The LA Gay & Lesbian Center changed its name to the LA LGBT Center

B and T do not belong with the GL. The T's are mental cases that need some serious therapy. The B's are narcissists that can't commit, it's all about them.

Start a petition to drop the "GLB" from it, OP. Make it the Trans Center. The sooner sane people are out of the screaming tranny shitshow the gay-rights movement has become the better. Straight people literally cannot tell us apart from the transgenders any more.

I'm not trans but jeez people, have some goddamn empathy for people who had slightly different life experiences, problems and identity issues from you. The transphobia on here goes way over the top. I imagine it's very hurtful to any trans people who do wander over here. But it's good for a few seconds of panto bitching, so it's good enough for DL right?

There are legitimate issues vis a vis the complicated relationship between gay and trans issues, but none of them are explored through the constant silly abuse you see on here.

R3 Well written, I agree!

Anyone that wants to mutilate their genitals has mental issues. It seems the trans are saying I'm a man but can't have sex with a man unless I try to pass myself off as a woman or a woman that wants to have sex with a woman but can't unless she tries to pass herself off as a woman. Really people?

But R3 you make the previous posters' points for them -

"People who have different life experiences, problems, and identity issues"

So that is why we should not be lumped together. I wish the trans community no ill, but they do us no favors either.

r3, are you listening to our concerns?

Transitioning is basically now gay reparative therapy.

How on earth can you condemn us for not promoting a homophobic agenda that involves mutilating human sex organs?

You really expect us to just sweep that under the rug, and go along with it?

In this day & age, there is NO REASON to "transition" to the opposite sex (as if that is EVEN possible).

Mutilating your own sex organs is an act of self-destruction. FUCKING, DUH!

Well, G and L don't exactly belong together either, do they? Since every letter's experiences are different.

Transsexual is not a sexual orientation. No trans women considers herself a gay man. To suggest so is actually backward homophobic and ignorant thinking. Anyone who wasn't a biologically born heterosexual male female, was thrown into one big freak group.

But now we know trans gender people, it is not an ordination.

r8 is wrong.

G & L do belong together. We are brothers & sisters.

The whole problem with neoliberals is their insistence on categorizing, labeling and separating people.

It's hard to unify when they make everything so complicated.

Liberation is simple. It does not involve expensive & risky surgery on your genetalia.

"Transitioning" is a waste of time, resources, money & energy because it's IMPOSSIBLE to change biological sex.

Transitioning is totally unnecessary. You can't solve a mental issue with physical modification.

'Well, G and L don't exactly belong together either, do they?'

Yes they DO belong together. We are natural allies.

Gay men and lesbian women are bonded by their desire to live openly and safely as people whose orientation is for same-sex sexual relationships . That desire translates into a proud shared history of fighting for equality and the provision of targeted support and information programmes for same-sex orientated people.

That's a simple, and very strong bond that gays and lesbians share.

Bis almost all end up living straight lives with opposite sex partners as we all know. They can fight their own battles, whatever they may be.

Trans MTF are mainly straight men with cross dressing fetish or full-blown autogyneohilia paraphilia. Or, they are ultra femmy gay boys and men who think life will be easier for them if they 'become a woman'. They can fight their own battles, with the help of their new friends at Vanity Fair and the E network and the Republican Party.

WW for R10.

R10 Do you not realize how ridiculous you're coming off? You're the one who wants to separate everyone.

Underneath all the transphobia, there are arguments to be made but you're not the one to make them. Stop playing armchair psychiatrist.

There is no such word as 'transphobia', R13. The trannies just made that up, to shut down any possible challenging of their agenda and the behaviors of some of their 'comrades'.

We recently had a thread that posted many, many examples of MTF who were convicted rapists, child abusers and even killers.

Yes, i am 'phobic' about such 'trans', and proudly so - I don't WANT to like such people, thanks.

R6:

You misquoted me, I said 'slightly' different. We do have a shared experience of experiencing life at skew whiff from gendered expectations. Our shared problem is gender oppression.

