Scotty Bowers: Reliable?

Whores are not above lying.

Love him or hate him he's the real deal.

Interesting, R2.

Who the hell is Scotty Bowers?

I read his book and promptly put it in the garbage.

Do tell us more, R2. I read his book, and, while wildly entertaining, he did seem to make things up. A friend tried to find the Colorado child he supposedly fathered, but could not corroborate it with news articles--Scotty gave identifying information the press would have covered in Denver.

It's garbage. Even time doesn't work in his book as it does in reality: He was out all night but worked all day, and fucked everyone, and everyone was gay, and he had time to procure and drive people out to celebrities but also fuck their brains out and oh yeah, he had a family. Nah, totally rubbish.

Here, R4.

If you know anything about Hollywood history, you know its nothing but lies. For example, that snobbish old gargoyle, George Cukor, would never give him the time of day, Yet Scotty treats him as if he were the guy next door.

Got married in 1984 and says he prefers women.

Whatever, Scotty.

Well, if his wife is Mrs Betty Bowers, that would explain a lot

Gore Vidal said he was!

he's practically at death's doorstep and doesn't care. I believe him and I read the book. Has anyone read The Gossip Columnist by Bill Dakota? That was juicy as well.

Gore Vidal was nearly dead, R12. I am sure he did it to keep Scotty from publishing BS about Vidal. Like the fact that Gore Vidal used to sneak into Shirley Temple's campaign headquarters and give her head. For hours.

Be careful not to confuse Kenneth Anger's Hollywood Babylon with Scotty Bowers' book. The former is definitely full of made-up BS; the latter, IDK.

He's like that Darwin Porter guy. Fan fiction?

r16, etc, oh my.

Raymond Burr's longtime partner confirmed that at least some of the stuff in the book was true

I think Bowers is an unreliable narrator and did embellish a LOT of stuff, including saying that he didn't charge any fees for his "matchmaking" services , but it is a fact that that service station where he worked was an epicenter of sexual vice and celebrity hookups -- I've seen it mentioned in other sources.

There's some fire underneath his smoke.

Bowers spilled a lot of real dirt. Cukor needed Bowers like all the closet cases in Hollywood needed him - easy hook ups. He's the real deal.

I really hope the Charles Laughton story is false. I won't be able to watch Witness for the Prosecution or The Hunchback of Notre Dame in the same way/

That a snob like Gore Vidal would even know Bowers speaks volumes to Bowers' credibility.

Scotty Bowers' view of sex sounds a lot like Gore Vidal's. A power/numbers game with zero personality or affection. Not too exciting, actually.

Romina Power is a classy, talented person. I'm sure she loved a smarmy nobody like Scotty Bowers gleefully letting the world know her father liked to be shat on by boys.

You really think Vidal wouldn't hang out with hustlers?! WTF?!

If you're reading the book, it doesn't take long to realize that most of it is made-up or embellished. It just doesn't hold up to scrutiny by anyone with half a brain cell.

Yes, Bowers was a whore and a pimp. But he certainly didn't know all the people involved or the details of their sex lives and he certainly was not altruistic, as he endeavors to make himself appear.

The Tyrone Powers Family Troll has joined us.

So, apparently, has the gullible idiot brigade.

r24 Does a bear shit in the woods?

Tyrone Power liked to be shat on by boys?

That's what I call a moveable feast!

R2 no he's not.

I read the Scotty book and it's all Unverifiable - and all those named dead apparently - can't argue, or can't sue. It might just as well be classified as fiction.

There were rumors of all kinds about many Hollywood figures, it is as easy to string them all together carefully as to write from direct knowledge about them.

Yes and who are they R214? Besides the partner of Burr who has been dead since the early 90s, and Gore Vidal who loved to spread gossip, lies, and misinformation himself but Gore was a nasty bitter queen.

But they're both obnoxious little cretins.

Best thing would be that nobody buys Bowers vile stories and shuns him into obscurity. He even claims to have given actors and celebrities advice about raising a family, or career advice. Or when the Beatles go to the United States the first time he claims that Brian Epstein their manager called him which is not true.

"I finally said yes because I'm not getting any younger and all of my famous tricks are dead by now," Bowers told the New York Times. "The truth can't hurt them anymore."

So it was purely out of consideration for their feelings that he said nothing when they were still able to defend themselves? A likely story!

What made me not believe Bowers besides his own words, were that he claims to have been with 1,000's of women and men but that he never once had an STD despite in the pre-HIV/AIDS times Syphilis, Herpes, Genital warts, and even Gonorrhea were common and around. Plus He also describes his sex as always great, never had ED or was not sexually attracted to his tricks, no mention of STD's , had a big one, could go all night and even went as far as to say he was always proud of his 'loads'. In essence Scotty is entertaining but full of it. He's the guy you get stuck sitting next to on a greyhound bus that is funny and makes the time go by, not because he's got great tales but because he's so full of it you can't help but laugh at all the lies.

Bowers is shallow and insensitive and intent only on squeezing every drop of scandal he can from the lives of those no longer around to defend themselves. The lack of time spent with the mother of his child and the child herself is very sad. But he is very nonchalant about these occurrences. His daughter dies, and he only devotes one sentence in the supposedly autobiographical book about himself to her. This is a man who was trying to make a few bucks from this book, as he has done most of his life it seems.

R213 brings up an excellent point as well, no woman that's bisexual or lesbian is going to go to a pimp let alone a man that's a pimp to find her a sexual partner let alone 100's of sex partners over the decades.

All we need now is for a few dozen++ of the hundreds/thousands of Holywood Whores - presumably now mainly retired - to fess-up about all this & freshen-up their pensions. Odd none mentioned so far, they can't All be respectably married.

As for the gossip of the Duke and Duchess of Windsor or King Edward VIII and Wallis Simpson being bisexual or gay/lesbian and Bowers having sex with them.

I find this very hard to believe! I am sure they were an odd couple in many ways... but this Bowers wasn't that amazing looking and it would have been a huge risk for them to have done such a thing.

The Duke and Duchess could not risk associating with such a low life and the servants know everything. It would have come out.

It has actually made me feel sorry for the Duke and Duchess of Windsor, they did not deserve this trash.

