When Hot Straight or Masculine Dudes hang out with Effeminate Gay Dudes

I've been pretty femmy and pretty all my life. Straight guys have hit on me in a jokey way or been friends with me and I have even had some "experiment" with me. In those situations, it always felt like they wanted to see what it would be like with a gay guy and I was about as gay as they come. Sort of like when anyone wants to try something different, they pick the most stereotypical version of that they can find.

Straight and bi guys love femmes and trannys

R1, do you feel like a token experimental project?

I think straight-identified dudes feel Better about messing around with effeminate guys than masculine dudes because they think fem guys are closer to real women, and they can rationalize it more than with a regular guy. However, they usually don't want to be seen in public with effeminate guys

R4 I like to think they are more open minded and less prejudiced with less hang ups. Unlike gay guys

(R3) I had a big crush on one of the guys so I kind of felt like he enjoyed being adored and he really liked me....as a friend. The other guy came as a total surprise and I think he just wanted the experience as he thought of himself as a daredevil type. He got off on being a rebel and I think he got off on thinking I would fall in love with him or be eternally grateful for the attention. I didn't and wasn't but enjoyed the sex. What I liked about both is I really felt accepted and not judged on my appearance or effeminacy. They both liked that about me which felt liberating at the time.i tend to feel gay guys are judging me because I judge myself pretty harshly. So getting this attention from who I believe to be straight guys was very affirming for me. So I didn't mind being used for experimentation. Even though I did crush pretty hard on one of them.

Idk what it is but it seems like straight guys are often more comfortable with fem gays than masculine gays. Maybe they feel their masculinity is not threatened or maybe like someone else have said it's easier to rationalize because fem guys are closer to a woman. I definitely think that straight guys often can't wrap their heads around masculine gay men, it makes them confused. It's just easier to hang out with a guy who is obviously gay, if that makes sense.

I don't get you OP. You assume the other guy is straight just because he wasn't flaming? They could of course have been gay friends, that is most likely scenario. I am pretty "masculine" in mannerisms/voice and I have friends that are fairly effeminate.

Also, I disagree with most of you guys. In my experience straight guys tend to be way more comfortable being friends with a gay guy as long as he isn't "too gay". When you can still "be a guy" and fit in with them it makes things simpler.

People assume masculine guys are straight.

R9 hits the nail on the head.

Vivian Vance

I've had sufficient (of this thread)

He's straight. In fact, he works out with his hot girlfriend sometimes. He also happens to be a former college football player, which has nothing to do with his orientation, but just more information.

I've seen it once, and the 'effeminate Gay Dude' swore he wasn't gay. We also have an 'effeminate Dude' at work who is married to a women, but none of the 'masculine' dudes will have anything to do with him. Sad.

There are plenty effeminate straight dudes

People don't think or care of they are banging unless the straight dude is hot

hot to death

Truth is, it is rdiculous and childish to think that a heterosexual guy is going to set his eyes on a guy just because he is effeminate. If the guy is heterosexual he is heterosexual for a reason, that is, he likes women with all that concept entails both physically and psychologically.

If anything, the vast majority of heterosexual men see effeminate gay men as someone to get emotional support, someone who can give them advices to approach women, a match-maker. Sometimes, they interact with flirts but not because the heterosexual one is attracted to the feminine gay guy, instead, it is a sign that the heterosexual guy is totally fine with the effeminate gay guy's personality, a sign of respect and friendship.

you're onto it r18. It' just true sometimes that some really str8 guys enjoy having a gay friend with no hidden agenda there. There are a lot of assholes out there no doubt but then there are also just a lot of good guys out there too.

There is a duo at my gym like this. The straight dude is a big buff jock, the gay guy a thin effeminate prancing stereotype. Odd for them to be together. People stare.

OP, you are the most observably feminine man posting today on DL. Seriously. Who else could think of, let alone share, such prissy sissy eructations?

And it's "femme," not "fem," low-IQed ones.

Heterosexual men are as interested in men as you gay guys are interested in women.

sounds like progress

Grow up.

OP, they were brothers and of course they were fucking.

It must be relieving to walk around with such mundane thoughts and observations, OP.

OP is proof that some people have entirely too much free time on their hands.

