Any gay men on DL ever been married to a woman?

She kept noticing poop on her vibrator.

No, but I'm a man married to a man who used to be married to a woman.

Ask John Travolta

I was married and have two daughters. Even though I KNEW I was gay since my teenage years, I was in denial. I pretty much married my high school "hag". I suspected that she ALWAYS knew, but since we were from a rural area--where a lot of guys are unemployed,drunk and like to beat women and kids--I was probably one of the best catches around.

After being married for a little over ten years, I finally got tired of living a lie. I came out, and my wife and I got a very amicable divorce. She DID admit that she had a hunch as to my true nature, but since I was a good husband and father who earned a decent living, she lived with my deception.

She was fortunate in that she married a nice man and both my ex and her husband are among my closest friends. My partner was also married to a woman and we both have grandkids.

Perhaps some kind soul can start a thread for gay peepaws and gay meemaws!

Ray Novak: Steve Harper’s Closet Confidant

He used to live above Steve Harper’s garage. Now he’s the second most powerful man in Ottawa.

“Ray is effectively the Prime Minister’s closest confidant,” enthuses one government official. “Not only as a member of his staff, but as a personal and intimate member of the Prime Minister’s life.”

OO

-00-

My situation is a bit like R4's but only in the end result.

When I was 15 my (male) friend's parents caught us fucking in the shower during a sleepover. They came early from the movies. It had been going on for a while. My friend's parent flipped out and we were forbidden to see each other.

My parents were more cool, but only a bit more. My father confessed to "doing things in the navy" and my mother was all "boys will be boys with THAT THING"

So they saw it as a phase. Then my father started setting me up with girls, "this one wants to play tennis with you" or "this one is a great tutor" "she thinks you are so handsome - who else tells you that?"

They were all older, all experienced, some were total sluts.

A young man in his late teens and early 20s can imagine just about anything to get off. I was hard all the time. I could even imagine being fucked while I was fucking a woman.

When I was 22 I got a woman pregnant and got married. I loved her which is why I left her 4 years later. I love her to this day. She miscarried. We shared so many interests I gave it a try. We had the same sense of humour. The last two years were almost sexless. Not fair to either of us.

There were three years we barely spoke after the divorce and then she called me, said she missed our friendship, said she was in a bad relationship. And the the friendship side of it just clicked again. A few years later she married a great guy and has two kids with him. He's a straight version of me.

Nice story, R6. Glad it worked out for you and your ex.

Two friends are partners. Each was married when they met. Wives had no idea either was gay. Never asked how they told the spouses.

I was married to a woman and we had 3 children together. I always knew I was gay but repressed it, mainly for family reasons. I lived the life of a straight married man for years until my wife found out I was gay from her girlfriend who saw me with a guy and told her. The fallout was ugly and painful - an experience I would never want to re-live.

She kept custody of our sons but allowed me custody of our daughter then aged 3 years, on the condition that I kept away from our sons as she didn't want them to be 'corrupted'. She was never close to our daughter as she couldn't relate to female children so it was an easy decision to give her up and a good trade off for her to keep me away. Several years down the line, I have a lot of regrets, not least that I let my children down by denying them a relationship with each other.

Eww, pussy smells like fiiiiiiish!!!

I have known gay men who had been married but the one who had children, NEVER mentioned his kids...I don't know why. I know he had two.

How did you "gay" men get hard for your wives?

Yes, she caught me fucking her younger brother.

My imagination r12. It was like masturbation and sexual fantasy with a flesh and blood participant. Eyes always shut, lights always off. It became a lot more difficult as I hit my mid 20s.

r12---I closed my eyes and pretended I was fucking or getting blown by a man.

r4 i think it's telling that you say she admitted she had an inkling....

as if somehow she bears ANY fault in this.

I was married and was resigned to living the straight life. No kids.

At a new job, I met a gay guy who showed me that being gay wasn't just about sex but about having emotional relationships (no, I didn't have sex or a relationship with him--just a good connection). Spending so much time hiding my sexuality, I had never had a gay friend before him. He introduced me to his friends, and they were wonderful people.

This was the first time I had even considered living as an out gay man.

It took me a year of wondering about it before I told my wife. We talked about it lot. We knew we had to get divorced so we could find our new lives. Once I moved out, I went into a deep depression. As I came out of it, she went into one.

We were cold to each other for about a year but then we started talking again. Now, she's married to another guy and we're all great friends (getting her married to another is the key to making everyone happy, I now understand)

Oddly, I still think the marriage was the deepest relationship I've had in my life emotionally.

The first wife must have known, although we never talked about it. We were young and dumb.

