Hillary Clinton and Datalounge: Where is the excitement, bitches?

[quote]President Obama needs to "step down" and let Clinton take over

What? When did this happen? Could you provide a link?

I am excited for Hillary to be the one appointing the next 2-3 Supreme Court Justices, and shaping Obamacare for the next generation!

I think that there's just so much baggage with the Clintons, and not Hillary, per se.

They have been in the political spotlight since 1992, and I think that people are just tired of them.

There is a real anti-dynasty sentiment in this country, especially on the heels of Bush 1989-1993, Clinton 1993-2001, Bush 2001-2009. I don't know if people want to see another Clinton 2017-whenever.

The US isn't supposed to be about political dynasties, but it's really starting to look that way. I think that's why Trump and Sanders are doing so well.

It has nothing to do with Hillary being a woman, and everything to do with Hillary being a CLINTON.

Truth be told.

r3, you summed up how I feel quite nicely.

Well, that and the fact that Hillary is too pro wall street. I prefer Bernie's politics, but I don't think he can pull it off.

Just how excited do you think gay men will get over a bossy lesbian with fat ankles?

Honey the election is a year and half away. Wake us when we get there.

I think the dynasty argument against Hillary is stupid. We can have two bushes, and a third in waiting, but not two Clintons? Even when both Bushes were disasters, as will a third, and the first Clinton presidency was the fastest peacetime economic expansion in history, we were kept safe from terrorism, and he left office with a surplus, without wars, and enormous respect around the world. But let's not do that again, because the alternative is so much better?

R8, two Clintons in one generation counts as a dynasty. Most people who oppose a Clinton dynasty also oppose a Bush dynasty.

Bernie Sanders? Excited? Not me!!

Miss ClinTON is too fat, too old and too last century.

In what alternate universe can Bernie Sanders win a general election? Get you heads out of your asses.

My mom is a registered Republican (east coast Rockefeller type), though many of her friends and some of our family members are Democrats. She reports that none of them like Hillary at all! These are not Feel the Bern wild millenial activists by any stretch. When I was visiting my mom, we ran across a neighbor who, when politics came up, said she'd back Hillary over any Republican in November, but had NO enthusiasm for her. That woman was Hillary's age from NYC - a demographic one would think would be Hillary's strongest?

Eh, the Sanders group is in it for the emotional rush. She has my vote. Hopefully, Bern will push her to be more populist and less third-way.

Fuck that cunt. Go Biden!

I never considered the Clintons a dynasty, and I think that charge against them is absurd. The Bushes are a dynasty, as are the Kennedys. With the Clintons, it was always Bill and Hillary, and then the Clintons are done. They haven't prepared the next generation for political office; Chelsea has expressed no interest in running, and she's the only one. Compare that to the Bushes, who are priming George P. to go after Jeb, or the Kennedys who always have one of Bobby's kids running somewhere (big families help; it's tough to pin dynastic hopes in just a daughter).

If the Clintons count as a dynasty, it's quite possibly the most feeble one in existence.

All races? You are SO kidding right now! So THAT'S why Black Lives Matter interrupted him! Because they support him OVER HRC. Apparently l missed the memo. Tell me exactly WHEN did that happen again?

r15, Biden lost me during the debates when he stood on stage laughing at his opponent. I thought he was incredibly immature and rude and I'm a democrat.

[quote]If the Clintons count as a dynasty, it's quite possibly the most feeble one in existence.

Ha, ha! I'll say!!

The time for them to oppose a Bush dynasty, R9, was back in 2000. I agree with R8.... which do we hate more from Bill's presidency: the peace or the prosperity?

[quote]which do we hate more from Bill's presidency: the peace or the prosperity?

The prosperity was borrowed and an illusion. Bill Clinton signed NAFTA and introduced the "service economy" where all the manufacturing jobs are sent overseas, while Americans are left to "grow" their economy by selling each other houses and doing each other's laundry.

Or ... say ... pardoning Marc Rich?

Does Hillary have a wife or girlfriend?