It's very simple, Bowers is a liar.

I danced with a man who danced with a girl who danced with the Prince of Wales. Lloyd George knew my father. I was Monty's double. I was Lord Kitchener's valet. I was Kaiser Bill's batman. I'm Henery The Eighth I am.

Scotty is a delusional Hollywood bottom-feeder who has taken some no-doubt truthful, interesting stories and stretched them beyond credibility.

R18 that's funny considering that Burr's partner died decades before this book was even published.

My post was a reply to this thread.

R24 Vidal when he had sex with men paid for them.

r31, no, he's still alive

Bowers' book was a joke and anyone with any sense would know that by a cursory examination.

I think it's basically truthy but embellishments appear. In any event, I liked Scotty's attitude. His personality comes through. Basically straight but no judgments.

Hollywood was very small in Bowers' day. Once one got a foot in the door, particularly in terms of working private BH parties, one had access to almost everybody.

Bowers is the real deal unlike the fiction written by those fat queens P and A.

The pretentious queen 'Boze Hadleigh' (oh dear) is the real deal as well.

I thought it was a fun, smutty read. Who cares if it is true?

You all are far to concerned about the "integrity" of a bunch of dead people.

Agreed R35 it was a total joke. Bowers is senile or has dementia and wrote the book in old age. He was sexually abused from a young age and never got help for it, and this is obvious.

R24. You have no idea what you're talking about. None.

Vidal associated with every kind of people his whole life.

Vidal and Bowers are total jokes and all the gossip they say isn't true.

I haven't read the book but just finished the underwhelming 2018 documentary, Scotty and the Secret History of Hollywood, which focuses more on Scotty himself as an old man hoarding junk in the houses his dead sugar daddy Mr. Beech boight for him.

In the doc he visits a few old hustler friends and they all grin at the camera and swear everything in Scotty's book is "aaallll true!"

I dunno.

He wrote nothing that was surprising. Real deal. He appears in a 1960s entry in Cecil Beaton's diary where Beaton called him over for sex, and yes, asked for a small fee. Beaton considered him a person of integrity. You only have to note the (now) lesser known people he also mentions: like the gay actor Peter Bull, and gay director Brian Desmond Hurst -- who was recently subject to another outrageous memoir, The Empress Of Ireland by Peter Robbins, who encountered him in the Sixties. And having sex with one's priest was once no big deal. That was the sexual introduction of every gay Catholic friend I have. Water off their ducks backs as far as they're concerned. Times change.

As for his claims re the Duke of Windsor being a crazed cocksucker: DL's own Charlie has backed up that one.

The Duke of Windsor's equerry Forwood told Charles Higham that he once saw Wallis Windsor dressed in a nurses uniform thrashing the Duke. (Higham mentions it in his own autobiography, In And Out In Hollywood, that he wrote just before he died.) Just a simple classic dominatrix relationship. The real crap is written by neutered royal authors who simply don't have the life experience to comprehend it.

Totally believe it. He has been consistent and has no bridges to burn / care about to lie. Everything he says is believable based on the ugly deceitful ness of Hollywood actors and the whole system of PR that created the myths. Everyone else who disputes it has reason to lie - except him.

In the book Scotty says he wasn't paid directly for his matching or personal services. However he worked a few nights a week as an extremely well-paid and nicely tipped bartender at high end Hollywood parties. Would he have been hired if he didn't have his day job?

Bowers take onthe priest stuff (from the documentary) was that he knew which ones were gay and basically sold himself to them for money...so it wasn't "molest-molest"

R46, Bowers has a reason to lie, sell more books and get publicity.

[quote]Bowers has a reason to lie, sell more books and get publicity.

Sweetie, he's 90. He doesn't give a fuck. And certainly doesn't want and need any more money. He has been bequeathed more houses than he knows what to do with.

R50, Well if he didn't give a fuck, he wouldn't have written a book and agreed to a documentary. Why did Trump run for president? The idiot didn't need the money or fame either.

I equate the Scotty Bower skeptics with the Michael Jackson accuser skeptics. I fully believe the accusers over the PR machines and stans of the rich and famous.

The difference is some of MJ accusers came out with the allegations while he was still alive, why didn't Bowers say anything while the rich and famous he "fucked" were still alive?

That’s what made him good at his job R53 - discretion. As he says, he doesn’t have to worry about embarrassing or outing most of the people now because they and most of those related are dead.

[quote] It has actually made me feel sorry for the Duke and Duchess of Windsor, they did not deserve this trash.

First of all: Mary!

Second: Get a fucking grip on reality. They were [italic]Nazi sympathizers.[/italic] The Duke helped the Nazis with their UK invasion plans. They deserve MUCH MORE than this.

[quote] He was out all night but worked all day, and fucked everyone, and everyone was gay, and he had time to procure and drive people out to celebrities but also fuck their brains out and oh yeah, he had a family. Nah, totally rubbish.

You could be describing any Datalounger.

"Sweetie, he's 90. He doesn't give a fuck. And certainly doesn't want and need any more money."

Well, he cared enough to write a book and do a documentary

everybody is entilted to their own opinions about Bowers and whether it was true. He was extremely attractive when younger and was very well endowed. A very very alluring double wammy in hollywood. Plus he wasnt trying to be an actor and didnt have a reputation to keep. I believe most of what he had to say. I dont make the mistake of confusing an actor with the roles they play so I wasnt surprised at the names he named. Many people had a hard time believing Spencer Tracy was gay or bisexual............it seemed pretty obvious to me.

I didnt think Bowers had a very fullfiling life however. He was mostly a sex addict and a terrible husband and mostly neglected his daughter. He spent his whole life fucking. Some might find that something to aspire too but it seemed like something people under 30 do until they grow up. Also his hoarding in old age was very very hard for me to watch on his documentary/film.

[quote]I didnt think Bowers had a very fullfiling life however.

You're looking at it through your lens. Try looking at it through his lens. He's not an ordinary person. Never was. So evaluating him in 'normal' terms is pointless. He's a sexual savant. If you've fucked around and lived long enough, you'll encounter one or maybe two. They're unicorns. Some are happy, some are sad. He's been happy-go-lucky throughout his life. So it's also clear he's got the happiness gene, lucky bastard. Doubly blessed.

