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How Republicans Get Americans To Vote Against Their Own Self Interest

The general stigma and opinion of the majority of the American people is that the Republican party and their policies favor the wealthy. If so many people believe that a particular political party has only a small elite in their best interest, why do so many still continue to vote for them? A question needs to be asked, why do working class, low and middle income families, continue to support a party that gives little to no benefit to them?

A New York Times/CBS News poll was released last October and showed that 70% of all Americans believed that the policies of congressional Republicans favored the rich. In addition to the backlash towards congressional Republicans, two-thirds of Americans actually disapprove of continuing tax cuts for corporations and millionaires. President Obama's recent proposal, the "Buffett Rule", which would place a minimum tax rate of 30% on millionaires, failed in the Senate with a 51-49 vote. Only one Republican voted for the bill, falling nine votes short of the 60 vote super majority it needed to move to the House of Representatives.

Though the "Buffett Rule" failed in the Senate, if a 60% threshold was needed among the American people, the bill would have passed with flying colors. According to a recent CNN poll, 72% of Americans favor the "Buffett Rule,"blowing away the numbers shown in congress. These numbers show where the majority of Americans stand when it comes to economics, but it doesn't translate in the polls when it comes to election time. On most occasions, both the Republican party and the Democratic party each gain around 45% of the electorate, with the remaining 10% swinging in either direction depending on the mood of the country. While Democratic voters are mostly working class Americans who are more inclined to change and accepting others, Republican voters stick to their ideology and are much more resistant to change.

It makes economic sense for the wealthiest Americans to vote for the Republican party because they want to protect their own private finances without giving others, including themselves, the chance for more upward mobility. What makes people scratch their head is the idea of a working class family, making $50,000 a year, voting for a party that continues to give tax breaks to the wealthy and paying for it by cutting the programs that benefit the lower and middle class income families. The Locust Fork News-Journal did a story about a retired Auburn History professor and author, Wayne Flynt, who has written about why Americans often do vote against their best interests in his book "Poor but Proud."

“It’s partly because preachers tell them that the Democratic Party is a godless party...It’s party because the Democratic Party is made up of a large number of African-Americans, and working class whites just won’t vote that way.” Dr. Flynt points out that before the 1960s and 1970s, social issues such as abortion, gay rights and religion weren't talked about as much as they are today. As the years have gone on, social issues and their importance have mixed together with the economic issues of our time. In many southern states, Evangelical Christianity makes up the majority of the voters, most of them Republican. With the recent insurgence of the Tea Party movement into the national Republican party, religion and Christianity has made its way into the secular society of the United States. Today, more than ever before, religion has found its way out of the home and churches and into the public square, a place where religion was never intended to be when our founding fathers began to craft the United States constitution. Dr. Flynt makes a very important statement when it comes to Americans and their idea of the importance of their religion and its impact on society.

“If you are a truck diver, a plumber, an electrician or a steel worker and you live in Alabama, you say, ‘Well, I think my religion is the way everybody ought to think,... but, let that same guy move to Salt Lake City, Utah (where the majority is Mormon) or New Jersey or Connecticut (where the majority is Catholic) or Dearborn, Michigan, (where the majority is Muslim), and he won’t think so highly of the idea that the majority of people ought to impose their religious values on the minority.” Even when conservatives leave the comfort of their conservative church, they quickly turn the TV to the right wing news station, Fox News, or set the radio dial to conservatives mouth pieces like Rush Limbaugh, Glenn Beck or Michael Savage. Fox News, owned by billionaire Rupert Murdoch, has been accused of multiple instances where they have taken a far right bias when reporting the news. The "journalists" on Fox News twist facts around to misinform their viewers and push them towards the Republican party. While conservatives hold Fox News close to their hearts, the rest of America can't take them seriously. With conservative talking heads like Bill O'Rielly and Sean Hannity blasting any political position that isn't far right conservatism, independent voters often see through the bias and turn the TV off.

The Republican party and the pundits who support them, use an agenda of fear, channeling the ways of former Republican senator from Wisconsin, Joseph McCarthy. In the 1950s, McCarthy had accused hundreds of Democrats in the United States of being members of the communist party without having any proof of his claims. As the years went on, the American people took McCarthy and his fear agenda as a sad and pathetic joke. The current Republican party goes further than McCarthy did, using what conservatives hold close to them against them, their religion. Republicans push the fear of gays, Muslims, atheists and others who aren't evangelical Christians onto conservatives voters, using those fears to bypass many economic issues that could normally work against them.

Whether it's religion, fear or simply a case of misinformation, conservative voters have been getting the wool pulled over their eyes for years and it's not only affecting them, but the entire country. The Democratic party is far from perfect, but more often than not, their policies represent the best interest of the majority of the American people. Until the media becomes accountable for the truth in their reporting and Americans start to think outside the box and accept that others might have some good ideas, the American people will have to continue to weather the storm of Republican destruction.

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by Anonymousreply 264June 6, 2022 2:06 AM

It helps that too many Americans are ignorant short-sighted morons.

by Anonymousreply 1November 16, 2013 9:33 PM

A lot of liberals do this too, by being so strident and purist and such Debbie-downers, that it turns off Democratic voters (who stay home) and arms Republican voters with additional propaganda.

by Anonymousreply 2November 17, 2013 2:27 AM

R1 R2 - I'm sure you have gotten a lot of support by calling people "sttident" and "morons". That works much better than sound social and economic policies.

by Anonymousreply 3November 17, 2013 2:33 AM

R1 needs to go out and educate these people then

R2 needs to start actually conversion with these said liberals face to face instead of sniping at them online.

by Anonymousreply 4November 17, 2013 2:36 AM

Ignorant rednecks are always going to be ignorant rednecks.

by Anonymousreply 5November 17, 2013 2:48 AM

Pretty straight forward.

You use the media to keep zapping away at the reptilian part of the brain.

fear-hunger-sex-fear-hunger-sex ad nauseum.

It works and they can't keep away from that shit. Keeps the populace jittery and overweight and paranoid.

They'll buy crap, listen to crap, eat crap and vote for crap.

by Anonymousreply 6November 17, 2013 3:21 AM

So many Americans are the dumbest people on the planet. Regan began the dumbing down by bringing the religious right into the picture. Now we've had well over 30 years of dumbing down. In addition I totally believe all the crap in our water and food contributes to the stupidity. Some people, are able to fight it off better.

It's not an accident that so many are so fucking stupid they vote against their interests. It was a plot that began with Reagan and continues to this day.

Now add in the fear, hate and red meat to the racists that they drill into the brains of these already very damaged and stupid people and you have what we have today.

Ask yourself that with all the money Democrats and the DCCC have why they aren't out there engaging the poor to vote and helping those who need ID or even a ride to the polls.

It's because today's Democrats are as afraid of the very poor voting as the Republicans are since both sides are screwing the poor at every term.

by Anonymousreply 7November 17, 2013 3:37 AM

There's no way that Republicans fight to prevent tax hikes on the super rich because they feel some special affinity to them. The tax cutting since the 80s has mostly been about the starve the beast strategy. Of course the strategy has been a colossal failure since spending is supported by borrowing the money instead.

by Anonymousreply 8November 17, 2013 3:53 AM

you have to remember that intelligence is spectrum so the bottom 40% of the spectrum is easily manipulated. GOP voters aren't just low information, they are low intelligence, period. they need the absolutist black and white thinking of the GOP, even when to you and i, it's full of contradictory messages and fallacies. the more nuanced version of life offered by progressives makes their heads hurt.

if we copied the GOP system of scripted, simple, unified talking point messages- even if they make no sense, we'd win more voters. but when you know that life is not a black or white situation, but full of varying shades of gray, short simple messaging isn't quite as easily accomplished.

plus liberals have consciences and empathy, something the GOP leadership lacks, so lying to people and fucking them over just doesn't sit as well, so there is that too.

by Anonymousreply 9November 17, 2013 4:10 AM

It's frustrating even discussing voting with most of these folks. They don't follow WHO is passing WHAT legislation, and they throw thier hands up in the air and say 'they are all the same(polititions and thier parties), when they are NOT.Those that thrive in America are those who have had legislation passed to, allow them to thrive. Same for those that are stuck in poverty. The last 20 years, it's been pretty clear that the Republicans have dismantled protection for middle class America, assaulted unions,reduced oversight in Corporate America, especially those in the Financial business. This has led to unpresidented greed that almost brought the country's financial system down and the government punishes the banks (ie:the little guy)and does nothing to the CEO's that orchestrated the 'fleecing'. The parties are NOT the same, but to get people to pay attention and get informed seems nearly impossible-even though we could change whats happening and the children coming up are gonna inherit a system so stacked against them, well, we will be a 3rd world country.

by Anonymousreply 10October 8, 2014 5:23 PM

Nothing more annoying than someone says "both parties are the same, why bother voting?"

Nothing could be further from the truth.

by Anonymousreply 11October 8, 2014 5:25 PM

No, it is the truth. But it doesn't have to be. It only got that way because people don't vote.

by Anonymousreply 12October 8, 2014 6:16 PM

With the election close, I am sick and tired of all the negative political attack ads on TV (one crook calling the other crook a crook), my mail box is full of useless flyers, and worst yet are the door-to-door canvassers...go away. I can't wait until 11/08/2014.

Please quit using Data Lounge for your own personal get the vote out efforts.

Its easy, if they are the incumbent, vote against them. Turnover reduces corruption.

Partisans, are you going to tell me that Senator Harry Reid is not corrupt. I will laugh at you. Same with Governor Rick Perry of Texas..not corrupt...ha ha. How about Chris Christy of NJ.. or Terry McAuliffe of Virginia.

This country deserves better.

by Anonymousreply 13October 8, 2014 6:48 PM

R10 [quote]unpresidented greed Oh, dear.

by Anonymousreply 14October 8, 2014 6:58 PM

R12, if you think 'both parties are the same', then you're beyond deeply ignorant into deeply brainwashed.

Because NOTHING is further from the truth. It's so blindingly obvious the parties are VASTLY different, that to claim they're "the same" is the height of insanity and delusion.

by Anonymousreply 15October 8, 2014 7:14 PM

The belief that big corporations are looking out for you, the individual, is laughable at best, dire at worst. Vilifying those who are not corporate fatcats (meaning just normal folks trying to make ends meet) is evil

by Anonymousreply 16October 8, 2014 7:20 PM

Some turgid prose here...god, I hope Soros and Brock are paying for this tortured syntax by the word. Conservatives outnumber liberals 2 to 1 in the US. Figure that out and you can begin to comprehend this situation.

by Anonymousreply 17October 8, 2014 8:34 PM

That's not true R17.

by Anonymousreply 18October 8, 2014 8:35 PM

[quote]Conservatives outnumber liberals 2 to 1 in the US.

That's a crock of shite, how's that for prose, asscunt?

by Anonymousreply 19October 8, 2014 8:38 PM

One of the problems is that there are only 2 parties. Because the Democrats mess up sometimes and people don't feel like voting for them, they then make the mistake of picking a worse option of voting Republican because it's the only other alternative.

by Anonymousreply 20October 8, 2014 8:39 PM

Everyone who disagrees with me is stupid.

I majored in Psychology for awhile and I learned about the bell-curve of Intelligence. The posters above are right: Republicans are clearly on the left side of it and Not-Republicans are on the right, the higher IQ area. It's plane science.

by Anonymousreply 21October 8, 2014 8:41 PM

"Plane science"? You sound retarded.

by Anonymousreply 22October 8, 2014 8:47 PM

Thank you for noticing.

by Anonymousreply 23October 8, 2014 9:04 PM

Obama attacks Repubs as party of billionaires as he hosts funraiser for billionaire Democrats who paid $32,000 a plate. Move along nothing to see here said Obama acolytes Warren Buffet an Bill Gates. "Democrats are too poor and stupid to notice things like hyocrisy or irony. They're all in Ferguson looting" joked Obama.

by Anonymousreply 24October 8, 2014 9:09 PM

R24 = a motherfucking idiot

by Anonymousreply 25October 8, 2014 9:13 PM

R25 evidently wasn't invited. It was QUITE the party, and the President was very quippy.

by Anonymousreply 26October 8, 2014 9:16 PM

Not enough people vote--that doesn't get the attention it should. Those who do are the ones who put these right wing rich favoring Repubs because their fears have been pandered to.

