laid without telling me...

Jeez, you have a personality disorder. Not too sure why you can't accept that other people's relationships, and what works for them, are the grand total of NONE of your fucking business. If you don't like it, don't do it - really is pointless to attempt to dictate how other people should live their lives and what makes them happy.

Also, it's not just gay men who have non-monogamous relationships, so don't be so homophobic!

Tell me you're not really monogamous without saying me you're not monogamous.

Bump

Oh good moral christian values created to maintain the patriarchy....

JUST exactly what a GAY webpage needs 🤯🤪😒😒

There is usually an unhealthy power imbalance in this sort of relationship.

On the other hand, people get together and form "relationships" or partnerships for various reasons unrelated to love. So, with those it might be doable.