As for him "writing the book", he didn't. He'd been approached for years by various writers, and turned them down, but after his principal clients were dead, telling his story couldn't hurt them, so he agreed to participate. The book was cobbled together from many hours of recorded interviews. I'd trust the opinions of those who know him that the last thing he is is a grifter, over the speculations of those who've never met him.

The movie was garbage and Bowers is an inveterate liar. And he comes across as a total scumbag on camera. Good riddance to him.

Agree with the “happy gene” view. I think he was a not overly intelligent, open, happy-go-lucky guy who was very sexual and unneurotic about sex when the world was uptight and neurotic about sex. Right guy, right place, right time - he found what he was meant to do. He was never going to be a rocket scientist - and didn’t seem to have the ego or ambition to be famous or super rich. Just enjoyed being happy and sex. Wouldn’t have worked for me - but maybe he feels he brought happiness to peoples lives and lived a full life. More than a lot of people can say.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

I assume that he loves the attention. He doesn't seem to need the money. I do think he left out a number of names because though dead their families would sue. Astaire's being only one of a number of them. When Walter Pigeon is the biggest name he can come up with that you've never heard anything about something is very wrong.

He also mentioned Clint Eastwood, who is still (barely) alive.

A perfect example of how overpriced LA is - $1.5 MM for that!? Is there no decent city left where you can buy something decent for less than $1MM?

I too think he is full of shit but I do believe some things. I believe that Hepburn and Tracy were really gay. I believe that Walter Pigeon was bi. I know Astaire was gay- as did the public who loved to watch him dance. We know Cary Grant was bi. I also think Gene Kelly, Tyrone Power, and Robert Taylor were bi. Hollywood was a different place in the days that Scotty writes about. Because of a lack of social labels many stars, just like today, are dabblers. Whenever people on the DL ask if certain people are gay I always think yes I see them dabbling- Justin Timberlake, Richard Madden. Sex is either an enjoyment or way to move ahead. Drug fueled or casting couch . I can see Ava and Lana getting it on. And I see Elvis experimenting with Nick Adams. I can also see that Rock Hudson was a bottom for everyone. The real tell all would have come from the hands of Roddy McDowell if he had written one. He knew every real secret. I also think Garbo was gay, and the reason she retired from films wasn't because her last film , " Two Headed Woman". failed , but because she was sick of living up to an image she had had no taste for. She used Hollywood to become rich, and left when she had run the course of her lie.

Did he out Eastwood or just say he was represented by Willson which is a fact that can't be disputed. I thought it interesting Chad Everett was one of his boys. Why waste time with actors who won't sleep with you when hundreds of new handsome guys flood the town every week?

Anyone with any sense knows that Bowers made up lots of stuff. Which is why so many DLers are ardent defenders. I got about halfway through the book and realized that even from a logistical point of view, his story was ridiculous.

His documentary was mostly scenes of an ancient hoarder visiting old haunts and yacking with his equally ancient wife, and then having to listen to her sing.

R9- here we go again- sheesh. It's all true and then some. I knew about him, George Cukor, the Duke and Duchess etc. etc. in the 1970/80s (he stopped hooking himself with the advent of the HIV epidemic.) I first heard of him via his clients (New York and LA) and I knew guys who worked with him. Loads of gay men and industry people knew of him and his services which were much more than sex. Every. word. is. true. And there is much more than is in his book. Nothing terrible here. Just a very non judgemental guy- bisexual- who realized he could give people a good time, help them have fun and make a living doing it. As he has said: I've done nothing wrong. If he has, please tell me what it was? Sex?

Bowers said he had a 3-way with Ava Gardner and Lana Turner at Frank Sinatra's house and Sinatra did nothing to him. Pull the other one.

Scotty was "the Bartender" in a few of the Confidential and Enquirer stories.

I hate the story about Laughton. I genuinely want to believe he made that one up. It's the only story that bothers me. I'll always be thinking about it when I see one of his great performances. Did great friends like Maureen O'Hara and Billy Wilder know about this?

Did they know he was gay? Yes.

R64 What did he write about Clint Eastwood?

Thanks for that "reliable" confirmation, r69. I guess if you feel the need to come defend Bowers on an anonymous board like this, we should all believe you, right?

P.S. People don't care about the sex thing with Bowers, it's the bullshit thing. Sure, he was a hustler and a pimp. But his stories are way exaggerated and his "friendships" were nothing more than client/whore arrangements.

Well I'm not talking about the gay thing but the sandwich thing which is something I never wanted to know.

Totally believe R69. Not sure why people are so adamant that he is lying. It all makes sense. I think the issue is acknowledging that the “star” propaganda machine is so powerful that the image that is created around these people seems more real than the people. I believe Gore Vidal when he vouched for Bowers veracity. The truth is ugly - or at least perverse. But that is the reality - we are learning just how twisted people are thanks to the internet. Look at Trumps sex with prosititutes. So much was hidden before the advent of the internet. And even now it’s shocking how much people,get away with - like Bryan Singer, Kevin Spacey.

R77 et al, except that I'd heard the "shit sandwich" thing about Charles Laughton long before I'd heard about Scotty Bowers. It's not exactly a secret if you have a taste (sorry!) for that sort of thing.

I read his book when it came out and saw the movie last year. Some of the other stuff was not news to me: Lucille Ball reading Scotty out at a party where he was bartending, telling him to stop pimping girls for Desi; Spencer's Tracy's predilection for rough trade from the garage, Hepburn's varied sexual tastes, Cukor's at-home Sunday soirees with ([italic]le tout[/italic] Hollywood in the late afternoon after the boys had their pool party and left, a hairless (all over) Duke of Windsor sucking cock after cock and the like. I asked an older friend from Los Angeles who knew them all (Jose Irtubi was her godfather, she grew up in Randolph Scott's old house on Roxbury Drive and her Mom looked after Liza, Lorna and Joey the day Judy Garland, fucked up and drunk, lit the stove on fire at the Luft's house next door and burned down half the kitchen; and told me Cary Grant wore women's underwear, not because it turned him on but because they were nylon, he was cheap, and he could wash out his panties and dry them easily overnight on the shower rod in a hotel) what she thought of the book and she said it sounded about right to her.