OP = Gladys Kravitz

There's somebody on DL who occasionally comments (perhaps facetiously) that Justin Bieber has a pituitary disorder that keeps him looking like a prepubescent. Well, I had that condition for real, and I was very pretty until my 40s when the docs fixed the problem. I didn't act fem, but despite being an athlete, I was slight of build with thick wavy blond hair and blue eyes and skin described by a female friend as "Your skin glows like you're pregnant AND you just had sex." I did not look masculine at all.

In my 20s and 30s, while 12 year old girls were peeing through more hair than I had on my face, I was a tutor at university. I got a lot of straight guy attention - at the gym and while tutoring, including from a couple college athletes and military guys - stereotypical alphas. They asked me to hang out with them, they would sometimes get sexual. I usually went along with that because I like sex and I think it's a good thing to expand straight guy horizons. (I made sure those horizons got thoroughly stretched.) I asked a couple of them "why me?" The answer was always similar, a combination of "you look approachable" and "you're very smart and very friendly and you don't judge."

So, it boiled down to: (a) my neotonous features made it easy for straight guys to initially approach me. My looks were what initially led them to believe I wasn't going to be another typical macho asshole they had to play their straight guy games around. Then after approaching, they discovered that I had engaging qualities, and because I responded to them with confident respect, they felt further encouraged to befriend me, and even to feel (horny) affection.

TBH, this is the way all relationships should go, regardless if you look like the Biebs or not and regardless of your labeled sexuality. Stories like this show you that contemporary masculinity is really a soul prison for guys. Many do not enjoy having to live emotionally, behaviorally and socially restricted lives. They would love to let down their guard and they would love to have a variety of types of people in their lives.

If the Hot Straight or Masculine Dudes have a socially acceptable reason to befriend you (you met them at the gym, you're their tutor) and you have some redeeming qualities (humor, personality, interests), and you don't bum them out with your self-hatred AND you don't act like a sexually aggressive creeper, many "straight" guys will be interested in you, for friendship and perhaps for a little bit more.

Thanks guys for all the amusing thoughts and theories expressed so far in this thread. Nothing related to any serious kind of questions, thoughts or realities, but amusing nonetheless. You can go back to your junior high locker rooms now.

Keep dreaming that heterosexual men will set their eyes on you. If they fantasise about sex with men then they're not hetero.

dont be perverted

>>If they fantasise about sex with men then they're not hetero.

What an original thought, especially here at the DL.

Gold star for you!

The more you focus on getting the unattainable straight guy the more you waste your time. If anything, you are meant to be with other gay/bisexual man because they do have the natural capacity to eventually fall in love with you, they were born with the qualities to love your male nature.

Exactly r33. I have ended up being quite happy with a bi guy. Yeah he still likes pussy but that has proven to be a non issue in building a bond a good relationship with each other. But in some ways he's an exception that he doesn't feel a need to hide the fact he happened to fall in love with another guy and pretending to be str8 etc that a lot seem to suffer from

There is a lot of fascination with heterosexual men on DL, kind of too much really.

It makes me wonder if this sort of fascination with them makes some gays (not all) adopt an affemiante personality, showhow thinking that one of them might feel attracted to his feminine manners the same ay hetero males feel attracted to women acting feminine...

When a heterosexual woman is interedted in a man she will usually move and express herself very feminine to get the man's attention. Could this be also be happening to some gay men when they are fascinated with hetero males?

Are you and Chicago Op? The reason I ask is because the black guy is my trainer. Yes he was a former football player as well. If you are the guy who always wears that baggy red sweatshirt with the Citcle patch label on it, then I really really want to have sex with you. I just thought you were straight. I'm confused because you always look at me and then you pretend you're not looking when I look back.

When I went to the office, I could see you staring in the reflection of the glass office door, but then when I looked at you, you quickly looked away. And, yes I did wait by the elevator the other day so I could get in there with you at the same time, but you stared at your phone so I couldn't make any small talk. I even asked Gabrielle (?) or that other girl who you waved to what your situation was, but she said you're straight, so I am just very confused .

I would like to turn this into the "I am in lust with my cousin" thread at your earliest convenience.

What are the chances? O.o

The is observably tranny OP with man-woman heteronormative views of sexuality.

Could you explain your observation in more detail? It sounds interesting.

