The JT LeRoy hoax

This is what you most associate with her, not, you know, being in Garbage?

She probably knew the truth about JT, like the other celebrity supporters, and was just playing along. I don't know if that makes it worse to you or not.

[quote] she fell hook, line and sinker for the JT Leroy hoax.

A lot of people did. I was interested in this story when it was happening. As a literary type, I even read some of Leroy's work before Albert got exposed. Hard to say why, but even early on I thought there seemed something kind of bogus about "Leroy" and his work. A lot of his backstory was SO extreme, it was really hard to swallow.

It wasn't a typical 'scam' btw in that Leroy/Albert wasn't really after other people's money. Just wanted to get famous/close to famous people and that lifestyle, I think.

Why would you create a male alter ego and have another woman appear as that alter ego in public? Sounds like Albert wanted a killer ending to her "saga".

He was supposed to be androgynous, possibly trans, hence the woman being the face of the character.

They're are plenty androgynous gay boys who could have stood in. She wanted to be "caught".

I mean "their r" obviously.

Didn't Gus Van Sant spend hours talking on the phone to JT LeRoy?

And didn't Asia Argent have sex with JT?

R5 She wanted the attention for herself. She wasn't going to let someone else have the spotlight. It was a brazen move, but she was an attention whore, so what else could be expected?

[quote] She wanted the attention for herself. She wasn't going to let someone else have the spotlight. It was a brazen move, but she was an attention whore, so what else could be expected?

But the OP's text stated that she had someone else stand in for her (another woman). Do you think everyone would want to interview a twink if he had been the stand in, rather than the other woman?

Gus Van Sant had JT Leroy write most of the script for Elephant, his Columbine massacre film.

Winona Ryder fell for the hoax, too.

JT Leroy with his female fans: Tatum O'Neal, Vanessa Carlton, Gaby Hoffmann, Rosario Dawson, Shirley Manson, Debbie Harry and Winona Ryder

Courtney Love looking a steaming mess, and JT

Whenever I saw a pic of Leroy, I couldn't imagine how people had been so taken as it looked so much like a woman in disguise.

I believe Winona Ryder concocted an entire bullshit story of meeting Leroy and being touched by his love of music outside an opera house and buying him a ticket.

But she's a thief anyhow.

That wig was horrible.

They weren't "playing along" - they were gullible. People believe what they want to believe

A lot of otherwise intelligent people got taken in by that scammer from "The Night Listener" too

The wig, omg. Wtf. Did these celebs really REALLY get fooled?

I imagine the wig was claimed to be a disguise, "I'm only wearing it for the scum press photographers, etc."

New doc on the subject.

But... it's CLEARLY a disguise. It looked nothing like a man. Celebrities are some of the most bandwagon jumping desperate people in the world.

Based on those two pics, JT could easily pass for a Drag Race contestant. In person, though - I don't know how it wasn't obvious.

Not sure R7 ....

But Armistead Maupin fell for THIS one (and wrote the book 'The Night Listener' about it). The movie version starred Toni Colette as the catfisher ad Robin Williams as 'Armistead'.

That documentary looks good, R20, thanks.

OP is so stealth .... start a thread and then announce the new documentary about the subject.

Well played, well played.

R25, your paranoia must be very wearying for those around you. I am the OP and I did not post that Variety link, it's simply a nice coincidence.

I love my gays!

[quote]I don't know how it wasn't obvious.

In his work, which was supposedly 'autobiographical,' Leroy indicated that he was gender-ambiguous, even at a young age. "He" also told people that he was now transitioning to female, including hormones and surgery. Part of the ruse was that Leroy was painfully shy in public, so though Laura Albert would talk to celebs and others for hours on the phone as Leroy, the woman who played him in public seldom spoke a word.

But, yes, even considering all of that, it's surprising Albert was able to keep up the hoax as long as she did.

Did anyone actually read his book?

I remember people praising it when it first came out, way before the jig was up...

Stop typing "his."

It's Laura the Fraud cunt.

And no, it's quite obvious that this entire thread is stealth PR, because Laura the FraudCunt is on the same par as Josh Kilmer -Media Whore- Purcell.

To the producers: I would never bother watching a doc about this subject unless the interviews told all. Meaning: was Winona Ryder lying about seeing JT outside some theatre and befriending "him"? If she lied, why? Because WR was in on it with the JT crew (which I would love, which would make it a media stunt of the highest order) or was she just blithely going with a trend for media attention and cred? Which celebrities were in on it or figured it out - and when? Which celebrities believed it because they are seriously stupid? What free shit did you get?

Nobody cares about the instigators' bulimia or victimhood or whatever. We want the scam laid bare, no holds barred. We want all the questions answered. Just cut the shit.

I never read any of LeRoy's books, but I do get the impression that their perceived quality heavily depended on the sympathy people felt for the LeRoy persona. I think authenticity is extremely overrated though. Art is about imagination, I wish there were more artists who are able to suck fantastic lies and illusions out of their thumb. I'm tired of confessional/autobiographical art.

Every celebrity who fell for it, or was complicit, should be hit in the face onscreen with a paint gun in a montage.

Gullible fools, the lot of them: Maupin, Dennis Cooper, Kevin Killian, Ryder and a host of other dupes who I will never respect.

[quote] Every celebrity who fell for it, or was complicit, should be hit in the face onscreen with a paint gun in a montage.

Is it that big of a deal?

No, it's that stupid. the gullible publishing industry, and all Albert's duped fans, are foolish, and should be made to look as such.

Have you ever seen the bitch? She's got crabapple face; total Fetal Alcohol Syndrome.

Here's the titty whore!

Steaming being the operative word. I would suck on her tits right now.