If everyone who disagreed with how the Republican Congress handled things voted against them, they'd be out.

But apathy is just as much to blame as ignorance and brainwashing.

by Anonymousreply 27October 8, 2014 11:25 PM

The Fox Tabloid TV station keeps the retards who watch it scared and angry at the Dems. My brother-in-law started watching it when Obama got elected. He's been getting angrier and angrier since then. He broke his kids computer, twice, because he was too rough with it, when he got frustrated. A few weeks ago, he got mad abut something, and was throwing things like a child. I think he's literally losing his mind.

by Anonymousreply 28October 9, 2014 1:45 AM

[quote]Conservatives outnumber liberals 2 to 1 in the US.

Exhibit A on how the powerful have utterly corrupted the system that should be holding them accountable. There's no such thing as a fact in this country anymore. Whatever you choose to believe is the gospel truth, and there are dozens of voices on your TV and online to reinforce how clever and correct you are.

by Anonymousreply 29October 9, 2014 1:52 AM

This article was sponsored by DUH.

by Anonymousreply 30October 9, 2014 3:15 AM

I hereby pledge my undying love for [r19]

by Anonymousreply 31October 9, 2014 3:25 AM

Repugs like to keep people stupid and work them up on false ideals like national pride and religion.

It is absolutely amazing to me that most people are not able to see through this.

by Anonymousreply 32October 9, 2014 3:34 AM

[quote]Conservatives outnumber liberals 2 to 1 in the US.


by Anonymousreply 33October 9, 2014 4:41 AM

Yanks are poorly educated, gullible, naive and easy to manipulate. Chumps most of 'em.

by Anonymousreply 34October 9, 2014 4:50 AM

It's funny when you ask them WHY they vote rethug, they never have an answer. You say, "do you agree that millionaires should pay more taxes than someone making $40K and year?" without fail, they will agree. But ask why they don't VOTE for the people who enact this, they start in on their "jesus, babies, guns" bullshit.

Who really gives a flying fuck about that? Mouth breathing idiots voting against their best interest because they believe Faux Noise.

by Anonymousreply 35October 9, 2014 4:54 AM

But it w wasn't your country who figured out how to cure Ebola R34.

Actually, we don't really know. With the advent of electronic voting it is quite possible that the Republican votes are fake.

by Anonymousreply 36October 9, 2014 4:55 AM

I'm afraid you are correct. We are dreadful when it comes to critical thinking, and that is by design.

It's not for nothing that our national school curriculum is designed in Texas.

which is why even Dems have to resort to designing simple, emotional appeals for votes.

Religion and fear are the handles by which we are throttled into voting. Or something like that.

by Anonymousreply 37October 9, 2014 4:58 AM

[quote]Mouth breathing idiots voting against their best interest because they believe Faux Noise.

Faux intellectuals and smart asses who believe theirs is the real and only TRUTH because they read/heard it in whatever medium confirms their current prejudices.

by Anonymousreply 38October 9, 2014 5:25 AM

ALL of the working class white people I know are flag waving republicans.

by Anonymousreply 39October 9, 2014 5:58 AM

Did anyone she Frontline last night? It was about Cameron Todd Willingham. A man who was convicted and executed for starting a fire that killed his children.

Even though scientific experts on arson have now proven that the fire was not arson, not one of those people in that little Texas town would change their minds about him.

That's what stood out to me. They were just so close-minded and intent on hanging onto their views and opinions, that scientific proof meant nothing to them.

That is what we are talking about. People that stubbornly, willfully, refuse to try and think about things from a different perspective.

I don't see how something like that can ever change.

by Anonymousreply 40October 9, 2014 6:15 AM

[quote]Faux intellectuals and smart asses who believe theirs is the real and only TRUTH because they read/heard it in whatever medium confirms their current prejudices

That doesn't even make sense, LOL!

by Anonymousreply 41October 9, 2014 6:22 AM

When I was in school in Australia, there was a required course called "Clear Thinking". Which taught critical analysis, recognizing alternative options and manipulative text, ad hominem, and non-arguments, etc. I use what I learned way back then to this day.

by Anonymousreply 42October 9, 2014 6:32 AM

Critical thinking is still a major focus of Australian schooling, and from what I understand of the US education system is that critical thinking is actively opposed by many, with elected school board officials minimizing its role.

We only elect our politicians in Australia. Educational decisions are made by experts, not deluded God botherers.

It also seems to be that students in the poorer parts of the US are taught by very low paying individuals without formal qualifications in education.

by Anonymousreply 43October 9, 2014 6:54 AM

"It also seems to be that students in the poorer parts of the US are taught by very low paying individuals without formal qualifications in education."

R43 That was substantially true. In 1930.

by Anonymousreply 44October 9, 2014 7:28 AM

I love this thread. Anytime well-educated, intelligent, worldly people get together and discuss how very stupid are people who disagree with them. A true learning experience for me.

by Anonymousreply 45October 9, 2014 7:29 AM

Always amazed at how many posters comment without actually reading/comprehending any of the posts in the thread.

by Anonymousreply 46October 9, 2014 7:50 AM

I'll usually read 40 or so. After 50, most posts do an R46.

by Anonymousreply 47October 9, 2014 8:13 AM

R44, my sister teaches in a high school in Mississippi. She has a degree but no teaching qualification. She earns about $30K a year.

So, low paying and unqualified. In 2014.

by Anonymousreply 48October 9, 2014 9:05 AM

Neither Australia nor Canada is in a position to complain about stupid American voters.

by Anonymousreply 49October 9, 2014 2:22 PM

Yeah, Australia votes for the Liberal Party and Tony Abbott. At least the US has a progressive chief executive.

by Anonymousreply 50October 9, 2014 2:25 PM

A really great documentary on how the Repugs get people to vote against their interest and where it started is The Boogeyman. It's about Lee Atwater. It is on both Amazon and Netflix. It is excellent and will pissed you off.

by Anonymousreply 51October 9, 2014 3:14 PM

My sister is brainwashed by The Fox Tabloid News. When the Affordable Care Act was discussed, she didn't think we could afford it.

by Anonymousreply 52October 10, 2014 12:41 AM

The ACA cost a lot less than Bush's "Medicare Part D", and was actually funded ... unlike Bush's program which just added to the deficit.

by Anonymousreply 53October 10, 2014 12:51 AM

Repugs employ and motivate their followers to trounce liberals on social media, I am sure. Media Spin doctors like Fox and Rupert Murdoch are in a massive undertaking to drown liberal voices.

Dems should step up their game!

by Anonymousreply 54October 10, 2014 1:01 AM


by Anonymousreply 55October 27, 2014 6:39 PM

As the GOP has only won the popular vote for the presidency once in the last 26 years, I think this is a little outdated. It may have been true in the Reagan/Nixon/Bush years, but not any more as the white working class declines as a percentage of the population and the minority vote increases

by Anonymousreply 56October 27, 2014 6:46 PM



... on which repugs, of course, like to spend the least money on.

by Anonymousreply 57October 28, 2014 10:16 AM

People will vote for Republicans this time because Democrats were in charge after Obama was elected and the country is still in a bad economic situation with 10 million officially unemployed plus those who no longer collect benefits.

by Anonymousreply 58October 28, 2014 11:27 AM

Republicans have no solutions to any of our problems.Their schtick is talking louder than anyone else. Rude, ignorant, and no original thoughts.

by Anonymousreply 59October 28, 2014 11:35 AM

Why isn't there a third party allowed to run in the U.S.A.?? This is what I don't understand.. The same two choices over and over again. Do Republican supporters actually think that the Republican Party cares about those unemployed people and will get them back to work? Apparently these people refuse to believe that the Republican Party only cares about white and wealthy voters. Let's not even get into their aversion to gay people, minorities and women.

by Anonymousreply 60October 28, 2014 11:41 AM

Libertarian is just a code name for old fashioned fascism...rich rule the poor.

by Anonymousreply 61October 28, 2014 11:47 AM

No amount of parties is going to change anything. Money talks in the US.

by Anonymousreply 62October 28, 2014 12:36 PM

R60, third parties are perfectly legal in the United States. Unfortunately our country's federal system and our winner take all elections guarantee the supremacy of our two centrist parties.

by Anonymousreply 63October 28, 2014 2:17 PM

Libertarians are full of shit. They vote for Republicans.

by Anonymousreply 64October 28, 2014 2:39 PM

Republicans caused the 1906 EARTHQUAKE and the BLACK PLAGUE!

by Anonymousreply 65October 28, 2014 2:51 PM

R65, the irony is that it's you dimwits who can't go five mins without going into an hysterical rage and blaming Obama for those things.

When you morons scream about impeaching him over Benghazi and yet were quiet over 3500 killed RIGHT HERE, then I wouldn't attempt to do "performance art" when it's tantamount to an alcoholic attempting to ridicule a teetotaler who drinks egg nog.

It's you idiots who tend to engage in hyperbole. It's your god damned platform at this point.

by Anonymousreply 66October 28, 2014 2:59 PM

Mitch McConnell is behind the EBOLA virus!

by Anonymousreply 67October 28, 2014 3:08 PM

I bathe in John Boehner's booze vomit!

by Anonymousreply 68October 28, 2014 3:15 PM

Oh, I see, R67. I'm dealing with a person who struggles just to maintain a two‐digit IQ...which would make you a MENSA member within the GOP.

It's sad when I'm actually hoping you're just a troll and not some self-loathing person actually attempting to defend the GOP. For your sake, I'm hoping not the latter.

by Anonymousreply 69October 28, 2014 3:27 PM

You can't tell Australians think more clearly from their politicians. And their media is 100% right-wing controlled.

by Anonymousreply 70October 28, 2014 5:08 PM

What R6 says. That's all. Thread closed.

by Anonymousreply 71October 28, 2014 5:32 PM

Not ISIS. Not Ebola. Not climate change. To Republicans, biggest threat facing USA is voters.

by Anonymousreply 72October 29, 2014 1:34 AM

Maybe if the Dems ran as something other than "Republican Lite", people would vote for them.

As it is, they're corporate, MIC sock puppets just like the Republicans.

by Anonymousreply 73October 29, 2014 1:40 AM

By that logic, how do Democrats get so many celebrities and other wealthy people to vote against their own self interests?

Fuck this I can only vote for one party logic is tiresome.

by Anonymousreply 74October 29, 2014 1:41 AM

Listen carefully, R74.

The difference between the Democrats and Republicans is this:

The Republicans represent the rich and the powerful.

The Democrats are the exact opposite. They represent the powerful and the rich.

by Anonymousreply 75October 29, 2014 1:53 AM

Thank you R75! I get it now.

by Anonymousreply 76October 29, 2014 2:11 AM

The belief is that Republicans make it easier for people to become wealthy.

True Republicans might do that, but this generation of Republicans, who run on proof-by-assertion and some ridiculous idea that religion should run politics, clearly do not.

I bet many DLers would hate to see a genuinely decent Republican candidate emerge. It's much better to have something to attack.

by Anonymousreply 77October 29, 2014 2:18 AM

I would love to see a decent Republican on the horizon, r77, but even if there were one, they'd saddle up with the Nazis, homophobes, NRA, wing-nuts, women controlling, oligarchs, and racist compatriots.

So, until all the bad seeds get voted out, the tea potty fades away, I wouldn't even support a decent repub. Because, in the end they all infect each other with their inhumane beliefs.

by Anonymousreply 78October 29, 2014 2:30 AM

Not all Republicans are dummies, but all dummies are Republican.

