Anyone watching "Holy Hell", the documentary about the gay 'guru'/cult leader on CNN?…

Kind of a modern day Gurdjieff.

There were a lot of handsome men in his enclave.

I wonder what his background was, before he came to the U.S. Did they say where he was from originally?

I get the feeling that Gurleen knows her way around a caftan or two.

No one knows, R1…not even those who have known him a long time, although the belief is South America (Venezuela, to be precise).

That was going to be my guess R3, because his accent reminded me of Ricardo Montelban, although I just looked him up and I guess Ricardo was actually from Mexico, not Venezuela. (I could have sworn he was from Venezuela!)

He is definitly of spanish speaking origen.

I am dying of curiosity to know about his past.

I watched part of it...I never understand why anyone ever joins a cult, unless they have a lot of power in the cult. I have nothing in common with that type of personality and for a grown man having sex with a guy who he supposedly does not want to have sex with...I do not get it at all.

The cult leader was East Indian.

Fetching:

Hot...?

Someone needs go track down the porn movies that he was in before he was a guru.

So many of the people who joined this cult seemed damaged. There was definitely an aura of sadness around each of them. It's easy to see why they got sucked in.

R7, I was forced to be in a cult growing up (not the one in this doc) and you'd be shocked by how quickly people - regardless of age, education or socioeconomic status - are willing to sign over accountability. For a lot of people, it's because they feel lost or disconnected and want to feel part of something bigger and/or comforting. Because of that need, they are willing to engage in things outside of their comfort zone and rationalize it's for the greater good.

Also, hive mind mentality plays a part: if a person sees other followers engaged in something (and seemingly reaping the benefits/happiness) they are then more inclined participate as well.

To your point, I think a strong sense of self helps avoid those sort of traps as these 'leaders' are actively looking for a person's vulnerability to exploit. It's more difficult to use the above tactics if someone is more confident/questioning.

Obviously, every person is different and the above doesn't always apply…but it's definitely my takeaway during my time in Cultville.

(That last word made me double take after typing as it looked like "Cuntville"…HA! Same damn difference, though) ;-)

I never heard of this cult before watching this documentary. Fascinating. LOL @ the leader telling everyone he had a cameo in "Rosemary's Baby". TBH he was hot in the 80s when the filmmaker joined and started filming. It's fascinating that none of the guys told anyone that they were unwillingly having sex with him. Of the guys who appeared in the documentary, only 2 of them were gay.

It was crazy to see how everyone thought this kween was some god-like being.

It's sad that at the end of the documentary, we saw that he still has followers, though the number is much smaller than in the 80s and 90s.

Glenn grew up in a cult, you know.

Walking around in speedos, obsessing over vanity, fitness, ballet...

And very bad ballet, at that...

and plastic surgery as he aged!

His eyes in the last several videos were so creepy

[quote]LOL @ the leader telling everyone he had a cameo in "Rosemary's Baby". TBH he was hot in the 80s when the filmmaker joined and started filming. It's fascinating that none of the guys told anyone that they were unwillingly having sex with him. Of the guys who appeared in the documentary, only 2 of them were gay.

A few slight corrections - Michel/Andreas/Reyji (sp?) actually told everyone (and wrote in some flyer offering his services as an acting coach or something) that he was FEATURED in Rosemary's Baby. Then they showed the clip and he was basically a line-less extra who managed to get a close shot of his face in the last scene of the movie.

Also, there were more than 2 gay guys - the bios at the end confirmed about two of them (the dirty blond with plucked eyebrows who lost his cherry to the master and the grey-bearded spiritual quirky one with the neck jewelry). In addition, it is safe to assume the filmmaker is gay (besides having had a love affair with the master for 18 years, he pings like hell in interviews now), and that the hot guy with the beard (the one who broke down thanking Sophia) is bisexual.

I realize times were different back in the 80s (I was only a baby back then) but were people unaware about cults? I thought there was great cult awareness after the disaster of the 60s and 70s with Charles Manson and others? I know that people who join cults feel lost and disconnected from society but I was surprised that none of the followers realized it was a cult until years later.

I was trying to think who does this guy remind me of? Then it hit me...John Basedow! The Fitness Made Simple guy

"Miss Gay Jim Jones was fond of wearing a speedo on the regular and regularly boned various male followers. I give the dude credit, he has a good eye for male candy."