@R13 Steaming being the operative word. I would suck on her tits right now.

[You do realize that this is a troll, right? You might want to stop talking to it.]

I know some of the players involved in the hoax and they're nuts. Laura is a huge publicity whore.

Maupin admitted he'd been taken unlike the silence from so many celebs once the truth was out in the open.

r37, honey, Courtney will happily oblige you if you catch her at the right upswing in her bipolar cycling.

[quote]I know some of the players involved in the hoax and they're nuts.

Details?

Gus Van Sant and Dennis Cooper were both taken in by her. Van Sant spent long hours with her on the telephone, probably talking about Keanu.

Dennis Copper was furious when he found out the truth...he probably was sincerely pissed that he wasn't going to ever be able to fuck the skinny little J.T.

I agree, I'd like to hear some details.

Gus Van Sant even had Leroy do commentary on The Criterion Collection, My Own Private Idaho. Would he have done that if he knew she was a woman? I doubt it.

IIRC Cooper's anger had also something to do with "Leroy" appropriating a photo of Cooper's dead high-school crush/obsession and presenting it as one of "him"self.

Seems to me like Cooper is possibly a danger to any boys in his neighborhood, am I wrong? Am I being ridiculous?

We've got how many stars who are foolish enough to believe in Scientology?

Are we surprised when they believe a goofy looking woman is a boy?

If Leroy presented the photo as himself, why would Cooper believe her?

When I still thought Leroy was who she claimed to be, I bought the first book. I couldn't get through it.

[quote]Gus Van Sant even had Leroy...

Actualy van sant had leroy write his movie Elephant.

Gus Van Sant did not know the truth. No way would he give so much attention to a straight woman.

I believe if you look at the credits for Elephant, you won't find Leroy as the writer...perhaps I should check it myself?

I was very involved in the JT scene. I knew all the principals, hung out with them every time they were in New York (even unto picking them up from the airport for their second trip, and spent a lot of time amidst the celebs they gathered about them. I posted a little about this in the Michael Pitt thread.

R1-- The fallout was, bitch got sued. I was at the trial. She sold the rights to "sarah" to the director who made "Secretary" (thus foisting Maggie Gyllenhall upon us all) and the film version of "Hedwig." When he learned of the hoax he decided to make a film about that instead but Laura Albert, the "real" JT thought she could do better on her own and tried to renege. It was a fraud case in essence and she argued on the stand that she was mentally fragmented and JT and she were the same. She lost the case and a judgement of 300K

cont'd

R11-- The only celebs who knew the truth about JT were Michael Pitt (who had an affair with Savannah, who played JT in public), Winona Ryder, and Billy Corgan. Of the three, the only one I didn't meet was Billy Corgan. Even Asia Argento didn't know, and she too slept with Savannah/JT. I never spoke to Savannah out of character ( I was a total believer until the very end) but Laura attested to it when we met during a break during her trial. I think Asia has said as much publically as well in an article I've read.

"Even Asia Argento didn't know, and she too slept with Savannah/JT."

Huh?

How?

Do you mean had sex with? Or shared a bed in pajamas.

This is too much.

cont'd

R13-- Van Sant never knew. It was Laura who made all those calls and spoke as JT on the phone to celebrities. In the beginning JT was a phantom who was never seen. Laura would seduce writers over the phone and get them interested in her work. Sharon Olds is the one who said it was like a seduction. She championed the writing very early and used to read for JT in public. JT NEVER read in public and rarely spoke. At parties JT would talk and get drunk, but only in private. The voice was small and high and whispery.

cont'd

R19 -- How did you know the memoir was a fake? Which book? "Sarah" was billed as fictional. The second book that Asia made a movie out of was billed as loosely autobiographical. Only the short story "Howard's End" was billed as pure memoir.

R51 -- The whole "Asia is having my child" stunt was met as a joke. I was so weirded out by it that I sent JT an email asking about it. Someone (now of course I don't know who it was; probably Laura, whom we called Speedie at the time) wrote right back saying it was a reference to their collaboration on the film version of "The Heart is Deceiful Above All Things."

I'm not a member so I can't post in primetime, so I will start signing off as StudLy GoLightLy.

i was at a Lit festival more than 10 years ago, "JT" gave a public reading of a short story: the venue was full of fans, i even got an autograph fo "him". How silly, now.

Great posts R56.

So why did Winona go along with this? For a laugh?

To me the only thing interesting about Laura is the gossip she knows. Would she ever share that gossip? I doubt it.

cont'd

R72 -- That's a bit off. The ruse was that Speedie (who was really Laura Albert, who wrote all the books etc.) had been a street worker as a young woman in England and moved to the U.S., where she cleaned up and was doing outreach with San Francisco strays. She and her husband Thor (I can't remember his real name but he was Savannah's brother) took in JT as a member of the family. They had a son whom JT kind of co-parented.

R80 -- Before I met them, JT was described as having HIV or AIDS; can't remember which. But as their fame escalated, they backed off that story. By the time I met them at their first New York reading (to which they invited me) they were saying he was beginning an M2F transition. By the time it started to unravel, some of their operatives were aggressively backing off of that line too. "JT" was coy about it when I asked, as was Speedie.

A LOT of people were really hurt by the deception. It wasn't just celebrities in their orbit. A lot of us were involved with JT because we cared so much about him. (S)he would call at all hours, fearful and afraid, or needing something big or small. People were devastated. When I met Laura during her trial I was there to support ordinary people who I knew had done a LOT financially and otherwise for JT and team and were now testifying against Laura. She saw me and asked to have lunch, which I did. The only time she was aggressive was in defending herself against my claim that she had injured so many people in her quest for fame and approbation.