Scotty's closing in on 100 or so by now and I doubt there are too many eyewitnesses left to absolutely corroborate and thus confirm or deny the accuracy of his stories, but given what we know about the Hollywood closet in the 40's and '50's and '60's, just about everything he wrote sounds plausible and so likely to me.

R75, I like to relate what I know and believe to be true. Take it or leave it. Frankly I don't really care what you think. I just wonder why people assume he is lying and seem to put him down. Client/whore relationships can get pretty intense you know. My take on him decades ago was that he was very well liked- because he was such a nice guy and so discrete- he was also very hot in his prime- cat nip to men and women. Of course his relationships with celebrities were at best unusual. They had to act as if they did not know who he was! But he knew the truth and it did not bother him. After he stopped hustling he tended bar (with as many help as needed), did errands and odd jobs, was a driver etc. And he was much the same in those roles, dependable, and apparently very popular because he was such a nice guy.

DL's fave blog NYSocialDiary vouched for him in an article. It said one of his regular clients was a guy with no legs. That titbit makes things all into place methinks. It suggests he wasn't a starfucker, but rather, that they were just the tip of his client list iceberg over the decades.

"I believe that Hepburn and Tracy were really gay."

Tell that to the hundreds of women Tracy slept with

"I knew about him, George Cukor, the Duke and Duchess etc. etc. in the 1970/80s (he stopped hooking himself with the advent of the HIV epidemic.)"

Just because he made those claims, does not mean he was telling the truth

R81 are you a woman he slept with? Then how the hell would you know?

Further support for Bowers:

"I can provide evidence that what Scotty Bowers says is true about Hepburn and Tracy being gay. Almost 30 years ago I had a close friend who lived and worked in Hollywood and Southern California. He owned a famous firm that did work for the wealthy and the famous. He had gotten his start being one of George Cukor's 'boys'.…Cukor told my friend that Hepburn was a lesbian and that Tracy was a highly repressed, self-hating gay Catholic and alcoholic. Tracy lived in a house Cukor owned where he would meet men for sex. This is where Bowers says he had his sexual encounters with Tracy. It seems Cukor had a big mouth and told my friend basically the same stories about Hepburn and Tracy that Bowers does. "

r82, how the hell would you know he was gay? Because Scotty claimed it? LOL.

As for Spencer Tracey: I'd believe the second-hand account of one of Cukor's boys over any DL frau's assumptions any day.

As for Hepburn: Jesus - if ever there was a hiding in plain sight dyke, it was she. And that was before she was outed by her friend Liz Smith.

r85, it's not frau assumptions, Tracey's affairs with women have been well documented, you should check out some of the dirt from the Strickling files in the Old Hollywood threads here. I do believe Hepburn was bi.

So how is the movie. Wondering if I should watch it.

WHET the Strickland files guy? I hope he’s working on a book, there was some great stuff in that thread.

^^^ Strickling

I'd heard about Tracy years before Bowers book and his mentoring Tom Drake and Van Johnson I always found interesting. Tracy when very very young like Bogart was surprisingly good looking. Heavy drinking really takes its toll.

I don't really find Bowers stories hard to believe. Of course there was lots and lots of beautiful people having sex with each other. In every way imaginable. Someone had to be there to perform services to make these transactions go more smoothly. Hollywood wasn't populated with prudes. So people ask why, but I prefer to ask why NOT?

R41 Vidal spread vile gossip (especially about people who were unable to reply to his accusations)

Implying Messala is in love with Ben Hur is vile! And incredibly hot.

I mean who wouldn't want to compete in a violent dangerous chariot race with a dim witted straight guy you've fallen hard for?

I think R92 meant that Gore Vidal outed Stephen Boyd (Messala) in his autobiography “Palimpsest” in 1995. Also Raquel Welch said he was gay.

I love Scotty. He really isn't telling people anything that hasn't been out there as rumor, fact, etc. I felt for him in the documentary where he was talking about (or glossing over) the deaths of his daughter and brother. I think the pain of losing loved ones -- that he tries not to think about -- caused him to become a hoarder.

R94 Unsubstantiated!

R93 Gore Vidal was a braggart.

And it's cruel to the late Stephen Boyd (who may have been dumb, pretty and an idiot cigarette-smoker). But he's the centre of so much idle speculation about the 1950s English underground gay sex scene— all of which is unsubstantiated and NOT helped by the geriatric Vidal's foolish braggartly gossip!

How did Vidal out Boyd? In his memoir he discusses the character's motivation with Wyler and Boyd but there is no mention of the actor's sexuality.

I've been crazy about the actor from when I was a boy and from reading up on him and seeing a doc about him made me wonder. Seems he was gay at least to me. Wishful thinking?

I think so for the most part...but again I am not one of those people that gets confused by the roles an actor plays versus real life........... or the way he or she looks versus what goes on in the private life/

The documentary is boring unless you like watching an old guy drive around L.A. and watch him paw through piles and piles of junk in one of his houses. Or if you like to watch 90+ year old singers warble through some numbers, you'll love it.

R97 It sound like wishful thinking to me.

Can you say what was it about Boyd that makes you think he "seems" gay?

One thing is that a minor star on a Fox contract should get such a flashy role in a VERY big MGM movie. But William Wyler wasn't gay. William Wyler was consummately sensible.

Scotty Bowers doesn’t even exist.

His relationships with women seem like they really were of the just good friend type and his marriage late in life did not seem a love match at all but one of convenience. This really struck me in the documentary about him on youtube. I guess a man of his type I expect to have wild romances and a couple of marriages to last for a few years each. He seems to have been a sad kind loner as if something were always troubling him.

R83 the gas station was not on Melrose.

R103: It was the Richfield Oil station at 5777 Hollywood Boulevard, at the corner of Van Ness Avenue.

There's a photo of Bower's gas station in the LA photographic archives. It's online but I can't be fucked looking for it.

I'm greatly amused by people who idolise actors. They've clearly never met any. The vast majority are psychologically screwed up in various ways: most don't even know their true selves. Yet people continue to take them at face value as normal citizens. They're not. Most of them are damaged goods. Far less than half of those I've known have been completely sane.