Jim Jim was the gay/bi Jim Jones.

[quote] "Miss Gay Jim Jones was fond of wearing a speedo on the regular and regularly boned various male followers. I give the dude credit, he has a good eye for male candy." [quote]

Jim Jim was the gay/bi Jim Jones.

Jim Jones was doing guys too. All successful cult leaders are sexually fluid (which may explain why this strictly gay Michel kween is not as successful). They need to be, to control their adoring followers.

[quote]so many of the people who joined this cult seemed damaged. There was definitely an aura of sadness around each of them.

And that's different from the guys that hang out at gay bars or Datalounge on any given night HOW exactly?

This just confirms for me that most Latin men age like shit 'cuz back in the day "Michel" was a HOT SLUT. A very SHORT-LIVED hot slut but still a hot slut.

Seriously, where do I sign up?

Did Jamie Gomez appear in any Kristen Bjorn videos? He's totally the type.

[quote]I watched part of it...I never understand why anyone ever joins a cult, unless they have a lot of power in the cult. I have nothing in common with that type of personality and for a grown man having sex with a guy who he supposedly does not want to have sex with...I do not get it at all.

Drugs. Lots and lots of drugs.

This article gives some background info about the Buddafield Cult and the making of the documentary.

R28 in this cult they did not do drugs or even drink alcohol. It was all about natural highs and healthy living.

Jaime Gomez aka Michel/Andreas, left, in a still from 1968 film Rosemary’s Baby

I would think this guy would be a DL favorite

I'm watching it now... This is some crazy shit.

Did I understand correctly that the Michel/Andreas/whatever didn't have a job once he started the cult? They mentioned how the followers all had regular jobs of varying levels and helped to pay for everything but I don't recall the "master" working after he stopped having those West Hollywood yoga classes.

Just watched it on Netflix. I probably would have joined the cult just to be around all of those men in speedos! Arf! Arf! Arf! I'm very easily brainwashed by fit men strutting their stuff like that.

Anyway, yea…someone find Michel's pornos! He looked quite hot in his prime.

c'mon elder gays! Were none of you in West Hollywood at the time this guy started his "classes" and turned it into a cult? Surely someone on this board had to have known someone who went at least once to a class.

R20 Think about how many people want so badly to be part of a group. Look around at all the people driving the same cars, wearing the same clothes. Clubs, sororities, sports teams, the military and all religions are usually about conformity, consensus and going along with the group thought.

The difference is that the majority of those in charge of these step in line type organizations realize they can last much longer and make much more money if they don't cross certain lines with their control. That doesn't mean they couldn't. If the Pope announced all good Catholics needed to sacrifice their 2nd born in order for Christ to return, you'd have people doing it. Maybe not all but in a religion of millions... If some NFL quarterback was playing lousy and announced that his play was jinxed and he needed a fan to kill himself at Lambeau Field to break it, you'd get at least one who showed up.

Frankly, I was pretty impressed with that theater they put up.

And now we know why Trump has so many supporters.

I watched it. Throughout the entire film, I kept thinking of the parallels to Scientology. And the 'charismatic' leadership In charge of the pack and blind devotion to all the tales - and if not - expulsion or punishment. F.R.E.A.K.Y.

Producer of this is a trust fund kid who pretends she isn't.

Big surprise there...

R26, he doesn't look latin to me. He looks Arab.

A lot of the cult members seem like they are trust funders. The leader was able to get a lot built/accomplished without fundraising. Plus the type of "jobs" the former members stated at the end of the film.

The film glosses over this, but It all screams playing on daddy's money.

The gay community often feels just like a cult

Is Buddhism (in the West) a cult?

The cult that made me think lonely people looking for a group was the Hale Bop one.

R37 you're right but I just don't understand people who are so desperate to "find where they belong". Yes, this guy started out seemingly nice but eyebrows should have been raised when he started telling members they needed to do "services" for him from body massages to cooking his meals and opening doors for him. The idea that he had each member attend private "psychotherapy" sessions with him for $50 each time should have been viewed as a scam too. Then add in that for men he found attractive, part of the session would include him having sex with them...just nuts.

Then the members REALLY should have been concerned once they moved from California to Austin and he stopped doing the whole "Knowing" thing. It seems like most of the time spent in Austin consisted of him using their money to make expensive plays, music videos and gardens.