I thought Dennis Cooper wrote Howard's End?

For r51.... From wikipedia:

"The original screenplay for Gus Van Sant's Elephant (2003) was credited to LeRoy ... LeRoy was also listed as that film's associate producer."

Seriously sick bitch, I would say. At this point, why would anyone want to spend time with her?

cont'd

R54

You have to remember that there were myriad lies told about the JT persona in addition to the false authorship-- he had AIDS then he didn't; he was F2M then maybe he wasn't. JT was fully capable of telling Asia he'd fully transitioned and only a few people were allowed to know. EVERYTHING was a secret. It was part of the seduction. I know I read somewhere that Asia never knew, even after having an affair with JT. In addition, Laura told me so herself. I'll try to find a link.

Also, I posted the "Cont'd" post before this one. Forgot to use my moniker

[quote]I think Asia has said as much publically as well in an article I've read.

Yes, she did, talk about it in an article. Thanks for the inside info. Finally some fucking gossip here.

Maybe Asia was out of her mind on drugs. I'm baffled.

Oh, StudLy, your breathless revelations about your gargauntuan gullibility is one long steaming pile of shit-smelling humblebrag.

I work in publishing, and was called a jerk for saying, aloud, and often, through this entire debacle, that this charlatan was just that.

Don't forget the hideous raccoon penis bone necklaces!

So Laura/Speedie knew that her sister-in-law was conning Asia Argento, into the sack by claiming to be 'JT Leroy, MTF transwoman?'

You can't make this up.

cont'd

R61 -- Nope, that was JT. I think it was origibally published in McSweeny's before being released as an overpriced limited edition. The launch party for it was particularly funny. My friend organized it in a Soho gallery space and it was a big ticket. Apparently, Lou Reed, who was invited, got turned away at the door and pitched a major fucking fit.

Biggest celebrity messes in the JT circus were Winona Ryder and Tatum O'Neal. Winona was meant to do the intros for another reading hosted at the Public but instead showed up apparently drunk and babbling about how she met JT after a bad breakup and took him to the opera and became smitten for life. Everything else she said was incoherent. She then tried to excuse it all by saying she was overwrought because her brother had just had a baby. Everyone clapped her off the stage so we could get to the fucking reading.

At that same reading, Tatum O'Neal made her debut as a JT reader/circus act. She acted it instead of reading it, complete with giggles and tears. She was beyond horrid; it was indescribably douche-chilling.

After that, Tatum was at every JT event in New York. At the one where Lou Reed was turned away I sat next to her the whole night. The words "sobriety" and "Oscar" were like articles in a sentence for her; she couldn't speak without mentioning one or the other, usally the latter.

The last time I saw her she was trying to foist some powdered "medicine" on my friend and her assistant to combat their colds.

Hot fucking mess. Of course, the absolute worst was Courtney Love, but that goes without saying.

cont'd

R67-- What does that even mean?

I don't work in publishing. I was a fan whom they liked and I became a part of their NY circle. The most I did was hook them up with people who could help them, pick them up from the airport once, and run a few minor errands. They had some sort of organization for abuse victims and GBLT youth where other fans turned associates poured a HUGE amount of time and money and effort into. Those were the people I was in court to support during the trial.

R69 is spot on.

In the right hands, this would be an incredible movie, a farce for the ages, ridiculing dumb celebrities, fame, media, publishing and the need for "true/real" stories instead of truth-telling fiction. But in order to do it right, you'd have to chop heads and ridicule them all, the whole worshipping people culture we have. Scare the shit out of the Independent Spirit Awards instead of trying to join the club.

I remember Albert claiming that Courtney Love knew and was encouraging her to go on Oprah for redemption.

StudLY, you doll, do share about Courtney.

So Albert won't write a book about her celebrity friends?

So, this is Asia and one of these nuts, with 'JT' in the background

Laura Albert grabbing Asia Argento's tits and looking cray

Ewww to the above...did Michael Pitt go into the whole thing knowing that JT was a fake.

Speaking of Dennis Cooper---did he ever fuck 10 year-olds, or was that just something he used to write about?

cont'd

I'd suggested the venue for this particular after-reading party, which was this lounge in the west 30's that had live mermaids swimming behind the bar. I met Courtney in JT's hotel room when we went to drop off some clothes another friend had knocked off from designer gear for a photo shoot they were doing that day. After the reading I went to the lounge to make sure it was ready (I knew the owners and was anxious for it all to go well).

The placed was closed for the private party but Courtney somehow managed to get so wasted that she was thrown out for punching out some non-celebrity who'd tried to crash the private dining area. I went outside with her to smoke and calm her down because the owner didn't want her back in. After working it out with the owner on her behalf, she stormed back in, cursed at him in French, and then for some unknown reason refused to allow me into the private dining area, saying it was for "celebrities only." Speedie had never been unkind towards me but I knew she was enough of a hustler to allow someone to organize an event and then not allow them to fully participate in it. Since I wasn't a famewhore I grudgingly decided to sit it out, but I was pissed. Happily, Rufus Wainwright got bored and came out early to drink with me.

Afterwards, a bunch of went to JT's hotel to hang out with him as we always did. By this time it was 3 something in the morning and JT was drooping. I suggested (s)he go to bed and JT got all frustrated about Courtney bogarting the hotel room. So I got the keycard from JT, went upstairs, and told Courtney that JT was exhausted and wanted to go to bed. She'd been speaking very animatedly to some randomite so I finally had to interrupt her to say my piece, whereupon bitch went ballistic-- screaming and cursing and speaking so rapidly that I couldn't follow what she was even saying. Someone called security and the moment they arrived she told them that I had broken into the room and that she was "highly protective of JT's space." I showed them my key card, told them all I was fetching JT, and that the room should be empty when (s)he returned.