R105 And more than half of them, I'm guessing, were able and willing to do just about anything (or anyone) to get them where they wanted to go. But if and when they got there, they couldn't very well admit to climbing one or more greasy poles to reach the top, could they?

Hence the need for someone who was discreet and reliable to help them get what they wanted, sex on the DL, without losing whatever success they'd so painfully achieved. If Scotty Bowers didn't exist as described, they'd have to have found someone else to do what he did.

R81, I do not know those things because of his claims. I know them from people who told be at the time (1980)- some who worked with him.

r107, his friends were not necessarily telling the truth.

I also don’t understand the people that refuse to believe most, if not all, of what Scotty says is true. Just look at your own sex life and deeper secrets - if you wrote it all down honestly you’d probably come off as a liar or more promiscuous and kinky than you really feel you are, or seem to others to be. I’m only average-handsome and I’ve managed to have sex with hundreds of guys, and more than a few of them were successful / gorgeous / accomplished and one was famous. Scotty was a very sexy, very uninhibited man who was in the right place at the right time.

r109, it's not that people can't be promiscuous or kinky, it's the sheer number of A list celebs he claimed to have been with or pimped for. If he had named a few A-listers among a sea of lesser names, it might be more believable

[quote]it's the sheer number of A list celebs

That's over decades. His vast client list was mostly nobodies.

Sorry, r111, way too many A-listers to be believable, even over a period of years. He claims to have known EVERYONE - sure sign of a liar. I can buy that some of the names are true, but I bet he exaggerated a lot.

[quote]He claims to have known EVERYONE - sure sign of a liar.

He ran a party bar operation also. You couldn't be in a better position to meet everyone in Hollywood. Add to that, he was very personable and handsome. Jesus: you must have led a quiet life not to have seen this for yourself or work it out. Some of those Studio 54 busboys used to wake up in penthouses and palaces.

Here's Debbie Reynolds' recalling Bowers in one of her biographies.

r113, maybe those Studio 54 guys hooked up with a few bigwigs, but Scotty claims to have known every big star in the world.

If someone came on the datalounge and claimed to have hooked up with or pimped for Tom Cruise AND George Clooney AND Brad Pitt AND Johnny Depp, you would all immediately scream "Liar/Wishful Thinker"

I rest my case.

Except Bowers hasn't. If you'd read his book properly, which obviously you haven't, you'd realise he actually only fucked a narrow spectrum of A-List Hollywood: the guys round Cukor's circle, plus the smattering garnered through his other connections. There were a shitload of stars he had nothing to do with.

r116, no, that's not true. He claims to have fucked or pimped for MANY people with no real connection to Cukor. Did you read the book?

[quote] I’m only average-handsome and I’ve managed to have sex with hundreds of guys,

R115 - have you ever been to LA and seen the physical lay-out of where the studios are? In the years right after WWII most movies were still shot on sound stages not on location - so it was essentially a factory town with all the “mills” grouped in three basic locations - all the A-Listers were there every day like everyone else. There was a level of concentration and proximity that is hard to realize today.

^Yet no one is claiming to have fucked every star in the heavens except for him. Go figure.

And proud of it R118! -R109

Yes, people he met through the gas station or his bar work. Simple. But Cukor was the third point of the triangle. Through him he directly met Tracey and Hepburn, for example. Cukor's introductions, such as to Beaton, lead to further introductions. Cukor knew EVERYONE. You clearly have led a very confined life and never socialised in connected circles because you don't seem to have any comprehension of how knowing even a single well-connected person can set you up for life. If you did, you wouldn't be disputing the book. Read The Empress Of Ireland, the memoir about director Bryan Desmond Forbes who knew all that set, which similarly gives a glimpse of the interconnections. Or for a historical perspective, try Princes Under the Volcano, or the Letters of Horace Walpole, which both show how a single person can be the focal point for high-level gay connections for dozens or even hundreds of people. Bowers was like Sir Thomas Mann, in the eighteenth century, whose villa gardens were a cruising ground, and knew every high-born homosexual and rentboy in Europe. It's not hard to do if your social, high sexed, and have the energy.

Before the DL grammar mavens pounce: "YOU'RE social".

R120. There are only about 30 famous names in the book and he doesn’t claim to have fucked all of them - some he just “made arrangements for.” It was a very small company town & he was a fixture for a certain subset of people who needed discretion & convienience.

He says that Beaton was a real pain but the photographer is nice about him in his diaries which is quite an anomaly. He's not nice about mostly everyone else. Those Cukor pool parties must have been something. Only the most hunky and beautiful for that starry homo crowd.

The one main thing that is obvious from this thread is how so many have very false assumptions of how the rich and famous live their lives, publicly and privately. Most big movie star's lives are far from 24/7 glamour and glitz. The vast majority of them balance a life of luxury they want everyone to see with a very hidden private life that can at times be seedy and sleazy. To assume a movie star who has a public persona of high class & glamour lives that way all the time is laughable.

I like Scotty. He seemed like he is/was a fun guy and kind hearted. I wonder how many things he DIDN'T tell!??

If someone came here and posted a bunch of stories about pimping for dozens of A-listers (not just one or two) and royalty everyone would call that poster a liar. Fact.

Nobody cares if you believe him or not.

r129, no one cares about you

I watched the Documentary and he comes off now as a demented old hoarder. He oozes "ick"!

Ha R131, take him back 60 years and he would've probably even fucked you!

Not a chance, R132... I did not need hookers. You are projecting again.

I would have done Scotty back in the day. He was very cute. And as mentioned above he is in Beaton's diary as either a very nice hooker or pimp. It's not made clear but that's definitely some evidence. And as some people get old they develop dementia and sometimes not in clear ways. All of this is to say there is something to what Scotty says no matter how strange he has become.

What I can't believe is Rooney saying there were no homos at MGM.