Nuff said.

by Anonymousreply 79October 29, 2014 2:35 AM

Awww. R79 thinks it's clever.

by Anonymousreply 80October 29, 2014 2:41 AM

[quote]The belief is that Republicans make it easier for people to become wealthy.

And the reality is that they make it easier to increase the wealth of the wealthy by socializing their fuck-ups and privatizing their profits while not extending that same courtesy to the rest of the country.

by Anonymousreply 81October 29, 2014 2:42 AM

R80, I don't think you're in any position to be a snarky tool considering that incredibly stupid post @R74.

You're dumb enough to think idiots with no money who vote for the Republicans are coming from the same place as the wealthy who vote for Democrats.

I'll explain it to you, because you're an idiot (and I say that as someone who is incredibly disappointed with the Democrats): Poor morons who vote for Republicans have delusions of grandeur. They vote under the misguided assumption that one day, they'll be one of the "haves." See: Joe the Plumber for further details.

They also happen to be hypocritical bigots who scream about the govt staying out of people's lives except that they believe in the complete opposite for women and gays and various other minorities.

The rich who vote for Democrats have have accepted the fact that in a civilized society, you pay taxes. They've accepted the fact that they must pay to maintain that civilized society. They also believe in women;s rights, gay rights, etc.

by Anonymousreply 82October 29, 2014 2:51 AM

[quote]You're dumb enough to think idiots with no money who vote for the Republicans are coming from the same place as the wealthy who vote for Democrats.

The discussion was about voting against their own self interests. How was I wrong?

by Anonymousreply 83October 29, 2014 2:54 AM

Because you're attempting to conflate one form of voting against self-interest for selfish reasons with voting against self-interest for altruistic reasons.

by Anonymousreply 84October 29, 2014 3:06 AM

[quote]Because you're attempting to conflate one form of voting against self-interest for selfish reasons with voting against self-interest for altruistic reasons.

Sure. I'll believe that argument when people who vote for altruistic reasons put their money and their time where their mouth is. Voting to spend other people's money doesn't make you a saint.

by Anonymousreply 85October 29, 2014 3:10 AM

[quote] Voting to spend other people's money doesn't make you a saint.

The wealthy who vote Dem are voting to spend THEIR money, not "people's money." They see nothing wrong with taxing the rich because shockingly, they still comprehend that they'll still have a massive amount of wealth leftover.

Seems to me most of the Republicans who bitch about liberals spending "their money" are from red states where they don't even pay enough in taxes to justify that lie. Most red states are at the trough. Blue states pay for them. It's not the other way around, but they sure as hell act like people who are keeping the country afloat.

Do you honestly believe these Republicans who represent shit states incapable of self-sufficiency don't spend MY blue state money on their shit states?

by Anonymousreply 86October 29, 2014 3:21 AM

left over*

by Anonymousreply 87October 29, 2014 3:24 AM

Maher explains -

Offsite Link
by Anonymousreply 88October 29, 2014 11:15 PM

@rupertmurdoch Elizabeth Warren right about middle class hardship, minority misery. Real challenge to @HillaryClinton

by Anonymousreply 89October 30, 2014 1:17 AM

How Have Republicans Served the Poor, the Middle Class, Women or Minorities? They haven't.

by Anonymousreply 90October 30, 2014 2:55 AM

Republicans have the opportunity to take control of a record number of state legislative chambers across the country this year, as Democrats play defense in unfavorable terrain.

The Republican landslide in 2010 and the subsequent redistricting process in 2012 gave the GOP control of a nearly unprecedented number of legislative chambers. Today, the party controls 59 of the 98 partisan chambers in 49 states, while Democrats control only 39 chambers (One legislature, Nebraska’s is officially nonpartisan).

Once election results are tabulated in the 6,049 legislative races on the ballot in 46 states this year, Republicans could find themselves running even more.

If Iowa Democrats can’t hang on to control of the state Senate, Gov. Terry Branstad (R) will be freer to pursue an ambitious agenda. If Arkansas Republicans keep control of the state House and win the governor’s mansion, the future of that state’s unique approach to Medicaid expansion under the Affordable Care Act is at risk. In Kentucky, Sen. Rand Paul (R) could take advantage of a Republican state legislature to change a law that prevents him from running for president and re-election to the U.S. Senate at the same time.

State legislative elections, in which candidates raise little money and generate almost none of the attention given to more prominent contests for U.S. Senate or governor, are especially susceptible to national political trends. In 2010, Republicans picked up more than 700 seats, which amounted to nearly one in 10 legislative seats around the country.

This year, another legislative wave benefiting the GOP is certainly possible, perhaps even likely.

Also on GovBeat: Both parties are happy about early vote data. They’re worried, too.

Voters deeply disapprove of President Obama, with a Washington Post-ABC News poll published this week finding just 43 percent approve of his job performance. Those polled say they would favor a Republican candidate for Congress over a Democrat by a 50 percent to 44 percent margin.

And history argues for GOP gains: In 26 of the 28 midterm elections held since 1900, the party that controls the White House has lost seats.

“For Republicans, the main message point everywhere is, it’s about Obama. There’s not a lot of creativity there,” said Michael Sargeant, executive director of the Democratic Legislative Campaign Committee. “It’s a difficult political environment.

States like New Hampshire, which is closely divided between the two parties, are especially susceptible to national waves. The 400-member state House there, the largest legislative chamber in the nation, has swung wildly in recent years. Democrats control 212 seats today — one of the most vulnerable majorities in the country.

In Washington State, where the Senate majority is controlled by a combination of Republicans and two centrist Democrats, the GOP is poised to gain at least one seat, formally giving them a total majority.

Nevada Democrats control the state Senate by the slimmest possible margin: 11 seats to 10. Republicans, led by popular Gov. Brian Sandoval (R), have poured millions of dollars into building a field operation aimed at retaking the chamber, and early vote numbers show the GOP has made impressive gains that put the chamber at risk. Games - Click Here for More!

In other states, Democrats are defending seats in areas that have changed ideologically. The West Virginia state House, where Democrats hold a 53 to 47 seat majority, is in play as President Obama’s approval rating sinks ever lower among white voters in coal country. And Democrats are defending a 54 to 46 seat majority in the Kentucky state House.

Also on GovBeat: Navajo Nation presidential campaign in turmoil over language requirement.

As Washington stands mired in partisan gridlock, states have undertaken a nearly unprecedented legislative boom. Experts say that’s because so many states are controlled by one party, giving that party free reign to pass ambitious liberal or conservative agendas.

“The states have been pushing the envelope from all directions, and sometimes counter-intuitively,” said Tim Storey, a legislative analyst at the National Conference of State Legislatures. “Immigration, minimum wage, tax increases, tax cuts, environmental legislation, abortion rights, all of those things, you’ve had a real uptick in policy making at the state level.”

But going too far can risk a backlash from voters who want to chart a more moderate path.

Colorado Democrats passed ambitious gun control legislation after taking control in 2012, but voter backlash allowed Republicans to successfully recall two sitting Democratic senators, including the Senate president. Now, Democrats cling to a narrow 18 to 17 seat majority, and Republicans have high hopes for winning back several seats.

“Colorado is a fairly evenly split state, so there’s not a lot of margin there for railroading some extreme policies,” said Bill Cadman, the Republican minority leader of the Colorado Senate. “The trend looks favorable to Republicans. People are generally dissatisfied with the direction the country is going, and whoever is driving that is responsible.” Games - Click Here for More!

Democrats have their own opportunities to win back contested chambers.

In the Arkansas House, Republicans control 51 of 100 seats. If Democratic efforts to turn out new voters pay dividends, that chamber is in play. The party is driving turnout in Iowa, where a closely fought U.S. Senate race is coming down to the wire; Republicans control the state House 53 seats to 47, a margin close enough to be at risk. And Pennsylvania Gov. Tom Corbett (R) trails his Democratic opponent badly in recent polls, putting the GOP’s four-seat Senate majority in play, too.

Still, the national atmosphere has Republicans optimistic they can set new records. The GOP controlled legislatures in 30 states after the 1920 elections, Storey said, their modern high-water mark. Before Election Day 2012, Republicans controlled 62 legislative chambers. To match those marks, the party would need to take control of three chambers — perhaps in New Hampshire, Iowa, Nevada or Kentucky.

If there is a silver lining for Democrats, NCSL’s Storey said, it’s that successively bad midterm elections have the party near its nadir. Ambitiously conservative agendas in states like North Carolina, Georgia and Virginia, all states where Republicans have made recent gains, put Democrats in a position to begin targeting winnable seats once more.

“Whichever state legislative chambers Republicans fail to pick up this Election Day are likely out of the GOP’s reach for a decade,” said Carolyn Fiddler, a Democratic strategist who focuses on legislative seats at The Atlas Project. “Republicans will make their hay while the sun shines this year, but it could be their last chance to do so for quite some time.”

by Anonymousreply 91October 30, 2014 3:04 AM

I'd bet my bottom dollar that republicans give more of their personal wealth and time to charities than democrats. Looking at Biden, Kerry, and Gore vs. Bush (both), Cheney proves the point.

Of course the beauty of being a democrat is you believe the government should fix everything without it affecting your personal wealth.

by Anonymousreply 92October 30, 2014 3:13 AM

r80 is Mitt Romney.

Great to see you, Mitt!

Please run again!

by Anonymousreply 93October 30, 2014 3:17 AM

Citizens requiring Government assistance need it because government has distorted markets with laws favoring high donor cronies who profit from our hardships.

by Anonymousreply 94October 30, 2014 3:19 AM

Not to mention the fact that making people feel their only way to survive is on government benefits is a fantastic way to secure votes.

by Anonymousreply 95October 30, 2014 3:20 AM

The economy ALWAYS grows faster and is stronger under a Democratic Administration in the White House, so wealthy people who vote for Democrats ARE NOT voting against their own interests. r74/80, you are not a big thinker, are you?

by Anonymousreply 96October 30, 2014 3:23 AM

[quote]I'd bet my bottom dollar that republicans give more of their personal wealth and time to charities than democrats. Looking at Biden, Kerry, and Gore vs. Bush (both), Cheney proves the point.

You're fucking psychotic.

Let me explain something to you, sweetheart: Red States ARE our (blue states) charity.

by Anonymousreply 97October 30, 2014 3:27 AM

It's APPALLING how many MILLIONS of dollars the republican party WASTES without any qualms whatsoever...yet FIGHT every PENNY to HELP the NEEDY.

by Anonymousreply 98October 30, 2014 3:28 AM

Did you bother to look up the stats R97? No, you didn't.

by Anonymousreply 99October 30, 2014 3:48 AM

I don't mind conservatives but I wish they were a lot less gullible.

There's an industry, from Fox News to church leaders who amuse themselves by firing off the poor suckers amigdalas every 20 seconds...muslims ZAP, welfare cheats KAPOW, Ebola ZING, gold standard BAM, gay marriage BAZOOM, guns TAC TAC, public schools POW, Wall Street EPA, IRS, FDA.... the poor bastards are being tortured for fun and profit and they don't even know it.

There are entire building dedicated to taking the very best the average conservative believes in...loyalty, hard work, honesty, freedom of choice etc and beating the poor bastards over their heads with it. So they volunteer to "defend freedom" and find themselves cripled for life defending some multinational's profits instead.

It's sad but until conservatives can build up their psychic defenses against this nonsense we will all suffer for it.

by Anonymousreply 100October 30, 2014 3:51 AM

Congressional Republicans have gained six points on Democrats among likely Latino voters according to a new Pew Research Center poll.

Twenty-eight percent of registered Hispanic voters favor or lean towards supporting the Republican congressional candidate, up from 22 percent in 2010.

ADVERTISEMENT Fifty-seven percent favor or lean towards favoring the Democratic candidate in their district, but that is down from 65 percent in 2010.

The shift comes after the Senate approved an immigration bill, which then stalled in the GOP-dominated House.

The White House says President Obama will take executive action on immigration after the midterm elections. Obama angered immigration activists by deciding to punt any executive actions to after Nov. 4.