R7:

They are altering their body so that it conforms with their mental perception of themselves. What is so difficult to understand? Yes, there are cases where gay men who couldn't face being gay have identified as women - but anyone without malice can see these cases as being vanishingly few. There certainly are - especially now with the burgeoning spectrum of unconventional gender identities - problems and grey areas with the current trans scene. But overall your paranoia is totally misplaced. Sometimes nature is weird. Why do I have to fuck men in their asses to make love to them? It's not natural, but it works. Ditto for physical transitioning.

I have no problem with people who feel like they want to become another sex. I do not, however, think that they belong in the homosexual political advocacy groups. I maybe be wrong, but I have always been under the impression that people who reassign their gender retain their sexual orientation i.e. MTF transsexuals who were attracted to women before sex reassignment surgery continue to be attracted to women afterwards. This simply doesn't mean homosexual to me. I don't think that transsexuals should be discriminated against, but I think that our issues have been forced together because we were the only group willing to take them in when they were first coming into the public's consciousness. That having been said, I think that transgender advocacy has a greater place under the feminism/NOW umbrella than the homosexual umbrella.

Also whatever you think about the issue, using words like 'tranny' is abusive and bigoted. The behaviour of knuckle draggers.

Trannysh? Whatsha tranny, they shoundsh sho darligsh

[quote]using words like 'tranny' is abusive and bigoted. The behaviour of knuckle draggers.

I say "trans." Neither abusive nor bigoted, and it works as both singular and plural.

Drop the trans.

"We had to fire her for spitting in people's food," a former Falls Church IHOP manager recalled.

[quote]Also whatever you think about the issue, using words like 'tranny' is abusive and bigoted. The behaviour of knuckle draggers.

Long before the unhinged screeds took over the debate, the gay community used the word "tranny." If you argue it is "not our word to use" then you fundamentally make the point that the gay community is not aligned and not part of the transgender community.

While there may be an overall goal amongst ALL minority groups to achieve non-discrimination, each group has its own specific concerns. While we may form temporary coalitions, there is a reason why there is not a single monolithic group which encompasses women, afro-Americans, latinos, etc.

Transgendered-Americans (note I didn't use the aforementioned "Tranny" in support of the premise that it is no longer a gay person's word to use because we are no longer part of that group and have very different goals and agendas) need to stand on their own, rather than appropriate gay and lesbian resources, mindshare, and culture, while bashing us at the same time.

Gays and lesbians are not your enemny, but you're proving that you're also not our friends.

It's time to separate the T from the LGB.

It's scary, but it's time to spread your wings and fly on your own.

Do you think the split will happen? I really want it to. Trans has nothing to do with gay, is in fact the opposite and homophobic. The straight world is using "trans" to destroy young gays.

I would really like a G&L movement I support. It seems there is none now.

Anybody who walks around with a dick and balls between their legs and then identifies as a woman is one very disturbed individual. If they are ever found in a woman's restroom they should be arrested and registered as a life long sexual offender.

People who defend this are off the deep end and cannot be reasoned with. We really need to stop defending this. It seems to have become a national psychosis.

'That having been said, I think that transgender advocacy has a greater place under the feminism/NOW umbrella than the homosexual umbrella."

What? no way - they are MISOGYNISTIC even more than they are HOMOPHOBIC. It seems to me trans biggest allies are in the straight world - perhaps that is why the straight corporate media cheers them so much as well as the straight SJWs.

[quote]There are legitimate issues vis a vis the complicated relationship between gay and trans issues, but none of them are explored through the constant silly abuse you see on here.

We had some terrific threads on the issue which were in-depth and useful. They were almost all deleted. We still get some good comments but not like we did on the old site on those now-deleted threads.

And yet even in those solid discussions, someone like you would come along and say that some well-reasoned, well-sourced comment was just "abuse." It's tiresome.

[quote]Bis almost all end up living straight lives with opposite sex partners as we all know. They can fight their own battles, whatever they may be.

My experience is that with bi men, they tend to go straight, while bi women who remain bi out of college frequently go lesbian. But it's a mixed bag, I agree.

Still, bisexuality is a non-hetero sexuality and I can see why it's paired with GL. Trans is a gender issue, not a sexuality issue. Some trans fall under GLB but many do not, thus their issues aren't really comparable to ours.