R39 at R38

Tranny wants to slice it's genitals to be a "straight" woman and fit into heteronormative world.

what the what

Hmm, well, the fascination with heterosexual men perhaps can be a consequensce of heterosexism. I mean, society conditions everybody to think of the attraction to men as a feminine quality/trait thus any man who is attracted to men is expressing a feminine quality; not masculine. On the other side of things, the attraction to women is seen as a masculine quality/trait.

This rhetoric conditions people both heterosexual and homosexual to think that all gay men are by default feminine. Given that maleihomosexuality is, in a broad sense, about attraction to men and traits deemed masculine, some gay men in their search for a masculine partner fixate their efforts on heterosexual men because our heterosexist culture has told them that the only masculine men are heterosexual and their attraction to femininity proves that.

Gay transvestites crossdress because they are obsessed with hetero men and their only possibility to attract any of these impossible men is by emulating a woman visually. They think that masculinity (somehting they lust after and desperately search for in a partner) is somethign that heterosexual men are born with exclusively.

If there is a reason why some gay gays obsess over heterosexual men it is because most have grown up with the idea that true masculinity is heterosexual; not homosexual.

I love it!

My gym and college is filled with such odd couplings. Masculine straight dudes are sometimes friends with effeminate men, ya know.

In your flaming dreams op

My gym has an odd pair. An old guy comes with a person I think is a MTF tranny who isn't very passable. Either that or she's a very rough looking woman. The tranny has formed some sort of crush on me (a lesbian). The gym always has odd pairings or people with strange behavior.

coolness

Those gays are conditioned to believe that all gay men are effeminate and since they aren't attracted to effeminacy they look for masculinity in hetero men. And so is how the fascination with heterosexual men began.

If they could break through this cultural conditioning they would most likely stop searching for masculinity in hetero men who will pay no attention to them and would set their eyes on the masculine gay men.

Two of my former partners were "Masculine Dudes": one a former pro football player and the other a former Green Beret. I'm not masculine by straight standards, but these guys got off on my effeminacy (not a screaming queen). And yes, both relationships lasted quite a while. "Masculine Dudes" aren't always attracted to other" Masculine Dudes.: I'll leave it the armchair Freuds to figure that one out.

r50, uh they just friends

That's absolutely true r51. one of my best friends is extremely masculine built etc and he def prefers more effeminate men. He likes being the dominate protector thing. He is a lot of effeminate guys dream so he's never had a shortage of bfs in the 15 years i've known him. He also likes them shorter and thinner.

That's called exaltation of the self. If a heterosexual man acts overly masculine around effeminate men he's just doing it to elevate himself to the state of the alpha male. He takes advantage of the emasculation that effeminate men perform around him. It feeds his ego.

For many effeminate gay men, heterosexual men embody the ideal of masculinity the way the media has made us believe about them heterosexual men. Super masculine, furiously protective, fearless, adventurous, etc. The media makes that sterotypical heterosexual men desirable and a standard of masculinity.

There are some who are that way just aike some homosexual men are also that way, but the truth that that is just a sterotype most men don't live up to.

Most heterosexual men also feel certain pressure to embody that stereotypical idea of masculinity when they don't want to be that way.

LOL, This is a fantasy thread of Trannies and nelly sisies .

I know many feminine out gay men and none of them lust after straight males. It seens like a datalounge, addicted to porn kind of thing.

By "hot straight dudes" as the title of this thread says I understand you mean masculine. Hot is code word for masculine here.

The title also revelas how heteronormativity also has an impact on some gay men and how they think they must present themsleves in order to attract men...

Hmmmm

I had a crush on a straight guy from work. One night he got very drunk and I convinced him to let me blow him, but he barely got hard and couldn't come. I chose to believe he was just too drunk but he never wanted to try again. I finally got it. He was really straight and just not into men.

One could easily assume this thread is about those feminine gays who are obsessed with heterosexual men and have this deeply encrusted idea in their minds that masculinity is a heterosexual trait.

This thread shows the other side of things that no one dares discuss: when the feminine gay is also saying "no fems" due to his attraction to masculinity just like the majority of gays.

R60, how in the world does the conversation about you fellating him even begin?

I think there is more a tendency for people to think sexual curiosity or tension is why a straight dude is hanging with an effeminate gay dude than if he is hanging with a masculine gay/bi guy. People think why would a masculine straight guy hang with an effeminate guy? They presume they are very different and have nothing significant in common that would make the platonic friends. With a masculine gay dude, they could be playing basketball together, going to hockey games, hanging in sports bars, chillin with the bros. There is more in common between masculine guys so that people don't automatically assume some sexual activity or motive is involved

Yeah, I wonder if they're more than friends. Then I start wondering how butch-boy tags fem-boy's tight little bubble, and, my thoughts go in a whole new direction. Hot...

