Serving up this steaming pile of
Celebrity Gossip
Gay Politics
Gay News
and Pointless Bitchery
Since 1995

Janet Jackson- "The Pleasure Principle"

This video separated her from the rest of the pack--including her brother Michael. Even today, it's just amazing to watch. Just her, alone, in a big warehouse ala Footloose and Flashdance, dancing her heart out. The hair, the Guess jeans, the balancing off of a chair, the backflip...iconic and awesome.

by Anonymousreply 18401/13/2015

I used to love this video when I was a kid. Videos were so much more creative back then. Nowadays videos are so computer generated and boring that they have no creativity.

by Anonymousreply 101/13/2012

Me too! I can't tell you how many times I tried that chair balancing thing. You're right about videos relying too heavily on gimicks, CG, etc. to be interesting these days. No creativity at all.

by Anonymousreply 201/13/2012

I loved this video. It's so simple, but I could not turn away. This made me fall in love with Janet.

by Anonymousreply 301/13/2012

My fave, far video from Janet. And she said in an interview that she actually did the backflip, but it's edited like she didn't. Either way, awesome, AWESOME vid

by Anonymousreply 401/13/2012

A brave, honest performance.

Why did she have to give it up?

by Anonymousreply 501/13/2012

Her best song and video. I'm still shocked that this single didn't hit the top 10 on Billboard.

by Anonymousreply 601/13/2012

Great song and video by Janet. I always loved the lyrics. It's everything that is 80s music.

by Anonymousreply 701/13/2012

[quote]Her best song and video. I'm still shocked that this single didn't hit the top 10 on Billboard.

I was surprised as well - it should have been a Top 5 at least. The video version (the Shep Pettibone mix) was definitely better than the album version.

by Anonymousreply 801/13/2012

It was the only single from "Control" to miss the Hot 100 top 5 (it went to #14), but it was still a #1 club and R&B hit. This video mix, the Shep Pettibone Mix, is vastly different from the one that's on the album.

A lot of people think Paula Abdul did the choreography, but it was actually choreographed by dancer/singer Barry Lather. Dominic Sena (who went on to direct the Brad Pitt/David Duchovny thriller "Kalifornia") directed this video.

by Anonymousreply 901/13/2012

Gotta love the Dave LaChapelle-shot single cover

by Anonymousreply 1001/13/2012

There's a few Janet songs that have really stood the test of time and I think The Pleasure Principle is definitely one of them.

by Anonymousreply 1101/13/2012

Yawn. Nutrisystem-sized Janet is much more fun.

by Anonymousreply 1201/13/2012

This is by far my favorite song by Janet.

by Anonymousreply 1301/13/2012

I disagree the Pettibone mix is better. It's good and I can see why it's liked, but it's also more cluttered and has that 80s dance mix sound which instantly time stamps it compared to the clean pared down original.

It was downhill from here, she/Jam & Lewis never came near the Control singles. This and When I Think of You are perhaps her finest moments. But she has destroyed her legacy to such an extent it's difficult to appreciate the good stuff now.

by Anonymousreply 1401/13/2012

Ha! I knew the miserable Madonna frau would show his face sooner or later. R12, you're so transparent.

by Anonymousreply 1501/13/2012

I love how it's obvious that, with one video, Janet inspired a bevy of female pop artists who came after her.

by Anonymousreply 1601/13/2012

It was so groundbreaking that it influenced another artist, Nia Peeples. Her similar song "Trouble" (which was actually pretty damn good) was also Shep Pettibone produced and hit #1 on the Billboard Dance Chart. Nia was also a very good dancer with a much more "aggressive" style than Janet.

by Anonymousreply 1701/13/2012

Yep, R17. Nia left "Fame" about two years after Janet jumped ship. I think she saw the success that Janet was having on the charts and said "Dammit, this is my time!"

by Anonymousreply 1801/13/2012

I do love the Janet copyists R17. I don't agree at all with the Madonna fans who say Control was her copying Madge - Prince and her brother for the videos, yes.

There was a hole spate of them: Jody Watley, Pebbles, Karyn White, Vanessa Williams and yes, her Fame co-star Nia.

When you said groundbreaking I thought you meant Cassie & Ciara!

by Anonymousreply 1901/13/2012

I disagree r14. The Control singles are more memorable and popular, but Rhythm Nation was Jam & Lewis' best work from a production stand point, a la Quincy Jones & Thriller. The beats and arrangements on RN are flawless. RN also started the sampling trend in the 90s, but no one could really match J&L. Those samples were almost unrecognizable by the time J&L got done with them.

by Anonymousreply 2001/13/2012

Oh, for sure, R19. "Control" was actually the antithesis of "Madonna". It was funky, sassy, street, and it was Janet asserting her independence. And the videos were nothing short of breathtaking. You can see the kind of effect those videos had on the music video landscape as you look back over the years. And yes, albums at the time by Karyn White, Vanessa Williams, Pebbles, Nia Peeples, et. al. were undoubtedly made possible by "Control"'s success. Vanessa Williams, for instance, had a video called "The Right Stuff", and it's basically "Nasty 2.0".

by Anonymousreply 2101/13/2012

I agree R20. Rhythm Nation was a juggernaut in every sense of the word. The 30-minute film short that accompanied the album was brilliant as well. Dominic Sena directed it, and it had echos of "Blade Runner" and old gangster films. Thomas Newman did the score, and Jason Patric's kid brother Joshua Miller had a cameo.

by Anonymousreply 2201/13/2012

I think J&L continued to write great songs after Rhythm Nation. "That's the Way Love Goes" is brilliant, for instance.

by Anonymousreply 2301/13/2012

From what I've read, Janet wrote the lyrics and JJ/TL did the music. It really is a brilliant song, though.