Tell that to Silicon Valley, Hollywood, Manhattan's real estate -- for that matter, real estate everywhere -- or the 23 million other additional jobholders that suffered so under the first Clinton presidency, r21. And I love how you try to blame Bill for the service economy, and not all of the "job creators" like Mittens who bought American companies, drove them into bankruptcy, sold the operating assets to China, and did the actual shipping of the jobs overseas, even sending the Americans who were losing their good, middle class jobs over there to train them how to use the equipment. Yeah, it's all Bill's fault.

R24, I never said the service economy was Bill's fault. But the transformation from manufacturing to service economy was part of the Clinton-era "prosperity" that you credit him for. We had prosperity under Reagan too. The economy rises and falls in cycles and Clinton, like Reagan, was in office at the right time to hog the credit for that.

The repeal of Glass-Steagel under Clinton led to the economic mess of 2008. Giving banks more power to create imaginary wealth is lovely in the short term, but disastrous by and by.

R23, the answer to your question is Huma Abedin, her 'Personal Assistant," who's married to Anthony Weiner. Bill fools around with women and "The Weiner" sends Sext messages to young girls, which gives Hill and Huma all the time they need to be together. A recent newspaper featured Tony as a wonderful "House Husband" with their baby boy.

People have Hillary fatigue.

Sanders or Biden. All politicians lie but Hillary Clinton takes it to a new level and is stupid enough to get caught.

I've been a subscriber to Bernie Sanders' newsletter for years, and I love him for his stance on so many things, but I simply cannot vote for a pro-Israel presidential candidate. I want U.S. presidents to be loyal to this country only.

I like Bernie but r8 has a point.

No more Bushes or Clintons!

The core for support for Bernie Sanders is young liberals like the ones who supported Barack Obama in 2008 and Howard Dean in 2004. They're loud early in the campaign, and would never go for Hillary because she's neither new nor exciting (Sanders has been around forever, but only recently as a national figure; Hillary has been the most famous woman in America since before most of Bernie's loudest supporters were born).

The only reason that Obama overcame that is that he united the young, liberal wing of the party with black voters. Dean couldn't accomplish that, and Sanders won't either. Excitement for a candidate is massively overrated; Obama didn't elicit a fraction of his 2008 excitement when he ran his reelection campaign, but still won by roughly the same comfortable margin.

One question for me is how would Bernie get anything done with the Repigs blocking him every step of the way? Same goes for Hills.

R27 = Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a WINNER!

Not really r34 but whatev.

And yet despite threads like these, she still leads in almost every major poll.

R17, Black Lives Matter harrassing Bernie Sanders says more about the latter than the former. Why aren't they disrupting one the speeches of one of the 25 Republicans? (Face it, Black Lives Matter, like OWS, has jumped the shark. For several reasons, but who the hell cares.)

Anyway, I have Clinton fatigue too. Clinton's presidency gets credit for the positives it had nothing to do with and doesn't get blamed for the negatives it did. Not to say he did nothing right or good, but Clintonites have nostalgia for the 90s like Dubya supporters did for the 80s and I'd rather keep moving forward.

The strange thing about this election is that there is a certain cult about the Clintons that's anti-liberal. (Where this cult was the last time she ran is anyone's guess. High school?) If you don't like Clinton, either one, or if you have some reservations, you're a rabid 'freeper' (what a dumb word), a misogynist, a self loathing elder queen, or worse. It's pathetic. And forget about, with good reason, comparing Bill Clinton to Bill Cosby. (Hillary's line about a vast right wing conspiracy still has legs--legs that have been amputated over and over, that're made of wood and sheer will, sure, but legs are legs.)

I don't see Sanders making it, but then again Trump is a front runner and even flop sweating Ted Cruz, with a makeover by Play Dough's Finishing School for Politicians and Hucksters, is still at it. The best of the GOP is probably Kasich and his numbers stink. So why not Sanders? Bc he's not pretty enough? Too white and too old? What?

Biden is a non entity. I'm not sure I see him even running. Does he even seem to want it? At this point I'm hoping Hillary does something actually brave, that she takes a specific stand on an issue, that'll make me feel at least ok voting for her. I don't want a Clinton but I definitely don't want a Bush, or worse.