The second one knew and was excited about it. I have no explanation, I was crazy hot for that woman,fucked her every day. I really did love her and love her to this day.

The third wife knows, I married my best friend so she can have my social security. Reasons for don't matter. It's a commitment and should she die first gives me all of her shit and she has lots of shit.

r9 that's a tough story. I've seen variations on the theme hundreds of times in Hollywood.

I myself married twice. Jesus Christ, TWICE. I did it because of a strong Catholic upbringing, the desire not to hurt my mother and work.

All so ridiculous in hindsight.

Not for the older generation, but def any gay guy who married after say '95 should stay in the marriage.

You used a woman and had kids as a convenient smokescreen for your cowardly ways, then dump them when you man up and decide to come out? Very selfish, if you married a woman and had kids have the decency to stay in the bed you made.

R20 Yes, stay in that bed so EVERYONE remains unhappy.

You're projecting, frau at r20.

In my case the wives were aware of my orientation.

[quote]Very selfish, if you married a woman and had kids have the decency to stay in the bed you made

No you don't. Are you posting from the 1950s?

Marriages end all the time for a variety of reasons. If you realize you are legitimate not happy and think you would be happier outside the marriage then you get a divorce.

Yes it was a mistake but there are mistakes other than being gay why people go into bad marriages.

R20 is a sow whose gay husband left her for the milkman.

Also more experiences, I find these fascinating.

[quote] I have no explanation, I was crazy hot for that woman,fucked her every day. I really did love her and love her to this day.

You are not gay, you are bisexual. There is a difference.

Wait, if you marry someone for purely deceptive reasons, that is really unfair to the person you are marrying.

[quote]If you realize you are legitimate not happy and think you would be happier outside the marriage then you get a divorce.

Again very selfish, all about you. You marry a woman because you want to hide your sexuality, no consideration about her or if she deserves to be in an honest marriage built on truth and fulfilling mutual sexual attraction.

Then when you get brave you dump her and the kids, no consideration there either.

Bottom line, if you're gay don't marry a woman.

Yes. We got married right out of college. I was in deep denial about the gay, but I loved her like crazy and was totally turned on by her. We had a great sex life. Fucked like rabbits. She got cancer and died shortly after our 2nd anniversary. I took at as a sign from the fates and came out and have been living an honest life ever since.

To be perfectly truthful, if she hadn't gotten sick and died. We'd still be married today and probably have some kids and I wouldn't regret a moment of it. I loved her like crazy. She will have been dead for 8 years now. I really hope that she's happy for me.

[quote] but I loved her like crazy and was totally turned on by her.

You are not gay, you are bisexual. There is a difference.

No no R26/R29, there is no such thing as being bisexual. Now let me tell you about STRAIGHT(!) men who love having sex with men...

[quote]You used a woman and had kids as a convenient smokescreen for your cowardly ways, then dump them when you man up and decide to come out? Very selfish, if you married a woman and had kids have the decency to stay in the bed you made.

Yeah, because you wouldn't want to free up the woman to find a man who genuinely loves her in the romantic sense and desires her sexually. No, just hang in there and make sure her life is as miserable as your own. Great advice.

GAY men who marry women who think they're actually straight are fucking scum. How could they possibly expect sympathy or understanding when they're directly responsible for ruining another person's life? And the ones who actually have kids deserve to be bashed to death when they finally get the "courage" to leave their marriage. Kids might as well get life insurance money if they can't have a dad they can respect.

I think like, now, say in the 90s any gay guy who married a chick so he could play straight is a selfish jerk.

My uncle was out in the late 80s, yeah he told me he came up against a lot of hostility, bit still. I don't know everyones story, but like maybe 40 or 50 years ago it could have been totally understandable, but now, I don't really respect gay men who marry chicks because they are too chicken shit to come out.

Why are bisexual men like r18 and r28 posting on the thread? A bisexual man marrying a woman is no more unusual than a straight man marrying a woman.

[quote]You marry a woman because you want to hide your sexuality, no consideration about her or if she deserves to be in an honest marriage built on truth and fulfilling mutual sexual attraction.

[quote]GAY men who marry women who think they're actually straight are fucking scum. How could they possibly expect sympathy or understanding when they're directly responsible for ruining another person's life?

It's homophobic hateful shit like this that some gay men internalize to point where they deny their sexuality to THEMSELVES.

Go away you bitter fucking bitch.

R33 Not everyone is as emotionally strong as your uncle.

Some groups, like white men, for example, have societal advantages. One thing, like being gay, will still keep most of those advantages.

A person of color has fewer societal privileges. Coming out publicly may make him a pariah.