by Anonymousreply 2401/13/2012

This really was a good song. I can't stand her, but you are correct - this is good.

by Anonymousreply 2501/13/2012

Looking back on it now, it's funny that this little squat and fat thing was pretending to be a dancer. Hell, who knew the difference at that time?

by Anonymousreply 2601/13/2012

Really? I was there at the time and Pleasure Principle was clearly an album track forced into service by greedy executives. They were beating a dead horse for hits by the time that song was released. I can't imagine that anyone would find the piffle brilliant on any level. Of course the '80s are notorious for milking albums dry.

by Anonymousreply 2701/13/2012

Remember, Whitney was in her prime during this time, and nobody, but nobody could compare to Whitney. Today, I could beat her with a stick for what she did to her career. Seriously.

by Anonymousreply 2801/13/2012

Squat and fat thing, R26? Such vitriol. Danny Devito is squat and fat. Janet Jackson has body. And a shapely one. And she never pretended to be a dancer. She IS a dancer. It's in her soul.

Videos like this (also taken from the RN film short) are why she is [italic]still[/italic] unparalleled.

by Anonymousreply 2901/13/2012

r27 I do think Janet was forced into doing the Pleasure Principle video. I recall her saying she was really over the video shoot because she was exhausted and she was ready to be done with the album so she could rest on her 21st birthday. The release date at r7 is around that time. You can't tell she was tired, she did a good job. One of her best.

by Anonymousreply 3001/13/2012

She's really had a good, considering that she has no singing voice to speak of.

by Anonymousreply 3101/13/2012

Her voice was horrible and she couldn't dance for shit, but she did the best she could being the sister of a superstar the time.

by Anonymousreply 3201/13/2012

She's not a belter, R31, but she can emote and convey feeling in her tone.

by Anonymousreply 3301/13/2012

R32 is a solvent-huffing, deluded shitstain. Can't dance? Sweetie, have you even seen a Janet Jackson video before?

by Anonymousreply 3401/13/2012

Janet didn't do the back flip, and you can barely hear her vocals. I do like the song. It was written by Monte Moir. Jam and Lewis neither wrote nor produced it.

by Anonymousreply 3501/14/2012

Monte Moir's a white guy, btw. Wonder if he's gay. Sounds like a song a queen would produced. lol.

by Anonymousreply 3601/14/2012

Long Vocal version.

by Anonymousreply 3701/14/2012

I was never a big Janet fan, but I thought 'The Pleasure Principle' was a great song. Excellent production values. I also liked Janet and Herb Alpert's 'Diamonds,' which was released around the same time and is totally forgotten today. That was also very good.

by Anonymousreply 3801/14/2012

Monte Moir was a member of The Time. Jam and Lewis recruited him for the album. And yes, R35, she did indeed do the backflip, just as she did it at 0:46 in this video...

by Anonymousreply 3901/14/2012

and just like she did it at 2:49 in this clip...

by Anonymousreply 4001/14/2012

Love "Diamonds", R38. "Making Love in the Rain" was the other Janet/Herb collabo released from Herb's "Keep Your Eye on Me" album. It had Lisa Keith on main vocals with Janet doing the hook. Great, relaxing bedroom ballad.

by Anonymousreply 4101/14/2012

r40, that's not a backflip as in on her own, and she didn't do the backflip in Nasty Boys either. Pop Up Video even mentioned it.

by Anonymousreply 4201/14/2012

[quote]Her voice was horrible and she couldn't dance for shit.

Anyone who says Janet Jackson couldn't dance can't be taken seriously.

by Anonymousreply 4301/14/2012

r29 thats my favorite video of Janet's. A lot people have said Janet could be easily interchangeable with any dancing female artist in her vids. But not that video, or the Rhythm Nation movie. They would look foolish. Those videos were 100% Jackson style.

by Anonymousreply 4401/14/2012

Making Love in the Rain, another intoxicating 80s track by Herb featuring Janet.

by Anonymousreply 4501/14/2012

My fav of hers, OP.

by Anonymousreply 4601/14/2012

Exactly, R43. What more proof do you need that there hasn't been a female pop performer in the history of pop music that has been able to outdance her?

by Anonymousreply 4701/14/2012

If she really does the back flips, why do they cut away, just as she flips, in all of the clips?

by Anonymousreply 4801/14/2012

Paula Abdul out dances her. In fact, she taught her.

by Anonymousreply 4901/14/2012

Thanks r31 & r32 for pointing this out. It's the truth, isn't it? Janet fantards always seem to ignore this fact, or act like it doesn't matter and EVERYONE should love Janet REGARDLESS. Some of us like people who can actually sing. She can dance, but her career is built primarily on gimmicks to cover her weak singing voice.

by Anonymousreply 5001/14/2012

Oh yes, just remebered this

by Anonymousreply 5201/14/2012

If Janet tried those backflips today, she'd go right through the floor like a cannonball.

by Anonymousreply 5301/14/2012

r20, absolutely everything off RN is forgotten these days. Give it up.

r19, Janet dropped her goody two shoes image once Madonna and Cyndi Lauper became uber-famous with their "tough independent women" personae.

"Nasty" was Janet packaged as Madonna, aimed at urban girls who didn't have "their Madonna" yet.

Janet always followed in the footsteps of Madonna, but it was most obvious during the Control era.

by Anonymousreply 5401/14/2012

[quote]Paula Abdul had an even worse voice than Janet, or well anyone (the original J-Lo) but was at least likeable and could dance her ass off.

Paula makes Janet sound like Leontyne Price in comparison.

by Anonymousreply 5501/14/2012

I agree, almost all singles off Control were good - despite Janet, that is.

It was the magic of the 80s, and her production team, that created some good songs.

Then they went into overdrive, and destroyed it.