Bi-curious straight guys often seek out fem guys because they're obviously gay, thus approachable and likely down to fuck -- not necessarily because they're the hottest things on the planet. With a conventionally masculine guy, it's harder to figure out right off the bat if he's into guys. (See also: prison.)

In any case, there are tons of bi/curious guys on Craigslist who are into twinks and fem guys -- probably way more than on Grindr, etc. Not surprisingly, though, a lot of the same guys also post ads looking for CDs and T-girls.

[quote]The title also revelas how heteronormativity also has an impact on some gay men and how they think they must present themsleves in order to attract men...

Is heterornormativity always bad, though?

In a way it may be detrimental because it reduces their chances to attract the only men that can be attracted to them: gays and bi men. R65

There's a reason why a portion of the male kind if defined as heterosexual: they like women; not men.

At my college, I have a dormmate who is baseball player. I have noticed that when his roommate is gone home on weekends, the openly gay male cheerleader comes over to visit him. Now, the cheerleader had a very nice body with an incredible prominent bubble butt. He is black, the baseball player is white. The cheerleader is rather effeminate. Cheerleaders don't cheer at baseball games so I first wonder how they met. Also, when he visits my dormmate, they not only close the door, they lock it. It is very unusual for guys to close the door when male friends visit, except maybe overnight. Maybe they are smoking weed in there, but their demeanor when I caught them emerging from the room one day seemed Curious

I was in a fraternity at a small, very liberal liberal arts college in the South -- we had everybody from jocks to nelly queens to stoners and geeks. One of my brothers was a hulking, ripped ex-military dude nicknamed "Goose" (after the character in [italic]Top Gun[/italic]). His closest friend outside the fraternity was this extremely fem and flamboyant queen who sort of reminded me of Lamar Latrell from [italic]Revenge of the Nerds.[/italic] He wore his hair in finger waves, carried a purse, and wore girls' jeans and big Sally Jessy Raphael glasses, although he stopped short of wearing makeup.

A good friend of mine was roommates with Miss Thing and used to report that he and Goose used to do a lot of sneaking around, locking doors, etc.

Ha! Finger waves

The more you get fixated with heterosexual men the more you keep gays away from you because you will try to embody the things that attract heterosexual men and not the things that attract gay men.

And it is not like you trying to embody the things that attract them is going to work because above all things, they are attracted to female nature.

No heterosexual man can love you the way you need it; only homosexual and bisexual men can give you that.

Fascinating

The poll needs an option for "Yes and you don't know everything so you mustn't jump to conclusions."

Perhaps

Yaaaasss

Hmmmm

He wasn't masc4masc?? wow

I think fixation with heterosexual men inspires gender-bending in some gays fixated with them.

For example, I don't buy the statement that drag is purely artistic as I have observed and heard drag queens who only sleep with heterosexual men.

I am not a psychologist, but in my view, it usually starts during childhood when some gays internalise the idea that men like women and femininity so in their heads, if they want to attract men then they must either be a woman or look and behave like one. So they fantasise with dressing like a woman and taking their role and as time goes by the fantasy grows stronger and stronger until the time they need to play out the fantasy. Actually, some of this I have also heard it from drag queens.

You don't think thesw gay men who are fixated on straight males are trans, R77? Not even to a variant degree?

No, transgender is completely different. R78

Transgender has to do with identity. They have always felt like the other sex/gender regadless of who they are attracted to. They don't transition to have access to heterosexual men; they transition because they need to make their inside and their outside match. It is about who they really are.

In the case I exposed I was talking about gay men identify as males and have no issues with being men (so they are not transgender, but perfectly cis males), but crosdress because they fetishise heterosexual men for their allegedly true masculinity. The fantasy with crossdressing usually starts during childhood when absorbing all the messages that men like women and femininity. The motivation is purely sexual.

As I said before, I have heard many drag queens state they only date heterosexual men, they are turned off my gay men even if they are storngly masculine because in their minds masculinity is only true in hetrosexual men.

R79, not only trans and effeminate men have the perception that gay men can't be truly masculine or manly. Society generally teaching that same notion to all.