Somehow JT heard all about it and was scared to go upstairs. Speedie was at first pissed because I'd upset Courtney (!), but the next day they called me to meet them for brunch and told me what a horror Courtney had been afterwards. She stayed until 8am, first talking Speedie to death until she barged in on JT. JT went to sleep with her sitting cross legged on the floor drawing pictures, chain smoking, and talking on the phone.

But my favorite is still Tatum O'Neal. In describing her rejection of some showbiz type who was known for dating starlets or something, she said, "He just wanted to trade up from an Oscar nominee to an Oscar winner."

Best.Line.Ever (from a has-been).

Albert was a frau. Her husband is Geoffrey Knoop.

I kind of put her Annie Proulx in the same category. Proulx never did say that she was a gay man though.

Wow, Studley. POOR KURT

But who was the person trading up?

I doubt if Cooper ever fucked a ten year old, I think that was just his fantasy...or probably cutting the dick and balls off a ten year old was his fantasy.

StudLY, you're a peach. Fun to have some actual gossip once again.

You sound like a good person, Studly, but you basically did the work of a personal assistant for these con artists for free. You were seriously duped.

I'm sure a lot of it was fun and interesting because you got to hang out with celebs and all, but that's just the sort of star-fuckery that kept the whole sham running for so long.

[quote] I kind of put her Annie Proulx in the same category. Proulx never did say that she was a gay man though.

So why would you put them in the same category?

Didn't Randy Harrison write some fan boy letter to JT?

Didn't JT start out writing the Terminator column in NY Press? Wasn't that years before Sarah and The Heart is Deceitful?

r89 -- yes. JT's first bylines were under the moniker "Terminator." We were told that the "J" in JT stood for Jeremiah and "T" stood for Terminator.

r86 -- I don't disagree with your assessment at all. Luckily, I didn't lose nearly so much materially or emotionally as others did in their investment in JT. I could tell some harrowing stories but they are not entertaining; just sad.

Thanks, gentlemen.

Please, tell the harrowing stories!

r91:

The only celebrities involved with JT when I got involved were unknown to the general public, as they were exclusively transgressive lit types (Mary Gaitskill, Dennis Cooper, Sharon Olds). The vast majority of us plebeians who got involved with JT had really traumatic backgrounds ourselves. His first novel had an email address at the end of it to contact him. I sent him a letter of encouragement and support, specifically about the power of healing through writing, and the potential inability to ever stop longing for one's abuser (not the abuse itself, but the parent who could have been had they not been abusive). I never expected to hear back from him, but I did; very quickly. He invited me to join a closed message board for his acolytes that was invite only. From it I guess some of us were selected to become personally involved with JT for our utility to the JT machine or image as it evolved. As I mentioned above, I emerged relatively unscathed but there were three people in particular who didn't. Among them:

A lovely M2F from Japan who used to travel to NY and San Francisco to be with them, She also assisted in organizing at least one overseas event. She was still transitioning and had deferred paying for and pursuing her full transition plan in favor of supporting JT. She'd been rejected by her family and thought of JT, Speedie, et al as part of her family of choice. All along I thought they used her terribly. Her English was limited and they liked to position her as part of their photo ops occasionally but they generally treated her as a factotum at best. When the hoax was revealed she didn't believe it. She (and I) were both recruited by Speedie (aka Laura Albert) to write rebuttal letters to New York Mag. At the trial I learned that she had tried to commit suicide in the wake of the revelations.

There was also a gay man who was selected from Chicago. He was middle aged and poured endless time, travel, and money into supporting JT and providing massive administrative and managerial support for the organization the JT machine founded in support of abused LGBT youth. He was treated especially poorly by JT's assistant when she tried to conflate his consensual relationship with a 20 year old with predatory behavior unbecoming to the org's mission. He eventually resigned in despair. He was a chief trial witness, and it was at his behest that I attended the proceedings.

Possibly the worst was Nancy, JT's assistant herself. She'd been a very pretty girl who was molested for 15 years by her father with her mother's tacit consent. The mother resented the girl's beauty while hustling her through the pageant circuit. When her parents became elderly, she nursed them faithfully until their deaths. By the time she got involved with JT she was a childless, never married mid-40'schoolteacher who had won awards for her devoted service to her students. She wrote JT after a questioning student gave her "Sarah" and he invited her to join the board. Over the course of several years I watched her transform from a stable woman into Laura's slave. Her devotion to JT took over her life, and as Laura became more jealous of her creation (JT) she took it out on Nancy. At the time I thought it was funny: unassuming spinster transmogrifies into obsessed starfucker. Before one of the NYC readings we all had dinner, at which Laura announced that Nancy had been elevated to JT's personal assistant. At the after party following the reading, Winona Ryder went to leave with JT et al to head back to his hotel to continue the festivities. When Winona appeared to be getting into the same car as JT, Nancy grabbed her from behind and hauled her out of the way before installing herself in the car with them instead. By the time I got to the hotel, I had missed the blood curdlng public berating Laura gave Nancy upon hearing why Winona wasn't feeling up to joining us. I did arrive in time to see Nancy weeping like a bereft child at being excluded from

the night's festivities. To my knowledge she was never included in the "inner sanctum" again; at least not when it came to private access. Publically, she still performed all the unpaid duties of a personal assistant with all that entailed for the ever hustling, grifting, JT machine.

