Gay men.... do you refer to your gay male friends using the feminine pronouns?

All the time. And I'm 35, so don't start with the eldergay shit. I know guys in their 20s who do it, too. It's campy fun and and makes us feel a part of a tribe.

I don't usually. Personally, I hate it because it perpetuates the notion that we want to be women or see ourselves as effeminates. However, when a friend is being outrageously campy or professing his love for Liza, I might throw in a "guuurl..."

I should change that to "we see ourselves as feminine." Sorry.

Boys who do that sort of thing lead tragically lonely, ignored lives.

I stay away from gay people who do that. I think they are pathetic. The worst of the worst. They embarrass me.

[quote] And I'm 35, so don't start with the eldergay shit.

Oh, honey...

Do y'all want to tell him, or should I?

LOL, R6. So LOL.

You tell [italic]her![/italic]!

The gay people who intentionally act vacuous and effeminate are basically the equivalent of straight people use words like 'dude' and 'bro'. Basically, these are not charismatic or captivating people. They are are repellent to be around, absolutely grotesque.

I usually don't, but I will make an exception for you and R8, OP, because you are such bitches about it. GUUUURRRRRLLLLL!

It's totally sexist to get hysterically offended by it.

I only do it around desperately insecure queens like the miserable cunts at R2, R4 and R5.

It's not insecurity r11. It's maturity. Some of us have no time for attention seeking sadcases like yourself and your 'peers'.

Oh girl, just get a fucking grip.

I don't but I don't mind if others do. I'm not bothered by arch campiness, I think it's just rude to try to censor how others speak.

The thing is, it's not even camp, that behavior. Campiness only comes about when something is trying to be earnest and fails miserably. If you are desperately trying to be funny by being flamboyant, that is not camp behavior, it's not even clever. It's trying too hard.

Unless one is strictly a topman, we are basically sisters competing for trade and sizemeat.

So, yes. But at least we're not fish.

From my perspective, it is not that referring to yourself with female pronounns is a bad thing per se; what happens is that most gay men want to be acknowledged by society as the males they are. If people, regardless of sexual orientation, refer to them with female pronouns they feel society is denying them their male nature and in certain way, because of this, heterosexual men feel they have a monopoly on male nature.

When you call a man by a feminine pronoun, what is the purpose? Why do you do it?

"It's not insecurity [R11]. It's maturity."

Hunty, please. You need to be bitch slapped into tomorrow.

r19, that's exactly what we're talking about. Nobody who is gay finds you people sexually desirable so you try and be like black women in order to compensate.

R17 is the smartest poster on this thread. Granted, that's not much of a boast . . .

Archie does it all the time.

Occasionally, for emphasis and laughs, or when demanded by the circumstances.

Never!

Only in a derisive manner.

No. I can tolerate a lot of diversity amongst my friends and associates, but this is one thing I don't tolerate, especially among effeminate men who project their gender pronoun confusion on males who do not consent to be apart of that bizarre conduct.

r20, you meant "NObody finds you people sexually attractive."

All the time. It's funny and it salutes our heritage. Plus, my masculinity isn't threatened by anyone's definition of what is and isn't acceptable language for a man to use.

Absolutely not. Perhaps because I have actual trans* friends, gays misgendering themselves and other gay folks seems really amazingly stupid. On the other hand, I love classic gay argot: 'Mary!' is fine with me, as long as it's an exclamation.

Young, hot, up-and-coming career-wise, and not afraid to goof around and embrace his feminine side:

'Some of us have no time for attention seeking sadcases like yourself and your 'peers'.'

MARY!!!!!

Well! We are ALL CLEAR NOW on what r26 WILL and WILL NOT tolerate!

Just fucking OWN it already, bitches!

Why does this board continue to mix gaymosexuals with us ordinary homosexuals?

I hate it. Someone calls me that and I tell them to feel again.