R36, polls don't mean much at this point of the election, and in this crazy summer especially. Regardless, HuffPost had a piece the other day called "Almost Every Major Poll Shows Bernie Sanders Challenging or Defeating Clinton and Republicans. Here's Why." So pick your mike back up.

I'd love to see demographics for Hillary's supporters. Not the ones who think she's the lesser of two evils but the fanatics.

Nobody LIKES Hillary.

They never have. They like Bill.

Hillary is a cunt.

R33, I seem to remember she was on mostly cordial terms with most Republican senators. This is why in part I feel she would actually accomplish much as President. What is Sanders relationship with his colleagues? Those who feel the Bern aren't realistic.

No mike drop here, r37. I make no claims as to whether she'll win or can maintain any sort of lead, but the fact remains that she polls extremely high - and still tends to lead polls - among the general population, which puts the lie to all the "of course she'll never win" and "no one likes her" rhetoric from people who don't want to see her win.

[quote]Black Lives Matter harrassing Bernie Sanders

Black lives matter did not harass Sanders.

All the people you know are fucking morons. Sanders is an Israel-Firster who cares more about the terrorist Israel than America.

You are a fucking moronic idiot. They all suck. More wars. More fake terror and blaming Arabs. More gun control fake shootings.

Shoot yourself. You smell like a rancid cunt.

This dynasty bullshit is for the birds! The Bushes are all related by birth. That silly analogy would only work if Chelsea was running.

P.S. She's old enough to be President. Chelsea that is. But then again so are Jeb's children and the Bush twins.

The only bush I want in my life is on my gf's pussy!

R21/R25, no, you said "Clinton introduced the service economy" which is not even slightly true. If you want to talk about the transformation to a service economy, responsibility lies further back than Clinton. I can't pinpoint when it started, but what I can say is that the bulk of the responsibility lies with Reagan who moved the economy towards low paying service jobs and was the first President to actively break unions as he served the uber-wealthy (and no one else). Remember all those levered by-outs, hostile takeovers, and "greed is good" from the '80s? By the time Clinton was elected, our economy had shifted and there was no way to bring those well-paying manufacturing jobs back.

Further, as has been explained over and over, here and elsewhere, the repeal of Glass-Steagall was thanks to Phil Graham (R-TX), who famously called Americans "whiners" because we had the temerity to say something when he and his band of merry fraudsters pushed repeal on the country, and then blackmailed Clinton into signing the repeal into law (Clinton himself put forth a pretty strong defense of both the repeal and NAFTA, pointing out that he used those bills as leverage to renew SCHIP and passage of support for women, infants and children [WIC]). That's the thing: we scream about how the republicans won't compromise, and then hold Democrats to a higher standard -- blaming them, essentially -- when they do.

To all of the Clinton naysayers, I'll point out that we're at the point in the election when everybody has stars in their eyes and thinks that if they just scream loud enough, their candidate will get the nomination and the Presidency. The thing of it is that we were there in 2007 as Hillary fumbled her campaign and Obama was there to reap the rewards. If nothing else, Obama is a brilliant opportunist and politician who saw the opening and grabbed it. Is there anyone presently who has the star power Obama had, regardless of their political affiliation?

I hope that Hillary doesn't make the same mistakes she did previously, and the signs are looking good; Mark Penn is not involved in the campaign. On one hand I wish that she was being more forceful on the campaign trail, and not let the republicans get away with all of the mud they're slinging her way. On the other hand, just stepping back and letting the republicans self-immolate is not exactly a bad strategy.

The bottom line, however, is too important. The republicans control the House and Senate, and a majority of statehouses and governors' mansions. If we let the presidency slide out of our control, it's over for the Democrats for a generation, maybe two; the republicans will stack the Supreme Court with young conservatives (like John Roberts and Sam Alito), and our system of justice, such as it is, will take a hard turn to the right. We're at a pivotal moment: Ginsberg is 83 and a two-time survivor of cancer, Breyer is in his late 70s, as are Scalia and Thomas. The next president will have at least two Supreme Court picks, possibly as many as four. If we elect a republican, there is no way another decision like Obergefell will come from SCOTUS; just more horrible judicial activism like Citizens United and Hobby Lobby.