I want to know what he was doing to them that made them feel like they were on an acid trip…was he drugging them somehow? Or were they just buying into his bullshit so hard that they fooled themselves into a placebo head trip?

Maybe they were lonely and would fall for anyone charismatic (to them, anyway).

R47, the documentary made it pretty clear that the leader-worship didn't start until years down the road. By that point, he had amassed a fairly large group that had been with him for several years (a decade or longer in many cases). And that the worship aspect was a slow process…it wasn't something that happened overnight.

Plus, there are people out there willing to overlook questionable behavior if they feel a sense of belonging. The people in the doc made it pretty clear that being there had filled a void they felt in their lives.

The sad fact is that while some people are able to see shenanigans with a discerning eye, not everyone is able or willing to do so.

He apparently modeled for Falcon Studios as "Dirk":

That is not an 8" cock.

I wasn't raised in a cult but my father was always trying to start one. He was a quiet, charismatic man who had found his own guru in 1973 to whom he paid five grand (in 1973 dollars) to work like a slave doing manual labor on an old castle in the Cotswolds for a few months. The guru died in 1974 and Dad came back to America and tried to recruit people to come live off the land in upstate NYC. He wanted what his guru had. He wanted it all. He talked all the time about losing his ego. But his ego was behind it all. Women, and men, were drawn to him and said the same things about him that they say about Michel in this doc. It's weird to see all these same types of "sheeple" again.

This guy failed as an actor, failed as a porn star, and finally found his calling hypnotizing a bunch of pretty boys into joining his cult and doing his bidding. Genius.

PS Anyone remember the guru with the Rolls Royces. He had a 100 of them all paid for by his American followers. He'd drive slowly by and his followers would line up to toss flowers on it.

I watched yesterday. When the guy was telling how he had sex with the master, it was hard for me to have sympathy. Here's a grown man whining that he was "forced" to have sex with the leader for five years. I feel the same about the woman who said she had an abortion at the leaders command. None of them say "I was stupid and blind and weak", they all want to lay blame on the creepy master.

I was a student at UT when he moved the cult to Austin. He used to go to a dance club called the Boathouse back then.

He really stood out because was so creepy. He had this old man face with blow-dried hair and muscular body, and he would always wear short-shorts and a tank top. The club had a large bar right in the center of it, and he would slowly strut around it like a peacock so everyone could admire him. He didn't realize that the mostly college-aged crowd was laughing at him. No one had any idea that he was the leader of a cult.

He would always cruise me and stare for long periods like he was trying to hypnotize me. My friends would comment on how creepy and gross he was.

I'm mainly pissed that that old creaton has an all-expense-paid life in Hawaii while I'm working like a dog to live in flyover country. Where the fuck did I go wrong.

R55 was the Boathouse a gay club? Thanks for the info!

Good point, R54!

The scenes of Michel in drag were truly bizarre!

[quote]Producer of this is a trust fund kid who pretends she isn't.

What r43 said. It becomes pretty obvious when you see the lovely digs all the doc participants interviewed from.

Will said that the Buddhafield was what happens when codependency meets narcissism.

I think the documentary actually pointed that out, R60.

If this was just a scam to rape guys, why did he have women in the cult too? They seemed like they were maybe 40% of the members.

Do cult leaders think completely cynically, or do they believe their own crap? Like, when they're lying in bed alone at night thinking to themselves are they all 'ha can't believe they're falling for it. Oh, well, another day of molesting and bullshit speeches about fake-spirituality for me tomorrow' or do they actually think they have powers and are on a grand mission and maybe are even actually helping people?

Clearly none of the devotees read "12 Rules Of The Community Leading Con-Man" before getting involved… It would not surprise me that Jaime Gomez/Michel Rostand/Andreas had some kind of experience which led him to believe in his own divine status, then milked it for all it was worth. The "prophet" motive was prior to the "profit" motive.

From an Amazon reviewer of a book by a former member:

"...the guru, and the group it describes, have absolutely nothing to do with the Buddha, the teachings of the Buddha, or Buddhism.

"It is an unfortunate tale of excess, secrecy, abuse, and extreme narcissism. This is spirituality as the latest vanity drug: addiction to ecstatic experiences, without ethical foundation, compassion for others, wisdom, genuine community, or transformation."