[quote]have some goddamn empathy for people who had slightly different life experiences

Why should gays have to have empathy and be lumped with them? Why shouldn't heterosexuals have empathy for them since their ultimate goal is to be straight?

With your kind of reasoning why not have empathy for pedophiles since they have 'slightly different life experience'

This is misplaced empathy not real empathy.

Read the comments here - the comments seem to be: 1. Liberal parents thrilled with their "transgender child" project,"2. Religious people that think this is wrong, 3. And a handful of reasonable people questioning the trans ideology especially in regard to children (ex: what is wrong with just being a tomboy?)

Note one comment: "This is such nonsense. Sounds like something that the "gay" crowd has dreamed up, to try to bolster their ranks... confused genders. "

As long as "LGBT" letters are together - it will appear that L&G do endorse this. Endorse the destruction of children and gay young people. NO - the thinking L&G DO NOT ENDORSE THIS!

My partner and I contributed $35,000 to local GLBT organizations in 2013. We give little to anything else and have always felt like any extra dollars we have to give should go toward our own community.

Where I live, the trans folks have become unbearable, and even the local HIV/AIDS relief and education center has begun to state openly its move away from those traditional supportive functions in order to focus more on transgendered issues. In 2014, we gave $6,000 and this year we've not given one dime. They lost us. They're calling us repeatedly, offering awards or recognition or inviting us to things, but we're out.

Gay men and women still have struggles to overcome, we're still marginalized in society, still banned from places and suffer the most from a horrible disease and the stigma it brings. I'll let others step up for the trans and bisexual people (not that I feel bisexual people have must to fight against). But for me, my money and my work going forward will be solely for the betterment of gay men and lesbians.. Real, actual men and women. If anyone is to be blamed for that, it is the aggressive, obnoxious trans community who I never see volunteering or marching or giving or working, only complaining.

bump and drop T

While I am sympathetic with anyone who suffers from body dysmorphia, which is the true trans issue, I can also understand that the combination of hormone 'therapy' and a debilitating mental illness is a recipe for poor impulse control and violence.

Body dysmorphics should not take hormones until we know what causes this brain disease. It could actually be a hormonal imbalance that needs to be adjusted with highly supervised treatments.

And body dysmorphia could be related to epilepsy and seizure disorders, as Depakote has been successful in treating many patients.

The fact the Children's Hospitals around the country are 'treating' this as anything other than body dysmorphia is shameful and embarrassing.

[quote]The fact the Children's Hospitals around the country are 'treating' this as anything other than body dysmorphia is shameful and embarrassing.

And really, really profitable.

[quote]Anybody who walks around with a dick and balls between their legs and then identifies as a woman is one very disturbed individual. If they are ever found in a woman's restroom they should be arrested and registered as a life long sexual offender.

You'd better be very careful. This is a hair's breadth away from the kinds of arguments that anti-gay bigots use. Gays should not be in the military because they have to share showers and might rape someone...or make someone uncomfortable.

Face it, being a man and sucking cock is not what nature intended, either. Or it is, and we were born this way, as were people who feel like they are stuck in the wrong bodies. Luckily for everyone, we don't have to be slaves to a biological imperative.

[quote]The transphobia on here goes way over the top. I imagine it's very hurtful to any trans people who do wander over here. But it's good for a few seconds of panto bitching, so it's good enough for DL right?

I don't have a problem with trans but DL is a gay site. It's "Gay celebrity gossip, politics and pointless bitchery." There is no trans in the tagline.

[quote]Our shared problem is gender oppression

No, it's not.

G & L's shared problem is homophobia.

Homophobia is the fear of homosexuality, not homogenderality.

I have no gender issue. I never have. Even when I was a little girl whom people assumed was male because I had short hair and wore jeans.

Even as a "gender nonconforming" tomboy, I never gave a FLYING FUCK how others perceived me.

Honestly, I did not OBSESS over this BULLSHIT.

Probably because I was reared by a feminist who taught me to true to myself.

There are three separate but related issues which need to be considered individually:

1. Whether the advocacy on behalf of gay, lesbia, and bisexual people is sufficienctly aligned with the needs and positions of transgendered people to continue to stay linked.