Of the Latino registered voters who had heard about Obama's decision, a greater share said that they were either disappointed or angry about it than had reacted positively.

Just less than half of the Hispanic registered voters polled by Pew said that a candidate’s opposition to immigration reform was a deal breaker when they went to the polls — assuming they agreed with the candidate on most other issues.

Still, two-thirds said that the issue was extremely important or very important to them.

Latino registered voters were also more likely to blame congressional Republicans for the failure to pass comprehensive immigration reform than they were likely to blame congressional Democrats or Obama.

The importance of the Latino vote has only grown as the Hispanic population in the United States has expanded. Latinos were part of the broad coalition that swept President Barack Obama to reelection in 2012, and Republicans have said that they must do better among Hispanic voters.

The poll was conducted from Sept. 11 to Oct. 9. It surveyed 1,520 Latino adults, of which 733 were registered voters. The interviews took place in English and Spanish on mobile and landline phones. The margin of error for the poll was plus or minus 3 percentage points.

by Anonymousreply 101October 30, 2014 3:51 AM

Republicans want smaller government while exalting corporate control. There is a word for this. It's called Fascism.

by Anonymousreply 102October 30, 2014 4:07 AM

R99? I don't have to look at stats to know Bush and Cheney are anything but "charitable" or do sick people like you just pretend that hundreds of thousands of people who did nothing wrong being killed/maimed by these monsters is acceptable? Your hateful little mind processes the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people so that it's justified.

This is why no one takes you people seriously. EVER.

by Anonymousreply 103October 30, 2014 4:12 AM

R102, not to mention they want the govt out of people's lives...except women and gays don't count as "people."

by Anonymousreply 104October 30, 2014 4:13 AM

Republicans can't stand a president who thinks before he acts. To them, a real leader shoots first and asks questions later.

by Anonymousreply 105October 30, 2014 4:21 AM

One party wants every body to vote while the other wants the opposite. Gee…which to vote for.

by Anonymousreply 106October 30, 2014 4:22 AM

At least they gave something, R103.

by Anonymousreply 107October 30, 2014 4:22 AM

R107, first of all, I knew you'd bring up the drones. No where did I say Obama was "charitable" whereas you have made a point of saying Bush and Cheney of all people are "charitable."

I mean that is just sick. It's no different than the people who say "Hitler loved dogs."

by Anonymousreply 108October 30, 2014 4:29 AM

BTW, they were certainly "charitable" to ISIS.

by Anonymousreply 109October 30, 2014 4:30 AM

The GOP is planning a replay of their last lost decade of devastation and incompetence.

9/11, 4 trillion dollar war, McCain/Palin, mega recession, obstructionism

by Anonymousreply 110October 30, 2014 4:42 AM

I think American voters are unwise enough to vote for a total Republican government in 2016. Hillary is already slipping in polls, and media have turned against her.

by Anonymousreply 111October 30, 2014 10:40 AM

Hope you will all watch the documentaries I posted on this thread linked below.

I really fear that your next election will see another Republican President from voter apathy and we all know what that means. If they get another 8 years in government then the US is absolutely fucked. What's worse is that it trickles down to the other Western countries.

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by Anonymousreply 112October 30, 2014 10:48 AM

Currently, and until the fascist republican's are voted out of their party, Democratic leadership is the only hope for a better future.

by Anonymousreply 113October 30, 2014 12:24 PM

Fuck Red and Blue, both corrupt corporatist shill parties.


by Anonymousreply 114October 30, 2014 2:08 PM

r114=throw away your vote for someone who will never win and help elect radical rightwing bigoted Republicans

by Anonymousreply 115October 30, 2014 2:13 PM

I know stupid white people/rednecks who refuse to get the subsidized benefits of the Affordable Health Care Act (or ObamaCare) - well I am not sure why?

by Anonymousreply 116October 30, 2014 2:37 PM

Not ISIS. Not Ebola. Not climate change. To Republicans, biggest threat facing USA is voters.

by Anonymousreply 117October 30, 2014 3:10 PM

Fuck that, R115.

I'm done voting for the "lesser of two evils" candidates.

by Anonymousreply 118October 31, 2014 12:15 AM

R118 you sound very irrational and politically destructive,

by Anonymousreply 119October 31, 2014 3:53 AM

Overall ... Our stock market does better under a Democrat. Our unemployment does better under a Democrat. Our deficit does better under a Democrat.

And yet somehow, Republicans seem to own those ideas, flying in the face of realty - and the general public tends to believe them.

I simply don't get it.

by Anonymousreply 120October 31, 2014 4:09 AM

R111 Not one poll has shown Hillary losing the national vote, the GOP will have another deeply divisive primary between the conservative and establishment wings while she cruises the Democratic primary with perhaps a token Sanders candidacy she will easily beat. Having separate parties in control of the Oval Office and Congress is actually the norm. If the GOP won the presidency they would likely soon lose Congress in the next mid-terms

by Anonymousreply 121October 31, 2014 8:56 AM

Reading this thread is making me physically sick. I fear here in Michigan that ignorance may give our megalomaniac governor a second term.

I think people vote Republican because it somehow makes them feel they have more power over their lives than is actually the case.

by Anonymousreply 122October 31, 2014 9:20 AM

There is no way on earth Bill is going to allow Hillary to become president. Does anyone think he wants to have his entire presidency overshadowed by being "married" to the first female president? We are in for a shit festival of primaries from both parties.

by Anonymousreply 123October 31, 2014 9:23 AM

The culture wars make people vote Republican. Huge swaths of America view Democrats as atheistic, big city, immoral, socialistic, in patriotic, elitist, gun-hating, and godless. People vote Republican because they view the Party to better represent their tribe. For many, Republicans represent their tribe of White people, God-fearing Christians, gun owners, Southerners, or rural citizens.

by Anonymousreply 124October 31, 2014 10:41 AM

When the GOP voted to stop your unemployment check Democrats gave you a Job ! VOTE

by Anonymousreply 125November 3, 2014 12:29 AM

The GOP corporate cash-hoarding crisis;

Why Your Salary Is FLAT & Not FAT.

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by Anonymousreply 126November 3, 2014 12:33 AM

It amazes me how Americans can be so clueless, oblivious, and stupid. Because you have to be all three at once to willingly and purposely vote for Republicans these days.

by Anonymousreply 127November 3, 2014 12:34 AM

If you mean by their own self interest and voting against allowing every illegal cockroach from Mexico getting amnesty, then yea, I can see why.

by Anonymousreply 128November 3, 2014 12:49 AM

Who is the smallest government spender since Eisenhower? President Obama.

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by Anonymousreply 129November 3, 2014 12:55 AM

r99, you ignorant sow, it's been published in numerous studies that red states take more federal dollars than they pay in taxes, and vice-versa for blue states.

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by Anonymousreply 130November 3, 2014 1:02 AM

R128 is a brainwashed racist moron. Garbage into his brain (via FOX News obviously), garbage out his mouth (in the form of ignorant racist posts like the above)

by Anonymousreply 131November 3, 2014 4:37 AM

GOP’s long history of paranoia and cruelty: Real lessons of the Obama presidency.

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by Anonymousreply 132November 3, 2014 3:19 PM

R99, I'm R97 and like every other right-wing douche, even when presented with a well-known fact (one that has been known for a good ten years at least), you convince yourselves we on the left made it up.

It's so much easier for you to believe the most conservative states in this country are the "real, hard-working 'mercans" while the states with large immigrant populations are the ones that rely on those red states.

BULL. SHIT. is all you right-wing TAKERS are full of when it comes to who is *actually* suckling away on that federal teat.

I would love nothing more than to have red states get a reality check when it comes to federal money. I would love nothing more than to watch them function on the pittance they give to the federal govt while we in the blue states get to keep what we put into the coffer.

Good luck with your red state "utopia."

by Anonymousreply 133November 3, 2014 3:35 PM

People whose moral leader is a Viagra-popping, underage prostitute-screwing, drug addled, shock jock liar actually believe what he says.

by Anonymousreply 134November 3, 2014 5:55 PM

The Left's problem (and I count myself in that group) is that we have never been able to express our positions within the space limitations of a bumper sticker.

Our positions are nuanced, complex, and require a fair amount of back story, explanation, and context, to express why what we propose is superior to that which the Republicans support.

We should take one of our biggest criticisms: that we are elitist intellectuals, and see a kernel of truth in it. Complicated issues require intelligence to dissect, parse, and respond to. Unfortunately, the average Republican has no patience for anything longer than one emotion-laden bumper sticker phrase that stirs the emotions (and bypasses the brain). Yup, this is an elitist statement, but we need to dumb down our message and deliver it in a form that the average American can understand. Until we do, we will get our asses handed to us. :-/

by Anonymousreply 135November 3, 2014 7:00 PM

[There is nothing more tedious than a race baiting troll. Except the people that talk to it.]

by Anonymousreply 136November 3, 2014 8:47 PM

40,000 missing votes (from black counties) in Georgia.

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by Anonymousreply 137November 3, 2014 10:13 PM

I moved to the south and work in a federal agency with some conservative christians. They vote republican because of the right-wing social agenda. One woman listens to Focus on the Family every day and believes that abortion is wrong because these fetuses would grow up to be taxpayers and we wouldn't be so sort of money. She believes that businesses have too many regulations, but when I ask for examples, she can never come up with any. And the guy is a know-it-all who thinks he knows more about everything than anyone. Both vote for candidates who would take their civil service pensions away in a second if they had the chance. They never seem to understand that, especially the guy who lives beyond his means.

by Anonymousreply 138November 3, 2014 10:59 PM

[quote]There is no way on earth Bill is going to allow Hillary to become president. Does anyone think he wants to have his entire presidency overshadowed by being "married" to the first female president? We are in for a shit festival of primaries from both parties.

I think he will be very cool with being the First Gentleman. He may be a lot of things but he isn't a misogynist.

by Anonymousreply 139November 3, 2014 11:10 PM

It is wrong to think that "self interest" is defined by personal Finance issues. Some people think outlawing abortion is the biggest issue. They vote Accordingly. That is their self interest at work. Cultural issues are self interests to many.

by Anonymousreply 140November 4, 2014 2:15 PM

R140, yet they couldn't give a shit what happens to those babies the moment they're born.

by Anonymousreply 141November 4, 2014 2:29 PM

[quote] It is wrong to think that "self interest" is defined by personal Finance issues

True. I have a friend, now in her mid 60's, who has voted Republican her entire life, even though her income has always been modest (even her tax preparer asked why the hell she didn't vote Democratic).

It wasn't until she lost her job and wasn't able to get health insurance (she's in TX, doesn't qualify for Medicaid) and the passage of Obamacare that she flipped. She finally had much-needed knee surgery and is pain-free for the first time in years. She voted for Wendy Davis today.

But her evil family, good Christians that they profess to be, all still vote Republican, even though they know the lack of Medicaid expansion under Perry, and Abbott if he wins, will cost her money every month, and could ultimately lead to the repeal of the Affordable Care Act.

And don't even get me started on the gay issue.

by Anonymousreply 142November 4, 2014 2:34 PM

[quote] Some people think outlawing abortion is the biggest issue.

Such people are called "fucking morons".

The number of abortions is highest in red states, lowest in blue states, and always falls under Democrats.

Republicans CLAIM to hate abortion but mostly they ban everything that REDUCES abortions (like family planning, contraception, sex education, maternal leave and child support, etc)

by Anonymousreply 143November 4, 2014 3:07 PM

31 cases of voter impersonation since 2000.

83 Americans are killed by a firearm EVERY DAY.

Guess which problem the GOP is trying to fix.

by Anonymousreply 144November 4, 2014 10:25 PM

This election cost $4 BILLION dollars, so you can imagine the scale of rapine they are planning.

by Anonymousreply 145November 4, 2014 10:29 PM

EXACTLY, r145.

by Anonymousreply 146November 4, 2014 10:31 PM

Obama better get out his veto pen.

by Anonymousreply 147November 4, 2014 10:33 PM

The "most expensive mid-term election in history", NONE of that money went to enhance the lives of people voting...