Thanks for DL to alerting me to this. Just watched it on Netflix. Wow.

It's always so crazy to me to see how people get sucked in by cults. But I guess in many ways it is not any different than followers of any organized religion. Same basic concept, offers a community and these bigger than life figures that speak "God's word" and get people to give them their money.

In a way I almost respect his skill, this queen was parading around in speedos, and dancing and got a bunch of people to adorn on him and worship him and give him this lavish lifestyle. He got a parade of hot guys who presented their ass to him. Funny how he was demonizing female sexuality and trying to slut-shame them, while being such a sexual predator himself, reminds me of some DL posters...

[quote]Do cult leaders think completely cynically, or do they believe their own crap? Like, when they're lying in bed alone at night thinking to themselves are they all 'ha can't believe they're falling for it. Oh, well, another day of molesting and bullshit speeches about fake-spirituality for me tomorrow' or do they actually think they have powers and are on a grand mission and maybe are even actually helping people?

I really wonder this as well. I feel as if they must believe the bullshit they are selling right? Though maybe not, L Ron Hubbard was being a completely cynical and manipulative asshole when he created scientology. Just wanted his own religion.

A vast amount of first-person accounts of this abusive group is online at the blog linked below. The cult leader here is called "Angelo."

[quote]L Ron Hubbard was being a completely cynical and manipulative asshole when he created scientology. Just wanted his own religion.

Not even. Scientology was created on a bet.

R66 thanks for that link. LOL @ 1 of the posts mentioning how "Angelo" didn't brush his teeth as often as necessary and had bad breath. Also interesting to read that "Angelo" was way ahead of the current trend of diet restrictions. Back in the 80s "Angelo" did not want to eat wheat, dairy or sugar but that wasn't as mainstream as now.

[quote]It's fascinating that none of the guys told anyone that they were unwillingly having sex with him. Of the guys who appeared in the documentary, only 2 of them were gay.

Most of the guys (though not all), the leader had sex with were gay. He would purposely use the therapy sessions to feel out how willing they were to have sex with another man.

Amusingly enough the filmmaker said in an interview that the first boyfriend he had after leaving the cult is now married to a woman.

And yes, one thing the filmmaker doesn't speak to is the Affluenza aspect. A lot of these were rich, bored white kids looking for something more. It almost seems their life of privilege made them easier to manipulate.

White people...

I watched the documentary a week ago. Funnily enough everyone seemed to have enjoyed living in the cult until the gay sex was revealed. If I understood correctly there was no violence or mistreatment of the members, unless you count the gay sex. Like an earlier poster I'm also wondering why did the guys agreed to have sex, and then kept quiet about it. I do understand it happens and some people can be in a way hypnotized to do things against their will but I can't help but wonder if those guys were enjoying the sex themselves as well. But yes, I do realize things are complex and I'm certainly not saying it was right to have sex with guys who possibly wouldn't have in normal circumstances.

Michel obviously is quite the character. Sure he's creepy and quite probably a narcissist, and possibly even a sociopath. But I still don't see him use violence the way some other cult leaders have. The way some members decided to go with him even after learning the truth tells they don't consider him to be a monster.

I spent a little while in an Indian yoga "cult". Our guru had already died years earlier and the organization had spread all over the world. Still, there were certain rules that were quite culty. Like that when you decided to stay you'd have to cut off your family and everyone you used to know. I decided to leave before it came to that.

Another horrific devotee of cosmetic surgery. Looks like those two tiger trainers.

narcissists/sociopaths are so selfish, they just start to gross people out after a while. they escalate in terms of taking and they stop giving. there's always an arc in a relationship with someone like this and the cult members had plenty of reservations the whole time, before it all reached critical mass. for sure, Michel is super-evil.

R66, that blog is quite a the little time capsule from former members. The pseudonyms are a bit much, although it's easy to guess who "Fellini" might have been. One poster who seems to an actual licensed therapist and who got a little sucked into Buddhafield but never all the way, Dr. Datanah, thinks Michel/Angelo/Reyji may be schizophrenic.

R71 (and others who have previously mentioned it).

["I'm also wondering why did the guys agreed to have sex, and then kept quiet about it."]