2. Trans-phobia

3. Transgenderism itself

The problem here is that people have based their desire to separate advocacy with both trans-phobia and the debate around transgenderism itself.

We can want to separate advocacy without resorting to namecalling and trans-phobia and trans-bashing.

The debate around transgenderism should not be trans-phobic, but usually is.

Should we separate advocacy - yes.

Should trans-phobia be condoned - NO.

Should transgenderism be debated - maybe, but only be people with a legitimate stake. Fear and loathing are not legitimate concerns. Red herring debates about locker rooms and bathrooms have no more weight than the debate about gay leaders in Boyscouts.

The debate around surgery and hormone therapy is a debate amongst medical ethicists and people who are considering it - the rest of us throwing our two cents into the discussion is as relevant as straight people weighing in on why gay people have same sex attraction and advocating "cures" for the mental defect.

Separate advocacy.

Continue to support equal rights and non-descrimination for everyone.

Leave the debate about whether you can have surgery and become a real (wo)men and what a real (wo)man is to people who have a horse in the race. Don't tell other people how to live their lives or police their bodies.

Really, OP? The current 4-letter acronym started about 20 years ago. You needed to start a thread about this? Because you're so outraged by a "T" that most of us grew accustomed to years ago?

I waffle back and forth on various trans issues, and find many of the broad-based criticisms (humorless, shrill, preachy, entitled, demanding) to be valid, but the blatant trans-hate here is tiresome. A lot of older trans people identified as gay or queer and marched (and got bashed) right along side of us. It's one thing to mock SJW who were born decades after Stonewall or special snowflakes who get up on their soapbox every time a pronoun is uttered, but to opposes any recognition of or solidarity with trans people is phobic and bigoted to the core.

You are playing right into our enemies goals here, the same as when lesbians are pitted against gay men or gays against any ethnic minority. We have the same enemies and our numbers are too small for any one community to stand alone. Stop the infighting and focus on our common ground and common enemies.

[quote]They are altering their body so that it conforms with their mental perception of themselves. What is so difficult to understand?

It's difficult to understand how anyone can think that altering their body resolves a "mental perception."

Operating on the body does not fix perception.

[quote]Yes, there are cases where gay men who couldn't face being gay have identified as women - but anyone without malice can see these cases as being vanishingly few.

Link, please? I'd like to see your data that reveals that homophobic homos are not getting sex changes. Considering that Laverne Cox was nearly topless on stage the other night simulating oral sex with a male go-go dancer, your conclusion is dubious.

[quote]There certainly are - especially now with the burgeoning spectrum of unconventional gender identities - problems and grey areas with the current trans scene.

"Unconventional gender identities"... is for people who don't have the guts to call themselves gay, lesbian or autogynphile. It's for homophobes.

We are the GAY COMMUNITY. If you aren't gay, then you're not part of our community. A straight man who wears make-up while fucking women with his penis is NOT GAY.

Laverne Cox IS GAY....but she's so deluded she things that her garish make-up on her manly face and her fake boobs on her pecs make her a woman. That's idiotic. And there's nothing more shameful than a homophobic homo who appropriates womanhood.

[quote]But overall your paranoia is totally misplaced.

Like fuck it is.

Had these psychos gotten a hold of me as a child, they would have insisted that I block my hormone growth and transition to male because I was a gender non-conforming lesbian. I don 't want to be a man! I'm happy and proud to b a lesbian. And I love my gay brothers.

[quote]Sometimes nature is weird. Why do I have to fuck men in their asses to make love to them? [bold]It's not natural[/bold], but it works. Ditto for physical transitioning.

Fuck off homophobe.

It is natural to gay men.

It's not natural to you because you're homophobic.

You're a hypocrite for judging gay men.

R37, those who would use scalpels and hormones to turn sissy boys into girls and butch girls into boys are most emphatically my enemies. There is no place in "gay" for "trans." No place at all.

You must be one of those doctors.

r17, Janet Mock calls women "fish." If you don't think that's worse than tranny, then you are insane.