Our politics are nit for the people. They are for the few.

by Anonymousreply 148November 4, 2014 10:40 PM

W&W for R144!

by Anonymousreply 149November 4, 2014 11:51 PM

Republican Voters ARE Angry, Theyre The Most Easily Manipulated & Riled Up & They Respond Most To Lies & Dogwhistles!

by Anonymousreply 150November 6, 2014 11:30 AM

Americans are stupid gullible mindless ignorant sheep... and Republicans know how to manipulate such people.

Liberals/Progressives/Democrats are smarter, more intelligent, more informed ... and make the mistake of assuming everyone else can easily see reason and logic and understands the basic facts on the ground.

by Anonymousreply 151November 6, 2014 1:59 PM

Republicans exemplify "cognitive dissonance." It's why these idiots can scream about welfare as they're collecting it.

by Anonymousreply 152November 6, 2014 2:04 PM

Republicans now have total control (legislature and governor) of 24 states; Democrats control just 6

by Anonymousreply 153November 6, 2014 2:12 PM

I hope the Republicans do try to take away healthcare from the morons who voted for them. I hope karma gets these stupid assholes.

I hate the Democrats, too. A bunch of pussies. Sick of 'em.

by Anonymousreply 154November 6, 2014 2:16 PM

Fact: 9 of the 10 poorest states are "Red" Republican-run states.

Fact: 97 of the 100 poorest counties are "Red" Republican-run counties.

Fact: When the GOP took over Wisconsin, it was in the top 10 of nearly every state ranking. Since they took over, that state has plummeted into the bottom 10 of nearly every state ranking.

Republicans are clearly no good for economies, for average people, and DEFINITELY no good at actual 'governing'.

No matter how good they are at winning (I should say "winning" with the amount of cheating, lying, gerrymandering, intimidating, and fraud that does on in how they win) elections, they SUCK at governing.

by Anonymousreply 155November 6, 2014 2:16 PM

KANSAS CITY, Mo. (AP) — State capitols across the country will be more Republican than at any point since the Roaring '20s when victorious legislators and governors take office next year. That could result in lower taxes and perhaps fewer dollars flowing to social safety net programs.

by Anonymousreply 156November 6, 2014 2:45 PM

It's obvious and expected for Republicans to lay it on thick with the race baiting, gun baiting, gay baiting propaganda as well as their contempt for minimum wage and other social safety nets.

But I get even more irritated when I see Democrats boastfully distancing themselves from Obama at a critical time when we all need to be sticking together. Them, and Libertarians are also responsible for creating a lot of apathy among liberals, with all their "why bother voting?" bitching and moaning.

Democrats outnumber Republicans in the US, there is no reason we couldn't have beat them if we all would have got out there and voted.

by Anonymousreply 157November 6, 2014 2:58 PM

America's political system is the best that money can buy.

by Anonymousreply 158November 6, 2014 3:00 PM

How did 90% of these ass clowns get re-elected when they went into these elections with a 10% approval rating?!

by Anonymousreply 159November 6, 2014 3:00 PM

If your Republican legislature stops you as an eligible citizen from #voting, what is the term "elected officials" supposed to mean to you?

by Anonymousreply 160November 6, 2014 3:58 PM

That should read 'How Demoncrats Get Certain Americans to Vote Against their Self-Interests.' And we all know how they go about it.

I'm a member of a group that has had large gains in entrepreneurship rates over the last 20 years. I'd also like to strike out on my own and experience the FREEDOM of being a business owner. I'm pretty sick of my low-paying, dead-end civil service job. Liberals back unions that hurt my community and they keep the very few high-paying private sector jobs still left in liberal states for themselves. But Republicans are [....[. I'm also for school choice. I'd like to send my child to a school that actually has books, not completely falling apart and has quality teachers ( and teachers older than 19). But the Republicans are [....]. Well, that's what liberals want me to think.

by Anonymousreply 161November 6, 2014 10:19 PM

You're a fucking moron R161.

by Anonymousreply 162November 6, 2014 10:25 PM

But not a liar.

by Anonymousreply 163November 6, 2014 10:36 PM

Both a Republicans and Democrats get people to vote against their interests. They do it through fear, numbing the people with shopping for cheap sweatshop goods and slogans like liberty, freedom, democracy, America #1, The-Greatest-Country-in-the-World.

As R145 pointed out, the elections cost 4B. You can be sure the corporations that invested this amount in the candidates of both the parties will get this investment back, plus profit, from the public coffers. They are businessmen; they have done the math.

It goes on and on. Round and round. Dem-rep-dem-rep. A well greased and entrenched system. The looting rises until the system crashes. Then the elected representatives put in place step up to do their job by bailing the corporations out on the public dime. Then it starts all over again.

Pretty nifty huh?

by Anonymousreply 164November 6, 2014 11:20 PM

No you are a liar R161. Do you know that more than a million people leave Florida every year because there are no jobs for ambitious college educated young people? Sure lots of failures and old people move in, but if you do well in school in Florida, you have to leave to make a career in some "liberal" state.

And this has been true for several generations and hasn't changed despite the conservative takeover of our government.

by Anonymousreply 165November 6, 2014 11:31 PM

The ones that horrified me the most was Scott winning in FL and Walker winning in WI. This country is filled with people who are scary stupid. They are taking us all down with them.

by Anonymousreply 166November 6, 2014 11:39 PM

R165 - got some documentation on that astounding fact?

by Anonymousreply 167November 6, 2014 11:40 PM

R164 Dubya did not bail out Lehmans, the Tea Party would have let all the banks go bust and indeed the House of Reps initially voted down the bailout. There is also always the Green Party

by Anonymousreply 168November 6, 2014 11:47 PM

[quote]Both a Republicans and Democrats get people to vote against their interests.

Sigh. More bullshit false equivalency from R164. How stupid do you have to be?

by Anonymousreply 169November 6, 2014 11:48 PM

Well it's gone down along with all migration owing to the difficulty of finding jobs in other places, but Florida still had an outmigration of 427,000 in 2010. Only California had more people leaving. Texas was No. 3 and for much the same reason.

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by Anonymousreply 170November 7, 2014 12:01 AM

We live in a country so profoundly ignorant and corrupt that it just re-elected the worst Congress in history.

by Anonymousreply 171November 7, 2014 1:47 PM

What R171 said.

by Anonymousreply 172November 7, 2014 7:55 PM

A new study from Princeton spells bad news for American democracy—namely, that it no longer exists.

Asking "[w]ho really rules?" researchers Martin Gilens and Benjamin I. Page argue that over the past few decades America's political system has slowly transformed from a democracy into an oligarchy, where wealthy elites wield most power.

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by Anonymousreply 173November 7, 2014 8:05 PM

So what has to be done to reverse the oligarchy?

by Anonymousreply 174November 7, 2014 8:25 PM

This American Election summarized:

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by Anonymousreply 175November 7, 2014 10:17 PM

Follow the money and don't be a sap R169. Unless you're in the 1%, in which case we understand, though do not necessarily admire, your position. Read the Princeton article that R173 has posted.

by Anonymousreply 176November 8, 2014 4:32 AM


by Anonymousreply 177November 8, 2014 5:25 AM

Third party R60? We should be grateful if we had two.

by Anonymousreply 178November 8, 2014 9:28 AM

That was not the only bail out R168. Look up the S&L crisis in the late 1980s under Bush Sr.

by Anonymousreply 179November 8, 2014 9:31 AM

I'm in the middle of a Facebook argument with a distant (thankfully) relative who thinks Ben Carson is the political messiah. And this is a guy with a Masters degree. No fact or argument seems to shake him from the belief that Ben "Obamacare is worse thing since slavery" Carson will fix what ails America.

I blame the lack of teaching critical thinking skills in schools.

by Anonymousreply 180November 8, 2014 9:39 AM

[quote]Democrats outnumber Republicans in the US, there is no reason we couldn't have beat them if we all would have got out there and voted.

Are there any actual stats about this sort of thing? I hear "it's your fault for not voting" all the time but can't for the life of me find any actual statistics that prove this to be true. I wonder if it really is?

For instance, Think Progress notes Latino voters registered Dem voted Repub in large numbers. WaPo says the only group of registered voters who increased recently were Indies, not registered Rep or Dem, yet they voted Republican in record numbers.

Maybe getting out the vote, as it were, ISN'T the whole solution?

by Anonymousreply 181November 8, 2014 10:10 AM

Hey OP, there are other issues involving us. It's not always about who you're fucking up the ass.

by Anonymousreply 182November 8, 2014 11:07 AM

They will never grasp that, R181. Liberals and Obama think that their base stayed home simply because they were too lazy to vote. They stayed home because they've become dissatisfied with the direction their party is going. Exit polls show that more than half of all legal Hispanics oppose amnesty. Why? Because it would hurt their community. Yet Obama and the libs are going to press on with the amnesty thing and punish their base. I hope he goes through with it only because it will destroy the democrats.

by Anonymousreply 183November 8, 2014 4:47 PM

So you are using an exit poll which applies to people who vote to figure out why people didn't vote? Do you really not see the logic problem there?

by Anonymousreply 184November 8, 2014 4:58 PM

I'm not trying to figure out why people didn't vote. I'm asking how much difference statistically (not anecdotally) registered Democrats staying home really made. How many stayed home, first of all, then how many, if they HAD voted, wouldn't have voted Dem anyway.

My post is pretty clear. Are you being deliberately obtuse just to cause an argument? Surely you have better things to do on a Saturday morning.

by Anonymousreply 185November 8, 2014 5:02 PM

Liberals are the worst when it comes to logic. Your party insinuates that your base is lazy, ignorant, and stupid based on nothing more than your gut feeling and you want to talk about logic? I'm using exit polls to show what your base thinks of your party.

by Anonymousreply 186November 8, 2014 5:06 PM

You said:

"They stayed home because they've become dissatisfied with the direction their party is going."

And then went on to talk about exit polls.

The logic inference is that one has something to do with the other.

But if not, you have simply made an unsupported assertion about why they stayed home (direction of the party).

by Anonymousreply 187November 8, 2014 5:06 PM

Polling of those who voted says nothing about why others didn't vote.

by Anonymousreply 188November 8, 2014 5:10 PM

I trust exit polls more than gut feelings and generalizations. If the majority of those who did vote do not agree with certain democratic positions, one can infer that these feelings aren't exactly isolated.

by Anonymousreply 189November 8, 2014 5:18 PM

You don't get it.

All you know is the majority of persons who identify as Hispanics and voted are against amnesty. You do not know what percentage of Hispanics voted. Therefore you can't know what percentage of Hispanics are for or against amnesty.

by Anonymousreply 190November 8, 2014 5:22 PM

No I do get it.

I never even claimed any of those things that you've suggested. Democrats keep insinuating ( or saying it right out) that their base didn't turnout in higher numbers because they're lazy and ignorant. I've suggested that it doesn't have anything to do with being stupid or uniformed. I believe they are dissatisfied with the party's positions. It's interesting to me that you seem a little surprised that the majority of Hispanics aren't for amnesty. This isn't exactly news. Sixty percent of Hispanics support enforcement before amnesty. Why would they support something that will hurt their community? Your base doesn't support amnesty. Check out what happened in liberal Oregon. Hispanics were 8 percent of the electorate.

by Anonymousreply 191November 8, 2014 5:49 PM

"Sixty percent of Hispanics support enforcement before amnesty."

You are now citing a GOP poll and ridiculously skewing it.

“Among all Hispanics, six in ten, 60%, support granting legal status to those already here only when the 90% goal is reached; 32% oppose,” GOP pollster John McLaughlin’s group said in a release. “Among Hispanic voters, 60% support, 34% oppose.”


Selective reading of a biased poll. Typical freeper bullshit.