To watch this woman reduce herself from a stable, accomplished, seemingly healed survivor of abuse to a sniveling, manipulated supplicant was astonishing. Shamefully, I blamed her and not Laura or JT, since I didn't realize we were ALL being played, and that Laura would push anyone as far as one allowed. By the time Nancy organized the putsch to get Steve (the gay guy who basically ran their charitable org) vilified for falling in love with someone younger, my disdain for Nancy was complete. When Steve resigned I wrote JT protesting his treatment and Nancy's wild overreaction to a consensual relationship. I ended the email by saying something like "Has it ever occurred to you just how long it's been since someone--anyone--consensually touched Nancy; if ever?" It was the only part of the email JT (or whomever) responded to. I

[quote]I never read any of LeRoy's books, but I do get the impression that their perceived quality heavily depended on the sympathy people felt for the LeRoy persona. I think authenticity is extremely overrated though. Art is about imagination, I wish there were more artists who are able to suck fantastic lies and illusions out of their thumb. I'm tired of confessional/autobiographical art.

THIS.

r94:

point taken.

from StudLy GoLightLy & Edward St. Aubyn (author of the fantastically written autobiographical "Patrick Melrose" series-- the initial trilogy of which entitled "Some Hope" I gave as a gift to JT).

So you never got to meet Gus Van Sant?

I once read on another DL thread that during this evening, Winona made "a sudden move" around JT and one his/her groupies "slugged her". Is this true?

Oh wow, live mermaids swimming in the background. Reeeaally?

R94 and the poster he quoted are idiots. This wasn't a performance piece.

Well, this thread harvested more details of the Leroy hoax than I could have imagined!

Many thanks StudLY and do continue to post your recollections if you wish.

It seems Laura Albert is some sort of psychopath, delighting in manipulating, humiliating and duping others.

Studly's treatment of Nancy makes it clear he'll be right at home here at DL.

Here's Winona from that evening. I love her but she's clearly somewhat inebriated (hopefully it's just alcohol)

Poor old Nancy. She needs to spend some time with the Michfest systeryn, working on her boundaries.

In The Heart Is Deceitful Above All Things (the film based on Leroy's "life") Asia Argento plays his wacko junkie mother and her look totally seems based on Courtney Love.

this story, link, pretty dang good about laura's masochistic ability

Give me a break, everyone knows Winona does whatever drugs she wants to. She isn't a puritan.

I think Winona was totally lying about how they met...why did she have to lie?

Because you can't truthfully say you've met someone who doesn't exist.

So was he like the Chris Gaines of the literary world?

Actors are kind of creepy. I mean why did Winona go into the bullshit story? I don't get it and why did Van Sant have JT do a commentary on My Own Private Idaho? Were any of JT's observations correct?

What I find most cloying about all this is how it's the worst example of the book industry's Cult of Personality (fraudulent or not).

The quality of writing is less important than the celebrity status of the author, and a nervous industry's craving for high profile celebrities versus good or great authors.

R97 & R111 -- No. But Van Sant hired JT to script "Elephant," so they were close associates. I'm pretty sure the JT clan got to go to Cannes with Van Sant when the film was shown there. & I'm almost positive that THiDAAT film was shown there out of competition. By that time the hoax was broken and Asia was indignant, so they probably didn't go that time.

R98 -- Very true. It's the incident I described above with Nancy. The look on Winona's face was priceless.

R99 -- Yup. It was fabulous. All pink and green and kitschy, with two live girls swimming in a mermaid tank behind the bar. It was called the Coral Room, I think. Sadly, it closed eons ago.

R101 & 102-- Thanks! & you're right; I was a cunt to Nancy. She went deep into the land of cray by the end; totally swallowing all of Laura's justifications and declaring that "JT's" work would continue. Laura eventually discarded her too, in the end.

R108-- Winona was definitely lying. She was in on the hoax before anyone else. I never found out why she agreed to go along with it. But being the first mainstream celeb to "discover" JT probably leant some edgy cachet to her fading profile. There's a VF article written at the height of the JT fame-whoring that lists an endless stream of top shelf celebs who'd fallen under JT's spell (though the only ones I can remember right now are Madonna and then "It" girl Liv Tyler). JT and Laura even got invited to Carrie Fisher's legendary annual joint birthday party with Penny Marshall the year before the hoax broke. I read that Carrie pulled JT assigned to warn him about Laura's jealousy, possessiveness, and general vulgarity. In retrospect, that is bloody hilarious.

Re: Elephant-- Van Sant reportedly despaired JT's inability to follow scriptwriting form, so his initial drafts weren't used. VS ended up giving him some sort of production credit though.

I found the other thread where Winona at the JT Leroy event was mentioned. It's on page 26.

[quote]winona ryder: a lunatic. and unprofessional. she was meant to host a reading event for JT Leroy and instead of preparing an intro she just batted her eyelashes, wrung her hands, and then blamed her rambling on the fact that she'd just become an aunt. at the afterparty she made a sudden move too close to JT and "his" superfan/groupie/manager literally slugged her. That JT circus was bananas.

The inner circle is more sinister than I thought. Call David Fincher for the dramatic feature version.

This is awesome!

Studly---how did Michael Pitt end up dating the girl who played JT?

R116-- I honestly don't know. But he knew that she was a biological girl playing a role by the time he got involved with her; unlike poor Asia Argento, who was never filled in.

To the poster above who said "This was not performance art"-- during my mid-trial lunch with Laura, she claimed it WAS performance art. She recalled some post JT had made on the mssg board about the whole family being in love with The Ali G. show, and Sasha Baron-Cohen's hoaxery in general. I recalled that post, which made it all the more pathetic when I watched her cry on stand about being an abuse survivor whose only coping mechanism was creating multiple identities.

Speaking of identity, I have a question that I hope someone will answer: What would you guess I am, demographically?