R1 for sure gurl friend right on missy ;)

'R34 - "gaymosexuals"? You mean, like us?'

he-she responded to my fucking the shit out of him last week....FUCK me bitch with no mercy that's right I said work that ass girl anything you say Queen and eat my jam

Grunt like a big GIRL!

Only when I want to be mean

o my LOL

Definitely not. I tolerate it when other people do, but I definitely don't do that shit myself.

Cunts

R29 is as tedious as the ridiculous dude bros.

but you're even worse, r44

fuck my pussy bitch

such a revolting thing for a dude to do. even as a joke

I do if the gay guy is queeny.

All of the time!

I have a couple of gay friends I call gurl. Sometimes it just fits and the comedy of it never gets old.

No! What a ridiculous fucking question.

Amen to R51!

It's similar to Canadians using 'eh'. Very few use the word in real life, expect to add emphasis in a self mocking way.

A flamer refers to me as girl or she i punch him!!

People as tedious as R26 make me roll my eyes and go "Oh, HER......."

Other than that, I tend not to use feminine pronouns. As for others, I'd much rather hear another gay guy use the feminine pronouns than the ridiculous "dude." Nothing says "I hate myself for being gay" than the use of "dude" or "dudes."

Oh, and "apart" and "a part" mean almost the opposite of each other, R26. And you used it wrong.

I don't. I'm also not friends with those who do.

I associate it with two-faced, mercurial, over sensitive gays who'll turn on you in a New York minute.

I called R54 a big girl...

And she hit me with her purse!

Of course OP. Nothing better than a well placed "gurl bye".

R58 is my new girlfriend.

I was watching this Alaska Thunderfuck drag person and (s)he speak so annoyingly. (S)he exaccerbates the lips infinitale and speak as of his battery is a about to wear out.

Even when he is out of drag he still speaks like his character.

I meant lisp; not lips.

This is why I avoid the "gay community" like the plague.

My friends started doing this a few years ago and it annoyed the shit out of me. Now, I think it's kind of funny & do it when someone is being a drama queen (then he gets called a she). I do it to my straight guy friends now too. They just think it's funny, cuz they get the context. btw, straight guys say this too "oh matt is on the rag today...don't bother him" - just change him to her. It's confusing at first, but it works!

[quote]This is why I avoid the "gay community" like the plague.

Why are you on a gay gossip / bitchery site, butch?

Why do US gay guys imitate black women's speech pattern?

Hate it.

r63, same here for the lesbians

I could never get the hang of it, and when I'm around people who girl it up with ease I feel like a less-than gay.

A while back, a good friend of mine could not break himself of the girl/she patter no matter who he was talking to (gay/ straight and in EVERY environment), and it created many an awkward moment. To break himself of his habit, he started calling everyone 'doctor' and it worked. He still calls me Doctor Kevin instead of Miss Kevin.

I had a masculine friend that really hated being refered to as she, so naturally he was called it even more. We also used to call him tinkerbell, which he also hated.

[quote]Why do US gay guys imitate black women's speech pattern?

I do not.

Sharolaid.

^ OMG what's going to happen to that poor girl being pranked?

R73 That is an old Youtuber who used to make prank call videos back in 2007 speaking like a black woman. His videos were constantly deleted by Youtube in those days.

Sharolaid is her name.

[quote]I could never get the hang of it

Guuuuurl, please! It couldn't be easier. I could find occasions to use this one every day,

Fucky my mussy

R70 sounds like these queens

Calling other homosexual men "queen(s)" for the sake of calling them that sounds like it stems from one's own inferiority complex or from some bad experience with homosexual men who don't fit the feminine standard who probably rejected you once in the past...

Doing this seems to reinforce the notion that masculinity is not a homosexual thing and helps empower heterosexual men in the monopolisation of male naure. It is a certainly counterproductive dynamic.

Nope

God, R78, you couldn't write more like a Priss if you went to Priss School, majored in Priss, then went for an MP. That's how queeny you sound, you male vagina.