Absolutely everything released after Control was utter shit, and is rightly forgotten these days. The sole exception being TTWLG.

Janet should have had the same career span as Karyn White and Pebbles, to be honest.

by Anonymousreply 5601/14/2012

Bitch @R56, don't you even try to talk shit on Karyn White. I will beat your ass.

by Anonymousreply 5701/14/2012

[quote][R20], absolutely everything off RN is forgotten these days. Give it up.

r54 apparently you missed the last Janet thread, and you dont read well.

I said that yes, the tracks on that album are less memorable. However, Rhythm Nation, the movie and album are probably the most imitated piece of work Janet has ever done. It has been redone many times by many different people, including Michael who dropped Quincy Jones after RN came out. RN made New Jack Swing popular in 1989. Nobody heard anything like that before then. Thats why it stayed on the charts for three years in a row. Bobby Brown, TLC, Paula Abdul, Michael and many others all wanted Janet's sound.

by Anonymousreply 5901/14/2012

[quote]Absolutely everything released after Control was utter shit, and is rightly forgotten these days. The sole exception being TTWLG.

Horseshit. Rhythm Nation, Escapade, Miss You Much, Black Cat, Come Back To Me, If, and the entire Velvet Rope album are all absolute classics.

by Anonymousreply 6101/14/2012

[quote]...um, except "Control," which was the actual first mainstream-pop example of new jack swing that hit #1.

It was the first example, but RN was the perfect example. It was the creative peak for J&L and Janet.

by Anonymousreply 6201/14/2012

I think she sank after [italic]The Velvet Rope[/italic].

by Anonymousreply 6301/14/2012

R61 You've got to be kidding about that embarrassing clunker Black Pussy. Awful! And you like "Speshul" as well from The Velvet Rope?!

Here is the ARTISTES rendering of Escapade

by Anonymousreply 6401/14/2012

[quote]I think she sank after The Velvet Rope.

I actually liked the All For You album too; it was no Velvet Rope, but it was still decent fun pop. It was that Damita Jo album where everything went to hell and never got better. Sad because I used to be such a huge fan.

by Anonymousreply 6501/14/2012

Not true, r58.

"Material Girl" projected a woman being in charge. It was the ultimate female go-getter anthem.

It wasn't just her songs, though. Madonna's real life persona was so forceful..... unlike anything ever seen before, at least in the arena of female pop.

She and Cyndi really did change the game. And early JJ WAS modelled after them.

That her sound was more urban / more Minneapolis is certainly true. As I said, she was "Madonna, packaged for an urban demographic". They gavea her a slightly different sound, but that was it.

by Anonymousreply 6601/14/2012

r61 has got to be joking. ALL those songs are completely forgotten today.

Miss You Much? Bwahahaha...

Janet Jackson has got ONE classic song under her belt, and that's "Nasty".

And even that one is hardly era-defining, the way "Like a Virgin" or "Beat it" defined the 80s.

by Anonymousreply 6701/14/2012

[quote]It was the creative peak for J&L and Janet.

Don't forget me!

by Anonymousreply 6801/14/2012

I'm not as old as you queens, but did the "urban demographic" really need a Madonna when there was a Grace Jones? Just wondering.

by Anonymousreply 6901/14/2012

r69, Grace Jones was never "urban mainstream", the way Janet was.

She was "artsy", "post-modern" and a high-fashion/independent pop melange, with strong Euro an NYC vibes.

Very different animal.

by Anonymousreply 7001/14/2012

OK

by Anonymousreply 7101/14/2012

Madge did mention Grace though in her early pre-fame interviews, she wanted to appeal to the kind of people who liked her.

And Grace enigmatically said that "she would never forgive" Madonna for something she'd done to her and wouldn't elaborate!

I also like Cristina of these early precursors, she is admittedly an acquired taste but her mutant disco ZE Records sound would resonate with Madge as pre-fame she was with all that crowd and could have gone that way.

by Anonymousreply 7201/14/2012

You Madonna trolls and your extreme virtiol about anything Janet Jackson is all at once sad and hilarious. This is a Janet thread, about JANET, but since some of you seem so hell-bent on comparisons, then I'll be the fist to say HORSESHIT to the fact that Control was packaged as "Madonna for Urban youth" or whatever foolishness someone said upthread. Control was Janet, period. It was Janet breaking free from the confines of her strict family. It was Janet dancing her ass off in videos that helped define the future for the dance/pop diva. It was Janet asserting herself with a Minneapolis funk sound, and saying "This is the way I want it done." And she became a star dressed in all black, with not an inch of skin showing, and, in those days, didn't use her sexuality to show that she was, indeed a star (ala Madonna, who's used sex from day one). Sorry, but there were NO similarities.

Madonna herself knew all this, which is why she shaded Janet in Truth or Dare when one of her dancers rightfully said that an outfit she was wearing was "Very Janet Jackson, Rhythm Nation." The bitch knew what time it was.

And, for the nutjob @R49, Paula Abdul did NOT teach Janet how to dance. She created some choreography for her, and that's it. If you can't dance, you can't dance, and I don't care if Gene Kelly is teaching you---if it's not in you, then it ain't gonna happen. And, speaking of Paula Abdul, if it wasn't for Control then not only would her debut album NOT have happened, but neither would Jody Watley's, Karyn White's, Pebbles's, Nia Peeples's, OR Vanessa Williams's. ALL of these ladies first albums came in the wake of Control. Janet's Control defined the dance diva of color for the '80s and beyond. Period. From TLC and Aaliyah, to Salt n Pepa and Ciara, they ALL have Janet to thank, and most have taken the time to do so. Hell, Jennifer Lopez (who appeared in a Janet video before she became "J-Lo") went on record stating that Janet's "Pleasure Principle" was what made her want to get into show business. You can see Control and RN's influence in ALL of these women's albums and videos.