That crap wig was a big tip-off for me way back when.

[quote]What would you guess I am, demographically?

35-45ish white urban gay guy.

Thanks R20!

I'm actually a 41 yo, homo-leaning bisexual (i.e. Kinsey 4) black female.

I learned that a mid-century Harlem pejorative for dykes was "Stud" by reading it in "Manchild in the Promised Land" as a teen. So I coupled StudLy with my favorite literary slut's surname (Holly Golightly, natch).

Online I am routinely assumed to be a gay man for some reason. While initially bemusing, I came to appreciate it. Lesbians never believe I'm actually a hot piece of ass bisexual.

Cheers!

so, you aren't a hot piece of ass? Too bad. But the gossip is nice, we don't get much here.

I had hoped you would say something about Van Sant. Was Joaquin Phoenix fooled by JT?

Wow...all this is fascinating. I remember reading the Terminator pieces in NYPress, and from very early on, I was sure they were fiction. They just felt like workshopped pieces by someone who had a vivid imagination.

And as the JT Leroy story emerged (and all those supporters) a guy I knew, who had achieved some indie success as a novelist, told me I was wrong, that he (the novelist) had talked to JT Leroy on the phone, and he was a a remarkable, wonderful writer & person, and I thought: no way. It's bullshit, and it's all going to come out one day.

Of course as the long grift went on, even people who began to suspect it was a hoax had all the more reason to keep their mouths shut, because it showed THEY'D been conned. (The novelist died before the hoax was revealed...I can only imagine what he would have said. I suspect he would have kept insisting it was TRUE despite everything. He was a stubborn man. And a very good writer.)

[quote] I'm actually a 41 yo, homo-leaning bisexual (i.e. Kinsey 4) black female.

I was going to guess: black transwoman. The fact that you asked made me think you couldn't be an AW(G)G.

R124-- ROFLMBAO!!!

um no. very much a biological woman, with the endometrial cancer to prove it!

transwomen can't get hysterectomies. I've read a lot of the "drop the t" threads on this board and while I don't quite know where I stand yet, I could never consider a M2F (or vice versa) as anything other than a qualified female or male; i.e. a transperson; totally distinct from a biological female or male.

cancer or no cancer, I'm still a hot piece. ;~)

StudLY hunty, it's you that should have a book deal.

'Celebrity is deceitful above all things: An insider's guide to the JT Leroy hoax'

Wishing you all the best for a - uh- speedie recovery, Studs.

Yjanks, genteme.

It's been real.

[quote]I could never consider a M2F (or vice versa) as anything other than a qualified female or male; i.e. a transperson; totally distinct from a biological female or male.

I agree, but we better keep it to ourselves.

StudLy you sound very cool. What's AW(G)G?

Average White Girl or Guy,R129

StudLy, I would write all this down. E-book it. So shady!

AW(G)G = Average White (Gay) Guy/Gal.

StudLy, do you know anything about the drug scene on the set of THiDAAT? I heard that Asia was a nightmare to deal with, because of her supposed drug use. It's no surprise that she never directed another film in the US.

She dated Michael Pitt later on; they were together during the shooting of Last Days. Was that after Michael's involvement with GVS?

Interesting, R123. I knew someone on Usenet who insisted he was part of Courtney Love's in-group for a while (no one lasted there long, as you can imagine) and he claimed JT was "definitely male" because he saw him come out of Courtney's shower in a hotel room somewhere.

But the guy wasn't trustworthy. In 1999 he faked his own death, and caused so much fallout it was mentioned in a Wired article a few years back. The guy was 5150'ed recently, too. It's possible he was involved but my guess is he made it up; he certainly never saw a nude male JT. (He later insinuated himself into Burning Man culture and caused a whole shitload of problems there, too. He's a complete mess.)

Yeah, well what was his name, R134.

R133 -- I only know what I read. JT, Speedie, and Thor were extremely protective of their relationships with Asia and Van Sant. They were at the axis of their famewhoring, and Laura was stretched too thin at this point:

non-stop famewhoring and networking

journo assignments as JT

relentless press pursuits for coverage of JT & Thistle, which started out as "JT's" band but was really always Thor's (Laura's husband/Savannah's brother)

the endless public readings & after parties which were now often combined concert events for Thistle

God only knows what happened on that set. I heard similar things to what you did, but never knew if it was true or not. Let's just say that in terms of my contact with them I found them all to be far more temperamental erratic than in the past.

To the person who asked about Joaquin Phoenix, I never heard of his knowing JT et al. There was probably a whole West Coast scene comparable to the one in New York, but I wasn't privy to it.

I meant "apex" not axis

Did Argento ever comment on the hoax in hindsight?

People like Van Sant et al went on to do other things and they're all famous for other things, but Argento's name seems like it will be forever tied to this. I know she's a famous cool person etc etc, but I'd actually never heard of her before, and I've never heard her mentioned in any other context.

And Studly, did you get to say everything you wanted to Laura, Savannah et all after the reveal? Is there anything you'd want to say to them if you ever saw them again?

Why did these cunts and cuntesses turn Lou Reed away from their gallery event, after inviting him, StudLY? Hoping he'd pitch a fit and get them some gossip coverage?

Presumably he was turned away at the door by event staff because the event was filled beyond capacity by the time he arrived. I don't imagine the cunts and cuntesses were there working the door or ordering people to turn Reed away.

R138-- I mentioned upthread that Asia stated publicly that when she was sleeping with JT she had no idea about the hoax. I can't find a link online, but did find this snippet from a long interview with Savannah in the Guardian:

"Asia Argento met JT LeRoy on a book tour in Italy for Harold's End, LeRoy's last novel. Argento had been emailing Albert, as LeRoy, for a few months before that, but she transferred all her attentions to Knoop. They began a relationship.