What I find kind of sad is how many of you defending Scotty's tales of bullshittery NEED to believe him. Most people I know familiar with his story take it with a grain of salt. Sure, he was a pimp and a whore. But he didn't have the close ties he claims and for him to pretend he had contact with people like the Duke and Duchess of Windsor is laughable. It's also pathetic that he doesn't realize what a damaged individual he was from the onset, when he cheerfully whored himself out to the local Catholic rectories starting at age 7. Yet he seems to think that was perfectly normal. Also didn't have more than a word for the daughter he neglected and abandoned even after she died from a botched abortion at 23. Scotty was a hooker with a soul of brass. That some of you seem to think he was more than that is pathetic.

Is it possible that Bowers knew so many celebrities? Just ask popular drug dealers in LA how many celebrities they know. Once you get a reputation for being discrete, you are shared like gossip.

[quote] Charles Laughton eating shit? I know it's funny to joke about, but it's a pretty horrible thing to say about someone who can't defend himself.

No it's not. He's dead. You cannot libel the dead.

^ Yeah, the shit eating stuff gives him a lot less credibility

Wouldn't a person who enjoys a nice smear of shit in a sandwich every once in a while become quite frequently ill with all kinds of bacteria, parasites and hepatitis B? It would be like eating bowls of vomit. Just consuming it I'd think would cause choking and upchucking. Anyone know of people who do this and are not constantly ill? I mean Divine died fairly young. Yes a heart attack but diet can influence heart disease. Think of the young man who as a joke swallowed a slug or some such insect as a goof thinking it would just pass through his body yet it released a parasite that literally ate through his brain and killed him.

I only believed about 1/4 of the book before I saw the documentary. Afterwards, I believed about 65%. First of all, there were photos of Scotty with lots of the stars he mentions in the book. HE found them in one of his hoarder garages in a box and the videographer of the film used them. There were also interviews with a number of guys who worked for Scotty back in the day (he sort of pimped them out to various stars). They verified what he said, and they themselves had some photographs taken with the stars they were mentioned being paired with. There was even a soft-core porn film of Scotty at some party where he gets sucked off. (He was a big boy back in the day). That being said, there were some stories I felt he either heard as rumors and repeated, or others that he exaggerated for the fun of it. The fact that some of the stars willed him houses in the hollywood hills gives some credence to his stories as well. (That's why that house could sell for 1.5 million). Crazy hoarder though - he would give some of the people on the TV show hoarders a run for their money.

Cary Grant rumors were also strongly verified by the (re)discovered diary of famous Hollywood costumer Orry-Kelly. The diary was suppressed by threats of lawsuits by Cary Grant during his lifetime, but was discovered after Kelly's death. And we already knew about some of the others - Tab Hunter, Anthony Perkins, Roddy MacDowell, etc. So it's no surprise that lots of others were sexually active with men. What proportion of straight men are drawn to a life in show business after all? It's not like going to work as a car mechanic......

Don’t believe he was a saint - and yes he was fucked up in a 50s/60s way. But believe he is telling his version of the truth. I didn’t take from it that he thought he was friends with celebs. He knew he was a service provider - and got kicks from the thrill of doing it for celebs. I think those who don’t believe him share a willful ignorance along the lines of the Jackson stans. Just can’t get past the PR fantasies created around celebrities - which were even more extreme in the 50s-70s. Better/easier PR combined with a more repressive sexual culture that was loosening up with Hollywood at the forefront - I would guarantee this stuf was happening even if Scotty never wrote a book.

Variety article about Scotty 6 years before the book came out - it alludes to a number of things that at the time Scotty was still keeping off the record.

[quote]But he didn't have the close ties he claims and for him to pretend he had contact with people like the Duke and Duchess of Windsor is laughable.

Bitch, please. When the Windsors hit America on their semi-annual visits, they spread themselves very thin. They were as discriminating in their choice of company as the Duke and Duchess of York -- in other words, not at all -- particularly if they smelled a buck or sex. The shining names the Yorks have associated themselves with, such as Jeffrey Epstein, John Bryan and Timur Kulibayev, to name but some, were replicated by the Windsors ten fold. In the glittering collection of pond life they mingled with, Scotty Bowers was just one more. It was utterly within their character and habits, and not laughable at all.

Oh, and just up the road from me in the corner of a garden is where the Duke of Windsor (when Prince of Wales) fucked a flapper on the grass at a party. The elderly bachelor of the family who witnessed it, proudly showed me the spot. It wasn't in a secluded spot either. Windsor was out for every bit of sex he could get, from the get-go. The upper classes think about sex 24-7, to a degree inconceivable by those who have to work for a living. Because that's what your mind runs to when there's nothing else to do.

R142, thanks for linking that Variety article. Fascinating and a preview of his book yet to come.

[quote]Pointing out a photo of a young Jennifer Aniston, he volunteers a salty anecdote — unprintable, of course — from the days when the actress used to live in the apartment above the garage.

I'm dying to know this one!!!!

"The upper classes think about sex 24-7, to a degree inconceivable by those who have to work for a living. Because that's what your mind runs to when there's nothing else to do."

Please, go to any trailer park or ghetto and you'll see plenty of women with multiple illegitimate kids and guys who've father kids with multiple women

R141. You said " I think those who don’t believe him share a willful ignorance along the lines of the Jackson stans. " Well I think those who believe Bowers also believe that a Nigerian prince has just emailed them.

So Cary Grant was definitely bisexual eh?

Bowers was a money-grubbing whore and pimp. No one denies that tons of movie stars back in the day were gay and/or sluts and that they all lived pretty wild lives. What we don't believe, however, is that he was anything more than a facilitator for a certain length of time, and that his stories are wildly exaggerated. But for people with weak minds, his bullshit of course rings true.

As long as Laughton didn't literally eat shit I'll believe everything else. Did Elsa know this?

[quote]his stories are wildly exaggerated.

How fortunate we are to have someone like yourself who was there.

r151, you weren't there, either, unless you're 90

No, you're prepared to dismiss outright the accounts of others, such as Beaton and Reynolds, who were.

[quote] (That's why that house could sell for 1.5 million)

Scotty didn't even own the house when it sold.

It's always hilarious to watch some internet queens get all bitchy over some otherwise normal Joe who had a more interesting & fortunate life then they have. The blind jealousy of some is palpable, so they automatically trash it and attempt to paint it as exaggerations or all lies.