Oh, and for the idiots who think Janet's songs are "forgotten," you'll have to come a little better than that if you want to be taken seriously. If they're "forgotten", then why is it that those songs are STILL remade, sampled and referenced by pop aritsts to this day? Kelly Clarkson, Britney Spears and Robyn often cover Janet songs in concert. Kylie Minogue used a Janet sample in her song "Too Much of a Good Thing." Rap artist Plies sampled Janet's "Come Back to Me" in his Billboard top Ten hit "Bust it Baby." The actress from "Vampire Diaries" named Kat Graham remade two Janet hits, and made a video to go with it. Gaga has commented that Janet is a legend. Even P!nk covered "Rhythm Nation" in the new Happy Feet film.

by Anonymousreply 7301/15/2012

Can there ever be a Janet thread not over taken by crazy madonna fans? In the 80's I loved them both, and still listen to both. I don't get the Janet hate from these people.

by Anonymousreply 7401/15/2012

James and Lewis did outstanding work on both Control and RN. They did really good work on Janet but they didn't reach the same levels they did with those Control and RN. But the fact that those 3 albums sound completely different is a testament to their talent as producers.

It was evident to me that Jam and Lewis were losing steam with Janet and by The Velvet Rope, with the exception of the title track which should have been a single, they were running on fumes.

Did Janet ever try working with Timbaland when he became the hot new producer? That style would have fit her like a glove and I'm surprised they didn't collaborate.

by Anonymousreply 7501/15/2012

r73 is the rabid Janet troll, aka Janbot.

Hello, Janbot!

by Anonymousreply 7601/15/2012

r72, r69 inquired whether Janet was another Grace.

No-one is disputing that Madonna and Grace Jones shared downtown NY roots. They obviously did.

But Janet was never NY, never post-modern/avantgarde, and never sought respect from, say, the Village Voice.

Janet was packaged as a mainstream artist to rival Madonna's fame, and take a piece of her cake.

Without Cyndi and Madonna, there wouldn't have been a "Nasty".

Deal with it, Janbots.

by Anonymousreply 7701/15/2012

Good interview with Janet in 1986 shortly after Control went to #1 in 1986. She is beautiful, the epitome of 80s fashion.

by Anonymousreply 7801/15/2012

I've told you before R77/The Streep troll (tm), stop referencing that clown Cyndi. It's embarrassing.

She is strictly of the era and was too outre look and imagewise even then to matter, and even Janet at her least relevant in the 21st century means a lot more than that gay niche artist.

I don't see how Cyndi can possibly have anything whatsoever to do with Nasty. If GJWHF was the ultimate in girl power back then 80s women might as well have just killed themselves.

by Anonymousreply 7901/15/2012

[quote]Janet was packaged as a mainstream artist to rival Madonna's fame, and take a piece of her cake.

r77 give it a rest dear. Janet was and is the female version of Michael, the last edition of Jackson family music. The Jacksons were around a long time before Cyndi and Madonna. Their music and style is completely their own. Janet finally got herself into a position to continue what her family had already started for her, and she ended up being hugely successful when she found her independence.

by Anonymousreply 8001/15/2012

[quote]Anyone who says Janet Jackson couldn't dance can't be taken seriously.

I love me some Janet. But I will never forget one of her earliest appearances on Dance Fever in the late 70s early 80s. She was singing a song and just stood there rocking back and forth off beat. She can dance. But someone took her by the hand and definitely showed her how to do it.

by Anonymousreply 8101/15/2012

r79, aka the anti-Streep/Cyndi troll, you've answered your own question.

"Girls Just Wanna Have Fun" was one of perhaps 3 or 4 songs that define the entire 80s, and "Nasty" was its afterthought.

Your need to bash Cyndi is silly. Her outre look was completely accepted by Middle America, just like a film like Tootsie was accepted back then, or Annie Lennox looking like a man.

It was a brief time in history where gender-bending and/or outre clothing was welcomed by the mainstream, and Cyndi was the figurehead of that era.

You can moan all you want, without the uber-success of both Cyndi and Madonna, both of who took "Control" of their careers/lives/sexuality, Janet wouldn't have happened.

Deal.

by Anonymousreply 8201/15/2012

r80, aka the Viola Davis / sometime MW troll, you conveniently ignore that Janet dropped her good two shoes act during the time Madonna & Cyndi became assertive superstars. Hardly a coincidence.

Her dropping her cutesy act had everything to do with that, and nothing to do with her Jackson roots.

How come she didn't release "Nasty" in, say, 1982?

Answer me that, silly fool.

by Anonymousreply 8301/15/2012

I like Janet too but before we start acting like she created music and dance, let's not forget she released two albums before Control, that tanked. She was Michael's sister before Control and no one cared. No one played her songs, no one bought her music. Cyndi and Madonna came along and the music industry realized how female artists could be marketed and their albums mined for singles in conjunction with well produced videos.

Madonna, even more so than Cyndi projected an image of indpendence for women, particularly with the Material Girl video and song...a full year before the Control album was released.

Paula was crucial to Janet's success because while Janet may be great at learning choreography, she desperately needs her team of choreographers (that started with Paula and segued to Tina Landau).

Left to her own devices, which you can see in any live Janet performance, she is reduced to mimicking Michael's moves.

I think Janet has plenty of memorable songs but has fewer iconic songs than Madonna.

Aside from That's The Way Love Goes, her music isn't played a lot on radio today. Whereas Madonna has: MATERIAL GIRL, LIKE A VIRGIN, CRAZY FOR YOU, VOGUE, LA ISLA BONITA, INTO THE GROOVE, TAKE A BOW, MUSIC, DON'T TELL ME and 4 MINUTES, all over recurrent radio.