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by Anonymousreply 192November 8, 2014 5:55 PM

New study:

[bold]Americans will vote for Republicans even though they disagree with them on everything[/bold]

... isn't that pretty much the definition of stupidity?

Anyway, see link for the article:

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by Anonymousreply 193November 8, 2014 5:57 PM

Isn't the 90 percent goal called enforcement? See what I said about liberals and logic?

by Anonymousreply 194November 8, 2014 5:59 PM

Liberals & progressives understand logic.

Conservatives & Republicans have no fucking clue what it even is.

by Anonymousreply 195November 8, 2014 6:02 PM

If Hispanics were really against amnesty and this fact was actually hurting the Democratic Party, there is no chance Freeperland would be telling them.

by Anonymousreply 196November 8, 2014 6:03 PM

[quote]Americans will vote for Republicans even though they disagree with them on everything

because RACISM. convince people that the black and brown people are the problem, and they'll buy the rest of the agenda without thinking any of it through. hitler proved this theory well with the jews.

by Anonymousreply 197November 8, 2014 6:08 PM

School choice has proven to be an effective way to reduce the achievement gap ( which would alleviate a lot of the social/economic problems in poor, minority communities) yet liberals oppose it because they feel that teacher's jobs are more important and that only the wealthy should have school choice and you want to talk about logic?

R196, I'm only saying it because I know it will be the end of your party and there's nothing that you can do about it.

by Anonymousreply 198November 8, 2014 6:13 PM

That's your battle cry, R197! It's sad that so many actually believe this. Demoncrats are the real racists but have so many fooled.

by Anonymousreply 199November 8, 2014 6:17 PM

Reduce and ELIMINATE.

by Anonymousreply 200November 8, 2014 6:20 PM

Freep freep freep freep freep freep!

by Anonymousreply 201November 8, 2014 6:20 PM

No, R198. Voucher programs have pretty much failed, and Liberals oppose it because it takes public taxdollars and diverts it from public schools that need it into private religious schools that indoctrinate kids with specific religious teachings and who DON'T need it.

Conservatives are such willfully ignorant boneheaded morons. It's just so disgusting and repugnant to listen to their twisted bullshit.


by Anonymousreply 202November 8, 2014 6:27 PM

R201 Idiot Idiot Idiot Idiot....

by Anonymousreply 203November 8, 2014 6:31 PM

Nowadays they are trying to use vouchers for private tutoring meaning even LESS money for schools.

by Anonymousreply 204November 8, 2014 6:34 PM

June 6, 2012 - Closing the Gap: MEAP Results Show That African-American Students Perform Better in Charter Schools

LANSING, Michigan (June 6, 2012) – An analysis of 2011-2012 MEAP results reveals that African-American students perform better in charter schools than in traditional public schools in both math and reading – in every grade. The findings also show that charter schools continue to outperform traditional public schools in most of the state’s largest urban areas, including Detroit.

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by Anonymousreply 205November 8, 2014 6:36 PM

Great Schools Can Close the Achievement Gap: Harlem Children's Zone Promise Academy Charter School

This research showed that schools alone have the power to close the achievement gap. The effects of attending the HCZ middle school are enough to close the black-white achievement gap in mathematics, and the effects of attending the HCZ elementary school are large enough to close the racial achievement gap in both mathematics and English Language Arts (ELA). Most importantly, we identified evidence that implies that these effects were driven by the high-quality schools. This, combined with other charter school research, suggests that high-quality schools are enough to significantly increase academic achievement among the poor, without requiring changes to students’ communities.

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by Anonymousreply 206November 8, 2014 6:39 PM

That's from a charter school website! How stupid are you?

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by Anonymousreply 207November 8, 2014 6:42 PM

Don't believe it. Not at all. Charter Schools "succeed" by only taking A students. They create violence from conflicting loyalties in underprivileged neighborhoods. Since charter schools were adopted many states report increasing scores, but overall national scores on tests not linked to school funding show no improvement, and indeed decline. Furthermore US performance on international tests is declining. Charter schools and the testing regime are a scam, nothing more.

by Anonymousreply 208November 8, 2014 6:43 PM

The cost of Administration Per Pupil for Michigan’s Charter Schools is nearly twice that of Michigan’s Public School Districts.

The cost of Administration as a Percent of Expenditures for Michigan’s Charter Schools is twice that of Michigan’s Public School Districts in four of the last six years.

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by Anonymousreply 209November 8, 2014 6:43 PM

For the fifith consecutive year, 100% of the seniors from Urban Prep's Englewood and West campuses and the inaugural graduating class from its Bronzeville Campus have been accepted to four-year colleges and universities.

Students from all three campuses, faculty, parents and other special guests, including Chicago Mayor Rahm Emanuel, celebrated the momentous occasion with an assembly on Tuesday, April 8, 2014. Seniors from the class of 2014 have been accepted to over 186 colleges and universities, and have amassed over $11 million in scholarships and grants.

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by Anonymousreply 210November 8, 2014 6:43 PM

So if the schools improve 5 points on a test (that we've made easier from year to year) then it's worth the hundreds of children shot in splintered communities by divided school loyalties?

by Anonymousreply 211November 8, 2014 6:44 PM

Michigan’s Public Schools outperformed Charter Schools on the MEAP Math test (grades 4 and 7) and the MEAP Reading test (grades 4 and 7) over the last four years by 9 to 22 percentage points.

Michigan’s Public School District Students outperformed Charter School Students on the MEAP Math test (grades 3 through 8) and the MEAP Reading test (grades 3 through 8) for both Fall 2010 and Fall 2011 by 10 to 15 percentage points.

Genesee County’s public school districts also outperform Genesee County’s charter schools on standardized tests.

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by Anonymousreply 212November 8, 2014 6:44 PM

Choice Schools Boost College Enrollment for African American Students 24 Percent

[Madison, Wisc...] African American students who took advantage of a school choice program during elementary and high school were 24 percent more likely to enroll in college.

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by Anonymousreply 213November 8, 2014 6:45 PM

Tobacco companies used to publish health data about the benefits of smoking too.

Of course there are "studies" showing improvement. Your tax dollars are paying for otherwise unemployable conservatives to make those "studies."

by Anonymousreply 214November 8, 2014 6:46 PM

And I think it's hilarious that the libs are pretending that teacher's unions have nothing to do with their opposition to school choice ( which again they feel should be reserved only for the wealthy).

by Anonymousreply 215November 8, 2014 6:46 PM

Again, if you skim off the top students and compare them to those they leave behind you are intentionally skewing the results.

by Anonymousreply 216November 8, 2014 6:47 PM

R215, claiming that liberals think "school choice only belongs to the wealthy" exposes you as a manipulative, deceitful propagandist. Because no liberal believes any such thing. That's twisted spin on your part, nothing more.

by Anonymousreply 217November 8, 2014 6:48 PM

R215=Republican racist fraud.

Schools aren't just for children. They are for communities. Eliminating the public school in favor of Sylvan Learning Center and the rest is destroying this country's future.

by Anonymousreply 218November 8, 2014 6:48 PM

Teachers' unions, not teacher's unions.

And nothing that you say about Democratic motivation is anything but a made-up Freeper lie.

by Anonymousreply 219November 8, 2014 6:49 PM

The excuses are quite funny.

by Anonymousreply 220November 8, 2014 6:49 PM

Do you know what charter schools prove? They prove that involved parents matter, not that public schools suck.

by Anonymousreply 221November 8, 2014 6:57 PM

There's that battle cry, R218. You allow poor, minority children to languish in under-performing, unequal, run-down public schools for generations , taking away alternative options for so many, yet you have the nerve to call me racist, R218? That's funny.

No it's accurate, R217. Poor people can't afford to purchase homes in wealthy communities with great schools since they're poor and all.

by Anonymousreply 222November 8, 2014 6:58 PM

I think schools with no books and busted windows are pretty sucky, R221.

by Anonymousreply 223November 8, 2014 6:59 PM

R222, full of spin and half-truths and deception and propaganda... trying to paint a picture that hides the real problems, and who supports a "solution" that is worse than the disease.

by Anonymousreply 224November 8, 2014 7:09 PM

So take it up with the local authorities. Despite what you might think, unions do not actually fund or run schools.

by Anonymousreply 225November 8, 2014 7:11 PM

No one is more dissatisfied with Obama and most Democrats than I am but I grit my teeth, held my nose and voted for the lesser of two evils. The worst Democrat, like Cuomo who I voted for (not in the primary when I voted for another Democrat but last Tuesday) is better than the best Republican.

by Anonymousreply 226November 8, 2014 7:54 PM

Back up...what did you think that poll said about Hispanics? --------------- But pollsters with Latino Decisions said the national exit poll can’t be trusted on Hispanic voting because the sample isn't representative of Latino voters and the vast majority of interviews are conducted in English.

“The sampling design on the national exit poll is not intended to get accurate or representative samples of subgroups like Latinos or Asians,” Matt Barreto, the co-founder of Latino Decisions, told The Huffington Post in an email. “It is just simply not their objective.”

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by Anonymousreply 227November 8, 2014 9:50 PM

r199 [quote]That's your battle cry, [R197]! It's sad that so many actually believe this. Demoncrats are the real racists but have so many fooled.

yes, it is democrats who are racist. my bad.

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by Anonymousreply 228November 9, 2014 2:50 AM

It's hilarious every time some right-winger tries to accuse Democrats of being "the real racists"... so much pathological projection going on.

No, hon. Sorry. The racists are all conservatives. Always have been. You can try to project your own flaws on the rest of us, but the only person you're fooling is yourself.

by Anonymousreply 229November 9, 2014 3:05 AM

You are the party of slavery and Jim crow laws yet you're constantly calling other people racist. I resent that accusation, especially from a wild pack of liberal liars. The Republican party is the party of solutions for minorities. The demoncrats are the party of ineffective programs/policies and dependency.You need minorities to be dependent and unequal in order to use your scare tactics to win their votes. You fail them over and over again but use racial divisions to scare them into voting for you. You are well aware that school choice would solve nearly all ( if not all) of the social and economic problems in poor, minority communities. Yet you deprive them of that opportunity. You don't want the achievement gap closed because minorities would no longer need you and would no longer fall for your dirty tricks and condescension.

Will Hurd's win must sting a little. A BLACK conservative ( and we know how much you love black conservatives) winning in a largely HISPANIC district! I love it.

by Anonymousreply 230November 9, 2014 5:04 PM

So the exit polls are inaccurate because they interviewed legal Hispanic citizens instead of illegals, R227? That's funny.

by Anonymousreply 231November 9, 2014 5:27 PM

R231, you're a fucking moron.

by Anonymousreply 232November 9, 2014 6:18 PM

"So the exit polls are inaccurate because they interviewed legal Hispanic citizens instead of illegals, [R227]? That's funny."

No. They selectively chose where to interview. And self-selected out any persons who didn't understand English. In other words, it was a biased poll.

by Anonymousreply 233November 9, 2014 6:24 PM

I think we should do away with the "R" and "D" labels. This would be a great first step in cleaning out congress. Each candidate actually has to say what he or she is for without the label.

by Anonymousreply 234November 9, 2014 10:35 PM

[quote]You are the party of slavery and Jim crow laws yet you're constantly calling other people racist.

Hey, speaking of Jim Crow laws, how did that minority voter suppression work out for your guys this year? Sounds like it helped push the GOP candidate over in at least five states....

Oh, and fuck off, you clueless twat.

by Anonymousreply 235November 9, 2014 10:46 PM

[quote] You (Democrats) are the party of slavery and Jim crow laws

Everything changed under FDR, then changed again under LBJ. R230's accusation is silly.

by Anonymousreply 236November 9, 2014 10:49 PM

R236, ignore that moron.

He doesn't realize that the one constant is that CONSERVATIVES are the ideology of slavery, jim crow laws, attacking voting rights, racism, homophobia, misogyny, etc.

Sure, back in the late 1800s, there were lots of conservative democrats.