Well they don't get out much in Buckfuckleville, so they've got no life experience to compare it to.

I communicated with this lady who worked for movie stars and help write some biographies. She said she has a friend who said Scotty is full it. She also said Gore Vidal was a miserable horrible person. She said you have to remember, people back then were afraid to get blackmailed especially guys who were in the closet. So for them to go to a guy who is a pimp in at a gasoline station doesn't add up. She said as a general rule movie stars back then had sex with one another because it was safer. Nether would squeal on each other because both had something to lose if they did. Scotty Bowers said he sex with an animal?!! BARF! he said he had sex with grown men when he was 7 years and he thought there was nothing wrong with it? He said when he was a little kid he enjoyed having sex with grown men? WOW! This guy is completely sick. He is a degenerate. How can you believe this guy is telling the truth when it is purely evident he is mentally ill?

BTW, I was told by an insider that Tyrone Power was bisexual when he was younger in Hollywood. Tyrone Power loved women big time, and he had many affairs with women. As he got a little older around his 30s,he wasn't into guys anymore ,and he was strictly into women. I have heard a couple of people claim that Tyrone Power enjoyed guys craping on him was bull. Again, he was into guys when he was younger ,but not like that. The poster who made the statement, wouldn't people like Charles Laughton eating crap get sick, that is a very good point. The anuse alone contains many parasites that's why many gay men who rim get hepatitis because they consume anal parasites.

Another thing, I remember that lady who was on DL ,Susan Kastner, her father was an actor she said that she had friends who knew the Duke and Duchess of Windsor very well. She said the Duke was straight and he regretted marrying the Duchess because he felt his life turn out a big nothing. The two of them just went to parties, traveled, and shopped. that's it. He felt he should have not abdicated because he would have been doing something with his life that had meaning. As I recall, she said the Duchess told friends that there was a lot of pressure to keep up this great love affair myth for the public when in reality their love died out years before.

BTW, I watched rare interview with Cesar Romero. He said people say we all had wild lives and we had sex on the set and we went to parties at night ,but in reality we were exhausted after a day of filming and we all went home as soon as we were done because we had to get up the next day to film to continue to film. He said there was no time for all the other stuff people have been claiming over the years. Yet, I have heard the movie stars had a large span of time between takes making films and therefore they had a lot of free time. So what is the truth?

BTW, someone on this thread asked if Maureen O'Hara knew if Charles Laughton was gay? Well is the thing, according Maureen O'Hara, she said in her autobiography that Charles Laughton was not gay. LOL! Uh? really? That is like saying, Liberace was a womanizer. In her book she comes off as a scatter brain. Che Guevara was a well known mass murderer, and yet she said she met him and she said he was a nice guy and she liked him?

BTW, R15, you come off as a scatter brain. And simple.

[quote]I communicated with this lady

Women know NOTHING of men's sexuality, so that discounts anything she might say right there. Next!

The book is hard to believe because Bowers comes off as a showbiz version of Zelig, someone who's present at, and a contributor to, all the major events in Hollywood history. I was expecting him to claim that he was the guy who suggested pairing Fred Astaire and Ginger Rogers.

This was addressed earlier. He was out every night in Hollywood for his bar work. He worked day and night. Industry Hollywood is a small world, and even tinier then. As a barman, and a procurer, and handsome, and with a big cock, and a sunny nature, AND a friend of Cukor's, and bisexual, and randy, and trustworthy, he had the perfect access keys. You want to know what would have been odd and unbelievable? If he had claimed NOT to have met everyone!

I’m surprised that he wasn’t in the crows nest of the Titanic, blowing off the lookouts when they struck the iceberg.

Scotty probably pushed Peg Entwhistle off the H in the Hollywoodland sign.

[quote]Again, [Tyrone Power] was into guys when he was younger...

HA!!! And then he just gave 'em up. I'm hysterical. All Scotty needed was Sydney Guilaroff and Orry Kelly to send movie stars his way. Those designers knew Scotty would be discreet. As for the Duke and Duchess, he was a premature ejaculator with a tiny dick. She was the only girl who could take it in and clench down on the base with her vaginal muscles so that he could have a satisfactory sexual experience. They called it the "Windsor Knot."

[quote]I watched rare interview with Cesar Romero. He said people say we all had wild lives and we had sex on the set and we went to parties at night ,but in reality we were exhausted after a day of filming and we all went home as soon as we were done because we had to get up the next day to film to continue to film. He said there was no time for all the other stuff people have been claiming over the years. Yet, I have heard the movie stars had a large span of time between takes making films and therefore they had a lot of free time. So what is the truth?

Both, really. You had to be on set very early for costume and makeup, which was often grueling, then you'd sit around for three hours waiting for the techs to get the lighting just right, work for 15 minutes, then wait around for another three hours. You'd do that for 12-16 hours a day, weeks on end, until the film was done.

If you were confident you could get away with a fling on set (in your dressing room or trailer) I guess you could while away the time boffing costars, and some stars were big enough they could waltz on set whenever they wanted, but mostly you were stuck on set being overworked and bored at the same time.

"No, you're prepared to dismiss outright the accounts of others, such as Beaton and Reynolds, who were."

Neither Reynolds nor Beaton said anything about linking him to the Duke and Duchess of Windsor, Spencer Tracy, etc. Like I said, I can buy that he hooked up with some stars and pimped for others....but the sheer amount of stars he claimed to have been involved with is what gives me pause. Also, some of the details seem made up, like the scat stuff

R157 sounds like an incoherent mess, there are words missing in your sentences, some of them are incomplete or trail off. What a nut.

You only have to listen to how Scotty interacts with people in real time in some of the stuff on You Tube and you can see and hear the man is no liar. Some of you are English-royal and star lickers with obvious blind spots. Have you learned anything about human nature in your decades on this planet?

Mary!!

r168, apparently you haven't learned anything. Don't you think it's suspicious that he doesn't seem to have any real inside info about most of these people that can be verified? He also doesn't seem to know that the Duke of Windsor's nickname was not "Eddie"

Maybe the Duke did not like him and said, 'YOU call me Eddie.'