We must win, and our best hope is Hillary.

True enough, R40. Hillary leads the polls. But so does Donald Trump.

Still, it's summer. This is like having an appetizer while waiting for an entree and then going to an entirely different restaurant for the entree.

The Democratic nominee will be Minnie Pearl, and the Republicans will nominate Junior Samples.

She's not likeable.

She's just another oliogarch in a suit. The Clintons were awful (as a Team Presidency) the first time around. ZERO desire to have them back for more of their middle of the road corporate funded bull shit wrapped Neo/Faux Liberalism.

If our choices as liberals are her and Grandpa Vermont, we're fucked.

#WhereAreTheDemocraticLeadersUnder55 ?

As opposed to WHAT? Trust fund baby from Florida? Sociopath that has his name on buildings? Wisconsin Pinocchio? Your reality check is coming soon. Trust.

There is little excitement for her. She's got an advantage because Democrats, and probably a majority of Ind's, see her as clearly more qualified than the Clown Car Kids.

The excitement will come when Bill starts talking. The wooden hag cannot excite a slug

Please, the word "dynasty" is not being used literally here, but the idea that Hillary feels she is entitled because of her last name is still the same. She thought she was owed the presidency in 2008 and she got beat by an unknown entity like Obama because of her entitlement mentality and complete lack of charm. Of course, her entitlement has remained but now she is playing even dirtier to ensure she becomes president. I'm sorry but staying in a phony marriage with a philanderer does not entitle you to anything. You don't get a prize for being a long suffering wife.

Blah blah blah blah blah HILLARY blah blah blah blah BILL blah blah blah DYNASTY blah blah blah blah blah blah.

There isn't much excitement because we have our nominee (Sanders is a sideshow with some good ideas). There's nothing to work on, the kids can jump up and down and do as they wish. The primaries will be calm with Sanders throwing a few "surprises" in terms of how well he does in a couple of states and then Clinton will easily take the nomination.

She will beat whichever clown eventually emerges from the Republican Clown Car so there won't be much reason to get all worked up over the general either. We'll vote, she'll win, life will carry on as usual.

R53 WELL SAID!

The Freepers that infest any and all threads containing the word Hillary manufacture crises where there are none. Par for the course on their side. Literally non existent on ours.

Apparently they don't like the 543 candidates that are running on the right so they attack HRC at every turn. Name calling. False equivalency. You name it. They try it. Insufferable twats.

R53, how well he does in some states is not something to sneeze at. That is how the momentum starts- by picking up some states. I would not count him out especially considering how much the media loves to make things horseraces. It is not far-fetched, even this early in the game, to say that Bernie will have an easier time attracting both older and younger voters than Hillary.

R55 You DO know you need the minority vote to get the nomination on the Dem side right?

NO evidence of that so far.

The people at those rallies will a) stay at home b) vote Republican hence the spoiler vote OR c) end up voting for HRC anyway. The White vote is VERY fickle when it comes to Democrats.

Hillbot starts another ridiculous thread. How many will there be today, Hillbot?

What R57 said.

Support Lindsey Graham for Pres. No dynasty problem. A bachelor. Experienced. Knows foreign affairs. Military expert. Can work across party lines and get things done.

[quote]Support Lindsey Graham for Pres. No dynasty problem. A bachelor. Experienced. Knows foreign affairs. Military expert. Can work across party lines and get things done.

Also: right wing nutjob and closet case.

[quote]Almost everyone I know is excited about Bernie Sanders. All ages, and races.

Mmm hmm.

and?

Stop it R59! I'm laughing so hard my sides hurt. Experience? What, on a fainting couch? Foreign policy? All Miss Lindsay wants to,do is bomb and invade Iran, and the rest of the Middle East. He has no support, no judgement, and no chance. Thankfully.