R77 - thank you for another reminder why I avoid all the 'trendy' social media sites. Do these two realize how foolish they look? You're aren't 20 forever, GURLFRIEND

Delete 're, as if it needs to be said, and on here, yes, every little error needs to be corrected, lest, all the old queens jump on you, to make themselves feel SO intelligent, and superior. Including the overuse of commas.

I don't use it and I don't mindful other people do but I HATE the use of "mussy", "boi pussy" etc. It's just something that gets on my nerves. You're a man why are you pretending to be a girl? I think it may stem from a dislike of homosexuality being viewed as essentially being effeminate.

[quote]Delete 're, as if it needs to be said

Whatever this means.....................................

Add me to those reasonable ranks who never do it myself & never bother to give a damn when others do

I'm not proud of it, but I do use "she" and "her" either when 1) I think someone is a closet case or 2) is a particularly obnoxious heterosexual authority. Yes, I recognize it contributes to misogyny and no doubt wounds many readers, but a girl's gotta have SOME fun, don't you think?

Sometimes a queen is a queen. Hate the female reference. If they want to be woman they should just do it. But a man with cock and balls is a man.

No.

Anyone who does that gets a punch in the face and their phone number deleted from my cell phone.

R88 = cunt

I could never pull it off, so I don't do it, and don't recall ever being called 'girlfriend'. I'm homosexual, not gay, if that makes sense. Perhaps it's just my lack of a strong personality, Having said that, I think it's a way some gay guys do it to be endearing, and to welcome you as a member of the tribe. It's an about face from growing up, and being teased about one's lack of perceived masculinity. So, you wear it as a source of pride when you get older. Although, it can get stale from overuse, and should only be used for emphasis.

R83 "Boy pussy" and stuff like that, I think it's mainly for fun. I think they perfectly know most gay guys are turned off by the use of such slang they they only use it for fun with friends.

Although, you never know if perhaps a few guys might actually be projecting some sort of desire to experience sex from a woman's perspective...

bump

R88 Course they do, petal.

What makes it a turn-off when gay guys use feminine pronouns?

To me it's an affectation and it seems inauthentic.... maybe the one word from the current bullshit speak I can actually get behind. It sounds false and camp and showy to me and if someone I know referred to me that way I would politely and clearly ask them not to. If it works for them, OK; if it doesn't work for me when it's me they're referring to it's for me to say please don't and them to respect that.

Might I be friends with somebody who talks like that? I hate fakers and showboaters. There are so many assholes in the world I really prize people who are themselves. Scene queens - of any scene - exhaust me.

No! Only when getting toppled do I scream "Fill my man-guy-na! Do me in my boypussy!"

I tend to think that it is mainly a fraction of bottoms who use feminine pronouns, probably because they assume that the bottom must be "the woman" or the feminine side in a relationship or to attract a possible sex partner. Kind of assimilating heterosexual standards given that it is heterosexual women who correlate to gay men who bottom.

I know it is used mainly as a bonding thing within gay culture but I also think it is the way some bottoms let tops know they are bottoms. It might not work much to attract tops, but it is the pattern that we learn from heterosexuals.

R88 Do you use a pencil to punch and delete them from your princess cell phone?

Do you imagine if women started to mock men and use male pronouns and expose through sarcasm the exaggeration of masculinity so typical among heterosexual men? That would be awesome.

No.

We have enough problems with insecure straight men so we don't need insecure gay men all in a huff about pronouns. Because everybody loves to dump on the femmes to make themselves feel better. The assumption is that femme behavior is learned and butch behavior is just natural when it's just as learned as anything else.

Masculine behaviour is also learnt for the most part. Typically, the boy learns from observing and imitating the father, an older brother or other boys/men who they may admire. It is typical that kids will have a mentor they try to imitate or aspire to be like in the future. It is essential that the boy feels embraced by other males to create a connection that will help him develop this masculine persona.