Just sayin'. And just sayin' as a Janet and Madonna fan.

by Anonymousreply 8401/15/2012

Thank you, r84.

What I've been saying all along.

You've got to be blind and dumb not to understand that Madonna was responsible for Janet's "Control".

The very title of the album is what Madonna is all about. A female in control, in charge, of her sexuality, her career, her self.

They DID market Janet as a black Madonna.

Deal.with.it.

by Anonymousreply 8501/15/2012

Everytime I try to watch the video on YouTube it stalls out. Still, I think she used a stunt double.

by Anonymousreply 8601/15/2012

Isn't Material Girl just a bit patriarchal though? Don't get why that of all things would be dug up as an example.

It's about some money grabbing gold digging bimbo, the antithesis of the financially independent Madonna. It's not exactly like the anthems Destiny's Child had. Even Gwen Guthrie's "Ain't Nothing Going On But The Rent" was more assertive.

Despite what Madonna would say (she didn't write it) there isn't a trace of IRONY. And she hated the song and the fact that name still follows her around to this day.

GJWHF is more along those lines but nothing that Sister Sledge hadn't done, and no explicit theme of control.

People wouldn't know of and think of Cyndi/Madonna being in charge back then, they were just fun popstars.

The public didn't become aware of how in control Madonna was till after Blond Ambition. 90s Madonna is a very different beast from the 80s version when she was building up her career and had to conform to some degree.

But apart from the messages and meanings of these songs, Janet would probably just have wanted a similar career to those two - and Michael/Prince.

And of course Cyndi has a couple of classic songs, I wouldn't dispute she could sing and had talent. But she was so cartoonish she was very difficult to take seriously and undid her career as a result. R82 is a flop Madonna loon for putting them on the same level, even the Janet hater fans would put her ahead of Cyndi.

by Anonymousreply 8701/15/2012

r84, Madonna also has HOLIDAY, BORDERLINE, LUCKY STAR, PAPA DON'T PREACH, LIVE TO TELL, OPEN YOUR HEART, WHO'S THAT GIRL, JUSTIFY MY LOVE, SECRET, I'LL REMEMBER, THIS USED TO BE MY PLAYGROUND, RAY OF LIGHT, FROZEN, and HUNG UP.

Madonna has like 30 iconic songs that still pop up on radio today, whereas Janet has 1 or 2.

Janet quite simply never had Madonna's killer instinct for pop music.

by Anonymousreply 8801/15/2012

Wrong, r87.

In 1984, Madonna pronounced that she was out to "conquer the world" and wanted "fame and fortune".

There quite simply never were pop singers rolling around on stage in a wedding dress before.

You might think that Material Girl and GJWHF were lame, but they were seen as feminist statements, regardless of the lyrics' inconsistencies.

The image that both Cyndi and Madonna projected was that of assertive women who *did whatever they wanted* - Cyndi dressing the way she did, and Madonna saying outrageous things. They were perceived as being in "control", long before Blonde Ambition.

And neither Sister Sledge nor Gwen Guthrie ever captured the zeitgeist like Madonna and Cyndi did, and you know it.

Janet jumped on their train, and that's why her album was called "Control", and her signature hit was "Nasty".

If you can't see that, then you're blind.

by Anonymousreply 8901/15/2012

Only a deluded Janbot would put Janet ahead of Cyndi.

Cyndi could sing, she could write great songs (e.g. Time After Time), and she was an interesting character.

None of which can be said about JJ.

by Anonymousreply 9001/15/2012

[quote]Madonna has like 30 iconic songs that still pop up on radio today, whereas Janet has 1 or 2.

That depends on what kind of radio your talking about. Control, When I Think Of You, Nasty, Pleasure Principle, Let's Wait Awhile, Funny How Time Flies, Alright, Come Back To Me, TTWLG, Any Time Any Place, & I Get Lonely are all still in regular rotation in AC radio. I even hear some of Janet's more recent stuff like All For You and Feedback sometimes on AC stations. To say Janet Jackson, of all people, has one or two songs on the radio even now is asinine.

by Anonymousreply 9101/15/2012

This thread made me go to the basement and get out my "janet." CD. I'm in a sad mood, and I'm getting ready to load "Where Are You Now?" on my MP3 player so I can weep.

by Anonymousreply 9201/15/2012

Material Girl was parodying patriarchal notions of a girl with brains.

by Anonymousreply 9301/15/2012

R90, I sit and wonder where...where are you now? Now that I'm ready too..ready to love you the way you love me back..

by Anonymousreply 9401/15/2012

I really dont see how any of these artists could be compared to Janet at all. Janet's music and influence is so distinctly Jackson. Jam & Lewis combined old Jackson harmonies with left over beats from Minneapolis as a dis to Prince and they struck gold. They were all surprised when she became a music superstar, including Janet herself.

Cyndi and Madonna would look like fools if they tried to pull stuff off like Janet did. Janet was original because she was a pretty, tiny woman whose dance and style matched the masculine and powerful beats that Jam and Lewis came up with. Thats what made videos like Escapade work, the contrast is beautiful between Janet and the music.

by Anonymousreply 9501/15/2012

"Escapade" is a tinny song that is rightly forgotten, while "Girls Just Wanna Have Fun", "Into the Groove" and "Material Girl" are timeless, iconic songs.

Nuff said.

by Anonymousreply 9601/15/2012

I love how sad eldergay Vadge trolls try to bring her up in every thread about another female in order to try to make people give a damn about the old cunt. They (like Vadge) are threatened by ALL other female artists.

by Anonymousreply 9701/15/2012

I'm CONVINCED that the pitiful, no-life-having troll @ R96, and R88, R89, R90, R82, R83, R85, and many many other posts if you just hit TROLLDAR, was shunned by Janet at one point in his life, or she gave him the finger once or something, hence his obvious bitterness and vitriol towards the fact that she is and will ALWAYS be younger, more beautiful, and inherently more talented, graceful and giving than HAGdonna could EVER be. It's sad that whenever there is a Janet thread, that thing has to come in and destroy it by comparing that veiny hasbeen to Janet.