Also, have you condemned the trans community for threatening to kill rad fems with grease fires & germ warfare?

Thank you, r29.

Hear hear r36 - a rare voice of reason and rationality.

[quote]You'd better be very careful. This is a hair's breadth away from the kinds of arguments that anti-gay bigots use.

No, r33...[bold]you'd[/bold] better be careful to not use Gay Liberation to support a homophobic agenda.

[quote]Face it, being a man and sucking cock is not what nature intended, either.

You, sir, are a homophobic ASSHOLE.

1. It's totally natural...even straight men have done it in prisons.

2. Keep your mind out of the gutter. We've fought straights identifying us strictly by our sex acts for decades. What we or anyone else does consensually in the bedroom is nobody's business.

Prior to the transgender media blitz, lesbians were the ones who got the shitty treatment from the community. The ones who were accused of not fighting as hard as their fellow gay men, and riding on their coattails. But now that there's a new "enemy" to spar with, lesbians are suddenly on equal footing with their gay brothers.

The sudden "We are one" mentality takes the cake when it comes to here, however. Where has all this love and support been for so many years?

[quote]Should trans-phobia be condoned - NO.

r36, you don't get to decide for me.

Yes, I am transphobic. I am afraid of men who think they are women trying to get into the women's bathroom to do pervy things. Please look at the linked thread for a list of MTFs who have victimized women & children.

[quote]Should transgenderism be debated - maybe, but only be people with a legitimate stake.

Transwomen are appropriating womanhood.

Women have as much right to debate their appropriation as blacks do theirs.

Why are trannies such control freaks?

[quote]Leave the debate about whether you can have surgery and become a real (wo)men and what a real (wo)man is to people who have a horse in the race. Don't tell other people how to live their lives or police their bodies.

You don't even see your own hypocrisy!

You tell people what to do and then tell people not to tell people what to do.

WOW.

Punch and Delete the T.

R44 I hear you. I wonder how the past 20+ years of G&L advocacy--as well as GLBT advocacy--would have developed had gay men received as much backlash from FtMs as lesbians did from aggressive MtFs?

This was postulated about a year ago on the "Whoiscis" blog.

There is no such thing as a "Gay-TERF," so to speak. Though many could rightly just say: look at the DL population :)

[quote] Why are we pandering to these trannies who contribute absolutely NOTHING (not $$, not outreach)

How do you know what they do or do not contribute? I'm pretty sure that Chaz Bono donates generously to the center, he even worked for them at the executive level several years back.

Using correct alphabetical form, it should be "The BGLT Center."

R38

Nice try, but I am a gay man and you are not. Not judging gay men. I love gay men and I love having sex with them.

You on the other hand are clearly in the uptight grim feminist lesbian tradition, so wedded to doctrine and grim policing of Marxisant political lesbianism you don't realise the 1970s are over, Andrea Dworkin is no longer with us and trans people are, like, a thing now. Are you so fearful of men that you think a MTF is somehow a straight man playing a long con to rape unsuspecting women? You obviously have no idea about what it is to grow up socialised as a man. No straight man would do that. But of course, for you and Germaine Greer and the rest of the feminist crazies trans people can be abused in the vilest language, without restraint, without compunction or compassion.

r49, they successfully boycotted MichFest...that's a huge negative impact on the lesbian community. Very hateful stunt they pulled there...going after lesbians, their privacy & livelihoods, instead of the powers that be.

Think about it. We all suffer from living in a patriarchy, and the first people they protest against are lesbians.

I want this to sink in: it was straight men protesting against lesbians for not including them.

Trannie remind me of the "frog & scorpion" story. G&Ls are the from; Ts are the scorpion:

[quote]So the frog agreed to take the scorpion across the river. He swam over to the bank and settled himself near the mud to pick up his passenger. The scorpion crawled onto the frog's back, his sharp claws prickling into the frog's soft hide, and the frog slid into the river. The muddy water swirled around them, but the frog stayed near the surface so the scorpion would not drown. He kicked strongly through the first half of the stream, his flippers paddling wildly against the current.