Argento must have known something was up.

'She says she didn't! I don't think she can admit that she knew something was up. I think she probably did.'

Because you were close - on every level.

'Right.'

Physically close...

Knoop laughs. 'Right! Everyone goes, she was so naive to think anyone could have had a perfect sex change. But I don't know ...'

I ask her if she felt guilty about cheating Argento into a relationship with her; Knoop doesn't really answer. 'It was unsettling, to be with her, and not be ... although I spent enough time with her at the end, so that basically I felt like we connected on so many other things. And it was this whole thing. At some point, I told Asia that she should call me Savannah. I don't know why.'

My guess is that she didn't know at the time but became accepting of it eventually. The URL link is to a Skype discussion between Laura and Asia where they suck each other's cocks over the released film THiDAAT

Give me a break, if Argento was sleeping with JT, she knew she was sleeping with a goddamn woman. How much bullshit are we suppose to swallow?

R139 -- I said all I felt I needed to to Laura at the trial. My only real objection was her usury and exploitation of the non-celebs, and she was downright hostile to the very idea that she'd hurt anyone. When we heard in court that the F2M acolyte from Japan had attempted suicide when he finally accepted the hoax was a reality, I looked right at Laura and her face was implacable.

I'm sure her only reason for asking me to lunch was to dissuade me from talking to a documentarian who was also there. I ended up allowing an interview anyway. I don't know whatever happened to the doco.

R140-- The Lou Reed thing was one of those door policy snafus that happen all the time. Regrettable fuck up. That particular party was the most successful of any thrown for JT in NY by far, and despite its success Laura REAMED my friend who had organized it (for free) over the Lou Reed mistake. It was completely chilling and over the top.

I can't imagine what it must have been like for Savannah and the husband to deal with her.

R143-- I appreciate your suspicion, but I personally am convinced that JT told Asia that she had fully transitioned but didn't want anyone to know yet. A lot of what JT and I discussed personally was around "her" supposed fears about transitioning.

It's not like most people know what a post-op vag looks like. Plus, we don't know what kind of sex they had; just that they did have sex.

Didn't that girl who had an affair with Brandon Teena never know she was really sleeping with a boy? To me, it just makes sense that JT lied as usual and Asia bought it. Asia was a drugged up mess at the time (rumor has it; I don't know anything directly & never met Asia).

[quote]Asia stated publicly that when she was sleeping with JT she had no idea about the hoax.

I know that much, and I actually believe it. I'm wondering if she said how she FELT about the hoax in hindsight. Was she angry? Did she feel betrayed? She must have. I'm wondering if she's spoken up. She made a shitty movie about this after all, and her name will forever be associated with it as the blindest of the blind, the most foolish of the fooled.

Winona and Courtney were sharing the same dr at the time. Courtney was a cracked out mess. She posted some about jt on her former website.

I wrote to jt as well. I was shocked at how quickly I was replied to.

I remember an article where Asia said the sex was great with jt.

Also to poster about the fake suicide - please tell me you're referring to Jason. :)

[quote]But the guy wasn't trustworthy. In 1999 he faked his own death, and caused so much fallout it was mentioned in a Wired article a few years back. The guy was 5150'ed recently, too.

I have to say that faking one's suicide was a move I saw more than once in the Courtney fan scene (and in various online fandoms over the years).

While I didn't hang with CL (we had some email correspondence & met once), the Hole fanatics online were a pretty combustible group. Spin even did an article about them.

Thinking about it, Courtney's brand of crazy and the JT Leroy scene were a match made in hell. Or purgatory.

Holemusic.com foreverrrrr!!!!

Well if JT told her that she had already had the surgery...she might not know. I haven't seen a transsexual either...

My parents weree friends with Melissa Auf Der Maur's father

Can someone link the fake suicide wired article?

What did Laura Albert do before the JT scam?

Phone sex, writing for/collecting zines, playing in a band, hanging out in NYC and SF.

StudLY ....wishing you well with your situation and appreciate all of the information you shared.

Ball park ---how much money do you think Laura Albert received during this hoax ? Is she still working and accepted within the publishing industry.

I saw part of the YouTube link of Albert doing a Q&A at the AA film and she seemed to get a decent reception.

Did she become a pariah or was her 'Gotcha !' generally accepted by most (except for those that sued, etc)?

not a JT link, but I thought this photo was funny. Someone mentioned Tatum upthread

"We are crazy!"

R153 Tried to be a writer but couldn't make it?

r155 -- that is such a good question because I was with them when they had nothing and clearly that changed over time. yet they still acted as though they were dead broke. until the very end they would loot very hotel room and restaurant of anything that wasn't nailed down. It got to the point where I knew never to join them for a meal on the day they were flying out because they always chose brunch buffets and then would hoard food for the plane ride home.

I asked Laura and she said they made nothing, which is clearly not true. I doubt they made a great deal though-- their publications were cult hits' not bestsellers. Both of the films they were associated with were small indies. Presumably their biggest and most consistent income came from the journo assignments, liner notes, etc.

Whatever profit they realized was probably eaten up by the trial costs. I doubt Laura ever paid the judgment of $300K; she told me there was no way she had that kind of money. But by then she was already a writer on Deadwood and had folks like the producer of that show who championed her post-hoax.

My guess is she is still writing, just low profile stuff. The only other job she ever had where she excelled was phone sex. Perhaps she's doing that too

OP is obsessed with this...which speaks a great deal in itself.