Control IS and will ALWAYS be Janet's benchmark, and one that many female artists followed and emulated. It was vastly more funky and hip than anything Madonna did before it. And now, YOU will deal.

by Anonymousreply 9801/15/2012

Isn't Material Girl just a bit patriarchal though? Don't get why that of all things would be dug up as an example.

It's about some money grabbing gold digging bimbo, the antithesis of the financially independent Madonna. It's not exactly like the anthems Destiny's Child had. Even Gwen Guthrie's "Ain't Nothing Going On But The Rent" was more assertive.

Despite what Madonna would say (she didn't write it) there isn't a trace of IRONY. And she hated the song and the fact that name still follows her around to this day.

The lyrics are loaded with irony and if they weren't then Madonna and Mary Lambert made sure the video illustrated the irony.

The final lines of the song depict the woman's strength.

Boys may come And boys may go And that's all right with me Experience has made me rich And now they're after me

The golddigger becomes the golddiggee.

And yes, she hates the song and the moniker.

by Anonymousreply 9901/18/2012

I wish the Meryl/Cyndi/"Deal" troll was dead.

by Anonymousreply 10001/18/2012

You know what else was great? Sayin' Sorry Don't Make It Right by Denise Lopez, Everybody Dance by Tamara and the Seen, Catch Me I'm Falling by Pretty Poison...

by Anonymousreply 10101/18/2012

an iconic song and video from Janet.

by Anonymousreply 10211/18/2012

One of my favorites!

by Anonymousreply 10408/10/2013

I'm sorry to read that Janbot died.

by Anonymousreply 10508/10/2013

A lot of the moves including the backflip were performed by a man in a wig. There was a huge scandal at the time. We were all being set up for the Milli Vanilli deception and Janet and her "singing" while "dancing" was in no small part at the foundation.

by Anonymousreply 10608/10/2013

I hate Janet Jackson and her lame songs. I heard that "Run Away" song on the radio tonight that starts out sounding like a Prince song (in fact I thought it was going to be "7"), and then goes into that useless "Run away with me, my love / yeah yeah yeah yeah" chorus.

What is with you simpletons who think so highly of her?

by Anonymousreply 10708/10/2013

Pleasure Principle was a good song and video!

by Anonymousreply 10808/10/2013

r105 There's only so many times you can cram a "Rhythm Nation 1814" CD up your ass before something gets hurt

by Anonymousreply 10908/10/2013

[quote]What is with you simpletons who think so highly of her?

She is LEGEND, you uninformed cretin. Get with the fucking program.

by Anonymousreply 11008/10/2013

Janet Pop Culture Trivia Time:

A recent episode of the SPIKE TV show "Bar Rescue" was titled "Play. Some. Janet. Jackson!". It put the spotlight on Las Vegas's first gay nightclub, Gipsy. Link below...

by Anonymousreply 11108/10/2013

[quote]I heard that "Run Away" song on the radio tonight

No surprise, as Janet is always being played on various radio stations. An interesting fact about YOUR FAVORITE SONG "Runaway" is that it made Janet the first female artist in Billboard's history to debut in the top ten of the Billboard Hot 100, entering at #6 in September 1995 and later peaking #3.

by Anonymousreply 11208/10/2013

Bump.

by Anonymousreply 11409/21/2014

What is this fucktard Janbot doing by bumping these ridiculous threads?

BAN JANBOT!

by Anonymousreply 11509/21/2014

I don't think it's Janbot. There's a demented queen out there who is anti Janet and makes Janbot's attentions look mild in comparison.

by Anonymousreply 11609/21/2014

But they were started by the janbot, right?

by Anonymousreply 11709/21/2014

[quote]She is LEGEND, you uninformed cretin. Get with the fucking program.

And true to form, Janbot becomes unhinged.

You stay classy, Janbot.

You stay classy.

by Anonymousreply 11809/21/2014

Jabba invented class.

by Anonymousreply 11909/21/2014

Ah yes, R115, you unmask yourself as the unhinged anti-Janbot troll.

You WILL be blocked.

by Anonymousreply 12009/21/2014

bump!

by Anonymousreply 12101/07/2015

I think she's learned how to reset her IP address, or whatever has to be done to trip up Trolldar. There's no way all of the comments aren't from Janbot.

by Anonymousreply 12201/07/2015

R122, you ARE an idiot.

by Anonymousreply 12301/08/2015

[quote]I think she's learned how to reset her IP address, or whatever has to be done to trip up Trolldar. There's no way all of the comments aren't from Janbot.

Jabba's too fucking retarded to ever figure out how to do that.

by Anonymousreply 12401/08/2015

^^Pot, meet kettle.

by Anonymousreply 12501/08/2015

GIRLS GIRLS GIRLS

Can we just get back to how great The Pleasure Principle is? Still to this day gets me excited every time I hear it. My fave Janet song.

And I say that is the biggest Madonna fan.