[quote]Halfway across the river, the frog suddenly felt a sharp sting in his back and, out of the corner of his eye, saw the scorpion remove his stinger from the frog's back. A deadening numbness began to creep into his limbs.

[quote]"You fool!" croaked the frog, "Now we shall both die! Why on earth did you do that?"

[quote]The scorpion shrugged, and did a little jig on the drownings frog's back.

[quote]"I could not help myself. It is my nature."

[quote]Then they both sank into the muddy waters of the swiftly flowing river.

[quote]Self destruction - "Its my Nature", said the Scorpion...

[quote]The debate around surgery and hormone therapy is a debate amongst medical ethicists and people who are considering it - the rest of us throwing our two cents into the discussion is as relevant as straight people weighing in on why gay people have same sex attraction and advocating "cures" for the mental defect.

There is no debate happening - that's the problem. Medical ethicists? Where are these fictional creatures when it comes to trans? What there is are doctors and surgeons pushing and profiting from trans - for young and old. Especially the young. It is very much and issue that gay people should talk about because a lot of these young people and children are gay. This is an unprecedented attack on young people, especially young gay people. It is a violent conversion therapy. This should not only be discussed, it should be loudly protested against.

[quote]Nice try, but I am a gay man and you are not.

Nice try, but you are a homophobe and I am not.

Nothing more pathetic than a homophobic gay man. If you think gay sex is unnatural, then you also have a lot of shame.

I'm noticing more and more that people are saying LGBT instead of any other phrase. I guess that phrase just "sounds right" or feels right saying compared to GLBT or any combination.

However, in LA for pride last year they put the T first, which pissed me off royally.

r51 is drenched in misogyny. Typical of someone who is homophobic...

[quote] Are you so fearful of men that you think a MTF is somehow a straight man playing a long con to rape unsuspecting women? You obviously have no idea about what it is to grow up socialised as a man. No straight man would do that.

Please look at the link in r45. More than thirty MTFs who have victimized women & children are listed in it.

You're asking for women, whom you HATE, to suspend centuries of accumulated survival instinct, so mentally ill men who "think" they are women can use OUR restrooms?

Sorry, woman-hater, but only women get to decide who uses our restroom. And no penises allowed.

Bathrooms are segregated per reproductive organs...it has nothing to do with "gender feels."

Not a single "pro trans" argument withstands scrutiny.

[quote] Sorry, woman-hater, but only women get to decide who uses our restroom. And no penises allowed.

And would you be okay if a burly, bearded FTM was forced to use your restroom?

R55 isn't joking - look: TLGB Pride and the "TLGB Celebration"

A FTM can be as burly as she likes, R57, but biological women who bump into her in the restroom are unlikely to be fooled into thinking she is a he, so they would be unlikely to experience any alarm at her presence.

[quote] A FTM can be as burly as she likes, [R57], but biological women who bump into her in the restroom are unlikely to be fooled into thinking she is a he, so they would be unlikely to experience any alarm at her presence.

You are aware that FTMs pass far more easily as male than MTFs, right? Exactly how do you think a bio women who see a fully bearded person walk into their restroom would react? Are you really that obtuse?

Yes, r57.

I have no problem with a transman in the woman's room.

Because transmen are adult females with XX chromosomes, and that is precisely for whom the women's restroom is.

Transmen do not rape and kill women and children like transwomen have done.

Have you ever wondered why so many transwomen are in jail? Far more than the number of transmen in jail. Obviously, transwomen commit more crimes than transmen. Because men commit more crimes than women, and transwomen are men.

Women and girls do not want men in the bathroom. They have been attacked. There is a current violent group of straight men currently involved in this aggressive trans ideology. The ones that want to "rape" and "kill" any woman that questions their ideology. They say they want to "rape" and "kill" women that do not allow men costumed as "women" to act as rape counselors. They certainly do not belong in women's bathrooms.

Is Michelle Duggar posting here now at R61?

Must be Michelle..or her lesbian sister

Is that all you got r63?

Women - gay, straight, old, young, republican, democrat, liberal, conservative, black, white, latina -- will never let biological males in their restrooms.

And why is this the top priority for trannies, anyway? As if men haven't been trying forever to get into ladies restrooms.