Of course, nothing in life is absolute so this will not represent every case.

Only time I do it is when my roommate and I are talking about this friend of his who does drag and has issues.

I do it and it doesn't bother me.

I'm 35, so firmly in eldergay territory, but I embrace it, hunty!

I find nothing as exasperating as calling another gay man dude or bro.

NEVER. NO FATS, OR FEMS!!

I do it sometimes just for fun. However, when I first came out I hated it. I was very insecure about using fem pronouns.

I do it jokingly, to mock a gay I disagree with, or teasingly about one who is staggeringly nelly.

By the way I love nelly gays. I'm not one of those people who puts them down -- I mean it in fun.

I will use feminine pronouns (or refer to someone as "gurrrrl") as satire, irony, or sarcasm, but never as a declarative.

I never use it conversationally - it's always the punchline to something.

Only when I'm mad at them.

No, I only use it to insult people. If the person pissing me off is male, I use female pronouns and adjectives like her, bitch, cunt, etc. If the person pissing me off is female, I call her asshole, dickhead, smelly bastard, etc. But I only use the "she/her" with men in this context. I refer to women in this context as "that dude/that guy".

Seems to be effective.

Drag queens influence slang for many gays.

NO!!! A guy that I liked on DL chastised me for being a "frau" but he flaked out on me, validating to myself why I don't fuck internet dudes. Flakey's BS steered me in another guy's direction, who on the surface I have nothing in common with, but eye to eye contact, mutual cruising, brought us together. He's amazing in and out of bed. If I can't see, touch, taste potential hook-ups and fuck buddies, I won't even bother. The net is for fantasy fucks. I live in the SHOW ME STATE.

Hell yes I do. Bitch suck my cock. You slut give me that butt.

r113 "Flakey's BS steered me in another guy's direction, who on the surface I have nothing in common with, but eye to eye contact, mutual cruising, brought us together. He's amazing in and out of bed. If I can't see, touch, taste potential hook-ups and fuck buddies."

You met a hook-up on DL? How did you manage that girl?

Never my actual friends. Never to anyone's face. But if I see a wacked-out ka-ween making a spectacle of herself, well...

No, and I don't let friends refer to me that way either.

for the joke value, absolutely, anything that means you're not taking yourself too seriously.

The intention is good, but the result is a disaster. So... no!!!

No!

The operative word here is "friend"

I bet most here don't use feminine pronouns in normal, nonjudgmental, non-derisive speech. But, as this board attests, its used ALL the time as a put down.

R115. I recently joined DL. I was inter-posting with another 'flyover state' guy. He talked the talk, I was sorta feeling him. While ignoring a guy at my favorite club all Summer, that vibed with me, mutual shy cruising. I placed real guy in the back burner, we don't appear to have shit in common but mutual lust and attraction. Flakey kinda used me for his own vanity purposes, strung me along, while creepily wanting me to cease things with my Cowboy object of fantasy. Flakey and I seemed to click on the mental/friendship vibe. Stupid me. I guess he wanted me to be in awe of him and the VERY impressive dic pix he exchanged. As soon as I gave into my attraction to Flakey, he flaked me off. Thankfully I didn't fuck it up with my actual, seeing is believing, hottie. Should've known better huh? A bird/hunk in the hand.. So no, R115, I was not successful in hooking-up with a DLer. And won't make that dumbass mistake again. Going to KC Chiefs watch party over his house tonight. I'm SOO not a bottom, but for him...

One of my girl friend's boyfriend loved dressing like a woman. I used to be part of an androgynous subculture and he once told me that since childhood he always felt attraction for women's clothing and makeup. He used to go into her mother's wardrobe when she was out. Whenever she dressed him up androgynous it gave him a smile and he loved to act all camp and flamboyant and use female pronouns. My girl friend never had a problem with it and enjoyed to see him change.