Republicans at the time were the PROGRESSIVE party.

That changed over time. But for a long time, both parties had both conservatives and liberals in them. Teddy Roosevelt was a progressive Republican (before leaving the GOP for the Bull Moose party).

After the civil rights act of the 60s, all the racists fled the Democrats, and the GOP welcomed them with open arms throughout the 70s ("The Southern Strategy").

But today's Republicans love to live in denial... and try to paint TODAY'S democrats with the sins of TODAY'S republicans.

by Anonymousreply 237November 9, 2014 10:54 PM

Charter schools are failed conservative social engineering. In fact, we knew that had failed before they were adopted nationwide, but we did it anyway. Why? Because Republicans are counting on campaign funds from private education companies. That's really the only reason they ever got behind this.

by Anonymousreply 238November 9, 2014 11:12 PM

[quote]today's Republicans love to live in denial... and try to paint TODAY'S democrats with the sins of TODAY'S republicans.


by Anonymousreply 239November 9, 2014 11:35 PM

What makes this Republican wave so horrible is the totality of the tide. State legislatures and governments are even more Republican and conservative now than they were before. Republicans are gonna wreck havoc in state governments like never before. Moreover, these state officials will run and likely rise to higher office. Democrats have a lack of a farm team waiting in the wings in state offices to recruit for Congress and President.

by Anonymousreply 240November 10, 2014 1:06 AM

Thinking back to the headline question in OP's post...

So here's from someone who's not from or in United States:

My idea is that after census results are released (most recently in and around 2010/2011), all gerrymandering breaks loose, and only falls into place by about year six after the census, which is when the second mid-term elections happen, and the Democrats win again by taking Congress and the White House after that.

Whereas right after the census it's the Republicans who win, because Democrat populations are always dispersed across most counties, leaving a dominant number of Republican populations in each county. At least, until gerrymandering inevitably happens and then ends for a time. (Had a sidethought that Republicans will redistrict at the earliest opportunity right after the census.)

Redistricting is done by both parties (D & R), and by year six after the census, there is effectively nothing much to gerrymander anymore, because it's all been done by then, and the unintended side-effect for the Republicans is, that more counties end up having Democrat majorities.

That's one of the reasons why political choices of Americans alternate between Democrat and Republican like a clockwork.

The current political system in the U.S. has stagnated so much, that new progressive parties with ideas better even than those of Democrats are not given any chance. The country is still divided.

Neither is voting on divisive issues (abortion, gay rights, universal healthcare, privacy and the Fourth Amendement, etc.) compartmentalized enough, that when voting for or against one thing, voters might inadvertently choose a leader who is very prone to making policy mistakes in other areas that damage the nation to such an extent that the next leader is unable to clean up the mess, as is now the case.

One such example is voting against abortion ('pro-life') in 2000, then getting the War in Iraq and permitting massive violations of the 4th Amendment of the Constitution.

In other cases, the best possible (for some, now 'the least worst') candidate gets to the White House, but in that case the externality is "we have to give up some privacy in order to get some security".

Another trait of U.S. voters is directing all blame on their president, even it's the ineffectual Congress or some other reason that is at fault. Sometimes it's because politicians philander (1998), and sometimes it's just plain racism at play.

Given that Congress has such a low approval rating, then strangely, most of the same people reappear election after election. Any meaningful change would then happen after a generational shift, but would it then be too little too late?

Yes, Congress and the President from time to time do make the right decisions. If sometimes only by accident and happenstance.

by Anonymousreply 241November 10, 2014 7:28 AM

Republicans are creating huge institutional barriers to keeping Democrats from gaining power, from eviscerating the Voting Rights Acts, to voter id laws, to gerrymandering, to Citizens United. Dems will be lucky to get Congress back anytime before 2032.

by Anonymousreply 242November 10, 2014 11:55 AM

[bold]The 10 Step Republican Process for Creating the Perfect Mindless Conservative Zombie:[/bold]

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by Anonymousreply 243November 10, 2014 2:10 PM

[bold]The Republican Party and the Great Conservative Long Con:[/bold]

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by Anonymousreply 244November 10, 2014 2:11 PM

Listen Jefferson Davis. Hispanics were 8% of the electorate and blacks were 12% of the electorate. That doesn't sound very suppressed.

R238= tenured public school teacher.

by Anonymousreply 245November 10, 2014 3:40 PM

It doesn't hurt that most Americans are kept completely ignorant about how things work (Civics isn't taught in schools any more) and distracted (reality TV and tabloid news).

Ignorant and distracted people are easier to manipulate & deceive.

by Anonymousreply 246November 11, 2014 2:14 AM

[quote]Listen Jefferson Davis. Hispanics were 8% of the electorate and blacks were 12% of the electorate. That doesn't sound very suppressed.

Just for you, Stepin Fetchit.

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by Anonymousreply 247November 11, 2014 2:23 AM

Obamacare premiums are falling by 0.2% across 48 major cities:

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by Anonymousreply 248November 11, 2014 4:29 PM

Anybody can get a God damned ID, R247. It's not a hardship. If you want to vote get an ID. If it's good enough for Canada it's good enough for us ( or are the Canadians vote suppressors as well?). Stop treating adults like infants.

by Anonymousreply 249November 12, 2014 1:37 AM

r240, perhaps you should act a bit more like an adult yourself, which includes telling the truth:

"Canada permits any voter who lacks one of the allowed forms of photo identification to present two of forty-five other forms of identification or documentation that have the voter’s name and address on at least one. Acceptable documents include leases, student transcripts, and utility bills.”

The cost of ID required for the American laws is estimated at $75 to $175. The illegal poll tax would run about $11 today.

r249, you seem very comfortable with voter suppression.

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by Anonymousreply 250November 12, 2014 2:19 AM

R249 typifies "privilege" ... insisting something isn't a problem, because it's not a problem for HIM.

Arrogantly ignorant, and damn proud of it. Typical moronic conservative.

by Anonymousreply 251November 12, 2014 2:28 AM

i lost my birth certificate years ago. what would i so if i needed to get ID specifically to vote, i'd have to pay $50 to get a copy of my birth certificate- which won't be easy without ID, and i'd have to do it months in advance of the election. then get someone to drive me to the nearest DMV which is 1 1/2 hours away and open weekdays only, due to budget cuts. i guess both my ride and i will have to call in sick to work that day too since the wait at the DMV is 2-3 hours, again due to budget cuts. then, when i finally get to the DMV clerk, she tells me i have to bring in a utility bill in my name, which i don't have because the apartment i share is in my roommates name, so i guess i just don't vote.

fuck you, r249.

by Anonymousreply 252November 12, 2014 4:26 AM

While Texans have always welcomed newcomers, they have never liked invasions. They didn’t like it when Santa Anna did it in 1835. They didn’t like it when the Yankees did it during the Civil War and Reconstruction. And it’s pretty clear from the midterm election results that they definitely didn’t like it when Jeremy Bird and his team of Obama organizers known as “Battleground Texas” did it in 2013.

Two weeks ago, Democrats took a walloping in Texas. Wendy Davis, the Lone Star State’s Democratic star a year ago, got just 38.9 percent of the vote—some 283,000 votes fewer than the party’s gubernatorial candidate four years ago and 200,000 less than Democratic Texas Gov. Ann Richards obtained in her losing re-election effort nearly two decades before that. Even more disappointing: Davis got more votes and a higher percentage of the vote than any of the other 11 Democratic candidates on the statewide ballot.

Yes, it was a bad year for Democrats across the country, but you can’t blame the GOP landslide in Texas purely on President Obama, the Islamic State and the “national mood.” Why did Battleground Texas—so sure a year ago that it could make the Sunbelt state competitive for Democrats—fail? Is the possibility of a purple Texas gone forever? Was it ever really there?


In January 2013, Jeremy Bird, the former field director for the Obama campaign, announced the formation of Battleground Texas to much fanfare and media attention. Backed by a number of major Democratic donors, the new effort was committed to turning Texas blue by rebuilding party infrastructure, recruiting strong candidates, registering new voters and turning out those whose voting history was erratic at best. Bird would be the overall strategist and spokesman for the effort while Jenn Brown, an Obama veteran from Ohio, would move to the state to oversee daily operations. In the end, Battleground Texas would raise a hefty nine million dollars to finance its operations.

Many observers believe Battleground Texas made a strategic mistake right from the start. Rather than recruit a prominent Texas Democrat to serve as nominal chairman or prime spokesman for the effort, Battleground Texas chose two non-Texan Obama organizers, Bird and Brown, to be the faces of the organization. Working apart from the existing state and county Democratic organizations, Battleground was viewed by some as an invading army made up of outside political operatives who might have understood politics better than the local folk, but who couldn’t relate. As Glenn Smith, a longtime Texas Democratic consultant, notes, “You have to speak Texan if you’re going to do well here. They didn’t. There was this belief after 2012 that if ya waved this turnout wand you would wake up some progressive majority. It didn’t exist.”

As the campaign year progressed, tension developed over Battleground’s failure to share much of the voter data they had accumulated with the major county Democratic organizations committed to boosting turnout. Operating distinctly from the regular party organization became a further bone of contention, a development described by Chris Young, political director of the Harris County Democratic Party, as a “kind of privatization of the political system.” Of course, in most Democratic circles, privatization is not viewed as a positive trend.

Then came the second strategic mistake. When State Sen.Wendy Davis launched her filibuster against a bill restricting abortion services in Texas, she became a bi-coastal liberal hero. Money and media attention came from Hollywood, Manhattan and Washington from those who hoped to see Davis bring Texas into their vision of the 21st century. But as Davis gained more popularity in liberal circles around the country, back home she became viewed, even among the state’s liberals, as unrepresentative of traditional Texas values and perspectives. By the time of the midterms, more Texans disapproved of Davis (47 percent) than approved of her (40 percent), according to a UT/Texas Tribune poll. Davis ended up losing to Republican Greg Abbott by a 20-point margin—a significant change from a year earlier, when she had been polling within five points of her eventual opponent.

The name identification, media appeal and fundraising potential of Davis led Battleground to merge much of its effort with the Davis gubernatorial campaign. In effect, Battleground Texas became the field operation for Davis: The two entities shared fundraising through what they labeled the Texas Victory Committee, and Battleground’s operations moved from the capital city of Austin to Davis’ home territory of Fort Worth. Suddenly the long-term effort to turn Texas blue had become a short-term objective to elect Wendy Davis as governor. Rather than building a lasting base at the local level, Battleground was now engaged in a top-down effort to change Texas politics.

This lack of a bottom-up strategy was particularly glaring on Dec. 9, 2013, the filing deadline for 2014 candidates. Far from attracting a number of qualified and vigorous candidates to the Democratic banner, Battleground and the party ended up ceding much of the field to the Republicans without even a whimper. In fact, Democrats failed to recruit anyone to run on their ticket for more than 40 percent of all state legislative positions on the ballot. The end result would be almost a two-to-one Republican majority in both the Texas Senate and the House. Even more depressing was the party’s showing at the county level. Democrats could not find anyone willing to run for County Judge (chief elected official in the county) in 165 of Texas’ 254 counties, ceding almost two-thirds of all counties to the Republicans without an election. Thus, by 2015, while the Democrats will retain the county judge in four of the six largest counties, the GOP will hold all 29 suburban county judge positions, 18 of 21 in the other metropolitan counties scattered around the state, and 150 of the 198 small town county courthouses. Of all the major counties in Texas, only Dallas, Bexar, El Paso, Jefferson and Travis, along with the border counties of Webb and Hidalgo, will have a Democratic county judge.

And even more depressing than that was the fact that not a single Democratic candidate could be found who was willing to run for any county office in 86 counties—more than one-third of the total. These 86 included the heavily populated suburban counties of Denton, Johnson and Parker (outside Dallas-Fort Worth), Montgomery (suburban Houston) and Comal (north of San Antonio) as well as the other urban counties of Bell (Temple), Randall (Amarillo) and Grayson (Sherman). As the saying goes, you can’t win a game if you don’t field a team.