Right, yet effeminate gays who fetishise heterosexual men and dislike gay men for not being "true men" get away with their homophobia... R80

Hmmmm

I don't know. I'm of the mind that there will be or should be Kinsey scale of transgenderism; of gender. I think it's bizarre when I read gay men here labeling their male parts "female parts" or they identify with the female in straight porn or lust after straight men and only straight men. It's strange - and there's something to it. It's no joke. It's real.

I don't think lusting only for straight men is necessarily a trait of femininity or transgenderism. I think it is moreso a reflection of just how society's lie about the masculinity and manliness of gay men has tainted everyone's minds.

R84.

That's true R84. Good point.

The fact that there are no gay role models for gay kids increases the chances for some gay boys to fantasise with the female role sexually and idealise heterosexual men.

It's okay to wonder that, but it's not okay to "think that" because it's an assumption.

Why do you want to think that?

Don't believe everything you think.

Femmy guys take a lot of shit in the community but admit it -- they're fun to have around. Straight guys don't need to be turned on by them to enjoy their company.

Being funny or easy-going doesn't come with your gender expression; it's a trait people have regardless of their gender expression.

Not all or even most effeminate guys are funny, campy, or flamboyant. Some effeminate dudes are very shy, quiet, and sweet.

I guess we are all prey of the social conditioning that gay men cannot be masculine. As time goes by and you get to know other homosexuals you see that that is simply a cultural myth, but some gays seem unable to scape that lie.

True

Straights just love to laugh and make fun of fems and Trannys. Some have the class do do it behind their backs if they are lucky.

Some talk on reddit.

But then are straight dudes into ladyboys and trans women

There are some hetero men who have a fetish with crossdressers. It is the femininity that they projec that gets them turned on. The better a man can project the aura of a woman the more attractive he will be perceived.

This is actually a heterosexual man from a Visual Kei band, but his feminine appearance deceives many heterosexual men. Usually, heterosexual men have great tolerance for this type of men because their feminine appearance fascinates them.

To your point, R97, I recall seeing a sex documentary about straight guys who like lady-boys and trannies who overdo the femininity of their appearance / behavior. There are straight men who love the exaggerated femininity...it's like the reverse of a Tom of Finland. A lot of Japanese cartoon porn (Anime porn) has exaggerated female traits....but then again anime porn looks like 12 year old girls... so yea, men are going to like whatever the fuck they like. Being mad about it changes nothing.

Freaky deaky

Correct me if I'm wrong, but lady-boys are actually transvestites, probably gay men who have the fetish with heterosexual men and are willing to alter their bodies to increase their chamces of sleeping with them...? R98

That would an extreme of fetishization of heterosexual men.

Are ladyboys found in the West?

Sort of....

This Chinese exchange student living in Milan has had the HOTTEST straight guys fuck her - it's insane. I've never even seen porn stars, actors, escorts, etc... as hot as what he gets ... by putting on a wig and heels.

his blog went back for years and had dozens of guys just like the one below - all fucking his ass and gettingblown... and all insanely hot. But, he deleted everything except the last few months, recently.

So, if this is a "Western" lady-boy... I don't know... I don't really know much about lady-boys but, it just reminds me of the vague details about them i do know.

straight guys fuck him*

It's confusing ...

This like when some heterosexual women are obsessed with gay men and want them to be their boyfriends. A losing game.

Those straight right-wing men crawling all over tranny Blaire White's social media.

Ladyboy = Asian tranny

Femboy/trap = Young (as in jailbait) crossdresser; most are naturally feminine without having to take hormones.

That's hot. Maybe I like ladyboys too, bro.

Asian ladyboys are so authentic and hot

Ugh.

Wow, Blaire White is the tranny Milo.

Transvestism has many layers.

Yeah

I like 10 years ago a heterosexual guy fell in love with this Japanese musician who is a guy and also heterosexual, but we had fun not telling him that was a guy XD

HMMmm

Straight or Masculine guys don't "hang out" with effeminate gay guys except in OP's fantasies.

Sometimes they do

Of course R116. In Nifty stories, porn videos AND OPs dreams.

My bad dude.