Why why why do we need to always slag these women off? They've all at one time or another been supportive of gay people, they make music we love to dance to and have all had exciting careers. You don't like one of them, then don't listen. But the constant hate posts on these women says much more about the person posting than it does about Madonna/Janet/Cyndi/Whitney/etc.

by Anonymousreply 12601/09/2015

Jane Jacket is the only Jackson we truly remember.

by Anonymousreply 12701/09/2015

^^^ Gurlfiend, I'm a gonna smack yo up side yo haid!

by Anonymousreply 12801/09/2015

Saw the video for the first time, borin song with an anemic chorus, hate the production (the melody and those cheesy horns are everything I despise about 80's pop). The only Janet song I actually remember as a boy is "Escapade" which I had on cassette and really liked. Anyway, she is really cute in that video, I'll give her that.

by Anonymousreply 12901/09/2015

Escapade, y'all!

by Anonymousreply 13001/09/2015

the pathetic Janbot-obsessed stalker will never stop chasing after him around DL, I see. That wack ass bitch needs to get a life. Janbot, you're hilarious and entertaining but your stalker is so annoying. He ruins all the Janet threads. He's also racist and anti-Semitic, based on what I've seen in the past using trolldar.

by Anonymousreply 13101/09/2015

Shut up you Janet loving, black Jew!

by Anonymousreply 13201/09/2015

Several people hate Janbot, but no one is obsessed with her. Janbot has a mighty high opinion of herself to think she's got a stalker. Janbot is nothing more than a bashing schoolyard bully with the humorless retorts is a six year old.

by Anonymousreply 13301/09/2015

Janbot probably hired a couple of nerdy high schoolers to do her dirty work for her on DL. She's obviously not paying them very well.

by Anonymousreply 13401/09/2015

R133 yes Janbot does have a stalker and the poster posted right above you actually.

The amount of hate for Janbot is only by silly, bitter kweens who have nothing going on in their lives so they get all wound up when Janbot posts about Janet. Get a fucking life.

by Anonymousreply 13501/09/2015

Please, R35. Janbot is a lonely drama queen who craves attention, and loves to create conflict. Why else would he continually start these tiresome thread? He'll take attention any way he can get it, good, bad, or otherwise.

by Anonymousreply 13601/09/2015

R135 sounds like Janbot's pimp.

by Anonymousreply 13701/09/2015

R131, we merely come here to witness another public shredding and execution of Janbot. She brings it on herself.

by Anonymousreply 13801/09/2015

Ooooooh...Methinks R131 / R135 is being stalked. Janbot will not be happy when he finds you're stealing his thunder.

by Anonymousreply 13901/09/2015

Janet Jackson? I'm surprised that anyone even remembers her. She was a minor blip in the '80s and '90s. She had a few big hits, but she was no Madonna, Prince or Michael.

by Anonymousreply 14001/09/2015

Wasn't Janet Jackson that chick who was on "Good Times" with Dy-no-mite?

by Anonymousreply 14101/09/2015

[quote]Several people hate Janbot, but no one is obsessed with her. Janbot has a mighty high opinion of herself to think she's got a stalker. Janbot is nothing more than a bashing schoolyard bully with the humorless retorts is a six year old.

LOL!!! LOL!!!

by Anonymousreply 14201/09/2015

Me thinks Janbot stalks herself. She's clearly obsessed and off her meds.

by Anonymousreply 14301/09/2015

She's just lost and lonely. It happens when you get old and fat.

by Anonymousreply 14401/09/2015

SSSSSHHHHHHHRRRRRRREEEEEEEEEDDDDDDDD!!!!!!!!!

by Anonymousreply 14501/09/2015

Terrible singer. Her voice was paper thin. Worse than Paula Abdul.

by Anonymousreply 14601/09/2015

so you freaks all proclaim your hate for Janbot yet you keep posting in all his threads? that makes sense...not. Also you seem like a bunch of cyber mean gays who get enjoyment out of trying to make Janbot angry or embarrassed when he clearly doesn't give a fuck. How can you complain about him yet you try to get him to keep doing what you think is annoying?

by Anonymousreply 14701/09/2015

Who the fuck still says that "....not" shit? R147, how fucking old ARE you?

by Anonymousreply 14801/09/2015

I feel sorry for people who had their heyday in the 80s, people like Madonna and Jane Jackson.

I'd be pissed if all my best songs were frozen in time, accompanied by those tinny synthesizers.

Everything sounds as if it was mastered of a $75 Casio keyboard. There is no depth or authenticity to the sounds.

So sad.

Jesus wept.

by Anonymousreply 14901/09/2015

I saw her Nasty video on TV the other day. I had forgotten how fat she was back then.

by Anonymousreply 15001/09/2015

She still is R150.

by Anonymousreply 15101/09/2015

[quote]Janbot is nothing more than a bashing schoolyard bully with the humorless retorts is a six year old.

Learn how to speak before you try to come for me, honeybunch.

by Anonymousreply 15201/10/2015

[quote]the pathetic Janbot-obsessed stalker will never stop chasing after him around DL, I see. That wack ass bitch needs to get a life. Janbot, you're hilarious and entertaining but your stalker is so annoying. He ruins all the Janet threads. He's also racist and anti-Semitic, based on what I've seen in the past using trolldar.

Yes, he really is human dreck. I wish there was a way I could zap him from the universe.

by Anonymousreply 15301/10/2015

[quote]The amount of hate for Janbot is only by silly, bitter kweens who have nothing going on in their lives so they get all wound up when Janbot posts about Janet. Get a fucking life.

I do love you.

by Anonymousreply 15401/10/2015

[quote]Please, [R35]. Janbot is a lonely drama queen who craves attention, and loves to create conflict. Why else would he continually start these tiresome thread? He'll take attention any way he can get it, good, bad, or otherwise.

Actually, you silly whore, I'm not always the creator of DL Janet threads. Sometimes they're started by other JanFans, and sometimes they're started by stupid trolls who just want to get shit going.

by Anonymousreply 15501/10/2015

[quote]Janet Jackson? I'm surprised that anyone even remembers her. She was a minor blip in the '80s and '90s. She had a few big hits, but she was no Madonna, Prince or Michael.

LOL, nice try, bitch.

by Anonymousreply 15601/10/2015

[quote]Me thinks Janbot stalks herself. She's clearly obsessed and off her meds.