If it were so easy to come out, there would be no such thing as 'the closet'

The frau remarks here are telling. Its no wonder Hollywood is full to the brim with arranged and lavender marriages. FULL.

She clued in at the 3:10 mark

This thread was interesting and helpful until some preachy fraus barged in.

I don't this subject is as black and white as everyone thinks it should be. Some relationships have no explanation, no label, and it's between those two ppl really.

Anyways, carry on with stories of your situation. They are enlightening and therapeutic.

Most homosexuals are married to fish

When I was 23 I married. Big mistake - I'd had a few homosexual experiences before the marriage. But my family was putting on the pressure, her family was too, her grandmother was at deaths door. So we married about a year and a half in, one of our friends was this hot rocker type. Well that started the discussion. Mostly amicable and she found another husband so all is good.

Been with the same guy for 25 years now. Love him to death.

You're gay and you married a woman THREE times? WTF, R 18? !

Most of our husbands were fishfuckers

I was closeted till my late twenties (and in the military) so the temptation to find an obliging lesbian was definitely there. I ultimately didn't go that route, but my partner did:

He grew up in a conservative part of the country (and a Mormon on top of it), went into ROTC straight out of high school and married his high school girlfriend the week of graduation, four kids. She kind of sensed there was something not quite right with the marriage but she was raised much the same as he was and was probably grateful for a nice polite man who helped around the house, didn't run around on her or bother her much for sex. Also, not to sound bitchy, but by marrying a gay man, she got a husband who was otherwise way out of her league. He got a family life, stability, kids, that family man image.

People who don't understand why this still goes on need to get out of their hipster neighborhoods once in a while. It's still Brokeback Mountain out there in a lot of America, more so in the mid 1980s.

Eventually cracks formed in the foundation of their lives, and they separated, only to reunite when he found gay life was no great shakes when you're a middle aged man coming out later in life. They split for good when his youngest entered high school, and we met about a year afree that.

They're amicable most of the time but the nature of the split makes him feel guilty and he puts up with behavior out of the kids that he normally wouldn't tolerate because of that guilt. I'd say family issues are probably the #1 cause of disharmony between us, but at our age, people have baggage, that's just life.

My biggest priority is making up for all the years when he didn't have what he wanted, where he suppressed his heart's desire to conform to societal ideas of what he should want and had to close his eyes and pretend. We've been only actually living together about 6 months and are set to marry in a few weeks, so the novelty is still very much there. I wonder if it'll ever really recede, the thrill of turning into the driveway and seeing the lights on and a man's silhouette in the kitchen window. You appreciate it a lot more when you didn't think you'd ever have it.

R18, and they all knew? So you guys just agreed on companionship?

In 1970, on our first date, I told her I also had sex with men. We were both in college, and liberal-minded. There was a period in American history, from about 1964 to 1983, i.e. from the advent of the birth control pill to the advent of AIDS, when sexuality was a kind of free-for-all.

Though I really knew in my heart I wanted a man, I thought it was impossible. Gay couples back then were not nearly as visible. She seemed the only person who cared, and we had a lot in common. She was also possibly the funniest person I ever met. We never had children; never wanted them.

We each had other outlets, and sometimes discussed them. I only tricked; she had kind of fuck buddies. We went like this for 15 years, living together for 10 of them, married for the last 6. But I yearned for a greater honesty.

We had one of the more serene divorces I've heard of. Her boyfriend moved in less than a month after I moved out. And I, who had been drinking periodically for years, came out and got struck sober, on New Year's Eve 1985.

You who criticize gay men who marry women have no inkling of what it was like to grow up in the 50's, gradually realizing you are fit only to be some kind of outcast, when homosexuality was listed in the D.S.M. as a mental illness, not removed by the American Psychiatric Assiciation until 1973. We had no legal rights to anything, let alone gay marriage!

Then AIDS came in to cinch the deal, and give the "mainstream" every divine excuse to damn us.

And wouldn't you know, I ended up coming out right at the height of that Plague. But I still felt better inside. In over 31 years since then, the closest I ever got to an LTR was with a man who ended up suddenly dying next to me, after I'd only known him 3 months.

Years ago, I met a married man, who asked me what it was like to come out. Without thinking, I told him, "Before I came out, all the advantages were outward, but all the disadvantages were inward. But after I came out, all the disadvantages are outward. But all the advantages are inward."

I was just going to post something very similar, R46 .

Very well said. Thank you!

[R47] still interested in hearing your story

You guys need to stop all this gay stuff or you'll go to Hell!

My future mother in law has discovered the DL--Howdy, Sarah!