[quote] And why is this the top priority for trannies, anyway?

Maybe because if they are presenting as female, no matter what anatomy they still have (surgery isn't cheap, you know), if they go to the men's room they risk getting assaulted or having the crap beaten out of them?

Yes, R65 - that is all they got. R63 and 64, same person pushing the trans line on this thread. They have NO argument whatsoever - so all they can do is namecall (transphobic, terf, etc) or attack

There probably were trans who were ok and would not pose a problem in the bathroom, but this current vicious trans bunch is certainly going to cause problems for them as well.

[quote] if they go to the men's room they risk getting assaulted or having the crap beaten out of them?

Are you so fearful of men that you think one is going to assault another man in the restroom just because he's dressed like a woman? You obviously have no idea about what it is to grow up socialised as a straight man. No straight man would do that.

See, you can't have it both ways. You can't tell women they're stupid for fearing men and then claim that "transwomen" (aka men) have every right to fear men.

Good point R69

The fact remains that Trans are a DRAIN on resources, when they, themselves do not contribute any $$ or actual time spent volunteering. This, at least, is true in the former LA "Gay & Lesbian" center - i would know. I know people who work there!

But boy are they the first to start complaining!

I know quite a few gay men who are NOT happy with the trans-dominating direction that organizations like the LA Gay & Lesbian Center have taken.

Needless to say, they will be losing quite a few donors and quite a bit of $$ funding this year.

The best way to fight against this is to let leadership know that you are not happy with this direction they are taking and you will not be contributing to any trans issues.

Outfest learned this lesson very quickly. $$ is where it hurts.

No, R69. You are just a fucking deluded transphobic, man-hating idiot cunt.

Ha. r73 lost his shit. He got outplayed by a dyke.

Game over, loser.

R3 Gay issues are identity are not just "slightly" different from those of straight male autogynephiles.

Like if trannies had been out there donating to HIV/AIDS funding, or had been fighting to end DADT, or volunteering or contributing in any way, shape or form to gay men or lesbian issues, I would not complain.

But typical trannie:

"Gay cis-white men are so privileged! They need to recognize us first and our issues first because we're even more under-privileged! Gay men have it easy!"

"Lesbians discriminate against us by not including us in their women-only events!"

Whine, whine, whine.

Trannies at least need to put in legwork or contribute $$ if they are going to continue to dictate what gay men and lesbians do. As it stands, they contribute NOTHING!

You don't know what "trannies" have contributed, R76. It's not juts about MTFs, it's also about FTMs.

Neither MTF or FTM contribute anything except complaints! I've active and have volunteered and donated at enough gay places to know that I've never seen a dime from them and have rarely (if ever) seen their face at any volunteer event. I'm not the only person who knows this -- ask around.

Trannies want all of you gay men to keep donating $$ so that they can use up all of your resources and then keep complaining about how horrible and privileged you are!

Without gay $$, the trans community would collapse in an instant.

R77 The number of FTMs is much smaller than that of MTFs; I doubt they are of more use to the gay community. The picture R76 painted of trans activism is very accurate - trans activists waste more of their time engaging in Oppression Olympics, making little of the challenges gay men face, and bullying lesbians into assimilate them, than they do promoting gay, or even trans, issues against resistance from straight society.

R78, It's hard to tell some of the dykes from the FTM trans, but otherwise you have a point. The only way to stop the madness is to stop donating money to any organization that includes trans and stop volunteering for organizations that include trans.

They are not our people. They do not share our struggles. They are violently mentally ill ego maniacs who want to eternally play the victim card and sap up money, resources and attention for themselves at the expense of gays, lesbians and bisexuals.

Here is the activism most important to trans people:

1. Getting transwoman into women's bathrooms.

2. Getting potentially gay children to transition.

Their priorities are both misogynistic and homophobic. No surprise that r73 was so quick to call a lesbian a man hating cunt. His use of hate speech is so frequent he doesn't realize how much he slurs those different from he.

R66 clearly didn't read our recent thread which posted many examples of violence from MTF , including a huge trans in a wig who punched out 5 of a woman's teeth when she challenged his presence in the female bathroom.