I've mentioned it before, but in my southern (read right-wing), Catholic high school circa 2005, two effeminate types were among the most popular kids in school and ostensibly straight "jock bro" types certainly hung out with them. If it can happen there, it can happen anywhere. And indeed, I've seen it since then living in various areas of the country. There's probably a certain type of straight guy who is actually more comfortable around a fem than a masc gay. For masculine gays, however, this sentiment doesn't hold.

You tell this story frequently R118, and I would guess that at your Southern Catholic high school (all boys, IIRC) the straight jocks did not realize that the popular femmes were in fact gay. If they'd known...

Only once before, R119. My school was co-ed and no, the two weren't out at the time, but everyone just kind of nodded knowingly.

I could probably count the times I've ever seen this on one hand, with four fingers left over.

But you are ignoring the two VERY POPULAR femmes at R120's Catholic high school in the South, R121

There were two of them, so they count double.

Sounds hot

It is always assumed that masculine gay men reject effeminate gays when actually effeminate gay men also reject each other.

I think effeminacy in gay men in many cases is a subconscious adaptation and assimilation of traits exhibited by women where the only perceived pool for gay men is heterosexual men who show a clear inclination for femininity. In a way, an effeminate gay man is preparing himself for the case a (heterosexual) man could set his eyes on him. Let alone the fact that society says liking men is a feminine trait so it all plots to psuh some gay men to effeminacy instead of exploring their masculinity.

Attraction is not learnt or conditioned; attraction is an innate reaction that happens spontaneously and it seems to be the case that there is predisposition to lust after certain traits associated with men over those associated with women. Gender expression, on the othe rhand can always vary through time.

fahjs

I wouldn't know.

It's really fucking sad that some of you can't imagine a gay man and a straight man having a platonic and mutually beneficial friendship. The internalized homophobia is very strong in some, even today.

Where there's smoke, there's fire!

I must be the only one who find the term "straight" offensive because it was coined by evenagelicals to mean "heterosexuality = correct". People should always say "heterosexuality".

Kmmbhfff

there are straight or straight-identified guys at my gym who work out with fem guys. It raises eyebrows at first but then people are like, meh. A masculine gay dude with a straight dude does not automatically raise a suspicion of sexual involvement because despite the different sexual orientations, people assume masculine guys have something in common to make them bros, friends. People suspect straight dudes hanging with fem gay guys have little in common except a hidden sexual curiosity or chemistry.

OP = Jealous Bitch

Hmmm

This is social conditioning in that as a gay man you are attracted to masculinity and, although you are supposed to connect sexually and romantically with gyay and bisexual men, social conditioning has brainwashed you and, in finding the man that exhibit the traits you find attractive in men you can't think of gay men as masculine because, even if they are masculine, social conditioning makes you think of them as not truly masculine. So you then over idealise heterosexual men who will never set their eyes on you because they lack attraction to their own sex.

It doesn't matter how effemiante you try to act around them, their hearts belong to women. I think this type of conditioning strengthens effeminacy is some gay men because they are trying to evoke a woman to some extent in hopes of getting one of those elusive hetero men in their beds.

Wrong focus.

It turns me on

uh huh

When Hot One Legged Chinese Lesbians hang out with Zambian Market Vendors

No ne notices the double standard that when masculine gay men express attractio to masculine men they get strongly criticised, but when effeminate gays express attraction to masculine men no one criticises them for sharing the same attraction as their masculine counterparts?

Why one has a free pass but the other is criticised?

Effeminate gay men are bitchy in general. They complain about everything. Masculine men tend to be more easygoing and chill

𝓔𝓯𝓯𝓮𝓶𝓲𝓷𝓪𝓽𝓮 𝓰𝓪𝔂 𝓶𝓮𝓷 𝓪𝓻𝓮 𝓫𝓲𝓽𝓬𝓱𝔂 𝓲𝓷 𝓰𝓮𝓷𝓮𝓻𝓪𝓵. 𝓣𝓱𝓮𝔂 𝓬𝓸𝓶𝓹𝓵𝓪𝓲𝓷 𝓪𝓫𝓸𝓾𝓽 𝓮𝓿𝓮𝓻𝔂𝓽𝓱𝓲𝓷𝓰. 𝓜𝓪𝓼𝓬𝓾𝓵𝓲𝓷𝓮 𝓶𝓮𝓷 𝓽𝓮𝓷𝓭 𝓽𝓸 𝓫𝓮 𝓶𝓸𝓻𝓮 𝓮𝓪𝓼𝔂𝓰𝓸𝓲𝓷𝓰 𝓪𝓷𝓭 𝓬𝓱𝓲𝓵𝓵

Sure, Jan.