I'm marrying your son and there's nothing you can do about it. You're still invited, but if you misbehave, we're gonna hog-tie you and put you in the laundry room and leave the radio on a hip hop station to keep you company.

Bless!

^wow, I'm trying to figure out how this post relates....

Does your future mother in law think he son should "fake it" and marry a woman?

I thought this thread was a testament to how things have changed, for the better, and that there are some things the younger gay generation just will never understand.

R44, you are right. There are still large parts of this country that are less than welcoming, if not outright hostile, to gay men.

Last year I had a date with a man who had once been married to a woman. He told me that two of his children had rocky relationships with him after he came out and divorced their mother. I know another guy who is from a conservative part of the country. He's a prominent professional. He's gay, married to a woman, and they have a large family. He's told her that he is gay. At the time his youngest had yet to start high school. They're still married. He plays around. I imagine she has stayed in the marriage, because a divorce would ruin an otherwise comfortable life. He stays in the marriage for the same reason.

What some posters wrote about their former wives might reveal that we fall in love with individuals, even if it goes against our sexual orientation. Yet those relationships fail, when our true sexual orientation is suppressed.

I live in a part of the country that is more progressive, yet I still encounter closeted, middle-aged married men and younger men "on the down low." They have hit on me at the gym.

Will the fact that closeted guys marry women become a thing of the past? I doubt it. We may see less and less of it, as time goes on. Then again, attitudes change slowly. Look at the racism systemic still in our society. Homophobia is still there, too.

My future mother in law (who's a big fan of the Duggars, hence the joke), as well as a few women up thread, sees everything from the woman's POV, R51. But in her case, like the "you made your bed, now lie in it" poster, that takes the perverse form of believing that if you fake it enough, you'll eventually make it--to heterosexuality.

In a nutshell, she doesn't believe that there's any such thing as homosexuality, just straight men who are immature and choose to act out infantile sexual impulses, rather than "evolving" into the mature love of man and wife.

My partner showed me a book that their minister gave him--at his mother's behest--when he was still struggling with his sexuality, written by one of those popular evangelical marriage counselors who's a household name in conservative Christian circles. It's basically 1950s Freudian pop psychology updated for the AIDS era, but still very effective. Its depictions of the gay community as a vicious, lonely place dull of compulsive, loveless sex and loneliness unfortunately reads like some of the DL threads, and the AIDS epidemic only confirmed for these people that homosexuality was a fundamentally dead end, miserable existence and the only way out was the love of God and a good Christian woman.

For them, marriage is about creating a family (their Mormon roots, even though they're more traditional evangelical), supporting your wife and children and honoring your promises, even if everyone's miserable. Marriage is a religious, social and economic institution--it's not about being in love with your spouse or desiring them, though the same preacher wrote a book on mental tricks wives who have no desire for sex can use to satisfy their marital duties without too much distastefulness. I don't think my partner's ex was ever much for sex and marriage to a gay man was an ideal arrangement for her.

It should be said that these aren't evil people who delight in other people's unhappiness. They genuinely believe they're saving misguided souls from misery and damnation. I've had many discussions with my future brother in law, who's a mite more open minded, about how those prohibitions are the very things that create the environment where fleeting, emotionless sex becomes the only connection two gay men can have without risking everything , and how the rest of it branches out from there, the extreme promiscuity, STDs, the inability to form relationships. His counter argument is if you let the standards down to allow for same sex marriage, usually society is on the downward trend at that point and it's like a tide marker. I doubt we'll ever be 100% on the same page but he is coming to the wedding, which is major progress for a guy who didn't talk to his brother for 8 months over the divorce.

This is what millions of gay people are up against, trying to be true to themselves in their sexuality but also to their faith and families. I know the DL consensus is to reject religion entirely but to me that's just as naive and unhelpful as saying the right woman will fix you.

It takes a long time to find the path between where you find a balance, and a lot of people never do. It's taken me half a century. My mother in law grew up in a different era and is a product of it. People change but not without great effort.

Some of the posts here show why gay DLrs are absolutely right to resent female presence in our forum. The petty bourgeois preaching, the inability to empathize with people who have worse than they ever know - we don't need that in a gay space, there's already too much of it in mainstream spaces.

Agree with posters that growing up gay in the fifties was awful. Gay men consciously and unconsciously repressed their true sexual identity.

I was married to one of these men for many years, Acceptance was difficult. Keep an open mind. I knew something was off in the marriage, but was raised to believe that nobody is really that happy anyway.

We have and adore two wonderful children. I regret nothing. Had I not married him, my children would not be who they are,

We are friends. We remember and cherish the good times. There is no blame. We both did the best we could.