Me thinks that you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

by Anonymousreply 15701/10/2015

LOL at how my pathetic stalker commented at R144 and then, because she just can't get enough of Janet threads, came back not even half an hour later to make some stupid, nonsensical comment. A life she CLEARLY does not have.

by Anonymousreply 15801/10/2015

My pathetic stalker had her ass handed to her by R147 and all she could come back with at R148 is some nitpicky thing about a word in R147's post. Boy, you can really tell when someone is fighting a losing battle!

by Anonymousreply 15901/10/2015

I think R151 is the most pitiful poster I've ever seen on DL in the many years I've been posting here, and I've seen some doozies, so that is saying a LOT.

by Anonymousreply 16001/10/2015

It's strange how some music holds up years after years, and Janet's stuff seems all so dated now.

by Anonymousreply 16101/10/2015

[quote]It's strange how some music holds up years after years, and Janet's stuff seems all so dated now.

Umm...no. I don't think so.

by Anonymousreply 16301/10/2015

The Velvet Rope--full of audio gimmicks and giggles to be "edgy". And it has that perennially awful 80's synthesized background sound. It is truly anachronistic and awful in 2015.

A timeless album should be absolutely that. Free of gimmicks and repetitive background production that identifies it from a particular decade.

The Velvet Rope fails all of these tests.

by Anonymousreply 16401/11/2015

R164 clearly doesn't know what she's talking about/is a troll.

The Velvet Rope was heralded upon its release, and with good reason. It was a dark and introspective album that provided an intimate look into one of the world's most guarded and private pop icons. It covered the themes of sex, domestic abuse, homophobia and the lost of loved ones, and did so while exploring the varied music genres of pop, R&B, funk and electronica. The production provided a beat to which Janet's deep lyrics were set against, and the album became a multi-platinum, award-winning affair. Not only are various tracks from it still sampled and re-made by today's artists, but it is still regarded as her masterpiece.

One of the best tracks from these sessions was the Japanese Bonus Track "God's Stepchild", which was also released on the soundtrack to the movie Down in the Delta.

by Anonymousreply 16501/11/2015

R165, maybe it was ALL those things as you say. Maybe you are just full of shit. The truth is that it was SO FUCKING LONG AGO that many of us reading this post don't recall it coming out at all because we were not born yet.

The rest of us merely recall it as it was: A gimmicky set of tunes with an awfully derivative production sound of the 80s.

No one will remember this music because many of us have already forgotten it. It was just another album in a sea of albums in the 80s, and not quite up to its peers of the day.

by Anonymousreply 16601/12/2015

I prefer the original

by Anonymousreply 16701/12/2015

Janbot has been around for awhile. I wonder why Janet is so afraid to put out any new music?

by Anonymousreply 16801/12/2015

[quote]It was just another album in a sea of albums in the 80s, and not quite up to its peers of the day.

The Velvet Rope was in the late '90s, fuckface, and like I said, it was heralded not only as one of the best albums to come out that year, but also as Janet's masterpiece. And tell that "we don't remember it" shit to somebody else, because it's just a load of bullshit to anyone with common sense. TVR spoke to fans all over the world--people dealing with depression, people dealing with the death of a loved one, people dealing with coming out of the closet, you name it. And, with as many artists and fans alike who still regard it as an album that inspired them/saved their life, etc., it's obvious that you are more than clueless.

[quote]many of us reading this post don't recall it coming out at all because we were not born yet.

This sentence pretty much negates anything else you have to say on the subject, honey. You weren't born in 1997? HA! You still have afterbirth behind your ears. Go back to the sandbox, child.

by Anonymousreply 16901/12/2015

R169, you old queen. Go back to the nursing home.

by Anonymousreply 17001/12/2015

R170, I'm not even close to old, but I'm definitely closer to wise than you'll ever be. Again, go play in the sand little boy.

by Anonymousreply 17101/13/2015

Yo' fat hard pay-nuss feels so good against my lips, sugah

I want you so bad I can taste yo' cum right now

by Anonymousreply 17201/13/2015

It is my pleasure principal to expose the MOST PATHETIC POSTER ON DATALOUNGE!

OP+ R2 R9 R10 R15 R16 R18 R21 R22 R24 R29 R33 R34 R39 R40 R41 R47 R73 R98 R121 R123 R125 R152 R153 R154 R155 R156 R157 R158 R159 R160 R163 R165 R169 R171

GO JANBOT GO!

DAZZLE US WITH ANOTHER ONE OF YOUR SNAPPY RETORTS.

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ..............

by Anonymousreply 17301/13/2015

Janbot has to fill her own threads. He's on the Janet Jackson Promotional Payroll Tour.

by Anonymousreply 17401/13/2015

Janbot is alive and unwell.

by Anonymousreply 17501/13/2015

Emotionally unwell R175. Very emotionally unwell.

by Anonymousreply 17601/13/2015

What do you people get out of hating on Janet?

by Anonymousreply 17701/13/2015

.

by Anonymousreply 17801/13/2015

.

by Anonymousreply 17901/13/2015

.

by Anonymousreply 18001/13/2015

.

by Anonymousreply 18101/13/2015

[quote]It is my pleasure principal to expose the MOST PATHETIC POSTER ON DATALOUNGE!

It takes a special kind of crazy to go through the trouble of referencing each and every one of someone's posts in a long thread, and you obviously fit the bill.

by Anonymousreply 18201/13/2015

[quote]Janbot has to fill her own threads. He's on the Janet Jackson Promotional Payroll Tour.

Nice try, but no cigar.

by Anonymousreply 18301/13/2015

[quote]What do you people get out of hating on Janet?

It unfortunately adds some spice to their otherwise humdrum, meaningless existences.

by Anonymousreply 18401/13/2015
Loading
Need more help? Click Here.