R113 Re: Winona - No, you said Nancy the groupie hauled her away and took her place in the car, the other comment said she slugged her ie. punched her.

r160-- Honey, I was right behind them. Nancy hauled the shit out of Wynona and shoved her aside. No she didn't punch her or start a fist fight but she was unexpectedly physical; violently so. Nancy was a big woman-- 5'7", probably 200 pounds. Winona looked like a petrified sparrow; terrified, then shocked. We all were.

r159-- I'm not the OP. I am just answering other poster's questions, as I hope others would do for me if they knew someone public about whom I was interested.

Thanks StudLy.... I guess Laura couldn't make much money if all of the checks were made out to JT Leroy

I wonder how that *did* work anyway ? Even the piddliest publishing company or movie studio had to be providing contracts and checks to pay JT/Laura ....... did she have bank accounts open as JT Leroy ?

Hmmmmmmmmmmm

I'm going to Google it, but I wonder if Winona ever commented publicly on her part in the hoax. Obviously that whole shoplifting debacle derailed Winona ......how much do you think her involvement in this hot mess cost Winona with regards to her own career ??

R161 Well, if I'd been there I'd like to have jumped to Winona's aid and slugged that Nancy bitch myself.

R159, I am the OP. It's an interesting story and StudLY has given the thread plenty of mileage with her insider take.

So fuck off.

One of the stories I have read since the start of this thread followed the money and it turned out that some of the checks were sent to Ira Silverberg, Leroy/Albert's agent, some were made out to Albert's sister and her mother.

Presumably, they were managing "JT's" finances.

I also want to know how Albert & Knoop's kid has turned out. I wonder what kind of shit he's had to go through with a fabulist as a mom and a father who sold out his mother (Knoop sold them out to the Times first).

Some writers in Hollywood were blackballed but friends would still hire them but not put their names on projects...I wonder if that still happens?

[quote]Also to poster about the fake suicide - please tell me you're referring to Jason. :)

No, his name's not Jason.

I'd rather not say this dude's name but I'm reasonably sure he wasn't part of the JT Leroy scene, he only pretended he was, so his name is irrelevant. I just thought it was funny that he claimed he'd seen JT nude and therefore knew JT was a man.

He only claimed this because he had some crazy idea that a few of us on Usenet were "starfuckers" and he thought he'd troll us with his stories. Except he didn't know anything more than what Courtney Love was posting on Prodigy at the time, so it was obvious he was a wanker and a wannabe.

Oh Usenet...that was some free-for-all in the early days of the Internet. I had friends who were on alt.showbiz.gossip and they had some major drama. Hole had the crazy Sasha in (I think) alt.fan.c-love. And Courtney was a major presence on AOL in the Hole folder (which was depicted in that Spin article). A playwright compiled a lot of Courtney's rants into a solo piece and it was performed as "Love in the Void."

(I think her AOL screen name was Violet00)

"StudLY has given the thread plenty of mileage with her insider take. "

And has proven that anyone involved in this whole scam is/was and will always be either a deluded twat or a narcissistic self-absorbed sycophant.

I watched the documentary "Author: The JT Leroy Story". Laura Albert is obnoxious about how this is not a hoax and it's real to here. There isn't much in it that hadn't been covered in the press. The best thing in the doc is Courtney Love's phone call with Laura and Courtney says she has a line of coke but doesn't want to put Laura on hold so she snorts up.

You can fool some of the people some of the time…

Can someone explain Ira Silverberg to me?

He must have known.

Is he just an asshole?

[quote] Gullible fools, the lot of them: Maupin, Dennis Cooper, Kevin Killian, Ryder and a host of other dupes who I will never respect.

Kevin Killian was extremely kind and nice, even though he was bisexual and so is his wife Dodie.

I do wonder if Killian was on the narcissistic spectrum at all? Or if the others are? It is obvious Ryder is a highly narcissistic person as almost all actresses and actors are. I liked Maupin's tales of the city but it's not like it is academic literature, it is a fun light read. Dennis Cooper's novels are boring, and too predictable. He basically copies the Marquis De Sade complete with pedo scenes, scat, and killing people, as well as necrophilia, cannibalism, and rimming. However Bruce Benderson and Samuel Chip Delaney are worse authors and also overrated like Cooper.

As someone who actually was abused-mainly physical, psychological, and just once sexually, I knew that the JT Leroy stories were fake, as they were too extreme, exaggerated, and outlandish. It became even more obvious when a woman pretending to be a boy or young adult man claimed to actually be JT Leroy.

Thanks for the inside information Studly.

Anyone else have any information?

Amazing thread.

I think I hate Laura Albert and her vile sister in law worse than any other literary figure with the exception of James Frey, who is Trump-level horrible.

R175 I was wondering when someone would mention James Frey. I view him as being akin to Augusten Burroughs.

I dislike Burroughs and his work is obviously bullshit (made a stuffed effigy of his daddy to sleep with - yeah, right) but he doesn't appear to be the utter cunt that Frey is.

Check out that asshole's Full Fathom Five scam. He's a completely greedy, gas-lighting, always-angry bastard.

Thanks R177, Frey's full fathom five certainly is a scam. Wasn't one of these teen/young adult sci-fi novels made into a film? I did not watch it and have never read any of the novels he took credit for that other people wrote.

Yeah, the "I Am Number 4" series.

He's the literary version of a sweatshop, no more, no less. Stupid fucking lying spoiled mommy-boy lard-ass CUNT.

so, I completely did not connect some of the dots when the metoo Asia Argento stuff came out against her.

she had a sexual relationship with JT thinking JT was a MtF then had a sexual relationship with Michael Pitt who also had a sexual relationship with JT but knew JT was a female and THEN Asia sexually assaulted the young male WHO PLAYED JT in the movie they were making together?