Because they thought they were special, they each thought they were the only one, like they were "chosen", that he loved them more than the others, and that it was their secret bond. On a much smaller scale, I fell hard for a narcissist who made me feel all these things. Then one day, I ended up having a conversation with this guy I'd occasionally see but heavily disliked despite having never formally met. I disliked him because one day his name came up in conversation with Mr. Narcissist, who told me they had dated briefly but this guy was a sociopath and should be avoided at all costs. He came right over to me, determined, and asked if I knew Mr N. Long story short, he had been dating Mr. N the whole time, and we each had been told to avoid the other. We both ditched Mr. N, discovered there had been many others, had a brief fling of our own but remain friends to this day. And this "other" guy is very attractive and a brilliant writer. You'd just never think....

From an interview on Vulture with the filmmaker:

[quote]The teacher mostly abused male virgins, out of fear of contracting AIDS, correct?

[quote]Yeah, I figured that out. He was grooming men, and this is my theory from my experience, but he would never let anyone get tested for AIDS. We weren’t allowed because he said our mind and our fear would create it, and even if we were HIV-negative. But because you couldn’t get tested, he would tell us not to have sex either. So we were not having sex, supposedly, and not getting tested. Later I realized that he wanted all his little concubine men that he got involved with to be clean so they wouldn’t bring anything to him, because he was never going to get tested. Now, there was one boy that he kept virginal for 20 years before he took his virginity, and the boy trusted him. “Oh, this is so beautiful. He’s doing this to help me.” And really, no, he’d been manipulating him for years, and then he would have sex with him without a condom because he knew it was safe, and that was shocking to me. Just unbelievably shocking.

To R57--yes, the Boathouse in Austin was a gay club... Why women in the cult? Offhand, I'd say it was to lure men to the cult...

the women were slaves, too. they worked hard, so they had value as slaves. just like the men. these people were willing slaves and the ultimate goal of a sociopath is create a willing slave.

I mean, in his defense, he gave them the dream that they wanted. he knew what they wanted and gave it to them and while they were getting it, they were thrilled. the problem is that is wasn't real. he gave them fantasy. they just can't accept that it was all fake. i think they still struggle, the guy who made the doc still cried every day.

I'm fascinated mainly by the fact Jared Leto caught an early screening and signed on immediately to Exec Produce. Interesting he'd be so drawn to this story.

Leto probably wants to fictionalize and play the guru. He's a method actor, right?

Leto would be perfect casting. He bears no resemblance to Michel/Andreas, etc. But the role of cult leader would fit Leto to a tee.

I'm just imagining Jared Leto's horse hung self parading around in a speedo all movie...

He lloks like a cross between Norman Bates

and the sheriff from Bates Motel

No Kool-Aid?

I just saw this on Netflix. The "Teacher" was supposed to be charismatic? He seemed like an overtanned organ grinder's monkey to me.. He seemed East Asian to me, not South American. Couldn't muster a lot of sympathy for his followers, they are obviously a little off.

One of this guy's supposed victims in the film is apparently now recreating the same pattern of abuse -- gathering up poz men in LA and using them for sex under the pretense of unity and thriving. Sick.

R88 tell us more

He IS East Indian.. Why does everyone seem to think he is Latino?

Huh? He is Jaime Gomez, from Venezuela.

His accent didn't sound like the accent of a native Spanish speaker.

I had to laugh when one of the women interviewed started to cry when she remembered having been denied the "knowing" because she wasn't ready. His followers were so stupid.

Let's face it. For straight people butt sex kills everything.

that's because women do not have s prostate, so they can't enjoy butt sex to the degree of men.

Jaime Gomez must be a made up name.

His real name is probably Vijay Sandeep.

Interesting in light of certain recent events...

I kinda thought he looked a little like DL fave (lol!), Michael Lucas, in some of those earlier shots...?

I was in a Satanist cult for a while. I didn't believe any of the shit, but I liked boning guys who would never do it otherwise.

I was one of the acolytes who would wear a mask and give men Satan's seed. I got off on their pain.

Yea it was sick and eventually I quite, but damn I fucked some hot men.

The ideal cult member is someone who feels alienated or misunderstood by mommy and daddy and is looking for a replacement father figure. The successful "guru" specializes in finding these members among the flock and turning himself into a father figure for them. Esp. if they have come to the cult with some of Mommy and Daddy's money.

Is his porn online?

R100 They're here.