After like a year they broke up and he went back to his hip hop subculture. I always got the feeling that even though I knew they loved each other he was also engaged to her because being in our androgynous subcuture allowed him to release that repressed side of his.

Oh Kansas City, gurl, the situations you seem to always find yourself in. I read you on other posts, and don't always agree with you, you make it entertaining at least. I also notice that some do seem to target you and focus on you personally in very mean and negative ways. I wonder is that the reason you post as Kansas City? That whole McDee's episode was lol. The shill show. You made mention of a strapping guy. Is he the flakey? Or you fell for the food nazi? Kansas City you are a riot.

-BUMP-

No never.

Total deal breaker on a date, annoying AF on DL where mousy white guys always seem to feel the need to channel their inner Proud Sassy Black Woman.

Never felt the need to be part of the "tribe" or that I had much in common with the dominant segment of gay culture, so I know I'm likely in the minority.

Shamefully redirected. I fear personally using the term FRAU. Under stiff penalty...

Non!

Boys will be boys....

Same question as R18 someone please answer to that question. Why you call gay men by female pronouns?

Because I would say they have grown up with society telling them they are not "real men" to the point they have internalised that message. Since they have constanly been called things feminine (although pejoratively) they assume that is better for them and they create a new identity for them around female pronouns. They know they are men, but since they don't embody all the traits society arbitrarily dictates as descriptors for men they may feel alien to maleness.

The fact they they have been excluded from male bonding but embraced by women reinforces the idea of embracing female pronouns and all that stuff.

There is also the other gay who uses female pronouns because he most likely fetishises a woman's role, he grew up thinking women have it all and better with men so he desires to experience all that by assuming a woman's role.

Who bumps this old shit?

That all sounds pretty accurate R131

I've also seen them use it as a putdown--you see it on DL a lot, when they want to "claim" an actor as gay or a masculine out guy, they'll immediately resort to "she", as if to say "see, you're really not any better than we are. You're still a freak."

I do. I love it. It is liberating.

No ....

Yeah, that's because effeminacy has become the very trait by which gay men are described as a category. When a gay guy is not effeminate or flamboyant in the eyes of flamboyant gay men he defies the "norm", they feel the masculine gay man is rejecting a crucial aspect of being gay and consequently the flamboyant gay guy feels looked down on by the masculine gay for being effeminate or flamboyant. As a revenge, he accuses the masculine gay man of being a "queen inside" to aleviate the sensation of being looked down on or rejcetd.

Basically, it has to do with ego issues. Masculine gay men hurt the ego of some flamboyant gay men who have found strength and a sense of identity in being flamboyant and share they flamboyance with other flamboyant men. R133

Why is it ok to call someone a queen, but not a fairy or a fag?

I think, in many gay men who refer to themselves as women one way or another they are showing some degree of internalisation of their disconnect with maleness. But this is basically because heterosexual men in society have pushed them away from brotherhood so they many times develop aversion to certain things categorised as masculine. That's why you usually hear the very effeminate portion of gay men speaking about patriarchy and heteronirmativity. There is aversion for what has hurt them in the past.

I bet most of us at least one during our lifetime experienced rejection or mockery where our male nature was degraged by other men simply for liking the same sex or for not being stereotypically masculine enough, but many regain their sense of maleness (if we can call it that) while for others these experiences hurt them deeper and develop disdain for masculinity and brotherhood.

I can't do it, but I think it's kind of cute when others do it in the right circumstances.

Bump

r17, You make a very good point. I totally agree with you.

It just reinforces old stereotypes about gay men wanting to be women and being unmanly

Our forefather Jean Genet used ‘elle’ in dialogue for his gay male characters, to great literary effect, especially in his most lauded novel NOTRE-DAME-DES-FLEURS.

R80 - or it could just be that R78 knows how to write in the English language, which is kind of rare among many of the raging, semi-literate queens in this site.

R78 - I do think you need to work on word order. "It certainly is a counterproductive..."