Jan?

....

That's a sweeping generalisation. Only a fraction will be bitchy. Masculine gay men can be annoying too.

But there is double standard where masculine gay men are socially scolded for their attraction to masculinity and accused of many things, accusations as stupid as misogyny (effeminate gays are not women), but effeimnate gay men don't face this self-righteous social criticism for also liking masculinity.

This double standard in how masculine gay men are constantly criticised and vivlified for their attraction to masculinity also comes form heterosexual circles, especially from women. I find it disappointing that still no ne seems to notice this double standard and denounce it.

Why is this double standard happening and why it is not facing criticism back?

[quote]But there is double standard where masculine gay men are socially scolded for their attraction to masculinity

I think social scolding from other gay men for being attracted to more feminine men is also a problem.

I have never heard a single person ever scolding a gay man for liking effeminate gays. That stuation simply doesn't exist R144

Straight guys will often treat effeminate gay guys like women, showing the same deference (holding doors) and I'm from Mars/You're from Venus cluelessness, as if they were different species.

I've also seen cases where, when the femme guy is pretty outgoing and not easily offended, they'll flirt back with him (femme will tell them their arms look big and they're flattered) or they'll ask them for fashion tips ("I have a date tonight. Blue shirt or striped shirt?") or ask them to interpret women's behavior. ("I met this girl in a bar last night. I said X, Y and Z. Do you think that was rude?")--that kind of thing. They can also fascinated by femme clothing choices, man-purses and shoes-that-aren't-brown or black and all that.

Speaking from experience I can tell you that straight men do get the action, going by my married work-friend I suck off now and then. Maybe it's novelty at first and then and easy way to get your rocks off.

But one thing is that I never know when he will decide that he will go completely straight. It's fun anyway while it lasts

Some guys happen to like femme guys, there's nothing wrong with that.

[quote]I have never heard a single person ever scolding a gay man for liking effeminate gays. That stuation simply doesn't exist [R144]

Please. If I start a thread here about how I'm in love with EJ Johnson or Johnny Weir, I would either get flamed or no one would reply at all.

True, R149

That "Cam from 'Modern Family' Is A Hot Bear Daddy" thread you started went nowhere ;)

This story is a work of fiction

A great one

It is always interesting with effeminate or very gay guys are the big muscleheads at a gym. Their physique will often garner respect from the gym bros at least in cities and college towns, but often guys seem somewhat uncomfortable around them.

Indeed

The history book, Gay New York, describes the various gay scenes that existed in that city at the turn of the last century. In working class districts, effeminate gay men would hang out and flirt with the male clientele at local saloons. The flirtations often led to sexual encounters. The straight men felt no shame having sex with the gay guys because they considered them women trapped in men's bodies. Perhaps the straight guys who have sex with effeminate gay friends today consider their friends' effeminacy "womanly" and therefore acceptable.

I witnessed this at my (college) gym this week, OP. A tall coiffed prancing pony led around a fairly good looking muscle-bound lug as they went through their workout. The effeminate guy went on and on about his hair cut earlier that day, and the date he had with some dude and where they ate and what he wore while the meathead dude occasionally grunted an acknowledgment that he thought the other guy had finished a thought.

I found them fascinating.

I rarely, if ever, see this scenario.

By definition, straight guys don't even flirt with gay guys, let alone fool around or experiment. Anyone that does is closeted.

I think the idea that hetero men sleep with effeminate gay men is purely dreams and projection of one's own desires. No wonder it is always affeminate gay men who are usually obsessed with hetero men.

It is stupid to say straight men don't flirt with dudes when some straight dudes have confessed doing so already

Gguhh

Flirting is not indication of mutual attraction. If other person flirts with you in most instances it is only a friendly game that's all.

I know this is not a popular opinion in today's world, but I do think that sometimes effeminacy is encouraged by personal fetishes or sexual fantasies with heterosexual men. If a gay guy happens to idealise heterosexual men and desire to be in bed with them he is going to put more effort into projecting a feminised persona hoping to attract the ellusive heterosexual man. The problem is that he thinks femininity is the way to get men, but next time, when he finds a gay man attractive and that man rejects him for been too feminine he will complain and hate gay men for rejecting him.