[quote]All Miss Lindsay wants to,do is bomb and invade Iran, and the rest of the Middle East. He has no support, no judgement, and no chance. Thankfully.

But that is the Neocons' plan under their new lackey, Jeb!

A vote for Jeb! is a vote for War!

If Jeb! doesn't step up his game somehow by the next debate, he's going to finish in the bottom half of both IA and NH.

[quote] If Jeb! doesn't step up his game somehow by the next debate, he's going to finish in the bottom half of both IA and NH.

What's fascinating is that BOTH of the "establishment" candidates may lose in NH and Iowa.

Hillary is actually now trailing Bernie Sanders in New Hampshire. I'm shocked about this. People are buying into the BS hype, without even knowing what the fuck his message is all about. He's a nutjob!

And the other wacko, Tronald Dump, is spouting generic platitudes, and trouncing Jeb Bush in the polls.

I am completely befuddled by the American electorate at this point. And yes, I'm American.

R66, as someone mentioned above, people are tired of establishment politics, as we now have another Clinton and Bush in the race. People are supporting the people who most seem to be outside of the Machine.

[quote] People are supporting the people who most seem to be outside of the Machine.

Yes, but fundamentally it doesn't make sense, because neither of them has proven to be able to lead the country in a serious or rational way.

Hillary is espousing solid, logical, and reasonable plans for the future of our country, and she is being completely ignored.

And for all of his obvious faults, even Jeb Bush is trying to have a serious conversation, and nobody is hearing a word he is saying.

Like someone mentioned above, young people are supporting Bernie Sanders, just because. Millenials are all about the latest trends, and right now, Sanders is trendy and cool, because he's anti-establishment. That's the most ignorant thing I've ever heard. Have they actually LISTENED to what the guy is saying?

And don't even get me started on Donald Trump. He's a complete and total joke. And yet right now the media is licking his shitter, because he brings in ratings.

There are so many things wrong with this country right now, I don't even know where to begin.

[quote]I am completely befuddled by the American electorate at this point. And yes, I'm American.

People are tired of letting Wall Street and the Pentagon pick our Presidents.

Wealth inequality gets greater and greater and the vanishing middle class resents seeing the greedy rich pigs at the top of the ladder eat their dinner and everyone else's too.

Yeah but let's be honest r17, BLM ( although I'm not certain that those women were true members of BLM) primarily consists of young lesbian activists. They were always going to be voting for Hillary over Bernie. However, I think Bernie's supporters ruined his chances to reach a broader audience just as Tea party bigotry destroyed Republican minority outreach efforts in 2008 and 2012.

People are tired of letting Wall Street and the Pentagon pick our Presidents. Wealth inequality gets greater and greater and the vanishing middle class resents seeing the greedy rich pigs at the top of the ladder eat their dinner and everyone else's too.

R69, you lack even a rudimentary understanding of the American psyche and the American electorate. They aren't resentful of greedy, rich pigs. They want to BE greedy, rich pigs.

Sanders, Cruz, Fiorina and Trump are all joke candidates.

What sad state of affairs.

And don't get me wrong. Clinton, Bush, Rubio, O'Malley, Kasich and Walker aren't too far behind.

Exactly what IS a Jim Gilmore?

Please tell why Dr. Carson is even on the stage?

And let's not get started with those phonies Paul and Christie.

Hillary eats wrinkled pussy.

Here's the deal, gang. Hills will win the general election, though NOT in a landslide, but because her opponent (who won't be Trump) will be seen as worse. She's seen as buying into her own inevitability myth, while many Democratic primary voters see things otherwise. Trump, on the other hand, is open about how bad the system is; one fault he does NOT have is being passive-aggressive.

HILLARY CLINTON POTUS 2016

Hillary the Loser

I'm excited about that!

R76 you'll be dead soon dude LOL

This was pointless, as it turned out

R71 was correct

[quote] I am excited for Hillary to be the one appointing the next 2-3 Supreme Court Justices, and shaping Obamacare for the next generation!

Oh, dear...