He was convicted, and in court offered that 'he was sorry she got punched, but she had committed a hate crime against him by challenging him', this fucker was about 6'5'.

Many, many MTF are built like trucks, R66 and are quite capable of defending themselves if some meanies in the men's room tease them about their purse and pumps.

R66, spare your tears , trans like Patrick Hagan at the link don't need protection from other men

Funny how there are no trannies here to pipe in.. Probably because even they know they're taking us gays for a ride and they're enjoying the hell out of it.

r38, you've been conned into thinking that we're a "community."

My liking ManSex has no relation to other aspects of my life. I have nothing in common with screaming queens, butch dykes, or people who think they're were born the wrong sex.

R86, you might not be part of the community but that doesn't mean everybody is like you.

WHO CARES?

THE COW IS GONE!

GET IT BACK!

lol, R74!

R69

I am not R66, so I don't know why you're using my words against him.

But clearly you're full of hatred and fear, not only for trans people but also for all men. If the lavatory argument were taken to it's natural conclusion, gay men would be forced to use a different bathroom because they could supposedly 'attack' their fellow men at any time. By misgendering lesbian trans women as straight men, and descending full on bigot style into a 'list of crimes', you show yourself to be the equivalent of the white power/homophobic neo Nazis whose style you so obviously admire

But it's typical of a certain kind of highly politicised intolerance in the lesbian community isn't it? You need to get over your sqeamishness about trans. It's provincial.

r50 BGLT. I like it and I'm gonna have a Bacon, Guacamole, Lettuce and Tomato sandwich for lunch tomorrow. Thanks for the idea.

Trannies are the worst houseguests ever!

They just sit around, don't do any of the work, expect you to pay for everything (while contributing nothing to the household itself) and then complain about how [bold][italic] you're [/bold][/italic] not doing enough for [bold][italic] them [/bold][/italic] or their issues!

Fuck off, useless trannies!

I'm a masculine gay man who has no real interest in associating with transsexuals. I'm not afraid or disgusted by them, we just don't have a lot in common.

But it's their bodies, and they have complete autonomy over their own bodies. If they want to turn their penis inside out, that's their business.

I wish I'd been asked before I had the skin on the tip of my penis cut off. Thanks, mom.

They can do what they want with their penis or vajayjay, just stop trying to latch onto gay people and gay rights!

If you consider what Victim Cultures did to the workplace (and the associated Labor Participation rate because of this) you have a pretty good idea where the Gay Movement will be in five years, after the Ts get through with it.

So according to @r1, sexuality is a choice. 'Can't commit' implies a conscious choice is being made, rather than innate sexuality. I guess you chose to be gay?

[quote] Funny how there are no trannies here to pipe in.. Probably because even they know they're taking us gays for a ride and they're enjoying the hell out of it.

Who says we're not here? Or that we haven't been posting?

R97 Um, no it doesn't. "Can't" implies an *inherent* lack of ability, not a choice. I don't know about bisexual women, but some bi men will tell you they go through cyles - one where they're exclusively attracted to women, and another to men. I have no idea how they're able to commit if they work like that. My guess is that they aren't, but it's clear this has nothing to do with choice - they don't choose their cycles just like gay men don't choose lacking them.

R99,

I'm a bisexual man and can answer this.

As a bisexual man I don't care about someone's gender. I am attracted to a person. And what attracts me is a combination of physical looks and that mysterious something that is hard to describe but just something about that person. Call it that "it" factor.

I do not go through cycles of being attracted to women for a while and then to men. I think people who do that may be confused. I am capable of being sexually aroused by either gender and I enjoy sex with either gender.

"And what attracts me is a combination of physical looks and that mysterious something that is hard to describe but just something about that person. Call it that "it" factor."

You're like the vast majority of people of whatever sexual orientation, then. So you're not really explaining anything.

Is that the center that uber sexy Jim Key is head over.

This cycle thing about bisexuals is the stupidest thing ever.

I'm attracted to both sexes, at the same time. Not in cycles. Weird.

R101, Key thing to note is that there are no "cycles" as someone wrote.

We must purge the past of all wrongthink.