Uh not really dude

Hmmmmm

ME Gusta

Nice

The more obsessed with EITHER masculinity OR femininity you are, the bigger the DOUCHEBAG YOU ARE.

Perhaps but people tend to find douchebags attractive and hot

lkkkl

I think this is a case of double fetish. One is the fetish with heterosexual men and the other is fetishization of a woman's role which perhaps on a subconscious level seems to be more enjoyable when being with a man.

This is also sample of double standard when effeminate gay men complain about gay men not dating them for not being masculine enough, but they drool over the sight of a heterosexual man who in heir eyes exudes masculinity.

Yeah

Hmmmm

Sort of hot

VERy

Ya never know.

Stop injecting sex into everything.

How do you guys even know any straight men to hang out with?

The only straight men I have any contact with are a co-worker's husband and my father.

My entire circle of friends is made up of gay men and my co-workers are all gay men and women. Where do you even meet these guys and why would you choose to be friends with straight guys over a great group of gay guys?

Most of my friends are heterosexual. Most of them are friends from high school. If the majority of the human population is supposedly heterosexual then you are bound to make more friends who are heterosexual. Unless, of course if you seclude yourself from certain people and circles.

R178, how old are you and where do you live, man. You Sound like you are typing from another era and place.

I meant r177.

Really? how so?

Just because you have difficulty making friends with people who are not homosexual doesn't mean that others can't either. R179

I have a diverse group of friends. It's natural that most of them are heterosexual because they are supposed to be the majority of the population.

The number of people on this thread that think more effeminate guys choose to be that way kills me. Some embrace it and play it up, sure, but most don't.

I happen to have a naturally higher voice, smaller build, and more feminine features. It's not on purpose, and I don't carry purses or watch reality tv and crap. As a kid I even tried cutting my hair super short to look more masculine, but it backfired and my classmates didn't recognize me and thought I was a new FEMALE student. It was humiliating at the time, but I learned to just not give a shit because I can only be what I am. Most of my friends are straight, and they don't care what I look/sound like. We grew up playing sports together and we like the same dorky sci fi stuff. It's completely platonic. Sometimes they joke flirt, but they also joke flirt with each other. It's a normal friend thing. I'm confused why so many on here think male friendship is impossible, but maybe it's a generational thing.

I think people think flamboyant when they imagine effeminate men. Not all fem guys are flamboyant or campy.

I can't even be bothered to read this thread as it is so boring and uninteresting. So I skipped straight to the bottom to post this remark. And BTW, fuck all you bitches who make nasty snarky comments about my post. Just fuck you.

R184, what are you trying to say? You seem unhinged.

Hinged means to hang on the wall. So yes, I am un-hinged. I do not hang on the wall. Why do you R185?

I know, right R186? #fucking.idiot @ R185

Don’t be weird.

A few years ago I worked as a teacher for a class and there was this gay guy who was very effeminate, however, he was not flamboyant at all. He was very down-toEarth and a bit shy. He was always with the girls; he never spent time with his male classmates so he rarely talked to any of them. The guys never mistreated him, never made fun of him nor treated him as less than. But for me it was a bit uncomfortable to make groups because he looked uncomfortable around the guys.

Yeah, effeminate Boys and young men still have trouble bonding with their male Peers, even in the most liberal environments.

Lack of interests in common segregate people.

Yes IT does

Funny how this thread pops up every month or two.

Such a random topic

Great topic. I’ve noticed this dynamic in my gym too. No one says anything, but you can see people looking puzzled.

The topic's title sounds fetishistic of heterosexual men and the idea they are "inherent" masculinity that supposedly (according to some) gay men don't possess.

A bit hypocritical because when gay men are masculine they get bashed and derogatorily feminised by the same who fetishise heterosexual men's masculinity.

GGGGFFFxx

People are still so prejudiced against those who are different.

There are two guys at me gym. One guy is a typical former football player jockbro, the other a flaming over the top effeminate guy. They hang out and work out together. People just gawk and stare at them Together in disbelief.

I love it!

My gym has a few odd couplings like this. People just avert their eyes and act normal

My gym has a “couple” like this. Both dudes are jacked, but one is a total jock dudebro, and his workout partner is a Flaming stereotypical gay guy who wears short shorts and sings Nicki Minaj lyrics out loud. Very bizarre pairing

I find it heartening

It’s a sign of progress