I learned much about compassion and that "deep love with a partner" can be many different things. I will always love my husband.

Fish are so disgusting that they should consider themselves very lucky to marry a sissy.

Plenty of gay men marry women fully believing that they could be straight if they try and fully intending to try. This is based on misinformation fed to them by society and religion that being gay is a choice. Many men and the women they married have been made miserable by this evil theory. Hopefully, this is becoming less common as society becomes more accepting.

This is a fascinating thread. I love to read about DL's personal stories.

Yes, I grew up in a Muslim home and was basically forced into an arranged marriage. My wife actually came home one day and caught me. Unlike many of the stories here, it was not amicable. She immediately filed for divorce and took our kid back to Jordan.

Can someone point out the frau threads so I know where they are. Also, what's a frau?

DL English : Frau

Straight Girl English : Follower

I was married, and was totally honest with my future wife. The second time we went out I could tell that she thought that something might come of our relationship, and I told her that I enjoyed her company, but I was gay and a romance was out of the question. As time went on we continued to spend time together and developed a very deep friendship. We thought that we would be the couple that could make such a relationship work, and we married. The first couple of years were fine. We had frequent sex, but as time went on that dwindled to almost nothing. By the time we divorced after eight years there was no sex at all, but we always enjoyed each others company. After the divorce we remained close friends. Both of us remarried after a couple of years. Both to men. The four of us maintained a close friendship until she died. We seldom see her husband since her death, but we remain in contact.

Not all the women on DL are straight...I am a lesbian who grew up southern Baptist in the deep South. On some level I knew I couldn't change my orientation, but being constantly told that you can change if you work hard enough, I got married in 1982. During sex, I did like many posters described earlier in the thread: I closed my eyes, kept the lights off, and thought about women. I had 2 kids who I adore, but other than this, marriage was a complete disaster for me. He is not a good man and I let him get away with mentally and physically abusing me because I thought I deserved it for marrying him even though I knew I was gay.

Religion will really fuck with a person's head.

If only all of you had lived in the post 1960s Queerbec Canada, this wouldn't be an issue. No homosexuals have these stories post 60s Quebec. Before that, gays joined the priesthood or became nuns or in the First Nations communities; a medicine man or shaman. These American stories are crazy! Only a gay man could become a shaman. Recruited them as children. A shaman must have female and male traits. Hard to imagine there was always this Uber progressive world up in the north country of Canada while poor Americans suffered.

A former boss of mine was the gayest gay that ever gayed. It was always him & his gaybros, and, this girl, the perpetual faghag. She was in love with him, it was plain to see. Next thing you know, they are married and he is 100% straight all of the sudden. I didn't know what to think.

OK (R66) You don't need to be STRAIGHT to marry a woman.....but It helps!!!!!!

Not being a gay man (or woman), sorry if my presence offends some.

Married for almost 30 years to a man who had repressed his gay orientation. I had no idea. When our son came our as gay at age ten, my husband came out and abruptly left marriage.

I have tried and try to have compassion for all involved. I accept being gay as a function of DNA. Normal.

Being on DL has helped me build compassion by providing a window into some of the thought processes of all involved.

To the posters who are sincere in sharing their respective truths: thank you. It takes courage.

Interesting thread. I've always felt it was the most selfish of acts, to weave a life of lies and treat another human as a prop in your movie, however as I see here, there still is love and respect and children, and things turn out OK. I'm still convinced however that easily 50% of gay people in America are in sham marriages and I don't know why. I suspect that root of all evil, war, hate...Religion -

I think it's interesting how many of our fathers told us about "a bit of grabass while in the Navy," I was never really certain what that "grabass" entailed, but I am guessing oral?

R32 and 33, I used to have a similar mentality (which was brought upon by getting royally messed with by a guy I dearly loved, who ended up getting married to a woman). But I have come to realize that, while we idealize marriage as some shining testament of love and fidelity, marriage is pursued for numerous reasons, many of which have nothing to do with love. I remember talking to a counselor/psychiatrist during a challenging part of my life, the challenge having a bit to do with the afore-mentioned dude. One of things he said that stuck with me was in regard to non-love marriages, and how people marry, even homosexuals, because it provides something they want. And as odd as it sounded to me, that reason really may not be love. Some guys just simply want biological children, and marry a wife to achieve that purpose. Some people just want a comfortable living (I am at a point where I would marry just for money and I'm not even remotely embarrassed to admit it anymore). Some people don't want to be lonely, so see marriage as some successful achievement and do it simply for the status, and some people just do it because they have nothing better to do.