That said, anyone who refers to their asshole as anything related to "pussy" or "vagina" is delusional and repulsive. We are men, we have an anus and, because we are gay, we have anal sex. That's all. I don't think it's fun to compare my asshole to a pussy.

Not all gay dudes have anal sex

No absolutely not. I immediately lose respect for anyone who talks like that.

From reading the responses in this thread it looks like I'm the odd one out.

R145 - some are missing out on serious fucking.

I don’t. Never quite understood it. To each his /her own though

Yes. It’s camp, and we know it’s camp.

R147, that’s their intent, dude

I only call them bitches because a) I am a top so that gives me care blanche in the world of gay men; and, b) because, let's face it, most of us are pretty bitchy a lot of the time.

R151, you type bottom, dude

R152 says "dude" and, probably uses "bro" and acuses others of typing bottom.

No, I only do this on Datalounge, mostly because it annoys some closet types so much.

R154 - good then you sound like my kind of person because I hate closet cases too (people in oppressive countries excluded). Too bad I can't demonstrate to you live that I am a top.

R140/2015 bump twat is at it again.

We used to call it "shetalk". A good friend of mine, Michael, was a master. I'm sure it all evolved from drag queen talk. The gist of it was that the speaker would refer to himself in the third person feminine throughout an entire anecdote. "She was walking uptown on Broadway, and could not believe her eyes. Four married men, each hotter than the last, and each wearing a band of death, gave her heavy duty cruises, just as she was about to enter the subway station. She was tempted to ditch her briefcase in a utility closet and chase one home, but she remembered that she promised to call her mother exactly at 7. She dropped some business cards like breadcrumbs in the vicinity, in the hopes that one of them would notice and give her a call tomorrow".

Referring to another gay man as she was usually derogatory. "I guess she doesn't realize that that toupee makes her look exactly like Moe from the three stooges".

Nope.

Bump

[quote]Gay men.... do you refer to your gay male friends using the feminine pronouns? I love her... she is my best friend... stuff like that.

No never OP.

R159 has bumped three almost identical threads pourquoi?

Je ne sais pas R161.

Mais c'est très ennuyeux...

Yes I do. Either Girl or Bitch.

i love it and use she for the fellow sisters always...there is even a mother superior in my friends circle

I used to visit a sex club in london where some of the bartenders have friendly chats. I always used she without worrying abt surrounding people and they d love it too. Miss those girls

When I first heard it when I was growing up it was always the stereotypical Boys in the Band types that did it. It seemed sad and bitter and self hating then. An unwelcome echo of the 50s. Nowadays it’s just a tired, desperate cliche.

R161 - to dump on gay men yet again. Must be a day that ends in Y.

My ex would call me an old Battle Ax! I was 29

Using feminine pronouns to refer to men - gay or otherwise - is obnoxious and needs to stop. Gay men are not women.

^^^^hates women more than she hates herself, poor girl

I'll be watching an episode of Law and Order SVU and Stabler will get violent with a perp and I'll say out loud to the computer screen- YOU GO GIRL!

No, I don't, it's really simple: we're men, not women.

No I don't, nor do I like it because it sounds ignorant to my ears, but I learned long ago you can't control what other people do and say, if you try you are just asking for more.

No, that's a ProMo thing--effeminate guys whose whole lives are centered around being gay (Professional Homosexuals) speak like that and are best avoided.

While DL ProMos claim it's affectionate, it has always seemed like a put-down to me and a manifestation of self-hatred, of gays who don't see themselves as men but rather some third gender.

Bitch please

Lighten up girls

[quote]we're men, not women.

Is that debatable? The trans stuff has really blurred that line even more. Gay men have fought for decades to not be thought of as women (same with lesbians—not being men) but that’s all going away—fast.

You named your daughter Mary? Mary's a boy's name !

I think gay men should stop doing it. I think it’s sad, annoying, and dangerous. Especially with this trans shit.

she thinks she's all that