Read more:

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by Anonymousreply 253November 18, 2014 2:15 AM

Now there is not one single white Democrat from the Deep South in Congress. Democratic candidates are getting only 15 to 20 percent of white voters in the South. The GOP reigns in the South.

by Anonymousreply 254December 7, 2014 2:32 AM

Phil Bredesen, the Democratic governor of Tennessee from 2003 to 2011, has a message for a party that, after Saturday’s runoff in Louisiana, will have no senators from the Deep South: “I come out of the business world. If you have a product that’s not working, you don’t say, ‘Our customers are lazy’ or ‘Our customers don’t know what’s best for them.’ The ones that are successful say, ‘I need a better product.’”

Sen. Mary Landrieu was the latest Democratic casualty in the region, losing this weekend’s election to Republican Rep. Bill Cassidy in a rout. But in interviews with more than a dozen elected Democratic officials, strategists and academics found some optimism that the party can find at least selective success across the South in the not-distant future, particularly in states with growing minority populations like North Carolina and Georgia.

It will take more than demographics, however, to rescue the once-dominant model of the centrist Southern Democrat: The party, the officials said, needs to spend less time on divisive social issues and more on middle-class economic concerns, and then hope that Barack Obama’s departure from the White House prompts skeptical white voters to give them a second look.

“We’re just trotting out the same old nostrums: a little class warfare here and a nod to labor unions there and more money for X, Y and Z programs,” said Bredesen. “People are looking for a vision.”

Most believe that vision will be found in pocketbook issues, particularly related to the middle class, including a revival of the more populist economic message that resonated during the first half of the 20th century. Support for student loans, Medicare and Medicaid, equal pay for equal work – all can be framed in a way that strengthens and bolsters the working class, Democrats say.

In 1962, every senator and an overwhelming majority of House members from the South was a Democrat. Next year, Democrats will control 39 of 149 Southern congressional seats, fewer than at any time since Reconstruction. The GOP won each of the seven governor’s races in the South this year as well, padding majorities in state legislatures across the region.

The Democrats’ earlier dominance, some of which stemmed from the Jim Crow era, faded steadily since the mid-1960s. Now, the party has hit rock bottom, but many younger candidates and strategists believe the atmosphere is ripe for a bounce-back.

“As tough as 2014 is, you have to go watch the game film,” said Atlanta Mayor Kasim Reed, a Democratic rising star. “The first thing you’ve got to do is shake it off. Then stop whining. Midterms are hard for Democrats, but we have the opportunity in ’16 to win the presidency and to rebuild the party.”

Here’s a look at what some top Democratic minds from the South say the party needs to do to win again in Dixie:

Move past the Obama era.

Mike Beebe, the popular outgoing Democratic governor of Arkansas, believes “most” of his party’s struggles in the state can be traced to Barack Obama.

In 2008, Obama became the first Democrat to carry Virginia and North Carolina for the first time in decades. Democrats dominated Arkansas’ congressional delegation, and Republicans did not even field a candidate against Sen. Mark Pryor (D-Ark.) that year.

But in 2010, driven by an anti-Obama backlash, Republicans won three of the state’s four House seats and knocked off Sen. Blanche Lincoln. In 2012, Republicans seized control of the state House and Senate for the first time since right after the Civil War and captured the fourth U.S. House seat. And Pryor was trounced this November.

“The No. 1 thing to be competitive in the South is to have Barack Obama not be president anymore,” said North Carolina pollster Tom Jensen, who runs the Democratic firm Public Policy Polling. “It’s just a simple reality that Southern whites really, really despise him in a way they have not despised any other president.”

Beebe says “it’ll help” for Obama to not be around, “but it’ll take more than that” to make up the lost ground.

Exit polls showed that Pryor received fewer than one-third of white votes last month. In Georgia, Democratic Senate candidate Michelle Nunn received a quarter of white votes, and Landrieu just 18 percent in the first round of voting last month.

Capitalize on demographic shifts.

Six of the 10 states with the largest black population are in the South, and the four states with the fastest growing black population are Florida, Georgia, Texas and North Carolina. Nine of the 10 states with the biggest Hispanic population growth are in the South as well.

Reed, the mayor of Atlanta, believes Georgia’s large African-American community did not turn out in force the way it did in 2008 and 2012 because Democratic candidates foolishly tried to distance themselves from Obama. In Kentucky, for example, Alison Lundergan Grimes refused to even acknowledge that she voted for Obama.

“Black people can see how the president of the United States is being treated by the party,” Reed said. “You’re trying to have the Obama coalition when you won’t even say the name of the president?”

“To the extent that we try to be Republican Lite, we’re gonna lose,” he added.

Reed praised Virginia Sen. Tim Kaine in 2012 and Gov. Terry McAuliffe in 2013 for not running away from Obama, espousing progressive principles and aggressively attacking their opponents

Exit polls showed that Pryor received fewer than one-third of white votes last month. | Getty

“The Virginia model is the model we need to follow in the South,” he said.

Dick Harpootlian, the former chairman of the South Carolina Democratic Party, said minorities would have a lot more sway if courts stopped allowing Republican state legislators to overly concentrate them in safe majority-minority districts. He noted that one-third of the Palmetto State population is black, but only one of its seven House districts is represented by a Democrat.

“The gerrymandered artificial districts are created for white people, not black people,” he said.

The Supreme Court is currently considering a case out of Alabama, in which Democrats and African Americans argue that Republicans impermissibly concentrated black voters in gerrymandered districts to create more GOP seats.

Talk more about economic issues — and less about social issues.

“During this last election — if you made above minimum wage, and you already had health care — there wasn’t a hell of a lot in [the Democratic message] for you,” said Jim Hodges, the governor of South Carolina from 1999 to 2003. “If the Republicans have a 1 percent problem, we have a 10 percent problem. We seem obsessed with the problems that 10 percent of the population has. Then voters don’t believe Democrats care about people like them.”

Even as Democrats were getting swamped, Arkansas overwhelmingly passed a minimum wage hike. Polling shows heavy support in the region for expanding Medicaid, reforming student loans and giving women equal pay for equal work.

Former Mississippi Gov. Ronnie Musgrove said all those things are good, but Democrats need a broader, more comprehensive plan. “To me, the sweet-tea-and-grits crowd still likes our economic issues,” said Musgrove, who served from 2000 to 2004 and narrowly lost a 2008 Senate race. “Democrats need an economic message based on opportunity: education, job training, infrastructure rebuilding, and even health care – where voters know that Democrats can make a difference in these issues.”

Bredesen, the former Tennessee governor, put it more bluntly. “We’re known for gay rights, immigration, climate change and an unpopular health plan,” he said. “I think we’re on the right side on all those issues, but it’s not what people are looking for right now from government.

“I’ll be honest: it passes my understanding how particularly the past few years we’ve ignored the economic pain that’s been created in this country,” he added.

Bredesen said Democrats who are thinking about running for office need to adopt what he calls “the Walmart test.”

“When you think about what your platform is going to be, go to the nearest Walmart and stop someone in the aisle and tell them what you’re going to run on,” he said. “If that engages them and they’re interested, then you have a plan.”

Stay out of the way while Republicans mess it up.

When Democrats controlled the South, moderates and liberals battled in heated primaries. Now Republicans find themselves with increasingly testy primaries — between the right and the far right.

Mississippi Sen. Thad Cochran received fewer votes than state Sen. Chris McDaniel in a June primary but narrowly won a runoff a few weeks later after African-Americans and other moderates rallied behind him. If McDaniel had won the nomination, his history of incendiary comments would have given an opening to former Democratic Rep. Travis Childers — and national Republicans might have needed to spend millions of dollars to hold the otherwise-safe seat.

Meanwhile in Alabama, state House Speaker Mike Hubbard was indicted on 23 felony corruption counts two weeks before the midterms; he denies wrongdoing.

“They’re not delivering,” said Mississippi’s Musgrove, who noted that his state is often ranked near the bottom of national quality of life rankings. “It’s constant overreach. It is corruption. There are positions that are so far to the right that people of the South just say we can’t go that far. “

Beebe, who is voluntarily leaving office next month as one of the country’s most popular governors, said that he successfully capitalized on division between “mainstream,” business-minded Republicans and “extreme right wing” tea partiers in the state legislature to expand Medicaid.

“The pragmatism of the business Republicans together with the Democrats created a coalition,” he said. “That’s going to be a dynamic going forward.”

Democrats need to build deeper benches in Southern state legislatures.

The Kentucky state House is the only legislative chamber in the South still controlled by Democrats. Gov. Steve Beshear marvels at how many voters pulled the lever for GOP Senate leader Mitch McConnell, who won by 15 points, and Democratic state representatives last month.

“In Kentucky, we’ve demonstrated to our people that we can get things done with a divided government,” said Beshear, who handily won reelection in 2011 and was just appointed to a Democratic National Committee task force to explore what lessons the party can learn from this year.

Insiders say the key is to win state races, which tend to be less polarized than federal ones, and have candidates prove themselves there.

There is a hunger and appetite for fresh faces, including business people who’ve never held office, after several Democratic dynasties showed their limitations this year.

Georgia Rep. John Barrow was the only remaining white Democrat from the Deep South in the lower chamber, but he lost by 10 points last month. And because Republicans control the other legislatures — which draw congressional-district boundaries in most states — Democrats will be hard pressed to make inroads at the federal level if they can’t take over before the next redistricting cycle, beginning in 2021.

Rep. Steve Cohen (D-Tenn.), who is white but represents a majority-minority district around Memphis, thinks his party has a long road back in the South.

“Lyndon Johnson allegedly said we lost it for a generation when he signed the Civil Rights Act [in 1964],” Cohen recalled. “I think it’s gone for the rest of my lifetime and probably yours.”

Lauren French contributed to this report.

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by Anonymousreply 255December 7, 2014 2:48 AM

R255, I might consider reading your pist if I thought you actually typed it, but, no.

by Anonymousreply 256December 7, 2014 2:54 AM

Actually the Republicans have a "product" that has never worked for anybody but the 1%, but their continued success shows that Phil Bredesen is a dumb motherfucker who doesn't understand anything about America or the voters.

by Anonymousreply 257December 7, 2014 3:56 AM

Voting Republican has become the White thing to do, particularly in the South.

by Anonymousreply 258December 7, 2014 4:01 AM

Only because nobody has attempted to give them a POPULIST alternative R258.

by Anonymousreply 259December 7, 2014 4:05 AM

There was an op-ed that ran in the Sunday paper about a month ago gave two theories as to why this happens.

The first is that poor people believe that one day they will be rich. A clerk at 7/11 making minimum wage believes that one day he or she will need to worry about things like capital gains taxes.

The second theory is that the poor know that neither political party will do anything to improve their status. Believing that, they will vote based on their views on social issues. I might be poor, but I am opposed to gun control, gay marriage and and abortion, therefore I will vote Republican

by Anonymousreply 260January 1, 2015 6:05 AM


Republicans now enjoy unmatched power in the states. It was a 40-year effort. (@databyler) Details:

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by Anonymousreply 261February 21, 2021 1:54 PM

I've come to the conclusion is that Democrats look to the future whereas Republicans want instant gratification and don't look at or care about the consequences of their actions.

by Anonymousreply 262February 21, 2021 2:13 PM

Computing margin swings across two elections has never sat well with me. It gives good overall insight, but it can mislead. North Carolina's suburbs swung left between 2012-2020, but they're adding new R voters faster than they swing, so they're actually trending favorably for Rs

by Anonymousreply 263June 6, 2022 12:38 AM

R56 We would always win or at least get a moderate democrat every time if it weren't for the electoral college and also now citizens united. People and corporations can give unlimited amounts of money to politicians through the republican pacts. And both of them are in the constitution and can't be changed as it takes 2/3 s of the states to change anything.

by Anonymousreply 264June 6, 2022 2:06 AM
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