R170 - he really didn’t know most of these people well - and that’s obvious in the book - his descriptions of personalities are usually shallow - “very nice guy” gets used over and over. That’s actually one of the reasons I believe he’s telling the truth most of the time - he knew these people as a bartender and as a hustler/pimp - in shallow, transactional situations where everybody would be “nice.” He doesn’t claim many great friendships with these folks, or have tons of insight - he was handsome, hung and fun - they mostly treated him as a utility and he was fine with that.

Bowers is definitely sleazy, greasy, slutty, dumb and sociopathic enough to be a pimp. But along with that goes hustler, grifter and pathological liar, so...

R172, The descriptions in the Dear Penthouse letters are shallow too, so they must be true.

Scotty Bowers was a sexual historian, like Samuel Steward.

[quote] He claims to have known EVERYONE

No he hasn't. He only claims to know the people he's written about. That's nowhere near "EVERYONE". If he had written about EVERYONE the book would be bigger than the Encyclopedia Britannica.

r172, most actually pimps do not describe their clients as "nice"

r176, he may not have claimed to encountered "everybody" but it's pretty damn close.

R177 - You don’t believe Scotty. You’re entitled to your opinion - but you’re playing a game of simplistic semantics. Scotty is an individual - he could easily be as different from “most pimps” as he could be the same. He did not claim to know everybody - it’s not “damn close” at all.

R174 - Your rebuttal is as unconvincing to me as my argument is to you. I have no real need to believe Scotty - I read the book and given my own life experiences over the past 50 years the world he describes - not just who he had sex with, but how they interacted and the way Hollywood actually functioned as a community - seems much more plausible to me than the PR myths it challenges.

^^^hit post as I was typing - I’m R172 above

Some queens are just genetically predisposed to disbelieve anything they hear or read when others in the group do believe. It's just their childish & feeble attempt at making themselves look more knowledgeable & intelligent than others.

That's a pretty sweeping generalization, R180. Should we also believe Entertainment Lawyer's bullshit blind items, because otherwise we're just trying to appear more knowledgeable and intelligent?

No, but in this situation it's more than clear the disbelievers are just being stereotypically bitchy and arbitrary.

At this point Scotty is in a wheel chair and really does seem to be suffering from a certain amount of dementia. His book comes from a period where he was still lucid and could hold a reasonable seemingly honest conversation.

Abused depression-era and WWII Marine combat survivor and sexual liberator, he NEVER claimed victimhood for any of it but instead found a way to make himself and others happy and THRIVED. Fucking hero.

Abused depression-era kid*

His anecdotes do not ring true. You seriously believe Ty Power and Charles Laughton were eating shit? That actually sounds like the kind of thing homophobes make up to smear gays

Chuck and Ty were bi, Rose.

r187, maybe, but they weren't into eating shit except in Scotty's fevered imagination

What if I told you there was someone who procured women for (at the time) A-List celebrities such as George Lucas, Johnny Depp, Hugh Hefner, Billy Idol, Charlie Sheen, Nicolas Cage, Sean Penn, Robert Shapiro and Mario Andretti. Would you believe it? The person who did this was Heidi Fleiss. I think a lot straight men and especially straight women here just don't want to believe their favorite celebrity was/ is gay. But they never dispute straight actors hiring female hookers, even when there's no "proof."

"What if I told you there was someone who procured women for (at the time) A-List celebrities such as George Lucas, Johnny Depp, Hugh Hefner, Billy Idol, Charlie Sheen, Nicolas Cage, Sean Penn, Robert Shapiro and Mario Andretti"

She didn't claim she slept with them herself. Of course if you run a high end call girl agency, you will attract big name clients.

Heidi doesn't claim anything. She hasn't actually spoken about her connection to any of the men who hired her. Also, Scotty doesn't claim to have slept with all of his clients.

FFS R186 did you have to use the word "smear" in your post.

Also my comment was going more to the fact that people say Scotty couldn't have been connected to all these celebrities, when (in my opinion) Heidi had more A-list clients.

Bwah, Heidi was claiming the Duke AND the Duchess of Windsor

I meant "wasn't" claiming the Duke and Duchess of Windsor

People act like Wally & The Duke were some rarefied untouchable saints when they were actually just rich selfish hedonists who had no country and were reviled at home. All they had was money, pretension - and a soft spot for Hitler.

Well, they sure weren't saints but they weren't hanging out with bartenders, either

The story about Charles Laughton eating shit sandwiches is included in Hollywood Babylon, published in 1965. That doesn't make it true - Bowers might have simply repeated the story, rather than having first-hand knowledge.

r51 Surely you can't be serious. Trump is a pathological narcissist. No amount of money or fame will ever satisfy him.

[quote]His anecdotes do not ring true. You seriously believe Ty Power and Charles Laughton were eating shit? That actually sounds like the kind of thing homophobes make up to smear gays

The drawings of Martin of Holland, and his memorial Brown Book, would never be so popular as they have been were shit not popular with some.

As for eating shit, I once knew a woman who loved to have someone shit on a piece of bread, which she would then spread like butter before chomping away on it. She would orgasm as she consumed this treat. The weirdest thing was she had no stomach for her own feces, had to be someone else's. I saw her do it just once and that was one time to much.

^ This. never. happened.

They couldn't live without their Shit Sex in Germany.

r122 I think you mean Sir Horace Mann.

The only interesting thing in this dirty little book was about Rock Hudson's wide hips.

The photographers had to artfully 'de-emphasize' them.

[quote]I think you mean Sir Horace Mann.

Yes!!!!

Just watched the movie. It was fabulous, and I believe him. He does NOT claim to be anything but a pimp and prostitute, no claims of falling in loves or changing lives or the course of history. He was a very driven businessman whose business was sex, and he’s not in the least sentimental about it. I haven’t read the book, though, and a lot of people questioning him here seem to have more problems with the book than the film. I wonder what the filmmakers believed after working with him.

Commenters here on DL bring it. No place like DL

Watch the film before reading the book.

he was polygraphed several times by the publisher and god knows who else. I believe him. He does not seem like some sociopath trying to destroy people. This is the life he lived with celebrities and he was no priss pot about sex, since he was desensitized as a young kid to all the crazy shit that is possible with sex.